June 18, 2026 • 34 mins
Brands have been gearing up for America's 250th birthday like it's the next Super Bowl. The market is shrugging. In this episode of Market Says, hosts Gayle Troberman and Marcus Collins sit down with University of Michigan marketing students to find out which 250 plays are actually landing with Gen Z, and why so much of the big-budget spectacle is losing out to the small, simple stuff.
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Speaker 1 (00:15):
Okay, So, Gail, I don't know if you notice, but
I've got my no stars but stripes on just for
this conversation. It's a little out of say, with the
flag the flag, but I'm here for it. I mean,
we are celebrating America's two hundred and fiftieth birthday. That's
a pretty big deal. And in the world of marketing,
one might even argue that we might be looking at
(00:38):
what could potentially be another Super Bowl like event. I mean,
I think that if if the brands had it their way,
this is a great, big media moment where we had
to stand so and shoulder with the rest of our
countrymen and celebrate this momentous occasion. Gail, are you feeling
the Super Bowl vibes here?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I don't think I'm really feeling Super bowlesque vibes yet, right,
I'm not sure I've felt a two fifty breakthrough yet.
But again, what I think is irrelevant because we're here
to see what does the market say.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I mean, we want to know what the market says exactly.
So thankfully for us, we've got really good representation of
the market with us today. We've got students from the
University of Michigan one would argue the best university on
the planet. But I am biased, I admit. But we
had Hannah with this, Maya with us, and Aria with this. Friends,
(01:34):
Welcome to the podcast, and today we're talking about America
to fifty And I just want to open up with
the question prior to this conversation, did you know anything
about America to fifty? Was it on your radar? Hannah,
let's start us off. What say you?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, I mean, first of all, thank you for having us.
I'm super excited. I think it's really interesting that I
actually didn't know about America's to fiftieth, but I did
know about Trump's eightieth, and I think that those are
a little bit synonymous with each other right now. I
don't know if brands are necessarily a specially stice season,
yeah for our age group, delineating themselves from the eightieth Instead.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I'm like looking at the UFC fight on the White.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
House lawn, not necessarily as a celebration as too fiftieths,
but again as Trump's birthday. So I think it's really
interesting that brands are trying to differentiate themselves from that.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
No, I'm kind of like on the same wave like this, Hannah,
in the sense of like I didn't really know a
ton about America to fifty like before, you know, like
doing some research, and I actually came across how Trump's
administration has like come up with Freedom to fifty and
it's just kind of a bunch of walls that they
passed like in this past year, and so I was
like kind of doing research in Yeah, I feel it's very.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
A lot of the marketing that's happening.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
It's kind of like being looped in with his eightieth
birthday too, Like the USC fight, I think is a
great example of that.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Where does one in and where does one start? It
seems to be pretty conflated here. Maya's that been your
experience to or did you see this differently?
Speaker 5 (03:07):
I mean totally definitely echoing that whole idea of it's
pretty synonymous at this point. But also I kind of
just felt like it was the same July fourth. Everything's
in red, white and blue, I'm seeing fireworks at the
grocery store, but there are little subtle changes with just
the number two fifty everywhere. So in seeing that, I've
kind of just had it in the background. So if
(03:27):
I had to put in one word, I just felt
indifferent to it.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
That's actually the worst thing for a marketer to hear
that I'm apathetic about it.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, definitely, like I would say, swaying towards the apathetic side.
I think where we kind of are right now with
like so many things are happening, like you know, in
the world around us, and I think it's like it
is like kind of hard sometimes to like feel like
we can all come.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Together and like celebrate this occasion.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I feel like, and I think also just because it's
kind of hard, also like I want to kind of
like be excited and like be curious about like a
lot of the marketing campaigns that are going on. Like
obviously you like doing research like what Coke is doing
with like the largest like delittering fast that they want
to do, and like things like that are super exciting.
But then I also kind of almost wonder like, Okay, yeah,
it's like for this is happening for like a day
(04:14):
or for a week, but like what about the rest
of the year, you know, Like I feel like that's
why it's like hard for me to really feel truly
like excited about it when there's almost just like a
little bit of angle, like is it a little bit performative?
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Like I can't exactly tell. I mean, that's a really
good shout. It's a kind of difficult time to celebrate.
I mean, Gail, are you fill a celebratory Are you
feeling this tension too?
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I think that's at the core of the challenge here
for brands, Right, if you look at this organized a
two point fifty campaign, I know, you know, kind of
Marcus in the in the CMO circles, right, people have
been talking about this for a couple of years. It
sounded like it'd be a big moment. And I think
most of the marketers that that I've spoken to on
(04:59):
and off through the the past couple of years, some
of them became sponsors, some didn't. But I think the
brands that were considering it or getting involved in it
all kind of felt maybe the opposite, right. I think
they felt like, Hey, we've been through a divisive election.
There's a lot of political negativity. You can't stop world events.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
You know, the news is the news, and what's happening
is happening.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
But finding moments, you know, like we did when we
talked about sports marketing, right, I think we all kind
of felt positive in a prior episode about the ability
for brands to rally around fandom and the shared passions.
I guess that's the big question for me back to you,
to you guys in the market. You know, does the
market say patriotism is like music in sports and other
(05:48):
passions and it's a moment to rally around, or is
patriotism somehow some kind of different beast.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
Something that Professor Collins says in the classroom a lot
is that culture is.
Speaker 6 (05:58):
A meaning making I love that up moment gradod now,
But so he says that culture is like this meaning
making system.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
And I think what I feel personally about these brands
is that they're buying into what America to fifty wants
to borrow from the youth, and what they're borrowing from
the youth, or what they think they're borrowing from the
youth's patriotism. And in the eyes of the youth, patriotism
is this like aspirational ideology where we're banning together for
a greater cause. But what I would argue is that
(06:33):
what America to fifty is doing, and in turn, what
these brands are buying into, is actually an idea of nationalism.
Where they're on the defense of we're the greatest country.
This is what we can pull off. We're going to
pull off all stops and like put in the.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Money of it.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
But they're in an area where they don't belong, like
the patriotism, the meaning the culture behinds patriotism for us
doesn't belong in that schema.
Speaker 5 (06:57):
On Hannah's point of like this nationalism, we want that patriotism.
In a way, if we're looking at eighteen percent of
the gen Z generation not being entirely proud of being American,
then I think we also have to look at the
word patriotism.
Speaker 7 (07:12):
What are you being proud of?
Speaker 5 (07:13):
And I think that word itself has changed in meaning
and association over time, And that's what I kind of
equate that eighteen percent being so low for So when
I look at what I'm actually being sold, part of
me as an American does want to be proud of
all these things that I am proud of being American for, Like, yes,
we have the UFC fight, we have IndyCar, we have
(07:35):
all these different things, but we also have blues, we
have the moon landing, we have soul food and all
these other things that I want to see in a
different light, but I'm not seeing as much of so
when you're looking at all these different identities, it's truly
just who are you truly speaking to in terms of
what is patriotism?
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Are you telling me you're not excited to see Vanilla
Ice rock the stage for Americas?
Speaker 6 (07:59):
Now?
