March 25, 2026 • 48 mins
On the latest NFL Players: Second Acts podcast, Peanut Tillman and Roman Harper are joined by their former head coach Ron Rivera. Ron was a Super Bowl winning linebacker, defensive coordinator, and head coach who took the Carolina Panthers to Super Bowl 50. Ron explains what he does in his current role as the first general manager of the California football program and shares his vision for the future of the team. He speaks out about the downsides of NIL and how he would like to see college football’s payment structure change. Ron also discusses his experience coaching Roman and Peanut on the Carolina Panthers and whether he would come back to coach in the NFL again.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The nil stuff is a bunch of bs, okay, because
when people are basically laundering money so it can be
given to kids. Yes, that's what we get in trouble.
I mean, let's let's let's look at the NFL model
and say that's where we need to be. When a
Nike or a USA or somebody call you up asay, hey,
we want you to do a commercial. Now we're talking
(00:20):
real because this is for us, same thing for us.
You had a contract, You had a contract, I had
a contract. Somebody from McDonald's calls you an ask for something.
You know, somebody who's somebody from Little Caesar's calls you
to do something. That's great because that's beyond your your contract. Yes,
and that's what it's supposed to be. It's not supposed
to be somebody paying you to play. That's the truth.
(00:40):
And that's what really bothers me because I hate to
see it ruin the sport. And we're kind of heading
that direction right now. What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Everybody on peanuts to Himan and this is the NFL
Player's Second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
And with me as always as my see co host
Roman Harbor, everybody's in our nice blues today, I'm really
excited about our next guest. He's one of my favorites.
He's definitely my top two coach in the NFL because
only had two. But you know, he's in there and
he's great and he deserves all the accolades. So Peanut,
let's jump into it. I can't wait to talk.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a super Bowl champion, played on
the great eighty five Bears defense. He took us to
Super Bowl fifty. Yeah, and we'll just leave it at that.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
We probably took him too, you did, I promise you
guys did? We probably took him to.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Now he's the general manager of Cow's football team. Ladies
and gentlemen, please welcome to the.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Pot run the thank you, thank you. How's that been?
It's been interesting? It is probably the best word I
could think because it really is my biggest disappointment though.
Was there there? There really is? There are no parameters,
there's no rules, and it's utter chaos, you know, And
(02:00):
and I think it culminated this past portal. Uh and
it actually culminated right after the portal. I think what
Dabo Swingey did, calling uh ole miss out. I believe
it was Ole miss right. It was miss calling them
out for what they did. I think that's big, and
I think that's important because we've got to get control
of this, uh because if not, we're going to ruin
a very good sport. Yeah, college football right now is
(02:23):
the second most popular television sport. So let's you know,
let's make sure we're at least following the rules so
we can, uh, we can produce uh quality football.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Like coaches have told on coaches in the past or programs,
but nobody actually like brought in presented receipts to the public.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yes, like dad, that was the first.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Of its kind, Yes it was. I mean he had
text messages, he had at all. He had a player
from CAV.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
I know that's you know what I will say this,
he's a heck of a young man. He's a good
football player. But I did tell people that, you know,
I wouldn't be surprised if he did leave.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Yes, you know, but you understand where the game is
right now, correct, Because.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Because they throw it out there in front of the
young man, the you know, they bait the hook. They
throw it out there. They know how to get to
these young people, and they exploit it. And it's unfortunate
because a lot of these young people are getting trapped
and caught up in you know, terrible situations. I mean,
you look at what happened with Duke with the quarterback. Yeah,
you know, that's another issue right there. And again it's
one of those things that once we have parameters and
(03:21):
once those things are set, you know, now, now let's
let's let's follow the rules, and if you break the rules,
take a percentage of people of people's revenue, share money,
and I promise you people will now fall in line
stare where they need to be, at least I believe.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
So the same thing happening with Washington's quarterback as well. So,
like you said, coach, I have no idea what a
contract is. What a contract Isn't you know the fact
that they say, well, it's not through the team, so
you're not it's through the nil. So it's like, do
you hear all these things and they're trying to I
don't understand it all. So I'm saying this with a
sense of ignorance as well, because I just know what
(03:56):
I hear, and like, what is actually true fact?
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Well, the true fact is there's base see two portions
of the of the money. There's the revenue share, which
is what the judge ruled on and said that there
is money that should be shared between the universities and
the student athletes. That's the twenty million, twenty point five
minimum per team, which I think we all could agree
is something that was well overdue. Yeah, so why don't
we make that the salary cap and just say, look,
(04:19):
the nil stuff is a bunch of bs. Okay, because
when people are basically laundering money so it can be
given to kids, Yes, that's what we get in trouble. Yeah,
I mean, let's let's let's look at the NFL model
and say that's where we need to be. When a
Nike or a USAA or somebody call you up a
say hey, we want you to do a commercial. Now
we're talking real because this is for us, same thing
(04:41):
for us. You had a contract, You had a contract.
I had a contract. Somebody from McDonald's calls you and
ask for something. You know, somebody who's somebody from Little
Caesar's calls you to do something. That's great because that's
beyond your your contract, right, and that's what it's supposed
to be. It's not supposed to be somebody paying you
to play. That's the truth. And that's what really bothers
me because I hate to see it ruin the sport.
(05:03):
And we're kind of heading that direction right now.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Since being the general manager, how have you run your
organization or cow as a GM with how the rules
are in place, knowing that it's such chaos.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
It's hard, It really is, because if you don't do something,
you're going to get left behind very quickly. And we've
seen that, I mean, you know, and it just shows
you what you can do if you do it. Look
at what Indiana built. They built it. You know, they
got good financial support. That's probably one of the biggest
things that you need right now to be able to
build is you need to financial support. Get you get
to the revenue share that makes everything equal. Now, where
(05:39):
everything gets distorted is when you go now to nil.
That's the money that comes in from other donors and
and really we really wonder where that money's you know,
coming from. What's that money really being used for? Yes,
you know, are you really truly getting commercials, really truly
being paid to do something where the other party is
getting value? Yep? Or are we making up value? That's
(06:01):
what I worry about. I mean, it's a great point.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
I I don't have the answers for it. It's been Look,
I work in the SEC and so I see it at.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
All by the way you do great, Yeah, I really do.
I enjoy watched it.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
I appreciate that coach you know, working there. You see
it at such a large scale. And then you also
see where like you know, everybody, the people with the
most money in the world, their teams aren't even that good.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Yeah, and so like how you spend.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
That dollar is just as important as having the dollar,
and so what are you doing with it? How fruitful
are you being? Texas Tech to me, in my opinion,
has been one of the best teams and university. It's
spreading the dollar and using it to be very impactful
in which they use their money. And you know they
are of course they got all money and they got
Lubbock and but they've been really good. I mean you
(06:47):
look at what they do with the women's softball player.
To me, I think that's one of the best. They
spend a million dollars and everybody said they were crazy.
Then all of a sudden they went to gyms and
was like it paid off. Yes, and so how you
spend that dollars This is important on who you you know,
how you're spinning and who you're spending it on.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And then the big thing that we're seeing is it
is really truly leveling the playing field to a degree.
But you've got to be able to be really good
in scouting too. Are you spending it properly and the
right type of people. But it's not just about having
recruiters on your coaching staff. They better be down good coaches, yes,
because talent will only take you so far, which will
get you to a really good level. Now, are you
(07:24):
as a coach going to screw it up or are
you going to be able to coach them through? You're
gonna be able to make the right decision to give
you yourselves a chance to get to the final four.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
The term GM is so we understand what is in
the NFL, right, but in college it is a loose term.
I don't even know because each GM is different.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Yes, it's very broad.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Yes, Okay, go into that and kind of explain that
to our viewers.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Well, I've heard everything from a general manager being the
guy that does the contracts, only they they do the
scouting aspect of it, or they're trying to find the talent.
They're jeans that work with the coaching staffs, work with
actually practicing, you know, on the field with the practices,
helping to grow and develop their their their talent. But
(08:07):
one of the biggest things that I did, and probably
last year, probably more than fifty percent of my time
was around alumni and donor donor engagement, trying to find
the funds for the for the revenue share and the
funds for nil. See everybody thinks that when the judge said, okay,
twenty point five million is the salary cap, that money
has to be raised, whether it comes from your multimedia
(08:30):
rights or it comes from donor engagements, it comes from
other resources like ticket sales, stuff like that. You've got
to have all that type of revenue sources lined up
so that you can fill that pot. And twenty point
five can all go to football or could be it
could be divided up amongst your other sports. What the
suggestion was seventy five percent of that twenty million dollars
(08:52):
would go to football. Minimum is what they say. You
give yourselves a chance, and then I think like five
percent would go to would go to men's basketball. Another
percentage we go to women's basketball because those are your
three primary money generating sports, and then you spread the
rest of it amongst you, amongst your other Olympic sports.
And that's kind of how it was modeled. And teams.
(09:13):
Some teams are taking the whole twenty point five were
right to football, and some have done like we have,
and we've taken that seventy five percent model and we've
worked off of that, and that's how you try to
distribute your money.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
It's got to be interesting with a university like cow
where in Stanford, you guys have so many Olympic sports.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
We have thirty Stanford has thirty six. If we were
our own countries in the last Olympics and we were combined,
we'd been like top five medal winners. I mean that
because we produced so many Olympic sports, yes, Olympic athletes,
and not just for the United States but internationally. I mean,
we have one of the best rowers, we have one
of the best women's field hockey players. I mean, all
these people play in the Olympics and yet they're representing
(09:54):
your university. That's why the Olympic sports are important to
cal Stanford, Texas. UCLA rules that have these programs because
what happens is it gets people's attention worldwide. These folks
are ambassadors to us. What we've learned is that athletics
is the doorstep to every university. You know, there was
a time when everybody wanted to go to Cal because
it's the number one public institution or say something like that.
(10:17):
But then when Alabama starts having a championship program, Ohio
State has a championship program, Michigan has this program, Georgia,
now people want to go to these schools. Now, what's
happening is not only the great students, they also want
because they want the total experience. Second, my daughter, God
bless her, she took UCLA over Cal because she thought
(10:37):
the pro I said, you have to be kidding me.
But the point being is that it is the doorstep.
That's what athletics, that's what football has done. Basketball has
done the same thing. So that's why it's important in
terms of being relevant as far as a football program
is concerned. That's why everybody's really concerned about what's going
to go on next. Is there going to be a realignment?
I mean, that's the next big question is are you
(11:00):
going to see perhaps of the four power for that
two of them come together, the other two come together,
and you form these super conferences, just like in the NFL.
The NFL is probably the best structure to look at.
You've got really, you've got AFC NFC withinside you got
four divisions. Well, you could do the same thing in
college college athletics if you took everybody and you combine them.
Now you cut them in half, yep, and you have
(11:22):
an AFC NFC. Just like in college. You have all
these divisions and you these divisions play for championships and
then from there you play against each other determined who
goes to the play in the championship game.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
I just think this thing could go a bazillion different ways.
That's why I've been telling people. I'm like, man, you
got to look at Texas Tech because they're preparing for
a big shift, because they want to be relevant. That's
why they're spending the money that they're spending right now,
because if it is a shift, they don't want to
get left behind you.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
And then that's our model. As far as we're looking
at Texas Tech, we're looking at at at at Indiana
and we say, Okay, what do they do. Well, they're
bringing a new head coach, they get the donors involved,
get them excited, we'll get an influx of money. Well
we had. That happened for us so much so that
we ranked. I believe we're ranked fourteenth in the portal
activity this year and big part of those we brought
in Toashlupoi. Yep, very well known recruited. Were you there?
