March 4, 2026 • 36 mins
Hour 1 of The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show opens with a deep dive into the rapidly evolving U.S.–Iran conflict, focusing on American and Israeli airpower gaining near‑total control of Iranian airspace. Clay and Buck analyze Secretary of War Pete Hegseth’s remarks highlighting overwhelming U.S. dominance—B‑2s, B‑52s, B‑1s, drones, and fighter jets—systematically destroying Iran’s military capabilities and reducing its missile launches and drone attacks. The hosts frame this as a strategic move to eliminate Iran’s ability to retaliate and to pressure Tehran into negotiating a path for selecting its next leader.
Buck expands the conversation by breaking down Iran’s complex internal dynamics: its many ethnic groups, fractured political factions, and the difficulty of identifying a viable, stable successor to the Ayatollah. He contrasts this with historical lessons from Iraq and Venezuela, emphasizing the danger of removing an entire governing apparatus without a transitional plan.
The hour also features a major comparative analysis between Iran and North Korea, with Clay and Buck debating which nuclear‑armed (or potentially nuclear‑armed) regime poses a greater global threat. Clay argues that Iran’s religious fundamentalism makes it more dangerous, while Buck counters that North Korea’s cult‑like isolation, mass delusion, and loyalty to the Kim dynasty create a uniquely unstable nuclear environment. The two revisit the history of missed opportunities to stop North Korean nuclear development in the 1990s and discuss President Trump’s previous diplomatic approach to Pyongyang.
Listeners hear a series of calls examining whether Iran would use nuclear weapons if it ever obtained them, the influence of China over North Korea, and how religious ideology versus cult loyalty shapes both countries’ behavior. Clay emphasizes that Iran acquiring nuclear weapons could trigger a wider Middle East arms race, pushing neighboring states toward nuclear proliferation.
Hour 1 concludes with strategic questions about the future of Iran: whether a pro‑U.S. figure could emerge within the IRGC or military, how regime change could unfold without nuclear escalation, and whether public opinion will support the operation as long as it avoids U.S. boots on the ground. The hour underscores the show’s central themes—geopolitics, nuclear deterrence, U.S. military strategy, authoritarian regimes, and the global stakes of the Iran conflict—setting the tone for the rest of the broadcast.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Wednesday edition.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
The primary in Texas is over continued discussion of the
war in Iran. Our buddy Jesse Kelly will join us
in the second hour. In the third hour, we are
hoping that maybe io Eckstein will be able to join us.
She is from the IFCJ. As missiles are raining down
on Israel. We will see whether that ends up happening
(00:27):
or not. But we appreciate all of you hanging out
with us, and let's go right to it. I've said
before Buck that I love early morning press conferences, and
I understand that people in media do not like to
get up early in the morning. I had five years
of early morning radio nobody else was awake. I love
(00:51):
making media members get up early and have to go
cover events. I've talked about it at the White House.
I particularly love that the Secretary of War and that
everybody there is doing early morning press conferences because it
sets the entire agenda of the day. And here is
what I thought was the most significant aspect of what
(01:16):
Secretary of War Pete Hegseth said that basically, and Buck,
I want you to analyze this as well. We are
close to having complete and total control of the skies
over Iran. Here is cut six.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
US and Israeli air power every minute of every day
until we decide it's over in Iran, we'll be able
to do nothing about it. B two S B fifty
two s B ones, predator drones, fighters controlling the skies,
picking targets, death and destruction from the sky all day long.
(01:58):
We're playing for keeps. Fighters have maximum authorities granted personally
by the President and yours.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Truly.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Our rules of engagement are bold, precise, and designed to
unleash American power, not shackle it. This was never meant
to be a fair fight, and it is not a
fair fight. We are punching them while they're down, which
is exactly how it should be.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
All right, we're finishing them. Would be another way of
pointing this out. Buck Let me hit you with another
couple of pieces of data. Raisin Kine, as Trump calls him,
General Kane, says Iran's this is a direct quote. Ballistic
missile shots fired are down eighty six percent from the
first day of fighting, twenty three percent decrease just in
(02:41):
the last twenty four hours. One way attack drones down
seventy three percent from the opening salvos that were fired.
Why is this significant because what we are seeing is
Iran's ability to fire back is diminishing in a hurry.
And I I understand that the talking points are this
(03:03):
war has just begun. I think that is largely to
try to drive Iran towards an agreement on who the
next leader will be. But to me, the story now,
and you correct me if you see anything else here,
is Iran's ability to fire back sort of indiscriminately, which
they've been doing peppering many different Gulf states with drones
(03:26):
with missiles is basically vanishing. Soon it will be gone,
and when that occurs, America's air superiority will be even
more pronounced. And then it's really just a question of
to what extent is Iran willing to negotiate with us
to determine what their new government will look like and
(03:46):
who the leaders are. Is that a fair assessment in
your mind? Well, mostly yes, except negotiate with whom This
is the problem is that there really is not a
sort of set and clear alternative to what we currently have,
(04:09):
which is now gone, or rather is mostly gone, And
there's a lot of factionalism. This is where you get
into This is a large and complicated country. We've thought
of it as in this country. I think a lot
of the media coverage has made people think of it
more as a monolith. People will refer to all Iranians
as Persians. Well, Persians are just one ethnic group actually
(04:31):
in around sixty percent according to the numbers that I
saw Buck. There are Kurds, there are Azeris, there are Turkmen,
there are I mean, there are so many different ethnic
factions otherwise that I can't name. I mean there's a
dozen or more that will make the list. There's a
lot of them. As the point, and when you actually
(04:54):
talk about a resistance forming from within, I think what
we what we want? Clay, the lesson of Iraq is
you cannot remove everybody who had any function in the
pre previous government unless you want bloody anarchy, which is
what we ended up getting. You cannot have every person
(05:18):
who ever held a gun for and and received a
paycheck from a government that is what was run by
the Ayatola or formerly run by the Ayatola.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Uh. You can't get rid of all of them.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
You need somebody from within who has enough Uh, Wasta.
I think they would say in the in the in Arabic,
in the Middle East, you need somebody with enough juice
that they can say, all right, we can calm things down.
We can approach America or American intermediaries directly. There's already
(05:53):
reporting out there. I mean, there's reporting up on CNN
of I mean, this is the CNN report. It says
c I A working to arm Kurdish Kurdish forces to
spark uprising in Iran, according to sources. Is that true?
Is that not true? This is what this is what
CNN is reporting. I can tell you this. That's that
(06:13):
comes with a lot the whole Kurdish thing. We went
through this in Iraq, and the Kurds are often pretty
reliable allies they fight. They kept northern Iraq very stable
even during the worst periods of the Iraqi insurgency. Anybody
who was if you went from you know, Baghdad or
Ramadi or or Mozil to Airbil. In the military military side,
(06:38):
it felt like you were in a completely different country. Uh,
if you were in what they called Kurdistan. But the
Turks get very aggravated because there's a lot of a
lot of Kurds in Turkey, and they have their own
separatist problem in Turkey. So it's just you're you're getting
into midiese factionalism here. What you need is someone who
(06:58):
is a rational actor from within the existing apparatus, not
an ideologue, not bloodied substantially by engaged in you know,
IRGC coulds for stuff or whatever. Does this person exist?
I don't know. I you know, we talked about Vene.
Venezuela is different. Venezuela has had democratic elections until quite recently.
