May 20, 2026 • 59 mins
He had the whole world yelling “New South” and led the search for “Ms. New Booty,” but before he was Bubba Sparxxx, he was just Warren Mathis in the mud of Troup County, Georgia.
Danielle hangs out with the Y2K rap sensation to hear stories from the football field, a passion that almost took him in a completely different direction.
Bubba also reveals details from the “Ugly” music video that took MTV by storm and opens up about his ongoing struggles with addiction (and how he’s made it his mission to now help others in the same predicament).
Plus, we get Bubba’s opinion on the new wave of country/hip hop artists like Jelly Roll and Post Malone, a road he helped pave, on this week’s Teen Beat!
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
That's okay because no one here.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Is Hello and welcome to another installment of teen Beat.
I am your host, Danielle Fischel, continuing to talk to
interesting people who do interesting things, all about how their
teenage years shaped who they are today. Remember getting your
ears pierced at Claire's, picking up some z Cavarici's from
(00:46):
Merry Go Round, or just hoping it's pizza Day at
the cafeteria. Me too. Still I love pizza Day. And
since my childhood, even the awkward parts were blasted onto
millions of TVs. That's worldwide. It's time I turned the
tables and find out what other celebrities were like at
the most vulnerable time of their lives. I look at
(01:08):
it this way. I gave you my childhood. It's time
we hear yours. And this week I'm chatting with a
legend of the South. He rose to attention in a
mud pit, starring in one of the most exciting debut
music videos of all time for his two thousand and
one hit single Ugly, a track that not only pushed
him front and center into the world of hip hop,
(01:31):
but helped further change the face of the genre forever.
His local Troop County, Georgia buzz led him to super
producer Timbaland during what could only be described as a
run of a lifetime, pairing him with not only the
hit maker of the moment, but the legendary Dungeon family
team Captain's Organized Noise as well, and that turned into
(01:52):
his first major label release at Innerscope Records, Dark Days,
Bright Nights, an album that went all the way to
number three on the Billboard two hundred. But it's his
second album that's gonna get the flowers it deserves today
on teen Beat two thousand and three's Deliverance, a perfect
mixture of rap and country, a gimmickless mashup that has
(02:13):
been so poorly done ever since. Featured Justin Timberlake, Sleepy Brown,
and Ryan Tedder, produced solely by Timberland and Organized Noise,
and forced the Village Voice to say, if Eminem is
hip hop's Elvis, then he is It's Greg Alman. But
but label politics and a strange climate for white rappers
(02:33):
at the time forced it to underperform, when in reality
it's a bona fide classic. I'm telling you go listen
to it now. I'll wait. He'd follow it up with
two thousand and six's The Charm, his first on Big
Boy from Outcasts Purple Ribbon Records, an album that included
yet another hit single, his biggest yet, Miss New Booty,
featuring the Yin Yang Twins and Mister Calla Park. But
(02:56):
today we'll not only find out what he's up to now,
but we are going to talk all about his past
as an all region high school football player and get
into how a kid raised half a mile away from
his closest neighbor became an integral part of rap in
the early odds. Today on teen Beat, it's a guest
that I chose, he didn't choose me. But nonetheless, it's
(03:17):
time to get ugly with Bubba Sparks.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Hello, miss Daniells, and I think congratulations are in order
for you. Just made another successful lap around the sun.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
I did.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Thank you, Thank you so much. It's a you know what.
To make it to forty five is an honor. Aging
is a privilege. I'm lucky to be here. I feel great,
so thank you.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Yeah, it is a privilege, but it's still painful at times.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
I know. I tell that to my knees. Well, thank
you so much for taking the time to talk with me.
We are going to get into young Warren Mathis and
how Bubba Sparks was born. But first I wanted to
start with the Ugly music video. I feel like that
was such a moment that took the world by storm,
(04:05):
and I wanted to hear about your experience with it.
It was directed by Mark Klassfield, and it is so
ahead of its time. Do you remember first getting the
concept for it?
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yeah, well, back.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
In those days, it was a lot more of a
production than videos are now because technology hadn't involved as much.
So basically, like that whole crew of like twenty people
came from la to Athens, Georgia, where I.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Was living at the time.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Yeah, for like two weeks. You know, I had a
big budget. I was on interscope, you know, I had
the Timberland Co sign and so they had all financial
cannons firing behind me at the time. And I didn't
realize what a blessing and gift that was until much later.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
But yeah, I thought it was just what everybody gets, I.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Guess, right, right, But yeah, and it was actually kind
of a tug of war because I I didn't want
to go quite as look real culture was captured in
the video, but at times I felt it was a
kind of a tug of war because I didn't want
it to quite go as sticky, and I didn't want
(05:09):
it to seem like we were making fun of country folks,
you know what I'm saying. So I wanted to present
it in a much cooler way, you know what I'm saying.
And it was just kind of that tug of war.
But I think it worked out in the end, because
I think if we had done it more the way
that I wanted to do it, me kind of being
too cool for school and trying to present like this,
(05:30):
you know, just more serious. You know, it really didn't
fit the song, and I don't think it would have
been as successful. But when I first saw the video,
I remember I had went into Jimmy Ivan's office when
they had the first we first got the rough edit back,
and Doug Morris, who was the head of like the
whole Universal System at the time, was in there and.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
He was watching.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
He was like, Jimmy, what in the hell is this?
And we were just all sitting there watching like, yeah,
you know, it was just well because it forced a response,
you know what I'm saying it was very you know,
you you you you weren't just gonna watch that video
and be like, oh, that's cool.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
You know what I'm saying it just love it or
hate it.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Either way, it was gonna it was gonna force a
defined emotion about it.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
So, yeah, it was a cool deal. And I was
very grateful for that song. And once again, you know,
I come into the industry with a record like that,
you know, number one on t r L, number one on.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
One on sixth and Park, number one in urban radio,
and and I probably it caused me to take that
for granted moving forward and not understand just how precious
that really was.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Yeah, well, right before it becomes a success. There you are,
your first song's about to come out on Nerscope, and
you are racing tractors with missy elliots. When is the
moment you knew this is going to be big?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Probably that day when I actually saw the video, because
I was so green to the whole experience. You know,
I never shot a video before, and I remember being
so nervous the morning, like because you know, back in
those days, like it was like a full like maybe
two and a half day shoot, like starting at like
six am and going to like ten or eleven at night, and.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
I just remember just it was also cluttered in my head.
You know, I didn't really I.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Just I knew we did some cool stuff, but I
just couldn't imagine what it would look like.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
And I was so nervous about how I would look
on camera. You know.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
It's kind of like the compounded version of like when
you hate your voice when you hear it.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
You know, it's like you're definitely gonna hate the way you.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Look on camera, you know what I'm saying, Especially me,
you know, I was I was kind of heavier back then,
and you know what they say, the camera adds about fifty.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Pounds and then you get to stand in a mudpit
with wild pigs.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Yeah, well that you know, I did grow up on
a farm and we did have pigs, so that, you know,
once again, we embellished it a little bit running around chasing.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
I mean, it was just but.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
That was really my crew and and we had a
good time doing it, and we had bizarre from D twelve. Yeah,
and that that that actually helped the video a lot too,
because because they were hot as firecrackers at the time,
you know, Eminem D twelve obviously, and and I know
a lot of people were probably wondering how Eminem was
(08:31):
going to embrace it and and and having him in
that video, you know, was I think it it? I
think he was our only celebrity. Well we had to
Timberline obviously and missing But as far as like outside
and Rico Way God bless it did from organized Noise
was in the video, who was a mentor of mine
(08:52):
and one of my heroes, and and but as far as.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Like people not in our camp, you know, I mean,
and that was cool. We came down there and just
did it, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
And once again I just thought everybody in the industry
was that cool, you know, and me and the large
super were super cool to this day.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Oh man, that's such a great story. How did life
change for you once the video hit TRL?
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Man? It was crazy.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I remember the first time I had like a like
a what the hell is going on?
Speaker 4 (09:26):
Moment?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
It was somewhere around that time because I was in
New York for about six weeks.
Speaker 4 (09:32):
Around that time. They just had me based there because
most of the media outlets are you know, are in
New York.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
And we were doing all kinds of stuff, and I
remember Georgia was playing Tennessee and football. You know, I'm
a huge University of Georgia football fan.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
And it was like we went to our hotel was.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Right around Times Square, but we walked to the TGI
Fridays and Times Square and we're sitting there like at
the bar or whatever, watching the game, going crazy, and
we're just all in our like me and the guy
that was my assistant at the time, guy named Jeremiah
Man shout out to Jeremiah and and we're sitting there just.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
Watching the game and we're like in fan mode.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
We're not even thinking about Bubba Sparks or anything like that,
you know. And we were walking back to the hotel
and you know, there's always just bustling, you know, pit
pedestrian traffic in Times Square, and somebody said that's him,
and I just remember hearing that, but it didn't register
(10:31):
at the times you know, yeah exactly.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
I was looking around, like who they're.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Talking about, and and then somebody said, yeah, that's Bubba
Sparks and my boys, like they're talking about you, and
I was like, and people just started chasing after me.
I didn't have security. I got security after that but
I didn't have security. I wasn't even you know, it's
such a.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
Surreal deal, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
And and yeah, it was crazy, you know, and and
just that because I really did come from where I
presented myself as having come from, you know, I was
really transplanting from.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
A you know, a dirt road to Times Square. And
so it was. And I didn't handle it the best,
you know, don't.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I don't know how many people would be able to
handle such an abrupt transition, you know, with grace.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
It wasn't a humility issue. I just didn't.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
There was just a lot of hard lessons that I
had to learn about the music industry and life and
just and and I was kind of learning on the fly,
you know. But it was an incredible time. I wouldn't
trade it for anything. And it almost, you know, it
was twenty five years ago, you know, I almost it
almost seems like another.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Life sometimes, like another lifetime, you know.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
But it was really cool, and I'm extremely blessed to
have been able to travel that path.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
You were at our tight end and linebacker on the
football team when you were in high school. Was it
your dream to play for the NFL?
Speaker 3 (12:08):
I wanted to play college football at a big school
my like my childhood best friend.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
He was a great football player. I was a good
high school football player.
Speaker 3 (12:17):
You know, but he was a great one of the
top one hundred most highly recruited players in the country,
you know, in high school the year he came out,
could have went anywhere, ended up going to Georgia. And
and you know, I guess I kind of always you know,
to to kind of start touching on like the team experience.
For me, I always kind of felt like maybe I
(12:39):
was in his shadow a little bit.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
I was never jealous or envious.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
I always celebrated his success, and I think that prepared
me for my own success journey later, just.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Learning how to how to pomp pom other people, you
know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
And and but you know, I always I was a
good high school football player, But I you know, when
you kind of that's that's known as my best friend
in football. High school football is so serious down where
I come from. It's Friday night lights, yeah vibes and
and yeah, football is probably still to this day my
(13:14):
first love. Honestly, if I love music as much as
I love football, it might be having a different conversation
right now, you know. But I was just I loved music,
don't get me wrong, but I was just really good
at it.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
It just came natural to me.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
And I always kind of wish that football he came
that natural to me, but you know, that just wasn't
in the cards, and it was what it was.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
And the journey is is the journey. So but yeah,
I love football. I really do.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Like it's a cultural like it's so ingrained in the culture,
like growing up where.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
I grew up, and man, I love it.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
I still keep up with my my high school football team,
like shoot, even baseball, like they're in the state baseball
playoffs right now. I caught myself like it was the
Braves player or saw checking the score you know, the
other day.
