“Washingtonian” (w/ Brandi Carlile)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Look Mayer, Oh, I see you. My own look over
there is that culture. Yes, goodness loves culture.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
Das culture calling.

Speaker 1 (00:13):
We're quickly off to the races with our guests.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
I'm wearing my Hijira hat, yes, and just as a
tribute to the just for the Jony connection. And I've gosh,
it feels crazy to look across at our guest as
if she's an old friend.

Speaker 1 (00:30):
Well, here's the thing I was thinking, Well last night,
I'm sort of like zoning in for the episode and
like consuming, consuming, consuming, and I'm thinking potential, most talented
person we've had, a potential.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
I don't think it's potential.

Speaker 1 (00:41):
No, I'm not kidding because I was actually texted our
vocal coach, Doug pack Pat, and I was like, can
we talk about the voice of our of our guest
And he was like, well, the word is fearless.

Speaker 2 (00:53):
Well this is fearless singing all your fucking songs in
the original key.

Speaker 1 (01:00):
You're crazy, you are crazy. But we haven't even spoken.
We haven't even breached that with our guests because we're
too busy talking about going on vacation on a boat
and going on vacation to the mouse house.

Speaker 2 (01:13):
And she's an expert at both. I can't believe I
got to tell this person this is what I breached,
broached with her reach broached. Last song I listened to
and I've told you this probably a million times. I
will remind you last song that was playing in the
car and I intentionally played it before my mom dropped
me off to the airport before I went to school.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
And was it the story?

Speaker 2 (01:33):
It was not the story, but it was off the album. Okay,
cannon Ball ooh so good.

Speaker 1 (01:38):
I will never forget being a nineteen year old singing
all of these lines across from my face. I'm nineteen,
tell you the story and I'm just like giving this
really like just because of course, you know, grazing out
of me open the door, of course, like millions of gays.

Speaker 2 (01:57):
A Sara Ramire is an underrated Sara Ramire. Shout out
to you, Sara. Okay, but anyway, I've told her guests
this since then. She is She has inadvertently started the
queer sort of commune that we will all be living
in an opposed apocalyptic world. She's building the mess hall.
She's built, She's building the dining hall.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
Now eleven Grammy Awards two Emmy Awards, an Oscar nomination.
Don't forget about that one.

Speaker 2 (02:23):
Everyone well, if she's a fucking legend. Everyone was running talent.

Speaker 1 (02:28):
Brandy Carlile, Hey, hey girl, Hey guys, we want to
know you said you're fresh from Disney. Yeah, what are
the vibes? Oh? Really good, really good. Unbelievable because you
do it with the guide and you sort of you
get your your reserve, your dinner dining reservations ahead.

Speaker 3 (02:46):
Exactly, and then you just regress.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Who's there? Are the twins, there are the kids there?

Speaker 3 (02:51):
Usually the twins, always the kids away? Nowadays, Yeah, are
mushroom days at Disney are over? But they did exist.

Speaker 1 (02:57):
They did exist, and they're fun when they last. Yeah yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
But did you hit up Universal as well?

Speaker 3 (03:04):
No, we do the California's Great Adventure. We do that
up and then we do Disney, and I try to
do Pirates of the Caribbean four or five times.

Speaker 1 (03:12):
And knows that because there's so much to see.

Speaker 3 (03:14):
This is nostalgia. I didn't get Disneyland until I was
twenty one. Twenty one was my first trip as an
adult with like my much order older girlfriend who older,
much older.

Speaker 1 (03:24):
So she was like I want to show you something exactly.
It's She's like, I got to show you something you've
never seen Disneyland.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yeah, it's so predatory.

Speaker 1 (03:36):
Was it a lot of older women in the beginning?

Speaker 3 (03:38):
Oh yeah, I mean only yeah, really, yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:40):
This is what people don't realize.

Speaker 3 (03:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:44):
See, Matt and I even come from did you ever
do Were you ever a cregslist? Guy?

Speaker 1 (03:47):
No, I never did crugslist.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
Can you tell me what that is?

Speaker 2 (03:50):
Oh? So you did credits. That's the sort of the listings,
the classifieds of the Internet, right, But they were there
was a personal section.

Speaker 3 (03:59):
Okay, okay, yeah, where it was M for M.

Speaker 2 (04:01):
M for F, F for M, F F T for T,
T M for T. Like what it really was like
a big tent for whatever whatever you wanted, and it
would be people there being like a non guy.

Speaker 1 (04:14):
It was.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
It was just it was just where you went before
the grinder days and before the and it was like
we were in a desert. It was a place of finding.
It was a place of finding. And so I feel
like there was a long there was a while where
I felt like I was identifying it as like, well,
I guess I'm just dating older man, even though that

(04:36):
never really that was that didn't really come to pass.
It was just like, well, it's just the people that
I'm like gravitating towards are like the older.

Speaker 3 (04:43):
What age were you when that was.

Speaker 2 (04:44):
Like, oh my god, like nineteen.

Speaker 3 (04:46):
Like that's what I'm talking about. I would have considered
it like a description of type for me.

Speaker 4 (04:51):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:51):
Really yeah, like almost like its own orientation. How much
older were I mean the one like at least ten
years yeah, but fifteen awesome, and maybe anywhere under twenty
would be like between fifteen when it would be like
really excellent.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
Sure, gosh, do is there a different is there different
is there a different math to it with lesbians?

Speaker 3 (05:16):
I'm not exactly sure. I think it's linked to like profession.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
Yeah is that so? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, well, like we were talking about boat captain, we
were like police officers, like firefighters. It could just be
me I'm talking about, but I remember going to the
pride parades in Seattle, like on Broadway in the nineties
and just standing on the sidelines with these baby dykes,
just like losing my mind for like the cops when
they would.

Speaker 4 (05:41):
Walk through you.

Speaker 3 (05:42):
Yeah, any authority figures sort of or just like yeah,
and they had to be just kind of like dykey
and awesome and had like warm and evolved and do
you know what I mean, well traveled, and it was
just like it was kind of a way that I
can maybe finish getting raised in some ways.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
Like yeah, they saw the old soul in YouTube.

Speaker 3 (06:00):
Yeah I think so.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
Yeah, Because when were you going into the city? When
were you going to Seattle to like be with your
with your fellow queers.

Speaker 3 (06:09):
As soon as I could, Like I didn't get a
driver's license till really quite late, but I would get
rides like to the city, and I would go busk
at Pike Place markets and then I would go and
take my busking money up to like Broadway and you know,
sit in the outside of the gay bar where I
could you know, have like a mocktail, you know, and

(06:31):
and just watch gay people live their lives. Because I
didn't meet a gay person until after I came out
of the closet. I never knew.

Speaker 2 (06:39):
One, so then and this is such a naive question.
So then, like what is what is your way of
like knowledge with your with your with your gayness without
a person there to like mirror that or like or
like download something into you.

Speaker 3 (06:56):
I think it was a combination of like just a
cultural recognition of gayness in music and film and television,
and then also just like puberty kicking in and realizing
I was thinking about kissing girls.

Speaker 2 (07:10):
Yeah am I saying?

Speaker 1 (07:12):
How did you know?

Speaker 3 (07:14):
Of those two things?

Speaker 1 (07:15):
But I think that the interest element of it is like, also,
we're just dying to talk to people about the things
that we love even now. Yeah, that's kind of why
we even have this. Yeah, I love this thing. It's
like it's like it's never hard to like talk to
people about what they love, and that is it's like

(07:36):
when you're that age, you're just dying to be seen
and what you've been told or what you've been feeling
is like a niche thing. Yeah, you know. And then
you can say the name of these artists and like
you can say, like whatever it is, and they have
the discography as well, and it's okay, my.

Speaker 3 (07:54):
People, yeah, and these little dog whistles and breadcrumbs and
the whole thing. And then you know, your friend group
but gets kind of based on that or built on
that and becomes like your personality in a way.

Speaker 2 (08:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
Yeah, that's how I felt.

Speaker 1 (08:06):
Seattle is such a great city, like we went. We
went the first time we ever went. We did and
it was like an I don't think so honey live
show and the space was was it all ages?

Speaker 2 (08:19):
It was an all ages venue and it was dry
and it was dry.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
And it was like Seattle and it was it was.
We left the show, which was bad, and we were like, Seattle, no, suck, no.

Speaker 2 (08:30):
No.

Speaker 1 (08:31):
Now that I've gone back, I'm like, Seattle rocks. No.

Speaker 4 (08:35):
No.

Speaker 1 (08:35):
Every time I do my show there, it's always the
best show. Like I come back every time being like
Seattle has it and.

Speaker 2 (08:41):
I need to wipe my slate clean from because I
even been back to see it to Seattle since since
twenty nineteen and the weather was bad. You know, it's
always all these things, and I was like, I need
to go back and like really experience it.

Speaker 3 (08:55):
Well, Seattle is like the older lesbian. She makes you
earn it. You have to go back, like we're almost
Canadian in that way. Yeah, we're not going to show
you our cards like all at once. You have to
come back two or three times and then maybe you know.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
Seattle doesn't chase you. No, Seattle, Seattle, Seattle. Actually that's
the real culture. Number ten. Seattle doesn't chase you. You chase Seattle.
But Seattle has actually given you so much when you
think about it, because not only this, not only all
this like formative experience and culture and like your musical
beginnings and so much, but also Seattle being the setting

(09:29):
of Grey's anatomy. Yes, how many gay we get and
women are like I found you because of the story.

Speaker 3 (09:37):
Being on grass of them really everyone that was how
I did it was yeah, and it wasn't just the story.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
The story was like the fourth third or fourth song. Yeah,
you were up in the soundtrack and son now Grays.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
Like I feel like like I'm alumni of like when
I see the cast, like when we're it's like, this
is a thing that happened. I'm so glad you guys
realized this.

Speaker 2 (09:57):
Yeah, because they would use your songs in all the promo.
What was it before the story? Because because it was
it was like it was like pre story. I was like, oh,
there's just like amazing singer Brandy Carlyle, and then yeah
and then ship like blew up.

Speaker 3 (10:09):
Yeah, there was a few songs and there were there
were a couple of songs. I even went in and
recorded just four grades and antimy uh huh.

Speaker 1 (10:16):
Yeah. I mean they also like they were noted for
having like the best soundtrack on on.

Speaker 2 (10:21):
Televion Alec Patsavas. And now she's the head of music
at Netflix. Yeah, she's supervisor and she was the music
superviser for the for the OC. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (10:29):
She just she's cool. She's cool as fuck. Oh she
did the OC too. I was gonna say I would
have wanted to date her.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
Yeah, I would have wanted to date she was taking
it to Disneyland. I think, so as many times as
you want.

Speaker 3 (10:40):
To get twenty not just twenty one?

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Do you know er fight Master?

Speaker 4 (10:46):
No.

Speaker 1 (10:46):
So they were on Gray's Anatomy for years. They were
playing like the first non binary resident resident there for years.
You and they're also a musician. Okay, that's a good connection. Okay, great,
that's a good spiritual.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
It's a good spiritual connection.

