Billy Eichner

This week on Thanks Dad, Ego sits down with actor and comedian Billy Eichner! To start, Billy thanks his parents for shaping who he’s become. Ego and Billy chat about the ways his parents showed affection, growing up in New York, and not having a driver’s license. They also dive into becoming extroverted, his first hookup, and not necessarily wanting marriage or kids.

 

Follow Billy

Follow Ego

Follow Thanks Dad on Instagram, TikTok and YouTube

\Watch the video of this episode on YouTube here!

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:09):
Ooh, it's almost summer. I like to think that basically
the whole year, it's almost summer. That makes me feel
really happy to say that. I get excited at the
notion that it's almost summer. I mean, is I'm wearing
a literal sweater right now talking about it's almost summer.
It's not that warm outside, but it's got me thinking
about how much summer makes us go out and meet
up with friends. And things are expensive right now. Things.

(00:34):
Have you seen the cost of gas, the cost of eggs?
I know you see it. So here's the thing. I
think we should be hanging out. First of all, you
know that I want us bringing friend like homehang set
back homehans, bring them back homehangs, bring them back to
the conversation. We don't have to go out, we don't

(00:55):
have to spend money. But here's the thing. If you
want to hang out with your friends and you don't
want to spend money, you gotta say, hey, I don't
really want to spend money, you know, just say hey,
I don't want to spend money on this hang Can
we go for a walk, Can we go on a hike?
Can I come to your home? Can I infiltrate your
pantry things like that, cause it's awkward going out and
everyone has a different idea of what they're supposed to

(01:16):
be spending out and I don't want that for any
of us, and so I feel like it should be
kosher and above board to be like, hey, I want
to hang out with you, I want to see you,
but I don't want to spend money, or I don't
want to spend a bunch of money. Let's do a coffee,
let's do a smoothie, or let's truly just go outside
and look at the stars. That's fun too. It's just

(01:40):
on my mind. I don't want people to feel like
they have to spend money. And when you don't want
to spend money, you're like trying to save up or whatever.
Like you should be able to do that. So that's
what I think we should do. We should just articulate
ourselves and say this is what I'm envisioning for the hangout.
Cause summer is upon us, which means people going to
be hanging out a lot more. And I think it's
okay to say what you need. We should make a

(02:02):
pact with our people and be like, I don't it's
I'm going to not judge you for saying you don't
want to spend money, and I'm going to say to you,
I don't want to spend money if that's the case.
And I know it's awkward and weird, but we love
our friends and let's make it safe for each other. Okay,
come on, There's so many things the museum. The museum

(02:26):
is free. Often the parks. It's like we rediscovered parks
back in twenty twenty Christopher Columbus that shit, and we're like,
oh my goodness, there's parks. I forgot about parks. What
else is there to do that's free? What else? Library
is free? I haven't even been to the library in
my neighborhood. I need to get in there. I mean,

(02:47):
what else? Minding your business is free? You can mind
a business your mind. You can mind your business with
a friend, mind your business with a loved one. You
could read a book. That's free. In many ways, it
can be at the library. What else is free? Kissing?
Kissing is generally free. I had to check in. I'm like,
are we paying for kissing? I don't know what the

(03:09):
market rate for kissing is right now? Kissing is generally
free kiss, kiss somebody, of course with consents, but it's free.
Generally speaking, there's so many things to do for free,
and spending money can be a lot and things add up.
But I want us to say, and I want us
to make it safe for our friends to say. I
ain't trying to spend money, but I do want to

(03:30):
see you maybe kiss you, you know. Anyway, up next,
I'm about to have a really cool conversation. I hope
it's cool with Billy Eichner, and I cannot wait. I
can't wait to have it. I can't wait for you
to listen. Here it is. How are you doing?

Speaker 2 (03:51):
I'm great? How are you?

Speaker 1 (03:53):
I'm good. Do you have a good weekend coming up?

Speaker 2 (03:56):
I do. I'm I'm throwing out the first pitch at
the Metsia game tonight a city field.

Speaker 1 (04:02):
This is exciting.

Speaker 2 (04:03):
It is very exciting. Though I'm a little nervous. I'm
sure by the time people see this it will not happen,
so my career might be over. This might be my
last interview. But I've been practicing okay, and it's a
very very exciting invitation to get It's huge.

Speaker 1 (04:17):
Which team invited you?

Speaker 2 (04:19):
The Mets? The Mets it's a city field. It's a
city in Queen's Yeah, when it was called say stadium,
city field, and so it's a big deal. And my
whole book is about growing up in Queens. So it's
nice synergy.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Yeah, I think. So, I think this is are we
doing overhand? Underhand?

Speaker 2 (04:34):
I've been practicing, so yeah, overhand? Okay. I was told
to throw it like a sling shot, like a sling shot, yeah,
except I do that.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
Okay, I don't know. I was asked to throw out
the pitch for the Orioles oh last year, but right
after I dislocated my shoulder, so I was like, I
can't really do anything right hand. But I'm now trying
to steal a lesson from you.

Speaker 2 (04:57):
Yeah you do? You hold it like this? Okay, I
didn't know. Yeah, and then you you got you gotta
you know, you're standing and then you have to like
lean in with your body okay, yeah and look at
the catcher, look at the ketch. Yeah, make eye contact.

Speaker 1 (05:11):
Oh from a distance.

Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yeah, it's like a week cute. Yeah, I hope.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
Say okay, Yeah, I feel like it's gonna go.

Speaker 2 (05:17):
Great for you, thank you. I just don't want to
be horribly embarrassing. People keep telling me, well, you won't
be as bad as like fifty cent when he did it,
or bab Babu, even Howard Stern, you know, like people
have really messed it up.

Speaker 1 (05:29):
Okay, Okay, I think I think you're gonna be Okay,
are you athletic at all?

Speaker 2 (05:33):
No? No, this is I was the worst kid on
my little league team. I was in the unique position
of always being the tallest kid in my class. But
pick Glass for basketball, you know, which is so awkward.
By the way, they should have They shouldn't have picked
me any sooner than that, because I was terrible. But
I think this is a nice lesson to show people
that you can be the worst at your you know,

(05:54):
on your little league team and still be asked one
day to throw out the first pitch.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
Okay, you heard it here for anything awesome exactly.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
I'm an inspiration.

Speaker 1 (06:03):
Yes, okay, I have to do an intro for you
so the people know if they don't already know.

Speaker 2 (06:08):
Okay, yeah, please.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
My next guest, who have already been talking to for
some time now, is an actor and comedian who's memoir
Billy on Billy, an audio memori is out now it's
Billy Eichner. Hello again.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1 (06:20):
I'm so happy you're here, Thank you for coming. Who
or what do you want to say thanks to?

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Oh I want to say thanks to my parents, even
though they're dead. I'm grateful for some time we thank
dead people in this country. No. I wrote a whole book,
Billy on Billy, which is it started out as like
the Billy on the Street origin story, and we were
trying to answer the question what kind of child grows

(06:46):
up to create a maniacal character like Billy on the Street.
And really what it became is a love letter to
my parents, you know, and to growing up in New
York in the eighties and nineties. But really they were
so unbelievably supportive and encouraging. They always let me be
me when it came to being gay, when it came
to having this intense interest in the performing arts and

(07:06):
in show business, they just always encouraging me to chase
my dream, you know, not knowing what was going to happen.
And I only I always knew they were great. But
in sitting down to write this book, and again, my
mom died when I was twenty. My dad died when
I was thirty two, but a month before Billy on
the Street became a TV show. Oh wow, So they

(07:27):
didn't see all the fun stuff happen. They saw like
the years of really wanting and trying.

