Allyson Felix - How to Handle Pressure, Failure, and Reinvent Yourself as an Olympian - Post Run High

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
My first silver medal I was eighteen, but the second
one four years later, the weight of it felt different.
Two silver medals back to back. The biggest doubt was, like, can.

Speaker 2 (00:09):
I ever do this? Alistin Felix is the most decorated
track and filled athlete of full time, eleven Olympic medals,
A torn ligament before the Olympic Trials, a Nike policy
she forced to change.

Speaker 3 (00:19):
This episode is your blueprint for resilience, identity and fighting
for what's right. While you were going through this pregnancy
and deciding to talk about maternity publicly. Was that when
you found your voice.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
I didn't find my voice until I became a mother.

Speaker 1 (00:32):
Once you have the success and you have this bulls
eye on your back and everybody comes for you, it
is hard to stay at that level.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
You wrote a ap ed for The New York Times
calling out Nike's maternity policy.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
I was terrified because I knew Nike controlled. I was
blowing that up. Women would become pregnant, start families, and
they would be pushed out of the sport.

Speaker 3 (00:53):
How did you hide the fact that you're pregnant.

Speaker 1 (00:55):
I literally would go out to the track when it
was still dark. I know At some points I thought
it was about metals, and then it's been about impact.

Speaker 2 (01:01):
Be disappointed, be angry. That is what makes you great.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
Hi guys, Kate here. Thank you so much for tuning
in to today's conversation with Alison Felix. Your support helps
us continue growing the show. If you've been enjoying post
run high, please be sure to hit that follow button
and we will be right back after this short break.

(01:30):
Today we're sitting down with Alison Felix. She is the
most decorated track and field athlete of all time, as
well as powerhouse business woman and entrepreneur. Alison, I'm so
grateful to have you here today. You've done so much,
as I said on the run, not just to inspire
women and men, but you've really been a face of
female empowerment for women in and outside of the sport

(01:51):
of running. And now that you've had a little bit
of time off from being a professional athlete, how have
you navigated this new identity?

Speaker 1 (01:58):
Yeah, well, thank you so much for having me so
much fun to run with you. It's been interesting. You know,
I feel like I've had to do a lot of
identity work because you know, I've been an athlete all
my life, you know, I have been a runner for
you know, so much of it and so thinking about
who I am away from that it was really challenging.
And I heard it was, you know hard to retire,
and I always imagine that it was hard because of

(02:21):
you know, finding out your next thing, like career wise,
but I didn't think about, you know, the emotional side
of it and just the grief and the loss of
this thing that you've loved for so long. And so
I've had to you know, find my way and really
just take my time and work through it.

Speaker 3 (02:39):
Let's talk about the grief aspect.

Speaker 2 (02:41):
That's interesting.

Speaker 1 (02:42):
I you know, I don't really remember hearing from any
of my friends on this side of it. You know,
I had heard a lot about the other parts of
it that were hard, you know, just you know, work
or figuring out, you know, your next kind of passion move,
but I don't really remember having a conversation with anyone
around loss or grief.

Speaker 2 (03:02):
And I think that's truly what it was.

Speaker 1 (03:04):
It was waking up and no longer having you know,
the structure of training and this big, ambitious goal to
go after every single day, and everything looked different. I
loved what I was doing in the work I was doing,
but it did not have that same fulfillment that you know,
reaching a goal as you know, concrete, as running and

(03:27):
as track and field gave me.

Speaker 3 (03:29):
Right, And it's like, you don't have this added pressure
in your life, right, It's like kind of like now
when you're training, you're obviously training to feel your best
and look your best, but it's a different type of pressure.

Speaker 2 (03:41):
It's so weird, you know.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
It's It's interesting though, because I also was so ready.

Speaker 2 (03:46):
You know, I.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
Felt very blessed to have such a long career and
I didn't have regrets, Like I felt really excited for
the next chapter. So I think that was also more
unexpected to feel this loss, and I knew I was
ready and excited for what was to come as well.

Speaker 3 (04:03):
I give you so much credit for being a professional
athlete for so many years, because I feel like that's
equally as hard on the psyche, right, because you're constantly,
especially as you get older, you have to set new
goals for yourself. You have to put in like infiltrating,
there's new structures, right, there's new recovery practices that you
have to implement.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
It is.

Speaker 1 (04:19):
I mean, I think it's it's so much fun when
you're new and you're fresh and there are no expectations
and you're coming in, you're taking names. You know, that
side of it is very exciting. But once you have
the success and you have this you know, bulls eye
on your back and everybody you know comes for you,
it is hard to stay at that level and you

(04:41):
know not to have any fall off and of course
everyone is navigating you know, injuries and things like that.
But I do as you know, athletes who are able
to stay in the game for so long, I think
it's it's really special and also, you know, really fortunate
as well. A lot of times we're not able to
make those choices just dealing with health.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
So I think it's, yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (05:02):
Rare, and it's nice knowing too that, you know, guys,
we just went on a run right before this, right
before sitting down. We you know, did a little warm
up jog a couple of blocks or a couple laps
around the block. And I loved finding out that running
is still a big thing in your life and you
still are training, you know, you do track workouts, which
is the most impressive thing to me. I think that's

(05:22):
the first thing I would give up. I'd be like,
no more track workouts.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
See, I only do track workouts. I have no long run.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
So it's all about intervals for me. And I don't know.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
I to me like being on a track by myself,
like when it's quiet, there's something that just makes me,
that just makes me happy, and something about the solitude
and pushing my body. I love to just you know,
see what it can do. And so yeah, I hope
that I'll always hold on to that.

Speaker 3 (05:51):
I think you will. I think you will, because you know,
there are so many cases of professional athletes once they're
done with a sport nite and have found it with
you know, maybe not professional athletes, but a lot of
my friends played college sports, and after you know, ending
that sport, whether it be in college or maybe professionally,
a lot of people like step away from activity for
a little bit and have to find their way back.

(06:11):
Did you have a moment post retiring where you were like,
I'm going to take a little break from training so
hard and a break from running.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
I definitely did.

Speaker 1 (06:18):
I definitely felt like I needed some space from just
track and field as a whole, and I felt like
I needed to just take a breath, and I did
different things, like I started like playing tennis and doing
some pilates and and then I just found that, you know,
I wasn't.

Speaker 3 (06:35):
You know that like hurt so good, you know, like, yeah,
I was gonna say, I'm like, I cannot imagine going
from being a professional track and field athlete to then
doing a pilates class. You're probably like, what is this?

Speaker 2 (06:45):
It just doesn't hit the same.

Speaker 1 (06:48):
So I had to get back to what I know
and and also that it's okay, like it's unusual, you know,
to go to a track and to do track workouts
you know, runs or you know, much more of the thing.
But knowing like, oh no, this is what makes me
feel good. And you know, that's what I'm gonna stick with.

Speaker 3 (07:07):
What itch is tennis scratching for you.

Speaker 1 (07:11):
You know, it's super humbling, and I love that you
run for a long time and you don't realize it.
And I think that's the only way I'm going to
like keep going at that phase.

Speaker 2 (07:20):
So that's been enjoyable.

Speaker 3 (07:22):
Yeah, I feel like it's also fun to keep that
competitive spirit alive a little bit.

Speaker 2 (07:25):
Yes, yes, I do love that part.

Speaker 1 (07:27):
Of it, but I'm not quite good enough to, like,
you know, really go after it, so I gotta keep practicing.

Speaker 3 (07:32):
Tennis is hard, it's very hard.

Speaker 2 (07:35):
It's deceiving. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
Yeah, my mom started playing tennis in her adult life
and she's so into it now. She plays like every
paddle sport and it's been so fun to see her,
you know, stay competitive at that level and also like
get her cardio workouts in literally through tennis, because she's
not somebody that will go do a track worker or
work out or go for a run. But yeah, it's
it's great. It's also a good way to stay social

(07:57):
and like play with other ladies exactly.

Speaker 1 (07:59):
And I want to my daughter to play, and so
I figured like, okay, I need to know how to
play this game.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
No, seriously, I feel the same. We're having a girl,
and I'm like, she's gonna be a little tennis player
because that's such a fun sport. It's like my favorite,
one of my favorite sports to watch.

Speaker 2 (08:14):
Professionally, I love it as well.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
And then one day, you know, be able to play
together and I think that's just a beautiful thing.

Speaker 3 (08:20):
Okay, So we are currently in Los Angeles. You're a
Angela's native. Right you grew up here?

Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (08:25):
Okay, So I want you to take us back to
the environment that shaped you. Who was young Allison? And
when did you find track and field? So?

Speaker 2 (08:34):
Yes, I'm an Angelino.

