The Book of Joe: Fixing slow starts and Remembering a friend

Hosts Joe Maddon and Tom Verducci begin with a look at the turnaround of the Rays and their stadium improvements.  Tom points out the slow starts from the biggest spending teams, while the lowest payrolls are doing well!  Hitting has been off and Joe explains the adjustments that need to be made.  While thinking of the most dominating pitchers that we've actually seen, Tom could be adding a new name to the list.  Plus, Joe remembers his good friend Garrett Anderson and his impact on baseball and the Angels.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:04):
The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Hey There and Welcome back.

Speaker 1 (00:17):
It's a Book of Joe podcast with me, Tom Berducci
and Joe Madden.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
Joe, how are you doing this week?

Speaker 3 (00:24):
Doing wonderfully. It's been a busy week here. We had
a great event at Palma Sea a couple of days.
That's a great golf course here country club for the
first team and it was co sponsored by the Tampa
Bay Rays. Got to meet Patrick Sulupski. Patrick was there
along with the Ken Babby and a host of others.

(00:46):
Was kind of fun and did poorly in our member
guest golf tournament. Frank and I did not defend well,
but it was still fun. And now getting prep to
drive the RB back up the coast of Pennsylvania again soon.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
So those are the new owners of the Tampa Bay Rays.

Speaker 3 (01:02):
Yes, nice man. Got to meet him and can have
met him several times.

Speaker 1 (01:07):
Well, there's got to be a good vibe around the
Rays since the ownership issue is settled. I think there's
momentum towards that ballpark being built in Tampa. Teams playing
well give us a sense of the vibe around the Rays.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
In the Tampa Bay region.

Speaker 4 (01:22):
Oh, it's heavy. It's good.

Speaker 3 (01:23):
I mean heavy in a good way. Everybody's jacked up
about him. I go places and they still think I'm
achiliated with the ball club, and you know, I just
talk to them as though I am just being a
former Ray. But yeah, there's a high level of excitement.
They've been playing well. They got that exciting method of
play working again. The old baseball methodology combined with the

(01:45):
new really well. The ballpark itself, I haven't been in it,
but they talk about how well it's been. Redone drive
by it off and the roof looks great. So there's
a lot of that on TVs. A lot, you know,
if you go in different bars or restaurants, you'll see
them on the tube there. But a lot of excitement
based on the way they played. It looks like back

(02:06):
to the roots when when the race had been successful,
the pitching, the defense timely, hitting a couple of home
runs here and there, but playing the game in a
in a more complete way. So it's it's been there's
a good vibe going on in the Tampa Bay area.

Speaker 1 (02:21):
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, Joe, because we're
going to talk about some teams that are struggling. But
I look at the way the Rays are playing and
you're right, it is. This is the formula that it's
worked for them. Fourth in the major leagues in batting average.
And you say, like, well, who pays attention to batting
average anymore? Well, it does mean something for a team that,
let's face it doesn't have a ton of power. The

(02:42):
razor towards the bottom in home runs, but they move
the ball and they move runners. It's a team that
can that can run as well. It's a team that's
exciting to watch in a mini version of what we
saw last year with the Toronto Blue Jays.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
So I'm impressed so far with this Tampa Bay team.

Speaker 3 (03:00):
I like Simpson, the speed guy, and they put at
the top it seems more often. He's just such a
throwback player. He's really fun to watch. He's got that
kind of really heavy speed. He's playing versus Cincinnati right now.
Cruise on the other side and himself, these are two
of the faster kids in all of Major League Baseball,

(03:21):
and it's fun to see that. So that's the part
I've been really focused on with them, just just as
a sidebar and was going to ask you this question anyway.
But the one thing I have noticed on not just
with the race, but in general, throwing arms from the
outfield do not appear to be what they had been.
Every third base coach just sends runners and when I
watch the throws coming and they kind of just trickle

(03:44):
onto the grass or they're always offline and fading all
the time, just as an offshoot.

Speaker 4 (03:49):
Have you noticed that. Has that been brought up?

Speaker 3 (03:50):
Do you do you know anything about like throwing arms
in the outfield and what the considerations are there.

Speaker 1 (03:55):
Yeah, it's interesting you said that, Joe. I have noticed
some sloppy throws from the outfield. For sure, I'm not
sure about arm strength, but I noticed relay is not
completed well properly. Now, you got to understand the last
probably ten years, but even the last five years, teams
started playing their outfielders much deeper. Sure, they are conceding

(04:17):
singles and they're defending doubles, so you know, you do
see outfielder's position deeper, and it allows third base coaches
to be a little more aggressive. But yes, anecdotally, I
have noticed I've noticed a lot of bad first base
play where teams are just throwing guys over there at
first base without a whole lot of instruction or experience.

(04:39):
And I have noticed, you know, throws just not being
either made to the right bases or completed well, especially
on relays. I don't know how you measure that, but
early in the season, I do think the outfield throwing
has not been great.

Speaker 4 (04:54):
Now.

Speaker 1 (04:54):
I know, guys get knocked. The teams don't throw to
bases anymore, but they do. They just don't do it,
you know, in the formal pregame infield outfield practice that
it used to be, but typically before a series starts,
guys will get out there and they'll throw the basis.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
Yeah, I don't need I don't need infield practice. I
always thought that was it was kind of fun and
it was like a thing to do back in the day.
But I never liked the idea of a player getting
his arm hot that many times. In other words, you
know me, you get you come out on the field,
you get ready for batting practice. Everybody plays catch to
get their arms hot.

Speaker 4 (05:28):
You know.

Speaker 3 (05:28):
Infielders take a thousand ground balls. Infielders constantly practicing their
craft on grounded balls and throwing the ball either the
first base or double plays whatever. And during this time,
you know, outfielders play catch, but they don't necessarily throw
the basis, although it's becoming more invoke to do it
at that time, which is what would I agree. I
agree that's when it should be done. If you're gonna
get your arm hot early, that's when you should practice

(05:50):
your throws. My point is they would do that, and
then they'd go and sit down, eat something, get change
some wet clothes, and come back out and then take
in infield practice, which you get your where you get
your arm hot again. And that's the part I didn't like.
So I try to get all that stuff done before.
I really, I don't mind when you're on a like

(06:10):
a long home stand, take your come out, get loose
for your batting practice, get really good and loose, and
then get the batting screens and stuff off the field
and have your outfielders throw to bases and have your
catchers throw to bases at that time too.

Speaker 4 (06:24):
I just think there's a better way to do it.

