September 19, 2023 • 55 mins
"Griffin."
"O'Donnell.'
"O'Donnell."
"Griffin."
This week's special guest is none other than Kathy Griffin. Join us as these two long term cohorts hang out, chatting about life and stuff; both big and small.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hi, everybody, It's me Rosie O'Donnell and this is Onward
and we have a wonderful podcast for you today. I'm
happy to be up and about. I was out for
about a week with COVID for the first time. You know,
I was always kind of proud of the fact that
I hadn't never gotten it, but there it is. My
(00:28):
turn was up. I got it and happy that it
was mild. You know, I was tiring, but mild and
still got a little bit of a throat thing going on.
You might be able to hear, but I am no
longer contagious hip hip hooray. A lot of news going
on this week, a lot of celebrity news. Drew Barrymore
(00:48):
was when the hot seat over the decision she made
to cross the picket line for the writer's guilt, and
that was it was a lot of press, negative press
that she got. And you know, everyone's allowed to change
their mind when they take a breath and they realize, well,
maybe let me listen to other people's point of view
(01:11):
and understand it, reframe it and make a different decision.
And I think it's wonderful that she did that. And
you know, as a result, other shows now say that
they're not going to cross the picket line either, like
the talk. And I believe Jennifer Hudson. And that's all
because Drew stood up. You know, you can't be the
(01:32):
one who crosses the picket line and ruins the actors
and writers' ability, the workers of show business to do
what they do. So I don't know. I'm Union strong
and I'm Drew Barrymore strong, and I think that she
did the right thing, so so good for her. And
(01:56):
you know, Union strong people, Union strong not asking for
anything unreasonable. It's just so that we can continue to
exist in the industry that we helped create. There you go,
all right. So today is a friend of mine. You
know her, you love her. She is the reason that
(02:17):
I tested myself for COVID because I was going to
see her for lunch, and everybody always makes sure to
test before because she lost half her lung had it
taken out with cancer. And she's doing great now and
she's performing in Vegas on October six that I'm going,
(02:38):
and I hope that you will too. She's here here,
she is Kathy Griffin. Well, look who's here, Kathy Griffin. Hello,
Kathy Griffin. Griffin o' donald o Donald Griffin, tell them
(03:02):
the genesis of that h You know, I don't really remember,
but I know this.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
It's every time you call me.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yeah, well I always call people their last name.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
But as oh, absolutely, it's an endearment for me. Yeah,
but as if I don't know your voice as it
you need to identify yourself like you're a telemarketer.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Yeah, grifin O'Donnell Donald Griffin. I just want to see
how you do it, you know. Yeah, I know, I
don't know. I've done it for a long time, but
until you pointed it out, I didn't realize it. They
put one of my specials, I know. Yeah, you talk
like this is your impression of o'donald. Jack it up
a little. I jack it up a little.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
I ambellish, you know, embellishment.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
But your embellishments are delightful. Oh hey, I'm just happy
to be back on stage. First of all, let's talk
about your miraculous, resurgent, emergent, amazing performance in Vegas that
you already did and you're going back very soon.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Yes, on Friday, October sixth, I'll be at the Mirage
in Las Vegas, and I cannot wait, so on June twelfth,
ro I did my first show in five year.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Now, tell me how it came about.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
First of all, Okay, so basically, the Trump scandal happened
six years ago, you know, and I've been you know,
kind of blacklisted, and a lot of people will have
trouble getting beyond that, et cetera. And that's been going
on for really quite a while, and it still kind
of has tentacles to this day. Then I got cancer,
So my voice is a bit altered. I'm kind of
(04:35):
self conscious about it, right because, you know, my whole life,
I've had this kind of scratchy voice and now it's
like a little bit higher pitch. But the good news
is I'm cancer free.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Fantastic.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
That is the best part. I had lung cancer even
though I've never smoked.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, isn't that wild? I know, do they know a percent?
What's the percentage of people who get that who've never smeked?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
It's getting much higher, especially for women.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
Because of pollution.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Because of pollution, they asked me if I had been
exposed to rate. I said, look, when I was a kid,
did you guys have the DDT truck?
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Oh my god, yes we did. And we ran in
it and we would go, I'm in a cloud, and
my mother would say, kids, the DDT truck is coming.
And it was like a neighborhood activity to run behind
pesticides and think we were emerged in a cloud. Yes,
and so now so people don't know that they used
(05:26):
to come and spray the neighborhoods in suburbia with all
this stuff for DDT's like to kill foliage.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Right.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
They would just drive drive right down the middle of
the street. Yes, and we would wipe piper. Yes, and
we would chase it like the ice cream truck. Yes.
It was crazy making.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We didn't know any better.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
And is that raid on in there? Is that?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I think rate I might.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Be in there.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Someone asked me if it was possibly from smoke doing
clubs at the beginning of my career. I'm not sure,
but I got it. It's more common to women. And
so they had to take out half my left lung,
and during the surgery I was injured, and so my
left vocal cord is permanently paralyzed, and I have an
aperture like a tear above it, and that's why my
(06:07):
voice will be like this permanently. But I will say
the audience at Vegas was very forgiving.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Right, because you talk about it right up front.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I gotta say right up front because I don't want
people to wonder why I have this voice or it
kind of sounds.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Like I have a bad cough or something. But you know,
and I also do a lot of jokes about cancer
because I say to the audience, clap if you have
been touched in any way, your family, yourself, your loved
ones by cancer, and of course the whole place clap.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
So as our mutual friend friend Dresher knows and when
she wrote Cancer Schmancer, there's actually a lot of comedy
that goes on in tragedy, yes, And so I talk
about that stuff and i find people relate to it,
and I'm just so grateful that they do. So I
get beyond that.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
And you know, they know that the reason I haven't
been on tour is because of the Trump scandal. Right,
And do you do you bring that up again or
do you leave it?
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Or you know what's funny, bro, I actually don't mention
him once in this new show.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
That's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
It's not even on purpose. I just have done that.
I made a whole movie about the scandal called Cathy
Griffin A Hell of a Story.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
You can see it on Amazon. I think it's even
free now. But I kind of feel like, you know,
if he does something in the.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
News, like obviously the mug shot coming out, I would
definitely acknowledge it if I had a show show, But
in this particular show, he just doesn't come up. And
I'm kind of just too busy talking about cancer. And
you know, I'm in recovery for prescription pills. I talked
about that. I've been diagnosed with complex PTSD, which I
(07:43):
know sounds funny and it should only be for combat veterans,
but you know whatever, I have it. And so I
talk about my therapies for that, because it's a lot
of stuff that you just have to laugh about. For example,
one of my therapies, I'm just going to tell you
this right too, okay, And you know what, you can
make fun of me.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
I will.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
You can get all Long Island on me.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
I can and I can take it all, right, Griffin
o'donald says, go okay, So I get on all fours, huh.
And part of my therapy is I do something called
cat cow, which is I don't know why I do it, okay,
but the Kundalini yoga teacher told me to yes, and
so I do. And when you put your head up,
you move like move like a cow or move and
(08:27):
then you art your back and you meow like a
caw wow.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
And you know what, Let me tell you something. After
my cancer, my PTSD was so bad. I I'm not
this is gonna be gross. I could not stop vomiting
for ten months.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
I remember this fit I got it. It was so scary.
It was so scary, and.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
I covered in flop sweat. Yes, I got a resting tremor,
which if I get nervous, it comes back. So sometimes,
like when I was on stage, I could feel my
leg shake. It's just involuntary. And I tell the audience too,
I go, I'm not even nervous, but I just kind
of shake a little bit.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Can I ask a question real quick? The PTSD was
definitely from the Trump situation, But do you think it
also was from the cancer situation?
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Absolutely?
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
I think I thought when they took out my half,
my left lung and I was cancer free, I think
I thought I was going to go back to being
my regular self, right, so having lost my voice and
until I found an amazing female doctor named doctor Anka Barboo.
She helped me go from a voice which you saw
me have for one year.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I actually sounded like this. Yes, and that will mess
with your head. Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
So I think frankly, from being such a happy workaholic
and grateful workaholic to then going to the phone not
ringing for five years.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Now, what would happen when you would call and say,
you know, I'm interested in working again, that people would
just say no? It would you know?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
I mean?
Speaker 2 (10:06):
It was everything from you know, I didn't have an
agent or a publicist or manager.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Oh wait, I should tell you this. Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
I had a publicist for a while and I found
out he was one of these qanons.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Oh god, So how did you end up with a
QAnon publicist? First of all, leave it to me, okay.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
So I'm looking on the TikTok and by the.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Way, I am very bitter about you. Why let me
tell you? Why tell me?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Because I work my ass off for that freaking TikTok.
I'm doing skits, I'm putting hair and makeup on.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
You know what you do?
Speaker 2 (10:38):
You wake up with your no makeup and you just
talk to people two million followers. All right, I'm doing cartwheels.
I got my lips tattooed. How was that painful?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Very painful? Well, let me say they look very good
right now.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Well, you know I don't always have to publisticod anymore,
and so for me, it's actually been a great thing.
It's called lip blushing. But I had like giant swollen
lips for about four days. But I don't mean like
lip fillers. I mean it looked like.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
You send me that picture. I had that picture, Yes,
And was that how swollen they were was indicative of
how much pain you were in? Yes, that's how much
pain it was. Wow.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
And I mean think about it, it's like you have tattoos.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
It's like a if you think about tattooing your lips,
that's a big tattoo. Yeah. So it's a lot of pain.
But and it's a regular tattoo gun.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Yeah whatever.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Yeah. Wow, I know I'm actually gonna get it like
refurbished in September, like I've get. They call it lip blushing.
I'm getting reblushed, Okay. And is it because it fades away,
it fades away.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
A little bit, Uh, huh, and they go in there
and just kind of fix it. But my point.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
Is you do everything for the TikTok people. Yeah, and
then you just, I know, I roll out of bed.
I don't even wash my hair. I mean, I wouldn't
even care about location. You're not going to cities around
the world. No, no, no, I'm staying on my couch.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Your person filming you in the light bar and.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Yeah, no filters. Yeah, I know. I don't know what
it is. I just till you are compelling. That's why.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
That's why you're showing successful and that's why your stand
up as successful because you are compelling.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
A griffin. It's O'Donnell, we got to take a commercial break.
(12:45):
I think that I am curious about people in a
way that most people aren't. Like, I really care about
someone's story, and you know, so when I hear stories
on there, I end up getting in conversations with people,
especially when it's about some niche thing in my like
my daughter having autism, yes, you know, or my daughter
being non binary. Like it's brought up a lot of
(13:07):
conversations with other parents in similar situations. So I also,
you know, I just really love doing it. You love
doing it too. They love TikTok. By the way, it's
never going to go away.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
People that are worried about the Congress taking away or whatever.
It's would never pass the First Amendment law. You know,
it would never be able to be even diminished because
of the First Amendment Law. So it's totally safe.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Oh that's good because I was worried.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
A lot of people were worried. And by the way,
it is owned by the Chinese government. That's no secret.
Right are they scanning our faces? Probably?
Speaker 1 (13:38):
But who isn't at this point? Who isn't at this point?
Exactly right, you know.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
But I just wanted to let you know of my
bitterness and I wanted you to just take that in.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I will take it in my jealousy, all right. And
yet I still love doing it and I love scrolling
it because I was a big Twitter person. Yeah, and
Elon kicked me off personally. Yeah, how weird?