Speaker 1 (08:36):
I grew up in my neighborhood so right here, just
doing pretty regular things, playing with our neighbors, up and
down the street, playing basketball, just a very normal childhood.
And then when I was in high school, I was
at a new school and I didn't really know anyone,
and my family encouraged me to go out for the
track team. My brother, he was at another high school,

(08:59):
and he was already run. He's two years older than me,
and he was doing really well. So it made sense
for them to, you know, to push me in that direction,
and I did, and I just I fell in love
with it, and I also found those friends.

Speaker 2 (09:11):
Also.

Speaker 3 (09:12):
I like that you said you're an Angelino. Yes? Is
that what people call themselves in Los Angeles? Ye?

Speaker 2 (09:17):
That before? Yeah, I'm like, okay, we.

Speaker 3 (09:19):
Are with the true native guys. I'm learning the slangy
so funny. How quickly did you realize you were good?

Speaker 1 (09:27):
I always knew that I was like an athletic, you know,
because from growing up in my neighborhood, you know of
race the boys, and you know, I my brother was
just like had no mercy on me, and so he
just never let me win in anything.

Speaker 2 (09:41):
So I always like felt that.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
But I would say, like, you know, early once I started,
then I saw like the potential. That first year I
started doing really well, and I was like, Okay, maybe
this could be my thing.

Speaker 3 (09:55):
Were there any events that you tried out in high
school that you immediately were like, that's not for me.

Speaker 1 (10:00):
I already knew that I was like a sprinter, so
there was like no question in my mind. I don't
ever remember like having to run a longer distance, but
that was just like what was fun to me. And
I do remember like during cross country season, they would
have all the track kids run across country, and I
was so against it that I actually did the stats

(10:22):
for the cross country team just to like not have
to run.

Speaker 3 (10:25):
So that's a thing I remember even in you know,
I did cross country for a couple of years when
I was in high school. But I remember even in college,
I like walked onto the cross country team for a year,
which maybe it lasted maybe like three weeks. Don't look
at to my stats. Guys, it was. But I remember
like knowing that the kids not only did cross country,

(10:45):
but they also did winter track and spring track.

Speaker 2 (10:48):
Yeah, so it's it. Yeah, it's it's a thing. Yeah
for sure.

Speaker 3 (10:51):
What mistakes in the sports did you have to make
before finding your groove?

Speaker 1 (10:56):
Oh gosh, I think really just like understand understanding training,
you know, was one thing. I remember, like, you know,
just sprinting everything and then realizing, oh, there's like you
have to pace and you have to kind of do
things like that, and just some of the things that
you know when you start running track and you've never

(11:17):
done it before, like how to use the blocks, like
just very basic things. Everything was new to me and
I was starting a bit later, so I had to
kind of figure out all that stuff.

Speaker 3 (11:27):
Would you credit your high school coach with a lot
of that early success?

Speaker 1 (11:30):
Absolutely, I mean he was awesome. He was, you know,
essentially a volunteer coach who was not an expert by
any means, but he had a passion.

Speaker 2 (11:40):
He was always.

Speaker 1 (11:41):
You know, reading, wanting to learn, and so he really
you know, went above and beyond for me. And yeah,
I'm really grateful that he laid that foundation and.

Speaker 3 (11:51):
It was did you start out with winter track or
spring track?

Speaker 2 (11:54):
I guess it was springtrack.

Speaker 3 (11:55):
Yeah, and within four years, you you know, weren't just
one of the best in high school, but you were
basically the best on a world level, right, like one
of the top runners. Yeah, So what do you remember
what that experience was like for your peers?

Speaker 1 (12:09):
You know, it was all such a whirlwind, because it's like,
you know, I from coming out, you know, and then
to making my first Olympic team, it all happened so fast.

Speaker 3 (12:18):
You know.

Speaker 1 (12:19):
People were really kind to me, and when I look back,
I'm like, that was probably really hard to see this
high school girl and just the different dynamics. You know,
you have professional runners, you know, people who are it's
their livelihood. And so I'm really grateful for to have
a lot of amazing friends that I've had, you know,
throughout my entire career who were really patient with me,

(12:40):
like took me under their wing and were just really
nice when I was this, you know, really shy girl
who was jumping into a professional sport where people were
significantly older than me.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
So you were seventeen years old, you made the decision
to go professional rather than competing at the NCAA level.
What was that decision like for you?

Speaker 1 (12:59):
Yeah, yeah, I mean it was a really hard decision
and it was one that we made as a family.
I had already signed at USC and I was really
excited to compete there. My brother was there, but then
you know, when I had like so much success in
the Olympics, we're going to be the next year. It
was really my brother kind of shedding a light on

(13:19):
the collegiate system and just saying like it was really
just like blunt with me, like you know, if you
come to SC you you know you're n Cuba's comes
first and you're gonna have to do you know, all
the events, get all the points, and if you want
to make the Olympic team, you know it's probably going
to be easier to go pro and just focus on that.
And so yeah, it was we made it because of

(13:42):
that essentially, and my family everybody was really supportive. My
parents just had like one rules like you're still going
to school and you're still going to graduate, but but yeah,
they you know, they were on the journey with me.

Speaker 3 (13:54):
And when you go pro with that age and specifically
in running, what is the process for it, Like does
it mean that you're just you know, at the level
where you're competing in certain tournaments, or did you sign
with a specific brand.

Speaker 1 (14:05):
Yeah, so at that time, I signed with Adidas, and
I was the first in the US. No one had
ever gone pro before in track and field from high
school and so it was kind of like uncharted territory.
But yeah, I signed with Ididas, and basically, you know,
I had to forego my collegiate eligibility and then I
went to the pro circuit and you know, the races

(14:27):
were overseas, and yeah, I started to do that while
also being a college student.

Speaker 3 (14:33):
What was that mentally like for you? Knowing that you
were the first person to do that?

Speaker 1 (14:39):
You know what, I think I just underestimated it, I think.
And I chalked that up to being seventeen, because I
think I thought it was going to be like high school.
You go to school, then you go to practice and
like it's all great, and just you know, being on
that level and the travel and also just getting to
USC and realizing, wow, this is really difficult and not

(15:00):
having the resources as a student athlete, and so the
first year was extremely rocky and I was trying to
figure it out. And it was you know, it showed
and then eventually I you know, I found my groove
and I was able to excel. But it was really
hard at the beginning.

Speaker 3 (15:17):
Because you were managing classes all while being a pro
athlete exactly. Oh wow, So you didn't take like a
gap year or anything.

Speaker 2 (15:22):
I didn't.

Speaker 1 (15:23):
I just power through, and you know, I would go
compete and then I would you know, be on the
road and maybe not be able to take a final
or something, and trying to explain to my professor as
you know, well, I'm I'm going to race, but they're like,
but You're not on the team, and it didn't quite
make sense. And so there wasn't you know, there wasn't
really that support there until we really tried to figure

(15:44):
it out later on.

Speaker 3 (15:45):
Yeah, and then I'm sure it's also like that community
aspect when you're at school. It is kind of nice
to have your teammates that are also on the track
and field team kind of banding behind you. Did you
feel like were you able to connect with some of
the girls on the ENDC on the USC team.

Speaker 1 (16:00):
I think that was another thing that was really challenging
for me, is that, you know, I was going to
sc you know, as you know, I was going to
be on the team, and so when I made the
decision to go pro, I went from you know, gonna
be in the dorms, you know, with you know, these people,
these friends that I was coming in with, to then
all of a sudden having a different situation, you know,

(16:21):
not having that camaraderie and not having you know, that
team atmosphere going. And then I was training by myself,
and so it went from you know, just the excitement
to being a part of something then to being like
really lonely and also navigating all these new things. So
when I look back, that's probably the one thing that
I still get a little bit sad about, is like

(16:44):
just not having been on the team.

Speaker 3 (16:46):
Right, It's almost like you will always wonder a little
bit like what would it have been?

Speaker 1 (16:50):
Like yeah, yeah, I mean I'm so grateful I was
able to do, you know, what I wanted to do
as far as my goal in the Olympics, But then
I for sure you know that was on the other
side of it, is missing out in that part.

Speaker 3 (17:02):
Right, So paint the picture for us, because you're living
on campus in the dorms.

Speaker 1 (17:06):
Well, I wasn't I was supposed to, and then when
I went pro, I couldn't live, you know, I couldn't
live you know, I was in the athlete dorm before
and then so then I got an apartment with my brother,
like off campus.

Speaker 3 (17:18):
Okay, so you and your brother are really close.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
We are. What's the age difference, he's two and a
half years older.

Speaker 3 (17:23):
Okay, I love that. I'm also super close with my brothers.
And having a supportive brother is a game changer, it is. Yeah,
especially somebody like your brother that seems like he believed
in your career so early on.

Speaker 1 (17:34):
Yeah, he's always been just an ally, you know, and
a supporter, and he's that classic big brother who has
always really taken care of me. And so then became
business partners and yeah, it's just a joy to get to,
you know, build together and do a lot of fun
things together.

