Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Five six six nine zeros or Kae Commins Spirit Health
text line. If you want to interact with the show,
A lot of great stuff here in the first hour.
You guys are really funny. We appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
So we were talking a little bit ago about the
Broncos defense and expectations coming up this year, and I
asked you guys the question about would you rather or yes,
would you rather have the Broncos lead the league in sacks,
which they did last year, or lead the league in takeaways?
You both said takeaways. What do you think they have
the better chance at leading the league in this upcoming season?
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Dave, Well, I see Nick. Nick would be able to
address this.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I think as a former player, former safety, but I've
always thought, I mean, you work on takeaways, You practice
drills on takeaways to emphasize takeaways.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Coaches talk about takeaways.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
We got to get three on Sunday, But they just
when they happen. They kind of happen sometimes in bunches.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
So I don't know. I mean, I think so.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
If you had if you had to, we could give
you a guess. I could give you a guess on
how many takeaways. I think the Broncos will have I'm
gonna guess a few more than last year five, So
I'm gonna say I'm gonna go with thirty one. But
that would just be sort of an educated guess, and
I don't know how you can quantify it.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
I mean that put you in top five, top four
category of the league.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
One would yeah, thirty one.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
I mean that last year we had four teams in
the thirties. The year before you had three teams in
the thirties. So if if you're hey, if you have
thirty takeaways on the season, you're the best. You're in
the category for the best defense.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I'm gonna say takeaways. And the reason I.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
See you think they can lead the league in takeaways.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Absolutely because last year we could talk about the sacks,
and for me, I look at Cooper and Nick Benito
continuing to get better as a tandem. So that means
a quarterbacks got to get the ball out of his hands.
And everyone loves sacks, but what we don't account for
on a consistent basis are precious because when you speed
(02:07):
up that clock in that quarterback's head and he can
feel that he's trying to get rid of the ball.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So for us.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
It's tips and overthrows, and as we say, you got
to get those. So when I look at what the
Broncos did to add play making ability to the defense,
I'm thinking more interceptions because you're playing more tight coverage.
Because now Ronley Moss is healthy, he's a year better.
You have Jaday Baron right at some point you're going
(02:32):
to play him at some particular position. And now the
Broncos can play more man to man. And when you
play more man to man, yeah, does it make it
tougher for the guys in the back end, But it
actually it gives the guys up front an opportunity to
get home. And then now you think about punch outs
and what I mean by that sack force fambles. Guys
may catch the ball fifteen yards down the field, but
(02:53):
now who fuck is punching it out? Now Brandon Jones
is punching it out. So now that in my mind,
looking at it from a secondary stated point, that's how
they can increase their tote.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
As far as tone over, I've.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
Always wondered this, and I probably a vast players defensive
players this in the past. But I guess I'll ask you, guys,
is there something too, repping its practicing it. Is there
something you can do to improve that?
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Oh yeah, okay, emphasize Okay, I.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Mean coaches talked about it all the time, and they
create drills. It's like he talked about when he talked
about punch out, I was thinking working on punching the
ball from a receiver. You know, when you track a
guy down from behind, I mean you want to make
sure you get control of him with one hand, but
the other hand you're trying to upcut that ball, you know,
(03:42):
and guys, I mean, guys get a little loose with
the football, especially when they're running, and especially receivers. Running
backs you know, maybe not as much because they're used
to tote in the rock and high and tight, but receivers
a lot of times you catch it, put it away
and then you make a move and you see on okay,
when this guy makes a move, the ball comes away
(04:03):
from his body.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
So he is a guy that.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
This week we want to emphasize when if he catches
it and starts to run, we are ripping for the ball,
because you see that stuff on film.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
The other thing, too, is you teach everyone pursues to
the ball, and I don't mean that you have to
do pursuit drill, but it's just known when the guy.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Catches the ball on the opposite side of the field.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Everyone is running to the ball because you never know
how many times do we see it. And it's said
on TV by the announcer and David's father saying so
many times in his career, Hey, you know, Johnny on
the spot, that guy was pursuing to the ball. As
soon as I receive a running back, stop his feet
to make a jump cut. Now a guy comes in
and punches the ball out. And I played with Drake Blid.
(04:48):
Drake Blid was probably I know people talk about Peter R.
Tillman all the time, but Drake Blid was one of
the best guys I've ever seen in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
To have a guy catch a ball over.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
Him and then now he's able to get it's both
hands in it, and he did this thing where you
guys can't see it, but it's like a flipping motion
and he's able to flip the ball out of the
re receiver's hands and now it is on the ground.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
So if you teach your.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
Guys, okay, we're always constantly in pursued. At the end
of the day, it's all about the ball. Now, that's
how you increase your level of ternal lists.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, I guess it's like like a lot of things,
including sacks, right, they come come in bunches sometimes, And
it's honestly, what I was thinking about this topic today.
I felt like we had to continue to bring up
the fact that the offense has to kind of carry
their load carry the share here, right, because if the
offense can't be competent, if the offense can't put pressure
on opposing teams, well, then the defense really can't do
(05:41):
their job either. And really, I mean include special teams
as well, but it's just sacks, turnovers, all those kinds
of things. They usually come because the opponent posing offense
has to do things that are outside of their comfort
zone a little bit. Is that Is that a fair assessment, Dave?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Yeah, I mean, if a team is behind right in
the fourth quarter by a couple scores, you got to
throw when you when you have to throw, then edge
pass rushers, defensive guys in general, I mean that should
peak their interest because now, okay, we know you have
(06:19):
to throw, and you know we know, so we're fixing
a dial up a.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Few things here.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
But if the team, if you're if the opponent is ahead,
then you get running game, then you get quick passing game.
You're not gonna you probably a head coach say to
a coordinator that you were up by ten, seven minutes
to go have the ball. Let's be careful here, right.
If the worst thing we do is punt, we're fine.
(06:46):
What you don't want to do is take a deep
drop back and let one of those edge guys come around,
knock the ball out of your quarterback's hands and turn
the ball over and then they get back in the game.
So yes, I think, I think the offense does have
to do their share, and if they can be ahead,
If the Broncos offense can put the Broncos ahead in
the fourth quarter by a couple of scores, then I
(07:09):
think anybody the Broncos play will have a hard time
blocking that defense.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
If I'm coaching the Denver Broncos defense, I'm just saying,
whatever the offense gives us, that's just a cherry on top.
We're looking to force turnovers and get takeaways.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Well, we're looking to score too as well.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
So independent of yes, I mean because as a mindset.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
But we can also talk in reality.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
But for me, that is a reality. I believe that
can take place with the team. I mean, Nick Benito
had thirteen and a half sacks, Zach Allen had eight
and a half. Zach Allen wrecked the Cincinnati Bengals by himself, and.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
The Broncos average twenty four or so points on offense,
which is one of the best marks they've had since
Peyton Manning was here.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
Well, once again you get both of these things working
in concert together and you get more turnovers than sacks,
that point total actually goes up. And then we look
at it turnover differential. We're gonna see both the Broncos
offense and their defense and the top five in the
league in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
We'll come back. I got a number. TJ.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Watt signed his extension yesterday. You're not gonna believe this number.
