Reclaiming Your Voice in Grief: Finding Confidence After Loss with Brittany Spivey

In Episode 2 of Season 2, Kendel and Rachel sit down with Brittany Spivey, their first guest of the season, for an inspiring and heartfelt conversation. Brittany opens up about her personal journey through grief after losing her mother, sharing how the loss profoundly reshaped her identity, mental health, and physical well-being. She dives into her struggles with weight gain, self-esteem, and the challenges of navigating grief, particularly during the holidays.

Brittany also explores the transformative power of affirmations and self-care in rebuilding her sense of self and finding healing. Throughout the episode, she offers valuable insights on how to create a new narrative after loss, providing a compassionate roadmap for those seeking to navigate grief and rediscover their purpose. Brittany's wisdom serves as a powerful reminder that even in the darkest moments, there is space for growth, transformation, and renewal.

Connect with Brittany Spivey here: https://linktr.ee/brittanydspivey

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to the Two Girls with Grief podcast.

(00:02):
The podcast where we share our real
and raw experiences with grief.
Whether it's tears or laughter,
or maybe a little bit of both,
we're here to figure it out in real time.
We are your hosts.
I'm Kendall Rogers.
And I'm Rachel Dwyer.
And while we're not professionals,
we are professional grievers.
Every Tuesday, we bring you honest conversations

(00:22):
that break down the stigma of grief,
one episode at a time,
because no one should have to grieve alone.
So grab a cup of coffee, settle in,
and let's navigate this journey together.
Today, we are thrilled to have Brittany Spivey,
a talented vocal coach and an incredible force
of positivity as our guest.
You may have seen her on TikTok,
where she's been sharing her journey
of healing and self-empowerment.

(00:43):
Brittany is not only a voice coach,
but someone who has transformed her grief
into a source of strength.
In this episode, she opens up about losing her mom
and how that has shaped her physically,
mentally, and emotionally.
We talk about using your voice,
both literally and figuratively,
to reclaim your power,
but also help others do the same

(01:04):
during their darkest moments.
Brittany's journey has been such a positive beacon of light,
and we're so excited to call her a grief friend.
So grab a seat, and let's dive into this inspiring
conversation about finding your voice
and your strength after loss.
So welcome, Brittany.

(01:35):
We are so happy to have you on our podcast.
Me and Kendall are big fans over here on your TikTok.
We were just watching your last live
and talking about how much you inspired us.
And something that we want to touch on later
in this podcast is like something that you said
that was like, make your grief pay you.
I don't remember the exact line,
but when I saw that, I was like,
we need to hear more about this.
We need to hear more from Brittany.

(01:57):
So please introduce yourself to the audience.
Okay. I'm so excited.
We're so excited to have you here.
Well, my name is Brittany Spivey,
and I'm a mom of a preteen.
So my world is very busy.
I have a 12 year old daughter.
You don't look like you have a 12 year old daughter.

(02:17):
I do. I'm also a vocal coach.
So I've been in business full-time over 10 years.
I always say 10 years, but it's been more
about maybe 12 or 13 years.
But I started off in a musical family
and we traveled and sang all over.
Then I worked as a chorus teacher.
And so from my chorus teaching job, and I loved it.

(02:38):
It was fun. I enjoyed working with the kids.
My mom ended up getting sick
while I was on my teaching job.
And so I decided I need to do something.
Like I have to bring her in, take care of her.
So I'm going to start a business.
And that's how that happened.
But I teach vocal coaching. I teach vocal freedom.
I teach people how to just release trauma within their voice

(03:01):
and to speak their truth.
And that's kind of how I ended up, you know,
meeting y'all and ended up sharing my story.
Well, I think Rachel and I relate so much
to what you talk about, both as Griebers ourselves
and you're so honest and relatable in your videos.
And I think that's why like so many people gravitate to you
and just find so much honesty and authenticity.

(03:22):
I think we want to give a little spotlight to your mom.
You know, unfortunately we're here for not great reasons,
but you talk so highly and beautifully of your mom.
And so do you want to like maybe mention
like maybe your favorite things about her
or like how your experience with her
and loss and grief has led you here?

(03:43):
Yes. So I'll go back to kind of how everything started.
And this is something that I talk about on TikTok,
how four months before my mom passed away,
I started seeing the numbers 444 every day.
Wow.
And I remember telling my mom, like, you know,
I keep seeing these numbers and we were trying to figure out
what does this mean?

(04:04):
Is this like, you know, a sign or something like that?
But I would wake up at 444 AM.
Wow.
I would get $4.44 back and change.
I would see it on license plates.
So I would see 444 every day.
And on 4, 8, 22 at 444 PM, that's when my mom passed away.

(04:24):
Oh my gosh.
The way that we even knew that she took her breath
at 444 PM was I was on FaceTime with my baby sister
because I had just left hospice.
My mom was in hospice.
And I literally just left.
And my sister called me as soon as I got to my mom's house
because I was just gonna take a nap and all of that.

(04:46):
So my sister called me on FaceTime and she was like,
hey, Britt, you know, you wanna talk to mama real quick?
So I was like, yeah, let me talk to her.
And in that moment, that's when it happened.
And my sister's phone, somehow, like a live photo,
it took a live photo at 444 PM with me on FaceTime

(05:07):
with my mom and you saw the time in the corner.
And that was when she took her last breath.
Oh my gosh.
And some things about my mom that I really appreciate,
even now, she was so good with her words.
My mom was a creative.
She was a writer.
Ever since I came into this world,
she was writing poems and songs.

(05:29):
Like I said, I come from a musical family.
So there's four of us, my siblings,
and we had a singing group as kids
and my mom would write our songs.
She would get our songs published and we traveled and sang.
She wrote poetry.
She wrote a book that she didn't,
unfortunately, she didn't get published,
but I just loved the fact that she was so creative.

(05:51):
You know, she knew how to express herself with her words
and she was really sweet.
She was so sweet.
But she would tell you off in a sweet way.
Yes.
It's gotta be necessary sometimes, you know,
can't be sweet all the time.
Gotta put the kids in line.
Absolutely.
That sounds like such a magical childhood though,
like traveling around singing.

(06:12):
It sounds kind of like a fairy tale book.
You know, so this is a part of my story
that I don't often share, but yes, so my family,
we did travel and sing,
but we were actually homeless during this time as kids.
Oh wow.
Yes, so, and you'll hear me talk about on TikTok
how I don't have parents or grandparents.