Speaker 7 (07:59):
That one that one I will tune in for.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I say, like normally like yeah, like I don't really
consider myself someone who's like going all out for the
fourth Like yeah, it's a great time to kind of
be with like family and friends, Like my parents have
off from work, so like we'll spend it together. But
typically it's like just kind of like another holiday for me,
like I have a day off. I also am thinking
about now, like the brands that I'm seeing as like
(08:24):
sponsors for the event, Like I personally don't know like
how much their marketing would kind of like influence me
specifically to like consume more of their products, like just
because I'm kind of seeing them in the America two
fifty context versus like maybe if I see like a
Super Bowl ad and like Coca Cola's like doing this
(08:44):
like a spot on for Super Bowl, Like in my head,
I'm like, oh, I feel like I'm more likely to
like buy whatever product they're kind of promoting through super
Bowl just because like I'm a bigger fan of the
super Bowl, like kind of do partake in it like
it's for me. It is, like you know, like everyone's like,
oh like this and my super Bowl Like that is
kind of like a big of that for me.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
So that's kind of the less that I'm taking it through. Yeah,
this is an interesting point here that Ario brings up,
like maybe between the Olympics and the super Bowl, which
we're both positioned as these patriotic moments? Are we all patriotic?
Speaker 7 (09:19):
Out?
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Is that where we are super interesting?
Speaker 7 (09:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
We know how to celebrate a sporting event, right, I
think for this one, you.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Know, I was thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I think it's like it's been historically like July fourth,
it's like more of a retail holiday, right, But does
it work to go to that next level of fandom?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (09:40):
I'm not sure you're saying we're fans of America? Okay,
but what are we? Where's the tension in it?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Maybe? Oh that's good.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Maybe there's just not enough tension for this to be
as exciting as FIFA or Super Bowl or Olympics too far.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
It's kind of going back to my idea of this
being synonymous with Trump's eightieth birthday, like political views completely aside.
I think that the tension is political and right now
to say that our country is completely political divided, like
I would say, that's almost an objective view.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
That's like it is. And it's very uncomfortable for people.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
To celebrate this country because when you're also celebrating it,
you are picking a political side, like what specifically are
you celebrating about this country? And so I think it's
hard because right now they've almost like institutionalized America's to fiftieth,
Like the Fourth of July isn't necessarily run by Fortune
five hundred companies, it's you know, they're putting it right
in the mix. And because they've institutionalized it so hard,
(10:39):
I think they're also killing its authenticity. Like I think
it's super authentic for these grocery stores and whatnot for
the Fourth of July to be putting out all of
this memorabilia. Also because I think historically that's what we're
used to. And unfortunately, with this being new, it also
has a new adoption, and right now that adoption doesn't
feel authentic.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
It just feels purely political to me.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Like we've talked about, it is the same day as
President Trump's birthday, so that kind of makes it feel like,
is this actually about America's two fiftieth And looking into
the event, you'll see that there's so many seats. A
large chunk is reserved for veterans, which is incredible, and
then there's a large chunk of VIP seats and things
like that which are being auctioned off for like one
(11:20):
point five million dollars. I mean, I'm sure there's a
demographic for that, but if you're going to talk about
kind of this core American value that you want to
celebrate in these two fifty years, I don't know if
that's the right message. And so in everything that's going on, Yeah,
you have Vanilla Ice, but there have been other artists
that have dropped out of this specific event because of
(11:42):
its political kind of affiliation, and to that end, I
just I don't know that it speaks to me and
don't know if it speaks to America to fifty.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
I want to add on to what Mama saying because
I think, especially like from a monetary perspectives, they're diluting
the image completely, Like I saw what the UFC that
they're losing like millions and millions of dollars on this,
and like yeah, and theory, that's cool, Like you want
to celebrate like America's to fiftieth, But then is that
not counterintuitive to these clean up initiatives that are going
on and like showing that we really care about America?
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Well, why is this money going to a fight on
the front lawn?
Speaker 3 (12:17):
Like That's where my mind is really conflicting of like
where is this brand message? Whereas again going back to
like the fourth of July, the message has been clear
for years. I think everyone's just a little bit confused,
and by everyone, I mean brands on, like how to
actually go about this? How do we actually celebrate America?
And that's where our perspective, as gen Z, I think
all like the three of us are kind of saying
(12:38):
that that patriotism is represented by cox cleanup and stuff
like that, where actual good is coming out of this,
whereas the fight again and theory is super cool. But
to us, I think we're agreeing that it's a was
some mommy I.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
Feel like for me and any of it as it
kind of just depends on like what values they're showcasing
like through these advertisements. Like I feel because so many
of these brand names that you just mentioned, like these
are household brands that like so many families, like you know,
like will consume on a daily basis, I think it
really kind of just depends like what their angle is
(13:12):
with marketing, Like if they're kind of like noting back
to their origins from like years ago, from decades ago,
of like this is like where we started, the here's
where we are now from their brand's perspective, Like I
feel like that'd be super cool to kind of like
reflect back on that. And I think when I am
like viewing these advertisements, like I'm kind of seeing like okay,
like how do its values like relate with mine? And
(13:33):
I think if they're kind of able to really like
create a distinction between like the eightieth birthday and like
you have seen all these like different kind of like
events are happening that I would say are kind of
more around like the nationalism that Handah was like kind
of mentioning, if they're able to kind of differentiate between
that versus like these are our values, Like this is
like what our brand is like this is what it
means to like the American people, Like I think that
(13:54):
could be something that's super cool and like really does
like create more differentiation with the brand.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Now, if we're going to play Devil's Advocate, I would say,
you know what, you know what, guys, we want to
rework the meaning of the United States that we're trying
to be more tough guy, that we're trying to show
that like you know, we're beefy, we don't play games,
and these are things we're going to celebrate. There are
like Americana in its nature that we you know that
(14:19):
we fight back. Maya. I know you'd be a strategic mind.
Can you buy that? Like if I give you that brief,
you go okay, I can see that, and I can
see how I want to teach the world to see
perfect harmony could play along with that if you're a
Coke or some other brand trying to find itself in
this new recontextualization of meaning.
Speaker 5 (14:40):
I mean in a way, yes, but say you gave
me that brief. My reaction is, this isn't a rebrand.
This is something we've already been saying in different ways.
We've seen this kind of very like macho kind of
almost violent approach in different ways in global events, in
messaging that has kind of become synonymous to America in
different ways. So if I were a brand in this
(15:03):
point in time, what I would love to do is
kind of contrast that and show the different parts of
what it means to be American and that it doesn't
have to be just like this show of brute force
in different ways that it can come out in ingenuity
in art and culture, because that's also really important to
the fabric of what it is to be America, and
(15:26):
it's often not what we are most known for if
you talk globally, so I can understand it, but I
don't know if it's a true rebrand.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
I mean the thing is, I think it's fair to
like put some pushback that there are some positives about this,
Like I do think there's some type.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Of unity that needs to be seen. But I'll give
an example.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
When I was thinking about this, I was thinking about
like Patagonia as the like ideal counter model of what's happening.
And I honestly don't know if Patagonia is American made
or what their process is. But when I hear like
the American made ideology. What I think of is like
Warrios saying, like the values, what are these underlying values?
And I think what's important is that there's the difference
(16:07):
between a substance and a spectacle.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
I think that these brands right now are using like this.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
One time activation to show their values where it's really
clear to us that that's not true. You put Patagonia
in front of me, I know what it's like. I
know the substance of their values. So to your point,
I do think it's important to give credit that some
of it is cool, But am I going to be
like reposting it on social media and.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Now like it doesn't make me feel more prideful.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
I think it's funnier than prideful, And honestly, at the
end of the day, like from a marketing perspective, a
there's too like there's sue lenses to look at this.
We're marketing America on the global stage, and I think
it is somewhat embarrassing the amount of money that we're
losing over this, where it could be to the more
substance of where our values should lie, but be in
(16:55):
terms of like what marketers could be doing a gen Z.
