April 29, 2026 • 37 mins
Episode Title: Episode 32: How Do We Do Worldschooling in Indonesia?
Hosts: Astrid & Clint, creators of The Wandering Daughter
(Intro clip sourced from 17:07 — Clint describing how to cross a street in Jakarta: commit, own it, and traffic will slow down or go around you — but no one will stop preemptively)
In this episode of Worldschooling Q&A, Astrid and Clint dive into one of our favorite topics: worldschooling in Indonesia. Indonesia and Mexico are the two countries we have returned to more than anywhere else, and as a family that has spent significant time traveling with kids in Indonesia, we wanted to give this country the deep dive it deserves.
From navigating Jakarta's notorious traffic to learning a few key Indonesian phrases, understanding the country's religious culture, and deciding which islands to explore, there is a lot to cover. Indonesia is one of those places that gets under your skin, and we believe most families who visit only scratch the surface by sticking to Bali. In this episode, we break down the practical side of family travel in Indonesia: getting around, managing cash and currency, understanding cultural norms and safety, and the highlights that make this country such a meaningful destination for worldschooling families. We also share what makes Jakarta and Jogjakarta two of the most rewarding stops for families looking for educational travel in Asia, with rich opportunities for cultural learning that you simply cannot find in a classroom.
Whether you are planning your first trip or considering a longer stay, this episode is packed with tips to help you travel responsibly and make the most of your experience. This is also part one of a two-part series: next episode, we go deep on Bali.
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📋 Episode Chapters: 00:00:00 – Introduction 00:00:23 – Welcome to Worldschooling Q&A 00:01:24 – Today's Question: How Do I World School in Indonesia? 00:01:58 – Getting to Indonesia & Around Jakarta: Airports, Traffic & Ride-Sharing 00:05:51 – Language, Currency & Cash 00:09:18 – Religion: Islam, the Call to Prayer & a Welcoming Culture 00:12:54 – Safety: LGBTQ+, Drug Laws, Conservatism & Dress 00:17:07 – ↩ Source of Intro Clip: No Sidewalks, Street Crossings & Street Food 00:20:40 – Jakarta Highlights: Dutch Colonial History & Cultural Pride 00:25:14 – Nature & Wildlife: Orangutans, Komodo Dragons & Island Gems 00:27:16 – Jogjakarta: Borobudur, the Arts, Batik & Getting Between Islands 00:35:54 – Outro & How to Support the Show
👉 For full show notes, resource links, and a complete episode guide, visit: https://thewanderingdaughter.com/episode-32-worldschooling-in-indonesia
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Clint Bush (00:00):
Crossing can be a little treacherous if you've
(00:02):
never crossed a if you've nevercrossed an Asian Street. This
is, I say Asian street because Ithink it's the same in Vietnam.
It's the same in Philippines.You there's a sense of like you
just have to own it will stopwith a slow down for you, but
you can't hesitate.
Astrid Vinje (00:23):
This is World schooling. Q and A. I'm Astrid,
creator of the wanderingdaughter. As a traveling family,
we've spent four years travelingfull time to over 18 countries
and six continents, wherever wego. We try to learn as much as
we can about the countries andcultures we visit while we
didn't coin the term, we like tocall this world schooling, using
(00:45):
the world as our classroom eachweek, my husband Clint and I
will answer one question aboutworld schooling and share our
experiences of traveling theworld with our Kids. Ready to
get started? Great. Let's divein. You. I continuing with our
(01:09):
country deep dives. This week,we are answering the question,
how do I World School inIndonesia? This is one of my
favorite topics, and I am biasedbecause I am Indonesian, but I'm
really excited to dive into thisepisode.
Clint Bush (01:24):
Yeah, I think along, I think the thing you mentioned
too, along with Mexico, we'vespent the most time in
Indonesia. So the Mexico andIndonesia are two places that we
we love going back to again andagain.
Astrid Vinje (01:37):
Yeah. Oh, and then I also want to mention that
we've decided to break this outinto two episodes. So this
episode, we're talking aboutIndonesia in general, and next
episode, we'll mention or talkabout Bali. So I don't like we
won't focus on Bali here, but itwill be talked about too.
Clint Bush (01:58):
Yeah, that's a good point. Okay, logistics. So I
think, like other episodes wejust talked about, Jakarta is
the main city. It the otherislands also have airports you
can fly into as well. Usuallythe other airports, though, I
don't think are international.They're, well, the Bali airports
International, yes, sorry, butLombok one, I don't think, is
(02:21):
internet.
Astrid Vinje (02:22):
No, they're more like regional ones, and even
like joke, Jakarta has anairport that maybe has flights
from Singapore, but it doesn'thave any other
Clint Bush (02:31):
that's true. I guess Singapore is technically
International. It doesn't. Itfeels still a little bit
domestic, because it's so cool.I mean, Singapore is really
close as far as flying in sochances are you're going to fly
into Jakarta, even if you aregoing to Bali. Sometimes tickets
are cheaper to fly into Jakarta.First, Jakarta is a huge city,
(02:53):
one of the largest cities in theworld. I think, I think it's in
the top five largest cities ofthe world, millions
Astrid Vinje (02:59):
and millions of people, 10s of people, 10s of
millions
Clint Bush (03:01):
of people, 10s of millions of people, I think over
20 million. So it's it is amassive city. It's also massive
city geographically. Is spreadout over a long distance.
Traffic is incredibly hard inJakarta,
Astrid Vinje (03:16):
yep,
Clint Bush (03:17):
I would say there's two cities, in my opinion, that
have the worst traffic in theworld, and it's Manila and
Jakarta, and so, at least fromwhat we've been,
Astrid Vinje (03:28):
yeah,
Clint Bush (03:29):
so
Astrid Vinje (03:30):
it can take you several hours just to go, like,
10 miles. So,
Clint Bush (03:34):
so that's, that's just to say, if you are planning
on visiting Jakarta a bit, andwe highly recommend it Jakarta.
We'll talk about that in in aminute. But like we highly
recommend visiting Jakarta,prepare yourself to just it's
going to take some time,especially getting from the
airport. And depending when youfly, and it's flying really late
(03:56):
at night, you probably won't todeal with as much traffic going
to your hotel, whatever. But ifyou're flying in any other time
of the day, it's possible you'llget stuck in traffic.
Astrid Vinje (04:06):
Well, with that said, there are some ways that
the government, or like thecity, has tried to, like, combat
some of that traffic. The mainone is this, like the MRT, which
goes right now, it just goeslike, north to south, from, like
Central or, I think like fromCentral Jakarta down south,
because once you get to centralJakarta, you still have to do
(04:29):
other, other modes oftransportation to get to get
North. And then, like in ourride sharing episode, grab is a
app that you can use to getaround in Jakarta. And that's
like, you know, Indonesia orSoutheast Asia's version of,
like, Uber.
Clint Bush (04:50):
They don't really have Uber, I don't
Astrid Vinje (04:51):
know, they don't have Uber. There. They have
grab. And then the other one ismore local, is called Go, check.
And then that's also, you know,you. Download the app and you
can get around and, like,connect a payment method and
stuff. So
Clint Bush (05:05):
I think both of those are really good to have,
because sometimes one or theother is not available. Go Jack
is spelled G, O, j, e, K, justin case you're checking but
like, they also do just, like,Uber here in the United States,
they do food delivery as well.You can pay by cash or via that.
Yeah, so,
Astrid Vinje (05:23):
and I forget, if it's grab or go check one of
them, you can hail a cab. Thebluebird taxis through that app
too. So sometimes, if you can'tget, like, a regular ride, then
just, you know, get, get a taxi.
Clint Bush (05:38):
And there are multiple cab companies. Bluebird
is the one we recommend. It'sthe most recognizable. It's been
there forever. That's allthrough Indonesia, so Bali as
well. Bluebird taxis are your goto taxis on that.
Astrid Vinje (05:51):
Let's talk a little bit about the language.
So Indonesia, the officiallanguage is Indonesian, but
every island has their or has,like, their own ethnic groups or
multiple ethnic groups, and theyalso have their languages that
are spoken there. But if youlearn some Indonesian phrases,
(06:12):
you should be able able to getaround the country
Clint Bush (06:15):
all the Yeah, all the younger people speak
Indonesian a lot of people speakEnglish at this point, but
you're still going to find that,you know, most people, even if
they do speak a little English,are hesitant to speak English as
much. Unless you're in likeretail, there's a lot of English
in retail or restaurants,additionally, Indonesia, I
think, is a little bit unique asfar as language goes, because
(06:39):
their unionized language, ortheir collective language,
Indonesian is still less than100 years old.