(06:33):
My father is actually alive,
but he wants my parents divorced, that was it.
So we have no relationship with him, no contact with him.
And after my parents divorced,
my mom, of course,
she had to take care of the four of us alone
and we were homeless, but we could sing.
We could sing.
So we could use our voice and our singing, you know,

(06:55):
to kind of help us get around the situation.
And it was a blessing.
Like it was of course unfortunate
that our father leaving put us in that position,
but we had a gift that we could use, which was helpful.
That's beautiful.
I feel like that kind of, I don't know, from like watch,
it's a weird thing when you like watch
so many TikToks of somebody,

(07:17):
you kind of feel like you know them.
And like we said before we started recording,
like if you like friends,
because we always watch each other's videos
and you get to know somebody
through what they share of their story.
And that feels very much aligned
with like what I see in your videos
of just being like very crafty
and like making the best out of your situation through that.
And I mean, I feel like you can see that the positives of,

(07:41):
even if that situation,
your mom figured out a way to make it work.
And that's like, I feel like such a good representation
of your mom that like four kids and she made it work.
Like that, that's crazy.
Like that feels like that'd be stressful,
but like what an amazing resilient mom
to be able to do that
and like make it a fun experience for you guys.

(08:01):
So another thing that I really resonated with
from watching your TikToks was
how you speak about your grief journey.
And it's always like very relatable and honest,
but something that I also dealt with
was that you mentioned that you gained weight
after the death of your mom,
which I also did more so like after the death of my sister.

(08:24):
And then it like didn't really get better
after the death of my mom as well.
But I don't feel like people talk about that enough
of just like how grief can affect you
in so many different ways and like how you view yourself,
like your health, all these different things.
But can you share a little bit
about your experience with that?

(08:44):
I gained so much weight after my mom passed away.
And the crazy thing is I wasn't even like overeating.
Sometimes I was under eating,
especially when things first happen,
when they initially happened, I just wouldn't eat.
Like I would go days without eating.
And I think like, like I'm in my late 30s,
so I guess my body just responded to not eating

(09:06):
with like storing everything.
But I mean, it was rough.
It was rough.
Some days I wouldn't eat at all.
And then other days I would eat everything
that there was to eat.
And then of course, with grief,
you don't have the energy to get up and go cook
and go grocery shopping.
So it was like, I was just having food delivered

(09:28):
to the house and it was unhealthy.
And even just being in the house and not being active,
I put on almost 30 pounds when my mom passed.
But it changes the way that you see yourself
because it's like, okay,
I've had this insanely difficult thing happen to me.
Now I look like a completely different person.

(09:48):
For me, when my mom passed, my entire identity shifted.
So it was like the weight gain,
I started looking different.
I lost friends and I didn't feel good in my clothes.
I didn't go outside often.
But yeah, the weight gain was,
I'm gonna say was and is still something that I deal with.
And it's rough.

(10:09):
It's so hard to get past it.
Yeah, something that I didn't realize was like,
sometimes you don't wanna look at yourself
in the mirror because you're just like,
one, it's like kind of like a trauma response
of whether your habits are overeating or under eating.
But it's like when your body changes
and then if you're not working out or even going outside,
it's like your body starts reacting.

(10:31):
And then you don't even realize sometimes
how quickly you put on weight.
I have now gone back into working out
and taking care of myself,
but it's still an ongoing process.
But it's definitely hard to look in the mirror
and be like, what did I do to myself?
It is.
And I just started going back to the gym.
So I first went and got this like elliptical

(10:53):
and put it in my garage and I was like,
okay, we're gonna do this.
Cause I was too embarrassed to go to the gym
and be around people.
And also y'all, like I have a little sprinkle of anxiety.
So it was like, I didn't wanna just go to the gym
and my town has one main huge gym and it's always busy.
So I was like, okay, I'm gonna work out in the garage

(11:13):
and try to do that.
And so I did that for a little while
and then I started going to the gym.
And because grief is weird.
So the first week of me driving up to the gym,
I just drove there.
I didn't go in.
I just drove and sat in the parking lot
and I hyped myself up like, you know, we're gonna do this.
I'm gonna give you a week or seven days

(11:34):
to get yourself together, but you're gonna go in there.
And I had to like hype myself to get out the car,
be around people and to go and start my journey.
But it was rough.
That's not easy.
I mean, when you're, especially at gyms,
one, they tend to be crowded,
especially if it's like the only gym in town.
And then there's mirrors everywhere.
And it's like, if that's what you've been avoiding,

(11:56):
it's really hard to be like where I used to feel
really positive and really confident in my body.
And then you're like forced to be like mirrors everywhere.
You're wondering if people are judging a workout,
judging maybe they've seen you before
when you were in better shape.
Like there's a lot of things that cross your mind
when you're trying to get back in shape,
which is crazy because you're like,
I'm just trying to take care of myself.

(12:16):
But like, why am I trying to stop myself
from also taking care of myself?
Because I'm scared of everything,
of all these different things.
It's really a crazy feeling.
I mean, I'm glad you were able to do it,
but I think it's such a good thing to point out.
Like you didn't do it your first try.
Like you had to pump yourself up
to kind of get yourself there.

(12:37):
Because I think, we think like
it's gonna be an automatic thing.
Like you make a decision and you can just automatically do it.
And sometimes you can, but sometimes you need to do it.
And it's harder when you don't have
your number one cheerleaders on this earth anymore
to be like, you got this, you can do this.
And that makes it just so much harder.
Absolutely.
Yeah, I think with what Rachel is mentioning,

(13:00):
like there's so much, I mean,
I feel like grief conversations are growing in this space
and that's great.
Cause it's one of the reasons we started this podcast
is to help like make the conversations around grief
and loss and death a little less taboo
because we didn't have these circles
to kind of express these emotions
that we were feeling around grief.
But nobody, even like when you're working

(13:22):
through the emotional part, which is big,
because you're going through all these new emotions
for the first time,
nobody's talking to you about the physical part of grief.
I think like even just the manifestation of grief,
like in your posture and your energy,
and you as a vocal coach,
like how does grief affect these other things

(13:43):
about you as a person, like your confidence
because of grief and because of that changing.
Grief actually affected my voice, my singing voice.
And of course it affected my business as well.
I'll say this, the way that I even started talking
about my mom's story and sharing on TikTok was,

(14:05):
and I always tell this story the same way,
but it was 11 days after my mom passed.
And with what I know about how the voice works
and how when we hold things in,
trauma and family secrets and really heavy things,
even grief, when we hold it in,
it stores itself in our ability to speak up for ourselves.
It stores itself in our voice

(14:25):
and our ability to create and be free.
You know?
I have chills right now.
It really does.
And I've seen that over the past 10 or 12 years
with my clients.
So when my mom passed,
I remember I put some red lipstick on
and I went to my backyard and I sat outside
and I was like, you know what?