As we're walking up to the Rockies at six o'clock,
who are back in action tonight taking on the Twins
or cover starting at six o'clock this evening. So this
was this blew my mind, and JJ Watt actually shared it,
(08:33):
so it was even funnier because he said if his
brother TJ even lets him reach for his wallet. He's
gonna be so bad. You realize JJ Watt in his
twelve years in the NFL career earnings one and twenty
nine point seven million. Pretty nice, I think, good work
(08:54):
if you can get it. Yeah, his brother TJ the
extension he just signed years one twenty three, so his
entire twelve of your career and.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
They only do you want to insert that phrase.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Only one twenty nine, only seven million, and the TJ
Watt just signed for one hundred and twenty three million.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Just now different era.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Very sure, because here's what we're seeing with this. The
NFL game continues to grow in popularity. What that means
salad cap goes up, more sponsorship for the NFL, more
streaming services, so the pot's gonna get bigger. Like ten
years from now, there's gonna be some other kid and
we're gonna look at salads like this is utterly ridiculous,
(09:41):
But this is where we are.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Who's a better player, Like, when all said and done,
both are Hall of famers. But JJ Watt JJJ over TJ. Yes,
different different players, Okay.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
J JJ was more of a run anchor that had
the ability to rush the passer to the thing that
strikes me about TJ is the motor runs every single,
every single play, right.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
He He and.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Max Crossby are I think the two guys that are
at the top of the list when it comes to
I'm not saying there aren't other guys that play hard.
These dudes, I mean are like energizer bunnies. So I mean,
I think JJ was a more dominant player, And I
think if you look at TJ back in the day,
(10:34):
you'd been like, I mean, okay, I think he's a
good player, plays hard, maybe little undersize for the position,
but he has he has been an unbelievable talent.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
So I just kind of looked as up right, I'm
still going to choose JJ. But because if you look
at JJ, you asked yourself, well, who has created the
most career turnovers?
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Turning your heads to the side with the smile you
just waiting. So I'm gonna falling into a trap. I'm
still gonna go with JJ. Anyway.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Twenty seven forced farmbers, two interceptions in his career. That's JJ, Right,
TJ thirty three forced fumbles and seven interceptions in his career.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
And the reason going, Hey, good for him, applause.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Who's more sacks.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
Let me look at this up. I'll look it up
a second. But I'm still gonna go with JJ. I
just like his enagery and being an interior.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Guys more sacks he does.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Yeah, I mean, I mean obviously being on the edge
where everyone else is doing the work inside and he's
flowing a quarterback to you.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Of course, you know those edge rushes. But I like
that the power of those interior guys.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Those guys don't really get a lot of praise, you know,
get the warren SAPs, those types of guys.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, it's so still.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Smiling the grinnin over there.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Well, I'll pull up the side because we gotta get
a break, but I'll hold up to sell the other side.
But I take TJ. I I just I think he's
a more dominant player. But but again, it's not to
take AWA from JJ.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I don't know if he's a more dominant player. You
you take TJ.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
But I don't know that you would say he was
not more physically dominant.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
No, he wasn't. No.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I guess part of it is sort of the tail
end of JJ's career kind of weighs on me and
how difficult. It was for him to sort of stay
on the field. That's not fair because in his heyday,
when he was at his best, he was unbelievable.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
It's tough.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
And I and I'd also say, and this is no
offense to the Texans or even the Cardinals, the teams
that JJ played for. That Steelers defense has been great
well while TJ has been there the entire time. But
that's who they are, Like, that is the Steeler, that's
like what they build their brand around.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
That's the Steelers DNA.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
I'm saying, of course, So is it fair and you
plug JJ into that what happen is.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
More domination, well on the hands of a.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
For man because he gets beat up too much from
the previews that you've seen.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yes, that is not my version of the Man of Steel.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
So you like the super dominance like never loses. I
mean even Henry Caville got beat up like by Batman.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
Well, the only reason that happens is because introduction to.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
His home planet. So that that's why it happens.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
So so no, I'm not gonna go see it because
I don't want to see the Man of Steel get pumbled.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
I mean, I mean, just let me just think about it.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
I bet you rooted for Tom Brady, like I bet
you were a massive Patriots fan at one point, weren't you.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
No, I bet you were.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
It was the best team in the NFL. You wanted
to continue to win and be dominant. No, even though
you know where I do have red, white and blue.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
No, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
I mean, I do have a TV twelve book sign
by Tom in a helmet, But that just because we
were competitives.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
It is sure not because he's like my favor guy.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
No, So I love Dave, not for long, fair enough,
by the way, very quickly following up on our conversation
a moment ago, So in twelve years, So right now,
JJ Watt actually has more sex than TJ Watt. So
I gotta I gotta correct that. I thought it TJ
had passed him. He will probably this season because TJ
has one hundred and eight sacks to the one fourteen
(14:34):
point five of JJ.
Speaker 4 (14:37):
That's not fair because one brother has had a better
team than the other.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
She's had some pretty good teams, Pittsburgh and Houston. Let's
be totally honest.
Speaker 4 (14:49):
I mean, who's the better organization historically?
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Pittsburgh.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I don't know man Houston had. Houston has such a
good team that Gary kube I had no interest.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
What's Gary Kubiak?
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Yeah it was Gary Kubiak had no interest whatsoever in
Peyton Manning while he was there. They were so good
one and Matt shab Remember that Dave I played with.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
I I remember that. I don't remember it like that?
Speaker 1 (15:18):
Where am I getting wrong?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Do you mean which part? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You say all of it if you have a different recollection,
all of it?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Okay, all of it, literally every word out of your mouth. Okay,
Well correct me then what I just did?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Well tell me then, what is the story with that?
Because I always understood?
Speaker 3 (15:39):
So help me understand. So say it again so that
I can. I'll discorrect you as you go.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Okay, I said that the Houston Texans, Matt Shab as
their quarterback, had no interest in Peyton Manning with Gary
Kopiak as the head coach.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
That's not true. Okay, that's that's it's not true. So
did they did they have interests in Bene Many? Yes?
They did?
Speaker 1 (16:04):
Okay over matshop.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
I don't. I mean, I don't know how they would
have balanced that. I think probably Matt shob would have
been gone.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
I don't think you bring Peyton Manning in for him
to be the backup player.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
I mean, Majob is coming off a Pro Bowl season,
and Matt job.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Was a good player.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
I think I don't know that match Shob would ever
be considered, uh in the NFL like a great player.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
He had some great.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Moments, like unbelievable games where it's like wow, I mean
this dude.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
But yeah, yes, they did have an interest in Peyton Manning.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
Okay, so well, that changes everything because honestly, at the time,
I remember it was it was forty nine Ers, right,
Jim Harbaugh wanted because it.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Was the forty nine Ers. Was that Harbor?
