October 26, 2024 • 33 mins
After a career in advertising for big alcohol, our guest, Adam Murphy, blows the whistle on his former employers, comparing their methods for selling a known cancer causing agent to those of big tobacco. He describes how governments are powerless because they're also invested in the success of our alcohol companies.
They sell a product they know kills consumers and we, the consumers are auto enrolled into a drinking culture that often feels inescapable. We'll also hear how Adam escaped his work with big alcohol and found alcohol freedom for himself.
Adam Murphy
https://www.instagram.com/prezentlife/
Our 30-day group programme:
https://www.cleanlifecoaching.org/aff-group
The podcast home page
https://podcast.alcoholfreedomfinders.com/
Justine Clark
https://justineclarktherapy.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/wellwithjustine/
Barry Condon
https://www.cleanlifecoaching.org/
https://www.instagram.com/clean.life.coaching/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/barry-condon-577b85294/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
This is Alcohol Freedom Finders.
After a career in advertisingfor big alcohol, our guest, Adam
Murphy, blows the whistle on hisformer employers, comparing
their methods for selling aknown cancer causing agent to
those of big tobacco.
He describes how governments arepowerless because they're also
invested in the success of ouralcohol companies.
(00:22):
We sell a product they knowkills consumers and we, the
consumers are auto enrolled intoa drinking culture that often
feels inescapable.
We'll also hear how Adam escapedhis work with big alcohol and
found alcohol freedom forhimself.
But before that, Justine and Icatch up on what's been going on
in our lives.
My alcohol flashback at anetwork event and Justine's
(00:45):
coaching skills making her anexpert guest on another podcast.
Let's dive in.
Barry Condon (00:53):
to see you.
How you doing?
Justine Clark (00:58):
I'm really well today.
I'm great.
Barry Condon (01:01):
Excellent.
Excellent.
Justine Clark (01:02):
Having already done one podcast for the day.
Barry Condon (01:06):
huh.
Justine Clark (01:07):
How are you?
Barry Condon (01:09):
I'm good.
I'm good.
Yeah, I had a, sort of funnyexperience this week.
I went to a thing, and gotsuddenly sort of a bit of a
flashback to how things used tobe.
And how I used to, uh, the needto drink in order to, to get
through those kind of occasions.
(01:32):
and it made me see things in avery different way.
Now you sort of realize,watching other people, how they,
also use alcohol to get throughthat it, yeah, it kind of works
against you in a way because,you know, after a while, your
initial anxiety and, that you,that we all feel as we, meet new
(01:53):
people and, and, and, want tomake a good impression, that,
that calms down.
And you become to be moreauthentic and be yourself and
relax into
Justine Clark (02:06):
exactly.
Barry Condon (02:07):
when you're, when I was drinking in the past, you
know, actually sort of tellingyourself, you're not able to do
that.
And, you're kind of, trying tolet yourself not care about,
your anxiety rather than, thandeal with it.
interesting.
Yeah,
Justine Clark (02:25):
it's kind of what we were talking about the other
day, is realising that leaninginto yourself is a great reward,
being able to overcome thediscomfort, and then realise
that you can do it, and you cando it better.
Today I just did a, I didanother podcast, which is
amazing, for a functionalmedicine practitioner who
(02:46):
brought me on board as a, as awellbeing coach.
So I was speaking to how withoutalcohol, in my life, regulating
my nervous system is so mucheasier.
That jangled feeling that weget.
So, not only am I not drinkingalcohol at the event that you're
talking about, I don't have thatjangled feeling that I, sort of,
(03:08):
we could call it anxiety, wecould call it nerves, that, that
up and down feeling all thetime.
So, what I was speaking to youabout is how, having a coach
really helps to work out thethings that we need as
individuals to calm our nervoussystem.
And whether that's, you know,hands on therapy or meditation
(03:29):
or talking therapy, and it wasexciting to be the expert.
I was like, oh my lord, oh mylord, I'm, I'm now, you know.
Alcohol, being free from alcoholhas led me to realize that I am
an expert, and I do know mystuff, and people want to hear
what I have to say,
Barry Condon (03:47):
for
Justine Clark (03:47):
and that's, yeah, that's revelation.
Barry Condon (03:51):
Okay.
Welcome everybody, to AlcoholFreedom Finders, with me, Barry
Condon and my amazing colleague,Justine Clark.
Today, we're really excitedbecause we have, Adam Murphy
with us and Adam is a formeradvertising exec and now an
integrated psychotherapist andalso a coach in the Alcohol Free
(04:16):
so Adam, welcome.
Adam Murphy (04:18):
Thank you.
Barry Condon (04:18):
nice to
Justine Clark (04:19):
Yeah, welcome.
Adam Murphy (04:20):
Yeah.
Thank you.
Thank you.
very much for having me.
Justine Clark (04:22):
I'm really curious, about how you've
managed to get to this part ofyour career that you are now
doing this.
So, what led you to working inthe alcohol free space and
working, in the way that you do?
Adam Murphy (04:35):
Uh, well, yeah, it sort of goes, it goes quite a
long way back really, but Iguess the, the, the, the, The
sort of rather than starting atthe beginning, sort of at the
end, um, I left, uh, I left myadvertising career at the
beginning of 2023 and towardsthe very end of it, one of my
main clients was, uh, a largealcohol company on the footsie.
(04:56):
Um, Diageo, and within my rolethere, I was actually working on
the launch of Guinness Zero.
So, I was party to lots of, lotsof data and information in and
around the alcohol free space.
Um, so that was uh, that waskind of one of the, one of the,
final elements pushed me into,uh, not only recognizing the
size of the market and theopportunity.
(05:18):
Uh, but also being exposed tosome of the data as well as the
motivation to some of thesecompanies.
So yeah, that was one of the,you know, we'll probably go
back, but, um, but yeah, thatwas one of the multitude of
different factors that ended uppushing me into this Um, and,
uh, yeah, I'm just delighted,delighted.
I am really, I've, I've, I'vespent a life in advertising,
(05:40):
which is essentially creatingfalse needs that need to be
fulfilled by insert companiesproduct, um, which.
which.
was fine in terms of my sort ofaspirations and what I wanted to
do as a, as a young man, but itwas, uh, increasingly counter to
the, the way that I saw myselfand how it sat with my own
values as I got older.
So yeah, it was an industry thatwas really, odds with what my
(06:06):
beliefs and, uh, yeah, and thenI was working in alcohol,
tobacco, oil, and farmer at theend.
So yeah, sort of, uh, you know,for the, for the kind of worst
sectors, really.
So yeah, pushed me intoexploring something different.
Now I'm into alcohol free,which, which means not only, um,
helping, helping people on theirown alcohol free journeys, but
also, you know, large part of itis, is education as well as
(06:28):
education as to You know why whythis product is out there as it
is why it's communicated the wayit is You know i've got lots of
sort of Kind of I hate the termbut poacher turned game keeper
kind of insight Which is reallyuseful for
Barry Condon (06:40):
That's a, that's amazing.
two questions really.
I mean, I I'd be excited tounderstand more about, the data
and the information and the sortof insider, sort of
communications, how to, how, howthe, alcohol companies look to,
alcohol free products now and,and, the way that they, approach
(07:00):
marketing in general, that wouldbe interesting, but also, but
firstly, you know, how long haveyou been, alcohol free and, and,
and how was that transition foryou?
How did you find alcohol
Adam Murphy (07:09):
Uh, so I have i'm up to 16 months now Um, so yeah
last summer I I stopped and itwas a con I'm sure you know,
there's there's kind of no onestory.
Is there lots of people gettheir different ways, isn't it?
and Uh, you know, I I got Youknow, from a health perspective,
I got gout for the first time,which, you know, isn't
(07:31):
particularly, it wasn'tparticularly sexy the way I got
it.
If you're looking to take backcontrol of your drinking, why
don't you join our AlcoholFreedom Finders 30 day group
program.
It's a great place to start.
Because we approach it as anexperiment, rather than a
challenge.
Whereas, as well as getting agreat detox, you learn the
science and the psychology aboutwhy you're drunk in the first
(07:51):
place.
