On this episode of Normally, Mary Katharine Ham and Karol Markowicz react to the latest revelations surrounding Dr. Anthony Fauci, including newly uncovered diary entries, renewed scrutiny over COVID-era policies, and why they believe Florida—and Gov. Ron DeSantis—got it right when much of the country did not.
MK & Karol discuss RFK Jr.'s fiery exchange with CNN's Dana Bash over free speech, public health, and media accountability, while revisiting the treatment of scientists like Dr. Jay Bhattacharya during the pandemic. They also examine why many Americans voted with their feet by leaving states with prolonged lockdowns and school closures.
Later, they turn to the growing controversy surrounding Rep. Max Miller, as serious domestic abuse allegations spark calls for his resignation and raise difficult questions for Republicans.
Finally, they unpack OpenAI CEO Sam Altman's latest AI parenting proposal—and explain why technology should help families spend more time together, not replace real conversations between parents and children.
Follow Clay & Buck on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/clayandbuck
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hey guys, we are back on normally the show with
normalist takes for when the news gets weird.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I am Mary Katherine.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Heyre, I'm Carol Markowitz. Hi Mary Catherine, I have missed you.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome back. We missed you too. We had some people
holding down the fort, but he did great.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Those were very good episodes. I enjoyed them very much.
You had such a good roster, really held it down
around here.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
It was a good time and as you know, while
you were traveling, which I hope you were truly enjoying.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
But all this fauci news, bro that is so.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Hard to stay away from.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
But you know, I really tried to disconnect on these trips.
I was in Israel for two weeks and I'm in
England for a few more.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Days with my kids.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Like I try not to follow the news, but obviously
I'm caught up now. But it is hard when the
news is something you're super interested in, Like the Fauntry
story that was like what happened?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
He really his diary. I'm picturing him like dear diary, you.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Know, like I mean, especially that's what he was doing.
And I am so great.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
People really like me here are all the reasons they
love me number one. So it has become revealed, according
to RFK, that he kept these on government computers. Yeah,
he kept notes about his days is, daily activities and
you know, all the people who love him on his
(01:32):
work computers. And when he left, he emailed them to
himself and so they became a parent man. Through you know,
our right to his government based computers and emails, we
were able to have them.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
Yeah, he does not seem like the brightest person alive.
And it's crazy because for a long.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Time he was. He was science.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
He was the man I remember in Park Slope people had,
you know, all those kind of holy candles.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Made to him. And this is like, what are people saying?
I guess that's what I missed.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
Like I caught up on the news, but what were like,
did any libs say anything other than let's move on?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Not really, there wasn't a ton of attention.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
I ask my friends, like text them like, oh hey, guys,
it's up with the thatching news.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So Stephen A.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Smith, who I appreciate as an interesting thinker in general,
the ESPN sports analyst and kind of gadfly. He he
said he wanted to apologize to Kyrie Irving because he
went after Kyrie Irving for not being vaccinated, and he
now says, knowing what he knows, that that was actually
a brave decision and he wasn't being a jerk, and
(02:46):
that he's sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Right, Yeah, that's that's it. I'm Stephen A.
Speaker 4 (02:50):
Smith lives in Florida, so I imagine there was some
you know, consideration about that on his part about the lockdowns,
because I think he moved.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I'm not sure if he moved during lockdowns or after.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
But look, you can't really live in Florida and not
think that DeSantis did a good job.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Which is what we're going to talk about.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Here, is that how unbelievable is it that we have
a system where we got to try out different methods
of handling and Desanta's clearly had the superior method.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
People moved to Florida and droves.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
I mean, I obviously did Josh Hammer, who wrote an
amazing piece on this, and you know, the celebration of federalism.
His syndicated column this week is called don't Forget how
Florida defeated Faucianism and vindicated Federalism.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
That's really it.
Speaker 4 (03:35):
Yes, DeSantis deserves all the accolades. But our system is
so good for stuff like this. It let us compete
in the free marketplace for people to choose which path
to take, and the Florida path was the right one.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, and I look back, there is an alternate history
here where Andrew Gillham won governor's race.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Oh yeah, it was close over.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
To Santa SU's extremely close. I think it was.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Eighteen thousand votes. Yeah, and had that happened. Gillham, who's
a problem in many other ways. As we've worked since
he ran. He's been caught by the police doing various
unsavory things in various hotel rooms. Aside from that, he
would have done exactly what Fauci said to do. You
(04:21):
needed people like Kemp and then DeSantis. Especially DeSantis has
this thing where he's like, I'm going to do the studying.
I'm going to look at the numbers, and I'm going
to decide how to balance these interests. And in fact,
the Constitution's pretty important to me, and these rights are
pretty important to me, and.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
They should be important to Floridians. So I'm going to
do that.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
And as a result, you know, Florida saw the largest
annual net in migration.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Between July twenty twenty and.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
July twenty twenty one, I saw a liberal I moved.
Speaker 4 (04:53):
In January twenty two, just to put a fine point
on it, because things were still insane in New York.
My kids were still eating lunch on the ground, on
the cold ground outside, having to mask up in between bites.
So I know, people, you know that's the era to
twenty twenty one, but it was ongoing into twenty twenty two.
(05:13):
And the thing that I always like to say is
that Randy Wingarden wanted schools closed for school.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Year twenty twenty two.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Twenty one is one more year, and that's, you know, bananas.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
I was actually looking back on the clip that I
was on CNN in summer of twenty twenty one, and
I was out of town, enjoying myself because we did
a lot of that during the COVID years, and I
was when I thought back on that clip in which
I made everybody very uncomfortable by saying that I felt
she obviously lies. When I was thinking back on it,
(05:45):
I thought it was probably summer of twenty twenty. I
was off doing my thing, and I remember like feeling
social pressure about how I was going to talk about
this and the fact that I was somewhere else.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
It was twenty twenty one, it was more than a year.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Yeah, after this had been gun and I still was
in that mindset to some degree. It's crazy how long
it lasted. James Sorowiki Is that how I say his name? Yeah,
the other day to somebody about Fauci, Like, look, it's
nonsense about people not liking COVID era policies. Look at
all these blue states where people still give the governors
(06:21):
great ratings, and it's like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
The people who stayed, Yeah, yeah, the people who stayed.
You lost people.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
And the people who stayed were the ones who felt
like the governor had the right to tell them not
to go shopping for garden seeds.
Speaker 4 (06:35):
Absolutely, and they wanted some people wanted more of that.
Some people wanted masking to go on. It just it's
crazy that they don't see that population loss is going
to cost New York and California congressional seats in the
next census. It's not nothing. It's it's a meaningful number
who left and were not replaced. And I get that
(06:55):
that's part of the you know, legal immigration consideration that
they could replace part of their population with some number
of legal immigrants, they can keep congressional seats.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
That's going to be tough to do.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah. Also they have to live in California too.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Where you're doing, they.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
May not love it.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
So a place that did discuss it was Dana Bash's
show on CNN where she had RFK on Yeah, partly
she argued with him about vaccines and vaccine hesitancy. I
thought this clip was interesting because it talks about that
balance that Dessanta is struck between constitutional rights and a
public health crisis.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we'll just listen to it. We can give feedback.
Speaker 5 (07:36):
We need to protect our constitutional rights. That's that is
the primary obligation.
Speaker 6 (07:41):
What does that make Sue?
Speaker 5 (07:43):
Well, during COVID, we completely dismantled our constitutional rights. We
began censoring people and violation.
