September 18, 2024 • 49 mins
Tamika and Mysonne discussed the importance of community engagement, voting rights, and financial security, focusing on the "Vote or Else" campaign and the need for resources to support such initiatives. They also highlighted the significance of the voter else day of activation and the importance of economic stability for black men. The conversation concluded with discussions on the need for inclusive spaces in the Democratic party, the importance of unity and strategic efforts to counteract division, and the commitment to continue organizing and advocating for change.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
I'm Tamika d Mallory and it.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Shit Boy my son in general.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of TMI.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Inspiration, Name New Energy. What's going on? My Son Lennon?
Speaker 2 (00:17):
What's going on? Tamika May How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm good. I'm good. You know, it seems like the
last few weeks we've really been live and in the action.
TMI has been on the road. So many things happening,
you know, so many people are outside right now, folks
who are either engaged in voter engagement work or people
who are doing just the normal day to day work
(00:42):
organizing and communities. There's a lot that's happening. And you know,
I think, I really know that you share the sentiments
that it is good to know that our audience that
they're sticking with us through the transition of you know,
us being more outside. You know, in this time, I
(01:05):
guess we always are outside, but it seemed like as
we dip zag across this country and meet with more people,
it feels more logical, if you will, to really take
the voices of the people from the community rather than
(01:27):
having to you know, excuse me, rather than having to
you know, sort of invite folks to come to us.
We're going out to where our people are and bringing
their voices and making it one with TMI, and so
I'm excited about it. I now think I need a
microphone or some type of device connected to my phone
(01:49):
because I see other people doing that and I was
thinking today I need to get some type of device
so I could be like, you know, hooked up and
profect to know what my outside recordings.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Yeah, I agree. I think I think we actually have.
They gave us those little mics. I really see a
matter of fact, I have it in my house. I
just never hooked it up to my phone. But I
guess since we are traveling and doing a lot of
improm too podcasts to where you know, we're on the
moment and we're meeting with different individuals and we might
need to interview like today, you know, it was one
(02:25):
of those days where we should have just interviewed so
many different people. But you know, the discussion that we
had today was amazing. Shout out to everybody you know
in Detroit. We're in Detroit right now and we had
a dope panel. I don't want to mention everybody but
I don't want to mention anybody and mention and forget anybody.
(02:47):
So I'm just saying it was a great panel. A
lot of different names. If you can think of something,
I could probably feel. Most of the.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Men here, Yellow Paine, Yeah, uh, Freeway Killer, Mike, push
your T, push your T, Joe tak It, Edie, Joe take.
Our moderators were wayno and also Britney Pacnet and Pastor
(03:18):
McBride who's coming up right now as a guest for
this evening, for this show. And uh, there was some
other folk. Of course, our brother Philip Agnew.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
And this a mm hmm Black Sam brother. Another I
forgot his cousin that was deal with him, so I
forgot his name. Also, I swear Visit was there. That's
my that's my guy. You know what I'm saying. It
(03:53):
was And it was a it was a very dope conversation,
just getting everybody's perspective and just hearing you know, where
we are in the world right now, not just polities,
but just in general. Like it was very empowering talking
about financial security, talking about entrepreneurship and how we should
(04:15):
be utilizing our resources and building with each other and
creating generational wealth and community wealth together. So that was
very very impactful, you know, and I think those conversations
are so much needed around this country because you get
to hear no, you know, we always hear that black
(04:36):
are in a monolith, and you got to see that tonight.
But it was brilliant because everyone had a way of
expressing themselves that was brilliant. But it was just different
perspectives and it was different point of views. There were
a couple of contentious moments. You know, you were involved
with one of those, but even in those moments, it
(04:58):
was love and respect. It was just people wanted you
to understand what their perspective was.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
So why do you want to say they want me
to understand. They wanted the everybody to know.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
I just said, just you. I said no, I said,
people wanted they wanted to be understood. It I was
some about us in general. I said, there was a
contentions moment that involved you because there was a pushback,
and you know, but it was still in love and
respect and everybody just wanted their position to be understood.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Yeah. No, I mean, I think, you know, first of all,
just to put this in a proper context, for those
who are listening in the discussion today. The panel that
we did, and not just a panel. We also did
a lot of community canvass and registering voters, knocking on doors,
reminding people of the upcoming election, as well as as
(05:54):
well as just you know, being in space with our
people and shout out to our brother Mark and being
who organized us, being who organized us all to be together.
There is a new campaign that we were a part
of launching today and that is vote or Else. You
(06:14):
know that every election season there are slogans that people
organized under to help make the point that it's important
for us to exercise our constitutional right to vote as
well as our ability to have our voices heard. That
(06:36):
people will know we are interested in these issues, we
are paying attention, we are organized, and our communities will
not be left behind or discounted and discredited and disengaged
and so voter else. I think the or else part
is so loaded. And I remember back in twenty fifteen,
(06:58):
I believe when we worked on Justice or Else with
the Nation of Islam and many other organizations from around
the country, Quinya Nasaha and so many that gathered for
the Justice or Else gathering where many people hundreds of
(07:20):
thousands of people came out to say and declare that
for us, it's justice or else. And you know, shortly
after that we developed until Freedom, which I think is
in line with that same ideology, that same mindset that
it is until freedom, that it is justice for our communities,
(07:41):
that it is that we vote. It's the the or
else for us is too dangerous and therefore we know
that the vulnerabilities of any community are preyed upon, and
we are going to show that we're not of just
a vulnerable people, but but we're and empowered people. And
so that's what voter els Vote or else was about today.
(08:07):
All of those incredible names, people who again come from
different perspectives. Every single one of us has a different
point of view. Even when we agree, we still have
a different point of view or different ways that we
see approaching our concerns or the issues we care about.
And you know, some folks are a little bit further
(08:29):
away from that than others. But I think it was
a very very powerful conversation.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
Oh, it was definitely powerful, and it should be replicated
around this country, you know, especially in this time when
we're talking about voting and for the engagement and what
the communities want, you know, I think we should replicate
that all around this country. Go to different cities and states,
you know, get powerful voices from different cities and states
(08:58):
and have those conversations and let our people be able
to disseminate the information because I know it's a lot
of stuff that a lot of people just don't know,
and and we've force fed misinformation on purpose, you know,
I always hear I'm constantly hearing people from our community's
parrot you know, false information, and then when you correct them,
(09:22):
they believe what's on the internet. So you know, I
think it's very informative and it's just needed at this time.
So shout out to everybody who was on that panel,
and hopefully we'll continue to do it.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Yeah, I hope so too. I hope that you know
that the resources are there and that the interest is there.
I think the interest is there, but you need resources,
and people be like, well, what do you need resources for?
Why can't you just go out and show up of it?
But how do you get there? How do you get
(09:57):
to Detroit from New York? It costs, it's a plane
to where do you sleep? You need a hotel? There
are other people who among those who were named, they
need a place, you know, to stay and to be
transported to get to a different city. I mean, this
is it's a process. People need at least one meal
(10:19):
while they're in another city. There the venues have to
be paid for. We were in a Union house today,
which is a convention center. It is very, very difficult
to cover all of the expenses in a union operated facility.
I support unions and I certainly support us being in
(10:43):
those spaces, but it costs money, and the union every
minute over the time, it costs more money. And so
you know, we are absolutely you know, in a place
where we need to be able to have the resource.
It's necessary. And it's funny because so many people are like, oh,
you know, y'all are being paid. You paid by the
(11:05):
Democratic Party, you paid by this. I would love to
know where the money is because I haven't. I haven't
seen it. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Also, man, listen, they tell me that all the time,
and I said, I wish because if they could pay
me just for telling the truth, that's free money for me.
So you know, I don't know where it is that
you know, I've been accused of it for years and
still haven't got a dime to do it. But listen,
if somebody was to pay me to tell the truth,
please contact me. Let me know how I get to
(11:35):
do it. Easy job I ever.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Had, oh one of the organizers for the voter Else
day of activation that happened today. Again, it wasn't just
a panel. The panel was the culmination. It was sort
of the end of a full day beginning at ten
o'clock in the morning on the street to Detroit from
the East Side and the West Side. Group of individuals,
(12:01):
all those that we named earlier. We're out knocking on doors,
talking to community, registering voters, engaging people, and going again
to where the people are, not expecting them to show
up at a convention center or a event space, but
really going out and taking the message that we have
(12:24):
out into the community. And I think it's important that
people are able to see that. They know they watch
us online and they see how we you know, they state,
they understand the positions that we take on a variety
of issues. They know that we don't all agree and
we don't all support the same things. I think it's
(12:47):
pretty powerful for them to see us walking through communities
together today knocking on doors and saying that listen, we
may not agree, but our communities are stronger together. And
you know, one thing that we know for sure is
that we have to be empowered and make sure that
our votes are counted. And so one of those who
(13:09):
was involved in the initial organizing, along with Marvin Ban
of today's efforts is our brother, dear friend and and
really our mentor in many ways past to Mike McBride
of so many he has so many titles.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
I'm a Jamaican man. I'm a Jamaican man all the
way from the Bay Area. I got fired down. But
what's happening to y'all? Live free?
