#72- How is the Ukraine Invasion Impacting The Music Industry?

The Boys have had their show taken over by the great Zak Kuhn, head of the Nashville Briefing and The Zak Kuhn Show. The boys waste no time jumping right into how Russian tours are dealing with the growing Ukrainian crisis. While also pondering, could Country music be next for multi-million dollar catalog acquisition? Jason Aldean could be the first with his new 100 million dollar deal. Lastly, Evergreen Artists, like Tears for Fears, are in the forefront. With longer and longer careers,  Newer records serve as a catalyst for increased catalog consumption. This, the FGL Musical, and more on the Biztape!

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Sources:

AJR Cancels Russian Tour Due to Ukraine Invasion — Will Others Follow? By Variety

Tears for Fears are Back by Variety

SPIRIT MUSIC GROUP BUYS JASON ALDEAN MASTERS IN $100M+ DEAL By MBW

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey guys, So our guests just wanted to go, and
we were about it. So Zach Cune showing us how
much of a go getter he is right here at
the start. Let's let's just go. I've had Mike d
on the on my podcast, which was a great interview,
and I've never had Bobby Bones on. But you know,
my hundredth episode of the podcast is coming up. And
on Bobby's episode, he interviewed Christian Bush and he said,

(00:26):
he said that you're not a real podcast until you've
done a hundred episodes. And he made this whole thing
about which is probably bullshit, like what was that? That
doesn't even mean anything? Like what does that even mean?
But that's what he said, that you're not real podcasts
even a hundred episodes. And I'm approaching my hundred episode.
I think I'm like eight episodes away, and I want
Bobby to come on as my guest from my hundredth episode.

(00:48):
All right, we can make that happen. Do you think
that would be like a good like antidote? Just like
he said, you were in a real guest, you were
in a real podcast until he had a hundred episodes.
And on my hundredth episode. I'd him on. I will
bounce him this audio. We'll get it to him this
audio and uh, And all I'm saying is I want

(01:09):
to be a real podcast. I want Bobby to be
to be what makes me a real podcast? I don't
I think that's I think that's a real Um. I
think that's a real point to be made. I wanted

(01:30):
to get Joe's microphones. You're in. Don't worry, We're gonna
I'm gonna cut that together through audio magic. Fantastic. So,
first off, welcome to the show. Very unusual intro for us,
but we're gonna go with it anyway because we have
the lovely I'm gonna let him. He was very excited
to introduce himself. So we're gonna make me sound like
an ego. Maybe it's just like I couldn't wait to
introduce myself. What would all you do? Your thing? What was?

(01:55):
Welcome to the business tape You're All Things Music, Business
and Media podcast. I'm here Colin ni Kay with my
lovely co host Joseph Bazilewski and introducing himself. We are
with Zack Qune on the podcast. Nobody says my name right,
They everybody would imagine. I think I said it wrong
before to Qune. I think it's just that when our
ancestors came over from Ellis Island, they just made up something,

(02:17):
and that's what we've been saying for a hundred years.
I don't know if anyone really knows how to say,
but qune with a you sound keene Zack Qune. Have
you ever thought about a stage name where you're where
it's spelled with a que. I've always want to stage
name because I think Zach Keune is a horrible name.
I love it. I love the name Zach. The problem
with Qune is it's a fine name, but nobody knows
how to say it, so it's it's a horrible stage name.

(02:38):
My middle name is Alexander, so I've always thought about
Zachary Alexander. That like just that that could be a
cool name, like two first names, very common in country music.
I thought I would use, you know, if I if I,
if I was an artist, or maybe be Zachary Alexander.
I don't know if that's a great um. I don't
know if that's a great name. So Zachary Alexander. Other
than you're virgining music career. We are waiting for the tracks.

(02:59):
I know you're a good guitar player, so we're waiting
for that. But what else do you do in the
music industry? The well, I run the newsletter of the
Natural Briefing, which is you know, thousands of people read
it every day, which is very exciting, and we've got
amazing audience and decade readers. And I also host a
podcast which is named after me, The Zach hun Show.
So I really missed my opportunity to pull in a
stage name. Um, but um, you know the podcast, the newsletter,

(03:22):
and um, I spent most of my time really on
those two things, and we're trying to make everything work. Yeah,
we appreciate. We just got in the newsletter game ourselves.
So because I saw that, because there's actually a link here, right,
what's tell me about your newsletter? Appreciate man, you were
just the best. We should just have you all the
time from my social cues everything. You're just a really
good transition. So I ruin it and call it out.

(03:43):
But yeah, our newsletter basically is a catch all kind
of like our show of music Macro. So I'm looking
at what's going on in the music business every week,
and I'm gonna get send this to your newsbox, and
it's going to be more macro than yours necessarily is.
And it's to be like, hey, let's talk about all
these different things that didn't make it in the show

(04:03):
basically because the exactly is happening on the newsletter. Yeah,
the B sides essentially, Yeah, that's what we call it,
is the B sides. So I do that. I link
out the regular show. We talked about the music we
recommend at the end of the show, which since we
just jumped right into this, I'll learn you right now
because I get our guests every time is we'll talk
about the music you listen to at the end of

(04:24):
the show. I'm actually glad to have this advanced notice.
Yeah I knew everyone. It's very upset when I don't.
But yeah, that's the point in the newsletter. And then
we got all of our socials for all the podcast
update stuff and uh, fun photos at the biz tape
and pretty much yeah, that's what we mostly do. I mean,
the newsletter has been really fun. Obviously, maybe we could

(04:44):
talk a little bit more after about our your Newsletter
experience and everything, because she's been going on for a while.
I mean, I know a lot of people here in
Nashville that talk about this newsletter. The newsletter has been
going on for about two years. Um and um, yeah,
what was the question? What we're like, you know, had
you started this newsletter like I started the newsletter in

(05:05):
Las Vegas at the A C. M Awards. Uh, And
I guess twenty nineteen and I was saying at a
lunch with a group of publicists who were basically saying
how they wished there were more like country music newsletters essentially,
and I sort of had this idea of like I
could do that. And I said to a friend of
mine in a hotel and he actually said to me,
he said, don't tell anyone you're gonna do that, because

(05:28):
there's no way you're going to do that, and it's
gonna be like really embarrassing when you like tell a
bunch of people you're gonna do it and then end
up not doing it. He was like, don't tell anyone
that you're going to do it. But I kind of,
you know, I I felt a I felt a commitment
to it. So I I originally I signed to like
five people who are like close friends. I was like,
you know, what do you think doing this is good?
And eventually I did that for about a month. And

(05:49):
I was talking to someone today about this because originally
I would send my newsletter out in the morning, and
I would wake up at like two three in the
morning and I would write it like in the morning
to send to someone. And then someone's I mean, you know,
you should really just write like the day before and
like schedule it to go out in the morning. I
was like, that's a way better idea. So we write
it the night before, the day before, and we set

(06:09):
it out and you know, it's one of these things
that we've done a little bit of marketing, but it's
really grown very naturally, naturally from word of mouth, people
forwarding into each other. Um, and yeah, like I said, like,
I mean, thousands of people are reading it every day,
so it's yeah, I mean you're literally And so what
are these dailies? Are they weeklies? Or they comes out
three times a week? Three times because um, you know,

(06:30):
because I'm just lazy, I don't want to write every
single day. Um. But um, but I think we're actually
moving towards every day and we've started to put out
a little more content. We've started doing interviews on Sundays.
Every Sunday, we've sent out like a like an executive interviewer.
We just started doing this, UM, and we're starting to
do a little more branded contents and things that we're
sending out more emails more frequently. But look, our bread

(06:50):
and butter is three times a week, alright, nobody wants
me more than that. We talk about here. Yeah, you
got that, and then you got your show as well.
I mean, so the show, yeah, and well the show
is where I'm actually in the process right now of
um signing a new podcast deal which nobody even knows about.
You're getting exclusive content here the but um, but but,

(07:11):
I mean, we've had amazing You guys probably have this
because you guys have great guests too, and it's like
the podcast is such an excuse to talk to you
ever you want. We had Billy Gibbons on my podcast.
It was Easy Top, who was the first concert I
ever saw. It was Easy Top, And I'm a massive
Billy Gibbons fan, and I brought my best friend along
to do the interview with me because he's a massive
Billy Gibbons fan also, And it was like, that's just
such a cool moment like you do this podcast, you

