November 25, 2025 • 28 mins
On this episode of the Seeing Eye Dogs Show, Harriet is joined by Seeing Eye Dogs Senior Instructor Brooke Anderson. Brooke is going to talk to us about the exciting new Navigating My Path program which will help inform and prepare potential handlers about all things dog guide mobility. This program brings a taste of life with a Seeing Eye Dog to our clients over 18 and comes after the success of the Youth Program. We also talk generally about eligibility for a Seeing Eye Dog.
Navigating My Path program is open to people who are blind or have low vision across Australia who travel independently but are interested in the benefits of dog guide mobility. The program will run from June 2026 but enrolment is open now. Reach out to Brooke: Brooke.Anderson@visionaustralia.org or give her a call on 0448 093 817 or head to the website: https://sed.visionaustralia.org/about-us/news-and-stories/25-10-20/navigating-my-path-independent-mobility-program to find out about the program or apply.
If you'd like to find out more about Seeing Eye Dogs head to our website: https://sed.visionaustralia.org/
If you're blind or have low vision and are interested in becoming a handler or applying for a Seeing Eye Dog, please email us at info@sed.org.au or call on 1800 037 773 to discuss dog guide mobility, eligibility or assessment.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:19):
On Vision Australia Radio. You're listening to the Seeing Eye
dog show with me, your host, Harriet Moffatt. Today I'm
joined by Seeing Eye Dogs senior instructor Brooke Anderson, who's
going to be talking to us about a new program
at Seeing Eye Dogs. That is the Navigating My Path program.
This is like our youth program, which contains kind of
(00:39):
some experiential work with seeing eye dogs, as well as
some O&M training to help prepare someone for potentially becoming
a senior dog handler, or learning a bit more about
what it's like. We're also going to be talking about
eligibility in general and who benefits from a seeing eye dog.
So lots to cover in this interview. And if you
would like to find out more about life with a
(01:01):
Seeing Eye dog as well. There are other great radio
interviews on this show with lots of our handlers from
their perspectives as well. So let's hear from Brooke about
our Navigating My Path new program for next year and
seeing eye dog eligibility. Thank you for listening.
S2 (01:24):
Hi, Brooke, thanks for joining me on the show today.
S3 (01:26):
No, thank you for having me.
S2 (01:28):
Could you please start off by introducing yourself?
S3 (01:30):
So my name is Brooke Anderson. I'm the senior instructor
at Seeing Eye Dogs.
S2 (01:36):
And what does that entail?
S3 (01:39):
So being a senior instructor, I support clients in a
range of different ways. So that can be through doing
an assessment with them to see if they're eligible for
a seeing eye dog. It can be training them with
their new seeing eye dog or providing sort of follow
up support once they've been paired with a dog guide. Um,
and a working with them, um, and things might crop up,
(02:01):
such as dog distraction or some sniffing and things. And
so I can support in that regard too.
S2 (02:07):
And when we talk about things like kind of, you know,
Assessment we're talking about, I guess, getting a seeing eye dog.
And that's a quite involved process, isn't it?
S3 (02:16):
Yeah it is. Um, so it starts off with someone
expressing their interest. Um, and from there we give them
a call to chat around some of the factors around
dog guides and whether they would meet our eligibility. Um,
if that call, it's seen that. Yeah, the client is
still interested, and they meet the eligibility criteria, we send
(02:39):
them out an application pack, and then once that pack
comes back, we organise a time to go out and
see the client. Um, and it's divided into two parts.
So the first part being a interview with the client
just to have a chat around their mobility, what type
of dog they're after, um, what they're sort of looking
(03:00):
for in dog guide mobility and then a walk somewhere
that they do in the community where the dog's going
to support them.
S2 (03:08):
And you've had a bit of success with the youth program,
which is I mean, actually, maybe I'll lead on to
asking you what the youth program is.
S3 (03:18):
Yeah. So the Seeing Eye Dog youth program, uh, is now, um,
at the end of its fourth year running. It's a
12 month program for clients between 12 and 18 who
have low vision or a blind interested in dog guide mobility, um,
whilst also increasing their orientation, mobility skills. So what they
(03:38):
do is a monthly um theory session with a seeing
eye dog instructor, where we talk around a range of
different concepts such as road crossings, traveling in different environments,
and how they may be different between the long cane
and dog guide. And then we suggest that they do
a one on one session with their O&M of choice
(03:59):
in their local area so that they can work on
the skills that are most important to them, um, and
where they're up to, um, in their own skills. And
then they do two camps. Um, so one in the
April school holidays and one in September, where they get
paired with a dog for three days, two nights, um,
to basically have that feel of what it is like
(04:20):
to have a dog guide and the ups and downs, um,
two dog guide mobility.
S2 (04:26):
And how was that, I guess been received so far?
S3 (04:29):
It's been a fantastic program. Um, we've seen some amazing outcomes. Um,
so clients going through and realizing maybe dog guide mobility
is not for them at that point, and perhaps it's
something that they'll explore a little bit more in the future.
Some clients getting to the end of the program and
having developed their skills to a level where they do
meet eligibility and have applied to be a seeing eye dog, um,
(04:54):
user gone through the assessment process and are now working
with their seeing eye dogs, um, which is fantastic. And
then some clients that at the end of the program,
we've identified a couple of things that we have suggested
they work on, um, either to continue with their own
sort of cane skills or if their dog guide mobility
is their goal, um, to achieve those before it might
(05:16):
be suitable for them.
S2 (05:19):
Yeah, and I guess that would give them a much
kind of better preparation for, you know, client training ahead.
It's not going to be quite as much of a
shock to the system if, you know, they're kind of
slightly more prepared.
S3 (05:31):
Definitely. Yeah. It's um, people enter sort of dog guide
training after going through the youth program with quite a
lot of information under their belt. Um, some people find
the training experience easier because of that. Um, training with
a dog guide can take 2 to 3 weeks, and
it's quite intensive. And so it can reduce sort of
(05:52):
that emotional burden as well.
S2 (05:55):
And it's not just, um, kids that are now able
or young people, I suppose, that are able to, I guess.
S1 (06:00):
Get a bit of a taste before they begin the process.
Can you tell us a bit about the new program
that's being devised.