So whether you want to stopaltogether, or just become a
more mindful and moderatedrinker, why don't you give it a
crack?
Use the link in the show notesto sign up to our next 30 day
program, and you won't regretit.
Because no one ever woke up inthe morning and said, I wish I'd
had more to drink last night,did they?
(08:12):
Back to the episode.
You know, my drink of choice used to be real ale,
which is very yeast heavy,which, you know, is what drives
a lot of that.
So my first gout flare up sortof triggered that actually
something might not be righthere.
Um, you know, within myindustry, I've mentioned before,
you know, I was, I was doinglots of client entertaining, um,
very social person, play a lotof sport, you know, captain, run
(08:35):
sports clubs, whatever.
So, you know, I'd, I'deffectively built a, built a
lifestyle around, around alcoholfor a very long time.
Um, and yeah, it got to thepoint where I was.
I had to recognize it was nolonger serving me, ultimately,
you know, and, you know, peopletalk about a rock bottom story
and, you know, my mind doesn'treally have that.
(08:58):
Um, but, you know, there wascertainly a period when, you
know, my wife was away, I waslooking after my children and,
you know, essentially not reallyfulfilling some pretty basic
duties, I guess, but, you know,it's just, it was an
accumulative effect over, overthe years, you know, I'd, I'd
been getting sober curious isobviously a phrase that we use a
lot.
I've been sober curious for sixyears before I stopped.
(09:21):
So that started with, you know,a friend of mine, um, I went on
a holiday with him and, youknow, we start counting,
counting the units.
So this is basic as that really.
So, so from that moment, I nowrecognize that as soon as you
start doing things like that,you know, the, you know, the
pennies kind of beginning todrop, isn't it, and it's just
how long you can move.
(09:41):
the people you're working withinto that, that element of
recognizing that you may want tochange into actually changing,
reducing that time period is,is, is critical.
I think, you know, it took mesix years.
Um, some people depending onwhere they fall off, get there
much quicker, but I think that'sa, that's a key part of it.
So, um, yeah, so, So, 16, 16months.
(10:01):
um, but yeah, within that, therewas periods of sobriety within
those six years, uh, areas whereI thought, Oh, I've cracked it.
Okay.
You know, I don't need itanymore because ultimately I
hadn't done the work really.
I was just, you know, whiteknuckle in it, uh, which is
another commonly used phrase.
Um, I hadn't actually made anyof the changes in my life, and I
hadn't actually changed therelationship with alcohol,
(10:21):
which, which is what you have todo in order for it to have a,
have a sort of lasting effect.
Justine Clark (10:28):
That's awesome.
I mean, that's what we talkabout all the time.
The difference that thewillpower is actually a muscle.
So, you know, it's like hangingon to the edge of the cliff.
You can
Adam Murphy (10:36):
Yeah,
Justine Clark (10:36):
for a time may not very long, but, you know,
over time that that musclefatigues and
Adam Murphy (10:41):
yeah, absolutely.
Justine Clark (10:42):
bringing the beliefs up underneath that
actually creates thattransformation.
you know, that lasting changedoesn't happen.
One thing that you just said tome really stood out.
And you said to me that alcoholno longer served you.
what you know, in terms ofmarketing in the industry and
knowing what we know thatsociety is actually telling us
(11:02):
that alcohol serves us.
My question to you is, alcoholever serve you
Adam Murphy (11:10):
Uh, yes, I think it did.
You know.
And we've got to be very carefulof, you know, wanting to erase
our, our, our past.
Um, yeah, I had many, many greattimes with alcohol in my teenage
years and early twenties, Ithink.
And it gave me many greatmemories, which I'm, I'm glad I
had, you know, yes, I probablytook it to excess during those
(11:32):
times, but yeah, I think it didit did serve as a, um, as a as a
way of, you know, driving anexperience and.
shared experience at the time.
So yeah, I certainly don'tregret that those moments, but I
think it is also important tosay that I can kind of pinpoint
the area where it did begin tostop serving me and how long it
(11:56):
took for me to actually act onthat.
Um, you know, I recognize nowthat I think I had a, I had a go
or.
You know, it must have been,again, my lifestyle was, you
know, I would be doing lots ofclient entertaining.
So it'd be days after days afterdays.
I was in my early thirties, sosort of 15 years ago, I sort of
had a, had a good sort of, sortof crack at doing it for a
(12:19):
couple of weeks and recognizingit wasn't serving me, but
ultimately, you know, the egowas too big for it to stick.
Um, and you know, and now I'm onthe other side of it,
recognizing the, the egoicbehavior is a key part of, um,
moving into a lifestyle that issustainable without alcohol.
So, so yes, I do believe, I dobelieve it was serving me at the
beginning, but certainly, youknow, certainly not towards the
(12:41):
end and certainly not for manyyears towards the end.
And, you know, I think that'sfor people who are considering
giving up.
I think it's trying to helppeople recognize when that point
is.
Justine Clark (12:50):
Yeah.
Barry Condon (12:51):
Yeah, I think you're right.
I mean, there is, there is,there's diminishing returns.
and I don't know whether that'sage or, or, or just we become,
more and more immune to, Thesort of, euphoric effects that,
that it, that it has in theearly days.
I certainly see it in, in myselflooking back and I see it in
(13:13):
friends still that drink a lot,that they just seem to get less
and less out of it.
And it, it's,, you know, it'svery difficult to watch.
Sometimes the people that seemto drink an awful lot, don't
seem to change a great deal.
but they seem to need it.
And, and he just, Oh, it wouldbe so nice if you could
understand that, that it'sholding you back and you'll feel
(13:33):
so much better if, if, if youjust let it go.
you know, everybody has to findtheir own path and everybody,
you know, needs to do it intheir own way and, and in their
own, at their own pace.
but yeah, so tell us, tell us,tell us some gory details about,
about, advertising and how the,the, the those, dodgy people,
at, Diageo, uh, uh, try andtrick us
Adam Murphy (13:53):
Well, it's obviously the fault of the
consumer, isn't it?
You should be drinkingresponsibly.
Barry Condon (13:58):
Oh, of course.
Adam Murphy (13:59):
Um, yeah, I mean, it's a, it's a very, uh, it's a
very tricky space, isn't it?
You know, it's, you know,they're, they're obviously aware
that what they're selling is, isa poisonous substance to public
health, um, and doing everythingthey can to not recognize that
in the public.
space is essential really, whichis why you're pushing the owners
(14:21):
onto the consumer, um, which iswhy you never see anybody
suffering from the effects ofconsuming their products.
Um, and you know, it's, uh, it'sthe, the, the, the relationship
with alcohol, and society is uh,is a is a very complex one.
Uh, and you know, I think it'svery important to understand not
(14:41):
only the, the, uh, the, the.
large companies promotingalcohol, but also where, where
these large companies sit.
within, you know, public policywithin, our own government, not
just our government, othergovernments around the world.
Um, you know, these, these is a,it's a sizable, um, sizable
company on the footsie.
(15:02):
Uh, it would make up, uh, asignificant, you know, a
significant proportion of itsshares would be held by, um,
pension companies, which meansthat, you know, the government
is.
is invested in the success ofthese alcohol companies.
So, you know, that, that's justa sort of very crude top line.
(15:22):
Sort of, sort of, um, look intoexactly how intertwined some of
these some of these things are,um, and for that reason, you've
just got to be, as a consumer,you need to be highly, you need
to be highly, um, aware of themotivations of any company, you
know, um, especially ones thatare in this sort of space, you
(15:44):
know, they're, they're, they're,their only motivation is to, you
know, They'll call it delivervalue to shareholders, which
ultimately means to drive profitand they'll do it by any means
possible.
Uh, you know, we is alcohol isa, is a regulated market in
terms of, how it's produced and,who it's sold to.
Uh, but I think, you know,pretty much everyone who's
(16:06):
listened to this was probablydrinking or had experienced
drinking below the age of 18.
And.