Speaker 4 (14:05):
You know. But that's just kind of how we grew up.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You know, how rural is Troop County. I know it's
near Lagrange, but I'm trying to figure out how much
you're even hearing rap music as.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
A cat well Lagrange itself, especially at this point. Less
So when I was growing up, there's a town of
about fifty thousand people.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
There's only like sixty.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Miles from Atlanta, so the actual town, but see you
have to remember, I grew up in.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
The suburbs of Lagrange, So I grew up about twenty
more minutes north of Lagrange.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Out in the country, Okay, And honestly, the town itself is.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
It's kind of.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Suffered from some of the same eels that America, you know,
particularly kind of impoverished areas. There's a lot of there's
violence there now, gun violence, not just like you know,
methadic shooting their you know, their their brothers or something
like that, but like street gang violence, you know. And
(15:08):
because where I grew up was basically fifty percent black,
fifty white, and really nobody much had anything except for
like that small percentage of the people that owned everything,
you know type deal. But I think that's probably a lot.
While we took so much pride in football too, because
it was one of the things that you know, allowed
(15:28):
us to escape that that that perception of that existence.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
So right, you know, your dad was a school bus driver.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
It was everybody knows Jimmy Mathews. That's that. People come
up to me all the time. I rode your daddy
school bus.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
That must be so special to make meet people who
knew your dad.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
Well, what special is because you know, we we we've
always had a you know, traditional southern men type relationship.
You know, didn't talk much about feelings or and uh
and when I talk to people, they say, he would
play your songs, he had so much, he was so
proud of you. And I hear that stuff, and that
that makes me feel good because you know, he's never
(16:22):
really voiced that to me. You know, I mean, he
said he's proud of me. But I'm saying, like, as
far as he would never reveal to me that he.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
Was ever that excited about.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Anything I did, because he didn't. He didn't agree and
with good reason. He didn't agree with with me pursuing
a career in music, you know what I'm saying, Because.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
I mean, come on, I grew up where I grew up.
When I grew up there.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
And me being a white boy from the country that
was that was telling people he was gonna make it
as a rapper.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
They would have sooner believed believe me.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
If I told him I was gonna be an astronaut
and be the first human to walk on Pluto. You
know what I'm saying, it would have been more unbelievable, right,
And so, uh yeah, he kind of felt like it
was a fool's errand to some degree, and that I should.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
You know, he really wanted.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
Me to because I would have been the first person
in my college in my family at the time to
get a college degree, and so he really wanted me
to get that. I guess that generation kind of just
thought that a college degree like earned you you know,
that was like a ticket to like the club or something,
and you were going to be straight for life or something,
you know, and we know now that's not the case.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
And plus I didn't know.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
I didn't have a plan, you know, So it's kind
of tough when you try to go to I went
to some junior colleges and stuff, and when you when
you try to, like, you know, do the college thing,
but you really don't have a vision for it. Like
I was kind of just going in circles. And then
and then you know, the music thing happened and kind
of bailed me out.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Your mom was also a grocery store cashier. Were either
of them musical? How did you decide to start rapping?
Speaker 4 (17:58):
All? Right?
Speaker 3 (17:59):
So I did come from a I have My mother
and father each had a boy and a girl from
a previous marriage, and then they got together and I
was the only child they had together. But my mother's
son and daughter that she brought to the situation lived
(18:19):
with me and my other brother. They lived with their
mom in Atlanta, so and I saw them pretty regularly.
But so I had one brother who was Iron Maiden
is his favorite band of all time. He loved like
eight like heavy metal and I mean like passionately now
(18:39):
and shout out.
Speaker 4 (18:40):
To my brother Russ. But he never spoke to me.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Like I would try to get with I stepped and
watch head Banger's Ball with him on Saturday nights on MTV,
and you know, and I would try to because even
my older brother and I wanted his approval and I
wanted his validation, and so you know, I would I
would try to get with it, but it just never
really spoke to me. Then my other brother that lived
(19:05):
in Atlanta, that was my dad's son. He was into
like Parliament funk like just as just as intensely. You know,
George Clinton cameo and my father loved traditional country like
George Jones is his favorite singer ever, Conway Tweety, you know,
Whale and Jens people like that, and and I have.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
Great memories of certain songs.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Now when I look back, you know, in retrospect at
growing up and me and my dad in the hay field,
you know, or going for a ride on Sunday, and
I'll hear songs that we used to listen to and
it sparks nostalgia now.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
But at the time, it was just like turn this
shit off.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
But to be honest, and my mother and my sister
were kind of just pop music fans. But my mother
loves to dance, like she loves to dance, So maybe
that's where I got, you know, some of.
Speaker 4 (20:01):
The rhythm from.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
But music never mattered to me until I heard n
w A you know, end up that Era two Live Crew.
It just spoke to me in a whole different way.
But when Outcasts came out, you know, they were really
they were no really to it. They were the first group, them,
the Dungeon Family, that was the first, first movement that
(20:28):
really just encapsulated Atlanta and even in a greater sense, Georgia.
And I was like, wow, that's how you represent Georgia
from their perspective. How do I need to represent Georgia
from from my perspective?
Speaker 4 (20:42):
You know?
Speaker 3 (20:43):
And so I started on the journey to tinker and
then just figure trying to figure it out.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
You know, I love that in your family, you had
three boys, and three those three boys all had very
distinct musical sounds that they loved so much that they
were all so passionate about. You know, that's really special.
And then your dad. I guess, technically four four men
in the family, and you're that and each of you
had your own love.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
And but but no one else is like my brother's music.
The guy that looked, the one that loved heavy metal,
he repulsed the Greater Home community. But when I started playing,
somebody saying hey, it kind of went to New Heights,
you know, people being like, turn net ship off.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
How did you come upon the name Bubba Sparks? And
did it always have three x's?
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Well all right, so me and a guy from the
so Bubba was kind of something that people just call me.
It's kind of like in the South, it's like dude,
like you know, you know, it's just it's just a
general term, you know. And and and I felt like
that name.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
Kind of.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
It's just kind of encompassed everything that I was trying
to trying to represent, because you know, people. Some people
have tried to imply that there's like a negative racial
connotation to it. I know more black bubbles than I
do white bubbles, you know what, And like so I
felt like it was a balanced representation. And so and
then we couldn't I knew. I remember thinking like names endure,
(22:26):
like full names endure, I think more than if I
just came up with a name like soda, Sola pop
or something, you know, like you know what I mean.
Like I mean not to say that there aren't plenty
of iconic people ice cube too short, But I was, like,
you know, already feeling like maybe people were not gonna
take it as serious.
Speaker 4 (22:45):
I wanted to just I don't know.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I just always envisioned it being like an actual first
and last name. And and me and Shannon Houchin is
the guy that was uh that had Eleventh Hour, which
was the initial production company I was signed to when
we signed with Interscope. He and I are trying to
figure out and remember the old Rodney Dangerfield movie Wally Sparks.
Speaker 4 (23:11):
Yes, so his kids had a bunch of DVDs.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
This is back during like the DVD DVR era, and
so he's just going through DVD and he says, what
about bubble Sparks And it came from Wally Sparks then
and then I was like, yeah, but what's spelled with
three exes? I wasn't thinking about the triple x, you know,
pornography angle of it. I was thinking more about three
(23:39):
xes represents like fire. That's like the like the best
of the best Moonshine.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Okay, yes, like three skull and crossbones.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
So when does Jimmy Iovine hear your music and then
does he fly you out to LA to sign you?
What was that?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
I think my first ever plane ride. I couldn't sleep
the night the heart didn't sleep a wink the whole
night before. I was so nervous, not about going to
meet with Jimmy Ivan, but about getting on the airplane.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
And that's what the intro to my first album.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Is is is is partially about, you know, just it's
called takeoff, and it's like just talking about those nervous
feelings but also like as being a metaphor for like
having those same feelings about taking off this in that industry.
But yeah, so Gerardo Mahea Rico Swabe Yes was the
(24:52):
first ever artists released on Interscope Records with Recall Ye Yes,
and and he.
Speaker 4 (25:01):
He went double platinum, and that kind of got him
in the door. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
That guy got them a foothold in the industry where
they continue.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
And so Jimmy was.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
Always very He took care of Gerardo and was always
you know, always.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
Paid that well up until a certain point. They don't
ask me to hear them of that. But so.
Speaker 3 (25:23):
He was specialized more in Latin music, like Enrique Glacis.
He signed and Rique Glaciers to interest Go a couple
of other things. And so he had gotten my project
and he was a champion of it. He loved it.
But he the only thing is when he's trying to
take it to him, you know, to the to the
higher ups, like not necessarily Jimmy, but more Steve Stout
(25:44):
was kind of the hip hop gate keeper, thehead of
black music at that time, and and and he just
didn't nobody was really checking for, you know, another white
wrapper quite that soon after Eminem but also you know,
Arnold was just more known for Latin music. So they're like,
why are you trying to bring hip hop back? And
(26:06):
but eventually he went straight to Jimmy with it, and
Jimmy got it pretty much instantly, you know. And when
I signed with and they flew aside out and and
made an offer, and it was it was it turned
out because you know, it's kind of like once the
industry learns the Inner.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Scope offered this white Rapper deal, and then you're back
in those days.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
Your lawyer would shop all these deals, and the words
starts getting out, and everybody wants you, wants you, you know.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
I remember we went to dream Works back when dream
Works was was was.
Speaker 3 (26:39):
I don't I don't even think that's they're they're actually
active as a record label anymore.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
But and and we.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
Went over there and they made a lot of sweet
promises and offered a lot more money, and I was like,
why was out here?
Speaker 4 (26:51):
You know, I'm telling the guys I'm with, you know,
and they're like, no, we're gonna go to New York.
Weren't meet with all these other people. And so we
met with Deaf.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Jam and Loud and and and Sony. I mean, we
met with everybody, and everybody was in and Interscope had
the lowest offer, and everybody hated on Interscope because they
were like they're just gonna just trying to shelf you
because you know, to make sure you're never a threat
to Eminem.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
And I'm like, that just doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
I was encouraged because that showed me that the success
they had when Eminem showed me that they knew how
to do it and they weren't scared, you know, and
and so and plus I felt I felt indebted too,
because Jimmy was the first person and.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Jimmy believed in me far, far, far greater.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Than he was ever rewarded, you know what I'm saying saying,
But I used to I didn't. I didn't understand why
he believed in me the way he did, but he
really did.
Speaker 4 (27:50):
And I'm forever indebted to that man.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Even though things didn't necessarily work out on the level
that that we all had hoped for. Man, that guy
believed in me, and he gave me every opportunity. And
I probably didn't earn a lot of those opportunities, especially
like you know, I was struggling with addiction at that time,
(28:16):
and you know, I just probably didn't fulfill my end
of the bargain in a lot of ways. But man,
that God loved me and believed in me for sure,
and he connected me with.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Timberland and what was that like, did you two see Jimmy.
Speaker 4 (28:31):
Jimmy knew he was only something with the Eminem and
Drake thing, you know what.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
I'm saying, Like, because people have a whole different view
on what a white rapper it means at this point
in time. If you remember that climate back there, you know,
I know, you know somebody who.
Speaker 4 (28:49):
Was was a rapper on a white rapper on air
scope and uh and so.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
You know, it was it was just a whole different
environment people after kind of after the Vanilla Ice thing,
there was like a ten year period where nobody was
checking for white rappers, you know, and so then Eminem
comes and it's like what but as a as a
white rapper, you kind of looked at it like, well,
it was only gonna ever be one more, you know, And.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
He just did it, and they did it.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
But Jimmy knew he was on THEO something would find
a credible black producer and have him stamp the white
white rapper, make sure they can see my pretty face
and and so yeah, he and he tried to put
me with Swiss Beats first, you know, he was kind
of shopping the white boy, you know, and.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Swiss was super cool.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
We made some decent music, but we just didn't really
have that chemistry. I don't think he quite understood culturally
what I was going for and being from New York,
and he he appreciated the fact that was a true
m seeing that that the hip hop side, but I
don't think he understood the country cultural side of it,
you know what I mean. And and then you know,
(30:08):
I was always very close with Organized Noise where we
go Waite Uh, Sleepy Brown and Ray Murray Uh. You
know they they're they're with the producers of Outcasts and
they were home team, but they were kind of going
through a transition and I worked with him and they
produced songs on every one.