S3 (06:08):
Yeah, we're very excited. So after some feedback from the community,
we've been informed that our clients over the age of
18 years old would like a similar opportunity. So if developed,
the Navigating My Path program, um, which is a condensed
version of the youth program. So instead of 12 months
runs over six months, um, but has the same structure.
(06:31):
So you're still doing the monthly online sessions, um, which
are outside of sort of work hours. So if you
are working or studying, they're, um, easy to attend, and
then you'll still do your O&M sessions when it's convenient
for you as well. Um, and with one learning retreat
at the end of the program to give you that
(06:52):
hands on experience of what it's like to be with
a dog guide.
S1 (06:57):
So who is eligible to take part in that program?
S3 (07:01):
So that program, um, we're looking for anyone who's over
the age of 18 years old, legally blind or have
low vision that impacts their independent mobility. So it's where
you're finding that a primary mobility aid, such as a
cane or a dog, might be something that you're exploring. Um,
finding challenges with, say, obstacles or locating things, um, as
(07:23):
well able to perform some self-care tasks. So, um, because
you are staying at the residence, if there is any, um,
need for things like showering and preparing teas and coffee
just to have some, um, self-care tasks such as those.
And then also we're looking at the moment at clients
(07:44):
who are currently traveling independently to one, maybe two destinations, um,
at the moment. So you've got some travel skills. It
might be you're heading from home to a local shop
or a friend's house currently, and you're looking to expand
that over the course of the program.
S1 (07:59):
I assume that's more kind of at a minimum, if
you're someone that's quite busy. That's still fine.
S3 (08:05):
Correct? Yep. That's why we've just done it at the
1 to 2. And that's just so that you're constantly
practicing the skills that we're sort of going to be
speaking around in the program. Um, so because the program
focuses on sort of traveling in the community, if you're
still at foundational level in terms of learning how to
use the long cane, it might be this program, something
that we look into, um, in a couple of years.
But if you've got those foundational skills and you're looking
(08:27):
to build on your independent mobility, then this can be
a fantastic program to do that as well.
S1 (08:33):
And you've said that part of it is over zoom,
and then you've got the kind of residential part. Can
someone take part in the program from anywhere in Australia?
S3 (08:43):
Yeah. Great question. So we support because we are nationally based,
our learning retreat will be at our residence in Kensington,
but we support interstate clients. So we would pay for
the flights to come down to from your state to
Melbourne and then pick you up at the airport and
travel down to our residents here in Kensington that way. Yeah.
(09:04):
Anyone can participate.
S1 (09:07):
What happens on the learning retreat?
S3 (09:09):
So the learning retreat will be over 3 or 4 days. Um,
and it's going to be a mixture of starting off
at foundational dog guide skills so you don't have to
have any experience, um, being around a dog, whether it's
a dog guide or a pet dog. Um, that's what
the program can be fantastic for. So we'll start off
with how to run obedience sessions, how to walk with
a dog on a loose lead, um, how to care
(09:32):
for a dog overnight toilet, a dog being, uh, having
low vision or blindness. And then we'll also go in
sort of guide work skills. So how to get a
dog to turn left or right or body positions and
locating doors and chairs. Um, we use uh, the residential
sort of area. So it's a suburban area. Um, we
(09:53):
are sort of inner city, so it can be sort
of like a shopping strip we head up to in
the early stages. We head out to a local restaurant, um,
so that we can practice how to get the dogs
under seats, manage, you know, 5 to 6 dog guides
around a table, um, eating our dinner and managing drinks
(10:13):
and things like that. There's the optional night walk for
clients that want to experience the differences between sort of
a long cane and dog guide at night time. Uh,
and then also ending with sort of a busier shopping strip.
So it guides you through sort of the early stages
and foundations. And then we every day sort of build
up to a busier area from there.
S1 (10:36):
It sounds quite immersive, and I guess at the end
of it then you, you know, it's that kind of
easier to make an informed decision about the next steps.
S3 (10:44):
Definitely. So having a dog guide if you do apply
can be sort of, you know, that commitment for something between,
you know, 6 to 8 years. Um, this gives you
a really good idea around what it is, um, what
benefits you'll get from it. Um, what's involved in caring
for a dog guide compared to maybe a pet dog
that you've had before, or if you've never had animals before? Um,
(11:06):
so it really is quite a good experience to figure
out what your next steps are, whilst also increasing your skills.
So it could be you get to the end of
the program and go wow, this dog stuff is too
much for me, but you would have developed quite a
lot of information around the differences, but then also increased
your skills at the same time. So there's no lose
(11:28):
situation by entering the program, which is fantastic.
S1 (11:32):
I assume that, you know, you want people that have
some interest or at least kind of, you know, um,
would like to find out more about the dog guide thing,
but it's it's good to know that it's not just a, um, cool. Well,
you've done it. And now here's your dog. You're taking
it home.
S3 (11:46):
Exactly. There's no commitment at the end. Um, to go
on to the next step. It's really to empower clients
to make an informed choice around what's right for their mobility, um,
either now or into the future.
S1 (11:59):
When is this program being held and how can a
client find out more or potentially apply?
S3 (12:04):
So the program will start in June 2026. The reason
we're recruiting now, and hope to have every sort of
the people enrolled by the end of this year, is
because it does take around six months to support in
terms of any NDIS and things like that, that we
need to sort of go through. It will start in
June 2026, with the learning retreat being around November 2026. Um,
(12:27):
if people are interested, a couple of ways that you
can find out more information, you can head on to
our website and have a look at the Navigating My
Path program. There's a page there. We'll talk about similar
things that we've talked around today. You can email myself
at Brooke b r e a n d e r
(12:50):
s o n at Vision Australia. Org. Or you can
give me a call on 093817 as well. If you're
talking to Vision Australia, any staff member will be able
to get you in touch with me as well. So, um,
lots of different ways to connect.
S1 (13:06):
Is there an upper age limit?
S3 (13:09):
No. Upper age limit? No, we don't have upper age
limit in terms of this program or dog guide mobility.
All we look into is just ensuring that someone is
fit and healthy to participate in the program. And dog
guide mobility isn't going to be a risk to that.
