After 4-1 homestand and statement win, have Rockets turned a corner?

After a prolonged stretch of mediocrity, the Rockets (26-15) completed their recent homestand at 4-1, punctuated by a statement win over a key Western Conference rival.

By defeating San Antonio (30-14), Houston moved up to the No. 4 spot in the West standings, and the Rockets only trail the second-seeded Spurs by a game in the loss column.

So, have the Rockets finally turned a corner, and are they a legitimate contender? In Thursday’s show, our Ben DuBose and Paulo Alves debate the pros and cons.

Topics include a recent regression by Alperen Sengun on defense; encouraging signs of growth from Reed Sheppard and Jabari Smith Jr.; the impact of losing Steven Adams (severe ankle sprain) for an extended period; and whether the team’s striking home-versus-road splits (15-3 in Houston, 11-12 away) could make capturing home-court advantage for the playoffs even more important.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Rockets Fans, Welcome to The Rockets Launch Pod, an exclusive
podcast from the home of the Rockets, Sports Talk seven
ninety Red Nation. Get Ready, Ready, Get Ready. The Rockets
Launch Pod starts now.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
Welcome aboard, Welcome back to another new episode of The

(00:51):
Rockets Launch Pod, presented by Clutch Fans and with support
from Sports Talk seven ninety, the official flagship radio station
of your Houston Rockets. As always, your host, I'm Ben
Dubo's he's Palo Alves. It's our first episode in a
couple of weeks, so as far as the full show goes,
there's a lot to catch up on. We do repurpose
the Clutch bands live post games that I do with

(01:14):
Deave PARTISTI and some special guests on this podcast channel.
So our listeners have heard from me, they have not
heard from Pallo since the Rockets have at least to
an extent, turned their season around. When we last recorded,
Pollo and I, that is back during the road trip
when the Rockets went zero to three in Portland and Sacramento.

(01:35):
It felt like that was them bottoming out, and at
one point they were ten and ten in their last
twenty games. Well, now the Rockets are at the halfway
point of the year. They're twenty six and fifteen. They're
back on that fifty two win pace that they finished
that a year ago, and so I'm sure we'll talk
about whether that's a good thing as the episode progresses,

(01:56):
but certainly the level of play since the road trip
has been much better. The Rockets just completed a five
game homestand they went four and one, and now starting
tonight we're recording. On Thursday, the twenty second of January,
the Rockets have a challenging back to back in Philadelphia
and Detroit, made even more difficult by the fact that

(02:16):
you won't have Steven Adams for either of those games
against fairly physical and imposing front courts. Steven is out
indefinitely with a severe sprain of his left ankle, which
we'll definitely talk about today as well. But because it's
been a couple of weeks since Powlo and I have recorded,
and I've been doing the Clutch Fans postgame shows, you
guys have heard from me, you haven't heard from Polo,

(02:38):
So I'm going to kick it to him for the
opening monologue, if you will, Pallo, how differently are you
feeling about this team now coming off that four and
one home stand where you did have a loss to
the Thunder in which you had a terrible fourth quarter.
But other than that, I mean, you win eighty percent
of your games. It's hard to complain about it. The

(02:59):
most recent one was nationally televised Tuesday night. Reach Shepherd
looked fantastic. You came back from sixteen down to beat
a very good Spurs team that at the moment is
number two in the West, but it is only one
game ahead of the Rockets in the lost column. Rockets
back in the four seeds, so as things stand, they
would have home court advantage at least one round in
the Western Conference playoffs. I guess, Pawell, my question for you,

(03:21):
how differently do you feel about this team after the
four and one home stand. Do you have a sense
of relief relative to when we last recorded on that
zero to three road trip.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
Well, actually, the timelines for me work a little bit differently.
And what we mean what do they mean by this?
We recorded the priors of the Kings game and you
can go and check last five. And I was pretty
kill about it. I thought that as long as as
long as we're the we're within striking distance of the
three seed will be fine, right. I have the whole

(03:54):
thing about how what really matters is docking the thunder
in round two, and then we los to the Kings
and all of my optimism just went to work. We
lost to the Kings, and I was like, well, we
might just not be that great or not be good
at all, because I mean, that's just how the NBA works.

Speaker 2 (04:14):
If there's one thing.

Speaker 3 (04:15):
That you can I guess all back on, not really
fall back how much you could. That was something that
you can apply to basically any time in NBA history,
is that if you're losing to the Kings, it might
be due. And so when we lost to the Kings,
I was like, well, this doesn't look good at all.

(04:35):
And it's not like it's not like it was close,
like they pulled away middle of the fourth quarter and
just never looked back. It just simply went run of
those games where the Rockets seem to hang in there
and then don't close it out in the end. And
so at that point I was I was I was
questioning things. But then we won against the Balls, which
is to be expected. Then we you know, we kept

(04:59):
the close for a little it against the thunder and
they're lost. And then we beat the Timberwolves without and
so they got you will from that, uh, And then
beating the Pelicans is expected, but well the expected well
up to that point has what wasn't you know what
was happening, So you know, always great to get a win.
And then that Spurs game happens, and the Spurs are

(05:21):
a pretty good team right there. They have the two
seed when it was healthy. Uh, so that's a good win. So,
you know, from a from an overall, overall like then
fast two perspective, I think it's fine. I think the
same logic applies that we had that I had on
the previous waller things that we're going poorly, not too high,

(05:41):
not too low either. It's just well we're a game back.
I guess on the lost column from the two seed,
we have the same losses as then it gets there
of pree seed. You know, granted that I gots are
playing without Yoki, but still they they that won't grant
them extra wins when they get to when when we
get to the side of the seeding for the playoffs.
So fine from a from a overall perspective, but getting

(06:03):
into a little bit of specific players and specific things
about the team. I was not impressed about that Spurs game.
I know it's a win, I know it's a great team,
but I saw confirmation of some stuff that I had
been talking about that I had been thinking about that,
particularly about Albern Shingo. I had touched on it a

(06:26):
little bit in previous spots, and in the Spurs game
it was especially especially glaring, especially in the second half.
The effort from shang Un just doesn't seem to be
there nearly to the level that it was last season
on defense especial, And so I just remembering from last night, right,

(06:46):
you know, you come out the Rockets are down sixteen.
Halfway through the third quarter, there's there's a play where
where Shingun, well, where castles on the ground grabbing the ball,
and Shingun just kind of haphazardly like put a hand
on it and looks to the reft to try and
throw to say, hey call it jump Paul, right, And
I'm like, really, that's kind of the bare minimum, like

(07:07):
you could have tried to take the ball away from
him rather than just, you know, clearly look for the
jump ball. And I'm sorry if this is going to
be very specific, a very specific grant, and then you
look at or well, then the jump ball happens and
he loses the jump ball to six foot six the
front castle, which you know, well you have hazard like

(07:28):
you have kind of you kind of hassed your way
into a jump ball where you probably could have taken
the ball away from him or at least try to
could have been a little Jayshontate with it. And then
you know, try to just take the ball away wrestled
with the ball out of his arms. You didn't, so
you settled for the jump ball, didn't try to get
better than that, and then he lost the jump ball.

