Ep. 10 - Agentic Shopping Takes Over

The year retail media stopped living on the product page and started shaping the whole journey came with growing pains, and big wins. We dig into what really changed in 2025: retail media going full-funnel with connected TV, social integrations, and creator programs, while brand and commerce teams finally learned to plan together. CTV’s role gets a sober look, yes, it’s premium and powerful, but it sits higher in the funnel for retailers and needs smarter targeting and frequency. The conversation then shifts to agentic shopping, where AI agents help with discovery and routine reorders but haven’t fully earned the right to “press buy” for most shoppers. We unpack the signals these systems read, from product data to price and availability, and how to prepare content and assortments for a world beyond classic SEO.

Commerce media also takes center stage as industries like travel and fintech monetize their first-party data. That expansion creates more options and more complexity, so we share a practical approach: anchor to the shopper, choose fewer but better-fitting networks, and orchestrate messages across touch points. In-store media returns as a meaningful lever when paired with aligned digital creative and measured with lift, traffic, and market tests rather than one-to-one attribution. And because no strategy survives bad metrics, we tackle measurement head-on: ROAS as a useful indicator, incrementality as the proof brands want, and the need for clearer standards on item sets and attribution windows.

We wrap with our retail media word of the year, agentic, and a round of bold 2026 predictions on creative vs targeting, AI’s share of ad production, and where standardization might finally land. 

If you enjoyed this deep dive into the trends shaping retail and commerce media, subscribe, share with a colleague, and leave a quick review to help more people find the show.

Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (00:08):
What's up, party people?
BV here, and welcome to a newepisode of Retail Media Vibes, a
doing business in Bentonvillepodcast.
And we are recording live atPodcast Video Studios in Rogers,
Arkansas.
Today, my guest is Lindsay Hamm,and we'll get to meet her in
just a minute.
But our topics today is a littlebit of a special one.

(00:29):
We're going to do a little recapon 2025, and we're going to talk
about the best retail mediastories for 2025.
And Lindsay and I are going toidentify what was the most
important word or the best wordin retail media from the past
year.
And then we'll like to wrap itup with something fun.

(00:50):
So we're going to do our boldvibes, where I'm going to throw
out a statement to Lindsay, andshe's going to give me her gut
reaction about predictions for2026.
So stick around for that aswell.
So with all of that out of theway, let's meet Lindsay.

SPEAKER_02 (01:05):
Yes, I'm excited to be here.
I've heard so much about thispodcast.
So I'm very excited.

SPEAKER_00 (01:10):
It is the fastest growing podcast.
I'm doing business inBettonville.

SPEAKER_02 (01:13):
That's what I hear.

SPEAKER_00 (01:15):
So Lindsay, great to have you on.
Appreciate you being here today.
But let's tell everyone a littlebit about you and what how you
found yourself here in thispodcast.

SPEAKER_02 (01:25):
Yeah.
Well, I lived in NorthwestArkansas for about 10 years,
working in different agencyenvironments.
I worked on the retailer side atSam's Club for a little while.
So I've been around.
I'm up in Cincinnati now, butstill living in that retail
media commerce world.
And so found myself here becauseI happen to know BV.
What?
How do you know?

(01:45):
How do I know you?

SPEAKER_00 (01:46):
How do you know BV?

SPEAKER_02 (01:47):
Oh well, I always make the joke that BV almost
failed to hire me.
Um made the right best decision,maybe of his career.
No, I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_00 (01:59):
Um by bringing But I had the opportunity to hire you
twice.

SPEAKER_02 (02:02):
Twice you had a chance to hire me.
You made the right choice andhired me at least one of those
two times.
Um We're not gonna get intothat.
No, but uh I've known UBV forquite some time now and love the
work that you do in the area.
Obviously, Northwest Arkansasneeds this type of podcast and
this type of work to be done.
So um was really excited.
No, was really excited about thechance to come and just talk to

(02:24):
you a little bit and learn fromyour big brain about Commerce
Media.

SPEAKER_00 (02:27):
Yeah, I want to hear from your big brain.
Learn from each other.
My brain is getting a littleold.
So I want in front, fresh new,young brain.
All right.
So just a couple littleicebreaker questions.
You know, so what is the lastimpulse buy that you bought
because of an ad or aninfluencer?

SPEAKER_02 (02:43):
Well, I have to cheat a little bit because I'm
actually gonna say, I'm gonnatell you what my husband was
influenced to buy by me beinginfluenced by TikTok.
TikTok influences my whole life.
Um, and I uh saw the NinjaCreamy, which is a lovely ice
cream making machine.
Oh, nice.
It can make protein shakes, itcan make, you can like to put
bananas in there and makeshakes.

