May 29, 2026 • 70 mins
Betrayal of Trust is the topic of conversation with Behavioral Relationship Consultant Dr. Dorothy Jeffries on The Bev Johnson Show on WDIA Radio.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Don't Memphis probably presents The Ben Johnson Show.
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Let me say Beth.
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First, let me you.
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Say she's done memphist. Okay, no matter of the problem,
she can have. So just all the phone and the
normans on your mind. She understand. Jimmy in the hair,
(00:42):
my challing you to just keep the thing.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Aridle pegging up, biot in show goes, Bell got nothing there,
heavy fucking in here every day, lean.
Speaker 5 (01:02):
Well, Bell got me a missed up.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Good morning, good morning, good morning, and welcome into w
d i A The Bev Johnson Show. I'm Bev. It
is indeed a pleasure to have you with us once
again on this Friday, as we say around here, Friday,
it is Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six. Enjoy
(02:12):
this fabulous day to day for our first time listeners.
You just may be a first time caller. It is
relationship Day where we talk about relationships to help make
yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful, and most of our loving
between consenting adults. Yeah, we'll talk relationships with our expert,
(02:39):
our behavior relationship consultant dot dot Dorothy Jeffries will be
in this day to talk with us a topic of conversation.
We will talk about betrayal trauma. Betrayal trauma. Think about
that for a moment. Another relationship chip stuff. When it's
(03:01):
your turn to talk, you know you can. Here are
the numbers to dial nine zero one, five three five,
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four two will get you in to me. And if
this day, this this, this, this here day, Friday May
(03:51):
twenty ninth, twenty twenty six is your birthday. Happy birthday
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who may be celebrating a birth on this day, May
twenty ninth, Saturday, May thirtieth, Sunday, May thirty first, Happy birthday, y'all.
What go out and celebrate your life, you Beta, you Beta.
(04:17):
When we come back, we'll share some w DIA goodwill
announcements and we'll talk to doctor j that's doctor Dorothy Jeffries,
our behavior relationship consultant, and me Bev Johnson on The
Bev Johnson Show only on double you d I A.
(04:55):
You're listening to the Heart and Soul of Memphis. W
D I A.
Speaker 4 (05:06):
M h.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
M hm.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
This is David Porter, and you are listening to the
Queen of talk, Bev Johnson. She is the one and only.
No one can top her, no one can stop her,
and I'm in love with her. You're listening to Bev
Johnson at w D I am.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Your mind.
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I'm telling you keeping.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
So welcome back to w D i A the Heart
and Soul of Memphis. I'm Bev. It is Relationship Day
on this Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six. Enjoy
(06:31):
this fabulous day. Today we talk about relationships to help
make yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful, and most of all
loving between consenting adults.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
Born busy, disy, disy.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
But I know you're busy. I told our listeners you
were with a client, so but you were coming on in.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
I am I was delayed a little bit, but hey,
you know how that goes. You can't really figure out Yeah,
that's okay, that's.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Going to need But I'm glad you. I'm glad you're here.
So I'm glad you're here. I know. I know, don't
I'm holding on. So don't you say, don't you see
my callouses?
Speaker 5 (07:09):
I tell you, Jeff, you a black woman in America.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I know you got that right, sister, you got that right.
I told our listeners this morning we will be talking
about betrayal, trauma and betrayal of trust. And doctor Jeffries,
that's a biggie. Let's talk about betrayal.
Speaker 5 (07:30):
You know, when you think about betrayal, and betrayal can
only happen when somebody has cultivated a sense of trust
and well being and confidence in something someone you know,
a relationship of some sorts, but it's always something that
(07:51):
you have confidence in, that you believe in, that you
feel support and that you can count on. And when
and you experience a betrayal, and the closer and the
more intimate the relationship is to you to an individual being,
(08:12):
the deeper and the more traumatic the feelings of trauma
and loss of trust hurts and lingers. So it's a
painful topic. But I doubt that there are very few people,
and even fewer adults who have not experienced some level
(08:34):
some type of betrayal and how they perceive the betrayal,
Like if they believe that this person intentionally did something
that he or she knew would hurt me or devastate me.
Then that is ease and worse because it feels like,
(08:57):
you know, there are people that could betray you. But
it may be an accident and may be without thought
or something like that. But when it's when you no way,
you can't say you didn't know that if you did
a B or C how it would impact me, then
that the knife cuts even deeper. And so, of course
(09:18):
the person that comes to mind, ironically is the relationships
that are friendships, particularly long term friendships. So you begin,
you know, that's the person who knows everything about you.
You've comfort, you have confidence in that person, so that
person becomes you're confident. That's the person when the things
(09:41):
are embarrassing things or painful things and you're at your work,
that's the person that you confide in. So they know
more things about you. And what we learn is that
the more a person knows about you, and they also
know what your triggers are, and they know what your
glimmers are. Glimmers are those things that empower you, that
(10:04):
make you feel good that your assets have you and
so those they know all of those things, but those
there's all things that they could use against you, you know,
and whether it's intentional or not, that cuts deep. One
example with friendship is that if somebody betrays your trust
(10:27):
by repeating or breaking a confidence of something that was
very personal, that that was very painful and that you
told with the all the deepest intimacies of it because
you trusted them. And that happens usually with people who
(10:48):
you know, they've been your friend for so long. You
just don't even go in now, don't tell anybody this.
You just don't. That's understood. If I tell you this,
this is between us. And so when it comes well
that they did betray you, sometimes it damages it permanently
damages the relationship. And I think then the next level
(11:12):
would be when you're in an intimate relationship. This is
the ones that people well, I've had clients come in
who were friends had a friend who betrayed them, and
it's is agonized and as an intimate relationship because in
a sense, it is a form of intimacy when you
(11:34):
have that close to that person in the physical and
emotional and sexual intimacy that occurs between couples, particularly couples
who are in long standing relationships or who were married
or been together for years, or what have you. Those
types of betrayals sometimes can permanently damage, where the injured
(12:00):
person never recovers from it, not because they may not
still be with you or but because they can't forgive you.
So they may say, you know, we'll work through it,
and claim that they have forgiven you. But couples repeatedly
(12:24):
may come in and say, he won't let this go
or she won't let this go, So how can you.
You may have forgiven the person if you still with them,
and that's just the technicality because I agree to stay
with you. But I can tell you people do not
forget any incident of betrayal. It's always there. Some people
(12:47):
can put it away, they may not bring it up
to you, but it's always there, and it's psychobaria. The
relationship will change. You will notice that there. You may
not be as close as you were. And the level
of trust, let's say it was a nine or ten. Initially,
(13:07):
it may be a two or less, and then at
best you may get to a four. But that is
always there. So people do not forget what happens to them,
what hurt them, what traumatized them.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I was just thinking when when we're talking about betrayal
of trust and now recently, doctor Jefferys, I know you've
seen the story about Gail King. No, okay, so Gail King,
y'all know Oprah's best friend.
Speaker 5 (13:40):
You're getting ready to shock me now.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
No, okay, okay, okay. So, well, she was on a
podcast and she was talking, and she told the podcast
so I'm trying to think of them anyway, but she said,
I guess talk. I don't know how it came up
that she walked in on her husband and her best
friend and her towel. Okay, yeah, And so I don't know.
(14:06):
And I'm thinking that was portrayed because she said this
was her best friend. This best friend wasn't Oprah, and
this friend was. This friend also had a husband. But
I'm thinking Gail has never forgotten about this. And now
the husband is begging, is saying, begging for forgiveness and
(14:26):
said he was wrong and forgiveness to his daughter and
the son. But I'm thinking betrayal. And her husband had
told her, well, don't say anything to the friend's husband,
and I guess it went home. The friend just told
her husband, Gail will be calling you and this, And
husband said, well, yeah, my wife told me that you're
(14:49):
gonna call and this, and so you need to get
a life. And then Gil started describing does your wife
have this colored panties? And anyway, went on from that
to tell her. But I was thinking, so all this
long time, I guess Gail has never forgotten that betrayal.
Speaker 5 (15:06):
Well, I'll tell you something ironically. You know, Gail was
in Connecticut, that's where it happened, and we happened to
be and I was thinking it was Oprah. There's something
that I had missed about her and open, But no,
I remember when that happened. They were together when we
first moved there and this incident happened, And of course
(15:30):
even though it wasn't on the news and everything, there
were enough people who knew people and what have you
was circulating, particularly in the black community there about when
that happened. I do remember that. But I'm thinking what
the husband counted was, you know, that she was just
getting too big and too popular, and.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Right exactly, he couldn't deal with that, yes, exactly. So
he's saying that now again because he's mentioning it well,
you know in People magazine they get everything, but now
but this that so he's he's telling you know, he's
told TMZ and everything, but that Gil was getting too big.
Speaker 5 (16:11):
Yeah mm yeah, I remember when that happened too.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:15):
But you're right, and she's not been in a state
of relationships exactly. So she's a perfect candidate that would
say she was traumatized by the betrayal. And then when
you walk into your house that you ought to be
able to go home at anytime, open your door to
(16:36):
your bedroom, right, and they're your husband and not with
just another woman, but your best friend, right, And so
there was a double thing. You know, that was a
double trauma because the best friend and the husband and
then everything like how long has this been going on?
I feel like such a food Yea, I believe both
(16:57):
of y'all and all of that. Yeah, you can we
can all understand what that's.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
Like, okay. And And because she said it was the
painful story that she shared about him, and and and
like you said, she was saying, well, why can't I
come in? Why can't I come in my own house?
And everything? So and I'm thinking when we talk about betrayal,
so she is still doctor jarr. I mean she's never
(17:24):
forgot what she says that she went on and they
tried to get back together with things that work, and
so they moved on. She couldn't get over there and divorced.
Speaker 5 (17:32):
Yeah, m she couldn't get over there because just to managine, Okay,
somebody is betraying your relationship. Okay, that's bad enough, right,
but when you disrespect me, yes, to the point that
you bring another person into our bedroom, my bedroom, right
(17:54):
and and violate me in that way, I can't help
not see that. I can't ever unsee that. And you know,
and and every time I think or hear about that,
you feel a psychological thrust or a physical pain. I
mean it could I understand that to be one of
(18:15):
the most traumatic experiences with it, especially if you were
deeply committed and so in love with this person that
you blindly trust them. So she probably never recognized what
a jealous person or insecure person would see his triggers
or things or signs red flag. Right, She probably blinded
(18:38):
that trusted him that you know, that's my husband, and
you know he would lay down in datam lay down.
But you would be the one that feels like you
had died.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
Yeah, so and when when when I thought about we're
talking about this topic and then this came up this week?
Oh wow.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Yeah, that's a perfect example of particularly in an intimate relationship.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So if that happens, doctor jeffries to somebody and somebody's listening,
or it has happened, how do you deal with the portrayal?