Speaker 1 (13:36):
The Black Church pack. You know, you're involved in so
many different things, and I think Voter Else. My son
and I were speaking before you got on about how
powerful today was. You know, all of the information that
we took in, I learned things, and I also, you know,
hope that my contributions or our contributions were helpful as well.
(13:58):
And so those are the spaces we on to Bill
wa why don't he tell us pastor Mike, uh, you know,
how how did this come about? The voter else idea?
And all the concept and how did it, you know,
move to Detroit specifically.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Well, first of all, thank y'all for rocking with us
out on this. Couldn't have did it without you all,
and obviously my son Jamika, Angelo, Linda, the antil Freedom
family and our family for life. And so when we
all rise rise together. We ain't following yet, but it's
it's getting getting tough out here. But let me just say,
(14:36):
you know, voter Else was a wonderful collaboration between my
guy and Marvin Bing. I've known Marvin for non it's
going on over ten years. We met in Ferguson, actually
both us getting tear gas done on the sideline. He
worked for MS Internationals. We both started pulling grandmothers in
freet people out of the street and we've been rocking
(14:58):
with each other ever since. We just said, I know,
we just started talking a little bit about several months
ago about the gaps that we had seen in the
electoral conversation, in the electoral engagement, in all the ways
in which particularly black men, a culture, street organizations, people
(15:20):
in the hood at the neighborhood weren't involved, weren't really
kind of animated or what they were asking for nobody
was really creative in space for them to have that conversation,
and so Margaret said, man, let's call out my guy
way On. You put Wayna on the thing, and literally
or Else was Wayno's idea. Wayna was like, what would
(15:42):
it look like if we help people to understand that
what's at stake in this election is the or Else?
And he was like, man, I would be hot. I
don't we just call this the or Else project? And
we put voter front of it to be clear, and
it just kind of started to really emerge from there.
The first idea was to do a record. It's some
artists and we know and all they're new. I signed
(16:03):
a whole bunch of people who you know, got the
name in the hip hop industry being Single, Dango, Smoke,
There's all these different people, and started to put an
EP together and then from there it evolved to a
kind of town hall great debate format. Part of what
we said is because they had already been in Detroit
(16:24):
working with Hill Harper, let's just take that energy from
the Hill Harper campaign and build on it. And that's
what culminated today. It was a wonderful day of just
conversation of activation, of showing up in the neighborhood where
nobody else shows up. And it was amazing first and
hopefully of many efforts to activate the people who were
getting left behind and out of the conversation.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
Yeah, it definitely wasn't amazing, you know, just being in
the room with a lot of my favorite artists, you know,
artists that I've looked up to, artists I've been friends
with for years, and some that I just met, you know,
and just and just hearing different perspectives. You know, also
talk about the fact that it's a whole music project, right,
the whole music project where it's going to be talking about,
(17:09):
you know, the things that come from our community, the
topics that are important in our community. So I'm definitely
looking forward to that. But I also want to ask you,
you know, as you go throughout these different states and
you're having conversations, you know, what do you think is
(17:29):
one of the most important things to black men in
this time when we're talking about election, because we're talking
about voter ass that isn't really being focused on by
either campaign.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Well, I think that too often the conversation about what
black people need, particularly black men need, is approach from
a solely definitive framework, or at least a defensive framework.
We need to stop shooting one another, we need to
stop getting killed by the police, we need to stop masking,
and we definitely need all those things. But part of
(18:03):
what I think came out tonight is this idea that
we have aspirations as well. We are not and should
not be defined, both inter personally, personally by our communities
or even by our political conditions, by the worst thing
that's happened to us, that's happening to us, or the
(18:24):
worst thing we've done. And so part of what I
think we are hearing from a lot of black men
is an economic message. They want to understand, how can
this administration to come, how can they help prepare an
economic roadmap into not just the middle class, but into
(18:47):
a multi generational sustainability, prosperity and self determination. And so
I think that both political parties are all political parties
for that matter, whether you're the mayor the dogcatcher, prosecutors, governors,
presidential candidates, senatorial candidates, I think people are asking more
about an economic message because keep it real, it sucks
(19:11):
being broke. You know, it is not a good feeling.
When you don't feel like you can sustain yourself, provide
for your family, desperation sets in, frustration sets in, and
the real talk there's nothing the society hates more than
a poor black man that they feel like they have to.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Take care of.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
They'd rather kill us or put us in jail to
move us out of society. And I think brothers are
starting to say to themselves, you know what I'm saying,
I'm not just going to keep allowing my life to
be defined by my worst condition. I want a president
who has some aspirational offerings to put out in the universe,
and then we will do what we need to do
(19:55):
to go and achieve that and organize to secure that.
I think that's what we're hearing. Definitely, brothers don't want
to be shot dead in the street. The brothers also
want to be able to kind of make a life
of dignity and prosperity. And I think that's the message
we're hearing all across the country as we move around.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Well, let me just say that I as a black woman,
would love for us for our black men to be
in the position to be able to take care of us.
I know the ministers who are listening tonight understand what
I'm talking about. Are you with me? SISIs listen. We
(20:37):
want the brothers to be focused on the bag, the economics.
It's nothing wrong with that. As you said, it's not
just that. I mean, obviously we know black men don't
want to be shot and killed, abused, degraded, and all
the other things that happen to our men and to
(20:57):
our communities in general. I think that it is important
to note that, you know, the more economically stable we are,
the more we can continue to build, the more we
can look at police in our own communities or community
safety and what that looks like rather than just policing.
(21:18):
You know, we can look at funding our own organizations
that do grassroots work. We can look at mental health
support for our loved ones who are in need, taking
care of our elders, being able to look at models
like you know, one that the Black Panthers started some
time ago and that it's still happening even today, which
(21:40):
is to feed our people, to have services where people
can pick up groceries or a hot meal in the morning.
I mean, these are things that we want to see
happen in our community. So economic development. And why I
am so excited that so many black men are paying
attention to that issue passing my and my son is
(22:01):
because I understand that there are benefits that stretch beyond
just having having money in your pocket or having nice things.
That there's also a community empowerment that we're looking to
establish as a result of being able to uh, you know,
succeed and to have economic freedom. So I'm all about it.
(22:24):
And I also like to be showered with nice gifts
and taking out to nice dinners. So I need all
the black men around me and all my relationships to
have have the money they need. But anyway, that's meaning
out there.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I hope you know, we we take it around from
time to time. Yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Do mean that I want when I want to and
my son, he tries to to make sure his mama
is good, but when I go to visit with him,
I want to be taken care of. I want my
father to continue to slip that little one hundred and
fifty dollars in my hand that I didn't ask for.
I want all those things because you know, I feel
(23:13):
that you know, I deserve it. I think that you know,
our communities are stronger when our men are stronger. I
think that, you know, there is an unfortunate narrative that
has developed somewhere along the way that we don't need
our men, and that has to be dispelled. It is
not true. I believe that our men, when our men
(23:35):
are strong, our communities are healthy and support. I certainly
support that. I certainly support the aspirations of black men
because I believe that for almost every black man that
I am in relationship with, again, family members, friends, they
are somewhere somehow taking care of supporting, standing next to
(23:58):
behind in front of a black woman and their black
children and other black community members. And so I know,
I believe that every black man that I know wants
to see me healthy, and you know, my family and
their own offspring and people around them, the extended family.
So I'm all about it. But here's what I want
(24:19):
to talk about on the panel. I also, I think
Brittney Pagnett asked, you know, what do I think about
this election as it relates to this whole idea of
economic empowerment? And I was talking about pastor mic and
love for you to speak to this how you know
there are many and I didn't get into it today.
(24:41):
But I have had, unfortunately some conflict with some of
our brothers who will say to me, you know, y'all
are talking about voting, and you know you're looking at
who's running for office, but we need to be focused
more on economic empowerment, investing and what have you. And
(25:03):
they say that politics is sort of a waste of time.