(03:04):
And so I immediately wasinfluenced, but I wasn't gonna
buy it myself.
So I went and influenced myhusband to buy it for me for
Christmas.

SPEAKER_00 (03:10):
So that dropped a little hint, right?

SPEAKER_02 (03:13):
That was it.
The hint was sending him thevideo multiple times.

SPEAKER_00 (03:17):
So have you already received the gift or are you
going to receive the gift in thefuture?

SPEAKER_02 (03:22):
You know, he's very bad at keeping a secret, but he
did keep this one.
He actually gave it to me rightbefore we left to come down to
Northwest, Arkansas.
So I got to make one round of umlemon, lemon chill ice cream and
then had to get out of there.

SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Well, it sounds great though, lemon chill.

SPEAKER_02 (03:37):
Delicious.
Delicious.
All right.

SPEAKER_00 (03:39):
So if you were not doing what you're doing now,
what would be your alternateuniverse career?

SPEAKER_02 (03:48):
You, you know, anybody that knows me knows that
my true passion outside of mediais making pottery.
So I've built my own littlepottery studio during the
pandemic, started selling it atlocal markets.
And so if I if I wasn't doingthis, I would be running my
pottery empire for sure.

SPEAKER_00 (04:03):
We'd be doing pottery, pottery pool time.

SPEAKER_02 (04:05):
Oh, 100%.
I'd be cornering the market onlocal handmade pottery.

SPEAKER_00 (04:10):
So truth be told, I've I've been to her stand uh
here in Northwest Arkansas.

SPEAKER_02 (04:16):
Yes, Rogers downtown.

SPEAKER_00 (04:17):
Yeah, Rogers downtown with the Mecca of
startups.
Rogers Rocks.
That's true.
Rogers Rocks.
Are you doing that also inCincinnati?
Are you selling in Cincinnati aswell?
You found some.

SPEAKER_02 (04:27):
I am.
Yeah.
I just started.
So I had to set up my kiln.
I had to get it fixed and dosome work on my studio, but I'm
all set up and Bad PotteryCompany is running yet again.
So we are supporting localmarkets and independence right
now.
Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 (04:42):
Great.
Yeah, I know.
Yeah, I know about you and yourpottery.
I have some Lindsay ham pottery.

SPEAKER_02 (04:47):
Lindsey Mam originals right there.
Yes.

SPEAKER_00 (04:49):
They are amazing.

SPEAKER_02 (04:50):
They'll be worth almost almost something.

SPEAKER_00 (04:52):
Almost what I paid for them.

SPEAKER_02 (04:53):
Almost what you paid for them someday.

SPEAKER_00 (04:55):
Awesome.
All right.
Well, welcome to the show onceagain.
I'm so happy to have you here.
And um, we're gonna go ahead andget into our main stories today.
Do it.
Um, how are you feeling?

SPEAKER_02 (05:06):
I feel so good.
I've been I've been excitedabout this.
So it's chat.

SPEAKER_00 (05:10):
All right.
So we're what we're gonna dotoday is something a little bit
different.
We're going to discuss the beststories that, in our opinion,
anyway, she she and I havecollaborated a little bit on
this.
The best retail media storiesfrom this past year, right?
So this has been the year ofretail media, I would say.
And I mean, hence why we have apodcast called Retail Media

(05:32):
Vibes.
But, you know, story number oneis all about retail media going
full funnel, right?
And you know, one of the thingsthat I've observed uh through
retail media, and it's itstarted last year, so it's not
like it all happened this year,is like what is now classified
as as retail media has continuedto explode.

(05:56):
Yeah, right.
Grow.
It it's growing.
And so, you know, and how thosehow those dollars are flowing
from brand to retailer, whattactics now fall into retail
media.
It's like anything, you know,anything that's tied to a
retailer feels like right is isis retail media.
And it's just such aninteresting time, right?

(06:19):
Because everybody talked used totalk about brand dollars and
brand media, and now you know,retail media, now we've got
connected TV.
We're even creators, you know,influencers and creators are
somewhat in that in that retailmedia ecosystem.

SPEAKER_01 (06:32):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (06:33):
Uh offsite media, you know, and some of the it's
all coming together.
So, you know, why do you thinklike this full funnel retail
media is really happening in2025?
And we saw a lot of accelerationthere.

SPEAKER_02 (06:47):
Yeah.
Well, I think I think first andforemost, we are starting to see
better integration between brandteams and commerce teams, both
in-house and on the agency side.
I think that's been a spacethat's been a little bit of an
unknown for some time.
Um, I think part of itstechnology, the capabilities
being offered by retail medianetworks is vastly superior than
it was even just a couple ofyears ago.