Speaker 1 (07:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:33):
But they were so encouraging. And I realized when I
sat down to write the book thinking about this, you know,
all these stories came to mind from my childhood that
I really don't sit around and think about very often.
I don't live in the past like that. Yeah, but
it gave me a reason to do that, and it
just gave me such an appreciation for, you know, this
self respect that they gave me to take my desires

(07:55):
seriously as a kid.

Speaker 1 (07:56):
Yeah, that is incredible. So I want to say thanks
to them too.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
They're great and I'm so excited for people to be
introduced to them. And they were so funny and both
native New Yorkers, a lot of energy. So they were
just remarkable, really very.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
Special, and I'd love to hear that they supported your
endeavors and your passion for entertainment and theater. Now, what
was your relationship like with each of them?

Speaker 2 (08:19):
My mom was they were very different in terms of
how physically affectionate they were, even though they were both
very loving. Okay, my dad was much older than my mom,
which is an odd thing, so kind of in our
head secretly we always planned on like, well, what's what's
my mom going to do when my dad dies? Oh yeah,
and then my mom dies first, yeah, you know, out
of nowhere. So that was just very unexpected. But my

(08:41):
dad was older than my mom. It was a second
marriage for him. My dad was born in nineteen thirty.
He was in the Korean War. You know, he goes
way back speaking of throwing out the first pitch, my
dad used to tell me he saw Babe Ruth play.

Speaker 1 (08:54):
Oh wow, wow, Okay, that's my dad was alive.

Speaker 2 (08:57):
Now you'd be like ninety five or something. Okay, yeah,
but he's from the Bronx. If you know the Alan
Arkin character in Little Miss Sunshine. He was kind of
like that, you know, kind of very blunt, not very
physically demonstrative, you know, kind of old school. He didn't
like hug and kiss me a lot, but you can
always feel how much he loved me and supported me.

(09:19):
He took me to auditions as a kid when I
was trying to be a child actor. We read page
six together. We read all the gossip columns together. He
took me to Broadway shows. You know, my parents took
me to see Madonna at the Blonde Ambition tour in
nineteen ninety one, where she's like pretending to masturbate on
stage surrounded by gay men and bras in nineteen ninety one.
They let me do this and did not make me
feel at all uncomfortable about it. They loved Madonna right

(09:43):
and so. But my dad was a little more stoic
on the outside, but always really defended me and was
very excited when I started to do comedy in my
twenties and I'm on stage, I'm being so loud and
crazy and I'm ranting and raving about everything from pop
culture to like gay sex. And my dad would come
to every show and he would walk around the audience

(10:06):
and before the show started, I swear, my mom's not
alive at this point, and he's like a guy in
his seventies at this point, and he would walk around
with my baby picture and go up to strangers in
the audience and show them my photo and be like,
see this, that's Billy. I'm the father right then, And
then the show starts and I am shouting about like
getting fucked yeah, and so they're.

Speaker 1 (10:27):
Watching you and him being like and what is dad?

Speaker 2 (10:30):
It was crazy. I mean it was really lovely. So
my dad was great. My mom was the opposite in
terms of how physically affectionate. She was an incredibly warm, optimistic,
you know, sort of typical Jewish mother and how close
we were, but more kind of vivacious than that stereotype implies.
She kind of had a little bit of a sexiness

(10:52):
about her. My parents met at a disco in nineteen
seventy six called The Jungle on Long Island. You know,
they were New Yorkers, they liked to have fun and
they were just fabulous.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
People, wonderful and did you have slip siblings?

Speaker 2 (11:04):
I have an older half brother, Steve Eichner, who I
knew as a kid, but he mostly grew up with
his mom and we didn't grow up together in the
same apartment, so you know, he was around. I saw him.
He was he's a photographer and when I was trying
to be a child actor in New York, he took
all of my child actor had shots, which I just
posted recently. They're very funny and ridiculous. So we you know,

(11:27):
you know we're friends, but I was raised mostly as
like an only child.

Speaker 1 (11:32):
Really, sure, and your dad was the common denominator between
you and Steven, that's right. And you say he was
more stoic than your mother and not as physically affectionate.
This was your dad one to say I love you.

Speaker 2 (11:44):
No, Okay, he didn't say it out loud. And I
remember once my mom got mad at him. It never
bothered me because my dad so clearly loved me, right,
It wasn't It wasn't cold, you know. He just wasn't
a big kisser and hugger. By the way, neither was
his mother. Just his side of the family. They just
weren't as affectionate, well, weren't as physically demonstrative when my

(12:06):
mother was all over me and all over everyone. Yeah,
my mother told the dry cleaner she loved him, She
told everyone she ran into I love you, love you,
love you, love you, she would say to everyone. And
my dad was not like that. His love was a
bit more subdued. Yeah, but you could see it in
his eyes. But once my mom got mad at him
because he never hugged me and never actually said I

(12:27):
love you a lot, And then he came over to me.
I was in my bedroom watching TV. I was just
I was like, I was like, can you guys just
shut up and let me watch? Like David Letterman like,
leave me alone. I just want to. I don't care.
I know you love me. It's fine. But my mom
was upset about it. Yeah, And he came over to
me in bed and like leaned over and he was like,
you know I love you, right, And I was like, yeah,
of course I do, Like, leave me.

Speaker 1 (12:47):
Alone, get out of here, this what's happening. Yeah, it's
weird when you say it.

Speaker 2 (12:52):
Yeah, I'm just like I know, I know. And I
did know. I did you know? I mean, you know?
And I also understood even then. He was from an
old generation of men who didn't say I love you
as easily. You know, they weren't as vulnerable. He got
softer as he aged, which which happens with people. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (13:11):
And were you closer to one parent.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
Than the other, as like a young gay child. I
was closer with my mother when she was alive, though
there were certain things my dad did with me that
my mom wouldn't do. My dad got off work more
easily than my mom, so he would take me to
auditions in Manhattan. We grew up in Queen's and he
would take me into the city to audition for commercials

(13:36):
and musicals. I barely got anything. I was I don't
know if you know this story. I played John Goodman's
son in a sketch on SNL when I was fourteen
year old.

Speaker 1 (13:45):
I didn't know that. Oh wow, Yes.

Speaker 2 (13:47):
It was one of the only things I got. Yeah,
except I got there and thought I was like the
only one in the like the only son in this sketch,
like real life, exactly exactly. And then there were twenty
five kids playing his children in the sketch and we
were all just glorified extras. But it was amazing, like
Chris Farley was in my sketch, and like all these
Mike Myers and this was the year the years of

(14:07):
like Phil Hartman, so that was very exciting. My dad
took me to all those things. Yeah, but before my
mom died, I was closer with my mom, you know,
a young gay boy, like, you're closer with your mom,
and because she was so affectionate. Yeah, I think it
was easier to be closer to her. My dad was
a bit quieter then when my mom died. You know,

(14:28):
it forced me and my dad. And this actually happened
with my half brother Steve too, Like we both got
closer to my dad because now we really needed each other. Yeah,
and we had to be closer, and you know, and
then he was basically doing the work for two parents.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
Yeah. Oh wow, what kind of work did each of
your parents do?

Speaker 2 (14:46):
My dad worked for the City of New York. He
was a commercial rent tax auditor, basically going around to
companies and saying, you know, you owe tax money to
the city. Okay. My mom he was an accountant by trade. Ye.
My mom worked for what was then known as the
Phone Company, which became New York Telephone and eventually becomes Verizon.

Speaker 1 (15:08):
I just worked in the Atlantic in their summer's exactly right, Okay,
So she worked and it became Verizon.

