June 3, 2026 • 45 mins
Danielle is foxtrotting back into the ballroom to hang with the host who was there for the DWTS universe Big Band, Tom Bergeron!
Tom shares his memories of the early seasons, and what his expectations were for a show trying to bring competitive dancing to the forefront of pop culture.
Plus, we get some expert advice for any new contestants coming on the show, and learn the exact recipe for making a great host, as we tango with Tom Bergeron on a new Danielle With…!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:16):
It's been a minute, but welcome back to Danielle with
a podcast that at one time faithfully followed my journey
from normal, everyday plead to exceptional exceptional professional dancer, and now,
with announcements and events popping up all over pop culture,
the season has returned. It's officially time to talk Dancing
(00:40):
with the Stars. I'm excited to be diving back into
the universe at the end of July at Dancing with
the Stars Con twenty six in Palm Springs, California, where
I'll be partaking in the festivities and endlessly complaining about
the heat. Tickets available now, and they've already welcomed three
new cast members for season thirty five, reality TV stars
(01:01):
Mora Higgins and Sierra Miller and Savannah Bananas baseball player
Jackson Olsen. But none of this could be possible without
the contributions of this week's special guest. There's been a
lot of Mount Rushmore talk on social media this year,
and I think you'd be hard pressed to leave this
legend off when it comes to Dancing with the Stars.
(01:22):
Variation Originally a radio DJ with stops in New Hampshire
and Boston, he did the unthinkable and did have a
face for TV, landing local hosting spots, including a teenage
discussion series called Wrap Around Spelled Rap I'm going to
need to know everything about that. And then the floodgates opened.
(01:45):
Three years at FX and Fox, guest hosts on Good
Morning America and a gig that landed him the Daytime
Emmy for Outstanding Game Show Host, Hollywood Squares. Then for
thirteen years he was the face of America's Funniest Home Videos,
still the show's longest tenured host, introducing dudes getting hit
in the genitals, which led to another Emmy winning spot,
(02:09):
the Master of Ceremonies for Dancing with the Stars from
two thousand and five to twenty twenty. He co hosted
the Emmys in two thousand and eight, wrote a best
selling autobiography in two thousand and nine, and made his
triumphant return to the ballroom last year, a hopeful sign
that we will get to see him even more during
this new renaissance of the show.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Also, we work out at the same gym this week.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm honored to welcome to Danielle with a pioneer of
reality and competition TV, Tom bergeron.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Well, I just have to tell you after hearing of
all my accomplishments, I'm exhausted.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Aren't you tired?
Speaker 3 (02:46):
I've just I have to go lie down now.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
No wonder you just want to stay in your home
and have food delivered, you know?
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, it's we were Danielle and I were talking just
before we invited you in that I had become a
recluse very happily with streaming services and Instacart and door
Dash and Zoom. I mean, why leave?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Why leave your house?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
You know?
Speaker 1 (03:11):
My mom actually has been saying that for years, long
before the streaming services.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
In the Zoom.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Whenever we would pitch the idea of going camping, my
mom would say, but I've worked very hard for this house.
Why would I want to pretend I don't have one?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Yeah, exactly, Why go into a smaller version, you know,
where we're all bumping into each other?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Well, it's in my absolute pleasure to get to sit
here with you for the podcast. I did mention in
your intro that we go to the same gym, and
there is not a single person at our gym who
doesn't say, what an absolute lovely gem of a human
being you are.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Oh stop, stop, I have to say at the outset.
One thing I really missed when I went back to
be a guest judge for the twentieth you were voted
off like the week before.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Right, I know I missed you missed you by that much,
I know, I think so.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, because what week were you there?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Was the I think it was week nine?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, I was voted off week eight, so yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yes, the twentieth celebration was week now. Yeah, sorry about that.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, I was there.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
I was just sitting in the audience now going hey everyone, Well,
first of all, I'm going to need to get wrap
around out of the way first. This was a weekend
TV show with troubled teens at WBZ in Boston.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Right, Yeah, yeah, they weren't all troubled. They were probably
troubled about it on a par with me. Okay, but yeah,
it was a really cool format. It was me with
a different high school or high schools every week talking
about issues a specific two teens, and some of them
(04:55):
were you know, like peer pressure, gang influences in and
around the Boston area, et cetera. So I only had
one rule. I said, I'm I'm I'm not going to
be either your parent or your peer Okay, I just
want to listen, and I'm going to respond with my
natural curiosity based on what you're telling me. Once we
(05:18):
establish what the topic for any given show is. And
we sat around together on these cushioned It was a
really cool, like graffiti Layton set that they came up with,
and I did that for a couple of seasons on
the what was then the NBC affiliate in Boston.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
OW I mean, how did you get that job?
Speaker 1 (05:37):
Because, with all due respect, when I think of gang
violence and hip hop music, my first thought is not, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
The whitest man in America. When I would show up
what I would show up for Hollywood Squares because we'd
shoot during the summer, and I'd show up, you know,
a T shirt and shorts because the wardrobe people had
my c was hanging up and Whoopy would look at
me and go, those are the whitest legs in America.
(06:07):
So I had been doing other stuff at that station
at BC, and I had done a magazine show for
younger kids called super Kids prior to wrap Around, and
then I started hosting the midday talk show called People
Were Talking, which was on the Westinghouse stations. Oprah did
the one in Baltimore as a matter of fact, at
(06:29):
one time, and as a result of that, they said, Hey,
would you like to do another show, just a weekend
show that we taped during the week just with kids. Yeah,
And I thought, well, that's you know, I think at
that point I was a new dad as well. Oh
so I wanted to see what I was in for exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Well, you had just started to make a name for
yourself as a host. Apparently you were so good that
people wanted you on other shows. You mentioned, people are talking,
and like you said, it was a big regional talk
show with guests like Spike Lee, New Kids on the Block,
Roseanne Barr and other very time relevant names. And then
this was in the Donna Hue or Oprah format of
(07:11):
the era.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Was this your style of talk show?
Speaker 1 (07:15):
It's very host reliant, so you had to love it.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
It was What I loved about it was it was
like cramming for an exam every night, because five days
a week for one hour midday live, which I love. Wow,
it was a given topic or guest. One of my
favorite guests he was on twice with me, was President
Jimmy Carter, the late Jimmy Carter, wonderful guests, and we
(07:44):
ran the gamut from sublime to ridiculous on that format.
But my favorite, my absolute favorite experience hosting on television.
And this might surprise people who think, well, it's got
to be America's funniest vidy as stars, it's not. It's
Breakfast Time on FX, which I co hosted from ninety
(08:08):
four to ninety six, and it was set in a
sixty five hundred square foot apartment in the Flatiron district
of New York, made for television, and it was just
and the cast was incredible, and I loved going to
work every day. I'd get up in Connecticut at three
point thirty in the morning and drive to Manhattan, so
(08:30):
I'd get there the office at about five, and you know,
loved it, not that part of it, but I loved
the actual show.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
What was Your bedtime? For a three thirty wake up?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
It was early as a matter of and the girls
were see our daughters at that point were probably do
six and four. So Lois, my wife, actually got them
a board game called Don't Wake Daddy. And I was
basically on the same sleep schedule as my kids.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. I actually know that schedule. Well, because
my husband did morning radio out in LA when we
first got married, and so he had a very similar
four am alarm clock.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
And I said, listen, I'm pregnant. Let's just start getting
on that baby schedule.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
So we'd go to bed at eight thirty and then
get up at four. It's actually kind of glorious. So
what was Breakfast Time about.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
Well, it was about two hours.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
And then it happened.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah. It was kind of a gonzo version of a
morning television show. We had news and weather and guests
and all that, but we did it in almost a
morning zoo kind of format. It was like a radio
show on television. Great, there are compilation videos on YouTube
(09:57):
and you can type in my name and Breakfast Time
and just I'm the guy with the brown hair in
those videos. But yeah, it was just wonderful. My co
host was Laurie Hibbert now Laurie Gelman, married to Michael Gelman. Yeah,
what is it, Kelly and somebody else? Now Mark or.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
I think it's Mark, Yeah, Mark, thank you?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Well, anyway that Laurie's married to Gelman. Yeah, but we
we just hit it off. I've been very fortunate with
with co hosts. Over the years.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Yeah, Well, as I mentioned my husband being a morning
radio DJ, and you said, like a morning zoo type thing.
Do you love We love radio. We think radio is
just one of the greatest formats ever. Do you think
it is something there's something special about that skill set
that helps with the transition then to TV.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
That's a really good question, and I think you're spot on.