The point of the podcast, this isn't changing like prices
in the market from what I've seen, and when we're
like the most price sensitive group there is and our
that's where our value honestly lies. Like you, we could
talk about like our idealism of where our values are
as gen Z, and realistically, I would love to say
(17:16):
that it's with Patagonia and with these brands that have
great underlying substant values.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
But honestly, I would totally buy a discount and love
America's to fifty if that was the case, But it's
just not the case right now. But there's something a
(17:44):
bit more wholesome I would argue here that feels sort
of Americana of yesteryear and probably size a place today
in the state fear, the great American state fear that
we all have across the country locally. Are now sort
of descending the National Mall to invite everybody in. And
I guess the thing I'm wondering here, and I think
(18:05):
I know the answer based on the apathy, is you
guys feel about this whole thing? Are y'all showing up
to DC? Are your friends going?
Speaker 5 (18:12):
I'm not flying to DC to go there? But if
I were in town, I wouldn't mind it. I think
that's like a very fun part of this lighthearted, wholesome
view of what America can be and used to be
still is in different perspectives. I used to have a
state fair in my own town and then they removed
it for some dumb reason, and that's been my.
Speaker 7 (18:32):
Biggest qualm with my city so far.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
But that moment kind of celebrates a diversity of experiences,
of age ranges, and just different levels of nostalgia for people.
It's not too far back, it's not limited to one experience.
Like everyone can kind of enjoy the ferris wheel. You
can enjoy live music and things like that, and this
is an event that is open to the public. I
(18:57):
don't need a million dollars on me to be able
to go and enjoy. So to that end, i'd say
that this event kind of appealed the butter sculptures. Yeah,
this event seems to appeal more to more Americans.
Speaker 7 (19:11):
There's more identities in the mix here.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
It totally invests in the community, and I think that's
what we're arguing patriotism is it's investing in the youth,
it's giving back, and like I think that's why like
our overarching ideas that we love the cleanups. We love
the ideas that like, sure we could put ourselves on
like this global stage, but that goes back to the
idea of being a spectacle, like make the substance of
a true American value, going back into the communities, like
(19:36):
bringing the light hearted nature back and making like our youth.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Happy spoken from the youth, I love it all right.
This is the part the segment of the show where
we do just like really quick rapid fire questions and
it's really just two answers, care or don't care? And
based on our conversation, I think this is going to
be I don't need polymar kid or Kelsey letting you know,
(20:01):
sort of based on our conversation. But for the sake
of consistency, let's do it all right, So UFC fight
on the White House lawn. Care or don't care? Aria care,
don't care, don't care? Mmm, Maya don't care? Hannah, what
say you don't care? One bet don't care, don't care?
(20:25):
Another I didn't to that. I guess it is a
third answer here to this. Are you upset about it?
Or are you apathetic about it? Not because you don't care,
but because it doesn't matter at all to you.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
I feel like for me, it's just like doesn't matter
to me. Like it's not like it's not something that
I would go to even if I was in the city.
And I also like, even though I'm not like, I
probably wouldn't like stream it or like watch it if I.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
Could copy that copy that. Okay, second question, so you've
got like Coke returning to you know, I wanted to
teach the world up of scene. I want to buy
America a coke, and you got all of the these
brands are sort of returning to some heritage communications. Are
you filling nostalgic? Do you care or don't you care?
Hannah care? Don't care?
Speaker 7 (21:09):
Care?
Speaker 6 (21:10):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Say more?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
I care because again it's like that institutionalized message or
like again back to substance versus spectacle, Like I think
it's cool to go back to the roots. And like
even with UFC, I'm one hundred percent gonna watch it.
It's something new, it's something exciting. But do I think
it screams to me? Is it gonna make me like
buy things?
Speaker 1 (21:28):
More?
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Like from a marketing perspective, I find it somewhat useless.
It's just something to watch. And again, they're losing money
on it, which I think speaks to it the most.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
But yeah, so there's something else better happening. You're not
watching it basically now, even if I have to go
pick up food, I'm not watching it. But in theory,
i'm watching it. So maya these nostalgic sort of HARKing
back to yesteryear communications as of brands care don't care?
Speaker 7 (21:55):
I do care.
Speaker 5 (21:56):
You know, Cooke's always been selling happiness and you can't
really argue with that.
Speaker 7 (22:00):
And there's also different parts to what they're doing.
Speaker 5 (22:02):
I think they have a pledge for around two hundred
and fifty thousand volunteer hours additional to all of their
kind of B to B marketing.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
That they're doing, and they added dimension to this, right.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Yeah, it feels like something I can engage with as
an individual and I can stand by that.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Are you care don't care?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
Yeah? I would say I also care. I think like
kind of like harping on like the whole aspect of community,
Like I think it's so important to bring people together
and like during like holidays like this, and I think
they're really achieving that aspect while also making an impact
in their community, like whether's small or large. So that's
super inspirational. And then also like on that kind of
like saying note like I am also curious to kind
(22:40):
of see what they continue to do, like not just
for this like one of them, but also I would
probably want to like follow them like throughout the next
couple of years or or months to see what other
indusatives they're coming up with.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I mean, this is actually really really inspiring that even
in a moment in time that's full of a lot
of bag to hand as earlier point, a lot of
meaning in congruence, now you all still feel like very
much protectic to brands, that these brands actually matter. The
challenge is sort of the bedfellows the brands seeds to
(23:13):
find themselves in they're plus one. In this case, the
plus one being America two fifty doesn't really feel like
the right opportunity. The brands matter to you regardless of
their plus one. That makes me feel really good. I
don't know about you, Gail, that feel really encouraged.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
You say, brands are our tribal mark, like they're the
extension of us, and so that's why it's hard to
delineate this from something political, because that is politics, Like
you know what group we're affiliated with, that's our tribal mark.
Then we want to be with brands that further insinuate that,
that capitalize on that.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
So it's hard.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
They have to do America to fifty in the way
that we want, Like all of us could have the
same political views, and that's why our conversation is this way,
and then you can have a completely different conversation with
a different party and see how they feel about America's
too fifty. Even with the UFC fight, I have a
ton of guy friends who are like so excited about this.
It's like really ramping up like what Gail was saying,
(24:08):
like that tension of like patriotism and getting them excited.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
But you're talking to yeah, us, and there's.
Speaker 7 (24:15):
Right.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
It's so interesting, right because you guys are making like
exactly the point, right, which is like when you boil
down all the different ways. I guess which you know,
if you take Super Bowl or Olympics or any other
big spectacle moments I think you guys called them, It's
always interesting to see which direction a brand goes, right.
I feel like there's a natural reason for mustard and
(24:38):
ketchup to come together and things. And then you know,
then you've got products like like I'll throw this one
out and see if you guys care, don't care, As
I was just doing a little research on this. Velveta
is doing America themed mac and cheese. Right, so you've
got stars shapes and America's shaped pasta noodles.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Care, don't care. Care. I think that's awesome.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Right, it's not my mark, and I think mac and
cheese this is American as it gets. That's prideful as
will get about America as our mac and cheese.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yeah, and it doesn't get to the divisiveness and the
domination and.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
We must win. We are we are America. You know.
I kind of love kind of the simple fun stuff too.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
How about how about the rest of you guys America
mac and cheese.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
Yeah, I would say that's cool. Yeah, all right, I
think we think Tod's got a winner. There, go ahead.
This is all you, my guy, So last one for you.
And again I think that we kind of know where
we're we're any here, but we'll end the way we started.
America two fifties was positioned like a potential another bite
(25:50):
at the Super Bowl Apple, this is going to be
a massive, massive undertaking that the country is going to
experience together and for brands, you know, you'd be hard
pressed to get this sort of concurrent media moment. But
it feels like it's not really happening the way that
we thought it was going to be a year ago.