How do you get over that trial? Because it seemed
to me that if you're getting into it, we'll try
to get into another relationship. You will have problems trusting
a person, absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
And don't we get that all the time? You know,
where somebody may eventually try to be with somebody else,
but usually they are the reasons that the relationship doesn't
work or that they damage the new relationship because the
X person is still in their house. So everything that
(19:49):
you see or that you presume or that you react
to about the new person is based on what you
remember with this ghost still in your house. So you're
living with it every day. And when we live deal
with situations like that, it's like picking out a wound
(20:12):
over and over again. It can't ever heal because what
the reality of what you experience and the pain of
what you experience. People hold on to that and they
think that they're holding on to it because they were
so hurting what have you. But now what they're holding
on to is the memory and the experience and the
(20:36):
feelings surrounding it as a form of protection so that
I'm not gonna ever let somebody hurt me like that again.
And it becomes like a marker in your life. They
continue to date the time the second that they experienced it,
but it also blocks any opportunities for positive change at
(21:01):
going on with your life. Right, some people never get
with anybody else. Yes, And the longer you've been in
the relationship, the harder it is to release it, you know.
And and ironically there are people for other reasons will
consciously choose to stay with that person, but the dynamics
(21:27):
of the relationship are traumatically changed, and so yes, they
may have stayed together. But it's like you two different
people now staying in the house.
Speaker 6 (21:39):
Right.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
One is going to react to and be suspicious of
you and challenge you, like where you're going or what
have you. Another person may not say anything, but anytime
you go out the door, they get that flashback and
they start ruminating about what you're probably doing if you're
doing anything at all. Right, But and especially if you
(22:02):
just have one blow up argument and never process it
to the point where you can put some closure on it,
and so you just stay in that until you grow
so far apart. There's just two people living in the
house together. And we've seen people who lived together like
that for years, right, And so both of their lives
(22:25):
are damaged from it.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
And I think doctor Jeffries, and we've talked about this before,
and you mentioned why would you stay?
Speaker 5 (22:38):
Why especially if you can't you if you're not willing
to work on change to move past it, if you're
not willing to talk about and hear and and be
aware of what role you might have played this person
(23:01):
doing that, and if you didn't play a role in it,
and you think that the person just went out willy
nilly and had this affair, or the person was missing
something in the relationship, but y'all didn't have the type
of communication intimacy where we can talk about things. Then
(23:25):
you know, you stay maybe out of hidden guilt and
what have you, Or I'm going to stay to make
him or her miserable, Yeah, and all of that. So
there are things that come out into out of your
personality where you may want to just punish to the
(23:47):
point where love is gone. But now you're the keeper
up that the way with spouse, and you're going to
punish them. You're going to be jealous, you're going to
be controlling, you're going to be monitoring their behavior, You're
going to be looking through the phone and all of
that kind of stuff. And people cannot live under those conditions.
(24:07):
But you're you're doing something you are definitely punishing, but
you're taking your swallow other porson first killing them, but
you're taking your shot of it too. So two people
are going to die from this, and I mean literally
where you've lost joy, you lost hope, you've lost love,
(24:28):
and you have no interest into anything else other than
catching them again.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
So you can be right right, Let's start off, doctor Jeffries.
Hold on, we are talking you all betrayal of trust
and betrayal trauma with doctor Dorothy Jeffrey. She is here,
she's talking with us, not in the studio live for
our first time listeners. She's by telephone, but we will
take those calls from you. You have a question as
(24:58):
we talk about, but trail of trauma betrayal of trust. Yeah,
we're talking about that this day and any other relationship
question that you may have. We invite you to call
nine zero one five three five nine three four two
(25:19):
eight hundred five zero three nine three four two eight
three three five three five nine three four two will
get you in to wd i A. We're going to
the other side of the Bev Johnson Show on the
Heart and Soul of Memphis w d i A.
Speaker 7 (25:50):
Whether you're in Arkansas, Tennessee, or Mississippi on Facebook, Twitter,
or Instagram, thank you for listening to the Bev Johnson
Show on dou W d ii A Memphis.
Speaker 5 (26:18):
That's justn't show Bell T Time Memphis Talking and home Away.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Help you go, you go, Son't getting ready to.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Go in time bet just show Joe, Let's go Bell.
Speaker 8 (26:37):
Just then we you make your ody right here wrong.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
To d I.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Listen to want to make you know.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
It's time of the bet of this show, time of.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
The belt of shoe. Let's go. We are rocking and
rolling on this Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six.
It's a relationship Day where we talk relationships to help
(27:17):
make yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful and most of all
loving between consenting adults. We're doing that with our expert,
our behavioral relationship consultant, doctor Dorothy Jeffries. Topic of conversation
is betrayal of trust and betrayal trauma. We're talking about that.
Going to our phone lines, doctor Jay and talk with David.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Hey, David, Yeah, good afternoon, my most beautiful African Violet.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (27:48):
I'm doing well. Good afternoon, my David. You got it right.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
Oh man, I'm sitting outside way for a package. They
know where I'm on, mister to Day.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
I hear you, I hear you. Brother.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Well, look, I actually had planned to text you the
link to the actual podcast because I said, you know what,
because you know, people all the time send your email,
they text you and regard story ideas or stuff you
can talk about, right, and so but I forgot, you know,
(28:24):
you know, I just forgot to do it. But so
when I turn on the radio to listen to your show,
the first thing I mean to the letter was that
you've talked started talking about the Gail King situation. So
I guess, I guess God just meant for me to
to talk about this and to mention some things and
(28:44):
some clearer us some things too, because I listened to
the whole podcast it was an hour and twenty minutes
and read.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah, David, text me the link please, I.
Speaker 6 (28:54):
Would do that.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
I can email or text you whatever, whichever one you're
telling me. I listened to them. I'm gonna be a spoiler. Unfortunately,
no folks this year.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
You know.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
Okay, first of all, and I have been a fan
of CBS Morning uh As. I remember before she became
on the show because I left the NBC Morning Show
because I didn't like the political spind that they were.
They were they were trying too hard to be so
I just left and I went to CBS. So I've
been on it, been a fan I show even before
she came home. And so what was interesting about me
(29:26):
was that Bell all the she flowed out. I think
about lev here. She will always every now and then
bring up the Cheetah cheeta cheetah, pumpkin eater and all
this kind of thing. So so yesterday I'm just looking
at it and the lady on the podcast, who has
been on the show before, you know, doing very well.
The podcast talked about the show. Think it was yesterday
(29:47):
and they just didn't actually ocous this because they talked
about the situation too. When she mentioned on the podcast
the relationship she had with the with the with the
with the crack added as well who she went to
high school with eleven twenty whatever years later, he calls up,
they get together, boom and he puts he takes picture
(30:08):
of her while she's sleeping, and he also sells it
to one of those tableaids. Okay, okay, moving forward, So
she talks about the situation and by the way, let
me clear, that was not and she said this morning,
that was not her best friend, but it was a
very close friend because remember Oprah was in her life
(30:28):
at that time, so Oprah is a bead friend. So
it could not have been a bead friend. But they
were very close friends to the point of playing tennis
and you know, over each other's house. And by the way,
as I remember, both the woman and the man were psychologists.
Are you there?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
But you know her husband is a lawyer. Now he went.
Speaker 6 (30:52):
Not a husband, not a husband the lady that she
found but naked in her house and her husband, as
I remember, listen, I both sat college.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
I got you, I got you now.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
So she she she comes in from from DC, like
she says, and unannounced because something happened traveling wise and
he has the alarm on. Okay, ball and so when
he comes to the door, just as you said, you
can't come in right now. But what was interesting because
because Oprah acts like a sister boy, Oprah wasn't playing
with it. It was funny, but so she says, and
(31:30):
she looks around the house and she finds it. Okay, well, boom,
my closest friend, one of my closest friends here is
sleeping with my husband. But this is the deep part
about it. He says to her, I don't want his husband.
I don't want her husband to know about this. So
let me take her to the train station so he
doesn't find out. And he leaves her. He leaves her
(31:53):
in the house, leaves his wife in the house to
take her to the train station so that she don't
get in trouble with her marriage. And that's when Oprah said, girl,
this is way worse than what you think it is. Okay,
and so boom she she then calls like you said.
It takes a while that she does call the man.
(32:14):
The man said, you got some kind of mental problem,
you know, you need to get that fit boom, and
and and it goes on from there. And then after
the years and all of this case, so she still
takes them back. And at that point Oprah said, look,
do what you want to do. Basically, just quit talk
to me about it. That kind of thing. And and
and of course he cheats on her again. He claimed
(32:35):
he didn't. But when they do break up, the woman
that she thought was a woman that he that he
that she saw him with a you know, as soon
as they broke up and got a divorce. This is
a question I want you to ask, doctor Jess. I'm
pretty sure that that. And I looked it up because
I said, was this a brother? You know?
Speaker 8 (32:57):
So I looked up. But husband, yep, he is little brother. Yeah,
graduate law ya, all that kind of thing. And I
don't know about the crack at it, but I'm pretty
sure because she said it was high school and all that.
So he's likely a brother too.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
But what was really interesting to me was that the
white woman who would host the podcast asked her what
kind of man was she looking for?
Speaker 4 (33:15):
Right?
Speaker 3 (33:16):
That kind of thing. He needs to be humorous, he
needs to be intelligent, you know, no problem with that.
But when she went to name and men, it was
Tom Brady and it was Hugh Jack and I'm a brother.
I'm waiting on her.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
Mother mention a brother and she never did. Now I
don't know, you know, I ain't mad at it either way,
but I'm just saying, you know, what you want is
what you want. Did this thing harm her so bad
that she's through with brothers? And that's my question?
Speaker 2 (33:50):
All right, David, good question, Thank you, David. That doctor Jeffers.
I don't know if you heard David, No, I didn't, Okay, okay,
So he David talks. He said he was going to
call in to talk about that Gail King thing and
he heard me talking about it. Anyway, So with the
(34:11):
bottom line, he talks about, you know, whatever happened and
the podcast, and then he was telling me that I
could go back and listen to the podcast because Gail
talks about a lot of things. But the thing is
that David says, she's been betrayed by a brother. So
he said, the podcaster asked us, well, what kind of
man you're looking for, and she said, humorous intelligence. Start
(34:34):
naming all these things. And then she named off two men,
doctor Jefferies, Tom Brady, and Hugh Jackman, and David was saying,
wait a minute, now, she ain't named math, no brothers
or brothers. Her husband was a brother. One of the
guys that portrayed her was an X cracker attic portrayed her.
But she's naming all these two white guys. So David
(34:57):
wants to know, because of this betrayal of trust, has
this done something to Gail that she doesn't want a brother?