Astrid Vinje (06:48):
Yeah, actually, it's 100 now. It was created in
the 20s, 1920s so it's over 100years old. But yes, that's a
very new language and constantlyinvolving. You know, the the
youth always have their like,slang and stuff if you want to
learn some phrases. I do have anIndonesian phrase book on my
(07:11):
like on my website, so checkthat out.
Clint Bush (07:15):
Yeah, and I would say, actually, Indonesian is one
of the easier languages to pickup simple phrases. And so I
think a lot of, at least a lotof the families we've known that
will travel in Indonesia,especially, just go to Bali,
they're hesitant to try to pickup the language. I think it
maybe because it's an Asiancountry, they feel like it's
(07:35):
hard, actually, it's really easyto pick up simple phrases,
especially for Westerners, theyuse the same alphabet as Western
alphabet. So in thepronunciations really clear,
there's not a In fact, I thinkin a lot of ways it's easier to
learn Spanish, so I think it itbehooves you to learn a few
things, especially like, Thankyou, the numbers, that kind of
(07:58):
stuff,
Astrid Vinje (07:58):
yeah,
Unknown (07:58):
yeah.
Astrid Vinje (07:59):
And then the money. The currency is called
rupiah, and they have, like, youknow, mostly the bills are like,
in hundreds or 1000s. So,
Clint Bush (08:08):
yeah, and I think it's, I think it's like, it's
similar to Pesos. It's a lot,the $1 to rupiahs, a lot. I
can't remember exactly whatexchange, but it's not like
euros, where it's like, prettyclose to one on one. So just
keep in that mind, you may needyour conversion app to just do
(08:29):
some conversions as you're asyou're pulling cash out. It's
mostly cash based, I think,
Unknown (08:34):
yes,
Clint Bush (08:35):
just like Mexico, it's very cash based, especially
if you start going to some ofthe food vendors and stuff like
that. And it's okay to get cash.I mean, obviously it's okay
cash, it's a little bit in themetropolitan areas. I think it's
easier to find ATMs, but it canget trickier in the smaller
(08:59):
towns,
Astrid Vinje (08:59):
Yep, yeah, yeah, I do remember, like, we were in
Ahmed in Bali, and the one atm,and maybe it was because we had,
like, so many foreigners thereat the time, but the one atm in
town would run out of money, andeverybody would be like, Oh no,
now we have to, like, borrowmoney
from
like, other families that Werethere. Yeah. So let's talk a
(09:22):
little bit about the religion,because I think that is
something that, like, makespeople a little bit hesitant to
come to Indonesia.
Unknown (09:29):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (09:30):
yeah. I can speak to this because, I think, because I
didn't grow up in a Muslimculture, I think, I don't think
it caught me off guard, but it'sdefinitely, it's a different
experience, if you're not usedto that.
Astrid Vinje (09:41):
So Indonesia, the majority of the country is
Muslim, like 80%
Clint Bush (09:47):
so what that means, what that translates to for
someone that's not used to it,is, you'll hear the call of
prayer every day, multiple timesa day, including really early in
the morning, 5am roughly, i.Love it. I love hearing that. I
don't know there's justsomething about it, but if
you're not used to that, it canbe loud depending on where
(10:09):
you're staying, and it is earlyin the morning and it is
throughout the day. And so it issomething that you need. You
know, don't try to record yourpodcast at certain times of the
day. You can get a call prayerin the middle of it.
Unknown (10:25):
Yeah?
Clint Bush (10:26):
So, yeah.
Astrid Vinje (10:27):
Did you ever feel, and I agree with you, like, I
spent my childhood in Indonesia,in Jakarta, and so that was
never really, like, it wasn'tjarring to me, because I'm like,
Oh yeah, six o'clock, of coursethe call to prayer is going to
go and I love that. Like, Idon't know, I just especially
(10:50):
during, like, Ramadan and stuff.I love the live liveliness that
happens around that time of dayand around, like, the mosque. So
I'm going to ask you, kind of,maybe it's a leading question,
but did you ever feel likethreatened or unsafe being in a
Muslim country?
Clint Bush (11:11):
I'm glad you asked this. No, I did not. And I think
there is a stigma of to in theWestern countries like United
States, about Islam in general.And, you know, justified or not,
there is a stigma Indonesia hasper capita, I think, the largest
(11:34):
Muslim population in the world,the island of Java, specifically
in Jakarta, I think is one of,if not the, largest Muslim city
in the world. But I, you know,all the time we spent in
Jakarta, I never felt unsafebecause of the religion in
(11:57):
general, it's always a very andif you don't have any
experience, experience withIslam, is like, it's actually a
very giving and loving religion,very accepting religion. And you
feel that for the most part inIndonesia, in Jakarta, in Jogja.
(12:20):
Now it has, I think that countryhas kind of some of the you
could call it a stereotype oflike, I think because people
work so hard, there is a littlebit of like, just a, like, a
stoic, a stoicism like, or kindof a, it comes across as
(12:42):
standoffish, but never unfriendly.
Astrid Vinje (12:46):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (12:46):
awesome, yeah, but yeah. So I know I never, never
felt that answer. Was there moreor something else you wanted to
Astrid Vinje (12:54):
say? No, I think that. I think you touched on
the, like, the stigma aroundIslam and it being, especially,
you know, Americans, and it'sbeen over 20 years since
September 11, but we still carrya lot of like, prejudices or
biases against Muslims ingeneral. But I do want to say,
(13:17):
though, that if you are, ifyou're like LGBTQ or trans or
there is a little bit of safetyconsiderations to think about if
you do plan to visit Indonesiabecause of the laws that exist
there against
gay
(13:37):
Marriage, or just againsthomosexuality in general. So
Clint Bush (13:42):
I would Yeah, that's the one part I would say, tread
carefully.
Astrid Vinje (13:46):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (13:47):
that is drug use. I think any sort of drug use can
also get you into really badhope. Yeah,
Astrid Vinje (13:56):
there's some very strict laws with that. Said, I
think if most families will havea very positive experience when
they come to India,
Clint Bush (14:07):
yeah, I think there's a level of, you know, we
go to Mexico, there's a level ofconservatism also, as far as how
you dress and things like that.But I don't think it's as
pronounced when you go toJakarta or jopja, both big
cities in Java, Java there isand actually in Bali too. When
(14:27):
we talk about Bali, we'll alsotalk about conservatism there,
even though it's not respectedas much. But in Jakarta and jop
Jakarta, there is definitely aconservatism that you probably
should respect, if nothing else,just to kind of fly under the
radar. Our, our, one of ourtravel philosophies is to fly
(14:49):
under the radar, right? And so Ithink, you know, don't, don't
wear too revealing clothing. AndI know to Western sensibilities
that sounds like, Oh, no one cancensor Me. You. That kind of
thing. But, like, just respect,I mean,
Astrid Vinje (15:02):
I actually is the same for men too. Like modest
clothing for men as well. Yeah,
Clint Bush (15:08):
yeah, it's not just women.
Astrid Vinje (15:09):
Muscle shirts. Yeah,
Clint Bush (15:12):
I worn shorts a lot. I don't think shorts are really
necessarily frowned upon. Or ifthey are, no one really calls
you out on that. So that's,that's my western clothing that
I always wear is shorts, justbecause I get really hot. So
Astrid Vinje (15:27):
yeah,
Clint Bush (15:28):
but yeah, I think that. I think that's the only
thing so safety wise, when itcomes to the religion, we've
heard families say that, likeoutside of Bali, it doesn't
really feel like the rest ofIndonesia is, is safe, or
whatever. That is totally just astigma. I just want to call bull
on that, because that's we'venever had an issue. It could be
(15:50):
just because you're Muslim, butI don't, and you're Indonesian,
but I don't think so. We've, wehave European friends, and
actually, yeah, that's what I'llsay. Europeans don't seem to
have any issue traveling allthroughout Indonesia,
Unknown (16:06):
in
Clint Bush (16:06):
Jakarta, and Jogjakarta. I mean, part of that
is because there, it's a formerDutch colony as well. So maybe
there's, like, a there's acasualness about that, but like
it the stigma only really existsthe United States and Canadians,
like, it's as far as going toIndonesia. So it's just travel
through Indonesia. It'sincredible. You're and there's
(16:26):
a, there's a lot to live sosafety wise, other than that,
though, there are some concerns,
Astrid Vinje (16:32):
yeah, I mean, like, petty theft, I think is a
is a concern as well, especiallybecause, like, there is poverty
in Indonesia as well. So it's aan opportunity to talk to your
kids about like, privilege aswell, privilege, inequities and
things like that. And they willsee that in in different parts
(16:53):
of the country that they visit,
Clint Bush (16:56):
there's a there's a huge growing middle class.