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Was that weird?
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Because I was impersonating him? And then I kept posting
things like, you know, hashtag vote blue no matter who
and saying that he had become pro choice after talking
to his various babies mothers. And it got a little
traction and people believed it, so he got very upset
with me.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
And then there was this bad joke running around Twitter
that a bunch of people had written saying, she's not
impersonating Elon, she should be kicked off for impersonating a comedian.
So he stole that joke, which is donating the rounds
because he's such a hack, right, And then he personally
kicked me off, and then he reinstated me because there
(14:39):
was like a little bit of blowback, which is a
good sign for me. Yeah, it means maybe like I'm
kind of coming back into people's good graces a little bit.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Tap. You just sold out a huge Vegas showroom and
you got like a ten minute standing ovation and they
stood up when you walked out, and it was incredible.
I think it's over. I think that part's over.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Through your mont to God's Ears, I will say I
was hoping after that show I would be able to
route a tour or book a tour, but I think
after this October sixth show, I can. I am with
a fancy management company now called Three Arts. Oh I
know them, yeah, and they're like fancy, they're very good, yes,
So thank goodness. That to me is like an actual
(15:23):
sign that things are finally turning around. Because it's nice
if you're on social media like we never left you,
and that's wonderful. But I want to get back to work.
I want to get back to making people laugh. And
I don't care if it's a tour or a reality
show or a game show or a host gig. I
just want to make people laugh.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
You know, I don't know anyone who loves to work
as much as you.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
I love it, you know, I really just stand up
in particular. I love all the gigs, but anything where
I can improvise, I mean, if I could do it,
I know you feel this way. If I could do
a Curb Your Enthusiasm type of show, that would be
the Holy grand of course, because what Larry gets to
do on that show is just goof around with the guys,
come up with the bullets, and then just do it
(16:05):
until it's right. Is just a heavenly environment. And you
are hilarious on that.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Thank you. I think if it was that easy to do,
so many people would have copied it. I think like
he's like a genius, you know that he came up
with the character that is so close to him that
he doesn't even really necessarily have to write. He just
thinks it up. You know it is, and it is.
You've been on there, I know I was.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
On the very first episode. I've kind of fallen out
of Larry's good graces. I'm not sure why, but I'm
still a fan. As many people that don't care for me,
I don't you know what, I don't need someone to
like me for me to like them.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
That is, that's good learn.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
I believe that miss Brooks Shields is not thrilled with me,
and has not been for many years. But let me
tell you, I will always love her. That show gave
me the break of a lifetime called Fu Susan. Yes,
I got to work on that show for four years.
She was lovely, she still lovely. I loved the documentary
about her.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Pretty Baby. I thought it was beautiful.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
And by the way, it's about time she got her flowers,
as the kids say, yeah, because that one's been a
long time coming. Yes, And you know Jerry Seinfeld is
not a fan of mine. Doesn't matter now.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
So when you say this, I'm curious, do you just
assume that because let's say you haven't been invited in
Comedians and Cars or something. Why do you think that
Jerry Seinfeld and Larry like because they like? You know,
I haven't spoken to Larry since I did the shows,
but I don't think that that means he's mad at
me or anything. Well, I the last time I saw
(17:37):
Larry was very kind. You're welcoming in the way that
he had been in the past.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Oh okay, And I think Jerry by not having either
one of us on Comedians and Cars. I think it's
a statement because you and I are real stand ups.
It's not like we started out doing soap operas right
fell into standup.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
You and I both cut our tea doing stand up,
have done stand up for many many years, have done
multiple stand up specials, write our own stuff, do our
own stuff, decades of material that is easily accessible, you know,
to anyone.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
And so I think it's I think it's a.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Bit of a statement. I would be I'll be honest
with you, if I were to see Jerry at a
social function, I would probably be afraid to go up
to him because I would not expect him to be
very kind.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
It's so interesting because you're so kind of free and abrasive.
If you want to be and cynical and sat time,
you know, in your act, and yet in real life
you're kind of different than that, Like, yeah, you wouldn't
have the bravado to go over and go Jerry, what's up? Man?
How am I? You know what?
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I'm too freaking sensitive, That's what problem. My skin is
too thin in real life, and so I kind of
have been through enough. Like the last thing I need
is to have like Jerry and Larry, like be just
kind of dismissive, and I imagine that that is how
they feel. And you know, look, I have that with
a lot of people in the industry. I have decades
(19:11):
behind me of a big agent telling me, you know,
Kathy Griffin is a life's too short situation. You know,
I have been told no career that I'm quote expensive
and difficult. And I've definitely burned a lot of bridges
and made a lot of enemies over the years with
executives because I was naive enough to think if I
(19:35):
fought hard enough and won awards and was a good earner,
because it's all about the mighty dollar, these guys would
pay me what they paid the guys. And I now
realize at the glorious age of sixty two years young.
That just didn't happen. They just weren't capable of going there.
In my opinion, they're still not. And I thought there
(20:00):
was a revolution happening with women in show business, and
I have to be honest, I don't think it's that
much better than when Joan was coming up. Joan rivers
and kind of threw the ranks, and I personally saw
her have to fight a lot of battles that I
didn't think she should have to fight at all. And
you know, let's talk about fashion Police. She wanted desperately
(20:23):
to make that a union show, and the writers of
that show really, in my opinion, viciously attacked her for
not getting enough money. Well, when you work for the
freaking E Channel, we're not going to make it a
union show.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I mean, it's like Bravo.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
I wish my life on the dealerst could have been
union or my specials or my talk show. But the
truth is they just never were prepared to pay me.
You know what it takes to make a union show.
And like I said, I you know, I look at
my male contemporaries and I see many of them immersed
in all kinds of scandals, and in my case, this
(21:01):
scandal really, you know, really put me out of work
for like I said, years, and it just was a
mind fuck to not have the phone ring for five
years but also be pitching. I was pitching this kind
of show, that kind of show. I was taking meetings
with anybody. I had a couple lower level people approach
me and say, I think you got a raw deal.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I think you're hysterical. I grew up watching the deal
List to help me come out all those wonderful things.
But when it gets up to the check signers, and
that's what I call the.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Check signers, the check signers, because people don't know there's
about a half dozen middle aged white dudes that now
own so many conglomerates that there's a half dozen dudes
that decide everything you watch, right, you know, you look
at David Saslov, who now owns Max in addition to
CNN and Discovery and Discovery Networks and of course Discovery.
(21:55):
They made their money on taking very low budget reality
shows Johnny Cape, Flissay, et cetera, Little People, Big World.
I mean all those shows, I love them, by the way,
but you know, those shows ran internationally did very well,
and I think when you have someone with that kind
of financial business ethos, they're not going to do it
(22:18):
any other way. And so for somebody like me, when
I would make an enemy of someone like a Leslie
Moonvez who used to be the head of CBS, and
I would tussle with him and confront him about certain things,
and he says, Okay, Kathy Griffin's on the shit list,
and then the board of directors backs him up.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
Then I go, gosh, that's why I haven't.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Worked at CBS in fifteen years or whatever. And I
would tussle with a guy named Jeff Zucker, who is
the head of NBC and then the head of the
head of a CNN. Well, Jeff had issues with me
because I used to personally ask for a raise for
Kathy Griffin my life on the d list. Because NBC
owns Bravo and now Comcast, I think I can't even remember.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, there's so many now, right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
But you know, so I think I've learned my lesson.
It's not a great lesson to learn, but let me
tell you, I'm just a lot less confrontational because at
this point I don't mean to sound lazy, but it's
kind of like how I'm starting to feel about feminism
and I'm going to get blown back for this. Yeah,
but I'm kind of like, can the young women take over? Like,
can the younger chicks be like getting in trouble with executives?
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Because I feel like I still am and well, do
you know, can I think I told you this once.
I have never talked to any of those kinds. I
never went to the head of you know, I would
call my agent and say, Nancy, could you please do this?
Could you do that? Could you I never in my
life would consider calling Jeff Zucker or any of them.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
I don't know ever in my life had an agent
that would do it for me. So they just took
the no, and I went like CNN, for example, New
Year's Eve, which I very much missed doing that gig.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Sure, it was just fun and I just loved Anderson
and I would honestly be thinking of jokes all year round.
It was just so much fun.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And you know that broadcast went from ninety minutes to
four and a half hours. And I, you know, asked
my agents to get me raised and the answer was no.
And I would personally call Jeff and we would tussle,
and you know, all sorts of things would happen on
those calls. I mean one time I had my mother,
my ninety nine year old mother called Jeff Sucker as
like a comedy bit to try to get a raise.
(24:29):
Like I tried everything with these guys, and sometimes.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
It would work, and sometimes it wouldn't right, And I
think sometimes when it would work, I think they still
resented me, you know, Like, yes, I went to a
guy named Peter Roth who was the head of Warner Brothers,
because I thought I deserved a raise on that show.
Suddenly Susan and I couldn't get a raise, and so
(24:53):
I called this before even emails are texting, I think.
And I went into his office one day at the
end of the day at like six thirty pm, and
you had an appointment. No.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
I called him in and I said, there's an emergency.
I need to talk to you.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
You called him personally. Wow, there's an emergency. I need
to talk to you.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
And I think, I said, or I may not be
able to come to work tomorrow, Oh.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Honey, And you played ard ball this I did with
the head guys, Yes.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Like an idiot, like I really thought. I mean, look,
it kind of works.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
So I went in.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
I had all my stats. I said, look, this, that
and the other. Here's why I think I deserve a raise.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
I wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I wouldn't go in with no stats. I went, this
is what I'm earning, this is what I'm doing on
the road, this is my level of visibility.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
This is my Q score.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
If you don't know what Q scores are, it's your
television scores on how recognizable you are and how likable.
I'm always more recognizable than likable. But I went in
and I said, we're going to do this like a
used car sale. And he kept saying, we're not doing this.
Talent doesn't do this. So I brought cocktail in actions
with me. I said, I'm going to write a number,
and then you're going to write a number. Were to
(26:02):
switch napkins, and he kept saying, I'm not going to
do this with you, and so he goes, look, maybe
tomorrow i'll call your agent, and I knew the agent
was kind of done negotiating, and the answer was zero.
So I wrote a number and then I gave it
to him and he said, you're crazy. And I just
kept making him laugh and doing bits and I mean everything,
the cartwheels, and finally I got the rais and I
(26:24):
got more than double of what I was making in
the room. You got what I did, and he said,
you wore me down. He said, you were so funny,
and you wore me down. So that was one incident
where it actually went well. I like Peter Roth. I
don't know if he thinks I'm difficult, too expensive, but
that was one time it kind of worked. But remember
(26:44):
how long agoes that. That was like twenty five years ago.
So I think I thought, oh, I can do this
with Comedy Central, I can do this with HBO, you know,
and the agents would just kind of take a no,
because sometimes the agents, you know, they're kind of more
in bed with the check signer than just little Dalist
Kathy Griffin.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Or there are other clients that they want to protect too.
They don't want to pissol off the head guy.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
And I was never the big client, you know. I mean, look,
you had giant contracts, and so I think your agent
really knew, like, hey, there's really big money coming in
from the Rosy Empire, frankly, and you know, my little
Dalist empire. I made a good buck, but I never
was getting the five million a year or any anything
close to that. So I tussled a lot, and I
(27:32):
think I was kind of just raised that way anyway.