I think the thing that I always tell aspiring broadcasters, podcasters, whatever,
is that, however big an audience you're shooting for, just
remember you're only talking to one person, right, And you
know that was really as a matter of fact, when
(11:13):
I first started in radio, Danielle, I had in my
hometown in Massachusetts. So that I could focus on one person,
I had an album cover on the other side of
the microphone that had this really attractive woman's face on it.
I couldn't tell you what band it was or but
I'm sure that for the first couple of years of
my career I just sounded horny.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
You're like, I'm gonna keep my eyes locked on.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
But I think that keeping that in mind, that you're
talking to one person, that was something easy to develop
in radio because you're kind of in a room by
yourself unless you have a morning team around you. And
then for television, it was funny. There was one one
time Fantastic with the Stars. Some friends from the East
Coast were in the audience visiting, and during a commercial break,
(12:06):
my buddy Greg called me over. He goes, Tom, you know,
there's so much noise here in the ballroom. I can't
hear you when you're talking. And I said, well, that's
all right, I'm not talking to you. Nothing I'm saying
is that person on the other side of the lens.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Yeah, exactly, I know. I have noticed. I've been toasting
the American Idol Official podcast in. Ryan Seacrest, of course,
is the host of that show, another legendary host, and
whenever he's talking, he's just it's.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
His absolute same volume. Everyone in the audience is going crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
No one knows what he's saying or when he's even
done saying it, but he's not talking to us.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
You mentioned Dancing with the Stars, and I always imagine
the first time somebody hears the pitch for the show,
and I think this, it must have just sounded insane.
It's not like ballroom dancing was having a moment or anything.
And then this concept of teaching celebrit parties how to
do it.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
It kind of sounds like a car wreck.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Well, you know, yes and no. I mean there was
a there was some momentum for ballroom okay time, there
was the movie Strictly Ballroom came out. I think Richard
Gear and j Low were in it. And as a
matter of fact, that's why the mothership, which had been
called Come Dancing for years, yeah, added illogically Strictly because
(13:29):
they were sort of, you know, in the slipstream of
the success of that movie, and Strictly Come Dancing shifted
from being I think originally it was like a weekend
legit ballroom professional show, and then they started adding the
celebrity element and moved it to prime time and it
blew up and it okay. So that's what prompted the
(13:52):
head of entertainment programming at the time, Andrew Along, to
pitch of an American version of that. And she told
me later, once we were established in a hit, she said, Tom,
when I was in that room pitching it, nobody would
make eye contact with me.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Like this is on com.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
She's killing her career right now, we're watching it happen.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, and turn away from the car wreck.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
That's right. So she had a pretty big I told
you so in her back pocket for quite some time.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Boy, I love that.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Did you have any dance knowledge going into it?
Speaker 4 (14:27):
No?
Speaker 3 (14:28):
I barely have any now, Yeah, No, I didn't at all. All.
The only knowledge I had was, you know, being comfortable
hosting live television. And in some ways that was an
advantage because I became your surrogate as the viewer. I
was learning while you were learning, you know, And I
(14:51):
mean I have some dance lingo. But I said to
everybody when I showed up to be a guest judge
in November, I said, I'm not gonna be critiquing technique.
I'm just going to tell you emotionally what I felt
watching the dance, because you know, Derek and Carrie Ann
and Bruno, they've got the technique stuff down.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Yeah, you're not going to compete with them?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
No that No, I wouldn't even pretend to have any
of that knowledge. But I could. I could critique based
as a viewer, and my role, I think when I
hosted it over the years was to basically protect you guys,
you know, from the judges and then God bless him.
I did miss him. I wish he was still with us.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Everybody misses.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
Everybody's such a wonderful, lovely man with just the right amount.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Of snark yep, exactly, yes.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
And you know, sometimes the judges were a little harsh,
and I try to be like a comedic shield between
the couples and the judges and try to and just
keep the show move, just keep everything going, because as
you know, there are a lot of moving parts.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
There sure are.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Okay, what can you tell me about that first season,
because I have to imagine it was like the wild West.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Yeah, it was the summer of two thousand and five.
I was on hiatus from America's Funniest Videos. So when
ABC asked if I would host a summer show, I thought, well,
you know, sure, Okay, six weeks live TV. Why not,
expecting nothing of it other than it might be it
might come back next summer if it's a hit this summer.
(16:34):
But you know, it didn't know what we had. I mean,
I was really skeptical about a celebrity ballroom show. Yeah,
but I'll give it a go. What the heck. The
one thing that I insisted on changing by the time
we got to season two. In season one, there were
a lot of scripted jokes. Okay, and the joke writer
(16:57):
is actually a friend of mine. He's award winning, great guy,
but it always felt weird. I finally said to the producers,
you know what, We're a live show. I should be
reacting in real time to what I'm seeing and feeling.
And sometimes that might be with a joke. Sometimes it
might be with a hug. You know. Sometimes it's just
(17:20):
but to have something scripted days earlier that has no
bearing on what we just saw, what's the point of that.
So I made the pitch. I said, just I'm asking
you to trust me, and and thankfully they did. And
from season two on, I pretty much abandoned having anything
prepared other than getting you to the commercial and bringing
(17:43):
you back.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Yes, yes, that's so great, and in the script, just
Tom reacts.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Yeah. That was basically. We'd be in script meetings and
especially leading into season two, and I'd look at something
that you know, on its own was a good joke,
but not germane to anything, right, and I would go on,
I'm not doing that. As a matter of fact. On
America's Funniest Videos in the early years, before they kind
of got my rhythm and my voice. We would sit
(18:13):
in a room before the taping and the head writer
was Todd Thick, and he would turn to the other
writers and he said, Okay, guys, here's where Tom kills
your babies.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Don't be too attached to anything.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I'll busy at that.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Yeah. Now, a lot of fans talk about how the
focus of the show has moved away from the drama
packages of the early days, the arguments between partners, the bickering.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Do you miss that element at all? Is there room
for it? In twenty twenty six.
Speaker 3 (18:51):
In all candor, I hadn't been watching.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Oh yeah, so.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
You know I I had mixed feelings had yeah, exactly,
So I wasn't really watching until the few weeks prior
to being the guest judge. I mean, I still I
think that was evident when I was back, have great
fondness everybody there, and the people that I didn't have
(19:19):
fondness for pretty much were all gone. Son made it
easy to come back. But so I can't speak to
how the packages have changed, but I will say since
Conrad Green came back as the showrunner, who was my
original showrunner, the ship has been righted. I know it
(19:39):
got a little rocky for a couple of seasons there
and seemed to spiral a bit, but I think Conrad
got you know, got back in there, and as I
said on the show last November, you know, it's it's
having a ratings resurgence. And so whatever they're doing, whatever
the in terms of cast or the packages or the focus,
(20:03):
they have adapted that show so brilliantly for now that
it's it's having a bit of a renaissance. And I
couldn't be happier. Somebody asked me on social media, Tom,
you must have been aware that the ratings went down
after they fired you and Aaron. You must have been
really happy, And I said no. I said I was
(20:24):
aware of it, but you know, there are a lot
of friends of mine working on that show who I
wanted to still have jobs. So I took no you know,
I took no pleasure in that. Yeah, And I was
just what I did, take pleasure and was seeing it
catch itself, yeah, and build into what it is again,
especially in this environment.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
There has been a lot of love in the in
the you know, mainstream media, certainly from the celebs and
stuff for Dina Cats Dina Cats. Her name comes up
all the time people talk about her. I would like
to have just a moment where we do talk about Conrad,
because Conrad's and doesn't necessarily get mentioned in the same
way Dina's name gets mentioned.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
But one of the things I so appreciated.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
About my experience on that show where the amount of
times there were group meetings leading into the start of
the show and then during the season where they would
let us know about something that was going to be
going on. I don't think I've ever felt more genuinely
protected than I did from Conrad, who made it very
(21:31):
clear how much of an open door there was for
anything we wanted to talk about, and that if anything
was going on, we shouldn't stay quiet about it, We
shouldn't talk about it, you know, amongst ourselves, we could
go directly to him, and I just he truly was
(21:52):
the way he runs that show makes the people who
are a part of it know that you are a
family and you're working together, and he's there for you
if you need him.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
And really well said and absolutely spot on. And again
he's the reason I went back. I would had he
not been at the Helm, I wouldn't have gone back
as much affection as I have for all the other people.
