Bobbi Brown

In this special live episode of Next Question with Katie Couric, recorded at the 92nd Street Y, New York, Katie sits down with beauty icon Bobbi Brown to talk about her new memoir Still Bobbi: A Masterclass in Leading an Authentic Life. The two longtime friends share stories from Bobbi’s trailblazing career — from Bobbi’s guest appearances as a regular contributor on the Today Show to the creation of Bobbi Brown Cosmetics and her new beauty venture, Jones Road. With humor and heart, they dig into what it means to stay true to yourself, build resilience, and reinvent at any age.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
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Speaker 2 (01:06):
Good evening everyone. My name's Celese Lannin. I'm part of
nine two n wys Reconnotti Kaplan Talks team. Thank you
so much for being here for this very special nine
to n Y Talks event in celebration of Bobby Brown
and her debut memoir, Still Bobby. Bobby is a renowned
makeup artist and entrepreneur, best selling author, sought after speaker,

(01:28):
beauty industry icon, and hotelier. She founded two successful cosmetic brands,
Bobby Brown Cosmetics and more recently, the clean beauty brand
Jones Road. She also envisioned and now operates the George
Hotel in Montclair, New Jersey. Moderating tonight's conversation is award
winning journalist, philanthropist, producer, and number one New York Times

(01:50):
bestselling author Katie Curic. We are very excited to have
our guests here with us this evening, so please help
me in giving a warm nine to two n Y
Welcome to Bobby Brown and Katie Curic.

Speaker 1 (02:11):
I agree one. I can't see anybody in this audience,
but it's great to have you here tonight, and I'm
very excited to be able to have a conversation with Bobby,
who has written a memoir called Still Bobby, A masterclass
in leading an authentic life, which is out now. First
of all, congratulations, it's like giving birth right.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
I think it took more than nine months. Yes it did.

Speaker 1 (02:35):
Did you enjoy the process?

Speaker 3 (02:36):
I did?

Speaker 4 (02:37):
It was very cathartic, and I do you know, I
tell all my friends I think everyone should write a memoir,
even if it's just for yourself, for your kids or
your grandkids.

Speaker 1 (02:45):
I agree.

Speaker 4 (02:46):
It helped me understand a lot of things. But you know,
I also, before we start, I just want to say
how happy I am that you said yes when we
asked you to do this, because Katie and I go
way back.

Speaker 3 (02:55):
We do.

Speaker 1 (02:56):
We go way back.

Speaker 4 (02:58):
And you know, every time I came to the Today Show,
like you were doing all this incredible news things and
I was doing makeup.

Speaker 3 (03:05):
I was teaching people.

Speaker 4 (03:06):
You know, how to line your eyes or whatever. And
one time you were interviewing me. I'll never forget this,
and I was showing people how to put mass scara
on and the girl opened her eyes and I was like,
I said to myself, oh shit, because it went on
you know, her eyelid.

Speaker 3 (03:21):
And I said, oh, I'm not going to say anything.

Speaker 4 (03:23):
And Katie says, Bobby, you smudged, and I said that's
good because we all smudge at home and this is
how you fix it.

Speaker 3 (03:32):
There You good.

Speaker 1 (03:33):
Well, we're very good at improvising, and I was very
good at not having an editor, right and just blurting
out whatever in yourself.

Speaker 3 (03:42):
And that's what we like about you.

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Yeah, And I think we both we have some I
think similarities in that way. We I mean, I hope
that we're unpretentious and kind of comfortable in our own
skin and kind of are who we are.

Speaker 3 (03:55):
And I think we're the same height. We're both grandmothers.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
I think I'm a little than you are.

Speaker 3 (04:01):
How tall are you?

Speaker 1 (04:02):
I used to say I was five three and three
quarters and then I think I was really only five
to two. But I recently went to the doctor and
I have shrunken inch.

Speaker 3 (04:13):
And I grew. I grew a quarter. You do well.
First of all, I only started at five foot.

Speaker 4 (04:19):
I've been five foot since third grade, right, so I
you know, and I think I just know how to
stand up really good.

Speaker 3 (04:25):
When I go to the doctor.

Speaker 1 (04:27):
Well, I was very depressed. I made them measure me twice,
but they said, yep, you're five to one. Anyway, that's
a whole other conversation. But let's talk about your book, Bobby.
So obviously that was funny because I was going to
start by asking you what your memories were of being
on the Today Show, and did you feel like that
was a real breakthrough because this was in the early nineties, right, Bobby, God,

(04:52):
you're asking.

Speaker 4 (04:53):
Me what it was a long time ago? Yeah, I
mean it was a long time ago. It was after
I wrote my first book. Only because you know the
how I even got on the Today Show. I was
at a book signing at Neiman Marcus, and you know,
I answered. Someone raised their hand and said they had
a question. I went over and I answered her and

(05:13):
she was the sweetest little old lady and she said,
she said to me, are you Jewish? And I said
I am why? And she said, well, for a Jewish girl,
you've done so much. I saw you on the Today Show.
You were great. I had been on once and she said,
is there anything else you want to do? I said,
I'd like to be a regular on the Today Show.
She grabbed my arm and says, honey, Jeff Zucker is

(05:34):
my grandson. And that's how I got on the Today's Show.

Speaker 1 (05:37):
Is that how you became a regular contessator?

Speaker 3 (05:39):
So Jeff came down. He called me Barbara.

Speaker 4 (05:42):
He always called me Barbara, and he says, all right,
Grandma Fran wants you on. He says, how often do
you want to be on. I said once a month.
He said, all right, you're on once a month. I
came wait. He came down the next month. He said, hi, Barbara,
how's it going. I said good. He says, now, what
do you want? And I didn't know? But I looked
up and I saw, you know, I was watching the
show and I saw everyone had titles. I said, can

(06:03):
I have a title? He said, what kind of title
do you want? I said, can I be the beauty
editor of the Today Show? He's like, all right, you're
the beauty editor. He never came down the third month.
I forgot to ask him for money. But I was
on for fourteen years. And by the way, like there
was no Internet, there was no Instagram. That's how I

(06:23):
think I helped Bobby Brown get on the map?

Speaker 3 (06:26):
Was the Today Show?

Speaker 1 (06:27):
Well you're welcome, Well, thank you fourteen years? Or maybe
we should thank Jeff Suckers Bubby right. Grandma obviously had
a lot of influence on him. So I wanted to
know why you thought now was the time to write
a memoir. Was there something that happened? I mean, for me,
I wanted to write a memoir while I still remembered

(06:49):
things no, truthfully, And it was that weighing on you
or why did you decide this was the moment to
do it.

