John Butcher of Madison Tree Care and Landscaping

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Let's garden with Scott Berlin. That's what you're doing right now.
And I'm here today with a couple of tree mendous guys.
I couldn't help myself. We did that earlier. I tried
to stop, but I'm here with Ron Roethis and John Butcher.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
Two really good. Stop that, Danny.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
It's two good, amazing arborists and tree lovers and tree
very just knowledgeable about the full extent of the whole
tree world. Welcome, gentlemen. Hey Scott, morning morning. How you
feeling great? Excited about today's show?

Speaker 3 (00:34):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (00:35):
Yeah, I'm actually awake at this point.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
Yeah, good, that's good. We have Chris Stone, also a
director from Boone County Arboretum, coming at the seven o'clock hour,
and again another really good tree guy. John, you're CEO
and part owner of Madison Tree Service. How long have
you guys been in business?

Speaker 3 (00:53):
It will be eighty years this year.

Speaker 2 (00:55):
Actually amazing eighty years, pretty crazy.

Speaker 1 (00:58):
Yeah, you'll be there. You're a young guy. You'll be
there for the century mark. Is that just crazy?

Speaker 5 (01:02):
Well, you know what, you can't always guarantee that, but
that's my plan.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
Yeah, you got God willing.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
God willing exactly. And you guys are full service.

Speaker 1 (01:12):
You do diagnosis or diagnostics, tree care, and even lawn
or landscaping.

Speaker 3 (01:19):
Correct, yep.

Speaker 1 (01:21):
And Ron, you're owner of Arbor Doctor, the arbor Doctor
here in Cincinnati. You do primarily diagnostics and treatments.

Speaker 4 (01:29):
Right, yep. Yeah, plant healthcare. We do some landscape in
stilation and that type of thing, but plant healthcare, tree preservation,
we're still little babies compared to Compared to John, I'm
in my twenty third year business but I started on
a community tree board when I was in tenth grade,

(01:50):
so probably have about forty five years in the industry
for this.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:54):
And you were telling us earlier that John's grandfather, Ed Butcher,
was your first instructor in our borer culture.

Speaker 3 (02:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (02:04):
He taught the arbor culture class what was then Cincinnati
Technical College now Cincinnati State. And he was It was
funny because he was kind of an eccentric old guy
he was getting I think towards the end of his career.
In the first day of class, He's standing there with
this crazy white hair and his hands in his pockets
and a little, believe it or not, unlit cigarette hanging

(02:25):
out of his mouth, and we were like, this is
this guy's nuts. This is going to be terrible. And
by the end of the quarter we were like, that
was the best experience we ever we ever had. I
used to say he was like a Baptist preacher preaching
a gospel of alex Chaigo. Alex Chaigo being a researcher
who really rewrote the book on how tree should be
pruned and compartmentalization to decay and trees. The guy was

(02:47):
amazing instilled a passion in me.

Speaker 1 (02:50):
Well, that's fantastic, John. Do you stand is Ron's description
of your grandfather?

Speaker 3 (02:56):
Well, you know, you know, I think so.

Speaker 5 (02:59):
But when he says it centric, it was what I
was used to, right, and it was normal. It was
just my grandfather and it didn't seem out of line.
But there is I want to add on to Ron's
story a little bit in that in Uh, He's got
a library of books that he's had from over the years,
and and in all of the alex Chigo books, they're
signed by Higo and it says to the first real

(03:20):
tree toucher, and it's a it's a pretty special thing.

Speaker 1 (03:23):
Yeah, For people who don't know, Alex Chaigo was one
of the first and still one of the best tree researchers.
Uh there's ever been uh what was it Oklahoma State
or it was.

Speaker 4 (03:34):
A New Hampshire was worried New Hampshire US four service
in New Hampshire.

Speaker 3 (03:39):
Okay, Yeah, I believe that's where he was.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
Really kind of one of the fundamental figures in our
borer culture.

Speaker 4 (03:46):
Would I would say I kind of came in towards
the end of his career, but I did get a
chance to attend one of his talks down in Kentucky once,
so I've met him one time. So he's long gone
at this point. But as the legend lives on.

Speaker 5 (04:02):
Yeah, well my grandfather as well is I think two
thousand and two passed away. But I think about the
history of this and the age of the company and
when he started doing tree care. It was the reason
that the first real tree toucher is that my grandfather
wouldn't use spurs at a time when that's all people

(04:24):
that climb trees would do.

Speaker 3 (04:26):
So those are spurs or hooks that you hook up.