There's all manner of methodsand techniques used to make the,
make the product moreattractive, you know, so, you
know, I've, I've obviously beeninvolved in lots of, you know,
when you're producing casting,you know, you don't obviously
cast ugly people, you don't castpeople who aren't having a good
(16:27):
time, you don't cast people whoare sat in, um, sat in their
pants watching the same fishingvideo for the fourth time on, a,
on, on a night.
You know, um, and it's, it's uh,it's, you know, it's seen as a
highly aspirational lifestyleand that's what people buy into.
And it's, in terms of themarketing, marketing dollars
that are spent, you know, youknow, we just think of the TV
(16:47):
ads, the, the, uh, outdoor andmaybe bits that we've seen in
newspapers, but it goes, it goesmuch deeper than that.
You know, the, how the, how thelie is pushed into all areas of
culture.
And, and now, you know, workingin the sector that I do.
You just see it on, in all sortsof like the movies and whatever,
(17:08):
you know, my, my, I've got adaughter who's, who's 10, who we
let, we let her watch 12s, youknow, so I guess we shouldn't do
that, but we let her watch 12s,but even, even at that sort of,
um, rating.
The amount of times there'sreference to doing shots, people
in parties, you know, andalcohol being seen as the elixir
to life and good times.
And it's, uh, it makes itreally, really tricky when
(17:31):
you've, Like ourselves, whenwe've been born into countries
in a culture where we've ineffect been auto enrolled into a
culture of drinking to, to thenstart to look beyond that is
very, very complex, especiallywhen you've got all of these
cultural cues throughadvertising, just being thrown
at you constantly.
Um, it's, uh, you know, you're,you're seen as odd if you don't,
(17:53):
if you don't partake, you know,and I think that's one of the,
that's one of the big things.
Yeah.
in and around the, uh, theclients I work with is just sort
of recognizing that, you know,you are leaving the tribe to a
certain degree.
And, you know, that, that isabsolutely to be applauded
because the easiest thing isjust to stay in it.
And in fact, I'm sure lots ofpeople, lots of the people you
(18:14):
work with have stayed in it forfar too long for fear of
rejection of the tribe.
And this is, uh, this is just aself fulfilling prophecy, which
is spun out by the, by theadvertising companies to keep
you involved.
So, you know, It's uh, It's areally complicated business.
They're selling the product thatthey know kills consumers.
You know, I'm assuming you usethese stats as well.
(18:34):
You know, it's class onecarcinogen, which puts it
alongside asbestos, radiation,and tobacco.
That means it's, uh, it's knownto induce cancer.
It has cancer causing propertiesconfirmed, you know, and what
we're doing is we're sellingversions of it, albeit diluted
quantities to, to a Which isjust completely ludicrous, you
(18:57):
know, completely ludicrous.
And, you know, I think we can,we can all recognize that the
world is going to be a verydifferent place in 50 years time
and, um, it's, you know, we arewhere we are at the moment, but
it's important that we educateourself in, in, in, and around
that.
And, and just whilst talkingabout some of the, the comms
techniques that advertisingcompanies use it, you know, one
(19:18):
of the, in the same way,there's, there's parallels with,
unfortunately I also worked intobacco.
And there are parallels in termsof the tobacco industry as well.
So, you know, tobacco if youthink of tobacco use through the
50s, 60s, 70s.
Um, you know, it was actually,it was sold as a way of, um,
soothing throats in the, in thefifties.
Um, and, you know, obviously,known, known, uh, health issues,
(19:41):
and they pushed, pushed healthwarnings onto cigarette packs,
which, which we got.
We then got the no smoking inpubs.
And.
Quite clearly, there's a push todo that within alcohol as well.
So I was, you know, I wasworking alongside, uh, the
department in the business whowere charged with, um, lobbying,
uh, European governments aroundpackaging and, and that means to
(20:04):
keep off the warning signs onthe bottles, you know, alcohol
kills you.
You know, there's all manner ofstats you can put up there, you
know, in 20 years time, they'llprobably have a picture of a
bloated liver on there orsomething anyway.
Um, There is a requirement to,or the lobbying that happens
within, you know, and it's notjust the company that I was
working for, it's every largealcohol company, all lobbying
(20:26):
the governments to ensure thatthe health ministers don't push
through these warnings on thebottles.
So then, you know, you've got tounderstand who's making this
decision, like these decisionsaren't being made in the best
interest of the public.
Uh, because as soon as thatwarning goes on, the profits are
only gonna go one way in thesealcohol companies as, as they
did in tobacco companies.
(20:47):
you know, you know, the, the,uh, the drinking base is
reducing year on year.
I saw wine was down 3%, uh, on 20 2 0 2 to 2 0 3, which I
thought was quite interesting.
We know that the youngerconsumers aren't just, aren't
consuming alcohol in the sameway.
Uh, as soon as these warning.
Labels hit the bottles.
Then it's obviously going tomassively impact, impact their
(21:08):
business.
Interestingly in Europe, theonly country that managed to
push it through Ireland andIreland were also the um, the
innovator with smoking as well.
They were the first ones to putthe warnings on the packs and
also to, to ban smoking in pubs.
So yeah, they're going to bewarnings on the bottles in
Ireland coming in the nextcouple of years.
(21:28):
And everyone in Europe will besat on their hands just to see
how that goes.
Basically.
But in the meantime, you know.
Lots of governments will betaking the money offered by
various large alcohol companiesin order to, you know, I guess
they'll call it fund petprojects of ministers or, you
know, an investment in thehealth department.
Whatever way you want todescribe it, you know, I'll be
(21:51):
careful the terms I use, butit's corporate lobbying, which
is to effectively suppress thetruth of the impact of the
product.
Justine Clark (22:00):
Yes, that makes perfect sense.
And if a consumer wants to sortof, or one of our potential
clients wants to find, find thereal stats and the real facts,
if you've got source informationor a place where people can go
and have a look at that forthemselves, that you can give to
us.
Adam Murphy (22:19):
Uh, yeah, I've, I've got, I've got, um, some,
yeah, a sort of facts pack thatI use.
I mean, yeah, you, you, it'salways good to use the WHO,
World Health Organization.
They're the, they're the sort ofthe best ones to sort of refer
to with regards to, to health, Ithink.
Um, and in the same way that,you know, we, we ride, ride
(22:41):
roughshod over some of thepositive claims that are made
by, by alcohol companies, youknow, there's also, you know,
lots of.
people who, you know, areagainst alcohol, who, who, you
know, some of them do havedubious stats as well.
So yeah, World Health.
organization is, uh, is alwaysthe go to, I think, with any of
this.
Justine Clark (22:59):
Good.
And also, Given that you'vestated clearly that big business
is involved, government isinvolved, and I love the fact
that you called it autoenrollment.
So society auto enrolls us intodrinking.
where do you see us making themost significant headway and
change helping to affect, youknow, the, the turning of the
(23:19):
tide?
Adam Murphy (23:21):
Uh, very good question.
Uh, I think, I, I think that,that comes, and it, it, it is a
movement, you know, and I think,I think it comes from an
individual basis, you know.
It happens with, you know, byyou not drinking, you're, you're
having a significant impact onfour other people around you.
You know, and, and actions asalways speak louder than words,
(23:43):
uh, in, in the same way that,you know, we were swept up with,
you know, maybe our parentsdrinking or friends drinking,
you know, the same thing happensthe other way, you know, and
it's, uh, you know, I'm not onethat's going to be going and
banging drum down to, uh, downin the street or anything like
that because it's a superfluousaction, you know, but what I
will be doing is through myimmediate action.
(24:05):
actions, I will be seen as a, Iwill be recognized as being that
person in and amongst my, myfamily and friends.
And for me, that is veryimportant.
And I have no doubt.
Although they probably wouldn'tsay, within 10 years that will
be recognised as a reason whythey've stopped drinking.
Justine Clark (24:23):
Love it.
Barry Condon (24:24):
really good.
Yeah, I think, I think you'reright.
I think, yeah, the more we cannormalize it, the more we can
make it.
It's something that people cantalk about and, and just see.
Through us, you know, that we'reactually, you know, we feel
better off.
We look better.