Speaker 4 (06:56):
I did not want to write a memoir I had.
It was not on my list of things I want
to do. And when you know, someone, an Asian in
France called me up and said, you've got to meet
this woman who's an agent. She wants to meet you
and she'd love to do a book with you. And
I'm like, oh great, I'd love to do another makeup book.
So this woman, Rebecca, I saw her come in, came

(07:18):
to my office and we just had the best talk
and the greatest time. She goes, I want to write.
I want you to do a memoir. I said, I
don't have anything to say. And I just said I
don't want to write a memoir. She goes, no, no, no,
you have a lot of things to say that could
help people. I want to put it in words. And
I said, She said, it doesn't have to be a memoir.
It could It could be advice, it could be anything
you want. So I kept telling everyone I'm writing a book.

(07:41):
It's not a memoir.

Speaker 3 (07:42):
What is it.

Speaker 4 (07:43):
I don't know what it is. It's advice, maybe there'll
be a recipe. There's no recipes because I don't cook.
But and so I wrote a memoir.

Speaker 1 (07:53):
Well, you know, I learned a lot about you. I
felt like I I you know, we've spent time together
and I know you, and I've always been so proud
and impressed by you, Bobby. But it was fun to
get to know you from an early age. And the
first part of the book, or part one, is called
Know where You're From, And it's where we're introduced to
your hometown. We met Illinois in the Chicago suburbs. Your dad,

(08:17):
Papa Sam aka Cadillac Sam, and Nana, your mother and father,
beloved aunt Alice, who had a really influential role in
shaping who you are today. Tell me a little bit
about your childhood and what it was like because it
was complicated, right, Well.

Speaker 3 (08:34):
It's so funny.

Speaker 4 (08:35):
You know people say complicated, and you know, people say,
I mean, I've heard all these different things. It was tragic,
it was this. I don't remember it being a tragic,
complicated childhood. I remember growing up in a loving family
who adored me, who were you know, fun, creative, all right.
My mom had problems with mental illness, which you know

(08:57):
her first we called it a nervous breakdown. We didn't
know what that was. No one talked about mental illness
or mental health. And unfortunately, or fortunately when she when
it first happened, it was the same year that one
Flew's Kuckoonest came out. And I was like, okay, so
that was my first introduction.

Speaker 1 (09:15):
You were in like seventh I was.

Speaker 4 (09:17):
I was in seventh grade, which was first hospitalized. Yeah,
but you know, the positive thing about my mom being
in the hospital, and I remember this so you know vividly,
is my father and I used to drive to visit
her every night, and we got to spend all this
time together and talk and really, you know, I felt
like a grown up and he said, you know, I
need you, You need to, you know, really help me

(09:38):
with this. And I don't know, I felt very important
and grown up.

Speaker 1 (09:42):
And she was ultimately diagnosed with bipolar. So how did
that manifest itself? And in sort of the way you
were parented, particularly by her? Was it a pretty stable
was it? You know? Were there ups and downs in
the family? How did it manifest it.

Speaker 4 (10:00):
In my young you know, my young years, there was
not ups and downs. She got better, she came home
and it was a long time before she had another episode.
When she got older and things happened, I don't know
if it was her hormones. She my parents got divorced,
she remarried someone, he passed away, and then it just
became like NonStop, you know, bad issues, and you know,

(10:25):
she was put on medication. You know, whether it was
lithium or whatever she was on. All those things really
took a toll on her. And you know, when I like,
I've been married thirty seven years and my husband married
into this and she wasn't good and she I don't
think he ever knew her good. So, you know, it
was a lot of years where it wasn't the mom

(10:47):
that I remember having. But I feel so lucky because
I had her in the important years. I think it
was harder on my younger siblings, but I was, you know,
seventh grade, eighth grade. I was busy with my friend friends,
and so I don't feel pain about my mom's illness.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
And in fact, I think you write about what it
taught you, how you developed an emotional resilience that you
write has carried me through my life during that time.
So how did her illness kind of help create this
resilience for you.

Speaker 3 (11:20):
You know, I'm not sure.

Speaker 4 (11:22):
But when I was writing the book and I was
talking about it, and you know, people whether it was
you know, my editor or my you know, co writer,
my ghostwriter, would say things to me like, oh my god,
And I'm like, did I block this out?

Speaker 1 (11:36):
Like?

Speaker 4 (11:36):
Is that how I dealt with it? I blocked it
out and I had to really kind of think about it.
I didn't. I just moved on. So why and how?
I don't know. Maybe it goes way back from my people.
You know, Papa Sam came from Russia. He had nothing,
and he, you know, somehow figured out how to maneuver
things to become Cadillac Sam. And you know, I don't know.

(12:01):
You know, I watched my dad, who was a lawyer,
but you know, very entrepreneurial, and nothing came easy to anyone,
but everyone just went on with it.

Speaker 1 (12:12):
I think when you don't know any differently, right, you
just deal with the circumstances you're in. And I know
that your mom was quite glamorous, and meanwhile you had
an aunt Alice, who was very practical. You describe her
that way, and that dichotomy really helped sow the seats
of what you would later become. Tell us about the

(12:33):
influence of both of these women in your life and
who you'd become.

Speaker 3 (12:37):
Sure they could not be more different.

Speaker 4 (12:38):
I mean, my mother was six years younger than my
aunt Alice, and she, I mean really was an absolute
gorgeous woman that you know, made sure she was as
skinny as possible, were the highest heels she could, were
the most beautiful makeup, and everything mattered to her, you know,
looks and you know, popularity and all those things. We

(13:00):
on every diet together. And my Aunt Dallas was or
is she's ninety four years old. My Aunt d Alice
was the opposite. Short hair, never wore heels, under five
foot tall, smart as a whip, read every article out there,
raised three kids, had this incredible love affair with Uncle Albert,
and just you know, we talked about life and things,

(13:23):
and it was my comfort zone to go there, you know,
and then I'd go home and have to kind of
fluff myself up, you know, to be with my mom sometimes.

Speaker 3 (13:31):
But I'm a little bit of both, you know. So
I'm a little bit of both.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
So you started playing with makeup like most girls, and
Bobby and I are the same age. I think I
might be a six months older than me. Maybe I'm
six months older.

Speaker 3 (13:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (13:46):
I was at least it's only six.

Speaker 4 (13:47):
So do you don't tell anyone how tall you are?
Do you talk about your age?

Speaker 1 (13:51):
Yes? I did?

Speaker 3 (13:51):
How old are you?

Speaker 1 (13:52):
I'm sixty eight?

Speaker 3 (13:53):
Okay, me too.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
When's your birthday?

Speaker 3 (13:57):
April?

Speaker 1 (13:58):
April? Okay? My birthday Janue? So three months old.

Speaker 3 (14:01):
Three months now.

Speaker 4 (14:02):
Because I went to your sixtieth birthday party with that's right,
I dig evers and my husband.

Speaker 1 (14:06):
Ah, well, thank you for coming. That was fun, by
the way, thank.

Speaker 3 (14:09):
You for inviting me.

