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January 13, 2023 48 mins

Ed talks with political strategist and pollster Cornell Belcher. They discuss the general state of politics, the future for the Biden administration ahead of the 2024 Presidential election, upcoming Supreme Court decisions and the importance of the Black voting.

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Speaker 1 (00:21):
Welcome to the latest edition of one hundred The d
Gordon Podcast. Today a conversation with political strategists and pollster
Cornell Belcher. Belcher is one of the nation's most respected posters.
He is the founder and president of Brilliant Corners Research
and Strategies. We started our conversation around what's the political

(00:43):
landscape for a year ahead of the presidential election. We
started with the newly seated one h Congress and the
better than expected outcome for Democrats. It wasn't a little
bit better than I expect that it was historical. Look, Um,
Barack Obama lost, Um belyve we lost over fifty seats. Um,

(01:10):
you know, Bill Clinton lost some forty seats, right, Uh?
Trump lost uh forty some seats or better. I believe
I'm getting old, my and my memory. I drink a
lot at so especially these days, So my memory not
what it used to be. But when you look at
how historically, uh, and this term Republicans are supposed to

(01:34):
have in fact a wave of election and then and
then look at the setup. Right, you had real economic
concerns coming out of the pandemic, and you had a
hundred million dollars of advertising by the Republicans saying that
the economy was terrible and inflation was terrible and that
was all Joe Biden's Democrats fault, regardless of whether or
not we understand that that from the data standpoint, that's

(01:55):
not true. And and and there's no magical button that
that Biden can push for inflation, and you had real
concerns about about crime and safety. They were set up
to have another historic um election and they didn't. And
that that says something to right, That says something that

(02:18):
speaks loudly that historically they were not able to build
a wave election like they have been in the past.
And I think that's an important story. Also, tell me
what you would like the average voter to hear in
that beyond the obvious, because there is still a lot

(02:40):
of despair, uh for the everyday person, and they see
a lot of dysfunction coming out of Washington. So what
should they take out of that? What should take out
of that is that you're going to get the government
that you're gonna you're not You're gonna get the government

(03:01):
that that ultimately we deserve. And what I mean by
that is look part and partial why they didn't have
a red wave because and I don't know, call me crazy,
but when you tell a woman what she can and
can't do with her body, maybe some people have an

(03:24):
issue with that. Right when you try to overthrow our democracy,
maybe some people have been issued with that when you
put anti semitism and racism and misogyny at the forefront
of so much of your sort of who you are

(03:46):
as as a campaign and a candidate. I mean, and
they weren't even you know, we've talked in the past
about dog whistles, and they're not dog whistles anymore. Right.
You look at you look at their you look at
their their candidates were sending and governor. They're not even dogs.
They are standing beside people and going to rallies with

(04:08):
people who are pushing replacement theory. Yeah, so you did
have a different kind of turnout. What typically happens at
is that that that young people and people of color
pull back in a midterm election. Right, you have really
what I've talked about here, as you have two electorates

(04:28):
fighting for control of the trol control of the future
of America. You have one that is older, less diverse,
and they're very anxious about the changes that are happening
in this country, and you have one that is younger,
more diverse, and are part of the changes that are
happening in this country, aren't and are not anxious about it,

(04:50):
and they're fighting for for for control of this country.
What I mean by we get the democracy or the
government we deserve is this it. We are lucky to
get turnout of eligible voters in this country. We're lucky.
And if you look at the last if you look

(05:12):
at if you look at mid terms over the last
two decades, right, two decades, take out because that was
an outlier we had turnout turnout really you usually ranges
somewhere between thirty eight and maybe forty two percent turnout,
which is turl right, So you have this narrow swath

(05:34):
of people determining what's happening in this country. Now, we
don't know what the exact turnout was from this past
mid term, but we do know it was it looked
this this past mid term looked more like um. But
still add when you can't get when you can't get
the majority of people engage in this process, then that's

(05:59):
what I mean by we often get the government that
we that we that that we that we deserve right.
So you know, now do have a government for at
least in the House of Representatives, you're gonna have lawmakers
pushing forward laws and trying to move legislation that the
vast majority of Americans don't want and didn't ask for.