Speaker 4 (30:26):
Of my albums.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
But yeah, I probably would have loved for them to
have been the Stampers, you know what I'm saying. But
but they were just transitioning in different ways at that time,
and it really wasn't feasible. And then he said, what
about Timberland. He said, I'm meeting with him tonight. I said, Jimmy,
that would be perfect, that would be perfect.
Speaker 4 (30:48):
Like.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Soul, you know what I mean and and then you know,
he he called me about two or three hours later
and he was like, you need to get out here.
Speaker 4 (31:00):
First thing in the morning.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Tim was like, you ain't no white, you ain't no
white war And I was like, what is he talking about.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
He's like, he doesn't believe you're white. He's got to
see you.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
And I was like, all right, I'm on the way
and the rest is history. When I got out there,
he was like, that's crazy. That's crazy that you make
the sounds out of your mouth, but you look the
way you look.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
So you guys just hit it off right off the bat.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
Yeah, we did, especially musically. You know, Timberland is just
and that once again, you know, that's another guy that
believed in me. You know when before I really couldn't
see it.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
You know.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
It's like I'm a bring alcoholic and addict, and part
of like what the disease of addiction is all about,
it is like as addicts, we kind of carry around
this emptiness inside of not feeling like we're worthy or
you know, feel like we just don't fit in or
if people knew the real us, they wouldn't like us.
And I think me being a white rapper, even though
I worked double time to try always make sure that
(32:01):
I was portraying authentically who I was and where I
was from and what that was all about, because I
felt that to be in line with the core principles
of hip hop. You know, I think that it kind
of just fed into the imposter syndrome.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
And I just it was like, not like as far
as like my talent or what I'm doing, but.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
If these people knew the real me, they would know
I'm a fraud, like like as a human, not as like,
you know, my talent or like what I'm representing or
anything like that.
Speaker 4 (32:31):
But I just, you know, I kind.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
Of always carried those those feelings around, and unfortunately, drugs
and alcohol became a solution that kind of quieted that
beast for a long time until it until it turned
on me in a major way. And and uh yeah,
but but Tim Is he was great man, you know
he was.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
And once again, I probably let him down in a
lot of ways also.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
But we did some great things and and man, I'll
be eternally grateful.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
Nobody could have ever taught me more.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Uh, there's not a studio session that I have today
where at some point, I don't reference something that that
Timberland told me or taught me. And the same could
be said for Rico Wade also and mister Colin Park
who produced Miss.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
Newboody later on. Yeah, I was just blessed to you know,
Polo to don There's people that I was post with
and that I worked with the just are real giants
in this thing, like the real deal.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
Like there's a lot of people get propped up by
publicity and and you know, but I was blessed to
really be around some guys that was a genuine article
when it comes to really being talented and really being
committed to their craft.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
I love that you are now so open about your
struggles with addiction, and I want to talk about how
you're giving back now. But when did drug use or
alcohol become a problem for you? At what stage of
your career did that start to happen?
Speaker 4 (33:58):
You know, and we're we're talking about with teen years.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
What's funny about that is I played football, and me
and my best friend who's also a recovering addict, the
guy I've been talking about it played for Georgia and
me played in the NFL for seven years and and
we we looked down on people that did drugs, you know,
like in high school and didn't drink and party on
weekends because we were so serious about football. But I
remember spring break my junior year of high school. We
(34:22):
went to Panama City Beach, Florida, Reteneck Riviera, and which
is like four hours from where I grew up, and
that was like our what do you call it, our
right up passage, you know, and we get down there
and we're.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
Like, we might as well have drink. Everybody's drinking, we
might as well drink. And we each funneled twelve zemas.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Oh and oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
I spent five or six hours, you know, like in
the bathroom praying to the porcelain God, sleep, you know,
passed out in my own vomit that that happened.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
But I remember a thirty minute window, maybe an hour, where.
Speaker 3 (34:59):
It was like all those feelings subsided, you know what
I mean, Like I felt peace.
Speaker 4 (35:04):
I felt connected, I felt like, wow, I get it.
We were the lanes. We should have been doing this
the whole time, you know, And it just kind.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Of gradually went from there to the point where, you know,
even even into my forties, you know, I've had a
back and forth journey with recovery, but yeah, it ended up.
You know, it's crazy. I look back at like the
kid I was, you know, and it's like I kind
of robbed him a lot of ways. But also I
(35:39):
don't know if I would have been able without alcohol
and drugs to some degree, even though drugs bring about
just maximum unmanageability in your life, Like it's you know,
there are no social cracksmokers, there are no social matthewsers.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Or heroin addicts.
Speaker 3 (35:57):
You know, there are social drinkers, you know, and you know,
I'm not sure that without alcohol specifically, I would have
been able to overcome the self centered fear I was
talking about and done all the things that I that.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
I was able to do, you know, with my with
my career.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
But it's a double edged sword because then later in
life I also everything that that that I earned or
was you know, given to me, I ended up giving
it back to drugs and I've called so you know,
it is what it is. But you know, I'm just
grateful to have peace in my life today because that's
(36:37):
really all I've ever been looking for. It.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, how do you think you juggled same while also
battling addiction.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Well my addiction most of like the last fifteen years,
I'd say, even though I've been sober a year and
a half this.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Time, congratulations, but thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
That's a big deal for me, and it is. It
is by God's grace, I can assure you that. But
my addiction had isolated me to such a degree.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
More what I went through with my addiction was just
being isolated from family and friends. I went two years
without talking to anybody in my family. My best friend
I've been talking about this whole time I went. I
talked to him like four times in ten years. And
you know, that's just that's what it does, you know,
as the progressive nature of the disease, you know, it
(37:36):
just further further isolates you, you know.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
And so I spent a lot of time.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
A lot of people could speculate about what I was
doing because they didn't see me, or I might not
look the best when.
Speaker 4 (37:49):
You did see me. But I got off the grid,
you know what I'm saying, to do my thing.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
So it's not like I was one of those artists
that was just out here driving around and just you know,
and and doing all I did have some public I
had a public arrest in Florida that was pretty embarrassing
at a Hooters coincidentally, and you know that that was
probably the most public thing that ever happened to me
(38:14):
in my addiction.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
But but yeah, like.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
I said, I was just I like to get the
hell out of the way, you know, when I when
I was doing my thing, and and yeah, so that
probably cut down on a lot of the you know,
the the fame colliding with with the struggles I was having.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
And most of my worst struggles, to be honest, were past.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
The period of my mainstream notoriety, you know, so to speak.
And you know, because like during the ugly times, like
you know, my first two albums, I was there were
some repercussions and consequences of my drinking and using some
you know, career wise, but for the most part, it
(38:59):
was still just the party stage.
Speaker 4 (39:01):
You know, I'm experiencing all these great things. I'm having
a great time.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Then when he got to the New Booty Time, I
had developed an opiate addiction and the isolation period had
had commenced, and you.
Speaker 4 (39:14):
Know a lot of great things.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
You know, performing on the Jay Leno Show, you know
that was such a big record to the New Booty thing,
and you.
Speaker 4 (39:22):
Know, just I had all my I had kind of.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Cut my crew down to like my real friends at
that time, and they're out there having a blast, you.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
Know, we're hanging out with the entourage as you know,
in l A and just you know.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
But I'm I'm being a weirdo my hotel room because
I'm so tweaked or whatever, you know. And because I
went to treatment for the first time shortly after that,
you know, the New Booty time, and so like eight
and and it was from from there I just kind
of slowly started like fading from the mainstream constance and
(40:05):
and and it directly coincided with with the progression of
my of my addiction, you know. So it was it
was the reason I was fading was because of my
addiction and because of drugs and alcohol in large measure.
But it also the fact that I was fading made
me less of a topic than anybody wanted to focus. Also,
(40:27):
I got just you know, the more, the uh significant
the fading was, the more peace.
Speaker 4 (40:34):
I could just have it, go do my thing, you know.
Speaker 5 (40:36):
So yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
I want to talk about deliverance because I will hoot
and holler about this album to anyone willing to listen.
What was your mindset going in to your second album?
Were you nervous at all about a sophomore slump type
of situation.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
Let me sell you something.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
Had it been up to me, Deliverance would have never existed, because, well,
you gotta think, now Ugly comes out, it's a huge
club urban record. I wanted to my second album because
you got to think that I had we ready with Archie,
I had, I had the Jadakiss record. So I'm kind
(41:29):
of like on more of a trajectory to do something
that that maybe Eminem hadn't even done. I was very
clear on the pecking order at that point. But I
was like Eminem never really like had club hits and
was doing his thing, you know, like like in the hood.
(41:50):
You know, people were actually you know, riding around bumping
my shit in the hood, you know at that time, and.
Speaker 4 (41:57):
Being from Atlanta, that meant a lot.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
I was very did and you know, I grew up
outside of Atlanta, but the Atlanta community had accepted me
and embraced me. You know, that meant a lot, and
so I wanted to continue on that path and still
to this day, looking back on it, I think we
probably would have been more commercially successful with the second album.
Have we Have we gone that direction? I was thinking
(42:20):
this when Little John's going crazy, I'm thinking, I get
Timberland produced half the album and a few from organizing
is getting Little John to produce two or three and
go get features from t I And you know what
I'm saying, No more in that direction, which short term
would have been the better route to take, I do believe.
(42:40):
But one record changed it all that Timberland basically just
made goofing around. It's called Coming Around, and it's a
sample of the young It's a sample of the younger
Mountain Stream band. And we did that record and Jimmy
Maths I think was the other one where we kind
(43:02):
of first stumbled into that.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Sound and Tim being the mad genius that he is
and just really enjoying.
Speaker 3 (43:11):
He was just like geeking out on it on the
trick of making this country shit be jamming, you know
what I'm saying. And once he realized after we did
Coming Around, that I could that I could.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
Paint the perfect pictures over those tracks.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
And then it was like, man, this could be really
big dude, like, you know, this.
Speaker 4 (43:30):
Could be like this is our shot to sell ten million, yes,
you know, but and so we went with it.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
You know, we went with it and abandoned the whod
That's why if you'll notice that that album was commercially unsuccessful.
Speaker 4 (43:46):
We got fired from Innerscope for a variety of reasons.
Then I go over here do this big deal with
big Boy in Virgin You know how.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
I came back the next time like I was like,
I'm not making that mistake again.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
Yep, you know, like Mama's got a house, you know,
like we got to go.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
And that is when you release Miss New Booty, technically
your biggest song, and man it still gets played so
much now for all new generations to enjoy. You had
been through so much at this point, and you are
still writing and putting out another smash? Did that record
(44:25):
always just feel big?
Speaker 3 (44:27):
I knew the night we recorded it what it was,
and I'm grateful eternally because it was a survival mechanism,
trust me. Like I had put out two singles that
are Timberland record and an Organized Noise record with Pete
Poplo and Sleepy Brown on it, like as kind of
like tester singles prior to putting out this new booty,
(44:51):
and they didn't, you know, back then it was so
people take for granted the fact that now it's so
easy to access such a such a vast array of
fans and to access your audience directly. Back then, if
you weren't on the radio, like literally, there were full
ways people received and consume music, live shows, CDs, the radio, And.
Speaker 4 (45:20):
All right, maybe there's three.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
All right, so there's one more though, but anyway and
O MTV and BT, Yes, TV that was the fourth one.
And so if you couldn't make you had to make
music that And you think, at any given time, what
are there forty songs that are.
Speaker 4 (45:38):
Like viable, right right.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
So if you didn't have one of those songs, then
chances are you weren't going to be played on a
MTV or BT, And so you had to make it fit.
Speaker 4 (45:51):
And that's where we lost with Deliverance. Deliverance is a
testament delivers the single.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
The single success is a testament to how great the
record Will was and how powerful Innerscope was, you know
what I'm saying, Like the fact that they made that
record go top ten at a time when the whole
world is crunk.
Speaker 4 (46:09):
Deliverance is coming on in between.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Get Low by the Little Y Yang Twins and you know,
and and fifty Cent, you know what I'm saying, and
so you know, and it's so stuck out like a
sore thumb. So the fact that even performed as well
as it did commercially is just mind blowing. At that time,
it could have been very boutiquey and very like underground,
(46:33):
you know.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
Like.
