“I’M AFRAID OF ETERNITY”

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hi.

Speaker 2 (00:00):
What's your name.

Speaker 1 (00:01):
My name is Malachi.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
Malachi. What's up? Malachi has life?

Speaker 1 (00:05):
Dude? Life is nuts. I this is weird.

Speaker 3 (00:10):
I told myself I wouldn't be nervous, but you always say,
don't be nervous, and it's just a it's just a geck.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
So the central nervous system does not The central nervous
system does not respond to logic. Only instinct.

Speaker 1 (00:24):
Makes sense.

Speaker 2 (00:25):
It's okay, it's instincts will eventually catch up to the logic.
It just takes a second. What's up, man? What's nuts?

Speaker 1 (00:35):
Dude?

Speaker 3 (00:37):
I've been dealing with I know you on your podcast
recently have been dealing with a lot of like existential dread. Sure,
And I have a perophobia. I don't know if you
know that is like a it's a fear of eternity.
And so I know you don't necessarily have, like you
say that you're not really spiritual or really believe in

(00:59):
a whole lot. But I'm a Christian, and so it's
weird for me because it's like the idea of what's
supposed to be my spiritual inheritance, you know, is like
the most terrifying thing to me. So it's something strange.
I've been battling for since I was like a kid.
And yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (01:20):
Guess that's it interesting. Okay, So tell me what you
believe as a Christian? Is your spiritual inheritance?

Speaker 3 (01:36):
Yeah, well I believe when I die obviously, if you
believe that Jesus Christ died in the cross and came
back to life and you, I mean, repentance is its
own thing within that, but that you would be able
to live an eternity forever with you know, Jesus and

(01:58):
everyone else that debth. And so I guess for me,
it's just like it's weird. I'll be sitting there and
I'll think of like, oh, well, it's one million years.
You know, you're you're there for one million years, and
it's like, oh, well, it's not just that you're there
for two million and three million and four million and

(02:19):
five million, and so it's like, I don't know if
it's like a weird OCD thing, but I'll start snapping
where I'm just I'll be like, oh, every snap is
a billion years, and it will pull me into like
almost full panic mode where I'm like my wife will
be sitting there, She's like are you okay? And I'm like, yeah,
I'm freaking out, but it's weird. And then I'll I've

(02:41):
been smoking recently to try and kind of combat it,
but it's sometimes made it worse, almost like more paranoid.

Speaker 2 (02:47):
Right, how old are you. I'm twenty three, and you've
had this fear for your whole life?

Speaker 3 (03:00):
Yeah, I would say since I was around like the
ten to twelve age, Like I want to say, it
was weird, Like I'd start thinking about it and it
would like really mess me up as a kid, and
I didn't really know what anxiety was or what you know,
panic attacks were or anything like that. And then my

(03:21):
stepbrother passed away. It was kind of messed up, but
he committed suicide, and so I started getting panic attacks
even worse than and then it kind of came back
in to that too. I feel like the idea of
death really like encompassed everything that I was thinking, and
I felt like I had to do things out of

(03:41):
spite to you know, like everything. I feel like everything
you do in life is like out of spite of
your death. And so it's coming. You're on the train
no matter what. There's no way to get around it,
and so it's weird. Because it's like, I almost the
idea of me being able to die and there just

(04:03):
be nothing for eternity, like I wouldn't be conscious, So
that almost sounds more enjoyable than being conscious for eternity,
and it messes me up because it's like, well, that's
directly against my beliefs. So it's very it's very strange,
and it makes me feel like uneasy. It's like the

(04:25):
same idea. There was some guy that I was listening
to literally yesterday at work that you were talking to
that had like the fear of planets and like the sun,
like he was a he said he was an amateur,
a strong.

Speaker 2 (04:41):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I remember that. That's that was like, yeah,
a year and a half ago. I remember talking to
that guy.

Speaker 3 (04:48):
So it's kind of it's like the same idea of that.
It's like just how crazily big like that number is
like with eternity or with other planets and suff because
I get that the same thing. Like my wife and
I will go up we live in Tucson and there's
like a big old mountain up here and sometimes we'll
drive up, and so it's the higher you go up,

(05:10):
the less light pollution there is, and I literally like
I'll get fearful, like I'm going to fall off the
edge of the earth. Like it's weird. I feel like uneasy.
It's it's weird and it's been bothering me for weeks since.
I'll listen to your show and there's people that are
talking about like the existential dread thing, and I'm like,
I have been dealing with that horribly.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
M So, well, tell me more about your beliefs, like
do you I mean this question genuinely, like do you
do you have conviction in your beliefs?

Speaker 3 (05:49):
Conviction how so like like conviction I'm wrong.

Speaker 2 (05:53):
I'm like, uh, well, well, conviction and your beliefs in
the sense of like you're talking about death as a
secession of any consciousness for all of eternity versus your
belief of Christianity, being that your spiritual inheritance upon death
is eternity with Jesus Christ in heaven.

Speaker 3 (06:15):
Yeah, I guess it's just pretty it's for me, it's
just like pretty straightforward. I feel like, like one breath out,
you're here on earth, Like it's just I don't know
if this is what you're asking about.

Speaker 1 (06:30):
One breath out.

Speaker 3 (06:31):
I'm dead and then the next breath in, I'm like,
I just I see the gates, you know.

Speaker 2 (06:37):
That's yeah, so that's that's that's your conviction. Yeah, okay,
hmm hm hm hmm. I'm trying to figure out how
I want to have this conversation with you, because I
I think it's good to well, well, actually, no, I'll

(07:03):
ask you this. I think you're a smart guy, like,
do you ever And I don't mean this, I swear
in my life, I don't mean this in a leading way.
I genuinely again ask do you ever question your beliefs?

Speaker 3 (07:14):
So for me, the doubts come up a lot more
with kind of what I'm battling in life, and so
right now I'm battling there's like a lot of pornography
that I'm trying to get around. I grew up kind
of not having a whole lot of confidence in myself,

(07:36):
and so I viewed sex as like a I love you.
I guess like if I got that with someone, then
that meant that I loved me. And so recently it's like,
if I'm not doing so well, I definitely get the
doubts of like why am I?

Speaker 1 (07:52):
Like, why am I doing this? What is this what
is this for?

Speaker 3 (07:55):
Or like right now, I'm like at work, I don't
like I have a good job, but it's not at
all what I want to be doing. And I think
that plays into the dread too, is like I'm like,
it's Attorney's just going to be me doing things that
I don't want to do forever and ever endeavor and
so there, I would say there's definitely those doubts that

(08:20):
you know, like what if what if it's bad? What
if it's not all good? Because it says, like, you know,
God keeps his promises in the Bible like everything is good.
But for me, it's like a lot of my joy
if your life comes through like battling and experience and
growth and saying hey I'm better than I was, you know,

(08:45):
a year ago. But that doesn't really happen in heaven.
It's apparently supposed to be just like all good and
all great.

Speaker 1 (08:55):
And I'm like, what the heck?

Speaker 3 (08:58):
How do I you know, like, and it's always forever changing.
It says it's never going to get boring, and I'm like,
am I going to be able to play skate four?

Speaker 1 (09:09):
You know?

Speaker 3 (09:10):
It's like I like, yeah, they.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
Might have heaven is definitely full of skate four setups
for sure. That's absolutely positive. Yeah, skate four. They got
grand theft Auto seven up there, it's great. Before my
death interesting so well, okay, because one of the questions
I was gonna ask you is like why, I mean

(09:33):
just the simple one of like why are you afraid
of eternity? And I guess one of the ways you're
answering it is like, okay, so in eternity, if everything
is always great and amazing fucking awesome forever, and we
live in utopia and there's heaven and everything is an
orgasmic beam of eternal light and sunshine and harmony for
all of Attorney forever, and Jesus is there and he's
jacked and everyone has a billion dollars and whatever the

(09:56):
you know what I mean, It's like, how how is there?
How is their measurable growth?

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Right? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (10:04):
And that's what makes you guys, what gives you happiness?

Speaker 1 (10:08):
That's that's a big part. I feel like, you know.

Speaker 3 (10:14):
You can be that's go ahead, go ahead, Yeah, sorry,
I feel like it's the idea of the sun shines
brighter the harder it rains.

Speaker 1 (10:24):
Yeah, you know, like how.

Speaker 3 (10:28):
It's so confusing in my head. One just the idea
of existing forever, but two, like, how how do I
measure happiness without sadness? Because like I've seen some i'd say,
some really bad stuff in my life, like I was
saying with my brother, and There's been a lot more

(10:48):
traumatic things as I've grown up. But I feel like
where I'm at now, Like I just got married. I've
been married for three months, and like it's like I've
I feel this thing that like I have so much
I don't know how to explain it. Like I like,

(11:10):
I built this thing from the ground up, and so
I'm proud of the fact of where I've got to.
And so it's like if I just enter heaven, it's like, oh,
here's your house, here's your million Jesus dollars, here's your
you know, like I'm just kind of like, okay, but
what do I have to do? You know, Like what's
my sense of purpose?