Speaker 1 (14:10):
But I'm thinking about Bobby in middle school or junior
high which we called it growing up in Virginia, and
I'm thinking about you, like discovering makeup for the first
time and really being enthralled by it. And then I
was thinking, as you were talking, you must have had
like the same makeup I had, like Bonnie bell Let's
Ours and Yardley Yardly Glimmerick. Do you remember Glimmerick? That

(14:34):
was Yardy too. Okay, Yeah, I had blue Masscara. I
loved blue mascot. I don't think I had that, But
did you have like gloves, lemon the cologne.

Speaker 3 (14:43):
Did you have t Geena tee? Of course?

Speaker 1 (14:46):
And did you use Noxima? I?

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Did we do? I did? Did you sleep? Wait? Did
you sleep with rollers? And like orange juice cans in
your hair?

Speaker 1 (14:54):
Yeah? Orange juice cans like this because my hair's kind
of curly, even though it doesn't look that curly. But anyway,
so tell me about kind of your when you became
infatuated and sort of interested in makeup.

Speaker 4 (15:05):
Well, you know, I used to watch my mom put
her makeup on to go on date night with my dad,
and she was just so glamorous and so beautiful, and
you know, wore the tightest little she had a teeny
little waist and she would put black liner on and
individual lashes, and I just remember this ultimate bronzer, this
fat bronzing stick she'd put on her cheeks. She'd blend

(15:27):
it in and oh my god, she looks so great.
And I used to play with her old makeup, but
I never wanted people to know I was wearing makeup,
so I always kind of blended it in. And you know,
I remember we would go to Florida for spring break,
and anyone that lived in Chicago it was a big
competition who would get more tan? Oh yeah, right, like
you had to go back the tannist. And so you

(15:49):
know besides baby oil and aidad so baby oil and iodine.

Speaker 1 (15:54):
I did that too, right, I mean, it's crazy. I
didn't do the record album covered in the loom in
a foil.

Speaker 3 (16:00):
I didn't do that.

Speaker 4 (16:01):
You know what I did my mother's refrigerator case. We
did the whole body. We took the old refrigerator box
and we just put tinfoil in it and we laid
in it.

Speaker 3 (16:11):
With baby oil.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
And I died so healthy.

Speaker 4 (16:14):
Yeah, I mean while we were smoking cigarettes, probably, but
no one told us that it wasn't good. But so
I used to use my mom's makeup to try to
look really tan, and I wanted I just it made
me when I looked in the mirror, I thought I
looked pretty.

Speaker 3 (16:30):
So that was just how I started.

Speaker 1 (16:44):
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(17:04):
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(17:24):
or book your own free personalized fitting. Then I know
you had an aha moment. I was trying to figure
out what year, how old we were when Love Story
came out. But when you saw Ali McGraw in Love Story,

(17:48):
it not only gave you an Aha moment, but it
also gave you some comfort in who you were and
what you look like.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
Right, I'm sure you I know you were a cheerleader, right,
what do you think? Of course? Yes, yes I did not.
I was not. Were you on the student council? Yes
I was not.

Speaker 4 (18:06):
I you know, so I just you know, I didn't
want to peak too soon. Okay, I'm still waiting, you know.
So I look, I was, I was in the popular group.
I had all these friends, but they were taller and
blonder and smarter, and they did cartwheels and you know,
and I just didn't. So you know, I never felt

(18:27):
that I was pretty enough, and I remember I saw
this book in a bookstore and I asked my dad
to get it for me.

Speaker 3 (18:34):
It was Sheryl TEGs was on.

Speaker 4 (18:35):
The cover, and it was like all her health and wellness,
like Hacks or whatever. My dad got her for me.
I read the book cover to cover. I tried every
single thing. I freaking looked the same. And when I
finished the book, so nothing, nothing worked. So I didn't
feel that I was that attractive. I look back now
and I was really cute, but but you know, I

(18:56):
didn't feel it. And then when I went to the
movies and saw Ali McGraw on the scool and she
was the first brunette with like big eyebrows, hair parted
in the middle, freckles on her nose, and I'm like, oh,
I could be cute too. I don't have to look
like Cheryl Takes.

Speaker 1 (19:14):
That's so funny and it's so crazy how popular culture
can have such an influence, especially I think when you're younger,
and I think one of the themes of this book is,
you know, I think you dealing with your insecurity and
feeling less than But also this quote from one of
your favorite authors, Liz Murray, which is, so what now?

(19:36):
What tell me about that quote and why it resonated
with you and you continue to kind of use it
as your mantra.

Speaker 4 (19:43):
Well, in the old company, I had it painted on
the wall because everybody would come in and tell me
why something couldn't happen or what happened you know that
couldn't happen, And I would just sit there listening and
I'm like, Okay, so what are you gonna do about it?

Speaker 2 (19:59):
You know?

Speaker 4 (19:59):
I mean I always think there's a solution and an
answer to things. And I know that's being an entrepreneur,
but I still think, so what now?

Speaker 1 (20:08):
What?

Speaker 4 (20:08):
Like I could, you know, list ten million things that
have happened, and I'm like, Okay, now, what are we gonna.

Speaker 3 (20:14):
Do about it?

Speaker 1 (20:14):
You're so unflappable.

Speaker 4 (20:16):
I don't think that's true. I'm I'm what do you
mean I'm unflappable?

Speaker 1 (20:19):
I just feel like you are Stephen?

Speaker 3 (20:21):
Where's my husband? Where are my kids?

Speaker 1 (20:24):
I feel like you're you have a lot of equanimity.
Is that the word?

Speaker 3 (20:27):
I don't know what that means.

Speaker 1 (20:28):
Well, it just means I see.

Speaker 4 (20:29):
That's how secure I am that I can ask you
on stage what the hell that means.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
I think it just means you're calm and kind of
nothing rattles.

Speaker 3 (20:37):
You again, where's my husband?

Speaker 1 (20:41):
But but I do think is that not true? Or
you are? You mean?

Speaker 4 (20:44):
No, I no, I get I get rattled, and honestly,
I go to Stephen and I tell him and he's like,
uh huh. So he's like, uh huh, we'll talk about
it tomorrow. Okay, it's fine.

Speaker 3 (20:56):
You know.

Speaker 4 (20:56):
So I think I've been conditioned to be that. Seriously,
I mean, I think it's because who I married. All right,
good Steven, Yeah, it's nice. Well, I'm also really interested
in your journey from growing up in Wamet and then
going to college. And I read Frank Brune's book and

(21:18):
I highly recommend it if you have any people in
your life very nervous about getting into college, because Frank,
who I love.

Speaker 1 (21:27):
By the way, I love Frank Bruney. He wrote a
book called Where You Go Isn't Who You'll Be? And
it's basically profiling so many interesting people like I think
Howard Schultz is in it, Bobby's in it about kind
of their paths.

Speaker 3 (21:43):
Are you sure a minute?

Speaker 1 (21:44):
Yeah? Oh, anyway, Frank will be so happy to hear
you say that. But anyway, he talked about kind of
your path, but I want you to tell everybody sort
of what happened you and you start at the University
of Arizona and.