Speaker 3 (46:36):
But then so when it was time to go back
in and like I said, I had two I was too.
They gave me like a million dollars at uh at
Virgin and Big Boy a million dollars, and then we
still had like a million dollars to make the album
with Wow. But we were two strikes down because back then,
you know, you would put out a single. Now you
(46:56):
just throw out a song every every Friday or whatever,
but back then it require a little more. And so
we put out these two songs and we're two strikes.
We're in a two strike hole. Yeah, and it's like
this is like my last shot in the industry, you
know what I'm saying. Like there was no go be
independent and put put out your own music. Then it
was like back to the factory in Truth County, you know.
(47:18):
And and so so Eddie Weathers skeuter Rock who Jermaine
Dupre had taken over black music at Virgin at this time,
so they kind of came up with the idea for
me to go in with mster Colle Park with DJ Smurf,
you know, who produced.
Speaker 4 (47:35):
All the Enyane Twins stuff.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
And man, I am eternally grateful to that man and
to the Twins because he and I come up with
this song the first night we go into the studio.
Speaker 4 (47:46):
With this idea and.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
He's like, we got to get the Twins on this,
and they were hot as like yeah, the middle of
the sun at that time, you know what I man,
And I was like, if they'll do it, man, yeah,
and and and when I kind of felt like it
was a hit, like just the night we did it
and we had the basic idead now, but then when
the Twins got on it, it was like so.
Speaker 4 (48:14):
But also I didn't.
Speaker 3 (48:17):
You know, when you do things for to survive out
of survival, it's a little bit of a double edged sword.
Because I didn't know that my obviously I couldn't have
predicted at that time that my life is gonna completely
come unglued in the period following that song, and that
was going to end up even above Ugly and Deliverance,
Like in a pop culture sense, that was gonna be
(48:37):
the song that I was kind of defined by, which
is a little tragic to me, you know, because the
story is so much more, you know, and that and
I feel like if I had been able in a
place where I could have just come back and followed
up with another record, you know, that it would have
just been a chapter rather than like kind of looked
(48:58):
at to some people. And you know, the funny thing
about New Booty is, initially when we did this song,
it was it was based on the movie Players Club,
and New Booty was like Miss new Booty was like
the new girl working at the strip club, and that
was that was what the song was originally created from,
from the spirit of that. But then what happens over
(49:19):
the twenty teens and into the twenty twenties, actual New
Booties bbs, it starts to become a thing, So that
gave it like another life, you know.
Speaker 4 (49:31):
So it's crazy. I mean, the.
Speaker 3 (49:34):
Song is just as culturally relevant today as it was
twenty years ago, and it's amazing, you know when.
Speaker 2 (49:41):
You hear Jelly Roll or Chaboozie or post Malone. Now
is it crazy to see how connected country and rap
has become. And do you still see yourself as ahead
of your time as I do?
Speaker 4 (49:55):
Well, I don't think any. I mean, Jelly Roll has
a history as a rapper, but I don't. I don't really,
you know. I saw a.
Speaker 3 (50:01):
List of top country rappers that had Jelly Roll number
one and had Shaboozie number two, and.
Speaker 4 (50:07):
I was like, like, jelly is a hell of.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
A rapper, Like he has a history as a rapper,
but what has made him successful is not rapping.
Speaker 4 (50:16):
He does not there's no hip hop involved in it
at all.
Speaker 3 (50:19):
Yeah, and much respect to Posty and Shaboozi. I don't
know if he used to be a rapper or whatever,
But I do country hip hop and there's not still
to this day, there's not a lot of other people
doing that. And what it really should be called is
hip hop country because the hip hop comes first.
Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:39):
And and you know you talk about like Big crit
you know, bun Be, Yellow Wolf Rits, I mean, would
Struggle Jenny's.
Speaker 4 (50:48):
There are some people that do something similar to what
I do.
Speaker 3 (50:53):
You know, people that represent some country culture but also
are like truly cheer about the craft of MC and
and and the founding principles of hip hop and where
hip hop comes from. Yeah, and posting. I love post Malone.
I just don't like his country music, but I respect
his right.
Speaker 4 (51:13):
To do it. Yeah, you know, do what you want
to do. You know, I don't. I'm not. I'm not
judging that.
Speaker 3 (51:19):
But also as a consumer and as a fan, I
can say or you know what I'm saying, that's.
Speaker 4 (51:25):
Just what I like.
Speaker 2 (51:27):
Well, you are still performing and releasing new music all
the time. What is the biggest difference in the way
you approach your art now?
Speaker 3 (51:37):
Well, now I'm trying to as I've gotten sober, you know,
and I've got music industry trauma, you know, the spills
over into like just.
Speaker 4 (51:50):
My broader view of music in general. So I was slow.
Speaker 3 (51:55):
To kickstart my creativity again when I got sober.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
It's getting a lot better.
Speaker 3 (52:04):
I kind of just decided that I was just going
to focus on sobriety and trust that process, you know,
the twelve step process and all and and kind of
leave the other stuff up to the universe or God
or however you want to look at that. And it's
it's worked well for me.
Speaker 4 (52:24):
You know. I'm grateful and blessed to.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Be able to still do you know, a good number
of shows and make a pretty good living doing that.
Speaker 4 (52:33):
And that's kind of just like living off.
Speaker 3 (52:36):
The old stuff, you know what I mean, which is
cool because there's really no pressure in that. It's kind
of like I just go watch a movie, you know,
when I go do it.
Speaker 4 (52:43):
And because I work at a treatment center. I work
at a treatment center here in Utah where I.
Speaker 3 (52:48):
Live, and yeah, I'm very active in service out here
and trying to you know, carry a message of hope
to addicts and alcoholics who are still suffering. And and
that means a lot to me. And that's probably my
first mission in life right now. And because it was
about me for a long time, yeah, you know, and
(53:10):
and it and it being about me kind of just
didn't turn out too well for me. And it works
better when I seem to like think about others and
think about what I can do to pack into the
stream of life and maybe help somebody else.
Speaker 4 (53:23):
It's weird how it works because that kind of ends
up helping me.
Speaker 3 (53:29):
And and yeah, but but I still am you know,
when I when I go to create now, I don't
like even up to like forty something years old, Like
I woke up every day thinking about creating music, you know,
and it was easier to do that in addiction. It's
like when I'm when I'm an active addiction, my whole
(53:50):
life is burning down around me, right, and people are
so worried about me. But I'm a peace because because
I'm in firing creatively, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
But then the flip side of that is, but the
whole res you know.
Speaker 3 (54:05):
Unfortunately we need the rest of the other parts of
our life, your help and money, and you know we
need those things. But then I get sober and every
other area of my life is blossoming. My spirit is blossoming,
but I'm not inspired creatively, you know what I'm saying.
So it's just kind of and so I've just been
(54:27):
striving to try to find that balance, you know, so
when I don't really wake up every day, and plus
I just aged out of it to some degree, even
though I am a lifelong music man, like it's in me,
not on me. But I enjoy taking trips to Louisville,
where where my manager and a person I create music with,
(54:48):
Dusty Lee, lives and he has a studio at his house.
I enjoyed going there once every three or four months
and locking in for a few days and working on
music and trying to, you know, get reinspired with it.
That's fun. It's like going on vacation or something, you know,
Whereas that's really not the.
Speaker 4 (55:07):
Core of my life. It is, right point.
Speaker 2 (55:09):
You know, how long what's the longest period of time
you've ever been sober?
Speaker 4 (55:13):
Right now? Well?
Speaker 3 (55:14):
No, I was actually sober for seventeen years, okay, yeah,
and then I turned seventeen.
Speaker 2 (55:24):
Right, Okay, those first seventeen years, I get it, you know,
I do. I want to tell you because I as
someone who hasn't had a sip of alcohol in eight years,
it took me a long time.
Speaker 3 (55:39):
Probably.
Speaker 2 (55:41):
Four years, four to five years of not drinking anything
before I felt like I knew who I was in
social situations and in fun situations without having that crutch.
And it was like every time there was a wedding
to go to, and I would think people go to
(56:02):
weddings sober or whatever the event was, and it just yes,
it took some time. So what I'm thinking, is i'm
hearing you talk, is I think you will find that
creative inspiration and that creative spark when you have. It's
(56:23):
just going to take longer than you'd expect. It's just
not going to be there.
Speaker 3 (56:27):
And I'm at east with it and I'm in the
process with it, and it is what it is. I'm
kind of surrendered to. I'm not in the results business,
you know what I'm saying, Like, I don't control results
and outcomes. And that's a tough pill for somebody as
much as a freak for the illusion of control as
I've been in my life. But we really don't control
(56:47):
the results. All we can do is focus on the process,
you know. And chances are, if I care enough about
the process each stop step of the way, I'm going
to have something at the valuable at the end of
it because I care about it so much all the
way through the process that it just may not the
value may not be what I envisioned it was gonna be,
(57:07):
you know, but there will be value, you know, And
just being cool with that, you know, Like, you know,
I obviously we as people, we don't we really don't
even know what we want, you know, so and we
damn stare don't know what we need, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 4 (57:24):
So it's like, you.
Speaker 3 (57:26):
Know, I'm just gonna try to take care of the
small stuff day by day and and you know, try
to live a good life. And I just believe that
that something good is gonna come from it, you know.
And if I if I never find I know the
creative spark will return, almost welcoming it being in some
other area, you know. You know, I always want to
(57:49):
be I owe so much to hip hop music and culture.
I will forever be tapped in and connected to it.
But it's be along long road, you know. And I'm
completely open to being redirected towards something in another as
(58:12):
far as like what my main source of creative inspiration is.
Speaker 2 (58:16):
Yeah, ooh, I wonder what it's going to be. I
can't wait. I can't wait. I'm excited. I'm excited to
watch your journey unfold.
Speaker 4 (58:23):
Thank you, Dania.
Speaker 2 (58:24):
I'm not letting Bubba Sparks just walk off like that.
I've got more to ask in a listener's embarrassing story
to play, So check out a bonus episode this Friday
on the Dedicated team beat feed because he is sticking around.
All you have to do is search for teen Beat
wherever you get your podcasts and subscribe. That way, you
never miss another episode and don't forget to check out
teenbeetpod dot com for a wide array of teen Beat merch.
(58:49):
Teen Beat is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by
Danielle Fischel. Executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman, Executive
in charge of production Danielle Romo, Producer and editor t
Tara Soudbox. The theme song is by Mark Coppus. Yes
that Mark Coppus. Follow us on Instagram at Teenbeatpod
That's okay because no one here.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
Is Hello and welcome to another installment of teen Beat.
I am your host, Danielle Fischel, continuing to talk to
interesting people who do interesting things, all about how their
teenage years shaped who they are today. Remember getting your
ears pierced at Claire's, picking up some z Cavarici's from
(00:46):
Merry Go Round, or just hoping it's pizza Day at
the cafeteria. Me too. Still I love pizza Day. And
since my childhood, even the awkward parts were blasted onto
millions of TVs. That's worldwide. It's time I turned the
tables and find out what other celebrities were like at
the most vulnerable time of their lives. I look at
(01:08):
it this way. I gave you my childhood. It's time
we hear yours. And this week I'm chatting with a
legend of the South. He rose to attention in a
mud pit, starring in one of the most exciting debut
music videos of all time for his two thousand and
one hit single Ugly, a track that not only pushed
him front and center into the world of hip hop,
(01:31):
but helped further change the face of the genre forever.