Speaker 5 (04:28):
Your boots and you stab into the trees you go up,
which is a complete no no for pruning.

Speaker 2 (04:32):
Fine for telephone poles. Yeah, right, right, not good for trees.

Speaker 3 (04:35):
Right.

Speaker 5 (04:36):
Occasionally you see some unqualified person still doing that on
a tree that they're attempting to prune.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
But it's really an absolute no no that we should avoid.

Speaker 5 (04:44):
But so they didn't have harnesses back then, and they
would actually use the end of the rope as the
harness and they would tie and not called a bowling
on a bite. And so they had a two pieces
of rope, one around the waist and one around their
legs that was supporting them in the tree the whole day.
And I just can't imagine how uncomfortable and what a
sacrifice that they were making to not hurt the tree

(05:05):
when they were doing that.

Speaker 2 (05:06):
Yeah, Yeah, amazing, amazing stuff.

Speaker 4 (05:09):
And I still see unfortunately a lot of people using
spurs in live trees, and.

Speaker 1 (05:17):
There's a lot of bad practices that go on in
our borer culture, and that I think is something we
should talk about later on in the show, how you
can pick a good arborist for your tree and how
you can spot a bad one.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
Love it.

Speaker 2 (05:30):
Yeah, I think that's very important for people to know.

Speaker 1 (05:35):
Just to cover some business. So we want to welcome
people to the Facebook page in the Garden, which Ron
started this morning already from the studio, so that's up
and running. Our podcast can be found on all the
best sources of podcasts, all the past shows, and even
on Ron Wilson shows. In the Garden with Ron Wilson
are still up there available to listen to. We're going

(05:59):
to take your We really want to hear from you today.
We've got experts here on trees. We're hoping you'll call
in and ask us about trees and then your questions
about your tree and what the plant all of that stuff.
Our number is eight hundred eight two five eighty two
fifty five, so we're I think we'll go ahead and
take a break right now. When we come back, we'll

(06:21):
run through the national days of Why because how can
you possibly navigate your week, your month, or your day
without knowing what the national week, day or month of
is happening?

Speaker 2 (06:33):
Right you guys in agreement.

Speaker 4 (06:34):
It's the only way I could possibly live my life
this week.

Speaker 1 (06:37):
Yeah, I don't know how people do it without agreed. Okay,
all right, let's take a break. When we come back,
we'll do that. Welcome back. You are listening to Let's
Garden with Scott Berlin. I gave the wrong phone number
out as we were exiting for the break, I said, well,
I won't repeat the wrong number. The correct number is
eight hundred eighty two three eighty two to fifty five.

Speaker 3 (06:57):
John.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
Someone somewhere is getting inundata with calls from some with
hundreds of people wanting to have their tree questions answered.
And I apologize to whoever that person who is?

Speaker 3 (07:08):
I feel bad for that person. Yeah, it must be
must be thousands of them.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
It must be hundreds of thousands.

Speaker 1 (07:16):
Anyway, let's run through the national days of So we've
gone the month of May. Uh, it's got get caught
reading month, Older Americans month, skin cancer Awareness month, It's.

Speaker 3 (07:28):
Egg month month. I didn't know that was the thing.
Drum month. Do you have a drum now?

Speaker 2 (07:33):
No drums?

Speaker 5 (07:33):
Mon?

Speaker 4 (07:34):
Father was a professional jazz drummer. Oh really, well, I
don't play drums at all, but my father lived and
breathed jazz drums.

Speaker 2 (07:42):
I tried it once.

Speaker 1 (07:44):
My son had a kit in our living room and
I would try. You know, I spent weeks just playing
with that try. There's no hope for me as a drummer,
and there's nothing anybody could do or teach me to
make me a good drummer.

Speaker 3 (07:56):
Not at all. We share that trait. Yep.

Speaker 1 (07:59):
It is Sally month, and you know at least that's
offset because it's also a barbecue month.

Speaker 3 (08:06):
Let's go well together. They are pretty good together. Yep. Yep.

Speaker 1 (08:09):
Chamber of Music Month, Hamburger Month, and cheese Month, and
you can celebrate both together by having a cheeseburger best
together yep. Asparagus month, Lime Disease Awareness Month. Important for gardeners.
The weeks for the third week in May are just
not fun or exciting. Public Works Week, EMS Week, Police Week,

(08:29):
Transportation Week.

Speaker 4 (08:30):
Well, police week is exciting, yea, and our first responders.

Speaker 3 (08:35):
I think they're nice things.