Speaker 6 (07:49):
But you're saying what not to do? I'm asking what
to do, But but I want to talk about that.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Something to do. So that is the number one priority.
We protect the content institution. The constitution was give me.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
But you're just you're talking about rights and I'm asking
about a potential public health crisis that is that is coming.
But I do want to let's.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
And one of the best stakes we made in the
last time. I was suppressing those right, so people weren't being heard,
doctors who were saying you're doing it wrong, for being
marginalized and vilified.
Speaker 6 (08:25):
Because because again I really want to move on, but yeah,
you were saying you are because part of the problem, no,
I wasn't.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
It was absolute press malpractice. You weren't allowing yours.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Your secretary, your job.
Speaker 5 (08:40):
Your job is a fear of skepticism authority, and you
weren't doing that.
Speaker 6 (08:45):
You am My job is no. Okay, are you going
to you want to sit here and attack me or
do you want to have conversations. I'm not attacking you.
I'm asking questions about how to pet the next question,
and I'll tell you that's what I'm trying to do.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
It's interesting because I, you know, I have mixed feelings
that are of k I like some stuff, I don't
like other stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
I think he's, you know, a little.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Kookie, but I love that he is taking that First
Amendment stance. And what I often don't like about him
is that I think of him as kind of a
lib and the fact that he's like, no, we have
to preserve the First Amendment at all costs, Like it
doesn't matter what the crisis is, you don't get to
suspend it just because you're real scared. And she's saying, well,
(09:30):
I don't want to talk about that. I want to
talk about, you know, a.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Possible health scare.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
And he's saying, no, we made a mistake that time,
and we can't make that mistake again.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
And of course he talks about freedom of.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
Speech, and that was obviously affected to such a large,
you know, extent. But what about freedom of religion. They
wouldn't let people practice their faith. And the fact that
that went on for as long as it did, and
there weren't people on TV saying this is a major
First Amendment violation. There weren't the Dane of ashes on
(10:03):
there worried about it, not even to get into other,
you know, other things that were shut down for way
too long and which we all suffered, and that there
was a cost to it. And now we find out
that Fauchi knew all along that it was a bad flu,
that it was the numbers of a bad flu, and
he and.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
His numbers, his numbers that he said in private were
the ones that Jay Abouditaria was positing in public and
getting canceled for right, they were the same lower threshold
numbers that we were all you know, told was a
conspiracy theory. Right that moment where she says, I'm you're
talking about rights and I'm talking about a public health
(10:47):
crisis emergency. Yeah, that is a tell my friends that
none of them have figured out, learned anything. None of
them will give Stephens some credit, but almost no one
in the media who pushed this has realized, oh.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
These things must exist together.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
And the crazy thing about it is the no King's
crowd simply wanted Trump to be a king, and I
have issues with the way that he handled it by
letting Fauci do too much. They're like, he should have
been an authoritarian. But in fact, these all these liberties
may coexist and need to be curtailed in the smallest
ways possible, which is what DeSantis decided.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Yeah, and it's again, it's not it's not even just
the major ones.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Oh, I don't know, Like the ability to gather people
in your backyard is a freedom the Americans don't need
to beg for, right, right.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
Right, Let's talk about Jay Bodicharia for a minute, because
there was a guy who got it all right, and
he was treated as if he was this fringe lunatic.
And I mean, look, he's had obviously great success since then.
He's in the Trump administration and he's just a wonderful
He's director of the NIH, and he basically has been
(12:06):
exonerated on all of this.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
But he is a guy that was portrayed as a
crazy person.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
And he was so right on all of it. I
love that he's in a position of authority now. I
think that that's like some of the stuff that I
love best about the Trump administration is that they did
stuff like this, that they put Jay Bicharia at the
top of the NIH saying this is a serious guy.
Looking at his education, I mean all Stanford University. I
think that's a pretty good school. Last I heard, it
(12:35):
wasn't It wasn't before COVID.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
He wasn't considered a kook.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
And then somehow he became a crazy person who believed
all the stuff that turned out to be completely true.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
True, and that Fasci was to some extent saying behind
the scenes and yeah, to me, Boucharia is the is
the trade off with RFK who like you I think
he's wrong sometimes, I think he's skooky sometimes, although when
he has these conversations with her with Dana bashing, this
was a twenty minute interview, so good on her for
going back and forth for twenty minutes. At one point,
she says in reference to measles cases, but then getting
(13:09):
into a conversation aboutvaccine hesitancy, she says, I'm not going
to debate this with you, and he says, I know
that this is the problem with you guys. Now I
disagree with him, means vaccines in many areas, but the point,
some of the points he was making are correct. For instance,
that Canada's measles rate is out of control. Did he
cause that? Like it that you trying depend this on
(13:32):
me is not exactly as causal as you take it
to be, and we are therefore not dealing with the
actual cause of it. So he's going back and forth
about that, and he also yells, yells at the press,
saying you scared people like that was your whole function,
and you didn't deal with actual facts. And so it
(13:53):
was an interesting back and forth, and I think revealing.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Right, I'm angrier at the press, I think than anything,
I'm angrier than I am at Fauci. Fauci is a
liar and a bad person. They were there to make
sure we didn't find out the truth. And it's scary
to look back. And you know, I've mentioned this before,
but I had liberal media members in my DMS being like,
I love what you're saying on schools, and I'm like, well,
(14:18):
why aren't you saying it on schools if you love
what I'm saying on schools?
Speaker 3 (14:22):
And they couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
They had it was obviously the era, the era of
compliance and the era of twenty twenty, where you had
to say the words and you had to post the
square and you had to say everything the way that
they wanted you to say it. But them all not
being brave is what led us to a bad place
as a country. And the fact that they haven't learned
(14:44):
any lessons is so because what I wanted to go
back to about the media is I used to think
that Fauci was just inept. I thought this guy is
bad at his job. He does not make sense. He's
constantly contradicting himself. He'll go on TV one day and
say one thing, and the next day he'll stand another thing.
The science quote unquote did not change in that time.
(15:04):
So I was like, he's doing a terrible job of
explaining what the positions are. I was willing to listen
to him, and then I realized nobody was asking him
follow up questions. There were no at all information to
be gleaned from his appearances other than this is an
amazing man. We all should follow everything he says, even
if he says a lot of different things. And that's
(15:26):
why I think the media is my top villain for COVID,
even despite Fauci pouting himself as a real key villain
as well.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and he says, he says to her, your job
is and he asked her at one point, is your
job to tell the truth or is it to fight
vaccine hesitancy?
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Right?
Speaker 6 (15:48):
Right?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Those are two different things.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yeah, And he also he also says, like you're you're
supposed to be critical and skeptical of people in power,
and she says, I am.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
But the point is she is now.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Yeah, she's only skeptical when it's him, when it's Republican.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
The way he doesn't mine he's there to go back
and forth with her for twenty minutes, but woof, it's
just such a mess, such a mess.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
I looked about COVID Mary Catherine us. We were right
about that, We were right.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
I looked back at a Ted copple or interview that
I had talked about in twenty twenty one where he
had a you know, soft focus. I think he was
wearing a turtleneck. It was very super villainy black turtleneck.
And one of the questions he asked him just to
give you a taste of the interview, and this is
what it was like that whole time. He says, when
you see the thank you doctor Fauci signs, does that
(16:44):
shelter you a bit? The thank you doctor Fauci signs
in the very liberal neighborhood he lives in. Yeah, that
was the critical question that he needed to open with
in that discussion, and he didn't.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
It doesn't get better from.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
There, no other than maybe ask Biden his ice cream flavor. Yeah.
