February 28, 2025 • 27 mins
In this episode we meet Jeannette Levitt whose drinking became a problem in the aftermath of a painful divorce. On reentering the dating world she thought that drinking alcohol was the only way to appear confident, and sexy but when she found alcohol freedom herself, she realised she’d been wrong and as she puts it - there is actually nothing confident or sexy about being sloppy drunk. She’s now a coach who specializes in helping those navigating the same all too common challenges that she faced
Jeannette Levitt
https://www.levitylifecoaching.com/
https://www.instagram.com/levitylifecoaching/
Our 30-day group programme:
https://www.cleanlifecoaching.org/aff-group
The podcast home page
https://podcast.alcoholfreedomfinders.com/
Justine Clark
https://justineclarktherapy.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/wellwithjustine/
Barry Condon
https://www.cleanlifecoaching.org/
https://www.instagram.com/clean.life.coaching/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/barry-condon-577b85294/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
This is Alcohol Freedom Finders.
In this episode, we meetJeanette Levitt, whose drinking
became a problem in theaftermath of a painful divorce.
On re entering the dating world,she thought that drinking was
the only way to appear confidentand sexy.
But when she found AlcoholFreedom herself, she realized
that she'd been wrong.
And as she puts it, there'sactually nothing confident or
(00:20):
sexy about being a sloppy drunk.
She's now a coach whospecializes in helping those
navigating the same all toocommon challenges that she
faced.
Let's meet Jeanette.
Justine Clark (00:32):
Welcome everybody to Alcohol Freedom
Finders podcast with me JustineClark and my fellow coach Barry
Condon.
Today we are super excited towelcome Jeanette Levitt with us.
She was in our coaching cohortis a marvelous human being and
also now specializes in the 3Ds.
(00:54):
So Jeanette, why don't you tellus about those 3Ds?
Jeanette Levitt (00:59):
So the three D's are, drinking, divorce, and
then dating.
So my story surrounds divorceand dating and, and, I mean, my
drinking escalated during those,events, parts of my life.
So, it seems like an appropriateniche for me.
Barry Condon (01:19):
That's brilliant.
why don't you.
Talking of, of, your story, whydon't you take us back to when
you decided, it was somethingyou, you do, you're drinking at
least, was something you neededto change.
Jeanette Levitt (01:33):
Okay.
Okay.
So.
I was somewhat of a latebloomer, I guess, because my
drinking escalated, when my lifetook a turn, that was really
unexpected.
So it was the divorce, that,that started, Drinking, more
heavily.
I really actually, I didn'tdrink very much during my
marriage.
I was raising 4 kids.
(01:54):
So it's pretty much a prettylight drinker.
but then the divorce was asurprise.
and it was just a reallydifficult time.
So that's when I started to, tojust, Turn to alcohol to kind of
help get me through some of it.
and then there was just a seriesof other events.
I mean, stuff happens at midlifeas we all know.
so, I, I lost my dad, mygrandmother, and then I had a
(02:18):
cancer diagnosis.
was all like within a year.
so it was just kind of,everything was kind of hitting.
And yeah, I find myself justturning to alcohol to, to numb,
and escape a lot of it.
Justine Clark (02:34):
Yeah, I mean, I really resonate with that.
I think that it's almost asurprise when you realize, hang
on a minute, I've never been, Iwas never a heavy drinker.
Why is it now that I'm theperson drinking a bottle a day
and looking for more going, thatwasn't enough?
It, it, it comes up, creeps upwhen you're, you start using it
for, you know, other reasonsother than socializing.
(02:57):
When you start using it foryourself, And then all of a
sudden it becomes a prop thatyou don't want to live without.
So I really resonate with thatfrom my own story, Jeanette, and
thanks for sharing that.
Jeanette Levitt (03:07):
yeah.
Justine Clark (03:07):
How did you, how did you overcome that?
Jeanette Levitt (03:12):
Well, it's, I mean, I think for a lot of, I
was, I was pretty much a, amiddle lane drinker, or a grey
area drinker, where I was, Imean I was binge drinking, I
wasn't a daily drinker, but I, Ijust, I knew it was becoming a
real problem.
I knew it was holding me back,but I just kept trying to, you
know, be this drinker, you know,this normal drinker.
(03:34):
And I would like set these rulesin place.
And then, you know, a few weekslater or whatever, I would break
them.
but I just had this naggingsense that I, this wasn't good
for me.
I just didn't, you know, Ididn't know there were options
out there.
I, I, you know, I thought it wasAA or, or nothing and I just
didn't resonate with that.
So, I just, I just kept on, youknow, for years to be a better
(03:59):
moderate drinker.
and then, so it's almost threeyears ago that I, I had a friend
who was going to do a dryJanuary and she said, Oh, why
don't we try, I heard this.
Something called This NakedMind.
They have a live alcoholexperiment.
And we can do that at the sametime as we're doing this Dry
(04:20):
January.
And I said, sure.
and that was it for me.
It was like, so I kind of Camein the side door, like I'd
always had this nagging thingthat I wanted to change my
relationship with alcohol, but Ijust didn't know how to do it.
And I was still had so many tiesto alcohol and so many thoughts
about why I really needed it andwanted it.
(04:44):
But then I did the anti racistlive alcohol experiment, and I
just really latched onto it.
It just made so much sense.
You
Barry Condon (04:53):
That's, that's brilliant.
I mean, I, it's funny how, youknow, the more times you hear
someone's story, the, the moreyou realize that everybody just
thought, oh, but I was the onewith the problem and, and, and I
wasn't normal and I wish I couldbe normal and, and why can't I
drink like other people?
You know, they didn't have a.
They don't have a problem andyeah, and, and, you know, it's
(05:16):
so silly if everyone had, ifwe'd just put our hands up to
each other kind of thing andpeople would admit, that They're
feeling a little bit feelingthat you know, they're losing
losing control And that it's noit's no big deal It's no nothing
to be ashamed of it's just youknow alcohol doing its thing
(05:37):
Yeah, it's that that's that'syeah That's really really
interesting to to hear it fromfrom your point of view and also
that that I can resonate fullywith the the idea that AA
seemed, seemed to me to be theonly thing that was available.
You know, if you had a problem,you go to AA and you admit, you
know, you know, you, you've hitrock bottom and you know, I'm an
(06:00):
alcoholic and, I need help andI'm powerless.