(07:24):
And yes there's oppression, and there's been the you know,
the Majuro regime stole the last election, and yes they've
been thaugish. But Clay, you don't have to go back
very far for there to be something resembling a real
election in Venezuela. You go back to twenty twelve, right, right,
And and that's when Chavez took took charge.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
I believe, right, wasn't it twenty twelve, twenty eleven, twenty twelve.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So in the Islamic Republic you got to talk rather,
you know, in Iran you got to go back to
nineteen seventy nine, and even then they didn't have elections.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
They had a shaw. So what is the game plan
for all of this?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
I think it's being figured out on the fly, But
I think that Secretary of War hegseats plan is We're
going to completely defang the snake and then we'll see
if the snake wants to play ball. But the snake
will have no fangs, that is for sure.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
And I just let me.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Let me make a suggestion, because I know we got
a lot of people in the administration who listen. I
think one of the most compelling arguments they can make.
And Buck again, tell me if you think this is crazy.
I made it yesterday, but I haven't seen it because
now the argument is well, they haven't really been able
to give us a full throated explanation of what the
(08:42):
motivation is. Well, the motivation is clearly to keep Iran
from getting nuclear weapons. That's the motivation for all of this.
This is basically doing to Iran what we should have
done to North Korea in the nineteen nineties. The world
would be infinitely better if that crazy fat dictator in
North Korea did not have nuclear weapons, and and now
(09:03):
that he does, we can't really do anything. The world
is unstable because of him.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Do we want a Now.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
The only thing I will say in favor of Kim
jong Un probably get clipped.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
People will be like Clay Travis loves Kim jong Un.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Clay Travis loves Kim jong Un, loves all the big posters,
the pot belly, all of it. Big Kim jong Un
guy here, he's not a religious fundamentalist. That's the only
thing I think you can say in his favor in
your Korea. I don't think he's a religious fundamentalist. You know,
he's just he's just God. But that's the whole He
(09:41):
thinks he's God. But yeah, well that's but my point
when you're God. But yeah, okay, Well my point is
he's not reading a book convinced that everybody else who
is not a member of that religion is an infidel.
And he's not trying to impose his religion. I don't
think so. I look, you're kind of too hard after
(10:02):
I'm pretty familiar with North Korea stuff, and I got
to tell you, they they have the most crazy. They're
absolutely you know, like we are vermin. We not non
Koreans are considered vermin in North Korean propaganda, I mean
actually sub human. Uh And and they use all kinds
of but.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
But it's it's a crazy place. We agree, we.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
We wish that they did not have nuclear weapons. My
point is, to my knowledge, North Korea has been unable
to in some way or even demonstrate that they're going
to enact terror upon the rest of the world in
a substantial way. I know they had the one attack
on the subway.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
They do terror. They do the terrorism thing too. Your
your point is that you're.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Trying to be positive here in saying that I think
Iran having nuclear weapons is even more dangerous than North Korea.
But the argument should be that North Korea having nuclear
weapons is absolutely awful for the world, and if we
had been smart in the early nineties, we would have
wiped out their ability to ever have nuclear weapons.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
That's what we're doing with Iran.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
And I think Iran is even more dangerous than North
Korea based on what they have demonstrated for fifty years
now that they want to wipe many countries off the world,
including Israel, but also death to America everything else.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
So the argument to me is pretty clear.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
It is President Trump is making a determination that for
the next forty years or fifty years, or who knows,
how long we're not going to have to deal with
the nuclear Iran because it destabilizes the rest of the
world even more than North Korea does now. And if
we could go back in time into the nineties, we
would have wiped out North Korea's nuclear ambitions. I haven't
heard anybody make that argument. I think that's the best
(11:54):
argument for what we're doing with Iran right now. We
certainly didn't want another nuclear standoff like what we had
with North Korea. But North Korea has already been whether
it's for proliferation or uh destabilizing activity, support of terrorism, assassinations, kidnappings.
The North Korean Intelligence Service operates like a a.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
A nation state backed you know, basically terrorist operation.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So you're my argument of trying to be kind and
say that Iran is a more dangerous North Korea, you
actually think North Korea might be more.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Korea is the craziest place. North Korea is the craziest
place on planet Earth.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
By I was too kind, I was too kind to
Kim Jong uk. It would be good, it would be
good if we didn't have a North Korean twin with
nuclear weapons. That to me is a really signed that
we did not need to understand, I co signed that
we did not need a country with totalitarian dictatorship that
also believes if we have a massive war will harken
(13:00):
the return of the twelfth Imam and there's religious prophecy
that will come out of the nuclear flames. But North
Korea does want to kill everybody in South Korea and
probably America too, So we got they really do or
is that just a delusional crazy person?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
More so like the.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Executed senior generals of the North Korean regime with anti
aircraft pieces just to make a point, They're pretty crazy.
He's crazy. It's bad that he has nuclear weapons. I
just I look at North Korea and say, if Kim
Jong un was gone, I think North Korea actually could
reconciliate with South Korea, and there is a way in
(13:40):
which that country eventually.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Could return to normalcy in the world.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
And and much of it is a cult of personality
driven around one person. And uh, maybe I'm just too
kind of North Korea. There is the possibility, maybe the
headline play is too kind of North Korea. You're gonna
you're gonna get a invite to peong Yang at this rate,
you and he and Dennis Rodman. We're gonna be just
chilling playing a basketball game with with my boy Kim
(14:07):
Jong Un. I will say the stories of what they
did when that movie was made about the assassination of
Kim Jong Un. Uh the interview I think with uh
with James who did that movie back in the day.
Do you remember that movie where they James Franco, James
Franco and Seth Rogan that led to the hacking of Sony,
(14:28):
which was a huge problem. By the way, just the
point about North Korea, Clay, they also operate as nation
state backed global hackers trying to everything from crypto to
state secrets to and.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
What are you gonna do?
Speaker 1 (14:41):
You're gonna go ton Interpol and say hey, we think
that we trace the source to North Korea.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Good luck with that one.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
But if we could go back in time and wave
a magic wand and we wiped out North Korea's ability
to ever have nuclear weapons, North Korea might not exist
as a country today, right, Like that been true?
Speaker 2 (14:57):
That was so the.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
Analogy here of trying to avoid creating another North Korea,
to me, I think is a really good one. Have
you heard anybody making that argument. I haven't heard it. Anywhere. Well,
the argument you will hear people make is the is
the Kadafi lesson, isn't reconcile with America.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
If you're a dictator, it's geting.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Nukes as fast as you can, because otherwise that's that's
the other side. Always, that's the rational choice to make.
And if you question it, Ukraine wouldn't have gotten invaded
by Russia if they hadn't given up their nukes. That's
also true. And we promised them that that would never
have it, protect them and allow that to happen. The
Bunipest memorandum. Yeah, not good.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Not good.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
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Speaker 4 (16:25):
Clay Travison, Buck Sexton, Mike drops that never sounded so good.
Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Welcome back into Clay and Buck.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
We were talking about the plan with regard to Iran,
and I said, defang. It turns out that's exactly what
Secretary of Rubio said, Great minds think alike.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
I didn't even know about this one. Here's Secretary of
Rubio play it.