So it was like a combination of how I just
was as a person. But I really I had thought, Okay.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
This is it. If I dance enough, they're going to
give me what the guys get. We'll be right back
with Kathy Griffin. Do you think since the cancer and
(28:11):
since what you call the cancelation, that you've changed like
you would you do that now? I would not do no, honestly.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
The nice thing is knock on wood. Our mutual dear friend,
Susie Rman, your girlfriend approved, you.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Can do part it well.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
She and I are still good friends. And you know, look,
I am very proud that I worked as hard as
I did, and I'm proud that I'm good with money.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You really are. You live a beautiful now. You don't
have children, you got a lot of adults, you're married,
but you know you have a very successful celebrity life.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
I think I'm very lucky. I always say I only
have two talents. I'm funny and I'm good with money.
And so I'm in a position where I don't have
to take a crappy gig, and I won't, but I'll
never be in a position where I can demand what
the guy's got, you know. I mean, I think about
the guys I came up with, you know, Ray Romano,
David Spade, Kevin James, you know, kind of the guys
(29:12):
who are like around circling when we were all just
doing sets.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Sure, yes, they were around with me as well. We're
in we're the same age. So yeah, all those guys, yes,
but you know, they had tremendous success on a sitcom,
all of them. They had. David was of course on SNL,
but the other two had successful sitcoms for many years.
And you know, it's hard sometimes to compare yourself to
other people. I find it for me, it's very unhelpful
(29:40):
because there's no way that you know what's going on
in someone's life or world or but the blatant, you know,
anti woman sentiment is still there. Yeah, you know, we're
not at equal pay really anywhere.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
No, No, And I certainly am not bitching because, like
you said, I have a great life and I'm very
grateful for that. But I am discouraged that there isn't
more progress made, and I what discourages me the most
is I don't want younger women to go through what
I did, where you have one meeting with an executive
and they're pissed off at you for twenty freaking years,
(30:15):
like some of these guys are pissed off at me
to this day, and I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, I
asked for a raise fifteen years ago, you know, or whatever,
and you know, just a lot of bizarre, spiteful behavior.
Like yes, when I the year Trump was elected, I
was my I think it might have been my last
year on cn ANAM. Yeah, that's right, of course it was.
(30:37):
And Jeff Zucker called me and he said, okay, I'll
give you one Trump joke an hour. And I said, Jeff,
he's you've never done this before. I said, it sounds
like you're being a posty and you're scared of him.
By the way, hence me having enemies with executives, because
that's how I talk to them. And I said, you know,
(30:59):
do we have a four to our broad broadcast and
he's in the news like constantly, but for his own
bizarre behavior, but also the world is watching it. This
is a global broadcast and I said, look, I don't
want to do four and a half hours on Trump
at all. But I said, I'm just kind of surprised.
I said, you know, I know you guys all had
this big meeting with Trump, but he's first elected. And
(31:20):
I saw the videos of Diane Sawyer walking in and
Jake Tapper walking in and what did he say in
that meeting?
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And he wouldn't tell me. And then I said, well,
I'll do the best I can, but my job is
to be funny.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
And that's how you hired me.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
And then Jeff Zucker for the first and last time,
actually showed up at the platform, no kidding, and I
just thought that was very odd, Like, I think you
guys can trust me. The ratings have only gone up,
you know, and so stuff like that. It still sticks
with me because I'm shocked at the length certain people go,
certain people have gone to quote put me in my place,
(31:57):
and that is something that is that ways have on me,
because I don't think it should be like that. Now,
do you want it to be better for the younger women?
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Do you think since your really tremendously visible happy state
of mind, I mean, you look so happy, you look happy,
You look like so much better than last year. Yeah,
you feel like you're more able to take on the life.
And and and I think, and if you could, if
(32:27):
you would explain, like what did it feel like when
you walked out into the sold out Mirage Theater and
the people weren't great? Like what what did it feel
like to get back in the water on a huge
wave and surf a huge Vegas casino and kill it? Well,
I've been trying it to cry, okay, because honestly, it
(32:48):
felt like I was home.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
For the first time in five years. As well, I
felt like I was home. The audience was so loving.
They were standing, they were clapping, and I understand they
I hadn't even open my mouth yet they were clapping
because I think I appreciate very much when people think
I'm alive and thriving or whatever people say, and that's
(33:09):
the truth. And I think the folks that come to
my shows, there's an understanding that I've been through kind
of the mill and you're honest about I talk about it.
And also I really enjoy talking about it because, as
I said, at this point, between COVID or between like
I said, cancer or recovery, who hasn't been through the mill, right,
(33:32):
And so I will always make fun of celebrities, and
celebrity culture will always fascinate me. But you know, I've
kind of moved away from talking about the Kardashians all
the time or talking about this celebrity. Now I talk
about some of it, and certainly if I've had a
run in with somebody that's that's funny to me, I'll
try to make it funny or but you know, I
(33:54):
am talking a little more about stuff I've been through
in a way hopefully that the audience can relate to.
And so that show is so meaningful to me because
you know, it showed such support and obviously for five
years I really doubted if any support was there because
the business was sending me a message that was kind
(34:16):
of like, no, thank you, You're not welcome here. And
it's a business I love. I haven't been treated so
great by it. It's something it can be a crappy
boyfriend sometimes, but it's a business I love, and like
I said, I live to make people laugh. So to
have that taken from me for five years, yes.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
Was like a whole And so were there little clubs
you could go to could you do an open mic night,
could you walk into the improve and say give me
ten or I Well, I've never really done well in
clubs because sometimes if I'm like sandwich between the two
bro comics, it's kind of a tough vibe because I'm
more of a storyteller, and you know, my joke is
it takes me ten minutes to even finish saying hello,
(34:55):
and so I'm better in a little long form situation.
But I did one thing, like one time, I just
did five Mondays at the laugh Factory and it was
just me and it was when the other comics were done.
I think I did a ten PM show or something
and those were fantastic. Now that was prior to my cancer,
it was even prior to COVID Wow. But I just
(35:15):
literally put on a different set of PJS every Monday,
went there, danced around.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I did a different hour every single week.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Which people don't understand how hard that is to do
another hour every week. I mean, these comedians, some of
them are so unbelievably productive, Like I could not do
that takes me a lot an hour a week. Cat, No, honey,
I couldn't. But thank you for believing in me. But
(35:45):
I'm you know, I'm definitely going to start doing it again,
going to go to Wendy Leibman's. Wendy's so funny. She's
so great. I loved her back way back when her
delivery is so many.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
She never seen her bomb I'm not kidding.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Never rights so funny, she really is. And she has
a club in the valley that she books. So I
talked to her on the TikTok Yes and I'm like,
could I ever just come down? She's like, of course,
you know.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Now for me, I have to say yeah. For me,
that's called burning tickets. So, for example, if my last
time I played in La I got to play the
Kodak Theater. I think it's now called the Hollywood and
Highland Theater where they have the Oscars. It's one of
my favorite theaters to play in the world. It's just
gorgeous and the acoustics are amazing, thirty three hundred capacity,
And frankly, if I go and do a pop up
(36:32):
at a club, there's three hundred people that might go.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
You know what.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I like Kathy Griffin, but I kind of just saw
her two months ago. So that's kind of where I'm
coming from. Is I have a dream of going back
to the great venues that I could play five years
ago on my last tour. Kathy Griffin, laugh your head off,
and I love you know, the Masonic in San Francisco.
(36:57):
I would love to play Carnegie Hall again. I have
a dream of playing Radio City again, and so I'm
trying desperately to work up to that. And I will say,
I think the reason I sold out in Vegas, and
I think the reason I'm selling well for the October
sixth show is people haven't seen me in five years, correct.
And I was so touched because at the show in
(37:18):
June I heard from someone that came from Paris, Wow,
someone that came from Dublin, multiple people from all over
the country. And I have never had that that Well,
first of all, I used to do tours there were
like eighty cities in a year. But I find that
so moving and so touching that frankly, i'd kind of
rather hold up and see.
Speaker 5 (37:39):
See.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
I don't know yet if I can sell these theaters again. Yeah.
I never think of it that way. But again, I'm
not a business well you know, I'm not as good
with money as you. I'm not as you know, I mean,
I don't get ostentatious things, and I don't have any
interest in fashion, so that helps. You know, I've got
a fashion bill, you do, You got a high one right?
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Become a fashion yeah. I don't know why, but it
just happened.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, And I see you when all these designer clothes
and all this.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
You know who's fault that is Bete Midler?
Speaker 1 (38:07):
No kidding. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
When Bette Midler was on Cathograph of My Life on
the D List, she showed up for the part where
we were just kind of hanging out and she had
this insanely gorgeous Vivian Westwood dress, and I, of course,
being a comic, I go bust her balls. I'm like,
what do you think we're going to funeral? What the
hell you were a designer for? And she goes, what
are you talking about? You should be wearing this at
this stage of the game. And I always remember saying
(38:30):
that at this stage of the game.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
And if you remember, Bet reached an age where she
became glam she was doing beautiful hair and makeup. She dresses,
and bet doesn't play. So when she's out in like
her New York social scene, which is no joke, she
runs with the Mockers as a New York restoration prodcas yes, yes,
and so I kind of took that to heart, and
(38:53):
Joan was like that, and you know, you know, Phyllis
kind of Phyllis kind of was like that, and so
you know, I'm trying to perpetuate this image that I'm
kind of like the grand Dame of stand up comedy.
And I have a new character I'm working on called
Kitty Carrington Colby Griffin, and she is in very expensive
(39:13):
designer clothing and designer momus and she hangs out with
designers and she's had a storied life where she's had
many lovers and they've been rich and poor, and naturally
she prefers rich and so like that's the sort of
stuff that I, frankly in my real life where I
started wearing this stuff. I started thinking of this character,
and as I'm developing her, I don't know anything could happen,
(39:37):
but I might even do a Q and A with
this character in Vegas as just a fun little way to.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Kind of mix things up.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
So there you go. That's how my head works.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
I go from buying nice stuff to tell it to
doing whatever Bet said. Because some of the divas like
Stevie Nicks lover. Are you ready for this? Yes, she
gave me a personalized makeup kit.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (39:59):
She saw me and Sti Colbert and she said, I
didn't like your palette and I said okay, And so
she had her makeup artist go out and shop. And
I have the list in Stevie's handwriting to this day
of every product. And let me tell you something that
has been my palette because I am not like what
am I going to argue with Stevie? No, now you suggesting,
(40:21):
I argue, I am not. She sounds like you were suggesting,
but I argue just.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
Like a one wing dove. I would never. I would never.
But listen, she she's a friend of yours though you.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
Met her, and she's someone that very much stood by
me as you did, and a couple of times publicly,
the last time she, you know, played the Hollywood Bowl,
she dedicated Landslide to me, and that was meaningful because
I know there's a lot of like showbiz executive e
types that go to the Bowl and that was just
(40:54):
so meaningful to me that she did that, because you know,
it's a stamp of approval that some people were you're
not willing to do, and so that means a lot.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Yeah, how is your marriage? How is Randy?
Speaker 2 (41:06):
It's good. My husband, Randy is also my tour manager.