Speaker 1 (08:36):
They're just not you know, entertaining weeks of you know,
it's not like you can make fun of them or
laugh about them, or you know, be snide and sort
of a jerk about them. You just have you know,
there are things you got to respect exactly, but yeah,
not entertaining, so we'll just pass them over. It's learned today, Saturday,

(08:58):
May sixteenth.

Speaker 2 (08:59):
Learn this.

Speaker 3 (09:00):
It's mimosa Day.

Speaker 1 (09:02):
And I'm hoping that's where the drink, not the tree,
because the tree is pretty invasive. In the south at
least in maybe working its way up here.

Speaker 5 (09:11):
Well, where's our drinks at If it's Mimosa day, I
would have brought them gladly if you told me about
this ahead of time.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
I'm trying to sober up still, So yeah, how about
that that has that good.

Speaker 3 (09:22):
Timing or work timing. Fiddle day, whiskey.

Speaker 1 (09:25):
Day, piercing day, plant a lemon tree day, so down
south you could do that.

Speaker 4 (09:31):
They might not go over too well in this area here. Hey,
they do really well until fall and winter and for.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
Some reason they just don't like cold weather.

Speaker 5 (09:42):
How about an in studio piercing. I think Ron would
have really looked good with a nose ring.

Speaker 1 (09:46):
I agree, right, and that would that would really work
on you. We can think about that. Yeah, let's think
about it. River clean up day, waiters day. Now, if
you miss waiters day to day, wait staff Day is
later in the week, so you can make for it. Okay, fair,
do something good for your neighbor day. It doesn't say
which neighbor. I would just say like, probably the one

(10:07):
you like the most. That should be every day. It
should be every day you let you're good to your neighbor.
Ron are you get to your neighbors. I try to
be Yeah, you try to be a good neighbor. Yeah,
there you go. Classic movie day. If you were watching
a classic movie day, what would it be? Put you
on a spot.

Speaker 5 (10:24):
I'm going to go first, Doctor Strangelove would be the one,
Rocky one.

Speaker 4 (10:27):
Rocky one, Ron, I guess it's old enough to be
a classic movie. But Field of Dreams is always I
love man great one.

Speaker 1 (10:35):
It's also the day for the Preakness today, so six
fifty pm that'll be on Eastern time.

Speaker 4 (10:40):
My brother was a huge horse racing fan. Yeah, and
he had every Kentucky Derby winner memorized. We would go
on family vacations down to horse farms in Lexington and
meet a lot of the horses. You actually got to
meet and be nipped by Secretariat. Once I won the Preakness,
carry that scar with pride exactly.

Speaker 3 (11:02):
Did he have to pay for that? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (11:04):
No, Actually those before lawsuits and our people.

Speaker 2 (11:08):
Who don't know.

Speaker 1 (11:09):
For people who don't know, the farm country around Lexington
is worth a trip, a vacation trip. It is about
the most beautiful country that you can find and very
very cool and some of them have tours. So if
you can do that. Try to do that tomorrow May seventeenth, Sunday,
Walnut Day. You know that's a tree. I think we
should talk about it a little bit later. It's not

(11:29):
one you would think of as an ornamental for your yard,
but a very valuable tree for wildlife and a lot
of other things.

Speaker 3 (11:36):
So maybe we'll talk about that more. Sun just graduated
from Walnut Hills. There you go.

Speaker 1 (11:40):
Yeah, yeah, Pino Grigio Day, ride a unicycle day. Pack
Rat Day, I think it should be extermin packrat Day.
I've been too many pack crats in my life. Mushroom
Hunting Day, Rural Life Sunday, and Cherry Cobbler Day.

Speaker 4 (11:57):
You know what they say about mushroom hunters. They are
old mushroom hunters and they are bold mushroom hunters. But
there are no old, bold mushroom hunters.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
That's right, that's right, makes sense. Cherry Cobbler Day.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
I mentioned that.

Speaker 1 (12:10):
But you know, I have this thing that you know,
the bakery treat industry has got too much control over
the national days of they it's every other day is
some kind of bike good And I just know that
this is some conspiracy or some power move I'm not
happy about it. I'm going to get to the bottom
of it too and just disclose, you know, expose this

(12:31):
whole thing in a great, big blog piece someday.

Speaker 3 (12:35):
Cherry Cobbler does sound great, all, it's all good stuff.

Speaker 1 (12:38):
Yeah, it's just that they're controlling the whole days of
narrative and out of control.

