November 23, 2025 • 8 mins
Originally aired on November 22, 2025. Cole's insightful interview with Michael Shapiro, for your listening pleasure.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Space a Saturday, rolling right along here on Sports Sucks
seven ninety Cole Thompson rock with you until one o'clock
always feels like I should say on longer. Oh well, seven, one,
three nine. If you want time on in, especially if
you want to hear from our friend Michael Shapiro from
Crown dot Com, give him a follow on Twitter at
mshap Underscore too. Michael, I must start off with this, Dude,
(00:22):
I gotta get your opinion. I said this in the
first segment. I'm going to continue to preach this. Last night,
did we watch a preview up? Potentially the Western Conference
Finals take place at Toyota Center.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Here's my guess for you, Cole. Also, good morning. I
expect that this will be the Western Conference semifinals. Right.
If we have to draw it up, you have to
assume the Oklahoma City Thunder will be the number one
seat in the Western Conference. They're a wagon. My guests
will get number two Denver, number three Houston or flip
the order and a knockdown or drag out second round
(00:55):
matchup in which the winner would likely face Oklahoma City.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Now, let me ask you, after what you saw last night,
good offensive performance from I mean let me first up
a good offensive rebounding team in Houston, a good defensive
rebounding team in Denver actually ended up Houston having a
better rebounding performance overall, there's only like a two defensive
rebound differential between the two. Who do you think has
a better shot of de throning Oklahoma City as the
favorites in the Western Conference right now?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Man, that's a pretty tough question because, okay, see, just
looks like they have so few holes. I think you
have to give the nod to Denver right now, just
because they do have the best player alive in Nikola Jokic.
I'll tell anyone who will listen that Nicola is just
an absolute delight to watch. He is absolutely dominant to face.
Doesn't mean the Rockets couldn't knockoff either the Nuggets or
(01:41):
the Thunder, or possibly both, but I think right now
the hierarchy probably goes Okay, see, then that second tier
is Denver and Houston kind of smoshed together.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Michael last night, thirty seven minutes from reed, Shepherd just
the kid's a wagon right now. He is off the
track twenty seven points. He's great when it comes to
execution on assist. He's getting better when it comes to steels.
He's playing I think a little bit more physically defensively.
He's also I had to getting a lot more comfortable
being able to drive toward the rim. Just how impressive
you been in his performance And after talking to Emay,
(02:12):
do you think at the role is going to be
a little bit more substantially bigger or do you think
that because of losing Aaron Gordon, Houston realized, listen, we
can run our small package and still be pretty good offensively.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
With regards to last night specifically, I do think Reid
starting in the second half was because of that Aaron
Gordon injury. But more importantly and moreover, this reached Shepherd
kid is feeling pretty confident right now. Right You see
him yelling after three's in the face of Tim Hardaway Junior.
We see him getting hyped on the bench with Kevin Durant.
He feels like he belongs this year, which I think
wasn't exactly the case last year. The kid's an impressive shooter.
(02:47):
As you mentioned, he's really improved on this two point
kind of mid range stop and go driving game. He's
an amazing three point shooter, such a smooth stroke, but
he's proved to be more than that, and yeah, I
do expect him to get more a run from eating
Udoka as a lead ball handler.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Michael Shapiro from cron dot Com give him a follow
on Twitter at mshaftwo. We're always gonna call it twitter here, Michael.
When you look back, what was the issue in the
second half from closing in for Kevin Deranton Outpert shan Gun.
They did a good job of kind of playing in
that triangle formation and boxing them out, but really overall
offensive inconsistencies from both of them, and it felt like that, Yeah,
(03:23):
you could afford to have one of them to have
a bad performance, you couldn't afford to have two.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
I thought that was a pretty championship defensive performance from Denver.
Late there, they were so smart. They really packed the paint,
clogged the lane, made the Houston others. Whether it's Jabari
Smith Junior, honestly, he was a guy they left open
a lot in that corner. They said, we're not going
to let Alprin in the middle beat us time and again,
and they swarmed the paint and guess what, it worked.