Speaker 5 (16:50):
From what I've been told by the Department of War,
everything is on or ahead of schedule and proceeding on
these objectives. We have every confidence in the world that
these objectives will be achieved. The last point I would
make is, and I said this yesterday, and I repeat,
what's about You know you're about to see you know,
we're going to unleash Chang on these people in the
next few hours and days. You're going to really begin
to perceive a change in the scope and in the
(17:11):
intensity of these attacks. As frankly, the two most powerful
air forces in the world take apart this terroristic regime
and defang it and take away its ability to threaten
its neighbors or hide behind a zone of immunity that
allows them to develop their nuclear ambitions. But this terroristic, radical,
cleric led regime cannot be ever allowed to have nuclear weapons.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
We just blew up the Iranian flagship Clay with a torpedo,
the first time the US has taken down a ship
with a torpedo since World War Two. I saw that
for the military history nerds out there. I don't even
know how many ships Iran has, but I don't manel
like they have a very very long history of seafaring
(17:57):
left in their future.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Here.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
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Travis buck Sexton Show, Texas Primary. We got some cuts
now that James Talery has beaten our good friend Jasmine Crockett.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
We're gonna play those for you in a moment.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
But as I was checking my text messages, the team
has been constructing photos of me playing the flute while
dining with Kim Jong un after the open of the show.
Those will soon be out on social media. Let me
circle back around on this angle and see if you'll
buy into this argument.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Buck.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
The reason why I think Iran with nuclear weapons is
more dangerous than North Korea with nuclear weapons. Both are dangerous.
But the reason why I think the North Korean argument
is a good one is my concern is if the
iotola dies and Iran has nuclear weapons, the reason why
the Iyotola is in power is there are enough fundamentalists
(19:48):
in Iran that the power of the Ayatola is not
coming from top down, it's from bottom up. In other words,
there are lots of fundamentalists who believe that they need
to kill people in order to spread their faith, and
the leader then is a reflection of what many actually
believe in the country, which means the length of time
(20:11):
that they can have nuclear weapons is in danger for
many different leaders. I think most people are lying when
they say, oh, we love Kim Jong un. They fear
him because he's very powerful, but there isn't actually a
fundamentalist belief system. Of the same way, when people leave
North Korea, they tend to embrace Western values and suddenly
(20:35):
realize the rest of the world is great. There are
people who leave Middle Eastern countries and decide that they're
going to act out based on their religion.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Does that make sense? I think the religion of Kim.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Jong un or whatever it is in North Korea is
not actually real. People are just terrified if they don't
put his photo up that they're going to be killed
because he is a very supremely powerful person. But if
you were gone, there actually could be some sanity in
that country. My concern, and we'll see what happens now,
is now that we've cut off the head of the
(21:07):
snake of the Ayatola, it is possible that we end
up with a religious fundamentalist leader in Iran who is
even worse and more dangerous going forward than what we
have right now.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
So both are bad.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
But I actually think Iran with nuclear weapons is more
dangerous than North Korea with nuclear weapons. I mean it's
I think it's a little bit of an Apples to
Orange comparison.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
But I don't know how much worse North Korea could
be than it than it it is.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
I just think if there are a lot of white
Allians who actually buy into the cult of personality there
that they don't clear they don't have external internet, they
don't have books, they don't have TV, the entire country.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
I mean, I.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Actually write about this in Manufacturing Delusion, which is a
fantastic book you can go check out. The entire country
is essentially in a mass mind control experiment. Well, they
will kill you if you bring in DVDs from other
countries and just try to watch them in your home.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
I mean, they have.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Millions of people who are part of the security apparatus
in North Korea who their privileged position, their their family's
privileged position. The fact that they have food to eat
and roof over their heads is entirely in their minds
tied to Kim Jong un and his benevolence. So it's
(22:23):
not as simple as like if he were gone. Everything
I mean, the country is. It is a bizarre place
in so many ways. It's not like it's gonna be
a flowering of Jeffersonian democracy.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
If you had no Kim Jong un.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Well, theory of another general take over on behalf of
the Kim family. It's technically a necrocracy, meaning that the
Kim Kim ill sung is still theoretically the head of
the Communist Party of North Korea, and he's been dead
for a long time. Well, and they have a dynasty
that is predicated on his supremacy that theoretically is now
(23:04):
going to run I think Kim Jong un has already
announced that his daughter is going to be the one
that takes over after he's dead, right, I mean he
is considered the eternal president, Kim il sung, that's what
they call him, the eternal president. So so to your
point about religion and everything else, play, the religion of
North Korea is the Kim dynasty, right, it is a
(23:25):
religion effectively. I mean, they have a dead guy who's
still technically the leader of the country forever because of
the way that they've set up all of the state propaganda.
And look, North Korea. Really, let's go access of evil here?
What was the access of evil?
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Iraq? Iran?
Speaker 1 (23:41):
North Korea? North Korea we can't get rid of because
of all of the nukes. And that's not just the nukes.
They've got enough conventional artillery that they could kill hundreds
of thousands of people, probably in Seoul, in the capital
of South Korea, in the first forty eight hours or
so of an engagement, right, I mean, it's an absolute
disaster waiting to happen. So Iran, we don't want to
(24:01):
get to that place. But I mean, you know, the
other side of it is people would say Iran would
have a little bit of a problem with Saudi Arabia,
all the Sudenty Arab states around it that are enemies
of it effectively. And then this little country called Israel
that is just really good at kicking their asses, that
also has nukes. So there is some box in reality
for Iran, I think as well. But will regime would
(24:22):
regime change ever happen if they had nukes? Probably not,
because you get into at what point does a country
with nukes have redlines? I mean, I think there are
things we could do to Russia where Russia would launch.
I'm not saying they would launch at all US cities,
but I think Russia says if we took out putin,
there is somebody who might push a button to I mean,
to send a nuclear weapon here. If we took out,
if we joined the Ukrainians and marched, and we had
(24:44):
you know, armored divisions rolling across Russian territory, would they
would they fire tactical nukes to take Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:50):
I think they would. Right.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
My point is that nukes will be used at some point.
It's not just we use them. We're the only ones
who have nukes. Aren't just there for show? And with
North Korea. If they had nukes and they were under
this degree of pressure, I do think that they would
be willing to launch.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
That's why we're doing it now so well.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
And again I agree that stopping them from getting to
that point is very important.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
But North Korea is a little crazier than you think
it is.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
I'm going around one on biggest threat with nuclear weapons
North Korea.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Two.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Are you taking North Korea one? Iran two? On the
power rankings of crazy? I mean it's very it's very hard.
I mean this I can tell you is North Korea
is the average North Korean more disconnected from reality and
and and more delusional than the average Iranian. Yeah, by
(25:44):
a factor of like ten. It's not even close. Because
a sophisticated, educated people that's been around for you know,
Persians and Iran have been around for millennia.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
North Korea is the kind of.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Mutant evil stepchild of the China Communist Party in China
next door, which is itself an outgrowth of Stalinist Soviet Communism.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
So, you know, North Korea is really that's a really
messed up place, really messed up place.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think if you had mass starvation in Iran, the
Mulas would have a big problem on their hands.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
In North Korea.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
They've had mass starvation and you say a word about
it and they'll just kill you faster it really is.
You know, they've opened up they've opened up resorts in
North Korea.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
Saw.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
I think we know who's gonna be one of the
first American commentators to go.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Clay's gonna be on the beach in North Korea. Like
this place isn't so bad.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I would go visit North Korea if if Dennis rod
miniral with me, I would go interview Kim Johnson?
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Would you serious question? Would you actually?