Speaker 3 (12:43):
It's out of control.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
It is Monday Victoria Day honors Queen Victoria's birthday and
her role as mother of Confederation. And again the bake
treats cheese souf le a day. Sounds good but still conspiracy.
Visit your relatives, Nope, Supply chain Professions Day, Professionals Day.
I love Reese's Day. How does a company, a product

(13:07):
get its own day? They probably paid for that day,
probably paid handsomely for that day. No dirty Dishes Day. Tuesday,
May nineteenth, May Ray Day. It's about going outside and
soaking up the sun. Now, if you're worried about that
for the health reasons. Friday is don't Friday Day. It's
all about skin cancer awareness. Isn't it funny? Isn't that cute?

(13:28):
Friday is don't Friday?

Speaker 3 (13:31):
Yeah, Devil's Food.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
Cake Day, plant something Day? No, you know, that smacks
of a little bit of desperation. It should be you know,
very specific, Plant something good day, not plant something anything day.

Speaker 2 (13:44):
There's a big difference, big difference, big difference.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
It's Elected Officials Day, and you know that kind of
makes me feel queasy honoring our elected officials. But it's
especially because it's also a fair play day.

Speaker 3 (13:57):
That sounds rather contradictory.

Speaker 1 (13:59):
Exactly exactly Wednesday, Streaming Day, Waits and Measures Day, Keith
Lorraine Day, High heeled Day.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
I thought this were kind of a thing of the past.

Speaker 1 (14:09):
I mean, it's like, if you were a woman, either
of you, would you wear high heels?

Speaker 3 (14:15):
Well, my feet still hurt from wearing them the one
time or from last night. Who can say, yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (14:25):
Can tell you if I were a woman, there's not
one time would I wear a high heel.

Speaker 5 (14:29):
It's unbelievable. I can't I get anybody can squeeze.

Speaker 3 (14:32):
Their it takes to do that.

Speaker 1 (14:36):
I can't imagine band Director's Day. Red Sneakers Day now,
that's more like it. Sneakers Day, sugar Bee, apple Pie,
or Apple Day. It's a specific, trademarked, highly popular cultivar
of apple known for its exceptional crunch and uniquely sweet
flavor profile and distinct notes of honey, caramel and molasses.

(14:58):
And no, I'm not We're not being sponsored by the
sugar Bee Apple Company.

Speaker 3 (15:04):
Have you ever had one? No? I have not. I've
never seen one one either. Yeah, it sounds good. I
would buy that.

Speaker 4 (15:10):
Yeah, makes it harder to eat when they aren't available.

Speaker 3 (15:14):
Maybe they're so good that they don't make it Cincinnati.
They can't get this far. Get it here.

Speaker 1 (15:18):
Yeah, Thursday Chardonay Day. We just had Pinot Greccio days,
but now it's the Sharden Day, Chardonay Day on Thursday.
End of the World Day on Thursday. Good lord, I
didn't know that was coming.

Speaker 4 (15:30):
It's amazing to be on your last show, Scott.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I would say, use these next
five days, so the three of them forgetting whatever fun
in you can, and then the last two for making amends.

Speaker 3 (15:46):
Make amends first, and then have the fun. I guess
you could just whatever order works for you. You know.

Speaker 1 (15:53):
It's funny though, like to see, like over the next
five days, which people are making amends first versus which
one's make amend's last.

Speaker 5 (16:01):
Well, I guess it depends on what you're going to
do for fun after you make amends?

Speaker 3 (16:04):
Is what that what you're telling you?

Speaker 2 (16:06):
If it's good, clean fun, it doesn't matter which direction
you go.

Speaker 3 (16:08):
Okay, fair, Yeah, okay. If you said if you're going
deep into ice, you do that first.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
And then you make amends afterwards. Cool Sword Day, how
about that? That sounds like fun?

Speaker 3 (16:20):
Yeah, so eat more fruits.

Speaker 1 (16:22):
And Veggie's Day, but then it's also Strawberries and Cream Day,
so uh a paradief day.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
And there you there's your waist. What's that drink?

Speaker 3 (16:33):
Resturt?

Speaker 1 (16:33):
Friday, we got a minute to talk about Maritime Day.
On Friday, we mentioned Goth Day, Free your inner goth,
wear black salt and celebrate the next day, which is
National Solitaire Day, by a Musical Instrument Day.

Speaker 3 (16:49):
If you're a goth, get a black guitar. Title track Day.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
Great title track songs out there, well, we won't have
a chance to talk about them. I don't think National
Cooler Day, Vanilla Pudding Day treats not baked, but treats
International Day for Biological Diversity, that's important, and Craft Distillery Day.
You are listening to Let's Garden with Scott Berlin, I'm
here with Ron Roethis and John Butcher talking trees. As

(17:14):
we move further, I will go actually with favorite plants next.