(03:48):
They forced four turnovers on Shengun and I hurt in
the Denver locker room post game, they say, and alpren
always start that pocket pass. We knew that pocket pass
and the lane was coming. I think Denver had a
lot of prep for Houston's offense night, and they had
kind of a funky scheme that took away a lot
of what the Rockets like.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
And you brought this up. I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
I think Nikola Yokich is the best player on the
planet right now. But I've always been such a big
fan of Jamal Murray's game. He had twenty six last night,
really good performance in the fourth quarter. When you look
at what happened on that run, twenty to nine was
six minutes left. Was it basically just coming down to, Hey,
the stars for one team stepped on up and the
stars the other one didn't.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
I hate to be kind of, you know, dismissive, or
I guess reductive is a better word, but yeah, I
mean the Jokic Murray pick and roll when it's right,
when both of those guys are healthy, it might be
the most unstoppable play in basketball. And Jamal Murray, I
think is an underrated, underrated point guard, especially when he's healthy,
clutch player, great in the mid range, and they just
kind of spam that pick and roll. It's Houston defended
(04:46):
it well, but the touch of the dev shooters, man,
it was pretty impressive. I really enjoyed watching that late
last night.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Who is the player that you have been the most
impressed with? Not named Reed Shepherd in clutch moments? I
thought Barr Smith making that three to make it a
two point game with like, what was it three seconds
left was really big.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
I think he's playing ball defensively.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
There's been a lot to like about both Holiday and
a Kobe coming off of the bench. But in your opinion,
who's been the name that has really kind of taken
that next show forward?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
This is going to be an annoying answer to you.
I think it's Kevin Durant, right, I mean, last a
touch time with the Rockets, you know last year in
the Rockets and clutch time, it was a lot of
us shrug our shoulders, late shot clock, we don't know
who gets the ball. Last night was a little rough,
but we've had a lot of nights over the past
couple of weeks sort of late in the game, get
the ball to Kevin, Get out of the way, and
(05:34):
we know who he is. Man. He's one of the
great closes of all time, and you can kind of
see Imo Udoka is delighted in crunch time. That's the
guy he can go to. Now. Credit to Denver last night,
they crowded Durant a lot. Not every team is going
to be able to defend Kad like Denver did. We're
going to see a lot more Quesch moments from Durant
down the stretch of the season.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Michael, we know that Emai likes to run the jump
up package a lot, big, big sound low Steven Adams
kd oppera ching goon, but it does feel like that
from the offensive perspect Steven Adams has that one game
that is really impressive second chance opportunities around the rim,
and then he goes back back down to being a
very good defensive player, offers little to no value offensively
(06:11):
five points last night. Is there going to come a
point where it does feel like the Rockets if somebody
like a Kogi or somebody like Shepherd continues to be
such a value offensively from the field, that they may
be willing to move minutes away from Steven Adams, even
though the jumpa package is what they really are prominent
in running.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Yeah, I think that jumbo double Big, that kind of
minute allocation will ebb and flow during the regular season.
I think Steven's going to be a real playoff weapon.
But yeah, I think as the season goes on, expect
more of those minutes to go to reach Shepherd And
something I think right now is no tary Ethan no
during Andy Smith. It makes that double big more enticing
for Emy. He has that full complement of wings. Expects
(06:53):
Stevens minutes to get kind of paired down in this
regular season especially.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
You have like five games coming on up between teams
that I don't know if we'll see them be full
on playoff threats, like the Phoenix Suns on Wednesday. Like,
this is a team that right now, yeah, you could
say that they're in the playoff hunt, but at the
same time, are they really like we're gonna see them?
Speaker 3 (07:11):
I think come back down to reality.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
You also got games against Golden State, two against Utah,
and then you're back home against Sacramento before going in
facing off against Phoenix in Dallas. What's the one thing
that you want to see over the next week and
a half for this offense to kind of get back
on track where it's names outside of Katie and opportune good.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Let's start with this Monday night matchup. To be honest,
the Phoenix Suns are tough, They're gritty, They're an impressive
defense with Dylan Brooks of course there. Now, I want
to see the Rockets young guards handle that pressure.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Well.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
You know, we talk about Read Shepherd a lot. It's
gonna be a big night for him because I think
they might stick Dylan Brooks on him. See if you
can get himself free. So I think these young guards,
these ball handlers and men Thompson as well, for Houston,
when you go into Phoenix, that's gonna be a tough situation.
Let's see how they handle it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Okay, before I let you go, Shapiro, you were the
one to ask Tamika Ryans about the quarterback controversy currently
is unfolding here in Houston. Your stance on CJ. Stroud
versus Davis Mills three and Ozho start.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
For the neck.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
But also you have a better quarterback number seven. Who
are you riding with?
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I love that you gave me the platform for this.
I don't think there's a controversy at all. When CJ.
Shroud is healthy, he should be the starter. I asked
the question to allow Jamika Ryans and the Textans to
say yes or no. They said no controversy. Let's move on,
all right.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
Michael Shapirocrown dot Com give him a follow on social
media at m chap two Shapiro, Man, you are the best.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
I'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Thank you, man, Appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Michael Shapiro, I constantly always enjoy conversations with him, and
I appreciate that he was willing to ask Tomika Ranes
the
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Question that I think many people in the city want
to hear
Space a Saturday, rolling right along here on Sports Sucks
seven ninety Cole Thompson rock with you until one o'clock
always feels like I should say on longer. Oh well, seven, one,
three nine. If you want time on in, especially if
you want to hear from our friend Michael Shapiro from
Crown dot Com, give him a follow on Twitter at
mshap Underscore too. Michael, I must start off with this, Dude,
(00:22):
I gotta get your opinion. I said this in the
first segment. I'm going to continue to preach this. Last night,
did we watch a preview up? Potentially the Western Conference
Finals take place at Toyota Center.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
Here's my guess for you, Cole. Also, good morning. I
expect that this will be the Western Conference semifinals. Right.