So the fact that this doesn't feel like it's going
(26:11):
to be this big celebratory super Bowl park to do
here in the country do we feel do you care
or don't you care? Yeah? I say I don't care
that it's not going to be this big thing. Like
I'm fine with that, Hannah. Let's say you I don't care.
(26:32):
Losing no sleep here, Maya, I'm going to I'm going
to take a wild guest, but I'd like you to
fill in the blake here, Kara, don't care, don't really.
Speaker 5 (26:40):
Care, But I would love to see a brand turn
this into something that they can also be proud of
and like highlight a value that they think is their
core as well.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Ariya, Maya, Hannah, thank you all so very much and
for continue to make me proud and our great university
of the University of Michigan proud. Shining. You're brilliant. We
are very very very very grateful. Thank you so very much.
Thank you. You know, what I take from this conversation
is that despite the apathy, despite the complication of it all,
(27:11):
the complexity of it all, is that there's still some optimism.
There's still some hope, Like even your last statement there
in Maya that like you, hope that a brand would
see this opportunity for what it is and try to
recontextualize in a way that provides value for those who
are actually involved, which is us. Whether we like it
or not, we are here in this country. We're celebrating
(27:33):
our birthday. Even if we choose to cry at our
birthday party, right, it's still happening and it still affects us.
I mean, we're actually putting the bill in this we're
you know, our taxpayer dollars are underwriting this thing. So
the fact that we're not just apathetic or even upset,
that there's still a little hope and some optimism there,
I think is the silver lining that we need. And nowadays, yeah,
(27:57):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Anyway they can, any way that brands can help in
this moment, and I'm sure a lot of them will
when we start seeing more of that. We haven't seen
a lot of the work too in the marketplace yet.
But I think if brands can help us, just like
you said, let's just have an excuse to have a
great celebration.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
It's a birthday. It's a great birthday party.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
And I think if brands could just bring us to
the joy and dodge sort of some of the negativity,
or let us forget it for a moment. But I
think if they're walking right into the negativity, it may
just be a buzzsaw with the market.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
That's what I'm hearing. Two things that came to mind
to me. And I don't know how you respond to
how you read to them, Gale, But I think, Hannah,
I mean, just like right between the eyes, this idea
of substance versus spectacle. And immediately I thought about this
scholar name Guide Deberge, who wrote a book called The
(28:49):
Society and the Spectacle. And you wrote this book post
World War two when Europe was sort of coming out
of this depressive state that they were in economically and
found themselves like really being wrapped up in consumption. And
his argument was that Europe was experiencing the spectacle and
that they weren't engaging experiences. Instead they were buying things
(29:14):
that were avatars to experiences, which you fast forward me
I was read like in the fifties, you fast forward today.
It's essentially social media, right that, like, you know, instead
of going to experience a thing, we just want the
photo to say that we've been there as a representation
of the experience. I think that that's really what this
thing is about. Like this thing, I think the challenge
that we're having with America to fifty is that it
(29:37):
feels far more spectacle than it does substance.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Right.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
It's like, because the substantive part of this goes, hey,
we should probably talk instead of having a party, It's like,
you know, we should probably actually have more of a
come to Jesus moment than a birthday party. Right now,
I think that being able to sort of just identify
that actually provide better context to what can either be
(30:05):
conflated to Trump birthday party or even sort of a
representation of an America that we are not all experiencing.
At the same time. I couldn't agree more.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
I think I think all the news in the hype
cycle has been around the spectacle, right, and that I
think that's what we're hearing the market react to pretty
negatively to the spectacle story. But I think I have
hope that a lot of the marketing from a lot
of the incredibly talented people we're going to start seeing
run in the next month or so as we get
(30:38):
closer to the two fiftieth, you know, I think we're
going to see a lot more campaigns that and there
seem to be a lot more openness to the campaigns
that just remind us what are two fifty is. It's
a day off, It's a day we all get to
share in one unified birthday. And for most of us,
we won't be on the south lawn at a giant
(30:58):
UFC match for a lot of money and travel and
costs and expensive tickets.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
Right for most of us, we're going to be in.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
The backyard, firing up the grill, hanging out with Grandma,
you know, doing the things, and you know, maybe going
to see some fireworks. And I guess the fireworks is
the spectacle that's always been part of this this holiday.
We don't really welcome a fireworks, right, but that is
the thing that makes July fourth always a spectacle beyond
(31:27):
just another American holiday.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
And it's a welcome spectacle at that, you know it is.
I talked about this before during our music episode, you know,
launching the main American music festival for Budweiser back in
twenty twelve. This set a time where like the patriotic
Americana had changed. It wasn't flag waving, I'm proud to
be an American. It wasn't that kind of patriotism. It
(31:49):
was you know, it was the new Americana. We smoked
marijuana like that's the That was the youth zeitguy. So yeah,
we want to go hear some good music together. Right.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
The things that are bringing us to together are the
simple pleasures, right, the backyard party, the pool party, the
sitting on a blanket in the park watching fireworks.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Right, those are the unifying moments.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
And maybe through the marketing, maybe these brands are gonna
bring that back into our zeitgeist and give us a
reason to think about how how we do share some
American values, even if we don't share all the values
of the news cycle every day.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
That's right, there is a reality here. There's a realness
that's not just sort of the bright flashing light that
is the tension that's in the United States. But there
are these parts that are like, you know, we experience
these things together and they're not like over the top,
but they feel so good. And I feel like, to
(32:48):
your point, that's where the opportunity is, that's where the
brief is. That like, there's these things that we know
that are bad, and everyone knows about them, everyone talks
about them, but no one's talk about these other things,
these things that we all sort of experience that still
feel really good right now. And they're simple, you know,
really simple. Yes, yes, they're totally totally simple, and they're
truly American.
Speaker 6 (33:09):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:09):
I have this weird connection to July fourth because it's
my dad's birthday and it's going to during eighty seven
this year, So Happy Birthday Bill.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
One year U, we had a place out in a.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Little town in Washington State, and I paid thirty five
dollars to get us a spot in the town parade,
and I dressed my mom and dad up and like
Uncle Sam outfits and put them on the back of
a convertible and we drove them through the parade with
a sign that said it's my birthday too, and the
entire town for three hours was like throwing candy and
(33:43):
saying happy birthday to my dad and it was like
the best thirty five dollars gift ever.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
It was just an amazing moment of community and family
and pure joy and acceptance.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
And I don't know, do I vote like everyone in
that parade?
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Probably not right, But we shared that moment and those values.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
And it made it a special day.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
And I hope that's what we see more of from marketing.
A little less unattainable tickets to one off spectacles and
a lot more brands showing up and slashing prices, giving
us good deals to buy their products, to just go
have a fun celebration with the people we love in
(34:27):
honor of America.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
I love it. That's a birthday. Probably I'm going to
show up for for sure.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Totally market Says is a Bubblo media iet podcast production.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
If you're not in the conversation, you're not in the game.
Okay, So, Gail, I don't know if you notice, but
I've got my no stars but stripes on just for
this conversation. It's a little out of say, with the
flag the flag, but I'm here for it. I mean,
we are celebrating America's two hundred and fiftieth birthday. That's
a pretty big deal. And in the world of marketing,
one might even argue that we might be looking at
(00:38):
what could potentially be another Super Bowl like event. I mean,
I think that if if the brands had it their way,
this is a great, big media moment where we had
to stand so and shoulder with the rest of our
countrymen and celebrate this momentous occasion. Gail, are you feeling
the Super Bowl vibes here?