(07:09):
We've seen just massive growththere.
But I think the other piece iswe're able to tell a stronger
story, and that's due tomeasurement.
So I think the improvement ofmeasurement within the retail
media networks, I know thatthere's still some measurement
methodology and things that arebeing around.

SPEAKER_00 (07:22):
Yeah, we're gonna talk definitely about that.

SPEAKER_02 (07:24):
We'll talk more about that later.

SPEAKER_00 (07:25):
You got a couple of times, a couple of
opportunities.
A little time of that once.

SPEAKER_02 (07:28):
But I think we're telling a stronger story from a
retail media networkperspective.
And I think the value is there.
And I think brand teams areunderstanding the value that a
retail media network can bringto their holistic solution.
And so it's measurement and itscapability set kind of
converging to create this reallyunique synergy.

SPEAKER_00 (07:47):
So do you think that brands are really starting to
understand retail?
Because, you know, when I was inthe mix, there was this
contention of, you know, branddoesn't really get retail.
Yeah.
And there's obviously somenuances in retail specifically,
and then obviously theapplication of retail media, and

(08:08):
you know, brands didn't reallyunderstand that.
So when you would talk to them,you know, it's almost like it
you were talking a differentlanguage.

SPEAKER_02 (08:14):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (08:15):
And I think a lot of those objectives were
misaligned, right?

SPEAKER_02 (08:17):
Absolutely.
And I think their education isstill happening and still needs
to happen.
I I mean, I think there's stilla gap that's being closed in
terms of understanding andspeaking the same language.
You're right, in that the KPIsthat are used by you know a
brand focused sort of upperfunnel team are not the same as
a commerce team, as a you know,below the line team.
And I think that's part of thechallenge is we aren't always

(08:40):
speaking the same language, butwe are seeing that convergence
with the launch of CTV, with thelaunch of more social
capabilities in-house within thenetworks.
I think we're starting to speakthe same language a little bit
better than we used to.
And in doing that, we're able tobuild stronger strategic plans
together.

SPEAKER_00 (08:58):
Right.
Well, one tactic in the funnelthat I saw a lot of growth in, a
lot of conversation about wasconnected TV.
And I think, you know, when youlook at connected TV as a brand
versus a connected TV as aretailer, you know, the
objectives are somewhatdifferent, especially the way
that those are applied, right?
So, you know, if you're a brand,you know, it's about awareness,

(09:19):
it's about brand building, youknow, you're trying to, you
know, gain that awareness, youknow, probably high frequency, a
lot of the, you know, and thenwhen you get to retail, it's
like, okay, targeting the shopor a little more strategic,
right?
So, you know, how do you see youknow CTV evolving?
Because CTV is still a veryexpensive medium, no matter if
you're doing it at the brandlevel or retail.

SPEAKER_02 (09:41):
And you are gonna pay a premium at the you know,
within the retail media network,you're paying a premium to reach
a more specific, tailoredaudience within that that
shopper pool.
So it does need to be usedstrategically to your point.
I mean, I think, you know, froma brand perspective, CTV has
been this broader awarenesstactic.
It's been a way to get yourbrand out there.
It still is.
I think even within the retailmedia networks, you still have

(10:05):
to consider CTV to be more of ahigher funnel awareness driver.

SPEAKER_00 (10:09):
But it is like the funnel within the funnel.

SPEAKER_02 (10:11):
The funnel within the funnel, exactly.
And I think that CTV is justgonna fill this very unique
space.
And I don't think most sort ofshopper teams are gonna want to
have day-to-day ownership of itbecause it's not gonna drive
conversion at the scale of likeon-site or search.
But at the same time, it's anecessary component that just
helps you nudge shoppers downfunnels.

(10:32):
So it's finding the right placefor this kind of commerce-driven
CTV as opposed to like thatbroader brand awareness.

SPEAKER_00 (10:39):
All right, I'm gonna put you on the spot.

SPEAKER_02 (10:40):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (10:41):
Okay.
So, like I said, there's been alot of growth in this funnel,
retail media funnel this year.
What is an up what is a a tacticthat may have not seen a lot of
growth in this this year in thatfunnel that you may see in the
up in in 2026?
Do you think?
What if you had to place a bet,yeah, you know, where where

(11:02):
would the where would thedollars start to grow?

SPEAKER_02 (11:05):
You know, I I think social still has a lot of
opportunity.

SPEAKER_00 (11:08):
Okay.

