Tears for Fears cofounder Roland Orzabal joins us on his new memoir “Welcome to your life.” This is must-hear radio!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
One half of the duo and co-creator of Tears for Fears,
Roland Orzabal, out with a new memoir called Welcome to
Your Life. Well, welcome to our show, Roland. Nice to
meet you, too. Listen, I got to tell you one
of the most interesting things about telling people I was
going to visit with you. And I think for most
people listening, Tears for Fears is shout. Everybody rules the world.
(00:24):
But I have found your real fans. They bring up
much different titles. You're out with a new memoir, Welcome
to Your Life. It tells the story of you and
Kurt and the formation of the band. There's so many stories.
interesting stories to tell. And the music is still so
much a part of people's lives. So we're excited to
go through this with you. I think probably the one
thing I learned, I didn't know that Everybody Wants to
(00:46):
Rule the World almost had a different title.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
It did.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
It was a song that I came up with the
same month that I came up with Shout and a
few others that ended up on the Big Chair album.
But I wasn't sure about it at all because it
wasn't like the previous material. of The Hurting, which was
darker and more emotional. So this was very light. And
(01:12):
it was originally called Everybody Wants to Go to War,
which is a very negative, grubby title. I was kind
of sitting on the fence about it, but my wife,
my late wife, Caroline, absolutely loved it. And so I
took it into the studio and played it to Kurt, Chris, Hughes,
our producer, and Ian Stanley, our keyboard player.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
And they loved it. So we tried to add.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
You know, the title of the memoir is a lyric
from that song, Welcome to Your Life. What a great,
who came up with that line?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I did.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, that's, I mean, it's a brilliant lyric. I thought
it was ingenious. I mean, America and the world hasn't
changed that much. I mean, we've been divided before. We
seem to be divided now. at all time levels right now.
But that time, the influence of the 60s and the
Vietnam War and then the Cold War, you had a
(02:05):
view of that even from Europe. And that was a
brilliant way to get around such a divisive title, just
avoid it altogether. And I think people have been singing
that song for 40 years and had no idea where
the inspiration came from.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I know, that's true. I mean, we were all worried
at the time about the Cold War very much. Russia
against America. You know, and things haven't changed. They've become
more subtle. We're now using drones instead of the threat
of nuclear weapons, but it's.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
Still pretty horrible. Everybody wants to rule the world. I mean,
just a, you know, perfect mix, instrumentation mixed with great lyric,
great vocal. I mean, just the recipe. I would think
by numbers, I didn't do this research before visiting you,
but that and Shout were the two biggest. But I
think everybody wants to rule the world, the biggest of
them all, right?
Speaker 3 (02:56):
It's become so over the years, you know, because of streaming,
we now have, I guess, what we can call a
mega hit. to the point where it's risen higher than
any other song in our catalogue, even though when we
play live, people can hear all of those songs and,
(03:17):
you know, they sound fantastic. Everybody Wants to Rule the
World is a song I don't think is ever going
to go away.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Fingers crossed.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Well, yeah, no, it'll outlive both of us. Dennis Miller
also took it to a new level, making it the
theme of his television and radio show as well. Roland
Orzabal is joining us, co-founder, half the duo of Tears
for Fears. This really is a friendship story too, not
just two teenagers who, by the way, I love Thin Lizzy.
I like Blue Oyster Cult. I never made a hit song,
(03:47):
but you and Kurt get together. This is kind of
the story of your meeting, early music, eventual breakup. now
reuniting it really is a very personal memoir isn't.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
It it's very personal you know it's a story of
tears for fears um from the horse's mouth which i
don't think has ever been told by an author uh
and so it's it's the intimate detail from someone um
shoot uh blowing my own trumpet.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Uh who has a very very good memory.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Exactly so yeah it's a story of me and kurt
and um This is also the story of my early childhood,
which was very strange because my parents ran an entertainment
agency from our council house in England.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Oh, my gosh.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
It's a story of what happened to me later in
life with my late wife and her alcoholism. It's not
a very nice story, but it also has an underlying
layer of astrology which can explain the highs and lows
and the patterns involved in my life.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
If I were to ask the young Roland, what does
welcome to your life mean compared to the Roland now
who has lived a lot of that life, but it's
still the same question. Welcome to your life, Roland, and
welcome to your memoir as we're all reading it. How
different would your views be? Well, I just wrote it
because I was looking for lyrics. I had one night
(05:16):
in Germany, um, as we were mixing, and I had
one night to come up with lyrics, so I didn't
think about it too much. And it seemed like a good,
a really strong opening line, but it's only now. Maybe
I knew I was going to write a book called
Welcome to Your Life. Maybe that's what it was all about.