It's just the trick, it's just the game. It's a
waste of time. I've been saying though, that when you
listen to the key points coming out of the two
individuals running for president, you hear them literally talking about
things that will impact your ability to have successful businesses.
(25:28):
So when they start talking about tax cuts or just.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Life in general, well successful life in general.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Right, But when you start hearing them talking about tax
cuts and tax codes and tariffs and all of the
things that we've heard over the last several weeks, I'm
hoping that our people understand that if you want to
go out and start you know whatever, cleaner's business, or
as was said today, that we need to make sure
(25:55):
about killer Mike and pushing t we're talking about making
sure we start business, is that that can also support
or work in conjunction with government because of the contracts
and what have you. But if the if the tax
codes do not meet the needs of particular communities, or
if it is harmful to us, how does that impact
(26:18):
the businesses, the very businesses we're talking about growing past
the night.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Yeah, I think that it's really important to remember a
couple of things. Number One, we live in a capitalistic society.
And it's not just a kind of soft capitalism. It's
a hard capitalism, which just means that the economic kind
of engine of this country is extremely exploitated. It prays
(26:45):
on the poor, it prais on the middle class, and
it rewards the rich, the wealthy, and the elite. And
so these are the conditions in which we have two
presidential candidates in the Democratics and Republican Party. Obviously we
have Jill Stein and we have Cornell West, who are
third or fourth party candidates that likely have no path
(27:08):
to the presidency to get the electoral college. So we
have two primary options in an arch harsh capitalistic economy.
We have one who is a self proclaimed billionaire who
has demonstrated he is open for business to the highest bidder.
A billionaire autocratch across the world who are and is
(27:32):
willing to make decisions to enrich himself at the expense
of everyone in this country, literally everyone, right, And then
you have someone who is a Kamma Harris, obviously from
the Bay Area, one of the most kind of progressive
parts of the country, who comes from a very similar
background as many of us, and has figured out a
(27:52):
way to navigate herself to become the first black woman
to be nominated to the presidency. I think that what
we have to do is listen not only to their plans,
but also just appreciate their backgrounds and their priorities and
understand that one of these individuals is going to be
the next political leader that we have to now either
(28:17):
negotiate with or organize to push towards the things we
care about. Just from a simple like which one would
I rather go up against for the next four years
to extract as many games as I want. I would
rather go up against someone who I believe has similar
values as us, even within a harsh political capitalistic economy
(28:40):
versus are, rather than someone who has the opposite values
in US and is in build and perhaps even participating
in making this harsh economic capitalistic society even worse for US.
So I think their players are extension not just of
their values, but it's also an extension of the proximity
by which we can at least relate. And when we
(29:04):
build the power necessary through organizing, organizing money, organizing people,
organizing ideas, that's the way I decline building power. We
build that power. I believe that, prayerfully, the next president
of the United States will become a Harris. She will
be responsive, she will be movable. Will she give us
everything we want? The political conditions have to be so
(29:26):
that she is able to, or the political conditions have
to be so where she is forced to. And so
I do believe the policies around not just taxes, but
the policies around right now. And this is something I
believe that they're doing a terrible job talking about. But
(29:46):
right now, one of the things that Kamala Harris as
the vice president, certainly with Joe Biden as the president,
have pushed us called the Justice for the Initiatives. I
want everyone who's listening to this podcast to google the
Justice for the Initiatives. It is a initiative started by
the Biden administration related to the Infrastructure Bill, the bill
(30:06):
that was a part of his Build Back Better Plan,
the only part that got passed through the Congress. Over
the next five years, they have to spend four billion
dollars with a B on infrastructure, roads, building, energy, free houses,
charging stations, all kinds of things that all of us
(30:27):
need in our communities. And listen to this. Forty percent
of the four billion dollars that have to be spent
in the next five years must be spent in neighborhoods
where forty percent of the population are under resource and
or fort of positively spent with black businesses or directly
(30:47):
impacted people. This is not black business directly impacted. So
let me just say in summary, there is an economic
model of economic policy that's in place. A lot of
us don't know about it. Even I know about it
because somebody came and told me about it from our
philanthropic partners, and we've been building and trying to get
ourselves in position to spread this throughout the hood and
(31:10):
the neighborhood and our organizing network. All I'm saying is,
these are the opportunities that she and this administration she
will create can put in place for us. But at
the end of the day, it still will require our
self determination, our elbow, grease of hard work, all of
the stuff we talked about on the panel. We're not
waiting for someone to do something for us. We're just
asking you to make an open door, an easy pathway,
(31:33):
and then we'll go do it ourselves. I think Kama
Harris is willing to do that. I know for sure
Donald Trump is not. And that is why none of
us should be giving Donald Trump a serious consideration. If
we care about the future of black people, and.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
You said, you said a lot that we need to
kind of unpack, you know, we definitely shouldn't. And I've
been very vocal and always saying that I would kamal
of high and you know, there's pretty much nothing that
can change that. But when I'm having these conversations, you know,
with people who are impacted in marginalized communities, with people
(32:13):
who just know day to day and they just don't
feel represented in the Democratic Party. We don't, especially black men,
but there are a lot of black men just don't
see this picture of what they call masculinity and I
and I would go as far to say that it's
creating some level of resentment. And I'm watching the divide,
(32:36):
especially online. You know, I'm watching the divide and I'm
having conversations with black men and they feel like this,
there's this conspiracy to raise us this and that, and
I would like to speak like, are you hearing that,
and what do you think that you know the party
needs to do to address that?
Speaker 3 (32:55):
Well, of course I'm hearing it. I mean, I think
it's not a new conversation, right, I think that black man.
And let me say like this, not all black men
are invited to the seat to the table, or not
all black men are extended a seat at mini table.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
You have to be a respectable black man most of
the time, unless you're a rapper who's super wealthy and
has lots of kind of cultural cachet to be invited
into places that are elite, right, that are our decision
making space. And so absolutely, I think that if you're
a preacher, you can get into a lot of rooms.
(33:35):
If you're a business person, you can get into a
lot of rooms as a black man. If you are
a wealthy black man, you need a lawyer. But if
you are someone who has a certain energy, a certain
tenure in her voice, a certain look, a certain smell,
a certain experience, and you don't have to polish that
aggression that you know what, we would say, the strength
(33:56):
that we had to tap into to make it through
the griminess of our daily existence. That energy is very
difficult for a lot of people to handle in a room.
And so I do think that the Democratic Party and
many spaces in the United States of America have put
so many of our men, particularly black men, in like
very toxic predatory environments, and then punish us when we
(34:21):
have to bring all of that energy with us into
a meeting that once we leave the meeting, we have
to go back into a very toxic predatory environment. So yes,
the Democratic Party, as well as many other institutions in
this country, including the church, pluding, our schools, including lots
of businesses, are not always able to create the conditions
(34:44):
where black men from a certain kind of experience, a
certain kind of texture, a certain kind of energy, are welcome.
Having said that, our job, people like you, Angelo, myself,
Phil Agne Killer, Mike, all of but Articul and the
brothers on the State, our job is to keep fighting
for our community and not throw in the town. And
(35:05):
I will say to all of us online who are
in a comments that's talking about while you know we
can't be involved in white we can participate. I just
want to remind you that at every era of black
people in business in this country, some white man was
trying to keep you out of a room. And every
generation of black people, particularly black men, up until now,
(35:27):
have fought for our people against the kind of odds.
And so we should name this contradiction. We should name
this fallacy, We should elevate it. We should push whoever
is guilty of that kind of behavior towards our people
to not only cease and desist right but to maybe
build our own tables like we did today and demonstrate
(35:50):
that not only is there something we can offer, but
we will cost you politically if you do not like
create a space for our voices, the totality of the
black experience to be heard. And so the Democratic Party
has a problem. The Republican Party certainly has no plan
to do this except for a very symbolic what do
(36:13):
you say, the kind of they know how to pray,
you know, they're how to manipulate, they know how to
kind of do performative justice. We want more to performance,
We want more to symbolism. We want concrete material conditions,
shifting policy decisions inclusion, and I think that's part of
the big work that we're trying to build with the
(36:34):
voter else and all the other movement work that we're collecting,
we're trying to do and this is why this conversation
is being raised, because we have to raise it no
one else with.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Absolutely well, my hat goes off to both of you brothers,
you know, because you all are courageous, you are saying
the things that need to be said. I think so
many of our people acknowledge your work, acknowledge both of
your efforts, knowing that you are come together, you know,
(37:05):
looking at you pastor mic who while you are extremely bold, courageous,
progressive and and when needed even confrontational, but at the
same time, there are many who do look at you
as more respectable of us, of you know, of the
(37:26):
many black men that you are around, uh, and the
fact that you have linked up with the Marvin Beings,
the Mysons and the Angelo Pintos and others and are
standing sort of in the middle of that, in the
midst of those types of folks, the beanie Seguels and
the whole thing. And then going back to people who
(37:51):
have power and proximity to power, and not just going
to get access to yourself, but to open the door
for these others to be able to share their experiences,
their knowledge, their expertise. You know, I think that it
is so important for people to understand that what we
(38:11):
might not have attended the top schools, you know, we
may not have been born with the silver spoon and
lived in the best communities and all of that, but
we have an expertise that is based upon the experiences
that we've gone through the people. We know the fact
(38:32):
that many of those who do have access and proximity
to power are folks who would never spend time in
the middle of the day walking through communities like the
ones that we were in today, where we are all comfortable.