(07:48):
And on the same possession that he lost the jump ball,
you lost the jump Paul stood there ball watching as
they scored the two, and I'm like, come on, man,
like that that's the That's that perfectly exemplifies what I'm
talking about.

Speaker 2 (08:03):
Yeah, and I do want to jump in real quick
and address the elephant in the room, which is that
he came back early from a sprained ankle, and that
might be contributing. However, I do agree with you, there's
some stuff just the awareness plays where he doesn't even
notice or care about a cutter someone going back door.
Reminiscent of the days when James Harden would get this
buying compilation package just clipped of his low lights that

(08:28):
I don't think you can attribute to the ankle if
he's not quite a springy and the jump balls maybe,
but the stuff that's awareness when he's moving just by
and otherwise that I think does speak to the middle side.
Just wanted to jump in quickly and address the ankle
component because I do think that there are small parts
you can attribute to that, but by and large, I
think your points are valid.

Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yeah, and one hundred percent. You know, you can blame
some of it on the angle, but it's it's you know,
you put it, you know perfectly. It really reminds me
of Jane Tartan, you know, when he's engage and James James,
I guess had his little lights as well, even when engaged,
but it really seemed like he that just doesn't care

(09:09):
when when you will when not defending on ball or
just you know, can can't be bothered to put up
a contest. Man, he's challenged at the rim and he
does nothing like literally, you know, guy is driving guard
a defend around his hip or a little all the
step behind and shan Gun you know, shows help and

(09:30):
then doesn't jump to try and block it, and and
then he's giving it both the layup and the and
the dump off to his men behind him like Cornet
was feasting on that on Apron Singun, I guess mispositionings.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
And then you look at when.

Speaker 3 (09:45):
The Rockets came back. It's a six minute stretch where
the where the Spurs didn't scut a single basket, you know,
partly due to just missing jump shots, partly due to
the Rockets playing better defense. You know, they got some
open jump shots. They will that they didn't. They cannot saying.
I'm not saying going six minutes without scoring was justifight
some of it as well, but a real part of
it was also you know the fact that they weren't

(10:08):
getting easy buckets. And you know that six minute stretch
happens with Shingun on the bench. The Rockets come back
in that game, all the way back with Singun on
the bench, and then Sengun comes back and the first
possession he has a defensive breakdown again, you know, and
I know he has a quox bucket to give the
Rockets a four point lead, you know, very late in
that game. But I challenge you, and I'm not being

(10:31):
a hater here. I think we've moved past that with
Singun and in my opinions on him, just watch the
second half and just pay attention to him, Like forget
about all of the rest of the game. Just pay
attention to him, his body language and the way he's moving,
the speed that he's moving at, and just look at
how he's playing. You know, it's not when we walked.
When we see him move, it doesn't seem like he's

(10:52):
debilitated with his movement. It really seems to be an
effort thing.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
And on the.

Speaker 3 (10:59):
Team, that's that a lot of like the main problem
with this team, we've talked about it at nauseum is
the fact that they can't string possessions together to gain
a real lead or to stop other teams from coming
back defensively when the offense is not working. And I'm sorry,
I hate to say it, but Ching Hun is a
very large part of why that's happening. It reminds me, well,

(11:21):
the attitude reminds me of Jame start. It It seems like, oh,
it seems like Chinghum's arrived and he's really good offensively,
and he is on sometimes the best on some that's
second best player on this team, and he's widely regarded
as a star now. But that doesn't mean if you
get to go to you know, you get to behave
like a superstar on defense, because to be honest, you're
going on office, but you're not good enough for the

(11:41):
team to survive. Where if if that's the attitude that
you're going to be having, and you know, there's nothing
better than to look at it with your own eyes.
Not gonna, i guess, publicize any type of websites here,
but just google NBA replays, click the first link, quick
second half, and watch it back. Because I did watch

(12:02):
it back because I said something about this two games
ago and I got flamed on Twitter for and so
I decided, Okay, this time, I'm gonna rewatch the this
is the fact that I got last night. I'm gonna
rewatch the game and see if it was real. And
it is real and you and you might say that
the comeback was largely due to Reach Shepherds scoring outburst
and the Spurts going cold from three, Well, a large

(12:24):
part of it was also because the Rockets were getting
stopped and the Sports were getting gold from three. But
at the same time during the obviously she gonna have
those breakdowns, had that that sequence of just really terrible
possessions defensively, after the jump ball, he goes to the bench,
they go six minutes without scoring. The Rockets are now
the game's not basically tied. He comes back in and

(12:46):
the only possessions like you can separate possessions into two types.
The ones where the rose of the defensive breakdown in
an easy basket and eighty percent of those in that
streat post that six minutes scoring drought are mostly on
shingle or The other ones are ones where the Spurs
decided to go ISO mode and settle for a gym
start in ISO and Rockers were doing a very good

(13:07):
job defending them. And then the large part of why
this game went really well was because they we had
KD and the man on on Wemby and having him
settle for gym clos and he did for all for
a large part of it, and the Spurs offense didn't
have the type of movement that they typically do to
get wenby his angles to get to the rim, but
a large part of it was the possessions where we
got stops were mostly they settled into ISOs and KDMs

(13:31):
and would put the clamps on Wemby. So like, that's
a real concern and I hope that it locks in
for the playoffs, but even even before the playoffs, like
getting the second or third seed is key, and there
is something to be said about the stretch of games
that you play before you head into the playoffs and
having some steam as you as you get into the

(13:51):
as you get into the playoffs, and you know, having
the widespread belief among the team that you are an
elite team, and you only get that truly by winning
a bunch of games in a row, or by you know,
winning a bunch of games against chially good teams like
the Thunder, like the like the Wolves when they have
and like the Nuggets when they have yoga. You know,
like the sports to some extent, But I didn't wasn't
really impressed by how the sports played last night. So yeah,

(14:13):
like that that's my mold. That's my kind of overarching
theme about about where the Rockets are. I guess there's
there's a couple of things the weekend that I don't
know if you. I don't know if you want to
get in you know, bigger pitch of things before we
get into some more specific players.