Speaker 5 (35:08):
Well, it could be, you know, you could look at
a number of different angles in that regard. I'm really
surprised because Tom Brady is a lot younger than she is, right,
And Hugh Jackman, I think he just he's either I
know he was there, but I thought that he was
(35:30):
getting a divorce. I may be wrong about that, but the.
Speaker 3 (35:33):
Point is.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
The one. The reaction may be, I'm not gonna date
another black man, right, and the erroneous assumption is that
if I date a white male, he won't treat me
like that. The other thing, maybe is that she's looking
with somebody with comfortable assets to her so that she
(36:01):
will feel that they're not involved with her because of
what she has in her association with so many different
people and what have you. I think that because because
she because she went so far as to bring this
(36:23):
topic up on this podcast, that she is a perfect
example of somebody who has never come to terms with it,
has never processed it and what have you. And there
has to be some deep seated shame and anger that's
still there because after all of these years, you know,
(36:47):
the kids have grown, she got grandchildren and everything else.
So it's either fear of it happening again or anger
is just too deep. So she really needs to process
there and to say out loud on you know, to
(37:10):
her fans. Now, a lot of people of color are
going to feel some kind of way about her response.
And these are only two men that she would be
interested in. And I do not think that because Tom
Brady baton't women that are much younger than her.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
And I was thinking, doct Jeffery Gale is seventy one years.
Speaker 5 (37:33):
Old exactly, So she had to be facetious about this.
Oprah will probably talked to her because she will do
she will do things sometimes that she puts her foot
in her mouth, and maybe she was being cute, you
(37:53):
know and saying that these are because she's always coming
up with these different men that she has a quote
crush shout right.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
You know.
Speaker 5 (38:03):
So I'm going to write it after that that she.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
Was not serious, right, And again when we talk about portrayal,
she was portrayed. And so this has affected her and
she and she's still doctor Jeffries living with a lot
of this stuff that she is every day and as
you said, holding on to it and looked like she
(38:27):
would have I don't know what you got into some
therapy or something, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (38:33):
But the thing about it is it has never been
able to even mulll O. But because she frequently brings
this up, because I mean even when her kids were
pregnant and stuff, she brought him up about having to
see him when he because he wanted to see the
grandchildren and all of that. Either she still has feelings
(38:56):
for him, and part of the feelings that she still
has for him is the why did he do that
to me? And there's anger and hurt still there that
has been unresolved. I doubt if she has sat down
and talked through it with him, because if she had,
(39:20):
she would be you know, he's out of her life.
He's been out of her life.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Yeah, and he's married. And doctor Jeffery William Bumpers has
a he's married, he's gone on. He has a sixteen
year old and he was saying that Gail and has
embraced his new daughter with the other his daughter and
son and all that. So he's gone on with his life. Okay.
(39:47):
And I'm saying all this, y'all because someone's out there
listening who is going through the same thing exactly. They're angry,
they're mad, they have said they haven't gotten over. And
I know I had wrote down a question, doctor Jeffers
when you also talk when we talked about people stay
in those relationships for punishment, to punish that person. But
(40:09):
what about doctor Jeffery's revenge?
Speaker 5 (40:13):
Well, yeah, you know, if you think I'm gonna just
let you just walk on off and have you a
happy life when you've hurt me this deeply, No, but
some people will still go See the thing, there are
several reasons why some people will stay in the relationship.
And the difference is when you have betrayal of trust.
(40:36):
Usually it's an egalitarian relationship in it, you know, you
both came to it, you build some things and both
of you probably contributed to what you've built together. So
there's no feeling that one person is more powerful or
has more of resources than the other one. And so
(40:56):
if the feeling of betrayal is to significant enough to you,
then you know that you could walk. And some people
know that they should walk, particularly if somebody is a
chronic cheater. Why are you staying? You know? And some
(41:19):
people stay long enough until they don't have any feelings
about discovering the new thing. It becomes a gang to
discover you know, who's he with now? And that's the
person that has been checking the phone for years and
you know, checking the pockets and the pants and all
of those kinds of things that they become ob obsessed
(41:42):
with it. And when they discover something like that, it's like, aha,
he's still doing it, but it's an aha, you occurred again,
even if you're pretending that you're not. Why are you
wasting your life policeing somebody who won't get caught and
have any consequences. Right, So that's that's one thing. But
(42:06):
then when you're traumatized.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
The betrayal, I was going to ask you about that.
Speaker 5 (42:12):
Yeah, I've learned from I know you you.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Ow my mind, so you read it so yeah.
Speaker 5 (42:18):
Gone so and the betrayal of trauma. Usually it's not
just an intimate relationships that people are traumatized by betrayal.
Children are often betrayumauh traumatized by parents who fail to
do the things that parents are supposed to do, obligated
(42:43):
to do for them where they can do for themselves.
So the parent is the one who's responsible for caring
for you, providing resources for your needs, being met for
all of those things, including those emotions on things like
believing in you, building up yourself a stream parents, making
(43:06):
sure you have sheltered clothes and get educated, and all
the physical care and all of that. When you don't
do that, what kids learn is I can't trust anybody
else to take care of me. But the parent child
relationship is so significant. And I learned a lot about
(43:28):
this when working with foster care kids. Kids who are
taken from a parent that they've lived with, and the
parent could have been the worst experience that any child
could have for somebody who's supposed to be caring for you,
they remain totally loyal to that parent. Kids who were
(43:49):
abused okay because they rather than see the parent as
a bad person. They will hold on to the fact
that it me And this is true with young children
and sometimes that stays with them until they developed some
(44:09):
things that I can't think of. The woman's name who
coined this raid, Jennifer Freed, caused betrayal blindness that when
something happens where you experience betrayal with that person, you
then work harder to be better, to do better, to
(44:32):
try to win them, you know, win them over again
because you feel like it must be me because the
core people, the primary people who were supposed to take
care of you, and all of that did not. Then
this is the This is the behavioral response when you
(44:53):
experience it as an adult. This is where you have
insecure people who will get involved with somebody who really
do not understand what love is and how people show
love and concern. So when their abuse emotionally or physically, financially, economically,
however they do it, that you take the blame for
(45:17):
it and try to figure out ways to do better
with the person to not rock the boat, or you
refuse to acknowledge that this person is hurting me. You
then just struggle to do better in order to earn
their love. You got to earn it because you don't
(45:37):
willingly deserve to get it. And that will stay from
early childhood into adult relationships. And you know when people
ask why does she stay with him? Why does he
deal with her like that? And it's male and females too.
They stay together because this person will bend over backwards
(46:01):
not to be abandoned physically again. And in those type
of imbalance relationships, the person is often dependent upon that
person for something, finances especially, it could be other things
that they feel that they can't do without. And so
(46:21):
the imbalance is maintained by the person who's victimized willingness
to be and remain submissive.
Speaker 2 (46:34):
So does you know you talk about those children, those
those children who have been betrayed or going through the
trauma doctor Jefferys as children when they become adults, do
they lose those thoughts, those inklings, or something else happens?
Do they learn better what happens with them?
Speaker 5 (46:55):
It will only happen if the child comes to a
point where they recognize that maybe it's not me. And
this is the time when someone they may befriend somebody
and this person starts pointing it out. Maybe they end
up while they're still children and a foster care home
(47:18):
or having a social worker that recognizes that they need
counseling or therapy or what have you. And then for
a lot of adult persons, it takes somebody who can
point out to them and try to educate them about
the dynamics that no matter what you do, not deserve
(47:40):
to be treated like that. It's not your fault, is
the person's willingness to be harmful and hurtful to you,
and nobody deserves that. And again reinforcing that with getting
somebody a support person, an advocate or therapy to consistently
(48:02):
refine that statement and that argument to them until they
begin to believe it and can begin to see changes
and have the confidence to change some behavioral responses themselves. Now,
when you don't have that, that's when you have people
who will remain in imbalanced relationships with somebody who has
(48:27):
control over their needs, their warrants, their experiences, and they
will stay with that person and minimize the impact that
it's having on them. You know, a lot of people
ask questions like, why does she stay with him and
he treats her like that and he doesn't do anything
like that because she's struggling to try to convince him
(48:51):
that she is worthy because that's what she's learned from
the people who we're supposed to care from her. And
so through the domestic violence advocates and other people that
provide support and some peer counseling from somebody who's been
through it, you can begin to point out the realities
(49:14):
of what happens and things that you can learn how
to do for yourself. And it takes a lot of
courage to hear that and see the dynamics. But what
really is helpful for somebody who can say I've been
where you are, and I refuse to go back to
that because once I learned that I could, I want
(49:38):
every person who experiences this to experience the freedom of
being an independent person. And so that's when we're talking
about the betrayal of trauma that continues from early betrayal
somebody who is responsible for you and did not do
you justice.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
Okay, And I I had got this question, oh from
common man, doctor Jeffries. He said, Doctor Jeffries, would that
be an example of a person being broken, like we
were speaking about last week, one who is still angry
about a relationship from the past that just won't let
it go.
Speaker 5 (50:20):
Yes, okay, thank you coming man. That's a great connection
to that. See, there are people who are hurting, who
are broken, and they walk around.
Speaker 3 (50:32):
They may be an.
Speaker 5 (50:33):
Expensive clothes, drive an expensive cars, that the place that
they've lived in, but they are still broken from un
finished business that possibly started earlier in their lives, when
their self esteem was never developed, or they lost their
(50:56):
sense of self due to irresponsible care givers or parents
or whatever the experiences were. And not only see a
lot of people assume that this only happens in families
where people are poor and struggling for survival. Yes, it
can happen in those situations where it may be generational
(51:18):
and maybe the family is overwhelmed by lack of resources.
But it also happens in middle class and wealthy families too.
When you have family, when you have parents that are
noncommunicative with each other and with the children, when you
have parents who are working through or trying to work
(51:40):
through their own issues of brokenness, and they don't know
how to be intimate with their partners, they don't know
how to be close and affectionate with their children, and
so these kids grow up feeling alone and having to
do it independently. But children need to feel dependent on
(52:06):
dependable parents. And when they's not met, children believe they're
the reasons they're not good enough, or they're too bad,
or whatever thing that they can internalize as negative on themselves,
and it follows them until they do have a difference
or a change in mindset. That's why we always be
(52:28):
careful what you teach your children. Yes, whether you're saying
it to them or showing it to them, they pick
up and learn every lesson that you teach.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
All right, correct, we are talking this day. We are
talking about portrayal, trauma, and portrayal of trust. If you
have a question or to for doctor Jeffries this day
about portrayal or another relationship, Yes, you can call nine
(53:02):
zero one five three five nine three four two eight
hundred five zero three nine three four two eight three
three five three five nine three four two will get
you in to us. Can't call. Email me your question
Bev Johnson at iHeartMedia dot com. That's Bev Johnson at
(53:30):
iHeartMedia dot com. You're listening to the Heart and Soul
of Memphis w D I A.