Speaker 2 (00:58):
I don't think I'm really feeling Super bowlesque vibes yet, right,
I'm not sure I've felt a two fifty breakthrough yet.
But again, what I think is irrelevant because we're here
to see what does the market say.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I mean, we want to know what the market says exactly.
So thankfully for us, we've got really good representation of
the market with us today. We've got students from the
University of Michigan one would argue the best university on
the planet. But I am biased, I admit. But we
had Hannah with this, Maya with us, and Aria with this. Friends,
(01:34):
Welcome to the podcast, and today we're talking about America
to fifty And I just want to open up with
the question prior to this conversation, did you know anything
about America to fifty? Was it on your radar? Hannah,
let's start us off. What say you?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
Yeah, I mean, first of all, thank you for having us.
I'm super excited. I think it's really interesting that I
actually didn't know about America's to fiftieth, but I did
know about Trump's eightieth, and I think that those are
a little bit synonymous with each other right now. I
don't know if brands are necessarily a specially stice season,
yeah for our age group, delineating themselves from the eightieth Instead.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
I'm like looking at the UFC fight on the White.
Speaker 3 (02:19):
House lawn, not necessarily as a celebration as too fiftieths,
but again as Trump's birthday. So I think it's really
interesting that brands are trying to differentiate themselves from that.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:30):
No, I'm kind of like on the same wave like this, Hannah,
in the sense of like I didn't really know a
ton about America to fifty like before, you know, like
doing some research, and I actually came across how Trump's
administration has like come up with Freedom to fifty and
it's just kind of a bunch of walls that they
passed like in this past year, and so I was
like kind of doing research in Yeah, I feel it's very.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
A lot of the marketing that's happening.
Speaker 4 (02:52):
It's kind of like being looped in with his eightieth
birthday too, Like the USC fight, I think is a
great example of that.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Where does one in and where does one start? It
seems to be pretty conflated here. Maya's that been your
experience to or did you see this differently?
Speaker 5 (03:07):
I mean totally definitely echoing that whole idea of it's
pretty synonymous at this point. But also I kind of
just felt like it was the same July fourth. Everything's
in red, white and blue, I'm seeing fireworks at the
grocery store, but there are little subtle changes with just
the number two fifty everywhere. So in seeing that, I've
kind of just had it in the background. So if
(03:27):
I had to put in one word, I just felt
indifferent to it.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
That's actually the worst thing for a marketer to hear
that I'm apathetic about it.
Speaker 4 (03:36):
Yeah, definitely, like I would say, swaying towards the apathetic side.
I think where we kind of are right now with
like so many things are happening, like you know, in
the world around us, and I think it's like it
is like kind of hard sometimes to like feel like
we can all come.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Together and like celebrate this occasion.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
I feel like, and I think also just because it's
kind of hard, also like I want to kind of
like be excited and like be curious about like a
lot of the marketing campaigns that are going on. Like
obviously you like doing research like what Coke is doing
with like the largest like delittering fast that they want
to do, and like things like that are super exciting.
But then I also kind of almost wonder like, Okay, yeah,
it's like for this is happening for like a day
(04:14):
or for a week, but like what about the rest
of the year, you know, Like I feel like that's
why it's like hard for me to really feel truly
like excited about it when there's almost just like a
little bit of angle, like is it a little bit performative?
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Like I can't exactly tell. I mean, that's a really
good shout. It's a kind of difficult time to celebrate.
I mean, Gail, are you fill a celebratory Are you
feeling this tension too?
Speaker 2 (04:36):
I think that's at the core of the challenge here
for brands, Right, if you look at this organized a
two point fifty campaign, I know, you know, kind of
Marcus in the in the CMO circles, right, people have
been talking about this for a couple of years. It
sounded like it'd be a big moment. And I think
most of the marketers that that I've spoken to on
(04:59):
and off through the the past couple of years, some
of them became sponsors, some didn't. But I think the
brands that were considering it or getting involved in it
all kind of felt maybe the opposite, right. I think
they felt like, Hey, we've been through a divisive election.
There's a lot of political negativity. You can't stop world events.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
You know, the news is the news, and what's happening
is happening.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
But finding moments, you know, like we did when we
talked about sports marketing, right, I think we all kind
of felt positive in a prior episode about the ability
for brands to rally around fandom and the shared passions.
I guess that's the big question for me back to you,
to you guys in the market. You know, does the
market say patriotism is like music in sports and other
(05:48):
passions and it's a moment to rally around, or is
patriotism somehow some kind of different beast.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
Something that Professor Collins says in the classroom a lot
is that culture is.
Speaker 6 (05:58):
A meaning making I love that up moment gradod now,
But so he says that culture is like this meaning
making system.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
And I think what I feel personally about these brands
is that they're buying into what America to fifty wants
to borrow from the youth, and what they're borrowing from
the youth, or what they think they're borrowing from the
youth's patriotism. And in the eyes of the youth, patriotism
is this like aspirational ideology where we're banning together for
a greater cause. But what I would argue is that
(06:33):
what America to fifty is doing, and in turn, what
these brands are buying into, is actually an idea of nationalism.
Where they're on the defense of we're the greatest country.
This is what we can pull off. We're going to
pull off all stops and like put in the.
Speaker 1 (06:47):
Money of it.
Speaker 3 (06:49):
But they're in an area where they don't belong, like
the patriotism, the meaning the culture behinds patriotism for us
doesn't belong in that schema.
Speaker 5 (06:57):
On Hannah's point of like this nationalism, we want that patriotism.
In a way, if we're looking at eighteen percent of
the gen Z generation not being entirely proud of being American,
then I think we also have to look at the
word patriotism.
Speaker 7 (07:12):
What are you being proud of?
Speaker 5 (07:13):
And I think that word itself has changed in meaning
and association over time, And that's what I kind of
equate that eighteen percent being so low for So when
I look at what I'm actually being sold, part of
me as an American does want to be proud of
all these things that I am proud of being American for, Like, yes,
we have the UFC fight, we have IndyCar, we have
(07:35):
all these different things, but we also have blues, we
have the moon landing, we have soul food and all
these other things that I want to see in a
different light, but I'm not seeing as much of so
when you're looking at all these different identities, it's truly
just who are you truly speaking to in terms of
what is patriotism?
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Are you telling me you're not excited to see Vanilla
Ice rock the stage for Americas?
Speaker 6 (07:59):
Now?
Speaker 7 (07:59):
That one that one I will tune in for.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
I say, like normally like yeah, like I don't really
consider myself someone who's like going all out for the
fourth Like yeah, it's a great time to kind of
be with like family and friends, Like my parents have
off from work, so like we'll spend it together. But
typically it's like just kind of like another holiday for me,
like I have a day off. I also am thinking
about now, like the brands that I'm seeing as like
(08:24):
sponsors for the event, Like I personally don't know like
how much their marketing would kind of like influence me
specifically to like consume more of their products, like just
because I'm kind of seeing them in the America two
fifty context versus like maybe if I see like a
Super Bowl ad and like Coca Cola's like doing this
(08:44):
like a spot on for Super Bowl, Like in my head,
I'm like, oh, I feel like I'm more likely to
like buy whatever product they're kind of promoting through super
Bowl just because like I'm a bigger fan of the
super Bowl, like kind of do partake in it like
it's for me. It is, like you know, like everyone's like,
oh like this and my super Bowl Like that is
kind of like a big of that for me.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
So that's kind of the less that I'm taking it through. Yeah,
this is an interesting point here that Ario brings up,
like maybe between the Olympics and the super Bowl, which
we're both positioned as these patriotic moments? Are we all patriotic?