His local Troop County, Georgia buzz led him to super
producer Timbaland during what could only be described as a
run of a lifetime, pairing him with not only the
hit maker of the moment, but the legendary Dungeon family
team Captain's Organized Noise as well, and that turned into
(01:52):
his first major label release at Innerscope Records, Dark Days,
Bright Nights, an album that went all the way to
number three on the Billboard two hundred. But it's his
second album that's gonna get the flowers it deserves today
on teen Beat two thousand and three's Deliverance, a perfect
mixture of rap and country, a gimmickless mashup that has
(02:13):
been so poorly done ever since. Featured Justin Timberlake, Sleepy Brown,
and Ryan Tedder, produced solely by Timberland and Organized Noise,
and forced the Village Voice to say, if Eminem is
hip hop's Elvis, then he is It's Greg Alman. But
but label politics and a strange climate for white rappers
(02:33):
at the time forced it to underperform, when in reality
it's a bona fide classic. I'm telling you go listen
to it now. I'll wait. He'd follow it up with
two thousand and six's The Charm, his first on Big
Boy from Outcasts Purple Ribbon Records, an album that included
yet another hit single, his biggest yet, Miss New Booty,
featuring the Yin Yang Twins and Mister Calla Park. But
(02:56):
today we'll not only find out what he's up to now,
but we are going to talk all about his past
as an all region high school football player and get
into how a kid raised half a mile away from
his closest neighbor became an integral part of rap in
the early odds. Today on teen Beat, it's a guest
that I chose, he didn't choose me. But nonetheless, it's
(03:17):
time to get ugly with Bubba Sparks.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Hello, miss Daniells, and I think congratulations are in order
for you. Just made another successful lap around the sun.
Speaker 4 (03:27):
I did.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
Thank you, Thank you so much. It's a you know what.
To make it to forty five is an honor. Aging
is a privilege. I'm lucky to be here. I feel great,
so thank you.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
Yeah, it is a privilege, but it's still painful at times.
Speaker 2 (03:45):
I know. I tell that to my knees. Well, thank
you so much for taking the time to talk with me.
We are going to get into young Warren Mathis and
how Bubba Sparks was born. But first I wanted to
start with the Ugly music video. I feel like that
was such a moment that took the world by storm,
(04:05):
and I wanted to hear about your experience with it.
It was directed by Mark Klassfield, and it is so
ahead of its time. Do you remember first getting the
concept for it?
Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yeah, well, back.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
In those days, it was a lot more of a
production than videos are now because technology hadn't involved as much.
So basically, like that whole crew of like twenty people
came from la to Athens, Georgia, where I.
Speaker 4 (04:29):
Was living at the time.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
Yeah, for like two weeks. You know, I had a
big budget. I was on interscope, you know, I had
the Timberland Co sign and so they had all financial
cannons firing behind me at the time. And I didn't
realize what a blessing and gift that was until much later.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
But yeah, I thought it was just what everybody gets, I.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
Guess, right, right, But yeah, and it was actually kind
of a tug of war because I I didn't want
to go quite as look real culture was captured in
the video, but at times I felt it was a
kind of a tug of war because I didn't want
it to quite go as sticky, and I didn't want
(05:09):
it to seem like we were making fun of country folks,
you know what I'm saying. So I wanted to present
it in a much cooler way, you know what I'm saying.
And it was just kind of that tug of war.
But I think it worked out in the end, because
I think if we had done it more the way
that I wanted to do it, me kind of being
too cool for school and trying to present like this,
(05:30):
you know, just more serious. You know, it really didn't
fit the song, and I don't think it would have
been as successful. But when I first saw the video,
I remember I had went into Jimmy Ivan's office when
they had the first we first got the rough edit back,
and Doug Morris, who was the head of like the
whole Universal System at the time, was in there and.
Speaker 4 (05:54):
He was watching.
Speaker 3 (05:55):
He was like, Jimmy, what in the hell is this?
And we were just all sitting there watching like, yeah,
you know, it was just well because it forced a response,
you know what I'm saying it was very you know,
you you you you weren't just gonna watch that video
and be like, oh, that's cool.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
You know what I'm saying it just love it or
hate it.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Either way, it was gonna it was gonna force a
defined emotion about it.
Speaker 4 (06:21):
So, yeah, it was a cool deal. And I was
very grateful for that song. And once again, you know,
I come into the industry with a record like that,
you know, number one on t r L, number one on.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
One on sixth and Park, number one in urban radio,
and and I probably it caused me to take that
for granted moving forward and not understand just how precious
that really was.
Speaker 4 (06:46):
You know.
Speaker 2 (06:46):
Yeah, well, right before it becomes a success. There you are,
your first song's about to come out on Nerscope, and
you are racing tractors with missy elliots. When is the
moment you knew this is going to be big?
Speaker 3 (07:00):
Probably that day when I actually saw the video, because
I was so green to the whole experience. You know,
I never shot a video before, and I remember being
so nervous the morning, like because you know, back in
those days, like it was like a full like maybe
two and a half day shoot, like starting at like
six am and going to like ten or eleven at night, and.
Speaker 4 (07:23):
I just remember just it was also cluttered in my head.
You know, I didn't really I.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Just I knew we did some cool stuff, but I
just couldn't imagine what it would look like.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
And I was so nervous about how I would look
on camera. You know.
Speaker 3 (07:36):
It's kind of like the compounded version of like when
you hate your voice when you hear it.
Speaker 4 (07:42):
You know, it's like you're definitely gonna hate the way you.
Speaker 3 (07:45):
Look on camera, you know what I'm saying, Especially me,
you know, I was I was kind of heavier back then,
and you know what they say, the camera adds about fifty.
Speaker 2 (07:54):
Pounds and then you get to stand in a mudpit
with wild pigs.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
Yeah, well that you know, I did grow up on
a farm and we did have pigs, so that, you know,
once again, we embellished it a little bit running around chasing.
Speaker 4 (08:08):
I mean, it was just but.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
That was really my crew and and we had a
good time doing it, and we had bizarre from D twelve. Yeah,
and that that that actually helped the video a lot too,
because because they were hot as firecrackers at the time,
you know, Eminem D twelve obviously, and and I know
a lot of people were probably wondering how Eminem was
(08:31):
going to embrace it and and and having him in
that video, you know, was I think it it? I
think he was our only celebrity. Well we had to
Timberline obviously and missing But as far as like outside
and Rico Way God bless it did from organized Noise
was in the video, who was a mentor of mine
(08:52):
and one of my heroes, and and but as far as.
Speaker 4 (08:56):
Like people not in our camp, you know, I mean,
and that was cool. We came down there and just
did it, you know.
Speaker 3 (09:02):
And once again I just thought everybody in the industry
was that cool, you know, and me and the large
super were super cool to this day.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Oh man, that's such a great story. How did life
change for you once the video hit TRL?
Speaker 4 (09:18):
Man? It was crazy.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I remember the first time I had like a like
a what the hell is going on?
Speaker 4 (09:26):
Moment?
Speaker 3 (09:27):
It was somewhere around that time because I was in
New York for about six weeks.
Speaker 4 (09:32):
Around that time. They just had me based there because
most of the media outlets are you know, are in
New York.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
And we were doing all kinds of stuff, and I
remember Georgia was playing Tennessee and football. You know, I'm
a huge University of Georgia football fan.
Speaker 4 (09:46):
And it was like we went to our hotel was.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Right around Times Square, but we walked to the TGI
Fridays and Times Square and we're sitting there like at
the bar or whatever, watching the game, going crazy, and
we're just all in our like me and the guy
that was my assistant at the time, guy named Jeremiah
Man shout out to Jeremiah and and we're sitting there just.
Speaker 4 (10:09):
Watching the game and we're like in fan mode.
Speaker 3 (10:11):
We're not even thinking about Bubba Sparks or anything like that,
you know. And we were walking back to the hotel
and you know, there's always just bustling, you know, pit
pedestrian traffic in Times Square, and somebody said that's him,
and I just remember hearing that, but it didn't register
(10:31):
at the times you know, yeah exactly.
Speaker 4 (10:35):
I was looking around, like who they're.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
Talking about, and and then somebody said, yeah, that's Bubba
Sparks and my boys, like they're talking about you, and
I was like, and people just started chasing after me.
I didn't have security. I got security after that but
I didn't have security. I wasn't even you know, it's
such a.
Speaker 4 (10:53):
Surreal deal, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:55):
And and yeah, it was crazy, you know, and and
just that because I really did come from where I
presented myself as having come from, you know, I was
really transplanting from.
Speaker 4 (11:09):
A you know, a dirt road to Times Square. And
so it was. And I didn't handle it the best,
you know, don't.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
I don't know how many people would be able to
handle such an abrupt transition, you know, with grace.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
It wasn't a humility issue. I just didn't.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
There was just a lot of hard lessons that I
had to learn about the music industry and life and
just and and I was kind of learning on the fly,
you know. But it was an incredible time. I wouldn't
trade it for anything. And it almost, you know, it
was twenty five years ago, you know, I almost it
almost seems like another.
Speaker 4 (11:50):
Life sometimes, like another lifetime, you know.
Speaker 3 (11:52):
But it was really cool, and I'm extremely blessed to
have been able to travel that path.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
You were at our tight end and linebacker on the
football team when you were in high school. Was it
your dream to play for the NFL?
Speaker 3 (12:08):
I wanted to play college football at a big school
my like my childhood best friend.
Speaker 4 (12:13):
He was a great football player. I was a good
high school football player.
Speaker 3 (12:17):
You know, but he was a great one of the
top one hundred most highly recruited players in the country,
you know, in high school the year he came out,
could have went anywhere, ended up going to Georgia. And
and you know, I guess I kind of always you know,
to to kind of start touching on like the team experience.
For me, I always kind of felt like maybe I
(12:39):
was in his shadow a little bit.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
I was never jealous or envious.
Speaker 3 (12:42):
I always celebrated his success, and I think that prepared
me for my own success journey later, just.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Learning how to how to pomp pom other people, you
know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (12:53):
And and but you know, I always I was a
good high school football player, But I you know, when
you kind of that's that's known as my best friend
in football. High school football is so serious down where
I come from. It's Friday night lights, yeah vibes and
and yeah, football is probably still to this day my
(13:14):
first love. Honestly, if I love music as much as
I love football, it might be having a different conversation
right now, you know. But I was just I loved music,
don't get me wrong, but I was just really good
at it.
Speaker 4 (13:26):
It just came natural to me.
Speaker 3 (13:28):
And I always kind of wish that football he came
that natural to me, but you know, that just wasn't
in the cards, and it was what it was.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
And the journey is is the journey. So but yeah,
I love football. I really do.
Speaker 3 (13:44):
Like it's a cultural like it's so ingrained in the culture,
like growing up where.
Speaker 4 (13:48):
I grew up, and man, I love it.
Speaker 3 (13:52):
I still keep up with my my high school football team,
like shoot, even baseball, like they're in the state baseball
playoffs right now. I caught myself like it was the
Braves player or saw checking the score you know, the
other day.
Speaker 4 (14:05):
You know. But that's just kind of how we grew up.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
You know, how rural is Troop County. I know it's
near Lagrange, but I'm trying to figure out how much
you're even hearing rap music as.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
A cat well Lagrange itself, especially at this point. Less
So when I was growing up, there's a town of
about fifty thousand people.
Speaker 4 (14:24):
There's only like sixty.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
Miles from Atlanta, so the actual town, but see you
have to remember, I grew up in.
Speaker 4 (14:32):
The suburbs of Lagrange, So I grew up about twenty
more minutes north of Lagrange.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
Out in the country, Okay, And honestly, the town itself is.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
It's kind of.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Suffered from some of the same eels that America, you know,
particularly kind of impoverished areas. There's a lot of there's
violence there now, gun violence, not just like you know,
methadic shooting their you know, their their brothers or something
like that, but like street gang violence, you know. And
(15:08):
because where I grew up was basically fifty percent black,
fifty white, and really nobody much had anything except for
like that small percentage of the people that owned everything,
you know type deal. But I think that's probably a lot.
While we took so much pride in football too, because
it was one of the things that you know, allowed
(15:28):
us to escape that that that perception of that existence.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
So right, you know, your dad was a school bus driver.
Speaker 4 (15:49):
It was everybody knows Jimmy Mathews. That's that. People come
up to me all the time. I rode your daddy
school bus.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
That must be so special to make meet people who
knew your dad.