(07:33):
do a show like that's just it's just a you know,
it's a platform to just create great moments and kind
of like memories in a word way that maybe sounds
a little dramatic, but I mean, there are so many
people I've talked about my podcast. I never thought I
would ever have the ability to talk to. So it's
just such a cool platform to have and to be
able to tap into that. Yeah, definitely, it has been
fun to use that card especially and just be like, hey,

(07:55):
you know, you wouldn't talk to me regularly, but now
you want to talk to me recorded at just weird.
Just to be clear, I would never talk to you
to either of you regularly ever. Without it carries around
a platform, There's no way I'd be talking to either
one of you. So Zaka so and and he like
brings the mic everywhere he goes. He's got the zoom
ready on hand. I bring the mic everywhere. Yeah, He's like,

(08:17):
you're in business meetings, were like hold on, hold on,
hold on, let me hitt, Yes, do we dive into this?
So we got some big topics here we do. Zack's
hijacking our show Joe, I just want to know. I'm
scared a little bit. Are we going in order here?
Because I'm I'm excited to talking about some of these things,
So yeah, we can go in order. UM, so let's

(08:37):
start off with UM. If you have heard any entertainment news,
you might have also heard about world news. So one
of the biggest world news events obviously is Russian invading
the Ukraine. And obviously I cannot overstate the tragedy that
is going on over there, but you know, for the
scope of this show, I want to kind of stay
on the music. And the question is, now, what is

(09:00):
this gonna do to the entertainment industry, like especially live entertainment.
As we're seeing a lot of different acts and bands
start to figure out am I gonna pull the trigger
and try to go to Russia? Or am I not?
Am I going to cancel it? What's going on? So
the first one to kind of go down this route
was A G. A j R. And they canceled their
tour of Russia obviously because of the invasion and clearly

(09:23):
stated that. And the question now is well others follow suits.
So another one that followed literally today Green Day, Green Day.
I saw yesterday. Actually, I think they announced it yesterday
on social media. They post a story on their Instagram.
Here's my thing. And this is gonna sound so ignorant
and like this is my fault, but to be totally honest,
like I think Russia sounds like this very scary place

(09:45):
in terms of like you know, there was the voter
fraud and all that. Like, to be totally honest, I
did not know that people even toward in Russia. Like
I didn't know that people even went there within the past,
like recently had a date in Russia and Moscow school
like Q. Like I didn't even know anybody was even
going to Russia. And it kind of brings up like

(10:07):
parallels to Israel, I know, like Roger Waters is always
like trying to get artists to not go to Israel,
which I don't really want to get into that, but
like it's just interesting, like you know, it's interesting how
these things affected. And the thing that's really sad that
Green Day actually posted is that they were like this
is not for the fans in Russia. It's just like,
you know, the fans are fans everywhere, right like and

(10:27):
and in a weird way, I think art is an
empathy machine, and art is kind of what you need
in bad places to sort of you know, I don't
like art, Like rock and roll is a good thing, right,
there should be a rock and roll concert and a
nice release of emotion, you know, a time to get
out there and really like feel feelings that maybe you've
been bottling up just to get. I don't know if
that's it, but I think it's more of that. You know,

(10:49):
art can create feelings of empathy, and I think it
has this very powerful ability to I don't know if
you're gonna change Pune's mind the Green Day Show, but
I just you know, in a way in this in
this place that's run by this horrible dictator, there should
be great art expressed and shown. But you can't go
to Russian play a show. What are we talking about.
You're not like a Disney Channel original movie. You're not

(11:11):
going to bring the country together by playing the best
song of all time. You know, you can't. You can't.
You have to cancel the show. Green Day canceled. And
what I'm curious to know is like, is anybody else
even schedule to play in Russia? Like, so, yeah, there's
a couple of big acts that are going down and
want to play in Russia. Um toe. So they haven't
said like that, thankfully. No one's been like, yes we're going,

(11:32):
you know what I mean, like Russia putin Forever. No
like uh, but people have just kind of been silent
on it, and they're still booked for it. So right
now we have One Republic, Bring Me the Horizon, Young
Blood Girl and Red Judas Priest, uh Callett. All these
different acts are scheduled to play and there's even big
festivals that go there, which is kind of going and

(11:53):
what you were saying, I didn't realize how big of
a market it is, but it's a huge market of
supposedly for the European sector of the touring into Street.
You can't play Russia at the stage in the game.
You can't do it. You gotta play Ukraine if you can.
I hope that doesn't sound sensitive. There's no way you
can really play Ukraine either, but you you. I think
there's no way you can get into you can't do it.

(12:14):
I think it's a bad I feel like, just lookwise,
it's bad. I also feel like this is a different
situation where it's like it's not as it is political,
but I also think for artist teams, um, it's a
little bit easier of a cancel because it's a safety
issue at this point and wants to go, like who
wants to? And then like I want to? You don't

(12:34):
want to play at the Kremlin like just I do
just not today, like not not in this moment. And
I hope I'm not saying sensitive. I just feel like
you can't go right now. It's not you can't, yeah,
I mean everything is closed down. I feel like you
can do it's impossible. So like it's interesting because a
couple of people have said the reason why this could
be such a big deal is because of different fan

(12:55):
bases that are really big in Russia compared to that.
That's what I'm saying is you're punishing the fans and
it's not it's not the fans fault is kind of
the issue, right, that's the right. And I guess the
question is are you going to try to pull like
a Billy Joel like you're going across the iron curtain?
You know what I mean? It's actually where it is.
It's a great it's an epic thing and uh, I

(13:16):
mean see that is such a rock and roll moment
and and in that movie you can see that the
fans are so excited and the I guess the guards
or the Kremlin are like basically telling everyone to like
tone it down right, And that's kind of what makes
that movie so epic. Same with there's a there's audio
that you can find of Roger Waters performing the Wall

(13:36):
right as the Wall fell in Berlin, like within the
same month or something, and it's like one of the
most epic concert you know things. Ever, it's it's in
these moments where it's like where you can come and
like you know, but the problem is like you can't
do it, you can't play Russian. To my question is
is really do we think that fans, due to how

(13:58):
this is becoming so in the face of everyone in
the world right now, will look to these artists and go, hey,
I still see you have a show here. Why are
you not making the decision to cancel it now? Why
are you waiting? You know what? I'm wondering if that
kind of anti Russia sentiment will affect artists who maybe
just like, well, let's see how this plays out. They've

(14:19):
only been a bad look to not be canceling your shows,
right in Russia. You gotta cancel the shows. There's no way.
By the way, if POON packed it up tomorrow, i'd stay.
You still have to cancel the shows. You can't be
playing Russia right now. Well, I mean, what do you want?
I know who am I? But you can't be playing
Russia right now. That's actually what Uh. This guy named
Jeff Meal, who's the Paradigm agent, said those exactly words

(14:42):
he said. He said, Uh, you got a post war
situation to deal with, even if it's over quickly. The
second part is is that it would become a moral
decision to play in Russia after this. So you hit
that right on the nail. It's like, this is causing
a huge, you know, schism in live entertainment, especially for
this big market, which apparently from what I was reading,

(15:02):
has very very very low taxation, which is why a
lot of people are very like want to go there
to tour because there's huge middle class coming up that
can you know, provide merch sales, ticket sales, and they
don't get tax as much. But also what's interesting about
this is that this is the first time that we've
really seen the world market in I would say years,

(15:25):
actually have a closure of a huge giant region. I mean,
we think back to the Beatles and you know that
Billy Joe example we're talking about about him playing the
Soviet Union. We've kind of lived in this luxury world
where the entire world is so connected you can go
anywhere and play a show, and it's kind of weird
now that we're living in this reality where it's like, well,
there's this huge part of the world now, like morally

(15:47):
and also physically, because it's not safe enough, you cannot.
I think there's always been maybe not for safety, but um,
you know the Rolling Stones did their playing Cuba. I
guess that was eighteen or that was a couple of
years ago. They played Cuba for the first time. They
were never never able to play Cuba. It's a great
uh concert footage of the Red Hot Chili Player Pepper

(16:08):
is playing in front of the Pyramids, which was actually
shot by I think a production company here in Nashville,
and and like that's an epic thing, playing in front
of the Pyramids, and I think they weren't. I think
it took them a long time to be able to
set that up and do that. So I think there's
been a couple of places. But yeah, you're right. It's
like we there's a luxury that you can basically anywhere
your fans are, you can basically go and perform, and
you should go. And I feel like playing Russia. There's

(16:30):
something about playing Russia that is so bad ass. And
I think that it's the juxtaposition of the rigidness of
what you think the Russian you know, political system is,
and with the rawness and the looseness of rock and
roll in the rebellion. You know, I just think the rebellions,
the rebellionous nature of rock and roll, it's like what

(16:50):
better place to bring it than Russia. You know, rock
and roll is like this rebellious thing. And in America
you can't even rebel anymore because you can basically do
whatever you want, right Like, even the leaders are smoking pot.
Where in the sixties, you know, it was like nobody
was smoking pot. Levels of oppression are the level of
pressure are like a place where I think you could
still feel the rebellious energy of rock and roll is

(17:13):
probably in a place like Russia. But no, you can't
go play show in Russia right now in this moment.
I just I just don't know how you do it.
It's not it's not good. I guess the question is is, like,
do you think so much of yourself that you're like,
I'm either a leading a revolution with my music or
am I providing relief to these people that are insanely
stressed in this region specifically, I mean the world stressed.