(06:21):
So let me take you to that, because what's interesting
and I'll get to participation in just a moment. But
what is interesting is even though the red wave, the
predicted red wave didn't happen, um, the apple cart is
upset enough that a small group of people canstall, trip

(06:43):
up change, even push things through. If people are asleep
at the wheel, How do you watch that to make
sure that you don't have this rabid, small conservative, right
wing um group push through legists relation that does not
speak to what the majority of Americans want. Yeah, that's

(07:04):
a really good question and there's no simple answer to it.
Let me start by saying this, not all of us.
So I thought it was gonna be a red way.
Someone was like me, were very vocal about and you
look at the data, guys, there's no red wave here
in this data. But that also speaks to the manipulation
and prop and propaganda that we're seeing. Uh, that was intentional. Um.

(07:31):
They there are forces in this country that that when
when they can make us cynical. And so when you
talk about turn out, you're talking about participation. You know,
there's so many people that I talked to sort of
in focus groups that there they just don't believe anything matters,

(07:51):
and they're so cynical about the process. But that's how
the other side wins. And so when you look at
the narrow and look this, McCarthy is speaker only in
entitle um because he's given away all most of the
power and the leverage um and legitimacy and integrity of

(08:17):
the speaker's office. So the emperor has no clothes, um.
How long do you think he'll last? I mean, with
the idea of just one person being able to say, hey,
you gotta look at this again. I don't think he's
gonna last very long. And and you know, at what costs?
You know, at some point you have to ask where

(08:38):
is integrity? What what costs? You know? What are you
willing to give up? What are you willing to How
much damage are you willing to do to to the
office and to the body in order for you to
gain power? And there's no and there's no shame anymore
um about it. But but and I will connect the
dots to all of this right back to two thousand

(09:02):
and eight. Cor. Now, how are you going to connect
with that pactice UM? I would argue that when you
see and even Republicans look, you know, I was reading
in the article in New York Times that rag right
in New York Times, and I was reading the New
York Times. It was yesterday to day before it was
like David Brooks then another conservative bemoaning how the Republican

(09:26):
Party is in their Republican Party, um, and how they've
gone off of off the deep end. Um. But I'm
going to trace all of this right back to I
would argue America's original sin that we've never confronted. Um.
And the A lot of people talked about Barack Obama

(09:51):
as some sort of historical racial breakthrough. Uh. And I
remember people, and you remembers that they were talking, they
were writing our arts about America's being post racial. Um.
And I was even in Paris when when I found
on America's post racial after the election, because all the
French were coming up to us and talking about how

(10:12):
America's post racial. They had his racial breakthrough. Now many
of us knew that wasn't. In fact, we were not
post racial. Um. It was a breakthrough, but not the
breakthrough that they were thinking it was a breakthrough. It
was a demographic breakthrough. It was a changing of American
breakthrough because because because look, Barack Obama did not do

(10:34):
better among white voters, um uh dramatically better among white
voters than John Kerry did. Right, there was maybe one
percentage point that that separated Barack Obama and John Kerry.
When you look at the percentage of the white voat nationally,
the difference with Barack Obama and John Kerry were about
five or six million more brown people. And that was

(10:59):
the break room. And a black man in a white
house was a cataclysmic event for so many Americans and
made them uncomfortable. And what happened, and speaking of that
mid term, what happened in two we heard calls of

(11:19):
started growing in two thousand nine into two thousand ten,
we have to take back our country now. Ad when
people say they gotta take back the country, we should
take them at the word that they really do think
they're losing their country, that someone is taking their country
away from them. Um. Now, trace that dots right back

(11:40):
to what many of my Republicans that I know I
thought could never happen. That was Donald Trump could win
a Republican primary because they've seen Donald Trump's types before.
I mean, I could argue that that Pat Buchanan was
a Donald Trump, a better Donald Trump, but he couldn't
break through what change. What change was the wolf was