Speaker 2 (11:31):
Yeah? If I'm going to be there forever, well, I mean, yeah, dude,
I have I got tons of thoughts about this is
how did you were your parents Christians?

Speaker 1 (11:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (11:51):
So my it's kind of crazy. Actually my family like
two or three generations up actually we're the earliest Mormon
settlers in the US, so all of Utah and I
don't know if you know, like I think it's called
Bear Lake was actually settled by His name is Charles
Colson Rich And so my family's Mormon coming all the

(12:14):
way down the line. And then when it came to
my mom, my mom said screw this U and converted
to Christianity. And so yeah, it was like kind of
since I was born, like I was dedicated at my church.
And I'd say, growing up, I kind of always went
to church because that's just what my parents had me do.

(12:35):
But then I dated some girl and was like, I
want to kind of figure out my own life. And
after she was she was pretty abusive to me for
three years, and so after that I kind of, i'd say,
really like laid my life down to Christ. So that's
been i'd say two or two or three years, and

(12:55):
like my wife now I'm at a church and it's
been pretty good. It's just yeah, i'd say, like, realistically,
my actual beliefs only started about two or three years ago.

Speaker 4 (13:09):
Do you.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
Do you when did you when did you start to
believe or I guess arrive at the conclusion that there
is this definitive eternal life in heaven.

Speaker 3 (13:30):
I'd say probably, jeez, dude, I'd probably like in my
teens somewhere, I'd say like fourteen to sixteen, did I
really like because I was going to church with my
family a lot, and they're always like, you're going to
go to hell if you you know, if this doesn't
work out or if this doesn't work out, you need
to you know, be this way and be you know.
I guess it wasn't like be this way, but.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
It's like, you know, you gotta believe in Christ and
go to heaven.

Speaker 3 (13:56):
I'm like, okay, cool, well that's like ultimate goal, right,
And I'm like, what am I going to enjoy about
this ultimate goal? And I started really sinking into it
and it's like it's weird because I've I was talking
to pastors and stuff and I tell them like I
felt like I was crazy because I'd be on Reddit.
I'd be like looking up why do I have a
fear of eternity? And there's like a Reddit thread called

(14:18):
a perophobia and there's apparently a lot more people that what.

Speaker 2 (14:22):
Do people on that Reddit thread say? What kind of
like other people who are dealing with this. What do
they have to say about it?

Speaker 3 (14:29):
It's well, it's not just for Christianity, it's for everything.
And so it's like some people have the fear of like, oh,
when I'm dead, I'm I'm gonna never be alive again.
You know, I'm just gonna float off into the cosmos.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
But there's other people that do.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
Kind of have the same things. For me, I actually
read an entire research paper that this guy made for
his college class. It was for like theology, but it
was called like four and against Eternal Life, and he
basically explains, like, you know, how God is as he

(15:09):
is stated in the Bible, and basically what his fears were,
and then what the pros and cons were of having
eternal life, and so it I mean I read it
in it like kind of helps, but it kind of didn't.

Speaker 1 (15:28):
And so.

Speaker 3 (15:31):
It's just it's weird. It's kind of just people saying
the same thing. Sometimes people kind of get over over
time and they say, I keep this thing, And a
lot of people are just saying, like, if it's within
your belief, you have to believe that God is greater
than like what these fears are being stirred up against. Yeah, yeah,

(15:52):
it's like the idea of.

Speaker 1 (15:56):
Letting go.

Speaker 3 (15:59):
And just like like Nirvana, you know, like letting go
and being in that state and let.

Speaker 2 (16:04):
Me it's sorry, I want to you're Before I cut in.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
I was just gonna say it's weird, but you're good.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
Well, let me say this, for for me to have
this conversation with you is yeah, you know, I talk
on the podcast a lot about like existential crisises and
thinking about death and thinking about eternity and thinking about
the big questions and really, like you know, I had
a whole period of time for most of this year.
I feel, I fucking feel great now. I feel the

(16:33):
best I ever have. But for most of this year,
I felt like I was in outer space and I
took my helmet off and I had to be directly
confronted with the these like big questions. And I thought
about like God, and I thought about, yeah, these big
questions of eternity and death and nothingness and and and whatnot.

(16:57):
And I I've become increasingly increasingly agnostic because I think that, like, well,
I think that God and the idea of like like
the idea of like submission, like what you just said

(17:19):
when you talked about like God's plan, you know, and
submitting to God's plan and letting go I whether or
not I'm I'm not a I'm not a Christian, and
I don't think I believe in any sort of like like,

(17:42):
I don't I don't think there's like a dude in
a heaven necessarily. But gain again, I'm becoming becoming I'm
becoming further further agnostic towards the idea of there being
some kind of like unseen plain or dimension or it
could all just be you know, I don't know. Yeah,

(18:04):
but anyway, anyway, God's plan, right, okay, And this is
And by the way, if you're listening to this and
you're like, what the FI, don't there's no God or whatever,
it's like, that's not You're not It's not the point.
It's not about a physical God. There is. Logically, God's
plan in the sense of the universe continues to march forward,

(18:28):
not with any kind of like a gentic plan made
by a God, but it marches forward.

Speaker 1 (18:36):
And you, you, and.

Speaker 2 (18:37):
You and you and you are on it. And it
contains an unfathomable bull amount of uncertainty. And I think
God and God's plan is an allegory for that uncertainty, Okay,
And so there's something to be said about submitting yourself

(19:05):
to that uncertainty a ka in your case as a Christian,
submitting yourself to to God's plan. And I think there's something, uh,
extremely peaceful about that. And I almost think that the

(19:25):
the crisis. Also, some people never have the crisis. They
just never have it. I don't know how you live
on this fucking planet and you never have the crisis,
but some people.

Speaker 5 (19:34):
Never have it.

Speaker 2 (19:35):
You're blessed, You're You're blessed enough truly to be endowed
with the gift of the realization of the of the
of the insane cosmic predicament that you're in. Yeah, and
it's it's diabolically uncomfortable. It's diabolically uncomfortable. And when I

(19:57):
was in it, I thought I was going to have
to kill myself. I thought, I thought, but there was
no return back to you know, eating a slice of
pizza and talking about a movie I just saw. You know,
I thought there was no return. And I since feel
very returned. I since feel even more at harmony with

(20:21):
you know, the the fucking matrix or whatever that we're
living in that we have are uncertain about if you
know it's it's real. And I can speak on that
as my personal experience, and I'll say that what people
are saying in that separated about submission to God's plan.

(20:43):
And again people get all crazy about like religion and stuff,
and it's like, you don't have you don't have to
believe in God to know to like submit to God's plan.
If you believe God's plan is just an allegory for
the uncertainty that we have about in the universe, like
consciousness and eternity and where we you know, uh uh

(21:04):
how we're able to do all the amazing fucking things
that we do as conscious beings. But I think it's uncomfortable,
but you kind of gradually learn to submit yourself to it,
and uh there's a lot of love and realizing that

(21:25):
everyone you're in the same unfathomable cosmic predicament as every
single other living thing and person around you, and you're
all going to submit together as this collective consciousness and
it's it's it's kind of beautiful and it's going to

(21:48):
be whatever it is, and you're not alone. You're the
universe experiencing itself and you'll be okay, and then you
can go, uh, you know, fucking watch a movie and
jack off. I know you're trying to not jack off,
but you know.

Speaker 1 (22:07):
Yeah, let's not let's not do that.

Speaker 3 (22:09):
No, but I completely understand what you're saying, Like I
feel like, whether or not you believe or not, you're
still on this fucking train man, You're you're still marching
towards the end.

Speaker 2 (22:22):
And so for me, I'm sorry. I mean, it's not
about it's not about I don't know if it's about belief.
I think it's about submission.

Speaker 3 (22:32):
Yeah, well it's like whatever, Like yeah, that makes sense,
Like what whatever it is you have to submit.

Speaker 1 (22:40):
To the train.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yes, you have to submit to the.

Speaker 3 (22:43):
Trarain is continually going forward, and then you're just whenever
you're done, whatever happens. It's like, okay, like you you
made it to the end of that train ride.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
And there's also sorry, go ahead.

Speaker 5 (22:56):
One of you.

Speaker 1 (22:57):
No, you're good.

Speaker 3 (22:58):
I was just gonna say for me, it's like it's
kind of cool like you and I both in the
general sense, have had the same you know, like like
you were saying, like the I don't know how people
get through life without having this happen to them. Yeah,
but it's like for you that brought you to even
more of going like, Okay, well I'm not gonna I

(23:20):
don't think there's any like, you know, God in heaven,
you know type of a thing is just God is
like the universe, which is nuts because that's actually like
directly what my brother believes. For me, it's pushed me
more into it and that makes sense. Yeah, it's like
gnarly because it's like I'm more uncomfortable as I go on,

(23:41):
but it's like I do find that sense of peace
of like I'll watch a movie or whatever and I've
it's like I almost break the fourth wall in the
movie and I'm like, oh, yeah, that's just an actor.

Speaker 1 (23:51):
That's house. Are gonna die? Yep, you know yep.