Speaker 9 (54:06):
Nobody and I mean nobody does it like the Queen
of talk, Bev Johnson on the BEB Johnson Show on
w d I A.
Speaker 7 (54:50):
You're listening to the Bev Johnson Show. Here's Bev Johnson and.
Speaker 2 (54:54):
We're talking about betrayal of trust and betrayal tru And
one of the things that I wanted to ask you,
doctor Jefferies, when we were talking about betrayal of trust,
is there at any time that you are able to
trust again?
Speaker 5 (55:18):
I think that that depends on the work that both
persons have to be committed to do with the understanding
that it's going to take time, consistency, and the willingness
to address the topic anytime the injured person brings it up,
(55:40):
because an unwillingness to do that kind of reignite that
feeling of you did this to me, and I loved
you and trusted you, Why would you do this to me? People,
you have to be willing to again rebuilding the trust
(56:02):
that you and it may never get back to where
it was, but a willingness to go through that shows
that I'm committed to try to do whatever repair works
that I can assist in the majority of the repairing,
if any of the relationship has to do with the
(56:22):
injured person being willing to try, but also being committed
to working on themselves to be clear about what they
need in order to remain in the relationship or to
(56:43):
continue to work on the relationship, or even to try again.
They have to be clear. You have to do X,
Y and Z initially for me to be able to
even talk to you again. And it's a it's a
painful process for both people because at some points, the
(57:05):
other person, the violator, is going to say, when the
hell are you going to get over this?
Speaker 2 (57:11):
Right?
Speaker 5 (57:11):
You know, we keep talking about the same things over
and over again, and what they have to understand you
keep talking about the same things over and over again
because the person believes that I have to keep testing
you to see if you're willing to do it again,
and only your willingness to allow me to process this
(57:34):
at my speed can help me begin to believe that
you do care something about me, because right now I'm
not sure. Right now that's not how I feel. And
right now I'm so angry with you that I don't
think that I ever wanted to trust you again. But
then there's this part of me that remembers the way
(57:56):
we were and I want to try. First, Some people
just say forget it. I'm never going to speak to
this person again. They're out of my life. I'm out
of their life. You know it's over. But even if
that's the avenue that you take, please talk to somebody,
Please journal about it, Please process it enough so that
(58:18):
you have some clarity about what happened, what your role
was in the experience, and some support and having and
trying to move beyond that episode of your life.
Speaker 2 (58:34):
And that brings me and I was looking emir Anita
wanted to know, says doctor Jeffries. So is it good
to accept an apology for for anything that person did
to hurt you? Should you accept the apology?
Speaker 5 (58:52):
I think that first of all, it has to be
a very clear apology.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
And let's say, when you mean very clear.
Speaker 5 (59:03):
You have to be able to say, I am so
sorry that I hurt you and violated our relationship and
your trust because I fill in the blank what they did.
Took money from you, I lied to you, cheated on you,
whatever it was that they did. And they have to
spell out and acknowledge the behavior, okay, that they did
(59:27):
before you accept. Think about what questions that they have
been rattling around in your brain, like, well, why would
you do that? What did I do that made you
think it was okay to treat me like that, to
disrespect me like that, to hurt me? And how do
you know you won't do it again? Ask all the
(59:48):
questions before you accept an apology. Oh, don't blank check.
You've had all these questions rolling around in your head.
You know, if it was you know, like, if you
violate a confidence, why would you go tell him or
her about something that I told you was so private?
Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Right?
Speaker 5 (01:00:10):
Why would you do that? And the person gives you
their reason if there really is a sincere apology, but
don't accept the blanket upon I'm so sorry sorry for what?
Speaker 2 (01:00:23):
How right?
Speaker 5 (01:00:24):
And how can Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
So that person who's apologizing to you needs to tell
you right? Why why?
Speaker 5 (01:00:33):
That's the question that you have. Why would you do that?
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
Yes?
Speaker 5 (01:00:37):
You know, why would you cheat on me? Did you
not know how I felt about you? Did you know
that I would never do that to you? I have
never done that to you? And wait for answers. Don't
just go on a roll just you know, go on
and say okay, yeah, yeah, don't say okay and don't
and when you make your statements like why would you
(01:00:59):
do that to me and allow them to answer, well,
I don't know, but you have to know. If you're
apologizing to me, you have to know why you did this.
And if you don't know, then come back and apologize.
If you really want me to try to forgive you,
(01:01:19):
come back and apologize when you can tell me some
answers to why, and people ask all kinds of things,
who is the person that you did? Why that person?
Have you done this before? All of that, and the
person has to be willing to be honest. Now, what
do you do if the person said and you ask,
(01:01:40):
is this the first time you've done this since we've
been together? They have to decide. If they say no
and you find out later that they had cheated before,
you're never going to forgive them again. And if they
say yes, I have done it before, you have to
be prepared to hear about that and decide, okay, if
(01:02:01):
they've done this two or three times, do I want
to be with this person or not? So both persons
have to work through this, and it should be a
process where the person comes and asks you and you say, well,
let me think about this, and you take the time
that you need so that you can get your thoughts,
(01:02:22):
your questions, what your expectations are for the future in
your mind, write them down if you have to, and
then go back. And that person has to be willing
to give you the time to ask the questions that
you need to have the answers to how do I
know you will never do this again?
Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
You don't.
Speaker 5 (01:02:45):
But what they're asking you to do is to stay
in the relationship or stay connected to me, and we
can work on this together. So if I say, well
I can't, I don't know. You know, I wasn't planning
to do this fine advance, Well then what am I trusting?
What am I building my trust? Don't? Because what I
(01:03:08):
thought we were building it on was the value of
our relationship, and so that's broken. So what are you
asking me to forgive you? For to forgive you so
you can go off to wild blue yonder, or forgive
you because you want to try to rebuild trust? Be specific,
ask the hard question. You don't have anything else to lose,
(01:03:29):
And if you don't get the answers, that's going to
give you some hope that this person is really sorry
that they're since here and they're willing to at least
try to work it out. You will feel better if
you try to work it out and it doesn't work.
Then if you just stay sitting on that injury and
(01:03:50):
the anger and the you know, that feeling of being
wrong that you will learn to live with if you
don't give yourself the opportunity to get all the responses
that you deserve.
Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Okay. And as we get ready to close up, and
we talk about betrayal, doctor Jeffries, and we talk about
trauma and being traumatized, there is we can do something
about it, but you have to be willing to do
something about.
Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
It absolutely, okay, and acknowledge the injury was painful, Yes,
it was awful. You would devastate it going after the
truth not only about your part but about you, because
(01:04:44):
in most relationships, we do things that we're blind to
that may irritate your partner, hurt your partner's feeling, and
if they're not a person to speak up about it
or say something to you out and then it builds
up because a lot of times infidelities come from some
(01:05:07):
level of detachment from the primary person, some level that
the person hurts them doing something over and over again,
ignoring them, taking them for granted, talking about past relationships
without thinking about it, humiliating them, trying to control them,
all of those things, and people then consciously or unconsciously
(01:05:32):
become to come to a point where they say, you know,
they're not acknowledged they're angry with you, but it gives
them permission to go on and do what they know
in the beginning, if you find out about it, you're
going to be hurt. So that's why it's important to
dig in deep enough to find out what you did
(01:05:52):
that contributed to this. And if they say you didn't
do anything, then you said yourself, look at your behavior,
look at your attitude. Ask somebody else what it is
about you in relationships that they like and what things
they like for you to change. You don't have to
go into detail while you're asking these questions. You say,
I'm on a self improvement stand or whatever. But you
(01:06:16):
need to go to people who are willing to tell
you the truth. And you know if people are making
it up or telling you the truth, because it'll feel like,
oh yeah, I am policy, Oh yeah, I do act
in different to people's feelings. You know, Oh I'm critical.
Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
You know, you'll know, you'll know who you are, all right,
all right, I hope I know our listeners they were
listening today. So because this is a painful, as you
said earlier, doctor Jeffer's a topic and a lot of
people don't want to acknowledge it, but it happens.
Speaker 5 (01:06:50):
Yes, And everybody may not have been hurt or betrayed
in an intimate relationship, but everybody has experienced some type
of betrayal. Okay, they've had to get through, even young
kids and best friends kind of stuff they go through
that you abandoned for a new best friend or whatever
(01:07:11):
it is you working through those feelings will tell a
lot about how you deal with relationships. Now, it's a
good journaling project. Yes, how do I feel about betrayal?
Have I ever been betrayed? What was my first memory
of being portrayed? Who hurt me first? Those kind of questions.
Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
Okay, very good, Doctor j I appreciate you. Thank you
so much for coming on in with us. We do
appreciate you.
Speaker 5 (01:07:40):
All. My pleasure is John.
Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
Yeah, always, and I will talk to you and doctor Jefferies,
don't forget to send me that number.
Speaker 5 (01:07:47):
But I'm going to make sure that you get. If
you didn't get it, let me know.
Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
Okay, okay, wait wait, let me check right. Why are
you on here? So I'll know that I didn't get it,
So send it again?
Speaker 5 (01:08:03):
Okay, I will.
Speaker 2 (01:08:04):
And also I'm going to email you a topic. I
think that is going to be good and even doctor
Harper suggested it. Okay, so I'll email it to you.
Speaker 5 (01:08:18):
Tell him hello the next time you see.
Speaker 2 (01:08:20):
I definitely will, Doctor Jeffries. Think you have a good
weekend and be safe, sister.
Speaker 5 (01:08:26):
All right, you too. Now I'm not mailing this to
your mobile. Is that not a good number?
Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
Yes, it is, it is, okay, please do please do
got it? Thank you, Doctor Jeffries.
Speaker 5 (01:08:37):
All right, take care and be careful now.
Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
You too, by now bye bye. That is our Behavioral
Relationship Consultant, Doctor Dorothy Jeffries.
Speaker 4 (01:08:49):
The views and opinions discussed on the BEV Johnson Show
are that of the hosts and callers and not those
of the staff and sponsors of w d I A.
Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
I want to thank you callers, I want to thank
you listeners for joining us all this week on the
BAB Johnson Show. We do, we really do appreciate you.
So until tomorrow, please be safe. Keep a cool head, y'all,
don't let anyone still your joy until tomorrow. I'm bab
(01:09:40):
Johnson and y'all keep the faith. Mark Baker take Me
Home Boyfriend, The
Don't Memphis probably presents The Ben Johnson Show.