Speaker 4 (22:00):
The University Wisconsin hush gosh. I went for six months,
followed a boyfriend, then we transferred to University of Arizona,
and then I came home and told my mom I
wanted to drop out of school because it was really boring. Oh,
it was terribly boring. And she said, you can't. You
have to go to school. But Mom, I don't know
what I want to do with my life. I don't

(22:22):
know where I want to go to school.

Speaker 3 (22:23):
She said.

Speaker 4 (22:24):
The craziest thing, she said, if today's your birth, that
you could do anything you want. What would you want
to do? And I don't know why it popped in
my head. I want to go to Marshall Fields and
play with makeup. She said, that's it, be a makeup artist.
I said, I don't want to go to beauty school.
She said, I'm sure there's a college somewhere. And a
friend of my dad's told me about this little communications

(22:44):
school in Boston called Emerson, and so I flew up
to Emerson and they would let me design my own major.

Speaker 1 (22:53):
You know.

Speaker 4 (22:53):
I said, do you have makeup here? They said no,
but if you want to, you could study makeup. I
think they needed students.

Speaker 3 (22:59):
At the time. But what really made me go to
Emerson was they had a Magic Pan cafe and I
had never seen an outdoor restaurant before and so it
was very European.

Speaker 4 (23:11):
I remember magic Cafe. Yeah, so I went to Boston
to see the Magic Pan.

Speaker 1 (23:17):
That's a good reason to choose the school, Bobby. But
you did get to devise your own curriculum, and so
tell us what that entailed. It was sort of theatrical
makeup right.

Speaker 4 (23:27):
Well, well, it's called an inner disciplinary major.

Speaker 3 (23:31):
I still don't know what that means.

Speaker 4 (23:32):
And I've gotten like an honorary degree from them too,
and I still don't know what it means. But what
it meant was that with you know, with my advisor,
I had to take all the requirements, but then I
had to take, you know, things for this major to
learn everything I could about makeup. So I ended up
just doing makeup for all the plays for the film department.

(23:53):
I took a speech course, you know, I did anything
I could. They had one teacher that taught one class
and make up, so I had to learn. And you know,
one year they my advisor came to me and says,
I have an opportunity for you. You can go to
New York and you could work at the Metropolitan Opera
House an internship.

Speaker 3 (24:13):
I said no.

Speaker 4 (24:15):
I didn't want to, like, like, waste my summer, so
I didn't do that. I didn't know, but who knows.
I could have not been in the fashion business. That's true,
So you know, I don't. I don't regret not going.

Speaker 1 (24:30):
But that would have been a cool opportunity.

Speaker 4 (24:32):
It would have been a cool opportunity. But you know
it didn't interest me doing. I mean, I like hip hop,
not opera.

Speaker 1 (24:39):
So you said no to that. But you graduate from Emerson, yes,
and you end up going to New York City.

Speaker 4 (24:45):
Well, no, that's after a year because I first was
a waitress. I needed money to pay my rent. Yes, so,
and I was a terrible waitress, terrible, I'm really bad,
but I did it for a year.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
I was a waitress too. Where you have so many
parallels where you what are bad? Was I a good waitress?
Not particularly? I was okay, I enjoyed it because I
kind of like the intensity and the hustle and bustle.
I remember somebody left me twenty five cents on a
table and it was like twelve or fourteen people. So

(25:17):
I followed them out to the parking lot and I
threw the quarter in their car and I said, don't.
I don't need your quarter, mister.

Speaker 4 (25:26):
And you wouldn't do that today. Though you would do
that today. You live in a different kind of world
right now.

Speaker 1 (25:33):
It depends on the revenant in the news on where
we are. Yeah. But anyway, so you did you worked
as a waitress.

Speaker 4 (25:40):
Yes, And then I moved to New York and all
I really wanted to do was be a makeup artist.
I actually one day went to get waitressing jobs and
everybody said no.

Speaker 3 (25:51):
So I went home.

Speaker 4 (25:51):
I said, well that's not going to work, and I
opened up the Yellow Pages and looked up modeling agencies, models,
you know, makeup. I got myself to the makeup artist union.
Who knew there was a makeup artist union. I went
there and I said, Hi, I'm here to sign up,
and the guy looked at me and said, uh huh,
let me tell you how it works. Sit down, and

(26:14):
he basically said, if you're not born into the Union,
it'll take you a good seven to ten years of
apprenticing to get in the Union. So I said, well,
that's not going to work. But he did say I'll
call you for gigs. And so I got to assist
the makeup artist on Saturday Night Live. I got to
do the local news. And I'll never forget doing the

(26:36):
local news. I forget the guy's name. He had a
big mustache. I did his makeup, and he was really
not nice at all, and he had a booger in
his nose, Okay, And I said to myself, do I
tell him? I told him because I cared more about
doing a good job than letting him go on.

Speaker 1 (26:52):
Yeah, I'm sure he appreciated that. Bobby. So you're doing
all these different gigs in New York City, and I
know that Bruce Webber a job that you had with him,
he saw something in you, didn't he about the way
you worked and kind of the lighter touch you had
with makeup. Tell us about that.

Speaker 4 (27:12):
I mean, it definitely wasn't like the first couple of
years in New York. It took a few years of
getting a little bit known and you know, being hired
for magazines. But I got the opportunity to work with
Bruce because his regular makeup artist, a woman named Bonnie Maller,
got a different or a better job.

Speaker 3 (27:28):
So I was a wreck. I mean, I was just
a nervous wreck.

Speaker 4 (27:32):
I think I tried on like three hundred pairs of
jeans to see which ones would be the cool jeans.

Speaker 3 (27:37):
But I'm sure Bruce didn't notice.

Speaker 4 (27:39):
But seriously, I got to the studio, I knocked on
the door and Bruce opened the door with his bandana,
and I'll never forget. I was like, and he said, Bobby,
I've been waiting a long time to work with you.
Please come in. You're you know, you're so great. And
that taught me, like he understood that I was a

(28:00):
nervous wreck.

Speaker 3 (28:01):
He was.

Speaker 4 (28:01):
He didn't have to be that nice, but he was
really nice. And I've carried that on, you know, years
and years with myself. But I worked with him. I
did makeup on the model. It was a girl named Talsa,
beautiful girl, and he said when we were all Donnie said,
all right, Bobby, take it off.

Speaker 3 (28:19):
It's too much.

Speaker 4 (28:20):
And it was really light handed, but he said, take
it off, and then he went and he pinched her cheek.
He said, that's what I want her to look like.
And you know, and he said, to Lisa, bite your
lips and.

Speaker 1 (28:31):
Then like Scarlett O'Hara, kind of yeah.