It's like you have a shot at asking an important
question to an important person at an important time, and
you waste it on that.
Speaker 3 (17:11):
Yeah problem.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
All right, we're gonna just say we're still mad, bro,
But this has been vindicating and a good moment for
the same side, and we hope that people take a
lesson to be skeptical, be critical, don't follow the herd.
It's okay to disagree even if you're politically aligned with people.
And I feel like we're gonna have a lot of
(17:34):
opportunities to do that in the future. So join us,
join us here at normally. In doing that, we're going
to take a short break and be right back with
more on normally.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
All right, we are back on normally with a growing
story that's sort of it was sort of bubbling under
the surface, but I couldn't figure out how much evidence
there was or what's going on for a while.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And now it's come more fully into the public eye.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
And this is the story of Republican Representative Max Miller,
who was married to Senator of Ohio Bernie Moreno's daughter.
So he's the son in law of a senator, and
he was accused during their divorce and custody battle of
abusing both her and possibly their.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Two year old daughter as well.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
And I had seen a little bit about the court stuff,
couldn't figure out how much it was rumors and not.
And now he's come Miller himself has come out on
a straight to camera denial of this, while Bernie Moreno
who people were saying, you probably need to talk about
this because these are pretty serious allegations. He finally came
out with a public statement about it, saying, Yeah, this
(18:45):
guy's a bad dude. He should not serve in the
House of Representatives. But of course, the larger political picture
beyond the abuse, just like they had the trying to
figure out what to do in Maine with Platner, is
that the number the house are getting.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
And so let's hear first, I guess a little bit
about a little bit from Miller on his denial of this.
His wife claims, among other things, that he his ex wife,
that he scalded her with hot water, that he like
tossed water in her direction, that he may have broken
the collarbone of his daughter. Again, I don't know beyond
(19:26):
the allegation, but I and that he pushed her.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
But I also know that another.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Woman had accused him of abuse in the past, and
that is Stephanie Grisham, who was a former White House
Press secretary.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Wow, I didn't realize it was Stephanie Grisham.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Okay, she didn't name him in her memoir, but people
put it together that this was him, and he sued
her for defamation over that charge, but also claimed that
he pushed her and got violent with her. So here
is Miller now responding, and it's a little bit of
a long click, but we'll let him go through it.
Speaker 7 (20:00):
My former wife has claimed that during a custody exchange
at my home that day, I assaulted her. Here's what
actually happened, and I have the ring doorbell footage that
backs it up. She came to my home in a
good mood, and we have text messages to prove it,
which you'll have to pick up our daughter early for
our friend's birthday party. She was inside my house for
(20:23):
several minutes when she left. The video shows her walking
out carrying our daughter, calm, in the same good mood,
showing no distress whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
And as they.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Left, you can hear me say goodbye, I love you
and I love you Ruthie, literally telling my ex wife
that I still cared for her. Does that sound like
somebody who would just walk out and who had been
violently thrown a wall and been abused. She didn't call
the police after that, She didn't go to the hospital.
(20:55):
Ladies and gentlemen, do you want to know what she did?
She went straight to child's birthday party. The very next day,
we had a friendly phone call about our daughter's upcoming
hospital procedure, and I drove in from Washington to be
there for it. Six days later, she offered a cook
empinadus for me for dinner. Just two days later after
(21:16):
this alleged incident. The day after that, she invited me
and my girlfriend and which you'll have in text messages,
to join her and our daughter at a playground. And
that day I just went with my former wife to
the playground to spend time with our daughter. A week later,
on February fifteenth, she wrote to me in her own
(21:41):
words which you will see, I think it's great you
and I are in a friendlier place. She then offered
me more extra overnights with our daughter, which I can
proved every single one of you is recently. Every one
of these messages is timestamped on our court sanctioned co
pairent app and is all in the packet. Only weeks
(22:03):
later did the story of February first assaulted Pierre. So
ask yourself if I had assaulted her, would she had
offered to cook me dinner six days later? Would she
have invited me to spend an afternoon at the playground
with her and our daughter? Would she have written that
we were in a friendlier place. No, she wouldn't have
(22:25):
ladies and gentlemen.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
Yeah, I don't like the ladies and gentlemen at all
around the jury.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
That stuck out to me too.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Are you what are you some show voting lawyer during
your closing statement? Yea, yeah, So, first of all, the
allegations are very serious, so don't be saying no ladies
and gentlemen.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
It's it's a it's very.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Like overly confident and flippant how he's dealing with it.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
This is a very bad situation.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, it is. It is a terrible, terrible situation.
Speaker 4 (22:54):
And I have to say that when he says, would
she offer to cook me dinner? I'm like, yeah, I
heard about many victims of domestic abuse who try to
cater to their abuser and try to calm him down
and try to make him friendlier towards them and try
to make the abuse stop. So obviously this is I
(23:16):
understand his defense of himself and I get, you know,
why he's doing it. But if he has evidence like
he claims to have in that video, now is the
time to release that because the words that he is
saying does not make him seem like he's all on
the clear. It's you know, it doesn't do that for
me at all.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, the whole vibe doesn't do it for me. Finding
out that there are two women who accuse him would
seem to suggest if he's merely unlucky in encountering women
who are fossely accusing him. He's done it twice, and
one of them is the daughter. If you want to
play the game the Left played about Plattner's accusers, one
of them is the daughter of a Republican senator and
(23:55):
another was a Trump administration official as well.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
So this is not.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
A and Morino, for his part, says that it's been
horrific to watch this play out, and he has gotten
blowback for not being public about this.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
I don't quite get that, but we'll come back to
that in a minute.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Well, then, he says, as he has admitted privately, this
isn't a tweet. Max Miller needs serious psychological help. He
has a danger to my daughter, and I hold my
breath every minute he has custody of my granddaughter. If
there are any basic standards of character required to hoold
elected office, max Miller fails them. He should not serve
in the House of Representatives. I believe Max Miller needs
to seek professional help to end the clear pattern of
(24:35):
abuse he is left in his wake.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
I believe he should not.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Be free to continue in endangering others until he does.
And that that point you made, Carol. I also thought
that the second he said, would she come over to
make dinner as a guess, yes.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
She would.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Why not, right, That's that's what you do to if
you're in a cycle of abuse.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
She would seek to.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Quell his anger. That's right, say, oh, he loves and panados,
let me take care of.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
That, and she like, let's have dinner with your girlfriend.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
She must be stuck in this dynamic with him because
she's co parenting and in a custody case, so she
has to go back and forth with him. So she's
trying to if she were being abused, she's trying to
get that anger down as low as she can get it.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
I don't understand the criticism of Marino for not commenting
on this before. I think that if you know, you're
in a terrible situation when your daughter is going through
an ugly, ugly divorce with somebody who's also in the
public eye. I don't see why it should be on
him to comment on it. Obviously he's on his daughter's side.
(25:36):
Obviously he thinks that anybody accused of abusing.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
His daughter is in the wrong. I don't know what
else he needed to stay here.
Speaker 4 (25:44):
And I looked at the comments on his posts, and
they're very just aggressive towards him, like why did you
wait so long? How how could you do this? I
just don't understand why that would be. Maybe I'm just
on a vacation high, you know, Yeah, maybe maybe I
forgot how the internet works.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I think the argument is it's his duty, because he's
part of, you know, the Congress as well, to tell
party this guy's bad news, you have to get rid
of him. He also may very well have been acting
on his daughter's behalf in these court proceedings.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
Right, Maybe he's in private saying things. Why does it
have to.
