What does it take to rise from the vibrant streets of Buffalo, New York, to become a celebrated voice in the music industry? Join host Buzz Knight on this captivating episode of takin' a walk as he sits down with the legendary singer-songwriter Willie Nile, whose journey embodies resilience and creativity. With over 20 albums to his name and admiration from icons like Bono and Pete Townshend, Nile's story is one of passion, perseverance, and the power of music.
Buzz Knight, known for his engaging style and deep dives into music history, guides listeners through Nile's early life, growing up in a lively Irish Catholic family steeped in musical traditions. As Willie Nile shares his transformative journey from studying philosophy at the University of Buffalo to carving out a niche in Greenwich Village during the 1970s, you’ll discover the challenges he faced, including a decade-long struggle against the music industry's often unforgiving nature.
Despite these hurdles, Nile's unwavering spirit shines through as he discusses his latest album, "The Great Yellow Light," inspired by the poignant letters of Vincent Van Gogh. This episode is a treasure trove of music history insights, where Nile reflects on his artistic influences, the significance of songwriting, and the importance of authenticity in a world that often pushes artists to conform. Buzz Knight's thoughtful questions lead to profound conversations about the emotional healing that music provides and the connections that fuel creativity.
Listeners will be captivated by Nile's heartfelt anecdotes, including his collaborations with fellow musicians like Steve Earle, showcasing the music and community aspect of his career. As the episode unfolds, Nile offers inspiring artist interviews that highlight the music journey of a true icon, emphasizing the importance of staying true to oneself amidst the chaos of the industry.
As the conversation wraps up, Willie Nile reflects on his remarkable career, sharing his desire to inspire others through music. This episode of takin' a walk is not just a celebration of a legendary musician's journey; it's an exploration of the stories behind songs and the creative journeys that shape our lives. Tune in for an enriching experience that blends classic rock history, indie music journeys, and the timeless tales of legendary songwriters that continue to resonate with audiences today.
Don’t miss out on this enlightening episode filled with music history moments and the vibrant spirit of an artist who has truly made his mark. Grab your headphones and join Buzz Knight for this unforgettable walk through the heart of music!
#buzzknight #music history on foot #willie nile interview #inspiring icons #troubadour #greenwich village music history #musician interview #rock and roll legends #music and resilience #legendary musician interview
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
He grew up in Buffalo, New York, and what he
calls a gregarious Irish Catholic family with music always playing
in the house, a grandfather who ran an orchestra and
played vaudeville with Bill bo Jangles Robinson and two older
brothers on piano. He studied philosophy at the University of Buffalo,
(00:22):
then packed up and headed to Greenwich Village, determined to
make his mark as a troubadour, and he did. I'm
Buzz's Night and Welcome to the Taken a Walk Podcast.
When Willie Niles' self titled debut dropped in nineteen eighty,
The New York Times called him one of the most
gifted singer songwriters to emerge from the New York scene
(00:46):
in years. The Who invited him on their summer tour.
The next Bruce Springsteen, people said, the next Bob Dylan.
Then came a decade of legal battles that silenced him,
not forever, but long enough to make the comeback that
much more remarkable. Because Willie Nile didn't just survive the
(01:06):
music business, he outlasted it. He's now released over twenty albums,
earned the devotion of Bono Pete Townsend, Lou Reed, Lusend Williams,
and Little Stephen and The New Yorker has called him
one of the most brilliant singer songwriters of the past
thirty years. His latest album, The Great Yellow Light, was
inspired by the letters of Vincent Van Go. He's a
(01:30):
New York City original, a rockers rocker, and coming up next,
we're going to talk with Willie Nile.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
It's so great to have Willie Nile on the Take
in a Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
Welcome Willie, Thanks for having me. I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
So is it true you studied philosophy at the University
of Buffalo and how does a philosophy student end up
as a rock and roller in Greenwich Village.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Well, I was a philosophy major at the University of Buffalo,
but that was purely by accident. When I was back
years ago, when I was going to University of Buffalo,
I was just taking classes that I liked. I had
no you know, kids go to school these days, I
have a plan in mind. I just was taking classes
that I liked. I figured i'd ended up being an
(02:24):
English major because I took a lot of and I
think it was one course short of being an English
major as well, and it turned out. My senior year
I went to visit my guidance counselor, who I had
never seen. I had him in the class once. George Boger,
great guy, and I said, how am I doing, you know,
my senior year. He goes, You're doing good. You're a
philosophy major and I went what, And I asked, I
(02:46):
do them. Well, that's great. What can you do with
a philosophy degree? He said, you can go to graduate
school and I went in, I'm going to New York
City to make records. He was really nice, and so was.
I took courses that I liked, Steve Art and beauty.
I thought that sounds good. It wasn't It sucked, but
you know, I just took things I liked, and when
(03:07):
I was got my degree, I moved to New York
City seventy two and started, for the first time, just
jumping up on open open mics and started playing songs.
That's really how it's I was writing songs all through college,
you know, and I thought they were good enough that
it was worth giving it a shot, you know, And
I did.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
So tell me what the village was like when you arrived.
I recently on an episode of the podcast had Alan Pepper,
who owned the bottom Line on and that was obviously
a great hangout. But who were the people and the
places that shaped you in those early years in the village.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
The early years in the village we're talking seventy two,
seventy three and the very early beginning, and it was
there were open lot of a lot of guitar players.
You'd see walking down the street with guitars on their back.
You don't see that much anymore. It's you know, things
change and folks city the bitter End. The Cafe of
(04:11):
Go Go was still open at the time, and it
wasn't long after that that CBGB's opened and I actually
played there before it became the punk mecca.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
I just thought I would get the Village Voice and
look and see what venues there were. And there was
a cool ad for this place called CBGB and omphug
other music for underground Gormandisers. I didn't know what Hilly
Crystal was smoking when he came up with that, but
and I like the ads. I walked out to my
guitar and walked down Bleaker Street, you know, and the
(04:45):
end of Bleaker Streets the Bowery, and right there it
just runs right into CBGB's, you know, perpendicular, and there's
a flophouse a men's shelter above it, and so it
was really cd back then. You know, now it's more
chic and gentrified, but it's still cool. But back then
(05:07):
it was really funky. And I remember walking in and
I asked the bartender who do I talk to for
playing here? And she said that would be Hilly. He's
in the back, he'll be out. So I got a beer,
sat down. After about twenty minutes, nobody know nothing, So
I went over to the jukebox. They had a CBGB's
at a great jukebox, really really good. But I noticed
(05:33):
the last two songs, the last song album, the last
forty five that was on there was by a guy
named Hilly Crystal, and I thought, how many Hillies are
there in the world. So I put about four dollars
of quarters and I played the same song like ten
times in a row, and after about seven or eight
plays six of it, this guy comes out from the back,
a grizzly bear who clearly woke up looking all pissed off.
(05:54):
What the hell I walked up to him and said, hey, Hi,
are you Hilly. He goes, yeah, I like your song
and I said, how do you get to play here?
And he said he just looked at me like I
looked up and down. He goes, We'll just kid on
the stage and play me something. So I still on
the stage, put my acoustic guitar out, played a couple
of songs and he said, you're hired, and I played.
(06:17):
There was a jazz pianist from City College that was
doing the music at the time, and he was really
nice black guy. He set me up on that night
and whatever nights I played and I would play. And
then not long after that, Tom Barlane and Richard Lloyd
from television walked in and asked Hillie if they could
start playing on Sunday nights, which they did, and that
(06:40):
started a whole Patty Smith joined him, and it started
a whole avalanche of outsiders and loaners and kids with
visions and wannabes and all the above, and it was
really great. I used to go to there three or
four times, so CBGB's I had one foot in the
acoustic world and one foot in the electric world, just
(07:01):
because I was broke as a church mouse. I couldn't
afford a band, you know, so I played acoustic. When
I would get on stage, was just mean an acoustic guitar,
and if it was a piano, I had played the piano.