(12:13):
Was he there when you're there?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
No? But he's a shout out Alabama though he's an Alabama.
He's a cow guy. He did great friends with Scott Fageta. Yes,
whoo Scott Figeta. We talked that He's told me a
lot about cal situation. And because I'm very affluent with
the college football space right now, he's like, dude, like
Cal right now, we have to see the alumni has
to see the value in growing the football program. It's
(12:36):
what Miami had to do a really big resurgence in
It's like, you guys have to see the value in this,
put the money into that, then everything else will flow down.
It's kind of weird because we always say top down economics.
It doesn't really work in America, but in college sports.
It works if you do it the right way.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
If you do it the right way, the big key
morse on anything else is being able to be relevant. Yes,
and that's what we've always struggled with the last lately,
I should say the last few years it was very
difficult because you know, we were trying to fund everybody
else and I think the realization of that model didn't work.
You can't share it that way. And that's why. Truthfully,
Title nine is based off of percentages. Well, the revenue
(13:15):
share is based off of percentages. The percentage goes to
your your your sport that generates the most money. Why
because they help fund it. Football runs in the black
at cal Okay. The athletic department runs in the red.
Why Because the big thing is we are trying to
fund everybody. We're trying to help everybody. That's why right
now the donor engagement is so important. Now if we
(13:36):
get beyond relevant, we get ourselves into a big situation
where the revenue coming the ticket sales, the MMR rights
get to a merchandise exactly. That's the key. Yes, ask Alaba, Indiana.
They will tell you the impact that it makes. That's
what we've seen our chancellor understands rich Lions, understands the
importance and significance of it, and that's why he's that's
why he's going in on this situation. That's why bringing
(13:59):
Tosh in, bringing myself in, and now with this Chanceor
we're all aligned, all three of us undergraduates pretty much
at the same time. Chanceor Lines was there. I came
in when he was there. Tosh came at the end
of mine, a little passing end of mind, but the
three of us have all pretty much been aligned on
trying to create a winning situation at cal to make
ourselves relevant.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
We're going to take a short break and we'll be
back in a minute. You got your rookie year out
of the way. How would you assess your rookie year
as a GM.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
I think it was pretty good, I really do, because
our donor engagement was outstanding. A lot of these folks
really got behind us. You know, there's some really terrific
people that really see the vision. But the nice thing
is they also see what the potential is the growth
and to your point, when you can sit there and
impact your women's sports, okay, your Olympic sports, you're doing
something right. Texas Tech has a model. We've got to
(14:51):
copy these people. We got to understand what it means
to do these things, because if we want to have
sports other than football, basketball, okay, men's and women, you've
got to be relevant. You've got to be able to
self sustain.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Yeah, you brought about Tosh Loopoy, right, who you just
brought in. You guys fired the last coach. What was
it like being on the other side of the firing
of coaches?
Speaker 2 (15:13):
It was like, because if you coach, that's part of
being on the other side of it already though, right.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
I've been on both sides of it. Yeah, when you're
the head coaching at Legal, Yeah, you fired. I've had
to let coaches go. Ye hate the word fire. Even
had to let people go, which is very difficult because
you develop relationships, and it is about relationships, but there's
also a certain part of that. You have to be
honest about it. And the biggest thing is you got
(15:40):
to understand you have a fiduciary responsibility. You know, I've
always looked at it football, you know, NFL, that's a
multi billion dollar industry, it really truly is. And I
understood that he I have my nephew worked for me,
and I told my mom, I said, Mom, now if
he messes up in a bad way, I'm gonna have
to fire him. You know, most what is it as
your nephew, I said, I know, mother, but I have
(16:01):
a responsibility. I had to tell my youngest brother the
same thing. If your son steps out of line, if
the fire because of my responsibility. It's a tremendous responsibility.
And I see that and I take it very seriously.
And there was a time when I did let coach go.
I let him go because he's a great guy, good person,
good human being. But I wasn't sure if he could
take players to the next level. And that's what I
(16:24):
had to be honest about. So that's always difficult going
into this year being the first, you know, being my
rookie year as a general manager. You know, we had
a coaching situation where we we we we've been above average,
we've been right in the here, but we needed to
take a great, big step and we were in a
good situation. We had a decent portal last year. We
were very comfortable comment and we thought we could take
(16:45):
it to a bigger step, and we didn't get to
where we needed to go and that's what drove it.
And it was a tough conversation. Justin Wilcox is one
of the smartest football coaches I've ever worked with, and
but it was a very short period of time. We
had to do this because of where we are, and
that's what that's what I did.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
But Tasha is awesome and it's very successful. Everybody raved
about him at Alabama is recruiting Prowless and uh and
then also just you know, young energy as well is
a big thing. Having a part and being out from
cal playing there. I think that's what you kind of
have to build upon. People that have a little bit
(17:22):
more emotional attachment to it means a little bit more
to them when it got at it.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, yeah, they do.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
And Nashville you had it, you guys. You ran upon
the dominanting the rough in that quarterback as well. Yes
we did, We really did. I'm nobody even heard of him.
Stay up late to watch him if you're really did.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
That was the hard part because but I will say this,
so we saw the influx from the NFL scouts. Oh really,
that was something that was really interesting and you know,
we're getting you know, the average few here for you
there like everybody else. Then all of a sudden, now,
all of a sudden, it's double that it's eight ten, twelve, fourteen. Guy,
we have fifteen guys one time the same day, and
first question out of their mouths, because I try to
(18:00):
entertain conversations all the time, the first questions, Hey, tell
me about the quarterback? What do you say? And then
it's funny because like everybody's like trying to pull me
a sise. What do you think you know? I'm sitting there.
I've tell him all the same things of guys. This
may be an NFL worthy talent. Arm talent, unbelievable. He
could throw he he can throw it from the think
about this. He throws it the college hashes, which are
(18:23):
wider than NFL hashes, numbers, which are wider than NFL numbers.
He can throw it from the from the far hash
to outside the numbers on the opposite side easily. I mean,
and and and and with the same velocity and the
same type of arc and get it there in plenty
of time. And I'm just trying. I mean, it's crazy.
(18:43):
Then you watch him throw off platform. He can change
his his arm angles and he can drop the platform,
he throws on the right. He's got the whole thing.
He's just young, he's raw, he's uh, he's developing. It's
fun to watch.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Him when they're raw like that sometimes though, because like
they do things that you probably not supposed to.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
But sometimes we like that, Oh yeah, exactly what we do. Yeah,
he is. But what's also crazy, though, is you know,
his his his toughness. I mean, he gets hurt, he
gets up, He tries not to show tough injury. He
wants to show that he's a tough guy and get
out there and do those things. But he also understands
how important is to treat your offensive linement. Well, oh yeah,
(19:22):
he takes those guys to dinner. Now, he's smart about that.
He's gotten it. He has vision.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
What do you see the vision of cow football in
the next five years?
Speaker 1 (19:32):
Oh. I like to believe that we're going to be
in position for whatever changes there come. You know, where
we are in the ACC, We're in a great situation.
I think Miami really did well for us, showed everybody
that hey, the ACC is very very competitive, which is
a big step and I think now we're getting the respect.
But whatever whatever comes in the next three to five years.
As far as realignment that we're there, that we will
(19:54):
be worthy.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
Coach, how do you guys kind of monitor and maybe
you can be in lockstep with Tosh, your head coach
about this. As far as like mine in Indiana were
the teams in the finals. They're probably two of the
older teams in college football this past year. So finding
the balance between high school recruiting, which is what we're
traditionally so used to. But man, these are the guys
that are ahead of us, and they're like kind of
(20:16):
cutting the corner because they're getting the older guys. I
don't know what to use to describe it, but you
understand what I'm at.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
I know exactly where you're going. That's a great question
because well, I'll tell you this much two things. First
of all, if I love to have had you guys
younger and then had you to to to where we
ought you, yeah, because why? For two reasons. One is,
when you guys are younger, you guys are a tremendous player, dynamic.
But as you get older and wiser, you can help
the younger guys develop and grow. So what we've looked at,
(20:42):
and then I think I think it's one of the
models you got to think about, is how do you
build your team up. What's happened now is everybody they're
not they're not recruiting as many high school kids as
they used to, right, so because that number has dropped.
What's happening now is you're going to the portal. Well,
what's happening in the portal now is guys are grabbing
guys that have played one year and not even really played.
(21:02):
They're disgruntled, they're not happy. They were high recruits. Okay,
they were four star five so whatever they were. But
the thing you got to remember is just because you're
recruiting them after their first year, you go, oh, we
got him for three more years. But I understand this.
They didn't play a lot. That's why they're leaving. Yeah,
so you grab those guys that go, well, shoot, he's
not ready. I mean I saw that from last year.
We grabbed a couple of guys that were really good recruits,
(21:24):
but they didn't play a lot. We brought him in
and it's like, well didn't he work on it? And
he you know, And for me, my perspective is, well,
who taught these guys? And then the realization that doing that,
you're not getting a refined player. But you take a
guy that's been someplace two years, three years, and all
of a sudden you get this player and he's played.
Now it's to your point. Now you've got a mature guy,
(21:45):
but you've also got a guy that's got more playing experience.
I used to tell people, you know, when we were
first developing and growing, when we went to Chicago with
you guys, have you talked about why do you like
this team so much? Because these young guys played when
young guys and they get a lot of playing time,
and all of a sudden you go, well, you got
the crap kicked out of Yeah we did. But guess
(22:06):
what happened. They got experience. Now that's go, oh wow,
how this team become so good so fast? No, they
did run fast. It took a period of time getting
your butt kick for two years. Not fast. It feels
like an eternity. That's what we went through in Carolina,
and then we finally got to a certain point. And
then once you get to that point, then you find
the veteran guys that come in and now they solidisfy
(22:26):
who you are. So to me, it's finding your own
Just like in the NFL. You want to draft guys
and you want to develop them and grow them. Same
thing with high school recruiting. Get those guys in there,
get your core why because they understand your culture. If
they're not going to play a lot they're freshmen, you
got to love them up and get them to understand
this is about growth and development. Get your academics square
so you don't have to worry about that part of it. Now,
(22:48):
let's figure your growth and development plan. How are we
going to develop you as a football player. And once
we get you to that point, your second year, maybe
your third year, guess who you are for the next
two seasons. Okay, you're everybody. Everybody's watching and I finished.
Young people don't understand when you go from one school
to the other. It's a new process every time. And
(23:09):
if you're never learning something and you're not refining your skills,
skill sets change, you're not going to be as desirable
until you get to the very end. Don't waste your
first year is growing, learning, developing. I don't know why
everybody thinks they have to play now, that's just that's
the model though. Yeah, but see the problem with the
model is it's not right in the NFL. But how
(23:33):
many times have we seen have we seen sacrificial quarterbacks?