Speaker 1 (10:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (10:59):
But I feel like this is you you sort of
like still have this even though I feel like you've
always had this like grunge like quality to the music.
I feel like you never have to like claim it
or like sort of like brandish it too much, because
it's just like you are like a Washingtonian and like

(11:22):
it's like, I.

Speaker 3 (11:24):
Feel like this is making me feel so good right now,
really say yes, just that you're like you're acknowledging or
noticing that those elements of grunge and like my City
and just kind of like shameless dramatic rock and roll.
That's sort of like uther's under the surface of everything
I do because.

Speaker 2 (11:41):
It's under the start, because I wouldn't remember, because would
you ever say that it's like been surface in like
in the albums.

Speaker 3 (11:47):
I mean, there are like a few times where it'll
become over, but it's always there. There's always this kind
of like there's always this I'm on the edge of
saying fuck it all the time. Yeah, and my voice
as fuck it all the time and falls apart and
breaks apart in ways that I'm not ready for, I'm
not prepared for, but like that I'm willing to just

(12:08):
kind of tumble through that what's gonna happen mentality when
I'm singing big and I don't ever want to like
lose that. I don't want to learn how to control
that part of it. Wow, But I do at test,
like I think that's a seattle, molecular seattle, like infiltration
into my singing.

Speaker 2 (12:25):
Where it's like where it's like the music like Seattle
having its own like music row, like Seattle having this
like tradition as like a music town kind of like
is the hub for you to then be like I'm
gonna go I'm going to have this relationship with Dolly
for country, not not not like not like not like

(12:46):
genre but jen but like with Joni for folk and
with like Elton for like rock. You know, it's like
it all kind of the Seattle is the source for
that for you.

Speaker 3 (12:54):
Yeah, it's like the lens through which I see all
of them too, you know what I mean. So, but
all those things are also definitely true. I'm having like
really a lot of nostalgia in my mind right now
because of the stuff you're saying.

Speaker 1 (13:07):
Well, this is what this thing that you're saying about
your voice not necessarily being prepared of everything, but you
singing big. Like one of the things I was talking
to Doug our coach about was like again I'll say
the fearlessness of your vocal and to hear you say
your voice is not always prepared for it, but you
are singing big. You are just an instrument, And I

(13:27):
feel like you sing like in fearless ways, and I
guess what I mean by that is like those breaks
in your vocals, like the ways that you approach vibrato,
in the ways that you really are an actor in
your songs. Like there's so many elements of your music
and even the songs that you cover which are so gargantuan,

(13:49):
and there are such tasks. Is there anything that scares
you vocally? And if so, like what are those things?
Because when you listen to you, you're listening to someone
without fear m As a listener.

Speaker 3 (14:01):
It all really scares me vocally, and really, yeah, absolutely,
Like I'm always kind of like sipping on this perfect
cocktail of paralyzing fear and like confidence in the belief
that whatever happens is meant to happen.

Speaker 1 (14:15):
You would never know. And you write such difficult stuff
for yourself.

Speaker 3 (14:18):
I know, what does my wife say? She's like, you've
creative a rule for your own back with that when
frenzy you have to hit that, not.

Speaker 1 (14:27):
Like what have I tasked myself with again for every show?

Speaker 2 (14:31):
But it's a choice that you're making because it's like
Marin was saying, it's like like you are singing in
the original key.

Speaker 3 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I mean I will change that
key if I need to, no problem. No, I mean
I want to go straight. I want to be Leonard
Collen and Johnny Cash like when I'm in mind, He's like,
I'll drop that. Yeah, but like right now it's the
original key. And honestly, because I am not like living
the same lifestyle I was when I was younger, it's
actually easier for me to sing than it was before.

Speaker 1 (14:57):
So what is that? What have you cut out entirely?

Speaker 4 (15:00):
Oh god?

Speaker 3 (15:00):
I mean alcohol when I'm on tour. Yeah, yeah, and
my like rules around eating and what I eat and
when I eat and what I do. And then I
have a vocal coach like you guys do.

Speaker 1 (15:14):
So it's a little different.

Speaker 4 (15:16):
It's a little different.

Speaker 3 (15:17):
It's like very un sexy, but like I become completely
owned by my ability to hit the notes. Yeah, that
is like I'm an athlete. Every night, I'm thinking of
it that way. And I don't know why I envision this,
like maybe you guys do this. I don't think the
audience does what I think they do. We just sit
there and go can she do it?

Speaker 1 (15:35):
Can she do it?

Speaker 3 (15:36):
That's what I think that they're all doing. It's not
what they're all like.

Speaker 1 (15:39):
They're like like Olympic judges, like that note was not clean.
But is it what you do?

Speaker 2 (15:47):
It is we projected onto the audience, Oh as audience.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
Is that what you do?

Speaker 4 (15:52):
I think?

Speaker 1 (15:52):
I think. I mean, I'd rather it all be perfect,
but I do I think something that you probably now
know from years of touring at the level that you do,
which is there there for the experience, not they're not
there in judgment, They're they're in excitement. And you know,
I've been playing I've been on the opposite coast of

(16:13):
you every single time. But my best friend Melissa and
her husband saw you at at the Key Forum and
Michael had had never seen you and never like, wasn't familiar.
But Melissa and her best friend Taylor were like huge fans,
and so he got there and they said they were
all sobbing the entire time, and then Michael Turner was like,

(16:35):
I love Brandy Carl and that he wasn't familiar, but
then he became like such a die hard fan. And
your live experience, they said it was so clear that
everyone was there almost in like pilgrimage, and that it
was the Lesbian Convention, and that everyone was incredibly keyed
in and respectful and everyone left in a very in

(16:56):
a very tight formation, and it was a real it
was beautiful, ossional, almost possessional, and but that the experience
of being there was like truly like everyone was there
just in excitement, so they were not like, well she
missed that one because it doesn't happen a I know,
well it doesn't.

Speaker 3 (17:14):
I know that you're what you're saying is true, and
I'm one day going to be able to fully like
let that end and stop believing that when I sing
it's about to be scored by Olympic And then I think,
when I do let that go, that's when I'm gonna
do the real shit. Yeah, Like that's when I'm gonna
take some real risks, you know, because I actually think
it might be just a little bit repressive and something

(17:37):
I'm like gonna untangle ye before I'm.

Speaker 2 (17:39):
Fifty, before you're fifty. Now do you feel does this
sentence ring true to you? I perform behave differently because
I feel like I'm being watched like that, Like the
idea of being perceived is the thing that's like.

Speaker 3 (17:56):
Yeah, well, yeah, I mean it is it that way
for you, Like, as we've become public people, it's hard
not to think that way. And it has like positives
and negatives, like you do something normal at home, something domestic,
and you're like, oh, that was cute, wishs ten thousand
people saw that, and then you know, but then you

(18:19):
have like normal everyday interpersonal mistakes, you know, like you know,
I'm a little bit too hard in one of my kids,
or something goes wrong, and then I feel like extra
sort of scolded by people that aren't there.

Speaker 1 (18:34):
I see.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
But ye, I feel like you've really done. You've you've
made a beautiful thing happen for yourself, not made it
happen for yourself, but you have been surrounded by people
like I think that's like a beautiful sort of like
Hallmark in the Brandy Carlos story, which is like you
are like you're with the twins, You're with Catherine, the
kids are with you, like you you are not alone? Yeah,

(19:00):
you know, and that I think is.

Speaker 3 (19:02):
Being alone is the worst.

Speaker 2 (19:04):
And you guys are talking about like you and I
think you and Colbert are talking about this. I feel
like it's like being alone as being alone is fine
until it's not and I love it. I love it
too much.

Speaker 3 (19:16):
My wife loves it too.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
So then how do you how does this?

Speaker 2 (19:18):
How does this work for for the two of you
where it's like you don't like being alone but she.

Speaker 3 (19:21):
Does, Like, no, what about you?

Speaker 1 (19:25):
Do you? I know I do need to be alone sometimes,
like Phraser and I are distant, So it's like if
I wasn't okay with that, that would be a horrible thing. Yeah, no,
I feel like you.

Speaker 3 (19:35):
It's the key is like if you don't like to
be alone, like I really don't like to be alone,
is that you you kind of learn to be alone
with someone, Like if you come over to my house,
I'm not going to stop everything and host you, like
I'm going to let you in and show you where
the refrigerator is. But whatever I was doing, I'm probably
going to go back to doing it and you can
join me. You cannot join me. I want you there,
but I don't want to have to interact, right, you

(19:57):
know what I mean? And so like that is just
I've just kind of been able to hold onto that.
It's weird because the more people you put around you
and the more intimacy you're able to sort of cultivate.
I think that like the more you can get away
with that shit, Yeah, and then you.

Speaker 2 (20:11):
Never Hey, I just come in, there's the fridge, Like
what do you.

Speaker 3 (20:14):
Mean, Well, I just think people can play like I
don't get to be alone with I don't get to
do what I want.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
Yeah, you're right, You're right, well, being being alone with
someone so being alone while someone else is there, Yeah,
is also a marker of true comfort with that person. Yeah,
you know what I mean. If I'm ever feeling like
I have to fill the silence a lot or entertain
all the time, I'm like, well, this is supposed to
be a person that's close to me in my space,

(20:41):
Like I don't have to like be talking the whole time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
You know it's but it is I don't know for me,
Like I I sometimes think like of silence means like
it's going bad.

Speaker 2 (20:52):
Yes, yeah, totally.

Speaker 3 (20:54):
That's also because you guys like live in a city,
like a major city. Do you think you'll always live in.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
New York? He's headed out, No, you have designs? Where
would you go?

Speaker 3 (21:07):
Because, like I do, I think that like being able
to step in and out of show business and the
music business is like a really kind of peaceful away
for me to keep my sort of inner piece and
compass point in the right direction. I'm not saying that
you can't live in a major city and be in
show business and not step out, but like, do you
ever see yourself living outside of sure?

Speaker 2 (21:29):
Like I honestly, I'm like, I'm so jealous of you,
like you have like you're building a dining hall. Yeah,
that's amazing.

Speaker 3 (21:37):
Literally right now it's called it's called the commons. Are
you making a joke as I really am?

Speaker 2 (21:41):
No, No, I'm tracking your I'm tracking this. Where are
you with it?

Speaker 3 (21:49):
It's actually going with me. Just I just a little
while ago, got the text that we passed framing inspection,
so we can.

Speaker 2 (21:55):
Let's what are we thinking?

Speaker 1 (21:58):
What's the color?

Speaker 3 (21:59):
What do the color drenching thing?

Speaker 2 (22:01):
What's that?

Speaker 3 (22:01):
Maybe it's just like too much social media, but like
I'm just so beyond the millennial gray thing, Like I
want to go like all one bold color, like a
cobalt blue or a forest green.

Speaker 1 (22:11):
I love that paint everything.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
Don't be afraid of a color, don't be afraid of
a color. I've got, I've got what it's called superior
blue in my own case where it's it's it's in
the kitchen, and then it's echoed in the in the
primary and the guest room is like a forest green,
and so I feel like this is good.