Speaker 3 (16:00):
Well, what special is because you know, we we we've
always had a you know, traditional southern men type relationship.
You know, didn't talk much about feelings or and uh
and when I talk to people, they say, he would
play your songs, he had so much, he was so
proud of you. And I hear that stuff, and that
that makes me feel good because you know, he's never
(16:22):
really voiced that to me. You know, I mean, he
said he's proud of me. But I'm saying, like, as
far as he would never reveal to me that he.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
Was ever that excited about.
Speaker 3 (16:31):
Anything I did, because he didn't. He didn't agree and
with good reason. He didn't agree with with me pursuing
a career in music, you know what I'm saying, Because.
Speaker 4 (16:41):
I mean, come on, I grew up where I grew up.
When I grew up there.
Speaker 3 (16:44):
And me being a white boy from the country that
was that was telling people he was gonna make it
as a rapper.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
They would have sooner believed believe me.
Speaker 3 (16:51):
If I told him I was gonna be an astronaut
and be the first human to walk on Pluto. You
know what I'm saying, it would have been more unbelievable, right,
And so, uh yeah, he kind of felt like it
was a fool's errand to some degree, and that I should.
Speaker 4 (17:05):
You know, he really wanted.
Speaker 3 (17:07):
Me to because I would have been the first person
in my college in my family at the time to
get a college degree, and so he really wanted me
to get that. I guess that generation kind of just
thought that a college degree like earned you you know,
that was like a ticket to like the club or something,
and you were going to be straight for life or something,
you know, and we know now that's not the case.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
And plus I didn't know.
Speaker 3 (17:30):
I didn't have a plan, you know, So it's kind
of tough when you try to go to I went
to some junior colleges and stuff, and when you when
you try to, like, you know, do the college thing,
but you really don't have a vision for it. Like
I was kind of just going in circles. And then
and then you know, the music thing happened and kind
of bailed me out.
Speaker 2 (17:50):
Your mom was also a grocery store cashier. Were either
of them musical? How did you decide to start rapping?
Speaker 4 (17:58):
All? Right?
Speaker 3 (17:59):
So I did come from a I have My mother
and father each had a boy and a girl from
a previous marriage, and then they got together and I
was the only child they had together. But my mother's
son and daughter that she brought to the situation lived
(18:19):
with me and my other brother. They lived with their
mom in Atlanta, so and I saw them pretty regularly.
But so I had one brother who was Iron Maiden
is his favorite band of all time. He loved like
eight like heavy metal and I mean like passionately now
(18:39):
and shout out.
Speaker 4 (18:40):
To my brother Russ. But he never spoke to me.
Speaker 3 (18:45):
Like I would try to get with I stepped and
watch head Banger's Ball with him on Saturday nights on MTV,
and you know, and I would try to because even
my older brother and I wanted his approval and I
wanted his validation, and so you know, I would I
would try to get with it, but it just never
really spoke to me. Then my other brother that lived
(19:05):
in Atlanta, that was my dad's son. He was into
like Parliament funk like just as just as intensely. You know,
George Clinton cameo and my father loved traditional country like
George Jones is his favorite singer ever, Conway Tweety, you know,
Whale and Jens people like that, and and I have.
Speaker 4 (19:29):
Great memories of certain songs.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Now when I look back, you know, in retrospect at
growing up and me and my dad in the hay field,
you know, or going for a ride on Sunday, and
I'll hear songs that we used to listen to and
it sparks nostalgia now.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
But at the time, it was just like turn this
shit off.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
But to be honest, and my mother and my sister
were kind of just pop music fans. But my mother
loves to dance, like she loves to dance, So maybe
that's where I got, you know, some of.
Speaker 4 (20:01):
The rhythm from.
Speaker 3 (20:02):
But music never mattered to me until I heard n
w A you know, end up that Era two Live Crew.
It just spoke to me in a whole different way.
But when Outcasts came out, you know, they were really
they were no really to it. They were the first group, them,
the Dungeon Family, that was the first, first movement that
(20:28):
really just encapsulated Atlanta and even in a greater sense, Georgia.
And I was like, wow, that's how you represent Georgia
from their perspective. How do I need to represent Georgia
from from my perspective?
Speaker 4 (20:42):
You know?
Speaker 3 (20:43):
And so I started on the journey to tinker and
then just figure trying to figure it out.
Speaker 2 (20:47):
You know, I love that in your family, you had
three boys, and three those three boys all had very
distinct musical sounds that they loved so much that they
were all so passionate about. You know, that's really special.
And then your dad. I guess, technically four four men
in the family, and you're that and each of you
had your own love.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
And but but no one else is like my brother's music.
The guy that looked, the one that loved heavy metal,
he repulsed the Greater Home community. But when I started playing,
somebody saying hey, it kind of went to New Heights,
you know, people being like, turn net ship off.
Speaker 2 (21:31):
How did you come upon the name Bubba Sparks? And
did it always have three x's?
Speaker 4 (21:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Well all right, so me and a guy from the
so Bubba was kind of something that people just call me.
It's kind of like in the South, it's like dude,
like you know, you know, it's just it's just a
general term, you know. And and and I felt like
that name.
Speaker 4 (21:57):
Kind of.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
It's just kind of encompassed everything that I was trying
to trying to represent, because you know, people. Some people
have tried to imply that there's like a negative racial
connotation to it. I know more black bubbles than I
do white bubbles, you know what, And like so I
felt like it was a balanced representation. And so and
then we couldn't I knew. I remember thinking like names endure,
(22:26):
like full names endure, I think more than if I
just came up with a name like soda, Sola pop
or something, you know, like you know what I mean.
Like I mean not to say that there aren't plenty
of iconic people ice cube too short, But I was, like,
you know, already feeling like maybe people were not gonna
take it as serious.
Speaker 4 (22:45):
I wanted to just I don't know.
Speaker 3 (22:48):
I just always envisioned it being like an actual first
and last name. And and me and Shannon Houchin is
the guy that was uh that had Eleventh Hour, which
was the initial production company I was signed to when
we signed with Interscope. He and I are trying to
figure out and remember the old Rodney Dangerfield movie Wally Sparks.
Speaker 4 (23:11):
Yes, so his kids had a bunch of DVDs.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
This is back during like the DVD DVR era, and
so he's just going through DVD and he says, what
about bubble Sparks And it came from Wally Sparks then
and then I was like, yeah, but what's spelled with
three exes? I wasn't thinking about the triple x, you know,
pornography angle of it. I was thinking more about three
(23:39):
xes represents like fire. That's like the like the best
of the best Moonshine.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
Okay, yes, like three skull and crossbones.
Speaker 4 (23:50):
Correct.
Speaker 2 (24:04):
So when does Jimmy Iovine hear your music and then
does he fly you out to LA to sign you?
What was that?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
I think my first ever plane ride. I couldn't sleep
the night the heart didn't sleep a wink the whole
night before. I was so nervous, not about going to
meet with Jimmy Ivan, but about getting on the airplane.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
And that's what the intro to my first album.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
Is is is is partially about, you know, just it's
called takeoff, and it's like just talking about those nervous
feelings but also like as being a metaphor for like
having those same feelings about taking off this in that industry.
But yeah, so Gerardo Mahea Rico Swabe Yes was the
(24:52):
first ever artists released on Interscope Records with Recall Ye Yes,
and and he.
Speaker 4 (25:01):
He went double platinum, and that kind of got him
in the door. You know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3 (25:04):
That guy got them a foothold in the industry where
they continue.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
And so Jimmy was.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
Always very He took care of Gerardo and was always
you know, always.
Speaker 4 (25:15):
Paid that well up until a certain point. They don't
ask me to hear them of that. But so.
Speaker 3 (25:23):
He was specialized more in Latin music, like Enrique Glacis.
He signed and Rique Glaciers to interest Go a couple
of other things. And so he had gotten my project
and he was a champion of it. He loved it.
But he the only thing is when he's trying to
take it to him, you know, to the to the
higher ups, like not necessarily Jimmy, but more Steve Stout
(25:44):
was kind of the hip hop gate keeper, thehead of
black music at that time, and and and he just
didn't nobody was really checking for, you know, another white
wrapper quite that soon after Eminem but also you know,
Arnold was just more known for Latin music. So they're like,
why are you trying to bring hip hop back? And
(26:06):
but eventually he went straight to Jimmy with it, and
Jimmy got it pretty much instantly, you know. And when
I signed with and they flew aside out and and
made an offer, and it was it was it turned
out because you know, it's kind of like once the
industry learns the Inner.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Scope offered this white Rapper deal, and then you're back
in those days.
Speaker 3 (26:29):
Your lawyer would shop all these deals, and the words
starts getting out, and everybody wants you, wants you, you know.
Speaker 4 (26:34):
I remember we went to dream Works back when dream
Works was was was.
Speaker 3 (26:39):
I don't I don't even think that's they're they're actually
active as a record label anymore.
Speaker 4 (26:43):
But and and we.
Speaker 3 (26:45):
Went over there and they made a lot of sweet
promises and offered a lot more money, and I was like,
why was out here?
Speaker 4 (26:51):
You know, I'm telling the guys I'm with, you know,
and they're like, no, we're gonna go to New York.
Weren't meet with all these other people. And so we
met with Deaf.
Speaker 3 (26:57):
Jam and Loud and and and Sony. I mean, we
met with everybody, and everybody was in and Interscope had
the lowest offer, and everybody hated on Interscope because they
were like they're just gonna just trying to shelf you
because you know, to make sure you're never a threat
to Eminem.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
And I'm like, that just doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
I was encouraged because that showed me that the success
they had when Eminem showed me that they knew how
to do it and they weren't scared, you know, and
and so and plus I felt I felt indebted too,
because Jimmy was the first person and.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Jimmy believed in me far, far, far greater.
Speaker 3 (27:40):
Than he was ever rewarded, you know what I'm saying saying,
But I used to I didn't. I didn't understand why
he believed in me the way he did, but he
really did.
Speaker 4 (27:50):
And I'm forever indebted to that man.
Speaker 3 (27:52):
Even though things didn't necessarily work out on the level
that that we all had hoped for. Man, that guy
believed in me, and he gave me every opportunity. And
I probably didn't earn a lot of those opportunities, especially
like you know, I was struggling with addiction at that time,
(28:16):
and you know, I just probably didn't fulfill my end
of the bargain in a lot of ways. But man,
that God loved me and believed in me for sure,
and he connected me with.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
Timberland and what was that like, did you two see Jimmy.
Speaker 4 (28:31):
Jimmy knew he was only something with the Eminem and
Drake thing, you know what.
Speaker 3 (28:35):
I'm saying, Like, because people have a whole different view
on what a white rapper it means at this point
in time. If you remember that climate back there, you know,
I know, you know somebody who.
Speaker 4 (28:49):
Was was a rapper on a white rapper on air
scope and uh and so.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
You know, it was it was just a whole different
environment people after kind of after the Vanilla Ice thing,
there was like a ten year period where nobody was
checking for white rappers, you know, and so then Eminem
comes and it's like what but as a as a
white rapper, you kind of looked at it like, well,
it was only gonna ever be one more, you know, And.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
He just did it, and they did it.
Speaker 3 (29:23):
But Jimmy knew he was on THEO something would find
a credible black producer and have him stamp the white
white rapper, make sure they can see my pretty face
and and so yeah, he and he tried to put
me with Swiss Beats first, you know, he was kind
of shopping the white boy, you know, and.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Swiss was super cool.
Speaker 3 (29:46):
We made some decent music, but we just didn't really
have that chemistry. I don't think he quite understood culturally
what I was going for and being from New York,
and he he appreciated the fact that was a true
m seeing that that the hip hop side, but I
don't think he understood the country cultural side of it,
you know what I mean. And and then you know,
(30:08):
I was always very close with Organized Noise where we
go Waite Uh, Sleepy Brown and Ray Murray Uh. You
know they they're they're with the producers of Outcasts and
they were home team, but they were kind of going
through a transition and I worked with him and they
produced songs on every one.