And, you know, and you hear thestory of them, you know, living
day to day and, and nevergetting past it, but, you know,
hanging on.
and you know, for some people,lots of people, you know, that
that has been a success, but forme, it just didn't speak to me.
I just wanted I wanted either tonot be a problem, and be able to
(06:22):
keep on doing it.
or for, you know, if I had tostop, then there had to be
something better than than thanconstantly looking over my
shoulder.
I wanted, you know, once I diddecide, okay, that I've
moderated, I've tried, you know,and and failed to, To set
boundaries and and and I've hadenough of the impact it was
having to, to at that point Iwas like, well, I need to make
(06:47):
this right.
I need to need for it to beokay.
And, and like you, I was fairlyquickly found, this naked mind
and they showed, you know, thatthen you suddenly realize the
people out there and there'sphilosophies out there and ways
of thinking that you can, Turnit all around in your head and
realize, Oh, actually, you know,I am better off without it.
You know, I, I can, you know,it's not like life has to be
(07:09):
awful without it.
It's actually, Oh, it washolding, like you said, it was
holding me back.
And actually, this is better.
That's better.
This is better.
That's better.
And yeah, just fantastic.
And, and so, for you, what,what's, I mean, how long did
that take?
How long did the process takebefore you sort of found that
things were improving and thatyou were comfortable, in the
(07:30):
decision that this was the rightway to go?
Jeanette Levitt (07:33):
Yeah.
It's funny.
I mean, I did not necessarilythink that I was, going to stop
forever.
I mean, I, when I did the, thelive alcohol experiment, know, I
was all in and I, and Idefinitely wanted to do the 30
days, but I still, you know, Ithink in the back of my mind
thought I was still trying to bea regular drinker, but then I
(07:57):
got to the end of the 30 daysand I was like, well, that went
well, you know, I liked what Iwas, how I was feeling and I
just, and then I had somemomentum and I thought, well,
let's, you know, Just keepgoing.
I mean, I had of the things thatwas hard for me is that I was, I
(08:17):
was in the dating world and Ihad one of the things that had
stopped me for so long andreally making a change is this
feeling like I had to be adrinker if I was going to date,
like who would want to, if I wasshowing up as a non drinker,
people would assume that Youknow, that I was an alcoholic,
they just wouldn't see me asfunny or sexy or fun, and I had
(08:39):
all these misguided beliefsabout what that meant be a non
drinker.
So, I had been still sort ofholding on to that, but I was
You know, when I went into thealcohol experiment, it was
January 1st.
and I actually had a first datewith somebody the next day,
January 2nd.
(08:59):
And I was able to say, you know,I was still sort of presenting
like, okay, this is easy.
I can, I can go on this date andexplain like why I'm not going
to order wine because I'm justdoing a dry January, you know?
So I didn't necessarily have to.
you know, to say that I'm a nondrinker necessarily, I'm just,
I'm doing a, I'm doing thisexperiment but you know, I found
(09:23):
that it went so much better thanI thought it was going to be.
I mean that date and then Iended up, I ended up actually
being in that relationship formonths or so and then had, had a
couple other relationships andjust realized, and now I'm in a
beautiful relationship withsomebody who's not much of a
drinker and it's just like.
(09:44):
I was able to dispel all thesebeliefs, about what that meant
to be, you know, dating withoutalcohol.
That is totally doable and that
Justine Clark (09:54):
It is, yeah,
Jeanette Levitt (09:56):
out.
Justine Clark (09:56):
it is totally doable and you're not missing
out, but you know, from, fromreally early on, a lot of us
have used alcohol socially togive us that, you know, courage
coat and to, to make us feelthat we are, that we Funnier,
prettier, you know, moresuccessful, all of those things.
What would you say yourexperience is as a non drinking
(10:20):
dater?
well actually, one of the thingsI was going to say is that you
are still a drinker.
This thing about us being nondrinkers, we drink lots of
different things.
It's not that we're identifiedby this one thing which is, you
know, You know, we don't getidentified as non dairy eaters,
or non sugar consumers, or nonwheat eaters, but we have to
(10:41):
classify ourselves as nondrinkers.
Well, actually, I am a drinker.
I drink all sorts of amazingthings, all day long.
Jeanette Levitt (10:47):
Right.
Justine Clark (10:48):
what would you say, what would you say to
someone that's really curiousabout starting this dating,
choosing to drink other things?
Jeanette Levitt (11:00):
Yeah.
I think, I mean, I can reallyspeak to this because I've
definitely, I have been in thedating world and I did.
Date a lot and haverelationships while I was a
drinker.
and, and when I was as what Iwould define kind of a
problematic drinker too.
I mean, I have, you know, I hadsome bad experiences that I'm
(11:21):
not, you know, that I'm notproud of while I was.
drinking too much and in thedating world, and now I've
experienced the dating world andnow I'm in a, in a good
committed relationship, and I'venavigated that without alcohol.
So I can really say it is, it'sso much better without alcohol.
If you are at all feeling likeyour drinking is problematic,
(11:46):
it's just so good to get that,to get a handle on that and to
feel better about that and thenbe in the dating world.
You don't have to be a drinker.
There's so many good men outthere who are happy to date
someone who is not, you know,drinking to excess is not, or
not drinking at all.
(12:06):
it's just, you know, all of mybeliefs about that have been
totally turned around.
They were just, they werenonsense.
and it's just much better.
So much it's, you can make agood connection and a real
connection and a trueconnection.
So much easier.
it's just so much better withoutthe haze of alcohol on top of
(12:28):
it.
and you just make betterchoices.
and, you just show up better asyourself and they get to know
the real you.
It's just nothing.
Yeah, I definitely, I was prettywrong in some of my beliefs,
Barry Condon (12:47):
But I think, I think it's so, counterintuitive
to, because we sort of feel, youknow, and it certainly
counterculture because the, the,the culture tells us, you know,
a bit of Dutch courage, youknow, a bit of, you know,
something to, to pep you upbefore you go.
And, and, and when you getthere, you know, you get, it'll
cut, settle your nerves.
And, and of course it does allof that in a way, but it's just
(13:08):
numbing.
It's just making you care less.
it's making you less authentic.
But it does have that warm andand and and and makes you feel
in that moment makes you feel,you know, stronger and and and
and more confident.
but I think it's natural, youknow, meeting someone for the
first time and wanting it to gowell and, and wondering what
(13:30):
people are going to think of youand all that kind of stuff.
