June 25, 2026 • 46 mins
How do you go from studying literature and planning a life in academia to leading one of the most innovative companies in real estate technology?
In this episode of CEOs You Should Know Dallas, iHeartMedia Dallas Market President Chris Long sits down with Janine Steiner Jovanovic, CEO of LeaseLock, to explore her unique path from aspiring professor to tech entrepreneur and industry leader.
Janine shares how an unexpected opportunity working alongside her father launched her into real estate technology, ultimately leading to executive roles at major firms like RealPage, where she helped scale the business through rapid growth and a public offering. She reflects on pivotal career moments, including stepping away at the height of her career to focus on family, and the lessons in leadership, resilience, and self-awareness that shaped her journey.
The conversation also dives into LeaseLock’s mission to modernize rental housing by replacing outdated security deposits with a more flexible, insurance-based solution—making housing more accessible for renters while simplifying operations for property owners.
Janine offers thoughtful insights on people-first leadership, building a culture rooted in humility and accountability, and why human connection still matters in an increasingly digital world.
From bold career pivots to transforming an industry, this episode highlights the power of adaptability, execution, and leading with purpose.
Guest: Janine Steiner Jovanovic, CEO, LeaseLock
CEOs You Should Know DFW features candid conversations with leaders shaping business in North Texas and beyond, hosted by Chris Long, Region President of iHeartMedia Dallas/Fort Worth. Follow, Rate, and Subscribe on the podcast platform you are listening on!
In this episode of CEOs You Should Know Dallas, iHeartMedia Dallas Market President Chris Long sits down with Janine Steiner Jovanovic, CEO of LeaseLock, to explore her unique path from aspiring professor to tech entrepreneur and industry leader.
Janine shares how an unexpected opportunity working alongside her father launched her into real estate technology, ultimately leading to executive roles at major firms like RealPage, where she helped scale the business through rapid growth and a public offering. She reflects on pivotal career moments, including stepping away at the height of her career to focus on family, and the lessons in leadership, resilience, and self-awareness that shaped her journey.
The conversation also dives into LeaseLock’s mission to modernize rental housing by replacing outdated security deposits with a more flexible, insurance-based solution—making housing more accessible for renters while simplifying operations for property owners.
Janine offers thoughtful insights on people-first leadership, building a culture rooted in humility and accountability, and why human connection still matters in an increasingly digital world.
From bold career pivots to transforming an industry, this episode highlights the power of adaptability, execution, and leading with purpose.
Guest: Janine Steiner Jovanovic, CEO, LeaseLock
CEOs You Should Know DFW features candid conversations with leaders shaping business in North Texas and beyond, hosted by Chris Long, Region President of iHeartMedia Dallas/Fort Worth. Follow, Rate, and Subscribe on the podcast platform you are listening on!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is CEOs you should know with Dallas market president
of iHeartMedia Chris Long. Welcome everybody to another episode of
CEOs you should know. I'm Chris Long, Dallas market president
for iHeartMedia, and I am really excited to introduce everyone
to my new friend, Janine Steiner Yovanovich, CEO of Leaslock. Janine,
(00:26):
how are you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I'm great, thrilled to be here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Absolutely we were. I was getting ahead of myself when
we met here a few minutes ago, so I'm trying
to rewind a little bit and get back into podcast mode.
But we'll get into things here real quick. So Janine,
as I mentioned to you that we feel it's important
to understand who you are a little bit musically. So
(00:51):
you know, with iHeartMedia being the country's largest audio platform
with eight hundred and sixty radio stations across one hundred
and sixty more markets, reaching podcast, you know, utilizing podcast
and streaming anything audio you can imagine, we feel it's
important we understand you a little bit better musically. So
we're gonna rapid fire a few questions at you. Don't
(01:13):
think about it, just give us the answers and we
will judge you accordingly. Artist poster that was on your
bedroom wall as you were growing up, Duran Duran, Okay,
like Wolf, all right, I'm good with that band T
shirt you owned. We're desperately wanted Daph Leppard. We're on
a heater here. I'm gonna keep going. Teenage music crush,
(01:36):
Joe Elliott, Prince France, Okay, I'm gonna keep going.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Last concert, The last concert I went to was, Oh boy,
it's been a while. Gypsy Kings.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Okay, first concert, Bruce Springsteen. We haven't had that, have we, Amanda?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I don't think we have.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
No, We've had some interesting ones. We've had Johnny Cash,
Pink Floyd, Backstreet Boys, as everybody knows if they listen.
Mine was men at Work, which sucks Houston. It's a
true story. Jeanie's trying not to laugh into the mic.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Can it be no?
Speaker 1 (02:14):
I know that you might, right, You know, you tell
your kids that you know they have a fundamental like
if you said Prince or Boston or some of these
ones that all of our guests had that I didn't have, Like,
oh yeah, I've heard of that, and they're like, what
are you talking about? And then you show me YouTube
and they're like, oh god, anyway, so Janine, welcome. I
(02:37):
know I have a lot to live up too, because
apparently you're being interviewed on a large cable network following
this this week.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Oh my gosh, No, this is the most important thing
I'm doing this week. For sure.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
I thought you said earlier the most important thing you're
doing this afternoon between one and three.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
No, not at all.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Plus, I've decided I adore you and that we should
be friends.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Now we are totally friends. We are totally friends, especially
with the whole Prince def Leppard.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Bruce Springsteen, Max.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
I mean, I'm not a Springsteen person.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
I'm sorry, but you have to be. I insist.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Now I'm going to bed.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Now I'm going to force you to listen to all
sorts of music that you didn't want to all right.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Okay, fair enough, fair enough, okay. So what we like
to do on the podcast talk a little bit about
how you got to where you are today a CEO.
In doing a little bit of research, it looks like
you have a really unique back. I mean, everybody has
a unique background, but yours is you. You've done both really,
You've been a founder and you've ascended through the corporate ranks,
(03:41):
so to speak, to be a CEO. So I think
this is going to be a lot of fun because
one of the things we find with founders they have
aha moments. And we've had some super super random ones. Uh,
doctor Harrison on the Mission trip pulling a tooth when
he was nineteen, and Shannon from Farmhouse Fresh sending Oprah
some of the lotion she'd created and getting a response.
(04:04):
So it's it's an interesting dynamic. So talk a little
bit about college. You grew up in Canada, correct, I.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Grew up in Toronto. Oh yes, I'm still a Maple
Leafs fan. And they just got the number one draft pick.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
That's something to get excited about. I'm hope. Hope is
a big important thing.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So there's always next year. That's what we That's what
we say in Toronto.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I know, I know, Okay, So talk a little bit
about college and what you were thinking when you went
to school, graduate degree and all of that.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Yeah, So I grew up wanting to be a professor
really of literature. So I have a master's degree in
compared toive literature, fluent in French and German, and I
was obsessed with the Enlightenment period, and my mission in
life at that time was to transform young minds and
enlighten young minds kind of the way that I had
(04:56):
been by teachers that I admired. And and then over
time I realized that academia is not exactly all about
just that what and I'll leave it at that. And
once you kind of realize that, you know, you start
opening your mind to other possibilities. And my dad was
a big real estate investor. Growing up in Toronto, he
(05:19):
started investing in Texas with his you know, Canadian buddies
and spending more and more time here, and so we
started spending the school years here when I was young.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Oh really, yep.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So I grew up, you know, all my formative years
really in Dallas and so, and my dad was the
kind of guy that wouldn't let me sit home idle. Ever,
So if he was if I was available, if I
had a day off school or a vacation and I
(05:51):
wasn't doing anything, I was going to his office with him.
So I grew up going to you know, zoning meetings
at city Hall and architect discussions around what to do
with land that he was buying, touring, retail and apartment
buildings and all sorts of things. There was really no
(06:12):
type of real estate he didn't do and wasn't involved in.
So I learned a lot from him growing up. And
I learned also a very solid work ethic, and my
goal in life was to grow up and be just
like him. But I also had this passion for literature,
and so when I pivoted, it was pretty easy. I
(06:33):
talked to my dad and he's like, you know, I
had a great idea. I want to build some software
and I want you to help me with it. And
that's how I launched into being a founder.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
So it's interesting you went to work with your father
and saw what he did. You know, I had something similar.
My grandfather was a bail bondsman, so I used to
remember being woken up at midnight when I visit my
grandparents and go down to the jail and bail out drunks.
I don't know how that helped me in my career,
but uh, certainly interesting and a great story.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Wow, yeah that coming in no actually, but I love it. Yeah,
because you know, for me, it's the same thing, you know,
hands on experience. The reason I fell in love with
housing and rental housing specifically, is because my dad owned
apartment buildings, and so a lot of the work I
did was leasing apartments and helping manage these buildings.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I will tell you candidly, when I was doing my
research and you probably saw me snooping on your LinkedIn
the other day, I was trying to figure out like
filling in the gaps, and especially when you said I
didn't realize the whole comparative literature thing. So yeah, those
track not at all together. And the software piece. So
(07:43):
when you were in college, like, tell me how the
I mean the whole software part came into play. I mean,
were you taking there.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
I took a computer class, but I mean we were,
I mean as four hundreds. You know, if anybody tells
I'm from the typing class, see anybody remember that stuff?
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yes, you know?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
So no, I wasn't. That wasn't my jam, and you
weren't in it, or I was not into it until
my dad said, hey, I need some help. I want
to build a software program to manage my apartment communities.
I need good information. And all of these apartment communities
were being managed in doss based software, and so we
did we used at the time. It was very innovative technology.
(08:25):
Hired some engineers and built one ended up being the
first commercially available asset management system for multifamily and that
was kind of fun. And my dad's like, this is cool.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
We should show up your guinea pig.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Yeah, he was my guinea pig.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Like, what a great like safe way to learn.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
One hundred percent plus he provided all the funding is
even better.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Well, yeah, there's that that helps.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
But he's like, you know, I like to make my
money back, so we should go talk to some of
my friends and see who might be interested in buying
this interesting And somebody said.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Yes, okay, so how where were you out of college
at this point.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Let's see twenty three, twenty two years old?