But I was playing rock and roll songs. So I
had one foot and acoustic in world and one foot
in the electric and a lot of interesting people back
then to say the least.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yeah, you know, when I think of your song Vagabond Moon,
which is just so wonderful to this day, it does
cast an image to me that feels very much like
sauntering through the village. Is that really a fair assessment?
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Absolutely? I wrote that song one night. It was about
three in the morning. I was going out every night
to clubs and you know, hank bars and just hanging out,
just taking in the whole scene. That first year I
was there and in my kitchen, I'm on the top floor.
It was it was three in the morning, and I
(08:03):
had my acoustic guitar sitting in the kitchen with a
lights off, and the moon full moon was shining, and
the light was coming in through the kitchen last and
the landing on the floor, and I just thought it
was so beautiful and I wrote that song, but it's
very much a backstreet, Grench village song. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
So I was talking to you before we started the interview.
We have some history because I was a program on
a radio station in Fairfield County, Connecticut. Technically it was Brookfield,
Connecticut called I ninety five, and we were big fans
of your music as you were hitting the scene and
you played a place I believe the venue was called
(08:42):
Stage three, and in the magic of that era, that
radio era, we were able to not only be the
co sponsor or whatever, co presenter of that concert, but
we also broadcasted live as it was happened. I mean,
I got chills thinking about that show. It was so fantastic.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I don't remember the recording, but I remember playing shows
back then with a great band that I had, you know, JD.
Doherty on drums, Fred Smith on bass. JD. Doherty played
with Patty Smith still to this day. Fred Smith, who
just passed last week. I'm broken hearted about. It's a great,
great guy who was the television television was my favorite
(09:26):
band by far back then. They were just so enigmatic.
So mystical was Tumberlane, Richard Lloyd, Fred Smith, you know,
Billy Figuett and Fred played bass, and Clay Barnes from
a band called The Criers played lead guitar, and Peter Hoffman,
a rocker from Boston, also played lead guitar. So I
(09:47):
had a mighty band. I had two lead guitar players
in a great rhythm section and we had fun. That
I do remember. It was.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
It was outstanding. Now, how did you feel about this
whole thing which a lot of artists of that time
were subject to, the whole Oh it's the next Dylan?
You know, that whole pressure that came upon you? What
was that like? And when you reflect on it, how
did does it make you feel? Now? When that came up?
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Well, I remember exactly how it felt, you know, and
I still feel the same. I just thought it didn't
it didn't throw me, It didn't put any pressure on
me at all. I just thought it was ridiculous because
but I knew that they you know, people were just
looking for something to compare it to, you know, Oh,
here's the next this, the next, that next Bob Dylan,
the next whatever, And uh, I knew. I didn't take
(10:40):
it seriously at all. I just knew it was just
a reference that was being used.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I didn't get into the music business, so to speak,
to become some kind of icon, some kind of idol,
to be famous. That was really never my focus I
and it really saved me from a lot of stuff
that that kind of really focused. I was a songwriter.
I was a poet writing songs that meant something to me.
(11:07):
And at the outside world had nothing to do with it.
I mean everything to do with it, because it influenced me.
But I was writing songs that, you know, I was
expressing myself. And when I first started writing poetry, I
was writing stream of consciousness. And there's no writer wrong
with stream of consciousness writing. It just is what it is,
you know. And so I for you know, four years
(11:28):
at the University of Buffalo, I was writing songs and
with nobody looking over my shoulder, and so I really
got a strong foundation of self and like what I
was doing. So when the first record came out and
all this, I was very grateful. I'm making no mistake
about it, for the reviews that I got. I got
rave reviews across the board. It was one bad review,
(11:49):
the Boston Phoenix I got slammed, and it made me
laugh because you know, he wasn't buying it, you know,
he thought this guy's full of shit, you know. And
it made me like because every single review was like
just like so strong and so supportive, and this guy's
amazing and he's going to be the next this, the
next that. But I didn't take it seriously, so it
(12:11):
didn't throw me. It really didn't throw me off by balance.
To this day, it's I've been very fortunate and Pressed
has been really good to me. And you know, I
just like to record my songs as well as I
can and make the songs come to life and that
so that means something to me and hopefully they'll mean
something to somebody else. The whole fame circus I never
(12:34):
was interested in, was never a part of. That's why
to this day I'm able just to carry on, and
you know, with ups and downs of the business. It's
like nons I walked away in nineteen eighty two after
two albums and like worldwide, you know, celebrated as the
next big thing. When it became more about business than
about music. I had problems with the former manager, former lawyer,
(12:58):
and it just turned me off so much. I thought
I told my wife to help with this. Let's get
out of here. I walked away. Maybe not the smartest
thing to do, but I just it was bullshit. So
that doesn't you know, I'm fame doesn't interest me, you know,
stinking rich. I'm sure that i'd be interested in because
(13:19):
I could. I could do some good things with the money,
and I could take care of, you know, my family
and stuff. But like, that's that's what I was about.
Back then. I had two kids and four kids and
a wife to feed, So my concerns were very mundane
and simple. So the whole comparison thing I didn't. I
knew it was just nonsense. I never I just didn't
give it a second thought.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
And we never knew back then the deep story that
was going on in terms of the legal battles that
you were faced with. I think there was somewhat, you know,
we sheltered from us during that period. We knew we
loved your music, and we became fans instantly, and then
suddenly we're like, well, we want more of this guy.
So this, this story was not truly told, at least
(14:03):
in my view at that time, as clearly as it
should have been.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
It was brutal it was like it just it's not
what I expected. I mean, you know, you get into
a you know, a gold mine oil field kind of business,
like the record business, where people are following money and
smelling it and wanting it. And that was not where
I was coming from. And I had problems with the
former manager, problems with the lawyer. We had the same lawyer,
(14:28):
which was which was conflict of interest, and I'm going
to arbitration during the day doing shows at night. And
it just all these managers coming from out of the
woodwork wanted to manage me because that was a double
Paige spread and Billboard magazine, you know, the next big thing. Nonsense.
I mean, I'm grateful that the record company they probably
pushed too hard, you know people it was a backlash
(14:48):
to that, but I had no control over that. But
it just turned me off. I just thought that that
killed I said to my wife, they're killing my buzz
for music. I don't want that to happen. So we
just left town. From my back it disappeared and it
took It was ten years later that I put another
record out. You know, I went to Buffalo. She was pregnant,
(15:10):
and you know, I continued to write. I'll always write,
you know. I don't write because somebody says to write.
I just write because it's my natural way of expressing
myself and I love it to this day. And then
I'm still very very lucky that the inspiration's still coming
out strong, very very lucky. So I went back to Buffalo.
I was writing and writing, you know, which is what
(15:32):
I do. And it was really hard times. You know,
money ran out, I had to borrow money. I was writing.
And then a couple of years in that was when
I thought I got songs I want to record and
I couldn't get arrested, made phone calls, you know, because
that tapes out of new songs, and nobody was interested.
They followed in general, people follow the hype, you know.
(15:54):
And at that time I was I was in Siberia.
I was up and outside of the Buffalo, but it
was basically Siberia. Really hard time. We had a great
you know. This was the one silver lining about those
years in Buffalo, which was about nine years, was that
I was able to be home all the time with
them and my children growing up. So we became very
(16:15):
very close. It's a very close family to this day.