(12:03):
no longer at the door, the wolf was in the house.
And and the anxiousness of the changes that were that
about the change that would happen in the country. It
was a cataclysm. And what happens in a cataclysm. All
the rules of the road go out the door. When
there's a cataclysm. The only thing that that matters is

(12:25):
putting this down and saving the house. Um. And look
at what Trump did, not only in twenty six team,
but right in this last election. Um. When you talk
to the front of crowd and say I'm gonna give
you back your country. We're gonna make America grant again, right,
that's all about driving tribalism. And right now, I would

(12:49):
argue that that we're we don't understand our politics right
now because so many on the on the on the
on the right, are behaving like Republicans in the past
because of this cataclysm, and because they understand that that
they're fighting for and there's zero some game. They're fighting
for their tribal survival. And that's a different equation with

(13:14):
politics today than it was uh to to three decades ago. Yeah,
let's take that a step further in terms of the cataclysm.
I think about what Donald Trump did masterfully, quite frankly,
if you think about the language that he used, not
behind closed doors, but in front of the door, that

(13:35):
was usually reserved for just a few and I'll still
call them fringe, even though they were dead center in
the Republican Party. Someone like a George Wallace, for instance,
certain language um that he was comfortable enough in using
in rallies and and even he was editing himself. What

(13:55):
Donald Trump has done is he is allowed some of
the language that to your point two decades ago, never
would have been set in public to now be said
by quote unquote mainstream middle of the road quote end
quote Republicans comfortably. And to your point, it's gone from
a dog whistled to a foghorn? Is this here to stay? Yes,

(14:20):
it's here. It was never left us and I mean
it is racist. Race matters have always mattered politically in
this country. Right, and I'm someone like I'm a child
of the South. Um. You know, tell me when, tell
me when race matters didn't play a partner in our politics,

(14:40):
and right, they always played a part. But but the
language and the verocity of language that is used now
post Donald Trump was not used in the same way.
It's it's it's, it's it's I will I will give
you that as more mainstream. But but but at the
same time it um. Uh, George H. Bush was trailing

(15:05):
when he until he put out the Willie Horton at yeah,
all right, Um, Ronald Reagan wanted you to remember a
country before Yes, right, well well and and and I understand. Look,
Ronald Reagan, where did Ronald Reagan start his campaign at?
He started campaign in Philadelphia, Misissippi. Now, a lot of

(15:27):
us who are steeped in the history of the civil
rights understand, we understand what Philadelphia, Misissippi means symbolically. Why
did he do that? Um? Why did Ronald Reagan talk
about you know, welfare queens? Um? You know this is
all really a within the continuum of the Southern strategy.

(15:51):
M hmm. It is all sort of what at Water
talked about, right that we're talked about. You start off
what he said, You start off in what he said,
Nick Nigga, Nick nigga. But then you get to the
point where you can't do that anymore. So you've gotta
be more nuanced about it. You guys start talking about
you know, bussing and and these people getting more from

(16:14):
from from the government than other people. You gotta be
more nuanced about it. But it's all the same thing.
It's all traces back to Nigga nigga nick nicka nigga. Um.
And this this conflict, right, this, this conflict, this, this, this,
this ghost of America's original sin holds the keys to

(16:38):
our downfall. And why do I say that. I say
that because and we've never seen a first world country
of our magnitude that is a so called democracy. Do
What's gonna happen and America over the next fift years

(17:00):
is where we become awfully close to a majority minority
country in the next fifteen or more years. Fifteen years
were close enough to to that tipping point anyway, where
where one group of people who think, one group of
people who historically, if you play the zero some game,
one group of people who have historically controlled this country,

(17:24):
UM have to share power or worse yet, have to
hand the mental power over to another group of people
who they don't consider in their tribe. There's gonna be
incredible tensions. Let me take you to something that is interesting.

(17:46):
Presidential campaigns, um wannabes are often made by moments. UM. There,
amongst all of the foolishness we saw in the McCarthy vote,
at the end of it, we saw what I think
was a moment for Hakim Jeffreys. The question is does

(18:07):
he take that moment and bounce it somewhere else? Um.
I was getting text and on my social media of
people immediately saying our next president, people who knew nothing
about Hakim, didn't even know he was in Congress, ready
to you know, uh put a yard sign up for him.