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Okay, wait, I got to rewind for a second. So
you do the comparative literature degree. So end of your
college experience you were realizing maybe this isn't what I
want to do.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Is that I realized that I had a desire to
let me, let me try to say this without it
sounding bad. I'm a capitalist at heart.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I was just gonna say make money.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Really, yeah, I'm with you, you know, And so you
just wake up one day. The combination of that and
the fact that academia is not just about inspiring on
minds and it has its own system that does I
learned about more and more over time, and it became
less interesting to me as a result. So it was
kind of a combo those two things.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, it's not as pure as you thought it was
going to be. And you're like, Okay, if I'm going
to do anything, if I'm a capitalist, I might as
well be compensated for it.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Thank you for translating.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Of course, I try to do that, well said. So
you graduated and you decided I want to do this management.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
My dad's like, hey, you need to put food on
your table. I've got a project, so you can do
this for me. And it was fun and exciting and innovative,
and I was fired up, and so I said sure,
instead of going and doing what I used to do,
which is maybe I'll try to see if I can
get a really good job waitressing again or whatever else,
(10:27):
I thought, you know, I'll try this, and it turned
out that it was the beginning of something special.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
So what was that window? How long was that period
of time?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
So let's see, graduated a little young from college, did
grad school in a year, so I was probably twenty
two when I started working with him on the project.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
And you went to him with the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
No, I wish I was that brilliant.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
I know the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It was his idea, but you know I executed.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
And you took the sea and you grew it.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
That's right, that's right. And you know, one of the
things I will say about myself, I work with a
lot of cool founders. I've seen people transform the world. Yeah,
I typically don't come up with the initial idea, and
I'm okay with that because a lot of brilliant people
that come up with ideas can't execute, and that's where
I come in.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
It's interesting because I've worked in companies with the founder
was still there. I wasn't there in the beginning. Founders
still there, and there's very much a founding culture and
a thought and it's very there's a very emotional tie
that's over emotional tie to the product, which is great
and nurtures it and takes a product to a point,
but at a certain point you do need someone who
(11:42):
can take that and really turn it into the bigger
thing it's supposed to be.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
And if you're smart, and you co found with somebody
at the beginning, then you get to stick around the
two of you and continue to scale it over time
and evolve together. Yep, that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Yeah, so it sounds like you had a really good partner.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Yeah my dad.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Yeah, I mean, come on, so, how so talk about
that partnership. I mean, was it It sounds like you
guys were close. Yeah, how was it that the business side?
I mean, you know they talk about working with family,
can be can run the gamut.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, it's tough. It's tough, I will say. He he,
he was hard to live up to. Yeah, you know,
brilliant guy, very successful, you know, a little bit of
a renaissance man. And but you know, I'm a humble
enough person and a grateful enough person. So I loved
(12:37):
taking what I needed to and what I should from
that relationship and could tolerate some of the challenges. And
I think that's also something during my whole career that
has worked well for me, is that I can find
something incredibly wonderful about almost anybody that I can take
from them that's a gift and learn from for sure.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
You know, it's it's funny. I'll talk to so of
the the younger members of our team. And you know,
the whole thing today, you know, over the last few
years is in office not in office. All of those things.
Everybody's got an opinion. I think some of it's generational
where you fit and that you know, and that whole
your feelings on that subject. But I talked to him
about just being present and watching how people do business,
(13:22):
how they speak to one another, and and you know,
I'm sure you have examples. You know. I remember the
first time I was in a sales pit and woman
that I sold sat next to that I sold with,
probably the greatest salesperson ever worked with. Could never do
it the way she did it, would never want to.
(13:42):
But I remember thinking, Okay, I understand why she does that,
and I want to. I want to take that piece.
And you're right. When you start to realize everybody has
something to offer, that's when you develop really the you know,
the full skill set, I believe. But you have to
be present, you have to be paying attention.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, I'm fascinated by human beings. I mean, this life
is such a gift and I want to find that unique, special,
awesome quality in everybody I interact with. Unfortunately not everybody
has one.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
I will say this. I mean, you also learn what
you don't want to be.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
That's one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yeah, you know, I leave names out of it, but
like there there are people that I worked underneath a
few layers that I was just like, oh my gosh,
they're horrible, and if I'm ever in those shoes, you know,
I will make sure that I don't do that. And
you know, conversely, I had one of those moments. There
was a gentleman that was a you know, at my level,
(14:40):
maybe even higher when I was really young, a gentleman
named Don Belucas and kind of gruff, been around, smart,
taught me things, you know, taught me the things like
I was presenting to him one time and he's like,
christo'mastafi right now you've used the word I, me and
my constantly in your.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Present tape, shake pet peeve on those and.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
He said, are you the only one around here doing anything?
I was. I was twenty seven, I was a manager,
and I talk about something that is I've tried to
stick with, like in my mind when I write things,
it's not always about me all of that, And so
I had the pleasure and so like one of the
things I learned, then I'll shut up. He would take
us out to a nice dinner. And when he would
come in town, there was a couple of us younger managers,
(15:24):
and you know, we were all kind of in awe
of him. And he'd always step away from the table
for about ten minutes and he'd come back and I
was saying good night to my kids. I didn't have
kids yet, learned that one too about doing that same thing.
I had the pleasure of in a previous job of
working with his daughter, and I was introduced to her
and I went up and I said, you need to
(15:45):
know this about your father, and she started bawling. I said,
your dad. And we were talking and Catherine, if you
somehow listened to this podcast, make sure you tell your
dad I was talking about him. But so and I said,
and when my son Peyton was born, the gift he said,
my wife, it was a silver rat on. She was
(16:05):
let me stop you right there. That was my mom.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
That was not my Yeah, adorable, but.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
It was one of those moments I really cherished in
my career, getting to tell her what I learned from
her father and what he meant to me. In my career.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Beautiful story. Thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I try this. Do you want to continue to interview me?
Because this is really no wait, this is about you.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Let's do that. That's reverse roles.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
No, we're not going to reverse that. Chris. Long more
about Chris. You need to know. No one cares. So
how long were you with your dad?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
I was with him for Yeah, I was with him
for a couple of years. We did hit an inflection point,
like you suggested, where I was ready to spread my wings,
and he was a pretty controlling guy, and he had
very specific thoughts. It had a lot of success, and
(16:56):
he had specific thoughts about what I should be doing,
how I should be doing it, and how my career
was going to progress. And you know, nobody can hold
baby back. So I needed to get away.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Okay, So tell me about that was what was the
moment and how did you tell him it?
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Was?
Speaker 1 (17:13):
There a big moment.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Oh, there was a really big moment. I can't believe
you asked me that, and I'm actually going to answer you.
We were standing in the den at the house and
I was with my then future husband, who, by the way,
we were engaged like six weeks after we met, so
he was always around for most of my adult life.
So we were standing there and I said, hey, I'm
going to move to New York with my future husband
(17:37):
and I'm going to go work. It was the largest
consulting firm's price waterhouse. I got myself a job, which
at the time it was the premiere place for sure
to work, and it was in this really cool new
department they created for real estate technology innovation. So he
should have been super happy, excited for me or whatever,
(17:58):
and instead completely lost it threatened, disown me all the things,
no controlling, beyond belief, you know. And I said, listen,
I'm never taking another penny from you again. You don't
have to worry about it.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Ouch.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I'm on my own. I love you. I'm going to
be your daughter. That's what I want to be. I
want to be your daughter from now on.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
Okay, no joke. I do have chills like that had
I mean in nulcations. That had to be hard.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
It was. It was a defining moment.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
Because that was your only legit, that was your work experience.
That you're basically saying, yeah, we're not a thing anymore.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Right, and you don't get to control me the rest
of my life, and I've chosen this guy to be
my future, not my dad.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Was he with you at the house when that happened.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Oh, he was standing right next to me. Oh good,
he's always standing next to me. Good for him, but that,
Oh no, don't feel bad. It was such a good
moment for everybody. And you know what, my dad and
I had a beautiful relationship the rest of our life.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Of course, kind of that midway point where like we
don't know which way this is going to go, gotten
to that.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Part of Okay, Well, sorry, I went all the way
to the end. No, no, that's no, that's a spoiler.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
No, no, spoiler. So you go to New York.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
I went to New York. My husband grew up in Manhattan,
so you know, easy decision. He knew his way around.
Did not like New York? You didn't at the time.
Now I look back and I think, oh gosh, how
fun to be in New York in your twenties. Right,
every every kid wants to.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Had you sold? Had you had you sold the company?
Speaker 2 (19:29):
I sold? I sold the software to what is right
now one of the country's most respected housing providers. I'm
not going to use any names, but and you know,
we made our money back and I felt really good
about that.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Did you make any I don't want that much, but like,
did you come out of head?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I think my dad felt like I should be grateful
for having a salary at the time, so it's okay, that's.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
He gave me an opportunity and that led to a
job at Price Waterhouse, which it was unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Yeah, you could not have gotten that. I like, that
doesn't happen.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
It doesn't happen.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
And it's amazing that you think about it that way,
because I think we've all met people in this lifetime
who are like, oh, you know, I did it, Like,
oh no, you really didn't. Like you had some help,
but you recognize that. I think in the right perspective
from our conversation is like, look, I had some assistants.
We all have assistance, you know, but you also had
to take that and not screw it up, take it
(20:31):
for granted.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
All of those Oh my gosh, you're gonna do the
whole positive reinforcement thing. Listen, I'm a very grateful person
and you're being so sweet. That is so nice. I
hate compliments. I'm warning you right now.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, I don't like your sweater, then you know you did?
I do? It's really a nice swetter. Okay, so you're
in New York. Forget about the sweater. So you're in
New York. How long were you there at Price?
Speaker 2 (20:54):
I was at Price for two years and then I
was wooed away by KPMG, who decided to start their
own real estate technology innovation group. So I got to
move over for a promotion and my career grew much
faster after.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Real Estate's a little bit foreign to me, like, was
this a burgeoning category at the time, So you were
cutting edge, front and center.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Oh my gosh, yeah, I mean the real estate market.