SPEAKER_02 (11:08):
I think what we're seeing is integration of paid
media from a um a retail mediaspecific lens.
Obviously, Meta is now acomponent of WMC's capability
with their reporting.
Um, I think we've had a lot ofconversations about social and
its space within the retailmedia networks.
I think where it continues toevolve is how that content is

(11:30):
generated.
And I think we'll talk moreabout some of those topics later
as well.
But I do see a space in which westart to evaluate content
curation and creation as well asthe paid media dynamics within
our retail media network.
I think we have content creatorplatforms and creator studios
that currently sit withretailers, but I think there's
continued evolution that's goingto happen there as we get into

(11:52):
AI.

SPEAKER_00 (11:54):
Content creation story for sure.
That's right.
All right, cool.
All right, let's move on to thenext story.
All right.
So the next big story from 2025is agentic shopping.

SPEAKER_01 (12:03):
Yes.

SPEAKER_00 (12:03):
And that has now become part of this retail media
uh conversation, right?
So there's the word of the hour.
Agentic, right?
Agentic, everything is AI.
Um, you know, I I have a saying,we'll know AI has made it when
we stop talking about AI.
That's it.
And everything just works theway we want it to work, right?
But you know, it a agenticshopping is kind of the new

(12:25):
darling in a way.
Like a lot of people are freakedout, yeah, like because they
don't really understand it.
Yeah.
Right.
And so it's but it's it's nowreally a big part of
conversation.
I just sat on a panel a coupleof weeks ago where we were just
talking about AI and retail andall the impacts.
And you know, there were a lotof brands and suppliers that
were there that were, you know,really wanting to you know

(12:46):
understand how to win, how towin in this space.
So, you know, when you now havethis situation where the human
isn't really making thedecision, right?
If you do if you do pure playagentic shopping, right?
Yeah.
You've now taken the humansomewhat out of the loop, not

(13:07):
fully, but out of the loop,right?
And and you have, you know, thisAI that is either either helping
you discover, which I think isone obviously use case, and then
helping you buy, which is ananother use case.
And then you you bring over theboth of those together.
Um let's let's break those twodown, I think, probably in like

(13:30):
what role in retail media do youthink AI and agentic shopping
has in the discovery side of theprocess?

SPEAKER_02 (13:38):
Yeah.
Well, and I think that's kind ofthe question of the hour, is
what you're tapping into, whichis I think right now AI, agentic
AI especially, is something thatis influencing purchase
decision, but there's a lot oftrepidation around actually
handing over the reins to allowagentic to buy on your behalf.
I think actual the actual finalclick, which is the purchase, is

(14:00):
some people are a little bithesitant to provide access to.
And so we do have a lot ofopportunity within the discovery
space.
Obviously, we've seen um sort ofagentic chat bots emerging from
like Amazon and Walmart andRufus and Sparky, and those are
being fed by differentcomponents of the site.
I think the discoverability isinteresting because you have so

(14:22):
many inputs advising andinforming uh AI.
I mean, you have retailers.

SPEAKER_00 (14:27):
And I think not everybody understands those
signals.

SPEAKER_02 (14:29):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (14:30):
Right?
What is, you know, what are thesignals that the AI is cueing in
on in order to ensure my productis recommended, right?

SPEAKER_02 (14:39):
Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 (14:40):
Everybody spent so much time and effort optimizing
for SEO, right?
Search engine optimization andto get ranked, you know, or or
buy or pay to play with withlisting ad product listing ads.
And so now it's like I don'tknow what you know, most people
don't know what those signalsare.
And there's obviously, you know,there's you're site being cited,
yeah, you know, beingrecommended and making sure your

(15:02):
attributes are so there, thereare some tactical things that
you can do.
Right.
We're not gonna get into allthat today.
Yeah.
But you know, I I just I thinkthere is this trepidation of
people not really understandingwhat it takes.
And there's no playbook.
This is that's the other thingtoo.
Like it's emerging with SEO,right?
There's kind of a playbook.
Absolutely.
With, you know, you know, andwe'll talk about GEO later and

(15:25):
AEO, but there is no realplaybook, right?
We're still kind of beholden tothese platforms, whether it be
OpenAI or Google, to providesome sort of result.
Right.
And and that's the thing toowith an agent with AI.
You've used AI, use AI all thetime, right?
It always gives you an answer.

(15:46):
I have never had an AI come backand say, I'm sorry, sorry, BB, I
got nothing for you, right?
It's always gonna come back withan answer.
So wherever we're getting theright answer that we need to
always cracks me up about thiswhole hallucination word, right?
Yeah, it hallucinates.
Like if I mess up, I get itwrong.
I'm not a who I don'thallucinate, right?
Right.
Or they if I said I washallucinating, they'd think I

(16:08):
was you know on something.