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Speaker 2 (23:18):
These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and
Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure,
or prevent any disease. US living in a city does not.

Speaker 1 (23:33):
When the grid goes down, He's going to Ontario.

Speaker 2 (23:36):
I'm going to Ontario. That's what you mean.

Speaker 3 (23:37):
That's I was gonna ask, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, where
are you gonna go?

Speaker 2 (23:40):
I'm gonna go to Ontario.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
He's got a plan, all right. It scares me. It
could happen tonight. But that's what they're saying. That's what
they're saying. It's tonight. We're recording this on what's today,
April seven? April seven? Anyways. Uh, but like he has
a whole plan for when the grid goes down, and
the gays have started to talk about when the grid
goes down. I feel like the lesbians have been talking

(24:02):
about when the gro goes down a very long time. Prepared.
Yeah yeah, yeah, it's big, prep, it's big, it's.

Speaker 2 (24:08):
Prepper, it's prepper culture.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
I think lesbians are better preppers than gay guys.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
You want us? You want us?

Speaker 4 (24:13):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (24:15):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (24:15):
Could you guys be rural gays?

Speaker 1 (24:17):
II? Those shoes and I'm like, yeah, no, he's sort
of in a cosplay right now, and that would suggest doorsiness.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
That's cosplay. But I'm from a lineage of farmers. I'm
from a linear to farms.

Speaker 1 (24:29):
I'm from a lineage of farmers, says Bow and Yang.
It's true. Yeah, I'm for millennia's of hairdressers and gym teachers,
so we can look cute while we do the works
with the gym teacher.

Speaker 4 (24:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
Past the presidential fitness test back in the day. I
don't know if they do that anymore. I think they do.
But in the President's name, who can climb a rope? Though?

Speaker 2 (24:52):
We were supposed to do this so hard to do?
We had to do the sit in reach. Sitting reach
was okay.

Speaker 1 (24:59):
Then there's the the wall set that wasn't part of
the test.

Speaker 4 (25:03):
Good one.

Speaker 1 (25:03):
We had to do pull ups okay, push ups, crunches,
the mile run, and there was one other thing.

Speaker 2 (25:11):
I don't remember it.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
I think there was five elements of it. Maybe I
just did five.

Speaker 3 (25:14):
But that was a rope climb.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
The rope.

Speaker 1 (25:16):
The rope climb is not something I'm familiar with.

Speaker 2 (25:19):
Oh, you guys didn't have to climber Washington crazy Town?

Speaker 1 (25:22):
Yeah, you could.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
Climb a rope and could you could? I couldn't even
hang off the thing. No, I would just just drop it.

Speaker 2 (25:29):
What are we getting yet?

Speaker 1 (25:30):
There? No? What was even that? Yeah? But all I
ever wanted when I was younger was to have was
to be at a fancy enough high school that had
like the Project Adventure shit. Oh you know what I mean,
Like they would have all this shit that was like
you know, you could zip line and you could do
that and this. And now it's like I watched the
Survivor Challenges and I'm like, I couldn't get through fifteen
seconds of this, Like I could, but it wouldn't be fun.

(25:53):
When I was younger, I was like, I can't wait
to be on Survivor one day. And now I'm like
that looks hard.

Speaker 4 (25:59):
Oh hard?

Speaker 3 (26:00):
Did you ever watch that show Naked and Afraid? Oh
my god, I have watched every season of Naked and Afraid?

Speaker 1 (26:04):
You love that?

Speaker 3 (26:05):
Would you do it with my children? I would not
be able to be naked and I wouldn't be afraid,
but I could do alone. Except for that, I'd have
to be alone. And they did have one season where
they could pair you. Okay, yeah, so, but I would
definitely be a pretty good in one of those situations.

Speaker 2 (26:22):
For a little while, I was Catherine outdoors.

Speaker 1 (26:24):
Do you know what?

Speaker 3 (26:25):
She's so like a Londoner, Like I'm talking, you know
what you.

Speaker 1 (26:30):
Spoke a little bit like your British partner. I do this.

Speaker 2 (26:34):
It's happening, it's beautiful. I love it.

Speaker 3 (26:36):
We've been married fifteen years now and I hear it
all the time, and myself, I'm like, what the fuck
is that?

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Nob it's good, it's good. I always go the word
I can't that he hates when I do this, but
I go who He's like, that's not a thing, it's not.
It's very a phrase about. My wife always says.

Speaker 3 (26:57):
I can't, I can't, I can't can I go you can't,
you can't, And she gets so annoying with me when
I do that.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
It's RP is it received pronunciation?

Speaker 1 (27:05):
I mean, they also.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
Don't hear themselves end a ending words in R like bra.
They can't say bra they say, and I know they
don't hear that. Are you tell them they put an
R on that. They just like flat out No, sky
is not blues.

Speaker 2 (27:21):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (27:22):
I love every second of them speaking.

Speaker 3 (27:27):
It's so gorgeous.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
It really is. You guys ever like fight, No, he
doesn't raise his voice.

Speaker 2 (27:33):
Okay, what's her fighting style?

Speaker 1 (27:34):
Oh god, she's she rips it.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
Oh my god, she's Yeah, she's absolutely fireball fireball. Oh
my god, that girl will fight. I mean I have
never fought so much in my life. Yeah, and I
mean I had brothers and sisters. I have like a
brother that's like a year younger than me. That girl
can fight and then just over it and a second
like it never happened.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
And now is that compartmentalizing or is that it actually
is over?

Speaker 3 (27:59):
Just over?

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Okay, yes, moves on.

Speaker 2 (28:02):
I don't think. I don't think gay guys can do that.
And I don't mean I don't mean to generalize with
with with lesbians. I just think gay guys they hold
a fucking grudge.

Speaker 1 (28:09):
Oh no, there's grudge holding in the lesbian community. Come on,
let's go.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
I mean I don't hold a grudge because I'm actually
so judgmental that I would judge myself for holding a grudge.
So what I do is worse than grudges. It's very intense.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
I wanted to ask you about being judgmental because in
the song Jony, you speak about how she laughs at
all the pop stars. So do you and Jony privately
just rip the ship out of the pop girlies or
do you love everyone.

Speaker 2 (28:43):
Like you know?

Speaker 3 (28:45):
My late millennial feminism won't let me rip the ship
out of any pop.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Up. Some pop guys with her. I love it. So
see we we actually are the same, like the pop girlies.
We love them all them the pop boys look on
this exactly fair game. Yeah, absolutely, she gets on them.

Speaker 3 (29:04):
I'm like, oh, John, they're really young, I mean.

Speaker 1 (29:09):
Them, I mean she does not love that though. If
anyone's like fall I'm a pop girl. I want to
hear Joni Mitchell drag me because.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
She she's dragged me. She drags me like all the time.

Speaker 1 (29:24):
Face. Its probably a term of endearment. Yeah, oh no,
it's heaven. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (29:28):
You these some of these Jony between Joany and Elton,
they really do they get on your ass?

Speaker 1 (29:36):
Easy ones? Yeah yeah, like you picked the the icons
of art.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
The most formidable and intimidating, but soulful and just hear
human beings. They're so here, they are so present. They
do not play by the same rules we play by,
and it's a powerful presence to be in. Let me
tell you what.

Speaker 2 (30:00):
Wow, I loved because I finally because I watched the
doc but like after the last year became to just
and now I watched I watched the the like the
thirty minute film of You, Of You and What Andrew
Watt and now I'm writing together. I loved there was
a Laura Nero song that you guys covered that I
loved because people forgot about Laura Neiro.

Speaker 3 (30:17):
I would be a Laura Nero fan.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
It's such a sad gay.

Speaker 2 (30:22):
I'm a sad gay.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
I feel like sad gay is a thing, like it's
becoming a thing. Like we talked about Girls Just Wanna
This last year. I saw more gay men at Girls
Just Wanna than I have ever seen.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
We're sadder than ever, sadder than ever.

Speaker 3 (30:37):
Yeah, and I love it because, well, the taste in
music is just off the charts.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
It's We're gonna see them all at folkne this weekend.

Speaker 2 (30:45):
She's going on the same time as Sabrina Carridge, So
we're no, we're not that.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
Can I say that might be my I don't think so, honey.
At the end of this episode is Coachella said times
have come out and we're going this weekend. I can't
believe what they're making people choose. I know it's Twigs
and oh yeah, yeah, why should people have to choose?

Speaker 3 (31:04):
That was gotten very high pitched.

Speaker 1 (31:07):
I haven't even warmed up. You're looking at two countertenors.

Speaker 2 (31:11):
I am not a countertenor.

Speaker 1 (31:13):
Well, the joke's on you because you are.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
Wait, we will I and we we're just inviting ourselves
to Girls Just Wanna. You don't have to put us.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
It's your hosting. We promised if you.

Speaker 3 (31:23):
Come to Girls Just Wanna with me next year, you
will be like my guests of honor. We will have
such a good time and we will sing a night
of the living nineties, will come up with one ninety song.
It can be as sadd as gay as we want.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
Yes, we'll do it. Oh yeah, we're like Meredith Brooks.

Speaker 3 (31:38):
We're talking. Oh you know some low ath fair moment.

Speaker 1 (31:41):
Yep, this is what we needed back and you knew it. Yeah,
you knew it. Yeah, because you know so, I am
of the experience of my parents did not let me
watch MTV. Okay, so v H one defined me and
they were the ones in the late nineties giving all
the love to Like, my idea of sexuality is not
like you know, Christina Aguilera, like writhing on the ground,

(32:04):
Like I appreciate that, but like my idea of sexuality
is like Shania Twain walking on the beach. Oh yeah,
while like like someone strummed a guitar and that was
then Lilith Fair and it was like all like it
was like oh my god, like yeah, like you said,
like Meredith Brooks and like McLaughlin and like like Natalie
and Brulia at that time, like you know, god, there

(32:27):
was also another one. My god, no, Natalie Merchant. This
opened the door.

Speaker 2 (32:35):
So it's that it's it's that sad gay.

Speaker 3 (32:37):
That that is a sad gay.

Speaker 1 (32:40):
You don't have to be said, but that being your
like you know.

Speaker 2 (32:43):
Proclivity, that is you and you are you welcome them
with open arms to girls.

Speaker 1 (32:49):
Oh yeah, because it's made for you.

Speaker 2 (32:52):
Like a like a fun lively place.

Speaker 3 (32:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
Well that's the thing.

Speaker 3 (32:56):
It's like, it's that's what that's what the sad gays do.
And by the way, strap person can be a sad gay.
It's like it is like mixing like on a bashi
shameless expression you know, of of emotion, unguarded with just
like lighthearted this and overused word but joy.

Speaker 1 (33:16):
Yes, yeah, just arms up over your.

Speaker 3 (33:18):
Head, dancing under the stars and screaming and yelling like
there's no tomorrow and then being able to like listen
to a Jewel song from you know nineteen ninety four.
Oh God, laying on your bedroom floor just crying to
everybody hurts by Iram, Oh my god.