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Then?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I think it was Harbor, yeah, Harbaugh? And then of
course the Broncos. Yep, I think there was some maybe
some Tennessee kinds of all. Okay, and I thought that
was it, and then Lotield thought maybe Houston because it
was in the same division and they Houston looked like
the team to sort of counter knicks point about Houston
being a terrible team, Houston had a good team with
(17:17):
Andre Johnson and Aaron Foster and JJ watt Man.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
Hold on, I'm not just gonna let you slide that
by me. I didn't say they were a terrible team.
I just said Pittsburgh was a better team.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
You said they were a lottery team.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
And I played with Matt Shaw and in a lot
of these games in my final two seasons in the league,
and we never really beat that cult team. So, I mean,
if Coop was really looking at him, I wish we
would have told us back then. I would say, go
get it. I would have went some gay.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
I mean, the two teams that were the finalists for
Peyton were the Broncos and the Titans.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And Titans, Okay, Titans, the bry Nyers really weren't that close, huh.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
I don't know if I don't know how close they were,
how close they got. But it came down to, I believe,
I believe this to be a fact, came down to
Denver or Tennessee if Houston.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
I'm just curious about this because I've always thought of
it different. So I'm glad to hear that I can
change my opinion on it. If Houston would have shown
more interest, would Peyton considered them.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
That I that I don't know, Okay, that I don't know.
There was there was interest from Houston. I don't know,
maybe what you know, what was the fly in the ointment?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Was it?
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Was it?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Money? Was it? I mean, look at it this way.
Gary Kubiak ran.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
I mean his offense, which was a byproduct of Mike's offense.
And Gary, Gary, I mean Gary was one of the
nice is one of the nicest guys in the world.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
But Gary, you know when you when.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
You're around him, he's got a way, well Nick play
for him. He's got a way of doing things, and
it's going to be done that way.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Right.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Peyton, I mean Peyton ran his own offense, ran his
own offense. I think at the end of that relationship,
and I'm not saying with something that they could not overcome,
but it took a little bit of it took a
(19:23):
little bit of work, I think for the head coach
who'd done it his way forever to then be able
to say, Okay, now I've got a guy that I
mean a lot of times wants to walk to the
line of scrimmage and look over and change the play.
Gary was never ever a huge check with me, guy,
(19:43):
We're going to change the play. Gary was a huge
run the play guy. And so that I mean that
I think that was an interest, the fact that they
could work together and get the best out of each
other and win a championship. I think it's a testament
to both of them realizing, like, you know, this is
(20:05):
a team. We have to have everybody and I need you,
you need me, so we have to share our toys
in the sandbox, you know.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
I think that was the.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
Magic elixir for the Broncos when they went to the
Super Bowl. Having two guys I would call both of
those guys alpha males and knowing as though you have
a quarterback who's used to running the show, and he's
capable of running the show, but.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
You are a type of coach.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
Where you want things done a certain way based on
how you scheme him up and other coaches that you
coach under before each one of those guys to give
up something, to sacrifice a little something to help the
team win. And once again, going back to SUPERWL fifty,
Peyton was not really truly himself, but knowing as though
you have him in the huddle, eighteen is there and
(20:57):
it builds a lot of confidence in other players around
him on offensive defense side of the ball.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
And we don't see that a lot of.
Speaker 4 (21:02):
Times in the coaching ranks, where coaches are willing to
kind of take a little off of themselves and their
pride and give it over to someone else, because we
know some coaches it's a pride game.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I want everyone to talk about me.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
This team succeeds, this quarterback succeeds, it's all on me.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
I did this well.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Successful people, and I think this is the case whether
in pro football or any other business.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
I'm not saying that you can't. You won't find some
that might.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
Be atypical of this, but successful people trust themselves, right.
I mean you sure, you know. It's not that you
don't trust others. But I trust me, right, So I've
done it this way. You know, for this many years
we've won. Now all of a sudden, you know, when
(21:54):
Peyton got traded, it didn't get traded. When he signed
with the Broncos. The first thing, one of the first
things John Fox did after he stopped jumping up and down,
was to bring in Tom Moore, right, and they installed
Peyton's offense. It's your offense, you're gonna run it. Bring
(22:15):
in Tom Moore. Tom Moore teach. The coaches were running
Peyton's offense when he inherited when when when John Elway
fired John Fox and hired Gary Kubiak, that was not
in totality Peyton's offense. That was Gary's offense that Peyton
had to make adjustments to. And I think Gary had
(22:38):
to make some adjustments as well, but Peyton really had
to had to make some adjustments in that offense.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So as possible, it might have been a non starter anyways,
when Peyton was released.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
By the Indianapolis Colts.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
If the Houston Texas had shown like more outward interests,
because at least at the time it didn't seem like
that was the case, least for me, he had to
show more outward interest, it may have been a non
starter anyways, because Gary Kubeck at the time was like, well, look,
we're already one of the best offenses in the league
and we're doing it with my system. So I think I.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Think that's I think that's true.
Speaker 3 (23:10):
I think I know there was interest from Houston standpoint,
but I don't know about the interest from Peyton's standpoint.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
And I do think Gary was comfortable with.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Matt Shabb who was a very you know, I mean,
he could be a good quarterback at times.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
He played great.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Other times it was like, oh, you know, and Gary
was doing it his way with that offense. And I
think he also knew you'd been around the league long
enough to know if you if you have Peyton Manning
Peyton's and Peyton's comfortable doing it Peyton's way, and.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
The other part about it you got to look at the.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Roster of players, and I'm sure with Tennessee everyone thought
that with his the fact that he went to Tennessee,
going back and playing for the Titans, that would have
been a big draw.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Well for Peyton, he is a big competitor.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
He wants to go to a place that is going
to allow him to compete because for guys who reached
that type of status, legacy is.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
A part of it.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
You have to remember your legacy. Who are you chasing
and who's chasing you. So ultimately, coming to Denver was
the best thing that ever happened for Peydon Manning.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
And it's wild.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
Because the individuals that I've spoken to who are Colts fans,
they feel a little slided, I'm sure, but I'm like, well,
he didn't do that. The organization made that decision.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Well, that's exactly right. I mean, they had the first
overall pick and they were going to take Andrew Luck.
And it is fascinating. I know Colts fans historically they
have the statue outside the stadium exactly. They still to
this day, you know, wonder about that, and I think
it's sort of tough to judge it with hindsight because
a lot of people didn't understand at the time. I mean,
(24:54):
even Peyton Manning, like we heard from Todd Helton at
the Times, said hey man, this guy can't throw it
like ten yards right now. I mean, we're worried about
these four next surgeries. There's a lot that's writing here
about what he's going to be able to do the
remainder of his career. Now, of course came here to
Denver and they were dominant. It was it was that
kind of thing. But at the time, I mean, Andrew
Luck looked like as close to a camp miss as
(25:14):
you could possibly imagine coming into the NFL.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
You know, we are in an.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Interesting era where you see teams like the Green Bay
Packers draft first round quarterbacks and keep their current guy
and they have them work together. But that's not the norm.