S1 (13:24):
Do you have to be NDIS eligible?
S3 (13:27):
Yeah. Good. Um, so in terms of funding, we support
clients who have NDIS to gain the funds for the program.
If for some reason we go through a few reviews
and the NDIS still aren't cooperating, then we can talk
around some different funding streams that we have available as well.
But our first point of call would always be to
see whether or not we can get those funds through NDIS.
S1 (13:50):
And is there anything else that you think would be
good for anyone to consider about taking part in the program.
S3 (13:56):
Great question. No, I think we've covered off a lot
of it. So the eligibility, um, sort of the outcomes,
what we're hoping to get from it. Any questions people have,
please always feel free. Um, even if there's, you know,
the program fits 80% of what you're needing. Um, we
can talk around that 20%. See whether or not it's
something we can adapt to or have a chat to
(14:18):
see if there are other options as well. So just
by opening the door doesn't mean that you have to participate. Um,
it can just be a chat around where you are
at the moment. Um, if this program suitable or how
it could help elsewhere.
S1 (14:32):
Awesome. Well, thank you for joining me on the show
and chatting about that new Navigating My Path program.
S3 (14:37):
No, thank you for having me.
S1 (14:40):
And now, I guess as a run on from that,
what are the kind of eligibility criteria in general for
becoming a senior handler?
S3 (14:49):
So eligibility wise, what we're looking for is, um, that
the client first requires a primary mobility aid. So they're
either legally blind or they have low vision to a
point where when they're navigating in the community, there are
some difficulties, and they can be a range of different
ones for different clients and different eye conditions. And that's
(15:12):
to make sure that the dog's going to fulfill a purpose, um,
and make sure it's the right age for the client.
Then we look for a workload for the dog. So
what is how many times will the dog go out
every week and be able to support a client, navigate
the community? And that's for a few different reasons. It's
to ensure that they've maintaining their purpose, but also practicing
(15:33):
their skills, which is really important to ensure that those
are maintained on those routes. We're looking for the client
to be able to be doing them independently, so not
requiring sort of support from others to navigate, because it
is that the client needs to give the instructions to
the dog. So when to turn left, when to turn right,
when it's safe to cross the road. Um, another criteria,
(15:55):
which I'll talk about in a second. And then also
having an idea around where in space they are so
that they can communicate to the dog to find, say,
the service desk, because they know it's maybe three meters
somewhere to their right. Um, so it is a partnership
in that regard. The dogs aren't GPS, so clients need
to have a good sense of orientation themselves. The third one,
(16:16):
which I just mentioned would be road crossing decisions. So
a myth out there is that the dogs are able
to assess traffic. Our dogs are super smart, but they
don't have the capacity to judge a car traveling ten
meters down the road at 70km and where that's going
to end up. And so safe road crossing decisions. And
the road crossing decision in itself is, is the client's responsibility.
(16:40):
Otherwise eligibility. We want to make sure again that placing
a dog is not going to affect their health. So
we just investigate whether or not there's any way that
the dog could pose risk to the client, but they
would be the main sort of things that we're looking at. Um,
when assessing a client and seeing whether or not they
would meet our eligibility.
S1 (17:01):
Are there age limits to being a handler either way?
S3 (17:06):
No. So no age limit at seeing eye dogs. If
you can meet all of those criteria, then age is
not a factor for us. One of the other considerations
is around financial responsibility. So when a dog is placed,
the ongoing maintenance for the dog, um, things such as
vet bills, grooming, food, things like that, uh, are the
(17:30):
client's responsibility unless they have a funding stream available to them.
So sometimes, uh, the NDIS and or it's used to
be called a home care package. I think it's called
my supports. Now, um, they may be able to fund, um,
some of those items, but where those funding streams aren't,
then it's the clients. And so having that, um, is
(17:51):
also something to consider as well.
S1 (17:54):
And I suppose the kind of general care and maintenance
of the dog in general is, is also kind of
something that people will have to consider.
S3 (18:01):
Correct. Yeah. And so where age is not a factor,
one of the things that we do consider for clients
under the age of 18 is just making sure that
they have those, the parent support, um, because usually that
financial responsibility lies with them at that point. Um, but yeah,
most of the time when we're heading out, um, yeah,
families are happy to provide that.
S1 (18:25):
I feel like there's lots of things that make someone
eligible or not eligible who would benefit or, you know,
what are kind of some of the benefits of having
a seeing eye dog, you know, versus another, um, you know,
primary mobility aid.
S3 (18:38):
So there's only two primary mobility aids, um, for clients who, uh,
have low vision or are blind. That being the long
cane or seeing eye dog. Um, there are lots of
differences in dog guide. Mobility and long cane. So there's not, um, say,
advantage or disadvantage. They can be. Sort of perceived depending
(19:00):
on who's sort of using the dog. But some of
the differences that people talk around can be things such
as speed. So, um, sometimes clients find that they can
walk a little bit faster, um, with a dog because
they're not having to stop as frequently because their cane
may be getting stuck, or perhaps they've contacted an obstacle
(19:20):
they have to investigate. Um, and so speed can be
one of the factors that people consider. The main difference
is that the cane is considered an obstacle detector. So
when you're going down the street, it's going to detect
all of the items that you want to avoid. So
the bins and um, you know, a-frames and things like
(19:40):
that that you want to go around, whereas a dog
is considered an obstacle avoider. So sometimes you won't have
those items in the community that you, um, come into
contact with. Um. Now, some people think that's an advantage
because they don't want to bump into the obstacles all
the time. But for other people, they're really big environmental
cues around where they are in space. And so that
(20:03):
can be one of the differences to consider as well. Um,
and some of the things that you can do with
your O&M to prep if dog guide mobility is interest you. Um,
some of the other differences are the dogs, um, being
living beings, they love targeting so they can help with
things such as finding, uh, doors and chairs, um, and
(20:25):
specific items that you may teach them, um, because they
know that once they get to that location, they get
a treat. Now, it doesn't mean that you can leave
the door and say, we're heading to Kohl's. And the
dog knows in the 20 minutes it takes, they're exactly
where they're going. But if you're getting between sort of
that 1 to 5m, but, you know, close to an
item that you want. That's where you can say, find
(20:47):
the door and the dog is going to be able
to detect perhaps where that is from where that that
your location in space. So that can be really helpful,
especially for things like for example, train doors and bus
doors and trams. Locating those doors is something that the
dogs really enjoy doing. Um, main difference with a dog
and a cane. Your cane. You can get home, fold
(21:08):
it up, put it away. Doesn't really require much attention.