Speaker 3 (06:26):
Infield is kind of fun to watch if you're a fan,
and what's kind of fun to do as a player
sometimes also, But I do believe there is diminishing, gonna
be turns when you get arms hot and cold.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
So often since you brought it up, my beef on
relays are third base coaches who don't bring the player
around the bag before they see where the throw is going.
I see a lot of third base coaches who don't
get down the line, who put the stop sign up
as the guy's pulling into third base. I always like
to bring the guy around the bag and see if
that first throw is handled properly. A lot of times

(07:00):
it's that old stop and start method, which can cost
you a run or not. I always like my guys
to think, run hard through the base. I'm going to
send you until I'm not, rather than putting up a
stop sign before a guy against the third.

Speaker 4 (07:12):
Base cannot agree more.

Speaker 3 (07:14):
And there was a time, and I think we've talked
about this before, Mesa Community College and Mace Arizona. Roger
Schmuck was the head coach there, and they went to
the point where there were the third base coach would
only have a stop sign. So if you're on second
base and you're coming to third, you're not looking for the.

Speaker 4 (07:31):
Wave that you're going to go.

Speaker 3 (07:32):
You're only looking for the stop in other words, you
are coming on the bag every time when you're at
second base going to home. It was hard. I tried
to implement that in instructional league. Mitch Cioni was coaching
third at that time. It's really good baseball guy. But
because you instinctively had done it one way for so long,
it was hard for the third base coaches to pick
up on that and just permit themselves to get, like

(07:53):
you said, down the line, and their only job was
to hold them up and not to send them. And
again it was like it's a paradigm shift. It's just
the mental shift of the with the runners because they're
not used to that either. We tried it instructionally. I
really wanted to do it, but I couldnot get enough
people on board. Traditionally it just worked the other way,
and it was hard to break the habit. But I

(08:14):
always considered that an interesting way to do that, only
have a stop sign and not like let's go, let's go,
let's go.

Speaker 1 (08:21):
Also, yeah, well, as deep as outfields play these days
and what you mentioned with throwing arms, yeah, I think
teams that run the bases aggressively, as the Rays do,
have a big advantage right now, what we're seeing, Joe,
And really what three weeks more into the season here
the world is upside down in baseball. I take the
top six payrolls in baseball, and four of them have

(08:46):
losing records. The Mets, the phill East, the Blue Jays,
the Red Sox combined are thirty three and fifty five.
They're not even close to being five hundred. And if
you look at the six lowest payrolls in baseball, three
of those teams have winning records, Cleveland, Tampa Bay.

Speaker 2 (09:04):
And Saint Louis. Of those teams, Joe, some of those we.

Speaker 1 (09:08):
Talked about before, specifically the New York Mets. Not much
has changed there except they keep losing now eleven in
a row. The Philadelphia Phillies and what is going on here, Joe?
Because offensively, I would be worried about this team, and
to say that before the season, you'd think I was crazy. Right,
We thought the Phillies should be a dynamic, certainly a

(09:30):
top ten offensive team, but man, there is signs everywhere
that they've got some issues. Top of the order is fine,
even though Trey Turner is off to a little bit
of a slow start.

Speaker 2 (09:41):
Swarbur and Harper are fine.

Speaker 1 (09:43):
After that, man, it falls off in a hurry, you know,
Adulas Garcia. They're trying to turn from a guy who
is defaded by the Rangers into a cleanup hitter that's
not really working.

Speaker 2 (09:54):
He's hitting two o eight.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
Alex Bohm, I mean, I've never seen a hit or
struggle like this, Joe. He has not barreled up a
baseball yet. Who were three more than three weeks into
the season. He has one hit that's traveled more than
two hundred and fifty feet. He's hitting one thirty three.
Bryson Start is hitting to ten. The team as a

(10:17):
whole is hitting two twenty and in the last three
innings of a game, when you're typically going to see
some really good arms plus velocity seven eight nine innings,
they're hitting one eighty. Is there something systemic going on
here with the Phillies, Joe, or do you just say, hey,
it's early, this team's going to be fine.

Speaker 4 (10:36):
Well, we talked about them going to the World Series.

Speaker 3 (10:38):
I believe in our appreciation kind of stuff, you know,
just liking the fact that they were pretty much still intact,
that their better players are still of age, that they're
still going to be really good. And again, you know
you're counting on other guys. It's the supporting cast really
needs to pick it up. I would not give up
on them yet, it is it's you know, it's difficult.
What are they almost like seven or eight under five

(10:59):
hundred right now? I think something heavy like that, and
that's that's hard to dig out from under. However, that
and then again, the Braves are doing so well, and
that's that's kind of interesting also from the other side
of things. But I like the makeup of the Philly group,
the Phillies group. You're right about Garcia having him in
a four hole, it's like suboptimal, I think. I mean,

(11:20):
this guy had a great year a couple of years ago.
He's a nice player, but he can't get hot. I mean,
that's part of it too with him. My experience with
him is that you get him at the right time,
you know he's pretty much and out, but get him
at the wrong time you can't get him out. So
I would just be a little bit more patient. I
like Stot a lot.

Speaker 4 (11:37):
Bom.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
He's got a lot of issues going on contractually and
even agent wise, and what he's been doing, and there's
a lot of that turmoil under the surface kind of
stuff that really it will eat out a player, will
lead at anybody. So just stay with it, I think,
and they're gonna get obviously better. But if the Braves
continue to do what they're doing, and it's going to

(11:59):
be very difficult to catch them over time.

Speaker 4 (12:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
I agree on the Braves.

Speaker 1 (12:02):
They look legit not as surprise that they're turning things around.
They have a lot of high end talent there. The Phillies, Yeah,
they get out of the gate here eight and fourteen.
They do have Zach Wheeler coming back within a week
or so. Now, he has not get anything close to
his normal velocity coming off of that thoracic outlet surgery.

(12:23):
He's going to need time to really be a dominant pitcher.
But that's going to help just having him back in
the rotation. But this team has to hit, There's no
question about it. It's an aggressive, swinging team. Right now,
the results aren't there. I agree with you that they
should be okay, but I always worry Joe. We talked
about this before this happened to Atlanta and Baltimore last year.

(12:43):
When you get off to bad starts like this and
the expectations are high, it can get away from you
pretty quickly, and you know they're at the point now.
And I'll say the same thing about the New York Mets,
maybe even more so for the Mets.

Speaker 2 (12:56):
You lose that margin of error.

Speaker 1 (12:58):
I always believe a playoff team can't afford one losing month.
It's a long season, but if you have two bad months, man,
it's tough. So for me, I look at not so
much the Braves, for the Phillies and the Mets, but
how are they going to get to eighty eight wins?

Speaker 2 (13:14):
That's the number for me.

Speaker 1 (13:15):
You know, you may sneak in with an eighty seven
maybe in a weird year, eighty six in a great year,
I mean where there's a lot of high end competition
and bad teams, maybe you have to get to ninety.
But I think eighty eight puts you into postseason play.
So I look at those teams chasing that number more
than chasing the Atlanta Braves.