You know, I just had it been the regime I
locked horns with. I mean, you know, well, frankly, if
(22:23):
they were still running the show, it'd be off the
air by now.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
But yeah, you're right, you're right.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Yeah, But yeah, Conrad being there made all the difference
for me.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So what do you think is the special sauce of
this show? Why do you think so many people who've
been a part of it, myself included, walk away from
it saying it's life changing.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Well, I think that I can only base it on
what I've seen in the years and what I've seen
now that he's back, and Alfonso and Julianne are there,
and Derek's in the center seat and all that, and
and I experienced it like a tsunami of affection when
I when I went back in November, and and that
(23:16):
to me is key that that what I would see
every season when I was host was the obvious competitiveness
among the couples, but also the support among the couples,
you know who. They'd walk into their somebody else's rehearsal
and offer a few suggestions, not not for sabotage, he
(23:39):
genuinely helped and and and that was lovely and and
you know, friendships that have lasted years after the show
or the season they competed in. So you know, that
speaks to I think that kind of quality that you
really uh, it was very well said about the environ
(24:00):
and Conrad creates and so for you know, a lot
of my time there, he was at the Helm, and
after he left it was people that he had brought
up through the ranks, so they up until a certain point,
had the same philosophy.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Right. Is there a contestant you remember from your time
on the show whose journey really stayed with you?
Speaker 3 (24:27):
You know, I probably could come up with a better example,
but the one that always pops into my mind first
is from an early season, and it was Jerry Springer.
And you know, because i'd only known him for his
talk show, which was you know, who was the Father?
Speaker 1 (24:44):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Yeah, you know throwing Yeah, yeah, yeah, the Father, you
know all that stuff. So when I heard he had
been cast and went really curious. But he turned out
to be the sweetest guy, just absolute mench And he
said the only reason he did the show was to
learn how to waltz for his daughter's wedding. Oh, I
(25:05):
thought was lovely. And she actually was in the audience
at one point and he was able to I think
he did the actual waltz.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Oh, that's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
Layla Ali danced for her dad. Muhammad Ali was in
the audience and it was sort of at a point
where the Parkinson's had taken his speech from him and
he was able to be there and you could still
see the sparkle in his eyes.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
Oh, those are such special moments. I'll never forget having
my children in the ballroom when I dance, like, I'll
never forget that moment. So I will say, and this
isn't just me trying to cope. It feels like nowadays
contestants like Whitney Lovett or Alex Earl, these are superstar
athletes basically doing insane moves, different than the old celebrity
(25:55):
trying to dance model.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Like Andy Rich There.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah, not naming any names, but you know.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
But that's part of it. There's always been an aspect
of the show, going back to the early seasons where
athletes were part of it or people who you know,
And it was no surprise to me that a lot
of NFL players did so well because you know, they're
used to being coached there, used to being part of
a team mentality. They tend not to have as many
(26:28):
yes people around them as some of the celebrities do
from entertainment, so they're better able to adapt to the
environment I think of dancing. But that's always been part
of it. I used to say when when people would say, oh,
it's just a it's a popularity contest, I said, well, look,
(26:49):
if you want a pure ballroom competition, I would suggest PBS.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Yeah, we're still putting on a show that people want
to run into every week.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
Here's a news flash. Bruno, isn't that flamboyant off camera?
He's just you know, he ratchets it up. I mean,
Len God love him. He would, you know, sometimes be
very direct and almost porderline hurtful with comments. He never
was lying about his critique. He actually felt it, but
(27:20):
he'd amp it up a little bit because we're doing
a TV show, of course, and then he'd call me
over during the commercial and he'd go, that.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Was good, right, did you like it?
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Do you think it's fair to have prior dance experience
before coming onto the show.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
Yeah, look, I think I think that ship has sailed.
I mean we've had they've had people with prior dance
experience going back oh yeah, two thousand and six. I
think so. Yeah, that's part of it. But by the
same token, it's somebody like Andy Richter who really stole
(27:58):
everybody's heart. I think because he epitomized a lot of
what the best parts of the show are. Somebody coming
in completely out of left field and really embracing it
and working hard and being supportive of the other couple.
I mean, it's just he kind of epitomized the best
(28:19):
of the show. Now, did he deserve to win, No,
of course not. But you know, at the end of
the day, if you had a bunch of people who
never danced before on a two hour show, you'd be
going for the remote.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yes, correct.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
There's only so much learning and fumbling around that you
can see. You want to see some actual jaw dropping
performances as well.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Well.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
That's you know, it's a tough show to produce for
all those reasons, because you're never going to please everybody
one hundred percent of the time. It's just not going
to happen.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
You mentioned that the only reason when you came back
last year, it was because Conrad Green was back. You
felt like, you know, your people were back. Were you
were you still nervous at all going back. I know
it can be tied to a lot of emotions.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Yeah, No, I wasn't. I was really excited too, because
it you know, obviously I left in a manner that
wasn't of my choosing. Yeah, and I you know, I
kind of grieved that camaraderie and that sense of work
(29:36):
family that we had really built over the fifteen years
I was there, so to go back. I think I
posted when I was back for the rehearsal day. It
was me with several of the dancers, and my caption
was like I never left, because that's what it felt like.
And I was just greeted so warmly by everybody, and
(30:00):
it really felt like I had never left. Alfonso and
I did a really really funny video where he walks
into what had been my dressing room and I'm on
the couch meditating, which I always used to do between
the dress rehearsal and the live show, and he comes
in and he's going Tom. I said, Oh, I'm sorry, Alfonso,
(30:22):
I'm just you know, back in my old routine meditating
in my dressing room before the show. He goes, wait
a minute, Tom, now this is my dressing room, And
as I stand up apologetically, I said, well, that explains
why it took so long to pick the lock. But
it was just lovely. It was a wonderful experience. It
(30:44):
was it put a nice sweet button on the time
that I was associated with the show, and I couldn't
have been happier. And Derek and Hayley and raych they
built this incredible open that paid tribute to the original
pros that took youah gorgeous journey and a dance journey
(31:05):
through the entire twenty years of the show. And then
and of course I'm waiting. I'm standing behind this massive
led wall YEP, which I know is going to open.
I'll be backlit with smoke. I mean, it was you know,
my ego was an overdrive at that point, but it
was just such a lovely gesture, and you know, Derek's
(31:33):
stated desire to really give me a nice entrance was
so appreciated. So yeah, I just had nothing but fondness
about that night and going.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Back, well, you got a front row seat as a
guest judge among Carrie, Anne Bruno and Derek, a few
of whom found themselves with some online criticism this year.
People never seem happy with the judging. How hard is
that job?
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Well, it was easy for me. I was one and done.
And also, you know, at the risk of just sounding
like an old guy, don't you know these these people
on line about anything, the hell with him? You know,
(32:21):
it's just I mean, you've got to take something seriously,
somebody you know, scratching their shorts and their parents' basement typing.
But you know, you got to let that roll off
your back and just do the job, you know, and
just can you look in the mirror and say, Okay,
I'm doing it the way I think I should be
doing it. Uh, People, you're not going to please everybody.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
That would be boring yea, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Yeah, but I think you know that it's it's really
tough to see some of the the vitriol they you know,
just some of the stuff that they had to put
up with.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
It's just, you know, especially carry Anne this year, I
really feel like this year it was it was just unfair.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, And there's almost like a feeding frenzy, isn't there
it's always like, oh, who are we going to attack
this season? Okay, it's gonna and that everybody just gotta
gets on board. So I don't have a lot of
patience for trolling.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Yeah I don't either. I really felt for Carrie in
this year in particular. I really there were a couple
of times I went over to her privately and was
just like, I am furious.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
When Alfonso came on the podcast, we talked about the
one piece of advice he gave us all at the
kickoff dinner, and that was to remember that it is
a reality show at the end of the day. What
would you say your one piece of advice for contestants
joining the show would be today.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Well, well, I'll answer it sort of indirectly. One of
the things that I was known for. I don't think
Alfonso probably followed in this respect. My dress rehearsals were
really like NC seventeen. They were I got everything out
(34:19):
of my system in the dress rehearsal that.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
You didn't have to worry about it in the live show.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
Would have been canceled instantly. But the reason I did
it was to break up the couples, like especially in
those early weeks. It was a way of saying, don't
take it. You know, do the work, but don't take
it so seriously that you lose the joy. You lose
(34:46):
the fun, you lose the absurdity of this environment. I mean,
you're in a makeshift ballroom with mirror balls and glittering
spray tanning and and you know, all paddles, and you know,
don't lose sight of how deliciously ludicrous this all is.
