January 31, 2024 • 15 mins
Explore decisiveness with Jamila Rizvi and Helen McCabe. Uncover the art of sticking by your choices and navigate the benefits and challenges that come with just making a call even if you're uncertain.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to Mindset, a guide to getting out of your
own way and a blueprint for professional success. Today, Helen
McCabe and Jamila Risby are here to share how they
turn uncertainty into decisiveness.
Ellen, we've all had those times in our lives where
we've experienced, like, uh, almost a decision paralysis state where
(00:25):
it feels like you can't move forward, and even minor choices,
I think, at that time can feel like they're, they're insurmountable.
And I found like, I think when I've experienced that
in the past, that it's incredibly exhausting, um, and the
idea of making a decision feels too hard, all of
a sudden. Um,
(00:46):
And those periods of uncertainty can be.
Really stressful, but the way that they show up is
really diverse in the way that they show up in
your life. So for me, I know one of them
can be that I start to overanalyze all my options.
So I go into options mode, and I'm trying not
to look at Helen as we record, um, folks, because
she knows I do this, and I start going, Well,
(01:06):
there's option A and there's option B, and there's option C,
and then there's option 1A, and then there's option and
I try and think about all the possibilities. And while
that can sound like a really sensible way of making
a decision, it's not if you can't stop. Yes.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Um, the procrastination is debilitating at times. So you just
go over it and over it again. And there's also
that unfounded fear of making, uh, a mistake. So, I,
I tend to be someone who, this doesn't show up
that much in my professional life, weirdly. I'm quite good
at making decisions professionally. I am really terrible, personally. So
(01:42):
if you ask me to choose.
Um, a fridge, or, um, a lounge or a paint colour,
or I'm OK with a restaurant. I'm OK with food
choices because you're hungry. Yeah. Um, and I have strong views,
but I can be I really struggle with decisions on
simple things. And, um,
(02:04):
And I'm, I, I, I just don't really know what
that's about. Now the good news is, they don't really matter,
the fridge doesn't really matter.
Um, but I, I definitely experience extreme levels of indecision
about almost the most insignificant things in life.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah. And that's something we see, I think, uh, in
the FW community and it shows up amongst ourFW and
Jobs Academy members quite a bit, where we hear about
people who have almost over-researched. Uh, they think.
Want to change careers and they're looking to a new industry,
and they've overthought it to the point that they start
to rule too many things out, and, uh, their options
(02:44):
become really, really narrow. Or people who are just struggling
with that procrastination of like, I know I need to start,
I know I have to start, but I'm so anxious
about this uncertainty that I'm in, that I'm actually keeping
myself in it longer by a
Avoiding hitting go, let's say.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
So I'm really good at helping with career, um, indecision, uh,
because for me, that is quite clear. Um, you are
unlikely to make an incorrect decision on your career. And
the reason I say that is because, um, life shape
shifts around the wrong. So you might, you might say
yes to that job. Uh, you might have two jobs,
(03:22):
you don't really know, and you say yes to one.
Um, because you have to say yes. Don't overthink that because.
You will learn something from every new job, correct. You
learn probably more from a bad job than you do
from a good job. And so I always say to
(03:43):
anyone who's really overthinking the pros and cons of a job, um.
You are literally wasting time. Just make the decision, take
the job. The other thing people make make mistakes on
when they're worrying about career decisions is they think the
job's forever. I'm taking a job, uh, at the cafe,
(04:03):
and that is my life. I am forever more gonna
work at that cafe. In actual fact, you can quit
the cafe. You can quit it in a week, you
can quit it in a month, and you can quit
it in a year. You do not have to stay.
Um, in your profession. Now, your family and your, and
your private life, that does get more complicated. But we're
here to talk about careers, right? So, indecision in, um, careers,
(04:27):
I think, can be way overblown. What about you? I
find
Speaker 1 (04:32):
that really interesting. I think that's also entirely.
True, and yet I also know I do it, right?
I also know I do overstress about a big career decision,
and it does feel defining, and it does feel like
this has to be the right job, and it's got
to take me to the next thing. And I do
see it quite strategically, and as a result, I think,
do get a bit wrapped up in, in that uncertainty
of what's going to happen.
(04:53):
Um, I found this quote that I really liked, Helen, from, um, Dr.
Brian Robinson, who wrote a wrote a book called Changed
to the Desk in a Hybrid World. And he talks
about why it is that being in that place of
uncertainty is so horrible. Um, and he says, work life's
inevitable uncertainties instantly arouse our fight or flight reaction. Your
survival brain.