Don't judge works out.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
I think he's great.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
He's great, and he is eighteen years younger, so that's
okay as well. We've been together twelve years and he's great.
We have been getting back to work, which is great
to see him in his element as well, because he's
a fantastic TM tour manager, right, and so he coordinates
with the venue and obviously with these new managers, he's
(41:33):
the point person. And what's great about that is having
Randy there and then these new managers, I don't have
to do those calls anymore. Right, That's what this management
company has promised me. They said, you will never have
to call an executive again. We're not going to let
them call you at home because sometimes they have your
phone number and then they try to get in that way,
(41:55):
Oh can you do this extra work for free or
can you you know whatever? And so having that kind
of those kind of barriers is actually helpful to me because,
like I said, I'm used to kind of getting in
the mud myself which ultimately has not been necessarily fruitful.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, different direction as you go on onward, right onward
in our into our adult life. Last third, you really
do you love the right? I love the road and
I love being on the road with Ran. Now would
you go on a tour bus with all your dogs?
What would you do?
Speaker 2 (42:28):
I would? We like to mix it up.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
So I will say.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
One thing that makes me sad is I do think
there are quite a few markets that I just couldn't
play anymore because of the Trump scandal.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
Like Texas.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Well, Texas is an open carey state, as is Florida,
and that gives me real worries. Sure, I still think
it is shocking and appalling that people in those states
have voted to make it possible for anyone to walk
into a theater where a comedian is doing a show
(43:00):
by herself and bringing a firearm. That is terrifying, terrifying,
mind blowing to me, only because I don't think the
person's with the firearm is the one who's having it
there to defend people. I think the person with the
firearm wants to use it. And you know, we're in
a time when people do that stuff in a way
(43:20):
to make a statement, et cetera. So you know, it
makes me sad because I think at the last time
I played Houston, I played Jones Hall, which is where
the Symphony plays, a gorgeous theater, and yet there was
a guy outside with a Trump shirt and a knife
waiting around asking for me.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
And it's on video.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
And you know, the Dallas Symphony Hall is amazing. I'd
love to play there again, so we'll see. I'm open
to all of it. And you know, when I did
the show in Vegas, I had just a ridiculous amount
of security, and I think, frankly, that makes everybody feel better,
and even the audience.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
And I would love to put together at least a
dozen cities, but you know, I would have to see
where I'm welcome, frankly, And look, the scary thing is,
you don't know until you're on sale. So what I
try to do Texas and Florida, I'm not sure. Let
me talk it to the man. What about the old
the casino towns, what about going from You know, that's
(44:16):
a tough market for me because and really, because you
do so well in Vegas.
Speaker 2 (44:19):
It was I was the queen of the Riverbow casinos.
You know right, yes, those they're almost all in Trump country,
like the Deep South, Like I don't know that I
would go to lafiy at Louisiana now because I don't
know that they would welcome me, you know, And that
makes me sad because I do hear, and I guess
one of the things that makes me sad. What I
see in social media is when a Trumper comes on
(44:42):
my TikTok or my Instagram or whatever and they say,
you know, I used to like you, but now you're
so ugly and disgusting and blah blah blah, and I think,
you know what they're being honest. Some of these women
did used to come to my shows and they loved
me because I kind of, you.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Know, in front of the Kardashians or whatever.
Speaker 6 (44:59):
Yes would, yeah, of A part of how I would,
And that was always my thing is I'm going to
kind of give you a while being dalist, a look
behind the veil and see what's really going on and
make fun of all of it. And remember, making fun
of Hollywood is absolutely punching up.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Yes, no, totally, And I thought making fun.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Of a president was punching up. I still do, but
you know, things changed in a very seismic way for me,
So I would honestly have to be quite mindful about
where I would be able to go.
Speaker 1 (45:29):
But also let's see where.
Speaker 2 (45:30):
The office are. I don't think I'm going to get
offers from those places.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Yeah, well you never know. Well listen, we're already done.
Our time is up. Oh my goodness, it was quick
and easy and fun. But will you come back after
your October sixth gig and talk about how that went,
because I'm coming. I have tickets to that.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
I am so excited you're coming. Yes, and I promised
to give you a lot many good laughs.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
And yes, I'll come back whenever you want. Okay, perfect,
Kathy Griffin. I love you. I'm glad that you're looking,
feeling and being so much better.
Speaker 3 (46:01):
I love you.
Speaker 1 (46:01):
All Right, honey, we are going to take a little break,
come back with questions. Don't go away, and I hope
(46:25):
you enjoyed our little conversation, me and Kathy Griffin, and
we have some questions from you, the loyal listeners. Thank
you so much for leaving us a little voice memo.
And here's question number one.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
Roll it hi, Rosie.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
This is Rachel Windhause from Saint Louis, Missouri.
Speaker 4 (46:41):
I can't believe I'm calling. I never call, but I'm a.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
Huge span of yours.
Speaker 4 (46:47):
I watched your talk show.
Speaker 3 (46:50):
And I was always so inspired how your entire life
has been about following your dreams and making them come true.
I too had a d to be a writer, and
I've made that dream come true.
Speaker 4 (47:05):
The reason I'm.
Speaker 3 (47:05):
Calling today is to respond to the question you posed
about if you and Chelsea should discuss your mother daughter
struggles and relationship on the podcast. And I want to
tell you a little bit about my own experience. My
mother was a therapist when I grew up and was
(47:26):
a pretty successful one.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
She wrote a.
Speaker 3 (47:29):
Self help book that sold a quarter of a million
copies and was on Oprah.
Speaker 4 (47:34):
And she was an excellent therapist who has loved.
Speaker 3 (47:39):
But we had a lot of struggles in our own
mother and daughter relationship that I never really talked about
until I decided to write a memoir a few years ago.
Speaker 4 (47:52):
And she was the first person I had read.
Speaker 3 (47:55):
The draft, and I wouldn't have published it without her approval.
But what it led to for us with such a
healing and path of recovery and has really changed our
relationship and deciding to be the public about it and
have it be a huge part of my memoir has
(48:16):
really helped many other people as well.
Speaker 4 (48:21):
As we know.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
Mother daughter relationship can be very complicated, but they can
also be beautiful and healing and wonderful.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
So I encourage you in Chelsea.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
If you both feel ready to take the step that
it could bring you closer and at the same time
help so many others out there.
Speaker 4 (48:42):
Thank you again for all you do. I'm a huge fan.
Speaker 2 (48:46):
Bye.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
What a wonderful Little Voice memoir. Thank you so much
for that. That's so so beautiful. I you know, I've
been thinking about it a lot, and I think maybe
when we have a little more time under our belt,
me and Chelse, you know, it would be when we
(49:08):
we're both feeling very very strong. I think that that
might be a good time, you know, to do it.
And I said to her, you know, we can record
it and then we decide no one else hears it,
just you and me, and then we decide if we
think that it's something that could be beneficial and helpful
to other people and to both Chelsea and myself. You know,
(49:30):
I mean, I think a lot about motherless daughters, you know,
And that's what I am, right. So I grew up
without a mom, and I wasn't so good at the
separation from mom phase of children's relationship. Now I was ten,
So I didn't go through that pushing my mother away
(49:52):
and trying to take it on my own identity. I didn't,
you know, I didn't see that in my family because
there was no mom there to do it too. And
the trauma of a dead parent is so profound on
a child's psyche and on the family. So I think
(50:12):
that I have a lot of things that I did
wrong as a parent that you know, I wish I
could fix. And I guess I'm trying to do that
that now as I'm more able to own, you know,
what my side of the street is, so to speak, right,
(50:35):
And I think that that's you know, this is going
to be a healing, a healing journey that we're on,
and I'm thrilled to be even at the very beginning
stages of it, and I'm hoping that it lasts for
a long time. So thank you so much for your
kind words, and you are thoughtful pros And I would
love to know what the name of your memoir is
(50:58):
and thank you very much. All right, we got one more.
Speaker 5 (51:02):
Here we go, Hi, Rosie, It's Leslie calling from Houston,
and I'm sure you'll pick up on my Texas accent
pretty easily.
Speaker 1 (51:12):
I was.
Speaker 5 (51:14):
I've been a follower and for a long long time,
and watched your show back in the in the nineties
and ninety six. I guess is when started. But I
used to record your show every day. The recorder was
set my VHS recorder. I think I'll probably still have
(51:35):
some of those tapes, even though I don't have a
VHS player anymore. But anyway, I one day I was
watching and I saw a tribute to Lori Beachman in
memoriam of Lori Beachman because she had just passed away,
(51:57):
and she's saying it was a bit of her, a
clip of her singing on a clear day on your show,
and what a bright light she was and just such
a so sparkling and real and nowadays, well through the years,
(52:17):
if I'm ever down, I'll often go to YouTube and
find her video of singing, her singing on a clear
day on your show, and it always makes me happy
and makes me sad because she's not here, but makes
me happy because what a great talent she was and
(52:39):
I can just feel her, you know, coming through her music.
So I wanted her family to know. I'm sure they do,
but she really still lives on and others and she
still makes a difference in people's lives. So thank you
for bringing Laurie b to my awareness and man, bringing
(53:04):
Broadway to all of us. I haven't gotten to Broadway
as much as I'd like to, and so it was
always very much appreciated that you brought Broadway to us.
Speaker 1 (53:15):
So thank you so much. Take care well, thank you
what a wonderful voice memory you left. I really do
appreciate that. Yeah, Laurie was amazing, what a phenomenal performer
and singer, and I loved every time we got to
have her on the show. And yeah, people talk about
her still. People you know, ask about her, and you know,
(53:38):
she was a tremendous bright light and just watch her
sing on stage or perform in a Broadway show was
just magical. And you know, I miss her. I'm sure
everyone does who knew her, And you know, I know
her family will greatly appreciate you sharing how much she
(53:59):
means to you. You know, that's all that we hope
for right when we're passed away, when we're gone, when
we're no longer here, right, that people remember you and
that you might bring a smile to someone's face. You know,
that's a pretty good legacy to leave, right there. Lori Beachman, Well,
thank you everybody. Listen. Next week special show a conversation
(54:22):
with Lyle Menendez. He of course is serving a life
without the possibility of parole sentence in prison and he's
been in there for thirty four years, and we talk
about his case, about the new evidence and about the
habeas that's been filed to try to get resentencing for
(54:43):
manslaughter instead of what they got, which was life without
the possibility of parole. Lyelmanz next week. Don't miss it.
Hi, everybody, It's me Rosie O'Donnell and this is Onward
and we have a wonderful podcast for you today. I'm
happy to be up and about. I was out for
about a week with COVID for the first time. You know,
I was always kind of proud of the fact that
I hadn't never gotten it, but there it is. My
(00:28):
turn was up. I got it and happy that it
was mild. You know, I was tiring, but mild and
still got a little bit of a throat thing going on.
You might be able to hear, but I am no
longer contagious hip hip hooray. A lot of news going
on this week, a lot of celebrity news. Drew Barrymore
(00:48):
was when the hot seat over the decision she made
to cross the picket line for the writer's guilt, and
that was it was a lot of press, negative press
that she got. And you know, everyone's allowed to change
their mind when they take a breath and they realize, well,
maybe let me listen to other people's point of view
(01:11):
and understand it, reframe it and make a different decision.