(14:45):
If I don't say something right now,
I am not going to survive this.
I'm not gonna survive it if I don't talk.
I had to talk.
And so I literally just took out my phone
and I started talking and that was 11 days.
And then I started talking on day 12 and day 15
and making this a thing.

(15:06):
And of course, talking doesn't eliminate the grief,
but it does kind of move that energy around in your body
so that you can function a little differently.
But I knew that I had to talk.
Grief did change my business.
And even when I started talking on TikTok,
I lost clients who didn't understand my grief journey,

(15:28):
especially when the page started to really grow
and they didn't really understand
the way that I was expressing myself,
but I gained a lot more in return.
But I knew that I would not survive my mom's death
if I didn't talk.
Yeah, that's, we in Kendall always talk about
how we took forever to talk about our grief,

(15:49):
like many years.
Like I, it took, like, I mean,
my dad passed away 10 years ago,
my sister eight and my mom six.
And it's been like four years since Kendall lost her dad.
So it took a while to do that.
It's really been, this year has been a turning point,
like with our podcasts and joining like a support group.
And I personally like feel so much lighter
because I don't keep it in

(16:09):
and I don't pretend like everything's okay.
And it's helped me process my grief
and just feel so more empowered with myself
by actually talking about it.
But I, like, we always say like,
we're so amazing people do that so much sooner.
Like people in our support group have done it.
We're like, I just didn't have the ability to do that,
but it feels so much better to grieve out loud

(16:30):
than grieving in silence.
And I'm just amazed that you did that in 11 days
and then have been able to kind of build
what you're building through that,
like the power of just your story.
Yeah, it was hard.
I'm not gonna lie, it was hard.
And it's crazy because I actually started
that TikTok page to hide because I have a business
and because I have clients, you know,

(16:52):
and I didn't know, I didn't want people to see me.
I didn't.
I was like, okay, I need to, I just need to talk.
And I don't want people to see this
because I knew that if I, and I made a commitment to myself,
if I'm gonna talk about how this really feels,
I'm gonna talk about how this really feels.
You know, whether people agree with it
or clients agree with it.

(17:13):
So I started the page to hide.
I wanna dig deeper into that for a moment
because I feel like that is a very relevant feeling
for a lot of grievers,
this feeling of wanting to hide within ourselves.
And it's not that anybody is prompting that,
but it's truly because of a loss and a great life change.
I went through a period of like,
I didn't want people to look at me

(17:35):
or like I'd wear sunglasses inside,
like truly a way to like hide my eyes from people.
I know like Rachel had some experiences too,
but why do you think that is?
Like that's such a interesting thing
that I think many grievers do.
I mean, if we even think about that,
let's think about traditional jobs in the workplace.

(17:55):
You're kind of forced to hide your grief to make a paycheck.
You have three to five days of bereavement, if that.
So I think-
Yeah, me and Rachel are very vocal about that.
I mean, even if you have that many days or whatever,
but I think it's something that happens in our society.
We expect for people to just get over it and move on

(18:18):
so you can get back to work.
So I think we kind of learned that like indirectly.
We learned, you know, okay,
let me three days of bereavement.
Maybe I shouldn't feel this way
three months or three years later, you know?
And I think even in certain spaces and societies
and cultures, like the way that I was raised

(18:39):
in my community, just in the black community,
you don't sit there and cry about stuff.
You gotta be tough and, you know, move on to the next thing.
What is therapy?
That's not a thing.
Yeah.
In some of the spaces that I was raised in.
So I think just as a whole, as a society,
we really have to take a step back
and consider the fact that it's not that some people grieve,

(19:04):
all people will grieve at one point in time
and there should be better things in place for us.
But I think we're trained indirectly to hide.
You know, we don't even get time off of work to grieve.
So you do hide from the world.
Dang, that's a good answer.
Yeah, I mean, I see it also, like, agree with all of that,

(19:25):
but I felt, it was almost like you're getting stabbed.
Like I lost both my parents and my sister.
So I felt like it was like so many
just crazy things happening
that I didn't want people's pity.
I didn't want people to see me as a sad, sad girl,
even though like, looking back,
like I was definitely a sad, sad girl for many times
around that year.
And I still cry, you know, frequently,

(19:47):
but I just like didn't want to be seen as like weak and sad.
You know, there's difference between like empathy
and like pity or anything, but I just like didn't want it.
I was just like, I don't want this to be part of my story.
And it was really hard.
I didn't realize just like, you stop like getting ready.
You stop finding clothes that fit, you know,
or like that work well for you.
You stop working out.

(20:07):
You don't want to be seen.
You don't want to be perceived by anyone.
You don't want people to know what's really going on.
And it's taken so long to like train myself out of that
and be like, I can be seen and I can share what I'm feeling.
And like me and Kendall cry in this podcast,
like all the time.
So like, if you feel like crying, you're welcome.
We pretty much cry every episode.
You're pro-criers here.
Yeah.

(20:29):
So it's been like a really growing like time for me,
and I think for Kendall as well,
to just start to feel like comfortable to speak
and even to feel comfortable talking about our grief.
Cause we even say like,
we need to feel more confident in our story
and like how we say it.
Because I feel like sometimes we're like,
should we stand on this when we say it?

(20:50):
Should we just be like correct in how we say it?
And sometimes it's like, you just need to say it.
And like, this is your story.
So you can't be wrong with it,
but it's something that we're like growing into.
And we definitely saw that when we were watching your live
and like texting each other,
we're like, Britney does such a great job
of like owning her grief and owning her story
and just like making good things out of it.
Like, we're taking notes.

(21:11):
Like she's doing the damn thing.
We were rapidly taking notes.
We were literally texting each other.
Like, oh my God.
It's like, I was like, that what she just said?
Oh my God, that speaks to me.
Like we were literally texting each other doing that.
So we've been talking about a lot of the hard things,
but on the flip side of that,
what are choices that you've been making

(21:31):
that you feel like have been good for your self-esteem,
for your body, like your overall self,
like that you've been making after you realized
kind of this negative cycle that you were going through?
Definitely going back to the gym was one,
a really good choice.
And then changing just my wardrobe.
I have, I decided that I want to feel good.