If we have to draw it up, you have to
assume the Oklahoma City Thunder will be the number one
seat in the Western Conference. They're a wagon. My guests
will get number two Denver, number three Houston or flip
the order and a knockdown or drag out second round
(00:55):
matchup in which the winner would likely face Oklahoma City.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Now, let me ask you, after what you saw last night,
good offensive performance from I mean let me first up
a good offensive rebounding team in Houston, a good defensive
rebounding team in Denver actually ended up Houston having a
better rebounding performance overall, there's only like a two defensive
rebound differential between the two. Who do you think has
a better shot of de throning Oklahoma City as the
favorites in the Western Conference right now?
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Man, that's a pretty tough question because, okay, see, just
looks like they have so few holes. I think you
have to give the nod to Denver right now, just
because they do have the best player alive in Nikola Jokic.
I'll tell anyone who will listen that Nicola is just
an absolute delight to watch. He is absolutely dominant to face.
Doesn't mean the Rockets couldn't knockoff either the Nuggets or
(01:41):
the Thunder, or possibly both, but I think right now
the hierarchy probably goes Okay, see, then that second tier
is Denver and Houston kind of smoshed together.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Michael last night, thirty seven minutes from reed, Shepherd just
the kid's a wagon right now. He is off the
track twenty seven points. He's great when it comes to
execution on assist. He's getting better when it comes to steels.
He's playing I think a little bit more physically defensively.
He's also I had to getting a lot more comfortable
being able to drive toward the rim. Just how impressive
you been in his performance And after talking to Emay,
(02:12):
do you think at the role is going to be
a little bit more substantially bigger or do you think
that because of losing Aaron Gordon, Houston realized, listen, we
can run our small package and still be pretty good offensively.
Speaker 2 (02:25):
With regards to last night specifically, I do think Reid
starting in the second half was because of that Aaron
Gordon injury. But more importantly and moreover, this reached Shepherd
kid is feeling pretty confident right now. Right You see
him yelling after three's in the face of Tim Hardaway Junior.
We see him getting hyped on the bench with Kevin Durant.
He feels like he belongs this year, which I think
wasn't exactly the case last year. The kid's an impressive shooter.
(02:47):
As you mentioned, he's really improved on this two point
kind of mid range stop and go driving game. He's
an amazing three point shooter, such a smooth stroke, but
he's proved to be more than that, and yeah, I
do expect him to get more a run from eating
Udoka as a lead ball handler.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Michael Shapiro from cron dot Com give him a follow
on Twitter at mshaftwo. We're always gonna call it twitter here, Michael.
When you look back, what was the issue in the
second half from closing in for Kevin Deranton Outpert shan Gun.
They did a good job of kind of playing in
that triangle formation and boxing them out, but really overall
offensive inconsistencies from both of them, and it felt like that, Yeah,
(03:23):
you could afford to have one of them to have
a bad performance, you couldn't afford to have two.
Speaker 2 (03:28):
I thought that was a pretty championship defensive performance from Denver.
Late there, they were so smart. They really packed the paint,
clogged the lane, made the Houston others. Whether it's Jabari
Smith Junior, honestly, he was a guy they left open
a lot in that corner. They said, we're not going
to let Alprin in the middle beat us time and again,
and they swarmed the paint and guess what, it worked.
(03:48):
They forced four turnovers on Shengun and I hurt in
the Denver locker room post game, they say, and alpren
always start that pocket pass. We knew that pocket pass
and the lane was coming. I think Denver had a
lot of prep for Houston's offense night, and they had
kind of a funky scheme that took away a lot
of what the Rockets like.