SPEAKER_02 (16:10):
There's a like they you have to like train and
retrain your AI.
Sometimes it just can't everquite get there, you know?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But I think that kind of speaksto the fact that there's still
inputs are still necessary atthis stage in the game.
There may come a point when AIis so advanced that we no longer
need the maestro behind thescenes to conduct the orchestra.
But right now we still do needthat sort of input.

(16:31):
And where is it getting thoseinputs to your point?
I think, you know, it's gettingit from outside sources, it's
getting it from on-site, fromPDPs, it's getting it from
price, distribution, things thatwe don't always even consider in
the marketing realm.
And there's so many pieces thatit is overwhelming.
It does become a lot for peopleto understand.

SPEAKER_00 (16:48):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And I I also think there is atime and a place to use AI for
your shopping needs.
You know, and I think it'salmost like in my head, I've got
like this matrix built, buildingin my head of when you use AI
for shopping and when you don'tuse AI for shopping, or how, or
quite frankly, how consumerswill use AI for shopping, right?

(17:09):
Right.
If you're trying to plansomething and you know, you've
got it's very complex, I thinkAI is a great place to go.
If I'm looking just to, youknow, refill on toilet paper, do
I really need to go to AI to dothat?
And then if I use an agent to dothat for me, well, that's just
glorified subscription.
Right.
You know what I mean?
Like so, like I think there'sstill this continuum that needs

(17:31):
to be you know worked through ofwhen what are the right moments
that a shopper will use AI andthen when they won't, right?
Because I also saw um I readsomething, I wish I could cite
it specifically, but I did seethat there was, I think it was
an ad week article, honestly,that um some people were saying
that AI discovery is going totake away from TikTok discovery,

(17:55):
right?
So TikTok has been such a bigplace for discovery, yeah,
right.
Absolutely.
But in my mind, I'm not so sure.
And the reason why is because Ithink like there's two types of
discovery, right?
There's active discovery andthen there's passive discovery.
And like most people are lazy.
I mean, I and I'll say I'm nottrying to, you know, trying to
be cruel here, but like peoplewant to we work less, not work

(18:17):
more.
Right when I say that.
That's what I mean.
And so like flipping throughTikTok and learning about
something is a totally differentpart of active uh leaning into
the platform than when you are,well, now okay, how do I point
form this prompt?
What is all the information Ineed to give it?
You know, and all it's it'sstill a lot of friction.
That's why I don't believe thatthe final modality of AI for

(18:41):
shopping has been discoveredyet.
And there's a lot of work to bedone there.

SPEAKER_02 (18:44):
Yeah, and I mean I think it is to your point, you
know, we are being influencedwhere we don't know it.
And I think that's what peopledon't always get behind.

SPEAKER_00 (18:51):
That's our whole career.

SPEAKER_02 (18:52):
That's our whole career.
And I think, you know, TikTok isa source of that.
But you mentioned you tappedinto this earlier, and I think
it's an extra interesting point,which is, you know, it does
become if it's just, you know,repurchase of existing items and
cart, that does just become, youknow, uh like a almost like a
recurring purchase online.
But it's also the hello hangingfruit.

(19:13):
I think it's what's going todrive adoption of AI to actually
make that conversion.
So what we were talking aboutearlier, when will they actually
allow agentic to press thebutton, press the, you know,
purchase now button?
And I think the low-hangingfruit is in those spaces where
they feel comfortable saying,yeah, I buy, you know, I buy, I
buy eggs every week.
I buy the same butter everyweek.

(19:34):
Those are the spaces thatthey're first going to feel
comfortable allowing agentic totake the lead.

SPEAKER_01 (19:38):
Got it.

SPEAKER_02 (19:39):
And then from there, I think then you move into a
space where it becomes sonatural for a gentic to take the
lead, you start allowing it totake the lead to more of those
discovery-based purchases aswell.

SPEAKER_00 (19:48):
Yeah.
Well, good news.
This conversation that you and Ihave just had is the last
conversation that will ever be.

SPEAKER_02 (19:54):
I'm sure agentic topic.

SPEAKER_00 (19:56):
No.
So yeah, a lot more to befigured out, but it is obviously
an exciting topic.
And definitely see someopportunities.
All right.
Let's move on to our next topic.
So there's a terminology, a termthat um has come up on the on
the map called commerce media,right?
So retail media is kind ofevolving into commerce media,

(20:18):
right?
And so, you know, what where I'dlike to start with this is like,
what is your definition ofcommerce media so we can kind of
set the tone, set the stage forthe differences between the two?