(21:52):
I don't care what it looks like.
I just want to feel good.
So if something makes me feel good, I'm gonna wear it.
Or if it's sweatpants and a little jacket or something,
like I'm gonna wear whatever makes me feel good.
But also affirmations,
taking the time to speak to myself.
And even if it's looking in the mirror
and saying, you know what,

(22:12):
you survived a really difficult season.
It's okay if you change.
I'm proud of you for growing.
You are beautiful.
You are strong.
Look at what you've done.
Look at what you're doing.
You're gonna make it out of this.
So even just taking the time for affirmations
just to affirm myself,

(22:32):
because grief does change your physical body.
And I think we have to get to know the new version of us.
And it's not always easy,
but definitely the gym,
taking time to affirm myself and then finding,
I'm creating a new style right now.
I don't know what it is that I want to look like.
I don't like, I'm wearing furs now and just trying to-

(22:55):
Oh girl, I love that.
Yes, I'm wearing furs
and trying to figure out what I want to do.
And I think that's the thing about grief.
Grief breaks you down so deeply
that you gotta build something up.
So now you can actually decide who you are.
And that's the process that I'm in now.
I'm just like, okay, we're gonna try everything
until I figure out who I wanna be.

(23:17):
Yeah, I remember seeing you post about like,
I think it was like a black jumpsuit and like a leather jacket.
You posted on TikTok and I was like,
oh, you look so good in that.
Yes, yeah.
And I would never put anything like that fitted on this body,
maybe my old body, but I'm learning.
I'm learning.

(23:37):
Yeah.
You know?
That is like delicious.
Like I love the style component.
Like grief brings out some fashion, honestly.
Yeah.
I've been using Nuuly, which is like a rental service
and you can pick like, I think six items at a time.
And I've been using that to try to like change up my style
and try out different things.
Cause it happens where you like,

(23:59):
you stop caring about your outfits
and like how cute you look.
And the times that I put effort into like what I look
and how I feel, I'm like, I feel so much better.
Like, why don't I do this all the time?
You know, like when I actually care about what I wear
and like care about if it's flattering,
I just feel like a hundred bucks.
Like I just feel so much better or a million bucks.

(24:20):
A hundred is a little low.
I feel like a hundred bucks a day.
So do I.
I so get it.
A hundred feels too low.
Sometimes 20 bucks.
Like, they said it's a dollar, like what up.
It happens.
I definitely felt like a dollar for many years

(24:42):
where I was like, I need to up it.
So it's been a, definitely a process
where I'm like, and Nuuly has helped,
with just, not even just Nuuly.
Like it's not Nuuly, but it's like,
I don't want to spend a ton of money figuring out my style.
And this is not a Nuuly ad,
but I just look away for me to like,
if I like it, you can buy it from there.
So I'm like, but I don't want to just like buy a bunch of stuff and not like it,

(25:04):
but it gives me a chance to try things on and in a space that's comfortable.
Like it comes to me.
So like, and I can see like, okay, I thought that was going to work and it really
isn't, or I could try something else.
And just trying different things like that has really helped me just like, okay,
I can't feel confident again.
Even if I still want to get into a little better shape still and like still
working out and doing all those things.

(25:24):
I still should love my body at every phase that it's in and like do that.
So like renting clothes is a good way where like, I don't have to commit to every
size. So that's been really helpful, but yeah, it's such a, it's a crazy experience.
It's like a whirlwind, like, okay, I did that to myself and now I'm trying to feel
like that million bucks again.
But I really liked how you brought up the affirmations because that was something

(25:46):
we were going to ask you later on that you're going to bring up because I do
think that affirmations are so important and I don't think I always give it enough
space in my day to day life.
Like I say it out of like, oh, I should do this.
Like I should tell myself, but it really does help.
So Brittany, have you gained a new appreciation for your voice or your body?

(26:07):
Or I think more importantly, like the ability to carry yourself through difficult
situations like grief.
Absolutely.
Yes. And I'll start with my voice.
I did not speak much as a child that could, I could talk, of course, but I just
didn't, you know, so things that happened in my childhood, I was just really

(26:30):
withdrawn and I didn't talk a lot.
And I was like the little kid in class that would just never raise their hand.
And I didn't make friends easily.
My voice was just cut off from an early age.
So the fact that I can go from someone who didn't speak, people didn't even know
that I could talk because I just wouldn't, you know, so to go from that to

(26:54):
someone who is using their voice professionally, not just for themselves,
but to help other people.
And then on top of that, using my voice to share my mom's story, I'm absolutely
proud of the way that my voice has found its path and its way and its freedom,

(27:14):
especially in one of the most difficult times of my life when I wanted to just
stay silent, you know, so I'm absolutely proud of that.
I'm also proud of myself for trying new things with, you know, my hair or my, my
wardrobe or my makeup and also y'all, I don't know if y'all had this happen to
y'all with brief, but I didn't leave the house for a long time initially.

(27:38):
Oh girl.
Yeah.
And even just starting this year, you know, I'm starting to get out more and,
you know, getting dressed up and going out with my friends.
And so I'm proud of that.
I'm proud of the fact that I've been able to use my voice and then make it
through a really difficult situation.
We're kind of flipping between questions, but I want to like jump in and ask
another question really quick, like before proceeding in that I feel like

(28:01):
between Rachel and I, one of the things that we like kind of bonded on early is
that it took us years to figure out and find some footing in healing and like
addressing the grief journey.
And like, I think us finding a community this year is a really, really
important part of the community this year in the grief space, like has added
so much clarity and like understanding to all of this.

(28:26):
I say that because when my dad passed in 2020, the world was shut down.
And in some sense, like even if I wanted to distract myself, there wasn't things
to do, do you have like a community that you lean on or like talk about grief with?
Do you think that is a huge part of maybe like your grief journey or a part of your
utilizing your voice and kind of confronting grief head on?

(28:47):
I would say TikTok has definitely been a huge part of that.
And I've made a lot of friends and you know, we message each other and text
each other and if you're feeling bad one day, so that's definitely been
something that's amazing.
But, and I talked about this a few, maybe a few days ago or last week, how I went
to a grief support group, I recently joined one and that's been amazing.