Speaker 1 (26:52):
I would not be willing to go because I think
North Korea cannot be trusted.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Even if they invite you, give you a visa and
you would you be willing to go? I wouldn't. I
would go.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
I would go to if they told me that I
was going to be able to interview Kim Jong un
and all those things, I think I would go. I
don't know that Laura Travis would think. James Franco, don't
you Clay is just like I go in there. I
go in there to talk SEC football, but really I
get rid of the dictator of North Korea. Mean, I
know everybody stopped talking about it, but remember the relationship
(27:23):
between Trump and Kim Jong un used to be a
huge talking point, right, I mean, obviously Trump went to
the Demilitarized Zone and Term one and visited and said,
I think one reason that North Korea has these beaches
and resorts that they have built is partly because President Trump,
as Trump would do, just says, hey, you know what
(27:45):
we should actually have. We should actually have a resorts
and things like that in North Korea. I think Kim
Jong un is actually likes Trump and is impacted in
some way by that. But there was the first efforts
to get some resolution from the Trump administration on diplomacy
with North Korea was a bust. Unfortunately, didn't didn't actually
(28:06):
get anywhere. I think you're right, he probably views Trump
as an interesting character. That is everythan everyone who spends
time with Trump is like, I like that guy. But
they were not able to get any kind of an
agreement out of it. Back to Iran, though, we're sinking
all their boats, we're blowing up all their planes, We're
just throwing all the surface to air missiles, We're blowing
up their intelligence headquarters, we're blowing up their military barracks.
(28:28):
I mean the plan is, I think, essentially, as Rubio said,
or as I was talking about before, make it so
that it's a country without a military and then we
can have a conversation about what comes next.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
That's really where we're taking this, and we have the
air power to do it.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
And again, I think we're basically at a point now
where we are saying to Iran, let us know when
you're willing to negotiate who your next leader is going
to be. And I don't know if you saw the data,
the pulling on this is basically as long as we
drop bombs and don't have boots on the ground and
this is not some.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
Multi year war.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
The overwhelming majority I think it was seventy four percent
I saw support the decision in Iran so long as
it doesn't lead to boots on the ground and it
is resolved within a month or two. And I think
that's the design right now of the of the president.
I think the question is who is the Delsea Rodriguez
(29:26):
of Iran. Who is somebody that we feel like is
a leader that will in many ways execute pro america
Ish policies that are not going to create a huge
issue going forward it and does that person exist? But again,
the opposition in Venezuela existed, Ran was organized one votes, Yeah,
(29:49):
nothing like that. In Iran, we're starting for starting zero.
We're starting from zero with political opposition in Iran because
it hasn't been allowed to exist. Now, the one thing
I've would say that Overlaps is they put it Delsea
Rodriguez in because I believe her brother runs the military.
What is the military in Iran going to do? To
what extent is the IRGC actually long term committed to
(30:13):
the iatola's leadership. Is there someone that could have a
role in the Iranian military that's trusted there, that would
not be trying to constantly provoke Middle Eastern responses? All
those things I think are certainly paramount of decision making
at this point in time. If you're looking for some
(30:34):
household savings, consider switching your cell phone service to Pure Talk,
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Speaker 6 (31:08):
Want to begin to know when you're on the go.
Speaker 4 (31:11):
The team forty seven podcasts Trump highlights from the week
Sundays at.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Noon Eastern in the Clay and Buck podcast feed.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get
your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Welcome back into Clay and Buck. Let's get some calls here.
I've got a lot of them coming in and we
want to hear from all of you. Am from Springfield, Massachusetts, unidentified.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Play it Clay and Buck. You talk about Korea in
the nineteen nineties, how about China? You think they would
have let us do what you're suggesting. I think you're
sadly mistaken.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Yeah, China uses North Korea as a gives them a
strategic depth, if you will, where they can keep.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
The inn they they Without China, North Korea falls apart.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
By the way North Korea could cut off China and
the country would starve and wouldn't have any gasoline and
or wouldn't have any ability to function. So North Korea
is an entirely a vassal state of China. China keeps
it going for its own purposes, and it's viewed as
a tool against us sometimes, Clay, it's you know, you better,
(32:26):
you better play nice with us here in Beijing. You
don't want things to get wild up in pyeong Yang, guys.
I mean the Chinese, you know, have played both sides
of this, and they also don't want to collapse in
North Korea because they have the most massive met or
refugee crisis imaginable of just millions of North Koreans flooding
into China. So they're they're, they're they're very involved in
that whole situation North Korea.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
I think I'm correct.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Buck doesn't have a airplane that they feel confident enough
in to travel with Kim Jong un, so they he
travels to China when he visits by train.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Train like, yeah, well.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That's also I think a security probably a security procedure
where they feel like the train is uh, yeah, safer.
They can they can make sure that he's all all
buttoned up and safe in there. But yeah, North Korea's
got all kinds of weird problems. Matt and Bethlehem, Pennsylvania.
Go ahead, Matt, I believe.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
North Korea has some nuclear ability and does not use it.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
If Iran would have seen a nuclear missile, do you
think that they would last more than a second before
shooting it at Israel? Yes, I look, I think I
mean this is this is a huge question, by the way,
but the answer is yes.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
I don't think that.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
I don't think that the entire leadership of North Korea
would instantaneously decide that they want to vaporize ninety million.
I'm sorry, the entire leadership rather of Iran would say yes,
I want Israel to vaporize like tens of.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Millions of Iranians.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Maybe it's a huge gamble, well we don't want to take,
but that is what would happen if they fired that
first nuke. And by the way, their first nuke might
not hit Tel Aviv, their first nuke might not even
get there.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
So think about the risk that they're taking.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I think it's yes, they want death to Israel, death
to America. But I think from a logical perspective, they
want the nuke because it protects their power forever. Yes,
which is why Kim Jong un has a nuke. Now,
my argument is I'm more concerned by North Korea by
Iran because of the religious fundamentalum fundamentalism of Islam that
(34:27):
would be behind it. But both are bad, and I
think the strong argument is if we could wipe it
out once and for all, if we could go back
in time, America and the world would be much safer
if North Korea had never been allowed to get jiliar Web.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
I would present this to you everyone.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
The Jihatis as bad as they are, having killed a
fraction of the people that the communists have in the
last hundred years, not even close. You're talking about one
hundred million dead versus maybe you know, a few million
dead at the hands of the jihadis over. So you know,
let's not under Let's not underestimate crazy. Let's not underestimate crazy.
(35:05):
Chuck and West Palm also wants to say Iran is
more dangerous.
Speaker 6 (35:09):
Let's there you go, I do Iran is more dangerous
because of the rigially religious fundamentalism they want to bring
forth to twelfty millions plus they sit on oceans of oil.
North Korea, as your previous caller says, it's controlled by
China only point I wanted to make guys, thank you.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Darryl in Savannah, Georgia, Daryl what you got for us.
Speaker 7 (35:32):
I just want to say I spent a lot of
time in koreab honors in the military, and I can
tell you that the North Korean people worshiped the kings,
ounding like they are God. There's a really good illustration.
Then they had a they had some blind North Koreans
and they as they finally he's got some Swiss scientists
and Swiss doctors there to operate on him. And when
(35:55):
they they operated on the fin they can see the
first thing they saw was kimill picture on the wall
and they started praising Kimilo Song and thanking him. That
did held say anything to the doctors.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Yeah, he's worshiped as a deity. He is the religion
of the state of North Korea.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
And I'll also just point out for everyone to keep
saying the twelfthy mom in Iran, I'm very familiar with this.
I'm familiar with the Hojjataia faction inside of Iran, which
used to be more prominent, but we use nukes're and
we're not a death cult. There is a calculation, a
military calculation that goes into the deployment of nuclear weapons.