Speaker 4 (28:34):
But then I saw what he was looking for, and
I went back and I did her makeup again, and
he said, that's it. So I understood what real like.
Not natural makeup doesn't mean it's hardly there or it's nude.
It just means it's the actual colors you have in
the skin. So that kind of started my makeup journey.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
And really influenced sort of your whole brand, not only
with Bobby Brown but now with Jones Road. But before
we get to that and kind of creating your own line,
you're you're really hustling in New York and then you
meet your husband, Stephen, and you dedicate the book to Steven.
And after that first meeting, you called your dad the

(29:15):
next morning and said that you had met the man
you're going to marry. So even though he's here and
we'll get embarrassed, tell us about Steve and Bobby.

Speaker 4 (29:25):
Well, first of all, he's my partner and everything. You know,
he's he's always there for me, and you know I'm
always there for him. I'm his partner. I don't know
if he cares as much about my opinion is I
need his opinion. But we are always there for each other.
You know, we are incredibly lucky people because we've you know,

(29:46):
we've had these three kids together. We now have two grandkids.
We you know, I follow him anywhere. He goes to
more places than I would choose to go to, but
I go because it makes him happy. And you know,
he's my partner in work and my partner in life.
I could, I honestly say this one hundred percent. There's

(30:06):
not a chance that I would be Bobby Brown without him.
I wouldn't have the guts and I wouldn't have the wherewithal.

Speaker 1 (30:13):
That's such a nice thing to say. Here's to Steven.
Where is he anyway? Where are you? Stephen?

Speaker 3 (30:18):
And I saved the front row for my family, But
clearly they.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
Oh, he's back there anyway. You know, So Stephen goes
to law school, right, Bobby, and you feel a lot
of pressure to work and to make a bit more money.

Speaker 3 (30:31):
Yeah, the real.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
Estate market crashed and he came to me and he said, oh,
I better get a job. And I looked at him
and I had this vision of him standing on you know,
at the sixty six bus with a briefcase. I'm like,
that's not my husband. I said, that is the dumbest
thing I've ever heard you say. And then he went
to law school.

Speaker 1 (30:50):
So you decided to help out obviously, while he's in
law school and you're on a shoot for Self magazine
and you meet the other Steven who is an on
site chemist at Keels and he makes his own lipsticks, right,
So tell us about that meeting and how that basically
created this new side hustle for yourself.

Speaker 4 (31:12):
Well, when I was doing this shoot for Self magazine,
it was the story was like makeup shopping and alternative
places in New York. I was actually pregnant with Dylan,
who's now thirty five. Isn't that insane? And he had
these lipsticks and I'm like, ooh, what are these? They're
really nice. He said, Oh, I make them out of

(31:33):
my house. He was a chemist from Pennsylvania, and I said,
I've always wanted to make a lipstick. I said, because
I always have to fix lipsticks to make them look
you know, this brownish nude color. He said, I could
make them for you. I said, really, he says, yeah,
tell me what you want. And so we started working
on this lipstick. We got the formula down and then

(31:54):
I sent him the things. We got the color down,
and I said to myself, oh my god, I love this.

Speaker 3 (31:59):
I bet I could sell it.

Speaker 4 (32:02):
And then I realized, well, not everyone is going to
like that color lipstick. Some people like you know, pink
or red, and people have different color lips. Like it
just dawned on me. I'm like, this is not going
to look the same. So I thought about ten different colors.
He made them our business deal. And if there's business
people in the audience, our business deal was he would

(32:23):
give me the lipsticks. We'd sell them for fifteen dollars.
He would get seven fifteen. I would get seven fifty.
Oh it's pretty good, right, that's some cash for groceries.
So that's how we started.

Speaker 1 (32:34):
And you had this set of ten different shades, right.

Speaker 4 (32:37):
That we would put in a Manila envelope. Stephen would
mail them and you know, we had the ingredients in
a card. Now I know that's called like, you know,
environmentally friendly, because we didn't have boxes.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
So this business grows and grows, right, these lipsticks become
super popular.

Speaker 4 (32:55):
They become popular, you know. Also a friend of mine
who was a beauty editor at Glamor magazine said, can
I write about them?

Speaker 3 (33:05):
Why would you want to write about Like?

Speaker 4 (33:07):
Why, Well, now I know it's called pr And they
kind of took off. And then we had to hire
my sister in La Brina to do the books. And
so she came and did the books, and Stephen did
the mailing and the accounting, and all of a sudden
we had this little business.

Speaker 1 (33:25):
And it was Bobby Brown Essentials.

Speaker 4 (33:27):
No, it wasn't it was it was just called Bobby Brown.
There wasn't essentials.

Speaker 1 (33:30):
So when did it become essentials?

Speaker 4 (33:32):
Well, so we had this little side hustle. We didn't
call it that then back then, but it was a
side hustle. And then one day we went to a
party in the city at someone's house. Her name was Alison,
and I said, thank you for inviting me, and she says, oh,
thank you for coming. I'm a big fan. I'm like, oh,
you know who I am. She said, yeah, I've seen

(33:53):
your work in magazines and I said, what do you do?
She said, well, I'm a cosmetics buyer at Bergdorf Goodman.
I said, oh, let me tell you about this thing
I have.

Speaker 1 (34:02):
Talk about serendipity, right.

Speaker 3 (34:04):
I mean Jeff's grandma and Burgdorf.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
Yeah, yeah, So she said, I'd like to sell them.

Speaker 3 (34:10):
Yeah, I'd like to sell him. So we sold, you know.

Speaker 4 (34:12):
So we we had this deal, which you know, this
is when Stephen came in, because I don't know how
to make those deals. I know how to open the door,
I just don't know how to close the door.

Speaker 1 (34:24):
So what was the deal was with Burgdorf?

Speaker 3 (34:27):
Right?

Speaker 4 (34:27):
But but you can't start a business seven fifty and
seven fifty. It doesn't work. So we had to find
someone to make the lipsticks and have, you know, start
all over again basically.

Speaker 1 (34:40):
And what happened to the Keels guy?

Speaker 4 (34:43):
He went on to do other things, you know, and
I had to start all over again, you know. He
I mean I he couldn't do what I needed to
be done, and he knows and he knew that. And
so I was at an elevator one day and I
said hi, and the girl said hi, And I don't
even know how. I asked her, what do you do?

(35:04):
She said, Oh, I work for a cosmetics manufacturer. I said,
do you have a card, and they started making my first.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
Shik like Walter Mitty or something. You know. Yeah, so
you met her, I.

Speaker 4 (35:16):
Met her, I got her card, and she helped me
reproduce the lipsticks. And so when we sold into Burgdorf
Goodman February of ninety one, it was, you know, ten
lipsticks sitting on a table. We thought we'd sell one
hundred the first day, and we sold the first month,
and we sold one hundred the first day.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
Wow. And you meanwhile, you're getting proposals out the wazoo
from all different corporations to sell Well not that week,
well no, but later on, later on after Bobby Brown
Essentials kind of really gets off the ground.

Speaker 4 (35:52):
I mean really, we sold the company after four and
a half years, which I know is not a long time.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
No, And there were a lot of offers, so a
lot of interest we had.

Speaker 3 (36:01):
We had a bunch of different interests.