(29:11):
I didn't expect that I would enjoy it, but I needed it, you know, so that's been
helpful and also my family group chat.
That's important, you know, just like being able to talk about all of the
things that have happened.
But you know what, I'll add one more thing is my friends, like my best friends.
I had one best friend who after my mom passed away, our friendship just, you

(29:33):
know, dissolved and that's cool because it happens, but I do have like really
close friends who they will pull up on me.
If they don't hear from me enough, they are like, listen, I'm coming to your
house, I'm pulling up.
Definitely having my friends to talk to has been amazing, but I will say that
just you asking me that question, Kendall is like, okay, I need to find more ways

(29:58):
to engage in a community.
Yeah, personally, I'm going to speak for myself, but having these communities to
talk about grief with because same way I had great friends, but I recognize that
it was like the three of us learning about grief and like, how do you even
support your friend who just lost their closest parent?
How do you even begin to start these conversations?
And I am very blessed to have them in my life because they carried me through

(30:22):
that dark time, but finding this grief space this year, I mean, Rachel and I
talk about it all the time together, how this exponentially changed us for the
better and that finding this grief group and us like finding like a friendship
with each other, like sharing this grief, like we share thoughts with each other.
I don't think grievers have them, but not the rest of the world that doesn't have

(30:44):
ever experienced loss.
I think just having these communities where like, Hey, this is a grief feeling
or the griefy thing that I'm dealing with today and having other grievers be like,
yep, I've been there, seen that like, this is how I've done it or here's some
advice or here's some resources.
I don't think I would even be talking about grief the way we have been on this
podcast.
If I hadn't found the support group or even met Rachel, I'd still be very

(31:07):
closed off and personal about my loss with my dad.
Yeah.
And I want to circle back to the support group because I didn't think I was
going to like it either.
And when I first joined one, not in the same organization that we're in now, but
I didn't really like it.
Like I just didn't feel that sense of community.
And some people were very, I'd say like not respectful of like my own grief

(31:32):
thoughts, you know, or like a little snappy.
And I was like, I thought this is a support group.
Like, why are you trying to be right?
Where's the support?
Like you're trying to be right in like my grief.
Like even if you grieve differently, like I can respect that that's how you
grieve and people grieve differently, but there's no reason to be like trying to
correct my own grief thoughts.
And I was like, maybe this really isn't for me.

(31:53):
And joining the other one, I also didn't find like a group that fits.
So I started organizing one and I met Kendall through like the training and
then she's in the one that I organized.
But like, if I hadn't done that and given up, like I never would have.
Then been like, Oh, me and Kendall, like, I feel like we could like create a
podcast, like I would, none of this would have happened if I hadn't just like kept
going.
So for the people that also think that maybe it's not for you, maybe try a few

(32:16):
because you never know.
And like Brittany said, like she didn't think it was going to be something she
liked, but she, she likes it, you know, like, and you might have to just find
the right community where you feel comfortable and you have that trust of
people for it to feel like a good thing.
So kind of going into that of, I feel like this is a good lead way to the next
question is how have you been able to find more peace with your grief and your

(32:39):
grief journey?
Because I feel like it took me a long time and I don't know, like I'm a
hundred percent at peace with it, but I feel like I've reached a level of
acceptance that I have of my grief, but like, where do you feel like you are in
your grief journey?
Oh, I found peace.
I would say that for me, allowing myself to be okay with the fact that grief may
not be peaceful sometimes.

(33:01):
Yeah.
I think that's the biggest thing.
And, and I don't know if y'all have been feeling this for the holidays, but the
holidays have been kicking my tail.
Yeah.
I've been dehydrated this whole month.
I've been crying.
The holidays have been kicking my tail and I have to keep reminding myself.
It's not always going to feel good.
It's not always going to be peaceful.

(33:21):
It's not always going to, you know, grief is not always going to feel the way that
we think it should feel.
And then there's a lot of people who aren't grievers who may think that we'll be
over it in five years or whatever, but that's just not the reality.
And I think allowing myself to just understand that it's okay if I don't have
peace in the moment, you know, I can do things to create peace or whatever

(33:46):
peace can look like, whatever for me.
So therapy is definitely one.
That's another thing that I have been doing and my therapist is amazing.
I will get online and research because I have anxiety.
So I'll get online and research, you know, how to calm down from anxiety or I'll
use my own breathing techniques that I do with my clients.

(34:07):
And one thing that saved my life, I think when my mom first passed was spending
time outside.
And it seemed so like minor or elementary to just go outside, but I would literally
go outside.
I don't care if I was full blown dressed.
I would go outside with no shoes on, just sit in the sun, put my feet to the earth.

(34:30):
And I would take a deep breath in and then I would blow out.
And when I blew my air out, I would just envision that the earth was just taking
my pain.
So I have my feet to the earth.
I take a deep breath in, blow out and just envision.
I would envision my pain and my grief as if it was leaving through my feet and the
earth was just taking it for me.

(34:53):
And as crazy as that sounds, it worked.
And that was something that I could do when I was feeling overwhelmed.
I'm like, okay, let me take off my shoes, go sit outside in the sun and we're just
going to envision like the ground is just going to help me get through it.
And it helped for all the other moments, taking time to rest, taking time to turn

(35:16):
off my phone or unplug from social media as well.
Yeah, Rachel and our big proponents of going out to nature as a way to explore that
grief.
There's something mystical and magical with the universal connection between grief
and nature.
Agree, if you're a griever and haven't gone outside, go outside.

(35:37):
For some reason, it does alleviate that pain a little bit.
It doesn't take it away, but it does help you deal with it.
And it's weird.
It's a weird thing.
I love going to like a clear body of water because I'm afraid of, you know, sharks,
alligator, whatever monsters of the water.
But I do love like a clear water where I can see just like something about that just

(35:59):
feels so at peace.
Like everything's washing away.
But I really liked the imagery of like putting your feet in the ground.
I think they call it like grounding.
Like it was like people actually, I don't know how much research, but I know people
talk about like grounding, like you put your feet in like the sand or the dirt or
wherever, and it like helps center you.
And I like the image of just like, let the earth take your pain because none of this

(36:23):
really makes sense, right?
Like us having to experience this, like it doesn't seem fair.
Like why does this stuff happen?
But I really like just imagining, asking the earth to like take your pain.
Like you gave this to me, like take it back and hopefully it's from you.
I just saw like in my head, I was like, that's really powerful.
I'm going to try that.
It definitely works.