(05:13):
You know, the, that's the brain that's supposed to make
us run away from the tiger, is constantly updated, updating
your world. It's making judgments about what's safe and what isn't,
and it will do almost anything for the sake of certainty,
because you're hardwired to overestimate threats and underestimate your ability
to handle them. The human brain prefers to know an
outcome one way or another.
(05:33):
And I, I just found that so useful because it
reminds me that the way my brain works in its
search for certainty, and it's discomfort in the uncertainty that
often can lead to procrastination and inaction and all sorts
of things is actually driven by being a human being
for millennia and having to make quick decisions and, uh,
you know, outrun an animal or find food, and yet
(05:56):
I'm applying it to the fact that I've got a
meeting with you this afternoon. Like, it's just not necessary
to be reacting in the same way.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
So
How do you overcome it and find your decisiveness?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Yeah, I think that's a good question, and I've been
trying to unpack that about, about both myself and about,
about others. Um, for me, I think I found through
experience that making a decision is what matters. And especially
as a team leader,
You have got people around you who are looking to
(06:31):
you for a decision to give them certainty. And so,
sometimes a decision is better than trying to hold out
a long time for the best decision. And, uh, sometimes
by delaying a decision, you make a decision anyway. And
that's something I try and tell myself a lot. By
not making a call, and absolutely, we, we do need
to be deliberate and careful and, and take advice and,
(06:53):
and research. But,
If you are consistently putting off making a call, making
a hard decision, you are still making a decision. You
are making a decision not to act. You are making
a decision to delay, you are making a decision in
favour of the status quo. And if you don't like
the status quo, then you are gonna have to take
a decision to get out of it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I'm, I'm listening to you thinking at it from, from
completely different perspectives. Um, there are times when no decision's
OK when taking the time.
So pulling out of the pace of the requirement for
a decision is not a bad thing. I call it
the drift. Um, I've always been a big fan of,
of implementing the drift when there isn't a lot of clarity.
(07:34):
And I think that is a decision, as you say.
If I make an active decision to let the drift
happen for circumstances to change, for the, for the energy
or the, um,
The discomfort to pass, uh, sometimes that is actually a
(07:57):
good decision. So slow it all down. Um, but equally,
I agree with you, if you are really struggling, um,
and there's no right or wrong, just make one because
you are.
Undermining um the confidence in you as a leader, but
let's say you're not a leader, say you are indecisive
(08:17):
about something that's really important to you and you personally, um,
why should you speed that up? Well, because
It's a sliding door moment. Like, you take a path
and then you, you, the world will shape shift around you,
and you will pick up good things and bad things
when you take that path and you will have picked
up good things and bad things when you take the
(08:38):
other path. Um, the delay, uh, from the learning of
either decision.
Uh, isn't serving you very well.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, absolutely. There's this study, um, I was reading this
morning from the University College of London, which made me
giggle because it, uh, described me in the form of
a whole lot of people who did this study. So
it was an experiment. They had, um, all these people, uh,
who were told in one group that you're gonna get
a very painful electric shock right now.
And they compared their experience of the stress of knowing
(09:09):
that that was coming with a group who were told,
you are going to get a moderately painful electric shock
at some point.
And not told when. And the stress is so much bigger.
It's why we say when there's a painful medical procedure,
just do it, just do it, just rip the band-aid off, right?
Because knowing at some point it's gonna be ripped and
it'll be slow and painful is, is worse. So I
(09:29):
think it, it is a reminder that while that uncertainty
can be beneficial for decision making at times, you also
need to know how to be decisive. And I think
this is probably a good example of how
Both states are OK, right? They, they are both OK.
We need to be good at sitting in the uncertainty,
which I'm not, and Helen is, and we need to
be good at being decisive. And being able to develop
(09:52):
your decisiveness is what's gonna move you forwards in your,
in your search for work journey or a promotion, seek.
A promotion. So let's talk about how we can learn
to be more decisive, Helen, because we know that decisiveness
can bring us a whole lot of benefits. So my,
my first suggestion is starting small. We make thousands of
decisions every day. We decide what to wear, we decide
(10:12):
what to eat for dinner. Uh, if you can start
to practise your decisiveness on smaller things, you'll sort of
start to stretch and work out your decisiveness muscle a
little bit harder.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
I'm reminded of, um, Barack Obama, who only ever had
the same coloured suit, because it was one decision he
didn't have to make every day. Yeah. So he always
wore the same blue suit. Um, time limits. Don't allow
yourself to ruminate indefinitely. Instead, give yourself a deadline and
keep yourself accountable to it. Certain decisions should not be
taken lightly. Absolutely give yourself some space and time, uh,
(10:45):
particularly when they carry substantial consequences. Getting married, um, booking
your time, folks. Yes, we.