(18:28):
What do you think that moment was for him? Anything? No?
I think it's you're you're so right. So let spot on.
And what's said for a lot of us, for a
lot of people, is that is that people think that
a lot of our a lot of people in politics
thinks that think politics about UM. You know a set

(18:49):
of policy positions and ten point plans. And there really
about a moment where people say, hey, I like this person. Um. Uh,
it certainly happened Barack Obama. UM, and I think perhaps

(19:09):
it's really interesting because I but I but I but
I I'm I pulled back from saying this because because
it's such a seems almost blasphem. But I think, Um,
Hakim's what Hakim did. And I'm congresman er, I'm sorry,
and I'm in the full tresparency. I know the congressman.

(19:29):
I come, I like the congressman a great deal. Um.
What he did came as close to um a moment
as Obama's no Red or Blue States speech as we've
seen since he since Obama did it. Uh. And and

(19:51):
so people who don't even know anything about uh the leader, right,
we'll call him leader now because he's the leader. Um,
all of a sudden were caught up in the emotion
and said, I like him. I want to know more
about it. Um. There being the Speaker of the House,

(20:13):
you you as you as a historian, you also know this.
There's not a lot of people go from Speaker House
at president. It's not a position where that lends itself
to broader national office. One of the reasons because you
actually have to get into the weeds of legislating, and
you make a lot of enemies, and you do have

(20:36):
to play hardball politics. Uh, if you are the Speaker
of the House or leader, you gotta do you gotta
make enemies right in a way that you don't have
to do necessarily if you're a senator. Uh, if you're
a senator's quite frankly, most a senator is the only
thing as senators do a lot of talking, not like
they actually do a lot of delivering um. And what

(21:00):
you're gonna see add over the next couple of years
is they're going to spend hundreds of millions and I'm
not exaggerating, hundreds of millions of dollars vilifying lead the
Hakim Jeffreys. They're gonna spend hundreds of millions of dollars

(21:21):
trying to make Middle America afraid of him. There has
been hundreds of millions of dollars trying to make him
a radical socialist. And we understand again history keeps repeating itself.
They called Martin Luther KINGO right it they you know,
almost any um leader of color becomes I'm scary socialist,

(21:44):
communist radical. They're gonna spend hundreds of millions of dollars
doing that over the next year or so. Here's what's
unique about Hakim Jeffreys in this position too. Unlike quite
frankly a myriad of African American politicians sans before him,
he understands and plays very very well the inner workings

(22:06):
of Congress. He sat at the right, left and feet
of Nancy Pelosi and understands what needs to be done
to run that. Do you think that will help him
at all in trying to combat some of that? I
think he will be a very successful leader. I do.
And I think eventually he's gonna be speaker. He's gonna
be historic speaking, And I think I think he's gonna

(22:28):
be a speaker on the on the scale of Nancy Close,
which is big because let's go back for a minute.
Folks don't understand how gangs the Nancy posy. Nancy Pelosi
was al capone man. People people miss that she was
at in hills and and contre dress um Barack Barack

(22:52):
Obama's biggest achieved, one of the biggest achievements President Obama
talks about was still the A c A. It's still
for what cares that? And that does not happen without
Nancy Plosi, that does not happen with name right, people
forget going in two thousand eight America, we were on
our way into a great depression. Yeah, and people literally

(23:18):
on their knees begging Nat Pelosi to do so. And
we don't get the sort of comprehensive legislation from that
from Congress in two thousands, especially such a divided comics
two thousand without without the leadership of Nancy Pelosi, you
can you can look back over the last decade, decade
and a half of the most impactful legislation for Americans,

(23:40):
and Nancy Pelosi's fingerprints are all over it. McCarthy is struggling,
and McCarthy we asked what McCarthy make it, given sort
of his narrow majority, and given how fractious his his
his his caucuses, Nancy Pelosi moved heaven and earth historic
pieces of legis Asian with that same narrow majority, and

(24:06):
and and a caucus at least behind doors, with the
with the with with the left, and and and and
the and the moderate Dems and the Blue Dog Dems
just as as divided on issues. Um as we've seen
some in the in the in the Republican coxs. But

(24:27):
she brought them all together and and move the ball.
I think leader, I think Jeffery. I think I think
Jeffery Will Will will be that sort of great leader.
But at does that translate into again, does that translate
into what is necessary or positioning for the drum for presidency.