Speaker 3 (13:34):
I like to start breaking it down to weeks, like
I like a winning week. I know I've always been
a month guy. Month to month. I've always looked at
a record for the month wherever I've been. But then
when you get in some more difficult moments like this one,
I was good like week by week. I wanted you
you wanted to win the week. I would always talk
about winning the week. So even for four and three,

(13:54):
if you play all seven days, whatever, that'd be great.
You know you love the five and two's and you
know the six and ones, et cetera. Is that that
you really got to start as a manager would focus
on things like that, and you're just trying to pick
up one game a week on your hoomever's in front
of you, that would be it. And especially this early
in the year strategy wise, just to try to explain

(14:14):
it to your guys. I would try to put it
in the perspective that way, then it's.

Speaker 4 (14:18):
Not as ominous.

Speaker 3 (14:19):
So when you get that far behind, and even did
that even in the latter parts of some seasons, but
this early I would really focus on, let's win the week, boys,
Let's win the week. Start winning some weeks, and before
you know it will be back to normal.

Speaker 1 (14:32):
Well, for a team like the Phillies, I mean hitting
their way back into contention if you will. I'm not
saying they're out of contention, but based on where we
think they should be, it is a tough world to
hit in. Right now, Joe, the league batting average is
two thirty nine, and I.

Speaker 2 (14:47):
Know that it's going to go up. I mean it's April.

Speaker 1 (14:50):
Traditionally, you know the batting average is going to go
up in the course of the season as the weather warms.
Pitcher is definitely ahead of the hitters, but it is
not an offensive game right now.

Speaker 2 (15:01):
I looked at this the other day, Joe.

Speaker 1 (15:03):
Where what I see happening in baseball now is you
have many pitchers now who are throwing three different fastballs,
and almost all of them also have three different breaking
balls too. The old three pitch mix is dead pretty
much everybody. If you're a four seam fastball guy, you
learn how to throw a two seamer and vice versa,

(15:24):
and then you add in the cutter. I mean Cam
Schlitzler the Yankees throws ninety percent fastballs. Now you're like, well,
why don't guys hit him. Well, they're three different pitches,
completely different pitches cutter, sinker, four seamer, and they're all
between ninety one hundred miles an hour. So if you
go back ten years ago, about thirty three percent of

(15:45):
pitchers through three different fastballs. Now it's up to fifty percent.
So these hitters are going to the plate now having
to defend against the whole suite of pitches that move
in all directions. I'm talking about four seamers with ride sinkers.
If you're right now handed, those right on right sinkers
running in on you, cutters that run away from you.

(16:08):
Maybe the guy has a change up or a splitter
that's going to move the ball down.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
So that's a lot for hitters to cover.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
And the great pictures a lot of times had these,
you know, a deep menu pitches. But now with these
pictures getting into these labs, it's happening all over the place. Joe,
this is normal, you know, night in, night out for
a major league hitter is trying to solve this riddle
of what's coming at you, which direction it's moving.

Speaker 3 (16:35):
Yeah, I mean I'm watching, I see it all also,
And doesn't that then speak to kind of a shift
regarding teaching of hitting Again, if you're up there just
trying to hit home runs and have that bigger swing
all the time, just trying to generate power lift, doesn't
that play into this kind of mix from the pictures

(16:57):
Because if the ball is going to be insidiously moving
in three different directions out of the same arm slot
to just go up there and you know, maybe guess
right on occasion, he guess.

Speaker 4 (17:06):
Right both pitch and where you're going to swing the bat.

Speaker 3 (17:09):
Does it not make sense to attempt to tone it
down a bit and and go into different kind of
versions of a swing, the b hack, the two strike approach, whatever.
And I know you've always made the argument, and it's
probably true, and it is true that you know the
game is won in October and November with power and
home runs. Again, I just continually, because I've just recently
had some q and as and stuff about this.

Speaker 4 (17:31):
I want it all.

Speaker 3 (17:32):
I still like to believe, like, if the pitchers are
making these kind of shifts, why aren't the hitters attempting
to do the same thing. Why isn't the offense trying
to make adaptations? According to if it's more difficult to hit,
then why not back off a little bit, you know,
chuck up on that seven irom whatever, just control things
a little bit better. That's just a curiosity thing again,

(17:52):
But not being on the field, not watching it eyeball, wise,
it's more difficult for me to totally understand, but it
just naturally makes sense. If they become more difficult to hit,
and the numbers verify that, validate to validate that, why
not then make the appropriate kind of adaptations from the
batter's box.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
I think you're on hundred percent right, Joe. We saw
this happen with velocity. Right when velocity really began to
shoot up. We saw hitters get in the cage on
the high velocity machines and essentially they learned how to
time velocity. And that's why we see velocity even though
it's going up, we see fewer fastballs in the game.
It's now about pitch shaping. So here's an example. I

(18:31):
think of what you're talking about. Xander Bogart's. You know,
he's been in the big leagues now, I think twelve
thirteen years. If you go back to twenty fourteen, his
first full season rookie season, he saw only twenty percent
sinkers and the average sinker was ninety two miles an hour.
Now he's seeing thirty two percent sinkers and they're coming

(18:52):
in at ninety four miles an hour. So he was
a guy who always was able to kind of reach
out over the plate, great breaking ball off speed hitter,
but that two seem fastball was backing him off the plate,
beating him on his hands and opening up the outside
part of the plate as well as the top of
the zone on the four seemer. So he has changed

(19:13):
the swing path a little bit to have that bet
in the zone earlier and stay through the zone longer.
I mean, it's not an easy adjustment to make, and
I think it's especially hard for these older hitters who
have seen this game change in the course of their
ten year careers or so.

Speaker 2 (19:30):
But you're onto something here that hitters have to adjust.

Speaker 1 (19:32):
Part of the adjustment is getting in on what they
call the traject machine, which you have where you can
dial up the exact pitch shapes of that picture you're
seeing tonight. The problem with that is it's not a
portable machine. Guys can only get on that at home,
not on the road. I talk about home field advantages,
But I think you're on to something that hitters do
need to adjust, you know. I hear hitters talk about

(19:54):
this all the time. I actually hear more, hear more
about hitters sitting off speed now, which I never used
to hear before.

Speaker 2 (20:03):
Be because again that the fastball is being thrown.

Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah, they're faster, but there's fewer of them, and essentially
you can't cover everything. So hitters have to make I
think choices. Now I don't like the word guess, but
you know, using intuition, scouting, whatever it is, there are
times where're gonna have to sit maybe on off speed,
which as you know, Joe, a lot of hitters can't

(20:27):
do that, or back in the day it was not
advised at all.