Um, definitely take your time. Um, but endless indecision is
is rarely helpful, and it's not helpful to the person
that has asked you to marry them, uh, and it's
not helpful to you either. So set yourself some time
Speaker 1 (11:05):
limits. Became a very different podcast. Uh.
I'm also gonna recommend changing it up. If you're someone
who is finding that your decision-making approach, and even if
you don't think you've got one, you just kind of
make them. You do have one. We all develop some
kind of consistency in our approach to decisions. But if
you keep
Ending up in this sort of analysis paralysis state, then
(11:27):
you need to start making decisions in a different way,
or at least try doing it a different way. One
thing I see a lot, uh, between friends, colleagues, people
who are members of, of FW and our jobs academy,
is that they are asking either the wrong people or
too many people for their opinions. Going out and getting
opinions from 400 different people in their life who all
(11:47):
give a different perspective, and it just leads them feeling
like they can't make any decision cause they're gonna disappoint everybody.
You've got to be really careful and quite selective about
who you get advice from and who you listen to.
Advice is great. Go out and find it, but make
sure you don't wait at all equally, or you're always
gonna be in a mess. If you're someone who works
with the pros and cons list in your head, let's say,
(12:08):
perhaps that doesn't work for you. Um, one of the
things that, um, I've heard from Mim Bartlett, who
Has run courses for FW before, which I love, is
that she talks about having a personal board. The way
that a business has a board of directors and advisors
who help, uh, bring different skill sets and experiences to
the business's decision making. Who are they in your life?
(12:31):
Who are the people you go to for advice on career?
Who are the people that you go to for advice
on
Um, parenting, who are the people that you go to
for advice on relationships? Uh, start to build up who
you rely on and who you trust so that you
can go to them when you're feeling stuck.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
And recognise, uh, when you are only going to a
certain type of person for a particular piece of advice.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Because you, you think they affirm what you,
Speaker 2 (12:54):
you believe. If that's what you're doing, 100%, that's fine,
cause it's confirming your your decision, um, but
recognise that's what you're doing. Um, embrace imperfection. Jamila, Remember
that there is no perfect decision. You can learn from
both courses of action. So, um, understand that any decision
you take or path you will follow will inevitably bring
(13:15):
joy and discomfort. Sometimes you have to settle for good
enough for now to achieve great in the long term.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Here, here.
I touched on this one a little bit earlier, folks.
Sometimes those big decisions are really intimidating, and so we
make no decision at all. Um, and as Helen said,
sometimes it's OK to drift for a period, to say,
I'm gonna wait for a few other things to eventuate.
I'm gonna wait till the end of September when I know, uh,
it'll be school holidays and I'll have a clearer mind,
(13:43):
or I'm gonna wait till the end of the financial
year when I know how the company that I'm working
at is doing financially. That's great. But if you're just
letting yourself drift forever,
You are making a decision and you're making a decision
in favour of the status quo. And if you're really
unhappy with the status quo, then you need to rethink that,
because indecisiveness is not your friend. It just means that
you're hanging out in the status quo where you don't
(14:04):
want to
Speaker 2 (14:04):
be. Commit and reflect. Follow through on the decisions you make.
If you commit to a certain action, then do it
immediately and don't allow yourself the space to return to
the toing and froing. We've all done it.
You make the decision, you're gonna buy the couch, you
ring the furniture shop, and you go, I've changed my mind.
(14:25):
So I don't know what it is about the small
decisions that freak me out. Um, but I completely identify
with indecision, and hopefully, Jamila, we've given people some things
to
Speaker 1 (14:36):
think about. I think we have. The truth is, folks,
that nobody knows what's going to happen next in life,
and I think we all need to make peace with
the uncertainty of being human.
Um, you've definitely heard in this conversation, I'm not one
of those people who's done that very well. Uh, I've
watched Helen Close up being able to live in that
drift for a period, and it is something we all
need to be able to do. But at the same time,
you also need to be able to know when it's enough,
(14:58):
when enough is enough, and that you can make a
decision and you can back your decision, and there will
be good things that come from it. There'll be less
good things from that come from it, but at least
you've had a go.