So that was the one, but otherwise it was really stressful,
trying to feed a family with knowing. I mean, I
got a publishing deal in the middle of that, which
really saved my ass. But I didn't mind walking away.
I didn't want him to kill my you know, I
love music more than ever. And the record companies that
(16:35):
tried for me aris that totally tried, and I'm very
grateful Clive Davis and his team there people tried for me.
I'm grateful for that. And when I signed a Columbia
and eighty eight. That record came out in ninety one.
Rick Trdoff signed me, tried for me, and the timing
was wrong. He was by the time the record got made.
(16:56):
I was waiting for him to produce it, and he
was producing Patty's Smythe and the Hooters and Temmy Conwell.
I had to wait. I wanted him to produce it.
By then he was in the doghouse and on the
way out. So my record came out, did you know.
I was told later that it was dead before it
came out, But I got to make it. And Richard
Thompson plays on it, and a lot of White Right
(17:18):
sings on it, and Wicks Paul Wickens, McCartney's keyboard player,
and Robbie McIntosh, a great art guitar player from the UK,
played the Pretenders. And I mean, so I got to make.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
A great record.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
I'm very, very hap happy Richard Thompson for crying out
loud and his bare feet come on. So I mean,
it's very naive of me to think that way, you know,
because you know, I was living and dying on the
income and it just came out. And someone told me
later that the president at the time said at one meeting,
this record has four weeks to happen on its owner.
(17:53):
It's done. So that's not how it works. You know,
they got to promote it and stuff, and there's a
few people at the label really did you know, which
from which I'm grateful. So, you know, no chip on
my shoulder. And that was the idea of walking away
from the record business. When I first moved here, one
of the really predominant things I saw was a lot
(18:13):
of musicians with chips on the shoulder. Oh why not me?
Oh you know, I'm better than this guy.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Bubbah.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
I want I want no part of that nonsense. So
you know, I to this day I don't have a
chip on my shoulder. I'm very grateful for the journey
has not been easy. You know, it's hard for my
my wife and my kids, but no one ever complained,
not once. Deeply grateful for that.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
We'll be right back with more of the Taking a
Walk Podcast. Welcome back to the Taking a Walk Podcast.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
Lucinda Williams once said, if there was any justice in
the world, I'd be opening up for him instead of
him for me. When you hear something like that from
a peer of that caliber or what goes through your mind.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
Well, I love I love us and that. When she
said that, we were down in Nashville. I think it
was the year two thousand something like that. I had
just put out Beautiful reck of the World on my
own label, and I met her at after a show
in New York, and she invited me down to Nashville
(19:23):
and literally set up a week of weeks worth of gigs,
put a band together for me. We did I played,
I think a couple of gigs with a band. I
did a solo gig. We did a songwriter circle in
which she was a part of. There were lines down
the block to see Lucinda and these other wonderful uh songwriters.
(19:44):
And I'm sitting next to her watching her sing. I'm
looking she's right next to me. I'm looking at her throat, going,
where's that voice coming from? You know that that amazing voice.
Nobody sounds like Lyscinda and I played a song on
the Road to Calvary and she just looked over when
I was done, and she goes, that's the most beautiful
song I've ever heard in my life.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
Something like that.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
And she said.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
That's when she made that quote about opening up for me. No, no, no,
that's not no. It was later that year she played
in New York City at Roseland Ballroom, legendary venue. You know,
Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, great bands. So she played the
Roseland Ballroom and I opened up and opened up the
(20:25):
show with my band. This was two thousand, had a great,
great band. I've been lucky with having great bands. We
opened up the show. It was packed. You couldn't get
up a toothpick in the room. It was so crowded
because she had just put out her great album, Carl
Wheels on a Gravel Road, utter masterpiece. You know, if
anybody hasn't heard that record, Carl Wheels on a gravel Road.
(20:47):
I highly recommend it. It's just brilliant. And so we
did it. We opened up. We got a great response,
and I'm up in the dressing room taking off my
wet clothes and somebody came running the telling me what
she said. She just said to the crowd. You know,
if it was any justice in this world, I'd be
open up for Willi and Ale instead of him. I
(21:07):
want it from me. Well, that just shows you what
a quality class act Lucinda Williams is. You know, in
an industry filled with wannabees, pretenders and people with big egos,
here's Lucinda Williams champion and other artists that she loves
and respects. And she's done that with many artists. I'm
(21:28):
not the only one that she's champion, and I think
the world I love her dearly, you know, and that
made me feel. I mean, the money can't buy some things,
you know, if I was stinking rich, I couldn't buy that,
you know, So God bless her for saying that.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
You've also had some incredible writing collaboration and other collaboration
with one of my favorites. He's been on the podcast
Steve Earle talking about your work with Steve and what
that means to you.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Oh my god, Steve Url. So, Steve Earl lived like
literally three doors down from me. I'm in the middle
of ground fills right now and near the corner mcdouglin Bleaker,
and he lived a couple of doors over on Bleaker Street,
and so I would see him all the time, and
we became friends. He has a nonverbal autistic son, you know,
(22:27):
a great, great burden, and he doesn't tour anymore for Mike,
mostly from September and to May, to be a single
parent taking care of that boy. I'll see him on
the street coming back from a Yankee game with.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
His son, you know.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
And so I really grew to love Steve. You know,
I obviously a huge fan of his work. He's one
of America's great songwriters. I mean, I ain't never satisfied.
Guitar Town. You can just go down the Revolution starts now,
you can just go down the list of masterpieces that
he's written. He's like Johnny Cash to me. I love Steve.
And so I was making this record called The Day
(23:01):
the Ear Stood Still, and there's a song on it
called Blood on Your Hands, which was about COVID politics,
all about all the people who died out of mismanagement
and uh, which I consider murder. And I wrote a
song called Blood on Your Hands and we were mixed
in it, and I thought, you know, maybe Steve might
(23:22):
want to sing on this, so I texted him send
on the song. Five minutes later, I'm in, that's it,
you know, And there's there's a there's a video of
it if people go to YouTube and look up blood
on your Hands with Willie All and Steve Earle. I'm
so I can't tell you how moved I am. It's
(23:42):
like Lucinda, you know, there's two giants. And then when
I think a year later, I wrote a song called
wake Up America, and I was going to put I
wanted to put out as a single, which I did
before the election. Yeah. I love people. I love this country,
you know, and I think that it's a lot better
than it only appears to be.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
I think there's a lot of good people in this country,
and people disagreeing on the facts, you know, because there's
so many news outlets nobody is about to believe and
people it's so divided. It's so sad. This is out
of tragedy. I mean, it's not going to last forever,
but it's pretty bad. And there's a lot of great people,
you know, in this country, and I think the vision,
(24:23):
the dream that is this country is still alive. It's
pretty buried right now. But I don't wake up America.
Just everybody like, hey, we can do better. Bobby Kennedy
used to say that we're good people, but we can
do better. Neighbors being neighbors. Don't be jumping to conclusions,
you know, let's not be judging so fast. We're all
immigrants here other than the first nations, people that are
(24:46):
that were here when the Europeans came over, and all
the people came from different countries. This is a country
of immigrants, and shame on this assault on immigrants. It's
just for show, and it's just for appealing to a base,
you know, and it's it's a shame. We're better than this.
And I think if people knew there's a line if
(25:06):
in blood in your hands, no uncle getting ugly out there.
If the people ever knew what was really going on,
there'd be another politician would be dead and gone. I mean,
I believe in this country and I think that we
can do better. I think we will. And I wrote
wake Up America and I same thing. I texted Steve, Hey, Steve,
you want to sing on this. I get a text
message back. Five minutes later. I'm in and there's a video.
(25:31):
It's on the new I put it on the new album.