(24:53):
He's a young man, I think the I think the
future for him is really bright. Um. And I think
he will be an extraordinary uh speaker at some point.
But history tells us that that doesn't necessarily translate into
the best positioning for running the president. And let's say, Uh,
you know, some would rather have that position than be president.

(25:17):
You know quite frankly there as you've already illustrated a
lot of power. Uh and and you know you can
go long in two terms, so you look at it
that way. Let me take you to a couple of
things before before we let you go. Um, you know,
the elephant in the room is is Joe Biden. And
um you know whether, in fact we'll here in the

(25:37):
next few days, whether he's going to re up and
run again. Um, you know, the administration I think has
UH by means of the people that voted for him,
by most accounts, gotten decent grades. Not a's and a pluses,
but decent grades. What do you think be a prognosticator
for me if you will? And then and then what

(25:59):
do you think the the administrations has to do UH
in the next few months to um kind of make
those who voted for him comfortable. Well, first, let me
say this. I'm not you know, I'm not. I didn't
work for the for the Biden campaign. I don't work
for the Biden White House in anyway. I'm a I'm

(26:20):
I'm a Howard. I work for Howard Dan that I
worked for Barack Obamama Dean Obama guy. So we qualified
what I'm about to say. And Joe Biden is better
position for reelection than Barack Obama was, and better for
election position for election then uh Bill Clinton was. And

(26:45):
I say that because of this, people are always underestimating
July and part of that is part of his part
of how he how he survises people underestimated. Um. There
were lots of call for Joe Biden to to to
to to push harder for to you know, cut people off.

(27:09):
And Joe Biden's comes from this school of thought where,
you know what, I'm gonna take what I can get
when i can get it, and I'm gonna come back
for more. And I'm gonna try to work with people
even even if they even even if they even if
they you know, call us names and bashists, I'm gonna
keep going at it. I'm keep trying to work the
process and see what i can get out of the process.

(27:29):
So again, very narrow majorities in both the House and
the Senate. And we have an infrastructure package that the
last time I checked, the last three presidents promised they
would get an infrastructure package because our infrastructure and we all,
every American knows whether we're probably you know, our infrastructure
cross country is falling apart, and we're falling behind China

(27:52):
and the Pacific RIM and Europe because our infrastructure is
so terrible. We've gotta position and make the investments for
the future. They moved the historic piece of legislation that
will transform this country over the next several years. And
you know what, and and so this year, people are
gonna start seeing projects all over this country that that

(28:17):
you know, needed to have done, being done, and Joe
Biden's name is going to be on those projects. One
of the big problems that the that some of our
young people um get up mobilized about is the is
the environment and how we're not taking it serious enough.
The largest investment in our and and and a clean

(28:38):
energy in our environment that we've ever had, and most
people that think it would happen, how could this possibly happen?
And he did it, you know. Uh, And so you're
gonna have right now. And what I love at is
that inflation, you know. And I said this after Republicans
are not spending tens of millions of dollars telling us
how bad they kind is and how inflation is. People's

(29:01):
perception of the economy're gonna actually begin to move back
into place, the more aligned with what the data actually
tells us. And the data tells us quite frankly, we've
created a lot of jobs and are and we're still
creating a lot of jobs. And inflation is slowing, and
for six months now it's a trend. Inflation is is slowing.

