March 10, 2026 • 32 mins
There are movies about how a dog can change your life — but for Dr. Laura Surovi and Michael Sivo, it actually happened. Laura had recently built a successful mobile vet practice, but the long drives were exhausting. Then in 2016, they met Chauncy, a rescue with serious injuries and no local rehab options. Watching him struggle they knew their community needed something better. So Laura built a veterinary rehab service herself and business took off. Then Michael pitched something bigger: a 6,000-square-foot state-of-the-art facility. It was a bold, risky and expensive move, but just what they needed to scale.
In this episode, Ben Walter and Kathleen Griffith talk with Laura and Michael from Cleveland Veterinary Rehabilitation about going all-in when the market isn't quite ready, building for what's next and trusting your gut when no one else sees your vision yet. These are The Unshakeables.
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Laura Surovi and Michael Sivo love dogs. In fact, that might be a bit of an understatement actually,because Laura is a veterinarian and she and her husband were inspired to start their business because ofone dog in particular.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
He wasn't in the greatest of shape. He smelled terrible. He had a UTI and he was dragging himselfaround all over the place and his feet were bleeding and everything else.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
This was a dog named Chauncey. He'd been rescued, and
Laura and Michael were at an event to raise money
for his care. As they mixed and mingled, Laura saw
a few folks she knew from her practice and the
animal care community in Cleveland. They all took a photo
together with Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
I think it was in a minute of that interaction
with the dog that he drug himself through the crowd
and he stopped right in front of me and looked.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
up, and I think we both knew at that time
there's more to this. I'm sorry. It's a very emotional.
You know why I think it's emotional. It is because
the dog changed our life, both of our lives.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
It was that resolve that Chauncey had to survive even
with all his complex medical issues and Laura and Michael's
commitment to his wellness that's now helping pets all over Ohio.
Welcome to The Unshakeables from Chase for Business and Ruby
Studio from iHeartMedia. I'm Ben Walter, CEO of Chase for Business.
(01:32):
There's nothing small about the impact small businesses have on America.
They don't just drive our economy, they define our communities,
create opportunities, and inspire the next generation of dreamers and builders.
On the Unshakeables, we're sharing the daring moments of business
owners facing their crisis points and telling the stories of
(01:52):
how they got through it. Hey Kathleen, nice to see
you again as always. Yeah you too.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
You know, I've been so excited about this episode. Who
doesn't love a heartwarming story about pets.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
And they're vets, so this is going to be fun.
Let's go on today's episode, Cleveland Veterinary Rehabilitation from Cleveland, Ohio.
Laura and Michael, it's great to have you here. I'm so
excited for this. Thank you, thank you, and it's real
privilege to be live at our corporate center in Columbus
I spend a lot of time here. I have hundreds
of employees here. We collectively as JPMorgan Chase have thousands of
(02:24):
employees here. So it's great to be able to bring
the show in house and let people see how we
make the magic.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
It's a beautiful place.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Thank you, Thank you for being here. So I want
to start with you, Laura, talk to me a little
bit about being a veterinarian.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I always wanted to be a veterinarian from the age
of five. I remember going around saying that I wanted
to be a veterinarian. I had a love for animals.
Both of my parents loved animals. We had all sorts
of animals growing up. It seemed like a reasonable choice
for a career. I graduated from VET school in two
thousand and I immediately went into private practice. I was
(02:58):
very happy working in general practice. My fifteenth year in
general practice is when I just started to feel I
always use the word stale. I wasn't seeing a lot
of new things.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Until she encountered several lectures on acupuncture for injury rehab
for animals during a professional development conference.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Right around the same time, I received a mailing for
the Chi Institute a place devoted to learning Chinese medicine,
and with acupuncture being one of those modalities, the.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Chance to learn new skills piqued Laura's interest and sparked
something new for her career. As she researched the Chi Institute,
she asked her boss if he would be open to
her studying Chinese medicine.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
This is a way to recreate myself, learn a new skill,
offer something beyond the prescription pad. He said yes, we
would support it, but I distinctly recall him saying, I
think if you want to do it, you're doing it
for yourself. I don't think you're going to see a
return on your investment. But I like a good challenge.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Even still, she wasn't sure it was the right choice.
It was her husband, Michael who encouraged her to.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Go when she started to talk about, Hey, you know
might be something I want to add. It sounded interesting
and I said just do it. She said, what it's
like forty thousand dollars. I said, just do it.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
So Michael was not a VET and at that time
wasn't involved in veterinary medicine at all.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
I'm running a real estate business. I'm selling but I'm
also managing a bunch of realtors. I'm a seven day
a week. Whenever I have to work, it's real estate, right,
So you have to work at three o'clock in the
morning signing something on the hood of somebody's car, or
you have to leave Christmas dinner. I did whatever it took,
and I normally didn't complain too much about it either,
because I just wanted to keep building that business. So
(04:49):
as I was doing that, she was learning to get
certified in chiropractic, and I just kept telling her to
keep moving. You know, It's funny. Chauncey kind of brought
it together. I think now it's time we.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Reintroduce you to the star of the show and the
star of Cleveland Veterinary Rehabilitations Practice, Chauncey. Chauncey is a
pit bull who Laura first saw on Facebook.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Somebody that I used to work with had tagged me
in a post regarding this dog who had kind of
a sad and difficult backstory involving abuse and abandonment and said,
don't you think acupuncture could work for this dog?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Laura did some more research and saw that Chauncey had
been taken into rescue. A fundraiser to help cover his
medical expenses was coming up, and Laura and Michael decided
to go, which was unusual for them.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
My husband and I don't necessarily attend things like.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
This because they're usually working or something. Our lives are
so crazy.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
We had three other dogs at the time, all pit bulls,
and this dog was also.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
A pit bull.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
We said, what the heck, it's a Sunday, let's go
out there and meet this dog.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
The fundraiser was at a local boarding facility.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
We walked in in the lob. He was just full
of people. The rescue was selling t shirts they had a
little backdrop set up and you could get your picture taken.
It was interesting that there were so many people that
had turned out for it. And one of the things
that I noticed is just that the dog. I mean,
he appeared very stressed.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
For one thing, he was a mess and in a
lot of pain.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I assume he was on a lot of pain, and
he had a UTI and he couldn't.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
use his back end, so he's dragging himself around on
this tile flooring and he was drinking water like crazy
and urinating at the same time. And I could see
his needs weren't totally being met.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
At some point we decided to take our turn and
go get a picture with Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
It was very early in my acupuncture training, but I
knew enough that I knew that there were some calming points.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
On the back of the head.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
And obviously I didn't have needles with me, but you
can do acupressure. We bent down and I just sort
of grabbed the back of his head and squeezed it
really hard, and he didn't fight. He seemed rather relaxed
for that moment.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
They had their photo taken and then they went back
out into the event to chat with another veterinarian that
Laura knew.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
All of a sudden, hear all this clamoring, and here
comes Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
My recollection is that it was in a minute of
that interaction with the dog that he drug himself through
the crowd.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
And he stops right in front of Laura.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
So I always say that, you know, I've had this
dog for almost ten years, and it's like I can
never tell that part of the story without crying. And
I don't know why. I mean, it was like, certainly
a monumental moment, but it was. It was truly the
moment that changed everything.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I think it's emotional because the dog changed our life,
both of our lives.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
We quickly recognize like, this dog needs somebody, needs an advocate,
needs somebody to care for him. He needed more care
than he was getting, and it would be easier for
me to do acupuncture on him pretty regularly without someone
having to bring him to me.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
Michael and Laura adopted Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
We brought him in and the first month we had
him was really, really difficult. He's a fifty pound dog
and he was young. We estimated him to be maybe
a year to eighteen months. He couldn't walk, he couldn't
manage his eliminations. I mean.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
It was a lot of work, but work that let
Laura put her new rehab skills to the test. She
was working with Chauncey at home on things she could
do herself, some massage, some mobility, acupuncture and acupressure, but
for more advanced care he needed a specialized facility. They
found one on the other side of town.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Laura started trapesing across town to get him into an
underwater treadmill and do some land exercises with him and
That's when she was saying, my god, this is crazy
that there's nothing closer.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
The clinic was an hour away from where they lived,
and based on their schedules, they'd have to drop Chauncey
off and leave him at the facility for a few days,
which was stressful for all three of them.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
That was my light bulb moment where I said, why
is there nothing in our own neighborhood like this?