(35:07):
Totally so, you know, as opposed to maybe having a
chat with you at a dinner. I put it into
practice in the rehearsals as a way of saying, and
then I would throw a party, which I think they
still do mid season. So great that I would throw
for the staff, cast and crew, and there were no
plus ones allowed. I love that. So it would just
(35:29):
be different departments that might not otherwise mingle in the
course of the season because it's a big machine to
put that show on there, and they would all get
to mingle, and later in the week I'd get the
benefit of hearing about hangovers and hookups.
Speaker 4 (35:44):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
Yeah, it was great. It was money well spent.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
You mentioned spray tans, which is something I have now
not been able to shake since doing dancing.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, I really.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Well, you know, I also did the tour, and I
did a month of the tour, and I became just
completely obsessed.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
With being tan all the time. Did you ever get
a spray tan.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
No, I I held out deliberately to be the pasty
old white guy.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
Someone has to represent, someone has to represent.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
Yeah, exactly. So No, I never did that, and I would.
I would just caution you, Danielle, if you're if you're
still addicted, I am there. There are Spray Tanner's anonymous
meetings all across the country.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
I'm going to need that number.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah. Yeah, you'll see a lot of people in various
stages of tanning.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, exactly, bright orange, pasty white. We're all there. Weresented. Okay.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Another thing I'd love your opinion on are people who
are judging both the audience and the judges behind the desk.
Should they be judging the dancing or the journey?
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Well, I think you can appreciate the journey, but ultimately
you have to judge the dance, Okay, you know, I
really think that. I mean, the journey is what makes
it compelling television to come back to every week. For
the viewer, and certainly it's a story that is told
(37:21):
from each couple's perspective as the season unfolds. But in
the moment, you know, that shouldn't weigh on the judges' reactions.
They should just be judging what they saw right then.
And that's what I did. You know, I didn't do
it from a technique standpoint, But what did that make
me feel? And I don't care what your journey is.
(37:44):
What were those two minutes like to me? You know,
I think that's the way to go now.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
As I don't know that we would call you a fan,
but as someone watching, what would you like to see next?
For the franchise second season? Every year a non celebrity season,
we already mentioned that that would probably be prick to
bring all stars.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
I made my desire pretty clear. I think they should
have brought back the result show. I agree, which I
guess they're not doing. I guess they unveiled their fall schedule,
and you know, they might be right. They seem to
be doing very well without a result show. My only
feeling was it just wasn't fair to a large swath
of the country that they're either voting blind or not
(38:30):
voting at all, because it's you know, it's already by
the time it gets to the you know, the last
two time zones especially, it's all done. Yes, you know,
somebody's already been voted off hours ago. Your vote doesn't matter.
And in the old days, when we had a result
show the next day, everybody's vote mattered because you'd vote
(38:51):
as you saw the show in your time zone, and
so all of those votes were tabulated. So that would
have been my I don't think two seasons is a
good eye yeah, because it, you know, it just wears
down the anticipation. There's just so much to watch on
television now. I know, with you know, TV networks and
(39:12):
streaming services and all that that it could get lost
in the shuffle. So I think one season a year
is good. But I would I would say, a half
hour result show the next night.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
I think that'd be I think that'd be great.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
I'm right there with you. And finally, and this is
one I am all ears for. What do you think
makes a good host other than talking to just the
one person?
Speaker 3 (39:36):
Well, I think and again I'll just use my love,
which is live television. It's it's it's an ability to
be present. And this is true whether it's a live
show or a tape show, or location or studio. Are
you here now?
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (39:57):
Are you in this moment, fielding as much potential as
you can from the environment you're in. It's why I meditate.
You know that meditation is all about being present. It's
why I would meditate between the dress rehearsal and the
live show, going out on that stage, knowing, you know,
(40:18):
knowing there are seven hundred people at that time in
the in the ballroom audience and millions watching.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
You know.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
I was like a kid in a candy store.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
It was because it was like, what's going to happen?
I know, I'm ready. I know I'm ready, and and
so that to not lose the joy of it, and
to not be in your head so much that you're
not here now. Don't think about what happened earlier, don't
think about what you might do later. Make sure you're present.
(40:49):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
What type of meditation do you do?
Speaker 3 (40:53):
I do TM popularized back in the days of the Beatles.
But I think you know, they'll they'll take issue, I'm sure,
but I think meditation is meditation. It just it's coke
and pepsi. You know. The key is do you have
a word, a sound, a place that you focus on
to build a mental muscle. And it's similar to like,
(41:17):
you know, with the gym, we go to the gym
to build physical muscles. Meditation builds through repetition, a mental
muscle so that you're better able to determine, at least
in my experience, incoming stress. So you don't treat everything equally,
you know. It's like because all of us every day,
(41:37):
you know, shit happens and it's coming at you, and
when you're present, when you're centered, you can determine better
whether this deserves your attention or you can just like, oh,
that's just flotsam and jetsam.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
That's you know, don't have to worry about that flotsam
and jetsam.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
I think it's yeah, it's not a law firm. It's
just like, oh, that a law firm of flotsam and jetson.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
Have you been injured on the job, Yeah, yeah, me too.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
But I tell people who say, oh, you know, I
try meditating, but I always have thoughts getting in the way,
so do I. The key is not to beat yourself
up about it. The key is not to judge yourself
when you're aware that your focal point is shifting, without judgment.
Just I said, treat it like styrofoam on the top
(42:31):
of a river. Just reach up, move it down, Yeah,
and get back to whatever your focal point is. And
you keep doing that and it keeps building that muscle,
and yeah, I think, and it has repercussions throughout your life. Yeah,
it really does.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
Well.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
I'm definitely taking away from this interview and conversation that
I need to start incorporating that more. I used to.
I used to start my morning with meditation, and then
you know, I've got a six year old and a
four year old, and you know I got mine. Now
my morning's are filled with packing lunches and trying to
scarf down at least one hot cup of coffee at
some point, and I've kind of lost that practice. But
(43:09):
you're right that it helps in so many different aspects
and avenues of life.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
You just carve out whenever, you know, whenever they're at
school or or whatever. You know, if you've got even
five or ten minutes, just sometimes in traffic, I'll be
on the four h five and I'll just go in
my heir now am I present? Am I getting too
irritated at you know, the guy who's directional has been
on for the last three miles?
Speaker 2 (43:35):
Exactly are you getting over or not?
Speaker 3 (43:38):
Yeah? Exactly. So it helps in those moments to kind of,
you know, stop and smell the roses a bit.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Tom. Thank you so much for spending your very precious
time with me today.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (43:51):
I have so enjoyed this. I'm sorry I was voted
off in week eight and didn't get to, you know,
enjoy hearing how my dance made you feel.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
But I hope I get to see you again.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
I feel like once you are a part of the
Dancing with the Stars family, you never really leave, and
they have embraced me so warmly, So I hope that
I get to see you again.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
That'd be great, That'd be great.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
Thank you and a pleasure, Danielle, and I would be
remiss if I did not tell you that. Richard Leecock,
it just loves you. He's that's my trainer at the gym.
He's my trainer. Gat gosh, he's wonderful. He's a great trainer,
and he's a wonderful man.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
He is, indeed and we're good buddies and the two
of us with Jonathan Franks from Star Trek. It's actually
a couple times a year we try to get lunch.
I love it together. But yeah, Richard's he's a class act.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Yes he is, and so are you. Thank you for
being here.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
All the best.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
Danielle with the Stars Produced and hosted by Danielle Fischl.
Executive Producers Jensen Carponamy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production,
Danielle Romo, producer, editor and engineer Tara Sudbosch. Theme song
by Justin Siegel. Follow us on Instagram at Danielle wood
Stars and vote for me
It's been a minute, but welcome back to Danielle with
a podcast that at one time faithfully followed my journey
from normal, everyday plead to exceptional exceptional professional dancer, and now,
with announcements and events popping up all over pop culture,
the season has returned. It's officially time to talk Dancing
(00:40):
with the Stars. I'm excited to be diving back into
the universe at the end of July at Dancing with
the Stars Con twenty six in Palm Springs, California, where
I'll be partaking in the festivities and endlessly complaining about
the heat. Tickets available now, and they've already welcomed three
new cast members for season thirty five, reality TV stars
(01:01):
Mora Higgins and Sierra Miller and Savannah Bananas baseball player
Jackson Olsen. But none of this could be possible without
the contributions of this week's special guest. There's been a
lot of Mount Rushmore talk on social media this year,
and I think you'd be hard pressed to leave this
legend off when it comes to Dancing with the Stars.