(36:34):
I think Iran would have made them if they had
ever gotten them. I think North Korea is making them
by saying no one's gonna do anything.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
To us, because if they do, well, nuke them. One
other thing too.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
If Iran gets them, all the other Middle East states
are gonna want them as well.
Welcome in Clay Travis buck Sexton Show.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Wednesday edition.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
The primary in Texas is over continued discussion of the
war in Iran. Our buddy Jesse Kelly will join us
in the second hour. In the third hour, we are
hoping that maybe io Eckstein will be able to join us.
She is from the IFCJ. As missiles are raining down
on Israel. We will see whether that ends up happening
(00:27):
or not. But we appreciate all of you hanging out
with us, and let's go right to it. I've said
before Buck that I love early morning press conferences, and
I understand that people in media do not like to
get up early in the morning. I had five years
of early morning radio nobody else was awake. I love
(00:51):
making media members get up early and have to go
cover events. I've talked about it at the White House.
I particularly love that the Secretary of War and that
everybody there is doing early morning press conferences because it
sets the entire agenda of the day. And here is
what I thought was the most significant aspect of what
(01:16):
Secretary of War Pete Hegseth said that basically, and Buck,
I want you to analyze this as well. We are
close to having complete and total control of the skies
over Iran. Here is cut six.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
US and Israeli air power every minute of every day
until we decide it's over in Iran, we'll be able
to do nothing about it. B two S B fifty
two s B ones, predator drones, fighters controlling the skies,
picking targets, death and destruction from the sky all day long.
(01:58):
We're playing for keeps. Fighters have maximum authorities granted personally
by the President and yours.
Speaker 2 (02:04):
Truly.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Our rules of engagement are bold, precise, and designed to
unleash American power, not shackle it. This was never meant
to be a fair fight, and it is not a
fair fight. We are punching them while they're down, which
is exactly how it should be.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
All right, we're finishing them. Would be another way of
pointing this out. Buck Let me hit you with another
couple of pieces of data. Raisin Kine, as Trump calls him,
General Kane, says Iran's this is a direct quote. Ballistic
missile shots fired are down eighty six percent from the
first day of fighting, twenty three percent decrease just in
(02:41):
the last twenty four hours. One way attack drones down
seventy three percent from the opening salvos that were fired.
Why is this significant because what we are seeing is
Iran's ability to fire back is diminishing in a hurry.
And I I understand that the talking points are this
(03:03):
war has just begun. I think that is largely to
try to drive Iran towards an agreement on who the
next leader will be. But to me, the story now,
and you correct me if you see anything else here,
is Iran's ability to fire back sort of indiscriminately, which
they've been doing peppering many different Gulf states with drones
(03:26):
with missiles is basically vanishing. Soon it will be gone,
and when that occurs, America's air superiority will be even
more pronounced. And then it's really just a question of
to what extent is Iran willing to negotiate with us
to determine what their new government will look like and
(03:46):
who the leaders are. Is that a fair assessment in
your mind? Well, mostly yes, except negotiate with whom This
is the problem is that there really is not a
sort of set and clear alternative to what we currently have,
(04:09):
which is now gone, or rather is mostly gone, And
there's a lot of factionalism. This is where you get
into This is a large and complicated country. We've thought
of it as in this country. I think a lot
of the media coverage has made people think of it
more as a monolith. People will refer to all Iranians
as Persians. Well, Persians are just one ethnic group actually
(04:31):
in around sixty percent according to the numbers that I
saw Buck. There are Kurds, there are Azeris, there are Turkmen,
there are I mean, there are so many different ethnic
factions otherwise that I can't name. I mean there's a
dozen or more that will make the list. There's a
lot of them. As the point, and when you actually
(04:54):
talk about a resistance forming from within, I think what
we what we want? Clay, the lesson of Iraq is
you cannot remove everybody who had any function in the
pre previous government unless you want bloody anarchy, which is
what we ended up getting. You cannot have every person
(05:18):
who ever held a gun for and and received a
paycheck from a government that is what was run by
the Ayatola or formerly run by the Ayatola.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Uh. You can't get rid of all of them.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
You need somebody from within who has enough Uh, Wasta.
I think they would say in the in the in Arabic,
in the Middle East, you need somebody with enough juice
that they can say, all right, we can calm things down.
We can approach America or American intermediaries directly. There's already
(05:53):
reporting out there. I mean, there's reporting up on CNN
of I mean, this is the CNN report. It says
c I A working to arm Kurdish Kurdish forces to
spark uprising in Iran, according to sources. Is that true?
Is that not true? This is what this is what
CNN is reporting. I can tell you this. That's that
(06:13):
comes with a lot the whole Kurdish thing. We went
through this in Iraq, and the Kurds are often pretty
reliable allies they fight. They kept northern Iraq very stable
even during the worst periods of the Iraqi insurgency. Anybody
who was if you went from you know, Baghdad or
Ramadi or or Mozil to Airbil. In the military military side,
(06:38):
it felt like you were in a completely different country. Uh,
if you were in what they called Kurdistan. But the
Turks get very aggravated because there's a lot of a
lot of Kurds in Turkey, and they have their own
separatist problem in Turkey. So it's just you're you're getting
into midiese factionalism here. What you need is someone who
(06:58):
is a rational actor from within the existing apparatus, not
an ideologue, not bloodied substantially by engaged in you know,
IRGC coulds for stuff or whatever. Does this person exist?
I don't know. I you know, we talked about Vene.
Venezuela is different. Venezuela has had democratic elections until quite recently.
(07:24):
And yes there's oppression, and there's been the you know,
the Majuro regime stole the last election, and yes they've
been thaugish. But Clay, you don't have to go back
very far for there to be something resembling a real
election in Venezuela. You go back to twenty twelve, right, right,
And and that's when Chavez took took charge.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
I believe, right, wasn't it twenty twelve, twenty eleven, twenty twelve.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
So in the Islamic Republic you got to talk rather,
you know, in Iran you got to go back to
nineteen seventy nine, and even then they didn't have elections.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
They had a shaw. So what is the game plan
for all of this?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
I think it's being figured out on the fly, But
I think that Secretary of War hegseats plan is We're
going to completely defang the snake and then we'll see
if the snake wants to play ball. But the snake
will have no fangs, that is for sure.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
And I just let me.
Speaker 1 (08:21):
Let me make a suggestion, because I know we got
a lot of people in the administration who listen. I
think one of the most compelling arguments they can make.
And Buck again, tell me if you think this is crazy.
I made it yesterday, but I haven't seen it because
now the argument is well, they haven't really been able
to give us a full throated explanation of what the
(08:42):
motivation is. Well, the motivation is clearly to keep Iran
from getting nuclear weapons. That's the motivation for all of this.
This is basically doing to Iran what we should have
done to North Korea in the nineteen nineties. The world
would be infinitely better if that crazy fat dictator in
North Korea did not have nuclear weapons, and and now
(09:03):
that he does, we can't really do anything. The world
is unstable because of him.
Speaker 2 (09:11):
Do we want a Now.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
The only thing I will say in favor of Kim
jong Un probably get clipped.
Speaker 2 (09:17):
People will be like Clay Travis loves Kim jong Un.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Clay Travis loves Kim jong Un, loves all the big posters,
the pot belly, all of it. Big Kim jong Un
guy here, he's not a religious fundamentalist. That's the only
thing I think you can say in his favor in
your Korea. I don't think he's a religious fundamentalist. You know,
he's just he's just God. But that's the whole He
(09:41):
thinks he's God. But yeah, well that's but my point
when you're God. But yeah, okay, Well my point is
he's not reading a book convinced that everybody else who
is not a member of that religion is an infidel.