(17:35):
But I mean if you were there, different story. I
think I feel like logistically though, to like even if
you wanted that moral standing of like I want to
bring like the riot to Russia basically or whatever. Um
is like when you're touring and a lot of these
countries they actually make you, like the government makes you
sign censorship papers and you basically agree to abide by

(17:57):
their censorship laws, and if you don't, you will get
arrest did in jailed in their country. But that's so
rock and roll. Like if you think about Jim More
pretty bad getting arrested for taking you know, for starting
a riot in New Haven or whatever. It's like that
doesn't happen anymore because you can't even like nothing you
do on stage is gonna even start a riot. But
it's like that energy is kind of sweet. But I

(18:17):
mean I think it's actually like if you look at
what people like um like Pussy Riot has done with
their n f T s for example, and there I
just read something today that someone just raised a million
dollars by selling n f T s for for the
for Ukraine. It's like, I think that you have to
find other ways to have art have an impact on
the situation. And I think that, like, I don't know

(18:37):
how you get to you can't even play Ukraine safely.
I mean, I think that's a big thing, is safely fans.
I mean, you could do so many different things in
the you know, globally connected world we live in as
a I mean, like if we went back to the
sixties and seventies, Like you're saying, like, what are you
gonna do? You have to be there to really cause anything,
But like you're saying, because of the power of the
Internet now maybe even n f T s as an example,

(18:59):
you don't have to physically be there. I mean you
could cause you know, a great live stream that are
streamed by thousands of Russian people. I'm sure there's so much,
I mean, I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm
sure there's so much, so many reasons why you couldn't
do this. But even if you look at like what
Todd Rudgren did last year on his tour where he
toured around he toured around the country, but it was

(19:19):
all live stream, but you could only access it if
you were in a certain region, like a live stream
that you could only access if you were in Russia.
I don't know. That seems he's always he's always done
the coolest technology ship, He's always done the best stuff. Right. Well,
I'm glad you're another Rendering fan because everyone I talked
about on this podcast about him and people think I'm insane,

(19:41):
you know what. And I'll tell you this not to
go on a tangent. But first of all, after meat
Loaf died, I was listening to that album Bad out
of Holy Funk. Is that a good record? Like sonically
that But the thing is like meat Loaf did not
need to be a part of that record like it was.
They could have plugged in any great voice, sorry meat Loaf.
It's like, like I hate to say, but the it's

(20:02):
like the songwriting of what's his name who wrote the songs?
Whose name is escaping me? And then Todd Rudgren produced
that records like the best sounding record of all time. Yeah,
and also Something Anything is one of my favorite albums
of all time. I mean, look like literally right there,
right right there. So the point is we all we
have look, we have a lot to cover. We need
to move on. Todd Rudgren is just not to be
you know, don't funk with Todd Rodgren. Okay, that's a

(20:24):
good point to I guess let's just keep going down
the list. Um, we're talking about this giant you know,
more your sphere with the country music. We're talking about
Jason Aldean selling all of the masters. Are we skipping this? Uh, this,
this other thing? I'm following you. I just want to
be sure. Are we skipping there? We're gonna skip that
one for now. We're gonna come back. We're gonna come back.

(20:45):
We're gonna go to the Spirit Music Group. That one's
actually more for the newsletter that Scott purshetta thing, so
if you're interested in that, but we can talk about
that too. We gave a little teaser Scot Perchez big
thing going on with Big Machine and Hirings signed for
the news letric because it's the only place you're gonna
see this, and I'm gonna I'm gonna do anything. This

(21:05):
is interesting, and this I'm really into because obviously the
catalog thing is a big trend happening in the industry,
but we haven't really seen that many country catalogs get
sold at all, But now I think we're kind of
going to see it. The thing that's interesting is like
Merk Mecurion, this is probably the biggest sort of face
or name in the space of people who's buying catalogs.

(21:25):
And he always talks about buying catalogs that are culturally
relevant and that will never go away. Well, you know,
we'll stand the test of time. In a hundred years,
We're still gonna be listening to Fleetwood, Mac and Neil
Young and Journey, And I'm thinking of other catalogs that
he's bought. And the thing with Jason al Dean is
to me, and I am a massive Jason al Dean fan,
so I don't I don't want this to be taking

(21:46):
out of context because I freaking love Jason Al. Leave
it in. But his music to me almost sounds like
it's it's very specific to a particular era, Like it's
sound is like it's that two thousand's y t K
country sound, And I don't know if it has the
timeless sound that Fleetwood Mac does. Are we gonna be

(22:08):
listening to Jason all Dean in a hundred years the
way I feel like we're gonna be listening to Fleetwood
Mac in a hundred years. And that's the box that
you know, Mark and Curiality is checking. But a hundred
million dollars for Jason A. Dean's catalog? What what talk
to me? I think? Okay, So he sold his catalog,
so he technically still has ten percent, which my joke

(22:28):
is is that he wants to keep those mail checks
rolling in basically, so he's gonna get that a hundred
million and then he's gonna get his ten percent checks
for the rest of his life. And so wait, I
don't know what he's gonna do with that. I mean,
obviously it's gonna be text and this lawyer is gonna
take out, but it's still a crap ton of money.
Like you said, um, Jason al Dean's first album was
in two thousand five, which is right in that y

(22:48):
two k kind of period. And Jason al Dean, unlike
the people you were naming before, like a Stevie Nicks
or Bob Dylan or Springsteen is still active, like in
terms of you know, especially in country mu sick. It's
not like they faded into the background. Still is having
massive songs. He's still very relevant. He released an album,

(23:09):
is his last one, to give you an example if
you're not an Aldine fan. So, uh, the thing that's
interesting that I personally dug up was that BMG is
the company that bought Um Broken Bow his label. But
what's interesting is that they will own uh, they will
still continue to release Aldiane's music until But what's interesting

(23:31):
to me is they brought Boken Broken Bow in seventeen
for only a hundred and three million dollars. It's a
great deal, right, so he like it. It's almost like you,
you know, somebody's barking at me about inflation. I get it,
Yes that's a factor, but still not that much more
money than Jason's. Aldane's entire catalog is being sold for.

(23:53):
And so that that is that like a trend because
if you look at what like screw Braun for example,
bought Big Machine for and then like a month I
think he bought what do you buy for? Do you remember?
It was like four hundred million dollars or something like that.
And then he sold Taylor Swift's catalog like a month later,
and I think he sold it for like three million dollars.
And granted it's no surprise that that was maybe the
most valuable collection asset in the company, but that's I mean, really,

(24:18):
I mean, Jason Atheen really is, you know, the flagship
artist for Broken Boat. The company was really built around
Jason al Dean. And you know, they've got some other
They have Landy Wilson who is having massive success right now.
He's an amazing artist, Lindsay l Dustin Lynch, So they
have some other really big artists, but nothing as big
as Jason is definitely the flagship artist for this label.