Speaker 2 (09:18):
That's where it really started a snowball with she was
going to maybe take this idea mobile.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
I just felt like animals needed this type of care
and maybe we could be the ones to provide it.
I was going to start this mobile rehab practice where
I would be going to people's houses and providing what
services I could.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
She approached her boss in January of twenty twenty, asking
to go part time at the general practice. He still
wasn't sold on the rehab services, and she wasn't completely
sure of herself either.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
At this point, they didn't fully know what the success
rate would be. Our area was lacking for those services,
but it's hard to know what the demand is if
you don't really have a comparison.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
But Laura knew she had to try and Michael was
all in with her.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Laura has something she will never admit to, but she
has some kind of magic about her that whatever she does,
she's able to make it reality. She's just a special person,
and I said, just do it.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
She worked out an arrangement with her boss where she'd
work at the general practice clinic two days a week
and run her mobile practice the rest of the time.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
My plan was to launch the mobile practice April first
of twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (10:30):
So if you.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Recall, there was a lot, Yes, there was a lot
going on.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
There was a lot going on as March, and then
we had the shutdowns, and I thought, oh my god,
what have I done. You know, I'm launching this practice,
this business. I can't think of a worse time to
build a business.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
But I bet people actually loved it.
Speaker 5 (10:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Well, in the end, it was actually a perfect time
to start a new business, and particularly one where I
was going to people's houses because you know, people didn't
want to go out anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
And because everyone was home all the time, they were
also spending a lot more time with their pets and
noticing their conditions like difficulty jumping on the bed or
using the stairs, word spread and pet parents were referring
Laura to other pet parents to the point where she
was booking four to six weeks out.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
I was quickly learning that there is a need for this, and.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Was this a cash business like people were paying out
of pocket? There's no insurance, so everybody's just paying for it.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Everyone's just paying for it. Yes, correct, And.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
When did you decide, well, this is bigger than my car.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
So really it was my husband's idea that maybe we
should consider building a facility.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
At this point, Michael was getting more and more involved
with the mobile practice, thanks in no small part to
the urging of his business partner at his real estate company.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
My business partner was diagnosed with leukemia just into the
first year of COVID. His name was Alan, and I
talked to him on the phone because I couldn't go
see him at the hospital because they weren't letting anybody
in with COVID. He would say, get out of this
crazy real estate stuff and support or to your wife,
help her work on that. And he just loved the
idea of the business. So I literally think about him
saying that every day, work on that business. It's a
(12:07):
great idea, it's a great plan. Just keep working on it,
and four months later he passed away. So that's when
I started to transition my focus from real estate to
veterinary medicine.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
As COVID continued on, Michael was less enthused about the
idea of Laura going in and out of strangers' homes.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
So at one point I started to think, we should
have bricks and mortar.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
That's a big jump. That's huge, like from my car
going to people's homes to building a facility, not even
renting something buildings, correct, that is correct. I mean, yes,
you're in real estate, but.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
It's a big jump.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
It's a big jump most definitely in our relationship. He
is the risk taker way more than I am, but
he had the foresight for it, maybe more than I did.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Michael was so certain Laura could make the business work
with a brick and mortar facility that he'd already been
scoping out the perfect location for them to build.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
There was a piece of land not even a mile
down the street from where we live, and it used
to be an old putt putt course, but for the
last twenty years just been a vacant lot and kind
of an eyesore in our city.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
And it was in poor shape. It was overgrown and
always looking terrible, and the real estate sign was literally
rotted out of the ground. It was a wood sign
and falling over.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Michael pried the sign out of the ground and recognized
the name of the seller.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So I gave him a call. They were asking three
hundred thousand dollars for the lot, and I said, well,
keep me in mind if you ever get the price
within reality. And not too long after that he called
me and he said, just throw a number at me.
I ended up offering him seventy five thousand dollars.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
He's pretty matter of fact, you know. It wasn't like
he eased into that conversation. It was more of a like,
we should just do this.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Laura wasn't so sure about it, and not because of
the business. Her mobile business was thriving, but turning a
small mobile practice into a facility on the scale that
Michael imagined that was huge.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
I thought, this seems really big and out of my realm.
It seems like a huge risk, like we're going to
bet everything we have and then we'll be living in
a van down by the river when it doesn't work out.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
I run a thousand miles an hour into anything I do.
She was very hesitant. I think, with you know, hey,
we're going to buy this lot, and we're going to
spend millions of dollars on a building, and we don't
have any people to come to us. Yet I knew
there was going to be success.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Michael kept pushing, fully confident in Laura at every step,
but it was Laura's love for animals that finally convinced her.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
I got to a point where I had to stop
taking new clients, and not only can we service so
many more animals than I was able to mobile, there
are a lot more services that I can offer that
I would have never been able to do mobily.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
They bought the lot. Now it was time to build
the facility of Lara's dreams. There maybe more Chaunceys dreams,
because every little detail was designed and chosen specifically for
animals and their owners.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
I think the biggest thing is just the appearance of it.
We didn't want a clinical environment. We wanted something that
was going to be very comfortable for pets and for
pet owners. People walk in, they think it looks like
a ski lodge, they think it might be a winery.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Let's just say that the clinic wouldn't look out of
place in Colorado. The front of the building has giant
timber trusses and extensive stone work. A large covered drive
through zone keeps people and their pets out of the
rain during drop off, and automatic doors mean they open
if you happen to be carrying a large dog or
a very unhappy cat. And the inside carries on the
look from the outside.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
In the reception area, we have a stone fireplace and
a stone feature wall. We have all mahogany trim, mahogany doors.
Everybody thought that was crazy.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
The most important thing, though, may surprise you, rubber flooring.
I learned that rubber flooring is a whole adventure because
we put a gym in my basement and there's like
seventy nine thousand different kinds of rubber. Yes, and I
did not understand that. Yeah, it's like some rubber for
the floor. What kind? Oh my god, right.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Yes, yeah, And this is the kind of flooring like
you would find in a gym.
Speaker 5 (16:14):
It's just durable,
Speaker 3 (16:17):
It's aesthetic, but you know, it had to be functional
of course as well. Whether these dogs are senior dogs
or they're recovering from surgery or they're injured. Slick flooring
is just very difficult for them, right, So rubber flooring
was what we needed to do. And you know, it's
certainly more expensive, but it just made more sense.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
If it sounds luxurious, it's because it is. Laura and
Michael worked with an architect to design the building and
by the time they got started building, material and labor
costs had ballooned. By the time the facility officially opened
in April twenty twenty two, Laura and Michael went from
Laura's paid off twenty ten SUV to a two million
dollars six thousands square foot facility.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
We probably could have saved an awful lot of money,
but at the end of the day, I think what
we ended up with is part of our success.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Do you want to know a fun fact about dogs?