And I think it's wonderful that she did that. And
you know, as a result, other shows now say that
they're not going to cross the picket line either, like
the talk. And I believe Jennifer Hudson. And that's all
because Drew stood up. You know, you can't be the
(01:32):
one who crosses the picket line and ruins the actors
and writers' ability, the workers of show business to do
what they do. So I don't know. I'm Union strong
and I'm Drew Barrymore strong, and I think that she
did the right thing, so so good for her. And
(01:56):
you know, Union strong people, Union strong not asking for
anything unreasonable. It's just so that we can continue to
exist in the industry that we helped create. There you go,
all right. So today is a friend of mine. You
know her, you love her. She is the reason that
(02:17):
I tested myself for COVID because I was going to
see her for lunch, and everybody always makes sure to
test before because she lost half her lung had it
taken out with cancer. And she's doing great now and
she's performing in Vegas on October six that I'm going,
(02:38):
and I hope that you will too. She's here here,
she is Kathy Griffin. Well, look who's here, Kathy Griffin. Hello,
Kathy Griffin. Griffin o' donald o Donald Griffin, tell them
(03:02):
the genesis of that h You know, I don't really remember,
but I know this.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
It's every time you call me.
Speaker 1 (03:10):
Yeah, well I always call people their last name.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
But as oh, absolutely, it's an endearment for me. Yeah,
but as if I don't know your voice as it
you need to identify yourself like you're a telemarketer.
Speaker 1 (03:22):
Yeah, grifin O'Donnell Donald Griffin. I just want to see
how you do it, you know. Yeah, I know, I
don't know. I've done it for a long time, but
until you pointed it out, I didn't realize it. They
put one of my specials, I know. Yeah, you talk
like this is your impression of o'donald. Jack it up
a little. I jack it up a little.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
I ambellish, you know, embellishment.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
But your embellishments are delightful. Oh hey, I'm just happy
to be back on stage. First of all, let's talk
about your miraculous, resurgent, emergent, amazing performance in Vegas that
you already did and you're going back very soon.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Yes, on Friday, October sixth, I'll be at the Mirage
in Las Vegas, and I cannot wait, so on June twelfth,
ro I did my first show in five year.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Now, tell me how it came about.
Speaker 2 (04:13):
First of all, Okay, so basically, the Trump scandal happened
six years ago, you know, and I've been you know,
kind of blacklisted, and a lot of people will have
trouble getting beyond that, et cetera. And that's been going
on for really quite a while, and it still kind
of has tentacles to this day. Then I got cancer,
So my voice is a bit altered. I'm kind of
(04:35):
self conscious about it, right because, you know, my whole life,
I've had this kind of scratchy voice and now it's
like a little bit higher pitch. But the good news
is I'm cancer free.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
Fantastic.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
That is the best part. I had lung cancer even
though I've never smoked.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Yeah, isn't that wild? I know, do they know a percent?
What's the percentage of people who get that who've never smeked?
Speaker 2 (04:54):
It's getting much higher, especially for women.
Speaker 1 (04:56):
Because of pollution.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Because of pollution, they asked me if I had been
exposed to rate. I said, look, when I was a kid,
did you guys have the DDT truck?
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Oh my god, yes we did. And we ran in
it and we would go, I'm in a cloud, and
my mother would say, kids, the DDT truck is coming.
And it was like a neighborhood activity to run behind
pesticides and think we were emerged in a cloud. Yes,
and so now so people don't know that they used
(05:26):
to come and spray the neighborhoods in suburbia with all
this stuff for DDT's like to kill foliage.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
Right.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
They would just drive drive right down the middle of
the street. Yes, and we would wipe piper. Yes, and
we would chase it like the ice cream truck. Yes.
It was crazy making.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
We didn't know any better.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
And is that raid on in there? Is that?
Speaker 2 (05:44):
I think rate I might.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
Be in there.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Someone asked me if it was possibly from smoke doing
clubs at the beginning of my career. I'm not sure,
but I got it. It's more common to women. And
so they had to take out half my left lung,
and during the surgery I was injured, and so my
left vocal cord is permanently paralyzed, and I have an
aperture like a tear above it, and that's why my
(06:07):
voice will be like this permanently. But I will say
the audience at Vegas was very forgiving.
Speaker 1 (06:13):
Right, because you talk about it right up front.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Right.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
I gotta say right up front because I don't want
people to wonder why I have this voice or it
kind of sounds.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Like I have a bad cough or something. But you know,
and I also do a lot of jokes about cancer
because I say to the audience, clap if you have
been touched in any way, your family, yourself, your loved
ones by cancer, and of course the whole place clap.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
So as our mutual friend friend Dresher knows and when
she wrote Cancer Schmancer, there's actually a lot of comedy
that goes on in tragedy, yes, And so I talk
about that stuff and i find people relate to it,
and I'm just so grateful that they do. So I
get beyond that.
Speaker 1 (06:53):
And you know, they know that the reason I haven't
been on tour is because of the Trump scandal. Right,
And do you do you bring that up again or
do you leave it?
Speaker 2 (07:02):
Or you know what's funny, bro, I actually don't mention
him once in this new show.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
That's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (07:08):
It's not even on purpose. I just have done that.
I made a whole movie about the scandal called Cathy
Griffin A Hell of a Story.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
You can see it on Amazon. I think it's even
free now. But I kind of feel like, you know,
if he does something in the.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
News, like obviously the mug shot coming out, I would
definitely acknowledge it if I had a show show, But
in this particular show, he just doesn't come up. And
I'm kind of just too busy talking about cancer. And
you know, I'm in recovery for prescription pills. I talked
about that. I've been diagnosed with complex PTSD, which I
(07:43):
know sounds funny and it should only be for combat veterans,
but you know whatever, I have it. And so I
talk about my therapies for that, because it's a lot
of stuff that you just have to laugh about. For example,
one of my therapies, I'm just going to tell you
this right too, okay, And you know what, you can
make fun of me.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
I will.
Speaker 2 (08:02):
You can get all Long Island on me.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
I can and I can take it all, right, Griffin
o'donald says, go okay, So I get on all fours, huh.
And part of my therapy is I do something called
cat cow, which is I don't know why I do it, okay,
but the Kundalini yoga teacher told me to yes, and
so I do. And when you put your head up,
you move like move like a cow or move and
(08:27):
then you art your back and you meow like a
caw wow.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
And you know what, Let me tell you something. After
my cancer, my PTSD was so bad. I I'm not
this is gonna be gross. I could not stop vomiting
for ten months.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
I remember this fit I got it. It was so scary.
It was so scary, and.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
I covered in flop sweat. Yes, I got a resting tremor,
which if I get nervous, it comes back. So sometimes,
like when I was on stage, I could feel my
leg shake. It's just involuntary. And I tell the audience too,
I go, I'm not even nervous, but I just kind
of shake a little bit.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Can I ask a question real quick? The PTSD was
definitely from the Trump situation, But do you think it
also was from the cancer situation?
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Absolutely?
Speaker 1 (09:15):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
I think I thought when they took out my half,
my left lung and I was cancer free, I think
I thought I was going to go back to being
my regular self, right, so having lost my voice and
until I found an amazing female doctor named doctor Anka Barboo.
She helped me go from a voice which you saw
me have for one year.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I actually sounded like this. Yes, and that will mess
with your head. Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
So I think frankly, from being such a happy workaholic
and grateful workaholic to then going to the phone not
ringing for five years.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Now, what would happen when you would call and say,
you know, I'm interested in working again, that people would
just say no? It would you know?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
I mean?
Speaker 2 (10:06):
It was everything from you know, I didn't have an
agent or a publicist or manager.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Oh wait, I should tell you this. Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
I had a publicist for a while and I found
out he was one of these qanons.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Oh god, So how did you end up with a
QAnon publicist? First of all, leave it to me, okay.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
So I'm looking on the TikTok and by the.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
Way, I am very bitter about you. Why let me
tell you? Why tell me?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Because I work my ass off for that freaking TikTok.
I'm doing skits, I'm putting hair and makeup on.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
You know what you do?
Speaker 2 (10:38):
You wake up with your no makeup and you just
talk to people two million followers. All right, I'm doing cartwheels.
I got my lips tattooed. How was that painful?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Very painful? Well, let me say they look very good
right now.
Speaker 2 (10:54):
Well, you know I don't always have to publisticod anymore,
and so for me, it's actually been a great thing.
It's called lip blushing. But I had like giant swollen
lips for about four days. But I don't mean like
lip fillers. I mean it looked like.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
You send me that picture. I had that picture, Yes,
And was that how swollen they were was indicative of
how much pain you were in? Yes, that's how much
pain it was. Wow.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
And I mean think about it, it's like you have tattoos.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
It's like a if you think about tattooing your lips,
that's a big tattoo. Yeah. So it's a lot of pain.
But and it's a regular tattoo gun.
Speaker 2 (11:33):
Yeah whatever.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Yeah. Wow, I know I'm actually gonna get it like
refurbished in September, like I've get. They call it lip blushing.
I'm getting reblushed, Okay. And is it because it fades away,
it fades away.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
A little bit, Uh, huh, and they go in there
and just kind of fix it. But my point.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
Is you do everything for the TikTok people. Yeah, and
then you just, I know, I roll out of bed.
I don't even wash my hair. I mean, I wouldn't
even care about location. You're not going to cities around
the world. No, no, no, I'm staying on my couch.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Your person filming you in the light bar and.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
Yeah, no filters. Yeah, I know. I don't know what
it is. I just till you are compelling. That's why.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
That's why you're showing successful and that's why your stand
up as successful because you are compelling.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
A griffin. It's O'Donnell, we got to take a commercial break.
(12:45):
I think that I am curious about people in a
way that most people aren't. Like, I really care about
someone's story, and you know, so when I hear stories
on there, I end up getting in conversations with people,
especially when it's about some niche thing in my like
my daughter having autism, yes, you know, or my daughter
being non binary. Like it's brought up a lot of
(13:07):
conversations with other parents in similar situations. So I also,
you know, I just really love doing it. You love
doing it too. They love TikTok. By the way, it's
never going to go away.
Speaker 2 (13:16):
People that are worried about the Congress taking away or whatever.
It's would never pass the First Amendment law. You know,
it would never be able to be even diminished because
of the First Amendment Law. So it's totally safe.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
Oh that's good because I was worried.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
A lot of people were worried. And by the way,
it is owned by the Chinese government. That's no secret.
Right are they scanning our faces? Probably?
Speaker 1 (13:38):
But who isn't at this point? Who isn't at this point?
Exactly right, you know.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
But I just wanted to let you know of my
bitterness and I wanted you to just take that in.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I will take it in my jealousy, all right. And
yet I still love doing it and I love scrolling
it because I was a big Twitter person. Yeah, and
Elon kicked me off personally. Yeah, how weird?
Speaker 2 (13:59):
Was that weird?
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Because I was impersonating him? And then I kept posting
things like, you know, hashtag vote blue no matter who
and saying that he had become pro choice after talking
to his various babies mothers. And it got a little
traction and people believed it, so he got very upset
with me.
Speaker 2 (14:18):
And then there was this bad joke running around Twitter
that a bunch of people had written saying, she's not
impersonating Elon, she should be kicked off for impersonating a comedian.