There's a huge middle class. Soit's not like, it's not like
it's it's a poor country in any
Unknown (17:06):
way,
Astrid Vinje (17:06):
no, but,
Clint Bush (17:07):
yeah. But there is definitely petty theft. I think
the biggest safety concern thatprobably families should know is
all through this is a, this isan issue. All through Indonesia,
there's not really sidewalks, orthere's very little sidewalks,
Astrid Vinje (17:20):
right?
Clint Bush (17:21):
And there are a lot of scooters and a lot of
driving,
Unknown (17:26):
yeah,
Clint Bush (17:27):
and so just, we walk everywhere we're in Jogja, when
we're in sorry joke, just shortfor Jogjakarta, when we're in
Jogjakarta, or in Jakarta, orwe're in Bali, like, yeah, we
walk a lot, and you just keepyour kids close. Crossing can be
a little treacherous if you'venever crossed a if you've never
(17:48):
crossed an Asian Street, thisis, I say Asian street because I
think it's the same in Vietnam.It's same in Philippines. You
there's a sense of like you justhave to own it,
Unknown (18:00):
and
Clint Bush (18:01):
people will stop, or they'll slow down for you. But
you can't hesitate. They mustjust commit, yeah, go.
Astrid Vinje (18:08):
They probably won't stop for you. You just
have to, like, make yourpresence known on the street.
Unknown (18:16):
They
Clint Bush (18:16):
won't, yeah, they won't preemptively stop,
Unknown (18:18):
yeah, but
Clint Bush (18:18):
they're not gonna run you over. No, they'll slow
down or go around you or what.But if you hesitate and you kind
of stutter through it, or youlike you're not sure of you're
gonna, if nothing else, you'rejust gonna make them really
upset. But yes, yeah, I thinkthat's the biggest safety
concern. Jakarta is also therest of the country is actually
(18:39):
fine, I think. But Jakartaspecifically has pretty bad air
quality,
Unknown (18:44):
yeah?
Clint Bush (18:44):
So just something to keep in mind, the water
throughout Indonesia is notpotable,
Astrid Vinje (18:49):
so bring a water bottle that has a filter like
the Grail that we love to use,yeah?
Clint Bush (18:55):
Street food can be hit and miss. Street food is one
of our absolutely favoritethings to eat in Indonesia. In
fact, it's one of thosecountries where street food,
well, specifically Java andLombok, maybe not necessarily,
Bali for street food, no, yeah,Bali too, yeah. We absolutely
love it. It's not very veganfriendly, not very vegetarian
(19:15):
friendly,
Astrid Vinje (19:16):
yes.
Clint Bush (19:17):
And you have to be selective about where you're
getting your street food,because there is chance to get
sick, yeah, couple
Astrid Vinje (19:26):
times. But again, there's also, because there's
also, like, clinics that you cango to to get treated, and so
yeah, and a few that are like,you know, catering to foreigners
and that can speak English. So
Clint Bush (19:42):
I think, you know, a lot of people, a lot of world
scoring families will go toThailand, or they'll go to
Vietnam and those types ofplaces. I think those are great
Asian countries to go to forWorld scores. I think a lot of
people will go to Bali. A lot ofworld scores will go to Bali.
And elite. Indonesia. They'llfly in, they'll fly into Bali,
(20:04):
and they'll leave from Bali andnever see the rest of the
country. I think it's, I thinkit's a miss. I think my
Astrid Vinje (20:10):
heart's sad.
Clint Bush (20:11):
I think if it's our one mission, it's like,
Astrid Vinje (20:14):
go to Indonesia. It's, yes,
Clint Bush (20:17):
there's, there's a lot to see, a lot of culture.
It's, it's,
Unknown (20:20):
yeah, it's
Clint Bush (20:21):
amazing.
Astrid Vinje (20:21):
So I write a lot about Indonesia on my website.
There's a lot of articles. Theone that I want to highlight is,
I do have an article that has,like, tips for kids traveling in
Indonesia that covers a lot ofthe things that we just
mentioned. So check that out.Let's, let's go into the
highlights. Yeah,
Clint Bush (20:41):
on our list here, we start with Jakarta and joke,
just maybe just fake kind ofthing. We talked a lot about
Jakarta already, but maybe isthere other highlights of
Jakarta?
Astrid Vinje (20:51):
Oh, you know what I like about Jakarta? And so
Indonesia used to be a Dutchcolony. It was like, and the
Dutch came there, not becausethey are initially. They came
there, not to, like, take overthe world, but they came as,
like, it was a businessopportunity. Indonesia has has a
(21:13):
lot of spices, cloves, nutmeg,things that were starting to be
Unknown (21:19):
cinnamon,
Astrid Vinje (21:19):
yeah, things that were starting to be like used in
European cuisine. And you know,if you can get a hold of the,
you know, the cultivationprocess here in if, if you are
able to get a hold of that, orcontrol that, then you there's
so much more money to be made.And so that was what brought,
(21:41):
initially, brought the Dutch toIndonesia, and then eventually
it became like, no, we want tocreate a colony,
Clint Bush (21:50):
yeah? And, I mean, agriculture has always been a
center part of that right, rightbetween, between quinine, yeah,
and cacao and coffee and riceand, I mean, it's So agriculture
is always and now palm palm oilis big, yeah.
Astrid Vinje (22:08):
So with that said, like in Jakarta, there's a
historical part. You can stillsee like Dutch architecture
there. And then, in joke,Jakarta as well, there's like
Dutch architecture in the inCentral Java that you can find.
And so I really like that part.And I like learning about, you
(22:30):
know, what like, what Indonesiawas like under Dutch rule, and
then how Indonesians became,like, empowered, or became
empowered to, like, resist Dutchrule. And I think something that
influences the culture inIndonesia is that there's like a
(22:52):
sense of activism amongIndonesians that I don't always
see in other countries. Andagain, it's partially because I
have such, like, a deepconnection to the country, and
I, you know, I read books aboutit, and, like, you know, talk to
my family members. I still havefamily that's over there. But,
(23:13):
like, even now, like, youthstudents are always protesting
about something in Jakarta, andso that's what I liked. And then
lots of museums and like justthings to do in the city for
families to learn about,
Clint Bush (23:31):
yeah, and it's interesting too, because I think
Indonesia, because there's athriving culture there, in a lot
of ways, like what you said, andthere's a pretty stable economy
and middle class there, thegovernment been really stable
over a decent amount of time nowthat there's actually not a
large diaspora of Indonesiansaround the world compared to
(23:54):
like other other countries. Sothere's like this nationalistic
pride for having been colonizedfor 300 years, or something like
that. I mean, really long time.The local languages exist a lot
still, like the islands, thelocal islands languages exist
Indonesia as kind of the Unifiedlanguage that was created by the
(24:17):
Indonesian government. And so,yes, go there. There's the
influence of colonial Dutch, butthere's still, it's still very
Indonesia.
Astrid Vinje (24:28):
Yeah, just for context, Indonesia has 13,000
islands. Over 6000 of them areinhabited. And I think there's
like several 100 differentethnic groups in in Indonesia
that speak their own language.So on the island of Java alone,
there's at least like three likethe major one is Javanese, with
(24:49):
their Sundanese. And then withinJakarta, there's also Betawi. So
yeah. Anyway, sorry, learningout about Indonesia.
Clint Bush (24:57):
We're gonna do super deep. So
Astrid Vinje (24:59):
the other thing. Think other things that you
like. So we talked to kind ofabout the diversity. But what
about like, the what otheraspects of the culture might
like families enjoy
Clint Bush (25:10):
for Jakarta specifically,
Astrid Vinje (25:11):
no, like, maybe around Indonesia and,
Clint Bush (25:14):
oh, I think nature. I think there's a lot of nature
all around Indonesia. I thinkpeople tend to think of just
Bali as, as a nature Haven, asfar as rice paddies, the
jungles, the the ocean. But, Imean, there's, it's all around
center, Central Java, forexample, has amazing forests,
(25:35):
amazing jungles, mountains. It'snot, you know, Indonesians,
yeah, incredible, like lakes andit's lots of coasts, lots of
beautiful, beautiful beaches. SoI think the nature in all of
Indonesia is, is something Ithink families can really latch
(25:58):
on to as well.