(24:39):
The lab, the arts of the label was definitely built
on um and then. And that's interesting to me from
the attitude of if I was working at the label,
it's like our biggest catalog. We have eight more years
to really for sure have this under our belt, so
we better give like fantastic service to these people that
own the catalog now, and so we they we can

(25:01):
keep facilitating the catalogs if he keeps this sale for
future works. Also, no, no, so he gets there selling
all of the catalog that they have now, but they
can still manage his catalog in the future, so BMG
and in Broken Boat can still be you know, a
part of it. Which it seems that from my research
that Aldine has been such an integral part of that

(25:21):
label that hopefully they have such good relations that that
would continue on if he wants to, you know, pull
up Mick Jagger and keep Tory until he's eight five,
you know what I mean. Yea, we even had you know,
we've discussed this Clarence Spalding on my podcast and he
had mentioned on the show that there's actually a moment
where their deal was up with Broken Bow and they
were shopping or they were considering shopping to other labels,

(25:44):
and they basically held her firm. With Broken Boat, they
could have they basically could have gone anywhere, and and
Aldine as manager said, look, you guys, what we've done
as well. We want to stay here with you, um
and they stayed. You know, it seems like they have
a great relationship. And why wouldn't you like it? Like
if you if you're the one artist, like even if
you look at Universal, like even if you're Luke Brian
at Universal, You're still on the same roster as Chris

(26:06):
Stapleton and Keith Urban and Eric Church and you know,
all these rising artists and all these other people. It's
like he is the guy at Broken Bow, right. Like
That's the thing though, is like he's losing of his
you know, catalog rights here. So like if they wanted
to be like, hey, we want to go with a
different company just because maybe we have different relations to
manage your catalog, they could, But isn't it just the artist.

(26:29):
It's just the artist rights that he's losing. So so
BBR is still going to have their share of the right.
That's the thing I couldn't That's the thing I couldn't
find all of is that if and I don't even
know of Aldine as he's been, you know, growing in
prominence over the years, if he's obviously maintained even more
rights as he's gone down the line, you know what
I mean, Like maybe his first album he doesn't really own,

(26:51):
but maybe his like eight he's like, oh I own.
Like so the point is is that like you're you're
adding another party into of this, that is you know,
that catalog. So yeah, and the reason that you brought
this up, which I think is interesting is that catalog
country music hasn't really been a big acquisition piece. And

(27:13):
it seems interesting because Music Business Worldwide founder Tim Ingram
actually asserts that country music could be the biggest acquisitions
in twenty two. Well, I think that's just because it's
like the only thing that's left, Like every other big catalog,
give or take, has basically been acquired. And I mean,
I think here's a question for you and Joe. Do

(27:33):
you think it's interesting though the age of al Dean
compared to some of these other artists in terms of
having you know, twenty to thirty years on a Bob
Dylan or or a Springsteen. Yeah, they've done a fraction
on the work and they're still getting massive payots. And
that's like what I think is interesting is it's like,
especially not to be like all dark and gloomy. As

(27:54):
you know, the medical industry can keep you alive longer,
you're gonna have longer careers, and I'm wondering, you know,
obviously when they're eighty seventy, I feel like a lot
of people when they sell their giant catalog are like, yeah,
you don't you know, you don't want to be touring
out anymore. You just whatever, sell it out. It goes
to your family. But if you're al Deane and you
might think I maybe might have twenty more years, thirty

(28:16):
thirty years if I really want to Is this too
early to start selling off these catalogs. Well, that's the thing.
First of all, I just did a quick google Jason
aldean net worth. According to Google, he's worth eighty million dollars.
I'm assuming that's before they factored in this sale. I
would assume that too. So there's no way he had
negative ten dollars or a negative ten million dollars before,
I would imagine unless that's why you sold the catalog,

(28:39):
that would be insane. I wish, but so no. But
you know, it's just one of those things where it's
like it kind of makes sense. At the end of
your life, you're gonna cash in it. Also, you know,
Bob Leftis writes about this all the time, and he's
always like, you should never sell your catalog. You should
leave it to your children. On the other hand, merk
and Curios going back to him, says like, if you're
you don't want your children to have your catalog because

(29:00):
they're not gonna know how service and what to do
with them. They're not gonna be able to do it's
best for the catalog. We will be able to do
it's best for the catalog. Um, which is the reason
to sell it. But you know, did Jason need the
cash grab right now? Especially with streaming has even reached
its full potential about what payouts are going to be
in the programs. You mentioned that because apparently one of
the reasons that tend ingram from music isiness worldwide asserts

(29:23):
that's gonna be bigger is because a lot of people
are noticing the streaming growth of country music because out
of all streaming, not like a percent out of all streaming,
country grew by one percent versus and then from vers
nineteen it's grown by two percent, which is a huge
margin if you think about all of streaming. Yeah, if

(29:44):
to grow by a percentage in a genre is huge. Yeah,
I think it was one of the I'm probably gonna
get the stat wrong, but but four out of five
stats are made out made up on the spot. Um,
I it wasn't there something like it was. It wasn't
streaming the genre that grew the most during the pandemic
streaming wise. True, Yes, and it is true. This data
I'm reading is from Nielsen and in the MRC, so

(30:06):
it's probably the most reliable. But it's like one of
those things where it might just be an overall growth
of the platform of streaming versus just the and those
fans you know, historically the last group of fans to
adopt streaming, and um, you know still obviously hanging onto
the radio. Radio still drives country obviously, and now those

(30:28):
fans might be crossing over and there might be a
bigger jump in that sense. Yeah, for sure, Joe, What
do you think about this? Yeah, I mean I think,
like like Zach said, I think really it comes down
to each artist, because I feel like if you are
thinking like career wise, you might have more energy than
another artist might have, and you might want to to
wear another twenty years. You might not want that, You

(30:49):
might just want to get your bag and get out
at the end of the day. Um. But I also
do think, like what you brought up, Zach, especially like
how your family members will actually like carry your legacy
is such an important thing, especially if you're an evergreen artist,
because there are many, many, many family members of artists

(31:10):
that have completely basically dropped the ball on dropped the
ball and and a lot of like artists that we
think of like that are huge actually have a lot
of label help still even in you know them being
deceased at this point. So I do think it comes
down to like kind of your plan and how how

(31:32):
much you actually care about your own music. And I
do think it's a personal thing. Um, does Jason Aldean
need this money? Now he's got eighty million dollars? He
doesn't need the money. Does he want a hundred million dollars?
Why not? Well? And I would argue also, I mean,
I don't know what you're doing with ninety million dollars.
But like, maybe he has this plan. He's he's opening
up a new thing of restaurants, Like maybe that money

(31:53):
is really going to be put towards Jason Aldan's Jason
al Dean's downtown. Maybe he's launching like a n F
T company. It seems unlikely, but he could be umon
like Tom Brady with autograph. You know, it's like, you know,
he might be doing something with his money. But I look,

(32:14):
I don't know. I mean, if someone won't want to
write me a check for ninety million dollars. Double my
net worth. It's like it's a lot of freaking money. Um,
I mean, double mind net worth. All you have to
do is right, check for like twelve dollars, but double
his net worth for ninety million dollars. I mean it's
hard to it's hard to say no, right, but it's just,
you know, it's just also, you know. The other thing

(32:36):
is that I wonder if it makes a difference, is
you know, you know, it's pretty you know, pretty commonly
known like Jason A. Dean has not written a lot
of his hits, And I wonder if you feel a
different connection to your catalog when you're basically singing songs
that other people have. Ring different relationship here to the music,
especially because Jason Aldean goes in sue He's got the

(32:57):
best band, the best session musicians. It's not to take
away from the art because I freaking love Jason Aldeen's
records because they're fun and they make you feel country
and they have a rock thing, but they have the country.
I mean, this is why everyone loves Jason Aldean. But
I just wonder if it creates a different connection to
your music, if these are not the songs that you're
writing and you know you're kind of just coming in

(33:19):
singing on these things, right, and uh yeah, I feel
like the connection is stronger if you are like the
main songwriter man, like maybe you know, Jason is just
like you know what, you know, I wrote these songs
of like eight other people. He's not only most of
his hits, he's not even credit as a writer on
so he he has like generally he's just he he
has no really like connection to the song. It sounds

(33:39):
like except the father and not being a mega famous
country star. That might not be fair to say so. So, Jason,
I would encourage you to come at us and tweet
us and you know, respond tell us any celebrity. I
don't care, but it would tell us, prove us, Jason,
tell us how connected you truly are to your music,
because I just want to know. I just want to understand.