We're happier and more energeticand, and yeah, all the benefits
that people can, can just see.
so hear a little bit about, uh,about who you're helping, how
(24:48):
you're helping them and, andwhat on earth is integrated
psychotherapy.
That's
Adam Murphy (24:54):
my target audience that I work with, so, um, I work
within a, um, another programmeas well, a, chap called Will
Armstrong, um, and also JamesMalone, called the Teetotal
Trail.
Uh, and, uh, You know, my targetaudience is very much people who
have been drinking for over 20years and alcohol is no longer
serving them.
So there's, you know, I'm awarethat's quite a large sort of
(25:14):
definition.
Um, it's very important topeople that I work with that
they've gone through at least acouple of years of of sober
curiosity, you know, does itsuit them taking short breaks,
things like that.
And the reason for that is justto, just to ensure maximum
effect, um, with the people thatI'm working with, within the T
Total trail.
Uh, we also work with a lot ofpeople who have substance abuse
(25:37):
as well.
Cocaine is, is rife in not onlyour country, but across the
Western world.
Um, it's, uh, it's a very taboosubject.
Lots of people always like totalk about how its usage is
increasing, but they don't knowanyone who does it.
And it certainly doesn't happenin their company.
Um, however, that is, that isobviously not the case.
And, uh, you know, we work witha very, very wide range of
(25:57):
people, everyone who workswithin a particular sector
thinks their sector must be theworst, but, you know, as we
found out now that all sectorsare.
So it's in all sectors and it'sacross society and, you know,
the, uh, you know, lots of theusage, lots of cocaine usage is
to extend drinking.
capacity and drink in time.
Uh, you know, not, there's notmany people that I work with who
(26:20):
are, who are, who are solely,solely there for, for cocaine
usage.
So, you know, alcohol really isthe gateway drug to all of this,
which is, which just makes thefact that, you know, we sell it
in big crates at the front ofthe supermarket before you even
get to the fruit and veg, andyou can buy it in petrol
stations now.
The fact that it's the gatewaydrug to many bad decisions is
just ludicrous.
Um, but you know, it's, it'scommercial success is, is
(26:42):
obviously very important for thecountry.
So that's why it's pushed theway the way it is, but so so
yeah, I generally work withpeople in their thirties,
forties, fifties, looking toremove alcohol from their lives
and, um, yeah, it has uh, yeah,it has really good traction.
I work in three and six monthprograms and, uh, it's, it's
(27:02):
essentially.
about walking through keymilestones with regards to
undressing the glamour ofadvertising to start making sure
you, you, you understand, um,where it sits in, in society and
therefore your life.
I do a lot of work from apsychological perspective, um,
because self identity iscritical within this process
because many of us have grown upwith alcohol.
(27:23):
So, you know, if I think aboutmy own self identity, um, my own
self identity had a lot ofalcohol in it, as I mentioned,
you know, and it's almostembarrassing to admit it was a,
it was a large part of mypersonality, which, which I'm
highly embarrassed to say now.
Um, but we need to move throughthat self identity of the
individual.
So I do a lot of psychologicalwork and then it's into
repetitions and implementationsof the skillsets learned.
(27:45):
Um, yeah, so that's how the,that's how the program works.
Justine Clark (27:48):
That's brilliant.
so just, as a practical session,what would a client have if
they, with you, if they come tosee you, what would happen?
Adam Murphy (27:58):
Uh, it's it's not, it's not a short session.
So, um, I, I, I work on, as atop line, we work on identifying
what are any unhealthy, negativebeliefs that are underpinning
any behavior.
Um, that can take, that can takea while to come through.
Um, and from that, you're ableto then, you know, devise a sort
(28:22):
of personalized program to helpthem understand why.
why they drink or use the waythey do And and then move beyond
that.
And lots of that is underpinnedby, you know, really good
practice in exercise, nutrition,um, sleeping.
Meditation is a large part ofwhat I do.
Hypnotherapy is a large part ofwhat I do.
Hypnotherapy, for those whodon't know, is kind of like a
clinical meditation.
(28:43):
Um, meditation is, meditationis, a really big part of what I
do.
Um, and lots of people, youknow, as you can imagine the
type of people that, presentwith challenges with alcohol or
substances.
Lots of people like to say, I'vegot ADHD or, you know, my mind
goes a million miles an hour.
Um, which is, which is obviouslytrue, you know, and it's
(29:05):
recognizing that any sort ofdesires that arise in agitation
are aligned with the ego.
yet, you know, the desires thatarise in stillness are those
which are more aligned to whatyou, your soul really, what sits
in your subconscious.
And that's why meditation is soimportant because it provides
that stillness.
And lots of the answers comeout, um, when we, when we align
(29:26):
ourselves with what is in oursubconscious.
So that is why meditationhypnotherapy is a, is a key part
of moving along or changing thatself identity, which is really
important in making an alcoholfree lifestyle stick.
Barry Condon (29:39):
really interesting.
I mean, I know that, that, thatwe focus a lot on the
subconscious as well.
And that, that kind of, the, thecognitive dissonance that exists
between our sort of executive,higher brain, that understands,
you know, that.
That things aren't serving youanymore and that we're making
bad decisions and yet that thesubconscious keeps telling us,
(30:00):
Oh, go on, you know, you'll feelbetter if you do.
And, and, and, and that, youknow, just sort of trying to
understand and listen and stopthe, stop the struggle.
is definitely, and I can, I canimagine, you know, that, that,
that meditation and hypnosiscan, could certainly, people to,
to access.
a pathway through all that.
why don't we, ask the, the, thequestion that we ask all our
(30:23):
guests, to wrap this up.
what are the three, key words toyou that, that sort of summarize
how you and why you found, uh,alcohol
Adam Murphy (30:33):
Uh, so it, Yeah, you shared that this before.
So I did, I did make a littlenote.
So the first one was courage,um, which is really important, I
think, uh, because, you know,lots of us are wrapped in very
egoic behavior to start with.
And, you know, before, beforestopping, we've usually tried to
do a number of things within theworld of moderation before we
(30:54):
stop trying to control it incertain ways.
So, you know, having thatcourage to really make the
decision of, you know, I'm notmoderating.
It's no longer serving me.
I've got to do something aboutit.
And that, that first step is, ishuge, you know, and you're in
you're in a sort of bit of awhirlwind for the first couple
of weeks when you, when you tryand get to come to terms with
the size of the decision thatyou've made.
Um, as well as it being a veryexciting period, it's like
(31:15):
you're obviously stepping intothe unknown, which is um, which
is a bit wild.
So yeah, courage is the firstone.
Presence is the next one.
So just being So much morepresent in every area of my
life, um, you know, my myrelationships, my work, um,
again, I just, you know, wewould have our past as our
reference point, but yeah, Ijust recognize how, how, you
(31:37):
know, my egoic behavior justmeant that I wasn't present.
for a large part of it, albeitin the room, not there mentally.
Um, and longevity, longevity isa, is a really important part of
this.
You know, again, it's a bit of abit of a sort of overused
phrase, you know, not just yearsto your life, but life to years,
you know, I'm, I'm 46 now.
(31:57):
And if I just think of the, thenatural arc of life, I was stuck
doing a job, which I reallydetested.
In an industry, which I reallydetested and my arc, I kind of
just played out what my futurelooked like.
I'm very lucky to be marriedwith two daughters and I just
sort of played out the arc of mylife and you know, I'll carry on
doing something which I reallyhate and then eventually I'll
stop doing it and you know,alcohol was going to accompany
(32:19):
me, accompany me all the waythere and I kind of just
accepted that, but getting ridof that now.
Like so many things have changedin my life and I'm just, I'm,
I'm very, very grateful for it.
You know, so, so longevity, youknow, we, we know it has a
massive health impact.
I mean, you know, that can stopjust for two or three weeks,
but, you know, get, getting asfar in as as, as, I am, you guys
(32:41):
you know, I know you guys muchfurther, um, you can just see
the impact that it has onlongevity.
Justine Clark (32:47):
That's brilliant.
So how could people find you tohelp on their journey?
Adam Murphy (32:54):
Uh, so my, I, I do a lot of um, a lot of my DMs and
through Instagram.
present life is my handle.