Astrid Vinje (25:59):
Yeah, a couple places that to that are
highlights for me, is like theisland of Sumatra, has we went
there? Now it's been 10 years,but it's still there. Like
there's a national park thathas, like all orangutans there,
and so you can hike and see likeorangutans in the wild, and then
(26:21):
National
Clint Bush (26:22):
Reserve,
Astrid Vinje (26:23):
yeah. And then on the other side of the country,
the island of Flores is like thelandscape is so completely
different. It's like more rockyand not as lush and jungly. And
then it's also like a jumpingoff point for this, for
experiencing Komodo Island,which is where the Komodo
(26:43):
dragons are from. So like, ifyou are the type of family that
loves learning about animals andlearning about, like nature,
like, those are some greatplaces to to visit.
Clint Bush (26:55):
And when you get up to, like, the Ahmed area, which
is kind of, we'll talk aboutthat in Bali more. But like,
there's also other like, Snork,there's snorkeling spots all
around Vinje. They're absolutelyincredible.
Astrid Vinje (27:06):
We haven't been to it yet, but this place that I
want to go is Raja Ampat, whichis, like, supposed to be a
really good snorkeling area,yeah, yeah.
Clint Bush (27:16):
I think. What about Jogja, is there anything
specifically about Jogja ,Jakarta, yeah, so
Astrid Vinje (27:23):
Central Java. Jogja, well, Jogjakarta is
located in Central Java, and itused to be okay. I'm gonna geek
out again. It used to be thescent center of power during the
colonial period, and even beforethat. And so what you can
experience there is, there'sstill, like a palace there, like
(27:47):
the Sultan of Jogjakarta livesin the palace, and he still has
like ceremonial title, kind oflike, you know, the the King of
England, so he so what I likeabout Jogjakarta is, like,
there's so much like culturethat's still being cultivated,
(28:08):
or like, you know, historicalculture, you see, like the
traditional court dances, andyou can watch, Like, the
traditional shadow puppet showsand listen to traditional gel
Milan music, which is like thepercussion orchestra that is
part of Indonesia,
Unknown (28:30):
yeah.
Astrid Vinje (28:31):
And I guess the other thing is, there's a UNESCO
World Heritage site that'slocated outside of Jogjakarta,
that is the largest Buddhisttemple or Buddhist structure in
the world, called Borobudur. Sothink those are, those are some
good opportunities for Worldschooling families to learn
(28:51):
about, like culture and historyand Yeah, what about you? What?
What's something that you likeabout Jogjakarta?
Clint Bush (29:00):
I mean, I think the city layout is amazing for
worldscores. I mean, you canfind homes to live in that are
in very residential areas. It'sfairly easy to get around.
There's lots of like baits,which are like, kind of
Astrid Vinje (29:17):
petty cabs,
Clint Bush (29:18):
like pedicabs. There's obviously the ride
sharing apps, there's taxis,there's a bus system. So it's
fairly it's walkable in a lot ofways. It's a spread out city, so
it's actually fairly large fromthat standpoint. So getting from
different sections of city,you'll definitely need to take
public transportation. There'sno subway, I don't think, or
(29:40):
anything like that. So it'smostly just vehicles of some
sort. We rented scooters thelast time we were there. So
that's kind of how we gotaround, which is really good.
There's a thriving art scenethere, modern art scene. So lots
of visual arts, lots of musicarts. There's a thriving because
it used to be the cultural.Center of Indonesia. It's very
(30:03):
similar to Kyoto, actually,right? Like, it's like the
cultural center point of ofIndonesia. There's you can learn
about batik making,
Astrid Vinje (30:12):
yeah, we took a fantastic batik class. You can
read about that on the website.
Clint Bush (30:18):
Yeah, it's, it is? It's a great place. I think it's
really, I think enriching ifyou're really into the arts as
well. It's,
Unknown (30:27):
it's
Clint Bush (30:27):
just a cool seat. It's also, it's not as humid as
it is in Jakarta. I don't thinkbecause you're more center
Jakarta is actually right on thewater, right off of the water,
so you there's a lot morehumidity there. So it's not,
it's not nearly as humid there.It does get hot, though, in the
middle of summer especially,
Unknown (30:48):
yeah,
Clint Bush (30:48):
it's a lot lower. Like, Jakarta has lost
skyscrapers, like really tallskyscrapers. Jokeja is a flatter
city, as far as that, as far asthat goes. So I don't know. It's
just, there's something Ithere's a energy I really like
about Jogja. Every time we golots of cafes. Jogja has ton, I
mean, Indonesia in general,cafes, but Jogja has a ton of cafe
Astrid Vinje (31:10):
and it speaks to, like, what Clint was saying
with, like, the growing middleclass. There's just people that
have, like, disposable incomethat can, like, go and sit in
cafes, like, relax. There areother cities in on the island of
Java that's worth mentioning. Wehaven't spent much time, or we
(31:31):
haven't spent any time there yetas a family. So Bandung in is
one that's kind of higherelevation, and then solo is
really close, about, probablyabout an hour away from
Jogjakarta by train. And that'skind of similar, because that
was like the competing palace inJava at the time. So you'll see
(31:53):
some of the traditional stuff inthere too. And then Surabaya is
like the furthest east on theisland of Jakarta on the island
of Java that I think would beworth visiting as well.
Clint Bush (32:06):
Anything else you want to mention?
Astrid Vinje (32:09):
Oh, there is something like so getting around
because it's an archipelago,getting around from country or
island to island, usuallyrequires like airplane. You can
take planes, and there's a lotof like, just local or regional
airlines that will service thoseplaces, but it you're taking
(32:32):
some if you're taking a flight,just be checking the flight
times, because,
Unknown (32:39):
yeah, it
Astrid Vinje (32:39):
happened to us. The last time we were in
Indonesia, the flight changedfrom like, morning to nighttime,
and
Clint Bush (32:49):
sometimes it changes from nighttime,
Astrid Vinje (32:51):
nighttime
to morning,
Clint Bush (32:53):
and then you might miss your flight.
Astrid Vinje (32:54):
Yeah, so just be like, be aware of your flight
times, and just check in Java,there is an extensive train
system. So if you have a littlebit more time, and you're you
want to, like, see thelandscapes that Clint was
talking about, taking the trainis a great you. And
Clint Bush (33:14):
you can literally take the train all the way from
East Java, all the way to WestJava. So it's, it's really
incredible. And I think theother thing is, if you have
time, if you're, if you aregoing to stay in Indonesia for
So, you can get a sponsored visafor up to six months.
Astrid Vinje (33:31):
That's true,
Clint Bush (33:32):
yeah. And then the normal visa is 30 days,
extendable to 60, a one timeextension to 60 days. Otherwise,
beyond that, you have to get asponsored visa. And they're
actually not that hard to get.There's companies out there
Astrid Vinje (33:45):
that visa agencies that will
Clint Bush (33:47):
that basically, will you kind of pay them and they
give you a sponsor for sixmonths. But anyways, if you're
going to spend longer time inIndonesia, I think the ferry
system is also an interestingway go island hopping a bit. So
you can go, for example, if youstart in Bali, then you can go
to Padang Bai, which is on theedge of Bali, closest to Lombok,
(34:10):
and you can take a ferry fromBali to Lombok. So the ferry
system is an interesting way tovisit some of the islands as
well. Yeah,
Unknown (34:19):
yeah.
Clint Bush (34:20):
The other thing I just wanted to mention, kind of
nature and food related is thatIndonesia has an incredible, I
mean, we talked about, like thethe agricultural history is
incredible, but there's allsorts of things that you can see
grown So you can do agriculturaltours or whatever. But there's
(34:43):
like, you know, on the fruitside, you can see jackfruit and
durian trees. You can see papayatrees. You can see on like,
there's coconut, there's palm,of course, there's rice fields,
there's tofu making. Plants.Tofu is a big export of
Indonesia, tofu and tempeh,which Tempe is a type of, yeah,
(35:05):
yeah, soy product. There's, ofcourse, coffee and cacao,
Astrid Vinje (35:09):
yeah,
Clint Bush (35:10):
there's, like, there's just these incredible
amounts of, like, agriculture.They grow tobacco still in
Indonesia, and sugar cane. Andit's just, I mean, it's a, it's
a rich, I haven't think, I thinkthat's why the Dutch capitalized
on that, right, for so long. Iguess, right, it just grows
everything,
Unknown (35:28):
yeah,
Astrid Vinje (35:28):
exactly
Clint Bush (35:29):
because of the volcanic soil and and the the
humid, the humidity, and thetropic jumper conditions,
Astrid Vinje (35:36):
yeah. So there's just so much potential to, like,
learn about those things whileyou're visiting,
Unknown (35:41):
yeah, yeah, yeah. So anything
Astrid Vinje (35:43):
else you want to add? I know we talked a lot, and
we could go on, but let's we
Clint Bush (35:50):
haven't even talked about Bali yet. That's another
episode. So yeah.