Speaker 3 (18:00):
How did you deal with the instant global expectations that
you had at seventeen years old?

Speaker 1 (18:06):
You know, I put a lot of big expectations on myself,
but I definitely felt that way and I didn't always
deal with it great. I remember, you know, my second Olympics,
really feeling the pressure of it and really being disappointed
that it didn't go the way that I wanted to.
I was a favorite, I didn't win, and it was

(18:27):
I was embarrassed. I was It was just it was
really hard and so I think it took some like
trial and error to figure out, you know, how do
I manage pressure? And eventually I was able to, you know,
to understand how to kind of focus on my own
goals and not what everybody else expects and the sponsors

(18:48):
and all these things, but really stay in the zone
of my training and my circle and who I'm listening
to as well.

Speaker 3 (18:55):
And how do you do that, Like, how do you
manage that outside pressure? What were some of the tactics
that you learn earned?

Speaker 1 (19:00):
Yeah, I started to just try to listen to my team,
so you know, the people that I trust and respected,
so my coach, my family, my friends, you know, all
of the people who if they had something to say,
I knew it had my best interests in mind, and
block out like, you know, the noise of whether it's

(19:20):
a commentator or you know, people who are doing their jobs,
but their job is also to be critical and not
listening to that and it's really challenging and especially you
know in this day and age with social media and
all of those things, but really being firm on my boundaries.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
Yea. I mean I mentioned that I had had Gabby
Thomas on and actually when we were on a run together,
she was like in this fiery kind of Twitter situation.
It wasn't I mean, fiery is an exaggeration, Like it
was something was going on on Twitter where she was
getting kind of chirped and just like, how are you
chirping this gold medalist? It's like, these people that will
never achieve the same level of success that you have
achieved are criticizing you exactly. How do you deal with

(20:00):
that as an athlete?

Speaker 1 (20:02):
Yeah, I think it is really hard because the accessibility
that people have to you, you know, it's like never before.

Speaker 2 (20:09):
And I think it's easy.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
I think it's human, you know, to for those things
to get to you sometimes, you know, and it's just
like it's just natural. But I think it is, like,
you know, it's it's realizing putting the boundaries up if
and everyone's different. You know, some people thrive off of
that and it helps them like go harder, and some
people it's best for them not to see that. And
so I think it's like being understanding to what works

(20:32):
for you and if it's not reading comments or you know,
not having an app on your phone or whatever, it
is making those changes so that you can perform your
best right.

Speaker 3 (20:42):
And your first Olympics was two thousand and four, right
in Athens, So I'm curious, like, what was commentary and
criticism like then, and then how did it compare to
fast forward to twenty twenty y're in Tokyo.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah, A criticism like at the very beginning was very
much so like on TV, like you know, a commentator,
you know, having an opinion or a buzz around. I
remember like chat rooms were a thing and like message
boards and you know, that's how people were communicating. And then,

(21:14):
you know, around my next Olympics, social media was very
much so a thing and obviously not what it is today,
but it was. It was prevalent and people had opinions
and everyone could have access them and everyone could say,
you know something and you could see it and that
would have an effect, you know, and so it was
making sure like Okay, who am I going to listen

(21:37):
to and whose voice really matters?

Speaker 3 (21:39):
Yeah, And when you were you know, seventeen eighteen, were
there any older women that maybe were teammates or people
that you competed against that were mentors for you.

Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:50):
I mean I consider her one of my closest friends,
Joanna Hayes, and but she's also been that person in
my life who has done everything before.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
You know.

Speaker 1 (22:00):
She in two thousand and four, she won a gold
medal in the in the hundred hurdles, and I was
competing that night as well. I got my silver medal,
and I remember like watching her compete, and I remember
her getting her gold medal, and I was like, I
want to do that. And you know, we eventually went
on to train together and become friends and just kind

(22:22):
of go through life together.

Speaker 2 (22:23):
And she had her.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
Kids before me, and she's just that constant in my
life where you know, I can ask her things, but
also we support each other and it's a really special friendship.
And I'm grateful that she was willing to kind of
take me under her wing and yeah, and be my
friend from the beginning.

Speaker 3 (22:41):
And it's important because I feel like, also the reputation
that track and field gets right at any level is
that it's an individual sport. But I think what's so
refreshing to hear from somebody like yourself, a professional athlete,
is that you know, it really is a community sport
and it's all about surrounding yourself with the right team members,
the right coaches, and then the right people that can

(23:02):
also serve as mentors in your life.

Speaker 2 (23:04):
Yeah, I agree so much.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
I think when I look at you know, when I
was in my peak and my training group, it was
such a big part of my success and just the
way that we supported each other.

Speaker 2 (23:15):
And it is a team.

Speaker 1 (23:16):
You have a coach and you have you know, all
these people who allow you to be able to get
to the line where yes, you're there by yourself, but
when you go back and look at the training you know,
there's there's literally a team around you.

Speaker 3 (23:29):
So you mentioned earlier that when you I don't know
exactly which Olympics you were referring to, but you know,
there's been a couple Olympics where you've gotten silver rather
than that gold. And I had interviewed Grant Holloway before
the Paris Olympics and he was talking about coming back
to Paris wanting that gold because he had gotten silver
in the last Olympics. And I was so shocked to

(23:51):
hear that getting silver as an athlete is a big disappointment.

Speaker 2 (23:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:58):
Yeah, it's something that can be hard to understand, you know,
as if you're not an athlete, or it's just because
you also want to be you are. You are grateful,
you know, it's this huge accomplishment, but when you are
elite and when you are going after a gold medal,
that is what you're thinking about every single day, and

(24:18):
that's what you're working towards. And to miss that mark
and have to wait four years, you know again for
the opportunity that's not guaranteed, it's really hard.

Speaker 2 (24:29):
And I remember, you know, my first.

Speaker 1 (24:32):
Silver medal, I was eighteen, but the second one four
years later, the weight of it felt different because it
was like, there are the expectations, you know, people, you know,
I was supposed to be this phenom and you know
it was supposed to just be a given that this happened,
and when it didn't, it felt like everything was falling apart.
And I also think as an athlete at that level,

(24:54):
you are so that is your world and so you're
unable to step out of that. And now, you know,
being retired, I'm able to really kind of put things
in perspective. But I wasn't able to do that when
I was competing, and it just felt like I'm not
okay in life without you know, when when everything doesn't

(25:15):
go the way that I had hoped right.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
And I feel like we're even witnessing this now with
the Winter Olympics going on, and I think a lot
of people have really closely been following some of the
snowboarders and some of the figure skaters. Again these more
individual individual sports where they're getting silver and not gold,
and there is all that disappointment around it. So can
you almost paint the picture for us of when you're
in that arena, surrounded by thousands of people watching you race,

(25:39):
and you get a silver you know, you know you
just came in second place. What are the emotions going
through your mind? What are like the sounds that you're hearing?
Like where are you at?

Speaker 1 (25:49):
For me, it was just like this devastation. You know,
it's you cross the line and you know, you know
immediately you know you didn't do it. You know you
did not this moment that there has been so much
attention around and also you know, not only from like
an athletic point of view, but like business wise, like
these two weeks. This is where you earn, this is

(26:11):
where you know your career is set up. And I
just remember feeling crushed and then you know, physically figuring
out like how do I even get off of the track?
You know you have to do a victory lap? And
I remember, you know, going to do my victory lap
and spotting my family and going over to them and

(26:32):
just falling in their arms and just feeling like I
almost couldn't even stand, like they were holding me up.
And then you know, making my way off and finding
my coach and kind of the process like of falling
apart over and over and then realizing, you know, this
is going to take some time to work through this,
and then you get to the point where it's like, Okay,

(26:52):
how do I pick up the pieces?

Speaker 2 (26:53):
How do I rebuild?

Speaker 3 (26:54):
Like?

Speaker 1 (26:55):
Is this something that I want to continue to go after?

Speaker 3 (26:58):
And when you got silver, there's another athlete that stands
out to me, Veronica Campbell. Brown's who you lost to
in some of those instances, right, So I would imagine
that the amount of mutual respect that you guys have
for each other is massive. Yeah, what did you learn
from her in that moment that you took with you
as maybe your inspiration into like the next the next Olympics.

Speaker 1 (27:20):
Yeah, I mean, she's such a she was such a
fierce competitor, and I knew, you know, when we raced,
you know, I would have to push myself beyond my best.

Speaker 2 (27:30):
And I think what I took away.