Speaker 7 (09:19):
Out?
Speaker 1 (09:19):
Is that where we are super interesting?
Speaker 7 (09:22):
Right?
Speaker 2 (09:22):
We know how to celebrate a sporting event, right, I
think for this one, you.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Know, I was thinking about it.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I think it's like it's been historically like July fourth,
it's like more of a retail holiday, right, But does
it work to go to that next level of fandom?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (09:40):
I'm not sure you're saying we're fans of America? Okay,
but what are we? Where's the tension in it?
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Maybe? Oh that's good.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
Maybe there's just not enough tension for this to be
as exciting as FIFA or Super Bowl or Olympics too far.
Speaker 3 (09:57):
It's kind of going back to my idea of this
being synonymous with Trump's eightieth birthday, like political views completely aside.
I think that the tension is political and right now
to say that our country is completely political divided, like
I would say, that's almost an objective view.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
That's like it is. And it's very uncomfortable for people.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
To celebrate this country because when you're also celebrating it,
you are picking a political side, like what specifically are
you celebrating about this country? And so I think it's
hard because right now they've almost like institutionalized America's to fiftieth,
Like the Fourth of July isn't necessarily run by Fortune
five hundred companies, it's you know, they're putting it right
in the mix. And because they've institutionalized it so hard,
(10:39):
I think they're also killing its authenticity. Like I think
it's super authentic for these grocery stores and whatnot for
the Fourth of July to be putting out all of
this memorabilia. Also because I think historically that's what we're
used to. And unfortunately, with this being new, it also
has a new adoption, and right now that adoption doesn't
feel authentic.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
It just feels purely political to me.
Speaker 5 (11:00):
Like we've talked about, it is the same day as
President Trump's birthday, so that kind of makes it feel like,
is this actually about America's two fiftieth And looking into
the event, you'll see that there's so many seats. A
large chunk is reserved for veterans, which is incredible, and
then there's a large chunk of VIP seats and things
like that which are being auctioned off for like one
(11:20):
point five million dollars. I mean, I'm sure there's a
demographic for that, but if you're going to talk about
kind of this core American value that you want to
celebrate in these two fifty years, I don't know if
that's the right message. And so in everything that's going on, Yeah,
you have Vanilla Ice, but there have been other artists
that have dropped out of this specific event because of
(11:42):
its political kind of affiliation, and to that end, I
just I don't know that it speaks to me and
don't know if it speaks to America to fifty.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
I want to add on to what Mama saying because
I think, especially like from a monetary perspectives, they're diluting
the image completely, Like I saw what the UFC that
they're losing like millions and millions of dollars on this,
and like yeah, and theory, that's cool, Like you want
to celebrate like America's to fiftieth, But then is that
not counterintuitive to these clean up initiatives that are going
on and like showing that we really care about America?
Speaker 1 (12:13):
Well, why is this money going to a fight on
the front lawn?
Speaker 3 (12:17):
Like That's where my mind is really conflicting of like
where is this brand message? Whereas again going back to
like the fourth of July, the message has been clear
for years. I think everyone's just a little bit confused,
and by everyone, I mean brands on, like how to
actually go about this? How do we actually celebrate America?
And that's where our perspective, as gen Z, I think
all like the three of us are kind of saying
(12:38):
that that patriotism is represented by cox cleanup and stuff
like that, where actual good is coming out of this,
whereas the fight again and theory is super cool. But
to us, I think we're agreeing that it's a was
some mommy I.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
Feel like for me and any of it as it
kind of just depends on like what values they're showcasing
like through these advertisements. Like I feel because so many
of these brand names that you just mentioned, like these
are household brands that like so many families, like you know,
like will consume on a daily basis, I think it
really kind of just depends like what their angle is
(13:12):
with marketing, Like if they're kind of like noting back
to their origins from like years ago, from decades ago,
of like this is like where we started, the here's
where we are now from their brand's perspective, Like I
feel like that'd be super cool to kind of like
reflect back on that. And I think when I am
like viewing these advertisements, like I'm kind of seeing like okay,
like how do its values like relate with mine? And
(13:33):
I think if they're kind of able to really like
create a distinction between like the eightieth birthday and like
you have seen all these like different kind of like
events are happening that I would say are kind of
more around like the nationalism that Handah was like kind
of mentioning, if they're able to kind of differentiate between
that versus like these are our values, Like this is
like what our brand is like this is what it
means to like the American people, Like I think that
(13:54):
could be something that's super cool and like really does
like create more differentiation with the brand.
Speaker 1 (13:59):
Now, if we're going to play Devil's Advocate, I would say,
you know what, you know what, guys, we want to
rework the meaning of the United States that we're trying
to be more tough guy, that we're trying to show
that like you know, we're beefy, we don't play games,
and these are things we're going to celebrate. There are
like Americana in its nature that we you know that
(14:19):
we fight back. Maya. I know you'd be a strategic mind.
Can you buy that? Like if I give you that brief,
you go okay, I can see that, and I can
see how I want to teach the world to see
perfect harmony could play along with that if you're a
Coke or some other brand trying to find itself in
this new recontextualization of meaning.
Speaker 5 (14:40):
I mean in a way, yes, but say you gave
me that brief. My reaction is, this isn't a rebrand.
This is something we've already been saying in different ways.
We've seen this kind of very like macho kind of
almost violent approach in different ways in global events, in
messaging that has kind of become synonymous to America in
different ways. So if I were a brand in this
(15:03):
point in time, what I would love to do is
kind of contrast that and show the different parts of
what it means to be American and that it doesn't
have to be just like this show of brute force
in different ways that it can come out in ingenuity
in art and culture, because that's also really important to
the fabric of what it is to be America, and
(15:26):
it's often not what we are most known for if
you talk globally, so I can understand it, but I
don't know if it's a true rebrand.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
I mean the thing is, I think it's fair to
like put some pushback that there are some positives about this,
Like I do think there's some type.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Of unity that needs to be seen. But I'll give
an example.
Speaker 3 (15:45):
When I was thinking about this, I was thinking about
like Patagonia as the like ideal counter model of what's happening.
And I honestly don't know if Patagonia is American made
or what their process is. But when I hear like
the American made ideology. What I think of is like
Warrios saying, like the values, what are these underlying values?
And I think what's important is that there's the difference
(16:07):
between a substance and a spectacle.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
I think that these brands right now are using like this.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
One time activation to show their values where it's really
clear to us that that's not true. You put Patagonia
in front of me, I know what it's like. I
know the substance of their values. So to your point,
I do think it's important to give credit that some
of it is cool, But am I going to be
like reposting it on social media and.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
Now like it doesn't make me feel more prideful.
Speaker 3 (16:32):
I think it's funnier than prideful, And honestly, at the
end of the day, like from a marketing perspective, a
there's too like there's sue lenses to look at this.
We're marketing America on the global stage, and I think
it is somewhat embarrassing the amount of money that we're
losing over this, where it could be to the more
substance of where our values should lie, but be in
(16:55):
terms of like what marketers could be doing a gen Z.
The point of the podcast, this isn't changing like prices
in the market from what I've seen, and when we're
like the most price sensitive group there is and our
that's where our value honestly lies. Like you, we could
talk about like our idealism of where our values are
as gen Z, and realistically, I would love to say
(17:16):
that it's with Patagonia and with these brands that have
great underlying substant values.