Speaker 3 (20:30):
You could just lead to chasing even more off speed.
So yeah, there's all the's paradox teaching hitting. I've always
thought that you eliminate your weakness by beginning with your weakness,
whatever that might be. In other words, like if a
hitter is pulling off the ball with his first movement,
I want him to start open with his front foot
because he won't get more open, he's going to close
it back down. I like for hitters to move in

(20:51):
the box first before they change anything. In other words,
got a different look. I never snap a different snapshot,
So wherever, and that's all based on where your back
foot is, not where your front foot. Your front foots
can always kind of want to move in a certain direction,
like a little bit towards the plate at least, or
may be somewhat even, but always a little bit where
the front foot should land a little bit closer to

(21:11):
the plate than the backfoot because as you turn, everything
kind of evens out based on that, and you could
find your balance. But I like movement in the box first,
and I would move my hitters again their backfoot first
in regards to making adjustments based on all of a sudden,
they're getting beat up.

Speaker 4 (21:28):
They're getting jammed.

Speaker 3 (21:29):
They're getting jammed because their backfoot's too far from the
plate and their front foot automatically wants to go towards
the plate, and all of a sudden they're blocking out
their hands with their front side. So I wanted the
back foot moved in. And when you move the backfoot in,
all of a sudden, the feet kind of even out,
and now all of a sudden, my hands have a
path to work within wore before I was blocking them out.
As an example, another thing is like when guys get

(21:51):
pitched that a lot down down in a way, and
if they've been a slider mania, they always get a
lot of sliders because they have in a chase mode,
and these kind of guys have a tendency to start
like bending over more because they really really want to
put that outer corner. And when they start doing that, man,
they become even more susceptible inside because they're bent over
and they just really again cannot clear and they have

(22:13):
this bad posture about them. So I was really big
on where they're standing, where their backfoot was, and that'd
be my primary thing to look at when things weren't
going well. And that was like when a guy was
going well, that was really on top of him, aware
where that backfoot was, because that was always my template
regarding where I wanted to get the guy back to

(22:36):
once he started going poorly, which is always going to happen.
Long answer, I guess, but I am. I'm all about feet.
I think feet. Placement of feet in the batter's blox
mean everything. And then obviously where the first move occurs
because of where that backfoot is. You might be diving
in all of a sudden you didn't even realize it.
You might be turning that front's shoulder in, which is

(22:56):
causing you to pull out even more.

Speaker 4 (22:57):
There's all these.

Speaker 3 (22:58):
Little nuances involved, But I like, where's the guy's back foot,
and that's where I begin to make mydjustments. And where's
that backfoot in the batter's box. I'm so glad you
brought that up, Joe.

Speaker 5 (23:08):
I actually have a couple of backfoot stories I want
to written by you.

Speaker 2 (23:12):
And then we have to do it again.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
We have to talk about the New York Mets and
how bad things are going.

Speaker 2 (23:18):
Now what you would do as a manager of that group.

Speaker 5 (23:20):
We'll do that right after this on the Book of Joe.

Speaker 2 (23:36):
Welcome back to the Book of Joe.

Speaker 4 (23:37):
Joe.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
You mentioned the backfoot. As you know, it's hard to
get a lot of guys to move where they stand
in the box. They routinely, and that's the key word.
Stick to a routine and step in the box in
the same place, no matter who's pitching, no matter what
they're throwing, no matter how hot or cold they are.
But a couple of stories for you. One is Kevin McGonagall,
the young hitter for the Detroit Tigers.

Speaker 2 (24:01):
So impressed watching him play.

Speaker 1 (24:04):
First of all, he's challenged seven times, he's won five
of them, so that he does have a great idea
the strike's on. Really impressed by seeing that so far
he's going to walk more than these strikes out. But
there was a game in Minnesota. He's facing Eric Orsey
who throws a nasty split and he rolled over and
grab all the first base. The next night he saw Orsy.

(24:26):
Orsy throws them in the same pitch, a splitter and
he ropes an RBI double into the right field corner,
and you look at the video.

Speaker 2 (24:33):
He actually moved up in the batter's box to kiss
that splitter.

Speaker 4 (24:36):
Early.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
I was just so impressed the twenty one year old kid,
first year in the major leagues making that adjustment from
one night to the other man.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
That's a high baseball IQ.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
And the other one is it kind of works oppositely
and maybe counterintuitively. But Ben Rice, you're watching him with
the Yankees, really developed into a premier hitter. He's to me,
he's always been a guy Joe that absolutely crushes fastballs,
crushes them, and you look at his numbers and they
show that.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
Well, this year he's hitting everything.

Speaker 1 (25:09):
You know, he sees one of the smallest percentages of.

Speaker 2 (25:12):
Fastballs in Major League Baseball, So he's.

Speaker 1 (25:15):
Gonna have to hit spend, he's gonna have to hit
off speed, and he's doing that. This year, and what
he did was, if you look at it, he's a
guy who stood on the back line already before. He
actually now has his heel farther on the back line,
and his toes are actually off the back line because
they're splayed a little bit. So he is literally as
far back as you can go without, you know, breaking

(25:36):
the rule and having the foot completely out of the box.
Whether that's the reason why he's hitting everything now, I
don't know, but I like the fact that he has
made an adjustment and he is actually crushing it.

Speaker 4 (25:47):
Yeah, you just kind of mentioned it.

Speaker 3 (25:49):
One of the hardest things to do was to get
a guy to move in the box.

Speaker 4 (25:53):
They just don't want to do it.

Speaker 3 (25:55):
And I always felt that was before you change anything
with your patterns and your swing and you want to
try to make adjustments, or because that's the harder thing
to do, I just just let's just move in the
box a little bit, let's move our feet around, and
again give yourself a different picture. I mean, there's guys
like you're suggesting with Rice and he's killing fastballs. I
think possibly because he wants to pull everything right. Just

(26:16):
I want to get that head out front and if
I'm playing a Yankee stadium, I want to give myself
the best chance of pulling a ball down the right
field line, because that's equal success right there. I would
the kid's pretty smart, and I'm sure you know they're
hitting coaches whatever. I've talked about that. But when you're
the farther up you're in the box, the less time
you have obviously to be able to get the bath

(26:37):
head out front. So I think he's just creating more time.
I think that would be part of it, and I
don't know that for a fact, but I do like
an iast to encourage my guys to move before we
changed anything else, because I'll tell you what, changing you
or your hand position is how you start the bat.

Speaker 4 (26:54):
All that kind of stuff. Man, that's hard to do.

Speaker 3 (26:56):
I mean, those are your fingerprints, that's your DNA kind
of stuff. You've done it for a long period of time.
To do any kind of change there's really uncomfortable, and
you're probably gonna have a sustained problem until.