Speaker 3 (26:17):
Be a public statement like this?
Speaker 4 (26:20):
You know? The plan Your comparison is an interesting one
because here we are two conservative women. I mean, we
haven't said it yet, but I think Miller needs to
resign or be kicked out. That's just I'm sorry to
domestic violence accusations is quite a bit, quite a few,
and yeah, it sucks that accusations are all it takes,
(26:43):
but these accusations sound pretty.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Real, and I don't know that.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
We can continue to have someone like this in Congress
on their publican side.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
And Grisham apparently talked to other friends contemporaneously about this
treatment of her before she wrote that book. Yeah, he
says he's not going, so we'll see what happens. There's
apparently a Wednesday. This is again weirdly analogous to Platner,
and that there is a Wednesday deadline to get rid
(27:13):
of this guy from this congressional race, where you can
replace him with someone else, and I would suggest probably
that is the correct move.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
What's amazing, and this is obviously a complete side story
to this terrible story, but that the parties have so
little power to force people out anymore. It's become just
anybody's ballgame.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
They used to be.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
You know, some people would get together and be like
they have to go, and that would be it. I mean,
not even that long ago. On the Democratic side, I thought,
you know when twenty twenty when they forced Bernie Sanders
out of the primary, basically they all united to support Biden.
It was so out in the open. And now it's like, no,
(27:55):
I'm not resigning. I don't answer to a party. It's
kind of amazing to watch the.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, although maybe the Supreme Court ruling that gives parties
more spending power will change the balance as ways in
the future.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
So we will keep you updated on that.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Also, I would note on the House front, Kay Granger,
who is a Republican House member from Texas. She was
one of these who disappeared for a while and people
couldn't figure out why. She was in an assisted living
home and she died this week and very sad for
her family.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Prayers for them.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
She was eighty three years old. She was the first
woman Republican to serve from Texas. But again, we got
to be forthcoming about what's going on when we're supposed
to be representing people. And this is yet another change
in the House situation where I'm not exactly sure what.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Happens right this second with that seat. So we will
keep you updated. But those House numbers that Margins getting.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Doing this isn't house.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
But today, August third is the deadline for Mitch McConnell
to have you know, stepped down to have a special
election or some you know, God forbid, something happened to him,
and so he's still he's still in the Senate. They're
going to have a regular election in November. No special
election we talked about on the show. I don't think
it would have changed anything anyway much to you know,
(29:23):
the people who are conspiracy theorizing dismay. But it is
interesting that he made it to August third. It's it's
going to be just a general election in November. We
gonna stop doing this. It's it's not good for anybody.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
It's really not. It's not it's not good for your
constituents who should know what's happening and be served here.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
All right, We're going to take a short break and
be right back with more on Normally. We are back
on Normally where Sam Altman, who is CEO of open Ai,
which is chat cheep bets, he had this really unpleasant
tweet that got a lot of attention. He said, cool
(30:06):
use case of chat GPT work I heard last night.
Connect your family calendars and explain your kid's interests every
morning for the drive to school. Have it make a
podcast it talks about one kid's soccer game that afternoon,
one kid's upcoming birthday, some news, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (30:22):
And everyone is.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Like, are you trying to say, don't talk to your
kids and just have chat GPT? Do it? And you know,
every parent is like, yeah, there are times you don't
want to talk to your kids. There are times you're
tired or all talked out or whatever. Not replacing my
conversations with them with chat GPT. Let's just listen to
music and silence.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Yes, it does seem odd like there's plenty of podcasts
I listened to with my kids and wouldn't choose a podcast.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
About our calendar.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Yeah right, how is soccer game going?
Speaker 4 (30:54):
I mean, like, the thing is that I think a
lot of these AI guys don't understand is that we
want AI to make our lives easier, but not to
replace our lives, and not to replace our interactions, not
to replace conversations.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
I think if you use it.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
For kind of what I consider good uses, it can
do a lot for you. Can give you more time
to talk to your kids.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
It should not.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
You should not use the time to avoid talking to
your kids and then use, you know, use it to work.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Like I'm trying to like that my meal planning time
so I can make real hang out with my family.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Yeah, that's my that's my strategy.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Right, And you know, the pushback to it was so
universal that I I have hope for the future. I
think that people get that you shouldn't have an AI girlfriend,
You shouldn't have AI talk to your kids for you.
It shouldn't be a social dynamic that you have with
your chat gupte. It should be used for tasks and
(31:58):
services and things like that and not for human connection.
And that was that was, you know, a positive thing
to see after the multiple New York Times stories about
how people are dating their AIS or they're using their
area as a therapist or any of that. I think
it's all dark and we shouldn't go down that road.
And it was encouraging to see that so many people
(32:20):
agree with that.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
Yeah, I think you can get tools to be a
better parent. You can get tools to be a better
employee so that you can then have more time to
be a better parent. Watching a clip yesterday that echoes
some of this where I think it was doctor Amen
actually who I enjoy who said the best piece of
(32:41):
parenting advice he gives all parents is to spend twenty
minutes with your kid a day doing talking about something
the kid wants to talk about. And so don't make
that a podcast because they want that attention from you.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Now, if you were say that meme, it's like the
kids like did you ever have a dream? That?
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Like, did you ever have.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
Like a dream?
Speaker 4 (33:03):
And then you know they're not getting anywhere. You missed
those moments. When they're gone, you just all the time
that your kids are going to tell you circular stories
that don't go anywhere, like it doesn't last that long.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Just enjoyed in the moment.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Speaking of which I was driving with this is relevant
to some of your travels. I read Wuthering Heights again,
hated it when I was a teenager. Still don't like
any of the characters, although I enjoyed the book more
and I was telling my kids about it, and someone again,
this is the conversation we were having.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
They're like, why'd you read it?
Speaker 1 (33:32):
And I was like, I wanted to see if I
still hated it. And then one of my daughters is
asking who it's by, and my older daughter goes, Emily Bronte,
let me tell you all about all three of them
and where they lived and what they did, and that I.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Didn't know she knew that.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
That was a conversation we then had before we went
to Henrykis, Virginia, which is a colonial village.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Because that's the kind of family we are.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I love it where.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Pocahontas was kept and instructed about the Bible for nine months.
And we walked in and my oldest child goes, it's
giving Jamestown.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
You want to have those interactions, Yeah, AI can have
them for you.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
Well.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Thanks for joining us on normally.
Speaker 4 (34:11):
Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays, and you can subscribe anywhere.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
You get your podcasts. Get in touch with.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Us at normallythepod at gmail dot com. Thanks for listening,
and when things get weird, act normally
Hey guys, we are back on normally the show with
normalist takes for when the news gets weird.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
I am Mary Katherine.
Speaker 3 (00:12):
Heyre, I'm Carol Markowitz. Hi Mary Catherine, I have missed you.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
Welcome back. We missed you too. We had some people
holding down the fort, but he did great.
Speaker 4 (00:21):
Those were very good episodes. I enjoyed them very much.
You had such a good roster, really held it down
around here.
Speaker 1 (00:28):
It was a good time and as you know, while
you were traveling, which I hope you were truly enjoying.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
But all this fauci news, bro that is so.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Hard to stay away from.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
But you know, I really tried to disconnect on these trips.
I was in Israel for two weeks and I'm in
England for a few more.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Days with my kids.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Like I try not to follow the news, but obviously
I'm caught up now. But it is hard when the
news is something you're super interested in, Like the Fauntry
story that was like what happened?