It is comfortable for us to be this. It's not
like no one standing around worried, nervous. You know, we
(38:54):
were standing and having conversations, having meetings, you know, right
there in the middle of the street. You know, comfortable
in our communities. That gives us a level of expertise
and we will not be devalued. No one will tell
us that some white consultant or some person who went
to school and studied urban communities knows more than a
(39:17):
Mason who has who comes from the community, is still
in the community and has also suffered the unfortunate collateral
consequences of being in a community, growing up in poverty,
and dealing with all the things that you know you've
dealt with my son. So, as a Black woman, I
(39:37):
just want to say to both of you, kings, that
I sit back and I look at y'all and I
feel like we are in still in good hands. My
father was the first man that I knew I was
in good hands. But now that I look at the
two of you, I know that the torture has been
passed along and you all are keeping that flame going
(39:59):
of protecting black women, protecting our families, protecting our communities.
And I say this last thing that you know, one
of the issues that concerns me is that a lot
of black women, especially as we and not just Black
women but women in general, are really fighting for our
right to bodily autonomy, to having the right to choose.
(40:24):
It is important to us that we see our brothers
stand side by side and stand in solidarity with us
and not say, well, these folks over here are offering
us some type of you know, trickonometry if you will,
of a possible financial reward for voting for this guy
(40:46):
who I won't name, and then but agree with or
and or turn the blind eye to women and our
rights being taken away from us. At the same time,
we can't do that. We have to push to ensure
that all the things that we want to see in
our communities are done. It's going to take a law.
(41:08):
It's not gonna be just this particular election that will
accomplish that. Nonetheless, we're moving the ball forward. We cannot
go back. And I'm I'm definitely a supporter of Kamala Harris,
but I'm a supporter enough to say that a part
of support is also to hold people accountable and the
(41:29):
telling the truth. And so hopefully we can accomplish all
those things at once that I get the right and
my granddaughter gets the right to choose what she and
her doctor think is best for her care, and at
the same time have a path towards financial freedom. So
(41:49):
I appreciate you passing, Mike, thank you for being with
us today, and thank you so much for bringing us
all together in Detroit, Michigan. It was truly an event
and a day that must be replicated in places around
the nation.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Yeah, and we plan to do that. And I encourage
all of you that are listening, you know, to remember
that the power always lies with us and our ability
to organize. We were not a people that is asking
for a handout. We already worked for free. It's called slavery, right,
So we we did our free labor. Now we want
(42:24):
what is deserved and what we have already put in.
And I do think part of what we did today
was plant a seed in the ground that I hope
turns into a huge oak of righteousness, an oak of
justice where we can indeed keep gathering our people, which
is what black people have been doing for years. They've
been called hush Harbor's places where we can have our
(42:46):
own conversation on our own turns away from the gaze
of the slave master and the oppression. So you being
there to mecause obviously you've been there, my son, helping
us to keep sowing the seed. I hope that we
come to North Carolina something very similar. Let's hit the
rural side of North Carolina. I hope we do it.
In Georgia. Let's let's hit the spots where people are
(43:07):
not being engaged, you know, and let's keep doing it
on big scales and then let's do it on smaller skills.
My son says, I'm so powerful today you just say, hey,
you know what if we just came together like this,
five six, seven of us, even if we don't agree,
and just hash out our differences, but then leave with
the united praying and move forward. I think this is
what I hope we were able to model today. And
(43:31):
doing it with you guys, we always have a good time.
And not like working with people you like right to
do hard work, because the work is hard. I ain't
working nobody, I don't like. I'm just telling that right now.
Too old in times. So when you can work with
people you like and laugh and have jokes and cry
and listen to good music and you know, talk talk
(43:53):
talk shop, it's a blessing. I love y'all. I'm gonna
stop talking. I'm alone with the Black Preacher and I
sleep and time that It's been great.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
All right.
Speaker 2 (44:04):
Again, We appreciate you, man, because it is important the
work that you do on so many different fronts, you know,
being a black preacher like you said, and still taking
the time out to invest in community and build with
grassroots organizations and make sure that there's a connection between
(44:24):
the church and the state, right. And I love the
fact the way that you play that that position. You know,
you you bring so many different ideas and people together
and you've been doing it since I met you. So
I just want to say that we definitely appreciate you
and we need people like you, especially in these times.
So I know you tie it and we had you
(44:47):
up all night, way past your bedtime.
Speaker 3 (44:49):
We definitely Hey, we'll do it again tomorrow night.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
Right now? Safe?
Speaker 1 (45:00):
Well, I think you know, today was a good day.
That was a great conversation. Love Pastor Mike so much,
you know, just a good, solid, all the way thorough individual.
Everybody that we talked to has said the same thing
(45:20):
so many times today. I had people say to me,
while you are blessed that Pastor Mike is your friend
and your supporter, and so it's been good. I mean,
all we can do is keep pushing, continue to do
our work, continue to do our part getting out there
(45:41):
in our communities. Is you know, I noticed that you
guys were having a pretty contentious conversation with a young
man today who didn't want to be registered and after
just you know a little bit of respect and building
and next thing you know, he had the clipboard and
he was registering. And now you know, with that type
(46:01):
of engagement, we had to go back. We've got to
knock on this door. We have to make sure that
he also has access to the voting polls and not
just registered, but that he actually goes to do his part.
So there's a lot of work to be done. I'm
here for it. I spent a week you know in
(46:23):
Paris and join myself and you know, living life with
my friends. But I said that when I got back,
I would get to running immediately to do this work
for the next less than fifty days. And I think
we got off to a great start today with Voter Else.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
Definitely got up to a great start. Shout out to
Marven being shout out too Passive McBride for you know,
coming to the show, and just shout out to everyone
that was a part of this event. Like I said,
it was a lot of artists in which you know,
I'm fans of and friends of and some that I
just met today. But it was just one of those rules,
(47:00):
is one of those spaces that it was just powerful.
You know, even the off camera and the prior to
the conversation, just being in green rooms and just building
with brothers and you know, ideology and just talking about
the things that are need in our community and just
seeing us all come together. And I know, that's what
it looks like. That's what the beloved community looks like.
(47:20):
That's what we want America to look like. You know,
brothers in the building, inside of rooms, building with each other,
talking about how we create generational wealth, how do we
you know, create unity, How do we stay together in
these times and speak about what it is that is
directly impacting us and it's needed. So you know, once again,
(47:43):
I enjoyed the conversation. You know, I love what you
had to say. You know what I'm saying, Our sisters
had to say when you were talking and you and
your taker came in with very key you know, elements
into that conversation. You know, we we we're so much
better together and they know that, and the intentionally, intentionally
(48:03):
try to divide us. So I just want us to
be very strategic. I said that all the time. We
just have to be so much more strategic, and we
have to understand what the enemies. They've been doing the
same thing for generations. Is trying to keep us divided,
you know, and I just don't want us to fall
for that. So with no service, with no further ado,
(48:24):
we come to the end of another beautiful show. Shout
out to all of our followers and listeners who love us,
who make us the number one podcasts in the world.
Don't worry. We coming back full throttle with our visuals,
so I want you to be prepared for that. But
in the meantime, we want to say that we love
you and we're going to continue to be authentic. I'm
(48:45):
not gonna always be right, Tamika, the Mallories not gonna
always be wrong, but we will both always and I
mean always be authentic. Check out the video.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Version of t M every single Wednesday on Iwoman dot TV.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
That's how
I'm Tamika d Mallory and it.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
Shit Boy my son in general.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
We are your host of TMI.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Tamika and my Son's Information, Truth, Motivation and.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Inspiration, Name New Energy. What's going on? My Son Lennon?
Speaker 2 (00:17):
What's going on? Tamika May How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:19):
I'm good. I'm good. You know, it seems like the
last few weeks we've really been live and in the action.