(05:38):
But when it came to, when it was suggested to
me that I write a memoir, I knew it was
the title immediately.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
And there's an element, I'm hoping there's an element of
this book, which is kind of like a self-help book.
The reason is it's called Welcome to Your Life and
not Welcome to My Life.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
You know, that begs the question, Roland Orzabal joining us,
one half of Tears for Fears, bring us the memoir,
Welcome to Your Life. You know, life, we end up
where we are by the series of choices we make.
I have a friend, David Zanotti, who always says you've
got to get 100 years behind someone's eyes to really
understand them. You speak to your parents, who were, by
the way, influenced and shaped by their parents. That's how
(06:22):
you get to 100 years. But it does beg the question, regrets,
musical regrets, relationship regrets, life regrets. How much of that
is a part of Welcome to Your Life? Well, I
don't put them in, you know, regrets. I mean, because
I do wonder... I really seriously wonder philosophically whether we
actually have a choice. Because when you look at the past,
(06:46):
it's etched in stone. And I'm really not sure, but
it regrets, of course. I wish I'd flossed. Okay, that's
the line of the day.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
I wish I'd bought shares in Apple. Come on.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
You know what? It's so surreal to me. I used
to play video games in the arcade while your music
was playing. You know, you've kind of become the soundtrack
of all of our lives. And what this memoir is
going to give us is a blueprint of what was
happening in that inspired the writing of those songs, what
was happening in your life during those songs, what happened
in your life since we haven't, you know, been sharing
(07:31):
time together.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Think the big takeaway is I don't believe in regrets either,
because you can't go back. You know, we don't get
a redo. And really, quite frankly, most of the things,
you know, I don't know, I guess my, I wouldn't
call it a regret, my dumbest career move was was
at 20 something years old, I had a chance to
go run WLS in Chicago. And I was just thinking, well,
I love Chicago. I love WLS, but none of the
(07:55):
people I grew up listening to still work there. It's freezing.
I'd be in traffic two hours a day. I got
a pretty good life where I am. And I said, no,
now from a career path, that was a dumb thing
to do. But you don't really have regrets, right? Because
even our mistakes shape us and make us what we are.
And I don't think anybody wants to change what we are, right?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
It's true.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
I mean, if I look back, and I had the
chance to move the dial somewhat at certain times, I
would have done that, and it would have made my
career much better and much easier. But the problem is,
at some point, your personal life and the world inside
completely takes precedent. And I think that, you know, when
(08:39):
I look back now, yes, there are definitely things I
would have done differently. But I'm not sure if the
overall pattern and the overall result would have changed that much.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Well, there is no tears for fears unless you and
Kurt are teenage friends. There is no breakup if working
together doesn't create strains. The reunion isn't what it is
if you don't have the breakup. So I mean, really,
is it worth our time to dissect? Although I should say,
as much as I always loved the name Tears for Fears,
(09:13):
I never really thought about Tears for Fears as a name.
Kind of like being smarter. enough not to call everybody
wants to go to war versus everybody wants to rule
the world tears for fears a psychology term so i
am talking to a psychologist slash astrologist i'm sure you've
overthought all of this uh how did you come up
with a name i mean what teenagers thinking about psychology terms.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Yeah i mean this is the thing that set us
apart i mean there is a chapter in the book
which explains in depth um what we were inspired by
and what and and the the life I chose to follow.
It's called a process of becoming. So Kurt and I
were very much influenced by a Californian psychologist called Arthur Janoff.
(10:02):
And he wrote a book called The Primal Scream. And
John Lennon made it famous many, many years ago. And
we embraced the theory.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
It was.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Pretty much about sort of The child being born a
blank slate, the child is a victim to his parents.
And whatever they did created our character. That was what
I believed at the time. And primal therapy, which is
what it was called, was very cathartic. There was a
(10:39):
lot of emotion involved in the therapy. It's not a
talking cure like a psychoanalysis therapy. And it's not like
modern psychotherapy at all. It's much more of an emotional bloodbath.
So that's what inspired us in the beginning, especially the
(10:59):
first album, The Hurting.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
I guess I was the only one who was thinking
about girls and being a Major League Baseball player. Closing
moments with Roland Orzabal, a co-founder, half the duo of
Tears for Fears, out with a new memoir.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Welcome to.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
radio host-ish, but if you love their music, you're going
to love the stories behind them and what created them,
who wrote it. You know, I want to end full circle.