Speaker 1 (17:20):
I don't know, Do I you do?
Speaker 4 (17:22):
So if you can believe it, there are more dogs
than there are kids in this country right now.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, I kind of believe it.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
It does speak to something interesting, which is the humanization
of pets, which this business could only exist insomuch as
people love their animals this much that they are willing
to go to great lengths with rehabilitation.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
I mean, the first thing I thought when I heard
this business was like, Oh, she can charge anything, she wants.
Speaker 4 (17:47):
Anything, A million dollars, you got it.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I remember when I was living in San Francisco the
first time I saw a sign for a pet day spa,
because it probably started in San Francisco, and I remember
thinking like, wait, that's a thing. And then I found
out that not only is it a thing, but people
pay crazy top dollar for it.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
This space has just exploded.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
And if I think of one area where I would
be interested investing, it would be functional pet care.
Speaker 5 (18:13):
I mean, it's just massive.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
And I give her a lot of credit. I mean
I give both of them credit. But she saw a
trend and she learned early.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
As you were talking to her, she felt like a
sleeper agent to me, you know, a little quiet and
soft understated.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
Yeah, yeah, very understated.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
And you hear her talk about going from this mobile
pet clinic and she's going to people's homes and then
she makes this like quantum leap into a six thousand
square foot two.
Speaker 5 (18:43):
Million dollar spot.
Speaker 4 (18:45):
I mean, can we talk about those sorts of inflection
points in a business.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I mean six thousand square feet in Cleveland is not
the same as six thousand square feet in LA but
still okay.
Speaker 5 (18:53):
Fair, but still two million dollars. And then they put
it all on the line, And how do you do that?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Like?
Speaker 4 (18:59):
How how do you just get the chutzpah to say?
All right, all chips are on the table.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
I would say two things. One is the fact that
they were both in on it helps. Like, if one
person in the marriage wants to spend all the money
on one big bet, that's pretty hard, versus if both
do and I think, on the one hand, it sounds huge. Kathleen,
I would argue that it was actually a pretty thoughtful,
calculated bet because they actually proved the model pretty well. Right, Like,
(19:26):
when you think about a new startup, what is the
most important thing? There's really two things that matter. Product
market fit and a business model that will support that
product market fit. If you have product market fit, you're
going to generate demand, and if you can deliver on
that demand for an acceptable cost structure, you're going to win.
I'm going to scale. That all comes later. If you
have product market fit, you will be able to scale
(19:48):
as long as you can deliver that product at an
acceptable cost. That's it, and I think her mobile pet
business proved that she had product market fit. She was
selling her product, there was tons of demand and she
could deliver it. And what she found actually she could
deliver it super efficiently, but not scale and she needed
physical space in order to be able to scale it.
(20:09):
But she could see how that would work. So for me,
it was actually a pretty thoughtful way to do it, right,
because she could have not tested it with the mobile
thing first and just opened a place she didn't.
Speaker 4 (20:19):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good way to think about it.
It was testing product market fit, and that's where when
he said build it and they will calm was the strategy.
I think part of the problem is a lot of
people build it assuming they'll come before they have product
market fit.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Right, they knew. I think it's a great test and
learn strategy. Yeah, it's a lot of money. I don't
want to make light of the fact that they put
up two million dollars and they mortgage their house and
they took a big bet, But I would argue they
took a pretty calculated bet because they had already proven
the product market fit. Okay, Kathleen, let's get back to
Laura and Michael. Remember how I said the facility with
six thousand square feet, Well, Michael and Laura just wrapped
(20:59):
another expansion.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
We're just at the tail end of adding another two
thousand square feet. We're adding five more exam rooms. We're
adding a room that's dedicated just to gaate analysis, so
that we have a specialized piece of equipment that goes
in that room to test footfall to see where lameness
might be. That We're adding some other office space.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
And the people you employ are they veterinarians all of them?
Is it a mix? You can't really go to VET
school for this, right or can you?
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Veterinary programs might be teaching some rehab now, but I
definitely had to pursue education outside of that. So we
have one other veterinarian in the practice. Interestingly enough, she
was the one who was taking care of Chauncey when
I was driving him across town. So she now works
for us. We're so happy about that. And then our staff,
(21:46):
we have a rather eclectic group of individuals, but we
have a great group of people, and we train them
and we teach them, and we spend a lot of
time educating them, and our clients really love.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Them so far. The business model sounds like sunshine and rainbows,
and I want to stress that Laura and Michael are
doing well. But every small business has challenges, including them.
Finding staff is always an issue for businesses of all sizes.
Have they been tough to attract and retain?
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Not hard to retain, but hard to find.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
It's tough because to get good people you have to
have good benefits. Right coming out of the gates, we
wanted to offer paid time off after ninety days. We
wanted to offer paid vacations. The 401k was something that
we added somewhat more recently, and we allow them to
have a voice in our practice. We always want there
(22:39):
to be open communication and we have dialogue about things
we can do better.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
The one thing they still can't offer is health insurance,
but not for lack of trying.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
As a small business owner, the rates have become astronomical
and just so difficult.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Certainly it's more lucrative for the insurance companies to work
with large your businesses, but for the little guy, it's
really difficult, and we want to offer our people everything
we can.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, it's really tough. We do hear that a lot
from people, and we actually have some initiatives in our
firm to try to influence policy to lower healthcare costs
for small businesses because we know it's in the way.
I'm hopeful that over the next few years, as their
business continues to grow, Michael and Laura will be able
to offer more benefits to their employees and continue adding
more services to their clients. They recently purchased an ultrasound
(23:29):
machine and they're hoping to add musculo skeletal ultrasounds to
their menu of services soon. I have to ask, what
does a machine like that cost? Just give me a ballpark.
It was, OK, it's not cheap.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
Not cheap, not cheap at all. Be a bit to
get a return on that, I'll tell you.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
The biggest question I have is how do you set
your prices? Because it's not like there's this giant market
where you can be like, well, they charge this, and
they charge that, and I'll charge You're kind of make
it up as you go along, right.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
I did an internship in my training, and I did
it at a practice down in Georgia, which was very successful.
It was a three doctor practice there. I could see
what she was charging and how she structured it, and
I chose to follow my mentor that I had and
I do more like an a la carte, So I
charged by the service. When I was mobile, I had
(24:18):
a few things right, I certainly didn't have the level
of services that I have with the facility. So I
started there and then every year we look at it
and we bump it up a little bit, just so
we stay in line.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Have you got any pressure to franchise this thing?
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Not to this point, but that's an interesting thought.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
I always wonder, thank you for floating that bias. Well,
if somebody called me and said, like, you need to
take your dog to the rehab, I wouldn't know where
to go.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Well, we do have a blueprint, so to speak, for
both the facility and the business, and it's always getting
perfected and tweaked and changed, but we feel like we
do have a pretty good plan.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Well, I can hear that you are as passionate about
the quality of the product as you are running a
business and making money, absolutely, which typically wins in the end.
My experience, Kathleen, I love this business. I mean the
way they talk about it, their approach, I think they
tapped on something that was in high demand and growing demand,
(25:16):
and they had a way to deliver a product in
a way that resonated with the consumer. And that's gold
dust if you get it.