(34:01):
But I think that's like falls back on genre to
like you guys said, like a country and pop, it's
very very dependent on songwriters and a lot of the
times too. Maybe you could even make the argument that
those genres are so ultra specific in a time period
that they're not going to care. That was my last
That was my point. That was what Well, I don't
want to figure out. That's what I said was like,

(34:23):
as much as I love Jason Alden, is his music transcendent?
Which I do you think like even Jason's kind of
gauging that at this point He's like, you know what,
let's just sell it. This might be peak time to sell. Yeah, yeah,
it might be. I also just think my personal theory
also is that from like the catalog acquisition side, I

(34:44):
definitely feel like, you know, country music having traditionally a
more conservative kind of audience might be more set in
their ways of listening to mostly country music, so that
might make their catalogs more valuable in that terms of
those fan bases compared to some other genres that are
a little bit more wishwashy, where it's like you could
be bouncing between a bunch of different type of music. Well, yeah,

(35:06):
especially have more dedicated fans there, they are willing to
spend more money than a lot of other genres. Um.
That's actually something that like um that is still a
huge concern in the rap and hip hop like community
and genres is a lot of the times you're relying
solely on ticket sales at that point, and people are
not buying your music. Sometimes they're not even streaming. They're
just gonna rip it. But um it's it is like

(35:31):
like we talked about like I can't remember which episode
we talked about Colin, but it was like, um uh
it was someone passed away. It was rapper who was it?
It was Max Yeah, And we were talking about his
seventeen next of kin exactly that, but also his catalog
worth and how we thought it was crazy how low
it was. But that is kind of the thing of like,

(35:52):
when you are in these genres that you know might
not you know, you don't think of country music like
being at the same level as like maybe pop music
is like at least the vast majority of I feel like,
of people listening to popular music. However, the amount of
money that it generates is astounding because of how many
like what we would call like whales in in the genres,

(36:15):
super fans whales who are willing to buy the product
and willing to support the artists. So for sure, um, Joe,
do you want to take us away on one actually,
which is not to hang up here, but now you're
basically buying the recorded rights, right So, I don't know,
does that mean that they can exploit the songs on
merchandise for example, because it didn't because right, so, doesn't

(36:40):
that mean they can't really exploit merch Well, I think
they can exploit I mean, obviously sometimes it depends on
the deal to It depends on he has a more
traditional deal and how many publishers are involved. Can you
take a song lyric and put on a T shirt
from this deal? But I feel like at the same time,
it like if you're talking about specifically, maybe like SINC licensing,

(37:03):
if you came up and we're like, hey, we did
nine percent of the work to get y'all a deal.
Do you just want to sign this and so you
get your cut of this check, and you know, we
already did all the work to set up this deal.
And so Jason Aldean songs in a movie, they'd be
like yeah, sure, yeah, okay, cool, you know what I mean,
unless it's something like egregious, you know, like some movie
that would never have a Jason Aldean you know. Uh. Well,

(37:25):
and now as we know, to SINC, I mean pays
so much money, so much so it's every artist is
trying to get into sinc. So it's it's even better
if you're already at that level. And like, you know
eventually that when the documentary start rolling in about the
early two thousands, country seeing, you're gonna be set man,
You're gonna be set on the Yeah, you don't really

(37:46):
see a lot of country though, you know Yellowstone that's
where you're seeing most of these sins. Yeah, it's it's like,
I guess like newer Western is a genre now, but
but yeah, I I also do think it does have
a lot a potential though with a documentary and um
filmmaking and UM, I don't know. I feel like every
genre has its moment right in the film sphere. So

(38:11):
when they make Urban Cowboy, there will definitely be a
Jason all Bean cut. But also you even have right now,
you've got the floor of Georgia Line musical me we
all opening up a tea pack this summer there, did
not know that there's plans to put turn into a movie.
And they've got about like twenty songs that they've licensed
for the show, and I will be in the movie

(38:31):
that they've basically woven into the story of this musical.
So you know, I'm not I'm not a big Florida
Georgia Line fan, but I'm interested interested. I don't like it,
but no, I would like to see it. It's gonna
be a great show. That was me going to f
g L House where I was like, I was expecting
a frat home, honestly, and I walked in. It's like

(38:52):
the nicest bar I've ever been in downtown. It's super nice,
especially the upstairs around. I don't want to waste too
much of your time. Do you want to do one
more topic? One more? Tears for Fears are back, but
they have the same impact that this one for me

(39:13):
after I showed him the greatest music video exactly have
you seen the music video for the I'm not the
biggest I'm not not a fan. I'm not the most
knowledgeable about Tears for Fears, to be honest, um, so
I don't even have I can name a Tears Fears song.
So everyone rules the world. Everybody wants Yeah. So that's

(39:35):
like they're big like song. I think Joe wants to
take this more like the example of them being in
evergreen acts. Mostly Tears for Fears is an evergreen act,
and you know what, don't you know? Part of the
reason might be saying that about Jason's because we're in
it right now. In ten years we might be, oh
my god, Jason, it's timeless. You know, Tears for Fears
probably sounds actually a little bit time stamped. Also, yeah,

(39:58):
I mean, for sure they have the icon on eighties sound. Yeah.
But but what's interesting is like they've kind of are
the the band that a lot of people in the
pop of sphere now and like indie pop have reference
as like their biggest influence, so like as as long
as like you know, they quit a long time ago.

(40:19):
They this is their first record back in like eighteen years,
which is insane um. But a lot of their kind
of career was kind of up, like kind of up
and down, mostly because Kurt Smith kept leaving the band.
He was like yeah, and then he would come back
and they'd be like peace out and then come back again.
It really what's hilarious trying to get him, you know,

(40:40):
when he left, it was devastating everyone else. I mean honestly,
it was for a lot of people. But if you
look at the Wikipedia, it's funny, like have you ever
gone to Wikipedia? And the like? Shows the band members
like when they yeah, and it's literally it's literally rolland
as like they're the whole time, and then Kurt's like, yep, no, yep, no,
it's like a telegraph. You're oh my bad when Zack

(41:08):
is inaudible about Tears for Fears, but you can school
me in morse coachy. But you know, it's it is.
It is interesting because like Zach, you're right, they are
a dated act, but they've had such a massive resurgence,
especially with like gen Z, this is kind of insane.
I feel like Aba has kind of had a similar moment.

(41:28):
I guess last year, like all of a sudden, like
everybody was listening to Abba, they put out a new record,
Like Alba was kind of going viral on TikTok for
a minute. But I'm nominated for a Grammy. Now, they
were nominated for a Grammy, But I actually don't think
consumption was Actually don't think that record did very well.
Um that's their newest one, right. You know. The thing
is with this is like they put out the record,
probably nobody's gonna listen to it, but it's such a

(41:48):
moment to just like people go oh yeah, I love
Tears of Fears like I should listen to the backhalg Like,
now they put this record, they get to do the press,
they'll they'll do you know, they'll play some late shows
or whatever. Like it's just like a moment for them
to kind of be back in the conversation. Right, maybe
they announced the tour, they do a thing. The record
is probably not going to be great, Okay, I got

(42:10):
I got through. I got through like three fourths of it,
and I will say it's it's surprisingly better than I thought.
That's a raving review. Surprisingly better than I thought. But
I will point out there there is a couple of
tracks in there that actually do hold up to Like
I feel like a lot of songs that I like.

(42:30):
My question to you, Joe, does it really matter if
this record does well? No, it doesn't matter at all
because at the end of the day, they've already made
their bag. Right, it's more of just like you know,
kind of coming back into the limelight. Um. And also too,
it seems like they're at this stage in their career
where they just want to make music and tour again together.
Say I love this for tears for Fears. I think

(42:51):
it's a great moment for them, for the families, for
the teams. Everybody's happy that Tears, nobody's unhappy that Tears
for Fears is back together. That's a that's a great thing. Beautiful. Yeah.
I mean it is like my mom's favorite band and
my favorite BANDA is it really one of your favorite bands?
Oh yeah, I love yeah. I So here's the thing

(43:13):
is like, um, which going back to like why they're
kind of big with gen Z is like they really
their their music connects to when you're kind of uh
like a coming of age part of your life, right,
You're going off to college, you're moving out of the house,
you're figuring out life by yourself, life by yourself without
your parents, and so a lot of those songs and

(43:35):
earlier songs that they have like talk about loneliness, loss, uh, questioning,
kind of just sledging through life. And I feel like
it connects a lot with people who are younger generally,
who aren't as secure in their lives. And it's kind
of just kept coming, like even since the eighties. It
had a resurgence back in the nineties, and our resurgence

(43:58):
in the early two thousand's and now here we are again.
It's like in the twenties was saying it's like timeless. Yeah,
it's timeless because it will always have a moment, right,
It's always going to come back. And you know, I
feel like we've always been in this. We've been in
this eighties resurgence for like, I feel like fifteen years
at this point of like indie acts or like rock