Speaker 2 (33:33):
My god.

Speaker 1 (33:34):
Yeah, by the way, Jewel, just by the way, Jewels,
by the way, Jewel, Like foolish Games, that's my karaoke song.
I need to be a girls just wanna.

Speaker 2 (33:42):
You guys should sing Foolish Games together.

Speaker 3 (33:44):
Me and Jewel or me and Matt, you and mas Yeah,
I think me and Matt too.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
I think I think that would be really amazing. But
you were meant for me. I remember, like I chemically
altered that I loved Jewels.

Speaker 3 (33:57):
It was the it was the pause before the ah
man for It's the pause for.

Speaker 1 (34:04):
The last word. And there's also like she she released
the album and then the single versions like there's a
different version of you or meant for me, and there's
a different version of Foolish Games, and like they do that,
they would do that back then. Back then there was
like three versions of everything.

Speaker 3 (34:18):
When I listened to it now here she has so
many voices, like and there was such an emotional so
many voices. But when I think when she goes into
the bit we're just like like that. I'm like, how
did she not loses?

Speaker 2 (34:28):
Like hook?

Speaker 3 (34:29):
But it's like I felt the emotion from that. Yeah,
but like for some reason it goes into something where
it sounds like it could almost be parody, and then
is working.

Speaker 1 (34:39):
Yes, that's fearless singing.

Speaker 4 (34:40):
Yeah, well I.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
Literally replaced her voice. That must have been what it
was because and then it's so different.

Speaker 3 (34:50):
There's some Shakira in there.

Speaker 1 (34:51):
Yeah, maybe the origins you know that shakira?

Speaker 2 (34:57):
Yeah, is that you're referring to.

Speaker 1 (34:59):
I mean there's like a yawn, you know, the Whi's
the general.

Speaker 3 (35:04):
Yon No, No, I'm a grown woman.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
Girls. Yeah. Cursive sing Oh that's the other thing.

Speaker 3 (35:17):
That's my thoughts are, where did it start? What started it?
I can't find it? Like I can find the origins
of all kinds of singing that turned into a thing, right,
and then the originator of that singing doesn't bother me,
whereas like the ripple effect of it does, of correct,
But I can't find the origins of that. I'm talking

(35:39):
early two thousands is when I first started hearing instead
of love Live. Yeah you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (35:46):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (35:46):
Yeah, No, I'm also trying to find it, but it
is it did it took over?

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Yeah, it took over. Yeah, and it became a thing
like no one can say birds everybody his bides.

Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, my thing, my pet peeve and look some of
our some of our favorites do. This is just saying
the word goddamn to like fill in to like fill
in the scanson and the syllables.

Speaker 3 (36:06):
I've done that.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
I think.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
No, I think it's fine. I just think it's been popular.

Speaker 1 (36:10):
I never I never aware, but I'm sure I did.

Speaker 4 (36:12):
No, I did it.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
I remember now it's in the it's on the album
what album?

Speaker 2 (36:16):
Is it?

Speaker 3 (36:17):
A goddamn?

Speaker 4 (36:17):
Liar?

Speaker 3 (36:18):
I say, could have said anything, but I said goddamn.

Speaker 1 (36:21):
Do you agree though? Was goddamn a placeholder or do
you stand Tanto's town in your use of goddamn? I
don't know.

Speaker 3 (36:26):
I think it's like vacation, Bible School, Sunday School, Ajana's
language for like the worst thing you can say. So
as soon as we get punk rock, we put it
into anything we get. But that's probably just a nineties
baby thing. I don't know, is it not? Goddamn is
like the worst thing you can say? Yeah, No, you
cannot say what words could you not say? Okay, So
when I was really young, it was weird things like dang.

Speaker 1 (36:47):
And heck and we're not permitted to say day. No,
it was weird.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
It's it's totally weird because like, my parents are not
strict people at all. In fact, I'm very free range
human being. But like, for a minute there, when I
was like really young, there were like you couldn't say
you didn't like something. You had to say you didn't
care for it. You couldn't say dang, you couldn't say heck,
you couldn't say shoot. Anything that was like reminiscent of

(37:12):
a curse.

Speaker 1 (37:12):
And it was just like weird.

Speaker 3 (37:13):
Odds was off the table, off the table. But now
that I have kids, you know, I WinCE when they
say dang and heck, and I'm like, keep your mouth shut.
That's some dysfunctional shit you do not need to carry forward.

Speaker 2 (37:24):
Interesting that it.

Speaker 1 (37:25):
Still let them say dangam heck.

Speaker 3 (37:26):
Yes, for God's sake, my.

Speaker 2 (37:28):
Parents are playing a prank on you. Huh do you
think your parents are playing a prank on you?

Speaker 1 (37:31):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (37:32):
Because right now I cannot imagine my parents having a
rule of any kind.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
Of Oh good, Yeah, because they're because the let the
kids say what they want.

Speaker 3 (37:40):
I don't know what that was. That was some weird
like that was some weird you know. Nineteen eighty four,
how lindsay Late Great Planet Earth, Heaven's Gate cold religious
movement that happened in the late eighties and early nineties
and led the people of my parents' generation to go
making nuts, and we're seeing the repercussions.

Speaker 2 (38:03):
Of it are Yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:05):
Well, it's interesting that you just mentioned entering into the
nineties because we are now at the point of the
show where we ask you about your culture, your form
of culture. So, Brandy Carlisle, what was the culture that
made you say culture was for you?

Speaker 3 (38:20):
Well, there were so many things. I feel like I
had such a rich era to sort of come of
age in. I was born in nineteen eighty one, so
in nineteen ninety two ninety three, country music sort of
got big, but Scout and Boogie came out. Yeah, okay,

(38:41):
And while country music is getting big, there is a
lot happening in gay culture. Tom Hanks and the Philadelphia Films.
I heard the Indigo Girls the first time. In that soundtrack,
you add Katie Lang and Cindy Crawford on the cover
of Vanity Fair and Katie Langskin in their face shaved
by Cindy Crawford is like one of the sexiest gender
bending photos the nineties. And then Katie Lane crosses over

(39:04):
into country music because she was a country music singer,
like an opry queen. Lawrence Welk show. Yeah, you know,
big boned gal from southern Alberta just couldn't call Who's small?
You know, she was like she was the queen in
that sense, you know, for me. And so there's this
intersection happening between queer culture and country music. You know,

(39:26):
Melissa Ethrich comes out with yes I am. What else
was going on? I mean everybody says that. You know,
the Ellen DeGeneres coming out moment nineteenninety seven was monumental,
but there was even stuff before that. It was happening
in TV like but not nothing as important as Ellen
coming out. But you guys remember the audacity of the
Roseanne kiss.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
Oh absolutely, I mean at least.

Speaker 3 (39:50):
It was a wild thing, right, Like there was all
this controversy around like Roseanne bar getting kissed on her show.

Speaker 1 (39:56):
So all this queer.

Speaker 3 (39:57):
Stuff was happening in between nineteen ninety three and nineteen
ninety seven while country music was coming up, and then
country music did this weird thing. It got queer, and
I'm not even sure that the mainstream, like the rest
of the world knew it, but they weren't. We were
dressing like cowboys. All of our gay bars turned into
get names like Timberline and you know, the Trucker and tracks,

(40:20):
and next thing you know, there's all these gay people
line dancing.

Speaker 2 (40:24):
Yep to this day, to this very day, kind of
like a boom again down country and yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:31):
And so I feel like between the era of like
nineteen ninety three and nineteen ninety seven was the birth
of the rural queer. Yes, And so that is a
formative moment in my life because it showed me that
too seemingly diametrically opposed things can coexist.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
And that's like the queerest thing possible, Yeah, exactly, intersecting
these things that no one would ever think to bring together,
and then that paves the way for broke Back Mountain and.

Speaker 3 (41:05):
For and then inevitably exactly allowed to Broke Back Mountain.
In the early two thousands was.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
Boys Don't Cry. I mean, I don't know if you
would call that like country necessary, but there's something rural
about it. There's something like it was.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
Right in that moment they challenged people's sensibility. There was
also a lot of things that came out during that
time that were really important. Boys on the Side came
out Woldburg Wow, and and Mary Lewis Drivers was in
that too, and then uh oh my was that all
Ward time?

Speaker 1 (41:38):
It was just before it was.

Speaker 3 (41:41):
Chris Folks. Elward came after that. But the Bird Cage
with Nathan Lane, well, I still that.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
Is the movie I put on if I need to,
like ye a laugh so wild to know that he
remained closeted publicly through.

Speaker 4 (41:57):
I didn't even know this.

Speaker 1 (41:58):
Yeah, well it was like he he would go out
for interviews alongside Robin and they would ask uncomfortable questions.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
Oprah asked him. Oprah asked Nathan Lane, like so like
just I forget what she asked, specifically Robin Williams like
gets in there and the most respectful way to all
involved is just like that's just like not you know,
we're just here portraying, like we just had so much
fun portraying this couple. Like let's I mean, it's it's
like the.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
Atmosphere like jokes out of it, like he would to like,
you know, steer away from what was completely uncharted terrain.
It's just so funny to think about how maximalist country
music was at that time. Too.

Speaker 3 (42:34):
Well, we had so many divas. That's the other thing too.
It was like there was like you we had your
bet share, yeah, you know, your bet share pop moment,
and then we had we had Reba and we have
wind No Nah Judd by the way, Whina Judd, yeah everything, yeah, exactly,
and so we we definitely had these kind of country divas,

(42:55):
which led to Shania Twain, yes, you know.

Speaker 2 (42:57):
Another Canadian legend like.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Mention and also you know, like I just remember, like,
oh god, one of the best ever is.

Speaker 4 (43:08):
Does He Love You Love Me? Whispers? Whispers?

Speaker 1 (43:21):
And then oh so good music, That's what I mean,
Like that gay ass song like that. You know, every
drag queen is trying to get their other drag queen
to do it with them. But yeah, what is this
like you got if you.

Speaker 3 (43:36):
Know, you know, if you know you know, And that's
what I'm talking about. That is the culture. That is
the cultural moment that most impacted me because it created
a different kind of thinking of expressing.

Speaker 1 (43:50):
Have you connected with Kelly Clarkson about this.

Speaker 3 (43:53):
We never talked about it, but every time you guys
are right, there are we yes. And I also feel
like that's what I mean when I say it's not
just you're really like I feel like.

Speaker 1 (44:03):
When I listened to her, I listened, I feel like
there's like you guys sing from a similar She.

Speaker 3 (44:10):
Can really sing. Yeah, I mean that girl. She is
an actual freak. Her mix like her ability to be
up and she doesn't actually have a head voice, like
it goes all the way to the top. She's crazy
where her head voice would be and there's no break
in it, and it's it's incredible what she can do,
how she can control it. She's steady too.