Speaker 2 (00:08):
Let me say Beth.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
First, let me you.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Say she's done memphist. Okay, no matter of the problem,
she can have. So just all the phone and the
normans on your mind. She understand. Jimmy in the hair,
(00:42):
my challing you to just keep the thing.
Speaker 4 (00:48):
Aridle pegging up, biot in show goes, Bell got nothing there,
heavy fucking in here every day, lean.
Speaker 5 (01:02):
Well, Bell got me a missed up.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Good morning, good morning, good morning, and welcome into w
d i A The Bev Johnson Show. I'm Bev. It
is indeed a pleasure to have you with us once
again on this Friday, as we say around here, Friday,
it is Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six. Enjoy
(02:12):
this fabulous day to day for our first time listeners.
You just may be a first time caller. It is
relationship Day where we talk about relationships to help make
yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful, and most of our loving
between consenting adults. Yeah, we'll talk relationships with our expert,
(02:39):
our behavior relationship consultant dot dot Dorothy Jeffries will be
in this day to talk with us a topic of conversation.
We will talk about betrayal trauma. Betrayal trauma. Think about
that for a moment. Another relationship chip stuff. When it's
(03:01):
your turn to talk, you know you can. Here are
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What go out and celebrate your life, you Beta, you Beta.
(04:17):
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Speaker 4 (05:06):
M h.
Speaker 5 (05:16):
M hm.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Hi.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
This is David Porter, and you are listening to the
Queen of talk, Bev Johnson. She is the one and only.
No one can top her, no one can stop her,
and I'm in love with her. You're listening to Bev
Johnson at w D I am.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Your mind.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
I'm telling you keeping.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
So welcome back to w D i A the Heart
and Soul of Memphis. I'm Bev. It is Relationship Day
on this Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six. Enjoy
(06:31):
this fabulous day. Today we talk about relationships to help
make yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful, and most of all
loving between consenting adults.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
Born busy, disy, disy.
Speaker 2 (06:43):
But I know you're busy. I told our listeners you
were with a client, so but you were coming on in.
Speaker 5 (06:50):
I am I was delayed a little bit, but hey,
you know how that goes. You can't really figure out Yeah,
that's okay, that's.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Going to need But I'm glad you. I'm glad you're here.
So I'm glad you're here. I know. I know, don't
I'm holding on. So don't you say, don't you see
my callouses?
Speaker 5 (07:09):
I tell you, Jeff, you a black woman in America.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I know you got that right, sister, you got that right.
I told our listeners this morning we will be talking
about betrayal, trauma and betrayal of trust. And doctor Jeffries,
that's a biggie. Let's talk about betrayal.
Speaker 5 (07:30):
You know, when you think about betrayal, and betrayal can
only happen when somebody has cultivated a sense of trust
and well being and confidence in something someone you know,
a relationship of some sorts, but it's always something that
(07:51):
you have confidence in, that you believe in, that you
feel support and that you can count on. And when
and you experience a betrayal, and the closer and the
more intimate the relationship is to you to an individual being,
(08:12):
the deeper and the more traumatic the feelings of trauma
and loss of trust hurts and lingers. So it's a
painful topic. But I doubt that there are very few people,
and even fewer adults who have not experienced some level
(08:34):
some type of betrayal and how they perceive the betrayal,
Like if they believe that this person intentionally did something
that he or she knew would hurt me or devastate me.
Then that is ease and worse because it feels like,
(08:57):
you know, there are people that could betray you. But
it may be an accident and may be without thought
or something like that. But when it's when you no way,
you can't say you didn't know that if you did
a B or C how it would impact me, then
that the knife cuts even deeper. And so, of course
(09:18):
the person that comes to mind, ironically is the relationships
that are friendships, particularly long term friendships. So you begin,
you know, that's the person who knows everything about you.
You've comfort, you have confidence in that person, so that
person becomes you're confident. That's the person when the things
(09:41):
are embarrassing things or painful things and you're at your work,
that's the person that you confide in. So they know
more things about you. And what we learn is that
the more a person knows about you, and they also
know what your triggers are, and they know what your
glimmers are. Glimmers are those things that empower you, that
(10:04):
make you feel good that your assets have you and
so those they know all of those things, but those
there's all things that they could use against you, you know,
and whether it's intentional or not, that cuts deep. One
example with friendship is that if somebody betrays your trust
(10:27):
by repeating or breaking a confidence of something that was
very personal, that that was very painful and that you
told with the all the deepest intimacies of it because
you trusted them. And that happens usually with people who
(10:48):
you know, they've been your friend for so long. You
just don't even go in now, don't tell anybody this.
You just don't. That's understood. If I tell you this,
this is between us. And so when it comes well
that they did betray you, sometimes it damages it permanently
damages the relationship. And I think then the next level
(11:12):
would be when you're in an intimate relationship. This is
the ones that people well, I've had clients come in
who were friends had a friend who betrayed them, and
it's is agonized and as an intimate relationship because in
a sense, it is a form of intimacy when you
(11:34):
have that close to that person in the physical and
emotional and sexual intimacy that occurs between couples, particularly couples
who are in long standing relationships or who were married
or been together for years, or what have you. Those
types of betrayals sometimes can permanently damage, where the injured
(12:00):
person never recovers from it, not because they may not
still be with you or but because they can't forgive you.
So they may say, you know, we'll work through it,
and claim that they have forgiven you. But couples repeatedly
(12:24):
may come in and say, he won't let this go
or she won't let this go, So how can you.
You may have forgiven the person if you still with them,
and that's just the technicality because I agree to stay
with you. But I can tell you people do not
forget any incident of betrayal. It's always there. Some people
(12:47):
can put it away, they may not bring it up
to you, but it's always there, and it's psychobaria. The
relationship will change. You will notice that there. You may
not be as close as you were. And the level
of trust, let's say it was a nine or ten. Initially,
(13:07):
it may be a two or less, and then at
best you may get to a four. But that is
always there. So people do not forget what happens to them,
what hurt them, what traumatized them.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I was just thinking when when we're talking about betrayal
of trust and now recently, doctor Jefferys, I know you've
seen the story about Gail King. No, okay, so Gail King,
y'all know Oprah's best friend.
Speaker 5 (13:40):
You're getting ready to shock me now.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
No, okay, okay, okay. So, well, she was on a
podcast and she was talking, and she told the podcast
so I'm trying to think of them anyway, but she said,
I guess talk. I don't know how it came up
that she walked in on her husband and her best
friend and her towel. Okay, yeah, And so I don't know.
(14:06):
And I'm thinking that was portrayed because she said this
was her best friend. This best friend wasn't Oprah, and
this friend was. This friend also had a husband. But
I'm thinking Gail has never forgotten about this. And now
the husband is begging, is saying, begging for forgiveness and
(14:26):
said he was wrong and forgiveness to his daughter and
the son. But I'm thinking betrayal. And her husband had
told her, well, don't say anything to the friend's husband,
and I guess it went home. The friend just told
her husband, Gail will be calling you and this, And
husband said, well, yeah, my wife told me that you're
(14:49):
gonna call and this, and so you need to get
a life. And then Gil started describing does your wife
have this colored panties? And anyway, went on from that
to tell her. But I was thinking, so all this
long time, I guess Gail has never forgotten that betrayal.
Speaker 5 (15:06):
Well, I'll tell you something ironically. You know, Gail was
in Connecticut, that's where it happened, and we happened to
be and I was thinking it was Oprah. There's something
that I had missed about her and open, But no,
I remember when that happened. They were together when we
first moved there and this incident happened, And of course
(15:30):
even though it wasn't on the news and everything, there
were enough people who knew people and what have you
was circulating, particularly in the black community there about when
that happened. I do remember that. But I'm thinking what
the husband counted was, you know, that she was just
getting too big and too popular, and.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Right exactly, he couldn't deal with that, yes, exactly. So
he's saying that now again because he's mentioning it well,
you know in People magazine they get everything, but now
but this that so he's he's telling you know, he's
told TMZ and everything, but that Gil was getting too big.
Speaker 5 (16:11):
Yeah mm yeah, I remember when that happened too.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (16:15):
But you're right, and she's not been in a state
of relationships exactly. So she's a perfect candidate that would
say she was traumatized by the betrayal. And then when
you walk into your house that you ought to be
able to go home at anytime, open your door to
(16:36):
your bedroom, right, and they're your husband and not with
just another woman, but your best friend, right, And so
there was a double thing. You know, that was a
double trauma because the best friend and the husband and
then everything like how long has this been going on?
I feel like such a food Yea, I believe both
(16:57):
of y'all and all of that. Yeah, you can we
can all understand what that's.
Speaker 2 (17:02):
Like, okay. And And because she said it was the
painful story that she shared about him, and and and
like you said, she was saying, well, why can't I
come in? Why can't I come in my own house?
And everything? So and I'm thinking when we talk about betrayal,
so she is still doctor jarr. I mean she's never
(17:24):
forgot what she says that she went on and they
tried to get back together with things that work, and
so they moved on. She couldn't get over there and divorced.
Speaker 5 (17:32):
Yeah, m she couldn't get over there because just to managine, Okay,
somebody is betraying your relationship. Okay, that's bad enough, right,
but when you disrespect me, yes, to the point that
you bring another person into our bedroom, my bedroom, right
(17:54):
and and violate me in that way, I can't help
not see that. I can't ever unsee that. And you know,
and and every time I think or hear about that,
you feel a psychological thrust or a physical pain. I
mean it could I understand that to be one of
(18:15):
the most traumatic experiences with it, especially if you were
deeply committed and so in love with this person that
you blindly trust them. So she probably never recognized what
a jealous person or insecure person would see his triggers
or things or signs red flag. Right, She probably blinded
(18:38):
that trusted him that you know, that's my husband, and
you know he would lay down in datam lay down.
But you would be the one that feels like you
had died.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
Yeah, so and when when when I thought about we're
talking about this topic and then this came up this week?
Oh wow.
Speaker 5 (18:59):
Yeah, that's a perfect example of particularly in an intimate relationship.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
So if that happens, doctor jeffries to somebody and somebody's listening,
or it has happened, how do you deal with the portrayal?
How do you get over that trial? Because it seemed
to me that if you're getting into it, we'll try
to get into another relationship. You will have problems trusting
a person, absolutely.
Speaker 5 (19:25):
And don't we get that all the time? You know,
where somebody may eventually try to be with somebody else,
but usually they are the reasons that the relationship doesn't
work or that they damage the new relationship because the
X person is still in their house. So everything that
(19:49):
you see or that you presume or that you react
to about the new person is based on what you
remember with this ghost still in your house. So you're
living with it every day. And when we live deal
with situations like that, it's like picking out a wound
(20:12):
over and over again. It can't ever heal because what
the reality of what you experience and the pain of
what you experience. People hold on to that and they
think that they're holding on to it because they were
so hurting what have you. But now what they're holding
on to is the memory and the experience and the
(20:36):
feelings surrounding it as a form of protection so that
I'm not gonna ever let somebody hurt me like that again.