Real estate was not investing in technology in the so
it was very in the mid nineties. It was super
old school, and it was it was frowned upon. It
was like, wait, you know, why am I having to
spend a peney on this stuff? And the really innovative
(21:38):
firms said, no, we need to actually invest in this
and do something with it. And I got to work
on the coolest projects with lots of different kinds of companies, public, private, institutional, developers,
you name it. And I was around with those companies
(21:59):
when the Internet became a thing. So talk about a
defining moment, right for sure. People ask me about AI today.
We've done this before. It's called the advent of the Internet.
It changed everything. And I got to work with some
of the coolest new startups like real Page, also Dallas
based company and do transformative things.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And you're still not even thirty yet.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Oh well, now I am. But at the time, well,
I mean, look, look now, you know it's crazy. I
think back sometimes and I think about the rooms I
was in and the people that were listening to me,
and it's so shocking and humbling, and I was great.
I'm a grateful person and I but wow, I mean,
(22:51):
the opportunities that I had were pretty incredible.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And again I think that what's thinking about your college
experience and then what you've got to do. I mean,
it is funny when you get to a certain point
in your career and if you're really honest with yourself
and look back, you're like, oh my god, what were
they thinking letting me do this? And you know, I
mean clearly you had the aptitude. I mean I look
back and there was one point I was twenty seven
(23:16):
years old and I had twenty four salespeople that rolled
up to me, and I was like, Okay, why would
anyone even do that? But it's just kind of what happened,
and you either make it or you don't, and you
move on down the road. So you move on from Price.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
I moved on from Price. I went to KPMG. And
then you know, you hit a moment if you're a
woman like me, where you're traveling five days a week
and you're in your thirties and you think, am I
gonna have kids? And if I do want kids? Can
I do this at the same time? So heads up
(23:51):
another spoiler alert. I'm I'm not a feminist, okay, so
some of the things I'm going to say right now,
don't judge. Don't judge, no judging. It's very, very, very
difficult to balance it all, of course, and it's hard
to be fighting to make partner at KPMG at the
(24:13):
same time as getting pregnant, having a family, and then
being there for your family. And I couldn't see a
way to do that, so I went to work for
my favorite client. So one of the things that's great
about consulting, we always get offered a job, right because
they're paying a fortune and an hour for you.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
And is that what brought you back to Dallas?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Yeah? Well, so JPI Partners, another day Dallas based company
that is highly admired and another company that so happy
is in my past, offered me a position helping them
transform themselves internally using technology. So they said, hey, just
come in here help us. They were growing so fast,
they had so much capital, they were building so many
(24:57):
apartment communities, and they just got in a fish because
of it. Right, you get over your skis when you're
growing that fast.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
That's one of the sayings that drives me nuts. Is
the whole building the plane while we fly. It makes it.
I get it, but like not really something to brag
about long term. Maybe short term, maybe you fix it,
maybe you land and build the plane.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
But well, to their credit, they saw a need. Yeah,
and they brought me in, you know, and said, hey,
we're going to invest in this initiative, and we want
you to spearhat it and go from kind of one
department to the next and help transform our business and
make it so that we can scale as much as possible,
as fast as possible. I had the best time doing that,
(25:36):
and very family friendly company had my two boys, and
I was able to spend time with them the way
that I felt like I needed to. So it was
just right, just right.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's awesome. How old do they know?
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Twenty and twenty one?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Oh, they're in college? Where theyre in school?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I've got a Hoosier okay, national champion, just finished freshman year,
and you're studying business. And then I've got one at
NYU who's junior, who's a computer science genius. He's going
to be mad if he hears me, Sae, but he
kind of is MO.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I'm talking about him on a podcast. Sorry, mom, stop
being weird.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Sorry not sorry.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
So okay, how long so you can? So you consulted
as they were growing up and.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
All that, and then and then so early on when
I was at KPMG, I think I mentioned did internet
startup work? Real Page was one of those companies. The
CEO calls me while I'm at JPI, says I needed
to come back. We're growing fast and need somebody like
you on the team. So he talks me into it.
(26:39):
I kind of got lucky. It was in two thousand
and seven, so leaving a real estate developer to go
work in emerging booming tech in two thousand and seven
was the most fortunate thing that I could do. Sure,
so I got to help build that company, Real Page,
(27:00):
into something special, take it public, ended up running about
half the business. I like to think all the cool,
fun stuff that they had in their in their bevy
of products and services was the stuff I got to oversee.
And and then I did it again. I had another
existential crisis moment where I was like, I'm not a
(27:23):
good mom, and so I spent my career trying to
get to a certain point, you know, be my best me,
achieve my greatest potential. Came pretty darn close to being
positioned to be the next leader of Real Page. And
then I had a dream that I wasn't going to
get in the pearly gates because I was a terrible mom,
(27:46):
And I had to go into the CEO's office and say,
I need to work myself out of this company. I
want to be home with my kids.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
That had to be a hard realization, But kudos to you.
I mean, I mean, but he's got to choose their path.
And you know, but I would imagine it's hard. You
were pretty lofty level. You'd worked earned it, But I
mean personal feeling is you know, there's no greater gift
you can give your kids than be in there.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
I could not agree more. I have zero regrets. Even
though the company sold for ten billion dollars a few
years later, I got to still help on the sidelines.
I did consulting work with Real Page, and I did
advisory work for my friends in the industry. I invested
in a lot of cool tech companies, and I spent
a ton of time with my kids and I was there,
(28:35):
I was present, I was involved, and I have zero regrets.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
So let's pause here for a second, because you were
on you know, fast one way train down the track
doing lots of really cool and interesting stuff. What kind
of size of teams did you lead, you know, in
terms of just leadership of teams and all of that management.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Yeah. I mean when I started at Real Page, I
think I had twenty people working for me. By the
time I left, I had hundreds. And they weren't just
us base. I mean I had a team in Manila,
I had a team in India.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
And that was before teams and zoom and it was
all that. It was.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
It was a lot of travel. It led to a
lot more.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Travel when you think about that, you know, as leaders,
you know, I talk, you know, I've been fortunate enough
to lead teams for almost thirty years, and yeah, I
had a great mentor mind that says, you know, there
are bosses and then there are leaders, and there's a
massive difference, and you got to choose which you want
to be. And I try and always remember that. I
(29:40):
try and talk to you know, younger leaders about that,
because everyone thinks they're a leader, but like, okay, what
do you do to prove that out? What are some
things that you took very personally as a leader that
you tried to show your people, be there for people,
whatever it was. What do you feel most proud about
that you think that you were best at.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Well, I'm a people first person.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
I can see that.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
And you know, when you're in the business of serving
a customer, you have to put your customers first. That's
where it all starts, because if you're you know, in
a for profit business, if your customers aren't happy, forget it.
So I always led with the customer comes first. Let's
do anything and everything we need to do to make
(30:27):
sure we're serving our customers to the best of our
ability and make good on the things we say we're
going to do right.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
I talk a lot with our teams. I think it's
really easy, especially you know, leading a sales organization and
there's always pressures and things like that, and you know,
of course there are moments in time where the short
game is important, but you have to always keep the
long game in mind. There are times you have to
say no or take a step back or whatever those
things are. And I believe that's how you really develop
(30:56):
real partnerships. I think that you know the dynamic of
there's certain dynamics and client relationships, in relationship to their
clients or your people that never change. I mean people.
The dynamic between people doesn't change. But I think that
that our society has changed, and that you know, the
technology and it makes it easy to hide behind emails.
And I've had conversations about this and it's funny. I
(31:18):
mean a founder, I was speaking to the days like,
you know, two emails as max before we start having
a conversation, and I think it's just important, at least
for me. I think about those things and how do
you maintain that over time? How have you managed that?
Just like going through COVID. I mean, I remember there
was a time where we were all at home, you know.
(31:39):
Being here in Texas, it was a little bit easier
because we opened up sooner. But like I was in
a large national company where there are people in New
York and they're never going in, Like, how do you
manage that? Now?
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yeah, it's interesting. So with COVID specifically, if you're asking
about that, that was tough because the businesses that I
was supporting and serving at the time, they all provide
I was saying. And the people that work at those properties,
they didn't get to not go to work. They were
they were required to be there every day taking care
of people in their homes, and so they had the
(32:13):
toughest job of all. Right, it's kind of I think
think about that. The housing providers, the nurses that you know,
those they didn't have a choice exposing themselves every day. Right.
So I had one very large client, one of the
largest providers of housing in the country, asked me to
be the chairperson of their COVID task team, and that
(32:35):
was that was an interesting.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Role, sure, because you had how many different points of
view on COVID.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, So but I digress. I think your Your real
question is, you know, how do you stay connected to people,
especially since COVID and since.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
You know, even generationally, I mean.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Absolutely, I think I initially I was one of those
people that resist did media, like the whole being on camera,
and I grew up, you know, having meetings in person
and using phone calls, and it's really it's something that
I've had to become accustomed to and get really comfortable with,
(33:16):
is being on camera and integrating with people, because that
is how this next generation especially wants to communicate. When
my son calls me from college, he wants to FaceTime me,
even if he's sitting on his computer working half the
time and we're quiet and I'm working and he's like
hey mom, and we'll start. He wants to be with
(33:37):
me on FaceTime. And so it's just kind of part
of how we integrate now remotely.