Speaker 2 (15:17):
Yeah. She worked in the World Trade Center when I
was a kid, So I used to go to the
World Trade Center all the time for like her office
Christmas parties and things. I have all these kind of
interesting memories about the World Trade Center because of my mom.
But yeah, they were nine to five middle class people
in Queens. I was an only child. Yeah, so whatever
they had, I got Yeah, you know, that's one of

(15:39):
the nice things about being an only child. But middle
class people know show business connections. They loved show business
from Afar. Sure, my dad read all the gossip commns,
the New York Post, you know. We watched Entertainment Tonight
and all those shows, and we'd watch all the award
shows together. They loved it. Started with me really falling
in love with the theater and then kind of dragging

(16:00):
them or begging them to take me to Broadway shows.
But once we started doing that, they realized how much
they loved the theater too. They love the theater, you know,
And we didn't always sit in good seats, but we
would go get discount seats somehow. And I saw a
lot of theater growing up Broadway. Off Broadway. They took
me to see plays about like adult gay men that
like a twelve year old normally doesn't see. Yeah, and

(16:23):
that all had an amazing impact on me. That's incredible, really,
I mean, they were so ahead of their time, and
that's why the book is like a real tribute to them. Ultimately.

Speaker 1 (16:31):
Yeah, that's special. That's so special. And also the notion
of growing up as an only child that you have
this half brother at times, did you ever wish for
additional siblings?

Speaker 2 (16:42):
I tell this story in the book My mother maybe
when I was ten. I think she started to feel
guilty that I didn't have a sibling, and she asked me,
I guess before it was too late. She said, do
you want a brother or a sister? Do you feel
bad you don't have a sibling? And I really acquired
my dad's like bronx, New York inspired, blunt and just practicality,
and I was like, look, you guys don't have a

(17:03):
lot of money. I'm fine on my own. I have
a ton of friends. You know, I get to do
whatever I want to do. And the last thing I
want is some annoying brat to share my bedroom with,
telling me like what TV shows to watch? And you
were ten, I was like ten already. It was very
kind of billy on precocious, very precocious, only child, New
York City child actor. You know, dangerous combination isangerous.

Speaker 1 (17:28):
I don't want no damn siblings. That's fun.

Speaker 2 (17:30):
And I think they were relieved. They were like, oh,
thank god.

Speaker 1 (17:33):
I don't want to do that because I just found out.
Because they don't teach women a lot about their bodies,
you see in school. So I just found out from
a friend who had a baby that it takes two
years for a woman's hormones to return to normal, or
what her norm is. That's crazy to me that you
have no reason to but I just need to say
it out loud.

Speaker 2 (17:52):
Well, no, I'm happy, I see you. You saved your Yes,
my mom had the same hormones for all of her
middle That's.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
Good, Billy. If you ever had any interest in living
somewhere else, given you're so New York's down.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
Such, well, I actually did live in LA for ten years.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
You did?

Speaker 2 (18:10):
Yeah, I did, and only last year moved back full
time to New York.

Speaker 1 (18:15):
What made you move?

Speaker 2 (18:16):
At first? It was work Funnier Die. The company produced
Billy on the Street, and I am very very hands
on with the editing of the show, because you have
to be. It's so pivotal to that show, to any show,
but especially a comedy like that. And I asked them,
I said, I need to be involved in the editing.
But it was solo budget when we started that it
was much cheaper for them to have me come out

(18:38):
to LA to edit in their office. I know this
is a fascinating story. People are on the edge of
their seat listen. So that brought me out to LA.
Then I got parts and parks and recreation that kept
me in LA, and I kept getting work and La
was exciting and new. And I was a kid who
loved Hollywood, you know, grew up wanting to be a

(18:59):
part of all of that. And so for a while,
it was really fun and different and New York was
all I knew, and I wanted a new experience. And
then something happened a few years ago. I really started
to miss New York a lot, and I started to visit,
and I visit more and more, and I just said, Okay,
I'm a.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
New Yorker and you were like, I did it. I
did La, And it's lovely, you know.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
And Hollywood's going through a hard moment right now. It
doesn't quite feel the same in La, sadly that it
did five ten years ago. Yeah, And so I don't know,
I just need that New York energy in my life.

Speaker 1 (19:35):
Right were you? Were you walking in La?

Speaker 2 (19:38):
I'm that crazy person that walked everywhere. I don't have
a driver's license, I've never driven a car. I'm scared
to drive. Oh, I don't go on wheels or blades.
I can be in a car, but I don't like
to be behind the wheel.

Speaker 1 (19:49):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (19:50):
And I strangely lived in LA for ten years without
a driver's license, but only in the years of uber
and stuff.

Speaker 1 (19:57):
Okay, got it? Oh my goodness, Billy, that stresses me.

Speaker 2 (19:59):
Also, I'm not the only one I remember early on.
Maybe maybe she now has a driver's license. Leana Dunham
did not drive a car.

Speaker 1 (20:07):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (20:08):
Wow, Nathan Lane does not have a driver's license out Okay, exactly, yeah, exactly. Yeah.
It's good enough for Nathan Lane. It's good enough for me. Yeah, yeah,
I made it through somehow.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
Yeah, and then you came home and you're like, and
you don't need to go back.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
So I'll go back to LA once in a while,
but New York is the place for me.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
Yeah. What are what would you say as your most
New York quality?

Speaker 2 (20:33):
Wow? I think so much of who I am and
so much of my work is informed by having grown
up here. My most New York quality I'm pretty fearless,
except I guess when it comes to driving.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
The wheel of a car.

Speaker 2 (20:51):
Here's the thing. There are basic things that everyone can
do that I'm scared to do. Drive a car, go
on ice skates, light a match. I don't like five Oh, Billy, you.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
Would be devastated to know I used to like to
play with matches as a child and lit my front
yard on fire by accident.

Speaker 2 (21:06):
Now you see, I'm right, you are right.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
But it all worked out. I know, I lit my
front yard on fire, and then I got on SNL
and now I have a podcast.

Speaker 2 (21:13):
So what you just keep going on?

Speaker 1 (21:17):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (21:17):
Wait, what happened with the what do you mean the bat.

Speaker 1 (21:21):
From front lawn? I was playing with matches too young
of an age, wind blue and and then I got
nervous and dropped the matches. But I've told destroy them.
I would hate to bore people destroy but it was
it's like and then I dropped the match, and then
the front yard was on fire. Department ultimately came and everything.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Was, everything was okay. That scares me, Like I can
run up to a stranger and shout at them on
the street, and which I've been doing for years. There
are certain things that would scare a lot of people
which I have the wherewithal to do. Right, I can
like steal myself and do it and there are basic
things that I'm terrified of that I cannot do.

Speaker 1 (21:56):
Okay, so we have the driving, we have the fire.
What else matches, I should say.

Speaker 2 (22:03):
Ice, skates, roller blades, Like when that was the thing,
I was like, oh God, no, I can't ride a bike.

Speaker 1 (22:08):
You can't ride a bike.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
I had a bike with training wheels as a kid
in Queen's which I love the training wheels. When the
training wheels came off, I was like, oh, I didn't
like that, and I got scared. I just I don't
like being on wheels or blades.

Speaker 1 (22:21):
You don't like wheels or blades.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
You just don't like being in a car.

Speaker 1 (22:24):
You don't like the like unilateral aspect of a I.

Speaker 2 (22:27):
Don't trust myself with balance, oh something about I don't
know hand eye coordination. Well, when it comes to driving
a car, I think my mind is gonna wander. I
know it is. Wow, Because I didn't grow up having
to drive, because I was in the city. I took
the subway to high school every day. I just never
needed to. And then by the time I was older

(22:48):
and thought, oh maybe I should drive a car, I
was in a place where I thought my mind wanders
so much, and I'm used to that being fine. Yeah, right,
because on the subway your mind can wander. When you're
walking for the most part, you know, you can listen
to music, your mind can wander. And I was worried
about my mind wandering and you know, hurting myself and
hurting other people on the road. It's just one of

(23:08):
those things. I inherently know the world is better off
without me behind the wheel. I know, I know it
is fair enough.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
And let me tell you, Pepe, I do drive, and
people's minds do, in fact wander.