And it becomes like a marker in your life. They
continue to date the time the second that they experienced it,
but it also blocks any opportunities for positive change at
(21:01):
going on with your life. Right, some people never get
with anybody else. Yes, And the longer you've been in
the relationship, the harder it is to release it, you know.
And and ironically there are people for other reasons will
consciously choose to stay with that person, but the dynamics
(21:27):
of the relationship are traumatically changed, and so yes, they
may have stayed together. But it's like you two different
people now staying in the house.
Speaker 6 (21:39):
Right.
Speaker 5 (21:40):
One is going to react to and be suspicious of
you and challenge you, like where you're going or what
have you. Another person may not say anything, but anytime
you go out the door, they get that flashback and
they start ruminating about what you're probably doing if you're
doing anything at all. Right, But and especially if you
(22:02):
just have one blow up argument and never process it
to the point where you can put some closure on it,
and so you just stay in that until you grow
so far apart. There's just two people living in the
house together. And we've seen people who lived together like
that for years, right, And so both of their lives
(22:25):
are damaged from it.
Speaker 2 (22:28):
And I think doctor Jeffries, and we've talked about this before,
and you mentioned why would you stay?
Speaker 5 (22:38):
Why especially if you can't you if you're not willing
to work on change to move past it, if you're
not willing to talk about and hear and and be
aware of what role you might have played this person
(23:01):
doing that, and if you didn't play a role in it,
and you think that the person just went out willy
nilly and had this affair, or the person was missing
something in the relationship, but y'all didn't have the type
of communication intimacy where we can talk about things. Then
(23:25):
you know, you stay maybe out of hidden guilt and
what have you, Or I'm going to stay to make
him or her miserable, Yeah, and all of that. So
there are things that come out into out of your
personality where you may want to just punish to the
(23:47):
point where love is gone. But now you're the keeper
up that the way with spouse, and you're going to
punish them. You're going to be jealous, you're going to
be controlling, you're going to be monitoring their behavior, You're
going to be looking through the phone and all of
that kind of stuff. And people cannot live under those conditions.
(24:07):
But you're you're doing something you are definitely punishing, but
you're taking your swallow other porson first killing them, but
you're taking your shot of it too. So two people
are going to die from this, and I mean literally
where you've lost joy, you lost hope, you've lost love,
(24:28):
and you have no interest into anything else other than
catching them again.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
So you can be right right, Let's start off, doctor Jeffries.
Hold on, we are talking you all betrayal of trust
and betrayal trauma with doctor Dorothy Jeffrey. She is here,
she's talking with us, not in the studio live for
our first time listeners. She's by telephone, but we will
take those calls from you. You have a question as
(24:58):
we talk about, but trail of trauma betrayal of trust. Yeah,
we're talking about that this day and any other relationship
question that you may have. We invite you to call
nine zero one five three five nine three four two
(25:19):
eight hundred five zero three nine three four two eight
three three five three five nine three four two will
get you in to wd i A. We're going to
the other side of the Bev Johnson Show on the
Heart and Soul of Memphis w d i A.
Speaker 7 (25:50):
Whether you're in Arkansas, Tennessee, or Mississippi on Facebook, Twitter,
or Instagram, thank you for listening to the Bev Johnson
Show on dou W d ii A Memphis.
Speaker 5 (26:18):
That's justn't show Bell T Time Memphis Talking and home Away.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Help you go, you go, Son't getting ready to.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
Go in time bet just show Joe, Let's go Bell.
Speaker 8 (26:37):
Just then we you make your ody right here wrong.
Speaker 5 (26:43):
To d I.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Listen to want to make you know.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
It's time of the bet of this show, time of.
Speaker 2 (26:54):
The belt of shoe. Let's go. We are rocking and
rolling on this Friday, May twenty ninth, twenty twenty six.
It's a relationship Day where we talk relationships to help
(27:17):
make yours healthy, happy, wholesome, wonderful and most of all
loving between consenting adults. We're doing that with our expert,
our behavioral relationship consultant, doctor Dorothy Jeffries. Topic of conversation
is betrayal of trust and betrayal trauma. We're talking about that.
Going to our phone lines, doctor Jay and talk with David.
Speaker 3 (27:42):
Hey, David, Yeah, good afternoon, my most beautiful African Violet.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (27:48):
I'm doing well. Good afternoon, my David. You got it right.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
Oh man, I'm sitting outside way for a package. They
know where I'm on, mister to Day.
Speaker 2 (28:01):
I hear you, I hear you. Brother.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Well, look, I actually had planned to text you the
link to the actual podcast because I said, you know what,
because you know, people all the time send your email,
they text you and regard story ideas or stuff you
can talk about, right, and so but I forgot, you know,
(28:24):
you know, I just forgot to do it. But so
when I turn on the radio to listen to your show,
the first thing I mean to the letter was that
you've talked started talking about the Gail King situation. So
I guess, I guess God just meant for me to
to talk about this and to mention some things and
(28:44):
some clearer us some things too, because I listened to
the whole podcast it was an hour and twenty minutes
and read.
Speaker 2 (28:50):
Yeah, David, text me the link please, I.
Speaker 6 (28:54):
Would do that.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
I can email or text you whatever, whichever one you're
telling me. I listened to them. I'm gonna be a spoiler. Unfortunately,
no folks this year.
Speaker 5 (29:03):
You know.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
Okay, first of all, and I have been a fan
of CBS Morning uh As. I remember before she became
on the show because I left the NBC Morning Show
because I didn't like the political spind that they were.
They were they were trying too hard to be so
I just left and I went to CBS. So I've
been on it, been a fan I show even before
she came home. And so what was interesting about me
(29:26):
was that Bell all the she flowed out. I think
about lev here. She will always every now and then
bring up the Cheetah cheeta cheetah, pumpkin eater and all
this kind of thing. So so yesterday I'm just looking
at it and the lady on the podcast, who has
been on the show before, you know, doing very well.
The podcast talked about the show. Think it was yesterday
(29:47):
and they just didn't actually ocous this because they talked
about the situation too. When she mentioned on the podcast
the relationship she had with the with the with the
with the crack added as well who she went to
high school with eleven twenty whatever years later, he calls up,
they get together, boom and he puts he takes picture
(30:08):
of her while she's sleeping, and he also sells it
to one of those tableaids. Okay, okay, moving forward, So
she talks about the situation and by the way, let
me clear, that was not and she said this morning,
that was not her best friend, but it was a
very close friend because remember Oprah was in her life
(30:28):
at that time, so Oprah is a bead friend. So
it could not have been a bead friend. But they
were very close friends to the point of playing tennis
and you know, over each other's house. And by the way,
as I remember, both the woman and the man were psychologists.
Are you there?
Speaker 2 (30:47):
But you know her husband is a lawyer. Now he went.
Speaker 6 (30:52):
Not a husband, not a husband the lady that she
found but naked in her house and her husband, as
I remember, listen, I both sat college.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
I got you, I got you now.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
So she she she comes in from from DC, like
she says, and unannounced because something happened traveling wise and
he has the alarm on. Okay, ball and so when
he comes to the door, just as you said, you
can't come in right now. But what was interesting because
because Oprah acts like a sister boy, Oprah wasn't playing
with it. It was funny, but so she says, and
(31:30):
she looks around the house and she finds it. Okay, well, boom,
my closest friend, one of my closest friends here is
sleeping with my husband. But this is the deep part
about it. He says to her, I don't want his husband.
I don't want her husband to know about this. So
let me take her to the train station so he
doesn't find out. And he leaves her. He leaves her
(31:53):
in the house, leaves his wife in the house to
take her to the train station so that she don't
get in trouble with her marriage. And that's when Oprah said, girl,
this is way worse than what you think it is. Okay,
and so boom she she then calls like you said.
It takes a while that she does call the man.
(32:14):
The man said, you got some kind of mental problem,
you know, you need to get that fit boom, and
and and it goes on from there. And then after
the years and all of this case, so she still
takes them back. And at that point Oprah said, look,
do what you want to do. Basically, just quit talk
to me about it. That kind of thing. And and
and of course he cheats on her again. He claimed
(32:35):
he didn't. But when they do break up, the woman
that she thought was a woman that he that he
that she saw him with a you know, as soon
as they broke up and got a divorce. This is
a question I want you to ask, doctor Jess. I'm
pretty sure that that. And I looked it up because
I said, was this a brother? You know?
Speaker 8 (32:57):
So I looked up. But husband, yep, he is little brother. Yeah,
graduate law ya, all that kind of thing. And I
don't know about the crack at it, but I'm pretty
sure because she said it was high school and all that.
So he's likely a brother too.
Speaker 3 (33:09):
But what was really interesting to me was that the
white woman who would host the podcast asked her what
kind of man was she looking for?
Speaker 4 (33:15):
Right?
Speaker 3 (33:16):
That kind of thing. He needs to be humorous, he
needs to be intelligent, you know, no problem with that.
But when she went to name and men, it was
Tom Brady and it was Hugh Jack and I'm a brother.
I'm waiting on her.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Okay, okay, okay.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
Mother mention a brother and she never did. Now I
don't know, you know, I ain't mad at it either way,
but I'm just saying, you know, what you want is
what you want. Did this thing harm her so bad
that she's through with brothers? And that's my question?
Speaker 2 (33:50):
All right, David, good question, Thank you, David. That doctor Jeffers.
I don't know if you heard David, No, I didn't, Okay, okay,
So he David talks. He said he was going to
call in to talk about that Gail King thing and
he heard me talking about it. Anyway, So with the
(34:11):
bottom line, he talks about, you know, whatever happened and
the podcast, and then he was telling me that I
could go back and listen to the podcast because Gail
talks about a lot of things. But the thing is
that David says, she's been betrayed by a brother. So
he said, the podcaster asked us, well, what kind of
man you're looking for, and she said, humorous intelligence. Start
(34:34):
naming all these things. And then she named off two men,
doctor Jefferies, Tom Brady, and Hugh Jackman, and David was saying,
wait a minute, now, she ain't named math, no brothers
or brothers. Her husband was a brother. One of the
guys that portrayed her was an X cracker attic portrayed her.
But she's naming all these two white guys. So David
(34:57):
wants to know, because of this betrayal of trust, has
this done something to Gail that she doesn't want a brother?
Speaker 5 (35:08):
Well, it could be, you know, you could look at
a number of different angles in that regard. I'm really
surprised because Tom Brady is a lot younger than she is, right,
And Hugh Jackman, I think he just he's either I
know he was there, but I thought that he was
(35:30):
getting a divorce. I may be wrong about that, but the.