Speaker 3 (23:36):
And they don't ask like, well did you play as
a freshman? Like they never asked that. No, Like NFL
doesn't care about that. And the other thing that coaches
so correct is like when you get there in college,
I would be telling guys the first year, like, if
you play, that's great, for your main goal should be
get them grays and get up out of study hall
(23:57):
where you ain't got to be here for two hours
or hour have every doing get them hours in the
study all because that's what you got as a freshman.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Your goals would get out of study hall yep.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
But for whatever everybody thinks you have to play, you
draft a guy he has to play well, he hasn't
been seasoned, he hasn't learned. Well, this guy's got a
great tremendous talent. Well, yeah he does, But at what
point is that going to be detrimental because he hasn't learned.
I've seen good young players get on the football field
and get whooped and they lose that confidence. Now all
of a sudden, they're filled with anxiety. Anxiety is a
(24:27):
matter of not knowing what the outcome is going to be,
or anticipating an outcome and then not being prepared for it.
And if those three things are aligned, guess what You're
in trouble. So we want to develop these young people, Well,
let's give him a reason to be confident. Why because
they've had an opportunity to be brought along slowly, They've
learned gradually, They've had veteran guys around him could tell
him about how and what to look for in terms
(24:47):
of pitfalls. Now, all of a sudden, after a good
year of development and growth, guess where they are. They're
ready to play. Let's give them that opportunity. But for
whatever reason, Hey, he was a top five pick, Well
he's got to have to play. Now.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It harder to develop kids, even though, oh, isn't harder?
Isn't it harder to develop kids?
Speaker 1 (25:08):
I believe it is.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
With the portal right there, yes, because it turns into hell, Okay,
I'm a high school kid. You bring me in from
whatever school. I'm a freshman. I don't play.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
I go into portal. Yep.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Like to me that that seems to be the process
of what college football is yeah, like I have to
play right now or I'm not making the forty fifty
one hundred K whatever that number is.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
But what they have to understand too is you you
have an opportunity to develop that. Okay, the more prepared
you are to play, right, the better you're going to show. Yeah,
accept what you're going to be as a freshman. If
you're unless you're special, unless you're dominant. That's what your
attitude should be is, hey, I am a hey, I'm
ready to play, and you'll play. We're not stupid. I
(25:54):
mean we can see that a freshman is better than
a senior. Guess who's playing firshman. Absolutely, that's what's going
to happen because we have to put the best player
in the field today, especially in today's game, because you
have to be able to compete and and and this
stuff about well you know he's a fresh he's well,
he's a senior. You know, you got no, you have
to play it in today's In today's game, you play
the player if they're ready, if they're and if they're
(26:16):
not ready, to be honest, hey, we'll work you in.
We'll give you an opportunity and then do that gradually
and who knows, maybe within two three games. He is
the guy I mean, and then sometimes some guys just
I mean, I love the quarterback we have. Jaring was ready,
he was prepared, and we saw in the Oregon State
opener his first ten passive completions two of them are touchdowns.
(26:38):
I mean, And I'll take a quick story. I'm in
the I'm in the press box watching and because they
don't have an extra box for the for the GMS,
so I've got to sit with the alums, So I'm
off in the corner. I'm taking my notes, I'm watching
the game. He throws his second touchdown and the alums
are high five in each other and I kind of
turned around and guy goes, oh boy, you got a
tough job. He said, No, I'm going to be calling
each and every one of you tomorrow and we get back.
(27:00):
Remember this feeling, that's right, Remember this feeling right.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Don't cats the holy ghosts in church, and then don't
go into your pocket, you know what I mean. Let
me get a little something about before you get out
of here. Sorry, go ahead, No.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Marshawn Lynch, Jared Golf, Cam Jordan. Why was it important
for those guys to be back at Cal the other day.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Oh, it was very important, just because well, this this
is what's crazy. So there's a stat that I read
recently from this past season. Do you know that the
that there are four of the top salary earners in
the NFL we're all cow guys. There are four of
them out of the top forty five. Four of them
(27:38):
Jared Aaron, Keenan Allen, and Cam Jordan. When I got
to to Jared on one of the players, he goes,
he played her. I see, Jared got played here. Yeah,
And I said, don't you know he played he plays
for Lions. Go I know he plays for Lions coach.
I didn't realize he played he I mean just one
(27:58):
of the current players. So then I said, then when
I said Keenan Allen, he goes, you mean Keenan Allen
plays for the Charger. I said, yeah, that Keenan Allen
goes he played there. Yeah, right there, this is Jersey's
on the wall. He said, I thought that was another guy.
But see, that's that's the crazy part about it. That's
the thing that we have to make sure so when
guys like that come back and all of a sudden
(28:20):
they see these guys in the realization that hey, you
can come to an academic institution and they will find you.
I promise you they'll find you. If they don't find
you and you show up on somebody else play, everybody
else will go start going wow, coach.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
You know, I've really struggled with the changes in college.
I'm a football purist, and so you know, I was
at Alabama during probation doing three coaching changes and I
never left. And so personally, you played at CAL and like,
I don't know, And I want you to try and
express to these young people what it's like, because ultimately
(28:55):
the biggest detriment when you leave and you go to
two to three different schools, and everybody's situation is different.
But like, I'm connected to Alabama with the rest of
my life and they're connected to me. You're connected to
kl for the rest of your life and they're connected
to you. Yep, And like not on a lot of
these kids are not graduating, but they're also When you're
(29:16):
done and you're a twenty something year old that's made
a little money and now you go into a job
and they not paying you nowhere near as much, you
feel a little down about yourself and where you're going
to go back to the call home. They don't have
that either, and so it's another sense of loneliness lost.
And it just kind of adds empoles onto what young
(29:37):
men are complaining about and what they may have to
deal with at an earlier age. And so how do
you feel about that part of it? Slowing that part
down and at least having them recognize that, hey, the
value of saying this is my school. That that is
value that nobody sees right now. But when you look
(29:59):
up fifteen years you want to go to a homecoming,
it's hard to pick when you got to choose some
three and not just one exactly.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
And I think that's a great point because to me,
one thing's everybody got to understand. And this is a
very stark reality. And I've only been challenged on it
one time by a parent. Okay, less than one percent
of draft, all draft eligible college student football players will
make it to the NFL. Less than one percent. That's
a transition rate of about three hundred and seventy five
(30:27):
to four hundred and seventy five guys. That's it. Think
about that because usually around three hundred and thirty to
three hundred and fifty get drafted. And that's including the
the extra rounds that are okay, the extra picks or
whatever that are added. So because of that, because of
the compiscatory picks, that numbers is becomes a little bit higher.
But if you didn't have it, it might even be smaller.
(30:48):
But think about that. Because of that, that that's less
than one percent, and that's only about on average, about
four hundred guys. And I'm sitting in a in a
room and I've watched as look around like okay, wait,
mine want you know, trying to figure out if he's
one of those less than one percenters. Well, how can
you mitigate that? How can you protect yourself? Well, you
(31:09):
got to get your education, you've got to plan for
the future, you got to develop those relationships. To your point,
think about this, cal produced and supported and helped finance
eighteen hundred startup tech startups the last few years. Okay,
it's it leads all the universes in producing them more
than anybody else. And let's say one of your really
good friends is a guy that had a tech startup,
(31:31):
all right, and he's making money and he's he's going
to a second round of looking for investors, and he says, hey, bro, well,
hey you want to throw one hundred thousand dollars in.
You know, next thing you throw a hundred thousand dollars
in and it's six x within five years whatever. I mean,
those are the kind of relationships that these guys don't
have an opportunity to help. They don't realize. And it's
(31:52):
not just it cal. I mean, we're sure we're at
the gateway to Silicon Valley and there's a lot of
that industry here, but it's true for pretty much in
the universities. What can they produce and what can they
have for you? If you develop that relationship, you have
that kind of connections. Like you said, when you're done playing,
there's that opportunity. I mean, Marshawn comes back and all
(32:12):
our guys sit there and wow, and Marshawn talks about
business about how he does it. I mean, he understands
marketing and and you know it's funny because you know,
some people talk about is beast mode. Some people really
know about him. I've heard him call him money beast
because he understands what it means to put it out there.
That's what you've got to learn. That's you got to
understand what those are, the connections, that's the that's the
(32:34):
homecoming you want to be able to have.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Yes, all right, coach. My last football question for cal
is how do you guys compete in today's college football space?
When if you're behind, how do you catch up? How
do you surpass? I think the ACC is a very
competitive league for you guys this year, understanding like every
(32:58):
team like it's a brand new season, Like I literally
have no idea what any team's going to be like
from year to year. I thought Clemson was going to
be a heavy hitter. They were a third and I
didn't see Miami being what they were as well. So like,
how and how do you guys compete this year? I
want to give me that vision.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
I think we have an opportunity to compete at a
higher level. I really do. And the reason I said
is again, you look at what Indiana does and you say, Okay,
that's the model. You look at what Texas Tech did,
that's the model. They go out and they get the
donor engagement the way they did. Both of them had
new coaching staffs coming in, so all of a sudden
they gave these.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Guys and they went and got some of your players.
They went at a quarterback too.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Absolutely, now you have that guy, Now you have those
people in position. Now you can take the next step.
You know, Indiana they felt they needed a quarterback and
probably the best available was for Nana Mendoza and he
proved it. And you know, he's a cow guy. The
nice thing about you know him leaving was he was
a graduate though. Yeah he finished his degree, so you know,
(33:55):
and and so a graduate got an opportunity to move
on and congratulates because he did a great job. The
best part is he gave the shout out to cal
That was kind of cool to see. But the truth, though,
to your point, how do you how do you look
at it? I look at it that if we've done
what we've needed to do, we've done well in the portal,
it looks like, but now we got to make sure
on the field their coach step and they play to
that ability. With that, you can be up in that
(34:17):
next echelon. And that's where we were. We were ready
to take one more step. You go back and look
at it, and we had three games. On the last
possession we lost, Okay, we score, we stop them, we score.
We could have won at two of those three and
then the right too. You win the right too. You're
you're in the ACC playoffs. So the potential's there. But
I think from what we've done finishing and I think
(34:40):
it's fourteen out of the number fourteen in the portal
for this year, I think that gives us the opportunity
to be even more competitive. So I'm i'm I'm expecting
a great opportunity for us to take a big step.
I love that we'll be back in a minute.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Coaching style, I'm used to your coaching style. You coach
both of us in twenty fifteen. I had you in
two thousand and four. If I'm not mistaken for four,
five and six, do you think your coaching style is
relevant in today's NFL with how much the game has changed.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Without a doubt, I'll tell you what I No matter
how you look at, the one thing you have to
understand is that these players want direct Yeah, that's the
first thing. Second thing they want consistency, okay, And I
think if you're consistent, you treat everybody the same and
you do things the right way with them, okay. And
understanding that it's got to be fair. It's got to
(35:36):
be fair. Everybody has a value and it's all based
off the value. But you got it. But they want that,
and I mean to the point where, you know, I
did a thing with Cam where he didn't have a tie.
I was there for this and he doesn't have the
tie on. So I treated him just like it did
everybody else. And I couldn't start them. Okay, Greg Hardy
didn't have a tie. Okay, I didn't start. I mean
(35:59):
that's the rule. Yeah, So that's what I did. And
it's one of those things. And when when the news
broke that it was over a tie, I had people
who didn't believe it was over a tie. First of all,
they thought he was out drinking or something like. Well,
Cam didn't drink. No, he would like that. I don't
know if he does now, but back then he did
and all I did. And and the best part was
he took it too. He got in front of he
didn't he didn't, you know, he know him. He wanted
(36:21):
to play. But at least he took it and he
took it the right way. Needless to say, I tell him, Mike,
you won't play the first series? Well, then thinking d
A throws an interception and you know, on the very
first place throat heaters cam runs over. He goes, I'm
in next next series, just like you said, My god, coach,
(36:42):
how do you deal with the balance of doing your job?