Speaker 1 (27:34):
Just from those losses was that, you know, I have
to continue to work, you know, I have to continue
to push myself. And I think it also just made
me understand that, you know, maybe I wasn't ready in
that moment, and you know, how can I look at
the situation and how can I get better and how
can I come back and you know, try again. And

(27:56):
you know, sometimes also it's life that things are not
going to come together. You know, you can do everything
possible and it may not you know, work out for you.
And I think it's also that understanding of saying, if
I give my all, if I've done all the things,
like that is enough. And I think sometimes, especially for me,
I think I really tied up my worth and my

(28:17):
value in the result of the race. And that's where
I really struggled. And it wasn't until I was able
to really you know, separate those two things where I
was able to understand that I can have you know,
I can put it all out there and be disappointed,
but I still am enough and I still, you know,
have that value in that those two things are not

(28:38):
the same.

Speaker 3 (28:39):
And it's also anyone's race on that day. Yeah, which
is the hardest thing. It's like that's one race, but
it's like, give me another race and who knows the
results could be different.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (28:47):
Yeah, it's it's the sport and it's I think it's
what we love about racing, and you know, competition and
you know, who can perform under the pressure, it's part
of it, but it is you know, you never know
what day is going to hold.

Speaker 3 (29:01):
And as Olympic athletes, you guys do get so good
at performing under pressure. Like how do you get so
good at it? Is? Their compartmentalization involved visualization, like how
are you preparing to step up onto those blocks?

Speaker 1 (29:14):
Yeah, for me, it was a combination of things. I
think it was failing, you know, it was figuring it out.
It was like, Okay, I think this works for me,
and then I get there and it doesn't, and then
it was I was very much so into visualization. It
was just the reps, like putting in the reps and
I would log all my workouts, I would write it
all down, and you know, before the big race, I

(29:35):
would go and review, you know, look at everything I've done.
It was like, I haven't cut any corners. I'm I
find my confidence in the preparation and I've done it.
So now this should be the fun part to execute it.
And yes, execution is hard, but it's way harder to
do the training day in and day out, and so
it's about really just okay, now it's time to put

(29:56):
it together.

Speaker 3 (29:57):
The discipline in knowing that you didn't cut any corners,
because how many of us, you know, set up, set
out for a goal, right whether it's running a marathon
or settying for a test, And we're like, you know,
if we just do all of these things, if we
hit all of these you know, smaller goals that then
lead up to that bigger goal, we'll be great on
you know, game day, test day, whatever it may be.
But it's so human for us to cut corners. But

(30:20):
when you're competing at that level, there are no corners
that can be cut.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
There aren't any corners that can be cut. But I
think there also is there's rest and there's recovery. And
I think that's really important because I don't know, our
culture really celebrates this grind and you know, this mentality
of no days off, and I think it is the
understanding of like no rest is built into the program
and so I had to learn that as well. I

(30:44):
used to, like early on, my coach would give me
like an off day and I would sneak and like
go do like hills or like go do some extra training.
And then I was like, oh wait, I'm actually like
hurting myself in the long run, like I'm not setting
myself up to, you know, to be successful in doing this.
And it's really saying, Okay, I need to buy into

(31:05):
this plan completely, and there's the days where you're not
going to feel it and you give yourself grace and yes,
you might go through the motions and still get it done,
but I think it's understanding that you know, it's not
all going to be perfect training.

Speaker 3 (31:19):
Yeah, And I completely agree, And I think that's why
like training regimens are so important to follow and those
rest days are so key, and even cross training, right,
like how big was cross training for you guys?

Speaker 2 (31:30):
You know what, It's so funny.

Speaker 1 (31:31):
We would take about, you know, six weeks off after season,
and I didn't really do cross training. I you know,
now that I look back, I'm like, why didn't I
do that? But we I would, you know, just go
completely away from the track. And it was really great
for my mind and I felt refreshed. And I was
also very young and you know, all of those things.

(31:53):
But you know, as I've gotten older, I think it's
much more important and just yeah, crucial to longevity as well.

Speaker 3 (32:00):
Yeah, taking time away. It's so funny that you say that. Sweet.
Interviewed Channon Loketty this year right before the New York
City Marathon and I was asking her, and Channon Lookketty
for anybody that doesn't know, she won the Boston Marathon
in twenty twenty five, so incredible long distance runner. And
I said to her, I was like, what are you
most excited for after this race? And she was like,
I'm just so excited to like go on vacation and
watch watch shows. Yeah, like, I'm so excited to like

(32:22):
bind this new TV show. And I loved it so
much because one of my favorite quotes I ask everybody
on runs, you know, what is a quoter model that
you live by. And I had this not professional runner,
but great runner on my show, and she said to me,
in the context of running, but it can be applied
to anything. Is you can't be one hundred percent all
the time. And I just loved that so much because
I feel like when you're we're younger, especially if we

(32:44):
like to run, it's like you just want to be
your fastest all the time. You know, feel your best,
perform your best, get the fastest, have the fastest pace, whatever.
But it is just such a cool quote to live by.

Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, I love that too. Yeah, it was my favorite thing.

Speaker 1 (32:56):
Like every season I would I would spend the season
like thinking about where my vacation was going to be
and like planning it and then you know, you get
to that moment and yes, it is like eating the
things you want and yeah, watching the show is not
having to follow this like regiment.

Speaker 2 (33:10):
I think it's really important to like be refreshed.

Speaker 3 (33:13):
How nice is it going on that vacation though, knowing
that you won gold.

Speaker 2 (33:16):
Yeah, it's way better. It's way better, way better.

Speaker 3 (33:29):
Did you ever feel like you weren't ready for a race? Oh?

Speaker 2 (33:33):
Absolutely?

Speaker 1 (33:34):
Yeah, it comes to mine in twenty sixteen, I had
some injuries and I had a really bad ankle injury
and it happened two months before the Olympic trials, and
I tore the ligaments in my ankle and I immediately
after I couldn't even walk, And so I was like
in the pool on the bike and did what I could.

Speaker 2 (33:56):
Olympic trials came.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
I had no professional races under my belt and kind
of just went out there extremely like taped up and.

Speaker 2 (34:04):
Was able to get it done.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
But I absolutely wasn't ready, Like you know, I talked
about my training log and doing the work and when
you don't have the work, and also you don't have
the confidence and so it's it's not the ideal situation.
And so I've definitely had those races where I wasn't ready.

Speaker 3 (34:22):
And how did your pace compare to maybe pre injury.

Speaker 1 (34:26):
I wasn't one hundred percent for sure, but it was enough,
Like it was enough, you know, I made the team.

Speaker 2 (34:34):
I did well. I of course I would have loved
to have felt better.

Speaker 1 (34:38):
And I didn't make the team in the two hundred
meters and that was like really disappointing for me. But
in the grand scheme of what I was able to
do essentially on one leg.

Speaker 2 (34:49):
You know, I made the most of it.

Speaker 3 (34:51):
Oh my god. The other girls that are like not
injured are probably like this woman comes in kicks our
butts with like literally with one ankle. That's out so impressive.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
You know, it was a lot of therapy.

Speaker 3 (35:03):
But yeah, and what race was that? What Olympic Trials
was that?

Speaker 1 (35:06):
Leading up to twenty sixteen? Okay, yeah, Lou leading up
to Rio? The Rio Games?

Speaker 3 (35:11):
And how did you end up performing at Rio?

Speaker 2 (35:13):
I got a silver medal.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
And it's funny because now you know, I've talked to
my coach about it and he's like, you know, I
really think it's one of your most impressive races. He
was like, you know, no one would know that because
they didn't know the ins and outs of, you know,
of what we had to do to get there. But
all things considered, he was really impressed with, you know,
how we how we were able to recovery, how we

(35:37):
were able to recover. And he talks about a lot,
you know, like it's easy to do it when everything
is perfect, but you know, can you do it when
the circumstances are less than ideal?

Speaker 3 (35:46):
Right? And oftentimes they're going to be less than ideal.

Speaker 2 (35:49):
That's just the way it goes, right. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (35:51):
I think it's so impressive the discipline that you guys have,
you know, like, and it's really the cool thing about
running is you have to be so disciplined in the
sport to be able to achieve the level of success
that you guys achieve, and that just applies so well
to so many different areas of your life.

Speaker 2 (36:07):
It does.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
Yeah, I think it's that's why I really love and
I love for you know, I always encourage kids to
play sports because I think it really teaches that discipline
and it does. It doesn't matter, you know, what you
go on to do in life, it applies. I can't
think of how many times I go back to just
the athletic background and pushing through and not giving up

(36:29):
and dealing with setbacks like that's just you know, as
as athletes, as runners, like, that's a part of the game,
right and when you take that, you know, to life,
to business to work, that's you know, it's really a
benefit for you.

Speaker 3 (36:43):
Yeah, and you know, I'm curious, you know, for your
advice to other young athletes right now that are maybe
dealing with their first Olympic trials or they're you know,
they're in the Winter Olympics and it didn't go as planned, Like,
what is your advice to them?