Speaker 1 (33:44):
Yeah, you know, it is funny, I know that like
talking to young salespeople in media and radio in the nineties,
like the legit I remember doing fels at lunch on
the back of a napkin like that, that's not a
made up thing, and I'll mention that, and like older
(34:06):
people on staff will kind of chuckle, and the kids
will look at me like, that's that didn't happen. I'm like, yeah,
oh yeah it did.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
There was a scotch next to your house too.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Absolutely there was, and and so you and and candidly
like I know that it's okay, so, but but I
know that, Like I in the last week, I've had
conversations like, look, I know that this client is comfortable
just doing a team's call. You're both in Dallas. Go
meet for coffee. Get to know this person outside of
(34:37):
this one dimensional you know you're on video. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
The relationships that I have in our industry go back
decades for sure, and it started with in person meetings
and conversations. And I make sure to continue to have those. Yeah,
I'm still on the airplane all the time. You just
it's it's a very relational business that I'm in, especially
and so even though I'm like I run a remote company. Yep,
(35:01):
we operate on you know, remote technology. I like to
get in front of people. I like my team to
get together frequently enough. Ye, because sparks fly when you're
all in the same room.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Absolutely. Yeah, It's funny because there are times where you're like, Okay,
I need to go see this client. And there's a
little bit of the creep of yeah, I could just
do it via No, I need to go see them,
because you know as well as I do. It's not
the thing you're going to talk about that's going to
be the big thing. It's gonna be the thing the
(35:31):
other you know, seed that comes out of Oh, but
did you realize I need help with this problem? And
like to your point, you know, you have relationships that
go way back, so you're going to get Yeah, Janine,
more good on this. But what could you how could
you help me here?
Speaker 2 (35:47):
But they might not they might not want to talk
about all those things on video.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
I had I had. It was funny. I had one
of these a few weeks ago and it was just
meeting a client out for a b and it was
on a Friday, and he'd just got you know, we say,
you never know what meeting somebody just came out of
and he was like, I've got this problem. And by
the next Wednesday we had a significant deal put together.
And I just chuckled, and I talked to some of
our younger sellers. I said, this isn't about me. Oh,
(36:14):
look at Chris, did this but if you go and
do this, you don't know what you're going to find out.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
But I think it's even more than that. I think
it's just having a human connection with me all and
you know, because I'll go and meet with a customer
or a prospective customer, and we'll connect on something that
we never would have talked about video because we're having
dinner together and we find out that we both have hoosiers,
(36:40):
or you know, we find out that our dads were
both in real estate, or who knows.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
No, you're right because I think on you know, teams
or whatever. There's an agenda. Oh, we got through all
six items on the agenda. Great, Jenene, Great talking to you. Done.
You know, it's just different. I think we're aligned as
far as that goes, because I just I don't think
there's no replacement for that. We can talk about AI,
(37:06):
we can talk all these things that are great and
they're the future, but there's still the one constant, and
it's the human dynamic that doesn't.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Never gonna go away. That's why I'm not afraid of AI. Yeah,
people who talk about you know, AI taking over, it's
never going to take over because humans need human contact. Oh, absolutely,
it's just gonna help make us better.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
I think everyone's going to feel better after that, right there,
I hope. So you're scared of AI talked to Genie.
Please do give her a call. I'll give her number
at the end of the podcast. So talk about lease
luck right now? What's you know, what's big today? And
what's what's the thing in three years? You think?
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Yeah, so LEAs luck that the fundamental solution that lease
Luck provides is a deposit replacement. And deposits have really
failed modern American renters and housing providers. Originally they were
created back in Roman times, you know, wow, as a
form of collateral and it makes total sense.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
I love history. Or you can take us through deposits
from the Roman era to now, Amanda, how much time
do we have? Not that far? And then in the
Middle Ages it took four chickens and a pig.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
I have to pause on the Enlightenment periods since to me,
now I'm.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Obsessed with Now she's getting your book out of her bag,
She's going to be a reading.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Oh my gosh. So essentially, in the modern digital era,
deposits have gotten to the point where they're an affordability
problem for American renters. We have a situation where most
Americans have less than two thousand dollars for savings in
their accounts and the cost to move is more than that. Correct,
(38:52):
that's the deposit including the deposit, right, It's very problematic
and the system is so broken that if you think
about it, if I'm living in an apartment I need
and I want to move to a different apartment, I
need my deposit back, but I'm not going to get
it back before I have to sign a new lease,
reserve it with some upfront costs, and then move in
(39:15):
and start paying rent. I still won't have seen my
deposit back and I've had to pay another deposit. So
how much more difficult are we going to make it
for American reveners to get access to quality housing? Yep, okay,
So that's the fundamental issue, and that's why the product
was designed and created. But it also doesn't work for
housing providers because it's highly regulated on an increasing basis,
(39:37):
and the administrative burden associated with it. It has become so
costly that it's difficult to even manage deposits. And then lastly,
they don't cost they don't cover the cost of financial
loss for a property owner, So you can't collect enough
from a runner move in to cover the cost of
(39:58):
the financial loss at move out. So it's not working
for anybody in the housing ecosystem. So we've replaced it
with a beautiful insurance program that does everything that it
needs to do to be a win win win for
all the constituents.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
So if I'm a property owner and I come to you,
I do business with lease Locke, what does that do
for the end consumer?
Speaker 2 (40:28):
What it does is I give you the opportunity to
not charge a deposit at all, so you at all. Instead,
you're going to charge a small, non refundable monthly fee
which is far less than the cost of a deposit
to the renter. And you'll get more prospects, you'll close
more releases faster, and because it's a commercial insurance program,
(40:51):
you'll be able to file claims if there's a loss
a move out and we'll restore that lost income within days.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
So penetration of what's your penetration, Well, we.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Have we've we've we've ensured millions of apartment homes and
that's kind of small.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Yeah, the only reason I'm asking I'm thinking about, you know,
all of my three kids have graduated college in the
last five years, and I'm trying to sit there and think, like,
I think we paid deposits. I don't. I'm not remember that.
I'm like racking my brain trying to remember on that
and so, but it is interesting because I think back
thirty five years ago or when I was leaving college, like,
(41:32):
You're like, I'm not getting my deposit back no matter
how hard I clean.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Well, that's the other that's the other bad part is
that there's an inherent mistrust in the system. Oh yeah,
because deposits do go mostly unrefunded. And the sad thing
is it's not because landlords don't want to pay them back.
They do. But do you have a forwarding address when
you leave? Did you give it to them? Did you
change your mind? Did you call the apartment community and say, oh, no,
(41:54):
I'm not living there, I'm actually living here. They get
lost in the system.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
So there's literally billions of dollars sitting in the system
that aren't helping the renter or the landlord. Think about it,
I am thinking it's sad.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
It is now. I never really thought about the forwarding
address and all of those things and it really was.
I mean I remember leaving college you out and never
get this back, you know, as you're scrubbing the kitchen
floor or whatever, trying to get some stain out from
some stupid party you had. So what's next?
Speaker 2 (42:30):
What's next is that, Well, there's an entire country of
apartments that can be ensured by Leaselock and if you
haven't used the program yet, call me. But uh, thank you,
but we're expanding into Canada. We've been asked by clients
to move into the UK and there are other types
(42:52):
of deposits for similar real estate classes that we can
expand into as well.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
You do you all work with like airbnbs.
Speaker 2 (42:58):
And all that we do work with rental homes that
are provided in through a platform like do.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
You notice as of trying to like come up with
something new?
Speaker 2 (43:07):
Thank you? Would you like to be then advisor?
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Geny? Call me anytime the direct line you need come on. Okay, Genie,
last question, And I think we've covered this a little bit,
but I do like to ask you know, we talk
a lot with teams, and I'm sure you speak in
company meetings and you know there are those moments that
are big wins, whether it's a big contract you sign
(43:31):
or some big moment you know, new technology or something
like that, you know, the seismic moment. But the reality
is so much success is built on, you know, doing
the little things. I call it the cracks and grace spaces,
Like where do you win in the cracks and grace bases?
And I'm a big culture believer, and you know how
you treat people and how you do business And you
(43:51):
talked a little bit about that. When you think about
cracks and grace spaces. For Lease Locke, what do you
like to think about? Like, this is what we own
in the every day, in the every moment.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
Yeah, so we always do the right thing. It's pretty simple.
We always do the right thing. We are renter first company,
so rent our best interests are the most important thing
to us. And when we always do the right thing
for our clients and we keep ultimately the American renter
at the forefront of our minds. I don't know, everything
(44:21):
seems to work out well. Culturally speaking, I would say
that there are several things that I establish when I
joined the company, and it's, you know, our mantra for
kind of how we behave, how we treat each other.
We are a company of really talented, capable people that
(44:45):
have humility. Part of the reason we all love each
other and get along and feel like we're part of
a family is because we all share that feeling. There's
no arrogance tolerated. We're not ever condescending. We don't need
to talk about what we're good at with each other.
We know we're good and we're grateful for the jobs
that we have and the opportunity to work with each other.
(45:06):
So that's kind of the first most important thing to me.
The second is flexibility. You have a job, you have
a job description. If you can help somebody and you
see they need help, jump in and help.
Speaker 1 (45:17):
Yeah. I'm not a big fan of not my job, not.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
A fan either. So and what that means is that
people at least lock get to grow professionally because you're
not limited. You want to get involved and help somebody,
offer to help. Oh, you just did that. Would you
like more responsibility? Would you like to grow in your career?
And so that's kind of the second part of it
is that that flexibility. And then the third is just
(45:41):
I have zero tolerance for hot potato behavior. If you
have a problem and you're the one that identified it
and it's in your lap. You own it. Don't throw
it over the fence for somebody else, and come with
a solution, right, come up with a solution.
Speaker 1 (45:56):
So it's really not that hard. I mean it is
like when you think about the fundamentals, well.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Guess what everybody wants to help. Just don't throw it
over the fence, own it and then ask for help
and everybody will jump into hepnin.
Speaker 1 (46:10):
This was a lot of fun. It was do you
feel prepared for later this week? I mean, you could
be on TV.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
I'm kind of just sad in general that this is over.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
I know, I am round two. Can we do it totally?
Season two?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
I have so many good stories, I know.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
I think, Amanda, what do you think? I think, go ahead?
Season two done too. I think we can make this
a seasonal thing and we'll pick topics. Maybe we'll talk about.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
Concerts, maybe we'll talk about the career that I didn't
choose that I still want to have that teezer. I'm sorry,
I can't tell you. Oh my gosh, season two, you'll
have to have me back.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
All right. This was a lot of fun, Janine, Thank
you It is great getting to talk to you, love
your story, and uh, we're going to have you back.