Speaker 3 (36:45):
But then you just were interviewed for the cardinal's job
this past cycle as well well.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
The biggest thing on that more anything else was they
were doing their due diligence. I had a relationship with
with mister Bidwell, you know, from from my league, some
of the the committees I was on in the league,
so you know, knowing that there was an option coming
in in an interview, I went took it. We kept
it quiet for as long as we could, mostly because
we had the portal was open and so and he
(37:11):
didn't get out. I mean, it didn't get out for
a long time that I had interviewed, and so really
the focus was always about saying keeping everything going. I
did it on I did the fifteenth, which was the
last the day before the closing of the portal, and
so really nothing, you know, and that was the idea
behind it. All.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
Right, coach, this is going to be really hard. That's
probably a toughest question I have to ask you, all right,
but just think about this. Describe Peanut Tillman in one word.
Speaker 1 (37:46):
Wow. I mean because you look at him first of all,
he's he comes across as he's unassuming until he opens
his mouth. Yeah, then you realize, Wow, Okay, this guy's
got some he's got something to him and he can't
control himself. No, he can't. Hmmm, oh gosh, I'm gonna
have to break out the sosaurus man to find the
(38:06):
right word. No lies told. Yeah, yeah, you know what.
Honest Okay, that's who he is. Okay, he is that.
He's honest. What you see and the way he acts honestly, okay,
the way he carries himself in an honest fashion. He's
going to give you the truth. He's going to be
honest with you. I think honest would be a really
(38:27):
good word. I'll take that.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
I would agree with that. He is honest. I mean,
we don't always need him to be honest. In that moment, yeah,
you know, he was like like, maybe we could have
waited like five minutes to like maybe get out of
the room before you said that.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
So, yes, okay, I'll tell you what. Yeah, thank you.
You gave me a good way to think of this
young man from now on. Yeah, yeah, I think that's
a great word for you, Charles.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
All right, I'll do the same thing, but with mister
mister Harper right here, one word to describe him as a.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Player, as a player who didn't I didn't use the
player for you. I'm gonna switch it up. Okay, okay. Determined.
He played with a determined fashion about He wanted to win.
He wanted to be successful. So everything he did he
did it with the fashion that I'm determined to be best.
Even later in his career, some guys accept that, hey,
(39:24):
you know what, I'm not. He still didn't. He still
wanted to be that guy, which I thought was great
because the young guys that would always ask me, why
is he always do things like that? I said, dude,
that's him. He's a professionalist. The way he does it.
He always wants to be the best. When guys asked
you about veterans, that was the thing I really appreciated too,
was your presence. You know, you always show that you
were working hard, that you wanted to win. I know
(39:46):
you wanted to win that Super Bowl. That was the
things that I really appreciated you have guys like that.
That's why I said, having had if I could add
both you guys in Carolina with me when you guys are.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
A little younger.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Because the other thing too, you guys both did you
guys had a way with Cam Yeah, okay, that's the
other thing, you know. And and I will say when
you guys left and Josh normanly mm hmm okay, there
was that little competitive edge that you guys could always
compete with them. I know the other guys did as well.
But when you have the right group of guys, and
(40:17):
then when we started having issues with the injuries, you
guys are the guys grab these new guys and say
this is not this is how we do things. Yep,
this is how we do it. And that was important.
Oh yeah, I appreciate that. I am very.
Speaker 3 (40:33):
Goal oriented, so I appreciate that, and so I'm very
determined and focused on what I want to accomplished. Look, Coach,
I've told you this before, like it was one of
the best compliments you ever gave me, was that in
fourteen you came up to me because you're the only
coach that's ever written handwritten letters to players as well
that I know of and so the personal style in
(40:55):
which you go about your business is amazing. We lost
what eight straight games that year. I was like the
maddest person in the world, and you just were like, dude,
you just gotta trust it, like.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
We've got to keep it going.
Speaker 3 (41:06):
And you you told me that, you know, Roman, you
should have been a guy that never. You should have
been a one team guy. You should have never they
should have never let you go. I'm happy, no, and
I agree. I really I still believe that. Yeah, you're like,
there's they should have never let you go. I'm so
happy you're here. Yeah, who you are. It was like
(41:27):
to me, I'm like, that's the ultimate compliment. And I
really took that and I was like, man, that's that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
You know. But you know, at twenty fourteen, I think
it was one of those years that the way everybody
rallied around each other and stay stay close. Yes, it
was crazy to me. It was it was basically the
month of October. Yeah, we were zero three and one. Yeah, okay,
and and that one was and I don't know if
you remember it, you know we were zero three one one. Oh. Yeah,
(41:54):
So we've lost four out of the five games in October,
and what was crazy was the the tie was the
Cincinnati and I don't remember. I got in front of
everybody said that's going to be the difference, and it was.
The game is what got us into the playoffs. We
were seven eight and one. Everybody else was seven and nine,
seven and nine, and we beat our last four games.
(42:14):
We beat New Orleans, we beat Tampa, we beat Cleveland,
and then we went and we beat Atlanta big time
in Atlanta to win the division. And that's what it was.
Winter was taken on that game and that's all we
could ask was just give us a chance. Oh yeah,
you guys were something else.
Speaker 3 (42:29):
Man.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Then once you guys realized it in a minute.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I hadn't lost that many games in a row since
I've been to the NFL or College. And so to
have a coach that was just steady, like steady Eddie.
Where I was with Sean Payton, who was very hot,
Oh yeah, you know, he was like I'll cut somebody
out oft and Ron was like, no, I love this team,
and I was like this is the most Like he's
(42:53):
the captain of the ship and like he won't let
it rock. And I'm like I'm waiting for it to rock,
so somebody falls off and he's like.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
This is who we are.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
And it was amazing to watch. And I had so
much growth under your tutelage and the way that you
ran the team, and it was just like, man, it's
more than one way to skin a cat, for sure.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Do you remember when the boat rocked and we were
on the bus. He made everybody get off the bus. No,
in Carolina, you remember that?
Speaker 3 (43:22):
No? I think I was was out. Had I gotten
on the bus yet?
Speaker 1 (43:26):
No, we were getting ready to leave.
Speaker 2 (43:27):
So I don't think you liked the energy the team had.
We were getting on a bus and we were Finna
travel Ivrey who were playing We're so undefeated. But everyone
gets on the bus. We're getting ready to leave, Bava,
we get off going to team room. You just you
(43:48):
let us have Hey, Hey, I damn it. I don't
like to look this energy. We're not Finna start to
strip off this way. We're this is a we're here
to play a football game. You said a couple of things,
and it was just like, oh, okay, maybe we start
filling ourselves, but you you let.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Us know like right away, right, I do remember you
let us right away the game too, because I don't
know the game. No, you know what it was. There
was a group of guys that were getting on the
bus late, and so I waited, so everybody on the bus,
and then I told them all to get out, get
off the bus. Let's go inside right now. I said,
first of all, guys, y'all better take this seriously. The
biggest thing I do not like is our attitude right now.
Think we're just going to show up. Yeah, but see,
(44:24):
the crazy thing is I always used to talk about attitude,
right and what I used to say when I played, Yeah,
but the attitude preparation effort. But I tell the guys
is I always used to tell everybody the story about
the Chicago Bears. When I played for the eighty five team.
We used to get off the bus and we were
already up by seven because of our attitude. Okay, and
I used this line. I said this, I said, the
(44:45):
reason I got you off that bus is, guys, your
attitude is about when you get off the bus, you're
ready to play. It's not about getting on the bus.
When you get on the bus, you got to be
focused and be ready getting off the bus. You can
get off it with confidence. I'm not going to have
you do this. So, yeah, you're right, I did. I
remember that. I can't say what I said. It's okay.
Speaker 3 (45:02):
Look man, well the message was war received because we
went out there and we beat it out of whoever
we played.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
Trying to remember it.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
You know, that season was just so fun, just all
the memories and I look back and I give you
so much credit because you allowed us to be who
we were, and ultimately I think you got a lot
of that because of your eighty five Bears experience. You're like,
this is like because I think we did a one thing.
(45:30):
It was only like three or four of us who
actually won a Super Bowl who've.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Been a part of a Super Bowl team. I happened
to be one.
Speaker 3 (45:35):
Ed Dixon was one, and then you were one. It
wasn't a lot of us. And I heard you talking
about the team and you were, you know, kind of
comparing to your eighty five team, how how much personality
this team had and how much your eighty five team
personality is like what they were. It was the strength
of the team.
Speaker 1 (45:55):
Yeah, I was. You could see it and you could
feel it because you guys started doing the down. I
was on the sideline. Yeah, I started doing pictures you like,
keeping doing it? Yeah, yeah, but we'll see. It was
really about what I said you guys was, hey, if
you can keep your personality, be true to who you
are and and and then live within the values, hey
you can play, you can play for us. And the
big thing that I really appreciated only guys, you remember
(46:16):
was handing the balls to the kids. Okay, yeah, yeah,
I mean there's like over fifty of them we're giving out,
And that was probably one of the really cool things
that happened was the way you guys reached out to
the community, because you know, that's my biggest point is
not is not winning, not just for you guys, but
for the community, because that community rally behind us. They
(46:37):
really did, and it was a great ride. It was
something else.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I'm just glad you brought me in.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
That was I'm glad too.
Speaker 3 (46:44):
I learned a lot from Peanut that year, just as
far as technique, being the constant technician that he is,
even though he has zero swag with an arm brace
and socks just legally right what they're supposed to be
a that's fine, I mean, but I really appreciated the
veteran presence, the fact that I got days off in
(47:05):
training camp for the first time, treated like a true pro,
and I live in Charlotte because of it, and so
it's forever changed my life, and only my.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Life, and my kid's life. We were being raised in
Charlotte as well.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
So it's been fantastic and I'm just forever grateful for
what you McDermott and Wilkes and everybody.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
How you guys took care of me. Well, Coach, we
appreciate you coming on the pod. This is awesome.
Speaker 2 (47:29):
Oh, always giving us great knowledge.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Yeah, this is great. It's always great to see you guys.
Speaker 3 (47:34):
For all our viewers and listeners out there. Wherever you
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make sure you like, subscribe, follow, leave a couple comments.
We always like to have our lovely producer go over
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check us out, man, and you can also see us
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Speaker 1 (47:57):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (47:58):
I'm Peanut.
Speaker 1 (47:59):
That's Roman.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
This is robot Ron and this is the NFL Player's
Second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
We are out
The nil stuff is a bunch of bs, okay, because
when people are basically laundering money so it can be
given to kids. Yes, that's what we get in trouble.
I mean, let's let's let's look at the NFL model
and say that's where we need to be. When a
Nike or a USA or somebody call you up asay, hey,
we want you to do a commercial. Now we're talking
(00:20):
real because this is for us, same thing for us.
You had a contract, You had a contract, I had
a contract. Somebody from McDonald's calls you an ask for something.