Speaker 1 (17:22):
But honestly, I would totally buy a discount and love
America's to fifty if that was the case, But it's
just not the case right now. But there's something a
(17:44):
bit more wholesome I would argue here that feels sort
of Americana of yesteryear and probably size a place today
in the state fear, the great American state fear that
we all have across the country locally. Are now sort
of descending the National Mall to invite everybody in. And
I guess the thing I'm wondering here, and I think
(18:05):
I know the answer based on the apathy, is you
guys feel about this whole thing? Are y'all showing up
to DC? Are your friends going?
Speaker 5 (18:12):
I'm not flying to DC to go there? But if
I were in town, I wouldn't mind it. I think
that's like a very fun part of this lighthearted, wholesome
view of what America can be and used to be
still is in different perspectives. I used to have a
state fair in my own town and then they removed
it for some dumb reason, and that's been my.
Speaker 7 (18:32):
Biggest qualm with my city so far.
Speaker 5 (18:36):
But that moment kind of celebrates a diversity of experiences,
of age ranges, and just different levels of nostalgia for people.
It's not too far back, it's not limited to one experience.
Like everyone can kind of enjoy the ferris wheel. You
can enjoy live music and things like that, and this
is an event that is open to the public. I
(18:57):
don't need a million dollars on me to be able
to go and enjoy. So to that end, i'd say
that this event kind of appealed the butter sculptures. Yeah,
this event seems to appeal more to more Americans.
Speaker 7 (19:11):
There's more identities in the mix here.
Speaker 3 (19:13):
It totally invests in the community, and I think that's
what we're arguing patriotism is it's investing in the youth,
it's giving back, and like I think that's why like
our overarching ideas that we love the cleanups. We love
the ideas that like, sure we could put ourselves on
like this global stage, but that goes back to the
idea of being a spectacle, like make the substance of
a true American value, going back into the communities, like
(19:36):
bringing the light hearted nature back and making like our youth.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
Happy spoken from the youth, I love it all right.
This is the part the segment of the show where
we do just like really quick rapid fire questions and
it's really just two answers, care or don't care? And
based on our conversation, I think this is going to
be I don't need polymar kid or Kelsey letting you know,
(20:01):
sort of based on our conversation. But for the sake
of consistency, let's do it all right, So UFC fight
on the White House lawn. Care or don't care? Aria care,
don't care, don't care? Mmm, Maya don't care? Hannah, what
say you don't care? One bet don't care, don't care?
(20:25):
Another I didn't to that. I guess it is a
third answer here to this. Are you upset about it?
Or are you apathetic about it? Not because you don't care,
but because it doesn't matter at all to you.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
I feel like for me, it's just like doesn't matter
to me. Like it's not like it's not something that
I would go to even if I was in the city.
And I also like, even though I'm not like, I
probably wouldn't like stream it or like watch it if I.
Speaker 1 (20:48):
Could copy that copy that. Okay, second question, so you've
got like Coke returning to you know, I wanted to
teach the world up of scene. I want to buy
America a coke, and you got all of the these
brands are sort of returning to some heritage communications. Are
you filling nostalgic? Do you care or don't you care?
Hannah care? Don't care?
Speaker 7 (21:09):
Care?
Speaker 6 (21:10):
Oh?
Speaker 1 (21:10):
Say more?
Speaker 3 (21:11):
I care because again it's like that institutionalized message or
like again back to substance versus spectacle, Like I think
it's cool to go back to the roots. And like
even with UFC, I'm one hundred percent gonna watch it.
It's something new, it's something exciting. But do I think
it screams to me? Is it gonna make me like
buy things?
Speaker 1 (21:28):
More?
Speaker 3 (21:29):
Like from a marketing perspective, I find it somewhat useless.
It's just something to watch. And again, they're losing money
on it, which I think speaks to it the most.
Speaker 1 (21:38):
But yeah, so there's something else better happening. You're not
watching it basically now, even if I have to go
pick up food, I'm not watching it. But in theory,
i'm watching it. So maya these nostalgic sort of HARKing
back to yesteryear communications as of brands care don't care?
Speaker 7 (21:55):
I do care.
Speaker 5 (21:56):
You know, Cooke's always been selling happiness and you can't
really argue with that.
Speaker 7 (22:00):
And there's also different parts to what they're doing.
Speaker 5 (22:02):
I think they have a pledge for around two hundred
and fifty thousand volunteer hours additional to all of their
kind of B to B marketing.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
That they're doing, and they added dimension to this, right.
Speaker 5 (22:12):
Yeah, it feels like something I can engage with as
an individual and I can stand by that.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
Are you care don't care?
Speaker 4 (22:19):
Yeah? I would say I also care. I think like
kind of like harping on like the whole aspect of community,
Like I think it's so important to bring people together
and like during like holidays like this, and I think
they're really achieving that aspect while also making an impact
in their community, like whether's small or large. So that's
super inspirational. And then also like on that kind of
like saying note like I am also curious to kind
(22:40):
of see what they continue to do, like not just
for this like one of them, but also I would
probably want to like follow them like throughout the next
couple of years or or months to see what other
indusatives they're coming up with.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I mean, this is actually really really inspiring that even
in a moment in time that's full of a lot
of bag to hand as earlier point, a lot of
meaning in congruence, now you all still feel like very
much protectic to brands, that these brands actually matter. The
challenge is sort of the bedfellows the brands seeds to
(23:13):
find themselves in they're plus one. In this case, the
plus one being America two fifty doesn't really feel like
the right opportunity. The brands matter to you regardless of
their plus one. That makes me feel really good. I
don't know about you, Gail, that feel really encouraged.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
You say, brands are our tribal mark, like they're the
extension of us, and so that's why it's hard to
delineate this from something political, because that is politics, Like
you know what group we're affiliated with, that's our tribal mark.
Then we want to be with brands that further insinuate that,
that capitalize on that.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
So it's hard.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
They have to do America to fifty in the way
that we want, Like all of us could have the
same political views, and that's why our conversation is this way,
and then you can have a completely different conversation with
a different party and see how they feel about America's
too fifty. Even with the UFC fight, I have a
ton of guy friends who are like so excited about this.
It's like really ramping up like what Gail was saying,
(24:08):
like that tension of like patriotism and getting them excited.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
But you're talking to yeah, us, and there's.
Speaker 7 (24:15):
Right.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
It's so interesting, right because you guys are making like
exactly the point, right, which is like when you boil
down all the different ways. I guess which you know,
if you take Super Bowl or Olympics or any other
big spectacle moments I think you guys called them, It's
always interesting to see which direction a brand goes, right.
I feel like there's a natural reason for mustard and
(24:38):
ketchup to come together and things. And then you know,
then you've got products like like I'll throw this one
out and see if you guys care, don't care, As
I was just doing a little research on this. Velveta
is doing America themed mac and cheese. Right, so you've
got stars shapes and America's shaped pasta noodles.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Care, don't care. Care. I think that's awesome.
Speaker 3 (25:02):
Right, it's not my mark, and I think mac and
cheese this is American as it gets. That's prideful as
will get about America as our mac and cheese.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Yeah, and it doesn't get to the divisiveness and the
domination and.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
We must win. We are we are America. You know.
I kind of love kind of the simple fun stuff too.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
How about how about the rest of you guys America
mac and cheese.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
Yeah, I would say that's cool. Yeah, all right, I
think we think Tod's got a winner. There, go ahead.
This is all you, my guy, So last one for you.
And again I think that we kind of know where
we're we're any here, but we'll end the way we started.
America two fifties was positioned like a potential another bite
(25:50):
at the Super Bowl Apple, this is going to be
a massive, massive undertaking that the country is going to
experience together and for brands, you know, you'd be hard
pressed to get this sort of concurrent media moment. But
it feels like it's not really happening the way that
we thought it was going to be a year ago.