Speaker 2 (23:19):
Yeah, that's yeah, I mean.

Speaker 1 (23:21):
But we're out here.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
Do you like driving?

Speaker 1 (23:23):
I love driving. Always say that I used to not
like driving. I love driving.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
I grew up again.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
I grew up in Baltimore, and then I went to
college in LA and traffic was Yes. In my first
two years, I didn't drive, and I liked letting other
people drive. And then I started driving, even being in traffic,
and this is crazy. I lived on the west side,
would perform at UCB East Side, oftentimes in the evening,
so that meant really bad traffic in LA. This is boring.

(23:49):
The traffic is worse going west to east because lots
of people work on the west Side. I lived on
the west Side, and I'd be heading east during rush hour,
the worst time to be going in that direction, and
I missed my commute. Once I got rid of my commute,
I was like, I miss being in traffic.

Speaker 2 (24:05):
Is because it was just like alone time.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
Yeah, I was like, I'm catching up on phone calls
hands free of course, right, and I'm like listening to music.
I could hear an album all the way through.

Speaker 2 (24:15):
The music part sounds fun to me about driving, Yeah, yeah,
I don't. But you know, I walk around now and
listen to my music. Fair enough?

Speaker 1 (24:21):
Will you go in a weaimo?

Speaker 2 (24:23):
I'm terrified of a weaimo. My friend just texted me
for Mother's Day. She heard what she wanted from Mother's Day.
She's in San Francisco, was for her kids and her
husband to take her in AWAYMO. This is what she wanted.
I'm you're a mother of two. But she she was
very excited about it. She said she they loved it.

(24:44):
But now, I when I'm in LA and I look
over and I'm in an uber and I look over
and there's a driverless car. That shit still freaks me out.
I'm not there yet. Emotionally, I'm not If.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
You're not ready to have your driver's license, I can't
imagine for the reasons you're not.

Speaker 2 (25:00):
I don't want to be behind the wheel, but I
want someone to be behind the wheel.

Speaker 1 (25:03):
But it needs to be there. It is jarring, but
you look over I've been in Awaimo. I do kind
of love it because you don't have the whole negotiation.
Sometimes you're feeling incredibly introverted because I go back and forth,
but you're feeling incredibly introverted. You get in a car,
there's no one there. There's not the negotiation of are
we talking? How much shocking I get? Yet it can
be terrifying. It is jarring, and there's so many more

(25:26):
waymos in LA in the last year than when I
went truly a year ago.

Speaker 2 (25:31):
I was like, oh there, yeah, over now, yeah, I
wonder if it could work in New York? Is it?

Speaker 1 (25:37):
I don't think that it's in New York? And I
have had that curiosity myself, like would this work.

Speaker 2 (25:42):
Here with the bikers and messengers?

Speaker 1 (25:45):
Right, Billy, what would it take you to get in Aweymo?
What would it take for you to get in away?

Speaker 2 (25:50):
Moo? Look, I'm open to trying it. Okay, what would
What I can see happening is me learning to drive
for the idea of me, like on the freeway and god,
that's terrifying.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
Wow, But you don't feel uncomfortable having your safety in
someone else's hands.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
I have no choice. Okay, sometimes I do, like when
you have a no uber driver who's clearly not great. Yeah,
but I just sit there like, oh god, oh God.
But most of the time they're okay, Look, they're better
than I would be.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
What am I gonna not go in a car? Ever?

Speaker 1 (26:22):
You know, did your dad drive, mom drive?

Speaker 2 (26:24):
My dad drove and my mom didn't drive, so maybe
that has something to do with it.

Speaker 1 (26:28):
Okay, it's like you're half non driver.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Yeah exactly. They made me confident about everything, but not
driving basically.

Speaker 1 (26:36):
But also you said your coordination is off, which surprises
me giving you love the theater, Like, did you ever
take dance classes?

Speaker 2 (26:42):
I did. I was forced to take dance classes as
a musical theater student in college, but that was never
my strong suit. I'm a good singer, you know, I
was funny, I could act, but dancing was not. If
a role required a lot of real dancing, I'm not
getting it.

Speaker 1 (26:58):
Okay. There was there a genre though, that you were
better at than others of the dancing.

Speaker 2 (27:03):
I remember I took modern dance. You can kind of
bullshit your way through that. I'm not saying I'm don
Timothy shallow Am comfort.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
I love modern dance, beautiful.

Speaker 2 (27:16):
I love modern and I do love it. I love
watching dance actually, and I've seen like Justin Peck's shows
in New York, and I have major respect for dancers
because I can't do it. They're so hot to me,
they have the most beautiful bodies. But I was just
never great at that. You know, tap looks fun. Tap,
It sounds like tap. You're not like flying across the room,

(27:40):
doesn't require that same type of like ballet like grace exactly.
I don't know what I'm talking like.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
I don't want to get canceled.

Speaker 2 (27:48):
I don't get cancel but but it feels a little
more like you can stand in one place and just like,
you know, that looks fun to me and maybe a
little more manageable.

Speaker 1 (27:55):
Okay, Okay, I mean I I think that's fair. I
did some tap dap dancing classes when I was younger,
and I'm like there's something very there's something very fun,
very feel fun.

Speaker 2 (28:09):
It feels very and you're like stomping out aggression.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
Do you have any guilty pleasures?

Speaker 2 (28:23):
You know? I try not to feel guilty about the
things that I like to watch. I'm sure I do
like certain things that other people would say are guilty pleasures,
but I'm like, why should I feel guilty about it?
I like that answer, what are you guilty pleasures?

Speaker 1 (28:36):
I don't. I don't feel guilty a damn thing.

Speaker 2 (28:39):
Somebody will tell me. Oftentimes, the things, especially culturally, that
are guilty pleasures are things that women and gay.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
Men like, Oh yeah, you know, yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:48):
It's always Oh that's a guilty pleasure, you know, And
I don't like that.

Speaker 1 (28:52):
That's fair. Do you watch reality TV?

Speaker 2 (28:55):
I'm not a big reality TV person. I don't. I'm
not a person who thinks that ruined the world or anything.
It's just not for me. I watched the only now
what I did like, I don't know. I liked reality
competition when that first started, like the early seasons of
American Idol and Project Runway. I love as a teenager
those early seasons of the Real World on MTV. Still, yeah,

(29:19):
I was so good. Some of the old Real World
folks like we follow each other on Instagram and I'm
so starstruck. Judd and Pam, Yeah from San Francisco. Real World.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
I mean I think my Gayana was on well, someone
who was my gynecologist was on Real World. I know,
can you imagine her looking at my vagina? And I'm like, so,
tell me, what was it like living in the house
six other strangers.

Speaker 2 (29:43):
I love that. As an adult, I don't watch a
lot of it except sort of a sad but maybe
interesting story. The only full season of Real Housewives I've
ever watched, and really some of the only Real Housewives
episodes I've ever watched, and I watched the whole season.
The first season of Beverly Hills coincided with the three

(30:04):
months my dad was dying in the hospital, and it
was all that I could wrap my head around was
the Real Housewives. I couldn't handle anything else because life
was like so stressful and scary and sad. And I
watched that whole season, Like the new episodes would come
on Wednesday nights and I would really look I would

(30:26):
all day. I'd be like, I just I just cannot
wait for the Real Housewives at Purplely Hills because I
was going to the hospital every day and you know,
taking care of my dad. And then strangely, you know, sadly,
my dad died, like right as they aired the season finale.
I watched it six months later, like or whenever. It
was like a year later, and the new season comes
out and I didn't need it anymore, and I thought, nope,

(30:50):
I'm not. I needed it during that very difficult time,
and now I don't have any reason to watch it.