Speaker 2 (17:19):
That could be anything across the board.

Speaker 3 (17:21):
But we're really.

Speaker 1 (17:21):
Gonna go into trees later and we'll take your calls.
Thanks for listening.

Speaker 3 (17:25):
We'll be right back.

Speaker 1 (17:26):
John Butcher from Madison Treecare and Landscaping. Yes, sir, and
Ron rothis from the arbor Doctor. It's tree Day. We're
gonna mostly focus on trees later and we'd love to
take your calls. But for now, we're gonna run through
some favorite plants that we're seeing out there in the
gardens and landscapes and around the community right now. And

(17:46):
I'm gonna I'll go ahead and start because I've got
I keep talking this plant up, but I just don't
see it that often. The Venus dogwood, there's a hybrid
dogwood that'sim bloom now, has been for about two and
a half weeks, kind of finishing up, but just a
great performer, covered in flowers, tough plant that can take

(18:09):
more drought and sun than our Eastern Florida dogwood.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
Great plant. I love it. You guys seen it much?

Speaker 3 (18:18):
Yeah, Yeah, it's around that's really yeah, should be used more.

Speaker 1 (18:21):
I know it's since in garden centers now, but I
don't think people have really come to know how great
that tree is.

Speaker 4 (18:28):
Yeah, it's certainly one that I haven't seen too much of.

Speaker 1 (18:31):
So, Yeah, we have it at the zoo and I
have it at home, and it's just a great performer
both places. John, you mentioned red buckeyes one that caught
your attention.

Speaker 5 (18:42):
Yeah, those bloomed earlier the spring really well, nice big
red flowers. I really prefer the true red Asculus pavia
over the hybrid horse chestnuts.

Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (18:56):
In a low wind, shady area they can get the
leaf blotch, which causes the leaves to drop a little early.
Is the one thing you need to be careful about.
But other than that, they're I mean, they're drought tolerant,
they're pretty solid. They bloom really well, but they do
have that one downside if you don't get them in
the right spot.

Speaker 1 (19:14):
Exactly, Ron, I know you've been being on yellow woods
this year. I drove by one in Maderra yesterday that
was just spectacular.

Speaker 3 (19:24):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (19:25):
I have one right next to my driveway at my
house and it's in full bloom now, but it's the
first time it's ever bloom, so it's not quite up
to this, you know what what it will be when
it gets a little bit more mature. But yeah, and
it's it's it's a beautiful tree.

Speaker 3 (19:41):
It is.

Speaker 4 (19:41):
It is bad wrap from being a little bit weak
branch angles. But if you do structural purening on that
tree when it's young, I just don't see that as
a significant problem.

Speaker 1 (19:52):
So apparently so the Latin on as cladrastis, which apparently
means in Latin weak wooded. That's kind of interesting, is
you had that reputation for a long time.

Speaker 3 (20:02):
I didn't know that. That's interesting.

Speaker 2 (20:04):
I've only found out a few years ago.

Speaker 3 (20:07):
Have you ever seen a pink version of those Yeah,
we have it at the zoo.

Speaker 4 (20:12):
Yeah, and it seems to me that Perkins pink, if anything,
is a little bit more vigorous.

Speaker 3 (20:17):
I agree.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
Yeah, Yeah, the pink is Okay, it's not the you know,
up close, it's a very pretty From a distance, I
don't think it has quite the power of the pure white.

Speaker 2 (20:27):
But you know, they're great trees, just great.

Speaker 4 (20:30):
And the neat thing about about yellowood is the only
place I've ever seen it real abundant is in the
palisades of the Kentucky River, which are limestone cliffs. It's
a tree that adapts really well to higher pH soils,
but it seems to do okay from what I've heard,
in somewhat lower pH soils too, So it's adaptable in
the Cincinnati area. In our area, we have you know,

(20:51):
pretty heavy clay, high pH soils, and it seems to
do really well in those conditions.

Speaker 1 (20:57):
The only thing I kind of feel, like what I've seen,
you know, observed, is that it prefers a dryer site.

Speaker 3 (21:03):
Actually it does.

Speaker 4 (21:05):
And again they're palisades of the Kentucky River, hanging on
cliffs one hundred and fifty foot two hundred foot tall cliffs,
and it's just growing out of cracks and the rocks
and things like that. So so yeah, I've I planted
one once for a gentleman. It was on a near
a hilltop location in northern Kentucky, and I felt it
was a great place for yellow one. The thing I

(21:26):
didn't know is that this guy ran his sprinkler system
almost continuously, and we got like an issue to I
ran and he still had a sprinkler system going and
he and he killed it. It's like they don't want
to live in a swamp. It's not a swamp tree.