So the fact that this doesn't feel like it's going
(26:11):
to be this big celebratory super Bowl park to do
here in the country do we feel do you care
or don't you care? Yeah? I say I don't care
that it's not going to be this big thing. Like
I'm fine with that, Hannah. Let's say you I don't care.
(26:32):
Losing no sleep here, Maya, I'm going to I'm going
to take a wild guest, but I'd like you to
fill in the blake here, Kara, don't care, don't really.
Speaker 5 (26:40):
Care, But I would love to see a brand turn
this into something that they can also be proud of
and like highlight a value that they think is their
core as well.
Speaker 1 (26:48):
Ariya, Maya, Hannah, thank you all so very much and
for continue to make me proud and our great university
of the University of Michigan proud. Shining. You're brilliant. We
are very very very very grateful. Thank you so very much.
Thank you. You know, what I take from this conversation
is that despite the apathy, despite the complication of it all,
(27:11):
the complexity of it all, is that there's still some optimism.
There's still some hope, Like even your last statement there
in Maya that like you, hope that a brand would
see this opportunity for what it is and try to
recontextualize in a way that provides value for those who
are actually involved, which is us. Whether we like it
or not, we are here in this country. We're celebrating
(27:33):
our birthday. Even if we choose to cry at our
birthday party, right, it's still happening and it still affects us.
I mean, we're actually putting the bill in this we're
you know, our taxpayer dollars are underwriting this thing. So
the fact that we're not just apathetic or even upset,
that there's still a little hope and some optimism there,
I think is the silver lining that we need. And nowadays, yeah,
(27:57):
I like it.
Speaker 2 (27:57):
Anyway they can, any way that brands can help in
this moment, and I'm sure a lot of them will
when we start seeing more of that. We haven't seen
a lot of the work too in the marketplace yet.
But I think if brands can help us, just like
you said, let's just have an excuse to have a
great celebration.
Speaker 1 (28:13):
It's a birthday. It's a great birthday party.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
And I think if brands could just bring us to
the joy and dodge sort of some of the negativity,
or let us forget it for a moment. But I
think if they're walking right into the negativity, it may
just be a buzzsaw with the market.
Speaker 1 (28:29):
That's what I'm hearing. Two things that came to mind
to me. And I don't know how you respond to
how you read to them, Gale, But I think, Hannah,
I mean, just like right between the eyes, this idea
of substance versus spectacle. And immediately I thought about this
scholar name Guide Deberge, who wrote a book called The
(28:49):
Society and the Spectacle. And you wrote this book post
World War two when Europe was sort of coming out
of this depressive state that they were in economically and
found themselves like really being wrapped up in consumption. And
his argument was that Europe was experiencing the spectacle and
that they weren't engaging experiences. Instead they were buying things
(29:14):
that were avatars to experiences, which you fast forward me
I was read like in the fifties, you fast forward today.
It's essentially social media, right that, like, you know, instead
of going to experience a thing, we just want the
photo to say that we've been there as a representation
of the experience. I think that that's really what this
thing is about. Like this thing, I think the challenge
that we're having with America to fifty is that it
(29:37):
feels far more spectacle than it does substance.
Speaker 6 (29:41):
Right.
Speaker 1 (29:41):
It's like, because the substantive part of this goes, hey,
we should probably talk instead of having a party, It's like,
you know, we should probably actually have more of a
come to Jesus moment than a birthday party. Right now,
I think that being able to sort of just identify
that actually provide better context to what can either be
(30:05):
conflated to Trump birthday party or even sort of a
representation of an America that we are not all experiencing.
At the same time. I couldn't agree more.
Speaker 2 (30:16):
I think I think all the news in the hype
cycle has been around the spectacle, right, and that I
think that's what we're hearing the market react to pretty
negatively to the spectacle story. But I think I have
hope that a lot of the marketing from a lot
of the incredibly talented people we're going to start seeing
run in the next month or so as we get
(30:38):
closer to the two fiftieth, you know, I think we're
going to see a lot more campaigns that and there
seem to be a lot more openness to the campaigns
that just remind us what are two fifty is. It's
a day off, It's a day we all get to
share in one unified birthday. And for most of us,
we won't be on the south lawn at a giant
(30:58):
UFC match for a lot of money and travel and
costs and expensive tickets.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
Right for most of us, we're going to be in.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
The backyard, firing up the grill, hanging out with Grandma,
you know, doing the things, and you know, maybe going
to see some fireworks. And I guess the fireworks is
the spectacle that's always been part of this this holiday.
We don't really welcome a fireworks, right, but that is
the thing that makes July fourth always a spectacle beyond
(31:27):
just another American holiday.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
And it's a welcome spectacle at that, you know it is.
I talked about this before during our music episode, you know,
launching the main American music festival for Budweiser back in
twenty twelve. This set a time where like the patriotic
Americana had changed. It wasn't flag waving, I'm proud to
be an American. It wasn't that kind of patriotism. It
(31:49):
was you know, it was the new Americana. We smoked
marijuana like that's the That was the youth zeitguy. So yeah,
we want to go hear some good music together. Right.
Speaker 2 (31:57):
The things that are bringing us to together are the
simple pleasures, right, the backyard party, the pool party, the
sitting on a blanket in the park watching fireworks.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Right, those are the unifying moments.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
And maybe through the marketing, maybe these brands are gonna
bring that back into our zeitgeist and give us a
reason to think about how how we do share some
American values, even if we don't share all the values
of the news cycle every day.
Speaker 1 (32:27):
That's right, there is a reality here. There's a realness
that's not just sort of the bright flashing light that
is the tension that's in the United States. But there
are these parts that are like, you know, we experience
these things together and they're not like over the top,
but they feel so good. And I feel like, to
(32:48):
your point, that's where the opportunity is, that's where the
brief is. That like, there's these things that we know
that are bad, and everyone knows about them, everyone talks
about them, but no one's talk about these other things,
these things that we all sort of experience that still
feel really good right now. And they're simple, you know,
really simple. Yes, yes, they're totally totally simple, and they're
truly American.
Speaker 6 (33:09):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:09):
I have this weird connection to July fourth because it's
my dad's birthday and it's going to during eighty seven
this year, So Happy Birthday Bill.
Speaker 1 (33:19):
One year U, we had a place out in a.
Speaker 2 (33:22):
Little town in Washington State, and I paid thirty five
dollars to get us a spot in the town parade,
and I dressed my mom and dad up and like
Uncle Sam outfits and put them on the back of
a convertible and we drove them through the parade with
a sign that said it's my birthday too, and the
entire town for three hours was like throwing candy and
(33:43):
saying happy birthday to my dad and it was like
the best thirty five dollars gift ever.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
Right.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
It was just an amazing moment of community and family
and pure joy and acceptance.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
And I don't know, do I vote like everyone in
that parade?
Speaker 2 (34:00):
Probably not right, But we shared that moment and those values.
Speaker 1 (34:04):
And it made it a special day.
Speaker 2 (34:06):
And I hope that's what we see more of from marketing.
A little less unattainable tickets to one off spectacles and
a lot more brands showing up and slashing prices, giving
us good deals to buy their products, to just go
have a fun celebration with the people we love in
(34:27):
honor of America.
Speaker 1 (34:28):
I love it. That's a birthday. Probably I'm going to
show up for for sure.
Speaker 2 (34:32):
Totally market Says is a Bubblo media iet podcast production.
Speaker 1 (34:40):
If you're not in the conversation, you're not in the game.
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