(29:22):
It's don't not where we want it, but it's slowing.
And it's certain we are certainly better off than any
of our European counterparts. Um. So you have jobs being created,
you have inflation slowing, you have one point whether one
point four trillion dollar cut in the depth of set
under under Biden's under Biden's management and his policies. Um,

(29:48):
and you have America once again being the arsul for
democracy around the world. As as this man has held together,
has brought back a call and an international coalition, and
and has been able to heal some of the wounds

(30:09):
in our international is ships caused by Donald Trump, and
hold together Native and and Europe sacrificing you know mightily
as through the winner for energy prices too. And and
to hold together this coalition in the Ukraine to to
to to to be to stand up to authoritarianism and

(30:34):
be the arsenal democracy. My god, ed if we can't
sell that, I mean, damn pretty damn good. The hard
thing for that, though is, let's be honest, it takes
a minute for for those numbers which are real, to
trickle down to the pocketbook, and people have to be
able to hold on and then be able to see

(30:55):
the vision that these policies did bring you back to
a more comfortable place. Yes, but and and this is
But my point I've always made is that the narrative
arc of presidency is not the narrative arc of of
of of of senator, remember of Congress um. You know

(31:15):
you will remember in UH people were literally writing out
at st Barack Obama should run it again. But but
the narrative art for presidents is different. So going into
that fourth year, Barack Obama had a fantastic story to
tell American And my only point is that if you
thought Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, and again people were

(31:37):
saying Bill Clinton's done. If you think Bill, you know,
Bill Clinton and Barack Obama had good stories to tell.
Towards the end of that year, Joe Biden has just
as good, if not a better story. Now, I'm not
gonna blow smoke and say Joe Biden's and this is why.
And it's not like the White House notices. Joe Biden's

(31:57):
primary obstacle is and you hear it in focus groups
all the time, and it's not in the the Republicans. Republicans aside,
they're never gonna be. But he had a majority coalition,
he got fifty one person and but members of his
own coalition have real questions about his age, right, when
let's not beat around the bush, and it's legitimate, it's fair.

(32:19):
It's completely fair that they have questions about his age.
So to me, the number one, the number one obstacle
to his to his reelection, is reassuring the majority of
the voters who voted for him. And he's still up
through the job and up to the task. He's got
to show he's got to show strength and vitality and again,

(32:41):
and when we circle back around to our to our conversation,
we're having a moment ago. It's not Joe Biden's ten
point plan, it's not all that other stuff. In the end,
Is he a strong leader with energy and vitality to
get the job done? Yeah, because for him, that's what

(33:01):
it's gonna be. It's not whether you're likable. He's a
likable guy. He's a good man. I mean he is.
He is that. I mean the times I've spent away
from a microphone with him, I mean he's a genuinely
good guy. Now, um, so it'll be interesting to see.
All right, two more questions, But let me ask you
about this person, his second in command, if you will,

(33:22):
before we get to the last two questions. And that's
Kamala Harris. Um, you know, interesting seat that she sits in.
A vice president always has an interesting seat in my opinion. Um,
but what do you think she thinks when the door
is closed? Well, I won't, I can't. I can't get
into it. What I think she thinks? I will say this, Um,

(33:42):
being the first, as you know at is not something
any it's not it's not a walk in apartment. And
and look there are but but she is getting her
putting her head down and she's doing the work right.
You know, she she has been on the road and look,
no one's more happier than them having fifty one centators

(34:04):
than she is because now she's free to go and
do and go on the road and do the work.
And look, she's been in the Midwest talking about infrastructure.
She's been she's been out west, uh uh talking talking
talking about and talking about investments during the campaign trail,
I would argue during the midterm campaign, no one better

(34:28):
focused and encapsulated the conversation about women's rights better than
she has done. Um. So here's the here's the elephant.
Though she's been a good soldier, there's no question about that.
There will be those who will whisper to her, I
am sure that being a good soldier because you're relatively

(34:51):
young as relates to politics, is not going to suit
you down a line. You know, hopefully she doesn't have
those those of people around her because those people are done,
because those people don't really understand politics. And I've heard
this time and time again, this conversation about they want
her to look in to stay expectation games. They want
her she has a different expectation than other than other

(35:13):
vice presidents. Because she's a woman, and because she's a
woman of color, the expectation game is different. And I've
heard time and time again I people talk about, well,
I want her to be out in front on X
Y and Z issue. I want her to do this
and that on X Y and Z issue, not understanding
she's the vice vice president. She's gonna get out in