Astrid Vinje (35:55):
Well, that's all for today. Thank you for joining
us on this episode of Worldschooling, Q and A with Astrid
and Clint. Be sure to check outthe show notes for any links we
mentioned in the episode, andvisit my website, the wandering
daughter.com to dive deeper intoworld schooling and family
travel.
Clint Bush (36:12):
If you like what you hear, please consider supporting
the wandering daughter onPatreon. It really helps us out
and keeps the show going. You'llalso get exclusive perks, like
episode transcripts, additionalresources, access to office
hours with us and more. You canfind us on Spotify or the
podcast app of your choice. Ifyou're listening to this on
Spotify, you can tap the bellicon to get notified when new
(36:32):
episodes come out. And if youlike this episode, please give
us a five star review. It reallyhelps new people find our show.
Astrid Vinje (36:39):
If you're watching this on YouTube, don't forget to
like and subscribe and tap thebell icon to get notified of new
episodes. You can follow me oninstagram@wander.or follow the
wandering daughter on Facebook.Links to these are also in the
show notes. If you have anyworld schooling questions you'd
like us to answer for futureepisodes, feel free to throw
(37:00):
them in the comments or send usa message at the wandering
daughter.com. Forward slashpodcast, until next time. Happy
travels. Bye.
Unknown (37:09):
You.
Crossing can be a little treacherous if you've
(00:02):
never crossed a if you've nevercrossed an Asian Street. This
is, I say Asian street because Ithink it's the same in Vietnam.
It's the same in Philippines.You there's a sense of like you
just have to own it will stopwith a slow down for you, but
you can't hesitate.
Astrid Vinje (00:23):
This is World schooling. Q and A. I'm Astrid,
creator of the wanderingdaughter. As a traveling family,
we've spent four years travelingfull time to over 18 countries
and six continents, wherever wego. We try to learn as much as
we can about the countries andcultures we visit while we
didn't coin the term, we like tocall this world schooling, using
(00:45):
the world as our classroom eachweek, my husband Clint and I
will answer one question aboutworld schooling and share our
experiences of traveling theworld with our Kids. Ready to
get started? Great. Let's divein. You. I continuing with our
(01:09):
country deep dives. This week,we are answering the question,
how do I World School inIndonesia? This is one of my
favorite topics, and I am biasedbecause I am Indonesian, but I'm
really excited to dive into thisepisode.
Clint Bush (01:24):
Yeah, I think along, I think the thing you mentioned
too, along with Mexico, we'vespent the most time in
Indonesia. So the Mexico andIndonesia are two places that we
we love going back to again andagain.
Astrid Vinje (01:37):
Yeah. Oh, and then I also want to mention that
we've decided to break this outinto two episodes. So this
episode, we're talking aboutIndonesia in general, and next
episode, we'll mention or talkabout Bali. So I don't like we
won't focus on Bali here, but itwill be talked about too.
Clint Bush (01:58):
Yeah, that's a good point. Okay, logistics. So I
think, like other episodes wejust talked about, Jakarta is
the main city. It the otherislands also have airports you
can fly into as well. Usuallythe other airports, though, I
don't think are international.They're, well, the Bali airports
International, yes, sorry, butLombok one, I don't think, is
(02:21):
internet.
Astrid Vinje (02:22):
No, they're more like regional ones, and even
like joke, Jakarta has anairport that maybe has flights
from Singapore, but it doesn'thave any other
Clint Bush (02:31):
that's true. I guess Singapore is technically
International. It doesn't. Itfeels still a little bit
domestic, because it's so cool.I mean, Singapore is really
close as far as flying in sochances are you're going to fly
into Jakarta, even if you aregoing to Bali. Sometimes tickets
are cheaper to fly into Jakarta.First, Jakarta is a huge city,
(02:53):
one of the largest cities in theworld. I think, I think it's in
the top five largest cities ofthe world, millions
Astrid Vinje (02:59):
and millions of people, 10s of people, 10s of
millions
Clint Bush (03:01):
of people, 10s of millions of people, I think over
20 million. So it's it is amassive city. It's also massive
city geographically. Is spreadout over a long distance.
Traffic is incredibly hard inJakarta,
Astrid Vinje (03:16):
yep,
Clint Bush (03:17):
I would say there's two cities, in my opinion, that
have the worst traffic in theworld, and it's Manila and
Jakarta, and so, at least fromwhat we've been,
Astrid Vinje (03:28):
yeah,
Clint Bush (03:29):
so
Astrid Vinje (03:30):
it can take you several hours just to go, like,
10 miles. So,
Clint Bush (03:34):
so that's, that's just to say, if you are planning
on visiting Jakarta a bit, andwe highly recommend it Jakarta.
We'll talk about that in in aminute. But like we highly
recommend visiting Jakarta,prepare yourself to just it's
going to take some time,especially getting from the
airport. And depending when youfly, and it's flying really late
(03:56):
at night, you probably won't todeal with as much traffic going
to your hotel, whatever. But ifyou're flying in any other time
of the day, it's possible you'llget stuck in traffic.
Astrid Vinje (04:06):
Well, with that said, there are some ways that
the government, or like thecity, has tried to, like, combat
some of that traffic. The mainone is this, like the MRT, which
goes right now, it just goeslike, north to south, from, like
Central or, I think like fromCentral Jakarta down south,
because once you get to centralJakarta, you still have to do
(04:29):
other, other modes oftransportation to get to get
North. And then, like in ourride sharing episode, grab is a
app that you can use to getaround in Jakarta. And that's
like, you know, Indonesia orSoutheast Asia's version of,
like, Uber.
Clint Bush (04:50):
They don't really have Uber, I don't
Astrid Vinje (04:51):
know, they don't have Uber. There. They have
grab. And then the other one ismore local, is called Go, check.
And then that's also, you know,you. Download the app and you
can get around and, like,connect a payment method and
stuff. So
Clint Bush (05:05):
I think both of those are really good to have,
because sometimes one or theother is not available. Go Jack
is spelled G, O, j, e, K, justin case you're checking but
like, they also do just, like,Uber here in the United States,
they do food delivery as well.You can pay by cash or via that.
Yeah, so,
Astrid Vinje (05:23):
and I forget, if it's grab or go check one of
them, you can hail a cab. Thebluebird taxis through that app
too. So sometimes, if you can'tget, like, a regular ride, then
just, you know, get, get a taxi.
Clint Bush (05:38):
And there are multiple cab companies. Bluebird
is the one we recommend. It'sthe most recognizable. It's been
there forever. That's allthrough Indonesia, so Bali as
well. Bluebird taxis are your goto taxis on that.
Astrid Vinje (05:51):
Let's talk a little bit about the language.
So Indonesia, the officiallanguage is Indonesian, but
every island has their or has,like, their own ethnic groups or
multiple ethnic groups, and theyalso have their languages that
are spoken there. But if youlearn some Indonesian phrases,
(06:12):
you should be able able to getaround the country
Clint Bush (06:15):
all the Yeah, all the younger people speak
Indonesian a lot of people speakEnglish at this point, but
you're still going to find that,you know, most people, even if
they do speak a little English,are hesitant to speak English as
much. Unless you're in likeretail, there's a lot of English
in retail or restaurants,additionally, Indonesia, I
think, is a little bit unique asfar as language goes, because
(06:39):
their unionized language, ortheir collective language,
Indonesian is still less than100 years old.
Astrid Vinje (06:48):
Yeah, actually, it's 100 now. It was created in
the 20s, 1920s so it's over 100years old. But yes, that's a
very new language and constantlyinvolving. You know, the the
youth always have their like,slang and stuff if you want to
learn some phrases. I do have anIndonesian phrase book on my
(07:11):
like on my website, so checkthat out.
Clint Bush (07:15):
Yeah, and I would say, actually, Indonesian is one
of the easier languages to pickup simple phrases. And so I
think a lot of, at least a lotof the families we've known that
will travel in Indonesia,especially, just go to Bali,
they're hesitant to try to pickup the language. I think it
maybe because it's an Asiancountry, they feel like it's
(07:35):
hard, actually, it's really easyto pick up simple phrases,
especially for Westerners, theyuse the same alphabet as Western
alphabet. So in thepronunciations really clear,
there's not a In fact, I thinkin a lot of ways it's easier to
learn Spanish, so I think it itbehooves you to learn a few
things, especially like, Thankyou, the numbers, that kind of
(07:58):
stuff,
Astrid Vinje (07:58):
yeah,
Unknown (07:58):
yeah.