Speaker 3 (23:54):
And so it's like all of us, we're we're the
entire generation that we are all living in. It's like
in one hundred and fifty years we're all gone. There
will be a complete new cycle of new people that
will be on there.

Speaker 2 (24:07):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (24:10):
It's weird.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
It's not it's not. It's it's what's your name again, Malachi, Malachi?
I think you have I still have existential crisises, and
I'm not like, uh uh, I'm figuring this out with

(24:33):
you as I'm trying to gain greater clarity on it.
But I've been thinking about it a lot lately, and
I think that there is there's a so because you're
you know what it is. Part of is is like
your there's a sense of like ego, I think, and

(24:53):
I have. I have tons of ego for sure, and
I and I care a lot about like what I'm
ex experiencing is my own life, especially when I'm not
especially when I'm not you know, having esoteric conversations and
I'm just going about my and I'm deeply entrenched in
the fucking matrix in my day to day, which is
ninety five percent of the time. But there's something truly

(25:20):
extremely peaceful because I assume that's what your mind and
body want, is peace, because you know it's such a
deeply uncomfortable position. But you'll find I think you can
find peace in like probably two things, which is one

(25:41):
is deciding like on the on the ego side of
the spectrum, is like deciding what is going to give
you meaning and progression in your own experience of your
own life, which you talked about already because you were like,
I like, that's what I like about my life. You're like,
I built this thing with my life. I'm building this career.

(26:01):
I that's you know, have heaven sucks ass. It's like
the game is on, you know, one hundred completion. I
want to play the fucking game. You're enjoying playing the game.
So that's good, that's real. That's that's that's where you
find uh peace on the one part, in the ego part,
and then on the uh on the flipping on the
on the uh on the whole thing of like, oh,

(26:24):
I have to at some point relinquish my ego and die.
There's something extremely beautiful about submitting to about coming to
complete terms with the fact that, uh, the world you
live in is unfathomably beyond you and bigger than you,

(26:49):
and UH, when you've come face to face with that,
there's actually a lot of peace in there. I think
there's a lot of peace in I'm gonna I'm gonna
just die, dude, and and everything else that's beyond me.
I served my own purpose that I created within the
framework of my ego by fucking uh loving my wife

(27:11):
or raising kids or starting a podcast, or playing Tic
tac toe or eating a sandwich, and or just or
just living or just purely just existing. It's fine fucking too.
And I served my own little the part of that
I could control within like my ego state. And then

(27:33):
and then outside of that, I'm just everything beyond that,
uh is I I fucking accept to be beyond me
and I submit to it. And there's peace in that.
I think people want to I don't. I don't get
why everyone wants to be in control of things all
the time. You're searching for control. You have control of it,

(27:54):
you have you have I mean, this is when you
this is when we start getting into like politics and
economics and what not. Is in the ego part is
like how much control do I have over the the
part of the matrix that I live in, right, And
that's when you get into That's when you get into
the politics and economics and whatnot, and that's its own thing.

(28:16):
And then everything beyond that you but everything everything beyond
that is you just have to submit yourself too, because
it's not uh, it's just fucking beyond you. You have
to submit yourself to it.

Speaker 3 (28:28):
Well, that's like one of the biggest things that the
Bible does teach too, is like being content with everything
and right now on earth, like existence as a whole.
Like there's as a version that says like we return
as dust, like as we've been made, you know, because
we're just freaking dirt or part of the earth. Yeah,

(28:51):
now the earth go back into it. And so it's, uh,
that's totally makes sense.

Speaker 1 (28:55):
There's just like.

Speaker 3 (28:57):
There's a piece that happens when you just say, screw it,
I am a little tiny ant on earth that nothing
really matters. Everything matters. Why not just like eat a
freaking cheese steak and watch TV with my wife, Like
why am I worrying about this?

Speaker 5 (29:18):
You know.

Speaker 2 (29:19):
It's it's very funny and interesting to hear you say
that your existential crisses and realizations and questionings have brought
you deeper into Christianity. It makes a lot of sense,
especially when you're reading the book that says like you know,
from dust to dust. Then you're like, that makes fucking sense,
and it's probably why Christianity is still I mean it's like,

(29:42):
I mean, how old. I guess Christianity is technically twenty
twenty five years old?

Speaker 1 (29:48):
Right? Yeah? No, yeah, I think okay.

Speaker 2 (29:54):
I mean that's why it stood the test of time
is because it has this like framework of uh answers
to great questions. It's been unfortunately, it's got a bad
rap because it's been unfortunately co opted into like for
like lots of like horrible stupid things that take it

(30:16):
so deeply, deeply far away from the.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
Yeah, no there, and that's I know exactly what you're
talking about, unfortunately, And that's the thing that sucks is
that like for you, for instance, it's like if there
was anyone else that was you know, like that, they
can't really have a conversation with other people. They're like,
you have to believe in this. But like my brother,
for instance, he believes exactly what you're saying. He's you

(30:45):
guys are I would like to see that conversation. But
it's like, shut up, just let people be human. Like
there is literally averse saying, don't have freaking stupid arguments,
Like if you're gonna tell any and about me, tell
them peacefully and then leave them the hell alone. And
it's like that makes the most sense. Like it's like

(31:06):
why am I gonna like one of my best friends,
I brought him to church last week he came out
as gay to me, but he was like, yeah, I
want to go to church. I'm like cool, sick. I
like brought him over. I was like, how is things
and he's like good, He's like I just want to
check with out. I'm like cool, have a good night.
You know, like like why why am why are you
gonna it sucks?

Speaker 5 (31:27):
Right?

Speaker 6 (31:27):
No?

Speaker 5 (31:28):
Right?

Speaker 2 (31:28):
The ethos of the thing is like a submission, and
it's like a fucking submission and acceptance of what is,
and then to use it to like make people like
feel bad about being gay is like is uh is stupid?

Speaker 1 (31:47):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (31:47):
No, Like I had a conversation with him. I was like,
so with you going here, I was like, that doesn't
change anything. I'm assuming. He's like, nope, absolutely not. He's
like I just wanted to check it out. I'm like cool, man, like,
it's not my place to tell anyone. And even more so,
it's like that's so stupid. In the Bible, it says
multiple times like God is the only judge. Why the
heck are you judging people? Like like it's just and

(32:10):
then you push them into the sense of existential threat.

Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yeah again, No, I totally. I I from having an
existential crisis. I get why why it brings you closer,
but it brought me close to God. It just as
an it's just as an allegory, like it's a fucking allegory,
you know, like God. And I've always thought it was
an allegory. I don't I know, and I don't know
what your belief is, but like it's not a I

(32:35):
don't know if I believe in it as like a
fairy tale. I don't know if there's like a a
unilateral force or like a higher being or like a God,
like a you know, a god God. But God as
an allegory for the answer. God is an allegory for
then the unknown and the yeah, you know, and at

(32:58):
all it's it's it's it's funny because it's, uh, it's
this all this conversation we're having. It sounds a little woo,
but it's also really not. It's really like grounded in
the acceptance of the unknown, which is like empirically unknown. Yeah,

(33:22):
and we don't even know if it can we and
they and part of part of the undude, the part
of the unknown is it's unknown if the unknown can
become known?

Speaker 1 (33:33):
Yeah, man, it's God.

Speaker 2 (33:34):
I know this. I I get. I get where you're
coming from, man, because this conversation it just really makes
me want to fucking jerk off and watch a lot
of porn and and zone out. You know, I get
you you're struggling with Tell me more about the tell
me more about the porn thing if you want ship Yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:51):
Oh god, okay, yeah no, that's a that's a loaded question.
I don't know how time we have, but.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
We have as much as much time as you have.

Speaker 3 (34:03):
Okay, No, man, I just I grew up with a
lot of really messed up things happening to me. I'd say,
like I my parents, my dad was gosh, I'm really
gonna have to be careful.

Speaker 1 (34:18):
Who I show this to if you end up posting it.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
But I will. I just want to let you know
because I I I am going to post this as
a podcast. This is I'm gonna post the podcast, and
so like for real, you like, if there's things that
you don't want to share, you don't want to talk about,
or you don't want to you know, get too deep
in like don't feel like you have to, or we

(34:43):
we can we can just bullshit. It's totally whatever as
much or as little as you want to fucking talk
about it as you want.

Speaker 3 (34:50):
No, I'm I'm I'm down to talk. It's more so
like I really I don't have a good relationship with
my father, but I mean I'm not gonna like show
him Hey I was a look you know anyway way, Yeah,
I'm good my dad. My dad was like a crazy, deadbeat,
drunk dad growing up, and so a lot of stuff
slipped the cracks when I was growing up, and like

(35:11):
I've been like sexually touched a lot when I was
growing up, from like friends and crap. And then my
dad he like I remember vividly like watching him throw
wine bottles across my kitchen into the bathroom at my
mom and crap like that.

Speaker 1 (35:32):
And so.