That's not that's not typical. So I know, for Colts fans,
they were like, is there a way we could have
made this work with Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck in
the building at the same time, I don't know, I.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Do the answer is no, that was not going to work.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I mean, you were you were not going to bring
Peyton back, and I mean I think I think the
Colts had decided we're going to go with Andrew Luck.
We think Andrew Luck can be a great player, and
so you're not bringing Peyton.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
You're not going to bring him back to compete with.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Andrew lul Luck, you know, and and with a guy
like that in the building, you know, I think I
think you can stifle a young guy's sort of a
cent in the game because I think Andrew Luck, you know,
his dad played playing in the league, Oliver uh played
for the Houston Oilers, so he grew up around pro football,
(26:23):
and so Andrew Luck knew most obviously who Peyton Manny was.
I would guess who's based on Andrew's personality. He would
have been totally deferential to Peyton Manning. I mean might
have called him mister Manning. So you're not going to
get the best in terms of being able to bring
the best out of your young quarterback. If if he
(26:45):
is just with the way that he's been brought up,
which I think is good. If he's so respectful, you know,
and deferential to a star like Peyton Manning, that's your
your You put him in that role, and there's really
how do you ever allow him to get out of it?
Speaker 4 (27:02):
See, there's pros and cons at being a backup quarterback.
Playing with Peyton Manning. You could say that you played
with one of the better quarterbacks in the league.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
But at the same time you.
Speaker 4 (27:10):
Say, well, you didn't get a whole lot of reps either,
because true paydon's gonna get those reps. Yeah, because if
you were to go back and say, well, let's look
at all the quarterbacks that were backups, how many times
we've ever seen them in the regular season game, and
we think about what happened with brought Oswaloen when Oswalow
was here, because Brock being the same situation as Andrew Luck.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Look, I was leading the team when Peyton was out.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Gary took me out in that Charges game, very important game,
trying to get.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
The number one seed. He never got it back. They
beat the.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
Chargers, they ride up in the soundset, but it's the
sheriff who's getting all the praise and not Brock.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
And Brock took it personal well first.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
He did, and that of course eventually let him leading
leaving for the Texans. Is that true? By the way,
as we're sort of talking about things that maybe we
remember a certain way, was it true true that Brock Osweiler,
I mean, the money maybe was better with Houston that
would have been in Denver. Is it true that part
of the reason he chose the Houston Texans is because
he felt slighted.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
I can't.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
I can't confirm that. I've I've talked to Brock many
times and consider him a friend. We've you know, after
after he is a player. But I know this, the
Broncos did not expect that. The Broncos did not expect
the Houston Texans to put that kind of offer on
(28:31):
the table. The Osweiler camp did not give the Broncos
a chance to match. So you mean you can you can,
you can draw conclusions however you want to. I think
the Broncos felt like they made a good offer and
then all of a sudden that offer got blown out
(28:53):
of the water. And I think from the Broncos perspective,
what they have loved. I don't know what they would
have done, but what they have loved Os Wilder's camp
to call and say, listen, here's the deal, here's the offer.
What do you want to do?
Speaker 1 (29:10):
I heard it was the difference of like seven million,
Like I can't remember. Yeah, he he he made it
killing at by NFL standards at that time. I just
don't remember what he made like forty million with Houston,
but I can't remember how many years.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
And then he ended up going to Cleveland after that too.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
They traded him to Cleveland. Remember they had to trade
a second round pick to Cleveland to offload the contract.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
Crazy, so they traded a quarterback and a second rounder
to get rid of him.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I mean sometimes, man, you know, it does matter in
terms of if you're an offensive player, what offense are
you in, and who's coaching you?
Speaker 2 (29:56):
It really does. And a lot of a lot of
young guys, a lot of guys at various levels of football,
don't understand that.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
They think, hey, you know what my skill set, you
can plug it into this offense and to that one
and it won't matter if that guy is coaching me.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And there are some players that that is true for, but.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
The overwhelming majority of players I would say that is
not the case.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
Think about Drew Brees, he gets injured with the Chargers,
he tries to hook on with Nick Saban with the Dolphins,
then he fails the example, and then now he ends
up in New Orleans with Sean Payton.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
He's a Hall of Famer, hall of famer, so what
you speak of is true.
Speaker 4 (30:39):
And then that play call annoying every intricate details of
that quarterback to say that I'm going to put him
in a position to be successful. And this is why
I'm so optimistic about the Broncos this year because even
though bow Knicks isn't.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Drew Brees, He's not Drew Brees, but he.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
Has a certain skill set that's better than Drew Brees,
who in his second year in this offense.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I'm thinking this office is going to soar because of
the mobility.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Yes, because obviously you know some die hard quarterback coaches
or evaluated and always saying well, quarterbacks have to make
plays or show they can make plays from the pocket.
I'm like, that's part of it, But for me, that's
only thirty percent of it, because the game is changing.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
You were just talking about how great you.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Know, t J. Watts was, So with that type of
edge pressure, I want my guy on a perimeter. I
won him on a perimeter. And last year, you know,
statistically bo had a great year. But I think bow
was a better quarterback throwing on the move opposed to
standing in the pocket.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Well, I mean the numbers support that too. I mean, honestly,
whether you get into the advanced analytics or otherwise, the
numbers for him throwing on the move were tremendous, and
it actually in the pocket was where he sometimes struggled
a little bit. So when we come back, I'm glad
you brought up bow Nicks because there's something being held
against bow Knicks and a lot of the assessments of
(32:04):
what he's going to be this upcoming season I think
is a bit unfair.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
And we'll explain coming up next
Five six six nine zeros or Kae Commins Spirit Health
text line. If you want to interact with the show,
A lot of great stuff here in the first hour.
You guys are really funny. We appreciate you.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
All right.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
So we were talking a little bit ago about the
Broncos defense and expectations coming up this year, and I
asked you guys the question about would you rather or yes,
would you rather have the Broncos lead the league in sacks,
which they did last year, or lead the league in takeaways?
You both said takeaways. What do you think they have
the better chance at leading the league in this upcoming season?
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Dave, Well, I see Nick. Nick would be able to
address this.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
I think as a former player, former safety, but I've
always thought, I mean, you work on takeaways, You practice
drills on takeaways to emphasize takeaways.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Coaches talk about takeaways.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
We got to get three on Sunday, But they just
when they happen. They kind of happen sometimes in bunches.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
So I don't know. I mean, I think so.
Speaker 3 (01:02):
If you had if you had to, we could give
you a guess. I could give you a guess on
how many takeaways. I think the Broncos will have I'm
gonna guess a few more than last year five, So
I'm gonna say I'm gonna go with thirty one. But
that would just be sort of an educated guess, and
I don't know how you can quantify it.
Speaker 1 (01:22):
I mean that put you in top five, top four
category of the league.
Speaker 2 (01:26):
One would yeah, thirty one.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
I mean that last year we had four teams in
the thirties. The year before you had three teams in
the thirties. So if if you're hey, if you have
thirty takeaways on the season, you're the best. You're in
the category for the best defense.