Astrid Vinje (07:59):
And then the money. The currency is called
rupiah, and they have, like, youknow, mostly the bills are like,
in hundreds or 1000s. So,
Clint Bush (08:08):
yeah, and I think it's, I think it's like, it's
similar to Pesos. It's a lot,the $1 to rupiahs, a lot. I
can't remember exactly whatexchange, but it's not like
euros, where it's like, prettyclose to one on one. So just
keep in that mind, you may needyour conversion app to just do
(08:29):
some conversions as you're asyou're pulling cash out. It's
mostly cash based, I think,
Unknown (08:34):
yes,
Clint Bush (08:35):
just like Mexico, it's very cash based, especially
if you start going to some ofthe food vendors and stuff like
that. And it's okay to get cash.I mean, obviously it's okay
cash, it's a little bit in themetropolitan areas. I think it's
easier to find ATMs, but it canget trickier in the smaller
(08:59):
towns,
Astrid Vinje (08:59):
Yep, yeah, yeah, I do remember, like, we were in
Ahmed in Bali, and the one atm,and maybe it was because we had,
like, so many foreigners thereat the time, but the one atm in
town would run out of money, andeverybody would be like, Oh no,
now we have to, like, borrowmoney
from
like, other families that Werethere. Yeah. So let's talk a
(09:22):
little bit about the religion,because I think that is
something that, like, makespeople a little bit hesitant to
come to Indonesia.
Unknown (09:29):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (09:30):
yeah. I can speak to this because, I think, because I
didn't grow up in a Muslimculture, I think, I don't think
it caught me off guard, but it'sdefinitely, it's a different
experience, if you're not usedto that.
Astrid Vinje (09:41):
So Indonesia, the majority of the country is
Muslim, like 80%
Clint Bush (09:47):
so what that means, what that translates to for
someone that's not used to it,is, you'll hear the call of
prayer every day, multiple timesa day, including really early in
the morning, 5am roughly, i.Love it. I love hearing that. I
don't know there's justsomething about it, but if
you're not used to that, it canbe loud depending on where
(10:09):
you're staying, and it is earlyin the morning and it is
throughout the day. And so it issomething that you need. You
know, don't try to record yourpodcast at certain times of the
day. You can get a call prayerin the middle of it.
Unknown (10:25):
Yeah?
Clint Bush (10:26):
So, yeah.
Astrid Vinje (10:27):
Did you ever feel, and I agree with you, like, I
spent my childhood in Indonesia,in Jakarta, and so that was
never really, like, it wasn'tjarring to me, because I'm like,
Oh yeah, six o'clock, of coursethe call to prayer is going to
go and I love that. Like, Idon't know, I just especially
(10:50):
during, like, Ramadan and stuff.I love the live liveliness that
happens around that time of dayand around, like, the mosque. So
I'm going to ask you, kind of,maybe it's a leading question,
but did you ever feel likethreatened or unsafe being in a
Muslim country?
Clint Bush (11:11):
I'm glad you asked this. No, I did not. And I think
there is a stigma of to in theWestern countries like United
States, about Islam in general.And, you know, justified or not,
there is a stigma Indonesia hasper capita, I think, the largest
(11:34):
Muslim population in the world,the island of Java, specifically
in Jakarta, I think is one of,if not the, largest Muslim city
in the world. But I, you know,all the time we spent in
Jakarta, I never felt unsafebecause of the religion in
(11:57):
general, it's always a very andif you don't have any
experience, experience withIslam, is like, it's actually a
very giving and loving religion,very accepting religion. And you
feel that for the most part inIndonesia, in Jakarta, in Jogja.
(12:20):
Now it has, I think that countryhas kind of some of the you
could call it a stereotype oflike, I think because people
work so hard, there is a littlebit of like, just a, like, a
stoic, a stoicism like, or kindof a, it comes across as
(12:42):
standoffish, but never unfriendly.
Astrid Vinje (12:46):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (12:46):
awesome, yeah, but yeah. So I know I never, never
felt that answer. Was there moreor something else you wanted to
Astrid Vinje (12:54):
say? No, I think that. I think you touched on
the, like, the stigma aroundIslam and it being, especially,
you know, Americans, and it'sbeen over 20 years since
September 11, but we still carrya lot of like, prejudices or
biases against Muslims ingeneral. But I do want to say,
(13:17):
though, that if you are, ifyou're like LGBTQ or trans or
there is a little bit of safetyconsiderations to think about if
you do plan to visit Indonesiabecause of the laws that exist
there against
gay
(13:37):
Marriage, or just againsthomosexuality in general. So
Clint Bush (13:42):
I would Yeah, that's the one part I would say, tread
carefully.
Astrid Vinje (13:46):
Yeah,
Clint Bush (13:47):
that is drug use. I think any sort of drug use can
also get you into really badhope. Yeah,
Astrid Vinje (13:56):
there's some very strict laws with that. Said, I
think if most families will havea very positive experience when
they come to India,
Clint Bush (14:07):
yeah, I think there's a level of, you know, we
go to Mexico, there's a level ofconservatism also, as far as how
you dress and things like that.But I don't think it's as
pronounced when you go toJakarta or jopja, both big
cities in Java, Java there isand actually in Bali too. When
(14:27):
we talk about Bali, we'll alsotalk about conservatism there,
even though it's not respectedas much. But in Jakarta and jop
Jakarta, there is definitely aconservatism that you probably
should respect, if nothing else,just to kind of fly under the
radar. Our, our, one of ourtravel philosophies is to fly
(14:49):
under the radar, right? And so Ithink, you know, don't, don't
wear too revealing clothing. AndI know to Western sensibilities
that sounds like, Oh, no one cancensor Me. You. That kind of
thing. But, like, just respect,I mean,
Astrid Vinje (15:02):
I actually is the same for men too. Like modest
clothing for men as well. Yeah,
Clint Bush (15:08):
yeah, it's not just women.
Astrid Vinje (15:09):
Muscle shirts. Yeah,
Clint Bush (15:12):
I worn shorts a lot. I don't think shorts are really
necessarily frowned upon. Or ifthey are, no one really calls
you out on that. So that's,that's my western clothing that
I always wear is shorts, justbecause I get really hot. So
Astrid Vinje (15:27):
yeah,
Clint Bush (15:28):
but yeah, I think that. I think that's the only
thing so safety wise, when itcomes to the religion, we've
heard families say that, likeoutside of Bali, it doesn't
really feel like the rest ofIndonesia is, is safe, or
whatever. That is totally just astigma. I just want to call bull
on that, because that's we'venever had an issue. It could be
(15:50):
just because you're Muslim, butI don't, and you're Indonesian,
but I don't think so. We've, wehave European friends, and
actually, yeah, that's what I'llsay. Europeans don't seem to
have any issue traveling allthroughout Indonesia,
Unknown (16:06):
in
Clint Bush (16:06):
Jakarta, and Jogjakarta. I mean, part of that
is because there, it's a formerDutch colony as well. So maybe
there's, like, a there's acasualness about that, but like
it the stigma only really existsthe United States and Canadians,
like, it's as far as going toIndonesia. So it's just travel
through Indonesia. It'sincredible. You're and there's
(16:26):
a, there's a lot to live sosafety wise, other than that,
though, there are some concerns,
Astrid Vinje (16:32):
yeah, I mean, like, petty theft, I think is a
is a concern as well, especiallybecause, like, there is poverty
in Indonesia as well. So it's aan opportunity to talk to your
kids about like, privilege aswell, privilege, inequities and
things like that. And they willsee that in in different parts
(16:53):
of the country that they visit,
Clint Bush (16:56):
there's a there's a huge growing middle class.
There's a huge middle class. Soit's not like, it's not like
it's it's a poor country in any
Unknown (17:06):
way,
Astrid Vinje (17:06):
no, but,
Clint Bush (17:07):
yeah. But there is definitely petty theft. I think
the biggest safety concern thatprobably families should know is
all through this is a, this isan issue. All through Indonesia,
there's not really sidewalks, orthere's very little sidewalks,
Astrid Vinje (17:20):
right?
Clint Bush (17:21):
And there are a lot of scooters and a lot of
driving,
Unknown (17:26):
yeah,
Clint Bush (17:27):
and so just, we walk everywhere we're in Jogja, when
we're in sorry joke, just shortfor Jogjakarta, when we're in
Jogjakarta, or in Jakarta, orwe're in Bali, like, yeah, we
walk a lot, and you just keepyour kids close. Crossing can be
a little treacherous if you'venever crossed a if you've never
(17:48):
crossed an Asian Street, thisis, I say Asian street because I
think it's the same in Vietnam.It's same in Philippines. You
there's a sense of like you justhave to own it,
Unknown (18:00):
and
Clint Bush (18:01):
people will stop, or they'll slow down for you. But
you can't hesitate. They mustjust commit, yeah, go.