SPEAKER_02 (20:29):
Yeah.
I well, I mean, I think commercemedia is a more holistic.
I think retail media has alwaysbeen thought as like this very
simple activation-based, likesingular mode of um of uh
providing tactical levelactivations, but commerce
encompasses so much more.
It's the data, the reporting,the multiple inputs that you
that you have from acapabilities perspective.

(20:51):
So it's a more holistic lens inmy mind than retail media.

SPEAKER_00 (20:55):
Yeah, I think what's what's interesting, you know, so
retail media, while why retailmedia really got its start was
because it had all of thisshopper data, right?
Um, whether there was a loyaltycard or a credit card or a
profile, you know, whether itwas Amazon, Walmart, Kroger,
whomever, right?
They had all of this informationabout you as a shopper.

SPEAKER_01 (21:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (21:17):
Right.
And so then they were able tomonetize that, right?
And so they run advertising andusing using that data.
There are other, and so it wasreally focused on retailer,
whether e-commerce, retailer, etcetera, right?
And then you get to commercemedia, and that it looks like
there are other industries.
Let's say, you know, fintech,for example, you know, like Cap

(21:37):
Capital One or Travel with Deltaor or United, right?
So they say, well, you knowwhat?
That's a really smart idea.
We have data too, we sell stuff,yeah.
And you know, obviously the youknow, commerce is the definition
of selling stuff, selling andbuying, right?
We're going to take advantage ofthat data as well.

(21:59):
And then kind of expanded thisthis network of media that is
not just tied to the retailer.
Now everything is, you know, Ihaven't everything is
everything.
I I say that quite a bit.
Um, but everything is retailmedia.
So I think it's the really likethat expansion of what you know
retail media started to all ofthese other in, you know, all

(22:22):
these other industries that havethis data that they can monetize
it now.
Now you get to thisfractionalization world of like
when do you want that?

SPEAKER_02 (22:33):
So many levers to pull all at once.

SPEAKER_00 (22:35):
So many, you know, so many levers to to to pull.
So I mean, I think that is, youknow, one of my key questions
here.
You know, does this just make itmore complex when you're doing a
plan for a brand at this point?

SPEAKER_02 (22:47):
Yeah.
And I think this kind of speaksalso to what you mentioned
earlier about brand teams stilltrying to understand what retail
media and commerce media trulyis.
And I think it lends itself tothe complexity of the
environment we're working within.
There are a lot of levers thatyou can pull.
But the important component isto pull the right levers.
And I think we get so lost inthe sauce sometimes trying to

(23:09):
understand all of thecapabilities out there across
all retail media networks andall of the data available.
And it can become a lot.
I think the key is to understandyour shopper.
And the shopper has always beencore to this business and
remains the number one tenant.
What does your shopper value?
Where are they at?
And how can you meet them there?
And I think if you're answeringthose questions, then you can

(23:31):
very quickly start to hone in onthe right levers for you to
pull.
So you don't need to be, I, youknow, I've worked with teams
where, you know, they're tryingto work across 32, 33, 34 RMNs
all in their first year ofreally diving into commerce
media.
And what you quickly learn isyou have to scale back.
You have to meet shoppers wherethey sit now predominantly.
And so, you know, there's alwaysthe big players in the room

(23:53):
that, you know, you need, youneed to have a presence on, but
you don't need to be pullingevery lever at the same time.

SPEAKER_00 (23:58):
Yeah, yeah.
I just think, you know, youknow, commerce media is
definitely an interesting, youknow, interesting term.
I I know the IAB, you know,spent some time you know, clear
trying to define that for thefor the industry.
You know, I think, you know,there are going to continue to
be expansions of what commercommerce media means and how
brands will play in commercemedia.

(24:18):
And, you know, we talked aboutthe funnel within the funnel.
Like, I mean, I think I think wemay be on to something there.

SPEAKER_02 (24:25):
We should we should coin that term trademark it
here.

SPEAKER_00 (24:27):
Yes, funnel.
Funnel within the funnel.
You know, because I know peoplelike to say, well, the funnel
has collapsed.
And uh, I get it.
Like everywhere you cantransact, everywhere you can buy
now, right?
There, like, you know, thanks toyou know, mobile phones and
computers, you know, we can doanything at any time, right?
Um, and so I think, you know,we're going to continue to to

(24:48):
see more opportunities andthings are gonna continue to be
fractionalized.
And I think there are gonna besome special sp uh speciality in
certain areas that are gonnacontinue to grow.
And then I think also there'sgonna probably some that are
gonna go away.

SPEAKER_02 (25:01):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (25:02):
Eventually.