It's gonna make you feel feeluncomfortable, gonna make you
feel nervous and and and Ithink, you know, and it's
natural to not want that.
But in the end.
I think I think you couldprobably testify that if you sit
with it for and go through thatfor the first 5 10 minutes that,
you know, things will, you know,you will calm down and and
(13:52):
actually then you can connectand have the authentic moment.
I don't know if you could speakto that.
Jeanette Levitt (13:58):
Oh, absolutely.
And I actually, to be honestwith you, I actually think that
like coming clean about beingnervous like, so it is endearing
and it's like, I think that'sthe way to go.
I mean, men don't need to seeyou trying to cover it up with,
you know, drinking glass afterglass of wine.
(14:20):
It's just not, it's, there'snothing wrong with showing up on
a first date and, and saying,wow, yeah, that's, I'm, I'm so
nervous.
I, you know, what's going on?
What about you?
Like, and that's being real andlike, people want someone who's
real, not.
I don't know.
I think, you know, it's fine tobe, be nervous and, and even to
(14:41):
have it show,
Justine Clark (14:43):
Exactly that, that vulnerability and,
endearing, quality of ourselves,that that's what people are
drawn towards, you know, thetruth.
We all, we're all looking forthe truth and for people to like
us.
Right.
what, what would you say wouldbe like hints or, or tips for,
for women who are.
(15:04):
Just starting on that journeybecause that's sort of going
well, you know, we always go toa bar.
What type of adventures have youhad and ways of dating that,
that have been more exciting nowthat you're not going to a
watering hole?
Jeanette Levitt (15:20):
I do think there's, there's so many things
that people can do date wise.
So it's not like, I think a lotof people think, how could I
date?
Because everyone just meets fordrinks.
But obviously that's not true.
We don't have to do that.
And I think are happy to mix itup a bit and do something
different.
I mean, could walk your dogtogether on a first date, you
(15:43):
know?
Justine Clark (15:43):
Hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (15:44):
picking up dog poop isn't so,
Barry Condon (15:46):
Hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (15:47):
isn't so sexy, but you know, I mean, you don't
have to, a walk, a coffee, Youknow, and then there's just all
kinds of fun dates in terms ofwhether it's, you know, going
bowling, going for a hike,whatever.
So it's, you know, I think,honestly, when it's just meeting
at a bar every time, that iskind of boring.
(16:08):
But I would say to people whoare, you know, if you're just
starting out and you're curiousabout your drinking to stay open
to changing it, and I think if,I think if drinking is really
problematic to you, it's good toTry to start getting that under
control before dating, I thinkyou can be sort of so recurrent,
(16:31):
you know, it's okay to be doingboth at once, meaning dating and
also, working on yourrelationship with alcohol at the
same time.
If you're looking to take backcontrol of your drinking, why
don't you join our AlcoholFreedom Finders 30 day group
program.
It's a great place to start.
Because we approach it as anexperiment, rather than a
(16:51):
challenge.
Whereas, as well as getting agreat detox, you learn the
science and the psychology aboutwhy you're drunk in the first
place.
So whether you want to stopaltogether, or just become a
more mindful and moderatedrinker, why don't you give it a
crack?
Use the link in the show notesto sign up to our next 30 day
program, and you won't regretit.
(17:13):
Because no one ever woke up inthe morning and said, I wish I'd
had more to drink last night,did they?
Back to the episode.
Barry Condon (17:21):
I think what you touched on earlier is also, you
know, what do you say to people?
And, and, and we, we tend tosort of, you know, if we, if we,
if we take a day off drinking orwe take a week off, or you go on
one date and you're notdrinking, you feel like you have
to confess your whole lifehistory to, to, to, of drinking
to them.
And that's not true.
I mean, you, you, you don't haveto, admit anything, you know,
(17:42):
like you said, you could justsay, I'm, I'm, I'm, you know,
I'm, I'm doing dry January, or,or I'm driving.
Or, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, justdoing a detox or whatever it is
that you feel comfortable with.
And, and, you know, that'spartly, you know, we, we tend to
overthink it and, and, and, andexpect to be judged.
so I don't, I mean, how, how didyou, have you had any good and
bad experiences with, with thatin the dating world where people
(18:03):
have, you must've been asked afew times, you know, why are you
not drinking?
How have you dealt with it?
You know, in, in subsequent,occasions.
Jeanette Levitt (18:11):
Yeah, I think we, we tend to assume that it's
gonna be really you know, to, toaddress it.
But it really, I think we makeit bigger in our heads than it
really is for the most part.
And I think if we just, like yousaid, if you're early on and
you're kind of experimenting,just say, you know, I'm taking,
(18:31):
right, I'm taking time off or Ijust, I, I was overdoing it.
I've been overdoing it over theholidays and just, I'm trying
to, Drink a bit less, you know,I don't think you have to, you
know, you don't necessarily wantto be defensive or and also you
don't necessarily want to beself righteous about it either.
Like, you know, you know, thatdrinking is horrible and I'm
(18:55):
whatever, but, I don't know.
So I think just, having an openminded kind of relaxed approach
to it and knowing that men areprobably going to respond a lot
better.
and it's, they're going to takeyour lead on it too.
I think if you are nervous anduptight about it and defensive
about it, that, maybe they will,you know, have thoughts about it
(19:18):
that you don't want them to.
But I think for the most part,if, yeah, just having sort of a
relaxed attitude about it sayingyou're, you're being curious
and, There's so many, I, I thinkpeople will be surprised at how
many men are happy to find womenout there that are addressing
problem drinking.
(19:38):
It's nobody want, you know,you're just, your chances of
having a nice relationship areso much better if, if, if you
both have a good relationshipwith alcohol, whatever that
means to you.
Justine Clark (19:49):
For sure.
And, and I, I, I love the factthat you're suggesting things
like, Going for a walk, becausewe don't normally walk along
with a glass of wine on ourhand, right?
And, and I love the idea oftaking a dog and seeing, you
know, how the other personinteracts with the dog, whether
they're able to pick up the,whatever, and put it in the bin
(20:10):
or not.
And you sort of would find outmore about the other person if
there's a sort of a, you know, athird entity with you.