Speaker 2 (14:32):
Well, let me throw a counter to this. First off,
I think if there's any coach in the NBA that
I would want to sort out an effort issue defensively,
it's em Udoka. And there's still forty one games left
to play before we get to the playoffs. So I'm
saying a lot of the same things that you are,
but I am going to give, especially on that side

(14:54):
of the ball, the benefit of the doubt to emay Udoka.
I do think he can make some headway there, and
I do think that some of the problems in recent
games have been made worse by the fact that the
Rockets are short handed, and when you're this short handed,
it's tougher to make the effort. Subs basically saying, like
that Clipper game where neither Katie nor Shangoon played in
the fourth quarter because clearly IM didn't like the effort, Well,

(15:17):
it's tougher to do that when you're as short handed
as they've been in recent games. That's hopefully going to improve.
Dorian Finney Smith continues to improve by the week. I
thought against the Pelicans he showed some really promising signs,
not just making the thority but attacking the closeouts. Tarry
Easton is now back from his ankle sprain, so other
than Steven Adams, it does feel like they're getting healthier

(15:39):
and so hopefully that'll give Emay more options if that's
what he needs to sit Shingoon down for a sequence
or two in the upcoming games to try and get
him in the right headspace, and hopefully Shingoon's ankle continues
to improve as well. I think that's while not everything
that's going on, it's at least a small part of it.
So I would say with Shingoon there's hope there. But

(16:01):
I will say that last night, even with those issues,
and even with the Spurs, look, I don't care if
you're just shooting against air. What they did from three
in the first half of that game was insane. The
Rockets took so many punches, and yet because you had
Reed Shepherd and to a lesser extent, Jabari Smith Junior
making those shots in the final eighteen minutes of that game,

(16:22):
it didn't matter. And if there's a blessing in disguise
to this Steven Adams injury. And I mean this in
the big picture, because certainly it's gonna hurt your win
loss record. I feel confident in saying that you'll lose
some games that you would have otherwise won if you
had Steven Adams. He's that important as a floor razer,
most notably on defense the data shows it, but also
with his offensive rebounding presence. But in the big picture,

(16:46):
Ima Ujoka is gonna have no choice but to trust
Red Shepherd and Jabari Smith Junior. Because you need the
shot making, you need the spacing, You're gonna need those
Jabari at the five lineups. Like the last two games
that Steven Adams Adams has missed, the win over the
Spurs and then the Timberwolves game that Stevens set out
because it was night too of a back to back,

(17:06):
Clint only played twelve minutes. So this is not gonna
be a situation where the Rockets turn Clink Capella loose
and say your great value, Steven Adams. Just go and
try to give us, you know, eighty percent of what
Steven did, and we're going to go on with the
same formula. No, that's not gonna be good enough. This
team just doesn't have that level of firepower, especially if
you're playing at times the double big the way the

(17:27):
Rockets did with Steven and Alpi and Aman Thompson. That's
three of your five players who are nonspacers. This is
going to force ema Udoka to go back to the
drawing board to get enough points, and so he's gonna
have no choice but to sink or swim with guys
like Reid and Jabari and especially Red. You know, Jabari
typically gets benefit of doubt because he always provides at
least some value with his defense, and as a connector

(17:49):
with Red, there's been games where he just hasn't played
much if the three isn't going in because the potential
defensive issues. Well, now that you don't have that offensive
rebounding superpower, Emo Udoka is to have no choice but
to trust Reed Shepherd, and he got rewarded for it
against the Spurs, and when Reid made the shots, I
also thought it brought out a better version of him defensively,

(18:11):
but he got in more rhythm. We saw the huge
block he had on a three late in the game
from Champinnee. So I think in the big picture, assuming
Steven gets back and it's not a given, but the
average return timetable Steven Adams Stats put this out on
Twitter is a little over two months for a Grade
three ankle sprain. That's still a decent bit of buffer

(18:31):
before the playoffs. Steven's gonna do what he does. He's
established enough. You're not gonna have to worry about Steven
forgetting how to play or needing to figure out where
he fits with this team. Steven in his minutes is
going to be the same guy. But in this period
where E is gonna have to trust the young guys more,
they're gonna have to shoot more threes, go for more variance,
go for better half court execution because you can't fall

(18:54):
back on the offensive rebounding formula. Maybe this gives a
confidence boost to guys like Reid and Jabbari, and that's
what you need. You know, if you want to look
at this season, we've done quarter season reviews. Now we're
at the halfway point, so we're you know, two of
the four quarters are in the books. From the first
twenty to the next twenty, A men Thompson clearly got better.

(19:15):
A men's been like a twenty eight and five guys
since the start of December on sixty two sixty three
percent true shooting. He's been tremendous. His defense has improved
as well well, if you get read In Jabari, because
they're going to get longer leashes, they're going to get
to play through their struggles, particularly Read the next few weeks,
and the way they haven't in the past. There's a

(19:37):
world where when Steven gets back, you have a better
version of those young guys, and maybe that's what you
need to have a real chance to make a run
this year because with all the flaws you talked about,
and you're right, particularly with Shunggoum, but just the overall defense,
it wasn't dialed in, especially early in the game. When
you have read In Jabari just making shots at that level,

(20:00):
nothing else matters. Like when you have that version of
those two young guys, they are I call them your
ceiling guys. They are so important, Like this team's potential
goes through the roof when you have that version of
those two guys, to the point where even against a
good team, even when you're not dialed in defensively, even

(20:20):
when you're down sixteen, you absorb the haymakers of those
early threes, the rockets still found a way, and so
to me, that's the I guess that's the counter. It's that, yeah,
this is these are blows losing Steven Adams, and that's
gonna make the Shongoon issues in the paint even more
clearing when you don't have another big body to help
protect the rim. But if you get a better version

(20:43):
of these young players, then your ceiling is even higher
than it was before. So I guess, Palllo, I'm curious
your thoughts on that, the juxtaposition of you know, the
low lights defensively, that now these young guys potentially taking
steps forward and what that means for the overall ceiling at.