Speaker 4 (27:08):
It comes back.

Speaker 3 (27:09):
You probably end up coming back where you had been anyway,
So moving the box, do that first, and let's see
if there's any kind of difference that you could be
you know you're gonna catch the break involve. I always
like guys that are having trouble again with that slider
down in the way, or if they get pitched a
lot down the way, move up in the box.

Speaker 4 (27:26):
I like my back foot at the point of the plate.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
Because I felt I can see the outside edge better
and I can protect it better.

Speaker 4 (27:33):
The farther back you are, the ball could nick that edge.

Speaker 3 (27:36):
And start moving away from you, and then the outside edge
looks even farther away. So there's there's all this little
nuance involved. But I say moving the box first before
you try anything else.

Speaker 1 (27:45):
And I it's funny brought that up, because I think
moving the foot can actually be very beneficial for a
pitcher as well. Right, guys, moving on the rubber. Great
example for you this year. The best pitcher in baseball,
if you just want to go by performance so far,
is Jose Soriano of the Angels. He's been almost unhittable
with that power, saying he throws a lot more than that,
but that's his bread and butter. He did move from

(28:08):
the far first base side of the rubber, probably five
or six inches towards the middle of the rubber and
he's just killing right handed hitters with that two seamer,
just running it in. It's got tremendous both downward movement
and armside run.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
Hitters are oh for twenty five.

Speaker 1 (28:23):
Right handed hitters oh for twenty five against his two seemer.
He has started out five and zero with a zero
point two eight ERA. Now you've got to go back
to Fernando Venezuela and Fernando Mania to find a picture
who started this well. Through the team's first twenty one games.
He's an absolute beast on the mound. He actually has

(28:43):
changed his delivery slightly where he's got what I call
that turn and tuck motion like Shohey has at the
top of his delivery. He's not just dead on to
the hitter the way he was before. We always knew
this kid had a great arm. Again, upper nineties two
seemer is just it's hard for hitters to track. But

(29:05):
now he's gone next level. I'm not sure if you
had a chance to watch him pitch Joe, but it's
fascinating to see a guy who's got a great arm
now start to put together.

Speaker 4 (29:14):
I have watched he he is all of that.

Speaker 3 (29:17):
He is kind of like a latter day Kevin Brown,
where the ball looks like a whiffle ball coming out
of his hand. It really, it's it's it's fabulous to watch.
I didn't realize about the foot adjustment. I just when
I do watch, you can just see it's so uncomfortable
for the hitters and the ball doesn't move that much.
And I love when when a pitcher learns how to
bury the ball into a hitter's hands. As a catcher man,

(29:38):
I used to get off when when my pitcher would
get in there and we would get in on hands.

Speaker 4 (29:44):
God, I would just like, because I was.

Speaker 3 (29:46):
Very talkative anyway behind the play, but I would just
let him know how good that was.

Speaker 4 (29:51):
It's just something that I think.

Speaker 3 (29:52):
You know, obviously there's been a lot of success major
league pitching wise.

Speaker 4 (29:55):
We just talked about it.

Speaker 3 (29:56):
But a big part if you're not, I just you'd
always want to find out exactly if the guy has
been able to get in enough and create that kind
of thought process within the hitter because he's coming at
my hands, which is very uncomfortable. I don't see this
as being a fad with this fellow. This guy is
all of that Soriano is. He's going to be that
good all year. I believe I'd love to see him

(30:16):
stay healthy because if he does, he's going to put
up some astronomically great numbers this year.

Speaker 2 (30:21):
I really believe that. I agree with you. It's a
real deal right now with him.

Speaker 1 (30:27):
We'll see him at the All Star Game and maybe
contend for a Cy Young I think he's that good.
We talked about the Mets, and I want to take
your take here, Joe, on what you might do with
this team. I mean, the other day in Chicago for
three games, Carlos Mendoza had Carson Benji hitting leadoff.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
I mean, the kids struggling. He's probably gonna have to
go back.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
I think his head moves way too much with that
swing that he has for him to hit consistently in
the big leagues right now.

Speaker 2 (30:57):
Really good athlete, I get it he's.

Speaker 1 (30:59):
Going to hit, but he's a little underwater right now.
I don't want him hitting lead off. He was hitting
lead off. There was the game the other day where
Picrow Armstrong and the tenth inning is on third base
with one out. Nico Horner is up, who is one
of the best contact hitters in baseball. It's a sack
fly to win the game. There's a lot of criticism
that Mendoza should have walked him. Mendoza talked about, well,

(31:19):
if we walk him, he's got a steal second base.
Who cares you're defending runner around third. That's the tie
breaking run. You'd have to go through Bush and Bregman
to get out of that inning. But Bush has been
cold as ice, and you know Bregman not so great
himself either. But in either case, you are setting up
a potential double play. So I don't know if that's

(31:41):
the right or wrong thing to do, but this is
what happens when a team is struggling. Mistakes or decisions
get magnified. They now have, Joe, a fifteen game stretch
where they're playing teams that had losing records last year.
You know it might be this early in the season.
It sounds crazy make a break time for the New
York Mets. I mean, they've got to establish the momentum here.

(32:02):
So I mentioned in the lineup, what can a manager
do in this spot? Joe, I'd always getting Soto back
at some point here soon, That certainly would help, But what,
if anything, can a manager do to break this streak?

Speaker 4 (32:17):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (32:17):
I love when we're debating whether we should have walked
Nico or not.

Speaker 4 (32:21):
I mean, especially with those guys.

Speaker 3 (32:23):
On deck, right, I'm aware of that situation, and listen,
you know Nico is going to move the ball. Absolutely,
the double plays would have been in order. I would
be superfluous. It doesn't matter if he steals and not.
I agree with that because we're not thrown through anyhow.
So just just a matter of where you're playing your infield,
et cetera, et cetera. Okay, when you get to this point,

(32:45):
for me, it's all about fundamentals, and you can't you know,
can't spell that word without the word fun being at
the front of it and mental at the back.

Speaker 4 (32:54):
So I would actually, I guess they're home.

Speaker 2 (32:58):
For a bit now, right, Yeah, nine game homestand come out.