My new album is called The Great Yellow Light, which
I'm so proud of, and it's one of my favorite
records that I've made and I love them all. And uh,
wake Up America is on that album, and there's a
video that's out. We put we reput it out. I
think we've got three hundred thousand people looking at it
(25:51):
or whatever. Wake Up America and Steve Earl's in it.
You know, it's a it's a prayer and a love
song to this country. You know that we can do better,
and I believe that we will.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
A new album, The Great yellow Light, is great. Love it.
It's inspired by Van Goes's letters to his brother. What
is it about Van go that resonated so deeply with you?
Speaker 3 (26:17):
With Van go Like the Great Yellow Light amidst all
this darkness and division, Like it's pretty dark out there.
You know, people's spirits are like down, you know. I
remember in the early sixties when John Kennedy was president
and there was a Peace Corps and there was you
can hear New York City outside of my window anyway,
(26:38):
the fire and ambulance and it. You'd be amazed. During
COVID how often you heard that all day long and
long story shorts. So with Van go So, with all
this darkness. I remember reading years ago one of Van
Goes's letters to his brother when he moved ar when
he moved to the south of France. She was blown
(27:00):
away by I love a huge fan of his work.
I love Vango, his story, his letters, his paintings. There's
something primitive that really resonates with me there, and I
love his work. And he mentioned to his brother that
he referred to the Great Yellow Light, how it inspired
him so in South France, and that stuck with me
(27:23):
and I wrote a song so a couple of years later,
not long ago, called the Great Yellow Light. And it's
not about Bango, it's just about inspiration in this case,
you know, it's it's about love. And I thought the
I thought that's the title of this record, the Great
Yellow Light. I wanted to make a record that would
inspire people, that a feel good record, that that would inspire,
(27:48):
you know, I mean, wake Up America's on there. It's
you know, it doesn't puts his foot around this record,
but it's inspiring. Anybody listens to it, I think you'll,
you know, you'll feel better whatever it ends with Washington
Day the album, the last song was called Washington's Day,
a song I wrote with two of the Hooters, Rob
Hymen and Eric Bazilian and also my producer at the time,
(28:10):
Rick Chertoff, wrote the song years ago in nineteen eighty
eight eighty seven eighty. I just signed with Airs with
Columbia Records, and I had just written a song and
wanted to plant for the producer. He was in the
studio working on a Hooters record. He was in the
record plant it's I called him up and he said,
come the boys, the ad band's out here. It's just
(28:30):
me and the engineer working on a mix. Come on buy.
So I went by the studio and was waiting for
them to work on a mix, and he said that
he told me the song was called Washington's Day, which
was a reference to July fourth Independence Day. And so
I'm sitting in the back of the room listened to
work on this mix, and it was so beautiful. There
(28:51):
was no lyrics, not a word, and here they are
mixing the song without a vocal on it, and it
was like listening to let it be. It was so beautiful.
And anybody hears that song Washingtons Day, you'll know what
I mean. It's stunning. And in the back of the room,
I just pulled out my pen and started writing. Did
you think I could ever forget the night by the
(29:11):
Arlington flame and the silence I heard it through streets
so deserted you whispered and called me by name? Did
you think I could ever forget the rockets, red glare
in your eye where Lincoln stood strong? There you held
me so long there that night and the fourth of
July and the chorus, I hope and I pray that
(29:31):
you'll be here with me when the mountains that rise
tumble into the sea, when the kingdoms that come set
us free on our way. Hope you'll be here with
me home on Washington's Day. I got chills just thinking
about it. It's it's a it's a Romeo and Juliet
story that takes place in Arlington National Cemetery and the
(29:52):
lyrics brought now to encompass war and you know, the
human condition. But it's a it's a song, it's a
prayer for better things. It's an optimistic end of this album.
This album is a firecracker. Starts out with wild Wild
World because it is a wild wild world, you know,
and it ends with Washington State. So I'm so, you know,
to answer your question, Van Goo inspires me to this
(30:16):
day and his phrase A great yellow light inspired that song,
and it's the heart of the album. It's one of
my maybe my favorite album. You know.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I got chills as you were reciting that. It was
so wonderful. I know you're going to be doing a
bunch of dates, aren't you. You're that's you always right, My.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
God, my calendars. I got a lot of a lot
of shows coming up. I'm leaving town next Wednesday, going
to Tulsa, Oklahoma. The Bob Dylan Center's there and Woody
Gouthries Center. I was there in July and October in Tulsa,
and it's just amazing. Anybody listening, if you're looking for
an interesting trip and you're any kind of a fan
(30:56):
of Dylan's or Woody gouthries Man is it interesting. Well,
they're having a sixtieth anniversary event of Blonde on Blonde
on the twentieth of February, and they've got all these
really interesting people singing one song each off at Blonde
on Blonde. Then they asked me to sing absolutely Sweet Marie,
which I will, and then later in the evening, I'm
(31:18):
gonna sing like a rolling Stone, talk about shooting fish
in a barrel. They've got a great backing band. It's
going to be so much fun, and takes place at
Cane's Ballroom, which is a legendary thirties roadhouse. And then
I'm off to I got a Caribbean cruise legend it's
called the Rock Legends Cruise, which makes me laugh. I
(31:39):
don't consider myself a rock legend. I consider myself a
simple poet with a guitar. But and then I'm going
to Buffalo, and then I'm off to Spain for a
couple of weeks, tour in Spain, to Italy for a
tour in Italy, and I'll crash there for a week,
come back home. And then I got a Midwest tour
in the middle of April, which with full band, it's
(32:00):
going to be great. And then I've got a Spanish
band that backs me in Spain, a great band. And
I've had an Italian band that backs me in Italy,
great band. Because it's expensive to take my American guys.
You know, I'd love to do it, but it costs
a lot of money. And I'm not a stinking rich
guy yet, but I'm working on it. And then in
May I go to the West Coast. I've got a
solo solo tour out there, so I've got a full
(32:22):
spring and I'm happy about that. You know, seventy seven
year old grandpa who loves what he does, and it's
still fortunately pretty good shape.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
Knock.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
I would because I live on a sixth floor walk up,
which I have for fifty three years. And I saw
somebody sent me an article the other day, somebody saying,
how walking upstairs a sudden burst of it. You know
how good that can be for you. Well, I've hated
those stairs for years, but the last few years as
I walk up, I'm going, thank you, thank you, thank you,
(32:52):
think as I go up, because it's kept me somewhat fit.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
That's so great. Well, before I let you go, since
we do call this podcast taking a Walk Willie. I
have to ask you, if you could take a walk
with somebody, just suspend disbelief, living or dead, who would
you take a walk with?
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Then?
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Where would you take that walk with him? That's a
good one.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Two places come to mind right away, because I'll often
ask people if we had a time machine, what three
places would you want to go? Where would you go? Well,
there's a number of I'd go a bunch of places.
I go to Dallas, Texas, nineteen sixty three and see
what I can do to stop the same with John Lennon,
(33:40):
you know, and I was in the recording studio and
that he was killed and the record play at the
same studio. He was upstairs, I was downstairs and he
left five minutes later he was murdered. And I would
know so two places. But if I could take a walk,
I would go. I would go to Arl France, south
of France, take a walk with Van Go and just
to watch his world. And other than that, I would
(34:01):
go to Homburg, Germany, and I have to take a
walk with four guys and go walk around Homburg, Germany
with the Beatles. And those are two magical places for me,
you know, the south of France with Van goh and Homburg,
Germany with the Beatles. I'd love to do.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
That, oh Man, Willie Nile, this has been a joy
reconnecting with you, the great Willie Nile. See him when
he's out on the road. Check out the Great Yellow
Light and his entire catalog. It's an honor to be
with you, Willie. And thanks for being on the Taking
a Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
Here well, thanks for taking the time. I've enjoyed it
and bless your heart. And anyway, if I'm anywhere near
where you are, let me know, and maybe my guest
I'd love to see in person. Thank you for taking
the time, my brother.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
I'm Buzznight and thanks for listening to the Taking a
Walk podcast. Now, please check out our companion podcasts produced
by Buzznight Media Productions with your host Lynn Hoffman. Music
Save Me showcasing the healing power of me music and
comedy Save Me shining a light on how laughter is
the best medicine. All shows are available on Apple Podcasts,
(35:09):
Spotify and are part of the iHeart podcast Network.