It gives you a focus that's notjust, you know, Steering down
the gunnels of each otheracross, across the table in the
bar.
And also it changes the, the, Idon't know, the, the narrative
arc of dating, because oftenwhat we're trying to get to is,
(20:32):
do I want to kiss this person?
Is the only question we, we arereally, I mean, I'm speaking for
myself here, not for others,that when I was dating, I was
going, just trying to work outwhether it was chemistry, and if
you are in a bar, you're kind ofshutting down lots of other
avenues for exploring that.
You're just looking at.
there, at the end of this night,do I or don't I want to kiss
this person?
(20:53):
so I just wanted to speak to alittle bit about the, that,
elephant in the room, which isthe intimacy side of things
without alcohol.
Because I think my fear wouldhave been, how will I allow
myself to, to do that if I don'thave alcohol?
Jeanette Levitt (21:09):
Yeah.
Justine Clark (21:10):
So one is go for the walk instead, I get that.
But if you're in a situationwhere, what do you talk, how do
you speak to that sort ofintimacy side and what's your
experience?
Jeanette Levitt (21:20):
Oh, I mean, if you meet, I mean, if you're
talking in terms of, like, thefact that a lot of women think,
Whoa, I can't, I could neverhave sex with somebody because I
always have sex when I'mdrinking.
Justine Clark (21:29):
Mm hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (21:30):
I mean, that's certainly not, That, I mean, I
find that intimacy is so muchbetter without the haze of
alcohol in general, whether it'slike all types of intimacy.
Justine Clark (21:41):
Yeah.
Jeanette Levitt (21:42):
so I've just found it to be, I just think
dating and getting to knowsomeone and get becoming
intimate with them is so muchbetter and, and richer and more
enjoyable the haze of alcohol.
And it's just like, it's justBetter.
I mean, not to be blunt, but sexis so much better alcohol.
(22:04):
Um, and also because comingalong, what comes along with
like ditching alcohol is alsojust getting back in touch with
yourself feeling so much betterabout yourself.
And when you feel better aboutyourself, that, that impacts
your relationship and yourability to connect with
(22:25):
somebody, you know, that's why Ifeel like I don't think it's a
surprise.
You know, it's a coincidencethat I've met somebody really
special that I'm in arelationship, that feels good
when I'm, you know, no longerdrinking problematically.
I mean, I'm not drinking at all,but I, I mean, as you said,
(22:49):
Justine, I still drink,beverages, just not alcoholic
ones.
Barry Condon (22:53):
But that's pretty, I mean, because what you're
talking about there is actuallysort of your instead, because if
the people will be thinking up,you know, I, I need it to be to
even to dare to do that sort ofthing.
And I wouldn't have theconfidence, you know, without
it.
And but you're what you'resaying there is, if I'm right,
is that is that actually, By notdoing it, you develop the
(23:15):
confidence by, by not drinking,you actually develop the
confidence in yourself and, and,and you make, make genuine
connection and, and, and, and Ican imagine that there's going
to be so much less regret and,and, and, you know, all those
sort of things that, that, youend up doing things without
thinking and, and yeah, I, Ican, I can imagine,
Jeanette Levitt (23:35):
Right.
Barry Condon (23:36):
that being a real, real benefit.
Jeanette Levitt (23:40):
Yeah, and you're just, I mean, to be
honest, I think you're just moreattractive.
are.
And that's why I think people,people think that you won't be
successful, that you're going tohave so much trouble dating, but
actually, I, I think peopleoften find that the reverse is
true because you are.
When you are alcohol free,you're feeling better about
(24:00):
yourself.
You're probably looking betterabout yourself.
You're gaining confidence,whatever.
That's sexy.
That's sexy.
Or not being of sloppy drunk.
you know,
Justine Clark (24:13):
Yeah, no, I totally agree.
I had to go out last week with,went to a concert with my
brother and all of his oldschool friends were there.
He's two years younger than me,so all of these guys were, you
know, two years younger than mein school.
So they remember me as the kindof senior in school and were the
juniors.
So they were all like, Hi! I waslike, I didn't know who any of
(24:36):
these people, well, I knew whothey were obviously, but they
were boys when I last saw them.
So all these men sort of, askingme how things were.
And I felt, I felt really goodabout being able to stand up and
go, be proud of my, be proud ofmyself from who I was then at 17
as a, you know, trans woman.
doing well senior and in schoolto being, you know, a really
strong independent woman that'sstill confident and out, not
(25:00):
someone that was going, Oh God,this is, this is going to be
awkward.
And, I'm going to need to havesome drinks to, in order to do
this socially.
So there's so much to gain.
with not just dating, but, youknow, after divorce, I imagine
it's sort of, it's about all ofyour connections and
relationships and how youactually just get back into
society after, after drinking.
Jeanette Levitt (25:21):
Mm hmm.
Justine Clark (25:22):
so I wanted to ask you really towards the end
of this conversation, speakingto that kind of all of your
three Ds.
given us your three words,really, with the three Ds, but
what within that would you sortof say are the, are the, the key
things that you, takeaways, whatthree words would be your key
takeaways of, of focusing onthose three Ds?
Jeanette Levitt (25:47):
I mean, I think just, when you become alcohol
free, just get more clarity ingeneral.
So being able to deal with, andnavigate the difficulties of
divorce and the dating world.
You just like have a sense ofclarity going forward.
And then just, I mean,possibility, it's just opened up
so many, possibilities to bewithout alcohol.
(26:10):
and the third word I love, Imean, my, the name of my
business is levity lifecoaching.
So levity has to be in there.
I just think, just being able todeal with life in a way that's
kind of light, lighthearted andjoyful is, is, um, key.
Um
Barry Condon (26:25):
That's really good.
Really good.
Well, I mean, it's beenfantastic, to catch up and, and,
and, to have you on the podcast.
can you tell people, you know,who resonates?
I'm sure there'll be lots ofpeople who resonate with, with,
your situation and, and would,would, you know, benefit from,
spending time, in coaching callswith you.
So how, how, can people get incontact with you and, and who
(26:46):
are the people you'd like toserve?
Jeanette Levitt (26:52):
around women in the divorce and dating world.
So, you know, People that arestruggling with drinking as they
navigate those, those events intheir life.
on, my website islevitylifecoaching.
com and, levitylifecoaching onInstagram.
I've finally ventured into theworld of social media.
I've kind of resisted it for abit.