Speaker 3 (35:33):
Point is.
Speaker 5 (35:37):
The one. The reaction may be, I'm not gonna date
another black man, right, and the erroneous assumption is that
if I date a white male, he won't treat me
like that. The other thing, maybe is that she's looking
with somebody with comfortable assets to her so that she
(36:01):
will feel that they're not involved with her because of
what she has in her association with so many different
people and what have you. I think that because because
she because she went so far as to bring this
(36:23):
topic up on this podcast, that she is a perfect
example of somebody who has never come to terms with it,
has never processed it and what have you. And there
has to be some deep seated shame and anger that's
still there because after all of these years, you know,
(36:47):
the kids have grown, she got grandchildren and everything else.
So it's either fear of it happening again or anger
is just too deep. So she really needs to process
there and to say out loud on you know, to
(37:10):
her fans. Now, a lot of people of color are
going to feel some kind of way about her response.
And these are only two men that she would be
interested in. And I do not think that because Tom
Brady baton't women that are much younger than her.
Speaker 2 (37:30):
And I was thinking, doct Jeffery Gale is seventy one years.
Speaker 5 (37:33):
Old exactly, So she had to be facetious about this.
Oprah will probably talked to her because she will do
she will do things sometimes that she puts her foot
in her mouth, and maybe she was being cute, you
(37:53):
know and saying that these are because she's always coming
up with these different men that she has a quote
crush shout right.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
You know.
Speaker 5 (38:03):
So I'm going to write it after that that she.
Speaker 2 (38:05):
Was not serious, right, And again when we talk about portrayal,
she was portrayed. And so this has affected her and
she and she's still doctor Jeffries living with a lot
of this stuff that she is every day and as
you said, holding on to it and looked like she
(38:27):
would have I don't know what you got into some
therapy or something, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (38:33):
But the thing about it is it has never been
able to even mulll O. But because she frequently brings
this up, because I mean even when her kids were
pregnant and stuff, she brought him up about having to
see him when he because he wanted to see the
grandchildren and all of that. Either she still has feelings
(38:56):
for him, and part of the feelings that she still
has for him is the why did he do that
to me? And there's anger and hurt still there that
has been unresolved. I doubt if she has sat down
and talked through it with him, because if she had,
(39:20):
she would be you know, he's out of her life.
He's been out of her life.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Yeah, and he's married. And doctor Jeffery William Bumpers has
a he's married, he's gone on. He has a sixteen
year old and he was saying that Gail and has
embraced his new daughter with the other his daughter and
son and all that. So he's gone on with his life. Okay.
(39:47):
And I'm saying all this, y'all because someone's out there
listening who is going through the same thing exactly. They're angry,
they're mad, they have said they haven't gotten over. And
I know I had wrote down a question, doctor Jeffers
when you also talk when we talked about people stay
in those relationships for punishment, to punish that person. But
(40:09):
what about doctor Jeffery's revenge?
Speaker 5 (40:13):
Well, yeah, you know, if you think I'm gonna just
let you just walk on off and have you a
happy life when you've hurt me this deeply, No, but
some people will still go See the thing, there are
several reasons why some people will stay in the relationship.
And the difference is when you have betrayal of trust.
(40:36):
Usually it's an egalitarian relationship in it, you know, you
both came to it, you build some things and both
of you probably contributed to what you've built together. So
there's no feeling that one person is more powerful or
has more of resources than the other one. And so
(40:56):
if the feeling of betrayal is to significant enough to you,
then you know that you could walk. And some people
know that they should walk, particularly if somebody is a
chronic cheater. Why are you staying? You know? And some
(41:19):
people stay long enough until they don't have any feelings
about discovering the new thing. It becomes a gang to
discover you know, who's he with now? And that's the
person that has been checking the phone for years and
you know, checking the pockets and the pants and all
of those kinds of things that they become ob obsessed
(41:42):
with it. And when they discover something like that, it's like, aha,
he's still doing it, but it's an aha, you occurred again,
even if you're pretending that you're not. Why are you
wasting your life policeing somebody who won't get caught and
have any consequences. Right, So that's that's one thing. But
(42:06):
then when you're traumatized.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
The betrayal, I was going to ask you about that.
Speaker 5 (42:12):
Yeah, I've learned from I know you you.
Speaker 2 (42:16):
Ow my mind, so you read it so yeah.
Speaker 5 (42:18):
Gone so and the betrayal of trauma. Usually it's not
just an intimate relationships that people are traumatized by betrayal.
Children are often betrayumauh traumatized by parents who fail to
do the things that parents are supposed to do, obligated
(42:43):
to do for them where they can do for themselves.
So the parent is the one who's responsible for caring
for you, providing resources for your needs, being met for
all of those things, including those emotions on things like
believing in you, building up yourself a stream parents, making
(43:06):
sure you have sheltered clothes and get educated, and all
the physical care and all of that. When you don't
do that, what kids learn is I can't trust anybody
else to take care of me. But the parent child
relationship is so significant. And I learned a lot about
(43:28):
this when working with foster care kids. Kids who are
taken from a parent that they've lived with, and the
parent could have been the worst experience that any child
could have for somebody who's supposed to be caring for you,
they remain totally loyal to that parent. Kids who were
(43:49):
abused okay because they rather than see the parent as
a bad person. They will hold on to the fact
that it me And this is true with young children
and sometimes that stays with them until they developed some
(44:09):
things that I can't think of. The woman's name who
coined this raid, Jennifer Freed, caused betrayal blindness that when
something happens where you experience betrayal with that person, you
then work harder to be better, to do better, to
(44:32):
try to win them, you know, win them over again
because you feel like it must be me because the
core people, the primary people who were supposed to take
care of you, and all of that did not. Then
this is the This is the behavioral response when you
(44:53):
experience it as an adult. This is where you have
insecure people who will get involved with somebody who really
do not understand what love is and how people show
love and concern. So when their abuse emotionally or physically, financially, economically,
however they do it, that you take the blame for
(45:17):
it and try to figure out ways to do better
with the person to not rock the boat, or you
refuse to acknowledge that this person is hurting me. You
then just struggle to do better in order to earn
their love. You got to earn it because you don't
(45:37):
willingly deserve to get it. And that will stay from
early childhood into adult relationships. And you know when people
ask why does she stay with him? Why does he
deal with her like that? And it's male and females too.
They stay together because this person will bend over backwards
(46:01):
not to be abandoned physically again. And in those type
of imbalance relationships, the person is often dependent upon that
person for something, finances especially, it could be other things
that they feel that they can't do without. And so
(46:21):
the imbalance is maintained by the person who's victimized willingness
to be and remain submissive.
Speaker 2 (46:34):
So does you know you talk about those children, those
those children who have been betrayed or going through the
trauma doctor Jefferys as children when they become adults, do
they lose those thoughts, those inklings, or something else happens?
Do they learn better what happens with them?
Speaker 5 (46:55):
It will only happen if the child comes to a
point where they recognize that maybe it's not me. And
this is the time when someone they may befriend somebody
and this person starts pointing it out. Maybe they end
up while they're still children and a foster care home
(47:18):
or having a social worker that recognizes that they need
counseling or therapy or what have you. And then for
a lot of adult persons, it takes somebody who can
point out to them and try to educate them about
the dynamics that no matter what you do, not deserve
(47:40):
to be treated like that. It's not your fault, is
the person's willingness to be harmful and hurtful to you,
and nobody deserves that. And again reinforcing that with getting
somebody a support person, an advocate or therapy to consistently
(48:02):
refine that statement and that argument to them until they
begin to believe it and can begin to see changes
and have the confidence to change some behavioral responses themselves. Now,
when you don't have that, that's when you have people
who will remain in imbalanced relationships with somebody who has
(48:27):
control over their needs, their warrants, their experiences, and they
will stay with that person and minimize the impact that
it's having on them. You know, a lot of people
ask questions like, why does she stay with him and
he treats her like that and he doesn't do anything
like that because she's struggling to try to convince him
(48:51):
that she is worthy because that's what she's learned from
the people who we're supposed to care from her. And
so through the domestic violence advocates and other people that
provide support and some peer counseling from somebody who's been
through it, you can begin to point out the realities
(49:14):
of what happens and things that you can learn how
to do for yourself. And it takes a lot of
courage to hear that and see the dynamics. But what
really is helpful for somebody who can say I've been
where you are, and I refuse to go back to
that because once I learned that I could, I want
(49:38):
every person who experiences this to experience the freedom of
being an independent person. And so that's when we're talking
about the betrayal of trauma that continues from early betrayal
somebody who is responsible for you and did not do
you justice.
Speaker 2 (50:01):
Okay, And I I had got this question, oh from
common man, doctor Jeffries. He said, Doctor Jeffries, would that
be an example of a person being broken, like we
were speaking about last week, one who is still angry
about a relationship from the past that just won't let
it go.
Speaker 5 (50:20):
Yes, okay, thank you coming man. That's a great connection
to that. See, there are people who are hurting, who
are broken, and they walk around.
Speaker 3 (50:32):
They may be an.
Speaker 5 (50:33):
Expensive clothes, drive an expensive cars, that the place that
they've lived in, but they are still broken from un
finished business that possibly started earlier in their lives, when
their self esteem was never developed, or they lost their
(50:56):
sense of self due to irresponsible care givers or parents
or whatever the experiences were. And not only see a
lot of people assume that this only happens in families
where people are poor and struggling for survival. Yes, it
can happen in those situations where it may be generational
(51:18):
and maybe the family is overwhelmed by lack of resources.
But it also happens in middle class and wealthy families too.
When you have family, when you have parents that are
noncommunicative with each other and with the children, when you
have parents who are working through or trying to work
(51:40):
through their own issues of brokenness, and they don't know
how to be intimate with their partners, they don't know
how to be close and affectionate with their children, and
so these kids grow up feeling alone and having to
do it independently. But children need to feel dependent on
(52:06):
dependable parents. And when they's not met, children believe they're
the reasons they're not good enough, or they're too bad,
or whatever thing that they can internalize as negative on themselves,
and it follows them until they do have a difference
or a change in mindset. That's why we always be
(52:28):
careful what you teach your children. Yes, whether you're saying
it to them or showing it to them, they pick
up and learn every lesson that you teach.
Speaker 2 (52:40):
All right, correct, we are talking this day. We are
talking about portrayal, trauma, and portrayal of trust. If you
have a question or to for doctor Jeffries this day
about portrayal or another relationship, Yes, you can call nine
(53:02):
zero one five three five nine three four two eight
hundred five zero three nine three four two eight three
three five three five nine three four two will get
you in to us. Can't call. Email me your question
Bev Johnson at iHeartMedia dot com. That's Bev Johnson at
(53:30):
iHeartMedia dot com. You're listening to the Heart and Soul
of Memphis w D I A.