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
He grew up in Buffalo, New York, and what he
calls a gregarious Irish Catholic family with music always playing
in the house, a grandfather who ran an orchestra and
played vaudeville with Bill bo Jangles Robinson and two older
brothers on piano. He studied philosophy at the University of Buffalo,
(00:22):
then packed up and headed to Greenwich Village, determined to
make his mark as a troubadour, and he did. I'm
Buzz's Night and Welcome to the Taken a Walk Podcast.
When Willie Niles' self titled debut dropped in nineteen eighty,
The New York Times called him one of the most
gifted singer songwriters to emerge from the New York scene
(00:46):
in years. The Who invited him on their summer tour.
The next Bruce Springsteen, people said, the next Bob Dylan.
Then came a decade of legal battles that silenced him,
not forever, but long enough to make the comeback that
much more remarkable. Because Willie Nile didn't just survive the
(01:06):
music business, he outlasted it. He's now released over twenty albums,
earned the devotion of Bono Pete Townsend, Lou Reed, Lusend Williams,
and Little Stephen and The New Yorker has called him
one of the most brilliant singer songwriters of the past
thirty years. His latest album, The Great Yellow Light, was
inspired by the letters of Vincent Van Go. He's a
(01:30):
New York City original, a rockers rocker, and coming up next,
we're going to talk with Willie Nile.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Taking a Walk.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
It's so great to have Willie Nile on the Take
in a Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (01:45):
Welcome Willie, Thanks for having me. I'm happy to be here.
Speaker 2 (01:50):
So is it true you studied philosophy at the University
of Buffalo and how does a philosophy student end up
as a rock and roller in Greenwich Village.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Well, I was a philosophy major at the University of Buffalo,
but that was purely by accident. When I was back
years ago, when I was going to University of Buffalo,
I was just taking classes that I liked. I had
no you know, kids go to school these days, I
have a plan in mind. I just was taking classes
that I liked. I figured i'd ended up being an
(02:24):
English major because I took a lot of and I
think it was one course short of being an English
major as well, and it turned out. My senior year
I went to visit my guidance counselor, who I had
never seen. I had him in the class once. George Boger,
great guy, and I said, how am I doing, you know,
my senior year. He goes, You're doing good. You're a
philosophy major and I went what, And I asked, I
(02:46):
do them. Well, that's great. What can you do with
a philosophy degree? He said, you can go to graduate
school and I went in, I'm going to New York
City to make records. He was really nice, and so was.
I took courses that I liked, Steve Art and beauty.
I thought that sounds good. It wasn't It sucked, but
you know, I just took things I liked, and when
(03:07):
I was got my degree, I moved to New York
City seventy two and started, for the first time, just
jumping up on open open mics and started playing songs.
That's really how it's I was writing songs all through college,
you know, and I thought they were good enough that
it was worth giving it a shot, you know, And
I did.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
So tell me what the village was like when you arrived.
I recently on an episode of the podcast had Alan Pepper,
who owned the bottom Line on and that was obviously
a great hangout. But who were the people and the
places that shaped you in those early years in the village.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
The early years in the village we're talking seventy two,
seventy three and the very early beginning, and it was
there were open lot of a lot of guitar players.
You'd see walking down the street with guitars on their back.
You don't see that much anymore. It's you know, things
change and folks city the bitter End. The Cafe of
(04:11):
Go Go was still open at the time, and it
wasn't long after that that CBGB's opened and I actually
played there before it became the punk mecca.
Speaker 1 (04:23):
You know.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
I just thought I would get the Village Voice and
look and see what venues there were. And there was
a cool ad for this place called CBGB and omphug
other music for underground Gormandisers. I didn't know what Hilly
Crystal was smoking when he came up with that, but
and I like the ads. I walked out to my
guitar and walked down Bleaker Street, you know, and the
(04:45):
end of Bleaker Streets the Bowery, and right there it
just runs right into CBGB's, you know, perpendicular, and there's
a flophouse a men's shelter above it, and so it
was really cd back then. You know, now it's more
chic and gentrified, but it's still cool. But back then
(05:07):
it was really funky. And I remember walking in and
I asked the bartender who do I talk to for
playing here? And she said that would be Hilly. He's
in the back, he'll be out. So I got a beer,
sat down. After about twenty minutes, nobody know nothing, So
I went over to the jukebox. They had a CBGB's
at a great jukebox, really really good. But I noticed
(05:33):
the last two songs, the last song album, the last
forty five that was on there was by a guy
named Hilly Crystal, and I thought, how many Hillies are
there in the world. So I put about four dollars
of quarters and I played the same song like ten
times in a row, and after about seven or eight
plays six of it, this guy comes out from the back,
a grizzly bear who clearly woke up looking all pissed off.
(05:54):
What the hell I walked up to him and said, hey, Hi,
are you Hilly. He goes, yeah, I like your song
and I said, how do you get to play here?
And he said he just looked at me like I
looked up and down. He goes, We'll just kid on
the stage and play me something. So I still on
the stage, put my acoustic guitar out, played a couple
of songs and he said, you're hired, and I played.
(06:17):
There was a jazz pianist from City College that was
doing the music at the time, and he was really
nice black guy. He set me up on that night
and whatever nights I played and I would play. And
then not long after that, Tom Barlane and Richard Lloyd
from television walked in and asked Hillie if they could
start playing on Sunday nights, which they did, and that
(06:40):
started a whole Patty Smith joined him, and it started
a whole avalanche of outsiders and loaners and kids with
visions and wannabes and all the above, and it was
really great. I used to go to there three or
four times, so CBGB's I had one foot in the
acoustic world and one foot in the electric world, just
(07:01):
because I was broke as a church mouse. I couldn't
afford a band, you know, so I played acoustic. When
I would get on stage, was just mean an acoustic guitar,
and if it was a piano, I had played the piano.
But I was playing rock and roll songs. So I
had one foot and acoustic in world and one foot
in the electric and a lot of interesting people back
then to say the least.
Speaker 2 (07:22):
Yeah, you know, when I think of your song Vagabond Moon,
which is just so wonderful to this day, it does
cast an image to me that feels very much like
sauntering through the village. Is that really a fair assessment?
Speaker 3 (07:41):
Absolutely? I wrote that song one night. It was about
three in the morning. I was going out every night
to clubs and you know, hank bars and just hanging out,
just taking in the whole scene. That first year I
was there and in my kitchen, I'm on the top floor.
It was it was three in the morning, and I
(08:03):
had my acoustic guitar sitting in the kitchen with a
lights off, and the moon full moon was shining, and
the light was coming in through the kitchen last and
the landing on the floor, and I just thought it
was so beautiful and I wrote that song, but it's
very much a backstreet, Grench village song. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
So I was talking to you before we started the interview.
We have some history because I was a program on
a radio station in Fairfield County, Connecticut. Technically it was Brookfield,
Connecticut called I ninety five, and we were big fans
of your music as you were hitting the scene and
you played a place I believe the venue was called
(08:42):
Stage three, and in the magic of that era, that
radio era, we were able to not only be the
co sponsor or whatever, co presenter of that concert, but
we also broadcasted live as it was happened. I mean,
I got chills thinking about that show. It was so fantastic.