TMI has been on the road. So many things happening,
you know, so many people are outside right now, folks
who are either engaged in voter engagement work or people
who are doing just the normal day to day work
(00:42):
organizing and communities. There's a lot that's happening. And you know,
I think, I really know that you share the sentiments
that it is good to know that our audience that
they're sticking with us through the transition of you know,
us being more outside. You know, in this time, I
(01:05):
guess we always are outside, but it seemed like as
we dip zag across this country and meet with more people,
it feels more logical, if you will, to really take
the voices of the people from the community rather than
(01:27):
having to you know, excuse me, rather than having to
you know, sort of invite folks to come to us.
We're going out to where our people are and bringing
their voices and making it one with TMI, and so
I'm excited about it. I now think I need a
microphone or some type of device connected to my phone
(01:49):
because I see other people doing that and I was
thinking today I need to get some type of device
so I could be like, you know, hooked up and
profect to know what my outside recordings.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
Yeah, I agree. I think I think we actually have.
They gave us those little mics. I really see a
matter of fact, I have it in my house. I
just never hooked it up to my phone. But I
guess since we are traveling and doing a lot of
improm too podcasts to where you know, we're on the
moment and we're meeting with different individuals and we might
need to interview like today, you know, it was one
(02:25):
of those days where we should have just interviewed so
many different people. But you know, the discussion that we
had today was amazing. Shout out to everybody you know
in Detroit. We're in Detroit right now and we had
a dope panel. I don't want to mention everybody but
I don't want to mention anybody and mention and forget anybody.
(02:47):
So I'm just saying it was a great panel. A
lot of different names. If you can think of something,
I could probably feel. Most of the.
Speaker 1 (02:54):
Men here, Yellow Paine, Yeah, uh, Freeway Killer, Mike, push
your T, push your T, Joe tak It, Edie, Joe take.
Our moderators were wayno and also Britney Pacnet and Pastor
(03:18):
McBride who's coming up right now as a guest for
this evening, for this show. And uh, there was some
other folk. Of course, our brother Philip Agnew.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
And this a mm hmm Black Sam brother. Another I
forgot his cousin that was deal with him, so I
forgot his name. Also, I swear Visit was there. That's
my that's my guy. You know what I'm saying. It
(03:53):
was And it was a it was a very dope conversation,
just getting everybody's perspective and just hearing you know, where
we are in the world right now, not just polities,
but just in general. Like it was very empowering talking
about financial security, talking about entrepreneurship and how we should
(04:15):
be utilizing our resources and building with each other and
creating generational wealth and community wealth together. So that was
very very impactful, you know, and I think those conversations
are so much needed around this country because you get
to hear no, you know, we always hear that black
(04:36):
are in a monolith, and you got to see that tonight.
But it was brilliant because everyone had a way of
expressing themselves that was brilliant. But it was just different
perspectives and it was different point of views. There were
a couple of contentious moments. You know, you were involved
with one of those, but even in those moments, it
(04:58):
was love and respect. It was just people wanted you
to understand what their perspective was.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
So why do you want to say they want me
to understand. They wanted the everybody to know.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
I just said, just you. I said no, I said,
people wanted they wanted to be understood. It I was
some about us in general. I said, there was a
contentions moment that involved you because there was a pushback,
and you know, but it was still in love and
respect and everybody just wanted their position to be understood.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Yeah. No, I mean, I think, you know, first of all,
just to put this in a proper context, for those
who are listening in the discussion today. The panel that
we did, and not just a panel. We also did
a lot of community canvass and registering voters, knocking on doors,
reminding people of the upcoming election, as well as as
(05:54):
well as just you know, being in space with our
people and shout out to our brother Mark and being
who organized us, being who organized us all to be together.
There is a new campaign that we were a part
of launching today and that is vote or Else. You
(06:14):
know that every election season there are slogans that people
organized under to help make the point that it's important
for us to exercise our constitutional right to vote as
well as our ability to have our voices heard. That
(06:36):
people will know we are interested in these issues, we
are paying attention, we are organized, and our communities will
not be left behind or discounted and discredited and disengaged
and so voter else. I think the or else part
is so loaded. And I remember back in twenty fifteen,
(06:58):
I believe when we worked on Justice or Else with
the Nation of Islam and many other organizations from around
the country, Quinya Nasaha and so many that gathered for
the Justice or Else gathering where many people hundreds of
(07:20):
thousands of people came out to say and declare that
for us, it's justice or else. And you know, shortly
after that we developed until Freedom, which I think is
in line with that same ideology, that same mindset that
it is until freedom, that it is justice for our communities,
(07:41):
that it is that we vote. It's the the or
else for us is too dangerous and therefore we know
that the vulnerabilities of any community are preyed upon, and
we are going to show that we're not of just
a vulnerable people, but but we're and empowered people. And
so that's what voter els Vote or else was about today.
(08:07):
All of those incredible names, people who again come from
different perspectives. Every single one of us has a different
point of view. Even when we agree, we still have
a different point of view or different ways that we
see approaching our concerns or the issues we care about.
And you know, some folks are a little bit further
(08:29):
away from that than others. But I think it was
a very very powerful conversation.
Speaker 2 (08:36):
Oh, it was definitely powerful, and it should be replicated
around this country, you know, especially in this time when
we're talking about voting and for the engagement and what
the communities want, you know, I think we should replicate
that all around this country. Go to different cities and states,
you know, get powerful voices from different cities and states
(08:58):
and have those conversations and let our people be able
to disseminate the information because I know it's a lot
of stuff that a lot of people just don't know,
and and we've force fed misinformation on purpose, you know,
I always hear I'm constantly hearing people from our community's
parrot you know, false information, and then when you correct them,
(09:22):
they believe what's on the internet. So you know, I
think it's very informative and it's just needed at this time.
So shout out to everybody who was on that panel,
and hopefully we'll continue to do it.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
Yeah, I hope so too. I hope that you know
that the resources are there and that the interest is there.
I think the interest is there, but you need resources,
and people be like, well, what do you need resources for?
Why can't you just go out and show up of it?
But how do you get there? How do you get
(09:57):
to Detroit from New York? It costs, it's a plane
to where do you sleep? You need a hotel? There
are other people who among those who were named, they
need a place, you know, to stay and to be
transported to get to a different city. I mean, this
is it's a process. People need at least one meal
(10:19):
while they're in another city. There the venues have to
be paid for. We were in a Union house today,
which is a convention center. It is very, very difficult
to cover all of the expenses in a union operated facility.
I support unions and I certainly support us being in
(10:43):
those spaces, but it costs money, and the union every
minute over the time, it costs more money. And so
you know, we are absolutely you know, in a place
where we need to be able to have the resource.
It's necessary. And it's funny because so many people are like, oh,
you know, y'all are being paid. You paid by the
(11:05):
Democratic Party, you paid by this. I would love to
know where the money is because I haven't. I haven't
seen it. I don't know.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Also, man, listen, they tell me that all the time,
and I said, I wish because if they could pay
me just for telling the truth, that's free money for me.
So you know, I don't know where it is that
you know, I've been accused of it for years and
still haven't got a dime to do it. But listen,
if somebody was to pay me to tell the truth,
please contact me. Let me know how I get to
(11:35):
do it. Easy job I ever.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
Had, oh one of the organizers for the voter Else
day of activation that happened today. Again, it wasn't just
a panel. The panel was the culmination. It was sort
of the end of a full day beginning at ten
o'clock in the morning on the street to Detroit from
the East Side and the West Side. Group of individuals,
(12:01):
all those that we named earlier. We're out knocking on doors,
talking to community, registering voters, engaging people, and going again
to where the people are, not expecting them to show
up at a convention center or a event space, but
really going out and taking the message that we have
(12:24):
out into the community. And I think it's important that
people are able to see that. They know they watch
us online and they see how we you know, they state,
they understand the positions that we take on a variety
of issues. They know that we don't all agree and
we don't all support the same things. I think it's
(12:47):
pretty powerful for them to see us walking through communities
together today knocking on doors and saying that listen, we
may not agree, but our communities are stronger together. And
you know, one thing that we know for sure is
that we have to be empowered and make sure that
our votes are counted. And so one of those who
(13:09):
was involved in the initial organizing, along with Marvin Ban
of today's efforts is our brother, dear friend and and
really our mentor in many ways past to Mike McBride
of so many he has so many titles.
Speaker 3 (13:26):
I'm a Jamaican man. I'm a Jamaican man all the
way from the Bay Area. I got fired down. But
what's happening to y'all? Live free?