Speaker 2 (01:42):
I'm gonna say takeaways. And the reason I.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
See you think they can lead the league in takeaways.
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Absolutely because last year we could talk about the sacks,
and for me, I look at Cooper and Nick Benito
continuing to get better as a tandem. So that means
a quarterbacks got to get the ball out of his hands.
And everyone loves sacks, but what we don't account for
on a consistent basis are precious because when you speed
(02:07):
up that clock in that quarterback's head and he can
feel that he's trying to get rid of the ball.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
So for us.
Speaker 4 (02:12):
It's tips and overthrows, and as we say, you got
to get those. So when I look at what the
Broncos did to add play making ability to the defense,
I'm thinking more interceptions because you're playing more tight coverage.
Because now Ronley Moss is healthy, he's a year better.
You have Jaday Baron right at some point you're going
(02:32):
to play him at some particular position. And now the
Broncos can play more man to man. And when you
play more man to man, yeah, does it make it
tougher for the guys in the back end, But it
actually it gives the guys up front an opportunity to
get home. And then now you think about punch outs
and what I mean by that sack force fambles. Guys
may catch the ball fifteen yards down the field, but
(02:53):
now who fuck is punching it out? Now Brandon Jones
is punching it out. So now that in my mind,
looking at it from a secondary stated point, that's how
they can increase their tote.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
As far as tone over, I've.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
Always wondered this, and I probably a vast players defensive
players this in the past. But I guess I'll ask you, guys,
is there something too, repping its practicing it. Is there
something you can do to improve that?
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Oh yeah, okay, emphasize Okay, I.
Speaker 3 (03:21):
Mean coaches talked about it all the time, and they
create drills. It's like he talked about when he talked
about punch out, I was thinking working on punching the
ball from a receiver. You know, when you track a
guy down from behind, I mean you want to make
sure you get control of him with one hand, but
the other hand you're trying to upcut that ball, you know,
(03:42):
and guys, I mean, guys get a little loose with
the football, especially when they're running, and especially receivers. Running
backs you know, maybe not as much because they're used
to tote in the rock and high and tight, but receivers
a lot of times you catch it, put it away
and then you make a move and you see on okay,
when this guy makes a move, the ball comes away
(04:03):
from his body.
Speaker 2 (04:04):
So he is a guy that.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
This week we want to emphasize when if he catches
it and starts to run, we are ripping for the ball,
because you see that stuff on film.
Speaker 4 (04:15):
The other thing, too, is you teach everyone pursues to
the ball, and I don't mean that you have to
do pursuit drill, but it's just known when the guy.
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Catches the ball on the opposite side of the field.
Speaker 4 (04:27):
Everyone is running to the ball because you never know
how many times do we see it. And it's said
on TV by the announcer and David's father saying so
many times in his career, Hey, you know, Johnny on
the spot, that guy was pursuing to the ball. As
soon as I receive a running back, stop his feet
to make a jump cut. Now a guy comes in
and punches the ball out. And I played with Drake Blid.
(04:48):
Drake Blid was probably I know people talk about Peter R.
Tillman all the time, but Drake Blid was one of
the best guys I've ever seen in the NFL.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
To have a guy catch a ball over.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
Him and then now he's able to get it's both
hands in it, and he did this thing where you
guys can't see it, but it's like a flipping motion
and he's able to flip the ball out of the
re receiver's hands and now it is on the ground.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
So if you teach your.
Speaker 4 (05:13):
Guys, okay, we're always constantly in pursued. At the end
of the day, it's all about the ball. Now, that's
how you increase your level of ternal lists.
Speaker 1 (05:19):
Yeah, I guess it's like like a lot of things,
including sacks, right, they come come in bunches sometimes, And
it's honestly, what I was thinking about this topic today.
I felt like we had to continue to bring up
the fact that the offense has to kind of carry
their load carry the share here, right, because if the
offense can't be competent, if the offense can't put pressure
on opposing teams, well, then the defense really can't do
(05:41):
their job either. And really, I mean include special teams
as well, but it's just sacks, turnovers, all those kinds
of things. They usually come because the opponent posing offense
has to do things that are outside of their comfort
zone a little bit. Is that Is that a fair assessment, Dave?
Speaker 3 (05:57):
Yeah, I mean, if a team is behind right in
the fourth quarter by a couple scores, you got to
throw when you when you have to throw, then edge
pass rushers, defensive guys in general, I mean that should
peak their interest because now, okay, we know you have
(06:19):
to throw, and you know we know, so we're fixing
a dial up a.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Few things here.
Speaker 3 (06:25):
But if the team, if you're if the opponent is ahead,
then you get running game, then you get quick passing game.
You're not gonna you probably a head coach say to
a coordinator that you were up by ten, seven minutes
to go have the ball. Let's be careful here, right.
If the worst thing we do is punt, we're fine.
(06:46):
What you don't want to do is take a deep
drop back and let one of those edge guys come around,
knock the ball out of your quarterback's hands and turn
the ball over and then they get back in the game.
So yes, I think, I think the offense does have
to do their share, and if they can be ahead,
If the Broncos offense can put the Broncos ahead in
the fourth quarter by a couple of scores, then I
(07:09):
think anybody the Broncos play will have a hard time
blocking that defense.
Speaker 4 (07:13):
If I'm coaching the Denver Broncos defense, I'm just saying,
whatever the offense gives us, that's just a cherry on top.
We're looking to force turnovers and get takeaways.
Speaker 2 (07:23):
Well, we're looking to score too as well.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
So independent of yes, I mean because as a mindset.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
But we can also talk in reality.
Speaker 4 (07:31):
But for me, that is a reality. I believe that
can take place with the team. I mean, Nick Benito
had thirteen and a half sacks, Zach Allen had eight
and a half. Zach Allen wrecked the Cincinnati Bengals by himself, and.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
The Broncos average twenty four or so points on offense,
which is one of the best marks they've had since
Peyton Manning was here.
Speaker 4 (07:52):
Well, once again you get both of these things working
in concert together and you get more turnovers than sacks,
that point total actually goes up. And then we look
at it turnover differential. We're gonna see both the Broncos
offense and their defense and the top five in the
league in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 2 (08:09):
We'll come back. I got a number. TJ.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Watt signed his extension yesterday. You're not gonna believe this number.
As we're walking up to the Rockies at six o'clock,
who are back in action tonight taking on the Twins
or cover starting at six o'clock this evening. So this
was this blew my mind, and JJ Watt actually shared it,
(08:33):
so it was even funnier because he said if his
brother TJ even lets him reach for his wallet. He's
gonna be so bad. You realize JJ Watt in his
twelve years in the NFL career earnings one and twenty
nine point seven million. Pretty nice, I think, good work
(08:54):
if you can get it. Yeah, his brother TJ the
extension he just signed years one twenty three, so his
entire twelve of your career and.
Speaker 2 (09:06):
They only do you want to insert that phrase.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Only one twenty nine, only seven million, and the TJ
Watt just signed for one hundred and twenty three million.
Speaker 2 (09:18):
Just now different era.