Speaker 1 (30:56):
Yeah, I'm done with it. It served its purpose.

Speaker 2 (30:58):
It served its purpose, but I was grateful for in
the moment, and it also made me see maybe why
people watch those shows. I don't know. People have a
lot of anxiety and they need an escape, something that
doesn't feel too heavy.

Speaker 1 (31:10):
What are you watch that makes you not now now
that you've left The Real Housewives of Beverly Hills behind season.

Speaker 2 (31:16):
One a long time, yeah, eleven?

Speaker 1 (31:19):
Yeah, what do you watch now when you're like I
want to escape?

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Oh, I watch a lot of things. I've been watching
The Comeback, the last season of The Comeback Genius. Yeah,
my favorite show of all time. I don't know if
that's an escape. Yeah, but it's very very and very
Hollywood century. This season especially, I thought really caught kind
of this strange, somewhat bleak time in Hollywood. I thought

(31:45):
it really captured that mood. I don't know if that's
what they were going for, but it kind of with
the AI of it all like that felt. I really
could feel that. What do I watch as an escape?
I love a music documentary because I'm not in music,
so it allows me to like watch a story about entertainment,
but that I don't feel like triggered by. I just

(32:07):
watch now if you want hip and cool. I just
watched the count and Crows documentary. Okay, do you even
know who that those? That band is, I'm too young.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
I do know the Counting Crows.

Speaker 2 (32:19):
They're a big band in the nineties when I was
in college. I just watched the count and Crows documentary.
I love a music documentary. I what else do I watch?
All kinds of things? You know, what's a comfort watch
for me? And I talked about this in my book
Gilmore Girls.

Speaker 1 (32:34):
Yeah, I remember Gilmore. That's right.

Speaker 2 (32:37):
I didn't watch it the first time around. I was
like in my early twenties, I was going out all
the time, I didn't need Gilmore Girls now as a
forty seven year old man. I'm a Gilmore middle aged man,
is what I am. You know, once in a while,
like I'll get under the covers and watch the Gilmore Girls,
and I'm not gonna feel ashamed about Time House.

Speaker 1 (32:54):
How many seasons deep are?

Speaker 2 (32:56):
They have so many seasons. That's what I under Gilmore Girls.
I was that's like old school TV where they made
like twenty six episodes, hour long episodes. Yeah, and it's
like eight, ten, twelve seasons and they brought it back.
I'm not done. Yeah, nowhere, we're done. Oh, Carol's only
going to Yale or wherever she's going. Rory Gilmore anyway.
But I love it. It's very it's a comfort watch.

Speaker 1 (33:19):
Oh that's good to know. I might have to pick
it up.

Speaker 2 (33:21):
It was time for you to discover gil I'm going to.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
Discover Gilmore Girls because I remember it being on TV
when I was like in elementary or middle school or something.
But I think I was like I was watching Seventh Heaven.

Speaker 2 (33:33):
Oh, I was the same.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
It was in the same vibe. It was Dawson's Creek
around the same time as well.

Speaker 2 (33:39):
Yes, I think so Gilmore Girls is like two thousand debuts.

Speaker 1 (33:43):
Okay, okay, good to know.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
I'm going to get it into Laurren Graham. You know
she's I really I really enjoy her.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
I do too. Did you watch her in Parenthood?

Speaker 2 (33:52):
I loved that show. That is such an underrated show
love and I've told Lauren Graham as much. Yeah, I'll
have you know Parenthood. If you haven't seen, you know
that's that'd be a good rewatch. Yeah. I love that show.

Speaker 1 (34:05):
It's a beautiful time of time. Do you do the
movies a lot as well?

Speaker 2 (34:08):
Do you go to Yes, movies were a huge part
of my childhood. I would go to the movies with
my parents every Saturday night, literally religiously. It's like what
bonded us as a family. Even if there was nothing
we wanted to see, we would just pick something and go.
I don't go to the movies as much anymore. I
don't think anyone does. Yeah, yeah, but but I love
I still love the movies, but I find myself watching

(34:32):
random movies, Like I'll watch something will pop in my
head and I'll say, oh, I want to watch that,
and it's nothing anyone else is watching currently. But you
can watch any movie at any time.

Speaker 1 (34:41):
So I just think, yeah, that is a thing. Do
you have a bunch of the streaming subscriptions or are
you like everything?

Speaker 2 (34:49):
You have everything? I don't use everything, but I have it.

Speaker 1 (34:52):
Isn't that messed up? Because I also have things where
I'm like, oh, I need to get Paramount plus to
watch this show, and then I'll discover I already have paramou.

Speaker 2 (35:00):
Totally and I never remember the password if I need it.
But I have everything. It's strange, like things were supposed
to be simplified, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (35:11):
And then somehow got complicated. How do you take care
of yourself besides like comfort watches in this day and
age where everything's a little kooky, right.

Speaker 2 (35:20):
How do I take care of myself? I listen to
a lot of music. I have music on constantly, like
from the second I get up going to bed. I
really love music that calms me down. I just love
Part of the reason I moved back to New York
is that I really missed just being able to walk

(35:41):
around and to be around other people without having to
talk to them, but you know they're there. You know
that's very New York. It's like I need that. I
need to be able to just leave my apartment and
not when I'm shooting Billy on the street or just
like when I have my AirPods in and I can
just walk around. Everyone in New York does that. One
has this like main character energy, but it's very zen

(36:03):
to me because I don't want to I would walk
around LA. That's the creepiest thing.

Speaker 1 (36:07):
It's very weird. And also people are looking at you
like what's going on?

Speaker 2 (36:10):
What's yeah? Yeah? And I would try to kind of
recreate that New York feeling in LA, but you can't. Ye.
The weather's perfect, but there's literally like no one around,
and it would creep me out. And I need people.
I have that New York thing where like I don't
necessarily want to know who my neighbors are, but I

(36:30):
want to know they're there.

Speaker 1 (36:31):
Right, Okay, Fair, Are you extroverted or introverted? Would you say,
obviously know Billy on the.

Speaker 2 (36:36):
Streeting my work. I'm very extroverted. I think I'm just
kind of normal. I can be normal. Oh, I can
be shy, like yeah if I know. If I'm around
my friends, I'm not shy. If I'm around new people,
it can take me a.

Speaker 1 (36:50):
Minute to warm up. Yeah, Okay, have you always been
like that?

Speaker 2 (36:54):
Yes? And I've gotten less so I think in a way,
especially if I'm in certain like gay spaces or something like,
I know that people will recognize me, and I know
everyone's like it was that weird for me. It's like
an icebreaker. I don't have to explain myself, right, you know,
even if they don't really know who I am as
a real person. It's like that actually undercuts some of

(37:16):
the awkwardness for me. When I was in my twenties,
I was like my best friend of thirty years since
high school is still my best friend, Heath. He's gay too,
and he was always the life of the party in
our twenties, right, and he's gorgeous and very very friendly,
and I was like his quirky, quiet, like nerdier friend,

(37:37):
like standing beside him. I've gotten I'm not like that anymore.
I'm more I'm more extroverted now. But in my twenties,
when I was younger, I was definitely quieter.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
Okay, And how did you and Heath, like, how did
you guys bond? What was the bond about?