Speaker 1 (44:30):
I bring her up, Oh God, please, the best ever
because she had like again, like I was like eleven
when Kelly was on American Idol, and American Idol exposed
me so much to the other genres of music because
I think it did for so many kids that age.
And she sing does he Love You? With her idol

(44:52):
Reba McIntyre on American Idol years ago after she had won,
they did like a special and it was like, now
Kelly's going to sing with her idol. It was Reba
McIntyre and they sang does He Love You? And Riba
did her part, and you know, like it was it
was just so great and so hearing you talk about them,
I just wondered, Oh, I'm going.

Speaker 3 (45:10):
To tell you something so much fun. Then here's a
little bit of inside ball for you about McIntyre and
Kelly Clarkson. So I went to the wedding of Blake
Shelton and Miranda Lambert.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
Wow.

Speaker 3 (45:22):
I sang them down the aisle with the story another era, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:25):
Back in the day.

Speaker 3 (45:26):
Not everybody knows this. Yeah, And they had a party
at the end like you would expect, and then it
was karaoke, ah, and everybody was like getting drunk and
singing karaoke, and Kelly Clarkson was there and Reeba McIntyre
was there, and they started singing together and then they
just like didn't get off the stage, like the party
was over, and we had to take these like shuttle

(45:47):
busses to, you know, back to the hotel. And I
remember a whole shuttle bus was waiting for McIntyre and
I could hear her singing fancy from the bus, singing
her own songs on stage, karaokeing with Kelly Clarkson doing
Carmony's and I was like, these bitches are everything everybody
hopes they are and no one knows, but now.

Speaker 1 (46:03):
You know, it's so good. So Red. Also Kelly's cover
of Fancy at the County Center Forget It.

Speaker 3 (46:10):
I remember it all very well looking beggables turned you
gotta do it?

Speaker 1 (46:15):
I know every word?

Speaker 2 (46:17):
Has this been recorded? You singing Fancy?

Speaker 3 (46:20):
I get drunk and sing this all the time, and
I don't even look at the screen. I don't even
glance at it. I know it so well.

Speaker 1 (46:29):
That's one of the best songs ever ever.

Speaker 3 (46:31):
It's so dark. And Bobby Gentry, that's an id. Lights
went out in Georgia, same thing. Oh, that's that whole
she was gonna. No one knows where she is, by
the way, Bobby Gentry, what yeah, do you not know
that she's missing? She's totally missing. She just went poof
and like disappeared, and people have said that they've found
her and like, no one knows where she is.

Speaker 1 (46:53):
Oh my god, that's dark. I feel like she was
the o g Lana Actually, oh yeah, sometimes the butt
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Speaker 2 (47:05):
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and we were there for a bachelor bachelor party. Dold
Kim Booster's bachelor party, and we were going to go
on a swamp tour, and we thought, do we go
the extra hour out of our way to get Londa

(48:20):
del Ray's husband to give us a swamp tour?

Speaker 3 (48:22):
Yes, yes we do.

Speaker 1 (48:23):
We didn't, but we should have really should have. Know
it's a swamp tour your vibe. No, that's just a
b several swamp tours.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
Yeah, I was going to say, you'd love it, but
what Pacific nor the rest is nice where it's like
the humidity is not oppressive.

Speaker 3 (48:36):
In the Northwest is beautiful, but when you get on
the Louisiana you gotta do swamp get Yeah.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
I loved it.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
It was pouring too, but it was kind of good
use the way they the crocodiles crocodiles, the way the
alligators come up like dogs because they're like it's time
to eat them. And it was freakish. I couldn't believe
a dinosaur was on on boat.

Speaker 2 (49:00):
Yeah, but they were so endearing.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
No, they were great.

Speaker 3 (49:03):
Well, and you see them in like the primitive like
part of you know is that they're prehistoric in a way,
and you just like you know you're witnessing something really
interesting people live down there. They're just like fish to them.

Speaker 1 (49:14):
No. My favorite was our boat captain was like, someone asked, so,
how long have you been friends with this alligator and
he goes, oh, we're not.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
Uld and then shows us as pinky with He would
give me he don't get me.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
They don't girl.

Speaker 2 (49:34):
And then we were like, oh my god, it was
they are these are these people are incredible.

Speaker 1 (49:42):
His name was Kelly, Kelly, Kelly Gatt and Kelly, you give.

Speaker 3 (49:47):
Me feel like he is one of my family members.

Speaker 1 (49:49):
Yeah, that feels like he felt family to us by
the end. Yeah, he was surprisingly accepting of our homosexuality.

Speaker 2 (49:56):
We were gay guy, gay guys on that boat, and
he was you play it up for him to It
wasn't played.

Speaker 1 (50:02):
I didn't need to be like when again, I almost
said crocodile When alligat hops on the boat, gay guys
are going to scream, that's the coature. Number six guys
are going to scream.

Speaker 3 (50:11):
Yeah, that's true that you know the first time you
said crocodile.

Speaker 1 (50:16):
He knew right then.

Speaker 2 (50:17):
He was like fund to say, alligators just doesn't not
not a good crocodile is.

Speaker 1 (50:22):
The gay alligator and that's what the coach of number
nine crocodile is the gay alligator. That's it's just crocodiles
live in a different part of the world.

Speaker 2 (50:30):
That's right.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
Now.

Speaker 2 (50:31):
Do you get do you get like I'm going to
say the word fussy about like wildlife identification, because I
feel like, since you're a fisher man, you can you
you of course you have to be like, well, that's
a cod, and that's this, and that's that. I'm like,
it's it's all fish. It's all in the water.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
So are you offended? Are you offended when we say
and fund offended?

Speaker 3 (50:54):
Not about the crocodile thing, but when you say it's
all fish, It's.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
Like, that's crazy. That is a diverse spectrum. That's crazy.

Speaker 2 (51:02):
Walk us through because it's not my culture yet, walk
us through the oceanet but watching you pull up these
these fish, it's it's incredible.

Speaker 3 (51:11):
I am fishing season starts today and yes, this is
my pain through holiday.

Speaker 4 (51:18):
And I am.

Speaker 3 (51:19):
I have my RV is running at home. I will
be in that RV the minute I land and I'll
be headed out to the Straits of Onandafuca to go
and catch lying cod and rockfish. So there are entire
seasons around these species and they can live you know,
you know the fish I'm talking about living twenty to
sixty feet of water, Like by July, I'll be out

(51:39):
in thousands of feet of water fishing for halibut on
you know, underwater plateaus of five hundred feet with electric reels.
And then it's going to be spot prown season and
I'll be dropping you know, spot pron cages four hundred
feet down and catching like drop yeah, yeah, and then
it'll be dungeness crab and.

Speaker 1 (51:57):
Oh I love dungeness crab, the best crab.

Speaker 3 (51:59):
Yeah, this is when we do come up to the Pacific.

Speaker 1 (52:02):
Used to work at a crab restaurant, okay, and Dungeoness
crab by far the best from the Northwest. Oyster oyster that.

Speaker 3 (52:16):
Well, it's originally it would be a Japan but we
we we farm them and we have them around and.

Speaker 2 (52:21):
Pen of course in spots.

Speaker 3 (52:24):
Yeah, it's conducive.

Speaker 2 (52:26):
You you were sorry, you were, you were in the zone.
You were You're you're talking electric electric cages electric.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Oh yeah, there's.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
I'm I'm wrapped.

Speaker 1 (52:37):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (52:38):
Well, there are so many different seasons and so many
different fish and ways to catch them in places to go,
and then all the things that happen around that little
ritual like, oh, you know it's halibuit season, we're going
to go out here and we're gonna get Halbut but
when you're out there, that's when you see the orcas.
Or that's just off the Olympic mountains enough to where
you've got this beautiful mountain view all the time. But
yet's take drama me. Because you're in the swells, everything

(53:00):
has little details like associated with it. And that's why
fishing is like such an immersive culture that you get
into and you just like you speak to people in
the dock in a series of grunts instead of words,
and everybody gets called captain and and nobody's a singer
or you know, it's like everyone's on the same level

(53:20):
in the open seat.

Speaker 1 (53:21):
You ever come face to face with a great white.

Speaker 3 (53:23):
No, we don't really do the shark thing out there,
but you know we see a lot of orcas.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
See they're they're just as as dangerous they.

Speaker 3 (53:31):
Are scary, but they're beautifl they're so beautiful.

Speaker 2 (53:35):
You've got sea lions out there, Oh yeah, they're huge, huge,
I love them.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
They're amazing. I like, they just flop everywhere.

Speaker 1 (53:42):
I agree, they just like slug into the water. What
say you about that phenomenon that was happening with the
Orca whales a couple years ago where they start sort
of strike back.

Speaker 3 (53:53):
Yeah, they're doing that in your it's I do not
know what to say about that. My suspicion is that
there are many things called Orca whales and that these
are totally different critters than what we see up in
the P and W. But so that's what I tell
myself when I'm offshore in my own boat. Yes, but
we have not seen a single aggressive tactic from an

(54:14):
arc of whale west ever.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
I should hope not. Yeah, so you you love this
culture because it is completely outside of what you do professionally.
Let's say, I think so, and that is refreshing and
so therefore it would be just a complete adulteration of
the beauty of fishing if you were to write music
about it, Like if you if you were like, is
there a fishing album in the future? I think if you,

(54:37):
if Brandy Carlo came out with like a yacht rock
fishing album, Wow, I.

Speaker 1 (54:42):
Could do that, Yes you could.

Speaker 3 (54:44):
I could do it.

Speaker 1 (54:45):
I did see I'm gonna.

Speaker 3 (54:48):
Trademarking anything fishing album idea. No, I think it would.

Speaker 4 (54:56):
It would.

Speaker 3 (54:57):
I want fishing to come into my job in in
a different way. I think I've been thinking about it,
about what I could do to make fishing a part
of my job.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
A barge concert, A barge concert.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
Well thoughts on Jimmy Buffett.

Speaker 3 (55:09):
Oh my god, I loved Jimmy Buffett, Oh my god,
so me. I got to be friends with Jimmy Buffett
toward the end of his life that rocks and I
sang at his memorial, Uh, oh you did come Monday, yeah,
saying come Monday.

Speaker 2 (55:25):
I did.

Speaker 3 (55:25):
I did?

Speaker 4 (55:25):
Oh God.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
And before Jimmy died, I could text him from anywhere
in the world and I could.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
Say, Hey, I'm in uh you know, I'm off.

Speaker 3 (55:35):
Of Saint John, and I want to go northwest and
I want to get some TUNEA what do I do?
And he'd go go to bed early tomorrow morning. I
got my guy coming to pick you up, and there'd
be somebody to take me on a boat from the
scent by Jimmy Buffett, or I was sent in boats
by Jimmy Buffett to catch fish. So many freaking times
that he couldn't even come do because he was doing
concerts or on the road. But he just wants other

(55:55):
people to be able to fish.

Speaker 4 (55:56):
Wow. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:57):
And then I would get like phone calls and text
from like random lesbians and they'd be like, I hope
you don't mind. We got your phone number from Jimmy.
It's like that's how he would make friends with random lesbians.
Like on the water, he'd like meet like a lesbian
couple like unloading their boat, and he'd be like, y'all
know Brandy.