Speaker 4 (09:21):
Very sure, because here's what we're seeing with this. The
NFL game continues to grow in popularity. What that means
salad cap goes up, more sponsorship for the NFL, more
streaming services, so the pot's gonna get bigger. Like ten
years from now, there's gonna be some other kid and
we're gonna look at salads like this is utterly ridiculous,
(09:41):
But this is where we are.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
Who's a better player, Like, when all said and done,
both are Hall of famers. But JJ Watt JJJ over TJ. Yes,
different different players, Okay.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
J JJ was more of a run anchor that had
the ability to rush the passer to the thing that
strikes me about TJ is the motor runs every single,
every single play, right.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
He He and.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
Max Crossby are I think the two guys that are
at the top of the list when it comes to
I'm not saying there aren't other guys that play hard.
These dudes, I mean are like energizer bunnies. So I mean,
I think JJ was a more dominant player, And I
think if you look at TJ back in the day,
(10:34):
you'd been like, I mean, okay, I think he's a
good player, plays hard, maybe little undersize for the position,
but he has he has been an unbelievable talent.
Speaker 4 (10:47):
So I just kind of looked as up right, I'm
still going to choose JJ. But because if you look
at JJ, you asked yourself, well, who has created the
most career turnovers?
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Turning your heads to the side with the smile you
just waiting. So I'm gonna falling into a trap. I'm
still gonna go with JJ. Anyway.
Speaker 4 (11:06):
Twenty seven forced farmbers, two interceptions in his career. That's JJ, Right,
TJ thirty three forced fumbles and seven interceptions in his career.
Speaker 2 (11:16):
And the reason going, Hey, good for him, applause.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Who's more sacks.
Speaker 4 (11:22):
Let me look at this up. I'll look it up
a second. But I'm still gonna go with JJ. I
just like his enagery and being an interior.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Guys more sacks he does.
Speaker 4 (11:34):
Yeah, I mean, I mean obviously being on the edge
where everyone else is doing the work inside and he's
flowing a quarterback to you.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
Of course, you know those edge rushes. But I like
that the power of those interior guys.
Speaker 4 (11:45):
Those guys don't really get a lot of praise, you know,
get the warren SAPs, those types of guys.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, it's so still.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Smiling the grinnin over there.
Speaker 1 (11:56):
Well, I'll pull up the side because we gotta get
a break, but I'll hold up to sell the other side.
But I take TJ. I I just I think he's
a more dominant player. But but again, it's not to
take AWA from JJ.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
I don't know if he's a more dominant player. You
you take TJ.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
But I don't know that you would say he was
not more physically dominant.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
No, he wasn't. No.
Speaker 1 (12:16):
I guess part of it is sort of the tail
end of JJ's career kind of weighs on me and
how difficult. It was for him to sort of stay
on the field. That's not fair because in his heyday,
when he was at his best, he was unbelievable.
Speaker 2 (12:30):
It's tough.
Speaker 1 (12:31):
And I and I'd also say, and this is no
offense to the Texans or even the Cardinals, the teams
that JJ played for. That Steelers defense has been great
well while TJ has been there the entire time. But
that's who they are, Like, that is the Steeler, that's
like what they build their brand around.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
That's the Steelers DNA.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
I'm saying, of course, So is it fair and you
plug JJ into that what happen is.
Speaker 2 (12:54):
More domination, well on the hands of a.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
For man because he gets beat up too much from
the previews that you've seen.
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yes, that is not my version of the Man of Steel.
Speaker 1 (13:13):
So you like the super dominance like never loses. I
mean even Henry Caville got beat up like by Batman.
Speaker 4 (13:24):
Well, the only reason that happens is because introduction to.
Speaker 2 (13:27):
His home planet. So that that's why it happens.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
So so no, I'm not gonna go see it because
I don't want to see the Man of Steel get pumbled.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
I mean, I mean, just let me just think about it.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
I bet you rooted for Tom Brady, like I bet
you were a massive Patriots fan at one point, weren't you.
Speaker 2 (13:54):
No, I bet you were.
Speaker 1 (13:55):
It was the best team in the NFL. You wanted
to continue to win and be dominant. No, even though
you know where I do have red, white and blue.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
No, I didn't.
Speaker 4 (14:02):
I mean, I do have a TV twelve book sign
by Tom in a helmet, But that just because we
were competitives.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
It is sure not because he's like my favor guy.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
No, So I love Dave, not for long, fair enough,
by the way, very quickly following up on our conversation
a moment ago, So in twelve years, So right now,
JJ Watt actually has more sex than TJ Watt. So
I gotta I gotta correct that. I thought it TJ
had passed him. He will probably this season because TJ
has one hundred and eight sacks to the one fourteen
(14:34):
point five of JJ.
Speaker 4 (14:37):
That's not fair because one brother has had a better
team than the other.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
She's had some pretty good teams, Pittsburgh and Houston. Let's
be totally honest.
Speaker 4 (14:49):
I mean, who's the better organization historically?
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Pittsburgh.
Speaker 1 (14:55):
I don't know man Houston had. Houston has such a
good team that Gary kube I had no interest.
Speaker 2 (15:00):
What's Gary Kubiak?
Speaker 1 (15:02):
Yeah it was Gary Kubiak had no interest whatsoever in
Peyton Manning while he was there. They were so good
one and Matt shab Remember that Dave I played with.
Speaker 3 (15:11):
I I remember that. I don't remember it like that?
Speaker 1 (15:18):
Where am I getting wrong?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
Do you mean which part? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (15:23):
You say all of it if you have a different recollection,
all of it?
Speaker 2 (15:26):
Okay, all of it, literally every word out of your mouth. Okay,
Well correct me then what I just did?
Speaker 1 (15:34):
Well tell me then, what is the story with that?
Because I always understood?
Speaker 3 (15:39):
So help me understand. So say it again so that
I can. I'll discorrect you as you go.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
Okay, I said that the Houston Texans, Matt Shab as
their quarterback, had no interest in Peyton Manning with Gary
Kopiak as the head coach.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
That's not true. Okay, that's that's it's not true. So
did they did they have interests in Bene Many? Yes?
They did?
Speaker 1 (16:04):
Okay over matshop.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
I don't. I mean, I don't know how they would
have balanced that. I think probably Matt shob would have
been gone.
Speaker 3 (16:11):
I don't think you bring Peyton Manning in for him
to be the backup player.
Speaker 1 (16:16):
I mean, Majob is coming off a Pro Bowl season,
and Matt job.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
Was a good player.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
I think I don't know that match Shob would ever
be considered, uh in the NFL like a great player.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
He had some great.
Speaker 3 (16:29):
Moments, like unbelievable games where it's like wow, I mean
this dude.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
But yeah, yes, they did have an interest in Peyton Manning.
Speaker 1 (16:38):
Okay, so well, that changes everything because honestly, at the time,
I remember it was it was forty nine Ers, right,
Jim Harbaugh wanted because it.
Speaker 2 (16:52):
Was the forty nine Ers. Was that Harbor?