Speaker 3 (21:01):
The seam hundred percent like those guys like you know,
you know what you're going to get for the most
part from basically every other guy on the team. I
guess besides, sorry, but those guys are where the ceiling's
going to come from, especially offensively, Which is why I
never really bought into the blaming Glabari part of it,
because as I will struggle to say this credits mad

(21:24):
More on Twitter. He put it perfectly. You know, Tivari
is the type of guy that will have you know,
scoring out purst and have consistent sixteen to eighteen points
for a stretch, and he'll have his pop off games,
but those, when those happen, you're winning already, right and
he's part of the reason why you're winning. But you
don't notice it as much as when he goes one
for eight and the team's are the overall struggling to shoot,

(21:47):
and you know those, I guess you kind of noticed
those more. But you know, we've talked about this a
lot on the spot. Clebaris may really big strikes this season,
and even with that really rough stretch of games, he's
still at thirty six percent from three on the season,
which goes to show you exactly what I was talking about,
which is he's been played well. But I guess you

(22:11):
just don't notice that as much in whims as you
do in losses when he plays poorly, because I guess
you kind of look to him to be the guy
that's going to break that shooting zone for the team,
and sometimes sometimes that just doesn't happen. But every guy
has cold streaks. Gavar is still someone who has done
a really good job, you know, connecting possession to possession
on offense and spring sprinkling in those midrange shots that

(22:34):
he can get really easily, basically at will, within the
flow of the offense that sometimes keep us from going
on those scoring droughts. So Gabari is someone who, if
he's playing well, if he's pacing the floor well, just
increases the ceiling of this scene that much more. As
you said, and with Read, it's except what we saw
last night.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
Read is the.

Speaker 3 (22:53):
Only guy on the team beyond i'll be open single
and KD who can just take over again, right, men,
Thompson can to some extent, but he's easier to deny,
let's call it that. With Read, you know, there's really
no denying him. He can score from all three levels.
He can pass the ball, there's no there's no clear
hole on his offensive game, but you can exploit. And

(23:16):
so when he is hitting, he can take over games.
And that's and he can be that third scoring star
on this team, and sometimes even higher than that. I
mean last game he was higher than Katy in in
points scored. Might have been a high lgoon as well. Actually,
so as you said, those guys are the X factors
and the ceiling razors. But at the same time, it's
as you said, it's as I said before. Sorry, I'm

(23:38):
not a non believer on this team, and I think
I've made clear by my optimism in previous positive things
or joy so well. But I'll only be if like
it's not you know, it's I'm not a doomer, I
guess saying, oh, this, this team is not good enough.
But I'm only going to be full in, you know,
parting to this team when I start seeing that they
can lock in when when it managers most or a

(24:00):
consistent stretch of games in which when the game's on
the line, they lock in and they play great defense.
Because the offense might be great, but if you if
you do not have the ability to lock in on
defense and in street possessions, in the clutch in those
tough games, then it doesn't really make like you can't
really look at the framework of this team as if
you've got KDS the closer, because no close, like if

(24:23):
you're gonna rely on one. The only way you can
win from your offensive output is if you've got just
a dynamic offense that's can that's like multi like that
has multiple scoring flights, and then you you can you
can manufacture open looks really easily, Like we'll get the
Pacers last year, right, they weren't quite good enough to
you know, win the championship, and they were in the

(24:45):
weak East. But the reason they could afford to be
poor on defense was because schematically that that team was
systematically getting open looks. And so you you you they
could very easily survive a poor game from one of
their stars because they could very easily get twenty from
from Embard or get twenty from Aeronie Smith. Right, the

(25:05):
Rockets are not and are not going to be that
type of offense, and so the process of acquiring a
closer only makes sense if you were saying part of
themsive identity that you have last year that you can
at least step into it when the game gets close
and allow KD to be that closer, right, Because you're
not expecting your closer to drop fifteen points in the

(25:27):
last five minutes of a game. No, you're expecting the
game to be tied, getting stops both ways. And your
closer is the guy that can make a shot when
nobody else can. Right that he might go for seven points,
scoring foury something like that, but not the guy that's
going to be by himself going back and forwards with
the entire other team, because if you can't play defense
and the entire other teams scoring right, and you don't

(25:49):
have offens and enough offensive fire part this systematically to
keep up with that, and it's not reasonable to ask
KAD or anybody else for that matter, to do that.
So yeah, for me to eventually fully by into this
team as a real contender, as someone who has a
real shot to beat Bill k C, I need to
see them having the ability to lock in on defense

(26:10):
and win you know, a few games in a row
or you know seven oundred ten or something like that
where they get close games, or he can even be
against four teams, but he reached the fourth quarter, he
reached the final five minutes, and the team locks in
on defense and you can survive from I guess a
few buckets from your stars, because that's the way they

(26:31):
won last year. And that's why acquiring kV made so
much sense because kV on last year's team would have
easily been enough offense to get them, you know, assobly
to the finals. Who knows now kind of beating what
I just said. But if the team can't get the
stops on defense, then whatever production k is going to
give you in the clutch, it's not going to be
enough because he's not going to keep up with with
an entire other team.

Speaker 2 (26:57):
I do think though, that in the interim what we're
seeing from the variable guys, the X factors and read
specifically against the Nuggets against the Spurs, Reid was tremendous
and basically all three of those games against the Nuggets,
including some high leverage possessions in that game they had
stolen by the amen quote unquote foul of Tim Hardaway Junior.

(27:19):
And now we see what Reid did against the Spurs.
He largely did it the first game in San Antonio
back in November as well. It's just he gave some
of it back, especially in the clutch defensively when he
got targeted. This time, he didn't give it back defensively,
And so for me, I'm seeing a lot of hope
that this version of Reid can potentially get the Rockets
to the front of the line behind Oklahoma City. Now,

(27:41):
can you beat the Thunder four times out of seven,
that's a different discussion. Something's gonna have to change with
the framework of the team. Either you get Fred and
Fleet back, or there's some sort of significant trade, or
maybe Read takes a sustained leap forward. Something needs to
change with the framework to get to the level of OKC.
But so we sort of knew that going into the

(28:01):
year this is a historically great Oklahoma City team. Every
team in the NBA is dealing with that. I guess
for me, especially coming off that ten to ten stretch
through twenty games, I'm taking a little bit of consolation
in that I don't see any team in this two
through six range. We saw what the Rockets did in
LA against the Lakers on Christmas, just systematically destroying them.