Speaker 3 (35:34):
Over time, like I realized that I wasn't really getting
a lot of love at all, and so I feel
like I tried to search for the best way that
I knew how to, which growing up was sexually. And
so I started, like, like I want to say, because

(35:57):
I lost my virginity when I was fifteen, and I
think I was in eighth grade, and so it was
like from there, I was just kind of like whatever
says goes, you know, like it doesn't matter. I'm just
trying to find those one off experiences over and over
and over again. And so it was probably for like

(36:19):
my eighth grades through like three fourths of high school,
I just kind of looked for sex wherever it was,
and if someone wanted to do it, then I was like, Okay, sure,
I'm down. And it made me feel good about myself
and it made me feel like I was like loved
and people actually liked me and that I wasn't some

(36:41):
like weirdo dude that was just hanging about. And I
think that really pulled into like pornography as well. And
so it's like to this day, like I struggled pretty
badly with like what I would say is temptation on it,
and it's like something that my wife and I have been,

(37:01):
you know, we talk about and you know, if I
mess up, it sucks, and my wife and I go
through like what I can do better next time, And
I feel like, regardless of you know, belief or whatever,
I feel like it definitely like pornography itself has a
can have a very detrimental impact on your mind. You know,

(37:24):
like it's like the idea of like Instagram and doom scrolling.
You you have a new source of material and content
every five seconds, and it's like with pornography, you have
a new source of do you know what color hair
and who and why? And it's just like you don't get.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
Well, I'm curious about this, and I've completely one hundred percent.
And I think a lot of people, you know, I
only know it from the male side, but I assume
both men and women. A lot of people, yeah, are
like can relate to you on the road of like

(38:08):
constantly seeking like like novel sexual experiences as a way
to like like gain self esteem, you know. I mean,
it's it's it's a it's a huge classic. I'm curious though,
how that manifests itself in porn, because yeah, novel sexual

(38:29):
experiences definitely give you that like short term self esteem boost.
But I don't I've never experienced porn doing that.

Speaker 3 (38:39):
Yeah, I really don't know how to, I guess. Let
me try to fathom and figure out like how I
don't know how to explain it. I guess like for me,
I grew up like always kind of chebby and I
don't know why. But like growing up I've had like

(39:01):
my brother or you know, people and friends tell me stuff.
And so when my brother I have two brothers, when
my other brother ended up committing suicide, and like the
idea of death really set in and then the existentialism,
so I think everything that ties into itself too. But
it was like, I'm going to die, and it's like,
what's the first thing that everyone's been telling me that

(39:21):
like I can't die about. And it's like, oh, well,
if you're overweight, then you know you're going to have
a heart attack or whatever. And so it's like I
feel like the overweight side of it. It was like
if I'm watching porn, I don't have to, you know,
like be all sweaty and breathing hard over some person

(39:46):
that I'm attracted to.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
You know.

Speaker 3 (39:50):
It's like I just get the it's a little selfish.
I just get the good parts of it, like the
parts that make me feel good and like, you know,
the dopamine that releases. No one has to see me
gross and naked and that's cool, you know. And so
I guess for me growing up, it was like, yeah,

(40:10):
it was like there was a sense of comfortability within
that where it's like no one knows that I'm doing this.
I can do it whenever I want to just feel
a little better and like and it's like like I
was saying, like you anything you want, it's there, like

(40:32):
the flick of your fingertips. Online is crazy. You can
look up anything and it's just there. And so.

Speaker 1 (40:42):
I guess that would be like the best way I
can explain that.

Speaker 2 (40:46):
I'd say, yes, yes, well, I mean, yeah, it's it's
everything that you want and you don't have to involve
another person in it, and it can just be quick,
easy and give you the same you know, keep the

(41:07):
train of whatever it is you were searching for going.
But yeah, yeah, interesting, So how do you how do you? Uh,
what's your wife's take on it?

Speaker 3 (41:23):
My wife, I mean, like I said, we're both Christians,
so the there's a very big idea of you know,
no sexual immorality and so it's pretty gnarly. Like I
went from doing a lot of stuff with a lot
of people too, I went to church, I found my wife,
and my wife was a virgin and she like told me,

(41:48):
you know, absolutely not, We're gonna get married and do
things like the the way that you're supposed to. And
I said, okay, cool, that sounds.

Speaker 1 (41:55):
Good with me.

Speaker 3 (41:56):
So we went through like our entire relationship where together
for a year and a half before we got married,
and then you know, everything happened to her. But along
that ride of the year and a half, obviously an
abstaining through like no sex and trying to do no porn, there.

Speaker 1 (42:19):
Was a lot of.

Speaker 3 (42:21):
Sucky conversations and things that would you know.

Speaker 1 (42:24):
Hurt her a lot.

Speaker 3 (42:25):
Obviously. I've tried to explain, you know, like I guess
how how I feel with it, and that it really
doesn't have anything to do with her. But dide, I
honestly could just like ask her and put her on
the phone.

Speaker 2 (42:48):
We can, we can, we can, we can leave her
out of it. But can I ask you? I want
to ask you another thing. Uh, why do you believe
that there is inherent morality in uh sexuality?

Speaker 3 (43:05):
I don't think there's an inherent in sexuality itself. I
think it's I think, you know, like, sexuality is obviously
a gift from God. But I do believe that the
gift from God is for your person that you marry,
and it makes things like logically, if you're thinking about
this people as a whole, like I grew up with,

(43:26):
you know, my dad and my mom you know, had
sex before marriage and then they ended up having my brother,
which my brother is awesome, but it pulled them into
they felt coerced and forced to be in a marriage
that really did not work out, and my dad ended
up becoming very abusive and drunk. And it's like.

Speaker 2 (43:46):
Well, that's like your parents felt coerced into a marriage
by the fact that they reproduced.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
Yeah, and so well.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
But but but I'm asking about like uh like like
like like take reproduction out of it, you know what
I mean, Like where where is the inherent? Where do
you see inherent? Where do you see immorality in because like, okay, wa,
Actually I'm curious about this, right, Like I know a
lot of Christians try to, like you know, they try

(44:16):
to like fucking like like ban birth control or condoms
or you know all that, and like why why is that? Where?
Where is the what's the logic behind that?

Speaker 1 (44:33):
I would say that I have a.

Speaker 3 (44:36):
Condoms and birth control itself.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
I don't have.

Speaker 3 (44:39):
Any direct personally, I don't have any beliefs on I've
used both, so I don't have any like negatives against that.
I would say, like I do have a particular idea
but like behind like abortion itself, but that's obviously political,
and so I don't know, ah, how much conversation that

(45:03):
we can have on that.

Speaker 2 (45:04):
Well well well listen, listen, listen. Well let's talk about
I just like like I mean sex, It's like why,
like what's the immorality behind like just have like I
I because I'm I'm I think like with Christianity again,
like as an allegory for attempting to face and understand

(45:27):
and deal with the things that are unknown, makes a
lot of sense to me. But I think that like
there's certain things like, uh, there's certain things that are known, right,
which is that human beings are where our brains are

(45:48):
wired for us to just be crazy fuck machines and
like have sex all the time and like be like
so like it's like so so when someone like is
out like having sex with a bunch of people, like, yeah,
that makes that makes sense according to the empirical data
that we have on just the human brain, you know
what I mean, So like what is the what is

(46:14):
the the the the I guess the the philosophical opposition
to that.

Speaker 3 (46:21):
No, yeah, I would just say very much that very
much is determined, just like just off the belief itself.
It's kind of like you you either feel it's like
two sides of a quint. Yeah, they feel like it's
like why, why, what's the wrong with me, you know,

(46:42):
doing this with this person and then going and doing
this with this person, or it's or it's like me
where I feel like I went from that and then changed,
you know, halfway through and then said no, I'm gonna
like try and practice celibacy and do that for my wife.
And I would say, at least for me from a
personal sense, the when I was going around and doing

(47:11):
everything I was doing and being safe with it obviously,
but you lose a sense of sitting down with someone,
I feel like for a long time. And I mean like,
I know people in relationships are like, Okay, well we
have sex before marriage, and I that's cool. But I

(47:34):
feel like the idea of marriage first really brings in,
like you are committed to this individual's totally Yeah.

Speaker 2 (47:46):
I mean there's I think that, Yeah, if that's the
way that you want to run it, I think it's
totally legitimate. I think there's there's there's definitely something to that,
for sure. I think there's definitely something to that I
don't Yeah, I don't know. I don't know.

Speaker 3 (48:10):
This is again, it's a loaded one for me too,
because I've like I've been on both sides of it,
you know, and so it's like I only can explain
personally how changing has made me feel significantly better about myself.
And you know, like I have my one person, I
have my wife that is like well and.