Speaker 2 (37:51):
Espe on this speech and debate team in high school? Yeah,
and in my I went to a strangely I went
to a high school in Manhattan called Stuyvesant.

Speaker 1 (38:01):
I know Stuyvesant went to college with a girl who
went to Stuyvesant.

Speaker 2 (38:04):
So it's a public school, but you have to take
a test to get in, like an SAT like test,
and it's really math and science focus. To this day,
I have no idea how I got in. I was
not a math and science student. I'm guessing my English
scores carried me. But at Stuyvesant there weren't that many
opportunities to perform right. It was a more of an
academic environment. So the speech team. Speech team is a

(38:26):
very cultish thing where you like perform scenes from plays,
but with all kinds of weird formal rules and it's
hard to describe. Josh Gad I think just made a
documentary about speech team, which which explains it. But it
was one of my only outlets to perform. And Heath
was on that team too, and we just bonded. We
didn't know each other were gay. I always thought it

(38:48):
was very obvious that I was gay. I like musicals.
I started the musicals. I was, you know, being funny
and I like to perform and I just thought based
on my interests. People knew I was gay. My parents
certainly knew I did not No Heath was gay at all. Yeah,
and then we were best friends. We never talked about it.
You know, he would like kind of pretend to date girls,
and I was just kind of being like asexual. And

(39:11):
Stuyvesant was a great place to be in the closet
in high school in the mid nineties because very few
of the kids were sleeping together, even the straight kids,
because everyone was so focused on school, math and science
exactly like what college you were going to get into?
Right in that way, it was a great mask the
way for being gay. No one was like, where's your girlfriend?

(39:32):
And you know, no one had girl, very few people
had girlfriends.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:35):
So then Heath and I had you know, i'll give
you the PG rated version of this, So we had
this is you can Okay, great, all right.

Speaker 1 (39:45):
It's a podcast exactly.

Speaker 2 (39:47):
Well, now that we're in the heated rivalry it we
were not. We did not play hockey, but we were
on the debate team just as well, okay. And we
graduated from high school the end of June nineteen ninety six,
and so thirty years ago, like right around this time.

(40:08):
I keep telling Heath like it's our thirtieth anniversary. A
week later, July fourth weekend, nineteen ninety six, he invited
me to his parents country house in Pennsylvania. I said okay,
innocently enough, and we went to his country house, hanging
out like everything was normal. His parents go to bed
one night. He's going to die that I'm telling this. Ooh, sorry,
He's the best. And we were not like boys who

(40:34):
wrestled around, you know, we were not like jocks like that.
We didn't we were gay, Like, we didn't have that
type of like aggressive nature at that point, right, But
one thing led to another. We were watching TV and
he kind of threw something at me, and then I
threw it back. And then all of a sudden, I
cannot believe I'm telling a story. It's not even in
my book. We were like on top of each other,

(40:58):
and I could tell very quickly that like, Heath is gay. Oh,
and I could not believe it. I was shocked. Yeah,
And that became so we were each other's first gay hookup.
Like we came out to each other in that moment
and hooked up in that moment. Then it's a long story,
like he didn't really want to be gay, and I
was like, We're gay. I was so happy. I was

(41:19):
like so ready. Yeah, and I was like I know,
I'm I had already gotten into college. I knew I
was going to Northwestern to study theater and musical theater.
In my head, I had the whole plan. I was like,
all the guys are going to be gay. I'm gonna
come out. It's going to be great.

Speaker 1 (41:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
Heath was not. He was like about to be a
frat boy, you know, at Cornell, and he didn't want
to be gay at that point. So he kind of
went back in the closet and we stopped. We kind
of stopped talking to each other. And then he called
me senior year when I was in college, and he said,
you know, I miss you. I'm starting to come out
of the closet and I want to be friends again.

(41:53):
He came out to Chicago to visit me. We went
to gay bars, and we've been best friends ever since.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
Oh my goodness, that's a that's a good story.

Speaker 2 (42:00):
Yeah, he's the best. He's like my brother.

Speaker 1 (42:02):
Oh that's incredible.

Speaker 2 (42:03):
Brothers who once hooked up. Fine, sometimes like that, you're
gonna win a glad award.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
Thank you. I've been gunning for a long.

Speaker 2 (42:19):
Yeah, I'm glad. I'm kidding. I have a glad award.
I'm very grateful.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
You have to cover all your bases there, Bill. Are
you am I allowed to ask if you're dating?

Speaker 2 (42:29):
I am single? I date? Okay, I'm single right now?

Speaker 1 (42:31):
You're single?

Speaker 2 (42:32):
Are you?

Speaker 1 (42:32):
Do you want to get married? One day?

Speaker 2 (42:35):
Married? I would be in a relationship married if the
person I was with felt if that was important to them.
I'm not against it, but I'm not like, oh God,
I can't wait to get married.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
It's not a thing that matters to you. Yeah, I
get that. Also, I'm seeing this trend now too, where
I'm like all the friends of mine who are engaged,
which is many of them, and even friends in the
last few years have been engaged. People are being like
cool to stay engaged and be like we just live
in an engagement and also being like we're not having
some grand wedding, We're going to the courthouse. It's like

(43:09):
the vibe right now.

Speaker 2 (43:10):
I like that vie too, like just staying engaged forever.
Imagine if feel sexy.

Speaker 1 (43:15):
Yeah, the tension like we'll do it one day. Maybe
it's like.

Speaker 2 (43:18):
A very goldie han Kurt Russ.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
Yeah, it works, it does work. What do you think
that is though? That makes like, yes, the like it's sexy,
it's enticing, but like, what do you think that is
that makes a couple that goes, we don't want to
get married or we're just gonna stay like we're not
even gonna get engaged. Because I know some couples like
that as well, who just going together forever and they're
doing the whole thing work. Yeah, why do you think
that works? I'm like, you know, he doesn't.

Speaker 2 (43:42):
Feel like you're locking yourself up. Yeah, you know, it
feels more free, it feels more liberated. The pressure isn't
there the minute there's pressure there too much pressure. Yeah, yeah,
it keeps you locked in on the one hand, but
also I think it starts to feel a little less fun.

Speaker 1 (43:59):
Yeah. Do you feel that way about titles too, by chance,
like being like going, we're official, we're defining the relationship
and stuff. Do you feel that way about that on dating?

Speaker 2 (44:08):
Yeah? I mean I don't really, I don't know if
I feel strongly about that one way or the other,
Like we're official, I mean, I guess if you're dating,
you want to know, like, okay, we're dating. Yeah, right,
because in the gay world, I mean, even when you're dating,
there's like always like other guys, I mean, you know,
the gays, it's like I can't keep up, you know.
But so it's nice to have a little stability. Yeah,

(44:30):
we just don't need all the old school rules necessarily.

Speaker 1 (44:33):
Yeah, fair enough. Do you want kids?

Speaker 2 (44:37):
I do not have a burning desire for children, and
I don't I think if you don't have a burning desire,
you probably shouldn't have kids. However, let me just put
this asterisk on it in case one day this all
blows up in my face.

Speaker 1 (44:50):
It should not. I don't want anything anyone says on
here ever blowing up. That's my desire.

Speaker 2 (44:54):
By the way, I just want to say rare.

Speaker 1 (44:57):
Like, yeah, I'm like, come, let's have let's have a conversation.

Speaker 2 (45:00):
If I agree with that having people celebrities to Billy
on the street. If there was something that they that
just kind of fell out of their mouths, like and
they didn't want it on the air, I'd be like, yeah,
we're cutting it, and you my show.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
What an honor?