(44:18):
acts having this very like eighties heavy sound, especially in
the production of it. And I think that's another element
is production deal, Yeah, it's the real deal. That's this
is when production was perfected this. Yeah, this was digital production,
the end of analog Digital tiers Fears by the way,

(44:41):
nine point six million monthly listeners on Spotify top selling
everybody reals the world with seven hundred and eight million
my saying that number eight seven million streams on it
so much by this callog mr number one tiers for
fierce fan over here, do you want to guess with
the second top at a hundred eighty million? Huge discrepancy

(45:02):
between the number one and the number two. Shout is
the two million number three at eighty seven million? It
really dives quick here? Do we have a guess on
what the number third? Most? Joe? This is all you
I can't is it? No, it's not the Mother's song,
is it. No? No, I'm gonna say. What is right

(45:24):
now is Women in Chain? Women in Chain? It's number three.
Let's do one more. It jumps back up again to
nine million streams, So I guess this is this is
actually the third most streams. It's just listed not in
order to Spotify? Is weird? Do we have a guest
on the third most stream Tears for Fears? The most
song is Head over Heels Joe will Not be Going

(45:48):
Home with the Tears. You can call in and be
a number three and ninety six point seven quite frankly
drove Joe. That was dreadful. Yeah, my favorite band. You know,
I don't know. I thought if I had a sound
effect board, this is the part where I played the
one I thought, I thought, you do very job. But
but you know, it was fine. You got that first
two that was I actually gave the Actually I really

(46:13):
appreciate it. But number five, by the way to a
round out Mad World three, which was famously covered by
which oh yeah, that's actually one of the reasons they're
so iconic. What's his name is Juels? God? What's his name?
It's like Jewels version. Yeah, it's like I think it's Jewels.

(46:33):
It's just it's oh man, I gotta look at it.
It's it was Gary Jewels. That's what it is. Yes,
Uh so Gary Jewels brought that back in the early
two thousand's. Wow, it was very notable for an ad campaign.
Actually I had so it had so many sinks. It's instead, Um,
it's that his version of it has more than like
two hund million listeners, two million lists. It also became

(46:56):
a meme, which never doesn't not help you know what
I mean with music. So, yeah, Joe, it's getting to
kind of some of these questions. I guess like do
you think, um, you know, what what do you guys
think of like for an evergreen? Like what, Yeah, it's
an artist that you're like, this is an evergreen act,
like they could just kind of come back and people
are just gonna keep streaming them over and over. Yeah,

(47:17):
and and preface like, what is an artist who's currently
alive that you think is an evergreen? Here is an
evergreen act for me, And this is not gonna be
what anyone's gonna think it's gonna be to me, the
ultimate evergreen act that can keep touring past every single
member being dead is Kiss because they're wearing costumes anyway,
and it's all about the production so much more than

(47:39):
it is about the band. And Kiss was my second
concert ever saw. I love Kiss. I'm a giant fan,
but first of all, half the bands I'm even in it,
they're still they're selling more tickets now than they ever
have doing massive arenas, and it's like you just need
people showing and wear the makeup, like you don't even
need people to look like forever, like honestly they and
like you buy the merch like you're buying a characters

(48:00):
like you're going to see a play when you go
to see kids. Everything is so corey graphed. Everything isn't
never thought about that. Yeah, it's kind of It's kind
of like Guerillas, where it has its own lore to it,
you know, has its own world. One percent, I think
Kiss is gonna be touring far past. There's gonna be
an official lineup, and it might be the two newest guys,
and then they might replace Gene and Paul. I mean,

(48:22):
on one hand, I know, you know people are probably
think you can't do a Kiss sho about Jean and Paul,
But I'm telling you I really think you could. I think, yeah, yeah, Colin,
who's your who's your pick? Hard turning into sports show, Yeah,
right to win. So I honestly, I mean I can
come up with like easy ones, you know. I mean
we've seen obviously the acts of like you could just

(48:44):
go down the sixties list pretty much Stones, Paul McCartney,
Beach Boys, Brian Wilson, which is a very distinct difference
between those two things if you don't know that, and
so like you could go down that list. But I
do think it's interesting with Zax bring up. It's like
that idea of like the music is bigger than the
actual people themselves, which the people I'm kind of listening.

(49:04):
It's like that's part of the reason you're seeing it.
It's like you're seeing like I can go see a
Rolling Stone. I can go on Broadway and go see
a Rolling Stones song whenever. But it's not the same
bout seeing mixing Rolling Stone. It was interesting too about
the Rolling Stones. Is I think, like I think that
the music of the Beatles will outlive Paul McCartney. You're
always gonna be listening to yesterday and let it be
in those heads. But I actually think the brand of

(49:26):
the Rolling Stones is actually bigger than the songs are, Like,
I don't think they have as many universal It's really
funny because you can show people that you know, the
lips and stuff like that, and they know what you're
talking about. But like, you can't go past like three
Rolling Stones songs sometimes like weirdly the Rolling Stones are
not you know, it's funny. I just did. It was

(49:47):
my birthday. A couple of weeks ago. I did a
Rolling Stones tribute show that I put together at the
High Watt in Nashville, and I asked all these country
artists to sing, and a bunch of them said yes,
But a bunch of them said to me that they
didn't even know what Rolling Stones. I thought that is shocking.
Um and the people who did know. But you know,
but I don't think weirdly the Rolling Stones songs are
as embedded in the fabric as like the Beatles songs are. Like,

(50:09):
I think I think the music is bigger than Paul McCartney.
I think the brand of the Rolling like I think
Mick Jagger and Keith Richards might be bigger than the
songs are as crazy as that. Well, yeah, and that's
when you're getting into selling the personality territory as opposed
to UM, I guess the songs themselves. I feel like
Mick Jagger has such an iconic stage presence and such

(50:32):
a visual person that it's like, you're right. I feel
like I feel like they're more visceral in my mind
than the Beatles because of their stage performances. It's kind
of like Elvis is like the perfect example. I think
that a younger generation today knows of Elvis, but they
don't really know the catalog. Maybe they know a couple
of songs. You guys are gonna watch that biopic looks great.

(50:54):
What I don't understand is I watched the biopic and
I saw and Tom Hanks is talking as Colonel Tom Parker,
and I was like, did Colonel Tom Parker have like
a weird accent, like a weird foreign accent? And that's
just Tom Hanks. And then I went on I looked
at these interviews of Colonel Tom Parker because I had
to figure out it was like, no, he sounds like
super American. So it's like, what is this accent that

(51:15):
Tom Hanks is doing. I might I just might get
a creative decision here, guys, I just might like he's
doing Hanks, he outranks the director. He's doing like this act.
I don't even know what it is, but it sounds
very It almost honestly sounds like Russian or like what
I would imagine like Ukrainian accent. Might like he almost
sounds like when the Presidents Lynsky is like talking, like
he almost has that accent like it. I was like,

(51:36):
I didn't realize Tom Parker was like four and but
he's like he's just he's not I don't really understand,
very very timely Tom Hanks. Wow. Yeah, many people will
do it this way, but only one person will do
it the Tom Hanks way. But it does look great.
And I'm so fascinated by Tom Parker and he's just
a fascinating character. So I think it's I'm glad you
brought up Elvis because I was actually gonna say, I

(51:56):
feel like a really if you're looking for like evergreen artists,
I think speaking of Elvis, Vegas thrives on evergreen artists
in terms of like residencies and stuff like That's yeah,
I mean, like go all the way back to the crooners,
Like that was the end of their kind of you know,
big careers, they're like, I'm just gonna get a Vegas residency.
I'm gonna be here every night. I'm gonna be with

(52:17):
the wife and kids. No, I'm not gonna do that,
but like, but it's like that idea of you know,
they're like, I'm gonna sort of settle down, and so
you see that now, Like Katy Perry has a big
residency residency this weekend. Really I'm really excited about ACT.
I think it cool. Mushroom people on the Mushroom people. Well,
I'm going out for the A C. M S and

(52:38):
then um, I'm going to Day early because I was
dying to see the Vegas thing there is. It's i mean,
like Billy Joel is under example super you know Evergreen
Artists plays every month. John is the number one selling
touring artists. Still. Yes, yeah, it's probably I'm wondering if
that's because of ticket pricing and I and I'm sure
it's because I remember to get his tickets one time