Your dogs, however, do require feeding, toileting, attention, um, when
off duty as well. And so that's something to consider. Um,
as a factor for dog guide mobility. Other differences? Um,
(21:29):
the dogs are trained to basically walk in a straight
line until you tell them to move off that, um,
now they'll stop at all of the down curbs and
identify that it's a down curve for you to make
the safe road crossing decision. Um, and then they'll basically
take some instruction from there. One of the things to
(21:50):
know is that dogs are dogs. So although they are
really smart, they can get distracted. And so if you
do notice a dog or a person or a bird,
all dogs have something different that they're interested by. Um,
it might be that they need a little support, um,
either vocal, uh, vocally with the lead, um, to pass
those items and then issuing a food reward. Um, if
(22:13):
they do that. Well, so that that way they want
to stay on task as well. Where's your cane? It's
not going to notice any of those things. Um, so
there would be some of the differences, um, as well.
S1 (22:24):
And I guess it's just like you said, it's a
bit of a personal preference either way. And some of
those things, you know, like you said about, um, you know,
you can fold cane away, whereas a dog, you know,
needs things from you. It's kind of it's it's a
bit of both, isn't it? It's like for, for some people,
you know, that could be a little bit inconvenient, which
might mean that maybe, you know, maybe the whole package
of the Seeing Eye dog is not worth it, whereas
(22:45):
other people, that is, you know exactly what they want
because the dog can also give you, you know, the
working tail and the comfort and some cuddles and, um,
you know, playtime. That's quite fun, you know, and like
you said, it's kind of almost it's two very different things,
I guess.
S3 (23:00):
Yeah, definitely. And that's right. There's no right or wrong.
It depends on the person and where they are. And
it could be that some person considers it is really
suitable now. And other people might say actually not for
this phase of life, but perhaps in another phase of life.
And so it's really personalised, um, is in terms of decision.
S1 (23:22):
And I guess it's kind of one of those like
it's not a now or never thing. It's kind of
at some point if now is the time that's great
and other otherwise it's kind of, you know, keep with
the cane and see how you go later.
S3 (23:33):
Yeah, definitely. And and that's where programs such as the
Navigating My Path or Seeing Eye Dog Youth Program, if
people are interested in just learning what that's like. Without
a commitment, they can be fantastic to have that experience,
to see what it is like. Um, and what some
of those eligibility factors are.
S1 (23:51):
And I guess either that kind of hands on or,
you know, even just having a really good chat with
an instructor, I guess you guys are kind of quite
happy to, you know, talk through some of those pros
and cons and have a bit of an open conversation.
S3 (24:02):
Definitely. And, um, happy with the conversation. Happy to do assessment.
The programs just mean that if you do go through them,
it's not just your dog that you're experiencing, but you'll
be in the program with others as well. So you'll
get to see differences in the dogs. All dogs have
a different temperament and personality. And, um, it means that
(24:24):
you'll get an idea of what things you really do
like in a dog. Um, and what things? Perhaps, um,
you wouldn't like in a dog guide. And so, for example,
some clients love a dog who wants to follow them
around the house and wants that to always be by
their side. And once that physical connection. Whereas other clients
can perhaps, you know, like that initial pat and then
(24:47):
want to sit down, um, and watch TV and the
dog head off to bed. And so something like that
can tell you a bit about the temperament. They all
do the dog guide role. But temperament can be very
different in um, the dogs um, which again is another
personal preference for clients.
S1 (25:03):
Yeah. And I guess with a cane it really, you know,
you've kind of got a cane or you've got a
cane other than different tips and different colors, it kind of,
you know, you're not going to get a whole different personality.
S3 (25:13):
No, no. They are they're very, very reliable in that way. Um, yeah.
They're very consistent.
S1 (25:20):
Is there anything else that you think that anyone considering
applying for a seeing eye dog should, you know, consider or, um,
be aware of?
S3 (25:29):
Um, I think they're the main ones I would consider, um,
if anyone's interested, one of the sort of activities that
I often give people before either talking to an instructor
or just reflecting themselves, is to keep some type of journal,
and whether that's audio in your head written down, depending
on who you are, um, just around where it is
(25:51):
that you're going and how your route would have been different,
or how you think it would have been different if
you were using a dog guide. Um, and that way
it gives us a really solid base to know, um,
what your workloads like, um, how the dog's going to
help and perhaps talk around some of those differences. So
for example, I go to clients houses frequently. And one
(26:13):
of the things people might say is I really need
help crossing the road. And that assessment, um, now that's
one of the things that isn't a myth out there.
The dog guides can't make that assessment. And so by
having that conversation, we can open up an area around, um,
what it is that the dog guide will provide so
that there's no surprises in the future around what it
(26:33):
is that they do and don't do. Um, so that
would be one of my key tips that I send
most people. Um, so that that way they can reflect
on their day to day. It only takes a couple
of minutes. Um, and if any questions come of that around, actually,
how would I have managed a dog in this situation?
They're the questions that we can go through.
S1 (26:53):
And maybe if your whole walk to work is, um,
through a dog park, you might, um, reconsider whether you
can be bothered to, uh.
S3 (27:01):
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah, it really means that
we can speak around the specifics, um, and the challenges
people are having and how the dog's going to be different.
S1 (27:12):
Well, thank you so much for joining me on the
show and giving our listeners a lot to think about.
S3 (27:17):
No. Thank you for having me.