Speaker 1 (36:02):
So then Esday Latter comes around, and what made you
finally say yes to es Day Ltder.

Speaker 4 (36:09):
Well, we didn't say yes to s D Latter. We
said yes to Leonard Lotter.

Speaker 3 (36:13):
Yeah right, I mean Leonard Lotter, right, I mean it.

Speaker 1 (36:16):
Was like, oh, I mean I love Leonard Lotter too.

Speaker 3 (36:19):
Right, I mean Leonard Lotter.

Speaker 4 (36:20):
You just always said yes to Leonard Lotter and he
always said yes to me.

Speaker 1 (36:25):
What were those years like? I mean, I know it
was a mixed bag ultimately, but when you first came
you said it was life changing, right, Yeah, it sounds
like an episode of that girl.

Speaker 4 (36:38):
You know, you're oh, it was very I was between
Melanie Griffith and you know, and working Girl and Marlo
Thomas and that girl like I you know, and a
little you know, Mary Tyler Moore. But it was it
was crazy, it was exciting, it was incredible, and you know,
we had an office. I think our first office was
on Park Avenue. We eventually moved into the GM building.

(37:00):
And in the beginning it was magic. I had all
the support I had, I had anything, you know that
I needed to grow this company. And you know, we
by the time they when they bought us, we were
the number one line in Bergdorf and in Niman Marcus.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
And you call those the wonder years. They were the
wonder years.

Speaker 4 (37:19):
I mean every you know, every event that Leonard went
to Steven and I got invited to and we got
to meet all these incredible people, and we traveled, you know,
the globe, and they took really good care of us.
And Leonard just let me be myself. Like I never
felt that my crazy ideas were juvenile.

Speaker 3 (37:38):
I just you know, he always he thought I was
really smart.

Speaker 1 (37:41):
But there was a moment, I guess after a while, right,
Bobby were say, twenty two years, twenty two years? But yes,
so you're you're happy until you're not right And and
what made you get restless and feel like maybe a
bit constraint by being in this corporate world.

Speaker 4 (38:00):
Well, you know, things changed and things got tougher, and
the you know, the business and the corporation grew and
there was new people that were coming in and then
little by little things started changing at Bobby Brown. And
you know, I always went to work thinking I could
fix things if they would just listen to me, if

(38:21):
I could just do this. I knew exactly what needed
to get done, and you know, towards the end, no,
it just didn't work. So it was it was, it
was pretty miserable at the end.

Speaker 1 (38:32):
Was that hard for you, especially with your close relationship
with Leonard.

Speaker 4 (38:37):
Well, I don't think Leonard was that involved at the end,
he was you know, other powers took over, so I
didn't have Leonard to go to to talk about things.
You know, he didn't just say yes to me. We
talked things through. He really was, you know, a business partner.
But when he wasn't around, and there was other important

(38:58):
you know, people running the company.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
Those who shall not be named, so those.

Speaker 4 (39:02):
Don't need to be named. But it changed, and you know,
it was a really different kind of company, and it
was probably you know, I probably overstayed my welcome by
a couple of years, but I kept thinking I was
going to fix it.

Speaker 1 (39:17):
Looking back, do you regret selling your company TOI?

Speaker 3 (39:20):
Not a nanosecond.

Speaker 4 (39:21):
Nor do I regret the last two miserable years I learned.
I became a much better person because of what I
went through.

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(40:41):
leave in twenty sixteen, four years remaining on your non compete.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
And twenty five year non compete.

Speaker 1 (40:48):
Yes, and so Mini you couldn't work in the beauty
industry till twenty twenty. Did you know, Bobby during that period,
I'm gonna I'm going to do it all over again.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
Absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
So what motivated you to say I'm going to start
this new line and I'm super excited to do it
and I'm not done yet.

Speaker 4 (41:12):
Well, I when I left the company, I really thought
I was done. I said I'm done. You know, that
was a journey, that was okay, that door's closed, now what?
And you know I took two days really kind of
you know, moping and not working and then I just said,
this stinks, and I started calling people and going out
and I didn't know what I was going to do.

(41:34):
I mean, you know, I had I had my calendar
was so overbooked from things that all of a sudden,
I didn't have anything on it.

Speaker 3 (41:43):
So I had to fill the calendar and.

Speaker 4 (41:45):
I would go talk to people, and you know, one
of the first people I talked to gave me an
opportunity to open a Just Bobby shop at for Lord
and Taylor's, So I got that project. You know, my
husband said to me, I need your help on this project.
He had bought a building and wants to turn into
a hotel. Okay, sure, I never even said once in

(42:07):
my life I want to have a hotel, but sure,
why not?

Speaker 3 (42:11):
So we did that and it was fun.

Speaker 4 (42:13):
And then I opened a wellness brand, which was incredibly
great experience, and it didn't work. You know, it's good
to have something that doesn't work, right.

Speaker 1 (42:24):
Yeah, Well, what he learned from that.

Speaker 4 (42:25):
I learned that it probably you know, first of all,
starting a line one line in Bergdorf and another line
of Walmart, two different things, and you know, it's a
different beast and not everything that I touch turns to
gold and that was you know.

Speaker 1 (42:42):
Okay, that was humbling. I guess, totally humbling. But you
decided to go back to your first love makeup and
you're sixty two years old and you say, I'm going
to start this new company called Jones Road, which is
named after a street near your house in Sagaharbor.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
No, no, it's actually a street. Step and I don't
agree on this. There's a street in East Hampton Jones Road,
but we don't usually go that way, so I think
it was some past West Hampton.

Speaker 3 (43:12):
There's a street called Jones Road.

Speaker 4 (43:14):
And I was complaining to Stephen that we couldn't find
a name of this new company. And I wanted to
launch the day my noncompete was up. I didn't care
that it was in the middle of the pandemic. I
didn't care that it was a week before the presidential election.
I didn't care. I just wanted to launch it that day.
I didn't care. So he said, if we don't have
a name by Monday, and this was like either Thursday

(43:36):
or Friday morning, we're not going to be able to
do it. And I looked down at the map because
when we drive Stephen likes me to look at ways
and Google maps, because god forbid, we're five minutes late,
even if we have nowhere to go. Okay, So I
looked down and I saw Jones Road, and I said
Jones Road beauty, And immediately in my head it sounded

(43:58):
like a bespoke British brand that they asked me to
make modern again. And Stephen said, I like it, and
we called our lawyer and it was available and it
became Jones Road.

Speaker 1 (44:09):
So what was your north star when you created this
new line and how did your goals and your mission
change from when you started out with Bobby Brown. I mean,
obviously you're in a very different situation and position, but
in terms of the product itself, well, it's.