(36:44):
So one thing I think both Rachel and I have been exploring, I think together is like
when you don't have your parents around to tell you they're proud of you, any person
that tells you they're proud of you, you start crying.
Like I think Rachel and I are kind of like trying to work through that together as we
like, we need to be proud of ourselves.
We need to be proud of each other and know that our parents would be proud of that.

(37:06):
So we wanted to ask you, what have you been the most proud of since the loss of your mom?
It's however big, however small, it's something to celebrate.
I will say this is a big one.
I mean, it may be small to people, but me and my daughter, we moved back to my hometown
and this is a place that I said I would never go back to ever.

(37:26):
This is where, you know, me and my family were homeless and this is where a lot of things
happened.
And also this is where I have all of my childhood memories with my mom.
So I just, I did not expect to be back here, you know, but I ended up here and it has been
beautiful.
And I was talking to my older sister last night and I was like, you know what?

(37:50):
I think I'm back here to create a new story for myself, to create a new story.
And this town, I told myself, I would never, you couldn't pay me to come back here.
And now I'm here and it's turning out to be one of the most beautiful places, even though
it didn't start out that way.
I'm so proud of that.

(38:10):
Yeah.
I really am.
That is amazing.
I think that something that we've talked about is like in your grief journey, you have to
choose to one, continue to live, but also choose to continue to find joy and continue
to build your story.

(38:30):
And I just immediately thought of that when you said that.
It's like you're choosing yourself and starting this new chapter because you have to.
And some people don't.
Some people just, you know, the pain is so much.
I'm not judging them.
It's hard to get past that.
It's hard to keep going.
But I think there's a beauty in like, I'm going to choose myself and figure out what

(38:50):
the next thing is for me and how to actually have a beautiful life as much as I can, because
you know, we get to live a life and they would want us to.
And I know a lot of people hate that, but I feel like you have to get to that.
You have to feel that in yourself.
Like no one can tell you that.
Like you have to reach that step where you're like, they would actually want me to be happy.
They would want me to be doing more for myself if you're really stuck in your grief.

(39:14):
And yeah, I really, when you said that, I was like, that's a beautiful step and kind
of full circle moment where like I'm doing this for me and starting over.
So kind of going off of that, what are some like activities would you recommend to other
grievers rediscover their strengths and passions after grief or maybe through their grief?
Because I feel like there is this new, like you're this new person once you kind of emerge

(39:38):
from your grief shell, like you're like kind of cocooning in there and then you kind of
have to do this like rebirth of yourself without the people that you love.
So do you have any recommendations for people that are like that?
I do.
And I have a written exercise that is really helpful for this because we know that grief is kind of
like putting your old self to rest, you know, just getting rid of your old self, even though

(40:00):
you don't want to, you kind of have to.
So I would tell, you know, someone that's trying to kind of figure out their new path through grief,
write down on a sheet of paper or a notebook who the old person was.
So write down every single thing about your old life, the stuff that you loved,
the stuff that you didn't like your loved ones who were there in that old life and that old reality.

(40:24):
Just write it out.
And I always say, write it out instead of typing it out.
Like there's just something powerful with you writing your words, write out the old life.
You know, you can take it, you can keep it.
I keep mine. You can, you know, do whatever it is you want to do with it.
And just write out your old life, like to the T and then on a new page,

(40:46):
write out what you want your new life to look like.
Now write out the person that you want to be, who you want to meet,
the things that you want to accomplish, what you want yourself to look like and your world to look like.
And start there, start there.
You'll have a clear outline of what happens next.
Grief, one of the things with grief is like our brains get so foggy and we can't really always process and remember things.

(41:10):
But when you have it written out, yeah, you can look at the old life and appreciate everything that has happened and everything that's come to you.
And then you have this new set of like, okay, this is what I want now.
This is what I want.
And maybe I'll start with one thing.
If it's, I want to be proud of my body, then I'll start with that.
Or the new me is in a new home.

(41:30):
Start with that.
Start with that, you know, whatever it is.
So creating two different versions of yourself on these two different pages and just taking the new, sticking to it.
You can adjust and add whatever you want, take away whatever you want, but you get to decide what happens next.
I love that so much.
Yeah, that's an incredible exercise.

(41:51):
And when we were jumping in into your TikTok live the other night, which we're going to plug you at the end.
But honestly, if you're not following Brittany on TikTok, do yourself a favor.
Hop on there.
Follow her now.
You were dropping so much like just tidbits where I was like, oh my God, like that is such a useful little nugget that I need to incorporate into my life on like, how do I see myself?

(42:15):
How do I envision my grief?
Like, how do I look at my future?
And so when you were talking on your TikTok, all these little like little nuggets of advice.
But I would love for you to share with our listeners how your grief story is helping you connect, but also inspire others because you do have your own business.
But like give them a little taste of how this all comes together.

(42:37):
It comes together.
Like Rachel said, it's like a full circle moment, even me being back in my hometown.
But I was perfectly fine with just vocal coaching and music coaching, because that's just what I've always done.
So I was perfectly fine with that.
And it just expanded into me using the voice and what I've learned about the voice to coach people into freedom.

(43:02):
And it's turned into another aspect of my business because there's a lot of people who've gone through really difficult things.
And like we were saying earlier, a lot of times we're told to not talk about it, to not speak about it.
So for instance, one of the programs that I am doing in January is called Let the Pain Pay You.

(43:24):
Oh, yeah, that's what we wanted for you to bring back up.
We're like that inspired us.
Let the pain pay you.
You know, and I've had people ask me like, how do I get rid of this pain?
You may not.
I mean, if I'm real.
So if it's going to be there, charge it rent, let it take care of you.
Let it provide the resources that you need, because the pain isn't going to go anywhere.

(43:46):
You know, so within my business, I've created different ways to teach people,
first of all, how to free themselves from just vocal stagnation and trauma.
There's people who come to me who have never actually spoken out loud the things that have happened to them.
And they're like, hey, you know, it's been 20, 30 years and I never even said that this happened to me.

(44:09):
Just having a place to do that.
And that's why I think therapy is so important.
I think that's one of the powerful things about therapy.
You're actually releasing that energy from your voice.
So even with let the pain pay you, it is an I'm sorry.
It's I was going to say it's an organization, not an organization, unless I'm making it into an organization.

(44:29):
Yeah, there's still time.
Make it a corporation, girl.
You should wait a minute.
Do I did that just like impart into me?
Yeah.
Growth is happening in 2025.
You know, it's crazy.
I've been calling in an organization every time I tell people about it and it's not.
Not maybe it's a sign.
It needs to be.
That's what it's.
That's what I think.