(28:23):
Now they had the big win in Denver, they came
back from sixteen down against the Spurs. I guess for me,
I'm I'm just thinking, can the Rockets get to the
front of that group right behind Oklahoma City and then
let's worry about Oklahoma City come April. That's my viewpoint
right now, and so if you look at it through
that prism, I'm taking what we're seeing, particularly from the

(28:46):
X factors, as a positive sign that even if the
Rockets aren't the two seed right now, maybe they do
eventually get to the front of the line. Even if
they're not the two seed, and name perhaps the Steven
Adams injury costs them there, they can be the second
best team by the time we get to the playoffs.
Does that makes sense?

Speaker 3 (29:04):
And that's to some extent, I guess how I feel
might actually be answered a little bit from from the
question about I'm about to take this off script a
little bit. I'm gonna ask you a question, which is,
who do you think wins in a playoff series between
this year's team and last year's team, and by how much?

(29:25):
Like give me a serious card so I know how
confident you are in your.

Speaker 2 (29:28):
Opinion this year's team in seven. I'm pretty competent in seven.

Speaker 3 (29:33):
Yeah, in seven. You see, I'm not sure how to
answer last year's team. But because I have not seen
them locking defensive end, showed that type of game, I'm
just unsure, Like I think I might pick last year's
team in seven at this moment, because when we look
at how we fared against teams that have muddied things

(29:54):
up against those defensively, especially when we get into these
defensive battles, you know, typically those results in poor KD
games because they're getting really physical with them. I think
last year's team was built in a lab to beat
this one. You know, I think it's a legit I
think it's a legit discussion, and it shouldn't be because
everybody else, everybody is one year older, and you're replaced,

(30:15):
and you you're raided a four KD. That's that's a
win now move. As much as as we're not all
in and winning now, that's a win now move. The
fact that it's closed, it's a litle bit scary, and
they do have half a season to you know, home
things and make the team better. I guess I've rased
the question. What about ceiling wise? Who you know, not

(30:35):
ceiy wise in the sense that how much better they
can get? That's not what I'm asking you take the rocket,
the history rockets from right now, This team as it is,
you know, no outlie development, no even normal development, and
you can compare it to last year's team. Would you
think has a better chance at being a team like
the thunder now? The current this week rockets fully healthy?

(30:56):
You know you can get all the players back. I
guess bar for the leads, because you know that's part
of the identity of this team or last year's team.
Fully healthy, you know the things without you know, any
bear ensury, what would you take? Who do you think
would have a better chance of beating this Thunder?

Speaker 2 (31:14):
That's a good question. I'm still leaning this year's team
because I don't trust last year's team to generate offense
when it matters most, and I just don't think you're
beating the Thunder four times out of seven without getting
some big buckets laden games. Now, I guess you can
point out that Fred bin Vleet hit some grenades against

(31:35):
the Thunder last year, and so maybe that's an option.
But I think your point is valid in totality in
that just from a matchup standpoint, I think last year's
team would give the Thunder more headaches, But in terms
of actually beating them four times out of seven, it's
unlikely in both cases. But I would prefer the version
that has Kevin Durant and Reed Sheppard just because I

(31:58):
think there's more shot making upside laden game.

Speaker 3 (32:00):
Yes, Okay, you know, I can you know I can
understand that, but I do, and I might even agree
that with the experience and with having KD, you might
have a better camps at beating them with this year's team.
But point stands, and the overarching point was last year's
team was the worst matchup for the Thunder than you.
I think this year's teamils just based on identity and

(32:22):
when based on the fact that you know, you could
we could mud, we could muddy the game up enough
to make any team play close to us, And right
now it doesn't seem like we can if we can
make the game explosive enough for us to be competitive
with any with with everything, because that's the trade off
that we made. You know, the defense is all worse. Uh,
the offense is a lot better, but I don't think
the offense has been enough better to to to compensate.

(32:45):
I guess yeah. I think that kind of explained my point.
You know, for me to be fully bought in, I
need to see at least the ability to in stretches
play to that level of defense.

Speaker 2 (32:56):
And I will say I'm hopeful that as Jorian Phinnie
Smith scales up Antari Easton comes back from his ankle injury,
you're gonna have a lot more in terms of versatile wings.
You're gonna try Jabbari at the five. You have no choice,
so you can have that all out switching lineup. I
think there's gonna be more clubs in the bag for
ima Udoka defensively in the second half of this year

(33:18):
relative to the first, and so that can that can
potentially help as well. But I understand your point, like
you've got to see it to fully buy in. I
guess the way I'm choosing to. I've been a little
down the last few pods, and the way I'm choosing
to sort of reframe my expectations. You have to give
to get and I go back to the off season
with the Kadi trade. This was not a free agent signing.

(33:42):
This was not a draft pick where it's a peer
add on. You had to give to get and there
are trade offs. And we thought after the first month
of this season, which was an incredibly small sample in
the grand scheme that thirteen and four start one of
the best net ratings of all time, that maybe this
team was going to be a sixty plus win jar
or not. But in hindsight, especially when you add in

(34:02):
the additional headwind of not having Fred and Fleet, of
not having anything close to the peak version of Doory
Anthony Smith for at least the first half of the year,
that was just unrealistic. And so when you go back
to the KD trade. You gave up two floor razors
in Dylan and Jalen Well. Specifically Dylan the culture, the

(34:23):
fight defensively, That's why it made sense for Phoenix in
their situation. KD is the upside guy. He can make
those tough shots against even great defenses in playoff settings.
But if you're the Suns and you're not close to
winning the title anyway, how much sense does it make
to invest in a thirty seven year old who doesn't
have an unlimited time window left, when instead you can

(34:47):
improve the other aspects of your team and give yourself
a longer window. And so they made the trade largely
for the culture, the leadership, the consistent effort, the things
that Dylan provides from an intangible perspective, and then Jalen
Green provides some of that. He's a he competes much
more defensively than people think, but he's also an upside
bet because he's still relatively young in the grand scheme,