Speaker 3 (21:40):
Right, Those get really big too.

Speaker 5 (21:41):
Most people think of them as a small but in
the right area those get pretty big.

Speaker 3 (21:47):
Yeah they do. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:48):
The ones at Spring Grove are probably fifty by forty wide.
And as they get older, it seems like those chains
of flowers these are these are legomes, so they have
pea like flowers held in long chains. Those just get
longer and longer. It's pring grow. I swear I've seen
three foot long chains of these flowers.

Speaker 3 (22:08):
You know.

Speaker 2 (22:08):
A newer trees, it might be a foot.

Speaker 4 (22:10):
Looks like white wisteria. Where it blooms, it's amazing. I mean,
it's a spectacular tree in bloom. Only really blooms every
other year, so I mean it's a it's a it's
a show when it does it. But you don't want
to plant it just for that reason. The bark looks
like a beach tree. If you if you blindfolded me
and took me out and showed me the bark, I
would think it was a beach tree and gold fall collar.

(22:34):
I mean, it can be spectacular fold collar.

Speaker 3 (22:38):
What do you guys think of tree? Lie likes.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
I'm noticing they're in bloom right now. When they're in bloom,
you can't help but notice them.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
I think they're a nice ornamental tree. I'm definitely worthy
of being used.

Speaker 1 (22:48):
Yeah, there's reticulata, which is the one that's mainly out there,
is called ivory silk, right, and I'm most borderline overused.
I see it a lot. You know, it's a good
street tree, so you see it in those situations often.

Speaker 4 (23:03):
And now, yeah, that's a tree that just doesn't do
it for me. But that's kind of a it's a
personal opinion appearance type thing.

Speaker 3 (23:12):
I mean, no, it's not. I like it. You must leave.

Speaker 4 (23:15):
Exactly, I'll be back. I'll see it later. Yeah, but
I mean it's a tough tree. I mean it does
do well along as a street tree and things like that,
and a lot of people like it.

Speaker 1 (23:25):
So that's just you know, it does have a heavy fragrance.
Some people will like it more than others. It's not
that sweet fragrance that a regular lilac that you might
know has. It's more of a heavy polony scent, which
I kind of like, but some people may not. It
is a good one for bees and other pollinators. They

(23:47):
do like those flowers.

Speaker 4 (23:48):
What the tree though, I kind of like is the
is the related or closely related Chinese?

Speaker 3 (23:57):
Yeah, so I knew where you were at.

Speaker 1 (23:59):
Yeah, that pea condensus. A couple of different cultivars. They're
great Wall is a really nice treet. These have like
they're they're much like the tree lilac that we know
the ivory silk, but they also have like a cherry like.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
Bark, which I really find appealing.

Speaker 4 (24:16):
And that's what I like about it because it gives
you a multi season interest.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
It does.

Speaker 1 (24:20):
The flowers are a little more white, I think than
than ivory silk. And you know, there's a couple other
cultivars China snow, which is big and round, but great
Wall is much more upright, so you can fit that
in other places places you couldn't. I've seen it used
as a street tree. It works, but where I've seen

(24:44):
it used it's really narrow median and it's it's getting
kind of tree or truck pruned. I guess you would
call it. There's a gold version in summer. Charm is
another one to get away from all trees because we're
gonna go heavy on trees later. Nepita or the cat
mints are looking really nice right now.

Speaker 4 (25:03):
Oh yeah, just saw those yesterday.

Speaker 1 (25:06):
Yeah, there are you know, any hot and sunny location,
poor soils. They handle that really well. They don't like
to be wet. But just look like lavenders in bloom
right now, just really handsome plants that are almost bulletproof.

Speaker 3 (25:24):
That's a good one.

Speaker 5 (25:24):
When they get done blooming, make sure to cut them
back and you'll get you know, additional blooms in the
year where if I feel like if you let them
ride out, you may not get that second bloom when.

Speaker 2 (25:34):
They kind of fall apart right, kind of like lose
their form.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
So yeah, cutback is good.

Speaker 5 (25:39):
Good cutback after they're finished blooming. I would recommend absolutely.
And there's a ton of different selections now. The old
one that the stand by the standard is Walker's Low
or Six Hills Giant. But now there's smaller ones, all
with corny names, Cat's Pajamas, Persian blue, cats, meal kit
cat all because they are nepitas and cats will in

(26:01):
fact hang out around them. It's not the true cat mint,
that's cat minta, but they do attract cats.