(01:22):
Variation Originally a radio DJ with stops in New Hampshire
and Boston, he did the unthinkable and did have a
face for TV, landing local hosting spots, including a teenage
discussion series called Wrap Around Spelled Rap I'm going to
need to know everything about that. And then the floodgates opened.
(01:45):
Three years at FX and Fox, guest hosts on Good
Morning America and a gig that landed him the Daytime
Emmy for Outstanding Game Show Host, Hollywood Squares. Then for
thirteen years he was the face of America's Funniest Home Videos,
still the show's longest tenured host, introducing dudes getting hit
in the genitals, which led to another Emmy winning spot,
(02:09):
the Master of Ceremonies for Dancing with the Stars from
two thousand and five to twenty twenty. He co hosted
the Emmys in two thousand and eight, wrote a best
selling autobiography in two thousand and nine, and made his
triumphant return to the ballroom last year, a hopeful sign
that we will get to see him even more during
this new renaissance of the show.
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Also, we work out at the same gym this week.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
I'm honored to welcome to Danielle with a pioneer of
reality and competition TV, Tom bergeron.
Speaker 3 (02:39):
Well, I just have to tell you after hearing of
all my accomplishments, I'm exhausted.
Speaker 4 (02:45):
Aren't you tired?
Speaker 3 (02:46):
I've just I have to go lie down now.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
No wonder you just want to stay in your home
and have food delivered, you know?
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Yeah, it's we were Danielle and I were talking just
before we invited you in that I had become a
recluse very happily with streaming services and Instacart and door
Dash and Zoom. I mean, why leave?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Why leave your house?
Speaker 3 (03:10):
You know?
Speaker 1 (03:11):
My mom actually has been saying that for years, long
before the streaming services.
Speaker 2 (03:15):
In the Zoom.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Whenever we would pitch the idea of going camping, my
mom would say, but I've worked very hard for this house.
Why would I want to pretend I don't have one?
Speaker 3 (03:25):
Yeah, exactly, Why go into a smaller version, you know,
where we're all bumping into each other?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Well, it's in my absolute pleasure to get to sit
here with you for the podcast. I did mention in
your intro that we go to the same gym, and
there is not a single person at our gym who
doesn't say, what an absolute lovely gem of a human
being you are.
Speaker 3 (03:49):
Oh stop, stop, I have to say at the outset.
One thing I really missed when I went back to
be a guest judge for the twentieth you were voted
off like the week before.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
Right, I know I missed you missed you by that much,
I know, I think so.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yeah, because what week were you there?
Speaker 3 (04:08):
Was the I think it was week nine?
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Yeah, I was voted off week eight, so yeah.
Speaker 3 (04:14):
Yes, the twentieth celebration was week now. Yeah, sorry about that.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Yeah, I was there.
Speaker 1 (04:19):
I was just sitting in the audience now going hey everyone, Well,
first of all, I'm going to need to get wrap
around out of the way first. This was a weekend
TV show with troubled teens at WBZ in Boston.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
Right, Yeah, yeah, they weren't all troubled. They were probably
troubled about it on a par with me. Okay, but yeah,
it was a really cool format. It was me with
a different high school or high schools every week talking
about issues a specific two teens, and some of them
(04:55):
were you know, like peer pressure, gang influences in and
around the Boston area, et cetera. So I only had
one rule. I said, I'm I'm I'm not going to
be either your parent or your peer Okay, I just
want to listen, and I'm going to respond with my
natural curiosity based on what you're telling me. Once we
(05:18):
establish what the topic for any given show is. And
we sat around together on these cushioned It was a
really cool, like graffiti Layton set that they came up with,
and I did that for a couple of seasons on
the what was then the NBC affiliate in Boston.
Speaker 2 (05:34):
OW I mean, how did you get that job?
Speaker 1 (05:37):
Because, with all due respect, when I think of gang
violence and hip hop music, my first thought is not, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
The whitest man in America. When I would show up
what I would show up for Hollywood Squares because we'd
shoot during the summer, and I'd show up, you know,
a T shirt and shorts because the wardrobe people had
my c was hanging up and Whoopy would look at
me and go, those are the whitest legs in America.
(06:07):
So I had been doing other stuff at that station
at BC, and I had done a magazine show for
younger kids called super Kids prior to wrap Around, and
then I started hosting the midday talk show called People
Were Talking, which was on the Westinghouse stations. Oprah did
the one in Baltimore as a matter of fact, at
(06:29):
one time, and as a result of that, they said, Hey,
would you like to do another show, just a weekend
show that we taped during the week just with kids. Yeah,
And I thought, well, that's you know, I think at
that point I was a new dad as well. Oh
so I wanted to see what I was in for exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
Well, you had just started to make a name for
yourself as a host. Apparently you were so good that
people wanted you on other shows. You mentioned, people are talking,
and like you said, it was a big regional talk
show with guests like Spike Lee, New Kids on the Block,
Roseanne Barr and other very time relevant names. And then
this was in the Donna Hue or Oprah format of
(07:11):
the era.
Speaker 2 (07:12):
Was this your style of talk show?
Speaker 1 (07:15):
It's very host reliant, so you had to love it.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
It was What I loved about it was it was
like cramming for an exam every night, because five days
a week for one hour midday live, which I love. Wow,
it was a given topic or guest. One of my
favorite guests he was on twice with me, was President
Jimmy Carter, the late Jimmy Carter, wonderful guests, and we
(07:44):
ran the gamut from sublime to ridiculous on that format.
But my favorite, my absolute favorite experience hosting on television.
And this might surprise people who think, well, it's got
to be America's funniest vidy as stars, it's not. It's
Breakfast Time on FX, which I co hosted from ninety
(08:08):
four to ninety six, and it was set in a
sixty five hundred square foot apartment in the Flatiron district
of New York, made for television, and it was just
and the cast was incredible, and I loved going to
work every day. I'd get up in Connecticut at three
point thirty in the morning and drive to Manhattan, so
(08:30):
I'd get there the office at about five, and you know,
loved it, not that part of it, but I loved
the actual show.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
What was Your bedtime? For a three thirty wake up?
Speaker 3 (08:42):
It was early as a matter of and the girls
were see our daughters at that point were probably do
six and four. So Lois, my wife, actually got them
a board game called Don't Wake Daddy. And I was
basically on the same sleep schedule as my kids.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. I actually know that schedule. Well, because
my husband did morning radio out in LA when we
first got married, and so he had a very similar
four am alarm clock.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
And I said, listen, I'm pregnant. Let's just start getting
on that baby schedule.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
So we'd go to bed at eight thirty and then
get up at four. It's actually kind of glorious. So
what was Breakfast Time about.
Speaker 3 (09:29):
Well, it was about two hours.
Speaker 2 (09:34):
And then it happened.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
Yeah. It was kind of a gonzo version of a
morning television show. We had news and weather and guests
and all that, but we did it in almost a
morning zoo kind of format. It was like a radio
show on television. Great, there are compilation videos on YouTube
(09:57):
and you can type in my name and Breakfast Time
and just I'm the guy with the brown hair in
those videos. But yeah, it was just wonderful. My co
host was Laurie Hibbert now Laurie Gelman, married to Michael Gelman. Yeah,
what is it, Kelly and somebody else? Now Mark or.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
I think it's Mark, Yeah, Mark, thank you?
Speaker 3 (10:23):
Well, anyway that Laurie's married to Gelman. Yeah, but we
we just hit it off. I've been very fortunate with
with co hosts. Over the years.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
Yeah, Well, as I mentioned my husband being a morning
radio DJ, and you said, like a morning zoo type thing.
Do you love We love radio. We think radio is
just one of the greatest formats ever. Do you think
it is something there's something special about that skill set
that helps with the transition then to TV.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
That's a really good question, and I think you're spot on.
I think the thing that I always tell aspiring broadcasters, podcasters, whatever,
is that, however big an audience you're shooting for, just
remember you're only talking to one person, right, And you
know that was really as a matter of fact, when
(11:13):
I first started in radio, Danielle, I had in my
hometown in Massachusetts. So that I could focus on one person,
I had an album cover on the other side of
the microphone that had this really attractive woman's face on it.