(44:49):
So we're going to look back at this recording and let it all come together.
But it's a program that helps people to free themselves with their voice, but also in an unconventional way,
learn to speak and as well, accept the abundance that comes in from that, you know, because we do sometimes,
sometimes we do kind of feel weird about like telling our stories when it's something that is traumatic

(45:14):
and receiving compensation from that can feel weird.
It feels a little weird.
You know, it does, but we have to kind of just rewire our thinking with that.
I think also, I mean, I've said it before, like there is this.
I worked with, he's like a self help guy or whatever.
And his story, he had a hard like childhood and stuff, but I don't think it's necessarily like,

(45:39):
I don't like comparing people's like trauma and pain, but in terms of like other, what other people go through,
it's like, it's pretty much on the same like playing field, but he has taken his story to now that he charges like,
it was 70,000 to speak at places and now it's like $120,000 to speak at places.
To speak for like an hour.

(46:00):
And that's what he charges.
So it very much is that.
And I feel like we, maybe it's as women, whatever, we feel like we can't,
I don't know if it's like charge for our pain, but it's like, it's our story.
It's our rebirth from the story.
And if this guy can do it, why can't we?
And I really like how you said that, like, make your grief pay you.
And it's true.

(46:20):
It's like, it's our story.
We should own it and like stand on it.
And I think that's something that me and Kendall like really took away from listening when you're
watching her live.
We speak about our story, but we don't necessarily like own our story.
We don't necessarily speak about it with the same, I feel like,
like conviction or just like strength that you speak about it.
Like, I feel like when you speak, I'm just like, I'm inspired the way that you say it.

(46:42):
I'm like, I just love the way that you speak about it.
And me and Ken are like, we say it in just like a more, I feel like almost shy way sometimes.
I'm a shy person.
That's true.
And I feel like we're like trying to step into our light as this continual process of like,
no, like we still have a story.
We do get really nice messages of like helping people and like we should own that more.

(47:02):
And why do we feel bashful that we're also trying to like build it into something bigger?
And I don't think we should because like everyone does, but why should we feel bad about it?
But like you definitely, you definitely should be.
That's really, I keep saying it.
It's like every time I try to talk about this, it comes out as an organization.
That's not what I have it planned as, but maybe so we'll see.

(47:25):
Maybe, maybe that's a sign.
I cannot talk about this without the word organization coming out of my mouth.
Yeah.
It's just, it is a sign.
And I feel like you said like the 444, like I see like 17 and 317 a lot,
which is my sister's birthday.
And I see that for so many things.
Like even when we were talking, I saw it because for me, I'm in standard time.

(47:45):
So like when you're talking about something that I was like kind of mentioning her,
I looked up and it was 317 and like that happens a lot.
Like I see 17 a lot.
Like yesterday I saw 17, like probably 17 times.
And so I just feel like, and then she was in my dreams.
She's trying to say something.
She's using her voice.
Yeah.

(48:05):
And I think it's something that's hard because sometimes it's like,
it can get tiring or we get shy or just like, is this enough?
And like we've talked about like, you know, we'll share something and it'll be like,
it'll get like five years and we're like, we're trying to share a story,
but it's also like how you craft it in a way.
It's like, it's, you have to kind of think about it.
It's like, how can you reach the most people and help the most people

(48:27):
is also by sharing your story in the proper way and having confidence in that.
And I think everyone should sign up for whatever Brittany offers because
I think she really does that.
And get yourself in that class immediately.
Yeah.
Sign yourself up.
She's going to turn into an organization because
it's going to sell like hotcakes.
Brittany is just like a great inspiration for us.

(48:48):
And I feel like there's one other thing that you mentioned that I want to talk about.
You, when you mentioned our old self and having to accept like that's our old self
and stepping into our new self, that is something that I don't think people talk about enough.
And I had such a hard time.
I kept thinking like, when am I going to feel the same?
When am I going to kind of be in that same body I was before?

(49:09):
I felt the trauma of like the loss of my sister.
When am I going to feel as happy?
When am I going to do all this stuff?
And it's just so hard to accept it.
Like that person is like essentially dead.
So like to use a term, it's like, I can't return to that person.
That person was carefree and depended on her family to do everything for her.
And I don't have that anymore.
And so I had to completely change.

(49:32):
But that took so much like just acceptance to be like,
that is where I am and I will have to think about the future.
Because I think also for grief, it's like sometimes you stop caring about the future.
You stop thinking about the future because the future looks so different
than what you pictured, what you envisioned as a little girl,
like what you thought it was going to be.
And it's really hard to let that go.
And then just like not be full of disappointment.

(49:53):
It's like, it doesn't look anything like that.
Like nothing looks the same.
And when you said that, I was like, that exercise I need to do because...
Me too.
Yeah, it's a thing that I've accepted, but it's still a process.
Like you're still ongoing.
You're never like cured from grief.
And like you said, like that pain of grief is always going to be there
because when you love someone so much, you're going to feel it.

(50:15):
And like December has sucked in so many ways.
Like I cried earlier today.
I'm almost crying now.
I'll probably cry later.
It's just been heightened emotions.
Like I have been having to like baby my Stanley Cup because I'm like,
you need to drink more water because you are leaking from the ducks.
And you're going to faint.

(50:35):
And so I really appreciated like listening to your stories.
And when I asked you to come on, I was like, I was telling Kendall,
I was like, we need to ask her.
I was like, I'm so inspired by her story.
Watch her videos.
And yeah, it was like, it was so fun when we were just kind of like texting about
how much we loved how you spoke, how you spoke about it.
And like, I think everyone should take your advice of like, make your grief pay you

(50:57):
because it is a part of our story.
And yeah, I just, we really appreciate you coming on.
So we already mentioned you're going to have that.
Is it a workshop?
It is a workshop.
It's a two hour workshop.
And with a lot of workshops and programs, they're prerecorded.
This is me like hopping on live with everyone teaching, interacting.

(51:19):
So it's two workshops.
Yes.
And just so that everyone knows, because you do teach vocal training,
but is this, this is more about speaking about your grief or and growth.
Like what are the differences?
So people like go to your website.
That's a good question.
What can they expect?
So this is not something that's like exclusive to singers.
You don't have to be able to sing.