Speaker 5 (25:21):
Ah, so good, and they deserve it.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
They totally deserve it. Now, what's amazing to me is
they've taken this big bet. It's working great, they're expanding,
they're doing all this stuff, and they still don't have
health insurance, not just for their employees but for themselves.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
I know, well, it's so darn expensive. Even with eighty
percent of cost sharing. You're looking at ten grand an employee,
that sort of thing. But what I think is really
interesting there is like, gone are the days where you
can say, well, you've got a great ping pong table
and we've got free snacks and we operate like a family.
Like most employees do expect more. They expect some form
(25:55):
of benefit and trying to figure that out.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
I'll tell you what. I can't remember where I read it,
but if you look at the economy over the last
thirty five years, this is a little bit of why
we have grievance politics today. From an understandable perspective is
goods by and large have gotten cheaper, maybe not an
absolute dollars, but as percent of income. So if you
think about you know, flat screen TVs, it's like two
hundred bucks now or three hundred bucks. You can have
this giant screen and it used to be three thousand dollars.
(26:18):
Technology has reduced the price of goods right large. I
mean even food, But for the inflation of the last
couple of years, food is a percentage of people's expenses
and as a percent of their income has continued to drop.
But there are three big ones that haven't. They're the
three ages, housing, higher education, and healthcare. Those are the
three that have outpaced income growth over the last generation.
(26:39):
And so when you talk about why people are frustrated
with their student debt, that's why. When you talk about
why people are frustrated they can't get into a house,
that's why. And when you talk about particularly to small
businesses but also to individuals about healthcare, it's why they're
frustrated because the pace of price increases is outpaced income growth,
and that's really hard and it's been particularly tough on
small businesses. So we're at a stage where you really
(27:00):
need technology to step up and figure out ways to
innovate and deliver care cheaper because you know, I say
this just like I would say about housing. If we
don't build more houses, it sort of doesn't matter what
you do with finance. It doesn't matter what you do
with mortgages, It doesn't matter what you just we have
more people. We need more houses supply and demand. It's
that simple, right. And with health insurance. Health insurance isn't
expensive because health insurance companies are making a lot of money.
(27:23):
Their margins are actually pretty thin. I'm not saying that
they're everyone's favorite company, but it's not like they're walking
around with fifty percent margins. Their margins are single digit.
Healthcare is expensive because delivery is expensive.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
And there has to be a better solution than just
chat gpting what ailment that you have at three in
the morning when you can't sleep or I can't sleep,
and uploading test results. I read a statistic that only
one in five small businesses provide health insurance to their
employees anymore.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
So it's pretty lean.
Speaker 4 (27:52):
But companies are looking for alternatives, and I know Morgan
Health is one.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
We've invested some money into some star ups that offer
alternative kinds of plans that we think can move the needle.
But again, most of those innovations, while they may be helpful,
they'll be at the margins. I mean, when the Affordable
Care Act was passed, whether you love it or hate it,
there had been some hope early on that it would
detach your health insurance from your employment. That clearly hasn't happened,
and something that's entrenched is hard to get rid of it.
But healthcare through your employer was kind of an accident
(28:20):
of history. It happened during the Nixon administration when they
passed the fact that healthcare premiums were not taxable as
income like other benefits, and that shoved the whole market
into the employer space. The fact that health care is
tied to your employer and that your employer has those responsibilities,
I think is quite difficult because a it puts smaller
(28:41):
firms at a disadvantage and b there's less employee mobility
because people are worried about their health benefits. And so
the more people we can have who are willing to
take risks in their career, that's good for the economy.
But one of the things that holds people back is healthcare.
So I'm hopeful that in the end that more of
that control can be put back into the hands of employees.
Plus most employers is they don't want to be in
the healthcare business, not what they do.
Speaker 5 (29:02):
No, no, no.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
And I'm hearing more and more too that sometimes small
businesses will give a stipend and then someone can use
that or deploy that as they see fit in terms
of either health insurance or dental or 401K, you know,
contributing to their own 401K. Obviously, flexibility and time management
is important unlimited PTO. Everyone wants to be fair and
(29:23):
do the right thing by their employees, but it's just
not financially accessible for a lot of companies right now.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah. The last thing I wanted to say is, and
this is a bit selfish because I'm the one who
mentioned it, but all I could think of when she
was describing her model is ploy could you franchise the
hell out of that thing?
Speaker 5 (29:41):
I know you suggested that to her.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
It gave her in her eyes, Yeah yea, But it
seems so dependent on them.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
How could it be franchisable?
Speaker 4 (29:53):
Like they didn't really seem like they had very replicatable
systems or.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
I'm not so processes.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
My guess is running the place would be I think
the brand could be because if you think about it,
like a new doctor, they're probably still not big enough
to be able to do it. She would need to
have a network of locations with different veterinarians running each
location to prove out that model and how it works.
You know, she's talking about that. She's got a second doctor. Now,
she's a long way off from it, don't get me wrong,
(30:21):
But I just started thinking that's the kind of thing
that you could franchise. We have a lot of franchise
clients and I spend a lot of time with them,
in our case, with the franchise ease more than the
franchise oers. And it's a really interesting business. They're great
businesses if you know how to do it. Increasingly, you
have to be experienced and have scale from the get go,
so they're quite capital intensive to start, but they do
(30:41):
scale quickly.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Yeah, And if nothing else, to just think about it
and maybe imagine it is a good exercise because it
forces you to also get a bit tighter in the
business that you're creating. But we'll see what happens fast forward.
Ten years from now. We can check in on them
and see whatever comes of it.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
I think she's going to be pretty successful. Yeah, all right, Kathleen,
have a great weekend.
Speaker 5 (31:03):
Thanks for having me. You too.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
I want to ask you both independently if you had
one piece of advice as they think about starting or
growing their business, what would it be?
Speaker 3 (31:13):
I have faith in yourself. I think if you believe
in yourself and have a lot of faith in yourself,
you will persevere.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Terrific. Michael, anything from you?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Yeah, I think you need to build a good solid
base for your business and a good business plan. And
once you have those pieces together, the best plans, if
they're left on the piece of paper, are never realized.
I think people that put a good business plan together
and have a roadmap to follow, with a lot of
hard work, they will succeed.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Terrific. Laura, Michael, thank you for being here. Thank you
for being trusted clients. We appreciate your business. We appreciate
you being here today. It's been terrific learning your story.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Thank you, Frank you so much.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Before we go, I just want to give you a
little update on Chauncey. He's hard at work with Laura
and Michael as the branch manager of Cleveland Veterinary rehab
and they told us recently and I'm actually quite serious.
He was also recently promoted to quality control manager for
all the toys on site. Thanks so much for listening
(32:10):
to this episode of The Unshakeables. If you liked this episode,
please rate and review it. In our next episode, we'll
hear from a woman who was desperate not to run
the family business until a movie inspired a change of heart.
Speaker 5 (32:24):
It literally was an epiphany.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
As I'm sitting on my couch, it became very apparent
that there was no one else who was meant for
this role.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Then me.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
I'm Ben Walter, and this is The Unshakeables from Chase
for Business and Ruby Studio from iHeartMedia. We'll see you
back here soon
Laura Surovi and Michael Sivo love dogs. In fact, that might be a bit of an understatement actually,because Laura is a veterinarian and she and her husband were inspired to start their business because ofone dog in particular.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
He wasn't in the greatest of shape. He smelled terrible. He had a UTI and he was dragging himselfaround all over the place and his feet were bleeding and everything else.