Mindset is created by FW Jobs Academy with support from
the Australian government's Office for Women.
Welcome to Mindset, a guide to getting out of your
own way and a blueprint for professional success. Today, Helen
McCabe and Jamila Risby are here to share how they
turn uncertainty into decisiveness.
Ellen, we've all had those times in our lives where
we've experienced, like, uh, almost a decision paralysis state where
(00:25):
it feels like you can't move forward, and even minor choices,
I think, at that time can feel like they're, they're insurmountable.
And I found like, I think when I've experienced that
in the past, that it's incredibly exhausting, um, and the
idea of making a decision feels too hard, all of
a sudden. Um,
(00:46):
And those periods of uncertainty can be.
Really stressful, but the way that they show up is
really diverse in the way that they show up in
your life. So for me, I know one of them
can be that I start to overanalyze all my options.
So I go into options mode, and I'm trying not
to look at Helen as we record, um, folks, because
she knows I do this, and I start going, Well,
(01:06):
there's option A and there's option B, and there's option C,
and then there's option 1A, and then there's option and
I try and think about all the possibilities. And while
that can sound like a really sensible way of making
a decision, it's not if you can't stop. Yes.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Um, the procrastination is debilitating at times. So you just
go over it and over it again. And there's also
that unfounded fear of making, uh, a mistake. So, I,
I tend to be someone who, this doesn't show up
that much in my professional life, weirdly. I'm quite good
at making decisions professionally. I am really terrible, personally. So
(01:42):
if you ask me to choose.
Um, a fridge, or, um, a lounge or a paint colour,
or I'm OK with a restaurant. I'm OK with food
choices because you're hungry. Yeah. Um, and I have strong views,
but I can be I really struggle with decisions on
simple things. And, um,
(02:04):
And I'm, I, I, I just don't really know what
that's about. Now the good news is, they don't really matter,
the fridge doesn't really matter.
Um, but I, I definitely experience extreme levels of indecision
about almost the most insignificant things in life.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Yeah. And that's something we see, I think, uh, in
the FW community and it shows up amongst ourFW and
Jobs Academy members quite a bit, where we hear about
people who have almost over-researched. Uh, they think.
Want to change careers and they're looking to a new industry,
and they've overthought it to the point that they start
to rule too many things out, and, uh, their options
(02:44):
become really, really narrow. Or people who are just struggling
with that procrastination of like, I know I need to start,
I know I have to start, but I'm so anxious
about this uncertainty that I'm in, that I'm actually keeping
myself in it longer by a
Avoiding hitting go, let's say.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
So I'm really good at helping with career, um, indecision, uh,
because for me, that is quite clear. Um, you are
unlikely to make an incorrect decision on your career. And
the reason I say that is because, um, life shape
shifts around the wrong. So you might, you might say
yes to that job. Uh, you might have two jobs,
(03:22):
you don't really know, and you say yes to one.
Um, because you have to say yes. Don't overthink that because.
You will learn something from every new job, correct. You
learn probably more from a bad job than you do
from a good job. And so I always say to
(03:43):
anyone who's really overthinking the pros and cons of a job, um.
You are literally wasting time. Just make the decision, take
the job. The other thing people make make mistakes on
when they're worrying about career decisions is they think the
job's forever. I'm taking a job, uh, at the cafe,
(04:03):
and that is my life. I am forever more gonna
work at that cafe. In actual fact, you can quit
the cafe. You can quit it in a week, you
can quit it in a month, and you can quit
it in a year. You do not have to stay.
Um, in your profession. Now, your family and your, and
your private life, that does get more complicated. But we're
here to talk about careers, right? So, indecision in, um, careers,
(04:27):
I think, can be way overblown. What about you? I
find
Speaker 1 (04:32):
that really interesting. I think that's also entirely.
True, and yet I also know I do it, right?
I also know I do overstress about a big career decision,
and it does feel defining, and it does feel like
this has to be the right job, and it's got
to take me to the next thing. And I do
see it quite strategically, and as a result, I think,
do get a bit wrapped up in, in that uncertainty
of what's going to happen.
(04:53):
Um, I found this quote that I really liked, Helen, from, um, Dr.
Brian Robinson, who wrote a wrote a book called Changed
to the Desk in a Hybrid World. And he talks
about why it is that being in that place of
uncertainty is so horrible. Um, and he says, work life's
inevitable uncertainties instantly arouse our fight or flight reaction. Your
survival brain.