Speaker 4 (56:14):
Carlyle, Yeah, like lesbians, gospel.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
Man, beautiful.

Speaker 3 (56:24):
Loved Jimmy Buffet and I love love his wife Jane.

Speaker 4 (56:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
Yeah, I just like he was a fixture in my
life growing up. And my dad was such a parrot
head that we I don't think he knew this was happening,
but he collected parrots to the point where our whole
back room was just a parrot.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Room in honor of Jimmy.

Speaker 2 (56:42):
But yeah, I saw its gorgeous.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
It was, I mean, there were so many parrots everywhere.
And then I think he's I think he was like,
maybe I have take some some parrots down because Matthew
keeps breaking his friends home and they laugh at the room.

Speaker 4 (56:52):
No, it's not that we know.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
We didn't laugh. It was just a lot of parrots.

Speaker 2 (56:55):
Yeah, it was just it was just shrine to to Jimmy. Yeah,
it was amazing of life.

Speaker 3 (57:00):
Did his family get you into Jimmy Buffett too?

Speaker 4 (57:02):
I know any songs?

Speaker 2 (57:03):
I don't know too many Jimmy Buffett songs I love.
I love them.

Speaker 1 (57:08):
I love Margaritaville, But I'm talking about the deep cuts on.

Speaker 3 (57:12):
He's kind of like Kenny Rogers in that way he has,
like all this other stuff is like folk music. That's
just that's kind of really take you by surprise.

Speaker 4 (57:18):
But he didn't.

Speaker 3 (57:19):
He didn't worry about telling it how it was in
a song, kind of like Willie Nelson.

Speaker 2 (57:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (57:23):
Yeah, but when even as someone who does know where
he's gonna go when the volcano blows, she still doesn't know.

Speaker 3 (57:32):
It's so good not he did not take himself too
seriously brilliant.

Speaker 2 (57:35):
I love that.

Speaker 1 (57:36):
I feel like we're missing well, you know that's actually
kind of not true. That guy high again. I was
gonna say, and now I'm warming up around you. No,
but I feel like I do, like in lyrics. That's
that's why I like Sabrina Carpenter so much, because she
just will fucking and Charlie does this too. It's like
you can tell they were just having fun and following

(57:56):
the fun lyrically, and I think that's what gets people
singing your songs forever. I'm working late because I'm a singer.
Sounds like a Jimmy Buffett lyric. It does you know
what I mean?

Speaker 3 (58:06):
Are you guys in the seamat yet?

Speaker 2 (58:08):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (58:09):
For you because I'm upset.

Speaker 3 (58:11):
I mean I watched everything that that that band does.
I think she is such a star. Yeah, we have
her for like five seconds and then she will be untouchable.

Speaker 1 (58:21):
To all of us. Had a great feeling though, I yeah.

Speaker 3 (58:24):
Because I really don't think anything can stop her. I
think she's a once every five hundred year star.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
It's unlike anything I've heard, and well it's it's it's
I I haven't heard anything like her. Her year country
album like in So Long Angela, Yeah a Coachella and
then and then Jensen McCrae's opening for you, We love
we love her.

Speaker 3 (58:42):
Oh man, you want to talk about lyrics? Lethal lorcist
lethal lyrics.

Speaker 1 (58:47):
So good that we had her performed Massachusetts on the
Culture Awards last year. We gave it a Record of
the Year nom. I literally gotten her DMS. I was like, Hi,
I'm a can you perform her on the show? She came.
Her brother accompanied hertely beautiful form, radiance so amazing. She's
got four voices in one voice like jewel Tube. She
really does. She's fab.

Speaker 3 (59:07):
We did a song together actually, oh really, God has
a hit man. It's really great song.

Speaker 1 (59:14):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:14):
Also we cover Dear Myster President.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
Yes, yeah, Pink the Endigo Girls, She's always a girl.

Speaker 3 (59:22):
Just wanted you guys this. You got to be there.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
We're definitely coming. Oh that's that's gonna be then.

Speaker 2 (59:28):
But then, but then you're gonna be You're You're not
gonna be drinking. We're gonna.

Speaker 1 (59:34):
Want to drink.

Speaker 3 (59:36):
By the end of that, I'm so red and bloated.
The tequila fully has permeated my being at that point.

Speaker 1 (59:44):
Because where are you though? Because where in Mexico is it?
It's PLI to Carmen.

Speaker 3 (59:49):
Oh, it's so fab, it's so good, and everybody there
is like it's just really it's such a free place,
like I can't tell you it's like everybody there is
getting a break from something that holds them back at home,
whether it's like body consciousness or a lack of safety
or acceptance, or there is something that everybody is going

(01:00:12):
to get a temporary break from at that weekend, and
then they're going to recharge their batteries and they're going
to go home and get to work. But it's that
kind of an environment, that's what it's for. We don't
ignore what's wrong with anything or anyone, but it's not
a place to feel self conscious or inhibited. And so
it makes it really.

Speaker 1 (01:00:31):
Wild and it's a cathartic community experience. It is. Yeah,
and it's wild.

Speaker 3 (01:00:36):
Like I'm not going to say it's not wild. We
go crazy. But then but what somebody said about it,
But it's the kind of place where if you lose
your child, they're going to come back to you, fed
with sunscreen on.

Speaker 1 (01:00:47):
More educated, with the better sense of the world.

Speaker 2 (01:00:49):
Yeah, I'm having a kid just so I can lose
them at girls just wanna that's amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:00:57):
When I was seventeen, I was at Low Affair, which
was nineteen ninety seven, and I was just a little
punk ass baby dyke with you know, an inch and
a half of bleach blonde hair. Now I have about
three inches. And I had like a big bucket of
mountain dew and I was like going back up to
my like the mountain dew hut to like get my

(01:01:19):
free refill.

Speaker 1 (01:01:20):
Of mountain dew.

Speaker 3 (01:01:21):
And this like some lesbian standing behind and lying behind me,
and she sees my sunburned shoulders and she's like, what
are you getting? And I was like, I'm getting my
mountain dew refill and she's like, no, you need to
drink some water.

Speaker 1 (01:01:32):
And I was like, I was like, well that's expensive.
The refill is free or whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:01:35):
And she's like, I'm gonna get you some water and
just hold still. I need to get some sound screen
on these shoulders.

Speaker 2 (01:01:41):
Yea.

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
And I mean that was my experience of Little Fair.
I thought I was being so punk rocket and to
go to that festival and.

Speaker 1 (01:01:48):
We actually got married kind of exactly, well, yeah, I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:01:56):
We'll be there. We got to go.

Speaker 1 (01:01:58):
We have to catch the vibe that girls just wanna,
I mean, especially because you know Coachell is going to
make it difficult to see everyone. It's actually time, it
might be time to do anything transition into I don't
think so, honey, because I'm hot on this now.

Speaker 3 (01:02:11):
Yeah, maybe you guys have about one more year of
being Coachella gays and after that, I know, I.

Speaker 1 (01:02:17):
Got another decade. You got another decade.

Speaker 4 (01:02:19):
I see that too. It was like, I love, I love.

Speaker 1 (01:02:21):
What I love about it is that you see everyone
like I loved. A couple of years ago, Debbie Harry
was playing Coachella and I was like it was clear
that like so many people were there just to see Debbie. Yeah,
and I love that about it. I was like, all
you really need is to follow the week.

Speaker 3 (01:02:35):
And I sort of see them.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
And what I also loved is like every year without fair,
without fail. I don't know why I can't spa every
year without fail. I end up discovering someone who's huge
two years later, Like two years ago, we were walking
and I was it was the Gobi Tan and I
was just like, I like what I'm hearing over here,
And it was Olivia Dean And now she's like truly international, great, what.

Speaker 2 (01:03:03):
A what a huge vote of confidence?

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Yeah? God?

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
And like she doesn't write an essay on it, she
just saw her saying and was like that's great.

Speaker 1 (01:03:10):
Yeah, Wow, What do you think it is that gets hurt?
There's like the thoughtful singing, is it the lyrics? What pings? Joan?

Speaker 3 (01:03:18):
I wish I knew.

Speaker 1 (01:03:19):
You don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:03:19):
I don't know. Like there's just certain things like even
you know, I watched the whole Grammys with our sat
next door, you know, which is harrowing. It's the camera
and there were only just there was just a few
things where she was like wow, and Olivia was one
of them.

Speaker 1 (01:03:37):
I love that. Yeah, I love it too, So I
actually never know.

Speaker 3 (01:03:40):
I think it's like some kind of a weird light
detector tests she has for authenticity or something like that,
which is what I hope it is, you know. And
I think that's pretty powerful.

Speaker 1 (01:03:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:03:50):
And like, at the risk of sounding like horribly ageist,
it's like, well, that's proof that like her like her
meter is like very attuned. It's like she's like can
watch something, receive it and be like that's good, that's
unremarkable whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:04:06):
And she's beholden to nothing. She's not beholden to my
opinion of her opinion, you know, it's just whatever she thinks.
I will say she is. I'm not gonna say obsessed.
Because's beneath Johnny to say that word. But she really
loves Bruno Mars. Of course, absolutely loves can until Bruno

(01:04:26):
Mars had played and was just like, you know, it's
not like Johnnie can just get stand up, but she
was like, I'm standing up.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Yeah. Spiritually it was d dancing.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
Yeah, that's her favorite. Bruno.

Speaker 3 (01:04:42):
Well, she likes the silk Sonic stuff all the time,
getting ready and stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
That's the thing is ultimately it is great, yeah, great, And.

Speaker 3 (01:04:49):
She always goes, I'm a dangerous man.

Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
That's kind of.

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
I love that song.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
All right, we gotta do. I don't think so honey.
This is if you don't know, now, you know our
one minute segment where we take something in culture that's
not so great or that we feel a way about.
We work it out on the remix aka the podcast.

Speaker 2 (01:05:13):
They have something okay, great, this is Matt Rodgers. I
don't think so many's time starts now.

Speaker 1 (01:05:17):
I don't think so honey Coachella, because the set times
have come out by now that it will already have happened,
so I'll already have figured this out. But I don't
want to decide between some of these artists and you
don't make it easy too, because they're very far away,
so I can't split time at the Sahara and the Mojave.
It's like a true journey. And I don't think so

(01:05:38):
honey that, like Sabrina, Carpenter is also not last on Friday.
You know what I mean that a bunch of stuff happens.
You were excited about disclosure after Sabrina thirty seconds.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
That could be fun.

Speaker 1 (01:05:48):
He wants to catch a vibe. But basically I'm not
actually upset because I'll just get there and I'll kind
of vibe out and I will and I'll only forty
percent be here on the physical plane, so by the
time everything happens, I'll be fine. But Coachello, just make
it a little bit easier. There's a big confident Duke
Dumont and major laser that should be at the same time,
and that happens again and again. I don't think so honey,

(01:06:09):
Coachella for this reason. I do think so honey, that
you give those water bottles out. There's only two dollars
and you can you can refill them. You know, you
could be charging nineteen dollars a water bottle, and you
don't do that. So thank you Coachella. I'll give you
credit for that. How much time do I have?