Speaker 1 (13:36):
The Black Church pack. You know, you're involved in so
many different things, and I think Voter Else. My son
and I were speaking before you got on about how
powerful today was. You know, all of the information that
we took in, I learned things, and I also, you know,
hope that my contributions or our contributions were helpful as well.
(13:58):
And so those are the spaces we on to Bill
wa why don't he tell us pastor Mike, uh, you know,
how how did this come about? The voter else idea?
And all the concept and how did it, you know,
move to Detroit specifically.
Speaker 3 (14:15):
Well, first of all, thank y'all for rocking with us
out on this. Couldn't have did it without you all,
and obviously my son Jamika, Angelo, Linda, the antil Freedom
family and our family for life. And so when we
all rise rise together. We ain't following yet, but it's
it's getting getting tough out here. But let me just say,
(14:36):
you know, voter Else was a wonderful collaboration between my
guy and Marvin Bing. I've known Marvin for non it's
going on over ten years. We met in Ferguson, actually
both us getting tear gas done on the sideline. He
worked for MS Internationals. We both started pulling grandmothers in
freet people out of the street and we've been rocking
(14:58):
with each other ever since. We just said, I know,
we just started talking a little bit about several months
ago about the gaps that we had seen in the
electoral conversation, in the electoral engagement, in all the ways
in which particularly black men, a culture, street organizations, people
(15:20):
in the hood at the neighborhood weren't involved, weren't really
kind of animated or what they were asking for nobody
was really creative in space for them to have that conversation,
and so Margaret said, man, let's call out my guy
way On. You put Wayna on the thing, and literally
or Else was Wayno's idea. Wayna was like, what would
(15:42):
it look like if we help people to understand that
what's at stake in this election is the or Else?
And he was like, man, I would be hot. I
don't we just call this the or Else project? And
we put voter front of it to be clear, and
it just kind of started to really emerge from there.
The first idea was to do a record. It's some
artists and we know and all they're new. I signed
(16:03):
a whole bunch of people who you know, got the
name in the hip hop industry being Single, Dango, Smoke,
There's all these different people, and started to put an
EP together and then from there it evolved to a
kind of town hall great debate format. Part of what
we said is because they had already been in Detroit
(16:24):
working with Hill Harper, let's just take that energy from
the Hill Harper campaign and build on it. And that's
what culminated today. It was a wonderful day of just
conversation of activation, of showing up in the neighborhood where
nobody else shows up. And it was amazing first and
hopefully of many efforts to activate the people who were
getting left behind and out of the conversation.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
Yeah, it definitely wasn't amazing, you know, just being in
the room with a lot of my favorite artists, you know,
artists that I've looked up to, artists I've been friends
with for years, and some that I just met, you know,
and just and just hearing different perspectives. You know, also
talk about the fact that it's a whole music project, right,
the whole music project where it's going to be talking about,
(17:09):
you know, the things that come from our community, the
topics that are important in our community. So I'm definitely
looking forward to that. But I also want to ask you,
you know, as you go throughout these different states and
you're having conversations, you know, what do you think is
(17:29):
one of the most important things to black men in
this time when we're talking about election, because we're talking
about voter ass that isn't really being focused on by
either campaign.
Speaker 3 (17:41):
Well, I think that too often the conversation about what
black people need, particularly black men need, is approach from
a solely definitive framework, or at least a defensive framework.
We need to stop shooting one another, we need to
stop getting killed by the police, we need to stop masking,
and we definitely need all those things. But part of
(18:03):
what I think came out tonight is this idea that
we have aspirations as well. We are not and should
not be defined, both inter personally, personally by our communities
or even by our political conditions, by the worst thing
that's happened to us, that's happening to us, or the
(18:24):
worst thing we've done. And so part of what I
think we are hearing from a lot of black men
is an economic message. They want to understand, how can
this administration to come, how can they help prepare an
economic roadmap into not just the middle class, but into
(18:47):
a multi generational sustainability, prosperity and self determination. And so
I think that both political parties are all political parties
for that matter, whether you're the mayor the dogcatcher, prosecutors, governors,
presidential candidates, senatorial candidates, I think people are asking more
about an economic message because keep it real, it sucks
(19:11):
being broke. You know, it is not a good feeling.
When you don't feel like you can sustain yourself, provide
for your family, desperation sets in, frustration sets in, and
the real talk there's nothing the society hates more than
a poor black man that they feel like they have to.
Speaker 2 (19:32):
Take care of.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
They'd rather kill us or put us in jail to
move us out of society. And I think brothers are
starting to say to themselves, you know what I'm saying,
I'm not just going to keep allowing my life to
be defined by my worst condition. I want a president
who has some aspirational offerings to put out in the universe,
and then we will do what we need to do
(19:55):
to go and achieve that and organize to secure that.
I think that's what we're hearing. Definitely, brothers don't want
to be shot dead in the street. The brothers also
want to be able to kind of make a life
of dignity and prosperity. And I think that's the message
we're hearing all across the country as we move around.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Well, let me just say that I as a black woman,
would love for us for our black men to be
in the position to be able to take care of us.
I know the ministers who are listening tonight understand what
I'm talking about. Are you with me? SISIs listen. We
(20:37):
want the brothers to be focused on the bag, the economics.
It's nothing wrong with that. As you said, it's not
just that. I mean, obviously we know black men don't
want to be shot and killed, abused, degraded, and all
the other things that happen to our men and to
(20:57):
our communities in general. I think that it is important
to note that, you know, the more economically stable we are,
the more we can continue to build, the more we
can look at police in our own communities or community
safety and what that looks like rather than just policing.
(21:18):
You know, we can look at funding our own organizations
that do grassroots work. We can look at mental health
support for our loved ones who are in need, taking
care of our elders, being able to look at models
like you know, one that the Black Panthers started some
time ago and that it's still happening even today, which
(21:40):
is to feed our people, to have services where people
can pick up groceries or a hot meal in the morning.
I mean, these are things that we want to see
happen in our community. So economic development. And why I
am so excited that so many black men are paying
attention to that issue passing my and my son is
(22:01):
because I understand that there are benefits that stretch beyond
just having having money in your pocket or having nice things.
That there's also a community empowerment that we're looking to
establish as a result of being able to uh, you know,
succeed and to have economic freedom. So I'm all about it.
(22:24):
And I also like to be showered with nice gifts
and taking out to nice dinners. So I need all
the black men around me and all my relationships to
have have the money they need. But anyway, that's meaning
out there.
Speaker 3 (22:41):
I hope you know, we we take it around from
time to time. Yeah, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
Do mean that I want when I want to and
my son, he tries to to make sure his mama
is good, but when I go to visit with him,
I want to be taken care of. I want my
father to continue to slip that little one hundred and
fifty dollars in my hand that I didn't ask for.
I want all those things because you know, I feel
(23:13):
that you know, I deserve it. I think that you know,
our communities are stronger when our men are stronger. I
think that, you know, there is an unfortunate narrative that
has developed somewhere along the way that we don't need
our men, and that has to be dispelled. It is
not true. I believe that our men, when our men
(23:35):
are strong, our communities are healthy and support. I certainly
support that. I certainly support the aspirations of black men
because I believe that for almost every black man that
I am in relationship with, again, family members, friends, they
are somewhere somehow taking care of supporting, standing next to
(23:58):
behind in front of a black woman and their black
children and other black community members. And so I know,
I believe that every black man that I know wants
to see me healthy, and you know, my family and
their own offspring and people around them, the extended family.
So I'm all about it. But here's what I want
(24:19):
to talk about on the panel. I also, I think
Brittney Pagnett asked, you know, what do I think about
this election as it relates to this whole idea of
economic empowerment? And I was talking about pastor mic and
love for you to speak to this how you know
there are many and I didn't get into it today.
(24:41):
But I have had, unfortunately some conflict with some of
our brothers who will say to me, you know, y'all
are talking about voting, and you know you're looking at
who's running for office, but we need to be focused
more on economic empowerment, investing and what have you. And
(25:03):
they say that politics is sort of a waste of time.
It's just the trick, it's just the game. It's a
waste of time. I've been saying though, that when you
listen to the key points coming out of the two
individuals running for president, you hear them literally talking about
things that will impact your ability to have successful businesses.