I couldn't tell you what band it was or but
I'm sure that for the first couple of years of
my career I just sounded horny.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
You're like, I'm gonna keep my eyes locked on.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
But I think that keeping that in mind, that you're
talking to one person, that was something easy to develop
in radio because you're kind of in a room by
yourself unless you have a morning team around you. And
then for television, it was funny. There was one one
time Fantastic with the Stars. Some friends from the East
Coast were in the audience visiting, and during a commercial break,
(12:06):
my buddy Greg called me over. He goes, Tom, you know,
there's so much noise here in the ballroom. I can't
hear you when you're talking. And I said, well, that's
all right, I'm not talking to you. Nothing I'm saying
is that person on the other side of the lens.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
Yeah, exactly, I know. I have noticed. I've been toasting
the American Idol Official podcast in. Ryan Seacrest, of course,
is the host of that show, another legendary host, and
whenever he's talking, he's just it's.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
His absolute same volume. Everyone in the audience is going crazy.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
No one knows what he's saying or when he's even
done saying it, but he's not talking to us.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
That's right.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
You mentioned Dancing with the Stars, and I always imagine
the first time somebody hears the pitch for the show,
and I think this, it must have just sounded insane.
It's not like ballroom dancing was having a moment or anything.
And then this concept of teaching celebrit parties how to
do it.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
It kind of sounds like a car wreck.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
Well, you know, yes and no. I mean there was
a there was some momentum for ballroom okay time, there
was the movie Strictly Ballroom came out. I think Richard
Gear and j Low were in it. And as a
matter of fact, that's why the mothership, which had been
called Come Dancing for years, yeah, added illogically Strictly because
(13:29):
they were sort of, you know, in the slipstream of
the success of that movie, and Strictly Come Dancing shifted
from being I think originally it was like a weekend
legit ballroom professional show, and then they started adding the
celebrity element and moved it to prime time and it
blew up and it okay. So that's what prompted the
(13:52):
head of entertainment programming at the time, Andrew Along, to
pitch of an American version of that. And she told
me later, once we were established in a hit, she said, Tom,
when I was in that room pitching it, nobody would
make eye contact with me.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Like this is on com.
Speaker 3 (14:11):
She's killing her career right now, we're watching it happen.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
Yeah, and turn away from the car wreck.
Speaker 3 (14:17):
That's right. So she had a pretty big I told
you so in her back pocket for quite some time.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Boy, I love that.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Did you have any dance knowledge going into it?
Speaker 4 (14:27):
No?
Speaker 3 (14:28):
I barely have any now, Yeah, No, I didn't at all. All.
The only knowledge I had was, you know, being comfortable
hosting live television. And in some ways that was an
advantage because I became your surrogate as the viewer. I
was learning while you were learning, you know, And I
(14:51):
mean I have some dance lingo. But I said to
everybody when I showed up to be a guest judge
in November, I said, I'm not gonna be critiquing technique.
I'm just going to tell you emotionally what I felt
watching the dance, because you know, Derek and Carrie Ann
and Bruno, they've got the technique stuff down.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
Yeah, you're not going to compete with them?
Speaker 3 (15:14):
No that No, I wouldn't even pretend to have any
of that knowledge. But I could. I could critique based
as a viewer, and my role, I think when I
hosted it over the years was to basically protect you guys,
you know, from the judges and then God bless him.
I did miss him. I wish he was still with us.
Speaker 2 (15:38):
Everybody misses.
Speaker 3 (15:39):
Everybody's such a wonderful, lovely man with just the right amount.
Speaker 1 (15:46):
Of snark yep, exactly, yes.
Speaker 3 (15:48):
And you know, sometimes the judges were a little harsh,
and I try to be like a comedic shield between
the couples and the judges and try to and just
keep the show move, just keep everything going, because as
you know, there are a lot of moving parts.
Speaker 2 (16:04):
There sure are.
Speaker 1 (16:05):
Okay, what can you tell me about that first season,
because I have to imagine it was like the wild West.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Yeah, it was the summer of two thousand and five.
I was on hiatus from America's Funniest Videos. So when
ABC asked if I would host a summer show, I thought, well,
you know, sure, Okay, six weeks live TV. Why not,
expecting nothing of it other than it might be it
might come back next summer if it's a hit this summer.
(16:34):
But you know, it didn't know what we had. I mean,
I was really skeptical about a celebrity ballroom show. Yeah,
but I'll give it a go. What the heck. The
one thing that I insisted on changing by the time
we got to season two. In season one, there were
a lot of scripted jokes. Okay, and the joke writer
(16:57):
is actually a friend of mine. He's award winning, great guy,
but it always felt weird. I finally said to the producers,
you know what, We're a live show. I should be
reacting in real time to what I'm seeing and feeling.
And sometimes that might be with a joke. Sometimes it
might be with a hug. You know. Sometimes it's just
(17:20):
but to have something scripted days earlier that has no
bearing on what we just saw, what's the point of that.
So I made the pitch. I said, just I'm asking
you to trust me, and and thankfully they did. And
from season two on, I pretty much abandoned having anything
prepared other than getting you to the commercial and bringing
(17:43):
you back.
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Yes, yes, that's so great, and in the script, just
Tom reacts.
Speaker 3 (17:50):
Yeah. That was basically. We'd be in script meetings and
especially leading into season two, and I'd look at something
that you know, on its own was a good joke,
but not germane to anything, right, and I would go on,
I'm not doing that. As a matter of fact. On
America's Funniest Videos in the early years, before they kind
of got my rhythm and my voice. We would sit
(18:13):
in a room before the taping and the head writer
was Todd Thick, and he would turn to the other
writers and he said, Okay, guys, here's where Tom kills
your babies.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Don't be too attached to anything.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
I'll busy at that.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Yeah. Now, a lot of fans talk about how the
focus of the show has moved away from the drama
packages of the early days, the arguments between partners, the bickering.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Do you miss that element at all? Is there room
for it? In twenty twenty six.
Speaker 3 (18:51):
In all candor, I hadn't been watching.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Oh yeah, so.
Speaker 3 (18:58):
You know I I had mixed feelings had yeah, exactly,
So I wasn't really watching until the few weeks prior
to being the guest judge. I mean, I still I
think that was evident when I was back, have great
fondness everybody there, and the people that I didn't have
(19:19):
fondness for pretty much were all gone. Son made it
easy to come back. But so I can't speak to
how the packages have changed, but I will say since
Conrad Green came back as the showrunner, who was my
original showrunner, the ship has been righted. I know it
(19:39):
got a little rocky for a couple of seasons there
and seemed to spiral a bit, but I think Conrad
got you know, got back in there, and as I
said on the show last November, you know, it's it's
having a ratings resurgence. And so whatever they're doing, whatever
the in terms of cast or the packages or the focus,
(20:03):
they have adapted that show so brilliantly for now that
it's it's having a bit of a renaissance. And I
couldn't be happier. Somebody asked me on social media, Tom,
you must have been aware that the ratings went down
after they fired you and Aaron. You must have been
really happy, And I said no. I said I was
(20:24):
aware of it, but you know, there are a lot
of friends of mine working on that show who I
wanted to still have jobs. So I took no you know,
I took no pleasure in that. Yeah, And I was
just what I did, take pleasure and was seeing it
catch itself, yeah, and build into what it is again,
especially in this environment.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
There has been a lot of love in the in
the you know, mainstream media, certainly from the celebs and
stuff for Dina Cats Dina Cats. Her name comes up
all the time people talk about her. I would like
to have just a moment where we do talk about Conrad,
because Conrad's and doesn't necessarily get mentioned in the same
way Dina's name gets mentioned.
Speaker 2 (21:04):
But one of the things I so appreciated.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
About my experience on that show where the amount of
times there were group meetings leading into the start of
the show and then during the season where they would
let us know about something that was going to be
going on. I don't think I've ever felt more genuinely
protected than I did from Conrad, who made it very
(21:31):
clear how much of an open door there was for
anything we wanted to talk about, and that if anything
was going on, we shouldn't stay quiet about it, We
shouldn't talk about it, you know, amongst ourselves, we could
go directly to him, and I just he truly was
(21:52):
the way he runs that show makes the people who
are a part of it know that you are a
family and you're working together, and he's there for you
if you need him.
Speaker 3 (22:02):
And really well said and absolutely spot on. And again
he's the reason I went back. I would had he
not been at the Helm, I wouldn't have gone back
as much affection as I have for all the other people.
You know, I just had it been the regime I
locked horns with. I mean, you know, well, frankly, if
(22:23):
they were still running the show, it'd be off the
air by now.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
But yeah, you're right, you're right.