So present P R E Z E N T life.
Uh, you'll be able to see lotsof my content up there.
So DM, DM me through there andwe can, we can jump on it.
Justine Clark (33:08):
Amazing.
Barry Condon (33:08):
Adam, thanks a lot.
It's been a real pleasure.
Adam Murphy (33:12):
Thank you for your time.
Thanks for having me on.
Justine Clark (33:13):
much for joining us.
This is Alcohol Freedom Finders.
After a career in advertisingfor big alcohol, our guest, Adam
Murphy, blows the whistle on hisformer employers, comparing
their methods for selling aknown cancer causing agent to
those of big tobacco.
He describes how governments arepowerless because they're also
invested in the success of ouralcohol companies.
(00:22):
We sell a product they knowkills consumers and we, the
consumers are auto enrolled intoa drinking culture that often
feels inescapable.
We'll also hear how Adam escapedhis work with big alcohol and
found alcohol freedom forhimself.
But before that, Justine and Icatch up on what's been going on
in our lives.
My alcohol flashback at anetwork event and Justine's
(00:45):
coaching skills making her anexpert guest on another podcast.
Let's dive in.
Barry Condon (00:53):
to see you.
How you doing?
Justine Clark (00:58):
I'm really well today.
I'm great.
Barry Condon (01:01):
Excellent.
Excellent.
Justine Clark (01:02):
Having already done one podcast for the day.
Barry Condon (01:06):
huh.
Justine Clark (01:07):
How are you?
Barry Condon (01:09):
I'm good.
I'm good.
Yeah, I had a, sort of funnyexperience this week.
I went to a thing, and gotsuddenly sort of a bit of a
flashback to how things used tobe.
And how I used to, uh, the needto drink in order to, to get
through those kind of occasions.
(01:32):
and it made me see things in avery different way.
Now you sort of realize,watching other people, how they,
also use alcohol to get throughthat it, yeah, it kind of works
against you in a way because,you know, after a while, your
initial anxiety and, that you,that we all feel as we, meet new
(01:53):
people and, and, and, want tomake a good impression, that,
that calms down.
And you become to be moreauthentic and be yourself and
relax into
Justine Clark (02:06):
exactly.
Barry Condon (02:07):
when you're, when I was drinking in the past, you
know, actually sort of tellingyourself, you're not able to do
that.
And, you're kind of, trying tolet yourself not care about,
your anxiety rather than, thandeal with it.
interesting.
Yeah,
Justine Clark (02:25):
it's kind of what we were talking about the other
day, is realising that leaninginto yourself is a great reward,
being able to overcome thediscomfort, and then realise
that you can do it, and you cando it better.
Today I just did a, I didanother podcast, which is
amazing, for a functionalmedicine practitioner who
(02:46):
brought me on board as a, as awellbeing coach.
So I was speaking to how withoutalcohol, in my life, regulating
my nervous system is so mucheasier.
That jangled feeling that weget.
So, not only am I not drinkingalcohol at the event that you're
talking about, I don't have thatjangled feeling that I, sort of,
(03:08):
we could call it anxiety, wecould call it nerves, that, that
up and down feeling all thetime.
So, what I was speaking to youabout is how, having a coach
really helps to work out thethings that we need as
individuals to calm our nervoussystem.
And whether that's, you know,hands on therapy or meditation
(03:29):
or talking therapy, and it wasexciting to be the expert.
I was like, oh my lord, oh mylord, I'm, I'm now, you know.
Alcohol, being free from alcoholhas led me to realize that I am
an expert, and I do know mystuff, and people want to hear
what I have to say,
Barry Condon (03:47):
for
Justine Clark (03:47):
and that's, yeah, that's revelation.
Barry Condon (03:51):
Okay.
Welcome everybody, to AlcoholFreedom Finders, with me, Barry
Condon and my amazing colleague,Justine Clark.
Today, we're really excitedbecause we have, Adam Murphy
with us and Adam is a formeradvertising exec and now an
integrated psychotherapist andalso a coach in the Alcohol Free
(04:16):
so Adam, welcome.
Adam Murphy (04:18):
Thank you.
Barry Condon (04:18):
nice to
Justine Clark (04:19):
Yeah, welcome.
Adam Murphy (04:20):
Yeah.
Thank you.
Thank you.
very much for having me.
Justine Clark (04:22):
I'm really curious, about how you've
managed to get to this part ofyour career that you are now
doing this.
So, what led you to working inthe alcohol free space and
working, in the way that you do?
Adam Murphy (04:35):
Uh, well, yeah, it sort of goes, it goes quite a
long way back really, but Iguess the, the, the, the, The
sort of rather than starting atthe beginning, sort of at the
end, um, I left, uh, I left myadvertising career at the
beginning of 2023 and towardsthe very end of it, one of my
main clients was, uh, a largealcohol company on the footsie.
(04:56):
Um, Diageo, and within my rolethere, I was actually working on
the launch of Guinness Zero.
So, I was party to lots of, lotsof data and information in and
around the alcohol free space.
Um, so that was uh, that waskind of one of the, one of the,
final elements pushed me into,uh, not only recognizing the
size of the market and theopportunity.
(05:18):
Uh, but also being exposed tosome of the data as well as the
motivation to some of thesecompanies.
So yeah, that was one of the,you know, we'll probably go
back, but, um, but yeah, thatwas one of the multitude of
different factors that ended uppushing me into this Um, and,
uh, yeah, I'm just delighted,delighted.
I am really, I've, I've, I'vespent a life in advertising,
(05:40):
which is essentially creatingfalse needs that need to be
fulfilled by insert companiesproduct, um, which.
which.
was fine in terms of my sort ofaspirations and what I wanted to
do as a, as a young man, but itwas, uh, increasingly counter to
the, the way that I saw myselfand how it sat with my own
values as I got older.
So yeah, it was an industry thatwas really, odds with what my
(06:06):
beliefs and, uh, yeah, and thenI was working in alcohol,
tobacco, oil, and farmer at theend.
So yeah, sort of, uh, you know,for the, for the kind of worst
sectors, really.
So yeah, pushed me intoexploring something different.
Now I'm into alcohol free,which, which means not only, um,
helping, helping people on theirown alcohol free journeys, but
also, you know, large part of itis, is education as well as
(06:28):
education as to You know why whythis product is out there as it
is why it's communicated the wayit is You know i've got lots of
sort of Kind of I hate the termbut poacher turned game keeper
kind of insight Which is reallyuseful for
Barry Condon (06:40):
That's a, that's amazing.
two questions really.
I mean, I I'd be excited tounderstand more about, the data
and the information and the sortof insider, sort of
communications, how to, how, howthe, alcohol companies look to,
alcohol free products now and,and, the way that they, approach
(07:00):
marketing in general, that wouldbe interesting, but also, but
firstly, you know, how long haveyou been, alcohol free and, and,
and how was that transition foryou?
How did you find alcohol
Adam Murphy (07:09):
Uh, so I have i'm up to 16 months now Um, so yeah
last summer I I stopped and itwas a con I'm sure you know,
there's there's kind of no onestory.
Is there lots of people gettheir different ways, isn't it?
and Uh, you know, I I got Youknow, from a health perspective,
I got gout for the first time,which, you know, isn't
(07:31):
particularly, it wasn'tparticularly sexy the way I got
it.
If you're looking to take backcontrol of your drinking, why
don't you join our AlcoholFreedom Finders 30 day group
program.
It's a great place to start.
Because we approach it as anexperiment, rather than a
challenge.
Whereas, as well as getting agreat detox, you learn the
science and the psychology aboutwhy you're drunk in the first
(07:51):
place.
So whether you want to stopaltogether, or just become a
more mindful and moderatedrinker, why don't you give it a
crack?
Use the link in the show notesto sign up to our next 30 day
program, and you won't regretit.
Because no one ever woke up inthe morning and said, I wish I'd
had more to drink last night,did they?
(08:12):
Back to the episode.
You know, my drink of choice used to be real ale,
which is very yeast heavy,which, you know, is what drives
a lot of that.