Astrid Vinje (18:08):
They probably won't stop for you. You just
have to, like, make yourpresence known on the street.
Unknown (18:16):
They
Clint Bush (18:16):
won't, yeah, they won't preemptively stop,
Unknown (18:18):
yeah, but
Clint Bush (18:18):
they're not gonna run you over. No, they'll slow
down or go around you or what.But if you hesitate and you kind
of stutter through it, or youlike you're not sure of you're
gonna, if nothing else, you'rejust gonna make them really
upset. But yes, yeah, I thinkthat's the biggest safety
concern. Jakarta is also therest of the country is actually
(18:39):
fine, I think. But Jakartaspecifically has pretty bad air
quality,
Unknown (18:44):
yeah?
Clint Bush (18:44):
So just something to keep in mind, the water
throughout Indonesia is notpotable,
Astrid Vinje (18:49):
so bring a water bottle that has a filter like
the Grail that we love to use,yeah?
Clint Bush (18:55):
Street food can be hit and miss. Street food is one
of our absolutely favoritethings to eat in Indonesia. In
fact, it's one of thosecountries where street food,
well, specifically Java andLombok, maybe not necessarily,
Bali for street food, no, yeah,Bali too, yeah. We absolutely
love it. It's not very veganfriendly, not very vegetarian
(19:15):
friendly,
Astrid Vinje (19:16):
yes.
Clint Bush (19:17):
And you have to be selective about where you're
getting your street food,because there is chance to get
sick, yeah, couple
Astrid Vinje (19:26):
times. But again, there's also, because there's
also, like, clinics that you cango to to get treated, and so
yeah, and a few that are like,you know, catering to foreigners
and that can speak English. So
Clint Bush (19:42):
I think, you know, a lot of people, a lot of world
scoring families will go toThailand, or they'll go to
Vietnam and those types ofplaces. I think those are great
Asian countries to go to forWorld scores. I think a lot of
people will go to Bali. A lot ofworld scores will go to Bali.
And elite. Indonesia. They'llfly in, they'll fly into Bali,
(20:04):
and they'll leave from Bali andnever see the rest of the
country. I think it's, I thinkit's a miss. I think my
Astrid Vinje (20:10):
heart's sad.
Clint Bush (20:11):
I think if it's our one mission, it's like,
Astrid Vinje (20:14):
go to Indonesia. It's, yes,
Clint Bush (20:17):
there's, there's a lot to see, a lot of culture.
It's, it's,
Unknown (20:20):
yeah, it's
Clint Bush (20:21):
amazing.
Astrid Vinje (20:21):
So I write a lot about Indonesia on my website.
There's a lot of articles. Theone that I want to highlight is,
I do have an article that has,like, tips for kids traveling in
Indonesia that covers a lot ofthe things that we just
mentioned. So check that out.Let's, let's go into the
highlights. Yeah,
Clint Bush (20:41):
on our list here, we start with Jakarta and joke,
just maybe just fake kind ofthing. We talked a lot about
Jakarta already, but maybe isthere other highlights of
Jakarta?
Astrid Vinje (20:51):
Oh, you know what I like about Jakarta? And so
Indonesia used to be a Dutchcolony. It was like, and the
Dutch came there, not becausethey are initially. They came
there, not to, like, take overthe world, but they came as,
like, it was a businessopportunity. Indonesia has has a
(21:13):
lot of spices, cloves, nutmeg,things that were starting to be
Unknown (21:19):
cinnamon,
Astrid Vinje (21:19):
yeah, things that were starting to be like used in
European cuisine. And you know,if you can get a hold of the,
you know, the cultivationprocess here in if, if you are
able to get a hold of that, orcontrol that, then you there's
so much more money to be made.And so that was what brought,
(21:41):
initially, brought the Dutch toIndonesia, and then eventually
it became like, no, we want tocreate a colony,
Clint Bush (21:50):
yeah? And, I mean, agriculture has always been a
center part of that right, rightbetween, between quinine, yeah,
and cacao and coffee and riceand, I mean, it's So agriculture
is always and now palm palm oilis big, yeah.
Astrid Vinje (22:08):
So with that said, like in Jakarta, there's a
historical part. You can stillsee like Dutch architecture
there. And then, in joke,Jakarta as well, there's like
Dutch architecture in the inCentral Java that you can find.
And so I really like that part.And I like learning about, you
(22:30):
know, what like, what Indonesiawas like under Dutch rule, and
then how Indonesians became,like, empowered, or became
empowered to, like, resist Dutchrule. And I think something that
influences the culture inIndonesia is that there's like a
(22:52):
sense of activism amongIndonesians that I don't always
see in other countries. Andagain, it's partially because I
have such, like, a deepconnection to the country, and
I, you know, I read books aboutit, and, like, you know, talk to
my family members. I still havefamily that's over there. But,
(23:13):
like, even now, like, youthstudents are always protesting
about something in Jakarta, andso that's what I liked. And then
lots of museums and like justthings to do in the city for
families to learn about,
Clint Bush (23:31):
yeah, and it's interesting too, because I think
Indonesia, because there's athriving culture there, in a lot
of ways, like what you said, andthere's a pretty stable economy
and middle class there, thegovernment been really stable
over a decent amount of time nowthat there's actually not a
large diaspora of Indonesiansaround the world compared to
(23:54):
like other other countries. Sothere's like this nationalistic
pride for having been colonizedfor 300 years, or something like
that. I mean, really long time.The local languages exist a lot
still, like the islands, thelocal islands languages exist
Indonesia as kind of the Unifiedlanguage that was created by the
(24:17):
Indonesian government. And so,yes, go there. There's the
influence of colonial Dutch, butthere's still, it's still very
Indonesia.
Astrid Vinje (24:28):
Yeah, just for context, Indonesia has 13,000
islands. Over 6000 of them areinhabited. And I think there's
like several 100 differentethnic groups in in Indonesia
that speak their own language.So on the island of Java alone,
there's at least like three likethe major one is Javanese, with
(24:49):
their Sundanese. And then withinJakarta, there's also Betawi. So
yeah. Anyway, sorry, learningout about Indonesia.
Clint Bush (24:57):
We're gonna do super deep. So
Astrid Vinje (24:59):
the other thing. Think other things that you
like. So we talked to kind ofabout the diversity. But what
about like, the what otheraspects of the culture might
like families enjoy
Clint Bush (25:10):
for Jakarta specifically,
Astrid Vinje (25:11):
no, like, maybe around Indonesia and,
Clint Bush (25:14):
oh, I think nature. I think there's a lot of nature
all around Indonesia. I thinkpeople tend to think of just
Bali as, as a nature Haven, asfar as rice paddies, the
jungles, the the ocean. But, Imean, there's, it's all around
center, Central Java, forexample, has amazing forests,
(25:35):
amazing jungles, mountains. It'snot, you know, Indonesians,
yeah, incredible, like lakes andit's lots of coasts, lots of
beautiful, beautiful beaches. SoI think the nature in all of
Indonesia is, is something Ithink families can really latch
(25:58):
on to as well.
Astrid Vinje (25:59):
Yeah, a couple places that to that are
highlights for me, is like theisland of Sumatra, has we went
there? Now it's been 10 years,but it's still there. Like
there's a national park thathas, like all orangutans there,
and so you can hike and see likeorangutans in the wild, and then
(26:21):
National
Clint Bush (26:22):
Reserve,
Astrid Vinje (26:23):
yeah. And then on the other side of the country,
the island of Flores is like thelandscape is so completely
different. It's like more rockyand not as lush and jungly. And
then it's also like a jumpingoff point for this, for
experiencing Komodo Island,which is where the Komodo
(26:43):
dragons are from. So like, ifyou are the type of family that
loves learning about animals andlearning about, like nature,
like, those are some greatplaces to to visit.
Clint Bush (26:55):
And when you get up to, like, the Ahmed area, which
is kind of, we'll talk aboutthat in Bali more. But like,
there's also other like, Snork,there's snorkeling spots all
around Vinje. They're absolutelyincredible.
Astrid Vinje (27:06):
We haven't been to it yet, but this place that I
want to go is Raja Ampat, whichis, like, supposed to be a
really good snorkeling area,yeah, yeah.