And he's not trying to impose his religion. I don't
think so. I look, you're kind of too hard after
(10:02):
I'm pretty familiar with North Korea stuff, and I got
to tell you, they they have the most crazy. They're
absolutely you know, like we are vermin. We not non
Koreans are considered vermin in North Korean propaganda, I mean
actually sub human. Uh And and they use all kinds
of but.
Speaker 2 (10:21):
But it's it's a crazy place. We agree, we.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
We wish that they did not have nuclear weapons. My
point is, to my knowledge, North Korea has been unable
to in some way or even demonstrate that they're going
to enact terror upon the rest of the world in
a substantial way. I know they had the one attack
on the subway.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
They do terror. They do the terrorism thing too. Your
your point is that you're.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Trying to be positive here in saying that I think
Iran having nuclear weapons is even more dangerous than North Korea.
But the argument should be that North Korea having nuclear
weapons is absolutely awful for the world, and if we
had been smart in the early nineties, we would have
wiped out their ability to ever have nuclear weapons.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
That's what we're doing with Iran.
Speaker 1 (11:14):
And I think Iran is even more dangerous than North
Korea based on what they have demonstrated for fifty years
now that they want to wipe many countries off the world,
including Israel, but also death to America everything else.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
So the argument to me is pretty clear.
Speaker 1 (11:32):
It is President Trump is making a determination that for
the next forty years or fifty years, or who knows,
how long we're not going to have to deal with
the nuclear Iran because it destabilizes the rest of the
world even more than North Korea does now. And if
we could go back in time into the nineties, we
would have wiped out North Korea's nuclear ambitions. I haven't
heard anybody make that argument. I think that's the best
(11:54):
argument for what we're doing with Iran right now. We
certainly didn't want another nuclear standoff like what we had
with North Korea. But North Korea has already been whether
it's for proliferation or uh destabilizing activity, support of terrorism, assassinations, kidnappings.
The North Korean Intelligence Service operates like a a.
Speaker 2 (12:19):
A nation state backed you know, basically terrorist operation.
Speaker 1 (12:24):
So you're my argument of trying to be kind and
say that Iran is a more dangerous North Korea, you
actually think North Korea might be more.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Korea is the craziest place. North Korea is the craziest
place on planet Earth.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
By I was too kind, I was too kind to
Kim Jong uk. It would be good, it would be
good if we didn't have a North Korean twin with
nuclear weapons. That to me is a really signed that
we did not need to understand, I co signed that
we did not need a country with totalitarian dictatorship that
also believes if we have a massive war will harken
(13:00):
the return of the twelfth Imam and there's religious prophecy
that will come out of the nuclear flames. But North
Korea does want to kill everybody in South Korea and
probably America too, So we got they really do or
is that just a delusional crazy person?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
More so like the.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
Executed senior generals of the North Korean regime with anti
aircraft pieces just to make a point, They're pretty crazy.
He's crazy. It's bad that he has nuclear weapons. I
just I look at North Korea and say, if Kim
Jong un was gone, I think North Korea actually could
reconciliate with South Korea, and there is a way in
(13:40):
which that country eventually.
Speaker 2 (13:41):
Could return to normalcy in the world.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
And and much of it is a cult of personality
driven around one person. And uh, maybe I'm just too
kind of North Korea. There is the possibility, maybe the
headline play is too kind of North Korea. You're gonna
you're gonna get a invite to peong Yang at this rate,
you and he and Dennis Rodman. We're gonna be just
chilling playing a basketball game with with my boy Kim
(14:07):
Jong Un. I will say the stories of what they
did when that movie was made about the assassination of
Kim Jong Un. Uh the interview I think with uh
with James who did that movie back in the day.
Do you remember that movie where they James Franco, James
Franco and Seth Rogan that led to the hacking of Sony,
(14:28):
which was a huge problem. By the way, just the
point about North Korea, Clay, they also operate as nation
state backed global hackers trying to everything from crypto to
state secrets to and.
Speaker 2 (14:40):
What are you gonna do?
Speaker 1 (14:41):
You're gonna go ton Interpol and say hey, we think
that we trace the source to North Korea.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Good luck with that one.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
But if we could go back in time and wave
a magic wand and we wiped out North Korea's ability
to ever have nuclear weapons, North Korea might not exist
as a country today, right, Like that been true?
Speaker 2 (14:57):
That was so the.
Speaker 1 (14:58):
Analogy here of trying to avoid creating another North Korea,
to me, I think is a really good one. Have
you heard anybody making that argument. I haven't heard it. Anywhere. Well,
the argument you will hear people make is the is
the Kadafi lesson, isn't reconcile with America.
Speaker 2 (15:13):
If you're a dictator, it's geting.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
Nukes as fast as you can, because otherwise that's that's
the other side. Always, that's the rational choice to make.
And if you question it, Ukraine wouldn't have gotten invaded
by Russia if they hadn't given up their nukes. That's
also true. And we promised them that that would never
have it, protect them and allow that to happen. The
Bunipest memorandum. Yeah, not good.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Not good.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
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(15:57):
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(16:17):
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Speaker 4 (16:25):
Clay Travison, Buck Sexton, Mike drops that never sounded so good.
Find them on the free iHeartRadio app or wherever you
get your podcasts.
Speaker 2 (16:36):
Welcome back into Clay and Buck.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
We were talking about the plan with regard to Iran,
and I said, defang. It turns out that's exactly what
Secretary of Rubio said, Great minds think alike.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
I didn't even know about this one. Here's Secretary of
Rubio play it.
Speaker 5 (16:50):
From what I've been told by the Department of War,
everything is on or ahead of schedule and proceeding on
these objectives. We have every confidence in the world that
these objectives will be achieved. The last point I would
make is, and I said this yesterday, and I repeat,
what's about You know you're about to see you know,
we're going to unleash Chang on these people in the
next few hours and days. You're going to really begin
to perceive a change in the scope and in the
(17:11):
intensity of these attacks. As frankly, the two most powerful
air forces in the world take apart this terroristic regime
and defang it and take away its ability to threaten
its neighbors or hide behind a zone of immunity that
allows them to develop their nuclear ambitions. But this terroristic, radical,
cleric led regime cannot be ever allowed to have nuclear weapons.
Speaker 1 (17:34):
We just blew up the Iranian flagship Clay with a torpedo,
the first time the US has taken down a ship
with a torpedo since World War Two. I saw that
for the military history nerds out there. I don't even
know how many ships Iran has, but I don't manel
like they have a very very long history of seafaring
(17:57):
left in their future.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Here.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
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Speaker 1 (18:44):
Right now with the brand new rad one and go
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Radios dot com. Check them out today. Welcome back in Play,
Travis buck Sexton Show, Texas Primary. We got some cuts
now that James Talery has beaten our good friend Jasmine Crockett.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
We're gonna play those for you in a moment.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
But as I was checking my text messages, the team
has been constructing photos of me playing the flute while
dining with Kim Jong un after the open of the show.
Those will soon be out on social media. Let me
circle back around on this angle and see if you'll
buy into this argument.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Buck.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
The reason why I think Iran with nuclear weapons is
more dangerous than North Korea with nuclear weapons. Both are dangerous.