SPEAKER_02 (25:03):
Absolutely.
I I think that the evolution ofthis space is so rapid that it's
it's almost hard to keep up.
But at the same time, there's adirectional trend, which is we
have to be able to simplify uhthe complex problems and
translate them into meaningfulaction.
And I think that's somethingwe're we're seeing now.

SPEAKER_00 (25:19):
All right, I'm gonna the next story, we're gonna move
on to the next story.
And so this was one that I thinkstarted off pretty strong early
in the earlier in the year andthen it's kind of faded.
And I think there may be someopportunity for it to come back,
which is talking about in-storeretail media, right?
And I think that's when you lookat the definition of in-store
retail media, I think mostpeople go to screens in-store,

(25:45):
right?
Right.

SPEAKER_02 (25:45):
That is, you know, it's like that's where your
brain goes.

SPEAKER_00 (25:48):
It is, it is, and so I think you know, it it's tough
because that environment is verydifficult to measure, right?
And so whenever you associatethe word retail media with any
tactic, the expectation aroundmeasurement increases
significantly, right?
And I and I and I do think thatthere are some opportunities to

(26:11):
improve measurement and re inin-store retail media.
But this was one that everyone,you know, I know definitely
early in the year people weretalking a bit about until AI
came around and kind of pushedit aside a little bit.
But I think I think there's a alot of lot of opportunity from
your stance, you know, where doyou see in-store retail media?
Is it do you think it, you know,do you think there is an

(26:33):
opportunity for it in 2026?
Do you what what where where doyou see it playing in in your in
your plans?

SPEAKER_02 (26:39):
Yeah.
Well, I mean, we've come fullcircle, haven't we?
I like when I started my shoppermarketing career, you know, 10
plus years ago, I was goingin-store and auditing in-store
signage to understand, you know,what shoppers were seeing at
shelf, uh, you know, in in inthe different uh in-store
environments.
And so we've kind of come fullcircle.
And then now we've got thisdigital media trend where

(27:01):
in-store is suddenly kind ofgonna be this re-emergence.
And we have to say, how are wegonna leverage this um to reach
shoppers?
And what we know is for most thenumber one point of point of
sale.
You know, I mean, to this day,in-store cannot be understated.
And so, you know, I thinkmeasurement is gonna continue to
be key.
Uh, I think there's a lot oftrepidation around measurement

(27:23):
for in-store media.
It's not the same game ason-site.
And I think that's a littlescary, but it has its own use
case, right?
And I think that's where we geta little bit lost sometimes is
we want everything to drivestraight to conversion.
We want it to be highlyattributable.
And while we know what we'redoing in-store from a media
perspective is highlyattributable or highly

(27:45):
attributed, it's not highlyattributable, which means we
can't always track it to thedegree we would like to.
We can look at, you know, storetraffic and store footprint.
We can look at uh sales lift,but we can't always say that
specific piece of signage, thatspecific in-store radio, you
know, spot that I put out waswhat drove it.
It's a piece, it's a factor inthe equation.

(28:06):
Right.
And so it does have a space.
I mean, I think it's in anemerging space in some ways,
ironically, because themeasurement's gonna look
different.
And I think we have to get onboard with that and understand
how it plays alongside whatwe're doing from like an
on-site, off-site perspective.

SPEAKER_00 (28:21):
Yeah.
I mean, it's it should becomplimentary and you know, is
you know, all omni-channel.
So in, you know, we you have anopportunity to influence a
decision in store where 80% ofsales still continue to happen.

SPEAKER_01 (28:33):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (28:34):
It's not at the all-time high of where store
sales used to be, but it'sdefinitely a very significant
part of that.
And so, you know, having thesewhen I used to work at my
foreign agency at Saatchi, weused to think about things in a
zone type of scenario, right?
And there are certain zones thata shopper will go through and
you have that opportunity toinfluence that shopper in those

(28:55):
specific zones.
I think if the uh placement ofthat communication is at the
right, right place and in theright way and served at the
right time, it can influence.
I think the challenge ismeasurement, right?
And again, that's going back tothe original point I made, which
was as soon as we throw the wordretail media in the in the in

(29:16):
the phrase, you know, in-storeretail media, right?
The expectation is measurementis is going to be you know just
as good as a sponsored placementon an e-commerce site.
Not going to be the same, right?
And so, you know, here we aretalking about measurement again.
Hopefully we'll get to that thatthat story here in a second.
But it it is just really, reallyinteresting that um there is

(29:38):
this opportunity.
I think there's been a lot ofexperimentation.
There are very specific networksthat have been you know partner
with you know different storesin order to put signage, but
there's also audio as well,right?
So it's as an opportunity, youknow.
Um and so I've I've played inthat space as as well as you
have.