Speaker 1 (00:30):
This was a dog named Chauncey. He'd been rescued, and
Laura and Michael were at an event to raise money
for his care. As they mixed and mingled, Laura saw
a few folks she knew from her practice and the
animal care community in Cleveland. They all took a photo
together with Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
I think it was in a minute of that interaction
with the dog that he drug himself through the crowd
and he stopped right in front of me and looked.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
up, and I think we both knew at that time
there's more to this. I'm sorry. It's a very emotional.
You know why I think it's emotional. It is because
the dog changed our life, both of our lives.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
It was that resolve that Chauncey had to survive even
with all his complex medical issues and Laura and Michael's
commitment to his wellness that's now helping pets all over Ohio.
Welcome to The Unshakeables from Chase for Business and Ruby
Studio from iHeartMedia. I'm Ben Walter, CEO of Chase for Business.
(01:32):
There's nothing small about the impact small businesses have on America.
They don't just drive our economy, they define our communities,
create opportunities, and inspire the next generation of dreamers and builders.
On the Unshakeables, we're sharing the daring moments of business
owners facing their crisis points and telling the stories of
(01:52):
how they got through it. Hey Kathleen, nice to see
you again as always. Yeah you too.
Speaker 4 (01:57):
You know, I've been so excited about this episode. Who
doesn't love a heartwarming story about pets.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
And they're vets, so this is going to be fun.
Let's go on today's episode, Cleveland Veterinary Rehabilitation from Cleveland, Ohio.
Laura and Michael, it's great to have you here. I'm so
excited for this. Thank you, thank you, and it's real
privilege to be live at our corporate center in Columbus
I spend a lot of time here. I have hundreds
of employees here. We collectively as JPMorgan Chase have thousands of
(02:24):
employees here. So it's great to be able to bring
the show in house and let people see how we
make the magic.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
It's a beautiful place.
Speaker 1 (02:30):
Thank you, Thank you for being here. So I want
to start with you, Laura, talk to me a little
bit about being a veterinarian.
Speaker 3 (02:35):
I always wanted to be a veterinarian from the age
of five. I remember going around saying that I wanted
to be a veterinarian. I had a love for animals.
Both of my parents loved animals. We had all sorts
of animals growing up. It seemed like a reasonable choice
for a career. I graduated from VET school in two
thousand and I immediately went into private practice. I was
(02:58):
very happy working in general practice. My fifteenth year in
general practice is when I just started to feel I
always use the word stale. I wasn't seeing a lot
of new things.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
Until she encountered several lectures on acupuncture for injury rehab
for animals during a professional development conference.
Speaker 3 (03:17):
Right around the same time, I received a mailing for
the Chi Institute a place devoted to learning Chinese medicine,
and with acupuncture being one of those modalities, the.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Chance to learn new skills piqued Laura's interest and sparked
something new for her career. As she researched the Chi Institute,
she asked her boss if he would be open to
her studying Chinese medicine.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
This is a way to recreate myself, learn a new skill,
offer something beyond the prescription pad. He said yes, we
would support it, but I distinctly recall him saying, I
think if you want to do it, you're doing it
for yourself. I don't think you're going to see a
return on your investment. But I like a good challenge.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
Even still, she wasn't sure it was the right choice.
It was her husband, Michael who encouraged her to.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Go when she started to talk about, Hey, you know
might be something I want to add. It sounded interesting
and I said just do it. She said, what it's
like forty thousand dollars. I said, just do it.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
So Michael was not a VET and at that time
wasn't involved in veterinary medicine at all.
Speaker 2 (04:28):
I'm running a real estate business. I'm selling but I'm
also managing a bunch of realtors. I'm a seven day
a week. Whenever I have to work, it's real estate, right,
So you have to work at three o'clock in the
morning signing something on the hood of somebody's car, or
you have to leave Christmas dinner. I did whatever it took,
and I normally didn't complain too much about it either,
because I just wanted to keep building that business. So
(04:49):
as I was doing that, she was learning to get
certified in chiropractic, and I just kept telling her to
keep moving. You know, It's funny. Chauncey kind of brought
it together. I think now it's time we.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
Reintroduce you to the star of the show and the
star of Cleveland Veterinary Rehabilitations Practice, Chauncey. Chauncey is a
pit bull who Laura first saw on Facebook.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
Somebody that I used to work with had tagged me
in a post regarding this dog who had kind of
a sad and difficult backstory involving abuse and abandonment and said,
don't you think acupuncture could work for this dog?
Speaker 1 (05:27):
Laura did some more research and saw that Chauncey had
been taken into rescue. A fundraiser to help cover his
medical expenses was coming up, and Laura and Michael decided
to go, which was unusual for them.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
My husband and I don't necessarily attend things like.
Speaker 2 (05:42):
This because they're usually working or something. Our lives are
so crazy.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
We had three other dogs at the time, all pit bulls,
and this dog was also.
Speaker 1 (05:50):
A pit bull.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
We said, what the heck, it's a Sunday, let's go
out there and meet this dog.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
The fundraiser was at a local boarding facility.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
We walked in in the lob. He was just full
of people. The rescue was selling t shirts they had a
little backdrop set up and you could get your picture taken.
It was interesting that there were so many people that
had turned out for it. And one of the things
that I noticed is just that the dog. I mean,
he appeared very stressed.
Speaker 1 (06:15):
For one thing, he was a mess and in a
lot of pain.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
I assume he was on a lot of pain, and
he had a UTI and he couldn't.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
use his back end, so he's dragging himself around on
this tile flooring and he was drinking water like crazy
and urinating at the same time. And I could see
his needs weren't totally being met.
Speaker 2 (06:34):
At some point we decided to take our turn and
go get a picture with Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (06:39):
It was very early in my acupuncture training, but I
knew enough that I knew that there were some calming points.
Speaker 5 (06:46):
On the back of the head.
Speaker 3 (06:48):
And obviously I didn't have needles with me, but you
can do acupressure. We bent down and I just sort
of grabbed the back of his head and squeezed it
really hard, and he didn't fight. He seemed rather relaxed
for that moment.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
They had their photo taken and then they went back
out into the event to chat with another veterinarian that
Laura knew.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
All of a sudden, hear all this clamoring, and here
comes Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (07:14):
My recollection is that it was in a minute of
that interaction with the dog that he drug himself through
the crowd.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
And he stops right in front of Laura.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
So I always say that, you know, I've had this
dog for almost ten years, and it's like I can
never tell that part of the story without crying. And
I don't know why. I mean, it was like, certainly
a monumental moment, but it was. It was truly the
moment that changed everything.
Speaker 2 (07:48):
I think it's emotional because the dog changed our life,
both of our lives.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
We quickly recognize like, this dog needs somebody, needs an advocate,
needs somebody to care for him. He needed more care
than he was getting, and it would be easier for
me to do acupuncture on him pretty regularly without someone
having to bring him to me.
Speaker 1 (08:09):
Michael and Laura adopted Chauncey.
Speaker 3 (08:13):
We brought him in and the first month we had
him was really, really difficult. He's a fifty pound dog
and he was young. We estimated him to be maybe
a year to eighteen months. He couldn't walk, he couldn't
manage his eliminations. I mean.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
It was a lot of work, but work that let
Laura put her new rehab skills to the test. She
was working with Chauncey at home on things she could
do herself, some massage, some mobility, acupuncture and acupressure, but
for more advanced care he needed a specialized facility. They
found one on the other side of town.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
Laura started trapesing across town to get him into an
underwater treadmill and do some land exercises with him and
That's when she was saying, my god, this is crazy
that there's nothing closer.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
The clinic was an hour away from where they lived,
and based on their schedules, they'd have to drop Chauncey
off and leave him at the facility for a few days,
which was stressful for all three of them.