(35:34):
front of the president. No, no vice president can get
out in front of the president. She can't lead. She's
got she's the vice president. And I think that expectation
game is one that has been problematic. But in the end,
her success is tied to his success as as a
as as the vice president, and she has done a

(35:56):
great deal of work to help this administration be successful.
And thenother thing I was said, and again again, I
didn't work on the Biden campaign. And they underestimate Vice
President Harris at there at their own, at their own
hair own. I mean, this is a woman who came
up and in California politics came up and Willie you know,

(36:20):
um was it leader Willie's politics. And in California, this
is a woman who has run for office, statewide office
in the most diverse, biggest state in this country. Uh.
And it's done it successfully. She's navigated. Um, she's naviga.
She's navigated to me politics that that a lot of

(36:44):
people would fail in. And right now it's hard to say,
and a lot of people and and again it's the
expectation game. But it's also the sexism game. And as
a lot of people are saying, well, I don't know
if she make a good president and all and all
these other men are lining up and say I'll make
a better president, the hell are you gonna tell me
you more? You you more, you'd be better at the
job and have more experience the job. And the person

(37:05):
who's literally sitting beside the guy doing the job. Now, yeah,
and let's be clear. She's young enough that if in
fact he gets a second term and does well, that
she could absolutely shoehorn herself in and she will be
at that point the favorite for the Democratic Party at
that point. But she will not be she but because
of because she's a woman, because personal color. Yes, let's

(37:27):
not be able to clear the field. Almost no that
that there there would be no competition if if this
were a white male in that same he would basically
clear the field. Yeah. The last two questions, Um, you know,
we always talk about the idea of the presidency being
much bigger than the person you vote into office. Um,

(37:49):
And I think we saw that with the appointments that
Trump was able to make. With the Supreme Court, we
talk about black interests, We're looking at two things that
come to mind immediately. That's the redistricting that will be
in front of them with the case from Alabama, in
two cases from colleges on affirmative action. UM, do you
do you do you think that these things are and

(38:11):
now I'm talking about not just political leadership but buth
social leaders as well. Do you think that we're making
enough noise about what's in front of the court and
getting the electorate to make noise, to try to sway um,
you know actions no and and and I'm gonna go

(38:33):
to a kind of a weird place on this. Oh
I'm gonna go, but I'm gonna try to land the plane. Um.
Black visibility does not equate the black power, right, That's
a famous um. Um. That's that's Dr Hamilton's and and stokely,

(38:53):
we have a lot of black visibility, not enough black power.
And what I mean by that is O there are
for better or worse, and I think it's for worse.
Super packs right now run a large part of our
politics because you have these these super PACs will have
a hundred million dollars and they will define what's important

(39:17):
and what the campaign is going to be about. And
so often the central focus and conversation of the vast
majority of the money is being spent aren't on the
issues that have to that relate to black and brown people.
That's a lack of black power. And we have some

(39:41):
packs and organizations that are trying to do the work
and raise the funds, but they struggle and we don't
make the investments, the grassroot investments as as individuals, and
certainly I would make it. I would argue that I
would like to see more of our are our three

(40:04):
four and our of of of our black and brown
communities making more investments in our organizations that move our
messages and that mobilize us around our issues. And I
got so tired of the conversation about um the economy, economy, economy,

(40:27):
economy and the top issue. And we just got to
talk about the economy, and we just talked about the economy.
We would not have seen it turnout that we saw
among young people brown people. Um, Uh, there are more
issues and help for most black people. Economy is always
the topicsue when the hell is economy topics black people?