Speaker 2 (45:13):
The test click world where people feel like they need it.
But my aster is having kids. Again. If I was
with someone and we were in love, and I felt
like we were in it for the long haul and
it was very important and important to them to have
a kid, I could have a kid. I am not
like dead set against it, and part of me thinks
it would be fun. I'm not one of those people

(45:36):
who's going to have a child by themselves if I
never meet the one, that's right, Okay, travel and have
a good time.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
Yeah, Instead, Exactly where do you normally like to travel to?
Are there? Are you like a like beach person a
city person.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
I like the beach to be in the near vicinity,
but I'm a little too restless and I get a
little too hot to sit on the beach all day long. Okay,
I like the beach for now. I'm more of a
like sit in the pool with a drink type of person.
Where do I like to travel? I'm a little bit
under traveled. There's a lot of places I haven't been

(46:12):
that I want to go. It's a little embarrassing. We
didn't travel a lot when I was a kid, Like
they didn't. My parents did have a ton of money,
So what we spent our money on things in New
York that didn't require getting on a plane and so
and then when I got older and I finally had money,
I didn't have time. So now I'm trying to like
make time till I've never been to Japan. Everyone's like,

(46:32):
oh my god, Japan is like the greatest. I need
to go. I know I need to go to Japan.
I know, the very excited waiting for Billy to exactly. Yeah,
so I want to go to Japan. I've never been
to Berlin. You know, things that I should places I
should go. But I love Paris very much, probably my

(46:54):
second favorite city. And I like all the gay places
I in terms of all like the popular gay or spots.
I'm a Provincetown, Massachusetts gay. I love Pete Town very much.
It's a magical place. And I you know, I do
Fire Island and all the things.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
Okay are you how are you with group travel?

Speaker 2 (47:12):
I like a group. I don't need twenty people. That's
a lot.

Speaker 1 (47:16):
We're recapping it. Where would you I think.

Speaker 2 (47:19):
Four to six is a good number. Even three can
a three that you really like? That's good?

Speaker 1 (47:25):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (47:25):
If one person wants to like not do something you
still have a person to do something with.

Speaker 1 (47:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:31):
I also don't mind traveling alone.

Speaker 1 (47:33):
Yeah, not for like.

Speaker 2 (47:34):
An extended period of time. But like you know, I've
gone to London by myself. That's actually kind of fun.

Speaker 1 (47:40):
I want to try that. I do, try. I try.
I went to Barcelona by myself not too long ago,
and I'm like, I also do enjoy a solow Yeah, travel,
it's notice I'm sleeping when I want to, for how
long I want to, eating where I want?

Speaker 2 (47:52):
No pressure?

Speaker 1 (47:53):
Yeah, it is very nice, but I get that you
would also appreciate it as an only child getting to
do your thing.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
Oh, you're right, that's used to getting my way.

Speaker 1 (48:02):
What are you in a relationship? An avoidant or an
anxiously attached person?

Speaker 2 (48:07):
Okay, everyone's talking about every terms up.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Or maximize or minimizers.

Speaker 2 (48:13):
I don't know what these things are. Relationship avoidant versus
what anxiously attached?

Speaker 1 (48:19):
So avoidant or an anxiously attached person. So that's two
attachment styles. Or you can be securely attached.

Speaker 2 (48:26):
That sounds nice, but are you I'm not attached to anyone.

Speaker 1 (48:32):
But like when you get in a relationship, whereas things
start to get romantic with someone.

Speaker 2 (48:36):
Do you get I freak out?

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Do you freak out and get avoidant in a little
stand off and get cold feet? Or are you like
I need answers we should hang out, or are you
like whatever I think.

Speaker 2 (48:47):
If you're feeling that anxiety, it might not be meant
to be. I have felt that anxiety. The minute you're
my Heath and I always say to each other, we
have an expression. The minute you feel a need to
check in, it's over. If you have to check in,
it's over.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
This is your official stance.

Speaker 2 (49:06):
My official stance. Maybe you check in once orright the
person's busy, if they have a certain kind of thing
going on in their lives where they're like really busy
or fine at their job or whatever. But if you
find yourself needing to check in where you want to
write a text, that's just like he's not getting back
to me just checking in, that's over. They are not
into you save your time. And it's so hard in

(49:27):
the moment because you want to make excuses if you
like the person. If you have to check in too much,
goodbye bye. Go meet someone that actually wants to text
you back.

Speaker 1 (49:36):
So if you get the if you feel the urge
to check in, Billy, right, do you go, fuck it, it's done.
If I'm having the urge to check in, I'm not
doing it, or are you going? I will check in
this once.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
It's what happens usually that, But I as I've gotten older,
I've tried to limit that. You know, sometimes you got
to give the person the benefit of the doubt. They're
not always available when you are, but you always I
have this with a guy I recently. You know, you
always know, you get that feeling in your gut he
could have gotten back to me by now. Even if

(50:08):
he does eventually get back to you, if it took
too long, it's a little funn you're looking for other options.

Speaker 1 (50:14):
Oh yeah, And so then you kind of just go
all right, I know what this is a moment of weakness.

Speaker 2 (50:19):
You might say, oh, he's so hot, I'll just check in.
But but even then you know, like it's not meant
to be. And almost always that gut feeling is right.

Speaker 1 (50:30):
Yeah, yeah, it's true, I will say when you talk
about it is a hard one that in the moment,
especially if you have chemistry when you are together, and yeah,
and it's a good time, damn that stuff is hard.
How do you deal with not liking like a really
good friend's partner or the person that they're dating, even.

Speaker 2 (50:48):
Luckily that hasn't happened a lot. Yeah, it's tough when
that happens. What do you do? You just kind of
have to hang out with the person without the partner around.

Speaker 1 (50:58):
You know, I'm like, oh, I don't have that.

Speaker 2 (51:01):
I'm just like, yeah, do you not have that?

Speaker 1 (51:03):
I'm imagining a friend in the situation where they're having
to check in with someone and you're kind of like
it's bad news.

Speaker 2 (51:08):
It would be a nightmare for me. Like if Heath
had a serious boyfriend who I didn't like, that would
be very hard. He was in love with him and
the guy like was treating him okay. I would be like, oh, yeah,
he's he's great, Like what are you say?

Speaker 1 (51:23):
You're a good actor, but for as good as you
as I didn't buy.

Speaker 2 (51:30):
But luckily that's never happened. But that's a tricky one. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:35):
Would you tell a friend though, and straight up be
like with a bad partner, not not the bad partner,
but he's not done it to you.

Speaker 2 (51:41):
Like if the person started to complain about the partner
and say I don't you know, ask questions like what
do you think about his behavior? Like if they brought
it up with me, got it? Then I would find
a gentle way to be honest, Yeah, because I don't.
If I love my friend, I don't want them to
be with this fucking your Yeah, so I would find

(52:04):
a way if they brought up some skepticism about the
relationship to me. But I wouldn't be like not just
want to tell you your boyfriend sucks a great day. No, No,
you can't do that. They have to realize it on
their own, right, Okay, unless the person's like abusive.

Speaker 1 (52:19):
And then you got to get in there. I mean
it's a big broad yet we got to get in
there and get them out of there. Oh wait, Billy,
I want to play a game with you. We're trying
a new thing around here. It's called dad Daddy Father.
This is our version of fuck Mary kill.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
You've heard of it, I have.

Speaker 1 (52:34):
Okay, we've got We've got three guys for you, and
I want to.

Speaker 2 (52:38):
Know dad Daddy father.

Speaker 1 (52:42):
Yeah, which we should maybe move around so if it's
at we shouldn't. We'll do this in real time here
with you. So fuck Mary kill. It should perhaps be
daddy father. No, do we want to kill the father
or the dad?

Speaker 2 (52:56):
Well, yeah, I need to know what the rules are.

Speaker 1 (52:58):
Well, I mean help me.