(51:39):
You know, you just have to be someone who has a story or someone who's made it through.
And I won't even say made it through a difficult time.
You don't even have to be through your difficult time.
You don't have to be because sometimes we think like we can only,
or our voice is only valuable when we've healed or when we've made it past something.
And that's not true.
Yeah.
But I would say anyone with a story, anyone with a story.

(51:59):
And, and I tell people, you know, if you've made it through anything,
you are a public speaker.
Anything.
If you have survived anything, if you are surviving anything,
you are a public speaker.
You are, you just don't know it yet.
You know, so it's open to anyone who has a business, wants to know how to speak out

(52:22):
for themselves or speak up about different things in their life and their family situations,
their past, their trauma to work through any issues and to also move trauma and baggage
that's been stored inside of the voice.
And once you do that, you realize that you become a lot more free in your creative life
and in your business life.
And you said, is it a two-part series or you're doing it twice?

(52:43):
So it is one, one workshop on two separate days.
And you do not have to go to both days because it's just going to be,
so I can have two different groups of people, but it's on my website and the dates are January 4
at 3.30 PM Eastern, and then also January 11.
Awesome.
I think we're going to post this in early January.
So hopefully we'll have it there.

(53:04):
If not, I'm sure it's going to be successful that we're going to mention it and it's just
going to have to keep happening because people are going to want to join.
I do think that like, there's such a power in like that workshop.
I've heard also like something, not exactly similar, but like laughter,
like there's such things like laughter yoga.
And it's like that expression of just like making your body feel that laughter and that joy,

(53:29):
even if you're prompting it makes you feel that.
And like, you need that sometimes to just like feel that, which I feel like connects to like
your voice and releasing that and even feeling like that power to like have your voice in like
metaphorically or literal of just like knowing your voice.
Expect to see me and Kendall in there.
Yes.

(53:49):
We'll be listening in.
And then where can people find you?
Well, my business is spivyvocals.com.
Also on TikTok, I am at Britney D Spivy, B-R-I-T-T-A-N-Y, the letter D, Spivy, S-P-I-V-E-Y.
Also I'm on Instagram.
I'm going to start posting over there.

(54:10):
Just in case.
Just in case.
Just in case.
Across all platforms, I'm Britney D Spivy.
Perfect.
And we'll put that in the show notes as well so people can find you.
And do you have any other last parting wisdom advice for the grievers that are listening in?
I would say this to anyone who is dealing with grief, and of course be gentle with yourself.

(54:33):
Allow this experience to teach you or to give you the freedom to decide who you will become next.
Allow it to give you the freedom to decide because we didn't get to decide that our
loved one passed away, but now we get to decide who we are from this pain.
You can take as much time to determine what that looks like.
And I would also say as painful as this is, enjoy your rebirth.

(54:58):
Enjoy it.
Yeah, I love you.
I just...
I love you so much.
Our listeners are going to as well.
Yeah, I relate to that part so much because of just that thought of this stuff happens to you,
but you don't have a choice.
And we've talked about that something similar on our podcast.
We didn't ask for people to die.

(55:19):
We didn't ask to go through this pain, but it's like, we're still here.
So let's make sure that we make the most out of it.
So I love that last advice.
So everyone that was sitting in, depending on when this is posted, it's going to be...
Well, it'll be posted.
Either way, we're going to link you to Brittany to find her.
She's going to be an organization by then because she needs to be.

(55:40):
That's true.
And she's going to have a bunch of these workshops because it sounds amazing.
And I do think it's really powerful.
And like we say, you never know what's going to work for your grief unless you try everything.
And this sounds like an amazing thing to try.
So we'll link that.
We'll link Brittany.
You can find her.
Follow her on Instagram, TikTok.
Hopefully TikTok is still around by then.

(56:01):
Hopefully that doesn't get banned.
She's been building a beautiful community.
She's been very supportive.
I've been loving following her journey and her growth and just her wisdom.
And seeing how she supports other people, but how many people support her as well.
So we love Brittany around here.
And we're truly in awe of your journey and how you speak and just kind of the light that
you give off to people.

(56:21):
And I think with grief, you could either go to the darkness or choose light.
And sometimes you kind of do both a little bit and then hopefully find your way back to the light.
But me and Kendall can agree.
You definitely give off that light.
That light power.
You exude sparkles and radiance like you really do.
That's so sweet.
Also great skin.
Like what do you use for your face?
You don't want to know.
I use the cheapest stuff there is out here.

(56:45):
Like I'm so serious.
And even my makeup and stuff, like I'll use whatever is there.
But I mean, I use like soap and water and alcohol, the little, you know, rubbing alcohol pads and
just, um, serif as a moisturizer.
And I mean, I don't even do anything, you know, I'm just like, I probably should start since I'm 35.

(57:06):
I probably should start getting a better routine and actually trying to spend money on stuff.
But I use the cheapest stuff there is.
I do.
Well, it's working.
God damn, you're gorgeous.
That's not fair.
You'll see it if you're listening, you can't see that she's glowing.
But if you're watching this on YouTube, then you'll be able to see that she's glowing.
So hop onto YouTube to check that out and watch her glow in real life.

(57:30):
Follow her on TikTok so you can feel the warmth, feel the radiance,
feel more sparkly after you're done listening to her.
Because you really do just feel more empowered to go out and change the world.
I feel empowered.
But thank you so much, Brittany.
Like thank you for coming on.
We're really excited to start our season two with you as our first guest for season two.

(57:53):
We thought that this would be like a great episode to inspire people, but also be very honest.
And we were happy that this worked out.
We were scared for a second with some internet issues, but like,
thankfully the universe was on our side and we were able to do this and get you in before
to start the new year because I think people really appreciate the wisdom and everything that you share.

(58:15):
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
We appreciate it so much.
Thank you so much for joining us for another episode of the Two Girls with Grief podcast.
If you are looking for any resources, we'll include some down below in the show notes.
And a reminder that we have new episodes every Tuesday.
And if you made it this far, we appreciate it.
If you could subscribe, rate, review our podcast.

(58:36):
It really helps us get the word out.
And as a reminder, grief looks different for everybody.
So if nothing we said resonates with you, it doesn't mean you're doing it wrong.
It doesn't mean we're doing it wrong.
It just means that we're all different and we process grief differently.
We're just sharing our experiences and our thoughts and yours might be different and that's totally okay.
So hopefully something we say resonates with you in one of our future episodes and we'll see you next week.

(59:01):
Bye.