Speaker 3 (04:03):
And you brought this up. I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (04:05):
I think Nikola Yokich is the best player on the
planet right now. But I've always been such a big
fan of Jamal Murray's game. He had twenty six last night,
really good performance in the fourth quarter. When you look
at what happened on that run, twenty to nine was
six minutes left. Was it basically just coming down to, Hey,
the stars for one team stepped on up and the
stars the other one didn't.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
I hate to be kind of, you know, dismissive, or
I guess reductive is a better word, but yeah, I
mean the Jokic Murray pick and roll when it's right,
when both of those guys are healthy, it might be
the most unstoppable play in basketball. And Jamal Murray, I
think is an underrated, underrated point guard, especially when he's healthy,
clutch player, great in the mid range, and they just
kind of spam that pick and roll. It's Houston defended
(04:46):
it well, but the touch of the dev shooters, man,
it was pretty impressive. I really enjoyed watching that late
last night.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
Who is the player that you have been the most
impressed with? Not named Reed Shepherd in clutch moments? I
thought Barr Smith making that three to make it a
two point game with like, what was it three seconds
left was really big.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
I think he's playing ball defensively.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
There's been a lot to like about both Holiday and
a Kobe coming off of the bench. But in your opinion,
who's been the name that has really kind of taken
that next show forward?
Speaker 2 (05:14):
This is going to be an annoying answer to you.
I think it's Kevin Durant, right, I mean, last a
touch time with the Rockets, you know last year in
the Rockets and clutch time, it was a lot of
us shrug our shoulders, late shot clock, we don't know
who gets the ball. Last night was a little rough,
but we've had a lot of nights over the past
couple of weeks sort of late in the game, get
the ball to Kevin, Get out of the way, and
(05:34):
we know who he is. Man. He's one of the
great closes of all time, and you can kind of
see Imo Udoka is delighted in crunch time. That's the
guy he can go to. Now. Credit to Denver last night,
they crowded Durant a lot. Not every team is going
to be able to defend Kad like Denver did. We're
going to see a lot more Quesch moments from Durant
down the stretch of the season.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
Michael, we know that Emai likes to run the jump
up package a lot, big, big sound low Steven Adams
kd oppera ching goon, but it does feel like that
from the offensive perspect Steven Adams has that one game
that is really impressive second chance opportunities around the rim,
and then he goes back back down to being a
very good defensive player, offers little to no value offensively
(06:11):
five points last night. Is there going to come a
point where it does feel like the Rockets if somebody
like a Kogi or somebody like Shepherd continues to be
such a value offensively from the field, that they may
be willing to move minutes away from Steven Adams, even
though the jumpa package is what they really are prominent
in running.
Speaker 2 (06:31):
Yeah, I think that jumbo double Big, that kind of
minute allocation will ebb and flow during the regular season.
I think Steven's going to be a real playoff weapon.
But yeah, I think as the season goes on, expect
more of those minutes to go to reach Shepherd And
something I think right now is no tary Ethan no
during Andy Smith. It makes that double big more enticing
for Emy. He has that full complement of wings. Expects
(06:53):
Stevens minutes to get kind of paired down in this
regular season especially.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
You have like five games coming on up between teams
that I don't know if we'll see them be full
on playoff threats, like the Phoenix Suns on Wednesday. Like,
this is a team that right now, yeah, you could
say that they're in the playoff hunt, but at the
same time, are they really like we're gonna see them?
Speaker 3 (07:11):
I think come back down to reality.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
You also got games against Golden State, two against Utah,
and then you're back home against Sacramento before going in
facing off against Phoenix in Dallas. What's the one thing
that you want to see over the next week and
a half for this offense to kind of get back
on track where it's names outside of Katie and opportune good.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Let's start with this Monday night matchup. To be honest,
the Phoenix Suns are tough, They're gritty, They're an impressive
defense with Dylan Brooks of course there. Now, I want
to see the Rockets young guards handle that pressure.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
Well.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
You know, we talk about Read Shepherd a lot. It's
gonna be a big night for him because I think
they might stick Dylan Brooks on him. See if you
can get himself free. So I think these young guards,
these ball handlers and men Thompson as well, for Houston,
when you go into Phoenix, that's gonna be a tough situation.
Let's see how they handle it.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
Okay, before I let you go, Shapiro, you were the
one to ask Tamika Ryans about the quarterback controversy currently
is unfolding here in Houston. Your stance on CJ. Stroud
versus Davis Mills three and Ozho start.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
For the neck.
Speaker 1 (08:08):
But also you have a better quarterback number seven. Who
are you riding with?
Speaker 2 (08:13):
I love that you gave me the platform for this.
I don't think there's a controversy at all. When CJ.
Shroud is healthy, he should be the starter. I asked
the question to allow Jamika Ryans and the Textans to
say yes or no. They said no controversy. Let's move on,
all right.
Speaker 1 (08:27):
Michael Shapirocrown dot Com give him a follow on social
media at m chap two Shapiro, Man, you are the best.
Speaker 3 (08:33):
I'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Thank you, man, Appreciate you.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Michael Shapiro, I constantly always enjoy conversations with him, and
I appreciate that he was willing to ask Tomika Ranes
the
Speaker 3 (08:43):
Question that I think many people in the city want
to hear
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