(35:11):
and so that's why the trade made sense for them.
They needed to reset with where they were organizationally, and
from a Houston standpoint, you got to the playoffs, but
you just didn't have that high end shot making potential
to beat the great teams. That was pretty clear after
that series against the Warriors, and so enter KD and

(35:34):
the hope is that you can get back to a
similar situation to what you were in a year ago,
and then KD can put you over the top. But
then you do lose Dylan and Jalen. And we're also
talking about training two for one, Well, who has who
has been the guy that's stepped into You know, Katie

(35:54):
is largely filled Dylan's minutes, especially with DFS being relatively unavailable.
So who has filled Jalen's minutes to a large extent,
Reach Shepher and reach Shepper is even more volatile than Jalen.
Like we always talked about Jalen being volatile, Well, Reid's
floor is even lower because with his size and just
twenty one years old year two. Defensively, there are nights

(36:17):
when he's borderline unplayable, but then the upside is even
higher because of the ability to hit threes at volume.
So you lost the consistency. You're taking out two guys
that were very consistent with their effort, with their defense,
with how they play the game, and you add it
in you know, Kat's always professional, but when you add

(36:39):
at thirty seven year old, there's going to be some
nights where they don't always have their legs. That's inherent
with that type of player. He's also as your leading scorer.
It's a completely different archetype. You don't want to ask
him to anchor your defense. He can do it at times.
I thought he was great against Wemby in the fourth
quarter the other night, but it's just a different archetype.

(37:00):
So ideally you'd have DFS to help fill what Dylan
gave you, but to this point it hasn't really worked out.
Hopefully that changes in the second half of the year.
And then read defensively is a downgrade from Jalen at
least on sub nights. So you had to give to
get and I think what the Rockets included was, hey,
we can find a way to get back to where

(37:23):
we were over eighty two games. We'll find a way
to get back, and then once we get in that
situation in the playoffs, we'd rather gamble on the upside formula,
which means Kevin Durant and Reed Shepherd. And that's how
I'm choosing to look at it, Like maybe there's a
world where if you had friend and Fleet it would
be closer to an add on, but especially without Fred,

(37:46):
it's just sort of like you had to give to get.
And so the Sun said, we're not close enough to
a title for that upside to be worth it, So
let's just improve the overall connected nature of our team,
the defense, the effort, the culture. Rockets said, Hey, we
think we're close enough. We believe in emy Udoka's ability
to get us back to at least something comparable to
where we were a year ago, and outside of OKC,

(38:09):
we think we're maybe the best, and so let's gamble
on upside this year. And that's what they've done, and
that's how I'm choosing to look at the halfway point
at this year's team, like the comparisons are really good
because this team is twenty six and fifteen, they're on
pace to win fifty two. Last year's team win fifty
two and thirty. So I understand superficially where the comparisons
come from. And it's a good discussion, just the way

(38:30):
I'm choosing to look at it. As the Rockets had
to give to Get. We sort of got suckered early
in the year to thinking that it wasn't a major sacrifice.
Ultimately it was, and there's gonna be nights that it
burns you, especially, you know, for Evey Udoka, there were
three culture setters defensively his first couple of years with
the team, prevently Dylan Brooks and then Steven Adams, and

(38:52):
now you've lost all three, So there's definitely a reset
on that side of the ball. But I just think
the bet is that in time you'll be able to
figure it out. Hopefully. Jorian Phinney Smith, the Navy, fredmin
Fleet not gonna word. If you get really lucky coming
back and getting back something close to healthy will will
further help. But I just I think it comes down

(39:14):
to the upside, and if you look at it through
that lens, I can understand it, even if it's frustrating.
I think the results spared out like the one thing
we have to keep reminding people they've beaten some really
good teams, follow the Spurs, the Nuggets, the Celtics, the Lakers.
This team has upside, it's just it's counteracted by the
fact that they lose to terrible ones like the Kings,

(39:35):
like the Trailblazers, twice. Well, the Trailblazers aren't terrible, but
you know what I mean, a team you should beat.
They certainly lost to other bad teams, the Pelicans last month,
and they had a twenty five point lead. This team
just inherently has a lot more volatility. But I think
they just they made a bet that in the playoffs,
that extra upside's going to be worth it. And that's
how I'm choosing to contextualize it. If you look at

(39:56):
it through that lens, does that make you feel any better?

Speaker 3 (39:59):
Yes, but still I cannot. I think this goes back
to nearly every uh nearly every championship team in in
the last few years. You know, you always have to
have you know, I'm not gonna go back to it.
You always have to have the ability to walk in
on defense when it matters most then sometimes they're not

(40:22):
just in the fourth quarter, but I mean when when
the other teams going on a run or when you're
just not falling. You know, right that ability is what
I'm missing from believing on the upside of this team,
and once we get it fully buy in. Regarding regarding
the trade, I mean, yes, you do. You do have
to give to get one hundred percent. But judging by

(40:45):
what the trade looked like at the time, I guess
the expectation and then for me as well, was that
we were at least on the short term, giving off
lesson we were getting back and the results. I haven't
reflected that. I haven't reflected that yet. And the logic
back then and then I think that still holds us
that the defense was not going to take as much

(41:05):
of a step back as it did, nor that as
a sacrifice for all we were getting on offense, and
that hasn't materialized. That doesn't mean it won't. But that's
why it's to me to view this team and to
take this team, you know, as seriously as being a
threat to the thunder. I need to see that once again.
I'm not saying this team is doomed, not saying I

(41:26):
don't believe in this team. I'm just saying I'm not
at the level of belief where I can imagine them.
To quote Kevin Wild, I don't think they passed the
Confederite test at this moment. I can't imagine them them
celebrating a championship. Ass can only constructive. I think they
need that step up in defense.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
I need.

Speaker 3 (41:44):
I think they have the personnel to do that because
it's largely the same as well as last year except
for Dylan Brooks. And I think a lot of it
comes from having guys step up in the intensity they
would included and I think mostly him, or not mostly him,
but more than the others. And once that kicks in,
and it might just only kick in and in the
back end of the season going into the playoffs, as

(42:05):
they tried, and they as it's up taking games more seriously,
you know, that's totally a possibility. But until I see that,
I'm not willing to say, hey, this team is a
you know, Tier one ake contender, which is what they
were aiming for, which is the step up from what
they were last year, because even though they lost the
first round, I didn't I thought they were a contender,
like a Tier two contender. But to get another to

(42:28):
get to the top of the top or top of
the top, I mean not really, but just all of
the thunder I need to see the ability or for
them to show the ability to gear into that defense
when when the time is most important.