Speaker 2 (26:12):
If you want cats straight cats in your yard, if.

Speaker 4 (26:15):
You don't want cats. It might be a catastrophe. Oh run,
it's your fault. Campanilas are looking really good. That's a
great groundcover that I love, particularly the Serbian Serbian bellflower.

(26:37):
Just great filler for anything from sun to shade. Don't
get it wet and otherwise it'll do really well for you.
Hostas are looking really nice right now. Their their folies
is still clean and beautiful. Three that I really like.
Our June first kiss in El Nino. We'll be talking
about El Nino in a.

Speaker 1 (26:57):
Minute here with Ron because apparently this is going to
be a super El nine year and what effect that
has on us, I don't know. The shrub roses are
all looking pretty good, the knockouts and all the others
that are similar type of bulletproof.

Speaker 5 (27:12):
Mostly what deer would be the one with a hasta
and the roses that.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
Uh yeah, you gotta watch it. Yeah, deer eat a
lot of those. Yep. What else have I got here?
What do you have? John?

Speaker 2 (27:27):
Or favorite trees, favorite plants, trees, whatever?

Speaker 3 (27:30):
You know.

Speaker 5 (27:30):
Nobody really likes to plant these, but they're native. They're
in balloom right now, and I think they're like one
of the coolest structural unique trees. But Cataulpa trees, yeah,
Catulpa speciosa, specifically.

Speaker 3 (27:41):
The native one to this area. And it I mean,
they just have the best structure and every tree is.

Speaker 5 (27:47):
Has its own unique shape. It's just not so uniform
and cookie cutter. And they seem to hold together so
well in storms.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Long towers are amazing.

Speaker 5 (27:56):
The flowers are so pretty, and there's so how many
big trees do we have that have such an appreciable
bloom and there's not that many. They grow really fast.
They can tolerate just about any kind of soil, the
one downside or the cigar pods right, the long skinny
pods that are a little bit of a mess that
some people might not love cleaning up. But the tree
has so many positive attributes.

Speaker 4 (28:18):
It's long lived too, yeah, very low.

Speaker 1 (28:21):
I have seen one with a lightning scar that ran
forty feet down a branch, down the trunk to the ground,
and it was callousing the entire length of it with
no problem. It was just they are rock solid trees.

Speaker 4 (28:35):
One thing that I did not realize about it. Friend
of mine, you probably know, I'm Tom Robinson's down at
the Spring Grove Cemetery. And their horticultural staff now. But
his house they have mature katapa trees on the hill
in the backyard, and I was over there once in
the spring when they were in bloom, and the aroma

(28:56):
was absolutely amazing nice and I never realized that about them.
But they're really nice ascent when they blow.

Speaker 5 (29:02):
The one thing to just for people to be aware
of though, when you buy a young one, they're not
the most impressive young tree, right you get it shows
up and it's a little wiggily, and it's not perfectly straight.
It's not the cookie cutter thing that we Americans are
used to having, our perfect our red sunset, perfectly shaped
red maples every time. You know, it's something that is

(29:24):
a little bit of a late bloomer, if you will,
not to have a pun. But it just takes them
a few years to get established. But they grow so
fast that it just doesn't take long before they really
produce shade. If people want something that's not gonna be
the next lifetime to give shade, it's a great plant.

Speaker 3 (29:40):
You know, we got to go to break.

Speaker 1 (29:41):
But you know, another tree just like that that's a
really good one we'll talk about later. Is Kentucky I'm
here with John, but you're from Madison Tree Care and Landscaping,
and Ron rothis from the arbor doctor, and Ron you are.
I don't know, how would you describe your passionate observer
and researcher of weather.

Speaker 4 (30:01):
Yeah, amateur meteorologist and official National Weather Service cooperative observer,
which means I keep official records in my backyard or
go into the National Weather Service every day.

Speaker 3 (30:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (30:14):
So yeah, I was a class weather man in first grade.
So I've never outgrown that. So I all my teachers
saw is going to be a meteorologist someday. But I
went our border culture.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
You went astray, but you've never lost, never lost that
love of weather. So I keep hearing all these these
stories in the in the news about it being a
super El Nino year. What will that mean for us
as gardners?

Speaker 4 (30:38):
Yeah, and there's still some some hesitation or they're not
really sure exactly how strong the al Ninho is going
to get. I think there's pretty high confidence that it's
going to be at least a moderate al Ninhoka some
of the and this.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
Is a warming of the water. Water in the western
or Eastern Pacific.