Speaker 3 (09:11):
That was my light bulb moment where I said, why
is there nothing in our own neighborhood like this?
Speaker 2 (09:18):
That's where it really started a snowball with she was
going to maybe take this idea mobile.
Speaker 3 (09:23):
I just felt like animals needed this type of care
and maybe we could be the ones to provide it.
I was going to start this mobile rehab practice where
I would be going to people's houses and providing what
services I could.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
She approached her boss in January of twenty twenty, asking
to go part time at the general practice. He still
wasn't sold on the rehab services, and she wasn't completely
sure of herself either.
Speaker 3 (09:47):
At this point, they didn't fully know what the success
rate would be. Our area was lacking for those services,
but it's hard to know what the demand is if
you don't really have a comparison.
Speaker 1 (09:59):
But Laura knew she had to try and Michael was
all in with her.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
Laura has something she will never admit to, but she
has some kind of magic about her that whatever she does,
she's able to make it reality. She's just a special person,
and I said, just do it.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
She worked out an arrangement with her boss where she'd
work at the general practice clinic two days a week
and run her mobile practice the rest of the time.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
My plan was to launch the mobile practice April first
of twenty twenty.
Speaker 5 (10:30):
So if you.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Recall, there was a lot, Yes, there was a lot
going on.
Speaker 3 (10:33):
There was a lot going on as March, and then
we had the shutdowns, and I thought, oh my god,
what have I done. You know, I'm launching this practice,
this business. I can't think of a worse time to
build a business.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
But I bet people actually loved it.
Speaker 5 (10:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
Well, in the end, it was actually a perfect time
to start a new business, and particularly one where I
was going to people's houses because you know, people didn't
want to go out anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:57):
And because everyone was home all the time, they were
also spending a lot more time with their pets and
noticing their conditions like difficulty jumping on the bed or
using the stairs, word spread and pet parents were referring
Laura to other pet parents to the point where she
was booking four to six weeks out.
Speaker 3 (11:14):
I was quickly learning that there is a need for this, and.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Was this a cash business like people were paying out
of pocket? There's no insurance, so everybody's just paying for it.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Everyone's just paying for it. Yes, correct, And.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
When did you decide, well, this is bigger than my car.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
So really it was my husband's idea that maybe we
should consider building a facility.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
At this point, Michael was getting more and more involved
with the mobile practice, thanks in no small part to
the urging of his business partner at his real estate company.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
My business partner was diagnosed with leukemia just into the
first year of COVID. His name was Alan, and I
talked to him on the phone because I couldn't go
see him at the hospital because they weren't letting anybody
in with COVID. He would say, get out of this
crazy real estate stuff and support or to your wife,
help her work on that. And he just loved the
idea of the business. So I literally think about him
saying that every day, work on that business. It's a
(12:07):
great idea, it's a great plan. Just keep working on it,
and four months later he passed away. So that's when
I started to transition my focus from real estate to
veterinary medicine.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
As COVID continued on, Michael was less enthused about the
idea of Laura going in and out of strangers' homes.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
So at one point I started to think, we should
have bricks and mortar.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
That's a big jump. That's huge, like from my car
going to people's homes to building a facility, not even
renting something buildings, correct, that is correct. I mean, yes,
you're in real estate, but.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
It's a big jump.
Speaker 3 (12:41):
It's a big jump most definitely in our relationship. He
is the risk taker way more than I am, but
he had the foresight for it, maybe more than I did.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Michael was so certain Laura could make the business work
with a brick and mortar facility that he'd already been
scoping out the perfect location for them to build.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
There was a piece of land not even a mile
down the street from where we live, and it used
to be an old putt putt course, but for the
last twenty years just been a vacant lot and kind
of an eyesore in our city.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
And it was in poor shape. It was overgrown and
always looking terrible, and the real estate sign was literally
rotted out of the ground. It was a wood sign
and falling over.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
Michael pried the sign out of the ground and recognized
the name of the seller.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
So I gave him a call. They were asking three
hundred thousand dollars for the lot, and I said, well,
keep me in mind if you ever get the price
within reality. And not too long after that he called
me and he said, just throw a number at me.
I ended up offering him seventy five thousand dollars.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
He's pretty matter of fact, you know. It wasn't like
he eased into that conversation. It was more of a like,
we should just do this.
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Laura wasn't so sure about it, and not because of
the business. Her mobile business was thriving, but turning a
small mobile practice into a facility on the scale that
Michael imagined that was huge.
Speaker 3 (14:00):
I thought, this seems really big and out of my realm.
It seems like a huge risk, like we're going to
bet everything we have and then we'll be living in
a van down by the river when it doesn't work out.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
I run a thousand miles an hour into anything I do.
She was very hesitant. I think, with you know, hey,
we're going to buy this lot, and we're going to
spend millions of dollars on a building, and we don't
have any people to come to us. Yet I knew
there was going to be success.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Michael kept pushing, fully confident in Laura at every step,
but it was Laura's love for animals that finally convinced her.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
I got to a point where I had to stop
taking new clients, and not only can we service so
many more animals than I was able to mobile, there
are a lot more services that I can offer that
I would have never been able to do mobily.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
They bought the lot. Now it was time to build
the facility of Lara's dreams. There maybe more Chaunceys dreams,
because every little detail was designed and chosen specifically for
animals and their owners.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
I think the biggest thing is just the appearance of it.
We didn't want a clinical environment. We wanted something that
was going to be very comfortable for pets and for
pet owners. People walk in, they think it looks like
a ski lodge, they think it might be a winery.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
Let's just say that the clinic wouldn't look out of
place in Colorado. The front of the building has giant
timber trusses and extensive stone work. A large covered drive
through zone keeps people and their pets out of the
rain during drop off, and automatic doors mean they open
if you happen to be carrying a large dog or
a very unhappy cat. And the inside carries on the
look from the outside.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
In the reception area, we have a stone fireplace and
a stone feature wall. We have all mahogany trim, mahogany doors.
Everybody thought that was crazy.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
The most important thing, though, may surprise you, rubber flooring.
I learned that rubber flooring is a whole adventure because
we put a gym in my basement and there's like
seventy nine thousand different kinds of rubber. Yes, and I
did not understand that. Yeah, it's like some rubber for
the floor. What kind? Oh my god, right.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
Yes, yeah, And this is the kind of flooring like
you would find in a gym.
Speaker 5 (16:14):
It's just durable,
Speaker 3 (16:17):
It's aesthetic, but you know, it had to be functional
of course as well. Whether these dogs are senior dogs
or they're recovering from surgery or they're injured. Slick flooring
is just very difficult for them, right, So rubber flooring
was what we needed to do. And you know, it's
certainly more expensive, but it just made more sense.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
If it sounds luxurious, it's because it is. Laura and
Michael worked with an architect to design the building and
by the time they got started building, material and labor
costs had ballooned. By the time the facility officially opened
in April twenty twenty two, Laura and Michael went from
Laura's paid off twenty ten SUV to a two million
dollars six thousands square foot facility.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
We probably could have saved an awful lot of money,
but at the end of the day, I think what
we ended up with is part of our success.
Speaker 5 (17:18):
Do you want to know a fun fact about dogs?
Speaker 1 (17:20):
I don't know, Do I you do?
Speaker 4 (17:22):
So if you can believe it, there are more dogs
than there are kids in this country right now.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, I kind of believe it.
Speaker 4 (17:28):
It does speak to something interesting, which is the humanization
of pets, which this business could only exist insomuch as
people love their animals this much that they are willing
to go to great lengths with rehabilitation.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
I mean, the first thing I thought when I heard
this business was like, Oh, she can charge anything, she wants.