I'm I'm making an executive decision. Mean thank you.
This is CEOs you should know with Dallas market president
of iHeartMedia Chris Long. Welcome everybody to another episode of
CEOs you should know. I'm Chris Long, Dallas market president
for iHeartMedia, and I am really excited to introduce everyone
to my new friend, Janine Steiner Yovanovich, CEO of Leaslock. Janine,
(00:26):
how are you doing.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
I'm great, thrilled to be here. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Absolutely we were. I was getting ahead of myself when
we met here a few minutes ago, so I'm trying
to rewind a little bit and get back into podcast mode.
But we'll get into things here real quick. So Janine,
as I mentioned to you that we feel it's important
to understand who you are a little bit musically. So
(00:51):
you know, with iHeartMedia being the country's largest audio platform
with eight hundred and sixty radio stations across one hundred
and sixty more markets, reaching podcast, you know, utilizing podcast
and streaming anything audio you can imagine, we feel it's
important we understand you a little bit better musically. So
we're gonna rapid fire a few questions at you. Don't
(01:13):
think about it, just give us the answers and we
will judge you accordingly. Artist poster that was on your
bedroom wall as you were growing up, Duran Duran, Okay,
like Wolf, all right, I'm good with that band T
shirt you owned. We're desperately wanted Daph Leppard. We're on
a heater here. I'm gonna keep going. Teenage music crush,
(01:36):
Joe Elliott, Prince France, Okay, I'm gonna keep going.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Last concert, The last concert I went to was, Oh boy,
it's been a while. Gypsy Kings.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Okay, first concert, Bruce Springsteen. We haven't had that, have we, Amanda?
Speaker 2 (01:55):
I don't think we have.
Speaker 1 (01:56):
No, We've had some interesting ones. We've had Johnny Cash,
Pink Floyd, Backstreet Boys, as everybody knows if they listen.
Mine was men at Work, which sucks Houston. It's a
true story. Jeanie's trying not to laugh into the mic.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Can it be no?
Speaker 1 (02:14):
I know that you might, right, You know, you tell
your kids that you know they have a fundamental like
if you said Prince or Boston or some of these
ones that all of our guests had that I didn't have, Like,
oh yeah, I've heard of that, and they're like, what
are you talking about? And then you show me YouTube
and they're like, oh god, anyway, so Janine, welcome. I
(02:37):
know I have a lot to live up too, because
apparently you're being interviewed on a large cable network following
this this week.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Oh my gosh, No, this is the most important thing
I'm doing this week. For sure.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
I thought you said earlier the most important thing you're
doing this afternoon between one and three.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
No, not at all.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
Plus, I've decided I adore you and that we should
be friends.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Now we are totally friends. We are totally friends, especially
with the whole Prince def Leppard.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Bruce Springsteen, Max.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
I mean, I'm not a Springsteen person.
Speaker 2 (03:10):
I'm sorry, but you have to be. I insist.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
Now I'm going to bed.
Speaker 2 (03:13):
Now I'm going to force you to listen to all
sorts of music that you didn't want to all right.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Okay, fair enough, fair enough, okay. So what we like
to do on the podcast talk a little bit about
how you got to where you are today a CEO.
In doing a little bit of research, it looks like
you have a really unique back. I mean, everybody has
a unique background, but yours is you. You've done both really,
You've been a founder and you've ascended through the corporate ranks,
(03:41):
so to speak, to be a CEO. So I think
this is going to be a lot of fun because
one of the things we find with founders they have
aha moments. And we've had some super super random ones. Uh,
doctor Harrison on the Mission trip pulling a tooth when
he was nineteen, and Shannon from Farmhouse Fresh sending Oprah
some of the lotion she'd created and getting a response.
(04:04):
So it's it's an interesting dynamic. So talk a little
bit about college. You grew up in Canada, correct, I.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Grew up in Toronto. Oh yes, I'm still a Maple
Leafs fan. And they just got the number one draft pick.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
That's something to get excited about. I'm hope. Hope is
a big important thing.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
So there's always next year. That's what we That's what
we say in Toronto.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
I know, I know, Okay, So talk a little bit
about college and what you were thinking when you went
to school, graduate degree and all of that.
Speaker 2 (04:35):
Yeah, So I grew up wanting to be a professor
really of literature. So I have a master's degree in
compared toive literature, fluent in French and German, and I
was obsessed with the Enlightenment period, and my mission in
life at that time was to transform young minds and
enlighten young minds kind of the way that I had
(04:56):
been by teachers that I admired. And and then over
time I realized that academia is not exactly all about
just that what and I'll leave it at that. And
once you kind of realize that, you know, you start
opening your mind to other possibilities. And my dad was
a big real estate investor. Growing up in Toronto, he
(05:19):
started investing in Texas with his you know, Canadian buddies
and spending more and more time here, and so we
started spending the school years here when I was young.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Oh really, yep.
Speaker 2 (05:31):
So I grew up, you know, all my formative years
really in Dallas and so, and my dad was the
kind of guy that wouldn't let me sit home idle. Ever,
So if he was if I was available, if I
had a day off school or a vacation and I
(05:51):
wasn't doing anything, I was going to his office with him.
So I grew up going to you know, zoning meetings
at city Hall and architect discussions around what to do
with land that he was buying, touring, retail and apartment
buildings and all sorts of things. There was really no
(06:12):
type of real estate he didn't do and wasn't involved in.
So I learned a lot from him growing up. And
I learned also a very solid work ethic, and my
goal in life was to grow up and be just
like him. But I also had this passion for literature,
and so when I pivoted, it was pretty easy. I
(06:33):
talked to my dad and he's like, you know, I
had a great idea. I want to build some software
and I want you to help me with it. And
that's how I launched into being a founder.
Speaker 1 (06:43):
So it's interesting you went to work with your father
and saw what he did. You know, I had something similar.
My grandfather was a bail bondsman, so I used to
remember being woken up at midnight when I visit my
grandparents and go down to the jail and bail out drunks.
I don't know how that helped me in my career,
but uh, certainly interesting and a great story.
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Wow, yeah that coming in no actually, but I love it. Yeah,
because you know, for me, it's the same thing, you know,
hands on experience. The reason I fell in love with
housing and rental housing specifically, is because my dad owned
apartment buildings, and so a lot of the work I
did was leasing apartments and helping manage these buildings.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I will tell you candidly, when I was doing my
research and you probably saw me snooping on your LinkedIn
the other day, I was trying to figure out like
filling in the gaps, and especially when you said I
didn't realize the whole comparative literature thing. So yeah, those
track not at all together. And the software piece. So
(07:43):
when you were in college, like, tell me how the
I mean the whole software part came into play. I mean,
were you taking there.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
I took a computer class, but I mean we were,
I mean as four hundreds. You know, if anybody tells
I'm from the typing class, see anybody remember that stuff?
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Yes, you know?
Speaker 2 (08:03):
So no, I wasn't. That wasn't my jam, and you
weren't in it, or I was not into it until
my dad said, hey, I need some help. I want
to build a software program to manage my apartment communities.
I need good information. And all of these apartment communities
were being managed in doss based software, and so we
did we used at the time. It was very innovative technology.
(08:25):
Hired some engineers and built one ended up being the
first commercially available asset management system for multifamily and that
was kind of fun. And my dad's like, this is cool.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
We should show up your guinea pig.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Yeah, he was my guinea pig.
Speaker 1 (08:40):
Like, what a great like safe way to learn.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
One hundred percent plus he provided all the funding is
even better.
Speaker 1 (08:48):
Well, yeah, there's that that helps.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
But he's like, you know, I like to make my
money back, so we should go talk to some of
my friends and see who might be interested in buying
this interesting And somebody said.
Speaker 1 (08:58):
Yes, okay, so how where were you out of college
at this point.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
Let's see twenty three, twenty two years old?
Speaker 1 (09:06):
Okay, wait, I got to rewind for a second. So
you do the comparative literature degree. So end of your
college experience you were realizing maybe this isn't what I
want to do.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Is that I realized that I had a desire to
let me, let me try to say this without it
sounding bad. I'm a capitalist at heart.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I was just gonna say make money.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Really, yeah, I'm with you, you know, And so you
just wake up one day. The combination of that and
the fact that academia is not just about inspiring on
minds and it has its own system that does I
learned about more and more over time, and it became
less interesting to me as a result. So it was
kind of a combo those two things.
Speaker 1 (09:49):
Yeah, it's not as pure as you thought it was
going to be. And you're like, Okay, if I'm going
to do anything, if I'm a capitalist, I might as
well be compensated for it.
Speaker 2 (09:56):
Thank you for translating.
Speaker 1 (09:57):
Of course, I try to do that, well said. So
you graduated and you decided I want to do this management.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
My dad's like, hey, you need to put food on
your table. I've got a project, so you can do
this for me. And it was fun and exciting and innovative,
and I was fired up, and so I said sure,
instead of going and doing what I used to do,
which is maybe I'll try to see if I can
get a really good job waitressing again or whatever else,
(10:27):
I thought, you know, I'll try this, and it turned
out that it was the beginning of something special.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
So what was that window? How long was that period
of time?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
So let's see, graduated a little young from college, did
grad school in a year, so I was probably twenty
two when I started working with him on the project.
Speaker 1 (10:45):
And you went to him with the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:47):
No, I wish I was that brilliant.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
I know the idea.
Speaker 2 (10:52):
It was his idea, but you know I executed.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
And you took the sea and you grew it.
Speaker 2 (11:00):
That's right, that's right. And you know, one of the
things I will say about myself, I work with a
lot of cool founders. I've seen people transform the world. Yeah,
I typically don't come up with the initial idea, and
I'm okay with that because a lot of brilliant people
that come up with ideas can't execute, and that's where
I come in.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
It's interesting because I've worked in companies with the founder
was still there. I wasn't there in the beginning. Founders
still there, and there's very much a founding culture and
a thought and it's very there's a very emotional tie
that's over emotional tie to the product, which is great
and nurtures it and takes a product to a point,
but at a certain point you do need someone who
(11:42):
can take that and really turn it into the bigger
thing it's supposed to be.