(27:13):
but yeah, I can be found thereor listed as a coach on this
Naked Minds website as well.
Barry Condon (27:19):
Brilliant.
Now, thanks so much
Jeanette Levitt (27:22):
oh, thank you guys.
This is wonderful.
So nice to catch up with you.
Finally.
Justine Clark (27:26):
You too, Jeanette.
Thanks so much.
Jeanette Levitt (27:29):
Alrighty.
Take care guys
This is Alcohol Freedom Finders.
In this episode, we meetJeanette Levitt, whose drinking
became a problem in theaftermath of a painful divorce.
On re entering the dating world,she thought that drinking was
the only way to appear confidentand sexy.
But when she found AlcoholFreedom herself, she realized
that she'd been wrong.
And as she puts it, there'sactually nothing confident or
(00:20):
sexy about being a sloppy drunk.
She's now a coach whospecializes in helping those
navigating the same all toocommon challenges that she
faced.
Let's meet Jeanette.
Justine Clark (00:32):
Welcome everybody to Alcohol Freedom
Finders podcast with me JustineClark and my fellow coach Barry
Condon.
Today we are super excited towelcome Jeanette Levitt with us.
She was in our coaching cohortis a marvelous human being and
also now specializes in the 3Ds.
(00:54):
So Jeanette, why don't you tellus about those 3Ds?
Jeanette Levitt (00:59):
So the three D's are, drinking, divorce, and
then dating.
So my story surrounds divorceand dating and, and, I mean, my
drinking escalated during those,events, parts of my life.
So, it seems like an appropriateniche for me.
Barry Condon (01:19):
That's brilliant.
why don't you.
Talking of, of, your story, whydon't you take us back to when
you decided, it was somethingyou, you do, you're drinking at
least, was something you neededto change.
Jeanette Levitt (01:33):
Okay.
Okay.
So.
I was somewhat of a latebloomer, I guess, because my
drinking escalated, when my lifetook a turn, that was really
unexpected.
So it was the divorce, that,that started, Drinking, more
heavily.
I really actually, I didn'tdrink very much during my
marriage.
I was raising 4 kids.
(01:54):
So it's pretty much a prettylight drinker.
but then the divorce was asurprise.
and it was just a reallydifficult time.
So that's when I started to, tojust, Turn to alcohol to kind of
help get me through some of it.
and then there was just a seriesof other events.
I mean, stuff happens at midlifeas we all know.
so, I, I lost my dad, mygrandmother, and then I had a
(02:18):
cancer diagnosis.
was all like within a year.
so it was just kind of,everything was kind of hitting.
And yeah, I find myself justturning to alcohol to, to numb,
and escape a lot of it.
Justine Clark (02:34):
Yeah, I mean, I really resonate with that.
I think that it's almost asurprise when you realize, hang
on a minute, I've never been, Iwas never a heavy drinker.
Why is it now that I'm theperson drinking a bottle a day
and looking for more going, thatwasn't enough?
It, it, it comes up, creeps upwhen you're, you start using it
for, you know, other reasonsother than socializing.
(02:57):
When you start using it foryourself, And then all of a
sudden it becomes a prop thatyou don't want to live without.
So I really resonate with thatfrom my own story, Jeanette, and
thanks for sharing that.
Jeanette Levitt (03:07):
yeah.
Justine Clark (03:07):
How did you, how did you overcome that?
Jeanette Levitt (03:12):
Well, it's, I mean, I think for a lot of, I
was, I was pretty much a, amiddle lane drinker, or a grey
area drinker, where I was, Imean I was binge drinking, I
wasn't a daily drinker, but I, Ijust, I knew it was becoming a
real problem.
I knew it was holding me back,but I just kept trying to, you
know, be this drinker, you know,this normal drinker.
(03:34):
And I would like set these rulesin place.
And then, you know, a few weekslater or whatever, I would break
them.
but I just had this naggingsense that I, this wasn't good
for me.
I just didn't, you know, Ididn't know there were options
out there.
I, I, you know, I thought it wasAA or, or nothing and I just
didn't resonate with that.
So, I just, I just kept on, youknow, for years to be a better
(03:59):
moderate drinker.
and then, so it's almost threeyears ago that I, I had a friend
who was going to do a dryJanuary and she said, Oh, why
don't we try, I heard this.
Something called This NakedMind.
They have a live alcoholexperiment.
And we can do that at the sametime as we're doing this Dry
(04:20):
January.
And I said, sure.
and that was it for me.
It was like, so I kind of Camein the side door, like I'd
always had this nagging thingthat I wanted to change my
relationship with alcohol, but Ijust didn't know how to do it.
And I was still had so many tiesto alcohol and so many thoughts
about why I really needed it andwanted it.
(04:44):
But then I did the anti racistlive alcohol experiment, and I
just really latched onto it.
It just made so much sense.
You
Barry Condon (04:53):
That's, that's brilliant.
I mean, I, it's funny how, youknow, the more times you hear
someone's story, the, the moreyou realize that everybody just
thought, oh, but I was the onewith the problem and, and, and I
wasn't normal and I wish I couldbe normal and, and why can't I
drink like other people?
You know, they didn't have a.
They don't have a problem andyeah, and, and, you know, it's
(05:16):
so silly if everyone had, ifwe'd just put our hands up to
each other kind of thing andpeople would admit, that They're
feeling a little bit feelingthat you know, they're losing
losing control And that it's noit's no big deal It's no nothing
to be ashamed of it's just youknow alcohol doing its thing
(05:37):
Yeah, it's that that's that'syeah That's really really
interesting to to hear it fromfrom your point of view and also
that that I can resonate fullywith the the idea that AA
seemed, seemed to me to be theonly thing that was available.
You know, if you had a problem,you go to AA and you admit, you
know, you know, you, you've hitrock bottom and you know, I'm an
(06:00):
alcoholic and, I need help andI'm powerless.
And, you know, and you hear thestory of them, you know, living
day to day and, and nevergetting past it, but, you know,
hanging on.
and you know, for some people,lots of people, you know, that
that has been a success, but forme, it just didn't speak to me.
I just wanted I wanted either tonot be a problem, and be able to
(06:22):
keep on doing it.
or for, you know, if I had tostop, then there had to be
something better than than thanconstantly looking over my
shoulder.