Speaker 4 (17:47):
Anything, A million dollars, you got it.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
I remember when I was living in San Francisco the
first time I saw a sign for a pet day spa,
because it probably started in San Francisco, and I remember
thinking like, wait, that's a thing. And then I found
out that not only is it a thing, but people
pay crazy top dollar for it.
Speaker 5 (18:05):
This space has just exploded.
Speaker 4 (18:07):
And if I think of one area where I would
be interested investing, it would be functional pet care.
Speaker 5 (18:13):
I mean, it's just massive.
Speaker 1 (18:16):
And I give her a lot of credit. I mean
I give both of them credit. But she saw a
trend and she learned early.
Speaker 4 (18:21):
As you were talking to her, she felt like a
sleeper agent to me, you know, a little quiet and
soft understated.
Speaker 5 (18:27):
Yeah, yeah, very understated.
Speaker 4 (18:29):
And you hear her talk about going from this mobile
pet clinic and she's going to people's homes and then
she makes this like quantum leap into a six thousand
square foot two.
Speaker 5 (18:43):
Million dollar spot.
Speaker 4 (18:45):
I mean, can we talk about those sorts of inflection
points in a business.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
I mean six thousand square feet in Cleveland is not
the same as six thousand square feet in LA but
still okay.
Speaker 5 (18:53):
Fair, but still two million dollars. And then they put
it all on the line, And how do you do that?
Speaker 3 (18:59):
Like?
Speaker 4 (18:59):
How how do you just get the chutzpah to say?
All right, all chips are on the table.
Speaker 1 (19:04):
I would say two things. One is the fact that
they were both in on it helps. Like, if one
person in the marriage wants to spend all the money
on one big bet, that's pretty hard, versus if both
do and I think, on the one hand, it sounds huge. Kathleen,
I would argue that it was actually a pretty thoughtful,
calculated bet because they actually proved the model pretty well. Right, Like,
(19:26):
when you think about a new startup, what is the
most important thing? There's really two things that matter. Product
market fit and a business model that will support that
product market fit. If you have product market fit, you're
going to generate demand, and if you can deliver on
that demand for an acceptable cost structure, you're going to win.
I'm going to scale. That all comes later. If you
have product market fit, you will be able to scale
(19:48):
as long as you can deliver that product at an
acceptable cost. That's it, and I think her mobile pet
business proved that she had product market fit. She was
selling her product, there was tons of demand and she
could deliver it. And what she found actually she could
deliver it super efficiently, but not scale and she needed
physical space in order to be able to scale it.
(20:09):
But she could see how that would work. So for me,
it was actually a pretty thoughtful way to do it, right,
because she could have not tested it with the mobile
thing first and just opened a place she didn't.
Speaker 4 (20:19):
Yeah, yeah, that's a good way to think about it.
It was testing product market fit, and that's where when
he said build it and they will calm was the strategy.
I think part of the problem is a lot of
people build it assuming they'll come before they have product
market fit.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Right, they knew. I think it's a great test and
learn strategy. Yeah, it's a lot of money. I don't
want to make light of the fact that they put
up two million dollars and they mortgage their house and
they took a big bet, But I would argue they
took a pretty calculated bet because they had already proven
the product market fit. Okay, Kathleen, let's get back to
Laura and Michael. Remember how I said the facility with
six thousand square feet, Well, Michael and Laura just wrapped
(20:59):
another expansion.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
We're just at the tail end of adding another two
thousand square feet. We're adding five more exam rooms. We're
adding a room that's dedicated just to gaate analysis, so
that we have a specialized piece of equipment that goes
in that room to test footfall to see where lameness
might be. That We're adding some other office space.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
And the people you employ are they veterinarians all of them?
Is it a mix? You can't really go to VET
school for this, right or can you?
Speaker 3 (21:24):
Veterinary programs might be teaching some rehab now, but I
definitely had to pursue education outside of that. So we
have one other veterinarian in the practice. Interestingly enough, she
was the one who was taking care of Chauncey when
I was driving him across town. So she now works
for us. We're so happy about that. And then our staff,
(21:46):
we have a rather eclectic group of individuals, but we
have a great group of people, and we train them
and we teach them, and we spend a lot of
time educating them, and our clients really love.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Them so far. The business model sounds like sunshine and rainbows,
and I want to stress that Laura and Michael are
doing well. But every small business has challenges, including them.
Finding staff is always an issue for businesses of all sizes.
Have they been tough to attract and retain?
Speaker 2 (22:15):
Not hard to retain, but hard to find.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
It's tough because to get good people you have to
have good benefits. Right coming out of the gates, we
wanted to offer paid time off after ninety days. We
wanted to offer paid vacations. The 401k was something that
we added somewhat more recently, and we allow them to
have a voice in our practice. We always want there
(22:39):
to be open communication and we have dialogue about things
we can do better.
Speaker 1 (22:45):
The one thing they still can't offer is health insurance,
but not for lack of trying.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
As a small business owner, the rates have become astronomical
and just so difficult.
Speaker 2 (22:57):
Certainly it's more lucrative for the insurance companies to work
with large your businesses, but for the little guy, it's
really difficult, and we want to offer our people everything
we can.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
Yeah, it's really tough. We do hear that a lot
from people, and we actually have some initiatives in our
firm to try to influence policy to lower healthcare costs
for small businesses because we know it's in the way.
I'm hopeful that over the next few years, as their
business continues to grow, Michael and Laura will be able
to offer more benefits to their employees and continue adding
more services to their clients. They recently purchased an ultrasound
(23:29):
machine and they're hoping to add musculo skeletal ultrasounds to
their menu of services soon. I have to ask, what
does a machine like that cost? Just give me a ballpark.
It was, OK, it's not cheap.
Speaker 3 (23:43):
Not cheap, not cheap at all. Be a bit to
get a return on that, I'll tell you.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
The biggest question I have is how do you set
your prices? Because it's not like there's this giant market
where you can be like, well, they charge this, and
they charge that, and I'll charge You're kind of make
it up as you go along, right.
Speaker 3 (23:57):
I did an internship in my training, and I did
it at a practice down in Georgia, which was very successful.
It was a three doctor practice there. I could see
what she was charging and how she structured it, and
I chose to follow my mentor that I had and
I do more like an a la carte, So I
charged by the service. When I was mobile, I had
(24:18):
a few things right, I certainly didn't have the level
of services that I have with the facility. So I
started there and then every year we look at it
and we bump it up a little bit, just so
we stay in line.
Speaker 1 (24:29):
Have you got any pressure to franchise this thing?
Speaker 2 (24:32):
Not to this point, but that's an interesting thought.
Speaker 1 (24:35):
I always wonder, thank you for floating that bias. Well,
if somebody called me and said, like, you need to
take your dog to the rehab, I wouldn't know where
to go.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
Well, we do have a blueprint, so to speak, for
both the facility and the business, and it's always getting
perfected and tweaked and changed, but we feel like we
do have a pretty good plan.
Speaker 1 (24:53):
Well, I can hear that you are as passionate about
the quality of the product as you are running a
business and making money, absolutely, which typically wins in the end.
My experience, Kathleen, I love this business. I mean the
way they talk about it, their approach, I think they
tapped on something that was in high demand and growing demand,
(25:16):
and they had a way to deliver a product in
a way that resonated with the consumer. And that's gold
dust if you get it.