Speaker 2 (11:45):
And if you're smart, and you co found with somebody
at the beginning, then you get to stick around the
two of you and continue to scale it over time
and evolve together. Yep, that makes sense.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Yeah, so it sounds like you had a really good partner.
Speaker 2 (11:58):
Yeah my dad.
Speaker 1 (11:59):
Yeah, I mean, come on, so, how so talk about
that partnership. I mean, was it It sounds like you
guys were close. Yeah, how was it that the business side?
I mean, you know they talk about working with family,
can be can run the gamut.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
Yeah, it's tough. It's tough, I will say. He he,
he was hard to live up to. Yeah, you know,
brilliant guy, very successful, you know, a little bit of
a renaissance man. And but you know, I'm a humble
enough person and a grateful enough person. So I loved
(12:37):
taking what I needed to and what I should from
that relationship and could tolerate some of the challenges. And
I think that's also something during my whole career that
has worked well for me, is that I can find
something incredibly wonderful about almost anybody that I can take
from them that's a gift and learn from for sure.
Speaker 1 (12:58):
You know, it's it's funny. I'll talk to so of
the the younger members of our team. And you know,
the whole thing today, you know, over the last few
years is in office not in office. All of those things.
Everybody's got an opinion. I think some of it's generational
where you fit and that you know, and that whole
your feelings on that subject. But I talked to him
about just being present and watching how people do business,
(13:22):
how they speak to one another, and and you know,
I'm sure you have examples. You know. I remember the
first time I was in a sales pit and woman
that I sold sat next to that I sold with,
probably the greatest salesperson ever worked with. Could never do
it the way she did it, would never want to.
(13:42):
But I remember thinking, Okay, I understand why she does that,
and I want to. I want to take that piece.
And you're right. When you start to realize everybody has
something to offer, that's when you develop really the you know,
the full skill set, I believe. But you have to
be present, you have to be paying attention.
Speaker 2 (13:57):
Well, I'm fascinated by human beings. I mean, this life
is such a gift and I want to find that unique, special,
awesome quality in everybody I interact with. Unfortunately not everybody
has one.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
I will say this. I mean, you also learn what
you don't want to be.
Speaker 2 (14:14):
That's one hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (14:17):
Yeah, you know, I leave names out of it, but
like there there are people that I worked underneath a
few layers that I was just like, oh my gosh,
they're horrible, and if I'm ever in those shoes, you know,
I will make sure that I don't do that. And
you know, conversely, I had one of those moments. There
was a gentleman that was a you know, at my level,
(14:40):
maybe even higher when I was really young, a gentleman
named Don Belucas and kind of gruff, been around, smart,
taught me things, you know, taught me the things like
I was presenting to him one time and he's like,
christo'mastafi right now you've used the word I, me and
my constantly in your.
Speaker 2 (14:59):
Present tape, shake pet peeve on those and.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
He said, are you the only one around here doing anything?
I was. I was twenty seven, I was a manager,
and I talk about something that is I've tried to
stick with, like in my mind when I write things,
it's not always about me all of that, And so
I had the pleasure and so like one of the
things I learned, then I'll shut up. He would take
us out to a nice dinner. And when he would
come in town, there was a couple of us younger managers,
(15:24):
and you know, we were all kind of in awe
of him. And he'd always step away from the table
for about ten minutes and he'd come back and I
was saying good night to my kids. I didn't have
kids yet, learned that one too about doing that same thing.
I had the pleasure of in a previous job of
working with his daughter, and I was introduced to her
and I went up and I said, you need to
(15:45):
know this about your father, and she started bawling. I said,
your dad. And we were talking and Catherine, if you
somehow listened to this podcast, make sure you tell your
dad I was talking about him. But so and I said,
and when my son Peyton was born, the gift he said,
my wife, it was a silver rat on. She was
(16:05):
let me stop you right there. That was my mom.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
That was not my Yeah, adorable, but.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
It was one of those moments I really cherished in
my career, getting to tell her what I learned from
her father and what he meant to me. In my career.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Beautiful story. Thank you for sharing that.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
I try this. Do you want to continue to interview me?
Because this is really no wait, this is about you.
Speaker 2 (16:23):
Let's do that. That's reverse roles.
Speaker 1 (16:25):
No, we're not going to reverse that. Chris. Long more
about Chris. You need to know. No one cares. So
how long were you with your dad?
Speaker 2 (16:34):
I was with him for Yeah, I was with him
for a couple of years. We did hit an inflection point,
like you suggested, where I was ready to spread my wings,
and he was a pretty controlling guy, and he had
very specific thoughts. It had a lot of success, and
(16:56):
he had specific thoughts about what I should be doing,
how I should be doing it, and how my career
was going to progress. And you know, nobody can hold
baby back. So I needed to get away.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Okay, So tell me about that was what was the
moment and how did you tell him it?
Speaker 2 (17:13):
Was?
Speaker 1 (17:13):
There a big moment.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
Oh, there was a really big moment. I can't believe
you asked me that, and I'm actually going to answer you.
We were standing in the den at the house and
I was with my then future husband, who, by the way,
we were engaged like six weeks after we met, so
he was always around for most of my adult life.
So we were standing there and I said, hey, I'm
going to move to New York with my future husband
(17:37):
and I'm going to go work. It was the largest
consulting firm's price waterhouse. I got myself a job, which
at the time it was the premiere place for sure
to work, and it was in this really cool new
department they created for real estate technology innovation. So he
should have been super happy, excited for me or whatever,
(17:58):
and instead completely lost it threatened, disown me all the things,
no controlling, beyond belief, you know. And I said, listen,
I'm never taking another penny from you again. You don't
have to worry about it.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Ouch.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I'm on my own. I love you. I'm going to
be your daughter. That's what I want to be. I
want to be your daughter from now on.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
Okay, no joke. I do have chills like that had
I mean in nulcations. That had to be hard.
Speaker 2 (18:24):
It was. It was a defining moment.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
Because that was your only legit, that was your work experience.
That you're basically saying, yeah, we're not a thing anymore.
Speaker 2 (18:33):
Right, and you don't get to control me the rest
of my life, and I've chosen this guy to be
my future, not my dad.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Was he with you at the house when that happened.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Oh, he was standing right next to me. Oh good,
he's always standing next to me. Good for him, but that,
Oh no, don't feel bad. It was such a good
moment for everybody. And you know what, my dad and
I had a beautiful relationship the rest of our life.
Speaker 1 (18:59):
Of course, kind of that midway point where like we
don't know which way this is going to go, gotten
to that.
Speaker 2 (19:04):
Part of Okay, Well, sorry, I went all the way
to the end. No, no, that's no, that's a spoiler.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
No, no, spoiler. So you go to New York.
Speaker 2 (19:12):
I went to New York. My husband grew up in Manhattan,
so you know, easy decision. He knew his way around.
Did not like New York? You didn't at the time.
Now I look back and I think, oh gosh, how
fun to be in New York in your twenties. Right,
every every kid wants to.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Had you sold? Had you had you sold the company?
Speaker 2 (19:29):
I sold? I sold the software to what is right
now one of the country's most respected housing providers. I'm
not going to use any names, but and you know,
we made our money back and I felt really good
about that.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Did you make any I don't want that much, but like,
did you come out of head?
Speaker 2 (19:48):
I think my dad felt like I should be grateful
for having a salary at the time, so it's okay, that's.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Okay, all right.
Speaker 2 (19:55):
He gave me an opportunity and that led to a
job at Price Waterhouse, which it was unbelievable.
Speaker 1 (20:01):
Yeah, you could not have gotten that. I like, that
doesn't happen.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
It doesn't happen.
Speaker 1 (20:07):
And it's amazing that you think about it that way,
because I think we've all met people in this lifetime
who are like, oh, you know, I did it, Like,
oh no, you really didn't. Like you had some help,
but you recognize that. I think in the right perspective
from our conversation is like, look, I had some assistants.
We all have assistance, you know, but you also had
to take that and not screw it up, take it
(20:31):
for granted.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
All of those Oh my gosh, you're gonna do the
whole positive reinforcement thing. Listen, I'm a very grateful person
and you're being so sweet. That is so nice. I
hate compliments. I'm warning you right now.
Speaker 1 (20:42):
Okay, I don't like your sweater, then you know you did?
I do? It's really a nice swetter. Okay, so you're
in New York. Forget about the sweater. So you're in
New York. How long were you there at Price?
Speaker 2 (20:54):
I was at Price for two years and then I
was wooed away by KPMG, who decided to start their
own real estate technology innovation group. So I got to
move over for a promotion and my career grew much
faster after.
Speaker 1 (21:09):
Real Estate's a little bit foreign to me, like, was
this a burgeoning category at the time, So you were
cutting edge, front and center.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
Oh my gosh, yeah, I mean the real estate market.
Real estate was not investing in technology in the so
it was very in the mid nineties. It was super
old school, and it was it was frowned upon. It
was like, wait, you know, why am I having to
spend a peney on this stuff? And the really innovative
(21:38):
firms said, no, we need to actually invest in this
and do something with it. And I got to work
on the coolest projects with lots of different kinds of companies, public, private, institutional, developers,
you name it. And I was around with those companies
(21:59):
when the Internet became a thing. So talk about a
defining moment, right for sure. People ask me about AI today.
We've done this before. It's called the advent of the Internet.
It changed everything. And I got to work with some
of the coolest new startups like real Page, also Dallas
based company and do transformative things.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And you're still not even thirty yet.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
Oh well, now I am. But at the time, well,
I mean, look, look now, you know it's crazy. I
think back sometimes and I think about the rooms I
was in and the people that were listening to me,
and it's so shocking and humbling, and I was great.
I'm a grateful person and I but wow, I mean,
(22:51):
the opportunities that I had were pretty incredible.