Clint Bush (27:16):
I think. What about Jogja, is there anything
specifically about Jogja ,Jakarta, yeah, so
Astrid Vinje (27:23):
Central Java. Jogja, well, Jogjakarta is
located in Central Java, and itused to be okay. I'm gonna geek
out again. It used to be thescent center of power during the
colonial period, and even beforethat. And so what you can
experience there is, there'sstill, like a palace there, like
(27:47):
the Sultan of Jogjakarta livesin the palace, and he still has
like ceremonial title, kind oflike, you know, the the King of
England, so he so what I likeabout Jogjakarta is, like,
there's so much like culturethat's still being cultivated,
(28:08):
or like, you know, historicalculture, you see, like the
traditional court dances, andyou can watch, Like, the
traditional shadow puppet showsand listen to traditional gel
Milan music, which is like thepercussion orchestra that is
part of Indonesia,
Unknown (28:30):
yeah.
Astrid Vinje (28:31):
And I guess the other thing is, there's a UNESCO
World Heritage site that'slocated outside of Jogjakarta,
that is the largest Buddhisttemple or Buddhist structure in
the world, called Borobudur. Sothink those are, those are some
good opportunities for Worldschooling families to learn
(28:51):
about, like culture and historyand Yeah, what about you? What?
What's something that you likeabout Jogjakarta?
Clint Bush (29:00):
I mean, I think the city layout is amazing for
worldscores. I mean, you canfind homes to live in that are
in very residential areas. It'sfairly easy to get around.
There's lots of like baits,which are like, kind of
Astrid Vinje (29:17):
petty cabs,
Clint Bush (29:18):
like pedicabs. There's obviously the ride
sharing apps, there's taxis,there's a bus system. So it's
fairly it's walkable in a lot ofways. It's a spread out city, so
it's actually fairly large fromthat standpoint. So getting from
different sections of city,you'll definitely need to take
public transportation. There'sno subway, I don't think, or
(29:40):
anything like that. So it'smostly just vehicles of some
sort. We rented scooters thelast time we were there. So
that's kind of how we gotaround, which is really good.
There's a thriving art scenethere, modern art scene. So lots
of visual arts, lots of musicarts. There's a thriving because
it used to be the cultural.Center of Indonesia. It's very
(30:03):
similar to Kyoto, actually,right? Like, it's like the
cultural center point of ofIndonesia. There's you can learn
about batik making,
Astrid Vinje (30:12):
yeah, we took a fantastic batik class. You can
read about that on the website.
Clint Bush (30:18):
Yeah, it's, it is? It's a great place. I think it's
really, I think enriching ifyou're really into the arts as
well. It's,
Unknown (30:27):
it's
Clint Bush (30:27):
just a cool seat. It's also, it's not as humid as
it is in Jakarta. I don't thinkbecause you're more center
Jakarta is actually right on thewater, right off of the water,
so you there's a lot morehumidity there. So it's not,
it's not nearly as humid there.It does get hot, though, in the
middle of summer especially,
Unknown (30:48):
yeah,
Clint Bush (30:48):
it's a lot lower. Like, Jakarta has lost
skyscrapers, like really tallskyscrapers. Jokeja is a flatter
city, as far as that, as far asthat goes. So I don't know. It's
just, there's something Ithere's a energy I really like
about Jogja. Every time we golots of cafes. Jogja has ton, I
mean, Indonesia in general,cafes, but Jogja has a ton of cafe
Astrid Vinje (31:10):
and it speaks to, like, what Clint was saying
with, like, the growing middleclass. There's just people that
have, like, disposable incomethat can, like, go and sit in
cafes, like, relax. There areother cities in on the island of
Java that's worth mentioning. Wehaven't spent much time, or we
(31:31):
haven't spent any time there yetas a family. So Bandung in is
one that's kind of higherelevation, and then solo is
really close, about, probablyabout an hour away from
Jogjakarta by train. And that'skind of similar, because that
was like the competing palace inJava at the time. So you'll see
(31:53):
some of the traditional stuff inthere too. And then Surabaya is
like the furthest east on theisland of Jakarta on the island
of Java that I think would beworth visiting as well.
Clint Bush (32:06):
Anything else you want to mention?
Astrid Vinje (32:09):
Oh, there is something like so getting around
because it's an archipelago,getting around from country or
island to island, usuallyrequires like airplane. You can
take planes, and there's a lotof like, just local or regional
airlines that will service thoseplaces, but it you're taking
(32:32):
some if you're taking a flight,just be checking the flight
times, because,
Unknown (32:39):
yeah, it
Astrid Vinje (32:39):
happened to us. The last time we were in
Indonesia, the flight changedfrom like, morning to nighttime,
and
Clint Bush (32:49):
sometimes it changes from nighttime,
Astrid Vinje (32:51):
nighttime
to morning,
Clint Bush (32:53):
and then you might miss your flight.
Astrid Vinje (32:54):
Yeah, so just be like, be aware of your flight
times, and just check in Java,there is an extensive train
system. So if you have a littlebit more time, and you're you
want to, like, see thelandscapes that Clint was
talking about, taking the trainis a great you. And
Clint Bush (33:14):
you can literally take the train all the way from
East Java, all the way to WestJava. So it's, it's really
incredible. And I think theother thing is, if you have
time, if you're, if you aregoing to stay in Indonesia for
So, you can get a sponsored visafor up to six months.
Astrid Vinje (33:31):
That's true,
Clint Bush (33:32):
yeah. And then the normal visa is 30 days,
extendable to 60, a one timeextension to 60 days. Otherwise,
beyond that, you have to get asponsored visa. And they're
actually not that hard to get.There's companies out there
Astrid Vinje (33:45):
that visa agencies that will
Clint Bush (33:47):
that basically, will you kind of pay them and they
give you a sponsor for sixmonths. But anyways, if you're
going to spend longer time inIndonesia, I think the ferry
system is also an interestingway go island hopping a bit. So
you can go, for example, if youstart in Bali, then you can go
to Padang Bai, which is on theedge of Bali, closest to Lombok,
(34:10):
and you can take a ferry fromBali to Lombok. So the ferry
system is an interesting way tovisit some of the islands as
well. Yeah,
Unknown (34:19):
yeah.
Clint Bush (34:20):
The other thing I just wanted to mention, kind of
nature and food related is thatIndonesia has an incredible, I
mean, we talked about, like thethe agricultural history is
incredible, but there's allsorts of things that you can see
grown So you can do agriculturaltours or whatever. But there's
(34:43):
like, you know, on the fruitside, you can see jackfruit and
durian trees. You can see papayatrees. You can see on like,
there's coconut, there's palm,of course, there's rice fields,
there's tofu making. Plants.Tofu is a big export of
Indonesia, tofu and tempeh,which Tempe is a type of, yeah,
(35:05):
yeah, soy product. There's, ofcourse, coffee and cacao,
Astrid Vinje (35:09):
yeah,
Clint Bush (35:10):
there's, like, there's just these incredible
amounts of, like, agriculture.They grow tobacco still in
Indonesia, and sugar cane. Andit's just, I mean, it's a, it's
a rich, I haven't think, I thinkthat's why the Dutch capitalized
on that, right, for so long. Iguess, right, it just grows
everything,
Unknown (35:28):
yeah,
Astrid Vinje (35:28):
exactly
Clint Bush (35:29):
because of the volcanic soil and and the the
humid, the humidity, and thetropic jumper conditions,
Astrid Vinje (35:36):
yeah. So there's just so much potential to, like,
learn about those things whileyou're visiting,
Unknown (35:41):
yeah, yeah, yeah. So anything
Astrid Vinje (35:43):
else you want to add? I know we talked a lot, and
we could go on, but let's we
Clint Bush (35:50):
haven't even talked about Bali yet. That's another
episode. So yeah.
Astrid Vinje (35:55):
Well, that's all for today. Thank you for joining
us on this episode of Worldschooling, Q and A with Astrid
and Clint. Be sure to check outthe show notes for any links we
mentioned in the episode, andvisit my website, the wandering
daughter.com to dive deeper intoworld schooling and family
travel.
Clint Bush (36:12):
If you like what you hear, please consider supporting
the wandering daughter onPatreon. It really helps us out
and keeps the show going. You'llalso get exclusive perks, like
episode transcripts, additionalresources, access to office
hours with us and more. You canfind us on Spotify or the
podcast app of your choice. Ifyou're listening to this on
Spotify, you can tap the bellicon to get notified when new
(36:32):
episodes come out. And if youlike this episode, please give
us a five star review. It reallyhelps new people find our show.
Astrid Vinje (36:39):
If you're watching this on YouTube, don't forget to
like and subscribe and tap thebell icon to get notified of new
episodes. You can follow me oninstagram@wander.or follow the
wandering daughter on Facebook.Links to these are also in the
show notes. If you have anyworld schooling questions you'd
like us to answer for futureepisodes, feel free to throw
(37:00):
them in the comments or send usa message at the wandering
daughter.com. Forward slashpodcast, until next time. Happy
travels. Bye.
Unknown (37:09):
You.
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