Speaker 3 (00:59):
He really his diary. I'm picturing him like dear diary, you.
Speaker 2 (01:03):
Know, like I mean, especially that's what he was doing.
And I am so great.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
People really like me here are all the reasons they
love me number one. So it has become revealed, according
to RFK, that he kept these on government computers. Yeah,
he kept notes about his days is, daily activities and
you know, all the people who love him on his
(01:32):
work computers. And when he left, he emailed them to
himself and so they became a parent man. Through you know,
our right to his government based computers and emails, we
were able to have them.
Speaker 4 (01:47):
Yeah, he does not seem like the brightest person alive.
And it's crazy because for a long.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Time he was. He was science.
Speaker 4 (01:56):
He was the man I remember in Park Slope people had,
you know, all those kind of holy candles.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
Made to him. And this is like, what are people saying?
I guess that's what I missed.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
Like I caught up on the news, but what were like,
did any libs say anything other than let's move on?
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Not really, there wasn't a ton of attention.
Speaker 4 (02:18):
I ask my friends, like text them like, oh hey, guys,
it's up with the thatching news.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
So Stephen A.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
Smith, who I appreciate as an interesting thinker in general,
the ESPN sports analyst and kind of gadfly. He he
said he wanted to apologize to Kyrie Irving because he
went after Kyrie Irving for not being vaccinated, and he
now says, knowing what he knows, that that was actually
a brave decision and he wasn't being a jerk, and
(02:46):
that he's sorry.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Right, Yeah, that's that's it. I'm Stephen A.
Speaker 4 (02:50):
Smith lives in Florida, so I imagine there was some
you know, consideration about that on his part about the lockdowns,
because I think he moved.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
I'm not sure if he moved during lockdowns or after.
Speaker 4 (03:00):
But look, you can't really live in Florida and not
think that DeSantis did a good job.
Speaker 3 (03:04):
Which is what we're going to talk about.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Here, is that how unbelievable is it that we have
a system where we got to try out different methods
of handling and Desanta's clearly had the superior method.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
People moved to Florida and droves.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
I mean, I obviously did Josh Hammer, who wrote an
amazing piece on this, and you know, the celebration of federalism.
His syndicated column this week is called don't Forget how
Florida defeated Faucianism and vindicated Federalism.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
That's really it.
Speaker 4 (03:35):
Yes, DeSantis deserves all the accolades. But our system is
so good for stuff like this. It let us compete
in the free marketplace for people to choose which path
to take, and the Florida path was the right one.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
Yeah, and I look back, there is an alternate history
here where Andrew Gillham won governor's race.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Oh yeah, it was close over.
Speaker 2 (03:59):
To Santa SU's extremely close. I think it was.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
Eighteen thousand votes. Yeah, and had that happened. Gillham, who's
a problem in many other ways. As we've worked since
he ran. He's been caught by the police doing various
unsavory things in various hotel rooms. Aside from that, he
would have done exactly what Fauci said to do. You
(04:21):
needed people like Kemp and then DeSantis. Especially DeSantis has
this thing where he's like, I'm going to do the studying.
I'm going to look at the numbers, and I'm going
to decide how to balance these interests. And in fact,
the Constitution's pretty important to me, and these rights are
pretty important to me, and.
Speaker 2 (04:38):
They should be important to Floridians. So I'm going to
do that.
Speaker 1 (04:41):
And as a result, you know, Florida saw the largest
annual net in migration.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Between July twenty twenty and.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
July twenty twenty one, I saw a liberal I moved.
Speaker 4 (04:53):
In January twenty two, just to put a fine point
on it, because things were still insane in New York.
My kids were still eating lunch on the ground, on
the cold ground outside, having to mask up in between bites.
So I know, people, you know that's the era to
twenty twenty one, but it was ongoing into twenty twenty two.
(05:13):
And the thing that I always like to say is
that Randy Wingarden wanted schools closed for school.
Speaker 3 (05:19):
Year twenty twenty two.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Twenty one is one more year, and that's, you know, bananas.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
I was actually looking back on the clip that I
was on CNN in summer of twenty twenty one, and
I was out of town, enjoying myself because we did
a lot of that during the COVID years, and I
was when I thought back on that clip in which
I made everybody very uncomfortable by saying that I felt
she obviously lies. When I was thinking back on it,
(05:45):
I thought it was probably summer of twenty twenty. I
was off doing my thing, and I remember like feeling
social pressure about how I was going to talk about
this and the fact that I was somewhere else.
Speaker 2 (05:55):
It was twenty twenty one, it was more than a year.
Speaker 1 (05:58):
Yeah, after this had been gun and I still was
in that mindset to some degree. It's crazy how long
it lasted. James Sorowiki Is that how I say his name? Yeah,
the other day to somebody about Fauci, Like, look, it's
nonsense about people not liking COVID era policies. Look at
all these blue states where people still give the governors
(06:21):
great ratings, and it's like, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
The people who stayed, Yeah, yeah, the people who stayed.
You lost people.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
And the people who stayed were the ones who felt
like the governor had the right to tell them not
to go shopping for garden seeds.
Speaker 4 (06:35):
Absolutely, and they wanted some people wanted more of that.
Some people wanted masking to go on. It just it's
crazy that they don't see that population loss is going
to cost New York and California congressional seats in the
next census. It's not nothing. It's it's a meaningful number
who left and were not replaced. And I get that
(06:55):
that's part of the you know, legal immigration consideration that
they could replace part of their population with some number
of legal immigrants, they can keep congressional seats.
Speaker 3 (07:04):
That's going to be tough to do.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah. Also they have to live in California too.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
Where you're doing, they.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
May not love it.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
So a place that did discuss it was Dana Bash's
show on CNN where she had RFK on Yeah, partly
she argued with him about vaccines and vaccine hesitancy. I
thought this clip was interesting because it talks about that
balance that Dessanta is struck between constitutional rights and a
public health crisis.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we'll just listen to it. We can give feedback.
Speaker 5 (07:36):
We need to protect our constitutional rights. That's that is
the primary obligation.
Speaker 6 (07:41):
What does that make Sue?
Speaker 5 (07:43):
Well, during COVID, we completely dismantled our constitutional rights. We
began censoring people and violation.
Speaker 6 (07:49):
But you're saying what not to do? I'm asking what
to do, But but I want to talk about that.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Something to do. So that is the number one priority.
We protect the content institution. The constitution was give me.
Speaker 6 (08:03):
But you're just you're talking about rights and I'm asking
about a potential public health crisis that is that is coming.
But I do want to let's.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
And one of the best stakes we made in the
last time. I was suppressing those right, so people weren't being heard,
doctors who were saying you're doing it wrong, for being
marginalized and vilified.
Speaker 6 (08:25):
Because because again I really want to move on, but yeah,
you were saying you are because part of the problem, no,
I wasn't.
Speaker 5 (08:33):
It was absolute press malpractice. You weren't allowing yours.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
Your secretary, your job.
Speaker 5 (08:40):
Your job is a fear of skepticism authority, and you
weren't doing that.
Speaker 6 (08:45):
You am My job is no. Okay, are you going
to you want to sit here and attack me or
do you want to have conversations. I'm not attacking you.
I'm asking questions about how to pet the next question,
and I'll tell you that's what I'm trying to do.
Speaker 4 (09:00):
It's interesting because I, you know, I have mixed feelings
that are of k I like some stuff, I don't
like other stuff.