Speaker 1 (36:55):
My advice is to first let yourself feel all the things,
like be disip point and be angry, like that is
what makes you great, that's what makes you special, and
those emotions are valid. It means that you care. And
then once you have your moment, and once you've done that,
be motivated, like you can absolutely do whatever the big

(37:17):
goal is. Learn from, you know, from how it went,
you know, take the positives away and keep building and
then go after it again.

Speaker 3 (37:25):
So we've talked about preparation and reading over the training
that you've done before entering the Olympic arena. What does
visualization look like like, what are you visualizing before a race?
And maybe also if you could talk about what people
get wrong about visualization.

Speaker 1 (37:41):
For me, my visualization is all about the perfect race
and so it is literally running through that race in
my mind. Everything from how I'm feeling standing in front
of the blocks, my position in the blocks, you know,
how I'm coming out of them, what I'm doing at
every point in race at ten meters at twenty meters
and it's really slowing the race down in my mind

(38:05):
and playing it over and doing that over and over again.
And I think, you know, what people might get wrong
is like just thinking it's not effective or just not
taking the time to really do it. And I think
it's I look at it almost as like practice. It's
like getting those reps in and if I'm able to
like see it, it's going to be easier to do it.

(38:26):
And I think it's one of those things you kind
of just have to you have to do, and you
have to also be disciplined to continue to do it
to see the results.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
And how early does visualization start?

Speaker 2 (38:37):
And you know, I think you can start it at
any point. Yeah, you know.

Speaker 1 (38:40):
I found it, you know, early on in my career
where it was like a part of my routine, like
a part of my training. Like, you know, if I
was gonna whatever the workout was that day, I was
making sure that at least one point in that workout,
I'm going to visualize my actual race and what it
looks like.

Speaker 3 (38:57):
And then when it comes to like the technical things
that you're doing. I've talked to long distance runners about this,
but I've never talked to sprinters about this, and when
it comes to long distance running. I talked to you know,
a great marathon or ultra marathon or that said, he's,
you know, he's like what I guess it's called like
drifting or draft Yeah, is that the word?

Speaker 2 (39:16):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (39:16):
He's like drafting.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
I know what you mean.

Speaker 3 (39:18):
Right, he's like behind somebody else running, he's kind of
like focused on who's the fastest person during the race
that he can kind of pace himself with. So there's
strategies that we've heard before with long distance running, but
what are the strategies in a race with sprinting? Like,
what are the things that you're thinking about?

Speaker 1 (39:32):
Yeah, I mean the shorter that you're going, You're not
really going to have a strategy based on anyone else.
You know, it is about you, and it's about your mechanics,
and that's really more where your mind is. It's about
your you know, how am I coming out of the blocks?
You know, what are my angles? What are my positions?
And what am I doing? Because you're not going to
be able to adjust, you know, based on someone else.

(39:55):
You need to be running your top speed and you're
going to need to be.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
Able to hold that.

Speaker 1 (40:00):
Your mind might tell you to do something, you know,
I need to reach another gear, but if your body
can't do that, it doesn't matter. Once you get to
races like the four hundred, it is different because it
is a more strategic race, and you might be thinking about,
you know, your pace through two hundred meters and then
what you're going to do from that point forward, and
that might you know, you might have markers based on,

(40:22):
you know, what other athletes typical times are. It's something
like that, but pretty much it's about you and it's
about being able to execute your race, and more times
than not, it's mechanics based.

Speaker 3 (40:34):
Right, would you say that going into your races you
were very very familiar with the other athletes competing.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (40:41):
I was always very familiar with the athletes I was
competing against because for a lot of us, we grew
up in the sport, We grew up racing against each other,
and you always knew each other's strengths and weaknesses a lot,
or if someone was doing really well and you know,
having really fast times. So yeah, you're pretty you're generally
familiar with who you're racing against.

Speaker 3 (41:01):
What would you say was the perfect race for you.

Speaker 1 (41:04):
My best race was in twenty twelve the Olympic Trials
in Eugene. I ran my pr there and it was
just for me. It was a race I was really
proud of and felt just really beautiful.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
And set the scene for us, like what made it
a perfect race?

Speaker 1 (41:21):
The thing that made it a perfect race is probably
all the drama that was the twenty twelve Olympic Trials
For me. I ended up tying with my teammate in
the one hundred meters and then the two hundred meters
was at the end, and I was so like stressed,
I was so angry about the situation.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
It was.

Speaker 1 (41:41):
It was a hard Olympic Trials and I was so
determined when I got to that two hundred meters, I
was like, I am going to make this team. And
so I think it was the sheer just like, you know,
the sheer determination to get it done that really made
it like it was a you know, really commanding race.

Speaker 3 (41:58):
I'd say, because what happens when.

Speaker 1 (42:00):
You tie, what happens is in that instance, there there
were no rules. So because the top three make the
Olympic team, we tied at third place all the way
down where they couldn't separate it. They had no rules
in place, and they ended up giving us like options
like flipping a coin, one person conceding, or doing a rerun,

(42:24):
and so it was just not ideal and like, nobody
wants to make the Olympic team with you know, those
options on the table, and so it just became a
really stressful two weeks.

Speaker 2 (42:35):
And what did.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
You guys end up doing?

Speaker 2 (42:37):
We agreed to.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
Do a runoff, but then my teammate she at the
end she didn't feel right about it or she didn't
feel like her heart was in it, and she ended
up going home before the runoff, and so I ended
up with the spot.

Speaker 3 (42:50):
But it was, oh my god, They're like you could
rock paper scissor at this point.

Speaker 2 (42:54):
Yeah, it was. It was crazy.

Speaker 1 (42:56):
They literally told us week at flip a coin. But
it was really sad for me because we were also
training partners, and so I saw how much work she
put in day in and day out, and I just
didn't want it to end like that.

Speaker 3 (43:10):
And what is it like for somebody that you know,
gets the Olympic trials. It's like for four years, you
guys are training for that big moment, right because in
track and field. It's like the Olympics are your gold stage.
They're they're the big that's the biggest stage, right And
there's other very big tournaments that like the world that
people compete in, but it's really the Olympics is like
that gold standard.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
Yeah, so what is it.

Speaker 3 (43:29):
Like if you're you know, an athlete that's training for
the Olympic Trials, training for the Olympics, then you don't
get it.

Speaker 1 (43:35):
It's heartbreaking, you know, I when I watched the Olympic Trials.
You know, even now, it's like this mix of emotions
because for some people, their dreams are absolutely coming true
and it's the best day. And then if you look,
you know at fourth place every single race, you know,
usually someone is going to be in tears because that's

(43:58):
the place that doesn't make it. That's the first spot
where you're so close, and so it's hard. You know,
you've given in most cases, you've you've probably dedicated your
life to trying to reach this, and then it's the
reality hitting of you know, you came up short, and
now what do you do?

Speaker 2 (44:13):
You know, are you going to go back or you're
going to keep training?

Speaker 1 (44:16):
In For For a lot of people, you may not
have that possibility to continue on, and so it's it's
a it's a really tough spot.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
And the possibility to continue on is a literal thing
because it's like your contracts come down to your performance.

Speaker 1 (44:29):
Right, yes, yeah, your livelihood and so maybe this was
your last shot, or maybe you know you you have
to go and you're gonna get you know, a different job.
You know you you life goes on, and so it's
not like you have these endless possibilities and opportunities. So
it's it's a really yeah, it's a really hard thing
to go through, really.

Speaker 3 (44:48):
Hard thing to go through. And I think that's the
beautiful thing about social media now as you see so
many runners that maybe don't make it to that Olympic level,
but they're still able to compete be kind of running
content creators in like a in a more professional way,
right where they're really training and showing you there's regimens
and whatever.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:05):
I love that about running that you don't there's competition
at every single level, and I think the most beautiful
part of it is just community. You know, I get
to see that day in and day out, when you know,
based on the places I'm running and I think that's
always what brings.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
Runners most joy.

Speaker 1 (45:23):
You know. I love like all the different goals that
people have, everything from marathons to people competing in Masters
and to little kids. Like it's that's what really what
brings us together.

Speaker 3 (45:33):
Hey, to people like myself that are running well, pregnant
and interviewing.

Speaker 1 (45:36):
People that come on though, and that's a whole new
category category.

Speaker 3 (45:40):
It's not easy a lifestyle runners. Okay, when was the
time you doubted yourself the most in the sport?

Speaker 2 (45:48):
Oh, that's a good question.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
I've it would probably have been after my second Olympics,
you know, two silver medals back to back. I think
the biggest doubt was like can I ever do that?
Like will this ever be for me? Like I feel
like I'm doing all the right things, like I'm doing
the training, but like maybe I don't have the ability,
Maybe this isn't going to be for me, and and

(46:11):
so I definitely had that running through my mind. And
then I think that's where it's important to just be
conscious of how we talk to ourselves and what thoughts
were allowing we're giving energy to.

Speaker 2 (46:24):
You know, Yeah, I found that.