Speaker 4 (44:27):
So funny because I felt really youthful and young and energized.
Because when I first started Bobby Brown with the lipsticks
and you know, and starting the early company where there
were not a lot of layers, it was just kind
of me being excited and doing things. I felt that again,
like I felt like I was in my thirties, and
you know, I had one I hired one person to

(44:50):
help me with this, and we started just kind of
playing with things and we had to find all new
labs because I didn't want to hire anyone from the
old company. I didn't want to use any of the labs,
and you know, I wanted to see if it was
possible to create a clean line and I didn't know.
So we found you know, we didn't open up the

(45:11):
Yellow Pages this time, but we googled. But it's kind
of the same thing. And we found these labs and
started making these products. And this one product came in
and I looked at it and it wasn't what I
asked for, and I was kind of annoyed. But then
I stuck my finger in it and I went like
this because that's what makeup artists do. And then I
put it on my face and I'm like, oh my god,

(45:33):
look at me. This is a friggin miracle. I didn't
say friggin, but I said, this is a miracle. And
everyone at the office was like, oh my god. And
it became miracle ballm and I ended up putting it
in little containers and I gave it to my friends.
Because you remember during the pandemic, when you finally realize
you're doing zooms again, yeah, and you realize you looked

(45:54):
terrible but you know you haven't colored your hair, cut
your hair, and just this little stuff on the face
made everybody look so much better. They kept coming back
and asking for more. Bobby, I ran out of that
little teeny thing, Can I have more? So I knew
I had a winner.

Speaker 1 (46:11):
And so your philosophy, I mean it's interesting, Bobby, because
I know you like Instagram. We're both a little addicted maybe,
And you know you see all these makeup tutorials, especially
I think in recent years the contouring that really the
Kardashian kind of look, and you have always rejected that

(46:33):
and felt that. I guess my question is, what is
your beauty philosophy?

Speaker 4 (46:39):
Well, you know, I watched those things, and I'm really
fascinated by the talent a lot of these you know,
content creators have with makeup. I'm not that talented. I'm
not like, I'm not that kind of a makeup artist painter,
But I'm really talented what I do. And I have
figured out, you know, how to teach women, how did

(46:59):
you just look better but still look like yourself and
not change? And you know I didn't invent makeup. I
just like reinventing it and I like to demystify it
because everyone's like, so it's they think it's so complicated,
and it's so not complicated.

Speaker 1 (47:17):
And I love that your models are all ages. As
somebody who's sixty eight. I really appreciate that you show
your products on someone who's twenty two and someone who's
seventy two, and I mean a beautiful seventy two.

Speaker 4 (47:33):
I mean, I you know, look, I know I'm sixty eight,
but I don't feel age.

Speaker 3 (47:37):
I don't see age.

Speaker 4 (47:38):
I don't think about it, you know, except when we
talk about something popular culture. And the kids in my
office have no idea, no idea who this person is.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
That's my assistant, didn't know who the Partridge family was.
I was crushed, was like, you don't know David Cassidy.

Speaker 4 (47:57):
I mean some of the girls in my office didn't
know who Diane von First was or Paul Smith. And
I'm just like, if you don't know who Paul McCartney is,
you're walking out of.

Speaker 3 (48:05):
The door right now.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
So I know that you. I was thinking when you
were talking about the Today Show being a great sort
of PR tool for you before before social media, you
adapted to social media really well, and I think you
did it by being yourself, and these videos you did
really went viral. Tell me about how you started, how

(48:30):
you became a TikTok star.

Speaker 4 (48:31):
I know, right, it was like Bobby brown sixty two
TikTok Star, Bobby Brown's sixty four TikTok Star. I guess
I'm not a TikTok star anymore because I don't say
Bobby Brown's sixty eight TikTok Star. But you know, in
the beginning, I didn't really want I didn't go on TikTok.
I just thought it was for you know, stupid dance
tricks or whatever. And you know, my our son Cody,

(48:54):
who is now the CEO, who was the head of brand,
who is the head of marketing, then said, you know,
we had a we had a call with Gary Vaynerchuck,
and he said, you got to stop what you're doing.
You just got to do TikTok. Go hire an agency,
go hire people, just get a team. We got off
the phone and Cody looked at me, he says, all right, mom,
go And I just looked in the in the phone,

(49:16):
you know, in good light, with my head up because
it you know, that's part of it now. And I
said I'm you know, I'm new to TikTok. I'm Bobby.
What do you want?

Speaker 3 (49:25):
You know, what do you want to know?

Speaker 4 (49:26):
And people went crazy. I didn't know there were people
my age on TikTok. Yeah, like they're a ton And so,
you know, we started doing TikTok and we had a
couple of major viral moments and it really quadrupled our
business for a while.

Speaker 1 (49:41):
Is it fun working with your son Cody, who is
now the CEO, Well, he was the head.

Speaker 4 (49:46):
Of growth, then he was marketing, and then he was
the CMO, and now he's the CEO. So it is
really interesting, you know, is it fun? I don't think
it's fun. You know, it's more fun when I go
to his house and play with his kids. He's you know,
he's very serious at work. He's really smart. He's not

(50:06):
here he's had enough of his mom and you know,
it's it's just super interesting for me to sit there
and listen to my son be the smartest guy in
the room.

Speaker 1 (50:17):
But that must make you really proud.

Speaker 3 (50:19):
It makes me really proud. It does. And his wife
is the head of brand, so.

Speaker 1 (50:24):
I met them both when I came, right, Yeah I did, Yeah, Yeah,
came to your place. Let me do some audience questions
so we can get to some of these. Somebody asked,
did you ever regret signing the twenty five year non compete?

Speaker 4 (50:40):
I don't need to regret. I mean, maybe I should
have signed a twenty year but no.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
Stephen was said it might be a problem.

Speaker 4 (50:47):
Well, Stephen said, you might not like this, But when
he told me we had a twenty five year non compete, like,
I'm I had to count on my fingers because I'm
not good at math. But I'm like, I'm not going
to want to work when I'm in my sixties, So
it didn't really matter.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
Someone asked, and this is a nice question. Your dad,
Joe is a children's book author. Did he have any
advice for you ahead of writing your memoir?

Speaker 4 (51:11):
Just no, he no, you know, he's he's He corrected
me a few things, like he read the chapter about him,
and he corrected me on a few things, as did
Aunt Dallas, and as did you know my kids?

Speaker 3 (51:24):
So yeah, no.

Speaker 4 (51:26):
And by the way, speaking of Aunt Dallas, if you
know anyone in Chicago, I couldn't wait for this book talk.
But my Aunt Dallas is interviewing me on stage at
her retirement community. She's ninety four.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
Oh, that's so nice.

Speaker 4 (51:40):
Her boyfriend is ninety five and he's bringing four of
his daughters.

Speaker 1 (51:45):
Ah, that's so sweet. That's so nice. This kind of
goes along the same lines as the earlier question. But
how do you feel having let go of something with
your name and now someone else is making the decisions
and the profits with no one from you because they
still sell Bobby Brown.