Speaker 4 (16:55):
Then?
Speaker 1 (16:55):
I think it was Harbor, yeah, Harbaugh? And then of
course the Broncos. Yep, I think there was some maybe
some Tennessee kinds of all. Okay, and I thought that
was it, and then Lotield thought maybe Houston because it
was in the same division and they Houston looked like
the team to sort of counter knicks point about Houston
being a terrible team, Houston had a good team with
(17:17):
Andre Johnson and Aaron Foster and JJ watt Man.
Speaker 4 (17:21):
Hold on, I'm not just gonna let you slide that
by me. I didn't say they were a terrible team.
I just said Pittsburgh was a better team.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
You said they were a lottery team.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
And I played with Matt Shaw and in a lot
of these games in my final two seasons in the league,
and we never really beat that cult team. So, I mean,
if Coop was really looking at him, I wish we
would have told us back then. I would say, go
get it. I would have went some gay.
Speaker 3 (17:43):
I mean, the two teams that were the finalists for
Peyton were the Broncos and the Titans.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And Titans, Okay, Titans, the bry Nyers really weren't that close, huh.
Speaker 3 (17:52):
I don't know if I don't know how close they were,
how close they got. But it came down to, I believe,
I believe this to be a fact, came down to
Denver or Tennessee if Houston.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
I'm just curious about this because I've always thought of
it different. So I'm glad to hear that I can
change my opinion on it. If Houston would have shown
more interest, would Peyton considered them.
Speaker 3 (18:14):
That I that I don't know, Okay, that I don't know.
There was there was interest from Houston. I don't know,
maybe what you know, what was the fly in the ointment?
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Was it?
Speaker 4 (18:26):
Was it?
Speaker 2 (18:26):
Money? Was it? I mean, look at it this way.
Gary Kubiak ran.
Speaker 3 (18:36):
I mean his offense, which was a byproduct of Mike's offense.
And Gary, Gary, I mean Gary was one of the
nice is one of the nicest guys in the world.
Speaker 2 (18:47):
But Gary, you know when you when.
Speaker 3 (18:50):
You're around him, he's got a way, well Nick play
for him. He's got a way of doing things, and
it's going to be done that way.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Right.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Peyton, I mean Peyton ran his own offense, ran his
own offense. I think at the end of that relationship,
and I'm not saying with something that they could not overcome,
but it took a little bit of it took a
(19:23):
little bit of work, I think for the head coach
who'd done it his way forever to then be able
to say, Okay, now I've got a guy that I
mean a lot of times wants to walk to the
line of scrimmage and look over and change the play.
Gary was never ever a huge check with me, guy,
(19:43):
We're going to change the play. Gary was a huge
run the play guy. And so that I mean that
I think that was an interest, the fact that they
could work together and get the best out of each
other and win a championship. I think it's a testament
to both of them realizing, like, you know, this is
(20:05):
a team. We have to have everybody and I need you,
you need me, so we have to share our toys
in the sandbox, you know.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
I think that was the.
Speaker 4 (20:18):
Magic elixir for the Broncos when they went to the
Super Bowl. Having two guys I would call both of
those guys alpha males and knowing as though you have
a quarterback who's used to running the show, and he's
capable of running the show, but.
Speaker 2 (20:32):
You are a type of coach.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
Where you want things done a certain way based on
how you scheme him up and other coaches that you
coach under before each one of those guys to give
up something, to sacrifice a little something to help the
team win. And once again, going back to SUPERWL fifty,
Peyton was not really truly himself, but knowing as though
you have him in the huddle, eighteen is there and
(20:57):
it builds a lot of confidence in other players around
him on offensive defense side of the ball.
Speaker 2 (21:01):
And we don't see that a lot of.
Speaker 4 (21:02):
Times in the coaching ranks, where coaches are willing to
kind of take a little off of themselves and their
pride and give it over to someone else, because we
know some coaches it's a pride game.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
I want everyone to talk about me.
Speaker 4 (21:16):
This team succeeds, this quarterback succeeds, it's all on me.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
I did this well.
Speaker 3 (21:21):
Successful people, and I think this is the case whether
in pro football or any other business.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
I'm not saying that you can't. You won't find some
that might.
Speaker 3 (21:33):
Be atypical of this, but successful people trust themselves, right.
I mean you sure, you know. It's not that you
don't trust others. But I trust me, right, So I've
done it this way. You know, for this many years
we've won. Now all of a sudden, you know, when
(21:54):
Peyton got traded, it didn't get traded. When he signed
with the Broncos. The first thing, one of the first
things John Fox did after he stopped jumping up and down,
was to bring in Tom Moore, right, and they installed
Peyton's offense. It's your offense, you're gonna run it. Bring
(22:15):
in Tom Moore. Tom Moore teach. The coaches were running
Peyton's offense when he inherited when when when John Elway
fired John Fox and hired Gary Kubiak, that was not
in totality Peyton's offense. That was Gary's offense that Peyton
had to make adjustments to. And I think Gary had
(22:38):
to make some adjustments as well, but Peyton really had
to had to make some adjustments in that offense.
Speaker 1 (22:44):
So as possible, it might have been a non starter anyways,
when Peyton was released.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
By the Indianapolis Colts.
Speaker 1 (22:53):
If the Houston Texas had shown like more outward interests,
because at least at the time it didn't seem like
that was the case, least for me, he had to
show more outward interest, it may have been a non
starter anyways, because Gary Kubeck at the time was like, well, look,
we're already one of the best offenses in the league
and we're doing it with my system. So I think I.
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Think that's I think that's true.
Speaker 3 (23:10):
I think I know there was interest from Houston standpoint,
but I don't know about the interest from Peyton's standpoint.
Speaker 2 (23:22):
And I do think Gary was comfortable with.
Speaker 3 (23:24):
Matt Shabb who was a very you know, I mean,
he could be a good quarterback at times.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
He played great.
Speaker 3 (23:31):
Other times it was like, oh, you know, and Gary
was doing it his way with that offense. And I
think he also knew you'd been around the league long
enough to know if you if you have Peyton Manning
Peyton's and Peyton's comfortable doing it Peyton's way, and.
Speaker 2 (23:45):
The other part about it you got to look at the.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
Roster of players, and I'm sure with Tennessee everyone thought
that with his the fact that he went to Tennessee,
going back and playing for the Titans, that would have
been a big draw.
Speaker 2 (23:57):
Well for Peyton, he is a big competitor.
Speaker 4 (24:00):
He wants to go to a place that is going
to allow him to compete because for guys who reached
that type of status, legacy is.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
A part of it.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
You have to remember your legacy. Who are you chasing
and who's chasing you. So ultimately, coming to Denver was
the best thing that ever happened for Peydon Manning.
Speaker 2 (24:22):
And it's wild.
Speaker 4 (24:22):
Because the individuals that I've spoken to who are Colts fans,
they feel a little slided, I'm sure, but I'm like, well,
he didn't do that. The organization made that decision.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
Well, that's exactly right. I mean, they had the first
overall pick and they were going to take Andrew Luck.