Speaker 3 (46:26):
It is so important and how do you get yourself
out of that negative mindset.

Speaker 1 (46:30):
It's really for me, it was about the people I
had around me, you know, because I could, I could
stay in a place where with negativity and you know,
poor self talk. But the people around me, you know,
they spoke life into me and they saw the vision
and they uplifted me when they saw that I needed it.
And to me, that's key, Like who who's around you?

(46:51):
And who are your people?

Speaker 3 (46:52):
Yeah, and looking back now you know, now you're the
most decorated track and field athlete of all time. Like
to be able to tell your younger self one thing,
like what would you say to that girl?

Speaker 2 (47:02):
Like embrace the failure, like it is a part of it.

Speaker 1 (47:05):
And you know, everybody wants to win all the time,
but more times than not, that's not going to be
your experience. And for me, I'm grateful, like I have
learned so much from the losses, from the defeats, Like
I feel like I'm a better person because I had
adversity and I had challenges. And it's not easy for everybody.
You know, it's you're not going to just have you

(47:25):
know that path, you know that easy path, and you
know that's what makes it, you know, a beautiful struggle,
and that's what adds to your story.

Speaker 3 (47:33):
Is there any athlete in the sport that has had
an easy path? Like did he have an easy path?

Speaker 2 (47:38):
I don't even mean.

Speaker 3 (47:40):
Or did he pay adversity?

Speaker 2 (47:41):
I'm sure he did.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
It looked, you know, he made it look easy, he
really did, and he made it look really fun.

Speaker 3 (47:46):
Yeah, the fast man. Is he still the tastest man
in the world. Yeah, let's go. I want to talk
about your final Olympics, the twenty twenty Olympics in Tokyo.

(48:09):
That was a monumental Olympics for you, right because you
were just coming off of pregnancy and getting back into
the sport. Talk to us about that.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
Yeah, it was. It was really challenging.

Speaker 1 (48:20):
You know, I had gone through so much before that Olympics.
You know, I had been in this battle around maternal rights.
You know, I left Nike, I started my shoes, my
shoe company, Seish, and I was a new mother and
so it was literally the pandemic, Like it was literally
like are you serious? Like there were so many things
that were going on, and I felt like, you know,

(48:44):
I had been told that I was too old and
that like now I was a mother and you couldn't
do both things, and so it was the constant like
fighting against all those things. And so to make that
team it was huge. And also for the first time,
I felt like it was less about the performance and
it was more about, Okay, I am showing women and

(49:06):
mothers and essentially people who had been told they couldn't
do something like that they can do it. And that
felt like such an honor and a privilege to be
that representation. And so it was for me it was
really like a full circle moment.

Speaker 3 (49:20):
I mean, it is a full circle moment. And this
is why, Like in the interro of this episode, I said,
you've really been a voice of empowerment for women specifically
because of this. And I feel like there's this term
in track and field and with running that people call
it the kiss of death, right when you become when
you get pregnant. Yeah, let's talk about that.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
Yeah, I think that had been the case for a
very long time. And you know, before my experience, there
are so many female athletes who struggled, you know, whose
stories were not told, who were under NDA's and for
a lot of women in the sport, like we knew
about this, like it was this thing that nobody was

(49:56):
talking about, you know, out in the open. But we
saw it like I had friends, I had teammates who
who went through things they should not have had to
go through. And so when it came to my situation,
I felt like I had the opportunity to say something.
And I didn't want to say anything, you know, I'm
that's not really my comfort zone. But I felt like

(50:18):
I had to. You know, there was women who have
paved the way for me to have the opportunity, and
now it was like, Okay, I stand on their shoulders,
and now it's time for me to do my part.
And it was really scary and I wasn't sure what
was on the other side of that. But in speaking up,
you know, and other you know, teammates speaking up as well,
we were able.

Speaker 2 (50:38):
To bring about change.

Speaker 1 (50:39):
And I look at the culture now, and I look at,
you know, the women who are in the sport and
who are having children in the peak and prime of
their career, and for so many of us, like that's
our wildest dreams, Like that's what it's all about. And
I absolutely love across sports that we have seen the
culture shift and there's still more to go, but you know,

(51:01):
women are doing it. They are having their careers and
they are becoming mothers, and it's it's beautiful to see.

Speaker 3 (51:09):
It is beautiful to see, and it's so unfair to
say to a woman that you need to put your
personal life on hold for your career.

Speaker 1 (51:16):
Absolutely, it's it should not happen, and it's happened for
far too long. And now you know, we're seeing these
amazing examples of women who are doing it like and
they're doing it exceptionally well. And that was always the case,
like they were always they always had the ability. But
when you're not supported through it, and when you had

(51:37):
to do like I hit my pregnancy, I trained at
four o'clock in the morning, you can't do it. It's
to the best of your ability when those are your circumstances.
But now to say like, okay, we are going to
tell these stories and we are going to support you
and you can have your best performances after having children.
I love that that's where we're at right now, and.

Speaker 3 (51:56):
I love that that's possible. Yeah, you know, and it
really shows that childbirth is a phase of your life,
but it doesn't have to be your entire identity. And
the biggest thing that I'm focused on right now is
running through pregnancy, right and not just physically running, but
really mentally running and knowing that, like I'm setting goals
for myself while I'm postpartum, you know, And we talked

(52:17):
about this on the run, but it's like, I really
want to run the New York City Marathon this year
and that's going to be really freaking hard to do.
But how cool will be to show women that you
can do that?

Speaker 1 (52:25):
Yes, and even if you know, whatever happens and if
you don't, it's about trying.

Speaker 3 (52:30):
To No, I'm going to do it. You are going
to do it, Alison. I can't tell you I'm going
to do it and then not do it.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
You're gonna do it.

Speaker 1 (52:36):
But also I think it's important for women to see
that it's about going for it. You know, it's about
trying and we don't always know the answer of what's
on the other end of that, but it's about saying
like I, yeah, I'm going to take ownership of that
and I'm going to go after this thing that's important
to me and we're going to see it through.

Speaker 3 (52:55):
How did you hide your training? Like, how did you
hide the fact that you're pregnant.

Speaker 1 (52:59):
It was like a really dark time. So I literally
would go out to the track when it was still dark.
And so that's how I did it. I I trained
when no one was out there. I wore baggy clothes.
I rarely ever left the house. The only time I
would leave the house was really to go train, you know.
And and yeah, and I just kind of pushed my

(53:22):
way through it. And it was sad because I I
wanted so badly to be a mother and I wanted
to do all the things like I wanted to, you know,
to show off the bump and to you know, have
the baby showers and you know, do all the celebrating
of it, and that wasn't my reality.

Speaker 3 (53:39):
It is hard because it's like having your first baby.
You don't get to do it again, yeah, you know,
when it really should be a time of celebration. And
also like again another empowerment moment, because it's like the
fact that you were training while pregnant is also so badass,
Like I like wish you could have showed that off
even more.

Speaker 1 (53:57):
I know, I when I look back at it does
make me sad because it's exactly what you said. You
don't get to do it again, and you know, to
have to do that to be able to secure a contract,
it just seems so silly.

Speaker 3 (54:11):
You wrote a op ed for The New York Times
calling out Nike's maternity policy. Let's talk about it.

Speaker 2 (54:16):
Yeah, I was really scared to do it.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
I was actually terrified because I'd always just been the athlete,
you know, head down, I did the work. I didn't
want to ruffle feathers. And so when I started to
go through this really difficult time, you know, with Nike
and asking for essentially, what I was asking for was
time to be able to recover from childbirth. So the
way track and field contracts are set up is their

(54:38):
performance bace. And so you go to the Olympics, you
go to World Championships, you get a bonus, you don't,
you get a reduction, but if you have a baby,
or if you're pregnant, there was nothing in place to
protect you. So essentially what was happening was women would
become pregnant, start families, and they would be pushed out
of the sport. They would eventually their salary would be
reduced to nothing and they would no longer you know,

(55:00):
be able to stay in it and so I asked
for you know, before writing this app op ED, I
asked for time to be able to recover, and eventually,
you know, I was told I could have the time,
and so I was like, oh, okay, great. But then
when the contract came back, there was no mention to
tie it to pregnancy, nothing about maternity. It was just
time granted to me. And so I learned that they

(55:22):
were not willing to set the precedent for all their
female athletes, and to me, that just you know, to
be such a large company and at the forefront, it
just didn't feel right. And so myself and other colleagues
started to talk about it, and I wrote that op
ED and and just shared you know, the battle that
we were having, you know, internally. And it was about

(55:44):
two and a half weeks after that op ED came
out that Nike and other companies as well, they changed
their policy and so today they offer eighteen months a
protection for their female athletes.