Speaker 2 (52:59):
Do I want to fuck the daddy?

Speaker 1 (53:01):
Of course, you want to suck the daddy.

Speaker 2 (53:02):
And I probably gonna want to suck the dado. We're
being real. Kill is the gay version. Fuck fuck.

Speaker 1 (53:14):
You're like, I'll fuck the daddy, I'll fuck the dad
and the father exactly their neighbor. Okay, and they're childlessen peptids. Okay,
so everybody's getting fucked, but maybe we'll see.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
Yeah, so so so so the dad is is like
your friend you know what, Yes, I like that, And
daddy is who you want to have sex with, and
and father is get him out of here. We're gonna
kill the father.

Speaker 1 (53:40):
I know that feels wrong.

Speaker 2 (53:42):
Yeah, you want to killing any of them? Feel maybe
you don't kill anyone. Maybe father is who like you.

Speaker 1 (53:50):
I don't want anything to do with, Like it's like
a priest where it's like, well that's not say I
don't want anything to do with, but like they're in
another room.

Speaker 2 (53:58):
Father, father is like, yeah, I want space from thought.

Speaker 1 (54:01):
Do you believe they gave me a podcast. Honestly, think
about it all.

Speaker 2 (54:05):
Thinking about everyone who has podcasts. Now, it's not that
much of a surprise. I think you're doing great, by
the way, and I think it's very inclusive to have
a game where you literally just fuck.

Speaker 1 (54:16):
Everything everyone's getting in this one. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:20):
I mean at this point, I you know, there are
a lot of dads and daddies that I would probably fuck.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
So then we're not gonna kill the father? Do we just?
Is it like fuck? Fuck?

Speaker 2 (54:29):
I think in the other room, I think it's I
think it's fuck fuck, oh fuck fuck fuck.

Speaker 1 (54:38):
Won maybe it's maybe it's maybe it's fuck make love
to be friends with.

Speaker 2 (54:46):
Oh that's nice.

Speaker 1 (54:47):
Yeah, Okay, so I'll write it down.

Speaker 2 (54:49):
Fuck make love to be friends.

Speaker 1 (54:51):
With, be friends with? Okay, Okay, all right, So it's dad,
daddy father fuck So but I'm dad is make love
to dad? So Dad? I would say, daddy, daddy as fuck.

Speaker 2 (55:05):
Daddy's fuck yes, dad?

Speaker 1 (55:06):
Always want you always want to fuck the daddy dad.

Speaker 2 (55:09):
You want to hear this on Amy Poehler's podcast, I'll
tell you that if you thought that's what was going on,
She's like, you know, having a lovely conversation with Adam Scott,
and we're like, I'm gonna fuck dad. I'm gonna fuck
daddy too, and I'm gonna blow father uncle Dad. Okay, Okay, okay, wait.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
Wait, Daddy, Daddy as fuck, dades make love too, and
fathers be friends with is for friends for friends.

Speaker 2 (55:42):
Okay, Dad is be friends with No dad is daddy.

Speaker 1 (55:47):
Dad is make love.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
Oh, dads make love.

Speaker 1 (55:50):
And Daddy is fun making daddy.

Speaker 2 (55:52):
Daddy is like this sells a lot of audio. Okay,
all right, making love to dad, Daddy is fuck and
there is.

Speaker 1 (56:01):
Friend Okay, thank you, we thank you for helping me
sort that. I hope somebody wrote it down. I don't
have already implement.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
Okay, I think I got it.

Speaker 1 (56:09):
Okay, okay, but I mean for later because you helped
me crack the case here today, for the future as well. Okay,
has tattoos that were has tattoos that are the names
of his exes. Okay, so I'm gonna read all three.
Has never floss and stands outside of the theater putting

(56:33):
on shows himself. Has tattoos that are the names of
his exes. Has you don't want to fuck anybody now,
has never has never flost, and stands outside of the
theater putting on shows of his own.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
Well, i'll fuck the guy with tattoos.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
Even if it's the name is of the exes.

Speaker 2 (56:58):
Okay, the the other guy is a floss.

Speaker 1 (57:02):
You can't fuck someone who doesn't flow, Okay, so I
have so where does the person who doesn't fly tattoos?

Speaker 2 (57:10):
So i'll the guy with daddy.

Speaker 1 (57:11):
So that's daddy.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
That's daddy, the guy who puts on shows. It's a
little sad, but that's sweet. Okay, that'll be father.

Speaker 1 (57:19):
Father.

Speaker 2 (57:19):
You'll be friends and then I'm making weight, No.

Speaker 1 (57:21):
And then you're making love and you'll make.

Speaker 2 (57:23):
Love to the guy who puts on shows.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
So that's so that's dad. The guy putting on shows
outside of the theater's dad.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
That's Dad, Okay, yeah.

Speaker 1 (57:31):
And then Daddy is the guy who has tattoos.

Speaker 2 (57:35):
And then father is the guy who doesn't floss. You'll be.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
That's fair enough.

Speaker 2 (57:41):
Yeah. But the guy who puts on shows, what kinds
of shows? Like a show could be hot if he's like,
has like an acoustic guitar and is like singing nice
like fun.

Speaker 1 (57:51):
We have specified Do you want to amend your answer.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Or I would like to know more about the guy
who puts on shows.

Speaker 1 (57:58):
Well, that's why you could be a friend. So far,
there you get to talk to him. Okay, so oh no,
father is the flossing anyway, you got it. The guy
who puts on shows you're going to make love to. Okay,
and you guys, you'll get to know them because you're
making love. Okay. Now it's time for a segment. I'm
calling thank you next.

Speaker 2 (58:16):
Okay, this is.

Speaker 1 (58:17):
Where our previous guest has a question for you, and
you'll get to ask our next guest a question. All right,
So Frankie Grande was our previous guest, asked, what's your
favorite Celene Dion song?

Speaker 2 (58:29):
Oh? I just saw titany Okay, Frankie Grande and a
lot of my friends are in that show. It's really
really funny. My favorite Selene Dion song? Ah, this is hard.
I should pick a single. There are deep cuts that
I could mention.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
If they're faves, I think you should pop off.

Speaker 2 (58:45):
Sometimes the deep cuts are NICs because they're not as
like overplayed. But let me mention one that people know.
I actually really do like taking Chances, okay, which they
sing in the show, and I like, oh, you just said.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
One you're on, So you're going with taking chances, taking chances,
taking chances. Good answer, because I'm not going to listen
to that now, Billy, what question do you want to
ask our next guest?

Speaker 2 (59:06):
Oh? Okay, what is your least favorite? Celine Dion.

Speaker 1 (59:12):
The new logo for this podcast, take my face off.

Speaker 2 (59:16):
Let's get Selene on.

Speaker 1 (59:18):
I hope I can get I hope I can book
Selene next. That would be great. That would be.

Speaker 2 (59:23):
Great, wait for her to play dad Daddy. But you
helped us sort it out.

Speaker 1 (59:31):
I'm just saying I think you'll have fun. Thank you
so much for doing this today.

Speaker 2 (59:35):
Thank you, of.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
Course that was my conversation with Billy Eichner. I hope
you enjoyed, and I will see you on the next episode.
I love you, I need you, I won't you. Also,
the beach is free, and that piece of advice from
me is free. A lot of shit is free. I

(01:00:00):
dare you comment wherever what else is free? Give us
ideas a free shit to do because people ain't trying
to spend money. Okay, waw that was free too. Thanks Dad.
Is a production of Will Ferrell's Big Money Players and
iHeart podcasts, I'm your host, Ago wodem Our, producer is

(01:00:20):
Kevin Bartelt, and our executive producer is Matt Appadaka