(53:02):
and then being like three that's what you're saying. It's
like the that's the power of these artists. It's like
they're not they're touring on old catalogs have become so timeless,
and then it almost feels like when Tears for Fierce
Case bring it back that it's like, this album's for us,
but it's also a reminder to y'all that we're here,
that we exist. Like it's almost like marketing for the

(53:25):
rest of it, you know, just about being in the conversation,
you know, and then you go back to the back
catalog and and you know, you listen to you know,
I think most people like there's an interview with m
Paul McCartney's manageries Now I can't remember Rayman's names today,
but he was basically saying that whenever they put out
a new Paul McCartney record, the back catalog always sees
consumption increase, which makes so much sense because it just
creates a media moment. It enters the conversation, like we're

(53:47):
talking about right now, we won't be talking about Tears
for Fear as otherwise. Right. Um, Hey, the more I
can get people to listen to Temporary Secretary by Paul McCartney,
the more I can win Let's go. Yeah. I mean,
I'd literally have a bunch of wings stuff in here
in our podcast room, but yeah, I mean, like, uh
that that's a great point. Is like it seems at
the end of the day that maybe you get to

(54:08):
this point hopefully where you can be sustainable enough with
your other endeavors that it's like you get to this
point where I was like, you know what, I can
do what I want. That's nice. But I hope that
we're setting up a system now with how many changes
there are in you know, the way streaming works and
the way that we've changed the music industry completely, that

(54:28):
that can be in the future. And that's something I
wanted to The last question I guess is, uh, like,
with how much of the music industry has changed, I
feel like it's it's harder to be an evergreen act
now because it's almost like you don't have as much
capital as like a lot of the people who are
evergreen act you know, currently had when they were starting

(54:48):
out UM and they also um didn't have like we
they have the backing of labels right whereas now there's
a lot more UM like people coming up in the
industry that are refusing to even sign with labels at
this point. They're getting publishing deals by themselves, they're having
a small team of of people. But do you guys

(55:10):
think that inhibits them from being greater than they could be? Well,
I think the real thing is that not everybody's listening
to the same music the way they were. You know,
if you're segmented now, if it's so segmented, I would
like to say the Beatles were on ed Sullivan seventy
three million people tuned in, but there were three channels,
you know, there was nothing else to watch at the time,

(55:31):
so it was just easier to get mind share of
people and everybody was listening to the same music. Today,
you could be a well informed music listener and me
another well informed music listener, and you guys could It's
possible you guys don't even know the same bands, you
know what I mean, because there's so many scenes. Everything
is just so segmented, and you could spend all day
on TikTok and Algorithmically I don't have to. I could
see none of the same bands or music that you're

(55:53):
seeing and listen to you right, um. So I think
that is a big part of it, that you know, culturally,
nobody's listening to the same music. You know, like you know,
three of us are probably listening to such and you've eliminated.
And we've talked about this on the show. The barrier
to entry. I mean back in the day, to be
a big you know, music buff, it costs money, Like
you would have to go buy all these records. You
would have to go do all this. Now it's like
if you have That's how I started becoming a music

(56:15):
nerd was YouTube and it was free, easy access and
same thing that you would buy a record and you
would listen to it front to back. You would really
build this deep connection with a band. You know, I've
I really haven't built a deep connection with a band.
I think that's an age thing too, that when you
get older it's hard to build that connection. But I
get so E d D on Spotify. That's like, I know,
I hardly ever listen to a new record front to

(56:36):
back right versus when I would buy a record on
iTunes or even CDs, you know, you listen to take
a chance. I can never remember band names now, and
I used to be so good. I never remember any
band name. Yeah, And I'm like, I love this song
and I'll hear the song over and overall I'll never
remember it. Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy that's why I started

(56:57):
becoming the worst person. And that would be like actually
that you know, I mean, thank thank you. First off,
you just came in here and took charge. I mean
we gave you a laptop and Zex over here like
looking through stuff like it's his laptop. We wait, do
we do the music recommendations or what I just wanted

(57:21):
that I wanted to thank you first and then get Also,
it's about thirty seconds of just, you know, think of
what you need to think of. So I guess if
you're ready, let's let's do it. Zach, what have you
been listening to? Well, here's what I'm listening to the
past seventy two hours NonStop, and it's a throwback band.
It's not like new and hip. But what I've been
listening to for the past seventy two hours is the

(57:42):
first Tom Petty record, Damn the Torpedoes, which is one
of my all time favorite records that I probably haven't
listened to, no hyperbole, I probably haven't listened every song
on this record in like ten years. And U and
I for whatever reason, I think I was like in
an airport and I heard like free falling note, which
isn't even on the record, but that made me want
to listen to it, And a couple of things I

(58:03):
want to say about this record. First of all, the
drum tones are like the best drum sounds ever. Jimmy
I veen engineered the thing and they played every song live,
and like not, these are the best drum sounds I've
ever heard of my life. It's like the snares that
everything is incredible, and the guitar playing of Mike Campbell
is so tasteful. And to hear the twelve string, especially

(58:27):
on Uh, Here Comes My Girl, there's an epic twelve
string line that's just sounds so lush, so full. Uh
even the losers get lucky. Sometimes I just relate to that.
You know, that's my that's me. Um this it's such
a good record. You lit up when I said that, right,
are you right? Record? I've started listening to it in

(58:49):
my freshman year of college. I remember I have a
distinct memory, which is always the best with records. Used
to be in a band that used to go on
the quad and they would play like I used to
play everything. So like one of the things I can
remember is Here Comes My Girl, and it has this
distinct like mystic kind of sound, and then it goes
like back to the chorus where it's like straightforward, and
then they're like back to the mysticism and it does

(59:11):
just thin. And I just remember driving back, coming back
to my hometown from college, and I was driving and
you know, it's like sunset out and that's the song
that's going And I think of that Mike Campbell wick
where he's doing that Mann, you know, like all the
way up there. There's a if you watch, I think
it's got to be like one of those v h
one things like behind the Album or something, but there's

(59:32):
something like behind the scenes story of that album. And
basically that record was super over budget and taking way
too long, and every time the label would come over
and basically the label comes to and be like, what
are you guys working on? Like what are we spend
so much money on? And they would play them here
Comes My Girl essentially, and that would basically shut them
up and say, Okay, keep doing what you're doing. Like

(59:52):
that was the song that basically made them confident that
this was going to be a good record. But that
record even that when that record kicks off with Refugee, yeah,
I ever get tired of hearing that opening drum thing.
It's like, damn, Dann Dan. It just hits so hard.
Also one of the few great organ heavy bands. Oh
my god, and the organ is unreal And that record

(01:00:14):
would would be nothing without the organ. It fills in
so much space. It's it's a great record. Damn the
Torpedo's great record. Cover two. I love. I could just
stare that photo. That's what it's like. It's not hip,
it's not current, but it's fine. I think it is hip.
It's just not current. But man, I love that record.
Now I do the same thing. I mean, I come

(01:00:35):
on this show every week and I go what random
stuff of my listening to this week? And people are like, Colin,
why are you down? This rabbit? Also mine this week
is I was listening to Devo and I've been listening
to a band called The band's name is Guy, which
I'll talk about Guy first. Guy is literally it's Guy

(01:00:56):
album Guy, which is like my favorite thing when the
band has the same name name for the album. That
Bad Company is the best worst one because it's bad Company,
Bad Company, Bad Company, which I think is the funniest
like but also the most ballsy move of all time
to be like, this is the song that everyone's gonna
star dope, right, This name is dope, this song is dope,

(01:01:19):
This album is dope. But yeah, Guy by Guy they
do I I've had no phone for two weeks. I
talked about it in the last episode, finally getting that resolved. Yeah,
it's been really annoying. But I've been listening to the
radio and I really like to, you know, just kind
of listen to whatever and I'll just scan the channels.
And I found a really good R and B, like
soul kind of radio station here in Nashville, and I

(01:01:41):
heard this because what the beginning of Guys album has
a track too, has a song called Teddy's Jam and
it's no vocals except for the beginning. And the only
reason I know it it's because the radio promo for them,
like being like a song is gonna start is they
play the start of this song and it's just a
guy going, oh jam, and it's like I was immediately,

(01:02:03):
I was like, man, I gotta listen to this song.
Where is this song? And I like, I'm you know
the best part about the radio is it's like a mystery,
like you're driving in the car and you have to
be like, remember oh Jam, Like I'm I'm like having
to quiz myself as I'm going to work. And then
I finally got to a computer and I finally found
the song, and I go, damn, this song is awesome