So my first gout flare up sortof triggered that actually
something might not be righthere.
Um, you know, within myindustry, I've mentioned before,
you know, I was, I was doinglots of client entertaining, um,
very social person, play a lotof sport, you know, captain, run
(08:35):
sports clubs, whatever.
So, you know, I'd, I'deffectively built a, built a
lifestyle around, around alcoholfor a very long time.
Um, and yeah, it got to thepoint where I was.
I had to recognize it was nolonger serving me, ultimately,
you know, and, you know, peopletalk about a rock bottom story
and, you know, my mind doesn'treally have that.
(08:58):
Um, but, you know, there wascertainly a period when, you
know, my wife was away, I waslooking after my children and,
you know, essentially not reallyfulfilling some pretty basic
duties, I guess, but, you know,it's just, it was an
accumulative effect over, overthe years, you know, I'd, I'd
been getting sober curious isobviously a phrase that we use a
lot.
I've been sober curious for sixyears before I stopped.
(09:21):
So that started with, you know,a friend of mine, um, I went on
a holiday with him and, youknow, we start counting,
counting the units.
So this is basic as that really.
So, so from that moment, I nowrecognize that as soon as you
start doing things like that,you know, the, you know, the
pennies kind of beginning todrop, isn't it, and it's just
how long you can move.
(09:41):
the people you're working withinto that, that element of
recognizing that you may want tochange into actually changing,
reducing that time period is,is, is critical.
I think, you know, it took mesix years.
Um, some people depending onwhere they fall off, get there
much quicker, but I think that'sa, that's a key part of it.
So, um, yeah, so, So, 16, 16months.
(10:01):
um, but yeah, within that, therewas periods of sobriety within
those six years, uh, areas whereI thought, Oh, I've cracked it.
Okay.
You know, I don't need itanymore because ultimately I
hadn't done the work really.
I was just, you know, whiteknuckle in it, uh, which is
another commonly used phrase.
Um, I hadn't actually made anyof the changes in my life, and I
hadn't actually changed therelationship with alcohol,
(10:21):
which, which is what you have todo in order for it to have a,
have a sort of lasting effect.
Justine Clark (10:28):
That's awesome.
I mean, that's what we talkabout all the time.
The difference that thewillpower is actually a muscle.
So, you know, it's like hangingon to the edge of the cliff.
You can
Adam Murphy (10:36):
Yeah,
Justine Clark (10:36):
for a time may not very long, but, you know,
over time that that musclefatigues and
Adam Murphy (10:41):
yeah, absolutely.
Justine Clark (10:42):
bringing the beliefs up underneath that
actually creates thattransformation.
you know, that lasting changedoesn't happen.
One thing that you just said tome really stood out.
And you said to me that alcoholno longer served you.
what you know, in terms ofmarketing in the industry and
knowing what we know thatsociety is actually telling us
(11:02):
that alcohol serves us.
My question to you is, alcoholever serve you
Adam Murphy (11:10):
Uh, yes, I think it did.
You know.
And we've got to be very carefulof, you know, wanting to erase
our, our, our past.
Um, yeah, I had many, many greattimes with alcohol in my teenage
years and early twenties, Ithink.
And it gave me many greatmemories, which I'm, I'm glad I
had, you know, yes, I probablytook it to excess during those
(11:32):
times, but yeah, I think it didit did serve as a, um, as a as a
way of, you know, driving anexperience and.
shared experience at the time.
So yeah, I certainly don'tregret that those moments, but I
think it is also important tosay that I can kind of pinpoint
the area where it did begin tostop serving me and how long it
(11:56):
took for me to actually act onthat.
Um, you know, I recognize nowthat I think I had a, I had a go
or.
You know, it must have been,again, my lifestyle was, you
know, I would be doing lots ofclient entertaining.
So it'd be days after days afterdays.
I was in my early thirties, sosort of 15 years ago, I sort of
had a, had a good sort of, sortof crack at doing it for a
(12:19):
couple of weeks and recognizingit wasn't serving me, but
ultimately, you know, the egowas too big for it to stick.
Um, and you know, and now I'm onthe other side of it,
recognizing the, the egoicbehavior is a key part of, um,
moving into a lifestyle that issustainable without alcohol.
So, so yes, I do believe, I dobelieve it was serving me at the
beginning, but certainly, youknow, certainly not towards the
(12:41):
end and certainly not for manyyears towards the end.
And, you know, I think that'sfor people who are considering
giving up.
I think it's trying to helppeople recognize when that point
is.
Justine Clark (12:50):
Yeah.
Barry Condon (12:51):
Yeah, I think you're right.
I mean, there is, there is,there's diminishing returns.
and I don't know whether that'sage or, or, or just we become,
more and more immune to, Thesort of, euphoric effects that,
that it, that it has in theearly days.
I certainly see it in, in myselflooking back and I see it in
(13:13):
friends still that drink a lot,that they just seem to get less
and less out of it.
And it, it's,, you know, it'svery difficult to watch.
Sometimes the people that seemto drink an awful lot, don't
seem to change a great deal.
but they seem to need it.
And, and he just, Oh, it wouldbe so nice if you could
understand that, that it'sholding you back and you'll feel
(13:33):
so much better if, if, if youjust let it go.
you know, everybody has to findtheir own path and everybody,
you know, needs to do it intheir own way and, and in their
own, at their own pace.
but yeah, so tell us, tell us,tell us some gory details about,
about, advertising and how the,the, the those, dodgy people,
at, Diageo, uh, uh, try andtrick us
Adam Murphy (13:53):
Well, it's obviously the fault of the
consumer, isn't it?
You should be drinkingresponsibly.
Barry Condon (13:58):
Oh, of course.
Adam Murphy (13:59):
Um, yeah, I mean, it's a, it's a very, uh, it's a
very tricky space, isn't it?
You know, it's, you know,they're, they're obviously aware
that what they're selling is, isa poisonous substance to public
health, um, and doing everythingthey can to not recognize that
in the public.
space is essential really, whichis why you're pushing the owners
(14:21):
onto the consumer, um, which iswhy you never see anybody
suffering from the effects ofconsuming their products.
Um, and you know, it's, uh, it'sthe, the, the, the relationship
with alcohol, and society is uh,is a is a very complex one.
Uh, and you know, I think it'svery important to understand not
(14:41):
only the, the, uh, the, the.
large companies promotingalcohol, but also where, where
these large companies sit.
within, you know, public policywithin, our own government, not
just our government, othergovernments around the world.
Um, you know, these, these is a,it's a sizable, um, sizable
company on the footsie.
(15:02):
Uh, it would make up, uh, asignificant, you know, a
significant proportion of itsshares would be held by, um,
pension companies, which meansthat, you know, the government
is.
is invested in the success ofthese alcohol companies.
So, you know, that, that's justa sort of very crude top line.
(15:22):
Sort of, sort of, um, look intoexactly how intertwined some of
these some of these things are,um, and for that reason, you've
just got to be, as a consumer,you need to be highly, you need
to be highly, um, aware of themotivations of any company, you
know, um, especially ones thatare in this sort of space, you
(15:44):
know, they're, they're, they're,their only motivation is to, you
know, They'll call it delivervalue to shareholders, which
ultimately means to drive profitand they'll do it by any means
possible.
Uh, you know, we is alcohol isa, is a regulated market in
terms of, how it's produced and,who it's sold to.
Uh, but I think, you know,pretty much everyone who's
(16:06):
listened to this was probablydrinking or had experienced
drinking below the age of 18.
And.
There's all manner of methodsand techniques used to make the,
make the product moreattractive, you know, so, you
know, I've, I've obviously beeninvolved in lots of, you know,
when you're producing casting,you know, you don't obviously
cast ugly people, you don't castpeople who aren't having a good
(16:27):
time, you don't cast people whoare sat in, um, sat in their
pants watching the same fishingvideo for the fourth time on, a,
on, on a night.
You know, um, and it's, it's uh,it's, you know, it's seen as a
highly aspirational lifestyleand that's what people buy into.