I talked about, I would have brought up Naturally Shout,
Everybody Wants to Rule the World. I must have heard
Mad World as more people's favorite song than that when
talking about I was going to visit with you. And
(11:38):
I'm thinking to myself, what were you, 19 when you
wrote that?
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Yeah, it was. Incredible, eh?
Speaker 1 (11:44):
I mean, God created a very thoughtful young man in
England who created some really thoughtful music. What are you
hoping we take away from this memoir? Because I'm with you.
I think there's a lot of real life in this
beyond music. Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
I mean, you know, my life, like a lot of people's,
has had ups and downs and triumphs and tragedies. And
I'm hoping... that people will read it and understand part
of themselves. And I'm hoping they will read it and
see that there is an underlying pattern to everyone's life,
(12:24):
even if there may not be someone up there controlling
us as puppets, may not be, may be simply organic.
But there is a series of principles and patterns behind
every life.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, and I was having this conversation yesterday with my cousin,
and every generation has the opportunity to break those cycles
and create new ones. That's what I'm hoping this book
allows people to see a little bit more clearly.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
That's a nice way of putting it.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Yeah, I just thought, you know, welcome to your life.
What a great way to start an iconic song. What
a great song. So many great songs. So great to
hear these stories. I encourage everybody to get Welcome to
Your Life. It is a memoir of Roland Orzabal and
the Tears for Fears lives behind the music and stories.
(13:13):
I know they're going to love it. I learned a
lot and I enjoyed every second of it. Roland, thank
you so much for your time.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
You'll hear something in the background during that interview if
you listen closely. And it's my pen doing that. Look,
I'm aware I have attention deficit disorder. I don't think
that Roland and I have the same eternal beliefs necessarily,
but that's a thoughtful guy. And I found it fascinating
and interesting. If you're hearing that click, that's because I'm
(13:41):
not thinking about what to say next.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
I'm in the moment.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
And this guy has me captivated. I hope you found
that as much must-hear radio as I did. Roland Orzabal,
the name of the memoir, Welcome to Your Life. It's
sold everywhere great books are sold.
One half of the duo and co-creator of Tears for Fears,
Roland Orzabal, out with a new memoir called Welcome to
Your Life. Well, welcome to our show, Roland. Nice to
meet you, too. Listen, I got to tell you one
of the most interesting things about telling people I was
going to visit with you. And I think for most
people listening, Tears for Fears is shout. Everybody rules the world.
(00:24):
But I have found your real fans. They bring up
much different titles. You're out with a new memoir, Welcome
to Your Life. It tells the story of you and
Kurt and the formation of the band. There's so many stories.
interesting stories to tell. And the music is still so
much a part of people's lives. So we're excited to
go through this with you. I think probably the one
thing I learned, I didn't know that Everybody Wants to
(00:46):
Rule the World almost had a different title.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
It did.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
It was a song that I came up with the
same month that I came up with Shout and a
few others that ended up on the Big Chair album.
But I wasn't sure about it at all because it
wasn't like the previous material. of The Hurting, which was
darker and more emotional. So this was very light. And
(01:12):
it was originally called Everybody Wants to Go to War,
which is a very negative, grubby title. I was kind
of sitting on the fence about it, but my wife,
my late wife, Caroline, absolutely loved it. And so I
took it into the studio and played it to Kurt, Chris, Hughes,
our producer, and Ian Stanley, our keyboard player.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
And they loved it. So we tried to add.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
You know, the title of the memoir is a lyric
from that song, Welcome to Your Life. What a great,
who came up with that line?
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I did.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Yeah, that's, I mean, it's a brilliant lyric. I thought
it was ingenious. I mean, America and the world hasn't
changed that much. I mean, we've been divided before. We
seem to be divided now. at all time levels right now.
But that time, the influence of the 60s and the
Vietnam War and then the Cold War, you had a
(02:05):
view of that even from Europe. And that was a
brilliant way to get around such a divisive title, just
avoid it altogether. And I think people have been singing
that song for 40 years and had no idea where
the inspiration came from.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I know, that's true. I mean, we were all worried
at the time about the Cold War very much. Russia
against America. You know, and things haven't changed. They've become
more subtle. We're now using drones instead of the threat
of nuclear weapons, but it's.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
Still pretty horrible. Everybody wants to rule the world. I mean,
just a, you know, perfect mix, instrumentation mixed with great lyric,
great vocal. I mean, just the recipe. I would think
by numbers, I didn't do this research before visiting you,
but that and Shout were the two biggest. But I
think everybody wants to rule the world, the biggest of
them all, right?