Speaker 4 (30:55):
Eastern and Central Pacific ocean. Yeah, some of the water
temperature below the surface are extremely warm right now, I
mean historically warm. And the question is how much of
that is going to make it to the surface. If
that some of that, if all that water came to
the surface, it would probably be the strongest al ninia
we've ever had. But there's a lot of there's a

(31:18):
lot of doubt as to how much of that's going
to make it to the surface. So it's definitely going
to be a pretty strong one. How does it affect us?
And there are other things around the globe that can
can also come into play, So it's it's a little
bit complex when when everything plays off of everything else.
But in general, it actually looks like the Midwest Great

(31:38):
Lakes could be a little bit cooler than normal this summer,
but then transition as we get into winter, when the
alninia probably would be peeking toward the defall or winter.
In other words, the strongest part of it would be
warmer than normal conditions in like the northern half of

(31:58):
the country cooler than north in the southern half of
the country. That kind of put Cincinnati in between in
the in the Ohio Valley in between. Also looks like
it could be become drier than normal in the Ohio Valley,
especially over the over the summertime, a lot of times

(32:19):
al Nino's will produce really heavy precipitation in California, winter
precipitation in California and the Sierra Nevadas. Some of those
really strong atmospheric river events have have happened in conjunction
with al Ninos, but not always. Again, there's a lot
of things that play off each other.

Speaker 1 (32:39):
Could just possibly help the extreme drought and the low
water levels in Colorado in the Southwest.

Speaker 4 (32:45):
If it plays out like that, it definitely could.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
Yeah, welcome, Yeah, in the Florida in the south is
awfully dry too.

Speaker 4 (32:53):
Right, It looks like over all the al Ninia would
increase significantly scipitation over the United States in general, But
like I said, in the Ohio Valley it could actually
and in the Great Lakes it could actually end up
being a little bit less, maybe even some periods of

(33:13):
some drought.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
What about just the next couple of months for us?

Speaker 1 (33:17):
What what are the weather models showing as far as
you know rainfall and temperature.

Speaker 4 (33:23):
Well, for the for the near future, it's looking like
we're going to be in general, you know, fairly warm,
and the precipitation has gotten pretty sketchy in the in
the Cincinnati area at least, although just to the west
Mississippi Valley's been getting a lot of rain. It looks
like the eastern part of the country the drought's going

(33:45):
to be easing some, but over the western part of
the country, it looks like drought will be increasing over
the next over the next three months.

Speaker 1 (33:56):
And there's all those concerns about the Colorado River and
all those reservoirs.

Speaker 2 (34:00):
Along the way that getting.

Speaker 4 (34:02):
Very very low, right, they got very little winter precipitation
winter snowfall this year. They did get a big snowstorm
about a week ago in the Rockies, which I mean
it's just a fraction of what they would get the
entire winter, but it's certainly you know, it added probably
two or three inches of water, so I mean, it

(34:23):
was it was helpful.

Speaker 1 (34:25):
So ron, what can we as gardeners do to affect
the weather.

Speaker 4 (34:29):
To affect the weather to make it better for us.
It's hard to affect the weather, but knowing what the
weather's doing is helpful, sure, I mean, and I always
encouraged my clients to have a rain gauge in the yard. Yeah,
because plants need that supplemental water when we get into

(34:50):
a dry period, and a lot of times you don't
really realize that it's driving. Right now, I'm running a
bit of a deficit at my house. Forecast. Yes there's
rain in the forecast, but if you read the fine print,
it's kind of maybe it will, maybe it won't, you know,
scattered showers and always say that your trees don't really

(35:10):
care what fell at the airport. So so having a
rain gage, knowing what you had have in your yard
and then supplementing natural rainfall to make sure that the
total equals about an inch a week from May through November.

Speaker 1 (35:25):
You know, and people you know this is we're talking
about trees today. But when people a lot of people
think about watering their yards, they're they're watering their annuals,
their they're flowers, their obvious plants, and they tend to
forget about their trees, which is very important. Those are
the most important elements in your yard. And then also
your conifers, which are going to be important for the winter.

(35:48):
They need to be watered through the year too.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
Couldn't agree more. Gotta water, the conifers in.

Speaker 2 (35:53):
The droughts, yes, exact priority.

Speaker 3 (35:55):
And the big trees you can't replace them.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
Right, you're listening to Let's guard with Scott early. We'll
be back in a few minutes, yeah,