Speaker 3 (09:05):
I don't remember the recording, but I remember playing shows
back then with a great band that I had, you know, JD.
Doherty on drums, Fred Smith on bass. JD. Doherty played
with Patty Smith still to this day. Fred Smith, who
just passed last week. I'm broken hearted about. It's a great,
great guy who was the television television was my favorite
(09:26):
band by far back then. They were just so enigmatic.
So mystical was Tumberlane, Richard Lloyd, Fred Smith, you know,
Billy Figuett and Fred played bass, and Clay Barnes from
a band called The Criers played lead guitar, and Peter Hoffman,
a rocker from Boston, also played lead guitar. So I
(09:47):
had a mighty band. I had two lead guitar players
in a great rhythm section and we had fun. That
I do remember. It was.
Speaker 2 (09:54):
It was outstanding. Now, how did you feel about this
whole thing which a lot of artists of that time
were subject to, the whole Oh it's the next Dylan?
You know, that whole pressure that came upon you? What
was that like? And when you reflect on it, how
did does it make you feel? Now? When that came up?
Speaker 3 (10:16):
Well, I remember exactly how it felt, you know, and
I still feel the same. I just thought it didn't
it didn't throw me, It didn't put any pressure on
me at all. I just thought it was ridiculous because
but I knew that they you know, people were just
looking for something to compare it to, you know, Oh,
here's the next this, the next, that next Bob Dylan,
the next whatever, And uh, I knew. I didn't take
(10:40):
it seriously at all. I just knew it was just
a reference that was being used.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
I wasn't.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I didn't get into the music business, so to speak,
to become some kind of icon, some kind of idol,
to be famous. That was really never my focus I
and it really saved me from a lot of stuff
that that kind of really focused. I was a songwriter.
I was a poet writing songs that meant something to me.
(11:07):
And at the outside world had nothing to do with it.
I mean everything to do with it, because it influenced me.
But I was writing songs that, you know, I was
expressing myself. And when I first started writing poetry, I
was writing stream of consciousness. And there's no writer wrong
with stream of consciousness writing. It just is what it is,
you know. And so I for you know, four years
(11:28):
at the University of Buffalo, I was writing songs and
with nobody looking over my shoulder, and so I really
got a strong foundation of self and like what I
was doing. So when the first record came out and
all this, I was very grateful. I'm making no mistake
about it, for the reviews that I got. I got
rave reviews across the board. It was one bad review,
(11:49):
the Boston Phoenix I got slammed, and it made me
laugh because you know, he wasn't buying it, you know,
he thought this guy's full of shit, you know. And
it made me like because every single review was like
just like so strong and so supportive, and this guy's
amazing and he's going to be the next this, the
next that. But I didn't take it seriously, so it
(12:11):
didn't throw me. It really didn't throw me off by balance.
To this day, it's I've been very fortunate and Pressed
has been really good to me. And you know, I
just like to record my songs as well as I
can and make the songs come to life and that
so that means something to me and hopefully they'll mean
something to somebody else. The whole fame circus I never
(12:34):
was interested in, was never a part of. That's why
to this day I'm able just to carry on, and
you know, with ups and downs of the business. It's
like nons I walked away in nineteen eighty two after
two albums and like worldwide, you know, celebrated as the
next big thing. When it became more about business than
about music. I had problems with the former manager, former lawyer,
(12:58):
and it just turned me off so much. I thought
I told my wife to help with this. Let's get
out of here. I walked away. Maybe not the smartest
thing to do, but I just it was bullshit. So
that doesn't you know, I'm fame doesn't interest me, you know,
stinking rich. I'm sure that i'd be interested in because
(13:19):
I could. I could do some good things with the money,
and I could take care of, you know, my family
and stuff. But like, that's that's what I was about.
Back then. I had two kids and four kids and
a wife to feed, So my concerns were very mundane
and simple. So the whole comparison thing I didn't. I
knew it was just nonsense. I never I just didn't
give it a second thought.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
And we never knew back then the deep story that
was going on in terms of the legal battles that
you were faced with. I think there was somewhat, you know,
we sheltered from us during that period. We knew we
loved your music, and we became fans instantly, and then
suddenly we're like, well, we want more of this guy.
So this, this story was not truly told, at least
(14:03):
in my view at that time, as clearly as it
should have been.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
It was brutal it was like it just it's not
what I expected. I mean, you know, you get into
a you know, a gold mine oil field kind of business,
like the record business, where people are following money and
smelling it and wanting it. And that was not where
I was coming from. And I had problems with the
former manager, problems with the lawyer. We had the same lawyer,
(14:28):
which was which was conflict of interest, and I'm going
to arbitration during the day doing shows at night. And
it just all these managers coming from out of the
woodwork wanted to manage me because that was a double
Paige spread and Billboard magazine, you know, the next big thing. Nonsense.
I mean, I'm grateful that the record company they probably
pushed too hard, you know people it was a backlash
(14:48):
to that, but I had no control over that. But
it just turned me off. I just thought that that
killed I said to my wife, they're killing my buzz
for music. I don't want that to happen. So we
just left town. From my back it disappeared and it
took It was ten years later that I put another
record out. You know, I went to Buffalo. She was pregnant,
(15:10):
and you know, I continued to write. I'll always write,
you know. I don't write because somebody says to write.
I just write because it's my natural way of expressing
myself and I love it to this day. And then
I'm still very very lucky that the inspiration's still coming
out strong, very very lucky. So I went back to Buffalo.
I was writing and writing, you know, which is what
(15:32):
I do. And it was really hard times. You know,
money ran out, I had to borrow money. I was writing.
And then a couple of years in that was when
I thought I got songs I want to record and
I couldn't get arrested, made phone calls, you know, because
that tapes out of new songs, and nobody was interested.
They followed in general, people follow the hype, you know.
(15:54):
And at that time I was I was in Siberia.
I was up and outside of the Buffalo, but it
was basically Siberia. Really hard time. We had a great
you know. This was the one silver lining about those
years in Buffalo, which was about nine years, was that
I was able to be home all the time with
them and my children growing up. So we became very
(16:15):
very close. It's a very close family to this day.
So that was the one, but otherwise it was really stressful,
trying to feed a family with knowing. I mean, I
got a publishing deal in the middle of that, which
really saved my ass. But I didn't mind walking away.
I didn't want him to kill my you know, I
love music more than ever. And the record companies that
(16:35):
tried for me aris that totally tried, and I'm very
grateful Clive Davis and his team there people tried for me.
I'm grateful for that. And when I signed a Columbia
and eighty eight. That record came out in ninety one.
Rick Trdoff signed me, tried for me, and the timing
was wrong. He was by the time the record got made.
(16:56):
I was waiting for him to produce it, and he
was producing Patty's Smythe and the Hooters and Temmy Conwell.
I had to wait. I wanted him to produce it.
By then he was in the doghouse and on the
way out. So my record came out, did you know.
I was told later that it was dead before it
came out, But I got to make it. And Richard
Thompson plays on it, and a lot of White Right
(17:18):
sings on it, and Wicks Paul Wickens, McCartney's keyboard player,
and Robbie McIntosh, a great art guitar player from the UK,
played the Pretenders. And I mean, so I got to make.
Speaker 2 (17:31):
A great record.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
I'm very, very hap happy Richard Thompson for crying out
loud and his bare feet come on. So I mean,
it's very naive of me to think that way, you know,
because you know, I was living and dying on the
income and it just came out. And someone told me
later that the president at the time said at one meeting,
this record has four weeks to happen on its owner.