(01:02:26):
and it's I think it's for the founder of the
group is named Teddy. But it's like one of those
nineteen late nineteen eighties and people have heard me talk
about new Jack Swing is the genre which is very
dance heavy, and uh yeah, I just got really into that.
But it also was my curse because every I was
literally for it happened five minutes into the drive at work,

(01:02:48):
and I have to drive forty minutes. So I'm sitting
there having to be like enjoying a song but not
enjoying a song too much. And I have nothing to
write this down, you know. So yeah, I was listening.
I got I gotta listening to us. It's pretty it's
pretty pretty good. Yeah, it's literally oh Jam, and it's
got this crazy slap back like effect to it, and

(01:03:08):
then it just goes into this like really grooving kind
of song. And then so much I was listening to Devo,
I was listening to their biggest album, which is Freedom
of Choice, because it's one of those ones that I
haven't listened to, Like everybody knows Whip It. Everybody knows
that song, which notoriously I've never been able to verify it,
but apparently Devo requires a hundred thousand dollar payment to

(01:03:29):
play that song live. I've actually verified that. Yeah, I've
heard that. I tried to get him on the ZAC
and their rates apparently are notoriously high, so yeah, they're
very artsy band. And another one I found from the
radio was it's called Working in the coal Mine, and uh,
literally it's super like spouse hates it because it has

(01:03:56):
the worst thing, which is a very loud beep sound
effect that goes to the whole thing because it's Devo,
so it's really weird. But it's literally just them talking
about working in a hypothetical coal mine and it's sick.
But yeah, the whole album is good if you're gonna
listen to it. The first track is the one that's
gonna get you. It's called Girl You Want, which is
like their biggest song past Whip It. But yeah, if

(01:04:18):
you don't know Devo, I guarantee if you look up
the photo of it. You'll know the hats. That's the
thing with Devo. Everybody knows that. Yeah, the red pyramid head. So, Joe,
what do you got? We were taking a back quickly, girl,
want is the fourth most zack? You're not You're not
a trippy to my struggle. I am one of the
few YouTube music users in the world most listen to

(01:04:41):
song on spofy with whip It being astronomically big. Oh yeah,
what is the difference between whip it and arrest? Like?
And uh, girl, you got ten millions? Pretty pathetic? Actually,
talk that just makes it so cool to be weird, right.
They also do a Rolling Stone cover. I don't know
if you know that there's a great rolling Stone like

(01:05:02):
they're on a cover rolling Stony. Yeah. I thought since
you're Rolling Stone fan, you would think that's interesting. But Joe,
what do you got? Um? So, I actually found this
guy called Griffith James and he has an like a
small album, something like eight songs called Comfortably High. I
told you would get us covered because we were in

(01:05:25):
the room, but um yeah, I mean, I honestly haven't
listened to an album. Uh, I feel like it's it's
been a long time since I listened to an album
like all the way through right because I I'm the
same way as Zach. I get a d h D
with it, and I'm like, I just listen to singles
and if you if you bore me, I'm gonna click
away basically. But this guy's songwriting is actually very, very

(01:05:46):
impressive and it really draws you in. He's done a
lot of cool production elements, especially with like how the
bass is played um throughout each song that I just
love real um, you know, I think it's really all
it's just like really up in the mix, like especially
in one song Let's See It's you know, it's something
I'll that. I don't know if this is a this

(01:06:07):
is a joke or not, but if you go the
credits of his songs, it says that's produced by Tennis.
It just says Tennis. Oh yeah, the band Tennis and band.
Yeah yeah, they're band. It's a duo. It's a wife
and husband and they're pretty badass to actually, they have
a lot of cool stuff. They're very they're really like um,
I like to say pretentious hipster, but it's like cool,

(01:06:29):
it's a compliment. Yeah, yeah. In in a very good way.
And um, I can't remember her name, but the lead
singer's vocals are amazing. It's like she can't it's like
she literally time traveled from like nineteen sixty and like came.
She seems like she would be in like you know,
she was the second replacement for Fleetwood Mac for like
McVie when they didn't just with an A it's very cool.

(01:06:52):
I'm gonna listen to this. Yeah, no, it's dope. Um,
And then you know, I I listened to Trademark USA
a lot by Baby Him this week, like just like
an inappropriately amount of times, you know, Like I just
I don't know, it's like that. I don't really I
didn't listen to you. I do, and I see elements

(01:07:14):
of Kendrick in there. But like I will say, people
make fun of Baby Team's lyrics all the time because
he says the most outrageous ship that's we talked. He
has a very high distinct, very nasally too, but like
his energy is just there and like when he's he
really sucks you in with the lyricism, Like even if

(01:07:35):
it's ridiculous, you're like what, like you just want to
listen to more of it. Yeah, so I love that.
I'm a tennis I'm in looks actually very cool. Yeah, No,
they're dope. I mean they played the Basement East really,
I want to say, like three years ago, sold out. Um,
they bring. Their live performance is amazing. If you ever

(01:07:57):
get the chance to seem live, you should go. They act,
they actually look sick. This is exactly a band that
I've been. They produce everything themselves too. I don't think
they have a producer, It's just it's the husband. I
think that does. He plays guitar too. But yeah, they're
they're They're amazing, honestly, so well awesome, Zack. Thanks for
being with us and dealing with us. I appreciate you

(01:08:17):
because you're like me in the way of like I
feel like you've got a hot take about everything. Like
I could talk to you about any subject whatsoever and
you'd be you know what, let me tell you about
this like And I appreciate the different day might take
my go in a different direction. But on fiery today. Yeah,
I'm all rallied up. Guys. Thanks for having me on
the biz Tape podcast. I had to come out, I

(01:08:39):
had to come far out. Yeah, apparently it took me
about half an hour to get out here, but it's fantastic. Yeah,
this was Honestly, this was great. I'm on my way
now to see the new Food Fighters movie Studio six
six six. I hope. I'm sure they're very happy to
have you, because I heard that did not get as much.
I heard it absolutely tanked. Damn. I'm actually not going

(01:09:03):
to see that right now, but I just want to
bring it up. What an absolute thrill. Thanks for having me.
Where can we find you again? Was it for everybody
who else? Nashural Briefing dot com or the Nashural Briefing
dot Com. It will take you the same place. You
can subscribe in the newsletter and the podcast as well.
You can go the zach Quin Show Zack z A
K K U h N wherever you listen to podcasts,

(01:09:27):
and you can check it out in canto. What our
most recent episode was of the zach hun Show was
with um Mike Erico was just like Cody Allen on
Billy Gibbins. Listen to the episode Billy Gibbins talking about
the history is eazy talk. I would definitely ask him
about being a fake Zombies member for a while that's
what I'd be interested. We got into the zombies. We

(01:09:47):
got into and you know, this was the best part
about Billy if I can tell a quick story. Afterwards,
we were talking with Billy about where he gets his
outfits from because the outfits are so iconic, and what
he said was, there's you know, everybody knows about the
nudy suits, and then everybody knows about Manuel, who was
Nudi's you know, protege, but nobody talks about him who

(01:10:08):
was the like thirteen year old k in the back
doing the seamstress work or whatever. And Himie is making
the best suits of all these guys, and Billy wears
exclusively Himie suits. So we're sitting there and Billy says,
let's call him right now. So he calls Himie. He
says Himie, I'm sitting here with like two friends. They're
gonna call in order some suits. Give him a fair price,
you know, hangs up to my friend. I call and

(01:10:28):
we've order a couple of you know, nudy style suits
from Himie. But that's the secret. You gotta you gotta
get these things from Himie's action of the price. We
gotta get ours for the next well, I was gonna say,
we're not a real podcast till episode of hundreds, So
maybe in the Himie suits we'll have a cannon. But

(01:10:49):
that that's how you bring it home. Guys, thanks for
listening to the biz tape. You're all Things Music, Business
and Media podcast we really appreciated. Go check out Zack
you and he's got the Zach hun Show on pretty
much everywhere I've seen, and also the Nashville Briefing newsletter
along with our newsletter which I'm gonna put right here,

(01:11:10):
which you'll catch you up on the other things we
could not get in the show. Music Picks Everything under
the Sun. I've been expanding it a lot, so please
check that link below. Also, our socials is always if
you want to see some exclusive content and everything under
the Sun. And lastly, thank you as always