I wanted, you know, once I diddecide, okay, that I've
moderated, I've tried, you know,and and failed to, To set
boundaries and and and I've hadenough of the impact it was
having to, to at that point Iwas like, well, I need to make
(06:47):
this right.
I need to need for it to beokay.
And, and like you, I was fairlyquickly found, this naked mind
and they showed, you know, thatthen you suddenly realize the
people out there and there'sphilosophies out there and ways
of thinking that you can, Turnit all around in your head and
realize, Oh, actually, you know,I am better off without it.
You know, I, I can, you know,it's not like life has to be
(07:09):
awful without it.
It's actually, Oh, it washolding, like you said, it was
holding me back.
And actually, this is better.
That's better.
This is better.
That's better.
And yeah, just fantastic.
And, and so, for you, what,what's, I mean, how long did
that take?
How long did the process takebefore you sort of found that
things were improving and thatyou were comfortable, in the
(07:30):
decision that this was the rightway to go?
Jeanette Levitt (07:33):
Yeah.
It's funny.
I mean, I did not necessarilythink that I was, going to stop
forever.
I mean, I, when I did the, thelive alcohol experiment, know, I
was all in and I, and Idefinitely wanted to do the 30
days, but I still, you know, Ithink in the back of my mind
thought I was still trying to bea regular drinker, but then I
(07:57):
got to the end of the 30 daysand I was like, well, that went
well, you know, I liked what Iwas, how I was feeling and I
just, and then I had somemomentum and I thought, well,
let's, you know, Just keepgoing.
I mean, I had of the things thatwas hard for me is that I was, I
(08:17):
was in the dating world and Ihad one of the things that had
stopped me for so long andreally making a change is this
feeling like I had to be adrinker if I was going to date,
like who would want to, if I wasshowing up as a non drinker,
people would assume that Youknow, that I was an alcoholic,
they just wouldn't see me asfunny or sexy or fun, and I had
(08:39):
all these misguided beliefsabout what that meant be a non
drinker.
So, I had been still sort ofholding on to that, but I was
You know, when I went into thealcohol experiment, it was
January 1st.
and I actually had a first datewith somebody the next day,
January 2nd.
(08:59):
And I was able to say, you know,I was still sort of presenting
like, okay, this is easy.
I can, I can go on this date andexplain like why I'm not going
to order wine because I'm justdoing a dry January, you know?
So I didn't necessarily have to.
you know, to say that I'm a nondrinker necessarily, I'm just,
I'm doing a, I'm doing thisexperiment but you know, I found
(09:23):
that it went so much better thanI thought it was going to be.
I mean that date and then Iended up, I ended up actually
being in that relationship formonths or so and then had, had a
couple other relationships andjust realized, and now I'm in a
beautiful relationship withsomebody who's not much of a
drinker and it's just like.
(09:44):
I was able to dispel all thesebeliefs, about what that meant
to be, you know, dating withoutalcohol.
That is totally doable and that
Justine Clark (09:54):
It is, yeah,
Jeanette Levitt (09:56):
out.
Justine Clark (09:56):
it is totally doable and you're not missing
out, but you know, from, fromreally early on, a lot of us
have used alcohol socially togive us that, you know, courage
coat and to, to make us feelthat we are, that we Funnier,
prettier, you know, moresuccessful, all of those things.
What would you say yourexperience is as a non drinking
(10:20):
dater?
well actually, one of the thingsI was going to say is that you
are still a drinker.
This thing about us being nondrinkers, we drink lots of
different things.
It's not that we're identifiedby this one thing which is, you
know, You know, we don't getidentified as non dairy eaters,
or non sugar consumers, or nonwheat eaters, but we have to
(10:41):
classify ourselves as nondrinkers.
Well, actually, I am a drinker.
I drink all sorts of amazingthings, all day long.
Jeanette Levitt (10:47):
Right.
Justine Clark (10:48):
what would you say, what would you say to
someone that's really curiousabout starting this dating,
choosing to drink other things?
Jeanette Levitt (11:00):
Yeah.
I think, I mean, I can reallyspeak to this because I've
definitely, I have been in thedating world and I did.
Date a lot and haverelationships while I was a
drinker.
and, and when I was as what Iwould define kind of a
problematic drinker too.
I mean, I have, you know, I hadsome bad experiences that I'm
(11:21):
not, you know, that I'm notproud of while I was.
drinking too much and in thedating world, and now I've
experienced the dating world andnow I'm in a, in a good
committed relationship, and I'venavigated that without alcohol.
So I can really say it is, it'sso much better without alcohol.
If you are at all feeling likeyour drinking is problematic,
(11:46):
it's just so good to get that,to get a handle on that and to
feel better about that and thenbe in the dating world.
You don't have to be a drinker.
There's so many good men outthere who are happy to date
someone who is not, you know,drinking to excess is not, or
not drinking at all.
(12:06):
it's just, you know, all of mybeliefs about that have been
totally turned around.
They were just, they werenonsense.
and it's just much better.
So much it's, you can make agood connection and a real
connection and a trueconnection.
So much easier.
it's just so much better withoutthe haze of alcohol on top of
(12:28):
it.
and you just make betterchoices.
and, you just show up better asyourself and they get to know
the real you.
It's just nothing.
Yeah, I definitely, I was prettywrong in some of my beliefs,
Barry Condon (12:47):
But I think, I think it's so, counterintuitive
to, because we sort of feel, youknow, and it certainly
counterculture because the, the,the culture tells us, you know,
a bit of Dutch courage, youknow, a bit of, you know,
something to, to pep you upbefore you go.
And, and, and when you getthere, you know, you get, it'll
cut, settle your nerves.
And, and of course it does allof that in a way, but it's just
(13:08):
numbing.
It's just making you care less.
it's making you less authentic.
But it does have that warm andand and and and makes you feel
in that moment makes you feel,you know, stronger and and and
and more confident.
but I think it's natural, youknow, meeting someone for the
first time and wanting it to gowell and, and wondering what
(13:30):
people are going to think of youand all that kind of stuff.
It's gonna make you feel feeluncomfortable, gonna make you
feel nervous and and and Ithink, you know, and it's
natural to not want that.
But in the end.
I think I think you couldprobably testify that if you sit
with it for and go through thatfor the first 5 10 minutes that,
you know, things will, you know,you will calm down and and
(13:52):
actually then you can connectand have the authentic moment.