(17:53):
It's done. So that's not how it works. You know,
they got to promote it and stuff, and there's a
few people at the label really did you know, which
from which I'm grateful. So, you know, no chip on
my shoulder. And that was the idea of walking away
from the record business. When I first moved here, one
of the really predominant things I saw was a lot
(18:13):
of musicians with chips on the shoulder. Oh why not me?
Oh you know, I'm better than this guy.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
Bubbah.
Speaker 3 (18:19):
I want I want no part of that nonsense. So
you know, I to this day I don't have a
chip on my shoulder. I'm very grateful for the journey
has not been easy. You know, it's hard for my
my wife and my kids, but no one ever complained,
not once. Deeply grateful for that.
Speaker 1 (18:36):
We'll be right back with more of the Taking a
Walk Podcast. Welcome back to the Taking a Walk Podcast.
Speaker 2 (18:48):
Lucinda Williams once said, if there was any justice in
the world, I'd be opening up for him instead of
him for me. When you hear something like that from
a peer of that caliber or what goes through your mind.
Speaker 3 (19:02):
Well, I love I love us and that. When she
said that, we were down in Nashville. I think it
was the year two thousand something like that. I had
just put out Beautiful reck of the World on my
own label, and I met her at after a show
in New York, and she invited me down to Nashville
(19:23):
and literally set up a week of weeks worth of gigs,
put a band together for me. We did I played,
I think a couple of gigs with a band. I
did a solo gig. We did a songwriter circle in
which she was a part of. There were lines down
the block to see Lucinda and these other wonderful uh songwriters.
(19:44):
And I'm sitting next to her watching her sing. I'm
looking she's right next to me. I'm looking at her throat, going,
where's that voice coming from? You know that that amazing voice.
Nobody sounds like Lyscinda and I played a song on
the Road to Calvary and she just looked over when
I was done, and she goes, that's the most beautiful
song I've ever heard in my life.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
Something like that.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
And she said.
Speaker 3 (20:04):
That's when she made that quote about opening up for me. No, no, no,
that's not no. It was later that year she played
in New York City at Roseland Ballroom, legendary venue. You know,
Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, great bands. So she played the
Roseland Ballroom and I opened up and opened up the
(20:25):
show with my band. This was two thousand, had a great,
great band. I've been lucky with having great bands. We
opened up the show. It was packed. You couldn't get
up a toothpick in the room. It was so crowded
because she had just put out her great album, Carl
Wheels on a Gravel Road, utter masterpiece. You know, if
anybody hasn't heard that record, Carl Wheels on a gravel Road.
(20:47):
I highly recommend it. It's just brilliant. And so we
did it. We opened up. We got a great response,
and I'm up in the dressing room taking off my
wet clothes and somebody came running the telling me what
she said. She just said to the crowd. You know,
if it was any justice in this world, I'd be
open up for Willi and Ale instead of him. I
(21:07):
want it from me. Well, that just shows you what
a quality class act Lucinda Williams is. You know, in
an industry filled with wannabees, pretenders and people with big egos,
here's Lucinda Williams champion and other artists that she loves
and respects. And she's done that with many artists. I'm
(21:28):
not the only one that she's champion, and I think
the world I love her dearly, you know, and that
made me feel. I mean, the money can't buy some things,
you know, if I was stinking rich, I couldn't buy that,
you know, So God bless her for saying that.
Speaker 2 (21:45):
You've also had some incredible writing collaboration and other collaboration
with one of my favorites. He's been on the podcast
Steve Earle talking about your work with Steve and what
that means to you.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
Oh my god, Steve Url. So, Steve Earl lived like
literally three doors down from me. I'm in the middle
of ground fills right now and near the corner mcdouglin Bleaker,
and he lived a couple of doors over on Bleaker Street,
and so I would see him all the time, and
we became friends. He has a nonverbal autistic son, you know,
(22:27):
a great, great burden, and he doesn't tour anymore for Mike,
mostly from September and to May, to be a single
parent taking care of that boy. I'll see him on
the street coming back from a Yankee game with.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
His son, you know.
Speaker 3 (22:40):
And so I really grew to love Steve. You know,
I obviously a huge fan of his work. He's one
of America's great songwriters. I mean, I ain't never satisfied.
Guitar Town. You can just go down the Revolution starts now,
you can just go down the list of masterpieces that
he's written. He's like Johnny Cash to me. I love Steve.
And so I was making this record called The Day
(23:01):
the Ear Stood Still, and there's a song on it
called Blood on Your Hands, which was about COVID politics,
all about all the people who died out of mismanagement
and uh, which I consider murder. And I wrote a
song called Blood on Your Hands and we were mixed
in it, and I thought, you know, maybe Steve might
(23:22):
want to sing on this, so I texted him send
on the song. Five minutes later, I'm in, that's it,
you know, And there's there's a there's a video of
it if people go to YouTube and look up blood
on your Hands with Willie All and Steve Earle. I'm
so I can't tell you how moved I am. It's
(23:42):
like Lucinda, you know, there's two giants. And then when
I think a year later, I wrote a song called
wake Up America, and I was going to put I
wanted to put out as a single, which I did
before the election. Yeah. I love people. I love this country,
you know, and I think that it's a lot better
than it only appears to be.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
You know.
Speaker 3 (24:01):
I think there's a lot of good people in this country,
and people disagreeing on the facts, you know, because there's
so many news outlets nobody is about to believe and
people it's so divided. It's so sad. This is out
of tragedy. I mean, it's not going to last forever,
but it's pretty bad. And there's a lot of great people,
you know, in this country, and I think the vision,
(24:23):
the dream that is this country is still alive. It's
pretty buried right now. But I don't wake up America.
Just everybody like, hey, we can do better. Bobby Kennedy
used to say that we're good people, but we can
do better. Neighbors being neighbors. Don't be jumping to conclusions,
you know, let's not be judging so fast. We're all
immigrants here other than the first nations, people that are
(24:46):
that were here when the Europeans came over, and all
the people came from different countries. This is a country
of immigrants, and shame on this assault on immigrants. It's
just for show, and it's just for appealing to a base,
you know, and it's it's a shame. We're better than this.
And I think if people knew there's a line if
(25:06):
in blood in your hands, no uncle getting ugly out there.
If the people ever knew what was really going on,
there'd be another politician would be dead and gone. I mean,
I believe in this country and I think that we
can do better. I think we will. And I wrote
wake Up America and I same thing. I texted Steve, Hey, Steve,
you want to sing on this. I get a text
message back. Five minutes later. I'm in and there's a video.
(25:31):
It's on the new I put it on the new album.
My new album is called The Great Yellow Light, which
I'm so proud of, and it's one of my favorite
records that I've made and I love them all. And uh,
wake Up America is on that album, and there's a
video that's out. We put we reput it out. I
think we've got three hundred thousand people looking at it
(25:51):
or whatever. Wake Up America and Steve Earl's in it.
You know, it's a it's a prayer and a love
song to this country. You know that we can do better,
and I believe that we will.
Speaker 2 (26:04):
A new album, The Great yellow Light, is great. Love it.
It's inspired by Van Goes's letters to his brother. What
is it about Van go that resonated so deeply with you?
Speaker 3 (26:17):
With Van go Like the Great Yellow Light amidst all
this darkness and division, Like it's pretty dark out there.
You know, people's spirits are like down, you know. I
remember in the early sixties when John Kennedy was president
and there was a Peace Corps and there was you
can hear New York City outside of my window anyway,
(26:38):
the fire and ambulance and it. You'd be amazed. During
COVID how often you heard that all day long and
long story shorts. So with Van go So, with all
this darkness. I remember reading years ago one of Van
Goes's letters to his brother when he moved ar when
he moved to the south of France. She was blown
(27:00):
away by I love a huge fan of his work.