And it's, in terms of themarketing, marketing dollars
that are spent, you know, youknow, we just think of the TV
(16:47):
ads, the, the, uh, outdoor andmaybe bits that we've seen in
newspapers, but it goes, it goesmuch deeper than that.
You know, the, how the, how thelie is pushed into all areas of
culture.
And, and now, you know, workingin the sector that I do.
You just see it on, in all sortsof like the movies and whatever,
(17:08):
you know, my, my, I've got adaughter who's, who's 10, who we
let, we let her watch 12s, youknow, so I guess we shouldn't do
that, but we let her watch 12s,but even, even at that sort of,
um, rating.
The amount of times there'sreference to doing shots, people
in parties, you know, andalcohol being seen as the elixir
to life and good times.
And it's, uh, it makes itreally, really tricky when
(17:31):
you've, Like ourselves, whenwe've been born into countries
in a culture where we've ineffect been auto enrolled into a
culture of drinking to, to thenstart to look beyond that is
very, very complex, especiallywhen you've got all of these
cultural cues throughadvertising, just being thrown
at you constantly.
Um, it's, uh, you know, you're,you're seen as odd if you don't,
(17:53):
if you don't partake, you know,and I think that's one of the,
that's one of the big things.
Yeah.
in and around the, uh, theclients I work with is just sort
of recognizing that, you know,you are leaving the tribe to a
certain degree.
And, you know, that, that isabsolutely to be applauded
because the easiest thing isjust to stay in it.
And in fact, I'm sure lots ofpeople, lots of the people you
(18:14):
work with have stayed in it forfar too long for fear of
rejection of the tribe.
And this is, uh, this is just aself fulfilling prophecy, which
is spun out by the, by theadvertising companies to keep
you involved.
So, you know, It's uh, It's areally complicated business.
They're selling the product thatthey know kills consumers.
You know, I'm assuming you usethese stats as well.
(18:34):
You know, it's class onecarcinogen, which puts it
alongside asbestos, radiation,and tobacco.
That means it's, uh, it's knownto induce cancer.
It has cancer causing propertiesconfirmed, you know, and what
we're doing is we're sellingversions of it, albeit diluted
quantities to, to a Which isjust completely ludicrous, you
(18:57):
know, completely ludicrous.
And, you know, I think we can,we can all recognize that the
world is going to be a verydifferent place in 50 years time
and, um, it's, you know, we arewhere we are at the moment, but
it's important that we educateourself in, in, in, and around
that.
And, and just whilst talkingabout some of the, the comms
techniques that advertisingcompanies use it, you know, one
(19:18):
of the, in the same way,there's, there's parallels with,
unfortunately I also worked intobacco.
And there are parallels in termsof the tobacco industry as well.
So, you know, tobacco if youthink of tobacco use through the
50s, 60s, 70s.
Um, you know, it was actually,it was sold as a way of, um,
soothing throats in the, in thefifties.
Um, and, you know, obviously,known, known, uh, health issues,
(19:41):
and they pushed, pushed healthwarnings onto cigarette packs,
which, which we got.
We then got the no smoking inpubs.
And.
Quite clearly, there's a push todo that within alcohol as well.
So I was, you know, I wasworking alongside, uh, the
department in the business whowere charged with, um, lobbying,
uh, European governments aroundpackaging and, and that means to
(20:04):
keep off the warning signs onthe bottles, you know, alcohol
kills you.
You know, there's all manner ofstats you can put up there, you
know, in 20 years time, they'llprobably have a picture of a
bloated liver on there orsomething anyway.
Um, There is a requirement to,or the lobbying that happens
within, you know, and it's notjust the company that I was
working for, it's every largealcohol company, all lobbying
(20:26):
the governments to ensure thatthe health ministers don't push
through these warnings on thebottles.
So then, you know, you've got tounderstand who's making this
decision, like these decisionsaren't being made in the best
interest of the public.
Uh, because as soon as thatwarning goes on, the profits are
only gonna go one way in thesealcohol companies as, as they
did in tobacco companies.
(20:47):
you know, you know, the, the,uh, the drinking base is
reducing year on year.
I saw wine was down 3%, uh, on 20 2 0 2 to 2 0 3, which I
thought was quite interesting.
We know that the youngerconsumers aren't just, aren't
consuming alcohol in the sameway.
Uh, as soon as these warning.
Labels hit the bottles.
Then it's obviously going tomassively impact, impact their
(21:08):
business.
Interestingly in Europe, theonly country that managed to
push it through Ireland andIreland were also the um, the
innovator with smoking as well.
They were the first ones to putthe warnings on the packs and
also to, to ban smoking in pubs.
So yeah, they're going to bewarnings on the bottles in
Ireland coming in the nextcouple of years.
(21:28):
And everyone in Europe will besat on their hands just to see
how that goes.
Basically.
But in the meantime, you know.
Lots of governments will betaking the money offered by
various large alcohol companiesin order to, you know, I guess
they'll call it fund petprojects of ministers or, you
know, an investment in thehealth department.
Whatever way you want todescribe it, you know, I'll be
(21:51):
careful the terms I use, butit's corporate lobbying, which
is to effectively suppress thetruth of the impact of the
product.
Justine Clark (22:00):
Yes, that makes perfect sense.
And if a consumer wants to sortof, or one of our potential
clients wants to find, find thereal stats and the real facts,
if you've got source informationor a place where people can go
and have a look at that forthemselves, that you can give to
us.
Adam Murphy (22:19):
Uh, yeah, I've, I've got, I've got, um, some,
yeah, a sort of facts pack thatI use.
I mean, yeah, you, you, it'salways good to use the WHO,
World Health Organization.
They're the, they're the sort ofthe best ones to sort of refer
to with regards to, to health, Ithink.
Um, and in the same way that,you know, we, we ride, ride
(22:41):
roughshod over some of thepositive claims that are made
by, by alcohol companies, youknow, there's also, you know,
lots of.
people who, you know, areagainst alcohol, who, who, you
know, some of them do havedubious stats as well.
So yeah, World Health.
organization is, uh, is alwaysthe go to, I think, with any of
this.
Justine Clark (22:59):
Good.
And also, Given that you'vestated clearly that big business
is involved, government isinvolved, and I love the fact
that you called it autoenrollment.
So society auto enrolls us intodrinking.
where do you see us making themost significant headway and
change helping to affect, youknow, the, the turning of the
(23:19):
tide?
Adam Murphy (23:21):
Uh, very good question.
Uh, I think, I, I think that,that comes, and it, it, it is a
movement, you know, and I think,I think it comes from an
individual basis, you know.
It happens with, you know, byyou not drinking, you're, you're
having a significant impact onfour other people around you.
You know, and, and actions asalways speak louder than words,
(23:43):
uh, in, in the same way that,you know, we were swept up with,
you know, maybe our parentsdrinking or friends drinking,
you know, the same thing happensthe other way, you know, and
it's, uh, you know, I'm not onethat's going to be going and
banging drum down to, uh, downin the street or anything like
that because it's a superfluousaction, you know, but what I
will be doing is through myimmediate action.
(24:05):
actions, I will be seen as a, Iwill be recognized as being that
person in and amongst my, myfamily and friends.
And for me, that is veryimportant.
And I have no doubt.
Although they probably wouldn'tsay, within 10 years that will
be recognised as a reason whythey've stopped drinking.
Justine Clark (24:23):
Love it.
Barry Condon (24:24):
really good.
Yeah, I think, I think you'reright.
I think, yeah, the more we cannormalize it, the more we can
make it.
It's something that people cantalk about and, and just see.
Through us, you know, that we'reactually, you know, we feel
better off.
We look better.
We're happier and more energeticand, and yeah, all the benefits
that people can, can just see.
so hear a little bit about, uh,about who you're helping, how
(24:48):
you're helping them and, andwhat on earth is integrated
psychotherapy.
That's
Adam Murphy (24:54):
my target audience that I work with, so, um, I work
within a, um, another programmeas well, a, chap called Will
Armstrong, um, and also JamesMalone, called the Teetotal
Trail.
Uh, and, uh, You know, my targetaudience is very much people who
have been drinking for over 20years and alcohol is no longer
serving them.