So he stole that joke, which is donating the rounds
because he's such a hack, right, And then he personally
kicked me off, and then he reinstated me because there
(14:39):
was like a little bit of blowback, which is a
good sign for me. Yeah, it means maybe like I'm
kind of coming back into people's good graces a little bit.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Tap. You just sold out a huge Vegas showroom and
you got like a ten minute standing ovation and they
stood up when you walked out, and it was incredible.
I think it's over. I think that part's over.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
Through your mont to God's Ears, I will say I
was hoping after that show I would be able to
route a tour or book a tour, but I think
after this October sixth show, I can. I am with
a fancy management company now called Three Arts. Oh I
know them, yeah, and they're like fancy, they're very good, yes,
So thank goodness. That to me is like an actual
(15:23):
sign that things are finally turning around. Because it's nice
if you're on social media like we never left you,
and that's wonderful. But I want to get back to work.
I want to get back to making people laugh. And
I don't care if it's a tour or a reality
show or a game show or a host gig. I
just want to make people laugh.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
You know, I don't know anyone who loves to work
as much as you.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
I love it, you know, I really just stand up
in particular. I love all the gigs, but anything where
I can improvise, I mean, if I could do it,
I know you feel this way. If I could do
a Curb Your Enthusiasm type of show, that would be
the Holy grand of course, because what Larry gets to
do on that show is just goof around with the guys,
come up with the bullets, and then just do it
(16:05):
until it's right. Is just a heavenly environment. And you
are hilarious on that.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
Thank you. I think if it was that easy to do,
so many people would have copied it. I think like
he's like a genius, you know that he came up
with the character that is so close to him that
he doesn't even really necessarily have to write. He just
thinks it up. You know it is, and it is.
You've been on there, I know I was.
Speaker 2 (16:27):
On the very first episode. I've kind of fallen out
of Larry's good graces. I'm not sure why, but I'm
still a fan. As many people that don't care for me,
I don't you know what, I don't need someone to
like me for me to like them.
Speaker 1 (16:40):
That is, that's good learn.
Speaker 2 (16:42):
I believe that miss Brooks Shields is not thrilled with me,
and has not been for many years. But let me
tell you, I will always love her. That show gave
me the break of a lifetime called Fu Susan. Yes,
I got to work on that show for four years.
She was lovely, she still lovely. I loved the documentary
about her.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
Pretty Baby. I thought it was beautiful.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
And by the way, it's about time she got her flowers,
as the kids say, yeah, because that one's been a
long time coming. Yes, And you know Jerry Seinfeld is
not a fan of mine. Doesn't matter now.
Speaker 1 (17:16):
So when you say this, I'm curious, do you just
assume that because let's say you haven't been invited in
Comedians and Cars or something. Why do you think that
Jerry Seinfeld and Larry like because they like? You know,
I haven't spoken to Larry since I did the shows,
but I don't think that that means he's mad at
me or anything. Well, I the last time I saw
(17:37):
Larry was very kind. You're welcoming in the way that
he had been in the past.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
Oh okay, And I think Jerry by not having either
one of us on Comedians and Cars. I think it's
a statement because you and I are real stand ups.
It's not like we started out doing soap operas right
fell into standup.
Speaker 4 (17:58):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:58):
You and I both cut our tea doing stand up,
have done stand up for many many years, have done
multiple stand up specials, write our own stuff, do our
own stuff, decades of material that is easily accessible, you know,
to anyone.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
And so I think it's I think it's a.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Bit of a statement. I would be I'll be honest
with you, if I were to see Jerry at a
social function, I would probably be afraid to go up
to him because I would not expect him to be
very kind.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
It's so interesting because you're so kind of free and abrasive.
If you want to be and cynical and sat time,
you know, in your act, and yet in real life
you're kind of different than that, Like, yeah, you wouldn't
have the bravado to go over and go Jerry, what's up? Man?
How am I? You know what?
Speaker 2 (18:49):
I'm too freaking sensitive, That's what problem. My skin is
too thin in real life, and so I kind of
have been through enough. Like the last thing I need
is to have like Jerry and Larry, like be just
kind of dismissive, and I imagine that that is how
they feel. And you know, look, I have that with
a lot of people in the industry. I have decades
(19:11):
behind me of a big agent telling me, you know,
Kathy Griffin is a life's too short situation. You know,
I have been told no career that I'm quote expensive
and difficult. And I've definitely burned a lot of bridges
and made a lot of enemies over the years with
executives because I was naive enough to think if I
(19:35):
fought hard enough and won awards and was a good earner,
because it's all about the mighty dollar, these guys would
pay me what they paid the guys. And I now
realize at the glorious age of sixty two years young.
That just didn't happen. They just weren't capable of going there.
In my opinion, they're still not. And I thought there
(20:00):
was a revolution happening with women in show business, and
I have to be honest, I don't think it's that
much better than when Joan was coming up. Joan rivers
and kind of threw the ranks, and I personally saw
her have to fight a lot of battles that I
didn't think she should have to fight at all. And
you know, let's talk about fashion Police. She wanted desperately
(20:23):
to make that a union show, and the writers of
that show really, in my opinion, viciously attacked her for
not getting enough money. Well, when you work for the
freaking E Channel, we're not going to make it a
union show.
Speaker 1 (20:37):
I mean, it's like Bravo.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
I wish my life on the dealerst could have been
union or my specials or my talk show. But the
truth is they just never were prepared to pay me.
You know what it takes to make a union show.
And like I said, I you know, I look at
my male contemporaries and I see many of them immersed
in all kinds of scandals, and in my case, this
(21:01):
scandal really, you know, really put me out of work
for like I said, years, and it just was a
mind fuck to not have the phone ring for five
years but also be pitching. I was pitching this kind
of show, that kind of show. I was taking meetings
with anybody. I had a couple lower level people approach
me and say, I think you got a raw deal.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I think you're hysterical. I grew up watching the deal
List to help me come out all those wonderful things.
But when it gets up to the check signers, and
that's what I call the.
Speaker 2 (21:32):
Check signers, the check signers, because people don't know there's
about a half dozen middle aged white dudes that now
own so many conglomerates that there's a half dozen dudes
that decide everything you watch, right, you know, you look
at David Saslov, who now owns Max in addition to
CNN and Discovery and Discovery Networks and of course Discovery.
(21:55):
They made their money on taking very low budget reality
shows Johnny Cape, Flissay, et cetera, Little People, Big World.
I mean all those shows, I love them, by the way,
but you know, those shows ran internationally did very well,
and I think when you have someone with that kind
of financial business ethos, they're not going to do it
(22:18):
any other way. And so for somebody like me, when
I would make an enemy of someone like a Leslie
Moonvez who used to be the head of CBS, and
I would tussle with him and confront him about certain things,
and he says, Okay, Kathy Griffin's on the shit list,
and then the board of directors backs him up.
Speaker 1 (22:39):
Then I go, gosh, that's why I haven't.
Speaker 2 (22:42):
Worked at CBS in fifteen years or whatever. And I
would tussle with a guy named Jeff Zucker, who is
the head of NBC and then the head of the
head of a CNN. Well, Jeff had issues with me
because I used to personally ask for a raise for
Kathy Griffin my life on the d list. Because NBC
owns Bravo and now Comcast, I think I can't even remember.
Speaker 1 (23:04):
Yeah, there's so many now, right.
Speaker 2 (23:06):
But you know, so I think I've learned my lesson.
It's not a great lesson to learn, but let me
tell you, I'm just a lot less confrontational because at
this point I don't mean to sound lazy, but it's
kind of like how I'm starting to feel about feminism
and I'm going to get blown back for this. Yeah,
but I'm kind of like, can the young women take over? Like,
can the younger chicks be like getting in trouble with executives?
Speaker 1 (23:28):
Because I feel like I still am and well, do
you know, can I think I told you this once.
I have never talked to any of those kinds. I
never went to the head of you know, I would
call my agent and say, Nancy, could you please do this?
Could you do that? Could you I never in my
life would consider calling Jeff Zucker or any of them.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
I don't know ever in my life had an agent
that would do it for me. So they just took
the no, and I went like CNN, for example, New
Year's Eve, which I very much missed doing that gig.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
Sure, it was just fun and I just loved Anderson
and I would honestly be thinking of jokes all year round.
It was just so much fun.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And you know that broadcast went from ninety minutes to
four and a half hours. And I, you know, asked
my agents to get me raised and the answer was no.
And I would personally call Jeff and we would tussle,
and you know, all sorts of things would happen on
those calls. I mean one time I had my mother,
my ninety nine year old mother called Jeff Sucker as
like a comedy bit to try to get a raise.
(24:29):
Like I tried everything with these guys, and sometimes.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
It would work, and sometimes it wouldn't right, And I
think sometimes when it would work, I think they still
resented me, you know, Like, yes, I went to a
guy named Peter Roth who was the head of Warner Brothers,
because I thought I deserved a raise on that show.
Suddenly Susan and I couldn't get a raise, and so
(24:53):
I called this before even emails are texting, I think.
And I went into his office one day at the
end of the day at like six thirty pm, and
you had an appointment. No.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
I called him in and I said, there's an emergency.
I need to talk to you.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
You called him personally. Wow, there's an emergency. I need
to talk to you.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
And I think, I said, or I may not be
able to come to work tomorrow, Oh.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Honey, And you played ard ball this I did with
the head guys, Yes.
Speaker 2 (25:23):
Like an idiot, like I really thought. I mean, look,
it kind of works.
Speaker 1 (25:26):
So I went in.
Speaker 2 (25:27):
I had all my stats. I said, look, this, that
and the other. Here's why I think I deserve a raise.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
I wouldn't.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
I wouldn't go in with no stats. I went, this
is what I'm earning, this is what I'm doing on
the road, this is my level of visibility.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
This is my Q score.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
If you don't know what Q scores are, it's your
television scores on how recognizable you are and how likable.
I'm always more recognizable than likable. But I went in
and I said, we're going to do this like a
used car sale. And he kept saying, we're not doing this.
Talent doesn't do this. So I brought cocktail in actions
with me. I said, I'm going to write a number,
and then you're going to write a number. Were to
(26:02):
switch napkins, and he kept saying, I'm not going to
do this with you, and so he goes, look, maybe
tomorrow i'll call your agent, and I knew the agent
was kind of done negotiating, and the answer was zero.
So I wrote a number and then I gave it
to him and he said, you're crazy. And I just
kept making him laugh and doing bits and I mean everything,
the cartwheels, and finally I got the rais and I
(26:24):
got more than double of what I was making in
the room. You got what I did, and he said,
you wore me down. He said, you were so funny,
and you wore me down. So that was one incident
where it actually went well. I like Peter Roth. I
don't know if he thinks I'm difficult, too expensive, but
that was one time it kind of worked. But remember
(26:44):
how long agoes that. That was like twenty five years ago.
So I think I thought, oh, I can do this
with Comedy Central, I can do this with HBO, you know,
and the agents would just kind of take a no,
because sometimes the agents, you know, they're kind of more
in bed with the check signer than just little Dalist
Kathy Griffin.
Speaker 1 (27:04):
Or there are other clients that they want to protect too.
They don't want to pissol off the head guy.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
And I was never the big client, you know. I mean, look,
you had giant contracts, and so I think your agent
really knew, like, hey, there's really big money coming in
from the Rosy Empire, frankly, and you know, my little
Dalist empire. I made a good buck, but I never
was getting the five million a year or any anything
close to that. So I tussled a lot, and I
(27:32):
think I was kind of just raised that way anyway.