Speaker 4 (30:26):
Of my albums.
Speaker 3 (30:27):
But yeah, I probably would have loved for them to
have been the Stampers, you know what I'm saying. But
but they were just transitioning in different ways at that time,
and it really wasn't feasible. And then he said, what
about Timberland. He said, I'm meeting with him tonight. I said, Jimmy,
that would be perfect, that would be perfect.
Speaker 4 (30:48):
Like.
Speaker 3 (30:50):
Soul, you know what I mean and and then you know,
he he called me about two or three hours later
and he was like, you need to get out here.
Speaker 4 (31:00):
First thing in the morning.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
Tim was like, you ain't no white, you ain't no
white war And I was like, what is he talking about.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
He's like, he doesn't believe you're white. He's got to
see you.
Speaker 3 (31:10):
And I was like, all right, I'm on the way
and the rest is history. When I got out there,
he was like, that's crazy. That's crazy that you make
the sounds out of your mouth, but you look the
way you look.
Speaker 4 (31:22):
That's crazy.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
So you guys just hit it off right off the bat.
Speaker 3 (31:27):
Yeah, we did, especially musically. You know, Timberland is just
and that once again, you know, that's another guy that
believed in me. You know when before I really couldn't
see it.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
You know.
Speaker 3 (31:38):
It's like I'm a bring alcoholic and addict, and part
of like what the disease of addiction is all about,
it is like as addicts, we kind of carry around
this emptiness inside of not feeling like we're worthy or
you know, feel like we just don't fit in or
if people knew the real us, they wouldn't like us.
And I think me being a white rapper, even though
I worked double time to try always make sure that
(32:01):
I was portraying authentically who I was and where I
was from and what that was all about, because I
felt that to be in line with the core principles
of hip hop. You know, I think that it kind
of just fed into the imposter syndrome.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
And I just it was like, not like as far
as like my talent or what I'm doing, but.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
If these people knew the real me, they would know
I'm a fraud, like like as a human, not as like,
you know, my talent or like what I'm representing or
anything like that.
Speaker 4 (32:31):
But I just, you know, I kind.
Speaker 3 (32:32):
Of always carried those those feelings around, and unfortunately, drugs
and alcohol became a solution that kind of quieted that
beast for a long time until it until it turned
on me in a major way. And and uh yeah,
but but Tim Is he was great man, you know
he was.
Speaker 4 (32:50):
And once again, I probably let him down in a
lot of ways also.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
But we did some great things and and man, I'll
be eternally grateful.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
Nobody could have ever taught me more.
Speaker 3 (33:02):
Uh, there's not a studio session that I have today
where at some point, I don't reference something that that
Timberland told me or taught me. And the same could
be said for Rico Wade also and mister Colin Park
who produced Miss.
Speaker 4 (33:15):
Newboody later on. Yeah, I was just blessed to you know,
Polo to don There's people that I was post with
and that I worked with the just are real giants
in this thing, like the real deal.
Speaker 3 (33:29):
Like there's a lot of people get propped up by
publicity and and you know, but I was blessed to
really be around some guys that was a genuine article
when it comes to really being talented and really being
committed to their craft.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
I love that you are now so open about your
struggles with addiction, and I want to talk about how
you're giving back now. But when did drug use or
alcohol become a problem for you? At what stage of
your career did that start to happen?
Speaker 4 (33:58):
You know, and we're we're talking about with teen years.
Speaker 3 (34:00):
What's funny about that is I played football, and me
and my best friend who's also a recovering addict, the
guy I've been talking about it played for Georgia and
me played in the NFL for seven years and and
we we looked down on people that did drugs, you know,
like in high school and didn't drink and party on
weekends because we were so serious about football. But I
remember spring break my junior year of high school. We
(34:22):
went to Panama City Beach, Florida, Reteneck Riviera, and which
is like four hours from where I grew up, and
that was like our what do you call it, our
right up passage, you know, and we get down there
and we're.
Speaker 4 (34:35):
Like, we might as well have drink. Everybody's drinking, we
might as well drink. And we each funneled twelve zemas.
Speaker 2 (34:43):
Oh and oh my gosh.
Speaker 3 (34:47):
I spent five or six hours, you know, like in
the bathroom praying to the porcelain God, sleep, you know,
passed out in my own vomit that that happened.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
But I remember a thirty minute window, maybe an hour, where.
Speaker 3 (34:59):
It was like all those feelings subsided, you know what
I mean, Like I felt peace.
Speaker 4 (35:04):
I felt connected, I felt like, wow, I get it.
We were the lanes. We should have been doing this
the whole time, you know, And it just kind.
Speaker 3 (35:15):
Of gradually went from there to the point where, you know,
even even into my forties, you know, I've had a
back and forth journey with recovery, but yeah, it ended up.
You know, it's crazy. I look back at like the
kid I was, you know, and it's like I kind
of robbed him a lot of ways. But also I
(35:39):
don't know if I would have been able without alcohol
and drugs to some degree, even though drugs bring about
just maximum unmanageability in your life, Like it's you know,
there are no social cracksmokers, there are no social matthewsers.
Speaker 4 (35:56):
Or heroin addicts.
Speaker 3 (35:57):
You know, there are social drinkers, you know, and you know,
I'm not sure that without alcohol specifically, I would have
been able to overcome the self centered fear I was
talking about and done all the things that I that.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
I was able to do, you know, with my with
my career.
Speaker 3 (36:14):
But it's a double edged sword because then later in
life I also everything that that that I earned or
was you know, given to me, I ended up giving
it back to drugs and I've called so you know,
it is what it is. But you know, I'm just
grateful to have peace in my life today because that's
(36:37):
really all I've ever been looking for. It.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, how do you think you juggled same while also
battling addiction.
Speaker 3 (36:47):
Well my addiction most of like the last fifteen years,
I'd say, even though I've been sober a year and
a half this.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Time, congratulations, but thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (37:00):
That's a big deal for me, and it is. It
is by God's grace, I can assure you that. But
my addiction had isolated me to such a degree.
Speaker 3 (37:12):
More what I went through with my addiction was just
being isolated from family and friends. I went two years
without talking to anybody in my family. My best friend
I've been talking about this whole time I went. I
talked to him like four times in ten years. And
you know, that's just that's what it does, you know,
as the progressive nature of the disease, you know, it
(37:36):
just further further isolates you, you know.
Speaker 4 (37:38):
And so I spent a lot of time.
Speaker 3 (37:42):
A lot of people could speculate about what I was
doing because they didn't see me, or I might not
look the best when.
Speaker 4 (37:49):
You did see me. But I got off the grid,
you know what I'm saying, to do my thing.
Speaker 3 (37:54):
So it's not like I was one of those artists
that was just out here driving around and just you know,
and and doing all I did have some public I
had a public arrest in Florida that was pretty embarrassing
at a Hooters coincidentally, and you know that that was
probably the most public thing that ever happened to me
(38:14):
in my addiction.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
But but yeah, like.
Speaker 3 (38:17):
I said, I was just I like to get the
hell out of the way, you know, when I when
I was doing my thing, and and yeah, so that
probably cut down on a lot of the you know,
the the fame colliding with with the struggles I was having.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
And most of my worst struggles, to be honest, were past.
Speaker 3 (38:37):
The period of my mainstream notoriety, you know, so to speak.
And you know, because like during the ugly times, like
you know, my first two albums, I was there were
some repercussions and consequences of my drinking and using some
you know, career wise, but for the most part, it
(38:59):
was still just the party stage.
Speaker 4 (39:01):
You know, I'm experiencing all these great things. I'm having
a great time.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
Then when he got to the New Booty Time, I
had developed an opiate addiction and the isolation period had
had commenced, and you.
Speaker 4 (39:14):
Know a lot of great things.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
You know, performing on the Jay Leno Show, you know
that was such a big record to the New Booty thing,
and you.
Speaker 4 (39:22):
Know, just I had all my I had kind of.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Cut my crew down to like my real friends at
that time, and they're out there having a blast, you.
Speaker 4 (39:33):
Know, we're hanging out with the entourage as you know,
in l A and just you know.
Speaker 3 (39:39):
But I'm I'm being a weirdo my hotel room because
I'm so tweaked or whatever, you know. And because I
went to treatment for the first time shortly after that,
you know, the New Booty time, and so like eight
and and it was from from there I just kind
of slowly started like fading from the mainstream constance and
(40:05):
and and it directly coincided with with the progression of
my of my addiction, you know. So it was it
was the reason I was fading was because of my
addiction and because of drugs and alcohol in large measure.
But it also the fact that I was fading made
me less of a topic than anybody wanted to focus. Also,
(40:27):
I got just you know, the more, the uh significant
the fading was, the more peace.
Speaker 4 (40:34):
I could just have it, go do my thing, you know.
Speaker 5 (40:36):
So yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (40:50):
I want to talk about deliverance because I will hoot
and holler about this album to anyone willing to listen.
What was your mindset going in to your second album?
Were you nervous at all about a sophomore slump type
of situation.
Speaker 4 (41:06):
Let me sell you something.
Speaker 3 (41:08):
Had it been up to me, Deliverance would have never existed, because, well,
you gotta think, now Ugly comes out, it's a huge
club urban record. I wanted to my second album because
you got to think that I had we ready with Archie,
I had, I had the Jadakiss record. So I'm kind
(41:29):
of like on more of a trajectory to do something
that that maybe Eminem hadn't even done. I was very
clear on the pecking order at that point. But I
was like Eminem never really like had club hits and
was doing his thing, you know, like like in the hood.
(41:50):
You know, people were actually you know, riding around bumping
my shit in the hood, you know at that time, and.
Speaker 4 (41:57):
Being from Atlanta, that meant a lot.
Speaker 3 (41:58):
I was very did and you know, I grew up
outside of Atlanta, but the Atlanta community had accepted me
and embraced me. You know, that meant a lot, and
so I wanted to continue on that path and still
to this day, looking back on it, I think we
probably would have been more commercially successful with the second album.
Have we Have we gone that direction? I was thinking
(42:20):
this when Little John's going crazy, I'm thinking, I get
Timberland produced half the album and a few from organizing
is getting Little John to produce two or three and
go get features from t I And you know what
I'm saying, No more in that direction, which short term
would have been the better route to take, I do believe.
(42:40):
But one record changed it all that Timberland basically just
made goofing around. It's called Coming Around, and it's a
sample of the young It's a sample of the younger
Mountain Stream band. And we did that record and Jimmy
Maths I think was the other one where we kind
(43:02):
of first stumbled into that.
Speaker 4 (43:04):
Sound and Tim being the mad genius that he is
and just really enjoying.
Speaker 3 (43:11):
He was just like geeking out on it on the
trick of making this country shit be jamming, you know
what I'm saying. And once he realized after we did
Coming Around, that I could that I could.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
Paint the perfect pictures over those tracks.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
And then it was like, man, this could be really
big dude, like, you know, this.
Speaker 4 (43:30):
Could be like this is our shot to sell ten million, yes,
you know, but and so we went with it.
Speaker 3 (43:39):
You know, we went with it and abandoned the whod
That's why if you'll notice that that album was commercially unsuccessful.
Speaker 4 (43:46):
We got fired from Innerscope for a variety of reasons.
Then I go over here do this big deal with
big Boy in Virgin You know how.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
I came back the next time like I was like,
I'm not making that mistake again.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
Yep, you know, like Mama's got a house, you know,
like we got to go.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
And that is when you release Miss New Booty, technically
your biggest song, and man it still gets played so
much now for all new generations to enjoy. You had
been through so much at this point, and you are
still writing and putting out another smash? Did that record
(44:25):
always just feel big?
Speaker 3 (44:27):
I knew the night we recorded it what it was,
and I'm grateful eternally because it was a survival mechanism,
trust me. Like I had put out two singles that
are Timberland record and an Organized Noise record with Pete
Poplo and Sleepy Brown on it, like as kind of
like tester singles prior to putting out this new booty,
(44:51):
and they didn't, you know, back then it was so
people take for granted the fact that now it's so
easy to access such a such a vast array of
fans and to access your audience directly. Back then, if
you weren't on the radio, like literally, there were full
ways people received and consume music, live shows, CDs, the radio, And.