Speaker 2 (48:30):
So well, this is well, this is the beauty of
the world that we live in. And also part of
the thing, one of one thing I've been thinking about
a lot lately is like, isn't it so fascinating that
different lifestyles and different philosophies and uh, you know, different
lifestyles and philosophies achieve different results in different people. You know. Yeah,

(48:56):
So i' mean, look, you went from, right, you went
from us letting it up around town to you know,
being a nice, married Christian man, and it seems as
though that is serving you and that's great. And then look,
there's probably fucking people who you know, became did the
opposite way from you, right, and that's serving them. And

(49:21):
that's actually one of the things I that's one of
the unknowns about life that I find truly fascinating is
that we do live in this world where all of
our consciousnesses are all wired differently and require different solutions
and different philosophies and different ways of being to be

(49:45):
compatible with them. I find that interesting. And I guess
the where things you know, I guess I guess where
people get pissed off at Christians is way or we're
honestly not even christ I'm not even Gonnay. I don't
want say Chritians or people get pissed off at really

(50:06):
anyone is where they attempt to espouse the philosophy or
the ideology that worked for them to be the one
true God. Like the idea of the one true God
is I think kind of douchey, because there's no if
there There can't we if we have such different wirings

(50:30):
in our consciousnesses such that you know, you can you
can be in a pollocule with five people and have
a rock and time uh. And you can also have
you know, the one person that you are is the
only person you have sex with uh forever and you
ever you have a rock and time doing that? You know?
Can there can there really be a a one true anything?

(50:55):
You can only really stand humbly before. I think. I
don't know. I guess you can only really stand humbly
before everyone and be like, hey, this is what I
think and what worked for me, and then period. And
then once you start being like, well, everyone should be polyamorous,
or everyone should be wait until marriage to have sex,

(51:21):
or everyone should be straight, or everyone should be this
or that is where you start pissing people off, because
that's that's incompatible with the world we live in.

Speaker 3 (51:29):
You know, yeah, well that's that's absolutely true. I feel
like like, at least for me, if my beliefs like
I'm one.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
I just I don't.

Speaker 3 (51:39):
I wouldn't even say I feel like I'm religious. I
feel like a lot of religion, like you were saying,
says to do things. I feel like what I believe
in is like I feel like someone's explained this to
you before, but I just like, I just follow Jesus Man.
I do what I read the Bible and I hear
what it says, and I try to do that as
much as possible. But the idea behind that is that,

(52:02):
like at least in Romans how it explains you, you
are going to want to do the things that your
carnal nation, like your your flesh and what like you
were saying like we're machines, like we're we absolutely are.
You're going to want to do what your body is
just wanting to do, and if that makes you feel good,

(52:22):
then I mean that makes you feel good, and you're
going to do it either way. I'm not here to
tell you one way or the other. You know what
you should be doing. What I am going to say
is that at least from my change and what I've felt,
there's a crazy great sense of peace beyond what I've

(52:46):
felt with anything else. That it's like mastering one's self.
That's like the idea of going into your carnal nature
and just freaking I.

Speaker 2 (53:00):
Go, oh yeah, sure, sure, I get I get what
you mean. I get what you mean. I get what
you mean.

Speaker 1 (53:05):
You're not a hedonist, not gonna lie.

Speaker 3 (53:11):
I don't know what that means.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
Heist is like, Okay, so you're you. You You get
off upon the idea that you possess this higher human
consciousness that can wrangle and maintain and overcome and usurped
the pleasures of the flesh that are that that your

(53:33):
consciousness is is is uh a prison to in in
your physical human body. You know the temptations of fucking,
uh laughy taffy and and uh, marijuana and porn and
and but but you have this like higher human consciousness
that is attempting to break free from the flesh prison.

(53:54):
And you believe that, uh you you you can and
you will over overcome and usurped the Yeah, the cardinal
pleasures or whatever. Yeah, audenis a hedonist would would would
say the opposite. A hedonist would go, Actually, the cardinal

(54:16):
desires is the one true God, and the cardinal desires
are to be are to be indulged and enjoyed. And
that's we were put up. We are our our biology,
our instincts are correct. My instincts are telling me too,

(54:36):
to fuck as much as possible, and to eat as
much as possible, and to to to uh do this
and do That's what my biological is. This, My body
is fucking telling me to do. It's it's real, it's here,
it's present, it's voices must be correct, and therefore I
must indulge. And you know what, the hedonist and the

(54:59):
the the hedonist and the Christian, they both die never
knowing if they both died never knowing which one of
them was right. I guess they both have some intuitive
sense of how their lifestyle. They both have some intuitive
sense whether or not there. They both have some intuitive

(55:24):
sense of whether or not their lifestyle is working for them,
and occasionally they have varying levels of being in tune
with whether or not there. Yeah, their lifestyle is working
for them. But yeah, that's why I'm That's why the
more I think about the world and life and shit,

(55:45):
I just become more agnostic because there's so many people
in so many variables, and it's all too complex, and
so I submit to it and I play Mario Kart
and I have a good time. What's your what's your
what's your name? Malachi?

Speaker 1 (56:04):
Yeah? Three.

Speaker 2 (56:09):
I hope you're doing okay, man. I know it's really
uncomfortable to be thinking about all this stuff all the time.
I hope you joined the living. I hope you. I
want you to know something I thought I was and
who knows what the future is like for me. But
I've only felt great for like a little over a month.
But the fact I I I thought I was never

(56:29):
going to be able to live a life beyond that discomfort,
and now I, at least for the past month, I have,
and so I I sincerely wish you a lot of
uh uh hope and uh you know a lot of
love in uh returning back to a version of your

(56:49):
life where you don't feel in such great discomfort and
that you even feel grateful for the discomfort you went through.

Speaker 3 (56:57):
Yes, I feel like I'm on I'm on the I
feel like I'm coming around it, Like I definitely like
I've almost tried to dive into my fear to overcome it,
if that makes sense. So I'm definitely I'm getting there.
I'm getting to the idea of, like you know, I'm
gonna do what I feel like in my beliefs and

(57:18):
try to be the best person as possible.

Speaker 1 (57:20):
But also like.

Speaker 3 (57:22):
I am an aunt, I also just wanted to play
Mario Kart and eat a freaking bag of doritosood so.

Speaker 2 (57:31):
Well, which everyone you choose? I wish you good luck, Thanks, Grek.
Is there anything else you want to say? The people
the computer before we.

Speaker 3 (57:39):
Go, Everyone says they're not prepared for this, and I
totally wasn't prepared.

Speaker 1 (57:50):
For this, But.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
You don't have to, Like, you can say no, you
can say no.

Speaker 3 (57:57):
Well, I feel like I want to say yes, but
like I want a shameless plug. I'm a photographer, but
I also I hate doing that ship man, realistically, I
hate I hate being like, hey, this person you know
has people that could also see my stuff.

Speaker 2 (58:11):
But you can do it. Yeah, I don't care. You
can do you can you can do whatever. You can
do whatever you want, but I'm gonna give you fifteen
seconds before I hang up on you.

Speaker 3 (58:20):
Okay, uh, limitless dot portraits. If you want to see
some photos, I think that's cool. If not, I don't care.
Ghek bless you, gak bless them.

Speaker 2 (58:31):
Thank you. Jeez, dear God, oh man, oh jeez, Rick.
That was cool. I liked that conversation. That was interesting.
It's hard to it's hard to have a podcast when

(58:54):
you're agnostic.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
You have to.

Speaker 2 (58:58):
Fucking whatever. Even even agnostics is a label, you know
what I mean. If you're truly agnostic, you can't even
you can't fucking be anything. It's hard because I feel
like having a podcast requires you to be very not agnostic.
Like the top podcasters in the world, they just they
just say stuff. You know, there's no question, there's no

(59:22):
eternal questioning. You just gotta say stuff. Maybe I should
start doing that, start saying things. I fully absolutely believe
that there is a in afterlife where I can play
Grand Theft Auto seven. No, I don't actually believe that,

(59:46):
but if I'm lucky, I'll get to play Grand Theft
Auto six. And I and and I by the way,
through everything, and you guys who listen to the podcast,
you guys know this, through everything, through all the existential whatever,
the through all the oh the Matrix and the God's
plan and blah blah blah, through everything. Who as long

(01:00:06):
as I get to play Grand Theft Auto six, I
don't give a fuck. Through everything, None of it matters.
Burn all the bibles. I just want to play Grand
Theft Auto six. That's all that matters. Hello, Hello, Hey,
what's your name? Brother?

Speaker 1 (01:00:27):
Hey, my name's Quincy. Dude. I can't believe I've gone on.
I've called you so many times.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
Quincy's a cool name. Quincy's like an old guy name,
but you sound like a young guy.

Speaker 1 (01:00:39):
I am kind I like to think I'm still young.
I'm twenty eight, but you know, getting up there, I let's.

Speaker 2 (01:00:47):
Talk about that. I'm twenty seven and I'm realizing that
you don't go back. We're only going forward. We're only
marching towards uh, you know whatever. And part of me
is was I spent a long part of this year
specifically being very terrified about that, but I'm coming to

(01:01:07):
accept it. I when I walk around I've probably talked
about this on the podcast a billion times already, but like,
walking around in New York is fun because you see
a lot of old people and they're they're living their
lives and doing things, and you know, it's like I'll
see like a fucking you know, guy in his fifties
and he's you know, he's he's out there, he's doing

(01:01:28):
his thing, he's living his life.