Speaker 2 (42:43):
And we should note that for the season overall, they
are still fifth in defensive rating and third on offense.
But there is a lot of volatility within those performances,
and I think that's what you're getting to when a
playoff series, you need some degree at consistency and the
inability to shrink consistent good performances together, especially since the
calendar turned to December now into January. Yeah, it's a

(43:06):
fair concern. Just want to note that that's even long
numbers are still really good, but it does feel like
there's issues with consistency in terms of how those numbers
were accumulated.

Speaker 3 (43:15):
And yeah, it's really just at risk, at risk of
sounding to a baldn't lie, is you know, my eyes
don't lie And the intensity you feel on the defensive
end just isn't the same or is it? And you're
close to the same, And the numbers might say it
and it might be a league white thing in which
you know, offense is the up tacking offense is so

(43:35):
much that or step down in defense is still step
up compared to other teams step down, or it's a
smaller step down than what other team are facing. But
it's exactly you put it perfectly. It's exactly as you said.
It seems to come into a random and what we
need to do is be able to harness that and
I guess deploy it when when it's most important.

Speaker 2 (44:00):
The reason I'm more optimistic than you about putting them
right behind the Thunder, I am putting more weight on
their performances against really good teams, and maybe there's some
small sample theater to that, but I'm a believer at
this point that when the lights are at their brightest
and they play the really good non Thunder teams, there

(44:22):
seems to be a consistent ability to tap into that
extra gear. So that's why I'm giving them the benefit
of the doubt. But the next week will certainly test that.
Their next four games, two in Philadelphia and Detroit. Detroit's
a contender, Philadelphia is probably not a contender, but a
good team, and it's on the road. It's a back
to back, and then a rematch with the Spurs next Wednesday.

(44:44):
So this theory of mine will be tested a little
bit over the next week. But the reason I think
I'm a little bit more optimistic than than you, Powo,
they do seem to have the ability when the lights
are at their brightest and they're playing the really good
teams to tap into that peak version of their defense.
I go back to probably the best defensive performance I've
seen from them all year was that second game in
Denver when they came in, and this was when the

(45:06):
Nuggets had Yokich. This was when the controversial game or
earlier that week when against them and the Rockets went
in Katie was shit talking and they just made a statement.
At the time, Nuggets had the best rated offense in
the league, and the Rockets held them to like sixty
six points in the first three quarters and was sort
of lowest scoring output by far all season, at least
at that time when they had Jokich. And so I'm

(45:29):
starting to become a believer that against the good teams,
maybe the Thunder being the exception, I will say the
Thunder got a startling amount of really open threes in
that game against the Rockets a week ago, but they
are a different challenge for everybody. Aside from that, I've
just seen enough from the Rockets against the good teams
that makes me, at least at this point, give them
the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps the next week changes

(45:51):
my thinking. The other thing, before we wind down the POD,
I wanted to get your input on Powlow, and this
will be tested the next two nights. Specifically, this team
is getting to a massive split in home versus road performance.
After that four and one home stand, they're fifteen and
three to two out to center, they're eleven and twelve
on the road. Now, perhaps some of that's been made

(46:12):
worse by how weird the schedule has been. Like twenty
three of their first thirty six were on the road,
tied to the most at that point of any team
in NBA history. So you go on these long road trips,
you get fatigue. You also have some injuries in there,
and perhaps it's exaggerated a little bit, but at this
point it's a it's a striking differential, like that fifteen
and three at home is just lethal, and they're literally

(46:33):
below five hundred on the road. And so when you
look at the standings right now where it's tightly packed,
I mentioned that that they're in the four spot, but
they're only a game back of the Spurs for the
two seed. They're tied in the lost column with the Nuggets.
And then conversely, like the Lakers have sixteen losses, the
Suns and Timberwolves have seventeen, So you can fall behind

(46:55):
by a spot or two very easily. If you have
a bad week, Top four means you have home advantage
and at least one round, get to two, you have
home court advantage and at least two rounds of the playoffs.
Is it more important for this team to aggressively go
after that two seed given what their home versus road
performance shows like going into the year, I would have
said no, because this team is more veteran laden, and historically,

(47:18):
you know, a veteran type team led by a thirty
seven year old All Star and former MVP like Kevin
Durant can play anywhere and home court advantage might not
be that important. But for this particular team, the home
versus road splits are are pretty striking. So I'm just
curious your thoughts, Polo, on how valid of a variable
that is moving forward.

Speaker 3 (47:36):
Yeah, I think we need to investigate two things. The
first one is is there a correlation between the home
you know, our away record and the losses in that
record in the quality of the strip clubs in the
cities that we're playing.

Speaker 2 (47:52):
I don't think there's many strip clubs in Sacravento and Portland.
For the record. Hey, great, but I'm sure there's some.

Speaker 3 (47:59):
You know, I'm just saying, well, since we were comparing
Chang too harder on defense a bit before, you know,
just had to just you know, might be something worth
looking into. And the other thing is what if our
home records related to the amount of the amount of
basic NBA equipment malfunctions we have at home and we
throw teams off by you know, oh oh my oh,

(48:23):
our shot clock's not working, oh our rims tilted. Man,
it might might be something to it. You know that
I never seen so many incidents on one team in
the same season. I mean, I guess I don't think
I've ever seen any incidents at all. There's been there's
been to this season already that I can remember.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
No, you gotta point out those those are NBA issued equipment,
so I know it seems like a lot, but this
is standardized. It's not like they're going to home depot
and picking this stuff up and installing it themselves. This
is all NBA issued and sanctioned, so on paper, it
should be as random as it gets. Maybe you've had
some bad luck, but I agree with you, it's been
extremely unusual, to say the least.

Speaker 3 (49:03):
Yeah, So I guess to take the question a bit
more seriously. The Rockets, you know, they they are one
and two against the Neggets this season, and then they're
just to counter a little bit of your narrative, even
though you know you'll see what I get with it.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
Hey, they won that first game in Genver two if
not for Starstrucks acts ORBA.