Speaker 4 (52:03):
Still sell Bobby Brown. And you know, in the beginning,
it was really hard. I'm not gonna lie. I didn't
want to go near a Bobby Brown counter. I still
haven't used any of the products since I left the brand.
It was just an emotional thing for me. It took
me a while to get rid of any kind of emotion, anger, sadness, loss,
all of that stuff. I worked through things, you know,

(52:27):
with the way I work through things, and you know,
nothing like a successful new act to kind of help
you get over it faster.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
Yeah, how does the brand do? Bobby Brown?

Speaker 3 (52:38):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
Okay, this is also an interesting question. The beauty industry
is in a very odd place at the moment. Big
companies like Cody are struggling, while Indie brands and influencer
brands are thriving. What are they doing right versus wrong?
And this person said, I love the miracle bombs. Ah.

Speaker 3 (53:01):
Well, you know, it's a new world, Goldie. That's all
I have to say.

Speaker 4 (53:04):
And I think that any you know, I think every
company out there has to, you know, shift and adjust
and adapt and just you know, be a little more
nimble to how things in the world are, you know, are.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
Happening, Bobby, I brought my mom to this event. She
traveled all the way from Canada. Thank you for coming
to our country, Canada. That was very brave of you,
she she she loves you and Katie, thank you, Thank
you Canadian Mom. What is the single most important piece

(53:39):
of advice you received that contributed to your success and
who was it from? Thank you, Nicole.

Speaker 3 (53:46):
Well, you know, I got a lot of advice.

Speaker 4 (53:48):
You know, my my parents pretty much taught me to
be myself and that was pretty good advice. And Leonard
Latter gave me the best. Well, my I'm gonna tell
you my dad and Leonard Lotter. Leonard Latter said to
me once, never ever ask for permission, just beg for forgiveness.
So he gave me that permission am my dad. When
I called my dad when I was trying to make

(54:11):
it in New York and I said, Dad, I keep
going over on my checking account.

Speaker 3 (54:15):
I can't, I can't balance, can't.

Speaker 4 (54:17):
I don't know how to you know how to do this,
and I'm just always going over. And he said, well,
stop worrying how you're going to budget yourself. Just figure
out how you're going to make more money.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
He said, okay, that was good advice and you took
it to heart. I'm going to do a quick lightning
round with completely shallow, superficial questions. Whatca, what's the biggest
mistake people make when it comes to makeup, especially if
you're over fifty, not using enough moisturizer. Can anyone wear
red lipstick?

Speaker 3 (54:47):
Absolutely not?

Speaker 1 (54:49):
Who I know? I can't.

Speaker 3 (54:51):
I can't either.

Speaker 1 (54:52):
I look so weird.

Speaker 3 (54:54):
I just you know what, you're either a red lipstick
person or you're not, so I just do red nails.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
Does it have to do with your skin? Now?

Speaker 3 (55:00):
It has to do with what you like?

Speaker 4 (55:03):
What you what you like? I mean red lipstick is
a little polarizing. Yeah, it looks swift, it does, and
a lot of you know, French women look great.

Speaker 3 (55:11):
And I don't know as anyone wearing red lipstick in here.

Speaker 1 (55:15):
One somebody?

Speaker 4 (55:17):
Yeah, one person. Well it's dark in here, but I'm
sure you look fantastic.

Speaker 1 (55:21):
Okay, is there really anything out there that will get
rid of creepy skin? Asking for a friend.

Speaker 4 (55:29):
So I grew up with a mom that bought every
wrinkle remover cream on the market, and nothing ever worked.
You know, creepy skin is just dry, dehydrated skin.

Speaker 1 (55:40):
But it also is skin that has separated from your
muscle when you get older.

Speaker 4 (55:44):
Well, guess what the best way to get rid of
it is to build more muscle. Yeah, that is really
the only way. And where moisturizer. Make sure you're drinking
enough water and just really, everyone in this room. If
you don't have a weight routine, there's nothing better for
your and health then weights.

Speaker 1 (56:02):
I have a weightlifting class tomorrow. In fact, I'm trying.
But then when I do it, I can't walk for
three days.

Speaker 3 (56:08):
Well there's a different way to do it, Katie.

Speaker 1 (56:10):
Then well you need to come and help me.

Speaker 4 (56:12):
Well, when I when I replace your oreos with the
Norri protein drink.

Speaker 3 (56:18):
We'll talk.

Speaker 1 (56:19):
I had oreos backstay dinner, but anyway, just once we
ordered it. What what what are your thoughts on botox
and facelifts?

Speaker 3 (56:27):
Well, let's see. You know, I've I've said I'm never
going to have a facelift. I'm not. I don't think
I'm ever going to have a facelift. You know.

Speaker 4 (56:38):
I Botox for me is not something I choose to do.
I tried it when I was in my forties and
I had two terrible, terrible things. I did not tell
my husband about it, you know, but he's heard me
admit it, and you know it's not for me. But
if it's for you and you like it, that's fine.

Speaker 1 (56:55):
Yeah. In closing, Bobby, you've accomplished so much, and I
know there's a lot more you want to do. But
what do you think is next for you? Are you
happy building this new very successful, very well loved brand
and kind of making this? You know this? You're not.

(57:16):
I don't want to say final act because I said,
but you know, are you? Are you looking to do
anything more after this?

Speaker 3 (57:23):
You think? Open to anything?

Speaker 1 (57:25):
Really?

Speaker 3 (57:25):
I have no thoughts or plans.

Speaker 4 (57:28):
First of all, I love what I'm doing at Jones Road.
I mean, it's just it's my favorite place to be
is in my office with all the kids that work
for me, and you know, talk about cool things that
are doing. It's it's it's my it's my happiness, you know.
Between that and Lily and Sean, my grandkids, it's like
it's just the best.

Speaker 1 (57:48):
And you really love to work. I mean I'm the
same way. I love to work. It just work gives
me purpose.

Speaker 4 (57:55):
And it gives and it like infuses energy and I
meet new peace and I get to, you know, use
my creativity and my curiosity.

Speaker 3 (58:05):
I do. I love it.

Speaker 4 (58:06):
I love new experiences. I don't know what else is
ahead in the future. I would like to figure out
a way to have more free time, but not until
this book is on the New York Times bestsellers list.

Speaker 3 (58:22):
Hey everybody, I need your help.

Speaker 1 (58:24):
Bobby, thank you so much. This was so much fun.
Thanks for listening everyone. If you have a question for me,
a subject you want us to cover, or you want
to share your thoughts about how you navigate this crazy world,
reach out send me a DM on Instagram. I would
love to hear from you. Next Question is a production

(58:47):
of iHeartMedia and Katie Kuric Media. The executive producers are Me,
Katie Kuric and Courtneyltz. Our supervising producer is Ryan Martz,
and our producers are Adriana Fazzio and Meredith Barnes. Julian
Weller composed art theme music. For more information about today's episode,

(59:07):
or to sign up for my newsletter, wake Up Call,
go to the description in the podcast app, or visit
us at Katiecuric dot com. You can also find me
on Instagram and all my social media channels. For more
podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Hi. Everyone, it's Katiekuric.

(59:31):
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