S1 (27:25):
You've been listening to the Seeing Eye Dog show on
Vision Australia Radio. I hope you enjoyed my interview with
Brooke Anderson Seeing Eye Dogs senior instructor. If you'd like
to find out more about seeing eye dogs, the work
we do, and how you can help or are navigating
my path program or dog guide mobility and becoming a
senior dog handler. Head to our website at. If you'd
(27:48):
like to reach out to our friendly team to talk
about if a Seeing Eye dog is right for you,
you can give us a ring on 1800Â 037Â 773. If you'd
like to find out more about that specific program, you
can email Brooke at Brooks Anderson at Com for more
interviews and life about, uh. For more interviews and information
(28:10):
about life of a Seeing Eye Dogs handler, you can
head to our Omni FM page or your preferred podcast
provider to hear lots of handler interviews from this show,
so you can find out a bit about the lives
of our handlers as well. Thank you for listening. I
hope you have a lovely week and don't forget to
tune in! Same time next week for another episode of
The Seeing Eye Dog Show on Vision Australia Radio.
On Vision Australia Radio. You're listening to the Seeing Eye
dog show with me, your host, Harriet Moffatt. Today I'm
joined by Seeing Eye Dogs senior instructor Brooke Anderson, who's
going to be talking to us about a new program
at Seeing Eye Dogs. That is the Navigating My Path program.
This is like our youth program, which contains kind of
(00:39):
some experiential work with seeing eye dogs, as well as
some O&M training to help prepare someone for potentially becoming
a senior dog handler, or learning a bit more about
what it's like. We're also going to be talking about
eligibility in general and who benefits from a seeing eye dog.
So lots to cover in this interview. And if you
would like to find out more about life with a
(01:01):
Seeing Eye dog as well. There are other great radio
interviews on this show with lots of our handlers from
their perspectives as well. So let's hear from Brooke about
our Navigating My Path new program for next year and
seeing eye dog eligibility. Thank you for listening.
S2 (01:24):
Hi, Brooke, thanks for joining me on the show today.
S3 (01:26):
No, thank you for having me.
S2 (01:28):
Could you please start off by introducing yourself?
S3 (01:30):
So my name is Brooke Anderson. I'm the senior instructor
at Seeing Eye Dogs.
S2 (01:36):
And what does that entail?
S3 (01:39):
So being a senior instructor, I support clients in a
range of different ways. So that can be through doing
an assessment with them to see if they're eligible for
a seeing eye dog. It can be training them with
their new seeing eye dog or providing sort of follow
up support once they've been paired with a dog guide. Um,
and a working with them, um, and things might crop up,
(02:01):
such as dog distraction or some sniffing and things. And
so I can support in that regard too.
S2 (02:07):
And when we talk about things like kind of, you know,
Assessment we're talking about, I guess, getting a seeing eye dog.
And that's a quite involved process, isn't it?
S3 (02:16):
Yeah it is. Um, so it starts off with someone
expressing their interest. Um, and from there we give them
a call to chat around some of the factors around
dog guides and whether they would meet our eligibility. Um,
if that call, it's seen that. Yeah, the client is
still interested, and they meet the eligibility criteria, we send
(02:39):
them out an application pack, and then once that pack
comes back, we organise a time to go out and
see the client. Um, and it's divided into two parts.
So the first part being a interview with the client
just to have a chat around their mobility, what type
of dog they're after, um, what they're sort of looking
(03:00):
for in dog guide mobility and then a walk somewhere
that they do in the community where the dog's going
to support them.
S2 (03:08):
And you've had a bit of success with the youth program,
which is I mean, actually, maybe I'll lead on to
asking you what the youth program is.
S3 (03:18):
Yeah. So the Seeing Eye Dog youth program, uh, is now, um,
at the end of its fourth year running. It's a
12 month program for clients between 12 and 18 who
have low vision or a blind interested in dog guide mobility, um,
whilst also increasing their orientation, mobility skills. So what they
(03:38):
do is a monthly um theory session with a seeing
eye dog instructor, where we talk around a range of
different concepts such as road crossings, traveling in different environments,
and how they may be different between the long cane
and dog guide. And then we suggest that they do
a one on one session with their O&M of choice
(03:59):
in their local area so that they can work on
the skills that are most important to them, um, and
where they're up to, um, in their own skills. And
then they do two camps. Um, so one in the
April school holidays and one in September, where they get
paired with a dog for three days, two nights, um,
to basically have that feel of what it is like
(04:20):
to have a dog guide and the ups and downs, um,
two dog guide mobility.
S2 (04:26):
And how was that, I guess been received so far?
S3 (04:29):
It's been a fantastic program. Um, we've seen some amazing outcomes. Um,
so clients going through and realizing maybe dog guide mobility
is not for them at that point, and perhaps it's
something that they'll explore a little bit more in the future.
Some clients getting to the end of the program and
having developed their skills to a level where they do
meet eligibility and have applied to be a seeing eye dog, um,
(04:54):
user gone through the assessment process and are now working
with their seeing eye dogs, um, which is fantastic. And
then some clients that at the end of the program,
we've identified a couple of things that we have suggested
they work on, um, either to continue with their own
sort of cane skills or if their dog guide mobility
is their goal, um, to achieve those before it might
(05:16):
be suitable for them.
S2 (05:19):
Yeah, and I guess that would give them a much
kind of better preparation for, you know, client training ahead.
It's not going to be quite as much of a
shock to the system if, you know, they're kind of
slightly more prepared.
S3 (05:31):
Definitely. Yeah. It's um, people enter sort of dog guide
training after going through the youth program with quite a
lot of information under their belt. Um, some people find
the training experience easier because of that. Um, training with
a dog guide can take 2 to 3 weeks, and
it's quite intensive. And so it can reduce sort of
(05:52):
that emotional burden as well.
S2 (05:55):
And it's not just, um, kids that are now able
or young people, I suppose, that are able to, I guess.
S1 (06:00):
Get a bit of a taste before they begin the process.
Can you tell us a bit about the new program
that's being devised.
S3 (06:08):
Yeah, we're very excited. So after some feedback from the community,
we've been informed that our clients over the age of
18 years old would like a similar opportunity. So if developed,
the Navigating My Path program, um, which is a condensed
version of the youth program. So instead of 12 months
runs over six months, um, but has the same structure.
(06:31):
So you're still doing the monthly online sessions, um, which
are outside of sort of work hours. So if you
are working or studying, they're, um, easy to attend, and
then you'll still do your O&M sessions when it's convenient
for you as well. Um, and with one learning retreat
at the end of the program to give you that
(06:52):
hands on experience of what it's like to be with
a dog guide.