So there's, you know, I'm awarethat's quite a large sort of
(25:14):
definition.
Um, it's very important topeople that I work with that
they've gone through at least acouple of years of of sober
curiosity, you know, does itsuit them taking short breaks,
things like that.
And the reason for that is justto, just to ensure maximum
effect, um, with the people thatI'm working with, within the T
Total trail.
Uh, we also work with a lot ofpeople who have substance abuse
(25:37):
as well.
Cocaine is, is rife in not onlyour country, but across the
Western world.
Um, it's, uh, it's a very taboosubject.
Lots of people always like totalk about how its usage is
increasing, but they don't knowanyone who does it.
And it certainly doesn't happenin their company.
Um, however, that is, that isobviously not the case.
And, uh, you know, we work witha very, very wide range of
(25:57):
people, everyone who workswithin a particular sector
thinks their sector must be theworst, but, you know, as we
found out now that all sectorsare.
So it's in all sectors and it'sacross society and, you know,
the, uh, you know, lots of theusage, lots of cocaine usage is
to extend drinking.
capacity and drink in time.
Uh, you know, not, there's notmany people that I work with who
(26:20):
are, who are, who are solely,solely there for, for cocaine
usage.
So, you know, alcohol really isthe gateway drug to all of this,
which is, which just makes thefact that, you know, we sell it
in big crates at the front ofthe supermarket before you even
get to the fruit and veg, andyou can buy it in petrol
stations now.
The fact that it's the gatewaydrug to many bad decisions is
just ludicrous.
Um, but you know, it's, it'scommercial success is, is
(26:42):
obviously very important for thecountry.
So that's why it's pushed theway the way it is, but so so
yeah, I generally work withpeople in their thirties,
forties, fifties, looking toremove alcohol from their lives
and, um, yeah, it has uh, yeah,it has really good traction.
I work in three and six monthprograms and, uh, it's, it's
(27:02):
essentially.
about walking through keymilestones with regards to
undressing the glamour ofadvertising to start making sure
you, you, you understand, um,where it sits in, in society and
therefore your life.
I do a lot of work from apsychological perspective, um,
because self identity iscritical within this process
because many of us have grown upwith alcohol.
(27:23):
So, you know, if I think aboutmy own self identity, um, my own
self identity had a lot ofalcohol in it, as I mentioned,
you know, and it's almostembarrassing to admit it was a,
it was a large part of mypersonality, which, which I'm
highly embarrassed to say now.
Um, but we need to move throughthat self identity of the
individual.
So I do a lot of psychologicalwork and then it's into
repetitions and implementationsof the skillsets learned.
(27:45):
Um, yeah, so that's how the,that's how the program works.
Justine Clark (27:48):
That's brilliant.
so just, as a practical session,what would a client have if
they, with you, if they come tosee you, what would happen?
Adam Murphy (27:58):
Uh, it's it's not, it's not a short session.
So, um, I, I, I work on, as atop line, we work on identifying
what are any unhealthy, negativebeliefs that are underpinning
any behavior.
Um, that can take, that can takea while to come through.
Um, and from that, you're ableto then, you know, devise a sort
(28:22):
of personalized program to helpthem understand why.
why they drink or use the waythey do And and then move beyond
that.
And lots of that is underpinnedby, you know, really good
practice in exercise, nutrition,um, sleeping.
Meditation is a large part ofwhat I do.
Hypnotherapy is a large part ofwhat I do.
Hypnotherapy, for those whodon't know, is kind of like a
clinical meditation.
(28:43):
Um, meditation is, meditationis, a really big part of what I
do.
Um, and lots of people, youknow, as you can imagine the
type of people that, presentwith challenges with alcohol or
substances.
Lots of people like to say, I'vegot ADHD or, you know, my mind
goes a million miles an hour.
Um, which is, which is obviouslytrue, you know, and it's
(29:05):
recognizing that any sort ofdesires that arise in agitation
are aligned with the ego.
yet, you know, the desires thatarise in stillness are those
which are more aligned to whatyou, your soul really, what sits
in your subconscious.
And that's why meditation is soimportant because it provides
that stillness.
And lots of the answers comeout, um, when we, when we align
(29:26):
ourselves with what is in oursubconscious.
So that is why meditationhypnotherapy is a, is a key part
of moving along or changing thatself identity, which is really
important in making an alcoholfree lifestyle stick.
Barry Condon (29:39):
really interesting.
I mean, I know that, that, thatwe focus a lot on the
subconscious as well.
And that, that kind of, the, thecognitive dissonance that exists
between our sort of executive,higher brain, that understands,
you know, that.
That things aren't serving youanymore and that we're making
bad decisions and yet that thesubconscious keeps telling us,
(30:00):
Oh, go on, you know, you'll feelbetter if you do.
And, and, and, and that, youknow, just sort of trying to
understand and listen and stopthe, stop the struggle.
is definitely, and I can, I canimagine, you know, that, that,
that meditation and hypnosiscan, could certainly, people to,
to access.
a pathway through all that.
why don't we, ask the, the, thequestion that we ask all our
(30:23):
guests, to wrap this up.
what are the three, key words toyou that, that sort of summarize
how you and why you found, uh,alcohol
Adam Murphy (30:33):
Uh, so it, Yeah, you shared that this before.
So I did, I did make a littlenote.
So the first one was courage,um, which is really important, I
think, uh, because, you know,lots of us are wrapped in very
egoic behavior to start with.
And, you know, before, beforestopping, we've usually tried to
do a number of things within theworld of moderation before we
(30:54):
stop trying to control it incertain ways.
So, you know, having thatcourage to really make the
decision of, you know, I'm notmoderating.
It's no longer serving me.
I've got to do something aboutit.
And that, that first step is, ishuge, you know, and you're in
you're in a sort of bit of awhirlwind for the first couple
of weeks when you, when you tryand get to come to terms with
the size of the decision thatyou've made.
Um, as well as it being a veryexciting period, it's like
(31:15):
you're obviously stepping intothe unknown, which is um, which
is a bit wild.
So yeah, courage is the firstone.
Presence is the next one.
So just being So much morepresent in every area of my
life, um, you know, my myrelationships, my work, um,
again, I just, you know, wewould have our past as our
reference point, but yeah, Ijust recognize how, how, you
(31:37):
know, my egoic behavior justmeant that I wasn't present.
for a large part of it, albeitin the room, not there mentally.
Um, and longevity, longevity isa, is a really important part of
this.
You know, again, it's a bit of abit of a sort of overused
phrase, you know, not just yearsto your life, but life to years,
you know, I'm, I'm 46 now.
(31:57):
And if I just think of the, thenatural arc of life, I was stuck
doing a job, which I reallydetested.
In an industry, which I reallydetested and my arc, I kind of
just played out what my futurelooked like.
I'm very lucky to be marriedwith two daughters and I just
sort of played out the arc of mylife and you know, I'll carry on
doing something which I reallyhate and then eventually I'll
stop doing it and you know,alcohol was going to accompany
(32:19):
me, accompany me all the waythere and I kind of just
accepted that, but getting ridof that now.
Like so many things have changedin my life and I'm just, I'm,
I'm very, very grateful for it.
You know, so, so longevity, youknow, we, we know it has a
massive health impact.
I mean, you know, that can stopjust for two or three weeks,
but, you know, get, getting asfar in as as, as, I am, you guys
(32:41):
you know, I know you guys muchfurther, um, you can just see
the impact that it has onlongevity.
Justine Clark (32:47):
That's brilliant.
So how could people find you tohelp on their journey?
Adam Murphy (32:54):
Uh, so my, I, I do a lot of um, a lot of my DMs and
through Instagram.
present life is my handle.
So present P R E Z E N T life.
Uh, you'll be able to see lotsof my content up there.
So DM, DM me through there andwe can, we can jump on it.
Justine Clark (33:08):
Amazing.
Barry Condon (33:08):
Adam, thanks a lot.
It's been a real pleasure.
Adam Murphy (33:12):
Thank you for your time.
Thanks for having me on.
Justine Clark (33:13):
much for joining us.
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