Speaker 3 (02:56):
It's become so over the years, you know, because of streaming,
we now have, I guess, what we can call a
mega hit. to the point where it's risen higher than
any other song in our catalogue, even though when we
play live, people can hear all of those songs and,
(03:17):
you know, they sound fantastic. Everybody Wants to Rule the
World is a song I don't think is ever going
to go away.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Fingers crossed.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Well, yeah, no, it'll outlive both of us. Dennis Miller
also took it to a new level, making it the
theme of his television and radio show as well. Roland
Orzabal is joining us, co-founder, half the duo of Tears
for Fears. This really is a friendship story too, not
just two teenagers who, by the way, I love Thin Lizzy.
I like Blue Oyster Cult. I never made a hit song,
(03:47):
but you and Kurt get together. This is kind of
the story of your meeting, early music, eventual breakup. now
reuniting it really is a very personal memoir isn't.
Speaker 3 (03:56):
It it's very personal you know it's a story of
tears for fears um from the horse's mouth which i
don't think has ever been told by an author uh
and so it's it's the intimate detail from someone um
shoot uh blowing my own trumpet.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Uh who has a very very good memory.
Speaker 3 (04:17):
Exactly so yeah it's a story of me and kurt
and um This is also the story of my early childhood,
which was very strange because my parents ran an entertainment
agency from our council house in England.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Oh, my gosh.
Speaker 3 (04:34):
It's a story of what happened to me later in
life with my late wife and her alcoholism. It's not
a very nice story, but it also has an underlying
layer of astrology which can explain the highs and lows
and the patterns involved in my life.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
If I were to ask the young Roland, what does
welcome to your life mean compared to the Roland now
who has lived a lot of that life, but it's
still the same question. Welcome to your life, Roland, and
welcome to your memoir as we're all reading it. How
different would your views be? Well, I just wrote it
because I was looking for lyrics. I had one night
(05:16):
in Germany, um, as we were mixing, and I had
one night to come up with lyrics, so I didn't
think about it too much. And it seemed like a good,
a really strong opening line, but it's only now. Maybe
I knew I was going to write a book called
Welcome to Your Life. Maybe that's what it was all about.
(05:38):
But when it came to, when it was suggested to
me that I write a memoir, I knew it was
the title immediately.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
Right.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
And there's an element, I'm hoping there's an element of
this book, which is kind of like a self-help book.
The reason is it's called Welcome to Your Life and
not Welcome to My Life.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
You know, that begs the question, Roland Orzabal joining us,
one half of Tears for Fears, bring us the memoir,
Welcome to Your Life. You know, life, we end up
where we are by the series of choices we make.
I have a friend, David Zanotti, who always says you've
got to get 100 years behind someone's eyes to really
understand them. You speak to your parents, who were, by
the way, influenced and shaped by their parents. That's how
(06:22):
you get to 100 years. But it does beg the question, regrets,
musical regrets, relationship regrets, life regrets. How much of that
is a part of Welcome to Your Life? Well, I
don't put them in, you know, regrets. I mean, because
I do wonder... I really seriously wonder philosophically whether we
actually have a choice. Because when you look at the past,
(06:46):
it's etched in stone. And I'm really not sure, but
it regrets, of course. I wish I'd flossed. Okay, that's
the line of the day.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
I wish I'd bought shares in Apple. Come on.
Speaker 1 (07:08):
You know what? It's so surreal to me. I used
to play video games in the arcade while your music
was playing. You know, you've kind of become the soundtrack
of all of our lives. And what this memoir is
going to give us is a blueprint of what was
happening in that inspired the writing of those songs, what
was happening in your life during those songs, what happened
in your life since we haven't, you know, been sharing
(07:31):
time together.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Think the big takeaway is I don't believe in regrets either,
because you can't go back. You know, we don't get
a redo. And really, quite frankly, most of the things,
you know, I don't know, I guess my, I wouldn't
call it a regret, my dumbest career move was was
at 20 something years old, I had a chance to
go run WLS in Chicago. And I was just thinking, well,
I love Chicago. I love WLS, but none of the
(07:55):
people I grew up listening to still work there. It's freezing.
I'd be in traffic two hours a day. I got
a pretty good life where I am. And I said, no,
now from a career path, that was a dumb thing
to do. But you don't really have regrets, right? Because
even our mistakes shape us and make us what we are.
And I don't think anybody wants to change what we are, right?
Speaker 2 (08:15):
It's true.