(40:47):
That does not mean it's the only issue. You know,
it's hard to it's hard for black people to look
at mean, look at what the l A p D
just did too, to that to that young teacher. Uh
and and l A A. It's hard for black people
not to look at not be like, we need police reform.
How how can I police and reform not be a

(41:07):
top issue for black people? Uh? But we have to
empower our organizations and our campaigns and our candidates UM
to have a conversation, enforce these policy, enforce these policies.
We've got to be we've got to get a little bit,
we've got to get more mature about politics. And this

(41:28):
just goes back to my conversation about the cynicis um
I get so I get myself get so cynical when
I hear young people, especially young people of color, talk
about how they don't have power, that that's can change
and there's nothing more. You know, Nowhere in the world

(41:51):
does a a eighteen or nineteen year old person have
the power that an eighteen or nine teen year old
black person, and in Georgia or Ohio you have. Nowhere
in the world does that does does an eighteen or
ninteen year old have the power to not only change

(42:16):
what's happening in their local area, but their state and
their country in the world because that eighteen year old
in Georgia has the ability to participate, and through their participation,
you change the face of the Senate and change the outcomes,
and you flip a state like Georgia from from from

(42:39):
red to blue, and you get a different president, and
that president puts policies not only in the country but
across the globe and put in practice that are different
and that's the power that our young people have in
this country that young people in no other country ads.
And they's got to realize that power that we gotta

(42:59):
keep talking to them about that power. No one has
the power in the world a where the young people
in this country have the power the change to change things,
and and the other side wins when they drive this
cynicism about nothing can change. We've got to be invested
in the future and making change. I almost don't want

(43:21):
to ask this last question because said that's such a
great moment to end on. But I want to take
it to what I have been dismayed about for a
long time, and that is the fact that our electorate,
and I will put this back again on leadership. For me,
waits too long to do exactly what you talked about doing,

(43:43):
and that is engaging people in the process of politics.
The idea that we get, you know, gend up a
month or two before an election has not serviced us
well when there will be months and months and months
leading into the You should be playing the game. I
always tell people election day should not be your last

(44:05):
day of participation. It really should be your first day.
What would you like to see the black electorate due
to to correct that in black leadership, understanding that you've
got to mobilize people a lot sooner. It goes back
to politics one on one and understand that we our

(44:25):
system is set up for competing interests. Right now, I'm
a Virginian. Um. You know, a lot of Virginians wrote
that were weighing heavily on that constitution. Madison in particularly,
they set it up as a as for competition, competing interests. Uh,
We've got to get in the game. We've got to

(44:46):
We've got to be part of the competing interests. Um.
The loudest voice is the one that has heard. You know,
I've heard conversations with uh with someone said they met
with with the mayor. I'm not gonna say what city
it was, uh years back, and the mayor said, I

(45:07):
agree with everything you're saying, Now make me do it.
And that's the thing it is. You've got to apply
political pressure. You can't. You know. Look, it's a good ideal,
doesn't mean politically it's gonna happen unless we're applying political pressure,
unless we are acting politically. So it's not so. Democracy

(45:30):
isn't a part time thing. It's a full time thing.
We have to be vigilant and and I'll go back
to our organizations there. Black Pack, who is an organism
is a pack run by Adrian Shropshire and it just
started maybe six seven years ago, and they are trying

(45:51):
to build and raise money and have a conversation uh
at the doors and and over the air ways with
people of color about issues that are most important and
frame elections in the context of our issues. They don't
have two hundred million dollars like like some of these

(46:11):
other packs do. We have to make greater investment in
our political vehicles in order for us to gain black power. UM.
And it's it's not rocket science. In order for us
to gain black for an order for black power to

(46:32):
be a force and and and and and a movement, UM,
we have to invest in it and we have to
work with UM. We can't have the other organizations defining
the terms of the debate or our issues, and our
conversations are never gonna be forefront uh for policymakers in

(46:56):
this country. Yeah, Cornell Belcher, it is all ways, uh,
an interesting conversation with you, and I greatly appreciate all
that you've done. Quite frankly on on the political forefront
for us in terms of making sure that our issues
are covered and and and watched. It will be an
interesting two years leading into Thank you and thank you

(47:17):
for all that you've done. Brother, I've been following you
for years. Thanks Man. One hundred is produced by ed
Gordon Media and distributed by I Heart Media. Carol Johnson
Green and Sharie Weldon are our bookers. Our editor is
Lance Patton. Gerald Albright composed and performed our theme. Please

(47:40):
join me on Twitter and Instagram at ed L Gordon
and on Facebook at ed Gordon Media. The Dard
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