Speaker 1 (01:01:29):
So it's uh and hopefully that's gonna be you dude, hopefully.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
I hope. So, man, I hope. I'd love to make
it the eighty. If I can make it the eighty,
that would be cool, wouldn't it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:40):
I dude, Honestly, I don't know. I like see so
many people that get to up that age like eighty. Honestly,
mid sixties, mid to late sixties. It seems like that's
when of all like the health stuff that's in and honestly,
if if something could take me out before I hit
like health issues to be sick.

Speaker 2 (01:02:01):
Really, I but what about like, uh, I don't know. Uh,
what about mel Brooks? He's making space balls too, he's
ninety something, he's hanging in there.

Speaker 3 (01:02:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:11):
What about the fucking the Six Flags guy? I know
he's not real, but he's based off an idea.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
Yeah, you ain't lying, you ain't lying.

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
What were you gonna say just now? Oh?

Speaker 1 (01:02:25):
I was just gonna say, like, is that guy in
good health like mel Brooks? Is he in good health
making this movie? Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:02:32):
He'sn't good enough. He's in good enough health. I guess.

Speaker 1 (01:02:36):
I guess I just don't want to like you know,
you know, life can be difficult at a young age,
you know, mentally difficult, like hopefully by the time I
hit that that age, like I've pushed past all the
mentally difficult things. But then like I feel like it's
a slap in the face. You push past the mental
things and then life just smacks you with physical.

Speaker 2 (01:03:01):
It's true. Yes, you can never escape conflict of any kind.
You will always be pushing some sort of boulder up
a hill.

Speaker 1 (01:03:12):
Yeah. Sadly, I mean not sadly.

Speaker 2 (01:03:15):
Not sadly, not so well, I mean theoretically not sadly
if you're a fucking monk or whatever. You know the uh,
you know the myth of Sisyphis. We've talked about it
on the podcast before.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
Yeah, yeah, okay, what that that's basically his punishment is
just like always pushing that boulder uphill.

Speaker 2 (01:03:34):
He's always pushing a boulder up a hill, right, He's
always pushing the Sisyphus. He did something to some guy
and the thing guy made him push a boulder up
a hill. And now, I mean that's I guess that's life,
as you're constantly forced to push a boulder up a
hill in some way, no matter who you are, because
you are you're just you're a slave to the drudgery

(01:03:56):
of the passage of time. But because pushed, But you
gotta you gotta imagine that Sisyphus is happily engaging in
the task of pushing the boulder up the hill. I
only bring this up because I post I posted some
clip about I don't know if people remember the firefighter
who called in and talked about how.

Speaker 1 (01:04:18):
He uh the volunteer firefighter.

Speaker 2 (01:04:22):
Volunteer firefighter talked about how he lives life out of
existential spite, where he said he He said he feels like
Charlie Brown because Charlie Brown is always having optimism and
then having his optimism return uh defeated, and then having
optimistic again, and he's stuck in that cycle. I posted
a clip somebody on YouTube shorts commented saying, one must

(01:04:45):
imagine Charlie Brown as happy as a reference to one
must imagine Sisyphus is happy. And I thought that was
really funny. Anyway, Quincy, Quincy, what's up?

Speaker 3 (01:04:59):
Man?

Speaker 2 (01:04:59):
Is there something you called in? Do want to talk about?

Speaker 1 (01:05:03):
Honestly, dude, I've called them so many times. There's so
many things that I'd like to talk about with you,
But like I think, I just want to talk about
what's going on today, please, Like I'm just I'm sitting
at home. I'm actually tonight, I'm like hosting for like
I don't know, ten to fifteen people, and I've like

(01:05:25):
I've never hosted a single thing in my life, and like,
I don't I don't know what it is. I don't
like having people inside of my house. Like it's it's
like my bubble, you know what I mean. So like
inviting people inside of my home feels like this huge thing.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
Why are you doing it?

Speaker 1 (01:05:51):
So okay, why am I doing it? Because so not
that long ago, me and my old lady met another
couple that like they always invite us over to go
do stuff, Like they always host stuff at their house.
They always like to like invite us to go do stuff.

(01:06:12):
So I kind of feel like I need to in
some sense put effort into you know, this friendship that
we have by inviting them into my home and you know,
taking my turn hosting.

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
But it's fifth why but you're not You're not having
like a couple over for dinner. You know, you're doing
like a fucking fifteen person party.

Speaker 1 (01:06:36):
Well yeah, yeah, See I have this issue with like
I can't do anything, like I can't just like dip
my toe into like we'll invite these people over. See
how that goes. I have to do like the We'll
invite a bunch of people over and then I'm gonna
be stressed out on like but it'll be fine because
because I know like once I do it, it'll be okay.

(01:06:58):
But like it's just get to that point of actually
doing it, And.

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Why what are you stressed out about?

Speaker 1 (01:07:10):
I don't know, they're like people in my house and
like maybe they might let my cats out. Maybe they
might judge the way that I live.

Speaker 2 (01:07:21):
Well fuck them if they judge the way that you live.
Do you like these people that you're having in your house?

Speaker 1 (01:07:27):
Yeah? Absolutely do so?

Speaker 2 (01:07:30):
Then do you whantn't you enjoy having them over?

Speaker 1 (01:07:35):
I feel like I'm going to when it's actually happening,
but the moment's leading up until you know, you have
too much time to like think about stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:07:47):
Sure, sure, I don't understand this. This this makes no sense.
You're having a party with a bunch of your friends.
You should be excited.

Speaker 1 (01:07:58):
Well, Like, I don't want to make it sound like
I'm not, because I am. But at the same time,
I'm just like, I don't know. I guess I'm not
always like the center of attention, and I feel like
being that at at my house I have to like
do the whole song and dance of like entertaining and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:08:20):
What how does your wife feel about it?

Speaker 1 (01:08:23):
I think she is fine with it, Honestly, I don't
think she cares much.

Speaker 2 (01:08:30):
Okay, well, uh, well, what kind of what kind of
food are you going to have for these people?

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
I'm uh, you know, doing the good old us a cookout,
having you know hot hamburger.

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
Oh, so you keep it everyone outside? This is an
outside ordeal.

Speaker 1 (01:08:46):
Well, uh, that was the plan.

Speaker 2 (01:08:49):
But do you have a lot? Do you have a lot?
Do you have a do you have a yard or
a lawn or something?

Speaker 1 (01:08:53):
Yeah? I have like a small like backpath, Like it's
not small. I have a back patio that's got like
a backyard and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
So can you can you fit fifteen people in that
back patio?

Speaker 5 (01:09:05):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:09:05):
Yeah, okay, then here's what you do. This is okay,
here's what you do. Don't fucking let anyone inside the house?
Is can you get people? Can you get people to
the yard without having to go through the house. Yes, okay, great,
don't let anyone inside the house. Okay if they have
to use the bathroom, then then sure, if they have

(01:09:25):
to use the bathroom. But you guide people to the backyard,
and then you focus only on the yard because right
now you're stressed out about it. Oh, are they gonna
let the cats out? Are they gonna h judge the
crap I have on my walls? But you gotta maintain
the sanctity of your home by not letting these people
in it. You just focus on the yard. It'll take

(01:09:46):
all your stress right now, your stress is permeating throughout
the whole house. You only need to be stressed out
about the yard. That makes sense, makes sense.

Speaker 1 (01:09:57):
You know what, it does make sense. But it was
gonna be a nice day, but then you know, that
kind of changed. So now it's a little damp outside,
you know what I mean?

Speaker 2 (01:10:08):
How damp we talking?

Speaker 5 (01:10:10):
Uh?

Speaker 1 (01:10:11):
Right now it's not raining, but they are talking about thunderstorms.

Speaker 2 (01:10:15):
You're talking without thunderstorms.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Yeah, does that mean I should cancel?

Speaker 2 (01:10:20):
I think you should. Well, I think that, I think that.
I think I think that in combination with the fact
that you really don't want to do it, means you
should cancel. I think that, in combination with the fact
that you're severely dreading this event, could be a good

(01:10:42):
reason to cancel. Yeah, what's you gonna have everyone inside
your fucking house while it's thunderstorming out?

Speaker 1 (01:10:48):
I mean, if it come, what will I do? Just
be like? Yeah, sorry, guys, like you're gonna you either
enjoy getting wet and eating food out some song et
ass food outside.

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
But bro, just can't just cancel the party if it's raining,
you don't want to do it, What are you doing?
Why do you just cancel the party? I gotta fucking
some what I was gonna go to some party someone
canceled the other week. It was fine, nothing bad happened.
I forgot about it.

Speaker 1 (01:11:17):
How last minute cancelation was it?

Speaker 2 (01:11:20):
So it was maybe one or two days?

Speaker 1 (01:11:23):
Yeah? See this is like, you know, a couple like
two hours.

Speaker 2 (01:11:28):
Wait, wait, this is happening in two hours?

Speaker 1 (01:11:31):
Oh yeah, yeah, this is going down.

Speaker 2 (01:11:33):
It's fifteen people two hours. Ye yeah, Okay, I guess
you can't really cancel it. I mean you can you go, yeah,
you can do whatever you want. You know that, right,
it's completely there's no point. No one cares. No one
cares about you enough for your actions to matter in
any real, genuine way, shape or for him. And you
could say that about kind of anyone.