But the reason why I think the North Korean argument
is a good one is my concern is if the
iotola dies and Iran has nuclear weapons, the reason why
the Iyotola is in power is there are enough fundamentalists
(19:48):
in Iran that the power of the Ayatola is not
coming from top down, it's from bottom up. In other words,
there are lots of fundamentalists who believe that they need
to kill people in order to spread their faith, and
the leader then is a reflection of what many actually
believe in the country, which means the length of time
(20:11):
that they can have nuclear weapons is in danger for
many different leaders. I think most people are lying when
they say, oh, we love Kim Jong un. They fear
him because he's very powerful, but there isn't actually a
fundamentalist belief system. Of the same way, when people leave
North Korea, they tend to embrace Western values and suddenly
(20:35):
realize the rest of the world is great. There are
people who leave Middle Eastern countries and decide that they're
going to act out based on their religion.
Speaker 2 (20:45):
Does that make sense? I think the religion of Kim.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Jong un or whatever it is in North Korea is
not actually real. People are just terrified if they don't
put his photo up that they're going to be killed
because he is a very supremely powerful person. But if
you were gone, there actually could be some sanity in
that country. My concern, and we'll see what happens now,
is now that we've cut off the head of the
(21:07):
snake of the Ayatola, it is possible that we end
up with a religious fundamentalist leader in Iran who is
even worse and more dangerous going forward than what we
have right now.
Speaker 2 (21:18):
So both are bad.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
But I actually think Iran with nuclear weapons is more
dangerous than North Korea with nuclear weapons. I mean it's
I think it's a little bit of an Apples to
Orange comparison.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
But I don't know how much worse North Korea could
be than it than it it is.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
I just think if there are a lot of white
Allians who actually buy into the cult of personality there
that they don't clear they don't have external internet, they
don't have books, they don't have TV, the entire country.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
I mean, I.
Speaker 1 (21:46):
Actually write about this in Manufacturing Delusion, which is a
fantastic book you can go check out. The entire country
is essentially in a mass mind control experiment. Well, they
will kill you if you bring in DVDs from other
countries and just try to watch them in your home.
Speaker 2 (22:01):
I mean, they have.
Speaker 1 (22:02):
Millions of people who are part of the security apparatus
in North Korea who their privileged position, their their family's
privileged position. The fact that they have food to eat
and roof over their heads is entirely in their minds
tied to Kim Jong un and his benevolence. So it's
(22:23):
not as simple as like if he were gone. Everything
I mean, the country is. It is a bizarre place
in so many ways. It's not like it's gonna be
a flowering of Jeffersonian democracy.
Speaker 2 (22:38):
If you had no Kim Jong un.
Speaker 1 (22:40):
Well, theory of another general take over on behalf of
the Kim family. It's technically a necrocracy, meaning that the
Kim Kim ill sung is still theoretically the head of
the Communist Party of North Korea, and he's been dead
for a long time. Well, and they have a dynasty
that is predicated on his supremacy that theoretically is now
(23:04):
going to run I think Kim Jong un has already
announced that his daughter is going to be the one
that takes over after he's dead, right, I mean he
is considered the eternal president, Kim il sung, that's what
they call him, the eternal president. So so to your
point about religion and everything else, play, the religion of
North Korea is the Kim dynasty, right, it is a
(23:25):
religion effectively. I mean, they have a dead guy who's
still technically the leader of the country forever because of
the way that they've set up all of the state propaganda.
And look, North Korea. Really, let's go access of evil here?
What was the access of evil?
Speaker 2 (23:39):
Iraq? Iran?
Speaker 1 (23:41):
North Korea? North Korea we can't get rid of because
of all of the nukes. And that's not just the nukes.
They've got enough conventional artillery that they could kill hundreds
of thousands of people, probably in Seoul, in the capital
of South Korea, in the first forty eight hours or
so of an engagement, right, I mean, it's an absolute
disaster waiting to happen. So Iran, we don't want to
(24:01):
get to that place. But I mean, you know, the
other side of it is people would say Iran would
have a little bit of a problem with Saudi Arabia,
all the Sudenty Arab states around it that are enemies
of it effectively. And then this little country called Israel
that is just really good at kicking their asses, that
also has nukes. So there is some box in reality
for Iran, I think as well. But will regime would
(24:22):
regime change ever happen if they had nukes? Probably not,
because you get into at what point does a country
with nukes have redlines? I mean, I think there are
things we could do to Russia where Russia would launch.
I'm not saying they would launch at all US cities,
but I think Russia says if we took out putin,
there is somebody who might push a button to I mean,
to send a nuclear weapon here. If we took out,
if we joined the Ukrainians and marched, and we had
(24:44):
you know, armored divisions rolling across Russian territory, would they
would they fire tactical nukes to take Yeah?
Speaker 2 (24:50):
I think they would. Right.
Speaker 1 (24:51):
My point is that nukes will be used at some point.
It's not just we use them. We're the only ones
who have nukes. Aren't just there for show? And with
North Korea. If they had nukes and they were under
this degree of pressure, I do think that they would
be willing to launch.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
That's why we're doing it now so well.
Speaker 1 (25:08):
And again I agree that stopping them from getting to
that point is very important.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
But North Korea is a little crazier than you think
it is.
Speaker 1 (25:15):
I'm going around one on biggest threat with nuclear weapons
North Korea.
Speaker 2 (25:20):
Two.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
Are you taking North Korea one? Iran two? On the
power rankings of crazy? I mean it's very it's very hard.
I mean this I can tell you is North Korea
is the average North Korean more disconnected from reality and
and and more delusional than the average Iranian. Yeah, by
(25:44):
a factor of like ten. It's not even close. Because
a sophisticated, educated people that's been around for you know,
Persians and Iran have been around for millennia.
Speaker 2 (25:54):
North Korea is the kind of.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
Mutant evil stepchild of the China Communist Party in China
next door, which is itself an outgrowth of Stalinist Soviet Communism.
Speaker 2 (26:08):
So, you know, North Korea is really that's a really
messed up place, really messed up place.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
I think if you had mass starvation in Iran, the
Mulas would have a big problem on their hands.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
In North Korea.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
They've had mass starvation and you say a word about
it and they'll just kill you faster it really is.
You know, they've opened up they've opened up resorts in
North Korea.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
Saw.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
I think we know who's gonna be one of the
first American commentators to go.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
Clay's gonna be on the beach in North Korea. Like
this place isn't so bad.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
I would go visit North Korea if if Dennis rod
miniral with me, I would go interview Kim Johnson?
Speaker 2 (26:50):
Would you serious question? Would you actually?
Speaker 1 (26:52):
I would not be willing to go because I think
North Korea cannot be trusted.
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Even if they invite you, give you a visa and
you would you be willing to go? I wouldn't. I
would go.
Speaker 1 (27:01):
I would go to if they told me that I
was going to be able to interview Kim Jong un
and all those things, I think I would go. I
don't know that Laura Travis would think. James Franco, don't
you Clay is just like I go in there. I
go in there to talk SEC football, but really I
get rid of the dictator of North Korea. Mean, I
know everybody stopped talking about it, but remember the relationship
(27:23):
between Trump and Kim Jong un used to be a
huge talking point, right, I mean, obviously Trump went to
the Demilitarized Zone and Term one and visited and said,
I think one reason that North Korea has these beaches
and resorts that they have built is partly because President Trump,
as Trump would do, just says, hey, you know what
(27:45):
we should actually have. We should actually have a resorts
and things like that in North Korea. I think Kim
Jong un is actually likes Trump and is impacted in
some way by that. But there was the first efforts
to get some resolution from the Trump administration on diplomacy
with North Korea was a bust. Unfortunately, didn't didn't actually
(28:06):
get anywhere. I think you're right, he probably views Trump
as an interesting character. That is everythan everyone who spends
time with Trump is like, I like that guy. But
they were not able to get any kind of an
agreement out of it. Back to Iran, though, we're sinking
all their boats, we're blowing up all their planes, We're
just throwing all the surface to air missiles, We're blowing
up their intelligence headquarters, we're blowing up their military barracks.