Speaker 3 (09:08):
I think he's, you know, a little.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Kookie, but I love that he is taking that First
Amendment stance. And what I often don't like about him
is that I think of him as kind of a
lib and the fact that he's like, no, we have
to preserve the First Amendment at all costs, Like it
doesn't matter what the crisis is, you don't get to
suspend it just because you're real scared. And she's saying, well,
(09:30):
I don't want to talk about that. I want to
talk about, you know, a.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Possible health scare.
Speaker 4 (09:36):
And he's saying, no, we made a mistake that time,
and we can't make that mistake again.
Speaker 3 (09:40):
And of course he talks about freedom of.
Speaker 4 (09:42):
Speech, and that was obviously affected to such a large,
you know, extent. But what about freedom of religion. They
wouldn't let people practice their faith. And the fact that
that went on for as long as it did, and
there weren't people on TV saying this is a major
First Amendment violation. There weren't the Dane of ashes on
(10:03):
there worried about it, not even to get into other,
you know, other things that were shut down for way
too long and which we all suffered, and that there
was a cost to it. And now we find out
that Fauchi knew all along that it was a bad flu,
that it was the numbers of a bad flu, and
he and.
Speaker 1 (10:24):
His numbers, his numbers that he said in private were
the ones that Jay Abouditaria was positing in public and
getting canceled for right, they were the same lower threshold
numbers that we were all you know, told was a
conspiracy theory. Right that moment where she says, I'm you're
talking about rights and I'm talking about a public health
(10:47):
crisis emergency. Yeah, that is a tell my friends that
none of them have figured out, learned anything. None of
them will give Stephens some credit, but almost no one
in the media who pushed this has realized, oh.
Speaker 2 (11:03):
These things must exist together.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
And the crazy thing about it is the no King's
crowd simply wanted Trump to be a king, and I
have issues with the way that he handled it by
letting Fauci do too much. They're like, he should have
been an authoritarian. But in fact, these all these liberties
may coexist and need to be curtailed in the smallest
ways possible, which is what DeSantis decided.
Speaker 2 (11:28):
Yeah, and it's again, it's not it's not even just
the major ones.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Oh, I don't know, Like the ability to gather people
in your backyard is a freedom the Americans don't need
to beg for, right, right.
Speaker 4 (11:43):
Right, Let's talk about Jay Bodicharia for a minute, because
there was a guy who got it all right, and
he was treated as if he was this fringe lunatic.
And I mean, look, he's had obviously great success since then.
He's in the Trump administration and he's just a wonderful
He's director of the NIH, and he basically has been
(12:06):
exonerated on all of this.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
But he is a guy that was portrayed as a
crazy person.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
And he was so right on all of it. I
love that he's in a position of authority now. I
think that that's like some of the stuff that I
love best about the Trump administration is that they did
stuff like this, that they put Jay Bicharia at the
top of the NIH saying this is a serious guy.
Looking at his education, I mean all Stanford University. I
think that's a pretty good school. Last I heard, it
(12:35):
wasn't It wasn't before COVID.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
He wasn't considered a kook.
Speaker 4 (12:39):
And then somehow he became a crazy person who believed
all the stuff that turned out to be completely true.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
True, and that Fasci was to some extent saying behind
the scenes and yeah, to me, Boucharia is the is
the trade off with RFK who like you I think
he's wrong sometimes, I think he's skooky sometimes, although when
he has these conversations with her with Dana bashing, this
was a twenty minute interview, so good on her for
going back and forth for twenty minutes. At one point,
she says in reference to measles cases, but then getting
(13:09):
into a conversation aboutvaccine hesitancy, she says, I'm not going
to debate this with you, and he says, I know
that this is the problem with you guys. Now I
disagree with him, means vaccines in many areas, but the point,
some of the points he was making are correct. For instance,
that Canada's measles rate is out of control. Did he
cause that? Like it that you trying depend this on
(13:32):
me is not exactly as causal as you take it
to be, and we are therefore not dealing with the
actual cause of it. So he's going back and forth
about that, and he also yells, yells at the press,
saying you scared people like that was your whole function,
and you didn't deal with actual facts. And so it
(13:53):
was an interesting back and forth, and I think revealing.
Speaker 4 (13:56):
Right, I'm angrier at the press, I think than anything,
I'm angrier than I am at Fauci. Fauci is a
liar and a bad person. They were there to make
sure we didn't find out the truth. And it's scary
to look back. And you know, I've mentioned this before,
but I had liberal media members in my DMS being like,
I love what you're saying on schools, and I'm like, well,
(14:18):
why aren't you saying it on schools if you love
what I'm saying on schools?
Speaker 3 (14:22):
And they couldn't do it.
Speaker 4 (14:23):
They had it was obviously the era, the era of
compliance and the era of twenty twenty, where you had
to say the words and you had to post the
square and you had to say everything the way that
they wanted you to say it. But them all not
being brave is what led us to a bad place
as a country. And the fact that they haven't learned
(14:44):
any lessons is so because what I wanted to go
back to about the media is I used to think
that Fauci was just inept. I thought this guy is
bad at his job. He does not make sense. He's
constantly contradicting himself. He'll go on TV one day and
say one thing, and the next day he'll stand another thing.
The science quote unquote did not change in that time.
(15:04):
So I was like, he's doing a terrible job of
explaining what the positions are. I was willing to listen
to him, and then I realized nobody was asking him
follow up questions. There were no at all information to
be gleaned from his appearances other than this is an
amazing man. We all should follow everything he says, even
if he says a lot of different things. And that's
(15:26):
why I think the media is my top villain for COVID,
even despite Fauci pouting himself as a real key villain
as well.
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Yeah, and he says, he says to her, your job
is and he asked her at one point, is your
job to tell the truth or is it to fight
vaccine hesitancy?
Speaker 3 (15:47):
Right?
Speaker 6 (15:48):
Right?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Those are two different things.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
Yeah, And he also he also says, like you're you're
supposed to be critical and skeptical of people in power,
and she says, I am.
Speaker 2 (15:59):
But the point is she is now.
Speaker 4 (16:01):
Yeah, she's only skeptical when it's him, when it's Republican.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
The way he doesn't mine he's there to go back
and forth with her for twenty minutes, but woof, it's
just such a mess, such a mess.
Speaker 3 (16:15):
I looked about COVID Mary Catherine us. We were right
about that, We were right.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
I looked back at a Ted copple or interview that
I had talked about in twenty twenty one where he
had a you know, soft focus. I think he was
wearing a turtleneck. It was very super villainy black turtleneck.
And one of the questions he asked him just to
give you a taste of the interview, and this is
what it was like that whole time. He says, when
you see the thank you doctor Fauci signs, does that
(16:44):
shelter you a bit? The thank you doctor Fauci signs
in the very liberal neighborhood he lives in. Yeah, that
was the critical question that he needed to open with
in that discussion, and he didn't.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
It doesn't get better from.
Speaker 4 (16:58):
There, no other than maybe ask Biden his ice cream flavor. Yeah.
It's like you have a shot at asking an important
question to an important person at an important time, and
you waste it on that.
Speaker 3 (17:11):
Yeah problem.
Speaker 4 (17:13):
All right, we're gonna just say we're still mad, bro,
But this has been vindicating and a good moment for
the same side, and we hope that people take a
lesson to be skeptical, be critical, don't follow the herd.
It's okay to disagree even if you're politically aligned with people.