Speaker 4 (45:20):
All right, maybe there's three.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
All right, so there's one more though, but anyway and
O MTV and BT, Yes, TV that was the fourth one.
And so if you couldn't make you had to make
music that And you think, at any given time, what
are there forty songs that are.
Speaker 4 (45:38):
Like viable, right right.
Speaker 3 (45:41):
So if you didn't have one of those songs, then
chances are you weren't going to be played on a
MTV or BT, And so you had to make it fit.
Speaker 4 (45:51):
And that's where we lost with Deliverance. Deliverance is a
testament delivers the single.
Speaker 3 (45:56):
The single success is a testament to how great the
record Will was and how powerful Innerscope was, you know
what I'm saying, Like the fact that they made that
record go top ten at a time when the whole
world is crunk.
Speaker 4 (46:09):
Deliverance is coming on in between.
Speaker 3 (46:12):
Get Low by the Little Y Yang Twins and you know,
and and fifty Cent, you know what I'm saying, and
so you know, and it's so stuck out like a
sore thumb. So the fact that even performed as well
as it did commercially is just mind blowing. At that time,
it could have been very boutiquey and very like underground,
(46:33):
you know.
Speaker 4 (46:34):
Like.
Speaker 3 (46:36):
But then so when it was time to go back
in and like I said, I had two I was too.
They gave me like a million dollars at uh at
Virgin and Big Boy a million dollars, and then we
still had like a million dollars to make the album
with Wow. But we were two strikes down because back then,
you know, you would put out a single. Now you
(46:56):
just throw out a song every every Friday or whatever,
but back then it require a little more. And so
we put out these two songs and we're two strikes.
We're in a two strike hole. Yeah, and it's like
this is like my last shot in the industry, you
know what I'm saying. Like there was no go be
independent and put put out your own music. Then it
was like back to the factory in Truth County, you know.
(47:18):
And and so so Eddie Weathers skeuter Rock who Jermaine
Dupre had taken over black music at Virgin at this time,
so they kind of came up with the idea for
me to go in with mster Colle Park with DJ Smurf,
you know, who produced.
Speaker 4 (47:35):
All the Enyane Twins stuff.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
And man, I am eternally grateful to that man and
to the Twins because he and I come up with
this song the first night we go into the studio.
Speaker 4 (47:46):
With this idea and.
Speaker 3 (47:47):
He's like, we got to get the Twins on this,
and they were hot as like yeah, the middle of
the sun at that time, you know what I man,
And I was like, if they'll do it, man, yeah,
and and and when I kind of felt like it
was a hit, like just the night we did it
and we had the basic idead now, but then when
the Twins got on it, it was like so.
Speaker 4 (48:14):
But also I didn't.
Speaker 3 (48:17):
You know, when you do things for to survive out
of survival, it's a little bit of a double edged sword.
Because I didn't know that my obviously I couldn't have
predicted at that time that my life is gonna completely
come unglued in the period following that song, and that
was going to end up even above Ugly and Deliverance,
Like in a pop culture sense, that was gonna be
(48:37):
the song that I was kind of defined by, which
is a little tragic to me, you know, because the
story is so much more, you know, and that and
I feel like if I had been able in a
place where I could have just come back and followed
up with another record, you know, that it would have
just been a chapter rather than like kind of looked
(48:58):
at to some people. And you know, the funny thing
about New Booty is, initially when we did this song,
it was it was based on the movie Players Club,
and New Booty was like Miss new Booty was like
the new girl working at the strip club, and that
was that was what the song was originally created from,
from the spirit of that. But then what happens over
(49:19):
the twenty teens and into the twenty twenties, actual New
Booties bbs, it starts to become a thing, So that
gave it like another life, you know.
Speaker 4 (49:31):
So it's crazy. I mean, the.
Speaker 3 (49:34):
Song is just as culturally relevant today as it was
twenty years ago, and it's amazing, you know when.
Speaker 2 (49:41):
You hear Jelly Roll or Chaboozie or post Malone. Now
is it crazy to see how connected country and rap
has become. And do you still see yourself as ahead
of your time as I do?
Speaker 4 (49:55):
Well, I don't think any. I mean, Jelly Roll has
a history as a rapper, but I don't. I don't really,
you know. I saw a.
Speaker 3 (50:01):
List of top country rappers that had Jelly Roll number
one and had Shaboozie number two, and.
Speaker 4 (50:07):
I was like, like, jelly is a hell of.
Speaker 3 (50:09):
A rapper, Like he has a history as a rapper,
but what has made him successful is not rapping.
Speaker 4 (50:16):
He does not there's no hip hop involved in it
at all.
Speaker 3 (50:19):
Yeah, and much respect to Posty and Shaboozi. I don't
know if he used to be a rapper or whatever,
But I do country hip hop and there's not still
to this day, there's not a lot of other people
doing that. And what it really should be called is
hip hop country because the hip hop comes first.
Speaker 2 (50:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:39):
And and you know you talk about like Big crit
you know, bun Be, Yellow Wolf Rits, I mean, would
Struggle Jenny's.
Speaker 4 (50:48):
There are some people that do something similar to what
I do.
Speaker 3 (50:53):
You know, people that represent some country culture but also
are like truly cheer about the craft of MC and
and and the founding principles of hip hop and where
hip hop comes from. Yeah, and posting. I love post Malone.
I just don't like his country music, but I respect
his right.
Speaker 4 (51:13):
To do it. Yeah, you know, do what you want
to do. You know, I don't. I'm not. I'm not
judging that.
Speaker 3 (51:19):
But also as a consumer and as a fan, I
can say or you know what I'm saying, that's.
Speaker 4 (51:25):
Just what I like.
Speaker 2 (51:27):
Well, you are still performing and releasing new music all
the time. What is the biggest difference in the way
you approach your art now?
Speaker 3 (51:37):
Well, now I'm trying to as I've gotten sober, you know,
and I've got music industry trauma, you know, the spills
over into like just.
Speaker 4 (51:50):
My broader view of music in general. So I was slow.
Speaker 3 (51:55):
To kickstart my creativity again when I got sober.
Speaker 4 (52:02):
It's getting a lot better.
Speaker 3 (52:04):
I kind of just decided that I was just going
to focus on sobriety and trust that process, you know,
the twelve step process and all and and kind of
leave the other stuff up to the universe or God
or however you want to look at that. And it's
it's worked well for me.
Speaker 4 (52:24):
You know. I'm grateful and blessed to.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Be able to still do you know, a good number
of shows and make a pretty good living doing that.
Speaker 4 (52:33):
And that's kind of just like living off.
Speaker 3 (52:36):
The old stuff, you know what I mean, which is
cool because there's really no pressure in that. It's kind
of like I just go watch a movie, you know,
when I go do it.
Speaker 4 (52:43):
And because I work at a treatment center. I work
at a treatment center here in Utah where I.
Speaker 3 (52:48):
Live, and yeah, I'm very active in service out here
and trying to you know, carry a message of hope
to addicts and alcoholics who are still suffering. And and
that means a lot to me. And that's probably my
first mission in life right now. And because it was
about me for a long time, yeah, you know, and
(53:10):
and it and it being about me kind of just
didn't turn out too well for me. And it works
better when I seem to like think about others and
think about what I can do to pack into the
stream of life and maybe help somebody else.
Speaker 4 (53:23):
It's weird how it works because that kind of ends
up helping me.
Speaker 3 (53:29):
And and yeah, but but I still am you know,
when I when I go to create now, I don't
like even up to like forty something years old, Like
I woke up every day thinking about creating music, you know,
and it was easier to do that in addiction. It's
like when I'm when I'm an active addiction, my whole
(53:50):
life is burning down around me, right, and people are
so worried about me. But I'm a peace because because
I'm in firing creatively, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 4 (54:02):
But then the flip side of that is, but the
whole res you know.
Speaker 3 (54:05):
Unfortunately we need the rest of the other parts of
our life, your help and money, and you know we
need those things. But then I get sober and every
other area of my life is blossoming. My spirit is blossoming,
but I'm not inspired creatively, you know what I'm saying.
So it's just kind of and so I've just been
(54:27):
striving to try to find that balance, you know, so
when I don't really wake up every day, and plus
I just aged out of it to some degree, even
though I am a lifelong music man, like it's in me,
not on me. But I enjoy taking trips to Louisville,
where where my manager and a person I create music with,
(54:48):
Dusty Lee, lives and he has a studio at his house.
I enjoyed going there once every three or four months
and locking in for a few days and working on
music and trying to, you know, get reinspired with it.
That's fun. It's like going on vacation or something, you know,
Whereas that's really not the.
Speaker 4 (55:07):
Core of my life. It is, right point.
Speaker 2 (55:09):
You know, how long what's the longest period of time
you've ever been sober?
Speaker 4 (55:13):
Right now? Well?
Speaker 3 (55:14):
No, I was actually sober for seventeen years, okay, yeah,
and then I turned seventeen.
Speaker 2 (55:24):
Right, Okay, those first seventeen years, I get it, you know,
I do. I want to tell you because I as
someone who hasn't had a sip of alcohol in eight years,
it took me a long time.
Speaker 3 (55:39):
Probably.
Speaker 2 (55:41):
Four years, four to five years of not drinking anything
before I felt like I knew who I was in
social situations and in fun situations without having that crutch.
And it was like every time there was a wedding
to go to, and I would think people go to
(56:02):
weddings sober or whatever the event was, and it just yes,
it took some time. So what I'm thinking, is i'm
hearing you talk, is I think you will find that
creative inspiration and that creative spark when you have. It's
(56:23):
just going to take longer than you'd expect. It's just
not going to be there.
Speaker 3 (56:27):
And I'm at east with it and I'm in the
process with it, and it is what it is. I'm
kind of surrendered to. I'm not in the results business,
you know what I'm saying, Like, I don't control results
and outcomes. And that's a tough pill for somebody as
much as a freak for the illusion of control as
I've been in my life. But we really don't control
(56:47):
the results. All we can do is focus on the process,
you know. And chances are, if I care enough about
the process each stop step of the way, I'm going
to have something at the valuable at the end of
it because I care about it so much all the
way through the process that it just may not the
value may not be what I envisioned it was gonna be,
(57:07):
you know, but there will be value, you know, And
just being cool with that, you know, Like, you know,
I obviously we as people, we don't we really don't
even know what we want, you know, so and we
damn stare don't know what we need, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 4 (57:24):
So it's like, you.
Speaker 3 (57:26):
Know, I'm just gonna try to take care of the
small stuff day by day and and you know, try
to live a good life. And I just believe that
that something good is gonna come from it, you know.
And if I if I never find I know the
creative spark will return, almost welcoming it being in some
other area, you know. You know, I always want to
(57:49):
be I owe so much to hip hop music and culture.
I will forever be tapped in and connected to it.
But it's be along long road, you know. And I'm
completely open to being redirected towards something in another as
(58:12):
far as like what my main source of creative inspiration is.
Speaker 2 (58:16):
Yeah, ooh, I wonder what it's going to be. I
can't wait. I can't wait. I'm excited. I'm excited to
watch your journey unfold.
Speaker 4 (58:23):
Thank you, Dania.
Speaker 2 (58:24):
I'm not letting Bubba Sparks just walk off like that.
I've got more to ask in a listener's embarrassing story
to play, So check out a bonus episode this Friday
on the Dedicated team beat feed because he is sticking around.
All you have to do is search for teen Beat
wherever you get your podcasts and subscribe. That way, you
never miss another episode and don't forget to check out
teenbeetpod dot com for a wide array of teen Beat merch.
(58:49):
Teen Beat is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by
Danielle Fischel. Executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman, Executive
in charge of production Danielle Romo, Producer and editor t
Tara Soudbox. The theme song is by Mark Coppus. Yes
that Mark Coppus. Follow us on Instagram at Teenbeatpod
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