Speaker 3 (33:00):
Yeah, and the weather's not the best maybe, but although
it's not horrible right now, this is where I would
have a mini spring training. Not every day because you
don't want to wear them out, but like the first
game of each series, try to get them out just
to do something, getting them back out for some cutoff
and relay stuff. Even though the bunt's not run real
off into some bunt defenses, whatever, any kind of a

(33:22):
pertinent group activity PfP for the pitchers. Maybe from an
offensive perspective, we work on just runners on second move
in the third, run around third base, let's score them somehow.
I would I would just turn it back to spring
training right now. And while you're doing this as the manager,
you walk around talk talk talk talk to different guys.
It's not punitive, listen. We just got to get our

(33:43):
heads on right again, and we got to get back
to doing these kinds of things well consistently in order
to advance. And that was where I was at when
I was let go by the Angels after we run
a twelve game losing streak. I was about to incorporate
that exact plan. I think it was June or something
that when that happened, that was part of my gig.
I got the mohawk haircut. I was going to go

(34:05):
out there. I normally don't get involved in early work,
but it was going to be, and we're going to
start doing kind of like spring training in June or
right now, to be spring training, gosh, right after spring training, but.

Speaker 4 (34:14):
That wouldn't matter. You truly get back.

Speaker 3 (34:16):
And really reduce, reduced, reduce, and start emphasizing those little
things once again that win games. So this is a
nine game homestand that would be three days out for
sure with the with the guys, just a variety of
different things, again not punitively and explain it in advance.
And my pictures once maybe twice doing some form of PfP,

(34:36):
whether it's comeback or's double plays. I don't necessarily need
covering first base as much. Maybe one round of that
and then a couple months and tow to different basis,
but get my fundamental brain going again and making them
understand and realize follow the scoreboard. That's what's going to
dictate what we need to do. And let's just play
a nice game of catch here and everybody knows where

(34:58):
they're supposed to be.

Speaker 1 (34:59):
That's where I would begin back to basics. I like
that because right now it does seem like this team.
You hear it a lot, but you know when you
see it trying to do too much right, I will
say that there are some issues here in terms of
how much offense they're going to get. They have three
of the seventeen slowest bats.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
In the National League.

Speaker 1 (35:20):
All players were added this offseason in Sime and Polanco
and Bishett. They need Soto to hit like an MVP,
to come back, be healthy every day. They need lind
Door to get going, need your stars to play like stars.
But I think getting back to basics for sure, really
is where the New York Mets have to start again.

(35:40):
They have a point in the schedule here where they
can get back closer to five hundred after these fifteen games,
you know, eight and seven. Probably not gonna do it,
but it's at least a path forward to start to
at least turn the narrative around, turn their season around.
Here's a question for you, Joe, who was the most
unhittable pitcher that you ever saw? The guy who goes

(36:04):
out to the mound and really is an outlier in
terms of just pure stuff.

Speaker 3 (36:09):
Okay, gosh, I mean what studs out to me was
de Gram you know when I saw him a little
bit with the Mets just several years ago. Prior to that,
Randy Johnson, you know, Randy Johnson was just another level
of ridiculousness.

Speaker 4 (36:24):
And I mentioned Kevin Brown. I mean when Kevin Brown
was in his prime, man.

Speaker 3 (36:28):
This guy was it was like, if you did hit
the ball, you could hit it into your front foot
or it's gonna be on the ground somewhere. But I'd say,
if I had to pick one in my own with
my own eyeballs, I'd say, Randy Johnson.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
That is a good call. Six foot eleven growing.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
I don't know back then what it was, but it
was upper nineties and a nasty, nasty, breaking ball. But
I bring it up because I think I have a
new contender for you, okay, and that's Mason Miller for
the San Diego Padres. I mean, this is like other worldlies,
throwing one hundred and three and it's not even his

(37:03):
best pitch, the fast ball. It's a slider, which he
throws a little bit more than fifty percent of the time. Basically,
you have to choose between those two pitches. He's faced
thirty eight batters this year, not a looted of run.
Actually has in a lot of runs. Since August fifth
last year, faced thirty eight batters. He has struck out
twenty seven of them. He's allowed two walks and two hits.

(37:26):
That is it, you know, I'm not sure I've ever
seen a pitcher who's been this dominant. I agree with
you on Jacob degram I always thought that he was
pitching elevated to its highest form. I mean, the dude
was throwing like ninety five millli hour sliders with command
and painting on both sides of the plate. Crazy, right,

(37:47):
But just in terms of hitters being completely overmatched one
after the other after the other. And I know it's
very different being a closer than a starting pitcher. Mason
Miller is doing things on the mouth I don't think
I've seen before.

Speaker 3 (38:00):
Yeah, and when they acquired him, they gave up their
maybe their top prospect at that time, didn't they.

Speaker 4 (38:07):
The Padres, the kid that went to Oakland.

Speaker 1 (38:09):
Yeah degrees, Yeah, in field prospect, he's going to be
a good Major leaguer.

Speaker 4 (38:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:12):
So I mean this is you know, for years you
would never see that happen. I mean it was always
the thing about you don't give up that for a
volatile bullpen arm, because there's from year to year you
never know what you're going to get. And but Miller
had demonstrated this even with Oakland. So I really give
give the Padres a lot of credit for stepping up

(38:33):
and doing something like that because that could be the
difference between them getting deep into this postseason or getting
to the postseason and then we're deeply.

Speaker 4 (38:41):
Into it based on what he's able to do.

Speaker 3 (38:44):
It's Mariano Rivera's stuff, right, I mean, when you had
the Yankees had so many great players, when they had
that long run late nineties whatever into the two thousands,
and you could go up and down the list of
wonderful players, pitchers, et cetera. But I always said and
believed that they could not not have done that without
Rivera being the cornerstone of that bullpen. And I think,

(39:06):
you know, so you look at what the Padres did,
and probably was criticized amongst some circles again because to
give up that talent for eight quote unquote relief pitcher,
But then you get, like the relief pitcher, the somebody
that's absolutely completely different than anybody that's anyone else that's
come down the line more recently. So I give the

(39:27):
Pods a lot of credit there for making that deal,
and this could be the difference maker for them, just
as for me on a personal level, eraldis Chapman what
he did for the Cubs in twenty sixteen, same kind
of a thing. And of course Mariano Rivera what he
did for years for the Yankees, their success and their
World championships would not have had as many up on

(39:48):
that banner behind home play whatever it is, had he
not been there.

Speaker 2 (39:51):
Yeah, I agree with you on Rivera.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
And you win the games you're supposed to win when
you have it in hand, and even more than that,
you affect gains. And no, the other manager knows that
guy sitting out there, Mason Miller. If you get to
that point, it's game over. Quite another question for you, Joe.
Have you ever been to Sweden?

Speaker 4 (40:08):
But I've been to Spain, I have not been to Sweden.

Speaker 1 (40:12):
I mean, when you think of Sweden, what do you
think about cold like a progressive you know cold yea progressive,
you know, state of the art country, pushing the envelope
of high tech.

Speaker 2 (40:22):
We like to talk here about analog baseball.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
Right Sweden is going analog or going back to the future.

Speaker 2 (40:30):
Talk about that right after this on the book of
Joe Joe, I'm not sure if you caught this. I
mentioned Sweden going analog. They literally are.