And I feel like we're gonna have a lot of
(17:34):
opportunities to do that in the future. So join us,
join us here at normally. In doing that, we're going
to take a short break and be right back with
more on normally.
Speaker 1 (17:47):
All right, we are back on normally with a growing
story that's sort of it was sort of bubbling under
the surface, but I couldn't figure out how much evidence
there was or what's going on for a while.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And now it's come more fully into the public eye.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
And this is the story of Republican Representative Max Miller,
who was married to Senator of Ohio Bernie Moreno's daughter.
So he's the son in law of a senator, and
he was accused during their divorce and custody battle of
abusing both her and possibly their.
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Two year old daughter as well.
Speaker 1 (18:24):
And I had seen a little bit about the court stuff,
couldn't figure out how much it was rumors and not.
And now he's come Miller himself has come out on
a straight to camera denial of this, while Bernie Moreno
who people were saying, you probably need to talk about
this because these are pretty serious allegations. He finally came
out with a public statement about it, saying, Yeah, this
(18:45):
guy's a bad dude. He should not serve in the
House of Representatives. But of course, the larger political picture
beyond the abuse, just like they had the trying to
figure out what to do in Maine with Platner, is
that the number the house are getting.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
Smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
And so let's hear first, I guess a little bit
about a little bit from Miller on his denial of this.
His wife claims, among other things, that he his ex wife,
that he scalded her with hot water, that he like
tossed water in her direction, that he may have broken
the collarbone of his daughter. Again, I don't know beyond
(19:26):
the allegation, but I and that he pushed her.
Speaker 2 (19:31):
But I also know that another.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Woman had accused him of abuse in the past, and
that is Stephanie Grisham, who was a former White House
Press secretary.
Speaker 3 (19:40):
Wow, I didn't realize it was Stephanie Grisham.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Okay, she didn't name him in her memoir, but people
put it together that this was him, and he sued
her for defamation over that charge, but also claimed that
he pushed her and got violent with her. So here
is Miller now responding, and it's a little bit of
a long click, but we'll let him go through it.
Speaker 7 (20:00):
My former wife has claimed that during a custody exchange
at my home that day, I assaulted her. Here's what
actually happened, and I have the ring doorbell footage that
backs it up. She came to my home in a
good mood, and we have text messages to prove it,
which you'll have to pick up our daughter early for
our friend's birthday party. She was inside my house for
(20:23):
several minutes when she left. The video shows her walking
out carrying our daughter, calm, in the same good mood,
showing no distress whatsoever.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
And as they.
Speaker 7 (20:34):
Left, you can hear me say goodbye, I love you
and I love you Ruthie, literally telling my ex wife
that I still cared for her. Does that sound like
somebody who would just walk out and who had been
violently thrown a wall and been abused. She didn't call
the police after that, She didn't go to the hospital.
(20:55):
Ladies and gentlemen, do you want to know what she did?
She went straight to child's birthday party. The very next day,
we had a friendly phone call about our daughter's upcoming
hospital procedure, and I drove in from Washington to be
there for it. Six days later, she offered a cook
empinadus for me for dinner. Just two days later after
(21:16):
this alleged incident. The day after that, she invited me
and my girlfriend and which you'll have in text messages,
to join her and our daughter at a playground. And
that day I just went with my former wife to
the playground to spend time with our daughter. A week later,
on February fifteenth, she wrote to me in her own
(21:41):
words which you will see, I think it's great you
and I are in a friendlier place. She then offered
me more extra overnights with our daughter, which I can
proved every single one of you is recently. Every one
of these messages is timestamped on our court sanctioned co
pairent app and is all in the packet. Only weeks
(22:03):
later did the story of February first assaulted Pierre. So
ask yourself if I had assaulted her, would she had
offered to cook me dinner six days later? Would she
have invited me to spend an afternoon at the playground
with her and our daughter? Would she have written that
we were in a friendlier place. No, she wouldn't have
(22:25):
ladies and gentlemen.
Speaker 4 (22:26):
Yeah, I don't like the ladies and gentlemen at all
around the jury.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
That stuck out to me too.
Speaker 1 (22:32):
Are you what are you some show voting lawyer during
your closing statement? Yea, yeah, So, first of all, the
allegations are very serious, so don't be saying no ladies
and gentlemen.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
It's it's a it's very.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
Like overly confident and flippant how he's dealing with it.
Speaker 2 (22:48):
This is a very bad situation.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, it is. It is a terrible, terrible situation.
Speaker 4 (22:54):
And I have to say that when he says, would
she offer to cook me dinner? I'm like, yeah, I
heard about many victims of domestic abuse who try to
cater to their abuser and try to calm him down
and try to make him friendlier towards them and try
to make the abuse stop. So obviously this is I
(23:16):
understand his defense of himself and I get, you know,
why he's doing it. But if he has evidence like
he claims to have in that video, now is the
time to release that because the words that he is
saying does not make him seem like he's all on
the clear. It's you know, it doesn't do that for
me at all.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, the whole vibe doesn't do it for me. Finding
out that there are two women who accuse him would
seem to suggest if he's merely unlucky in encountering women
who are fossely accusing him. He's done it twice, and
one of them is the daughter. If you want to
play the game the Left played about Plattner's accusers, one
of them is the daughter of a Republican senator and
(23:55):
another was a Trump administration official as well.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
So this is not.
Speaker 1 (23:59):
A and Morino, for his part, says that it's been
horrific to watch this play out, and he has gotten
blowback for not being public about this.
Speaker 3 (24:13):
I don't quite get that, but we'll come back to
that in a minute.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Well, then, he says, as he has admitted privately, this
isn't a tweet. Max Miller needs serious psychological help. He
has a danger to my daughter, and I hold my
breath every minute he has custody of my granddaughter. If
there are any basic standards of character required to hoold
elected office, max Miller fails them. He should not serve
in the House of Representatives. I believe Max Miller needs
to seek professional help to end the clear pattern of
(24:35):
abuse he is left in his wake.
Speaker 2 (24:37):
I believe he should not.
Speaker 1 (24:38):
Be free to continue in endangering others until he does.
And that that point you made, Carol. I also thought
that the second he said, would she come over to
make dinner as a guess, yes.
Speaker 2 (24:48):
She would.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
Why not, right, That's that's what you do to if
you're in a cycle of abuse.
Speaker 2 (24:53):
She would seek to.
Speaker 1 (24:54):
Quell his anger. That's right, say, oh, he loves and panados,
let me take care of.
Speaker 4 (24:58):
That, and she like, let's have dinner with your girlfriend.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
She must be stuck in this dynamic with him because
she's co parenting and in a custody case, so she
has to go back and forth with him. So she's
trying to if she were being abused, she's trying to
get that anger down as low as she can get it.
Speaker 6 (25:14):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
I don't understand the criticism of Marino for not commenting
on this before. I think that if you know, you're
in a terrible situation when your daughter is going through
an ugly, ugly divorce with somebody who's also in the
public eye. I don't see why it should be on
him to comment on it. Obviously he's on his daughter's side.
(25:36):
Obviously he thinks that anybody accused of abusing.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
His daughter is in the wrong. I don't know what
else he needed to stay here.
Speaker 4 (25:44):
And I looked at the comments on his posts, and
they're very just aggressive towards him, like why did you
wait so long? How how could you do this? I
just don't understand why that would be. Maybe I'm just
on a vacation high, you know, Yeah, maybe maybe I
forgot how the internet works.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
Yeah, I think.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I think the argument is it's his duty, because he's
part of, you know, the Congress as well, to tell
party this guy's bad news, you have to get rid
of him. He also may very well have been acting
on his daughter's behalf in these court proceedings.