(05:13):
You know, the, that's the brain that's supposed to make
us run away from the tiger, is constantly updated, updating
your world. It's making judgments about what's safe and what isn't,
and it will do almost anything for the sake of certainty,
because you're hardwired to overestimate threats and underestimate your ability
to handle them. The human brain prefers to know an
outcome one way or another.
(05:33):
And I, I just found that so useful because it
reminds me that the way my brain works in its
search for certainty, and it's discomfort in the uncertainty that
often can lead to procrastination and inaction and all sorts
of things is actually driven by being a human being
for millennia and having to make quick decisions and, uh,
you know, outrun an animal or find food, and yet
(05:56):
I'm applying it to the fact that I've got a
meeting with you this afternoon. Like, it's just not necessary
to be reacting in the same way.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
So
How do you overcome it and find your decisiveness?
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Yeah, I think that's a good question, and I've been
trying to unpack that about, about both myself and about,
about others. Um, for me, I think I found through
experience that making a decision is what matters. And especially
as a team leader,
You have got people around you who are looking to
(06:31):
you for a decision to give them certainty. And so,
sometimes a decision is better than trying to hold out
a long time for the best decision. And, uh, sometimes
by delaying a decision, you make a decision anyway. And
that's something I try and tell myself a lot. By
not making a call, and absolutely, we, we do need
to be deliberate and careful and, and take advice and,
(06:53):
and research. But,
If you are consistently putting off making a call, making
a hard decision, you are still making a decision. You
are making a decision not to act. You are making
a decision to delay, you are making a decision in
favour of the status quo. And if you don't like
the status quo, then you are gonna have to take
a decision to get out of it.
Speaker 2 (07:13):
I'm, I'm listening to you thinking at it from, from
completely different perspectives. Um, there are times when no decision's
OK when taking the time.
So pulling out of the pace of the requirement for
a decision is not a bad thing. I call it
the drift. Um, I've always been a big fan of,
of implementing the drift when there isn't a lot of clarity.
(07:34):
And I think that is a decision, as you say.
If I make an active decision to let the drift
happen for circumstances to change, for the, for the energy
or the, um,
The discomfort to pass, uh, sometimes that is actually a
(07:57):
good decision. So slow it all down. Um, but equally,
I agree with you, if you are really struggling, um,
and there's no right or wrong, just make one because
you are.
Undermining um the confidence in you as a leader, but
let's say you're not a leader, say you are indecisive
(08:17):
about something that's really important to you and you personally, um,
why should you speed that up? Well, because
It's a sliding door moment. Like, you take a path
and then you, you, the world will shape shift around you,
and you will pick up good things and bad things
when you take that path and you will have picked
up good things and bad things when you take the
(08:38):
other path. Um, the delay, uh, from the learning of
either decision.
Uh, isn't serving you very well.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, absolutely. There's this study, um, I was reading this
morning from the University College of London, which made me
giggle because it, uh, described me in the form of
a whole lot of people who did this study. So
it was an experiment. They had, um, all these people, uh,
who were told in one group that you're gonna get
a very painful electric shock right now.
And they compared their experience of the stress of knowing
(09:09):
that that was coming with a group who were told,
you are going to get a moderately painful electric shock
at some point.
And not told when. And the stress is so much bigger.
It's why we say when there's a painful medical procedure,
just do it, just do it, just rip the band-aid off, right?
Because knowing at some point it's gonna be ripped and
it'll be slow and painful is, is worse. So I
(09:29):
think it, it is a reminder that while that uncertainty
can be beneficial for decision making at times, you also
need to know how to be decisive. And I think
this is probably a good example of how
Both states are OK, right? They, they are both OK.
We need to be good at sitting in the uncertainty,
which I'm not, and Helen is, and we need to
be good at being decisive. And being able to develop
(09:52):
your decisiveness is what's gonna move you forwards in your,
in your search for work journey or a promotion, seek.
A promotion. So let's talk about how we can learn
to be more decisive, Helen, because we know that decisiveness
can bring us a whole lot of benefits. So my,
my first suggestion is starting small. We make thousands of
decisions every day. We decide what to wear, we decide
(10:12):
what to eat for dinner. Uh, if you can start
to practise your decisiveness on smaller things, you'll sort of
start to stretch and work out your decisiveness muscle a
little bit harder.