Speaker 1 (22:56):
And again I think that what's thinking about your college
experience and then what you've got to do. I mean,
it is funny when you get to a certain point
in your career and if you're really honest with yourself
and look back, you're like, oh my god, what were
they thinking letting me do this? And you know, I
mean clearly you had the aptitude. I mean I look
back and there was one point I was twenty seven
(23:16):
years old and I had twenty four salespeople that rolled
up to me, and I was like, Okay, why would
anyone even do that? But it's just kind of what happened,
and you either make it or you don't, and you
move on down the road. So you move on from Price.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
I moved on from Price. I went to KPMG. And
then you know, you hit a moment if you're a
woman like me, where you're traveling five days a week
and you're in your thirties and you think, am I
gonna have kids? And if I do want kids? Can
I do this at the same time? So heads up
(23:51):
another spoiler alert. I'm I'm not a feminist, okay, so
some of the things I'm going to say right now,
don't judge. Don't judge, no judging. It's very, very, very
difficult to balance it all, of course, and it's hard
to be fighting to make partner at KPMG at the
(24:13):
same time as getting pregnant, having a family, and then
being there for your family. And I couldn't see a
way to do that, so I went to work for
my favorite client. So one of the things that's great
about consulting, we always get offered a job, right because
they're paying a fortune and an hour for you.
Speaker 1 (24:31):
And is that what brought you back to Dallas?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Yeah? Well, so JPI Partners, another day Dallas based company
that is highly admired and another company that so happy
is in my past, offered me a position helping them
transform themselves internally using technology. So they said, hey, just
come in here help us. They were growing so fast,
they had so much capital, they were building so many
(24:57):
apartment communities, and they just got in a fish because
of it. Right, you get over your skis when you're
growing that fast.
Speaker 1 (25:03):
That's one of the sayings that drives me nuts. Is
the whole building the plane while we fly. It makes it.
I get it, but like not really something to brag
about long term. Maybe short term, maybe you fix it,
maybe you land and build the plane.
Speaker 2 (25:15):
But well, to their credit, they saw a need. Yeah,
and they brought me in, you know, and said, hey,
we're going to invest in this initiative, and we want
you to spearhat it and go from kind of one
department to the next and help transform our business and
make it so that we can scale as much as possible,
as fast as possible. I had the best time doing that,
(25:36):
and very family friendly company had my two boys, and
I was able to spend time with them the way
that I felt like I needed to. So it was
just right, just right.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's awesome. How old do they know?
Speaker 2 (25:48):
Twenty and twenty one?
Speaker 1 (25:49):
Oh, they're in college? Where theyre in school?
Speaker 2 (25:51):
I've got a Hoosier okay, national champion, just finished freshman year,
and you're studying business. And then I've got one at
NYU who's junior, who's a computer science genius. He's going
to be mad if he hears me, Sae, but he
kind of is MO.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
I'm talking about him on a podcast. Sorry, mom, stop
being weird.
Speaker 2 (26:10):
Sorry not sorry.
Speaker 1 (26:13):
So okay, how long so you can? So you consulted
as they were growing up and.
Speaker 2 (26:18):
All that, and then and then so early on when
I was at KPMG, I think I mentioned did internet
startup work? Real Page was one of those companies. The
CEO calls me while I'm at JPI, says I needed
to come back. We're growing fast and need somebody like
you on the team. So he talks me into it.
(26:39):
I kind of got lucky. It was in two thousand
and seven, so leaving a real estate developer to go
work in emerging booming tech in two thousand and seven
was the most fortunate thing that I could do. Sure,
so I got to help build that company, Real Page,
(27:00):
into something special, take it public, ended up running about
half the business. I like to think all the cool,
fun stuff that they had in their in their bevy
of products and services was the stuff I got to oversee.
And and then I did it again. I had another
existential crisis moment where I was like, I'm not a
(27:23):
good mom, and so I spent my career trying to
get to a certain point, you know, be my best me,
achieve my greatest potential. Came pretty darn close to being
positioned to be the next leader of Real Page. And
then I had a dream that I wasn't going to
get in the pearly gates because I was a terrible mom,
(27:46):
And I had to go into the CEO's office and say,
I need to work myself out of this company. I
want to be home with my kids.
Speaker 1 (27:53):
That had to be a hard realization, But kudos to you.
I mean, I mean, but he's got to choose their path.
And you know, but I would imagine it's hard. You
were pretty lofty level. You'd worked earned it, But I
mean personal feeling is you know, there's no greater gift
you can give your kids than be in there.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
I could not agree more. I have zero regrets. Even
though the company sold for ten billion dollars a few
years later, I got to still help on the sidelines.
I did consulting work with Real Page, and I did
advisory work for my friends in the industry. I invested
in a lot of cool tech companies, and I spent
a ton of time with my kids and I was there,
(28:35):
I was present, I was involved, and I have zero regrets.
Speaker 1 (28:40):
So let's pause here for a second, because you were
on you know, fast one way train down the track
doing lots of really cool and interesting stuff. What kind
of size of teams did you lead, you know, in
terms of just leadership of teams and all of that management.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
Yeah. I mean when I started at Real Page, I
think I had twenty people working for me. By the
time I left, I had hundreds. And they weren't just
us base. I mean I had a team in Manila,
I had a team in India.
Speaker 1 (29:12):
And that was before teams and zoom and it was
all that. It was.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
It was a lot of travel. It led to a
lot more.
Speaker 1 (29:19):
Travel when you think about that, you know, as leaders,
you know, I talk, you know, I've been fortunate enough
to lead teams for almost thirty years, and yeah, I
had a great mentor mind that says, you know, there
are bosses and then there are leaders, and there's a
massive difference, and you got to choose which you want
to be. And I try and always remember that. I
(29:40):
try and talk to you know, younger leaders about that,
because everyone thinks they're a leader, but like, okay, what
do you do to prove that out? What are some
things that you took very personally as a leader that
you tried to show your people, be there for people,
whatever it was. What do you feel most proud about
that you think that you were best at.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Well, I'm a people first person.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
I can see that.
Speaker 2 (30:06):
And you know, when you're in the business of serving
a customer, you have to put your customers first. That's
where it all starts, because if you're you know, in
a for profit business, if your customers aren't happy, forget it.
So I always led with the customer comes first. Let's
do anything and everything we need to do to make
(30:27):
sure we're serving our customers to the best of our
ability and make good on the things we say we're
going to do right.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
I talk a lot with our teams. I think it's
really easy, especially you know, leading a sales organization and
there's always pressures and things like that, and you know,
of course there are moments in time where the short
game is important, but you have to always keep the
long game in mind. There are times you have to
say no or take a step back or whatever those
things are. And I believe that's how you really develop
(30:56):
real partnerships. I think that you know the dynamic of
there's certain dynamics and client relationships, in relationship to their
clients or your people that never change. I mean people.
The dynamic between people doesn't change. But I think that
that our society has changed, and that you know, the
technology and it makes it easy to hide behind emails.
And I've had conversations about this and it's funny. I
(31:18):
mean a founder, I was speaking to the days like,
you know, two emails as max before we start having
a conversation, and I think it's just important, at least
for me. I think about those things and how do
you maintain that over time? How have you managed that?
Just like going through COVID. I mean, I remember there
was a time where we were all at home, you know.
(31:39):
Being here in Texas, it was a little bit easier
because we opened up sooner. But like I was in
a large national company where there are people in New
York and they're never going in, Like, how do you
manage that? Now?
Speaker 2 (31:50):
Yeah, it's interesting. So with COVID specifically, if you're asking
about that, that was tough because the businesses that I
was supporting and serving at the time, they all provide
I was saying. And the people that work at those properties,
they didn't get to not go to work. They were
they were required to be there every day taking care
of people in their homes, and so they had the
(32:13):
toughest job of all. Right, it's kind of I think
think about that. The housing providers, the nurses that you know,
those they didn't have a choice exposing themselves every day. Right.
So I had one very large client, one of the
largest providers of housing in the country, asked me to
be the chairperson of their COVID task team, and that
(32:35):
was that was an interesting.
Speaker 1 (32:36):
Role, sure, because you had how many different points of
view on COVID.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
Yeah, So but I digress. I think your Your real
question is, you know, how do you stay connected to people,
especially since COVID and since.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
You know, even generationally, I mean.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
Absolutely, I think I initially I was one of those
people that resist did media, like the whole being on camera,
and I grew up, you know, having meetings in person
and using phone calls, and it's really it's something that
I've had to become accustomed to and get really comfortable with,
(33:16):
is being on camera and integrating with people, because that
is how this next generation especially wants to communicate. When
my son calls me from college, he wants to FaceTime me,
even if he's sitting on his computer working half the
time and we're quiet and I'm working and he's like
hey mom, and we'll start. He wants to be with
(33:37):
me on FaceTime. And so it's just kind of part
of how we integrate now remotely.
Speaker 1 (33:44):
Yeah, you know, it is funny, I know that like
talking to young salespeople in media and radio in the nineties,
like the legit I remember doing fels at lunch on
the back of a napkin like that, that's not a
made up thing, and I'll mention that, and like older
(34:06):
people on staff will kind of chuckle, and the kids
will look at me like, that's that didn't happen. I'm like, yeah,
oh yeah it did.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
There was a scotch next to your house too.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
Absolutely there was, and and so you and and candidly
like I know that it's okay, so, but but I
know that, Like I in the last week, I've had
conversations like, look, I know that this client is comfortable
just doing a team's call. You're both in Dallas. Go
meet for coffee. Get to know this person outside of
(34:37):
this one dimensional you know you're on video. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:40):
The relationships that I have in our industry go back
decades for sure, and it started with in person meetings
and conversations. And I make sure to continue to have those. Yeah,
I'm still on the airplane all the time. You just
it's it's a very relational business that I'm in, especially
and so even though I'm like I run a remote company. Yep,
(35:01):
we operate on you know, remote technology. I like to
get in front of people. I like my team to
get together frequently enough. Ye, because sparks fly when you're
all in the same room.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
Absolutely. Yeah, It's funny because there are times where you're like, Okay,
I need to go see this client. And there's a
little bit of the creep of yeah, I could just
do it via No, I need to go see them,
because you know as well as I do. It's not
the thing you're going to talk about that's going to
be the big thing. It's gonna be the thing the
(35:31):
other you know, seed that comes out of Oh, but
did you realize I need help with this problem? And
like to your point, you know, you have relationships that
go way back, so you're going to get Yeah, Janine,
more good on this. But what could you how could
you help me here?