Speaker 4 (26:13):
Right, Maybe he's in private saying things. Why does it
have to.
Speaker 3 (26:17):
Be a public statement like this?
Speaker 4 (26:20):
You know? The plan Your comparison is an interesting one
because here we are two conservative women. I mean, we
haven't said it yet, but I think Miller needs to
resign or be kicked out. That's just I'm sorry to
domestic violence accusations is quite a bit, quite a few,
and yeah, it sucks that accusations are all it takes,
(26:43):
but these accusations sound pretty.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Real, and I don't know that.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
We can continue to have someone like this in Congress
on their publican side.
Speaker 1 (26:52):
And Grisham apparently talked to other friends contemporaneously about this
treatment of her before she wrote that book. Yeah, he
says he's not going, so we'll see what happens. There's
apparently a Wednesday. This is again weirdly analogous to Platner,
and that there is a Wednesday deadline to get rid
(27:13):
of this guy from this congressional race, where you can
replace him with someone else, and I would suggest probably
that is the correct move.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
What's amazing, and this is obviously a complete side story
to this terrible story, but that the parties have so
little power to force people out anymore. It's become just
anybody's ballgame.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
They used to be.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
You know, some people would get together and be like
they have to go, and that would be it. I mean,
not even that long ago. On the Democratic side, I thought,
you know when twenty twenty when they forced Bernie Sanders
out of the primary, basically they all united to support Biden.
It was so out in the open. And now it's like, no,
(27:55):
I'm not resigning. I don't answer to a party. It's
kind of amazing to watch the.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Yeah, although maybe the Supreme Court ruling that gives parties
more spending power will change the balance as ways in
the future.
Speaker 2 (28:09):
So we will keep you updated on that.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
Also, I would note on the House front, Kay Granger,
who is a Republican House member from Texas. She was
one of these who disappeared for a while and people
couldn't figure out why. She was in an assisted living
home and she died this week and very sad for
her family.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Prayers for them.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
She was eighty three years old. She was the first
woman Republican to serve from Texas. But again, we got
to be forthcoming about what's going on when we're supposed
to be representing people. And this is yet another change
in the House situation where I'm not exactly sure what.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
Happens right this second with that seat. So we will
keep you updated. But those House numbers that Margins getting.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
Doing this isn't house.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
But today, August third is the deadline for Mitch McConnell
to have you know, stepped down to have a special
election or some you know, God forbid, something happened to him,
and so he's still he's still in the Senate. They're
going to have a regular election in November. No special
election we talked about on the show. I don't think
it would have changed anything anyway much to you know,
(29:23):
the people who are conspiracy theorizing dismay. But it is
interesting that he made it to August third. It's it's
going to be just a general election in November. We
gonna stop doing this. It's it's not good for anybody.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
It's really not. It's not it's not good for your
constituents who should know what's happening and be served here.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
All right, We're going to take a short break and
be right back with more on Normally. We are back
on Normally where Sam Altman, who is CEO of open Ai,
which is chat cheep bets, he had this really unpleasant
tweet that got a lot of attention. He said, cool
(30:06):
use case of chat GPT work I heard last night.
Connect your family calendars and explain your kid's interests every
morning for the drive to school. Have it make a
podcast it talks about one kid's soccer game that afternoon,
one kid's upcoming birthday, some news, et cetera.
Speaker 3 (30:22):
And everyone is.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
Like, are you trying to say, don't talk to your
kids and just have chat GPT? Do it? And you know,
every parent is like, yeah, there are times you don't
want to talk to your kids. There are times you're
tired or all talked out or whatever. Not replacing my
conversations with them with chat GPT. Let's just listen to
music and silence.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Yes, it does seem odd like there's plenty of podcasts
I listened to with my kids and wouldn't choose a podcast.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
About our calendar.
Speaker 3 (30:51):
Yeah right, how is soccer game going?
Speaker 4 (30:54):
I mean, like, the thing is that I think a
lot of these AI guys don't understand is that we
want AI to make our lives easier, but not to
replace our lives, and not to replace our interactions, not
to replace conversations.
Speaker 3 (31:12):
I think if you use it.
Speaker 4 (31:14):
For kind of what I consider good uses, it can
do a lot for you. Can give you more time
to talk to your kids.
Speaker 3 (31:21):
It should not.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
You should not use the time to avoid talking to
your kids and then use, you know, use it to work.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Like I'm trying to like that my meal planning time
so I can make real hang out with my family.
Speaker 2 (31:34):
Yeah, that's my that's my strategy.
Speaker 4 (31:37):
Right, And you know, the pushback to it was so
universal that I I have hope for the future. I
think that people get that you shouldn't have an AI girlfriend,
You shouldn't have AI talk to your kids for you.
It shouldn't be a social dynamic that you have with
your chat gupte. It should be used for tasks and
(31:58):
services and things like that and not for human connection.
And that was that was, you know, a positive thing
to see after the multiple New York Times stories about
how people are dating their AIS or they're using their
area as a therapist or any of that. I think
it's all dark and we shouldn't go down that road.
And it was encouraging to see that so many people
(32:20):
agree with that.
Speaker 1 (32:21):
Yeah, I think you can get tools to be a
better parent. You can get tools to be a better
employee so that you can then have more time to
be a better parent. Watching a clip yesterday that echoes
some of this where I think it was doctor Amen
actually who I enjoy who said the best piece of
(32:41):
parenting advice he gives all parents is to spend twenty
minutes with your kid a day doing talking about something
the kid wants to talk about. And so don't make
that a podcast because they want that attention from you.
Speaker 4 (32:55):
Now, if you were say that meme, it's like the
kids like did you ever have a dream? That?
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Like, did you ever have.
Speaker 2 (33:02):
Like a dream?
Speaker 4 (33:03):
And then you know they're not getting anywhere. You missed
those moments. When they're gone, you just all the time
that your kids are going to tell you circular stories
that don't go anywhere, like it doesn't last that long.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Just enjoyed in the moment.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Speaking of which I was driving with this is relevant
to some of your travels. I read Wuthering Heights again,
hated it when I was a teenager. Still don't like
any of the characters, although I enjoyed the book more
and I was telling my kids about it, and someone again,
this is the conversation we were having.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
They're like, why'd you read it?
Speaker 1 (33:32):
And I was like, I wanted to see if I
still hated it. And then one of my daughters is
asking who it's by, and my older daughter goes, Emily Bronte,
let me tell you all about all three of them
and where they lived and what they did, and that I.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
Didn't know she knew that.
Speaker 1 (33:47):
That was a conversation we then had before we went
to Henrykis, Virginia, which is a colonial village.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Because that's the kind of family we are.
Speaker 3 (33:53):
I love it where.
Speaker 1 (33:54):
Pocahontas was kept and instructed about the Bible for nine months.
And we walked in and my oldest child goes, it's
giving Jamestown.
Speaker 4 (34:05):
You want to have those interactions, Yeah, AI can have
them for you.
Speaker 6 (34:09):
Well.
Speaker 3 (34:09):
Thanks for joining us on normally.
Speaker 4 (34:11):
Normally airs Tuesdays and Thursdays, and you can subscribe anywhere.
Speaker 3 (34:14):
You get your podcasts. Get in touch with.
Speaker 4 (34:16):
Us at normallythepod at gmail dot com. Thanks for listening,
and when things get weird, act normally
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Clay Travis
Buck Sexton
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