Speaker 2 (01:06:23):
Yeah, that's it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:27):
Yes, this is okay.

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
You know Europe, the water would be free.

Speaker 1 (01:06:32):
It two dollars water bottle like Coachella is not bad.
That's like you know, they could be Yeah, a lot
throwing the girls under the bus.

Speaker 2 (01:06:41):
We'll put in money for free waters that girls just
want to Okay, unless you're already.

Speaker 3 (01:06:44):
Doing that, well, you know, we definitely have fill station.

Speaker 1 (01:06:48):
You hydrate the community.

Speaker 2 (01:06:50):
You have very concerned, doting, doting lesbian giving sunscreen and
water because of that person who had that.

Speaker 3 (01:06:57):
Yeah, there's a fleet of them. They're all my exes.

Speaker 1 (01:06:59):
Yeah sixty. You can trust all of these people. I've
had ten plusier relationships with each and every one of them.

Speaker 2 (01:07:06):
And it's and that's community.

Speaker 1 (01:07:08):
Yeah, hello, all right, are you ready?

Speaker 2 (01:07:10):
I'm ready?

Speaker 1 (01:07:11):
This is Bowen Yang's I don't think so many his
time starts now.

Speaker 2 (01:07:15):
I don't think so, honey, lesbians not being in the audience,
I think that they are. They are the true perfect
receptors of art and culture. I think anytime there is
not a lesbian in the I think we would not
be where we are without lesbians in the crowd, I
think without that beautiful sort of frequency in the communal space,

(01:07:38):
in the collective consciousness that we experience in performances, we
would be we would be nothing. We would be nothing.
And I feel like as gay men, we kind of
are we put our blinders on and we kind of
just are performing to other gay men sometimes, and I
think we need to let that go. And I need
this is sort of self call in, a self check in,
a self call out that.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59):
We need to sort of fifteen seconds.

Speaker 2 (01:08:00):
Really extricate ourselves from this sort of potentially toxic dynamic
that I'm in as it relates to other gay men.
I think this is five seconds something that I am
really willing to intentionally explore more with you. Not that
we haven't done it before, but I think, as we
plant our own live shows, let's really talk about that,
not in the pandering way.

Speaker 1 (01:08:18):
Well that's one minute. I have. First of all, the
only contracts I ever go to are Muna, So I
don't know what you're talking about.

Speaker 2 (01:08:26):
They know that those Munas they see me every show
and they hate to see you coming.

Speaker 3 (01:08:35):
Are you a fan? Of course they did? Girls just
want to I love them we did. Oh guess what
song we all did together?

Speaker 4 (01:08:41):
What I'm a bit.

Speaker 1 (01:08:45):
Show mother.

Speaker 3 (01:08:49):
We're the sole most soulful siblings on the planet, lesbians
and game man. We need each other if we kind
of complete each other.

Speaker 1 (01:08:57):
Do I think there's been less conflict though as of
like I think in the Trump presidency, I don't think
we fight as much. And I don't I don't think
there's like I don't think we're rupping up against each other.

Speaker 3 (01:09:08):
No, it's a lot less. There's been some cross pollination,
and I would I would attribute that to the younger generation.
We got like Chapel Room bringing us together and shit,
you know, and.

Speaker 1 (01:09:16):
You must love the chaps.

Speaker 2 (01:09:17):
I love her, yeah, because Elton, Because Elton was actually
one of the people who was just like that girl
is special and you're like, well fucking.

Speaker 3 (01:09:25):
Very early on, very very very early on. And then
I got to she asked me to interview or I
interviewed her, and it's not like the easiest thing in
the world to interview Chapel round as you guys now, Yeah, yeah,
and I loved it. It made me want to interview.

Speaker 1 (01:09:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:09:42):
She's just a true artist, you know, she's like, you know,
she's one of those. She's not inaccessible, but she's she's
like Seattle, She's gonna make you work for it.

Speaker 1 (01:09:51):
You should be the like singer songwriter producer that is
interviewing other singer songwriter producers though, because you have bulary
for every genre you have, Like I don't know, I
feel like also like someone from Seattle should be the
person doing that. I feel like you're the reach you
have for conversations you could have with people. You should

(01:10:12):
consider it.

Speaker 3 (01:10:13):
I will, I will, I will consider that because it's
just such a compliment and I think I would really
enjoy it. I'm so interested in them, yeah, you know,
and interested is interesting, and I think that that would
be a really fun thing to do some.

Speaker 1 (01:10:27):
Of my time, just to hear you talk to Chapel
about Like, I don't know all of it. What I
think what it would get at something is because you know,
you're right, I feel like there is and people shouldn't
be afraid to be interviewed, you know what I mean.
Like it's got such a weird thing because now we're
having the conversation about who should be doing these interviews

(01:10:47):
or like or what journalism is now, Like should people
be challenged, et cetera. I don't think it's about that.
I just think it's about we should have people who
are genuinely interested in their subjects. Yes, yeah, why this is.

Speaker 3 (01:11:00):
A great podcast for that reason, because you guys are
just so you know, communicative, communally like the fact that
you are, We're so interested in each other. I feel
like this isn't going to end when we stop there.

Speaker 1 (01:11:12):
No, absolutely not, we were. I'm just just the fact
that someone that you're i know level, what's hang out
with this?

Speaker 2 (01:11:18):
You don't remember this, maybe, but you hung out with
me and my friend Josh Sharp at an after party
ones and then we tried to coax you to come
out to Gingers when they in park Slope, the lesbian
bar and Parkers. Oh my god, everyone everyone would you
You would be mobbed, and so it's it's it's for
the best.

Speaker 3 (01:11:32):
I'm into that. I've been going out to lesbian bars
after hours recently. Really, yeah, I've been doing it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:36):
Do you enjoy a good mobbing? I love it. I
love people, you know, I mean, I like be alone. Yeah, yeah,
come up, we'll talk about I don't care, it's fine.

Speaker 3 (01:11:45):
No, Like, by the way, I don't understand like nobody
ever picked up a guitar and learned how to sing,
trying to sing like Freddie Mercury so that nobody would
come up to them and go, I'm a fan. Of course,
it's like the audacity, And what I do is because
I want to draw people.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Of course, to me, people have personal boundaries on an
individual level. But I think I always say people like
someone asked me, They're like, are you, like, like, how
is it for you? I'm like, ninety nine nine percent
of people are kind, so generous, have nothing but lovely
things to say, And it's like, why would I You
would never complain about that anyway.

Speaker 3 (01:12:19):
It's not it's not always fun that I have somebody
put their phone in your face and say like, will
you talk to my friend? We sing my friend Happy Birthday.

Speaker 1 (01:12:27):
With the phone, Like this is sort of like all right,
So now I am And now I feel like it's
it's it's become pokemon. And when it becomes Pokemon, I'm like.

Speaker 2 (01:12:36):
I'm out. Wait, I'm so, I'm so in a reverie.
Have we gone?

Speaker 1 (01:12:39):
Have we done? Now?

Speaker 2 (01:12:40):
All right?

Speaker 3 (01:12:41):
Okay, but I can't decide between two things.

Speaker 1 (01:12:42):
Okay, do you want our help or do you want
to go with your heart?

Speaker 3 (01:12:46):
Okay, I'm going with my heart.

Speaker 1 (01:12:47):
Okay, okay, this is Brandy Carliles. I don't think so honey.
Time starts now.

Speaker 3 (01:12:52):
I don't think so honey to people that dodge high
fives are too cool to do a high five, right
do you? I mean, like, if you put the hand
up for a high five, it's like so earnest and
it's like kind and it means like an enthusiasm, like
a connection is gonna happen. And if they like go
to fist bump you or give you a hug or something,

(01:13:13):
I call that like indier than thou. It's a very
indie thing to do to not high five. And I
hate that because I just think that, like when somebody
is is kind of being rejected for being overly eager
or uncool or whatever, it triggers me like the deepest
part of myself. So if I ever put my hand

(01:13:35):
up to you, let's just go for the high five.
Even if like high fiving is not like in your thing,
you got to you gotta high five and we got
to connect, and you know the you.

Speaker 4 (01:13:43):
Know the rule.

Speaker 3 (01:13:43):
A high fiving right elbow makes your elbow. You look
at the elbow and then you get.

Speaker 2 (01:13:48):
That smack every time.

Speaker 3 (01:13:51):
Earnestness, goodness, kindness.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
And that's one minute. I could cry that really, because
high fives are so back. We've been a lot hi five.

Speaker 3 (01:14:01):
I have never seen, ever seen, I have never seen
a gay person not do a high five.

Speaker 2 (01:14:07):
Obviously, if you are sensitive to you know, you know
who I'm not talking to. Yes, I'm not talking to
a compromise, okay, So don't make it that I'm gonna
get We stay at home.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
We stayed home. Yeah, stayed home. It was home the
whole time. I was watching Survivor gaining twenty five pounds.
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:14:28):
One time I was on a boat and this guy
I know wouldn't do a high five. I was on
a boat one time, the boat, my boat in the pandemic.
It was like new boat. I was in the middle
of the ocean. I couldn't see land, you guys, And
and I saw kayak go by all alone, and in
the kayak was a man with a mask on.

Speaker 2 (01:14:47):
Bless his heart, dear, I don't know Tom Hanks in March.
That's because I got to get my paddles.

Speaker 3 (01:15:02):
That's amazing, really, just paddling, you know, paddling. You can
see what I believe?

Speaker 2 (01:15:06):
Right, Oh my god, Well damn, Okay, we didn't say
this up top. Brandy's going on the Human Tour sitting
near you. The new albums that we didn't talk about
the new album. The new album is amazing, So it was.

Speaker 3 (01:15:23):
In the subtext of the whole time it was.

Speaker 1 (01:15:25):
And also, congrats on the Dock. I mean, I got
nominated for a goddamn Academy Award and it's so spectacles,
it really is.

Speaker 3 (01:15:35):
It's just like it's it's a part of me now.
It will always be referred to in my poetry and
the way that I interact with my within my marriage,
you know, and also the way I interact with my
with myself. For anybody that that doesn't know what you're
talking about, that's come see me in the good light.
It's on Apple, Yeah, and it's an incredible poet. Andrea Gibson, Yeah,

(01:15:59):
passed away, left us way too early from cancer. But
they did this amazing thing where they sort of documented
that journey and it's not like an end of life documentary,
you know, Andrea's actually still alive. At the end of
the Dock Andrew's gone now. But there were so many
unintended things messages within that documentary.

Speaker 1 (01:16:21):
I think that weren't all the best docks.