You know, somebody who's somebody from Little Caesar's calls you
to do something. That's great because that's beyond your your contract. Yes,
and that's what it's supposed to be. It's not supposed
to be somebody paying you to play. That's the truth.
(00:40):
And that's what really bothers me because I hate to
see it ruin the sport. And we're kind of heading
that direction right now. What's up?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Everybody on peanuts to Himan and this is the NFL
Player's Second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:58):
And with me as always as my see co host
Roman Harbor, everybody's in our nice blues today, I'm really
excited about our next guest. He's one of my favorites.
He's definitely my top two coach in the NFL because
only had two. But you know, he's in there and
he's great and he deserves all the accolades. So Peanut,
let's jump into it. I can't wait to talk.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's a super Bowl champion, played on
the great eighty five Bears defense. He took us to
Super Bowl fifty. Yeah, and we'll just leave it at that.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
We probably took him too, you did, I promise you
guys did? We probably took him to.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Now he's the general manager of Cow's football team. Ladies
and gentlemen, please welcome to the.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
Pot run the thank you, thank you. How's that been?
It's been interesting? It is probably the best word I
could think because it really is my biggest disappointment though.
Was there there? There really is? There are no parameters,
there's no rules, and it's utter chaos, you know, And
(02:00):
and I think it culminated this past portal. Uh and
it actually culminated right after the portal. I think what
Dabo Swingey did, calling uh ole miss out. I believe
it was Ole miss right. It was miss calling them
out for what they did. I think that's big, and
I think that's important because we've got to get control
of this, uh because if not, we're going to ruin
a very good sport. Yeah, college football right now is
(02:23):
the second most popular television sport. So let's you know,
let's make sure we're at least following the rules so
we can, uh, we can produce uh quality football.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Like coaches have told on coaches in the past or programs,
but nobody actually like brought in presented receipts to the public.
Speaker 1 (02:38):
Yes, like dad, that was the first.
Speaker 3 (02:40):
Of its kind, Yes it was. I mean he had
text messages, he had at all. He had a player
from CAV.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
I know that's you know what I will say this,
he's a heck of a young man. He's a good
football player. But I did tell people that, you know,
I wouldn't be surprised if he did leave.
Speaker 3 (02:56):
Yes, you know, but you understand where the game is
right now, correct, Because.
Speaker 1 (03:00):
Because they throw it out there in front of the
young man, the you know, they bait the hook. They
throw it out there. They know how to get to
these young people, and they exploit it. And it's unfortunate
because a lot of these young people are getting trapped
and caught up in you know, terrible situations. I mean,
you look at what happened with Duke with the quarterback. Yeah,
you know, that's another issue right there. And again it's
one of those things that once we have parameters and
(03:21):
once those things are set, you know, now, now let's
let's let's follow the rules, and if you break the rules,
take a percentage of people of people's revenue, share money,
and I promise you people will now fall in line
stare where they need to be, at least I believe.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
So the same thing happening with Washington's quarterback as well. So,
like you said, coach, I have no idea what a
contract is. What a contract Isn't you know the fact
that they say, well, it's not through the team, so
you're not it's through the nil. So it's like, do
you hear all these things and they're trying to I
don't understand it all. So I'm saying this with a
sense of ignorance as well, because I just know what
(03:56):
I hear, and like, what is actually true fact?
Speaker 1 (03:58):
Well, the true fact is there's base see two portions
of the of the money. There's the revenue share, which
is what the judge ruled on and said that there
is money that should be shared between the universities and
the student athletes. That's the twenty million, twenty point five
minimum per team, which I think we all could agree
is something that was well overdue. Yeah, so why don't
we make that the salary cap and just say, look,
(04:19):
the nil stuff is a bunch of bs. Okay, because
when people are basically laundering money so it can be
given to kids, Yes, that's what we get in trouble. Yeah,
I mean, let's let's let's look at the NFL model
and say that's where we need to be. When a
Nike or a USAA or somebody call you up a
say hey, we want you to do a commercial. Now
we're talking real because this is for us, same thing
(04:41):
for us. You had a contract, You had a contract.
I had a contract. Somebody from McDonald's calls you and
ask for something. You know, somebody who's somebody from Little
Caesar's calls you to do something. That's great because that's
beyond your your contract, right, and that's what it's supposed
to be. It's not supposed to be somebody paying you
to play. That's the truth. And that's what really bothers
me because I hate to see it ruin the sport.
(05:03):
And we're kind of heading that direction right now.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
Since being the general manager, how have you run your
organization or cow as a GM with how the rules
are in place, knowing that it's such chaos.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
It's hard, It really is, because if you don't do something,
you're going to get left behind very quickly. And we've
seen that, I mean, you know, and it just shows
you what you can do if you do it. Look
at what Indiana built. They built it. You know, they
got good financial support. That's probably one of the biggest
things that you need right now to be able to
build is you need to financial support. Get you get
to the revenue share that makes everything equal. Now, where
(05:39):
everything gets distorted is when you go now to nil.
That's the money that comes in from other donors and
and really we really wonder where that money's you know,
coming from. What's that money really being used for? Yes,
you know, are you really truly getting commercials, really truly
being paid to do something where the other party is
getting value? Yep? Or are we making up value? That's
(06:01):
what I worry about. I mean, it's a great point.
Speaker 3 (06:03):
I I don't have the answers for it. It's been Look,
I work in the SEC and so I see it at.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
All by the way you do great, Yeah, I really do.
I enjoy watched it.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
I appreciate that coach you know, working there. You see
it at such a large scale. And then you also
see where like you know, everybody, the people with the
most money in the world, their teams aren't even that good.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
Yeah, and so like how you spend.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
That dollar is just as important as having the dollar,
and so what are you doing with it? How fruitful
are you being? Texas Tech to me, in my opinion,
has been one of the best teams and university. It's
spreading the dollar and using it to be very impactful
in which they use their money. And you know they
are of course they got all money and they got
Lubbock and but they've been really good. I mean you
(06:47):
look at what they do with the women's softball player.
To me, I think that's one of the best. They
spend a million dollars and everybody said they were crazy.
Then all of a sudden they went to gyms and
was like it paid off. Yes, and so how you
spend that dollars This is important on who you you know,
how you're spinning and who you're spending it on.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And then the big thing that we're seeing is it
is really truly leveling the playing field to a degree.
But you've got to be able to be really good
in scouting too. Are you spending it properly and the
right type of people. But it's not just about having
recruiters on your coaching staff. They better be down good coaches, yes,
because talent will only take you so far, which will
get you to a really good level. Now, are you
(07:24):
as a coach going to screw it up or are
you going to be able to coach them through? You're
gonna be able to make the right decision to give
you yourselves a chance to get to the final four.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
The term GM is so we understand what is in
the NFL, right, but in college it is a loose term.
I don't even know because each GM is different.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Yes, it's very broad.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
Yes, Okay, go into that and kind of explain that
to our viewers.
Speaker 1 (07:47):
Well, I've heard everything from a general manager being the
guy that does the contracts, only they they do the
scouting aspect of it, or they're trying to find the talent.
They're jeans that work with the coaching staffs, work with
actually practicing, you know, on the field with the practices,
helping to grow and develop their their their talent. But
(08:07):
one of the biggest things that I did, and probably
last year, probably more than fifty percent of my time
was around alumni and donor donor engagement, trying to find
the funds for the for the revenue share and the
funds for nil. See everybody thinks that when the judge said, okay,
twenty point five million is the salary cap, that money
has to be raised, whether it comes from your multimedia
(08:30):
rights or it comes from donor engagements, it comes from
other resources like ticket sales, stuff like that. You've got
to have all that type of revenue sources lined up
so that you can fill that pot. And twenty point
five can all go to football or could be it
could be divided up amongst your other sports. What the
suggestion was seventy five percent of that twenty million dollars
(08:52):
would go to football. Minimum is what they say. You
give yourselves a chance, and then I think like five
percent would go to would go to men's basketball. Another
percentage we go to women's basketball because those are your
three primary money generating sports, and then you spread the
rest of it amongst you, amongst your other Olympic sports.
And that's kind of how it was modeled. And teams.
(09:13):
Some teams are taking the whole twenty point five were
right to football, and some have done like we have,
and we've taken that seventy five percent model and we've
worked off of that, and that's how you try to
distribute your money.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
It's got to be interesting with a university like cow
where in Stanford, you guys have so many Olympic sports.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
We have thirty Stanford has thirty six. If we were
our own countries in the last Olympics and we were combined,
we'd been like top five medal winners. I mean that
because we produced so many Olympic sports, yes, Olympic athletes,
and not just for the United States but internationally. I mean,
we have one of the best rowers, we have one
of the best women's field hockey players. I mean, all
these people play in the Olympics and yet they're representing
(09:54):
your university. That's why the Olympic sports are important to
cal Stanford, Texas. UCLA rules that have these programs because
what happens is it gets people's attention worldwide. These folks
are ambassadors to us. What we've learned is that athletics
is the doorstep to every university. You know, there was
a time when everybody wanted to go to Cal because
it's the number one public institution or say something like that.
(10:17):
But then when Alabama starts having a championship program, Ohio
State has a championship program, Michigan has this program, Georgia,
now people want to go to these schools. Now, what's
happening is not only the great students, they also want
because they want the total experience. Second, my daughter, God
bless her, she took UCLA over Cal because she thought
(10:37):
the pro I said, you have to be kidding me.
But the point being is that it is the doorstep.
That's what athletics, that's what football has done. Basketball has
done the same thing. So that's why it's important in
terms of being relevant as far as a football program
is concerned. That's why everybody's really concerned about what's going
to go on next. Is there going to be a realignment?
I mean, that's the next big question is are you
(11:00):
going to see perhaps of the four power for that
two of them come together, the other two come together,
and you form these super conferences, just like in the NFL.
The NFL is probably the best structure to look at.
You've got really, you've got AFC NFC withinside you got
four divisions. Well, you could do the same thing in
college college athletics if you took everybody and you combine them.
Now you cut them in half, yep, and you have
(11:22):
an AFC NFC. Just like in college. You have all
these divisions and you these divisions play for championships and
then from there you play against each other determined who
goes to the play in the championship game.
Speaker 3 (11:33):
I just think this thing could go a bazillion different ways.
That's why I've been telling people. I'm like, man, you
got to look at Texas Tech because they're preparing for
a big shift, because they want to be relevant. That's
why they're spending the money that they're spending right now,
because if it is a shift, they don't want to
get left behind you.
Speaker 1 (11:51):
And then that's our model. As far as we're looking
at Texas Tech, we're looking at at at at Indiana
and we say, Okay, what do they do. Well, they're
bringing a new head coach, they get the donors involved,
get them excited, we'll get an influx of money. Well
we had. That happened for us so much so that
we ranked. I believe we're ranked fourteenth in the portal
activity this year and big part of those we brought
in Toashlupoi. Yep, very well known recruited. Were you there?
(12:13):
Was he there when you're there?
Speaker 3 (12:14):
No? But he's a shout out Alabama though he's an Alabama.
He's a cow guy. He did great friends with Scott Fageta. Yes,
whoo Scott Figeta. We talked that He's told me a
lot about cal situation. And because I'm very affluent with
the college football space right now, he's like, dude, like
Cal right now, we have to see the alumni has
to see the value in growing the football program. It's
(12:36):
what Miami had to do a really big resurgence in
It's like, you guys have to see the value in this,
put the money into that, then everything else will flow down.