So it was like a combination of how I just
was as a person. But I really I had thought, Okay.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
This is it. If I dance enough, they're going to
give me what the guys get. We'll be right back
with Kathy Griffin. Do you think since the cancer and
(28:11):
since what you call the cancelation, that you've changed like
you would you do that now? I would not do no, honestly.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
The nice thing is knock on wood. Our mutual dear friend,
Susie Rman, your girlfriend approved, you.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
Can do part it well.
Speaker 2 (28:29):
She and I are still good friends. And you know, look,
I am very proud that I worked as hard as
I did, and I'm proud that I'm good with money.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You really are. You live a beautiful now. You don't
have children, you got a lot of adults, you're married,
but you know you have a very successful celebrity life.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
I think I'm very lucky. I always say I only
have two talents. I'm funny and I'm good with money.
And so I'm in a position where I don't have
to take a crappy gig, and I won't, but I'll
never be in a position where I can demand what
the guy's got, you know. I mean, I think about
the guys I came up with, you know, Ray Romano,
David Spade, Kevin James, you know, kind of the guys
(29:12):
who are like around circling when we were all just
doing sets.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Sure, yes, they were around with me as well. We're
in we're the same age. So yeah, all those guys, yes,
but you know, they had tremendous success on a sitcom,
all of them. They had. David was of course on SNL,
but the other two had successful sitcoms for many years.
And you know, it's hard sometimes to compare yourself to
other people. I find it for me, it's very unhelpful
(29:40):
because there's no way that you know what's going on
in someone's life or world or but the blatant, you know,
anti woman sentiment is still there. Yeah, you know, we're
not at equal pay really anywhere.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
No, No, And I certainly am not bitching because, like
you said, I have a great life and I'm very
grateful for that. But I am discouraged that there isn't
more progress made, and I what discourages me the most
is I don't want younger women to go through what
I did, where you have one meeting with an executive
and they're pissed off at you for twenty freaking years,
(30:15):
like some of these guys are pissed off at me
to this day, and I'm thinking, oh, my gosh, I
asked for a raise fifteen years ago, you know, or whatever,
and you know, just a lot of bizarre, spiteful behavior.
Like yes, when I the year Trump was elected, I
was my I think it might have been my last
year on cn ANAM. Yeah, that's right, of course it was.
(30:37):
And Jeff Zucker called me and he said, okay, I'll
give you one Trump joke an hour. And I said, Jeff,
he's you've never done this before. I said, it sounds
like you're being a posty and you're scared of him.
By the way, hence me having enemies with executives, because
that's how I talk to them. And I said, you know,
(30:59):
do we have a four to our broad broadcast and
he's in the news like constantly, but for his own
bizarre behavior, but also the world is watching it. This
is a global broadcast and I said, look, I don't
want to do four and a half hours on Trump
at all. But I said, I'm just kind of surprised.
I said, you know, I know you guys all had
this big meeting with Trump, but he's first elected. And
(31:20):
I saw the videos of Diane Sawyer walking in and
Jake Tapper walking in and what did he say in
that meeting?
Speaker 1 (31:27):
Right?
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And he wouldn't tell me. And then I said, well,
I'll do the best I can, but my job is
to be funny.
Speaker 1 (31:33):
And that's how you hired me.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
And then Jeff Zucker for the first and last time,
actually showed up at the platform, no kidding, and I
just thought that was very odd, Like, I think you
guys can trust me. The ratings have only gone up,
you know, and so stuff like that. It still sticks
with me because I'm shocked at the length certain people go,
certain people have gone to quote put me in my place,
(31:57):
and that is something that is that ways have on me,
because I don't think it should be like that. Now,
do you want it to be better for the younger women?
Speaker 1 (32:05):
Do you think since your really tremendously visible happy state
of mind, I mean, you look so happy, you look happy,
You look like so much better than last year. Yeah,
you feel like you're more able to take on the life.
And and and I think, and if you could, if
(32:27):
you would explain, like what did it feel like when
you walked out into the sold out Mirage Theater and
the people weren't great? Like what what did it feel
like to get back in the water on a huge
wave and surf a huge Vegas casino and kill it? Well,
I've been trying it to cry, okay, because honestly, it
(32:48):
felt like I was home.
Speaker 2 (32:49):
For the first time in five years. As well, I
felt like I was home. The audience was so loving.
They were standing, they were clapping, and I understand they
I hadn't even open my mouth yet they were clapping
because I think I appreciate very much when people think
I'm alive and thriving or whatever people say, and that's
(33:09):
the truth. And I think the folks that come to
my shows, there's an understanding that I've been through kind
of the mill and you're honest about I talk about it.
And also I really enjoy talking about it because, as
I said, at this point, between COVID or between like
I said, cancer or recovery, who hasn't been through the mill, right,
(33:32):
And so I will always make fun of celebrities, and
celebrity culture will always fascinate me. But you know, I've
kind of moved away from talking about the Kardashians all
the time or talking about this celebrity. Now I talk
about some of it, and certainly if I've had a
run in with somebody that's that's funny to me, I'll
try to make it funny or but you know, I
(33:54):
am talking a little more about stuff I've been through
in a way hopefully that the audience can relate to.
And so that show is so meaningful to me because
you know, it showed such support and obviously for five
years I really doubted if any support was there because
the business was sending me a message that was kind
(34:16):
of like, no, thank you, You're not welcome here. And
it's a business I love. I haven't been treated so
great by it. It's something it can be a crappy
boyfriend sometimes, but it's a business I love, and like
I said, I live to make people laugh. So to
have that taken from me for five years, yes.
Speaker 1 (34:33):
Was like a whole And so were there little clubs
you could go to could you do an open mic night,
could you walk into the improve and say give me
ten or I Well, I've never really done well in
clubs because sometimes if I'm like sandwich between the two
bro comics, it's kind of a tough vibe because I'm
more of a storyteller, and you know, my joke is
it takes me ten minutes to even finish saying hello,
(34:55):
and so I'm better in a little long form situation.
But I did one thing, like one time, I just
did five Mondays at the laugh Factory and it was
just me and it was when the other comics were done.
I think I did a ten PM show or something
and those were fantastic. Now that was prior to my cancer,
it was even prior to COVID Wow. But I just
(35:15):
literally put on a different set of PJS every Monday,
went there, danced around.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I did a different hour every single week.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
Which people don't understand how hard that is to do
another hour every week. I mean, these comedians, some of
them are so unbelievably productive, Like I could not do
that takes me a lot an hour a week. Cat, No, honey,
I couldn't. But thank you for believing in me. But
(35:45):
I'm you know, I'm definitely going to start doing it again,
going to go to Wendy Leibman's. Wendy's so funny. She's
so great. I loved her back way back when her
delivery is so many.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
She never seen her bomb I'm not kidding.
Speaker 1 (35:59):
Never rights so funny, she really is. And she has
a club in the valley that she books. So I
talked to her on the TikTok Yes and I'm like,
could I ever just come down? She's like, of course,
you know.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Now for me, I have to say yeah. For me,
that's called burning tickets. So, for example, if my last
time I played in La I got to play the
Kodak Theater. I think it's now called the Hollywood and
Highland Theater where they have the Oscars. It's one of
my favorite theaters to play in the world. It's just
gorgeous and the acoustics are amazing, thirty three hundred capacity,
And frankly, if I go and do a pop up
(36:32):
at a club, there's three hundred people that might go.
Speaker 1 (36:36):
You know what.
Speaker 2 (36:37):
I like Kathy Griffin, but I kind of just saw
her two months ago. So that's kind of where I'm
coming from. Is I have a dream of going back
to the great venues that I could play five years
ago on my last tour. Kathy Griffin, laugh your head off,
and I love you know, the Masonic in San Francisco.
(36:57):
I would love to play Carnegie Hall again. I have
a dream of playing Radio City again, and so I'm
trying desperately to work up to that. And I will say,
I think the reason I sold out in Vegas, and
I think the reason I'm selling well for the October
sixth show is people haven't seen me in five years, correct.
And I was so touched because at the show in
(37:18):
June I heard from someone that came from Paris, Wow,
someone that came from Dublin, multiple people from all over
the country. And I have never had that that Well,
first of all, I used to do tours there were
like eighty cities in a year. But I find that
so moving and so touching that frankly, i'd kind of
rather hold up and see.
Speaker 5 (37:39):
See.
Speaker 1 (37:39):
I don't know yet if I can sell these theaters again. Yeah.
I never think of it that way. But again, I'm
not a business well you know, I'm not as good
with money as you. I'm not as you know, I mean,
I don't get ostentatious things, and I don't have any
interest in fashion, so that helps. You know, I've got
a fashion bill, you do, You got a high one right?
Speaker 2 (37:59):
Become a fashion yeah. I don't know why, but it
just happened.
Speaker 1 (38:02):
Yeah, And I see you when all these designer clothes
and all this.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
You know who's fault that is Bete Midler?
Speaker 1 (38:07):
No kidding. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (38:09):
When Bette Midler was on Cathograph of My Life on
the D List, she showed up for the part where
we were just kind of hanging out and she had
this insanely gorgeous Vivian Westwood dress, and I, of course,
being a comic, I go bust her balls. I'm like,
what do you think we're going to funeral? What the
hell you were a designer for? And she goes, what
are you talking about? You should be wearing this at
this stage of the game. And I always remember saying
(38:30):
that at this stage of the game.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
And if you remember, Bet reached an age where she
became glam she was doing beautiful hair and makeup. She dresses,
and bet doesn't play. So when she's out in like
her New York social scene, which is no joke, she
runs with the Mockers as a New York restoration prodcas yes, yes,
and so I kind of took that to heart, and
(38:53):
Joan was like that, and you know, you know, Phyllis
kind of Phyllis kind of was like that, and so
you know, I'm trying to perpetuate this image that I'm
kind of like the grand Dame of stand up comedy.
And I have a new character I'm working on called
Kitty Carrington Colby Griffin, and she is in very expensive
(39:13):
designer clothing and designer momus and she hangs out with
designers and she's had a storied life where she's had
many lovers and they've been rich and poor, and naturally
she prefers rich and so like that's the sort of
stuff that I, frankly in my real life where I
started wearing this stuff. I started thinking of this character,
and as I'm developing her, I don't know anything could happen,
(39:37):
but I might even do a Q and A with
this character in Vegas as just a fun little way to.
Speaker 2 (39:42):
Kind of mix things up.
Speaker 1 (39:43):
So there you go. That's how my head works.
Speaker 2 (39:45):
I go from buying nice stuff to tell it to
doing whatever Bet said. Because some of the divas like
Stevie Nicks lover. Are you ready for this? Yes, she
gave me a personalized makeup kit.
Speaker 1 (39:58):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (39:59):
She saw me and Sti Colbert and she said, I
didn't like your palette and I said okay, And so
she had her makeup artist go out and shop. And
I have the list in Stevie's handwriting to this day
of every product. And let me tell you something that
has been my palette because I am not like what
am I going to argue with Stevie? No, now you suggesting,
(40:21):
I argue, I am not. She sounds like you were suggesting,
but I argue just.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
Like a one wing dove. I would never. I would never.