Speaker 3 (55:55):
That's amazing. It's so cool that you have such a
voice in this and you're such a voice for women.
And I said this before we started filming, but I
was listening to your ted talk earlier and I was
just so impressed by you and how well spoken you are.
Was it while you were going through this pregnancy and
postpartum and deciding to talk about maternity publicly, Was that
when you found your voice?

Speaker 2 (56:16):
Yeah, I did not.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
I feel like I didn't find my voice until I
became a mother and I had a traumatic birth experience.
I had severe preclampsia and I gave birth to my
daughter two months early. And I think only because I
went through both of these things simultaneously, this such a
hard battle around the maternal protections and then watching my

(56:41):
daughter fight in the NICU, I think seeing both of
those things happen together, it just pushed me to say, like,
I will not let my daughter's generation go through this fight,
like if I can talk about it. And I didn't
even expect anything to happen. It was just like I
can't stand by, and so yeah, that's what really led

(57:02):
me to finding my voice.

Speaker 3 (57:03):
Were you nervous at all about maybe something positive not happening,
but something negative happening to you for speaking out?

Speaker 1 (57:10):
Yes, I was terrified because I knew, you know, Nike
controlled so much of everything, and I knew like I
was blowing that up, and so I wasn't sure what
the consequences were, but I knew that they were real,
and I knew that I would face them.

Speaker 3 (57:25):
Like, really, hopefully this goes well.

Speaker 2 (57:27):
Literally, I was like, I yeah, I'm just I'm doing it.

Speaker 3 (57:31):
No, but it is so important and it's so cool
that you were able to say, like, Okay, this is
great for me that like on a personal level, they're
not taking x Y and Zu away from me because
of this.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
But like what about all the other girls exactly and
all the other you know, they were real women to
me because I had I knew them, like I knew
women who struggled, and I knew it wasn't right, and
I knew it had been happening for as long as
I enter the sport. And so if I didn't take
this moment, like how long is this going to go on?

Speaker 3 (57:58):
How soon after your pregnancy did the twenty twenty Olympics
come around?

Speaker 1 (58:04):
So it eventually it got postponed to twenty twenty one.
So I had my daughter in the end of twenty eighteen,
and then yeah, and then we moved to twenty twenty one.

Speaker 3 (58:15):
What was it like training post having a baby?

Speaker 1 (58:18):
It was very humbling, especially just because of the c
section and also our time in the NICU. I I
did the thing that you're not supposed to do. I
compared myself to everyone else who you know, had a
baby and had been a runner, and I was like,
I am going to have this baby and four weeks later,
I'm going to come back and I'm going to be
back to training.

Speaker 2 (58:39):
And that just wasn't my experience, you know.

Speaker 1 (58:41):
I was still I was in the hospital for you know,
over a week after I gave birth. My daughter was
in the hospital for a month. We were we were
living at the hospital, and so track was like the
furthest thing from my mind. It became you know, will
we live, you know, not will I you know, get
back to training, And so my mindset, you know, shifted,

(59:01):
and then eventually I slowly found my way back and
it was just rebuilding, you know, it was rebuilding from
you know, the ground up. I was also older, and
so it was you know, it just it wasn't as
easy as I thought it was going to be, and
it was a process where I really had to give
myself grace and time to get back.

Speaker 3 (59:21):
Yeah, and I really do feel like pregnancy. I mean,
as somebody like I'm going through it right now. I'm
six months in and you know, I've been running as
much as I can because obviously I have this show
and like, this is my livelihood and this is my job,
and I run with people and then we sit down
we have conversations, right And we were kind of talking
about this earlier, But it is interesting how humbling a
pregnancy is, but then be how much your mindset does shift,

(59:43):
you know, in obviously ways where obviously it's like you're
still focused on your job, but then at the same
time it's like, well, now you're protecting this child.

Speaker 1 (59:49):
Yeah, and it's a beautiful thing, you know, to be
growing a life. And I think one thing that really
helped me and that I had to also kind of
fight in the beginning, was, you know, trying to get
to myself and that's really not what you're trying to do.
You are someone new now, you know, and you're building
a different version of yourself. And I think that is

(01:00:10):
amazing and it's incredible, and I think we have to
lean into that more than saying, Okay, this is what
I did before, how can I you know, how can
I do that again? And it's just like a little mindset,
mindset shift.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
And I do love that you had a girl too,
because I feel like, I don't know, just the topic
of like female empowerment and like inspiring the next generation.
It must have been so cool for you and such
a source of pride for her to not only watch
you at the Olympic Trials, but then to watch you
meddle in the twenty twenty Olympics.

Speaker 1 (01:00:40):
Absolutely, I mean I think, you know, having a girl
and going through everything I went through, I mean, it
was just such a motivation. And then you know, being
able to tell her about all of these things that
happened and that you know, she was my reason why,
like you know it was it was because of her.

Speaker 2 (01:00:59):
And yeah, and I love that.

Speaker 3 (01:01:01):
What would your advice be to the pregnant moms out
there that are currently trying to train through their pregnancy
and then you know, want to get back as quickly
as they can postpartum.

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Yeah, I think my encouragement would be, you know, give
yourself grace and more than anything, listen to your body.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
I think it's.

Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
Great like that you have goals and that you're pushing yourself.
I think that's completely healthy and you should and I
would just say like, yeah, when your body feels good,
go for it. When you need to give yourself grace,
do that, and yeah, honor all those things.

Speaker 3 (01:01:31):
We've talked a decent bit about mindset throughout this interview
so far. But I love talking about mindset, and especially
with people that get to the top of their performance
and their whatever it is, whether it's you know, their
career and finance or tech. You know, for you as
an athlete and now as an entrepreneur. So I'm curious,
what is the biggest thing that you had to overcome?

Speaker 1 (01:01:52):
I think, you know, one thing that was really different
when I moved, you know, as an entrepreneur. I was
so used to working essentially by myself, you know, and
I was so used to just kind of being the
one that goes out there, and you know, when I'm racing,
it is me, and it's it's on me when it
comes down to it. And now, you know, in business,

(01:02:14):
I get to collaborate so much. I get to work
with an incredible team, and sometimes I have to remember,
like you know, I don't have to be the expert
in everything. I don't have to do it all like
I have, you know, people that I get to work
with and so just really shifting that and yeah, being yeah,
having a team dynamic.

Speaker 3 (01:02:33):
That must be so like such a nice load off.

Speaker 2 (01:02:35):
It is.

Speaker 1 (01:02:36):
It's really refreshing to know that I'm not in it alone.

Speaker 3 (01:02:40):
When you first started your company, though, in your brand,
was it hard for you to delegate tasks?

Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
It was?

Speaker 1 (01:02:45):
I think, you know, there's something beautiful about having an
amazing team, but also, you know, when you're used to
being in control of everything, it is hard to like
let some things go.

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
Are you wearing your sneakers right now? Yeah? Okay, can
I see that? Okay? So, how so you made sneakers
pecifically for women, right like they're designed for the female foot,
the female anatomy. Yes, what went into creating the perfect sneaker?

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
I mean, first it was this realization that you know,
most companies are making their shoes made off of a
mold of a man's foot, and you know, there are
real difference between men's and women's feet, and so we
build you know, everything based on a women's glass. And
so right now there's just now research being done on
female athletes, which is absolutely insane, but we're seeing that,

(01:03:30):
you know, because women have been wearing men's shoes, everything
is affected our knees, our backs, you know, there are
real consequences from that. And so everything is tailored around
a woman's foot and how the women's body is shaped
and the feet obviously being the foundation of that. There's
a lot of differences there on.

Speaker 3 (01:03:48):
What are the fundamental differences.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
Yeah, so a woman's forefoot is a bit wider, our
heel is more nero and women who wear heels, their
achilles will even shorten and as sure as like six
or seven months. And so those are you know, some
of the basic things. But even like the cushion that
is in shoes, it's based on the average weight of

(01:04:11):
a man, so even that we're not even able to
take advantage of. And so those are all things that
our shoes are are different.

Speaker 3 (01:04:18):
It must be so cool for you to have gone
from obviously working with companies like Adidas Nike that have
been known for years to make for making sneakers right,
but having to be you know, having to work with
a brand that is in your own right and like
supporting that sneaker. But now it must be so cool
for you to be able to design sneakers a that
you love and be that you get to share with

(01:04:38):
other people, but also like it's your brand, you own.

Speaker 1 (01:04:41):
It, you know, I mean, it's you know, it's still
sometimes I'm like, wow, this is amazing, but it is
being able to also say that we want to do
things differently. We have a maternity returns policy that says
that if you're a lot of people don't know this,
and I don't know if this has happened to.

Speaker 3 (01:04:55):
You yet, it's happening.

Speaker 2 (01:04:56):
It's happening.

Speaker 3 (01:04:57):
I say, well, my I'm not gonna want too.

Speaker 2 (01:05:02):
Yeah, women's their feet.