It's kind of weird because we always say top down economics.
It doesn't really work in America, but in college sports.
It works if you do it the right way.
Speaker 1 (12:54):
If you do it the right way, the big key
morse on anything else is being able to be relevant. Yes,
and that's what we've always struggled with the last lately,
I should say the last few years it was very
difficult because you know, we were trying to fund everybody
else and I think the realization of that model didn't work.
You can't share it that way. And that's why. Truthfully,
Title nine is based off of percentages. Well, the revenue
(13:15):
share is based off of percentages. The percentage goes to
your your your sport that generates the most money. Why
because they help fund it. Football runs in the black
at cal Okay. The athletic department runs in the red.
Why Because the big thing is we are trying to
fund everybody. We're trying to help everybody. That's why right
now the donor engagement is so important. Now if we
(13:36):
get beyond relevant, we get ourselves into a big situation
where the revenue coming the ticket sales, the MMR rights
get to a merchandise exactly. That's the key. Yes, ask Alaba, Indiana.
They will tell you the impact that it makes. That's
what we've seen our chancellor understands rich Lions, understands the
importance and significance of it, and that's why he's that's
why he's going in on this situation. That's why bringing
(13:59):
Tosh in, bringing myself in, and now with this Chanceor
we're all aligned, all three of us undergraduates pretty much
at the same time. Chanceor Lines was there. I came
in when he was there. Tosh came at the end
of mine, a little passing end of mind, but the
three of us have all pretty much been aligned on
trying to create a winning situation at cal to make
ourselves relevant.
Speaker 2 (14:17):
We're going to take a short break and we'll be
back in a minute. You got your rookie year out
of the way. How would you assess your rookie year
as a GM.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
I think it was pretty good, I really do, because
our donor engagement was outstanding. A lot of these folks
really got behind us. You know, there's some really terrific
people that really see the vision. But the nice thing
is they also see what the potential is the growth
and to your point, when you can sit there and
impact your women's sports, okay, your Olympic sports, you're doing
something right. Texas Tech has a model. We've got to
(14:51):
copy these people. We got to understand what it means
to do these things, because if we want to have
sports other than football, basketball, okay, men's and women, you've
got to be relevant. You've got to be able to
self sustain.
Speaker 3 (15:03):
Yeah, you brought about Tosh Loopoy, right, who you just
brought in. You guys fired the last coach. What was
it like being on the other side of the firing
of coaches?
Speaker 2 (15:13):
It was like, because if you coach, that's part of
being on the other side of it already though, right.
Speaker 1 (15:19):
I've been on both sides of it. Yeah, when you're
the head coaching at Legal, Yeah, you fired. I've had
to let coaches go. Ye hate the word fire. Even
had to let people go, which is very difficult because
you develop relationships, and it is about relationships, but there's
also a certain part of that. You have to be
honest about it. And the biggest thing is you got
(15:40):
to understand you have a fiduciary responsibility. You know, I've
always looked at it football, you know, NFL, that's a
multi billion dollar industry, it really truly is. And I
understood that he I have my nephew worked for me,
and I told my mom, I said, Mom, now if
he messes up in a bad way, I'm gonna have
to fire him. You know, most what is it as
your nephew, I said, I know, mother, but I have
(16:01):
a responsibility. I had to tell my youngest brother the
same thing. If your son steps out of line, if
the fire because of my responsibility. It's a tremendous responsibility.
And I see that and I take it very seriously.
And there was a time when I did let coach go.
I let him go because he's a great guy, good person,
good human being. But I wasn't sure if he could
take players to the next level. And that's what I
(16:24):
had to be honest about. So that's always difficult going
into this year being the first, you know, being my
rookie year as a general manager. You know, we had
a coaching situation where we we we we've been above average,
we've been right in the here, but we needed to
take a great, big step and we were in a
good situation. We had a decent portal last year. We
were very comfortable comment and we thought we could take
(16:45):
it to a bigger step, and we didn't get to
where we needed to go and that's what drove it.
And it was a tough conversation. Justin Wilcox is one
of the smartest football coaches I've ever worked with, and
but it was a very short period of time. We
had to do this because of where we are, and
that's what that's what I did.
Speaker 3 (17:02):
But Tasha is awesome and it's very successful. Everybody raved
about him at Alabama is recruiting Prowless and uh and
then also just you know, young energy as well is
a big thing. Having a part and being out from
cal playing there. I think that's what you kind of
have to build upon. People that have a little bit
(17:22):
more emotional attachment to it means a little bit more
to them when it got at it.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, yeah, they do.
Speaker 3 (17:28):
And Nashville you had it, you guys. You ran upon
the dominanting the rough in that quarterback as well. Yes
we did, We really did. I'm nobody even heard of him.
Stay up late to watch him if you're really did.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
That was the hard part because but I will say this,
so we saw the influx from the NFL scouts. Oh really,
that was something that was really interesting and you know,
we're getting you know, the average few here for you
there like everybody else. Then all of a sudden, now,
all of a sudden, it's double that it's eight ten, twelve, fourteen. Guy,
we have fifteen guys one time the same day, and
first question out of their mouths, because I try to
(18:00):
entertain conversations all the time, the first questions, Hey, tell
me about the quarterback? What do you say? And then
it's funny because like everybody's like trying to pull me
a sise. What do you think you know? I'm sitting there.
I've tell him all the same things of guys. This
may be an NFL worthy talent. Arm talent, unbelievable. He
could throw he he can throw it from the think
about this. He throws it the college hashes, which are
(18:23):
wider than NFL hashes, numbers, which are wider than NFL numbers.
He can throw it from the from the far hash
to outside the numbers on the opposite side easily. I mean,
and and and and with the same velocity and the
same type of arc and get it there in plenty
of time. And I'm just trying. I mean, it's crazy.
(18:43):
Then you watch him throw off platform. He can change
his his arm angles and he can drop the platform,
he throws on the right. He's got the whole thing.
He's just young, he's raw, he's uh, he's developing. It's
fun to watch.
Speaker 3 (18:57):
Him when they're raw like that sometimes though, because like
they do things that you probably not supposed to.
Speaker 1 (19:01):
But sometimes we like that, Oh yeah, exactly what we do. Yeah,
he is. But what's also crazy, though, is you know,
his his his toughness. I mean, he gets hurt, he
gets up, He tries not to show tough injury. He
wants to show that he's a tough guy and get
out there and do those things. But he also understands
how important is to treat your offensive linement. Well, oh yeah,
(19:22):
he takes those guys to dinner. Now, he's smart about that.
He's gotten it. He has vision.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
What do you see the vision of cow football in
the next five years?
Speaker 1 (19:32):
Oh. I like to believe that we're going to be
in position for whatever changes there come. You know, where
we are in the ACC, We're in a great situation.
I think Miami really did well for us, showed everybody
that hey, the ACC is very very competitive, which is
a big step and I think now we're getting the respect.
But whatever whatever comes in the next three to five years.
As far as realignment that we're there, that we will
(19:54):
be worthy.
Speaker 3 (19:54):
Coach, how do you guys kind of monitor and maybe
you can be in lockstep with Tosh, your head coach
about this. As far as like mine in Indiana were
the teams in the finals. They're probably two of the
older teams in college football this past year. So finding
the balance between high school recruiting, which is what we're
traditionally so used to. But man, these are the guys
that are ahead of us, and they're like kind of
(20:16):
cutting the corner because they're getting the older guys. I
don't know what to use to describe it, but you
understand what I'm at.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
I know exactly where you're going. That's a great question
because well, I'll tell you this much two things. First
of all, if I love to have had you guys
younger and then had you to to to where we
ought you, yeah, because why? For two reasons. One is,
when you guys are younger, you guys are a tremendous player, dynamic.
But as you get older and wiser, you can help
the younger guys develop and grow. So what we've looked at,
(20:42):
and then I think I think it's one of the
models you got to think about, is how do you
build your team up. What's happened now is everybody they're
not they're not recruiting as many high school kids as
they used to, right, so because that number has dropped.
What's happening now is you're going to the portal. Well,
what's happening in the portal now is guys are grabbing
guys that have played one year and not even really played.
(21:02):
They're disgruntled, they're not happy. They were high recruits. Okay,
they were four star five so whatever they were. But
the thing you got to remember is just because you're
recruiting them after their first year, you go, oh, we
got him for three more years. But I understand this.
They didn't play a lot. That's why they're leaving. Yeah,
so you grab those guys that go, well, shoot, he's
not ready. I mean I saw that from last year.
We grabbed a couple of guys that were really good recruits,
(21:24):
but they didn't play a lot. We brought him in
and it's like, well didn't he work on it? And
he you know, And for me, my perspective is, well,
who taught these guys? And then the realization that doing that,
you're not getting a refined player. But you take a
guy that's been someplace two years, three years, and all
of a sudden you get this player and he's played.
Now it's to your point. Now you've got a mature guy,
(21:45):
but you've also got a guy that's got more playing experience.
I used to tell people, you know, when we were
first developing and growing, when we went to Chicago with
you guys, have you talked about why do you like
this team so much? Because these young guys played when
young guys and they get a lot of playing time,
and all of a sudden you go, well, you got
the crap kicked out of Yeah we did. But guess
(22:06):
what happened. They got experience. Now that's go, oh wow,
how this team become so good so fast? No, they
did run fast. It took a period of time getting
your butt kick for two years. Not fast. It feels
like an eternity. That's what we went through in Carolina,
and then we finally got to a certain point. And
then once you get to that point, then you find
the veteran guys that come in and now they solidisfy
(22:26):
who you are. So to me, it's finding your own
Just like in the NFL. You want to draft guys
and you want to develop them and grow them. Same
thing with high school recruiting. Get those guys in there,
get your core why because they understand your culture. If
they're not going to play a lot they're freshmen, you
got to love them up and get them to understand
this is about growth and development. Get your academics square
so you don't have to worry about that part of it. Now,
(22:48):
let's figure your growth and development plan. How are we
going to develop you as a football player. And once
we get you to that point, your second year, maybe
your third year, guess who you are for the next
two seasons. Okay, you're everybody. Everybody's watching and I finished.
Young people don't understand when you go from one school
to the other. It's a new process every time. And
(23:09):
if you're never learning something and you're not refining your skills,
skill sets change, you're not going to be as desirable
until you get to the very end. Don't waste your
first year is growing, learning, developing. I don't know why
everybody thinks they have to play now, that's just that's
the model though. Yeah, but see the problem with the
model is it's not right in the NFL. But how
(23:33):
many times have we seen have we seen sacrificial quarterbacks?
Speaker 3 (23:36):
And they don't ask like, well did you play as
a freshman? Like they never asked that. No, Like NFL
doesn't care about that. And the other thing that coaches
so correct is like when you get there in college,
I would be telling guys the first year, like, if
you play, that's great, for your main goal should be
get them grays and get up out of study hall
(23:57):
where you ain't got to be here for two hours
or hour have every doing get them hours in the
study all because that's what you got as a freshman.
Speaker 1 (24:04):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
Your goals would get out of study hall yep.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
But for whatever everybody thinks you have to play, you
draft a guy he has to play well, he hasn't
been seasoned, he hasn't learned. Well, this guy's got a
great tremendous talent. Well, yeah he does, But at what
point is that going to be detrimental because he hasn't learned.