Speaker 9 (54:06):
Nobody and I mean nobody does it like the Queen
of talk, Bev Johnson on the BEB Johnson Show on
w d I A.
Speaker 7 (54:50):
You're listening to the Bev Johnson Show. Here's Bev Johnson and.
Speaker 2 (54:54):
We're talking about betrayal of trust and betrayal tru And
one of the things that I wanted to ask you,
doctor Jefferies, when we were talking about betrayal of trust,
is there at any time that you are able to
trust again?
Speaker 5 (55:18):
I think that that depends on the work that both
persons have to be committed to do with the understanding
that it's going to take time, consistency, and the willingness
to address the topic anytime the injured person brings it up,
(55:40):
because an unwillingness to do that kind of reignite that
feeling of you did this to me, and I loved
you and trusted you, Why would you do this to me? People,
you have to be willing to again rebuilding the trust
(56:02):
that you and it may never get back to where
it was, but a willingness to go through that shows
that I'm committed to try to do whatever repair works
that I can assist in the majority of the repairing,
if any of the relationship has to do with the
(56:22):
injured person being willing to try, but also being committed
to working on themselves to be clear about what they
need in order to remain in the relationship or to
(56:43):
continue to work on the relationship, or even to try again.
They have to be clear. You have to do X,
Y and Z initially for me to be able to
even talk to you again. And it's a it's a
painful process for both people because at some points, the
(57:05):
other person, the violator, is going to say, when the
hell are you going to get over this?
Speaker 2 (57:11):
Right?
Speaker 5 (57:11):
You know, we keep talking about the same things over
and over again, and what they have to understand you
keep talking about the same things over and over again
because the person believes that I have to keep testing
you to see if you're willing to do it again,
and only your willingness to allow me to process this
(57:34):
at my speed can help me begin to believe that
you do care something about me, because right now I'm
not sure. Right now that's not how I feel. And
right now I'm so angry with you that I don't
think that I ever wanted to trust you again. But
then there's this part of me that remembers the way
(57:56):
we were and I want to try. First, Some people
just say forget it. I'm never going to speak to
this person again. They're out of my life. I'm out
of their life. You know it's over. But even if
that's the avenue that you take, please talk to somebody,
Please journal about it, Please process it enough so that
(58:18):
you have some clarity about what happened, what your role
was in the experience, and some support and having and
trying to move beyond that episode of your life.
Speaker 2 (58:34):
And that brings me and I was looking emir Anita
wanted to know, says doctor Jeffries. So is it good
to accept an apology for for anything that person did
to hurt you? Should you accept the apology?
Speaker 5 (58:52):
I think that first of all, it has to be
a very clear apology.
Speaker 2 (58:59):
And let's say, when you mean very clear.
Speaker 5 (59:03):
You have to be able to say, I am so
sorry that I hurt you and violated our relationship and
your trust because I fill in the blank what they did.
Took money from you, I lied to you, cheated on you,
whatever it was that they did. And they have to
spell out and acknowledge the behavior, okay, that they did
(59:27):
before you accept. Think about what questions that they have
been rattling around in your brain, like, well, why would
you do that? What did I do that made you
think it was okay to treat me like that, to
disrespect me like that, to hurt me? And how do
you know you won't do it again? Ask all the
(59:48):
questions before you accept an apology. Oh, don't blank check.
You've had all these questions rolling around in your head.
You know, if it was you know, like, if you
violate a confidence, why would you go tell him or
her about something that I told you was so private?
Speaker 2 (01:00:09):
Right?
Speaker 5 (01:00:10):
Why would you do that? And the person gives you
their reason if there really is a sincere apology, but
don't accept the blanket upon I'm so sorry sorry for what?
Speaker 2 (01:00:23):
How right?
Speaker 5 (01:00:24):
And how can Yeah?
Speaker 2 (01:00:26):
So that person who's apologizing to you needs to tell
you right? Why why?
Speaker 5 (01:00:33):
That's the question that you have. Why would you do that?
Speaker 2 (01:00:36):
Yes?
Speaker 5 (01:00:37):
You know, why would you cheat on me? Did you
not know how I felt about you? Did you know
that I would never do that to you? I have
never done that to you? And wait for answers. Don't
just go on a roll just you know, go on
and say okay, yeah, yeah, don't say okay and don't
and when you make your statements like why would you
(01:00:59):
do that to me and allow them to answer, well,
I don't know, but you have to know. If you're
apologizing to me, you have to know why you did this.
And if you don't know, then come back and apologize.
If you really want me to try to forgive you,
(01:01:19):
come back and apologize when you can tell me some
answers to why, and people ask all kinds of things,
who is the person that you did? Why that person?
Have you done this before? All of that, and the
person has to be willing to be honest. Now, what
do you do if the person said and you ask,
(01:01:40):
is this the first time you've done this since we've
been together? They have to decide. If they say no
and you find out later that they had cheated before,
you're never going to forgive them again. And if they
say yes, I have done it before, you have to
be prepared to hear about that and decide, okay, if
(01:02:01):
they've done this two or three times, do I want
to be with this person or not? So both persons
have to work through this, and it should be a
process where the person comes and asks you and you say, well,
let me think about this, and you take the time
that you need so that you can get your thoughts,
(01:02:22):
your questions, what your expectations are for the future in
your mind, write them down if you have to, and
then go back. And that person has to be willing
to give you the time to ask the questions that
you need to have the answers to how do I
know you will never do this again?
Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
You don't.
Speaker 5 (01:02:45):
But what they're asking you to do is to stay
in the relationship or stay connected to me, and we
can work on this together. So if I say, well
I can't, I don't know. You know, I wasn't planning
to do this fine advance, Well then what am I trusting?
What am I building my trust? Don't? Because what I
(01:03:08):
thought we were building it on was the value of
our relationship, and so that's broken. So what are you
asking me to forgive you? For to forgive you so
you can go off to wild blue yonder, or forgive
you because you want to try to rebuild trust? Be specific,
ask the hard question. You don't have anything else to lose,
(01:03:29):
And if you don't get the answers, that's going to
give you some hope that this person is really sorry
that they're since here and they're willing to at least
try to work it out. You will feel better if
you try to work it out and it doesn't work.
Then if you just stay sitting on that injury and
(01:03:50):
the anger and the you know, that feeling of being
wrong that you will learn to live with if you
don't give yourself the opportunity to get all the responses
that you deserve.
Speaker 2 (01:04:04):
Okay. And as we get ready to close up, and
we talk about betrayal, doctor Jeffries, and we talk about
trauma and being traumatized, there is we can do something
about it, but you have to be willing to do
something about.
Speaker 5 (01:04:22):
It absolutely, okay, and acknowledge the injury was painful, Yes,
it was awful. You would devastate it going after the
truth not only about your part but about you, because
(01:04:44):
in most relationships, we do things that we're blind to
that may irritate your partner, hurt your partner's feeling, and
if they're not a person to speak up about it
or say something to you out and then it builds
up because a lot of times infidelities come from some
(01:05:07):
level of detachment from the primary person, some level that
the person hurts them doing something over and over again,
ignoring them, taking them for granted, talking about past relationships
without thinking about it, humiliating them, trying to control them,
all of those things, and people then consciously or unconsciously
(01:05:32):
become to come to a point where they say, you know,
they're not acknowledged they're angry with you, but it gives
them permission to go on and do what they know
in the beginning, if you find out about it, you're
going to be hurt. So that's why it's important to
dig in deep enough to find out what you did
(01:05:52):
that contributed to this. And if they say you didn't
do anything, then you said yourself, look at your behavior,
look at your attitude. Ask somebody else what it is
about you in relationships that they like and what things
they like for you to change. You don't have to
go into detail while you're asking these questions. You say,
I'm on a self improvement stand or whatever. But you
(01:06:16):
need to go to people who are willing to tell
you the truth. And you know if people are making
it up or telling you the truth, because it'll feel like,
oh yeah, I am policy, Oh yeah, I do act
in different to people's feelings. You know, Oh I'm critical.
Speaker 2 (01:06:32):
You know, you'll know, you'll know who you are, all right,
all right, I hope I know our listeners they were
listening today. So because this is a painful, as you
said earlier, doctor Jeffer's a topic and a lot of
people don't want to acknowledge it, but it happens.
Speaker 5 (01:06:50):
Yes, And everybody may not have been hurt or betrayed
in an intimate relationship, but everybody has experienced some type
of betrayal. Okay, they've had to get through, even young
kids and best friends kind of stuff they go through
that you abandoned for a new best friend or whatever
(01:07:11):
it is you working through those feelings will tell a
lot about how you deal with relationships. Now, it's a
good journaling project. Yes, how do I feel about betrayal?
Have I ever been betrayed? What was my first memory
of being portrayed? Who hurt me first? Those kind of questions.
Speaker 2 (01:07:32):
Okay, very good, Doctor j I appreciate you. Thank you
so much for coming on in with us. We do
appreciate you.
Speaker 5 (01:07:40):
All. My pleasure is John.
Speaker 2 (01:07:42):
Yeah, always, and I will talk to you and doctor Jefferies,
don't forget to send me that number.
Speaker 5 (01:07:47):
But I'm going to make sure that you get. If
you didn't get it, let me know.
Speaker 2 (01:07:52):
Okay, okay, wait wait, let me check right. Why are
you on here? So I'll know that I didn't get it,
So send it again?
Speaker 5 (01:08:03):
Okay, I will.
Speaker 2 (01:08:04):
And also I'm going to email you a topic. I
think that is going to be good and even doctor
Harper suggested it. Okay, so I'll email it to you.
Speaker 5 (01:08:18):
Tell him hello the next time you see.
Speaker 2 (01:08:20):
I definitely will, Doctor Jeffries. Think you have a good
weekend and be safe, sister.
Speaker 5 (01:08:26):
All right, you too. Now I'm not mailing this to
your mobile. Is that not a good number?
Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
Yes, it is, it is, okay, please do please do
got it? Thank you, Doctor Jeffries.
Speaker 5 (01:08:37):
All right, take care and be careful now.
Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
You too, by now bye bye. That is our Behavioral
Relationship Consultant, Doctor Dorothy Jeffries.
Speaker 4 (01:08:49):
The views and opinions discussed on the BEV Johnson Show
are that of the hosts and callers and not those
of the staff and sponsors of w d I A.
Speaker 2 (01:09:15):
I want to thank you callers, I want to thank
you listeners for joining us all this week on the
BAB Johnson Show. We do, we really do appreciate you.
So until tomorrow, please be safe. Keep a cool head, y'all,
don't let anyone still your joy until tomorrow. I'm bab
(01:09:40):
Johnson and y'all keep the faith. Mark Baker take Me
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