S1 (06:57):
So who is eligible to take part in that program?
S3 (07:01):
So that program, um, we're looking for anyone who's over
the age of 18 years old, legally blind or have
low vision that impacts their independent mobility. So it's where
you're finding that a primary mobility aid, such as a
cane or a dog, might be something that you're exploring. Um,
finding challenges with, say, obstacles or locating things, um, as
(07:23):
well able to perform some self-care tasks. So, um, because
you are staying at the residence, if there is any, um,
need for things like showering and preparing teas and coffee
just to have some, um, self-care tasks such as those.
And then also we're looking at the moment at clients
(07:44):
who are currently traveling independently to one, maybe two destinations, um,
at the moment. So you've got some travel skills. It
might be you're heading from home to a local shop
or a friend's house currently, and you're looking to expand
that over the course of the program.
S1 (07:59):
I assume that's more kind of at a minimum, if
you're someone that's quite busy. That's still fine.
S3 (08:05):
Correct? Yep. That's why we've just done it at the
1 to 2. And that's just so that you're constantly
practicing the skills that we're sort of going to be
speaking around in the program. Um, so because the program
focuses on sort of traveling in the community, if you're
still at foundational level in terms of learning how to
use the long cane, it might be this program, something
that we look into, um, in a couple of years.
But if you've got those foundational skills and you're looking
(08:27):
to build on your independent mobility, then this can be
a fantastic program to do that as well.
S1 (08:33):
And you've said that part of it is over zoom,
and then you've got the kind of residential part. Can
someone take part in the program from anywhere in Australia?
S3 (08:43):
Yeah. Great question. So we support because we are nationally based,
our learning retreat will be at our residence in Kensington,
but we support interstate clients. So we would pay for
the flights to come down to from your state to
Melbourne and then pick you up at the airport and
travel down to our residents here in Kensington that way. Yeah.
(09:04):
Anyone can participate.
S1 (09:07):
What happens on the learning retreat?
S3 (09:09):
So the learning retreat will be over 3 or 4 days. Um,
and it's going to be a mixture of starting off
at foundational dog guide skills so you don't have to
have any experience, um, being around a dog, whether it's
a dog guide or a pet dog. Um, that's what
the program can be fantastic for. So we'll start off
with how to run obedience sessions, how to walk with
a dog on a loose lead, um, how to care
(09:32):
for a dog overnight toilet, a dog being, uh, having
low vision or blindness. And then we'll also go in
sort of guide work skills. So how to get a
dog to turn left or right or body positions and
locating doors and chairs. Um, we use uh, the residential
sort of area. So it's a suburban area. Um, we
(09:53):
are sort of inner city, so it can be sort
of like a shopping strip we head up to in
the early stages. We head out to a local restaurant, um,
so that we can practice how to get the dogs
under seats, manage, you know, 5 to 6 dog guides
around a table, um, eating our dinner and managing drinks
(10:13):
and things like that. There's the optional night walk for
clients that want to experience the differences between sort of
a long cane and dog guide at night time. Uh,
and then also ending with sort of a busier shopping strip.
So it guides you through sort of the early stages
and foundations. And then we every day sort of build
up to a busier area from there.
S1 (10:36):
It sounds quite immersive, and I guess at the end
of it then you, you know, it's that kind of
easier to make an informed decision about the next steps.
S3 (10:44):
Definitely. So having a dog guide if you do apply
can be sort of, you know, that commitment for something between,
you know, 6 to 8 years. Um, this gives you
a really good idea around what it is, um, what
benefits you'll get from it. Um, what's involved in caring
for a dog guide compared to maybe a pet dog
that you've had before, or if you've never had animals before? Um,
(11:06):
so it really is quite a good experience to figure
out what your next steps are, whilst also increasing your skills.
So it could be you get to the end of
the program and go wow, this dog stuff is too
much for me, but you would have developed quite a
lot of information around the differences, but then also increased
your skills at the same time. So there's no lose
(11:28):
situation by entering the program, which is fantastic.
S1 (11:32):
I assume that, you know, you want people that have
some interest or at least kind of, you know, um,
would like to find out more about the dog guide thing,
but it's it's good to know that it's not just a, um, cool. Well,
you've done it. And now here's your dog. You're taking
it home.
S3 (11:46):
Exactly. There's no commitment at the end. Um, to go
on to the next step. It's really to empower clients
to make an informed choice around what's right for their mobility, um,
either now or into the future.
S1 (11:59):
When is this program being held and how can a
client find out more or potentially apply?
S3 (12:04):
So the program will start in June 2026. The reason
we're recruiting now, and hope to have every sort of
the people enrolled by the end of this year, is
because it does take around six months to support in
terms of any NDIS and things like that, that we
need to sort of go through. It will start in
June 2026, with the learning retreat being around November 2026. Um,
(12:27):
if people are interested, a couple of ways that you
can find out more information, you can head on to
our website and have a look at the Navigating My
Path program. There's a page there. We'll talk about similar
things that we've talked around today. You can email myself
at Brooke b r e a n d e r
(12:50):
s o n at Vision Australia. Org. Or you can
give me a call on 093817 as well. If you're
talking to Vision Australia, any staff member will be able
to get you in touch with me as well. So, um,
lots of different ways to connect.
S1 (13:06):
Is there an upper age limit?
S3 (13:09):
No. Upper age limit? No, we don't have upper age
limit in terms of this program or dog guide mobility.
All we look into is just ensuring that someone is
fit and healthy to participate in the program. And dog
guide mobility isn't going to be a risk to that.
S1 (13:24):
Do you have to be NDIS eligible?
S3 (13:27):
Yeah. Good. Um, so in terms of funding, we support
clients who have NDIS to gain the funds for the program.
If for some reason we go through a few reviews
and the NDIS still aren't cooperating, then we can talk
around some different funding streams that we have available as well.
But our first point of call would always be to
see whether or not we can get those funds through NDIS.
S1 (13:50):
And is there anything else that you think would be
good for anyone to consider about taking part in the program.