Speaker 1 (01:11:54):
Well yeah absolutely, maybe.

Speaker 2 (01:11:56):
Not really, I don't know. I just said that Eaven
a little bit. You could probably be the like, I
don't know, that's just that's just nihilism talking. But it's
it's a little true. Quincy, Quincy, what do you? What
do you? What's the food situation? Pizza cooking? Are you cooking?

Speaker 1 (01:12:21):
Oh?

Speaker 2 (01:12:21):
I'm cooking, like I got cooking for fifteen people you
really like made this so much harder for yourself than
I had to be.

Speaker 1 (01:12:30):
Well, you know, I like the I like to just
torture myself a little bit at a time, you know
what I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:12:36):
You were gonna say, you were gonna say you like
to cook, in which case I'd be like, that's wonderful.
But the other part do not?

Speaker 1 (01:12:44):
I do? I do? But I don't know, man, I
say it's one of those things for like, I have
anxiety about it. But I have always kind of wanted
to be like that guy that's like, oh, come on in,
come on over, and like I'll do We'll do stuff,
hang out, like have a big bar, have a cook out,
but like I just never.

Speaker 2 (01:13:05):
But you're not you know, you're not that guy.

Speaker 1 (01:13:10):
So let me ask you this, Yeah, wile, yes, do
you think that like exposure therapy is good or bad?

Speaker 2 (01:13:20):
Because like that, I think it's good. I think it's good.
Don't listen to me. I think it's good. I think
it's good. I think you should have your party. I
think I think by the I think I think you're gonna.
I think you should have your party, and I think
it'll be fine and you'll have a fun time, and
then you'll be like, all right, cool, we can maybe
we'll do that again. It's never going to be stressed.

Speaker 1 (01:13:40):
Well hopefully you know, maybe something while it happens, who knows,
but well, we'll think positive thoughts on.

Speaker 2 (01:13:46):
This one, Quincy, Is there anything else you want to
say to the people of the computer before we go?

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
Get bless you guys? Honestly, this this was this made
my whole day. Whether I cancel it or I have it,
just be able to talk to you with sweet dude, Hey.

Speaker 2 (01:14:02):
Let me the next time you're having it. I want
to come. Wait where do you live? You don't have
to give me your thing in Pennsylvania?

Speaker 1 (01:14:09):
Want Yeah, you want my social too.

Speaker 2 (01:14:12):
What part of Pennsylvania are you in?

Speaker 1 (01:14:14):
Soutful? I'm outside of Pittsburgh.

Speaker 2 (01:14:16):
Okay, all right, no, I'm probably I'm never going to
come to your house ever.

Speaker 1 (01:14:20):
Wh dude, you don't like Pittsburgh.

Speaker 2 (01:14:22):
No, it's what I you That's I don't like when
people say that I don't like. There's nothing I've loved Pittsburgh.
I think Pittsburgh is awesome, but I'm not going to
go there to go to your house.

Speaker 1 (01:14:33):
Well that's good. It's a fair enough point. Well, Gek,
I appreciate you taking my phone call.

Speaker 2 (01:14:40):
Thank you, Quincy, Quincy. I hope you have a good party.
Don't let don't don't stress yourself out. It will be
a good time.

Speaker 1 (01:14:47):
I'll do my best, beautiful.

Speaker 2 (01:14:50):
Wait, what do you wait? What are you cooking? You
never said what you were cooking?

Speaker 1 (01:14:53):
Oh, I told you I was doing like hot dogs, hamburgers.
I made some like oh.

Speaker 2 (01:14:58):
Yeah, oh right, yeah, I'm sorry. Yeah, you to tell
me that. Yeah, yeah, you got a barbecue. Wait, this
is gonna be awesome. Well, actually I might come to
Pittsburgh to come to your house. I can't make it
in two hours, though, but if you have another one.

Speaker 1 (01:15:08):
Maybe, I mean, if you you know, I'll shoot you
a d M a couple of weeks and you know,
I'll give you like a month's notice.

Speaker 2 (01:15:15):
Yeah, okay, better if I see.

Speaker 1 (01:15:17):
You're playing, like, if you're gonna gonna be doing a show, like,
I'll just hit you up maybe the next day. How fast,
hold on, before we go, how fast do you move
to city?

Speaker 2 (01:15:28):
How fast do I move city to city?

Speaker 1 (01:15:31):
Yeah? Like when you're out, like when you're out doing shows.

Speaker 2 (01:15:38):
It always it kind of depends. It's just like, yeah,
it always depends. There's no real like set time late.
I think when I first started, I wanted to spend
more time in each city, and now now I'm like,
I'm enjoying. I'm enjoying being at home a little bit more.
I get that by Quincy, you have a good time

(01:15:59):
at your Thanks Gek. I wonder what kind of desserts
he's gonna have.

Speaker 5 (01:16:11):
From Jerryanna?

Speaker 2 (01:16:14):
Hello?

Speaker 5 (01:16:18):
Hello, is this the Gek?

Speaker 1 (01:16:20):
Yes?

Speaker 2 (01:16:21):
Who is this?

Speaker 5 (01:16:23):
Oh? Snap, this is Jerryana Jerryanawa.

Speaker 2 (01:16:29):
Yeah, what's up, Jerryanna. How's it going?

Speaker 5 (01:16:33):
Hey man? The weekend? Just catching up on chores, boring
shit like that. By the way, I h I like that.
I mean I love all the conversations on here, but
the one about you know, religion and marriage, and I

(01:16:53):
just kind of wanted to follow up on that because
it's just so important to our society nowadays. Love. You know,
we need more to say now, but it's like, well, yeah,
we do need it.

Speaker 2 (01:17:07):
What's what was your take on the on that conversation?

Speaker 5 (01:17:11):
Well, well, the Colors seemed like a really sweet guy
and he was kind of like wasn't he kind of
talking about monogamy and how he's kind of like a
born again Christian something.

Speaker 2 (01:17:25):
I don't know if he was a born again Christian,
but a little bit.

Speaker 5 (01:17:27):
Yeah, okay, okay, So I really believe in commitment to
the person you love and at the same time, you know,
two things can be true at the same time. Uh,
just monogamy is just way too toxic. And no, I

(01:17:49):
don't believe in collyamor it works for other people too,
you know, but which the vibe.

Speaker 7 (01:17:54):
You know?

Speaker 5 (01:17:57):
But uh, the Modern day Philosopher, because you know, states
of love and being, that's like, that's all the School
of Life, right, Like you're talking about life being loved,
shit like that.

Speaker 1 (01:18:16):
You know.

Speaker 5 (01:18:17):
Have you ever heard of the Modern day Philosopher? Then
de patonce?

Speaker 2 (01:18:21):
No, I thought you were just talking about No, no,
I haven't. Who are they?

Speaker 5 (01:18:27):
I know'm kind of all over the place.

Speaker 8 (01:18:30):
But well, he actually founded this.

Speaker 5 (01:18:32):
University that's like in several.

Speaker 3 (01:18:37):
Countries.

Speaker 5 (01:18:38):
I think there's one in Canada too, but it's called
it literally called the School of Life. And he talks about,
you know, when it comes to religion, we honestly we
need to start cherry picking like the good things from it. Yeah,
and so I'll get back to my whole point. I
was going to get about monogamy and coxpic and stuff

(01:19:01):
like that, but like cherry picking religion because what I
found fascinating during COVID is like.

Speaker 7 (01:19:07):
I I I defaulted to practices in Islam without knowing it,
and then when I realized, I was like, oh shit,
you know, I'm definitely not Muslim, but this is very Muslim.

Speaker 5 (01:19:22):
How did you?

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
How did you accidentally become Islamic?

Speaker 5 (01:19:26):
Man? It's so cool, Like I, you know, we're all
stuck in our damn living quarters and or like scrambling
for things to keep us entertained, you know, things to do,
and we need a routine. Where's a routine? Right? And
I was like, okay, I need to find a routine
to be saying because I'm going insane. We're all going insane,

(01:19:49):
and so I, you know, I'm like, okay, first thing,
when I wake up in the morning, I'm just gonna stretch' stretch.
Then the day starts passing, you're like, shit, still like
cooped up here? What the hell?

Speaker 2 (01:20:01):
You know?

Speaker 5 (01:20:02):
You find something to do this or that, and then
you're like and then you get into meditating a little
bit here and there, and then I'm like, you know what,
I need to stretch again?

Speaker 2 (01:20:11):
I need?

Speaker 5 (01:20:11):
And then throughout the day I found myself like doing
the yoga pose. I think it's called like the something
cat pose.

Speaker 8 (01:20:22):
Or the ah or like do you know what yoga poses?

Speaker 3 (01:20:26):
Do you know what?

Speaker 5 (01:20:26):
Anyway?

Speaker 2 (01:20:27):
Sure? Sure? Sure?

Speaker 5 (01:20:31):
Well okay, so kid yourself. You're on a yoga mat
and you're sitting there and then you you curl over
your knees with your arms stretched out but your legs
are curled under you. Okay, that stretch. And then like

(01:20:52):
have you ever done yoga?