I love Vango, his story, his letters, his paintings. There's
something primitive that really resonates with me there, and I
love his work. And he mentioned to his brother that
he referred to the Great Yellow Light, how it inspired
him so in South France, and that stuck with me
(27:23):
and I wrote a song so a couple of years later,
not long ago, called the Great Yellow Light. And it's
not about Bango, it's just about inspiration in this case,
you know, it's it's about love. And I thought the
I thought that's the title of this record, the Great
Yellow Light. I wanted to make a record that would
inspire people, that a feel good record, that that would inspire,
(27:48):
you know, I mean, wake Up America's on there. It's
you know, it doesn't puts his foot around this record,
but it's inspiring. Anybody listens to it, I think you'll,
you know, you'll feel better whatever it ends with Washington
Day the album, the last song was called Washington's Day,
a song I wrote with two of the Hooters, Rob
Hymen and Eric Bazilian and also my producer at the time,
(28:10):
Rick Chertoff, wrote the song years ago in nineteen eighty
eight eighty seven eighty. I just signed with Airs with
Columbia Records, and I had just written a song and
wanted to plant for the producer. He was in the
studio working on a Hooters record. He was in the
record plant it's I called him up and he said,
come the boys, the ad band's out here. It's just
(28:30):
me and the engineer working on a mix. Come on buy.
So I went by the studio and was waiting for
them to work on a mix, and he said that
he told me the song was called Washington's Day, which
was a reference to July fourth Independence Day. And so
I'm sitting in the back of the room listened to
work on this mix, and it was so beautiful. There
(28:51):
was no lyrics, not a word, and here they are
mixing the song without a vocal on it, and it
was like listening to let it be. It was so beautiful.
And anybody hears that song Washingtons Day, you'll know what
I mean. It's stunning. And in the back of the room,
I just pulled out my pen and started writing. Did
you think I could ever forget the night by the
(29:11):
Arlington flame and the silence I heard it through streets
so deserted you whispered and called me by name? Did
you think I could ever forget the rockets, red glare
in your eye where Lincoln stood strong? There you held
me so long there that night and the fourth of
July and the chorus, I hope and I pray that
(29:31):
you'll be here with me when the mountains that rise
tumble into the sea, when the kingdoms that come set
us free on our way. Hope you'll be here with
me home on Washington's Day. I got chills just thinking
about it. It's it's a it's a Romeo and Juliet
story that takes place in Arlington National Cemetery and the
(29:52):
lyrics brought now to encompass war and you know, the
human condition. But it's a it's a song, it's a
prayer for better things. It's an optimistic end of this album.
This album is a firecracker. Starts out with wild Wild
World because it is a wild wild world, you know,
and it ends with Washington State. So I'm so, you know,
to answer your question, Van Goo inspires me to this
(30:16):
day and his phrase A great yellow light inspired that song,
and it's the heart of the album. It's one of
my maybe my favorite album. You know.
Speaker 2 (30:26):
I got chills as you were reciting that. It was
so wonderful. I know you're going to be doing a
bunch of dates, aren't you. You're that's you always right, My.
Speaker 3 (30:35):
God, my calendars. I got a lot of a lot
of shows coming up. I'm leaving town next Wednesday, going
to Tulsa, Oklahoma. The Bob Dylan Center's there and Woody
Gouthries Center. I was there in July and October in Tulsa,
and it's just amazing. Anybody listening, if you're looking for
an interesting trip and you're any kind of a fan
(30:56):
of Dylan's or Woody gouthries Man is it interesting. Well,
they're having a sixtieth anniversary event of Blonde on Blonde
on the twentieth of February, and they've got all these
really interesting people singing one song each off at Blonde
on Blonde. Then they asked me to sing absolutely Sweet Marie,
which I will, and then later in the evening, I'm
(31:18):
gonna sing like a rolling Stone, talk about shooting fish
in a barrel. They've got a great backing band. It's
going to be so much fun, and takes place at
Cane's Ballroom, which is a legendary thirties roadhouse. And then
I'm off to I got a Caribbean cruise legend it's
called the Rock Legends Cruise, which makes me laugh. I
(31:39):
don't consider myself a rock legend. I consider myself a
simple poet with a guitar. But and then I'm going
to Buffalo, and then I'm off to Spain for a
couple of weeks, tour in Spain, to Italy for a
tour in Italy, and I'll crash there for a week,
come back home. And then I got a Midwest tour
in the middle of April, which with full band, it's
(32:00):
going to be great. And then I've got a Spanish
band that backs me in Spain, a great band. And
I've had an Italian band that backs me in Italy,
great band. Because it's expensive to take my American guys.
You know, I'd love to do it, but it costs
a lot of money. And I'm not a stinking rich
guy yet, but I'm working on it. And then in
May I go to the West Coast. I've got a
solo solo tour out there, so I've got a full
(32:22):
spring and I'm happy about that. You know, seventy seven
year old grandpa who loves what he does, and it's
still fortunately pretty good shape.
Speaker 1 (32:31):
Knock.
Speaker 3 (32:31):
I would because I live on a sixth floor walk up,
which I have for fifty three years. And I saw
somebody sent me an article the other day, somebody saying,
how walking upstairs a sudden burst of it. You know
how good that can be for you. Well, I've hated
those stairs for years, but the last few years as
I walk up, I'm going, thank you, thank you, thank you,
(32:52):
think as I go up, because it's kept me somewhat fit.
Speaker 2 (32:57):
That's so great. Well, before I let you go, since
we do call this podcast taking a Walk Willie. I
have to ask you, if you could take a walk
with somebody, just suspend disbelief, living or dead, who would
you take a walk with?
Speaker 1 (33:13):
Then?
Speaker 2 (33:14):
Where would you take that walk with him? That's a
good one.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Two places come to mind right away, because I'll often
ask people if we had a time machine, what three
places would you want to go? Where would you go? Well,
there's a number of I'd go a bunch of places.
I go to Dallas, Texas, nineteen sixty three and see
what I can do to stop the same with John Lennon,
(33:40):
you know, and I was in the recording studio and
that he was killed and the record play at the
same studio. He was upstairs, I was downstairs and he
left five minutes later he was murdered. And I would
know so two places. But if I could take a walk,
I would go. I would go to Arl France, south
of France, take a walk with Van Go and just
to watch his world. And other than that, I would
(34:01):
go to Homburg, Germany, and I have to take a
walk with four guys and go walk around Homburg, Germany
with the Beatles. And those are two magical places for me,
you know, the south of France with Van goh and Homburg,
Germany with the Beatles. I'd love to do.
Speaker 2 (34:16):
That, oh Man, Willie Nile, this has been a joy
reconnecting with you, the great Willie Nile. See him when
he's out on the road. Check out the Great Yellow
Light and his entire catalog. It's an honor to be
with you, Willie. And thanks for being on the Taking
a Walk podcast.
Speaker 3 (34:33):
Here well, thanks for taking the time. I've enjoyed it
and bless your heart. And anyway, if I'm anywhere near
where you are, let me know, and maybe my guest
I'd love to see in person. Thank you for taking
the time, my brother.
Speaker 2 (34:45):
I'm Buzznight and thanks for listening to the Taking a
Walk podcast. Now, please check out our companion podcasts produced
by Buzznight Media Productions with your host Lynn Hoffman. Music
Save Me showcasing the healing power of me music and
comedy Save Me shining a light on how laughter is
the best medicine. All shows are available on Apple Podcasts,
(35:09):
Spotify and are part of the iHeart podcast Network.
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