Speaker 3 (22:27):
Yeah, But yeah, Conrad being there made all the difference
for me.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So what do you think is the special sauce of
this show? Why do you think so many people who've
been a part of it, myself included, walk away from
it saying it's life changing.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Well, I think that I can only base it on
what I've seen in the years and what I've seen
now that he's back, and Alfonso and Julianne are there,
and Derek's in the center seat and all that, and
and I experienced it like a tsunami of affection when
I when I went back in November, and and that
(23:16):
to me is key that that what I would see
every season when I was host was the obvious competitiveness
among the couples, but also the support among the couples,
you know who. They'd walk into their somebody else's rehearsal
and offer a few suggestions, not not for sabotage, he
(23:39):
genuinely helped and and and that was lovely and and
you know, friendships that have lasted years after the show
or the season they competed in. So you know, that
speaks to I think that kind of quality that you
really uh, it was very well said about the environ
(24:00):
and Conrad creates and so for you know, a lot
of my time there, he was at the Helm, and
after he left it was people that he had brought
up through the ranks, so they up until a certain point,
had the same philosophy.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Right. Is there a contestant you remember from your time
on the show whose journey really stayed with you?
Speaker 3 (24:27):
You know, I probably could come up with a better example,
but the one that always pops into my mind first
is from an early season, and it was Jerry Springer.
And you know, because i'd only known him for his
talk show, which was you know, who was the Father?
Speaker 1 (24:44):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (24:45):
Yeah, you know throwing Yeah, yeah, yeah, the Father, you
know all that stuff. So when I heard he had
been cast and went really curious. But he turned out
to be the sweetest guy, just absolute mench And he
said the only reason he did the show was to
learn how to waltz for his daughter's wedding. Oh, I
(25:05):
thought was lovely. And she actually was in the audience
at one point and he was able to I think
he did the actual waltz.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Oh, that's beautiful.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
Layla Ali danced for her dad. Muhammad Ali was in
the audience and it was sort of at a point
where the Parkinson's had taken his speech from him and
he was able to be there and you could still
see the sparkle in his eyes.
Speaker 1 (25:33):
Oh, those are such special moments. I'll never forget having
my children in the ballroom when I dance, like, I'll
never forget that moment. So I will say, and this
isn't just me trying to cope. It feels like nowadays
contestants like Whitney Lovett or Alex Earl, these are superstar
athletes basically doing insane moves, different than the old celebrity
(25:55):
trying to dance model.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
Like Andy Rich There.
Speaker 2 (26:00):
Yeah, not naming any names, but you know.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
But that's part of it. There's always been an aspect
of the show, going back to the early seasons where
athletes were part of it or people who you know,
And it was no surprise to me that a lot
of NFL players did so well because you know, they're
used to being coached there, used to being part of
a team mentality. They tend not to have as many
(26:28):
yes people around them as some of the celebrities do
from entertainment, so they're better able to adapt to the
environment I think of dancing. But that's always been part
of it. I used to say when when people would say, oh,
it's just a it's a popularity contest, I said, well, look,
(26:49):
if you want a pure ballroom competition, I would suggest PBS.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
Yeah, we're still putting on a show that people want
to run into every week.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
Here's a news flash. Bruno, isn't that flamboyant off camera?
He's just you know, he ratchets it up. I mean,
Len God love him. He would, you know, sometimes be
very direct and almost porderline hurtful with comments. He never
was lying about his critique. He actually felt it, but
(27:20):
he'd amp it up a little bit because we're doing
a TV show, of course, and then he'd call me
over during the commercial and he'd go, that.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Was good, right, did you like it?
Speaker 1 (27:33):
Do you think it's fair to have prior dance experience
before coming onto the show.
Speaker 3 (27:38):
Yeah, look, I think I think that ship has sailed.
I mean we've had they've had people with prior dance
experience going back oh yeah, two thousand and six. I
think so. Yeah, that's part of it. But by the
same token, it's somebody like Andy Richter who really stole
(27:58):
everybody's heart. I think because he epitomized a lot of
what the best parts of the show are. Somebody coming
in completely out of left field and really embracing it
and working hard and being supportive of the other couple.
I mean, it's just he kind of epitomized the best
(28:19):
of the show. Now, did he deserve to win, No,
of course not. But you know, at the end of
the day, if you had a bunch of people who
never danced before on a two hour show, you'd be
going for the remote.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Yes, correct.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
There's only so much learning and fumbling around that you
can see. You want to see some actual jaw dropping
performances as well.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Well.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
That's you know, it's a tough show to produce for
all those reasons, because you're never going to please everybody
one hundred percent of the time. It's just not going
to happen.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
You mentioned that the only reason when you came back
last year, it was because Conrad Green was back. You
felt like, you know, your people were back. Were you
were you still nervous at all going back. I know
it can be tied to a lot of emotions.
Speaker 3 (29:12):
Yeah, No, I wasn't. I was really excited too, because
it you know, obviously I left in a manner that
wasn't of my choosing. Yeah, and I you know, I
kind of grieved that camaraderie and that sense of work
(29:36):
family that we had really built over the fifteen years
I was there, so to go back. I think I
posted when I was back for the rehearsal day. It
was me with several of the dancers, and my caption
was like I never left, because that's what it felt like.
And I was just greeted so warmly by everybody, and
(30:00):
it really felt like I had never left. Alfonso and
I did a really really funny video where he walks
into what had been my dressing room and I'm on
the couch meditating, which I always used to do between
the dress rehearsal and the live show, and he comes
in and he's going Tom. I said, Oh, I'm sorry, Alfonso,
(30:22):
I'm just you know, back in my old routine meditating
in my dressing room before the show. He goes, wait
a minute, Tom, now this is my dressing room, And
as I stand up apologetically, I said, well, that explains
why it took so long to pick the lock. But
it was just lovely. It was a wonderful experience. It
(30:44):
was it put a nice sweet button on the time
that I was associated with the show, and I couldn't
have been happier. And Derek and Hayley and raych they
built this incredible open that paid tribute to the original
pros that took youah gorgeous journey and a dance journey
(31:05):
through the entire twenty years of the show. And then
and of course I'm waiting. I'm standing behind this massive
led wall YEP, which I know is going to open.
I'll be backlit with smoke. I mean, it was you know,
my ego was an overdrive at that point, but it
was just such a lovely gesture, and you know, Derek's
(31:33):
stated desire to really give me a nice entrance was
so appreciated. So yeah, I just had nothing but fondness
about that night and going.
Speaker 1 (31:42):
Back, well, you got a front row seat as a
guest judge among Carrie, Anne Bruno and Derek, a few
of whom found themselves with some online criticism this year.
People never seem happy with the judging. How hard is
that job?
Speaker 3 (32:00):
Well, it was easy for me. I was one and done.
And also, you know, at the risk of just sounding
like an old guy, don't you know these these people
on line about anything, the hell with him? You know,
(32:21):
it's just I mean, you've got to take something seriously,
somebody you know, scratching their shorts and their parents' basement typing.
But you know, you got to let that roll off
your back and just do the job, you know, and
just can you look in the mirror and say, Okay,
I'm doing it the way I think I should be
doing it. Uh, People, you're not going to please everybody.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
That would be boring yea, absolutely.
Speaker 3 (32:45):
Yeah, but I think you know that it's it's really
tough to see some of the the vitriol they you know,
just some of the stuff that they had to put
up with.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
It's just, you know, especially carry Anne this year, I
really feel like this year it was it was just unfair.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Yeah, And there's almost like a feeding frenzy, isn't there
it's always like, oh, who are we going to attack
this season? Okay, it's gonna and that everybody just gotta
gets on board. So I don't have a lot of
patience for trolling.
Speaker 1 (33:15):
Yeah I don't either. I really felt for Carrie in
this year in particular. I really there were a couple
of times I went over to her privately and was
just like, I am furious.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (33:38):
When Alfonso came on the podcast, we talked about the
one piece of advice he gave us all at the
kickoff dinner, and that was to remember that it is
a reality show at the end of the day. What
would you say your one piece of advice for contestants
joining the show would be today.
Speaker 3 (33:59):
Well, well, I'll answer it sort of indirectly. One of
the things that I was known for. I don't think
Alfonso probably followed in this respect. My dress rehearsals were
really like NC seventeen. They were I got everything out
(34:19):
of my system in the dress rehearsal that.
Speaker 2 (34:22):
You didn't have to worry about it in the live show.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
Would have been canceled instantly. But the reason I did
it was to break up the couples, like especially in
those early weeks. It was a way of saying, don't
take it. You know, do the work, but don't take
it so seriously that you lose the joy. You lose
(34:46):
the fun, you lose the absurdity of this environment. I mean,
you're in a makeshift ballroom with mirror balls and glittering
spray tanning and and you know, all paddles, and you know,
don't lose sight of how deliciously ludicrous this all is.