I don't know if you could speakto that.
Jeanette Levitt (13:58):
Oh, absolutely.
And I actually, to be honestwith you, I actually think that
like coming clean about beingnervous like, so it is endearing
and it's like, I think that'sthe way to go.
I mean, men don't need to seeyou trying to cover it up with,
you know, drinking glass afterglass of wine.
(14:20):
It's just not, it's, there'snothing wrong with showing up on
a first date and, and saying,wow, yeah, that's, I'm, I'm so
nervous.
I, you know, what's going on?
What about you?
Like, and that's being real andlike, people want someone who's
real, not.
I don't know.
I think, you know, it's fine tobe, be nervous and, and even to
(14:41):
have it show,
Justine Clark (14:43):
Exactly that, that vulnerability and,
endearing, quality of ourselves,that that's what people are
drawn towards, you know, thetruth.
We all, we're all looking forthe truth and for people to like
us.
Right.
what, what would you say wouldbe like hints or, or tips for,
for women who are.
(15:04):
Just starting on that journeybecause that's sort of going
well, you know, we always go toa bar.
What type of adventures have youhad and ways of dating that,
that have been more exciting nowthat you're not going to a
watering hole?
Jeanette Levitt (15:20):
I do think there's, there's so many things
that people can do date wise.
So it's not like, I think a lotof people think, how could I
date?
Because everyone just meets fordrinks.
But obviously that's not true.
We don't have to do that.
And I think are happy to mix itup a bit and do something
different.
I mean, could walk your dogtogether on a first date, you
(15:43):
know?
Justine Clark (15:43):
Hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (15:44):
picking up dog poop isn't so,
Barry Condon (15:46):
Hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (15:47):
isn't so sexy, but you know, I mean, you don't
have to, a walk, a coffee, Youknow, and then there's just all
kinds of fun dates in terms ofwhether it's, you know, going
bowling, going for a hike,whatever.
So it's, you know, I think,honestly, when it's just meeting
at a bar every time, that iskind of boring.
(16:08):
But I would say to people whoare, you know, if you're just
starting out and you're curiousabout your drinking to stay open
to changing it, and I think if,I think if drinking is really
problematic to you, it's good toTry to start getting that under
control before dating, I thinkyou can be sort of so recurrent,
(16:31):
you know, it's okay to be doingboth at once, meaning dating and
also, working on yourrelationship with alcohol at the
same time.
If you're looking to take backcontrol of your drinking, why
don't you join our AlcoholFreedom Finders 30 day group
program.
It's a great place to start.
Because we approach it as anexperiment, rather than a
(16:51):
challenge.
Whereas, as well as getting agreat detox, you learn the
science and the psychology aboutwhy you're drunk in the first
place.
So whether you want to stopaltogether, or just become a
more mindful and moderatedrinker, why don't you give it a
crack?
Use the link in the show notesto sign up to our next 30 day
program, and you won't regretit.
(17:13):
Because no one ever woke up inthe morning and said, I wish I'd
had more to drink last night,did they?
Back to the episode.
Barry Condon (17:21):
I think what you touched on earlier is also, you
know, what do you say to people?
And, and, and we, we tend tosort of, you know, if we, if we,
if we take a day off drinking orwe take a week off, or you go on
one date and you're notdrinking, you feel like you have
to confess your whole lifehistory to, to, to, of drinking
to them.
And that's not true.
I mean, you, you, you don't haveto, admit anything, you know,
(17:42):
like you said, you could justsay, I'm, I'm, I'm, you know,
I'm, I'm doing dry January, or,or I'm driving.
Or, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, justdoing a detox or whatever it is
that you feel comfortable with.
And, and, you know, that'spartly, you know, we, we tend to
overthink it and, and, and, andexpect to be judged.
so I don't, I mean, how, how didyou, have you had any good and
bad experiences with, with thatin the dating world where people
(18:03):
have, you must've been asked afew times, you know, why are you
not drinking?
How have you dealt with it?
You know, in, in subsequent,occasions.
Jeanette Levitt (18:11):
Yeah, I think we, we tend to assume that it's
gonna be really you know, to, toaddress it.
But it really, I think we makeit bigger in our heads than it
really is for the most part.
And I think if we just, like yousaid, if you're early on and
you're kind of experimenting,just say, you know, I'm taking,
(18:31):
right, I'm taking time off or Ijust, I, I was overdoing it.
I've been overdoing it over theholidays and just, I'm trying
to, Drink a bit less, you know,I don't think you have to, you
know, you don't necessarily wantto be defensive or and also you
don't necessarily want to beself righteous about it either.
Like, you know, you know, thatdrinking is horrible and I'm
(18:55):
whatever, but, I don't know.
So I think just, having an openminded kind of relaxed approach
to it and knowing that men areprobably going to respond a lot
better.
and it's, they're going to takeyour lead on it too.
I think if you are nervous anduptight about it and defensive
about it, that, maybe they will,you know, have thoughts about it
(19:18):
that you don't want them to.
But I think for the most part,if, yeah, just having sort of a
relaxed attitude about it sayingyou're, you're being curious
and, There's so many, I, I thinkpeople will be surprised at how
many men are happy to find womenout there that are addressing
problem drinking.
(19:38):
It's nobody want, you know,you're just, your chances of
having a nice relationship areso much better if, if, if you
both have a good relationshipwith alcohol, whatever that
means to you.
Justine Clark (19:49):
For sure.
And, and I, I, I love the factthat you're suggesting things
like, Going for a walk, becausewe don't normally walk along
with a glass of wine on ourhand, right?
And, and I love the idea oftaking a dog and seeing, you
know, how the other personinteracts with the dog, whether
they're able to pick up the,whatever, and put it in the bin
(20:10):
or not.
And you sort of would find outmore about the other person if
there's a sort of a, you know, athird entity with you.
It gives you a focus that's notjust, you know, Steering down
the gunnels of each otheracross, across the table in the
bar.
And also it changes the, the, Idon't know, the, the narrative
arc of dating, because oftenwhat we're trying to get to is,
(20:32):
do I want to kiss this person?
Is the only question we, we arereally, I mean, I'm speaking for
myself here, not for others,that when I was dating, I was
going, just trying to work outwhether it was chemistry, and if
you are in a bar, you're kind ofshutting down lots of other
avenues for exploring that.