(25:28):
So when they start talking about tax cuts or just.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Life in general, well successful life in general.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Right, But when you start hearing them talking about tax
cuts and tax codes and tariffs and all of the
things that we've heard over the last several weeks, I'm
hoping that our people understand that if you want to
go out and start you know whatever, cleaner's business, or
as was said today, that we need to make sure
(25:55):
about killer Mike and pushing t we're talking about making
sure we start business, is that that can also support
or work in conjunction with government because of the contracts
and what have you. But if the if the tax
codes do not meet the needs of particular communities, or
if it is harmful to us, how does that impact
(26:18):
the businesses, the very businesses we're talking about growing past
the night.
Speaker 3 (26:22):
Yeah, I think that it's really important to remember a
couple of things. Number One, we live in a capitalistic society.
And it's not just a kind of soft capitalism. It's
a hard capitalism, which just means that the economic kind
of engine of this country is extremely exploitated. It prays
(26:45):
on the poor, it prais on the middle class, and
it rewards the rich, the wealthy, and the elite. And
so these are the conditions in which we have two
presidential candidates in the Democratics and Republican Party. Obviously we
have Jill Stein and we have Cornell West, who are
third or fourth party candidates that likely have no path
(27:08):
to the presidency to get the electoral college. So we
have two primary options in an arch harsh capitalistic economy.
We have one who is a self proclaimed billionaire who
has demonstrated he is open for business to the highest bidder.
A billionaire autocratch across the world who are and is
(27:32):
willing to make decisions to enrich himself at the expense
of everyone in this country, literally everyone, right, And then
you have someone who is a Kamma Harris, obviously from
the Bay Area, one of the most kind of progressive
parts of the country, who comes from a very similar
background as many of us, and has figured out a
(27:52):
way to navigate herself to become the first black woman
to be nominated to the presidency. I think that what
we have to do is listen not only to their plans,
but also just appreciate their backgrounds and their priorities and
understand that one of these individuals is going to be
the next political leader that we have to now either
(28:17):
negotiate with or organize to push towards the things we
care about. Just from a simple like which one would
I rather go up against for the next four years
to extract as many games as I want. I would
rather go up against someone who I believe has similar
values as us, even within a harsh political capitalistic economy
(28:40):
versus are, rather than someone who has the opposite values
in US and is in build and perhaps even participating
in making this harsh economic capitalistic society even worse for US.
So I think their players are extension not just of
their values, but it's also an extension of the proximity
by which we can at least relate. And when we
(29:04):
build the power necessary through organizing, organizing money, organizing people,
organizing ideas, that's the way I decline building power. We
build that power. I believe that, prayerfully, the next president
of the United States will become a Harris. She will
be responsive, she will be movable. Will she give us
everything we want? The political conditions have to be so
(29:26):
that she is able to, or the political conditions have
to be so where she is forced to. And so
I do believe the policies around not just taxes, but
the policies around right now. And this is something I
believe that they're doing a terrible job talking about. But
(29:46):
right now, one of the things that Kamala Harris as
the vice president, certainly with Joe Biden as the president,
have pushed us called the Justice for the Initiatives. I
want everyone who's listening to this podcast to google the
Justice for the Initiatives. It is a initiative started by
the Biden administration related to the Infrastructure Bill, the bill
(30:06):
that was a part of his Build Back Better Plan,
the only part that got passed through the Congress. Over
the next five years, they have to spend four billion
dollars with a B on infrastructure, roads, building, energy, free houses,
charging stations, all kinds of things that all of us
(30:27):
need in our communities. And listen to this. Forty percent
of the four billion dollars that have to be spent
in the next five years must be spent in neighborhoods
where forty percent of the population are under resource and
or fort of positively spent with black businesses or directly
(30:47):
impacted people. This is not black business directly impacted. So
let me just say in summary, there is an economic
model of economic policy that's in place. A lot of
us don't know about it. Even I know about it
because somebody came and told me about it from our
philanthropic partners, and we've been building and trying to get
ourselves in position to spread this throughout the hood and
(31:10):
the neighborhood and our organizing network. All I'm saying is,
these are the opportunities that she and this administration she
will create can put in place for us. But at
the end of the day, it still will require our
self determination, our elbow, grease of hard work, all of
the stuff we talked about on the panel. We're not
waiting for someone to do something for us. We're just
asking you to make an open door, an easy pathway,
(31:33):
and then we'll go do it ourselves. I think Kama
Harris is willing to do that. I know for sure
Donald Trump is not. And that is why none of
us should be giving Donald Trump a serious consideration. If
we care about the future of black people, and.
Speaker 2 (31:48):
You said, you said a lot that we need to
kind of unpack, you know, we definitely shouldn't. And I've
been very vocal and always saying that I would kamal
of high and you know, there's pretty much nothing that
can change that. But when I'm having these conversations, you know,
with people who are impacted in marginalized communities, with people
(32:13):
who just know day to day and they just don't
feel represented in the Democratic Party. We don't, especially black men,
but there are a lot of black men just don't
see this picture of what they call masculinity and I
and I would go as far to say that it's
creating some level of resentment. And I'm watching the divide,
(32:36):
especially online. You know, I'm watching the divide and I'm
having conversations with black men and they feel like this,
there's this conspiracy to raise us this and that, and
I would like to speak like, are you hearing that,
and what do you think that you know the party
needs to do to address that?
Speaker 3 (32:55):
Well, of course I'm hearing it. I mean, I think
it's not a new conversation, right, I think that black man.
And let me say like this, not all black men
are invited to the seat to the table, or not
all black men are extended a seat at mini table.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Right.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
You have to be a respectable black man most of
the time, unless you're a rapper who's super wealthy and
has lots of kind of cultural cachet to be invited
into places that are elite, right, that are our decision
making space. And so absolutely, I think that if you're
a preacher, you can get into a lot of rooms.
(33:35):
If you're a business person, you can get into a
lot of rooms as a black man. If you are
a wealthy black man, you need a lawyer. But if
you are someone who has a certain energy, a certain
tenure in her voice, a certain look, a certain smell,
a certain experience, and you don't have to polish that
aggression that you know what, we would say, the strength
(33:56):
that we had to tap into to make it through
the griminess of our daily existence. That energy is very
difficult for a lot of people to handle in a room.
And so I do think that the Democratic Party and
many spaces in the United States of America have put
so many of our men, particularly black men, in like
very toxic predatory environments, and then punish us when we
(34:21):
have to bring all of that energy with us into
a meeting that once we leave the meeting, we have
to go back into a very toxic predatory environment. So yes,
the Democratic Party, as well as many other institutions in
this country, including the church, pluding, our schools, including lots
of businesses, are not always able to create the conditions
(34:44):
where black men from a certain kind of experience, a
certain kind of texture, a certain kind of energy, are welcome.
Having said that, our job, people like you, Angelo, myself,
Phil Agne Killer, Mike, all of but Articul and the
brothers on the State, our job is to keep fighting
for our community and not throw in the town. And
(35:05):
I will say to all of us online who are
in a comments that's talking about while you know we
can't be involved in white we can participate. I just
want to remind you that at every era of black
people in business in this country, some white man was
trying to keep you out of a room. And every
generation of black people, particularly black men, up until now,
(35:27):
have fought for our people against the kind of odds.
And so we should name this contradiction. We should name
this fallacy, We should elevate it. We should push whoever
is guilty of that kind of behavior towards our people
to not only cease and desist right but to maybe
build our own tables like we did today and demonstrate
(35:50):
that not only is there something we can offer, but
we will cost you politically if you do not like
create a space for our voices, the totality of the
black experience to be heard. And so the Democratic Party
has a problem. The Republican Party certainly has no plan
to do this except for a very symbolic what do
(36:13):
you say, the kind of they know how to pray,
you know, they're how to manipulate, they know how to
kind of do performative justice. We want more to performance,
We want more to symbolism. We want concrete material conditions,
shifting policy decisions inclusion, and I think that's part of
the big work that we're trying to build with the
(36:34):
voter else and all the other movement work that we're collecting,
we're trying to do and this is why this conversation
is being raised, because we have to raise it no
one else with.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
Absolutely well, my hat goes off to both of you brothers,
you know, because you all are courageous, you are saying
the things that need to be said. I think so
many of our people acknowledge your work, acknowledge both of
your efforts, knowing that you are come together, you know,
(37:05):
looking at you pastor mic who while you are extremely bold, courageous,
progressive and and when needed even confrontational, but at the
same time, there are many who do look at you
as more respectable of us, of you know, of the
(37:26):
many black men that you are around, uh, and the
fact that you have linked up with the Marvin Beings,
the Mysons and the Angelo Pintos and others and are
standing sort of in the middle of that, in the
midst of those types of folks, the beanie Seguels and
the whole thing. And then going back to people who
(37:51):
have power and proximity to power, and not just going
to get access to yourself, but to open the door
for these others to be able to share their experiences,
their knowledge, their expertise. You know, I think that it
is so important for people to understand that what we
(38:11):
might not have attended the top schools, you know, we
may not have been born with the silver spoon and
lived in the best communities and all of that, but
we have an expertise that is based upon the experiences
that we've gone through the people. We know the fact
(38:32):
that many of those who do have access and proximity
to power are folks who would never spend time in
the middle of the day walking through communities like the
ones that we were in today, where we are all comfortable.