Speaker 2 (01:20:54):
I've done yoga a couple of times.

Speaker 3 (01:20:55):
Yeah, damn it.

Speaker 5 (01:20:59):
I wish I knew the name anyways. So and then
like my cat passed away a while that tragically for
all these reasons. And so I was like doing my
yoga stretches in front of in front of my little
shrine to my cat. And then I'm like, and the
in front of my fucking shrine for my freaking cat,

(01:21:20):
Let me pray. Let me just like pray to my cat,
who's like my heart, my freaking goddess, Like that's my goddess.

Speaker 3 (01:21:27):
Like that's.

Speaker 2 (01:21:30):
Well, why did you why do you? Why did you
say that? Monogamy is toxic. I'm curious what your philosophy
is on that.

Speaker 5 (01:21:38):
Well, I'm going to get back to that, but I
just want to say about how, like how I got
into like the practices of his mom.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
Okay, oh wait, sorry, you know what, I kind of
lost the threat of our conversation in my head.

Speaker 5 (01:21:53):
And that's okay, because I'm talking about doing yoga whom
the shrine of my cat.

Speaker 2 (01:21:57):
Okay, I forgot. Yeah, we're talking about how you came Islamic. Okay.

Speaker 5 (01:22:02):
Yeah, so I'm pound I'm gonna type egg. Got it.
So I'm like, so while I'm doing.

Speaker 8 (01:22:10):
Yoga throughout the day and finding things to do, I
start to pray after I do my little yoga cat stretch,
pose and try and I do that like five times
throughout the day.

Speaker 5 (01:22:21):
Early morning when when I wake up at five am,
stretch pray a couple other times throughout the day, and
by the time the end of the day, I do
my stretch and pray like five six times. And that
is actually the amount of times that Muslims pray. It's
like a five or six. And I'm like and and.

Speaker 4 (01:22:40):
I because because I was like, oh, I'm just all.

Speaker 5 (01:22:43):
Of a sudden, I'm praying throughout the day to my cat,
to shrine, my cat shrine, and I'm like, this seems.

Speaker 9 (01:22:49):
Like, wait, don't Muslims pray throughout the day?

Speaker 5 (01:22:52):
Two And I was like, how many times did you pray?
And it was an exact amount of time and I
was like, that's crazy. So and that but that really me.
It centered me. And you know, from that chaos of
the pandemic, I from their religion. You know, obviously I'm
not Muslim. I was raised in like a Christian type
of Methodist thing, which is still not even that, but

(01:23:14):
you know, and anyways, the philosopher guys talking about Adam
de Baton when he who when he was talking about
you know, takes of being and religion, and he's like,
you know, religion has a lot of great things in
it that help us with the complexities of being human,
you know, like if and so anyways, he said, cherry

(01:23:36):
pick the good things. And so I love that about Islam,
even though I don't believe in whole everything else that
I don't understand about it.

Speaker 2 (01:23:47):
But yeah, yeah, yeah, that's yes. Actually you accidentally practiced Islam, I.

Speaker 5 (01:23:54):
Guess, yeah, yeah, And so okay, and so going back to, uh,
how I find like monogamy toxic? Is that like even
though the practice of committing yourself to someone is beautiful
and needed, because I feel like love equals trust and respect.

(01:24:15):
I mean, without that, what do you have? You know,
if you don't trust the person, how can you really
love them? If you don't respect them, how can you
really love them? You got to have those two things?

Speaker 2 (01:24:28):
And so.

Speaker 4 (01:24:31):
Uh oh yeah, So anyways, and what were they saying about,
uh oh yeah, monogamy being toxic.

Speaker 5 (01:24:43):
So even though you even though committing yourself to someone
is really important, it's just.

Speaker 9 (01:24:53):
When you have children, you need to have more of
a tribe than just one women, like raising.

Speaker 5 (01:25:03):
All these kids. Yeah, well, it takes a village. And
the thing is about modern day society is obviously the
village is not right down the street. You got to
drive here and there, and then so you have kids
growing up in these nuclear households that so many of
us have experience without the grand parent down the street.

(01:25:24):
And and thank god, you know, some of us walked
out and did have those family members down the street,
which is great, but it's like becoming more and more
rare and like with that you know, mental health. Obviously
nowadays we're seeing with the pinnacle of narcissism of Trump
is so important and we don't have any policies to

(01:25:46):
keep these people out and anyway, so you have kids
being raised by just one person, not getting the eye
contact that they need to have a healthy core self.
And sure, I'm you know, I think, like a lot
of us, we read up on narcissism and things because
it's just so bad nowadays, which is an understatement, and

(01:26:11):
it talks about to have a healthy human psyche.

Speaker 2 (01:26:16):
Yeah yeah, you need, you need yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
I'm with you. I I I agree, I agree with
I agree with the sentiment that you know, I think,
uh sorry, I'm I've just been I think I'm losing
conversational steam. I think. You know what it is, every
every every podcast I have the every podcast, I have

(01:26:39):
the energy for one really good conversation that I put
at the beginning of the episode. And that's how that's
how I began to format this podcast. Is every every
every time I go to stream and do a podcast,
I have the energy for one really good conversation and

(01:27:00):
I put at the beginning, and then at the end,
I'm like and then you know, I start to I
start to lose steam.

Speaker 6 (01:27:06):
But I'm trying to well, I totally get it because
I'm I'm in healthcare and I happen to be I
happen to provide hygiene, and I have all these patients
throughout the day.

Speaker 5 (01:27:17):
By the end of the day they're talking about this that,
and I'm just like, I'm sorry, the caffeine is wearing off.
But I heard you.

Speaker 2 (01:27:24):
I just I care, but I yeah, what's your what's
your name again?

Speaker 5 (01:27:31):
My quote unquote name is Jerrana Marianna, uh like Tom
and Jerry Gianna, Jerryanna.

Speaker 2 (01:27:45):
Well, listen, Jerryanna, thank you for providing a alterned. I
do I get what you mean in terms of I
don't know. Well, here's the thing is is we're about
to there's lots of people probably in polycules who are
raising children that way, and so in our lifetime, yeah,
we'll get to find it's bad. I thought you said
it was good.

Speaker 5 (01:28:07):
Wait you said I thought you.

Speaker 8 (01:28:09):
I don't know what you said.

Speaker 5 (01:28:10):
I thought you said, like there's lots of people in
like in like capsules of like raging raising children like
that like a monogamous way.

Speaker 2 (01:28:21):
Polycles polycules.

Speaker 5 (01:28:25):
Oh like the polyamorous lifestyle.

Speaker 2 (01:28:27):
Yeah, but we'll get to we'll see how those people
turn out. Maybe they're amazing, maybe they're maybe everyone, maybe
they're awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:28:35):
Well, the problem with the poly lifestyle is that they
should be I think they should be more like with
with again, going back to cherry picking good things out
of religion, right, Like I like the commitment with Christianity,
but with Islam you can also have several wives. And
I happen to be like bisexual, and I don't understand

(01:28:57):
how women are like, oh yeah, I'm just gonna be
with this man forever. That's it. Like, but also I
don't want to be going out to different people having
sexual romantic connections. Like I want to have one good
good I want to have one good Betty, who's my
ride or die wife?

Speaker 2 (01:29:15):
Sure?

Speaker 5 (01:29:16):
And then also we have our husband, and like, why
not fucking do that? Like everyone stop going insane with
one person.

Speaker 2 (01:29:25):
Stop it nice. That sounds nice, It sounds nice.

Speaker 5 (01:29:29):
But I know that I'll let you I'll let you go.
I'm glad we got the chat, and I just want
to get that out there about uh love. So thanks
for having me on the show.

Speaker 2 (01:29:43):
Of course, thank you. And next time you pray to
your cat, you know, put in a good word for
me too. In case if your cat I'll tell y'all,
just in case, if your cat does end up being
the one true God, I want I want some favor
with them, all right, man, I will all right? Later,
have a have a have a I'm sorry, what did
you say? Your name was? Again? It starts with the
jay I have a good one, Jerryana YouTube guy. Later, Well, folks,

(01:30:13):
that was it. We did a therapy Gecko podcast. We
talked a lot about life. We learned a lot of stuff,
like hop in those Spotify comments or those Apple podcast
reviews or those YouTube comments. I want to know what
people thought about these conversations. We had some pretty dense
conversations on this episode. I want to know what the

(01:30:34):
people thought. I hope people. I hope people understood what
we were trying to say. And if not, that's okay too,
because it's fine. Thank you guys very much for listening,
Thank you for being here. Thanks for continuing to indulge

(01:30:54):
me as I as I do this podcast, and and
continuing to indulge the people that call in. Uh, this
is fun. I feel very honored to get to wax
philosophy with strangers, and thanks for listening.

Speaker 1 (01:31:09):
Rep KT goes on the line taking your phone calls
every night.

Speaker 2 (01:31:13):
The repin Can goes doing a ride.

Speaker 3 (01:31:15):
He's teaching you about in the middle of your life,
but he's not really an expert.

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Host

Lyle Drescher

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