I've seen good young players get on the football field
and get whooped and they lose that confidence. Now all
of a sudden, they're filled with anxiety. Anxiety is a
(24:27):
matter of not knowing what the outcome is going to be,
or anticipating an outcome and then not being prepared for it.
And if those three things are aligned, guess what You're
in trouble. So we want to develop these young people, Well,
let's give him a reason to be confident. Why because
they've had an opportunity to be brought along slowly, They've
learned gradually, They've had veteran guys around him could tell
him about how and what to look for in terms
(24:47):
of pitfalls. Now, all of a sudden, after a good
year of development and growth, guess where they are. They're
ready to play. Let's give them that opportunity. But for
whatever reason, Hey, he was a top five pick, Well
he's got to have to play. Now.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
It harder to develop kids, even though, oh, isn't harder?
Isn't it harder to develop kids?
Speaker 1 (25:08):
I believe it is.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
With the portal right there, yes, because it turns into hell, Okay,
I'm a high school kid. You bring me in from
whatever school. I'm a freshman. I don't play.
Speaker 1 (25:21):
I go into portal. Yep.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
Like to me that that seems to be the process
of what college football is yeah, like I have to
play right now or I'm not making the forty fifty
one hundred K whatever that number is.
Speaker 1 (25:32):
But what they have to understand too is you you
have an opportunity to develop that. Okay, the more prepared
you are to play, right, the better you're going to show. Yeah,
accept what you're going to be as a freshman. If
you're unless you're special, unless you're dominant. That's what your
attitude should be is, hey, I am a hey, I'm
ready to play, and you'll play. We're not stupid. I
(25:54):
mean we can see that a freshman is better than
a senior. Guess who's playing firshman. Absolutely, that's what's going
to happen because we have to put the best player
in the field today, especially in today's game, because you
have to be able to compete and and and this
stuff about well you know he's a fresh he's well,
he's a senior. You know, you got no, you have
to play it in today's In today's game, you play
the player if they're ready, if they're and if they're
(26:16):
not ready, to be honest, hey, we'll work you in.
We'll give you an opportunity and then do that gradually
and who knows, maybe within two three games. He is
the guy I mean, and then sometimes some guys just
I mean, I love the quarterback we have. Jaring was ready,
he was prepared, and we saw in the Oregon State
opener his first ten passive completions two of them are touchdowns.
(26:38):
I mean, And I'll take a quick story. I'm in
the I'm in the press box watching and because they
don't have an extra box for the for the GMS,
so I've got to sit with the alums, So I'm
off in the corner. I'm taking my notes, I'm watching
the game. He throws his second touchdown and the alums
are high five in each other and I kind of
turned around and guy goes, oh boy, you got a
tough job. He said, No, I'm going to be calling
each and every one of you tomorrow and we get back.
(27:00):
Remember this feeling, that's right, Remember this feeling right.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
Don't cats the holy ghosts in church, and then don't
go into your pocket, you know what I mean. Let
me get a little something about before you get out
of here. Sorry, go ahead, No.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
Marshawn Lynch, Jared Golf, Cam Jordan. Why was it important
for those guys to be back at Cal the other day.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Oh, it was very important, just because well, this this
is what's crazy. So there's a stat that I read
recently from this past season. Do you know that the
that there are four of the top salary earners in
the NFL we're all cow guys. There are four of
them out of the top forty five. Four of them
(27:38):
Jared Aaron, Keenan Allen, and Cam Jordan. When I got
to to Jared on one of the players, he goes,
he played her. I see, Jared got played here. Yeah,
And I said, don't you know he played he plays
for Lions. Go I know he plays for Lions coach.
I didn't realize he played he I mean just one
(27:58):
of the current players. So then I said, then when
I said Keenan Allen, he goes, you mean Keenan Allen
plays for the Charger. I said, yeah, that Keenan Allen
goes he played there. Yeah, right there, this is Jersey's
on the wall. He said, I thought that was another guy.
But see, that's that's the crazy part about it. That's
the thing that we have to make sure so when
guys like that come back and all of a sudden
(28:20):
they see these guys in the realization that hey, you
can come to an academic institution and they will find you.
I promise you they'll find you. If they don't find
you and you show up on somebody else play, everybody
else will go start going wow, coach.
Speaker 3 (28:32):
You know, I've really struggled with the changes in college.
I'm a football purist, and so you know, I was
at Alabama during probation doing three coaching changes and I
never left. And so personally, you played at CAL and like,
I don't know, And I want you to try and
express to these young people what it's like, because ultimately
(28:55):
the biggest detriment when you leave and you go to
two to three different schools, and everybody's situation is different.
But like, I'm connected to Alabama with the rest of
my life and they're connected to me. You're connected to
kl for the rest of your life and they're connected
to you. Yep, And like not on a lot of
these kids are not graduating, but they're also When you're
(29:16):
done and you're a twenty something year old that's made
a little money and now you go into a job
and they not paying you nowhere near as much, you
feel a little down about yourself and where you're going
to go back to the call home. They don't have
that either, and so it's another sense of loneliness lost.
And it just kind of adds empoles onto what young
(29:37):
men are complaining about and what they may have to
deal with at an earlier age. And so how do
you feel about that part of it? Slowing that part
down and at least having them recognize that, hey, the
value of saying this is my school. That that is
value that nobody sees right now. But when you look
(29:59):
up fifteen years you want to go to a homecoming,
it's hard to pick when you got to choose some
three and not just one exactly.
Speaker 1 (30:06):
And I think that's a great point because to me,
one thing's everybody got to understand. And this is a
very stark reality. And I've only been challenged on it
one time by a parent. Okay, less than one percent
of draft, all draft eligible college student football players will
make it to the NFL. Less than one percent. That's
a transition rate of about three hundred and seventy five
(30:27):
to four hundred and seventy five guys. That's it. Think
about that because usually around three hundred and thirty to
three hundred and fifty get drafted. And that's including the
the extra rounds that are okay, the extra picks or
whatever that are added. So because of that, because of
the compiscatory picks, that numbers is becomes a little bit higher.
But if you didn't have it, it might even be smaller.
(30:48):
But think about that. Because of that, that that's less
than one percent, and that's only about on average, about
four hundred guys. And I'm sitting in a in a
room and I've watched as look around like okay, wait,
mine want you know, trying to figure out if he's
one of those less than one percenters. Well, how can
you mitigate that? How can you protect yourself? Well, you
(31:09):
got to get your education, you've got to plan for
the future, you got to develop those relationships. To your point,
think about this, cal produced and supported and helped finance
eighteen hundred startup tech startups the last few years. Okay,
it's it leads all the universes in producing them more
than anybody else. And let's say one of your really
good friends is a guy that had a tech startup,
(31:31):
all right, and he's making money and he's he's going
to a second round of looking for investors, and he says, hey, bro, well,
hey you want to throw one hundred thousand dollars in.
You know, next thing you throw a hundred thousand dollars
in and it's six x within five years whatever. I mean,
those are the kind of relationships that these guys don't
have an opportunity to help. They don't realize. And it's
(31:52):
not just it cal. I mean, we're sure we're at
the gateway to Silicon Valley and there's a lot of
that industry here, but it's true for pretty much in
the universities. What can they produce and what can they
have for you? If you develop that relationship, you have
that kind of connections. Like you said, when you're done playing,
there's that opportunity. I mean, Marshawn comes back and all
(32:12):
our guys sit there and wow, and Marshawn talks about
business about how he does it. I mean, he understands
marketing and and you know it's funny because you know,
some people talk about is beast mode. Some people really
know about him. I've heard him call him money beast
because he understands what it means to put it out there.
That's what you've got to learn. That's you got to
understand what those are, the connections, that's the that's the
(32:34):
homecoming you want to be able to have.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Yes, all right, coach. My last football question for cal
is how do you guys compete in today's college football space?
When if you're behind, how do you catch up? How
do you surpass? I think the ACC is a very
competitive league for you guys this year, understanding like every
(32:58):
team like it's a brand new season, Like I literally
have no idea what any team's going to be like
from year to year. I thought Clemson was going to
be a heavy hitter. They were a third and I
didn't see Miami being what they were as well. So like,
how and how do you guys compete this year? I
want to give me that vision.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
I think we have an opportunity to compete at a
higher level. I really do. And the reason I said
is again, you look at what Indiana does and you say, Okay,
that's the model. You look at what Texas Tech did,
that's the model. They go out and they get the
donor engagement the way they did. Both of them had
new coaching staffs coming in, so all of a sudden
they gave these.
Speaker 3 (33:32):
Guys and they went and got some of your players.
They went at a quarterback too.
Speaker 1 (33:34):
Absolutely, now you have that guy, Now you have those
people in position. Now you can take the next step.
You know, Indiana they felt they needed a quarterback and
probably the best available was for Nana Mendoza and he
proved it. And you know, he's a cow guy. The
nice thing about you know him leaving was he was
a graduate though. Yeah he finished his degree, so you know,
(33:55):
and and so a graduate got an opportunity to move
on and congratulates because he did a great job. The
best part is he gave the shout out to cal
That was kind of cool to see. But the truth, though,
to your point, how do you how do you look
at it? I look at it that if we've done
what we've needed to do, we've done well in the portal,
it looks like, but now we got to make sure
on the field their coach step and they play to
that ability. With that, you can be up in that
(34:17):
next echelon. And that's where we were. We were ready
to take one more step. You go back and look
at it, and we had three games. On the last
possession we lost, Okay, we score, we stop them, we score.
We could have won at two of those three and
then the right too. You win the right too. You're
you're in the ACC playoffs. So the potential's there. But
I think from what we've done finishing and I think
(34:40):
it's fourteen out of the number fourteen in the portal
for this year, I think that gives us the opportunity
to be even more competitive. So I'm i'm I'm expecting
a great opportunity for us to take a big step.
I love that we'll be back in a minute.
Speaker 2 (34:59):
Coaching style, I'm used to your coaching style. You coach
both of us in twenty fifteen. I had you in
two thousand and four. If I'm not mistaken for four,
five and six, do you think your coaching style is
relevant in today's NFL with how much the game has changed.
Speaker 1 (35:15):
Without a doubt, I'll tell you what I No matter
how you look at, the one thing you have to
understand is that these players want direct Yeah, that's the
first thing. Second thing they want consistency, okay, And I
think if you're consistent, you treat everybody the same and
you do things the right way with them, okay. And
understanding that it's got to be fair. It's got to
(35:36):
be fair. Everybody has a value and it's all based
off the value. But you got it. But they want that,
and I mean to the point where, you know, I
did a thing with Cam where he didn't have a tie.
I was there for this and he doesn't have the
tie on. So I treated him just like it did
everybody else. And I couldn't start them. Okay, Greg Hardy
didn't have a tie. Okay, I didn't start. I mean
(35:59):
that's the rule. Yeah, So that's what I did. And
it's one of those things. And when when the news
broke that it was over a tie, I had people
who didn't believe it was over a tie. First of all,
they thought he was out drinking or something like. Well,
Cam didn't drink. No, he would like that. I don't
know if he does now, but back then he did
and all I did. And and the best part was
he took it too. He got in front of he
didn't he didn't, you know, he know him. He wanted
(36:21):
to play. But at least he took it and he
took it the right way. Needless to say, I tell him, Mike,
you won't play the first series? Well, then thinking d
A throws an interception and you know, on the very
first place throat heaters cam runs over. He goes, I'm
in next next series, just like you said, My god, coach,
(36:42):
how do you deal with the balance of doing your job?