(28:28):
I mean the plan is, I think, essentially, as Rubio said,
or as I was talking about before, make it so
that it's a country without a military and then we
can have a conversation about what comes next.
Speaker 2 (28:40):
That's really where we're taking this, and we have the
air power to do it.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
And again, I think we're basically at a point now
where we are saying to Iran, let us know when
you're willing to negotiate who your next leader is going
to be. And I don't know if you saw the data,
the pulling on this is basically as long as we
drop bombs and don't have boots on the ground and
this is not some.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
Multi year war.
Speaker 1 (29:04):
The overwhelming majority I think it was seventy four percent
I saw support the decision in Iran so long as
it doesn't lead to boots on the ground and it
is resolved within a month or two. And I think
that's the design right now of the of the president.
I think the question is who is the Delsea Rodriguez
(29:26):
of Iran. Who is somebody that we feel like is
a leader that will in many ways execute pro america
Ish policies that are not going to create a huge
issue going forward it and does that person exist? But again,
the opposition in Venezuela existed, Ran was organized one votes, Yeah,
(29:49):
nothing like that. In Iran, we're starting for starting zero.
We're starting from zero with political opposition in Iran because
it hasn't been allowed to exist. Now, the one thing
I've would say that Overlaps is they put it Delsea
Rodriguez in because I believe her brother runs the military.
What is the military in Iran going to do? To
what extent is the IRGC actually long term committed to
(30:13):
the iatola's leadership. Is there someone that could have a
role in the Iranian military that's trusted there, that would
not be trying to constantly provoke Middle Eastern responses? All
those things I think are certainly paramount of decision making
at this point in time. If you're looking for some
(30:34):
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Speaker 6 (31:08):
Want to begin to know when you're on the go.
Speaker 4 (31:11):
The team forty seven podcasts Trump highlights from the week
Sundays at.
Speaker 2 (31:16):
Noon Eastern in the Clay and Buck podcast feed.
Speaker 4 (31:19):
Find it on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get
your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Welcome back into Clay and Buck. Let's get some calls here.
I've got a lot of them coming in and we
want to hear from all of you. Am from Springfield, Massachusetts, unidentified.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Play it Clay and Buck. You talk about Korea in
the nineteen nineties, how about China? You think they would
have let us do what you're suggesting. I think you're
sadly mistaken.
Speaker 1 (31:51):
Yeah, China uses North Korea as a gives them a
strategic depth, if you will, where they can keep.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
The inn they they Without China, North Korea falls apart.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
By the way North Korea could cut off China and
the country would starve and wouldn't have any gasoline and
or wouldn't have any ability to function. So North Korea
is an entirely a vassal state of China. China keeps
it going for its own purposes, and it's viewed as
a tool against us sometimes, Clay, it's you know, you better,
(32:26):
you better play nice with us here in Beijing. You
don't want things to get wild up in pyeong Yang, guys.
I mean the Chinese, you know, have played both sides
of this, and they also don't want to collapse in
North Korea because they have the most massive met or
refugee crisis imaginable of just millions of North Koreans flooding
into China. So they're they're, they're they're very involved in
that whole situation North Korea.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
I think I'm correct.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Buck doesn't have a airplane that they feel confident enough
in to travel with Kim Jong un, so they he
travels to China when he visits by train.
Speaker 2 (32:59):
Train like, yeah, well.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
That's also I think a security probably a security procedure
where they feel like the train is uh, yeah, safer.
They can they can make sure that he's all all
buttoned up and safe in there. But yeah, North Korea's
got all kinds of weird problems. Matt and Bethlehem, Pennsylvania.
Go ahead, Matt, I believe.
Speaker 7 (33:20):
North Korea has some nuclear ability and does not use it.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
If Iran would have seen a nuclear missile, do you
think that they would last more than a second before
shooting it at Israel? Yes, I look, I think I
mean this is this is a huge question, by the way,
but the answer is yes.
Speaker 2 (33:37):
I don't think that.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
I don't think that the entire leadership of North Korea
would instantaneously decide that they want to vaporize ninety million.
I'm sorry, the entire leadership rather of Iran would say yes,
I want Israel to vaporize like tens of.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Millions of Iranians.
Speaker 1 (33:52):
Maybe it's a huge gamble, well we don't want to take,
but that is what would happen if they fired that
first nuke. And by the way, their first nuke might
not hit Tel Aviv, their first nuke might not even
get there.
Speaker 2 (34:04):
So think about the risk that they're taking.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
I think it's yes, they want death to Israel, death
to America. But I think from a logical perspective, they
want the nuke because it protects their power forever. Yes,
which is why Kim Jong un has a nuke. Now,
my argument is I'm more concerned by North Korea by
Iran because of the religious fundamentalum fundamentalism of Islam that
(34:27):
would be behind it. But both are bad, and I
think the strong argument is if we could wipe it
out once and for all, if we could go back
in time, America and the world would be much safer
if North Korea had never been allowed to get jiliar Web.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
I would present this to you everyone.
Speaker 1 (34:42):
The Jihatis as bad as they are, having killed a
fraction of the people that the communists have in the
last hundred years, not even close. You're talking about one
hundred million dead versus maybe you know, a few million
dead at the hands of the jihadis over. So you know,
let's not under Let's not underestimate crazy. Let's not underestimate crazy.
(35:05):
Chuck and West Palm also wants to say Iran is
more dangerous.
Speaker 6 (35:09):
Let's there you go, I do Iran is more dangerous
because of the rigially religious fundamentalism they want to bring
forth to twelfty millions plus they sit on oceans of oil.
North Korea, as your previous caller says, it's controlled by
China only point I wanted to make guys, thank you.
Speaker 1 (35:27):
Darryl in Savannah, Georgia, Daryl what you got for us.
Speaker 7 (35:32):
I just want to say I spent a lot of
time in koreab honors in the military, and I can
tell you that the North Korean people worshiped the kings,
ounding like they are God. There's a really good illustration.
Then they had a they had some blind North Koreans
and they as they finally he's got some Swiss scientists
and Swiss doctors there to operate on him. And when
(35:55):
they they operated on the fin they can see the
first thing they saw was kimill picture on the wall
and they started praising Kimilo Song and thanking him. That
did held say anything to the doctors.
Speaker 2 (36:08):
Yeah, he's worshiped as a deity. He is the religion
of the state of North Korea.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
And I'll also just point out for everyone to keep
saying the twelfthy mom in Iran, I'm very familiar with this.
I'm familiar with the Hojjataia faction inside of Iran, which
used to be more prominent, but we use nukes're and
we're not a death cult. There is a calculation, a
military calculation that goes into the deployment of nuclear weapons.
(36:34):
I think Iran would have made them if they had
ever gotten them. I think North Korea is making them
by saying no one's gonna do anything.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
To us, because if they do, well, nuke them. One
other thing too.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
If Iran gets them, all the other Middle East states
are gonna want them as well.
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