Speaker 3 (08:15):
I mean, if I look back, and I had the
chance to move the dial somewhat at certain times, I
would have done that, and it would have made my
career much better and much easier. But the problem is,
at some point, your personal life and the world inside
completely takes precedent. And I think that, you know, when
(08:39):
I look back now, yes, there are definitely things I
would have done differently. But I'm not sure if the
overall pattern and the overall result would have changed that much.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
Well, there is no tears for fears unless you and
Kurt are teenage friends. There is no breakup if working
together doesn't create strains. The reunion isn't what it is
if you don't have the breakup. So I mean, really,
is it worth our time to dissect? Although I should say,
as much as I always loved the name Tears for Fears,
(09:13):
I never really thought about Tears for Fears as a name.
Kind of like being smarter. enough not to call everybody
wants to go to war versus everybody wants to rule
the world tears for fears a psychology term so i
am talking to a psychologist slash astrologist i'm sure you've
overthought all of this uh how did you come up
with a name i mean what teenagers thinking about psychology terms.
Speaker 3 (09:37):
Yeah i mean this is the thing that set us
apart i mean there is a chapter in the book
which explains in depth um what we were inspired by
and what and and the the life I chose to follow.
It's called a process of becoming. So Kurt and I
were very much influenced by a Californian psychologist called Arthur Janoff.
(10:02):
And he wrote a book called The Primal Scream. And
John Lennon made it famous many, many years ago. And
we embraced the theory.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
It was.
Speaker 3 (10:15):
Pretty much about sort of The child being born a
blank slate, the child is a victim to his parents.
And whatever they did created our character. That was what
I believed at the time. And primal therapy, which is
what it was called, was very cathartic. There was a
(10:39):
lot of emotion involved in the therapy. It's not a
talking cure like a psychoanalysis therapy. And it's not like
modern psychotherapy at all. It's much more of an emotional bloodbath.
So that's what inspired us in the beginning, especially the
(10:59):
first album, The Hurting.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
I guess I was the only one who was thinking
about girls and being a Major League Baseball player. Closing
moments with Roland Orzabal, a co-founder, half the duo of
Tears for Fears, out with a new memoir.
Speaker 2 (11:13):
Welcome to.
Speaker 1 (11:15):
radio host-ish, but if you love their music, you're going
to love the stories behind them and what created them,
who wrote it. You know, I want to end full circle.
I talked about, I would have brought up Naturally Shout,
Everybody Wants to Rule the World. I must have heard
Mad World as more people's favorite song than that when
talking about I was going to visit with you. And
(11:38):
I'm thinking to myself, what were you, 19 when you
wrote that?
Speaker 2 (11:41):
Yeah, it was. Incredible, eh?
Speaker 1 (11:44):
I mean, God created a very thoughtful young man in
England who created some really thoughtful music. What are you
hoping we take away from this memoir? Because I'm with you.
I think there's a lot of real life in this
beyond music. Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
I mean, you know, my life, like a lot of people's,
has had ups and downs and triumphs and tragedies. And
I'm hoping... that people will read it and understand part
of themselves. And I'm hoping they will read it and
see that there is an underlying pattern to everyone's life,
(12:24):
even if there may not be someone up there controlling
us as puppets, may not be, may be simply organic.
But there is a series of principles and patterns behind
every life.
Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, and I was having this conversation yesterday with my cousin,
and every generation has the opportunity to break those cycles
and create new ones. That's what I'm hoping this book
allows people to see a little bit more clearly.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
That's a nice way of putting it.
Speaker 1 (12:53):
Yeah, I just thought, you know, welcome to your life.
What a great way to start an iconic song. What
a great song. So many great songs. So great to
hear these stories. I encourage everybody to get Welcome to
Your Life. It is a memoir of Roland Orzabal and
the Tears for Fears lives behind the music and stories.
(13:13):
I know they're going to love it. I learned a
lot and I enjoyed every second of it. Roland, thank
you so much for your time.
Speaker 2 (13:18):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (13:19):
You'll hear something in the background during that interview if
you listen closely. And it's my pen doing that. Look,
I'm aware I have attention deficit disorder. I don't think
that Roland and I have the same eternal beliefs necessarily,
but that's a thoughtful guy. And I found it fascinating
and interesting. If you're hearing that click, that's because I'm
(13:41):
not thinking about what to say next.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
I'm in the moment.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
And this guy has me captivated. I hope you found
that as much must-hear radio as I did. Roland Orzabal,
the name of the memoir, Welcome to Your Life. It's
sold everywhere great books are sold.
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