Speaker 3 (49:21):
And he's gotta is gonna turn that down. He's gonna
like he's gonna get you know, he's gonna get refs
on that. That's got Foster, you know, VENDTMO against Chris Palmer.
I'm unsure if that's the best started, the best strate
to go about dealing with refereeing, although it does it
did seem to work for a little bit for Chris
Finch and SGA with seems like you have a couple

(49:42):
of games little less three throws after that. You know,
I'm not gonna get into that speaking about the Rockets.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (49:48):
Also, you know it's still even though it's tough as
these and they're just a little bit of a small sample,
says multiple side, as far as good teams are concerned.
You know this last for example, you know we thought
about about this before and right, but they've lost some
games that were just terribly unlucky, and you know, I
guess it rebounded a little bit. You know, I thought
we won against the Spurs, and a large part of

(50:10):
it was because we got looky that they just went
I sculled from three after being really hot, like they fit,
after being insanely hot for the first half. They finished
below thirty percent from three. Uh, And you know that's
a bit of luck coming our way as well.

Speaker 2 (50:23):
That's part of why.

Speaker 3 (50:24):
We got to come back in that game. But to
talk about the home away record, with those things, right,
it's really hard to notice unless it's efforts related, and
I don't think that's that big of a difference. It's
really hard to pinpoint where when and when it's different.
And so when those things, I just go by what
the stats say, and the stats say that we're a

(50:44):
lot better on We're a lot better at home than
we are on the road. And so what you've gotta
do is you got to take what the stats give
you and go with that. If we have that much
better of a record at home, then there's neck that
has to be that symbothizes big enough. When we talk
about again, any team, for us to have to give
freedoms to it and say, yes, getting the two seat

(51:06):
is important because this team seems to play better at
home than it does on the road, which is surprisingly
because I guess throughout the reveal that we've clipped between
being better on the road at home. But it's always
been a thing where or for most of the time,
it's been a thing that we just must be much
better on either at home or on the road with

(51:26):
the Rocket stall the past few years. So yes, it
isn't very important to get the two seat, but it's
still not as important as it is to talk being
the four seed or being on the same side as
the bracket as the Thunder. It would be a nice
bonus to get, but you know, homecourt advantage at the
end of the day is just one game out of seven, right,
that's different, So it's only going to sway a series

(51:50):
so much. It would be nice. I think it might
be disproportionately good for the Rockets compared to other teams,
but it shouldn't be a defining thing on our season.

Speaker 2 (52:00):
All right. We will wrap this show here because full disclosure,
I'm not sure until I play this pack what the
audio quality is going to be. Polo's in Portugal where
they're having a storm at the moment, so his audio
sounds good to me, but you never know until you
play it back in some cases. And as for me,

(52:21):
I'm in Las Vegas this week. If you watch my
show with Dave Hardesty and Adam Clinton after the Furst
game the other night, people were busting me in the
chat for my AOL fifty six K modem giving out.
I think the internet connection is a little bit better today,
and this is audio only, but again, you could never
be sure until you actually play it back. So rather

(52:42):
than keep going on, I'm going to end it here
in hopes that we can salvage what we've done over
the past fifty to fifty five minutes or so. And
also I think you know, there's certainly some potential trade
deadline implications that's two weeks from today that you can
certainly get into with the recent develops, But I think
that's a better discussion for next week because we're at

(53:04):
a point now with the Rockets where I think we
just need to get more data. Like I heard Kelly
Eco on Brian Bearfield's postgame show the other night, that's
big starred making the case for without Steven Adams, why
you might want to hold Clint Capella and not use
him as matching salary, And the same could be said
for Dorian Anthony Smith because he needs to play more

(53:24):
since you were potentially slatting Jabari Smith to the five
a little bit more like those are valid perspectives, but
there's also a lot to be gained from seeing how
the Rockets perform over the next week. I mentioned three
of the four games are against the Pistons and Sixers
on a back to back the next two nights, and
then the Spurs rematch next Wednesday. And in between there
the Memphis Grizzlies, who are not a terrible team at

(53:47):
the moment, they're competitive and John Moran is playing to
boost his trade value. It feels like there's a lot
to be learned about the Rockets, and if things go
off the rails a little bit, maybe that moves the
needle more for refel Stone and to thinking man, this
is a year in which we need to be aggressive
to salvage a thirty seven year old Kevin Durant that's
still in peak form, and you don't know how many

(54:08):
more opportunities you're going to have with KD playing like this. Conversely,
if they have another good week, then maybe that lends
credence to Kelly's theory that hey, you've started to figure
it out. They are four to one in their last
five games, and guys like the FS and Capella are
playing better and could be even more important in the
coming weeks and months given roster constraints, and so that

(54:30):
could make it more likely for you to stay the course.
And typically discussions don't pick up until the last week anyway,
you know, there's some exploratory calls being made right now,
but it's just it's a constant game of chicken, and
front offices are just waiting for the other sides to
give in, and it takes deadline pressure to see just

(54:51):
how far each is willing to go. So, because discussions
probably aren't going to pick up until a week or
so at the earliest, and because there's going to be
a lot of interesting data points collected over the next week,
have the Rockets truly figured this out or with the
schedule getting more difficult, are they going to fall off again.
It's this kind of undercut my narrative. If they figured
it out against good teams, there's just a lot to

(55:11):
be learned. So in terms of the trade deadline implications,
there's definitely some fascinating conversations to be had, but let's
pick that up in a week or so. For now,
I think this is a good roundup of where the
Rockets are at, and then we'll learn more information over
the next four games and reflect accordingly. Anyway, for today,
we've talked enough. Hopefully the audio works out knock on

(55:33):
wood until next time. If you want more insight from
Polo and myself, the best place to get it is
on social media. You can follow Polo at Powo, Alps,
NBA meet at Bendubo's and then the show The Rockets
Launch Pod presented by Clutch Fans go to its Twitter
page or x page at launch Pods seven to ninety
and the If you hit up the link tree in
the bio, that's got all the links you could need

(55:55):
to help us out. Support friends, sponsors at the program
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(56:16):
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That's how we can keep looking good to those friends,
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the most active ones covering Houston Rockets basketball. All right,
with that, we're done for today. For Polo Alves, I'm
Ben Dubos. As always, we appreciate you, guys and girls
so much for listening, and please come back soon for

(56:37):
mar new episodes of the Rockets Launch Pod, Go Rockets.

Speaker 3 (56:42):
If you stick it out till the end tweets, ask
me how many stills will reach upard have if you
play the game against CJ's Stroud.

Speaker 2 (56:53):
We're done.