S3 (13:56):
Great question. No, I think we've covered off a lot
of it. So the eligibility, um, sort of the outcomes,
what we're hoping to get from it. Any questions people have,
please always feel free. Um, even if there's, you know,
the program fits 80% of what you're needing. Um, we
can talk around that 20%. See whether or not it's
something we can adapt to or have a chat to
(14:18):
see if there are other options as well. So just
by opening the door doesn't mean that you have to participate. Um,
it can just be a chat around where you are
at the moment. Um, if this program suitable or how
it could help elsewhere.
S1 (14:32):
Awesome. Well, thank you for joining me on the show
and chatting about that new Navigating My Path program.
S3 (14:37):
No, thank you for having me.
S1 (14:40):
And now, I guess as a run on from that,
what are the kind of eligibility criteria in general for
becoming a senior handler?
S3 (14:49):
So eligibility wise, what we're looking for is, um, that
the client first requires a primary mobility aid. So they're
either legally blind or they have low vision to a
point where when they're navigating in the community, there are
some difficulties, and they can be a range of different
ones for different clients and different eye conditions. And that's
(15:12):
to make sure that the dog's going to fulfill a purpose, um,
and make sure it's the right age for the client.
Then we look for a workload for the dog. So
what is how many times will the dog go out
every week and be able to support a client, navigate
the community? And that's for a few different reasons. It's
to ensure that they've maintaining their purpose, but also practicing
(15:33):
their skills, which is really important to ensure that those
are maintained on those routes. We're looking for the client
to be able to be doing them independently, so not
requiring sort of support from others to navigate, because it
is that the client needs to give the instructions to
the dog. So when to turn left, when to turn right,
when it's safe to cross the road. Um, another criteria,
(15:55):
which I'll talk about in a second. And then also
having an idea around where in space they are so
that they can communicate to the dog to find, say,
the service desk, because they know it's maybe three meters
somewhere to their right. Um, so it is a partnership
in that regard. The dogs aren't GPS, so clients need
to have a good sense of orientation themselves. The third one,
(16:16):
which I just mentioned would be road crossing decisions. So
a myth out there is that the dogs are able
to assess traffic. Our dogs are super smart, but they
don't have the capacity to judge a car traveling ten
meters down the road at 70km and where that's going
to end up. And so safe road crossing decisions. And
the road crossing decision in itself is, is the client's responsibility.
(16:40):
Otherwise eligibility. We want to make sure again that placing
a dog is not going to affect their health. So
we just investigate whether or not there's any way that
the dog could pose risk to the client, but they
would be the main sort of things that we're looking at. Um,
when assessing a client and seeing whether or not they
would meet our eligibility.
S1 (17:01):
Are there age limits to being a handler either way?
S3 (17:06):
No. So no age limit at seeing eye dogs. If
you can meet all of those criteria, then age is
not a factor for us. One of the other considerations
is around financial responsibility. So when a dog is placed,
the ongoing maintenance for the dog, um, things such as
vet bills, grooming, food, things like that, uh, are the
(17:30):
client's responsibility unless they have a funding stream available to them.
So sometimes, uh, the NDIS and or it's used to
be called a home care package. I think it's called
my supports. Now, um, they may be able to fund, um,
some of those items, but where those funding streams aren't,
then it's the clients. And so having that, um, is
(17:51):
also something to consider as well.
S1 (17:54):
And I suppose the kind of general care and maintenance
of the dog in general is, is also kind of
something that people will have to consider.
S3 (18:01):
Correct. Yeah. And so where age is not a factor,
one of the things that we do consider for clients
under the age of 18 is just making sure that
they have those, the parent support, um, because usually that
financial responsibility lies with them at that point. Um, but yeah,
most of the time when we're heading out, um, yeah,
families are happy to provide that.
S1 (18:25):
I feel like there's lots of things that make someone
eligible or not eligible who would benefit or, you know,
what are kind of some of the benefits of having
a seeing eye dog, you know, versus another, um, you know,
primary mobility aid.
S3 (18:38):
So there's only two primary mobility aids, um, for clients who, uh,
have low vision or are blind. That being the long
cane or seeing eye dog. Um, there are lots of
differences in dog guide. Mobility and long cane. So there's not, um, say,
advantage or disadvantage. They can be. Sort of perceived depending
(19:00):
on who's sort of using the dog. But some of
the differences that people talk around can be things such
as speed. So, um, sometimes clients find that they can
walk a little bit faster, um, with a dog because
they're not having to stop as frequently because their cane
may be getting stuck, or perhaps they've contacted an obstacle
(19:20):
they have to investigate. Um, and so speed can be
one of the factors that people consider. The main difference
is that the cane is considered an obstacle detector. So
when you're going down the street, it's going to detect
all of the items that you want to avoid. So
the bins and um, you know, a-frames and things like
(19:40):
that that you want to go around, whereas a dog
is considered an obstacle avoider. So sometimes you won't have
those items in the community that you, um, come into
contact with. Um. Now, some people think that's an advantage
because they don't want to bump into the obstacles all
the time. But for other people, they're really big environmental
cues around where they are in space. And so that
(20:03):
can be one of the differences to consider as well. Um,
and some of the things that you can do with
your O&M to prep if dog guide mobility is interest you. Um,
some of the other differences are the dogs, um, being
living beings, they love targeting so they can help with
things such as finding, uh, doors and chairs, um, and
(20:25):
specific items that you may teach them, um, because they
know that once they get to that location, they get
a treat. Now, it doesn't mean that you can leave
the door and say, we're heading to Kohl's. And the
dog knows in the 20 minutes it takes, they're exactly
where they're going. But if you're getting between sort of
that 1 to 5m, but, you know, close to an
item that you want. That's where you can say, find
(20:47):
the door and the dog is going to be able
to detect perhaps where that is from where that that
your location in space. So that can be really helpful,
especially for things like for example, train doors and bus
doors and trams. Locating those doors is something that the
dogs really enjoy doing. Um, main difference with a dog
and a cane. Your cane. You can get home, fold
(21:08):
it up, put it away. Doesn't really require much attention.