But listen, she she's a friend of yours though you.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
Met her, and she's someone that very much stood by
me as you did, and a couple of times publicly,
the last time she, you know, played the Hollywood Bowl,
she dedicated Landslide to me, and that was meaningful because
I know there's a lot of like showbiz executive e
types that go to the Bowl and that was just
(40:54):
so meaningful to me that she did that, because you know,
it's a stamp of approval that some people were you're
not willing to do, and so that means a lot.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Yeah, how is your marriage? How is Randy?
Speaker 2 (41:06):
It's good. My husband, Randy is also my tour manager.
Don't judge works out.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
I think he's great.
Speaker 2 (41:12):
He's great, and he is eighteen years younger, so that's
okay as well. We've been together twelve years and he's great.
We have been getting back to work, which is great
to see him in his element as well, because he's
a fantastic TM tour manager, right, and so he coordinates
with the venue and obviously with these new managers, he's
(41:33):
the point person. And what's great about that is having
Randy there and then these new managers, I don't have
to do those calls anymore. Right, That's what this management
company has promised me. They said, you will never have
to call an executive again. We're not going to let
them call you at home because sometimes they have your
phone number and then they try to get in that way,
(41:55):
Oh can you do this extra work for free or
can you you know whatever? And so having that kind
of those kind of barriers is actually helpful to me because,
like I said, I'm used to kind of getting in
the mud myself which ultimately has not been necessarily fruitful.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
Yeah, different direction as you go on onward, right onward
in our into our adult life. Last third, you really
do you love the right? I love the road and
I love being on the road with Ran. Now would
you go on a tour bus with all your dogs?
What would you do?
Speaker 2 (42:28):
I would? We like to mix it up.
Speaker 1 (42:30):
So I will say.
Speaker 2 (42:31):
One thing that makes me sad is I do think
there are quite a few markets that I just couldn't
play anymore because of the Trump scandal.
Speaker 1 (42:37):
Like Texas.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Well, Texas is an open carey state, as is Florida,
and that gives me real worries. Sure, I still think
it is shocking and appalling that people in those states
have voted to make it possible for anyone to walk
into a theater where a comedian is doing a show
(43:00):
by herself and bringing a firearm. That is terrifying, terrifying,
mind blowing to me, only because I don't think the
person's with the firearm is the one who's having it
there to defend people. I think the person with the
firearm wants to use it. And you know, we're in
a time when people do that stuff in a way
(43:20):
to make a statement, et cetera. So you know, it
makes me sad because I think at the last time
I played Houston, I played Jones Hall, which is where
the Symphony plays, a gorgeous theater, and yet there was
a guy outside with a Trump shirt and a knife
waiting around asking for me.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
And it's on video.
Speaker 2 (43:39):
And you know, the Dallas Symphony Hall is amazing. I'd
love to play there again, so we'll see. I'm open
to all of it. And you know, when I did
the show in Vegas, I had just a ridiculous amount
of security, and I think, frankly, that makes everybody feel better,
and even the audience.
Speaker 1 (43:55):
And I would love to put together at least a
dozen cities, but you know, I would have to see
where I'm welcome, frankly, And look, the scary thing is,
you don't know until you're on sale. So what I
try to do Texas and Florida, I'm not sure. Let
me talk it to the man. What about the old
the casino towns, what about going from You know, that's
(44:16):
a tough market for me because and really, because you
do so well in Vegas.
Speaker 2 (44:19):
It was I was the queen of the Riverbow casinos.
You know right, yes, those they're almost all in Trump country,
like the Deep South, Like I don't know that I
would go to lafiy at Louisiana now because I don't
know that they would welcome me, you know, And that
makes me sad because I do hear, and I guess
one of the things that makes me sad. What I
see in social media is when a Trumper comes on
(44:42):
my TikTok or my Instagram or whatever and they say,
you know, I used to like you, but now you're
so ugly and disgusting and blah blah blah, and I think,
you know what they're being honest. Some of these women
did used to come to my shows and they loved
me because I kind of, you.
Speaker 1 (44:57):
Know, in front of the Kardashians or whatever.
Speaker 6 (44:59):
Yes would, yeah, of A part of how I would,
And that was always my thing is I'm going to
kind of give you a while being dalist, a look
behind the veil and see what's really going on and
make fun of all of it. And remember, making fun
of Hollywood is absolutely punching up.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Yes, no, totally, And I thought making fun.
Speaker 2 (45:18):
Of a president was punching up. I still do, but
you know, things changed in a very seismic way for me,
So I would honestly have to be quite mindful about
where I would be able to go.
Speaker 1 (45:29):
But also let's see where.
Speaker 2 (45:30):
The office are. I don't think I'm going to get
offers from those places.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Yeah, well you never know. Well listen, we're already done.
Our time is up. Oh my goodness, it was quick
and easy and fun. But will you come back after
your October sixth gig and talk about how that went,
because I'm coming. I have tickets to that.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
I am so excited you're coming. Yes, and I promised
to give you a lot many good laughs.
Speaker 1 (45:53):
And yes, I'll come back whenever you want. Okay, perfect,
Kathy Griffin. I love you. I'm glad that you're looking,
feeling and being so much better.
Speaker 3 (46:01):
I love you.
Speaker 1 (46:01):
All Right, honey, we are going to take a little break,
come back with questions. Don't go away, and I hope
(46:25):
you enjoyed our little conversation, me and Kathy Griffin, and
we have some questions from you, the loyal listeners. Thank
you so much for leaving us a little voice memo.
And here's question number one.
Speaker 4 (46:36):
Roll it hi, Rosie.
Speaker 3 (46:38):
This is Rachel Windhause from Saint Louis, Missouri.
Speaker 4 (46:41):
I can't believe I'm calling. I never call, but I'm a.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
Huge span of yours.
Speaker 4 (46:47):
I watched your talk show.
Speaker 3 (46:50):
And I was always so inspired how your entire life
has been about following your dreams and making them come true.
I too had a d to be a writer, and
I've made that dream come true.
Speaker 4 (47:05):
The reason I'm.
Speaker 3 (47:05):
Calling today is to respond to the question you posed
about if you and Chelsea should discuss your mother daughter
struggles and relationship on the podcast. And I want to
tell you a little bit about my own experience. My
mother was a therapist when I grew up and was
(47:26):
a pretty successful one.
Speaker 1 (47:27):
She wrote a.
Speaker 3 (47:29):
Self help book that sold a quarter of a million
copies and was on Oprah.
Speaker 4 (47:34):
And she was an excellent therapist who has loved.
Speaker 3 (47:39):
But we had a lot of struggles in our own
mother and daughter relationship that I never really talked about
until I decided to write a memoir a few years ago.
Speaker 4 (47:52):
And she was the first person I had read.
Speaker 3 (47:55):
The draft, and I wouldn't have published it without her approval.
But what it led to for us with such a
healing and path of recovery and has really changed our
relationship and deciding to be the public about it and
have it be a huge part of my memoir has
(48:16):
really helped many other people as well.
Speaker 4 (48:21):
As we know.
Speaker 3 (48:21):
Mother daughter relationship can be very complicated, but they can
also be beautiful and healing and wonderful.
Speaker 4 (48:30):
So I encourage you in Chelsea.
Speaker 3 (48:32):
If you both feel ready to take the step that
it could bring you closer and at the same time
help so many others out there.
Speaker 4 (48:42):
Thank you again for all you do. I'm a huge fan.
Speaker 2 (48:46):
Bye.
Speaker 1 (48:48):
What a wonderful Little Voice memoir. Thank you so much
for that. That's so so beautiful. I you know, I've
been thinking about it a lot, and I think maybe
when we have a little more time under our belt,
me and Chelse, you know, it would be when we
(49:08):
we're both feeling very very strong. I think that that
might be a good time, you know, to do it.
And I said to her, you know, we can record
it and then we decide no one else hears it,
just you and me, and then we decide if we
think that it's something that could be beneficial and helpful
to other people and to both Chelsea and myself. You know,
(49:30):
I mean, I think a lot about motherless daughters, you know,
And that's what I am, right. So I grew up
without a mom, and I wasn't so good at the
separation from mom phase of children's relationship. Now I was ten,
So I didn't go through that pushing my mother away
(49:52):
and trying to take it on my own identity. I didn't,
you know, I didn't see that in my family because
there was no mom there to do it too. And
the trauma of a dead parent is so profound on
a child's psyche and on the family. So I think
(50:12):
that I have a lot of things that I did
wrong as a parent that you know, I wish I
could fix. And I guess I'm trying to do that
that now as I'm more able to own, you know,
what my side of the street is, so to speak, right,
(50:35):
And I think that that's you know, this is going
to be a healing, a healing journey that we're on,
and I'm thrilled to be even at the very beginning
stages of it, and I'm hoping that it lasts for
a long time. So thank you so much for your
kind words, and you are thoughtful pros And I would
love to know what the name of your memoir is
(50:58):
and thank you very much. All right, we got one more.
Speaker 5 (51:02):
Here we go, Hi, Rosie, It's Leslie calling from Houston,
and I'm sure you'll pick up on my Texas accent
pretty easily.
Speaker 1 (51:12):
I was.
Speaker 5 (51:14):
I've been a follower and for a long long time,
and watched your show back in the in the nineties
and ninety six. I guess is when started. But I
used to record your show every day. The recorder was
set my VHS recorder. I think I'll probably still have
(51:35):
some of those tapes, even though I don't have a
VHS player anymore. But anyway, I one day I was
watching and I saw a tribute to Lori Beachman in
memoriam of Lori Beachman because she had just passed away,
(51:57):
and she's saying it was a bit of her, a
clip of her singing on a clear day on your show,
and what a bright light she was and just such
a so sparkling and real and nowadays, well through the years,
(52:17):
if I'm ever down, I'll often go to YouTube and
find her video of singing, her singing on a clear
day on your show, and it always makes me happy
and makes me sad because she's not here, but makes
me happy because what a great talent she was and
(52:39):
I can just feel her, you know, coming through her music.
So I wanted her family to know. I'm sure they do,
but she really still lives on and others and she
still makes a difference in people's lives. So thank you
for bringing Laurie b to my awareness and man, bringing
(53:04):
Broadway to all of us. I haven't gotten to Broadway
as much as I'd like to, and so it was
always very much appreciated that you brought Broadway to us.
Speaker 1 (53:15):
So thank you so much. Take care well, thank you
what a wonderful voice memory you left. I really do
appreciate that. Yeah, Laurie was amazing, what a phenomenal performer
and singer, and I loved every time we got to
have her on the show. And yeah, people talk about
her still. People you know, ask about her, and you know,
(53:38):
she was a tremendous bright light and just watch her
sing on stage or perform in a Broadway show was
just magical. And you know, I miss her. I'm sure
everyone does who knew her, And you know, I know
her family will greatly appreciate you sharing how much she
(53:59):
means to you. You know, that's all that we hope
for right when we're passed away, when we're gone, when
we're no longer here, right, that people remember you and
that you might bring a smile to someone's face. You know,
that's a pretty good legacy to leave, right there. Lori Beachman, Well,
thank you everybody. Listen. Next week special show a conversation
(54:22):
with Lyle Menendez. He of course is serving a life
without the possibility of parole sentence in prison and he's
been in there for thirty four years, and we talk
about his case, about the new evidence and about the
habeas that's been filed to try to get resentencing for
(54:43):
manslaughter instead of what they got, which was life without
the possibility of parole. Lyelmanz next week. Don't miss it.
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