Speaker 2 (35:47):
But they might not they might not want to talk
about all those things on video.
Speaker 1 (35:52):
I had I had. It was funny. I had one
of these a few weeks ago and it was just
meeting a client out for a b and it was
on a Friday, and he'd just got you know, we say,
you never know what meeting somebody just came out of
and he was like, I've got this problem. And by
the next Wednesday we had a significant deal put together.
And I just chuckled, and I talked to some of
our younger sellers. I said, this isn't about me. Oh,
(36:14):
look at Chris, did this but if you go and
do this, you don't know what you're going to find out.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
But I think it's even more than that. I think
it's just having a human connection with me all and
you know, because I'll go and meet with a customer
or a prospective customer, and we'll connect on something that
we never would have talked about video because we're having
dinner together and we find out that we both have hoosiers,
(36:40):
or you know, we find out that our dads were
both in real estate, or who knows.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
No, you're right because I think on you know, teams
or whatever. There's an agenda. Oh, we got through all
six items on the agenda. Great, Jenene, Great talking to you. Done.
You know, it's just different. I think we're aligned as
far as that goes, because I just I don't think
there's no replacement for that. We can talk about AI,
(37:06):
we can talk all these things that are great and
they're the future, but there's still the one constant, and
it's the human dynamic that doesn't.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
Never gonna go away. That's why I'm not afraid of AI. Yeah,
people who talk about you know, AI taking over, it's
never going to take over because humans need human contact. Oh, absolutely,
it's just gonna help make us better.
Speaker 1 (37:27):
I think everyone's going to feel better after that, right there,
I hope. So you're scared of AI talked to Genie.
Please do give her a call. I'll give her number
at the end of the podcast. So talk about lease
luck right now? What's you know, what's big today? And
what's what's the thing in three years? You think?
Speaker 2 (37:44):
Yeah, so LEAs luck that the fundamental solution that lease
Luck provides is a deposit replacement. And deposits have really
failed modern American renters and housing providers. Originally they were
created back in Roman times, you know, wow, as a
form of collateral and it makes total sense.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
I love history. Or you can take us through deposits
from the Roman era to now, Amanda, how much time
do we have? Not that far? And then in the
Middle Ages it took four chickens and a pig.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
I have to pause on the Enlightenment periods since to me,
now I'm.
Speaker 1 (38:23):
Obsessed with Now she's getting your book out of her bag,
She's going to be a reading.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Oh my gosh. So essentially, in the modern digital era,
deposits have gotten to the point where they're an affordability
problem for American renters. We have a situation where most
Americans have less than two thousand dollars for savings in
their accounts and the cost to move is more than that. Correct,
(38:52):
that's the deposit including the deposit, right, It's very problematic
and the system is so broken that if you think
about it, if I'm living in an apartment I need
and I want to move to a different apartment, I
need my deposit back, but I'm not going to get
it back before I have to sign a new lease,
reserve it with some upfront costs, and then move in
(39:15):
and start paying rent. I still won't have seen my
deposit back and I've had to pay another deposit. So
how much more difficult are we going to make it
for American reveners to get access to quality housing? Yep, okay,
So that's the fundamental issue, and that's why the product
was designed and created. But it also doesn't work for
housing providers because it's highly regulated on an increasing basis,
(39:37):
and the administrative burden associated with it. It has become so
costly that it's difficult to even manage deposits. And then lastly,
they don't cost they don't cover the cost of financial
loss for a property owner, So you can't collect enough
from a runner move in to cover the cost of
(39:58):
the financial loss at move out. So it's not working
for anybody in the housing ecosystem. So we've replaced it
with a beautiful insurance program that does everything that it
needs to do to be a win win win for
all the constituents.
Speaker 1 (40:16):
So if I'm a property owner and I come to you,
I do business with lease Locke, what does that do
for the end consumer?
Speaker 2 (40:28):
What it does is I give you the opportunity to
not charge a deposit at all, so you at all. Instead,
you're going to charge a small, non refundable monthly fee
which is far less than the cost of a deposit
to the renter. And you'll get more prospects, you'll close
more releases faster, and because it's a commercial insurance program,
(40:51):
you'll be able to file claims if there's a loss
a move out and we'll restore that lost income within days.
Speaker 1 (41:00):
So penetration of what's your penetration, Well, we.
Speaker 2 (41:04):
Have we've we've we've ensured millions of apartment homes and
that's kind of small.
Speaker 1 (41:11):
Yeah, the only reason I'm asking I'm thinking about, you know,
all of my three kids have graduated college in the
last five years, and I'm trying to sit there and think, like,
I think we paid deposits. I don't. I'm not remember that.
I'm like racking my brain trying to remember on that
and so, but it is interesting because I think back
thirty five years ago or when I was leaving college, like,
(41:32):
You're like, I'm not getting my deposit back no matter
how hard I clean.
Speaker 2 (41:34):
Well, that's the other that's the other bad part is
that there's an inherent mistrust in the system. Oh yeah,
because deposits do go mostly unrefunded. And the sad thing
is it's not because landlords don't want to pay them back.
They do. But do you have a forwarding address when
you leave? Did you give it to them? Did you
change your mind? Did you call the apartment community and say, oh, no,
(41:54):
I'm not living there, I'm actually living here. They get
lost in the system.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Yeah, that's true.
Speaker 2 (42:00):
So there's literally billions of dollars sitting in the system
that aren't helping the renter or the landlord. Think about it,
I am thinking it's sad.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
It is now. I never really thought about the forwarding
address and all of those things and it really was.
I mean I remember leaving college you out and never
get this back, you know, as you're scrubbing the kitchen
floor or whatever, trying to get some stain out from
some stupid party you had. So what's next?
Speaker 2 (42:30):
What's next is that, Well, there's an entire country of
apartments that can be ensured by Leaselock and if you
haven't used the program yet, call me. But uh, thank you,
but we're expanding into Canada. We've been asked by clients
to move into the UK and there are other types
(42:52):
of deposits for similar real estate classes that we can
expand into as well.
Speaker 1 (42:57):
You do you all work with like airbnbs.
Speaker 2 (42:58):
And all that we do work with rental homes that
are provided in through a platform like do.
Speaker 1 (43:04):
You notice as of trying to like come up with
something new?
Speaker 2 (43:07):
Thank you? Would you like to be then advisor?
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Geny? Call me anytime the direct line you need come on. Okay, Genie,
last question, And I think we've covered this a little bit,
but I do like to ask you know, we talk
a lot with teams, and I'm sure you speak in
company meetings and you know there are those moments that
are big wins, whether it's a big contract you sign
(43:31):
or some big moment you know, new technology or something
like that, you know, the seismic moment. But the reality
is so much success is built on, you know, doing
the little things. I call it the cracks and grace spaces,
Like where do you win in the cracks and grace bases?
And I'm a big culture believer, and you know how
you treat people and how you do business And you
(43:51):
talked a little bit about that. When you think about
cracks and grace spaces. For Lease Locke, what do you
like to think about? Like, this is what we own
in the every day, in the every moment.
Speaker 2 (44:01):
Yeah, so we always do the right thing. It's pretty simple.
We always do the right thing. We are renter first company,
so rent our best interests are the most important thing
to us. And when we always do the right thing
for our clients and we keep ultimately the American renter
at the forefront of our minds. I don't know, everything
(44:21):
seems to work out well. Culturally speaking, I would say
that there are several things that I establish when I
joined the company, and it's, you know, our mantra for
kind of how we behave, how we treat each other.
We are a company of really talented, capable people that
(44:45):
have humility. Part of the reason we all love each
other and get along and feel like we're part of
a family is because we all share that feeling. There's
no arrogance tolerated. We're not ever condescending. We don't need
to talk about what we're good at with each other.
We know we're good and we're grateful for the jobs
that we have and the opportunity to work with each other.
(45:06):
So that's kind of the first most important thing to me.
The second is flexibility. You have a job, you have
a job description. If you can help somebody and you
see they need help, jump in and help.
Speaker 1 (45:17):
Yeah. I'm not a big fan of not my job, not.
Speaker 2 (45:21):
A fan either. So and what that means is that
people at least lock get to grow professionally because you're
not limited. You want to get involved and help somebody,
offer to help. Oh, you just did that. Would you
like more responsibility? Would you like to grow in your career?
And so that's kind of the second part of it
is that that flexibility. And then the third is just
(45:41):
I have zero tolerance for hot potato behavior. If you
have a problem and you're the one that identified it
and it's in your lap. You own it. Don't throw
it over the fence for somebody else, and come with
a solution, right, come up with a solution.
Speaker 1 (45:56):
So it's really not that hard. I mean it is
like when you think about the fundamentals, well.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Guess what everybody wants to help. Just don't throw it
over the fence, own it and then ask for help
and everybody will jump into hepnin.
Speaker 1 (46:10):
This was a lot of fun. It was do you
feel prepared for later this week? I mean, you could
be on TV.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
I'm kind of just sad in general that this is over.
Speaker 1 (46:19):
I know, I am round two. Can we do it totally?
Season two?
Speaker 2 (46:23):
I have so many good stories, I know.
Speaker 1 (46:25):
I think, Amanda, what do you think? I think, go ahead?
Season two done too. I think we can make this
a seasonal thing and we'll pick topics. Maybe we'll talk about.
Speaker 2 (46:36):
Concerts, maybe we'll talk about the career that I didn't
choose that I still want to have that teezer. I'm sorry,
I can't tell you. Oh my gosh, season two, you'll
have to have me back.
Speaker 1 (46:45):
All right. This was a lot of fun, Janine, Thank
you It is great getting to talk to you, love
your story, and uh, we're going to have you back.
I'm I'm making an executive decision. Mean thank you.
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