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
They change size, you know, when they're pregnant, and often
the size does not go back. And so you know,
if you have our shoes, we'll give you a new
pair and your new size. But things like that, like
you know that we can do at our company and
say no, we want to see women, you know, as
a whole and we want to celebrate them in all
you know, the different ways.

Speaker 3 (01:05:22):
Did your feet grow each time you were pregnant?

Speaker 1 (01:05:24):
Thankfully I went up a half size, you know, just
that was it for both with both pregnancies, just for one.

Speaker 2 (01:05:31):
Yeah, it's stay there.

Speaker 3 (01:05:33):
Because my biggest fear is like does your foot grow
every time you have a baby. It can no, No,
that would be marrible. I already have a size nine
and a half and I'm five four, Like that's unfair.
It's if I I'm like, if I go to a
size eleven and I'm like short, Like this is.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
Not no, it'll It'll be fine.

Speaker 3 (01:05:49):
Okay. How did your first pregnancy compared to your second?

Speaker 1 (01:05:53):
You know, my second pregnancy, I felt so much more
informed because I did have a difficult first pregnancy, and
so I knew so much more. But it was an
IVF pregnancy, so it was, you know, just a bit
more complex and all of those things. But it was
beautiful because I was able to push for an unmedicated
natural birth that I had really really wanted.

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
Did you do it?

Speaker 2 (01:06:15):
I did it, Allison.

Speaker 3 (01:06:16):
I need to know details. I when I tell you,
I'm on the side of TikTok, that's all. I'm medicated births.
I am.

Speaker 2 (01:06:21):
Oh my gosh. We could like, did you talk forever?

Speaker 3 (01:06:24):
It was?

Speaker 2 (01:06:25):
It hard?

Speaker 1 (01:06:26):
It was hard, but I think being an athlete is
to your advantage. I did hypno birthing and it was
it was a beautiful experience and people were like, oh,
that's crazy, but it really was like to see what
your body can do. And and also just we're so
conditioned that birth is this scary, awful, painful thing. And

(01:06:48):
when you start to you know, to change your mind
around the way that you think about it and the
words that you use, it is so powerful and so
it's absolutely possible and it can be beautiful.

Speaker 3 (01:06:59):
I have to say, I feel like as an athlete,
I've been thinking about birth, like I'm so excited to
give birth because I feel like it's game day.

Speaker 2 (01:07:06):
It is.

Speaker 3 (01:07:06):
It's like we've spent nine months prepared for this. The
baby's ready, We're ready to go, you know what I mean.
It's trade and it's also so hard. Like some people
love being pride and I get it, and I, you know,
talk to a lot of women that are like mourning
kind of the loss of literally being pregnant and feeling
that connection. I don't know if I'm gonna be like that,
Like I just I can't wait to have the baby
be here.

Speaker 1 (01:07:25):
It's so amazing once you have your baby in your arms.
And I do think like it is like training, like
preparing for birth. And I look back at some of
the photos when I was in labor.

Speaker 2 (01:07:36):
And it's like, oh, this is the same look I.

Speaker 1 (01:07:39):
Have on the track, you know, you're focused, had my
headphones on, like doing it. And then there's this also
this sense of like pride, like once you do it
and you know, it's just it's an incredible feeling and
I can't wait for you to experience it.

Speaker 3 (01:07:53):
I'm so excited. No, I do. See so many people's
videos too that are like the female urge to do
this over and over again.

Speaker 1 (01:07:59):
Yeah, you forget, you forget also like you know how
it is challenging.

Speaker 3 (01:08:04):
Yeah, oh for sure. I'm I'm like scared but also excited.
It really is game day.

Speaker 2 (01:08:08):
It's gonna be amazing.

Speaker 3 (01:08:11):
So you competed for nearly two decades. What is something
that running did for you that nothing else could?

Speaker 1 (01:08:22):
I think just like the shape it puts you in,
like you know, just the way what it does for
your body, like how you feel. You know, I've I've
tried other workouts, like there's nothing like running, like the
relationship that I have with running in my life, And
you know, I think how it's changed through the years,
but it's always you know, been at been.

Speaker 2 (01:08:44):
Something really important to me.

Speaker 3 (01:08:45):
What does it mean to you? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
To me, it's like this beautiful connection, like this ability
to like challenge myself, push myself, prove myself, and then
I don't have to be in competition with anybody else.
Like it is this relationship literally that I have with myself.
And I'm a curious person. I like to see what

(01:09:09):
I'm capable of, and so I love that It's it's
evolved through the years, and it's you know, there's always
different seasons of what it is at at this moment.

Speaker 3 (01:09:17):
What would you say the season is that you're currently
in as it relates to running.

Speaker 1 (01:09:21):
I think I'm back like wondering what my body is
capable of now, you know, just because it's I'm older,
and yet I'm still like ambitious and yeah, and I
still am like pushing myself.

Speaker 3 (01:09:35):
Yeah. Running is one of those things too where I've
heard that as we get older, especially as women, we
actually can get better at running. I mean maybe not
on like a professional stage, competing in the Olympics, whatever,
but I do hear that a lot for some reasons.

Speaker 1 (01:09:48):
Things that you don't have to stop, yeah, you know,
And I think that's it's always great when you can
have a lifelong relationship with something that gives you so
many benefits for sure.

Speaker 3 (01:09:58):
Well kind of parent do you think you're gonna be
on the side lines of sports games?

Speaker 1 (01:10:02):
An involved parent of enthusiastic, but you know, I'm definitely
not the So my daughter's seven, and she's like, you know,
doing all the sports right now, So I definitely like,
let the coaches coach. So I'm like, you know, chill,
hands off, but like also fiercely competitive, and I want
her to like crush it. Yeah, I want her to

(01:10:24):
do all the things, but I just I try to
play it cool.

Speaker 3 (01:10:26):
Were your parents competitive with you guys?

Speaker 2 (01:10:28):
It's funny.

Speaker 1 (01:10:29):
They were not, Like they were not competitive in the
sense of, you know, those parents like athletic parents. They
are competitive people, but they never pushed us in sports
like it was something. They weren't athletes. You know, my
dad ran a bit in high school, but that was it.
So they were very much still like hands off in
that respect, but competitive by nature.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
Where do you think the running gene came from?

Speaker 2 (01:10:53):
I don't know. I mean, yeah, my dad ran a
little bit.

Speaker 1 (01:10:56):
My mom she always says she walks really fast and like,
so how that combination, you know, led me and my
brother to be runners?

Speaker 3 (01:11:04):
I don't know. Honestly, I love that You're like, oh,
that's so funny that she's.

Speaker 2 (01:11:10):
Like she probably would have been an amazing runner. I'm like,
we don't know, we don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:11:16):
That's so great. Okay, well, this has been so fun
sitting down with you, Alison. I have one final question.
What do you think has been the core theme of
your life? If you were to look back, m.

Speaker 2 (01:11:29):
That's a deep question.

Speaker 1 (01:11:30):
I guess I would say, you know, being able to
grow and evolve. You know, I look at my career
and I look at the meaningful moments, you know, and
I think it's always been about, you know, pushing for
more and and just growing. Like I know, at some
points I thought it was about metals, and then it's
been about impact and and you know, it's about constantly,

(01:11:53):
you know, discovering what's new and and how I can
improve in whatever or you know, season of life or
whatever journey you know I'm on.

Speaker 3 (01:12:03):
And I love how you said, you know, there's different
seasons of your life, and I think what's so cool
is there's so many different ways that you can have impact.
You know, when you had so much fear of impact
with your career, but now you're having so much impact
as a mom and with your brand, and that I
hope to see you at the twenty twenty eight Olympics
in LA doing something.

Speaker 1 (01:12:22):
I appreciate that I'll absolutely be there in some capacity.

Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
Thank you so much for being on Post Run High
with me today. This was amazing, So great to talk
to you, So great to talk to you. Hi, guys,
Kate here, Thank you so much for tuning into today's episode.
If you made it all the way to the end
of this conversation, you are a real one. Alison Felix
is a total powerhouse. I have chills coming out of
this conversation. From sprinting on the biggest stages in the

(01:12:48):
world to advocating for mothers and building space for the
next generation. Her story really is about using your platform
for something bigger than yourself. So if you learn something
new from today's episode, please please share it with a
friend and make sure you're following Post Run High wherever
you are listening. Your support truly helps us continue bringing
you inspiring conversations, and we are grateful for every single

(01:13:12):
one of you that tunes in and listens to our episodes.
We're posting every Monday, so I will see you guys
next week,

All Episodes

Allyson Felix - How to Handle Pressure, Failure, and Reinvent Yourself as an Olympian

Episode Transcript

Host

Kate Mackz

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

Dateline NBC

Kingdom of Fraud

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Allyson Felix - How to Handle Pressure, Failure, and Reinvent Yourself as an Olympian