Your dogs, however, do require feeding, toileting, attention, um, when
off duty as well. And so that's something to consider. Um,
as a factor for dog guide mobility. Other differences? Um,
(21:29):
the dogs are trained to basically walk in a straight
line until you tell them to move off that, um,
now they'll stop at all of the down curbs and
identify that it's a down curve for you to make
the safe road crossing decision. Um, and then they'll basically
take some instruction from there. One of the things to
(21:50):
know is that dogs are dogs. So although they are
really smart, they can get distracted. And so if you
do notice a dog or a person or a bird,
all dogs have something different that they're interested by. Um,
it might be that they need a little support, um,
either vocal, uh, vocally with the lead, um, to pass
those items and then issuing a food reward. Um, if
(22:13):
they do that. Well, so that that way they want
to stay on task as well. Where's your cane? It's
not going to notice any of those things. Um, so
there would be some of the differences, um, as well.
S1 (22:24):
And I guess it's just like you said, it's a
bit of a personal preference either way. And some of
those things, you know, like you said about, um, you know,
you can fold cane away, whereas a dog, you know,
needs things from you. It's kind of it's it's a
bit of both, isn't it? It's like for, for some people,
you know, that could be a little bit inconvenient, which
might mean that maybe, you know, maybe the whole package
of the Seeing Eye dog is not worth it, whereas
(22:45):
other people, that is, you know exactly what they want
because the dog can also give you, you know, the
working tail and the comfort and some cuddles and, um,
you know, playtime. That's quite fun, you know, and like
you said, it's kind of almost it's two very different things,
I guess.
S3 (23:00):
Yeah, definitely. And that's right. There's no right or wrong.
It depends on the person and where they are. And
it could be that some person considers it is really
suitable now. And other people might say actually not for
this phase of life, but perhaps in another phase of life.
And so it's really personalised, um, is in terms of decision.
S1 (23:22):
And I guess it's kind of one of those like
it's not a now or never thing. It's kind of
at some point if now is the time that's great
and other otherwise it's kind of, you know, keep with
the cane and see how you go later.
S3 (23:33):
Yeah, definitely. And and that's where programs such as the
Navigating My Path or Seeing Eye Dog Youth Program, if
people are interested in just learning what that's like. Without
a commitment, they can be fantastic to have that experience,
to see what it is like. Um, and what some
of those eligibility factors are.
S1 (23:51):
And I guess either that kind of hands on or,
you know, even just having a really good chat with
an instructor, I guess you guys are kind of quite
happy to, you know, talk through some of those pros
and cons and have a bit of an open conversation.
S3 (24:02):
Definitely. And, um, happy with the conversation. Happy to do assessment.
The programs just mean that if you do go through them,
it's not just your dog that you're experiencing, but you'll
be in the program with others as well. So you'll
get to see differences in the dogs. All dogs have
a different temperament and personality. And, um, it means that
(24:24):
you'll get an idea of what things you really do
like in a dog. Um, and what things? Perhaps, um,
you wouldn't like in a dog guide. And so, for example,
some clients love a dog who wants to follow them
around the house and wants that to always be by
their side. And once that physical connection. Whereas other clients
can perhaps, you know, like that initial pat and then
(24:47):
want to sit down, um, and watch TV and the
dog head off to bed. And so something like that
can tell you a bit about the temperament. They all
do the dog guide role. But temperament can be very
different in um, the dogs um, which again is another
personal preference for clients.
S1 (25:03):
Yeah. And I guess with a cane it really, you know,
you've kind of got a cane or you've got a
cane other than different tips and different colors, it kind of,
you know, you're not going to get a whole different personality.
S3 (25:13):
No, no. They are they're very, very reliable in that way. Um, yeah.
They're very consistent.
S1 (25:20):
Is there anything else that you think that anyone considering
applying for a seeing eye dog should, you know, consider or, um,
be aware of?
S3 (25:29):
Um, I think they're the main ones I would consider, um,
if anyone's interested, one of the sort of activities that
I often give people before either talking to an instructor
or just reflecting themselves, is to keep some type of journal,
and whether that's audio in your head written down, depending
on who you are, um, just around where it is
(25:51):
that you're going and how your route would have been different,
or how you think it would have been different if
you were using a dog guide. Um, and that way
it gives us a really solid base to know, um,
what your workloads like, um, how the dog's going to
help and perhaps talk around some of those differences. So
for example, I go to clients houses frequently. And one
(26:13):
of the things people might say is I really need
help crossing the road. And that assessment, um, now that's
one of the things that isn't a myth out there.
The dog guides can't make that assessment. And so by
having that conversation, we can open up an area around, um,
what it is that the dog guide will provide so
that there's no surprises in the future around what it
(26:33):
is that they do and don't do. Um, so that
would be one of my key tips that I send
most people. Um, so that that way they can reflect
on their day to day. It only takes a couple
of minutes. Um, and if any questions come of that around, actually,
how would I have managed a dog in this situation?
They're the questions that we can go through.
S1 (26:53):
And maybe if your whole walk to work is, um,
through a dog park, you might, um, reconsider whether you
can be bothered to, uh.
S3 (27:01):
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And so, yeah, it really means that
we can speak around the specifics, um, and the challenges
people are having and how the dog's going to be different.
S1 (27:12):
Well, thank you so much for joining me on the
show and giving our listeners a lot to think about.
S3 (27:17):
No. Thank you for having me.
S1 (27:25):
You've been listening to the Seeing Eye Dog show on
Vision Australia Radio. I hope you enjoyed my interview with
Brooke Anderson Seeing Eye Dogs senior instructor. If you'd like
to find out more about seeing eye dogs, the work
we do, and how you can help or are navigating
my path program or dog guide mobility and becoming a
senior dog handler. Head to our website at. If you'd
(27:48):
like to reach out to our friendly team to talk
about if a Seeing Eye dog is right for you,
you can give us a ring on 1800Â 037Â 773. If you'd
like to find out more about that specific program, you
can email Brooke at Brooks Anderson at Com for more
interviews and life about, uh. For more interviews and information
(28:10):
about life of a Seeing Eye Dogs handler, you can
head to our Omni FM page or your preferred podcast
provider to hear lots of handler interviews from this show,
so you can find out a bit about the lives
of our handlers as well. Thank you for listening. I
hope you have a lovely week and don't forget to
tune in! Same time next week for another episode of
The Seeing Eye Dog Show on Vision Australia Radio.
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