Speaker 1 (40:50):
They were one of the first countries to go really
heavy when it comes to education, to all things digital,
you know, putting screens in the hands and laptops in
the hands of kids and everything that way, well, they
found out that, you know, after doing this for a
few years and looking at the research, it's probably not
a good thing to do it that deeply. So what

(41:13):
they're doing is they're investing over one hundred million dollars
to bring back physical textbooks, pens, paper and handwriting because
all their literacy rates are going down. So the way
they're combating that is to actually have people writing and
reading with physical analog elements. So it's not like they're

(41:39):
getting rid of screens, but they're certainly decreasing the amount
of time that people spend on screens. And so far
the research, Joe is saying that kids are losing comprehension,
they're losing focus, and a lot of it is because
of digital tools that people schools have gone way too

(42:01):
far down the path of putting digital devices in the
hands of these kids, and this is all they're doing.

Speaker 2 (42:08):
So I love the idea.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
That Sweden is at least examining the evidence and saying
this ain't working.

Speaker 2 (42:18):
Let's try to go back to what we know works.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
And again, it's not like they're closing the door on
anything digital.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
It's not it at all.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
It's saying that we're questioning the methods that before went unquestioned.

Speaker 3 (42:31):
Wow, I'm moving to Sweden. You know that sounds it's
cold right now. It's cold though. That's the golfing. It's
not going to be as good. Wow, I completely forgotten.
First of all, I love your description of analog baseball,
and I got to make that. I just wrote it down.
It's got to happen. The shirt's got to occur, and
it's going to happen.

Speaker 2 (42:51):
So I want a hoodie. I want an analog baseball hoodie.

Speaker 4 (42:54):
Okay, I think that's brilliant. I love that. And then
so all they're going back to analog.

Speaker 3 (43:01):
We're talking analog baseball and they're talking analog society. Analog
Is that some way, ten amount or in some way
related to analytics. I mean, when you talk about analog baseball,
we would we like to create a better balance between
analog baseball and the present version of analytical baseball. And

(43:21):
what that would mean is that you talked about these
shorter attention span for kids. It's spread adults too. Man,
I'm guilty. I used to read novels. I used to
read a novel a week, maybe two weeks at the most,
I would turn over. I'd go to the one of
the bookstores and grab another book, and I would sit
down and I would just devoured. I could not wait
till I get back at night. Whatever it's you know,

(43:42):
to shut it, to shut the whole thing down. I
would open that book and it was never about Netflix
or Prime Video whatever. It was always about whatever that
book was. I missed that, and it's okay, then then
why don't you just do something differently when you start
doing that again? Because I have been absolutely bought into
this digital component where I'd read constantly, but I don't

(44:03):
read novels anymore. I will read articles, articles, articles, I
will look at videos, and I will research stuff, and
sometimes I get lazy because I don't want to reach
so I'll just just show me the video, just tell
me what this article says. And I'm guilty of that also,
and I hate that. I think it's brilliant. I really
hope and pray that the success rate they but they
can glean from that and demonstrate to the rest of

(44:25):
the world how it has turned the corner for them
educationally with their kids. I think it's absolutely brilliant. I
could go on and on about that. But I love it,
and I'm so happy that you're about that to my attention,
I'll start following it more closely. So, you know, in
baseball world, all this all this stuff that we're doing
man and the AI component, And I just saw a
robot rand a marathon faster.

Speaker 4 (44:46):
Of course, the robot.

Speaker 3 (44:47):
Random marathon faster than a human can. But to what
point I don't know. I get like, if we start
creating robots that could run like that, eventually they turn
into soldiers, and what happens at that point, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (45:01):
So this is all scary stuff.

Speaker 3 (45:03):
I love Sweden's doing, and now I need to visit
them at some point.

Speaker 1 (45:08):
Yeah, and to answer your question, it is based on analytics.
They've seen all their you know, reading scores and comprehension
scores going down. So I give them credit for reacting
to that. So does that change baseball at all? I
don't know, But I'm encouraged by the fact that now
you have a lot of countries at least re examining
or complete bands in some cases, you know, social media

(45:29):
in the hands of kids. I mean again, we're working
off analytics, we're paying attention to a generation that is
growing up with with more anxiety, more body image issues,
less confidence, and again we have to react to I mean,
really the first generation that is going through this this

(45:50):
age where the age of convenience I call it, where
everything is that you're literally at your fingertips and it's
too much, too soon for a lot of children. And
I think that's why we're starting to see the rest
of the world and the US as usual is a
little bit behind reacting to say this maybe isn't a
good thing. Let's see if we can put some governors

(46:12):
on it.

Speaker 4 (46:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (46:13):
I mean it's the you know, the unintended consequences always
occur with everything new that pops up. You know, so
many people, even in the beginning, I talked to so
many folks that were just so into social media and
with the net, positive is going to be a democratization
and how everybody's gonna have a voice and all this
other kind of stuff. But then you don't really realize

(46:34):
where all these other voices coming from and the influence
that they may have not necessarily being positive, and and
a lot of it, there is a lot of Absolutely,
there's a lot of positive, no question about I get
a lot of good information right down to recipes, you know,
and I love that stuff. But there's so much negativity
and detrimental components of this stuff that obviously I don't

(46:55):
maybe some of you know, some brilliant people thought about
it when it first came to Bear. I just didn't
like it. From the perspective as a young manager. It
was so easy to be critical of us and me
from a distance from somebody that really wasn't a journalist,
that wasn't that wasn't there all the time. They could
be critical from their basement and not have any kind
of accountability from that. That's the stuff that that I

(47:19):
glommed onto early on as a young manager with the.

Speaker 4 (47:22):
Rays, and that did bother me.

Speaker 3 (47:24):
And I always thought that at some point legislatively, there's
got to be some adjustments made to this, because that
there is a there's there's a lot of it's not
true and and and there's some kind of a slander
component to that. I would believe also, and even from
two thousand and six seven eight, Rick Vaughn came in
my office with the Rays and Harby said that they'd
like me to have a Twitter account. I was like

(47:46):
adverse to it. But it's gonna help us, It could
help the rais it. You know, it's it's a promotional
component all this stuff, And so I did and I still,
I mean, I don't really utilize it, but I have it,
and I've only utilized it more recently to promote like events,
like my events that would occur within the foundation, those
kinds of things. But I wouldn't just tweet whatever to

(48:07):
put out there my feelings on something, my thoughts on
something when I ate that morning, all that kind of stuff.
So yeah, there there is an absolute positive component to it.
But I you know, I think if you started weighing
it out, if you put it on a scale, the
scale is gonna take it's gonna tip towards a negative
side because that's where the influence is. We have a
tendency to want to report bad before we want report
good in anything, and it's just an easy way. And

(48:30):
amateurs are doing the reporting. Professionals and shoved to the
background because of this. Because it's so easy. We all
we all have our own newspaper, our own magazine within
our grasp with whether it's a cell phone or an
iPad or a computer, you all become journalists. And non
accountable journalists. And that's really what I think is the

(48:50):
is the worst part about it.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
I always liked your idea, and this is going back
aways for a good Twitter and a bad Twitter. Yeah,
good Twitter, you start being negative or you're ripping somebody,
you're off, you lose.