Speaker 4 (01:16:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:16:24):
There was like complicated religious stuff, there was body image stuff.
There was you know, complicated family dysfunction stuff. There are
different different things surfacing like they would, you know, in
an end of life scenario. But I think that the
most impactful thing for me was that moment. There's this

(01:16:45):
moment where Andrea and their wife Meg, they get that
filter going on their phone where it shows you older.
And Andrea's looking at themselves as an old person and
recognizing that they'll ever know that person. That'll never happen,
and is like laughing and crying at the same time

(01:17:06):
because they're in love with that image. And then Meg,
you know, their wife, comes on and they're getting to
see their wife as an old woman. And it's so
beautiful because it just shows you that aging is such
a privilege and ordered to so few, and it changes
my perspective on aging and my own face and just
kind of like how I'm gonna enter into that chapter

(01:17:28):
of life. So that documentary just it took me out, dude.

Speaker 1 (01:17:31):
Really beautiful, Yeah, really really beautiful and it's I that
you that you are attached to that project is so
it's just a no brainer because it's like spiritually, it's
so many of the themes. It's connection as Catharsis, it's love,
it's togetherness, it's just so many things and yeah, so
many things beneath the surface, which is just in all
of your albums. It's just I feel like you and

(01:17:54):
Sarah Burrellis. It's like I could listen on nonsense. By
the way, where is your musical?

Speaker 2 (01:17:59):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:17:59):
Wow?

Speaker 3 (01:18:00):
All I was approached about doing one. That's kind of like,
I don't know if it's on hiatus or what's going
to happen, but it seems like to do the music
and be a part of a musical of fragg Green Tomatoes.

Speaker 2 (01:18:12):
Oh that is so fab how perfect that's like?

Speaker 1 (01:18:17):
That is I was thinking, I was like, what's the property,
and then you just said it. Oh, and that makes
me so happy. I hope it happens. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:24):
So if it's on hiatus, guys, let's get it going. Well,
this is the place, the table permanently. Who let's start something.

Speaker 2 (01:18:29):
No, no, we're manifesting here. This is the thing, the
way of happening.

Speaker 1 (01:18:33):
Okay, we're very happy to hear it.

Speaker 3 (01:18:34):
How great is Sarah Burrows the best?

Speaker 1 (01:18:36):
I mean, did you see her in Into the Woods?

Speaker 3 (01:18:41):
No, I didn't see.

Speaker 1 (01:18:43):
Just she's just so perfect for someheim because I was
saying at the time she's such a thoughtful singer and
that that his songs are so full of thoughts, that
like she lands everything so cleanly. She's an instrument, walking
instrument like you. And that's why I was just like,
you know, both your music.

Speaker 2 (01:18:58):
It's just that's how she's like an amazing like sitcom actor.

Speaker 1 (01:19:04):
I'm like, god, I'm gonna send you guys this.

Speaker 3 (01:19:07):
Video of us doing she used to be mine. Oh god, girls,
just wanna it was like, honestly one of the most
blissful musical like moments of my life. Like I don't
know what happened, something happened out there.

Speaker 1 (01:19:18):
Yeah, that's one of those forever songs. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:19:22):
And you know she said that she was influenced by
the story when she wrote it. I can kind of
hear it and the melody now that I think about
it a little bit, that's.

Speaker 1 (01:19:32):
That really reads. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:19:36):
I mean, like just that just that I don't know
if Yeah, I see it.

Speaker 1 (01:19:39):
Whatever, and the fact that every singer that does it,
like because it's so beautifully written, it almost feels like
every singer that does it is making it their own
without even really trying. It's just like they connect to it.

Speaker 3 (01:19:54):
It's because the lyric.

Speaker 1 (01:19:55):
It's the lyrics.

Speaker 3 (01:19:56):
It's like suddenly that lyric becomes your tattoo and it
means thing to your life, and so you're emphasizing different
words in different moments and you make it your own.

Speaker 1 (01:20:05):
That's what that's.

Speaker 3 (01:20:06):
No great lyric can be emulated, no, not if it
is able to really get get through to a person.

Speaker 1 (01:20:12):
It's like it's like defying gravity and that It's one
of those Broadway songs where you could just watch a
YouTube if you're a gay guy, you watch a YouTube
population of just everyone doing it, and suddenly you're seventeen
minutes into a YouTube video watching Jordan's Sparks's rendition off
she used to be Mine, and you're still crying like
the same way Shanna Bean did it. It's like these
names are such dog whistles as well, but loud.

Speaker 3 (01:20:35):
It's one of those the greatest YouTube like rabbit Hole
that I can go down and I can do it
for hours. I'll get on a flight now that you
can like stream yea, and I will just be like, hm,
five hours of Selendeon.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
Yeah, and that's it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:48):
Five hours of Celendion, good moments, bad moments, just no
interviews anything, just all Celendion all day or Whitney. Those
two rabbit holes are like I could live in those
rabbit holes.

Speaker 2 (01:21:01):
Yeah, gorgeous, gorgeous rabbit holes. We're going to Paris to
see her.

Speaker 1 (01:21:05):
We definitely are at this residency.

Speaker 3 (01:21:07):
Yeah, we're not going to miss wins because I'm not
saying I won't join.

Speaker 2 (01:21:10):
You if you have.

Speaker 1 (01:21:13):
It's like the Mafia.

Speaker 2 (01:21:15):
You're doing your red Rock show in September and then
we're going to meet you in Paris or we'll pick
you up or something.

Speaker 3 (01:21:19):
Oh, you'd be perfect, so dead serious when I say
that this has to happen, I would love.

Speaker 2 (01:21:25):
That's love.

Speaker 1 (01:21:26):
Let's let's plan for it. If I could go to
Sleem with you guys, don't play. It was like the
great regret of our life because we were supposed to
go see her and then we were working or something
and being like, oh, well, you know, Selene will always
perform in Vegas dumbest sentence ever. And then the pandemic
happened and we lost our opportunity, but we had tickets.

Speaker 2 (01:21:46):
And as someone who grew up in Montreal, like, this
is my this is this is what my life is
led up to. I'm telling you it actually has.

Speaker 3 (01:21:52):
Have you met her?

Speaker 2 (01:21:53):
No?

Speaker 1 (01:21:54):
Oh my god, do you think she would come on?

Speaker 3 (01:21:55):
I bet you would come on.

Speaker 1 (01:21:57):
I bet you would come on, and she would be
so outrageous. She's now said for like probably over a year,
right like like now, because we've gotten so many bucket lists,
like Mariah Carey came.

Speaker 4 (01:22:07):
I know, I loved that one.

Speaker 3 (01:22:09):
I mean I could go down to Mariah Carey rabbit hole.
I met her once. And I know you guys have
met her because you had this amazing, amazing pod and
I listened to it actually just yesterday, but he and
I saw the clips on Instagram. But when I met her,
it was at the Clive Davis party.

Speaker 2 (01:22:28):
Huh.

Speaker 3 (01:22:29):
And I was like summoned to her yet someone to
get me.

Speaker 1 (01:22:33):
Yeah, well she knows what's real.

Speaker 2 (01:22:35):
She's not coming to you. Yeah, Oh my god.

Speaker 3 (01:22:36):
I've written I've written Mariah Carey two letters. I wrote
me me twice. You did yes when like once when
I was a young girl, like twenty two, twenty three,
and then once again when by the way I forgive
you came out. Oh my god, people don't understand there's
cross over here.

Speaker 1 (01:22:50):
I'm massive Maria Carey. Yes, seem of course you are.

Speaker 3 (01:22:52):
So I get like summoned to Mariah Carey, and of
course I'm I walk over there in my suit, you know,
with like my haircut, and she's like sitting in her
chair and she didn't stand up.

Speaker 1 (01:23:02):
She just goes.

Speaker 3 (01:23:04):
And looked up at me, and I'm like, cool, I'll
get down my knees from Riah Carey like any day,
and she goes, my bra strap is really cutting into
my shoulder. She's like, can you get it for me?
And so I got to like maneuver Mariah Carey's bra
strap and like make her more comfortable. And then I
got down on my knees to talk to Mariah Carey.

(01:23:25):
And as soon as I did that and she asked
me to move for brastrap, I was like, I knew
you were a real Mimi, and she goes, thank you.
So she summoned me to fix her brodstrap and thank
her for summoning me, and then we got the most
iconic photo, and I mean that was our whole interaction.

Speaker 2 (01:23:42):
She never stops being icon iconic, and she doesn't even
try and talk about no great lyric can be emulated.
She's full of them.

Speaker 1 (01:23:51):
Oh my god, this isn't the year. This is what
I should have done. I don't think so, Honey on preemptively,
if they snub her at the Rock and Roll Hall
of Fame this year, I'm burning it down. I'm burning
it down.

Speaker 3 (01:24:03):
You're right in doctor, you should be the one to indoctor.

Speaker 1 (01:24:09):
She posted a story I say, hello, tag the Rock
and Roll Hall of Fame. I said, this is the year.
This is the year.

Speaker 3 (01:24:15):
She even did alternative music.

Speaker 2 (01:24:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:24:18):
Oh. On this podcast, we said to her, brought up
the grunge album. Release the Grunge album, and she said,
I know, right, I should do that. I don't know
if she forgot, and then she was like, what label
do I really said on I'm like, the one of
your choosing.

Speaker 3 (01:24:31):
Let's go full subpop.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Oh that would be amazing. Come on, that'd be so good.

Speaker 3 (01:24:37):
Come to Seattle, do it at the show Box.

Speaker 4 (01:24:42):
Label.

Speaker 1 (01:24:42):
She was like, maybe, I was like, don't threaten us
with the time of our life.

Speaker 3 (01:24:46):
Yeah, she just doesn't know how much cross whatever. She
hasn't everything right.

Speaker 1 (01:24:51):
This has been a joy and a half for me.

Speaker 3 (01:24:55):
It's been a joy and a half for me. I
wanted to do this for such a long time.

Speaker 4 (01:24:58):
I'm happy.

Speaker 1 (01:24:59):
I'm such a fan. Well, we just were were there
was just beyond to hear that. And like, you guys
have met several times, but we met briefly at S
and L fifty and I was floating after the interaction
because you're just so good. So thanks for comments.

Speaker 3 (01:25:13):
You guys are so good. Well, I guess I'll see
you when we go see Celine together, I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:25:18):
And speaking of her, we end every episode of the song.
I really set us up for that one. Yeah, which
one do we beck? You love my strength? When that
I was weak, Diane were my Swena couldn't speak? Should
have won for this well man, when I couldn't see,
so the best was lit me. I couldn't speak.

Speaker 4 (01:25:44):
You gave me everything I am because you love me.

Speaker 1 (01:25:56):
Remember that.

Speaker 4 (01:26:02):
Yes.

Speaker 2 (01:26:05):
Last Culture Reacts is the production by Will Ferrell's Big
Money Players in iHeartRadio Podcasts.

Speaker 1 (01:26:09):
Created and hosted by Matt Rogers and bowen Yang executive
produced by Anna Hasbier and produced by Becka.

Speaker 2 (01:26:14):
Ramos, Edited and mixed by Duck Babe, and our music

Speaker 1 (01:26:17):
Is by Henry Komerski

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Hosts And Creators

Bowen Yang

Matt Rogers

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