It is comfortable for us to be this. It's not
like no one standing around worried, nervous. You know, we
(38:54):
were standing and having conversations, having meetings, you know, right
there in the middle of the street. You know, comfortable
in our communities. That gives us a level of expertise
and we will not be devalued. No one will tell
us that some white consultant or some person who went
to school and studied urban communities knows more than a
(39:17):
Mason who has who comes from the community, is still
in the community and has also suffered the unfortunate collateral
consequences of being in a community, growing up in poverty,
and dealing with all the things that you know you've
dealt with my son. So, as a Black woman, I
(39:37):
just want to say to both of you, kings, that
I sit back and I look at y'all and I
feel like we are in still in good hands. My
father was the first man that I knew I was
in good hands. But now that I look at the
two of you, I know that the torture has been
passed along and you all are keeping that flame going
(39:59):
of protecting black women, protecting our families, protecting our communities.
And I say this last thing that you know, one
of the issues that concerns me is that a lot
of black women, especially as we and not just Black
women but women in general, are really fighting for our
right to bodily autonomy, to having the right to choose.
(40:24):
It is important to us that we see our brothers
stand side by side and stand in solidarity with us
and not say, well, these folks over here are offering
us some type of you know, trickonometry if you will,
of a possible financial reward for voting for this guy
(40:46):
who I won't name, and then but agree with or
and or turn the blind eye to women and our
rights being taken away from us. At the same time,
we can't do that. We have to push to ensure
that all the things that we want to see in
our communities are done. It's going to take a law.
(41:08):
It's not gonna be just this particular election that will
accomplish that. Nonetheless, we're moving the ball forward. We cannot
go back. And I'm I'm definitely a supporter of Kamala Harris,
but I'm a supporter enough to say that a part
of support is also to hold people accountable and the
(41:29):
telling the truth. And so hopefully we can accomplish all
those things at once that I get the right and
my granddaughter gets the right to choose what she and
her doctor think is best for her care, and at
the same time have a path towards financial freedom. So
(41:49):
I appreciate you passing, Mike, thank you for being with
us today, and thank you so much for bringing us
all together in Detroit, Michigan. It was truly an event
and a day that must be replicated in places around
the nation.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
Yeah, and we plan to do that. And I encourage
all of you that are listening, you know, to remember
that the power always lies with us and our ability
to organize. We were not a people that is asking
for a handout. We already worked for free. It's called slavery, right,
So we we did our free labor. Now we want
(42:24):
what is deserved and what we have already put in.
And I do think part of what we did today
was plant a seed in the ground that I hope
turns into a huge oak of righteousness, an oak of
justice where we can indeed keep gathering our people, which
is what black people have been doing for years. They've
been called hush Harbor's places where we can have our
(42:46):
own conversation on our own turns away from the gaze
of the slave master and the oppression. So you being
there to mecause obviously you've been there, my son, helping
us to keep sowing the seed. I hope that we
come to North Carolina something very similar. Let's hit the
rural side of North Carolina. I hope we do it.
In Georgia. Let's let's hit the spots where people are
(43:07):
not being engaged, you know, and let's keep doing it
on big scales and then let's do it on smaller skills.
My son says, I'm so powerful today you just say, hey,
you know what if we just came together like this,
five six, seven of us, even if we don't agree,
and just hash out our differences, but then leave with
the united praying and move forward. I think this is
what I hope we were able to model today. And
(43:31):
doing it with you guys, we always have a good time.
And not like working with people you like right to
do hard work, because the work is hard. I ain't
working nobody, I don't like. I'm just telling that right now.
Too old in times. So when you can work with
people you like and laugh and have jokes and cry
and listen to good music and you know, talk talk
(43:53):
talk shop, it's a blessing. I love y'all. I'm gonna
stop talking. I'm alone with the Black Preacher and I
sleep and time that It's been great.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
All right.
Speaker 2 (44:04):
Again, We appreciate you, man, because it is important the
work that you do on so many different fronts, you know,
being a black preacher like you said, and still taking
the time out to invest in community and build with
grassroots organizations and make sure that there's a connection between
(44:24):
the church and the state, right. And I love the
fact the way that you play that that position. You know,
you you bring so many different ideas and people together
and you've been doing it since I met you. So
I just want to say that we definitely appreciate you
and we need people like you, especially in these times.
So I know you tie it and we had you
(44:47):
up all night, way past your bedtime.
Speaker 3 (44:49):
We definitely Hey, we'll do it again tomorrow night.
Speaker 2 (44:54):
Right now? Safe?
Speaker 1 (45:00):
Well, I think you know, today was a good day.
That was a great conversation. Love Pastor Mike so much,
you know, just a good, solid, all the way thorough individual.
Everybody that we talked to has said the same thing
(45:20):
so many times today. I had people say to me,
while you are blessed that Pastor Mike is your friend
and your supporter, and so it's been good. I mean,
all we can do is keep pushing, continue to do
our work, continue to do our part getting out there
(45:41):
in our communities. Is you know, I noticed that you
guys were having a pretty contentious conversation with a young
man today who didn't want to be registered and after
just you know a little bit of respect and building
and next thing you know, he had the clipboard and
he was registering. And now you know, with that type
(46:01):
of engagement, we had to go back. We've got to
knock on this door. We have to make sure that
he also has access to the voting polls and not
just registered, but that he actually goes to do his part.
So there's a lot of work to be done. I'm
here for it. I spent a week you know in
(46:23):
Paris and join myself and you know, living life with
my friends. But I said that when I got back,
I would get to running immediately to do this work
for the next less than fifty days. And I think
we got off to a great start today with Voter Else.
Speaker 2 (46:40):
Definitely got up to a great start. Shout out to
Marven being shout out too Passive McBride for you know,
coming to the show, and just shout out to everyone
that was a part of this event. Like I said,
it was a lot of artists in which you know,
I'm fans of and friends of and some that I
just met today. But it was just one of those rules,
(47:00):
is one of those spaces that it was just powerful.
You know, even the off camera and the prior to
the conversation, just being in green rooms and just building
with brothers and you know, ideology and just talking about
the things that are need in our community and just
seeing us all come together. And I know, that's what
it looks like. That's what the beloved community looks like.
(47:20):
That's what we want America to look like. You know,
brothers in the building, inside of rooms, building with each other,
talking about how we create generational wealth, how do we
you know, create unity, How do we stay together in
these times and speak about what it is that is
directly impacting us and it's needed. So you know, once again,
(47:43):
I enjoyed the conversation. You know, I love what you
had to say. You know what I'm saying, Our sisters
had to say when you were talking and you and
your taker came in with very key you know, elements
into that conversation. You know, we we we're so much
better together and they know that, and the intentionally, intentionally
(48:03):
try to divide us. So I just want us to
be very strategic. I said that all the time. We
just have to be so much more strategic, and we
have to understand what the enemies. They've been doing the
same thing for generations. Is trying to keep us divided,
you know, and I just don't want us to fall
for that. So with no service, with no further ado,
(48:24):
we come to the end of another beautiful show. Shout
out to all of our followers and listeners who love us,
who make us the number one podcasts in the world.
Don't worry. We coming back full throttle with our visuals,
so I want you to be prepared for that. But
in the meantime, we want to say that we love
you and we're going to continue to be authentic. I'm
(48:45):
not gonna always be right, Tamika, the Mallories not gonna
always be wrong, but we will both always and I
mean always be authentic. Check out the video.
Speaker 1 (49:02):
Version of t M every single Wednesday on Iwoman dot TV.
Speaker 3 (49:07):
That's how
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Monster: BTK
'Monster: BTK', the newest installment in the 'Monster' franchise, reveals the true story of the Wichita, Kansas serial killer who murdered at least 10 people between 1974 and 1991. Known by the moniker, BTK – Bind Torture Kill, his notoriety was bolstered by the taunting letters he sent to police, and the chilling phone calls he made to media outlets. BTK's identity was finally revealed in 2005 to the shock of his family, his community, and the world. He was the serial killer next door. From Tenderfoot TV & iHeartPodcasts, this is 'Monster: BTK'.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.