(35:07):
Totally so, you know, as opposed to maybe having a
chat with you at a dinner. I put it into
practice in the rehearsals as a way of saying, and
then I would throw a party, which I think they
still do mid season. So great that I would throw
for the staff, cast and crew, and there were no
plus ones allowed. I love that. So it would just
(35:29):
be different departments that might not otherwise mingle in the
course of the season because it's a big machine to
put that show on there, and they would all get
to mingle, and later in the week I'd get the
benefit of hearing about hangovers and hookups.
Speaker 4 (35:44):
I love it.
Speaker 3 (35:45):
Yeah, it was great. It was money well spent.
Speaker 2 (35:48):
Perfect.
Speaker 1 (35:49):
You mentioned spray tans, which is something I have now
not been able to shake since doing dancing.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, I really.
Speaker 1 (35:55):
Well, you know, I also did the tour, and I
did a month of the tour, and I became just
completely obsessed.
Speaker 2 (36:03):
With being tan all the time. Did you ever get
a spray tan.
Speaker 3 (36:07):
No, I I held out deliberately to be the pasty
old white guy.
Speaker 2 (36:14):
Someone has to represent, someone has to represent.
Speaker 3 (36:18):
Yeah, exactly. So No, I never did that, and I would.
I would just caution you, Danielle, if you're if you're
still addicted, I am there. There are Spray Tanner's anonymous
meetings all across the country.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
I'm going to need that number.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Yeah. Yeah, you'll see a lot of people in various
stages of tanning.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, exactly, bright orange, pasty white. We're all there. Weresented. Okay.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Another thing I'd love your opinion on are people who
are judging both the audience and the judges behind the desk.
Should they be judging the dancing or the journey?
Speaker 3 (37:01):
Well, I think you can appreciate the journey, but ultimately
you have to judge the dance, Okay, you know, I
really think that. I mean, the journey is what makes
it compelling television to come back to every week. For
the viewer, and certainly it's a story that is told
(37:21):
from each couple's perspective as the season unfolds. But in
the moment, you know, that shouldn't weigh on the judges' reactions.
They should just be judging what they saw right then.
And that's what I did. You know, I didn't do
it from a technique standpoint, But what did that make
me feel? And I don't care what your journey is.
(37:44):
What were those two minutes like to me? You know,
I think that's the way to go now.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
As I don't know that we would call you a fan,
but as someone watching, what would you like to see next?
For the franchise second season? Every year a non celebrity season,
we already mentioned that that would probably be prick to
bring all stars.
Speaker 3 (38:07):
I made my desire pretty clear. I think they should
have brought back the result show. I agree, which I
guess they're not doing. I guess they unveiled their fall schedule,
and you know, they might be right. They seem to
be doing very well without a result show. My only
feeling was it just wasn't fair to a large swath
of the country that they're either voting blind or not
(38:30):
voting at all, because it's you know, it's already by
the time it gets to the you know, the last
two time zones especially, it's all done. Yes, you know,
somebody's already been voted off hours ago. Your vote doesn't matter.
And in the old days, when we had a result
show the next day, everybody's vote mattered because you'd vote
(38:51):
as you saw the show in your time zone, and
so all of those votes were tabulated. So that would
have been my I don't think two seasons is a
good eye yeah, because it, you know, it just wears
down the anticipation. There's just so much to watch on
television now. I know, with you know, TV networks and
(39:12):
streaming services and all that that it could get lost
in the shuffle. So I think one season a year
is good. But I would I would say, a half
hour result show the next night.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
I think that'd be I think that'd be great.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
I'm right there with you. And finally, and this is
one I am all ears for. What do you think
makes a good host other than talking to just the
one person?
Speaker 3 (39:36):
Well, I think and again I'll just use my love,
which is live television. It's it's it's an ability to
be present. And this is true whether it's a live
show or a tape show, or location or studio. Are
you here now?
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (39:57):
Are you in this moment, fielding as much potential as
you can from the environment you're in. It's why I meditate.
You know that meditation is all about being present. It's
why I would meditate between the dress rehearsal and the
live show, going out on that stage, knowing, you know,
(40:18):
knowing there are seven hundred people at that time in
the in the ballroom audience and millions watching.
Speaker 4 (40:24):
You know.
Speaker 3 (40:25):
I was like a kid in a candy store.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (40:27):
It was because it was like, what's going to happen?
I know, I'm ready. I know I'm ready, and and
so that to not lose the joy of it, and
to not be in your head so much that you're
not here now. Don't think about what happened earlier, don't
think about what you might do later. Make sure you're present.
(40:49):
I think that's it.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
What type of meditation do you do?
Speaker 3 (40:53):
I do TM popularized back in the days of the Beatles.
But I think you know, they'll they'll take issue, I'm sure,
but I think meditation is meditation. It just it's coke
and pepsi. You know. The key is do you have
a word, a sound, a place that you focus on
to build a mental muscle. And it's similar to like,
(41:17):
you know, with the gym, we go to the gym
to build physical muscles. Meditation builds through repetition, a mental
muscle so that you're better able to determine, at least
in my experience, incoming stress. So you don't treat everything equally,
you know. It's like because all of us every day,
(41:37):
you know, shit happens and it's coming at you, and
when you're present, when you're centered, you can determine better
whether this deserves your attention or you can just like, oh,
that's just flotsam and jetsam.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
That's you know, don't have to worry about that flotsam
and jetsam.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
I think it's yeah, it's not a law firm. It's
just like, oh, that a law firm of flotsam and jetson.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
Have you been injured on the job, Yeah, yeah, me too.
Speaker 3 (42:10):
But I tell people who say, oh, you know, I
try meditating, but I always have thoughts getting in the way,
so do I. The key is not to beat yourself
up about it. The key is not to judge yourself
when you're aware that your focal point is shifting, without judgment.
Just I said, treat it like styrofoam on the top
(42:31):
of a river. Just reach up, move it down, Yeah,
and get back to whatever your focal point is. And
you keep doing that and it keeps building that muscle,
and yeah, I think, and it has repercussions throughout your life. Yeah,
it really does.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
Well.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
I'm definitely taking away from this interview and conversation that
I need to start incorporating that more. I used to.
I used to start my morning with meditation, and then
you know, I've got a six year old and a
four year old, and you know I got mine. Now
my morning's are filled with packing lunches and trying to
scarf down at least one hot cup of coffee at
some point, and I've kind of lost that practice. But
(43:09):
you're right that it helps in so many different aspects
and avenues of life.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
You just carve out whenever, you know, whenever they're at
school or or whatever. You know, if you've got even
five or ten minutes, just sometimes in traffic, I'll be
on the four h five and I'll just go in
my heir now am I present? Am I getting too
irritated at you know, the guy who's directional has been
on for the last three miles?
Speaker 2 (43:35):
Exactly are you getting over or not?
Speaker 3 (43:38):
Yeah? Exactly. So it helps in those moments to kind of,
you know, stop and smell the roses a bit.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Tom. Thank you so much for spending your very precious
time with me today.
Speaker 3 (43:49):
It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1 (43:51):
I have so enjoyed this. I'm sorry I was voted
off in week eight and didn't get to, you know,
enjoy hearing how my dance made you feel.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
But I hope I get to see you again.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
I feel like once you are a part of the
Dancing with the Stars family, you never really leave, and
they have embraced me so warmly, So I hope that
I get to see you again.
Speaker 3 (44:11):
That'd be great, That'd be great.
Speaker 1 (44:13):
Thank you and a pleasure, Danielle, and I would be
remiss if I did not tell you that. Richard Leecock,
it just loves you. He's that's my trainer at the gym.
He's my trainer. Gat gosh, he's wonderful. He's a great trainer,
and he's a wonderful man.
Speaker 3 (44:28):
He is, indeed and we're good buddies and the two
of us with Jonathan Franks from Star Trek. It's actually
a couple times a year we try to get lunch.
I love it together. But yeah, Richard's he's a class act.
Speaker 2 (44:42):
Yes he is, and so are you. Thank you for
being here.
Speaker 3 (44:44):
All the best.
Speaker 1 (44:48):
Danielle with the Stars Produced and hosted by Danielle Fischl.
Executive Producers Jensen Carponamy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production,
Danielle Romo, producer, editor and engineer Tara Sudbosch. Theme song
by Justin Siegel. Follow us on Instagram at Danielle wood
Stars and vote for me
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