Speaker 2 (49:04):
You're right. It's like we're keeping the water unpolluted. That's
you want to go pollute the water, you go on
bad Twitter.

Speaker 4 (49:11):
That's right.

Speaker 3 (49:12):
That was two thousand and six seven. That was my
first impression. I did, that's your hunter. I forgot all
about that, but I said, we need that. Uh, And
I don't even want to I don't even want to
tell you what I wanted to call bad Twitter because
it's kind of a derogatory turn.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Well, you were ahead of your time with that idea.
Of course I had no chance of flying. It's not
the world we live in. But I liked where you
were going there. So what else do you have for us, Joe?
In terms of words of wisdom? To end this episode
of the Book of Joe.

Speaker 3 (49:40):
My words of wisdom today are based on an event
that occurred recently, a tragic event that really has has
broken me up a little bit and a lot of
my buddies. The death of Garrett Anderson GA was a
big part of that Angel organization is sending to the
point that they did has doubled on the right field

(50:02):
line versus the Giants. Obviously, Game seven, I could still
see it ringing because I had a great view of
perspective on that. I could still see it coming off
as bat ringing into that corner, and you just knew
pretty much knew that was going to be the difference maker.

Speaker 4 (50:16):
But that's just one event. I've been replaying the.

Speaker 3 (50:20):
Real in my head about all my interactions with Garrett
from the time I met him, I think he was seventeen,
maybe eighteen, from the time he was in Boise early
on and playing right field under lights, and he was
having a really hard time with the lights. So I
made the groundskeepers keep the lights on after a night
game and we went out there together. I think Kach

(50:42):
was out there to help Tommy Kouchman, and we just
tried to get Ga more comfortable with the lights in
the outfield, who he just never done that before. The
other thing was I as a hitting coach, I used
to talk about hunting a pitch. I thought, you know,
trying to if you're able to hunt pitches and organize
your strike zone and accept walks when they want to

(51:04):
walk you and makes you a better hit her. And
that was one of my main teaching points with all
the guys. And the one time game joke and I
talk to you, Yeah, of course ya, you know that
thing about honey pitches. Yeah, I can't do that. He said,
I can't do that. And I said, Garrett, uh, you're
pretty darn good. Just forget about that. Just keep doing

(51:25):
what you're doing. He turned into a really good I
used to work with him in the outfield, was the
outfield coach.

Speaker 4 (51:31):
He was so good at.

Speaker 3 (51:32):
Going down that left field line and his spin throw
into the into the bag at second base or even
if throws the homeplate. He progressively got better because he
worked so hard at it. Beyond all that he talked
to any of the boys, he was. He's one of
the best teammates ever. He played. He showed up and
he played every day. He played through a lot of

(51:52):
little bumps and bruises, but he played. Look at the
on an annual basis, the number of games played by
g A. It was, it was, it was. It was
such a an anchor within that lineup, and everybody could
count on me. He was so clutch, you know, really
covertly put up some great numbers if you look at
what he had done over time. Not an analytical darling

(52:14):
based on you know, the way he hit. He swung
the bat. He liked to swing the bat. He was
not wanted to go up, like I said, hunt pitches
and take the ball.

Speaker 4 (52:24):
Wasn't play a lot, and he.

Speaker 3 (52:25):
Would probably if he had a little bit more discerning
I who knows, he could have been a little bit better,
but then again, it could have been worse.

Speaker 4 (52:31):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (52:32):
But anyway, we all miss We're all struggling with this one.
I was on the phone with Timmy Samon a couple
of days ago and we just talked it all the
way through, and anyhow, I just wanted to point that out.
Garrett maybe been a little bit misunderstood because he was
so reserved, but promise you, from my own personal perspective,

(52:55):
when he liked and trusted you, my God, the conversation
could go on forever. So sympathies to Teresa and the
entire family and all the angel world because we lost
a really good one with Ga you.

Speaker 1 (53:09):
Know, he's just fifty three years old, far too young.
And when we lose people like this, who are such
great human beings besides being a great ballplayer, so young,
just the effect of it is just it's crushing it.
I remember when we lost Gary Carter. I kind of
felt the same way, you know, just a really good

(53:30):
guy who left us way too young. And you know,
every death is tragic and we feel for the families,
but this one just hit like out of the blue,
especially hard. Garrett Edison. You're right, I think he was
undervalued as a player in general because, let's face it,
he was so consistent, right, I mean, out to me

(53:52):
was his hallmark. You could count on him, as you've mentioned,
Joe playing every day producing you know, maybe not producing.

Speaker 2 (53:59):
A highlight reels. He certainly was not going to sell
himself at all.

Speaker 1 (54:04):
But if you watched him play, it's kind of like
cal Ripken, you know, watching cal Ripken play, you had
to watch him play a series a week, a month,
and then you're like, okay, I get it. You know,
the more you see this guy, the more you realize
what's special about him. And I think Garrett was the
same way that maybe if you saw him only play
one night, you were like, Okay, he's a pretty good player.

Speaker 2 (54:24):
But it was the.

Speaker 1 (54:25):
Consistency, reliability, the way he carried himself game after game,
night after night, year after year. Really special player and
had gone too soon.

Speaker 3 (54:36):
Yeah, and the last point, this guy never made an excuse.
Never things went badly. Sometimes you go into like pretty
pretty hard slumps because of the swing and the contact,
round ball, the second base kind of stuff. And he
would hear it, you know, he'd hear from different arenas,
whether it was the fans or the media, whatever, he'd
hear it, and even coaching staff. But he never lashed out.

(55:00):
He never now he never s had never made an excuse,
never pinned it on anybody else. He was just very stoic.
He'd keep it to himself and he'd work his way
through it. And I love, you know the dudes that
never make an excuse, and Garrett never did. He just
came out and put the uniform on again the next

(55:21):
day and power of twenty four hours, he could turn
things around in the very next day, very next to
that bat. So yeah, way too young, And this one
it hit me hard, hit a lot of his heart.

Speaker 1 (55:35):
Yes, good stuff, Joe, we will see you next time
on the Book of Joe.

Speaker 4 (55:39):
Take care, Tommy, Thanks budd.

Speaker 1 (55:43):
And The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.
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