Speaker 5 (25:21):
Ah, so good, and they deserve it.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
They totally deserve it. Now, what's amazing to me is
they've taken this big bet. It's working great, they're expanding,
they're doing all this stuff, and they still don't have
health insurance, not just for their employees but for themselves.
Speaker 4 (25:33):
I know, well, it's so darn expensive. Even with eighty
percent of cost sharing. You're looking at ten grand an employee,
that sort of thing. But what I think is really
interesting there is like, gone are the days where you
can say, well, you've got a great ping pong table
and we've got free snacks and we operate like a family.
Like most employees do expect more. They expect some form
(25:55):
of benefit and trying to figure that out.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
I'll tell you what. I can't remember where I read it,
but if you look at the economy over the last
thirty five years, this is a little bit of why
we have grievance politics today. From an understandable perspective is
goods by and large have gotten cheaper, maybe not an
absolute dollars, but as percent of income. So if you
think about you know, flat screen TVs, it's like two
hundred bucks now or three hundred bucks. You can have
this giant screen and it used to be three thousand dollars.
(26:18):
Technology has reduced the price of goods right large. I
mean even food, But for the inflation of the last
couple of years, food is a percentage of people's expenses
and as a percent of their income has continued to drop.
But there are three big ones that haven't. They're the
three ages, housing, higher education, and healthcare. Those are the
three that have outpaced income growth over the last generation.
(26:39):
And so when you talk about why people are frustrated
with their student debt, that's why. When you talk about
why people are frustrated they can't get into a house,
that's why. And when you talk about particularly to small
businesses but also to individuals about healthcare, it's why they're
frustrated because the pace of price increases is outpaced income growth,
and that's really hard and it's been particularly tough on
small businesses. So we're at a stage where you really
(27:00):
need technology to step up and figure out ways to
innovate and deliver care cheaper because you know, I say
this just like I would say about housing. If we
don't build more houses, it sort of doesn't matter what
you do with finance. It doesn't matter what you do
with mortgages, It doesn't matter what you just we have
more people. We need more houses supply and demand. It's
that simple, right. And with health insurance. Health insurance isn't
expensive because health insurance companies are making a lot of money.
(27:23):
Their margins are actually pretty thin. I'm not saying that
they're everyone's favorite company, but it's not like they're walking
around with fifty percent margins. Their margins are single digit.
Healthcare is expensive because delivery is expensive.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
And there has to be a better solution than just
chat gpting what ailment that you have at three in
the morning when you can't sleep or I can't sleep,
and uploading test results. I read a statistic that only
one in five small businesses provide health insurance to their
employees anymore.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
So it's pretty lean.
Speaker 4 (27:52):
But companies are looking for alternatives, and I know Morgan
Health is one.
Speaker 1 (27:58):
We've invested some money into some star ups that offer
alternative kinds of plans that we think can move the needle.
But again, most of those innovations, while they may be helpful,
they'll be at the margins. I mean, when the Affordable
Care Act was passed, whether you love it or hate it,
there had been some hope early on that it would
detach your health insurance from your employment. That clearly hasn't happened,
and something that's entrenched is hard to get rid of it.
But healthcare through your employer was kind of an accident
(28:20):
of history. It happened during the Nixon administration when they
passed the fact that healthcare premiums were not taxable as
income like other benefits, and that shoved the whole market
into the employer space. The fact that health care is
tied to your employer and that your employer has those responsibilities,
I think is quite difficult because a it puts smaller
(28:41):
firms at a disadvantage and b there's less employee mobility
because people are worried about their health benefits. And so
the more people we can have who are willing to
take risks in their career, that's good for the economy.
But one of the things that holds people back is healthcare.
So I'm hopeful that in the end that more of
that control can be put back into the hands of employees.
Plus most employers is they don't want to be in
the healthcare business, not what they do.
Speaker 5 (29:02):
No, no, no.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
And I'm hearing more and more too that sometimes small
businesses will give a stipend and then someone can use
that or deploy that as they see fit in terms
of either health insurance or dental or 401K, you know,
contributing to their own 401K. Obviously, flexibility and time management
is important unlimited PTO. Everyone wants to be fair and
(29:23):
do the right thing by their employees, but it's just
not financially accessible for a lot of companies right now.
Speaker 1 (29:30):
Yeah. The last thing I wanted to say is, and
this is a bit selfish because I'm the one who
mentioned it, but all I could think of when she
was describing her model is ploy could you franchise the
hell out of that thing?
Speaker 5 (29:41):
I know you suggested that to her.
Speaker 4 (29:43):
It gave her in her eyes, Yeah yea, But it
seems so dependent on them.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
How could it be franchisable?
Speaker 4 (29:53):
Like they didn't really seem like they had very replicatable
systems or.
Speaker 5 (29:57):
I'm not so processes.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
My guess is running the place would be I think
the brand could be because if you think about it,
like a new doctor, they're probably still not big enough
to be able to do it. She would need to
have a network of locations with different veterinarians running each
location to prove out that model and how it works.
You know, she's talking about that. She's got a second doctor. Now,
she's a long way off from it, don't get me wrong,
(30:21):
But I just started thinking that's the kind of thing
that you could franchise. We have a lot of franchise
clients and I spend a lot of time with them,
in our case, with the franchise ease more than the
franchise oers. And it's a really interesting business. They're great
businesses if you know how to do it. Increasingly, you
have to be experienced and have scale from the get go,
so they're quite capital intensive to start, but they do
(30:41):
scale quickly.
Speaker 4 (30:42):
Yeah, And if nothing else, to just think about it
and maybe imagine it is a good exercise because it
forces you to also get a bit tighter in the
business that you're creating. But we'll see what happens fast forward.
Ten years from now. We can check in on them
and see whatever comes of it.
Speaker 1 (30:59):
I think she's going to be pretty successful. Yeah, all right, Kathleen,
have a great weekend.
Speaker 5 (31:03):
Thanks for having me. You too.
Speaker 1 (31:06):
I want to ask you both independently if you had
one piece of advice as they think about starting or
growing their business, what would it be?
Speaker 3 (31:13):
I have faith in yourself. I think if you believe
in yourself and have a lot of faith in yourself,
you will persevere.
Speaker 1 (31:21):
Terrific. Michael, anything from you?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Yeah, I think you need to build a good solid
base for your business and a good business plan. And
once you have those pieces together, the best plans, if
they're left on the piece of paper, are never realized.
I think people that put a good business plan together
and have a roadmap to follow, with a lot of
hard work, they will succeed.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Terrific. Laura, Michael, thank you for being here. Thank you
for being trusted clients. We appreciate your business. We appreciate
you being here today. It's been terrific learning your story.
Speaker 2 (31:47):
Thank you, Frank you so much.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Before we go, I just want to give you a
little update on Chauncey. He's hard at work with Laura
and Michael as the branch manager of Cleveland Veterinary rehab
and they told us recently and I'm actually quite serious.
He was also recently promoted to quality control manager for
all the toys on site. Thanks so much for listening
(32:10):
to this episode of The Unshakeables. If you liked this episode,
please rate and review it. In our next episode, we'll
hear from a woman who was desperate not to run
the family business until a movie inspired a change of heart.
Speaker 5 (32:24):
It literally was an epiphany.
Speaker 4 (32:26):
As I'm sitting on my couch, it became very apparent
that there was no one else who was meant for
this role.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Then me.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
I'm Ben Walter, and this is The Unshakeables from Chase
for Business and Ruby Studio from iHeartMedia. We'll see you
back here soon
Hosts And Creators
Ben Walter
Kathleen Griffith
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