Speaker 2 (10:23):
I'm reminded of, um, Barack Obama, who only ever had
the same coloured suit, because it was one decision he
didn't have to make every day. Yeah. So he always
wore the same blue suit. Um, time limits. Don't allow
yourself to ruminate indefinitely. Instead, give yourself a deadline and
keep yourself accountable to it. Certain decisions should not be
taken lightly. Absolutely give yourself some space and time, uh,
(10:45):
particularly when they carry substantial consequences. Getting married, um, booking
your time, folks. Yes, we.
Um, definitely take your time. Um, but endless indecision is
is rarely helpful, and it's not helpful to the person
that has asked you to marry them, uh, and it's
not helpful to you either. So set yourself some time
Speaker 1 (11:05):
limits. Became a very different podcast. Uh.
I'm also gonna recommend changing it up. If you're someone
who is finding that your decision-making approach, and even if
you don't think you've got one, you just kind of
make them. You do have one. We all develop some
kind of consistency in our approach to decisions. But if
you keep
Ending up in this sort of analysis paralysis state, then
(11:27):
you need to start making decisions in a different way,
or at least try doing it a different way. One
thing I see a lot, uh, between friends, colleagues, people
who are members of, of FW and our jobs academy,
is that they are asking either the wrong people or
too many people for their opinions. Going out and getting
opinions from 400 different people in their life who all
(11:47):
give a different perspective, and it just leads them feeling
like they can't make any decision cause they're gonna disappoint everybody.
You've got to be really careful and quite selective about
who you get advice from and who you listen to.
Advice is great. Go out and find it, but make
sure you don't wait at all equally, or you're always
gonna be in a mess. If you're someone who works
with the pros and cons list in your head, let's say,
(12:08):
perhaps that doesn't work for you. Um, one of the
things that, um, I've heard from Mim Bartlett, who
Has run courses for FW before, which I love, is
that she talks about having a personal board. The way
that a business has a board of directors and advisors
who help, uh, bring different skill sets and experiences to
the business's decision making. Who are they in your life?
(12:31):
Who are the people you go to for advice on career?
Who are the people that you go to for advice
on
Um, parenting, who are the people that you go to
for advice on relationships? Uh, start to build up who
you rely on and who you trust so that you
can go to them when you're feeling stuck.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
And recognise, uh, when you are only going to a
certain type of person for a particular piece of advice.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Because you, you think they affirm what you,
Speaker 2 (12:54):
you believe. If that's what you're doing, 100%, that's fine,
cause it's confirming your your decision, um, but
recognise that's what you're doing. Um, embrace imperfection. Jamila, Remember
that there is no perfect decision. You can learn from
both courses of action. So, um, understand that any decision
you take or path you will follow will inevitably bring
(13:15):
joy and discomfort. Sometimes you have to settle for good
enough for now to achieve great in the long term.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
Here, here.
I touched on this one a little bit earlier, folks.
Sometimes those big decisions are really intimidating, and so we
make no decision at all. Um, and as Helen said,
sometimes it's OK to drift for a period, to say,
I'm gonna wait for a few other things to eventuate.
I'm gonna wait till the end of September when I know, uh,
it'll be school holidays and I'll have a clearer mind,
(13:43):
or I'm gonna wait till the end of the financial
year when I know how the company that I'm working
at is doing financially. That's great. But if you're just
letting yourself drift forever,
You are making a decision and you're making a decision
in favour of the status quo. And if you're really
unhappy with the status quo, then you need to rethink that,
because indecisiveness is not your friend. It just means that
you're hanging out in the status quo where you don't
(14:04):
want to
Speaker 2 (14:04):
be. Commit and reflect. Follow through on the decisions you make.
If you commit to a certain action, then do it
immediately and don't allow yourself the space to return to
the toing and froing. We've all done it.
You make the decision, you're gonna buy the couch, you
ring the furniture shop, and you go, I've changed my mind.
(14:25):
So I don't know what it is about the small
decisions that freak me out. Um, but I completely identify
with indecision, and hopefully, Jamila, we've given people some things
to
Speaker 1 (14:36):
think about. I think we have. The truth is, folks,
that nobody knows what's going to happen next in life,
and I think we all need to make peace with
the uncertainty of being human.
Um, you've definitely heard in this conversation, I'm not one
of those people who's done that very well. Uh, I've
watched Helen Close up being able to live in that
drift for a period, and it is something we all
need to be able to do. But at the same time,
you also need to be able to know when it's enough,
(14:58):
when enough is enough, and that you can make a
decision and you can back your decision, and there will
be good things that come from it. There'll be less
good things from that come from it, but at least
you've had a go.
Mindset is created by FW Jobs Academy with support from
the Australian government's Office for Women.
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