And it is fascinating. I know Colts fans historically they
have the statue outside the stadium exactly. They still to
this day, you know, wonder about that, and I think
it's sort of tough to judge it with hindsight because
a lot of people didn't understand at the time. I mean,
(24:54):
even Peyton Manning, like we heard from Todd Helton at
the Times, said hey man, this guy can't throw it
like ten yards right now. I mean, we're worried about
these four next surgeries. There's a lot that's writing here
about what he's going to be able to do the
remainder of his career. Now, of course came here to
Denver and they were dominant. It was it was that
kind of thing. But at the time, I mean, Andrew
Luck looked like as close to a camp miss as
(25:14):
you could possibly imagine coming into the NFL.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
You know, we are in an.
Speaker 1 (25:19):
Interesting era where you see teams like the Green Bay
Packers draft first round quarterbacks and keep their current guy
and they have them work together. But that's not the norm.
That's not that's not typical. So I know, for Colts fans,
they were like, is there a way we could have
made this work with Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck in
the building at the same time, I don't know, I.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Do the answer is no, that was not going to work.
Speaker 3 (25:42):
I mean, you were you were not going to bring
Peyton back, and I mean I think I think the
Colts had decided we're going to go with Andrew Luck.
We think Andrew Luck can be a great player, and
so you're not bringing Peyton.
Speaker 2 (25:56):
You're not going to bring him back to compete with.
Speaker 3 (25:59):
Andrew lul Luck, you know, and and with a guy
like that in the building, you know, I think I
think you can stifle a young guy's sort of a
cent in the game because I think Andrew Luck, you know,
his dad played playing in the league, Oliver uh played
for the Houston Oilers, so he grew up around pro football,
(26:23):
and so Andrew Luck knew most obviously who Peyton Manny was.
I would guess who's based on Andrew's personality. He would
have been totally deferential to Peyton Manning. I mean might
have called him mister Manning. So you're not going to
get the best in terms of being able to bring
the best out of your young quarterback. If if he
(26:45):
is just with the way that he's been brought up,
which I think is good. If he's so respectful, you know,
and deferential to a star like Peyton Manning, that's your
your You put him in that role, and there's really
how do you ever allow him to get out of it?
Speaker 4 (27:02):
See, there's pros and cons at being a backup quarterback.
Playing with Peyton Manning. You could say that you played
with one of the better quarterbacks in the league.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
But at the same time you.
Speaker 4 (27:10):
Say, well, you didn't get a whole lot of reps either,
because true paydon's gonna get those reps. Yeah, because if
you were to go back and say, well, let's look
at all the quarterbacks that were backups, how many times
we've ever seen them in the regular season game, and
we think about what happened with brought Oswaloen when Oswalow
was here, because Brock being the same situation as Andrew Luck.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Look, I was leading the team when Peyton was out.
Speaker 4 (27:35):
Gary took me out in that Charges game, very important game,
trying to get.
Speaker 2 (27:39):
The number one seed. He never got it back. They
beat the.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
Chargers, they ride up in the soundset, but it's the
sheriff who's getting all the praise and not Brock.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
And Brock took it personal well first.
Speaker 1 (27:49):
He did, and that of course eventually let him leading
leaving for the Texans. Is that true? By the way,
as we're sort of talking about things that maybe we
remember a certain way, was it true true that Brock Osweiler,
I mean, the money maybe was better with Houston that
would have been in Denver. Is it true that part
of the reason he chose the Houston Texans is because
he felt slighted.
Speaker 2 (28:10):
I can't.
Speaker 3 (28:11):
I can't confirm that. I've I've talked to Brock many
times and consider him a friend. We've you know, after
after he is a player. But I know this, the
Broncos did not expect that. The Broncos did not expect
the Houston Texans to put that kind of offer on
(28:31):
the table. The Osweiler camp did not give the Broncos
a chance to match. So you mean you can you can,
you can draw conclusions however you want to. I think
the Broncos felt like they made a good offer and
then all of a sudden that offer got blown out
(28:53):
of the water. And I think from the Broncos perspective,
what they have loved. I don't know what they would
have done, but what they have loved Os Wilder's camp
to call and say, listen, here's the deal, here's the offer.
What do you want to do?
Speaker 1 (29:10):
I heard it was the difference of like seven million,
Like I can't remember. Yeah, he he he made it
killing at by NFL standards at that time. I just
don't remember what he made like forty million with Houston,
but I can't remember how many years.
Speaker 2 (29:29):
And then he ended up going to Cleveland after that too.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
They traded him to Cleveland. Remember they had to trade
a second round pick to Cleveland to offload the contract.
Speaker 2 (29:39):
Crazy, so they traded a quarterback and a second rounder
to get rid of him.
Speaker 3 (29:44):
I mean sometimes, man, you know, it does matter in
terms of if you're an offensive player, what offense are
you in, and who's coaching you?
Speaker 2 (29:56):
It really does. And a lot of a lot of
young guys, a lot of guys at various levels of football,
don't understand that.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
They think, hey, you know what my skill set, you
can plug it into this offense and to that one
and it won't matter if that guy is coaching me.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And there are some players that that is true for, but.
Speaker 3 (30:17):
The overwhelming majority of players I would say that is
not the case.
Speaker 4 (30:22):
Think about Drew Brees, he gets injured with the Chargers,
he tries to hook on with Nick Saban with the Dolphins,
then he fails the example, and then now he ends
up in New Orleans with Sean Payton.
Speaker 2 (30:35):
He's a Hall of Famer, hall of famer, so what
you speak of is true.
Speaker 4 (30:39):
And then that play call annoying every intricate details of
that quarterback to say that I'm going to put him
in a position to be successful. And this is why
I'm so optimistic about the Broncos this year because even
though bow Knicks isn't.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Drew Brees, He's not Drew Brees, but he.
Speaker 4 (30:58):
Has a certain skill set that's better than Drew Brees,
who in his second year in this offense.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
I'm thinking this office is going to soar because of
the mobility.
Speaker 4 (31:07):
Yes, because obviously you know some die hard quarterback coaches
or evaluated and always saying well, quarterbacks have to make
plays or show they can make plays from the pocket.
I'm like, that's part of it, But for me, that's
only thirty percent of it, because the game is changing.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
You were just talking about how great you.
Speaker 4 (31:26):
Know, t J. Watts was, So with that type of
edge pressure, I want my guy on a perimeter. I
won him on a perimeter. And last year, you know,
statistically bo had a great year. But I think bow
was a better quarterback throwing on the move opposed to
standing in the pocket.
Speaker 1 (31:44):
Well, I mean the numbers support that too. I mean, honestly,
whether you get into the advanced analytics or otherwise, the
numbers for him throwing on the move were tremendous, and
it actually in the pocket was where he sometimes struggled
a little bit. So when we come back, I'm glad
you brought up bow Nicks because there's something being held
against bow Knicks and a lot of the assessments of
(32:04):
what he's going to be this upcoming season I think
is a bit unfair.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
And we'll explain coming up next
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