You're just looking at.
there, at the end of this night,do I or don't I want to kiss
this person?
(20:53):
so I just wanted to speak to alittle bit about the, that,
elephant in the room, which isthe intimacy side of things
without alcohol.
Because I think my fear wouldhave been, how will I allow
myself to, to do that if I don'thave alcohol?
Jeanette Levitt (21:09):
Yeah.
Justine Clark (21:10):
So one is go for the walk instead, I get that.
But if you're in a situationwhere, what do you talk, how do
you speak to that sort ofintimacy side and what's your
experience?
Jeanette Levitt (21:20):
Oh, I mean, if you meet, I mean, if you're
talking in terms of, like, thefact that a lot of women think,
Whoa, I can't, I could neverhave sex with somebody because I
always have sex when I'mdrinking.
Justine Clark (21:29):
Mm hmm.
Jeanette Levitt (21:30):
I mean, that's certainly not, That, I mean, I
find that intimacy is so muchbetter without the haze of
alcohol in general, whether it'slike all types of intimacy.
Justine Clark (21:41):
Yeah.
Jeanette Levitt (21:42):
so I've just found it to be, I just think
dating and getting to knowsomeone and get becoming
intimate with them is so muchbetter and, and richer and more
enjoyable the haze of alcohol.
And it's just like, it's justBetter.
I mean, not to be blunt, but sexis so much better alcohol.
(22:04):
Um, and also because comingalong, what comes along with
like ditching alcohol is alsojust getting back in touch with
yourself feeling so much betterabout yourself.
And when you feel better aboutyourself, that, that impacts
your relationship and yourability to connect with
(22:25):
somebody, you know, that's why Ifeel like I don't think it's a
surprise.
You know, it's a coincidencethat I've met somebody really
special that I'm in arelationship, that feels good
when I'm, you know, no longerdrinking problematically.
I mean, I'm not drinking at all,but I, I mean, as you said,
(22:49):
Justine, I still drink,beverages, just not alcoholic
ones.
Barry Condon (22:53):
But that's pretty, I mean, because what you're
talking about there is actuallysort of your instead, because if
the people will be thinking up,you know, I, I need it to be to
even to dare to do that sort ofthing.
And I wouldn't have theconfidence, you know, without
it.
And but you're what you'resaying there is, if I'm right,
is that is that actually, By notdoing it, you develop the
(23:15):
confidence by, by not drinking,you actually develop the
confidence in yourself and, and,and you make, make genuine
connection and, and, and, and Ican imagine that there's going
to be so much less regret and,and, and, you know, all those
sort of things that, that, youend up doing things without
thinking and, and yeah, I, Ican, I can imagine,
Jeanette Levitt (23:35):
Right.
Barry Condon (23:36):
that being a real, real benefit.
Jeanette Levitt (23:40):
Yeah, and you're just, I mean, to be
honest, I think you're just moreattractive.
are.
And that's why I think people,people think that you won't be
successful, that you're going tohave so much trouble dating, but
actually, I, I think peopleoften find that the reverse is
true because you are.
When you are alcohol free,you're feeling better about
(24:00):
yourself.
You're probably looking betterabout yourself.
You're gaining confidence,whatever.
That's sexy.
That's sexy.
Or not being of sloppy drunk.
you know,
Justine Clark (24:13):
Yeah, no, I totally agree.
I had to go out last week with,went to a concert with my
brother and all of his oldschool friends were there.
He's two years younger than me,so all of these guys were, you
know, two years younger than mein school.
So they remember me as the kindof senior in school and were the
juniors.
So they were all like, Hi! I waslike, I didn't know who any of
(24:36):
these people, well, I knew whothey were obviously, but they
were boys when I last saw them.
So all these men sort of, askingme how things were.
And I felt, I felt really goodabout being able to stand up and
go, be proud of my, be proud ofmyself from who I was then at 17
as a, you know, trans woman.
doing well senior and in schoolto being, you know, a really
strong independent woman that'sstill confident and out, not
(25:00):
someone that was going, Oh God,this is, this is going to be
awkward.
And, I'm going to need to havesome drinks to, in order to do
this socially.
So there's so much to gain.
with not just dating, but, youknow, after divorce, I imagine
it's sort of, it's about all ofyour connections and
relationships and how youactually just get back into
society after, after drinking.
Jeanette Levitt (25:21):
Mm hmm.
Justine Clark (25:22):
so I wanted to ask you really towards the end
of this conversation, speakingto that kind of all of your
three Ds.
given us your three words,really, with the three Ds, but
what within that would you sortof say are the, are the, the key
things that you, takeaways, whatthree words would be your key
takeaways of, of focusing onthose three Ds?
Jeanette Levitt (25:47):
I mean, I think just, when you become alcohol
free, just get more clarity ingeneral.
So being able to deal with, andnavigate the difficulties of
divorce and the dating world.
You just like have a sense ofclarity going forward.
And then just, I mean,possibility, it's just opened up
so many, possibilities to bewithout alcohol.
(26:10):
and the third word I love, Imean, my, the name of my
business is levity lifecoaching.
So levity has to be in there.
I just think, just being able todeal with life in a way that's
kind of light, lighthearted andjoyful is, is, um, key.
Um
Barry Condon (26:25):
That's really good.
Really good.
Well, I mean, it's beenfantastic, to catch up and, and,
and, to have you on the podcast.
can you tell people, you know,who resonates?
I'm sure there'll be lots ofpeople who resonate with, with,
your situation and, and would,would, you know, benefit from,
spending time, in coaching callswith you.
So how, how, can people get incontact with you and, and who
(26:46):
are the people you'd like toserve?
Jeanette Levitt (26:52):
around women in the divorce and dating world.
So, you know, People that arestruggling with drinking as they
navigate those, those events intheir life.
on, my website islevitylifecoaching.
com and, levitylifecoaching onInstagram.
I've finally ventured into theworld of social media.
I've kind of resisted it for abit.
(27:13):
but yeah, I can be found thereor listed as a coach on this
Naked Minds website as well.
Barry Condon (27:19):
Brilliant.
Now, thanks so much
Jeanette Levitt (27:22):
oh, thank you guys.
This is wonderful.
So nice to catch up with you.
Finally.
Justine Clark (27:26):
You too, Jeanette.
Thanks so much.
Jeanette Levitt (27:29):
Alrighty.
Take care guys
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