Speaker 3 (36:45):
But then you just were interviewed for the cardinal's job
this past cycle as well well.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
The biggest thing on that more anything else was they
were doing their due diligence. I had a relationship with
with mister Bidwell, you know, from from my league, some
of the the committees I was on in the league,
so you know, knowing that there was an option coming
in in an interview, I went took it. We kept
it quiet for as long as we could, mostly because
we had the portal was open and so and he
(37:11):
didn't get out. I mean, it didn't get out for
a long time that I had interviewed, and so really
the focus was always about saying keeping everything going. I
did it on I did the fifteenth, which was the
last the day before the closing of the portal, and
so really nothing, you know, and that was the idea
behind it. All.
Speaker 3 (37:30):
Right, coach, this is going to be really hard. That's
probably a toughest question I have to ask you, all right,
but just think about this. Describe Peanut Tillman in one word.
Speaker 1 (37:46):
Wow. I mean because you look at him first of all,
he's he comes across as he's unassuming until he opens
his mouth. Yeah, then you realize, Wow, Okay, this guy's
got some he's got something to him and he can't
control himself. No, he can't. Hmmm, oh gosh, I'm gonna
have to break out the sosaurus man to find the
(38:06):
right word. No lies told. Yeah, yeah, you know what.
Honest Okay, that's who he is. Okay, he is that.
He's honest. What you see and the way he acts honestly, okay,
the way he carries himself in an honest fashion. He's
going to give you the truth. He's going to be
honest with you. I think honest would be a really
(38:27):
good word. I'll take that.
Speaker 3 (38:29):
I would agree with that. He is honest. I mean,
we don't always need him to be honest. In that moment, yeah,
you know, he was like like, maybe we could have
waited like five minutes to like maybe get out of
the room before you said that.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
So, yes, okay, I'll tell you what. Yeah, thank you.
You gave me a good way to think of this
young man from now on. Yeah, yeah, I think that's
a great word for you, Charles.
Speaker 2 (38:53):
All right, I'll do the same thing, but with mister
mister Harper right here, one word to describe him as a.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Player, as a player who didn't I didn't use the
player for you. I'm gonna switch it up. Okay, okay. Determined.
He played with a determined fashion about He wanted to win.
He wanted to be successful. So everything he did he
did it with the fashion that I'm determined to be best.
Even later in his career, some guys accept that, hey,
(39:24):
you know what, I'm not. He still didn't. He still
wanted to be that guy, which I thought was great
because the young guys that would always ask me, why
is he always do things like that? I said, dude,
that's him. He's a professionalist. The way he does it.
He always wants to be the best. When guys asked
you about veterans, that was the thing I really appreciated too,
was your presence. You know, you always show that you
were working hard, that you wanted to win. I know
(39:46):
you wanted to win that Super Bowl. That was the
things that I really appreciated you have guys like that.
That's why I said, having had if I could add
both you guys in Carolina with me when you guys are.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
A little younger.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Because the other thing too, you guys both did you
guys had a way with Cam Yeah, okay, that's the
other thing, you know. And and I will say when
you guys left and Josh normanly mm hmm okay, there
was that little competitive edge that you guys could always
compete with them. I know the other guys did as well.
But when you have the right group of guys, and
(40:17):
then when we started having issues with the injuries, you
guys are the guys grab these new guys and say
this is not this is how we do things. Yep,
this is how we do it. And that was important.
Oh yeah, I appreciate that. I am very.
Speaker 3 (40:33):
Goal oriented, so I appreciate that, and so I'm very
determined and focused on what I want to accomplished. Look, Coach,
I've told you this before, like it was one of
the best compliments you ever gave me, was that in
fourteen you came up to me because you're the only
coach that's ever written handwritten letters to players as well
that I know of and so the personal style in
(40:55):
which you go about your business is amazing. We lost
what eight straight games that year. I was like the
maddest person in the world, and you just were like, dude,
you just gotta trust it, like.
Speaker 1 (41:05):
We've got to keep it going.
Speaker 3 (41:06):
And you you told me that, you know, Roman, you
should have been a guy that never. You should have
been a one team guy. You should have never they
should have never let you go. I'm happy, no, and
I agree. I really I still believe that. Yeah, you're like,
there's they should have never let you go. I'm so
happy you're here. Yeah, who you are. It was like
(41:27):
to me, I'm like, that's the ultimate compliment. And I
really took that and I was like, man, that's that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (41:32):
You know. But you know, at twenty fourteen, I think
it was one of those years that the way everybody
rallied around each other and stay stay close. Yes, it
was crazy to me. It was it was basically the
month of October. Yeah, we were zero three and one. Yeah, okay,
and and that one was and I don't know if
you remember it, you know we were zero three one one. Oh. Yeah,
(41:54):
So we've lost four out of the five games in October,
and what was crazy was the the tie was the
Cincinnati and I don't remember. I got in front of
everybody said that's going to be the difference, and it was.
The game is what got us into the playoffs. We
were seven eight and one. Everybody else was seven and nine,
seven and nine, and we beat our last four games.
(42:14):
We beat New Orleans, we beat Tampa, we beat Cleveland,
and then we went and we beat Atlanta big time
in Atlanta to win the division. And that's what it was.
Winter was taken on that game and that's all we
could ask was just give us a chance. Oh yeah,
you guys were something else.
Speaker 3 (42:29):
Man.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
Then once you guys realized it in a minute.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
I hadn't lost that many games in a row since
I've been to the NFL or College. And so to
have a coach that was just steady, like steady Eddie.
Where I was with Sean Payton, who was very hot,
Oh yeah, you know, he was like I'll cut somebody
out oft and Ron was like, no, I love this team,
and I was like this is the most Like he's
(42:53):
the captain of the ship and like he won't let
it rock. And I'm like I'm waiting for it to rock,
so somebody falls off and he's like.
Speaker 1 (43:00):
This is who we are.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
And it was amazing to watch. And I had so
much growth under your tutelage and the way that you
ran the team, and it was just like, man, it's
more than one way to skin a cat, for sure.
Speaker 2 (43:13):
Do you remember when the boat rocked and we were
on the bus. He made everybody get off the bus. No,
in Carolina, you remember that?
Speaker 3 (43:22):
No? I think I was was out. Had I gotten
on the bus yet?
Speaker 1 (43:26):
No, we were getting ready to leave.
Speaker 2 (43:27):
So I don't think you liked the energy the team had.
We were getting on a bus and we were Finna
travel Ivrey who were playing We're so undefeated. But everyone
gets on the bus. We're getting ready to leave, Bava,
we get off going to team room. You just you
(43:48):
let us have Hey, Hey, I damn it. I don't
like to look this energy. We're not Finna start to
strip off this way. We're this is a we're here
to play a football game. You said a couple of things,
and it was just like, oh, okay, maybe we start
filling ourselves, but you you let.
Speaker 1 (44:03):
Us know like right away, right, I do remember you
let us right away the game too, because I don't
know the game. No, you know what it was. There
was a group of guys that were getting on the
bus late, and so I waited, so everybody on the bus,
and then I told them all to get out, get
off the bus. Let's go inside right now. I said,
first of all, guys, y'all better take this seriously. The
biggest thing I do not like is our attitude right now.
Think we're just going to show up. Yeah, but see,
(44:24):
the crazy thing is I always used to talk about attitude,
right and what I used to say when I played, Yeah,
but the attitude preparation effort. But I tell the guys
is I always used to tell everybody the story about
the Chicago Bears. When I played for the eighty five team.
We used to get off the bus and we were
already up by seven because of our attitude. Okay, and
I used this line. I said this, I said, the
(44:45):
reason I got you off that bus is, guys, your
attitude is about when you get off the bus, you're
ready to play. It's not about getting on the bus.
When you get on the bus, you got to be
focused and be ready getting off the bus. You can
get off it with confidence. I'm not going to have
you do this. So, yeah, you're right, I did. I
remember that. I can't say what I said. It's okay.
Speaker 3 (45:02):
Look man, well the message was war received because we
went out there and we beat it out of whoever
we played.
Speaker 1 (45:07):
Trying to remember it.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
You know, that season was just so fun, just all
the memories and I look back and I give you
so much credit because you allowed us to be who
we were, and ultimately I think you got a lot
of that because of your eighty five Bears experience. You're like,
this is like because I think we did a one thing.
(45:30):
It was only like three or four of us who
actually won a Super Bowl who've.
Speaker 1 (45:33):
Been a part of a Super Bowl team. I happened
to be one.
Speaker 3 (45:35):
Ed Dixon was one, and then you were one. It
wasn't a lot of us. And I heard you talking
about the team and you were, you know, kind of
comparing to your eighty five team, how how much personality
this team had and how much your eighty five team
personality is like what they were. It was the strength
of the team.
Speaker 1 (45:55):
Yeah, I was. You could see it and you could
feel it because you guys started doing the down. I
was on the sideline. Yeah, I started doing pictures you like,
keeping doing it? Yeah, yeah, but we'll see. It was
really about what I said you guys was, hey, if
you can keep your personality, be true to who you
are and and and then live within the values, hey
you can play, you can play for us. And the
big thing that I really appreciated only guys, you remember
(46:16):
was handing the balls to the kids. Okay, yeah, yeah,
I mean there's like over fifty of them we're giving out,
And that was probably one of the really cool things
that happened was the way you guys reached out to
the community, because you know, that's my biggest point is
not is not winning, not just for you guys, but
for the community, because that community rally behind us. They
(46:37):
really did, and it was a great ride. It was
something else.
Speaker 2 (46:41):
I'm just glad you brought me in.
Speaker 1 (46:43):
That was I'm glad too.
Speaker 3 (46:44):
I learned a lot from Peanut that year, just as
far as technique, being the constant technician that he is,
even though he has zero swag with an arm brace
and socks just legally right what they're supposed to be
a that's fine, I mean, but I really appreciated the
veteran presence, the fact that I got days off in
(47:05):
training camp for the first time, treated like a true pro,
and I live in Charlotte because of it, and so
it's forever changed my life, and only my.
Speaker 1 (47:15):
Life, and my kid's life. We were being raised in
Charlotte as well.
Speaker 3 (47:18):
So it's been fantastic and I'm just forever grateful for
what you McDermott and Wilkes and everybody.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
How you guys took care of me. Well, Coach, we
appreciate you coming on the pod. This is awesome.
Speaker 2 (47:29):
Oh, always giving us great knowledge.
Speaker 1 (47:31):
Yeah, this is great. It's always great to see you guys.
Speaker 3 (47:34):
For all our viewers and listeners out there. Wherever you
pick up your podcast, whether it's iHeartRadio or the Apple Podcast,
make sure you like, subscribe, follow, leave a couple comments.
We always like to have our lovely producer go over
them and talk about it. So tell a friend to
tell a friend to do what Pnut. There we go, man,
check us out, man, and you can also see us
on the NFL's YouTube channel.
Speaker 1 (47:57):
I like that.
Speaker 3 (47:58):
I'm Peanut.
Speaker 1 (47:59):
That's Roman.
Speaker 2 (48:00):
This is robot Ron and this is the NFL Player's
Second Act podcast.
Speaker 3 (48:05):
We are out
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