SPEAKER_02 (29:54):
Yeah.
And and we see the convergence,right?
I mean, I think you know SamsClub is a prime example
launching the Scan and Go unit,you know, this past year, where
Scan and Go is predominantlysomething that, you know, it's
within the Sam's Club app now,but it's something that users uh
shoppers use in store.
And so there are different waysto reach shoppers in store that
aren't just a single digitalsignage.

SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
I mean, there's not a camera watching you in every
place you go in the store.

SPEAKER_02 (30:18):
Not yet.

SPEAKER_00 (30:19):
I mean, well, there is.
So so let's be clear.
That does that technology doesexist.
Absolutely.
Right.
Yeah.
The cameras are good enough inmost stores, especially big, you
know, big masses.

SPEAKER_02 (30:30):
They can identify us.

SPEAKER_00 (30:31):
They can identify us all.
A little creepy, but probably alot of AI in the background and
identifying a lot of key, keydata.

SPEAKER_02 (30:38):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (30:38):
But obviously nobody's using that data for the
these purposes at the at thisstage in the game.

SPEAKER_02 (30:44):
Not yet.
But it's good.
Technology exists.
And I think we'll continue tosee that evolution of in-store
over time.
I mean, I think the technologyis moving in that direction.
It's just, I I always I thinkthat the the value of in-store
is very different.
And so I I think where we wantto apply apply the same tenants
and the same approach toin-store digital media as an

(31:06):
on-site or an off-site, youknow, unit, we have to
understand the logic of it'sjust a different space in the
user journey.
And it's it's often oftenreaching it, uh, even if it's
reaching the same shop or it'sreaching them at a different
point in their purchase cycle.
And so, you know, understandingthose tenants, I think we have
to approach it in its own sortof sphere and separate it a
little bit from what we're doingelsewhere.

SPEAKER_00 (31:27):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It really interesting.
I do think there, there'sdefinitely a role for in-store
retail media.
Um, and I think there's, youknow, some things that still
need to get worked out beforethey it becomes uh it doesn't
definitely definitely doesn'tneed to be in every plan, right?
Right.
But it, you know, in in theright plan, it could it could do
wonders.

SPEAKER_02 (31:44):
And what synergies can you gain from um, you know,
applying and stacking it withother tactics?
You know, if you uh uh assumethey're seeing an on-site ad and
then traveling in store forspecific categories, that's very
common.
We see on-site uh ads having alower attribution rate in
specific categories becausepeople prefer to purchase and
store.
Well, if you're running on-siteads, assuming they're going to

(32:04):
go to the store, then meet themwith uh in-store digital signage
and and run an A-B test.
See in markets where you'veapplied that signage versus not
whether you saw an uptick andpurchase that you know plays
into incrementality and gives uslots of good information.

SPEAKER_00 (32:18):
And the part that I think in that scenario that you
just illustrated was that it isimportant for the messaging to
be consistent.
Right.
You have to think through theentire shopper journey and
ensure that you are consistentin your messaging throughout.
Like if you do a one-off, youknow, you know, let's just say

(32:40):
you take a brand message and youput it on a screen in a store,
but all your other retail mediaactivities are very specific and
tied to a certain cohort and acertain kind of, it's it's not
gonna work, right?
Because it's gonna be verydisjointed and the shopper is
gonna be confused by you knowwhat they potentially saw online
versus what they see in store.

SPEAKER_02 (32:59):
Yeah.
And it's okay to pivot yourmessage in a store, but it needs
to tie into the same shopperinsight and the same
connectivity.
There has to be a connectivityand a bridge between those two.
Because you're right.
If you have pivoting messageleft and right, then there's no
cohesiveness for your brand.
There's no story you're tryingto tell, and you're gonna lose
shoppers.

SPEAKER_00 (33:17):
Right.
Yeah, there should be those samevisual cues and semantically the
same communication, butobviously applicable to that
store or the in-storeenvironment.

unknown (33:26):
Cool.

SPEAKER_00 (33:26):
Awesome.
All right.
So moving on to story numberfive, which is our our last
story, which is something we'vealready hinted on like 18 times
in this conversation.

SPEAKER_02 (33:37):
We're excited about this.

SPEAKER_00 (33:38):
Yes.
Well, I mean, you know, it'smeasurement, right?
So retail media measurementfinally is making progress that
you know we're we're hoping tosee.
I think you and I havedefinitely touched on a lot of
the challenges with measurement,but it continues to be the one
of the things that is discussedthe most um when it comes to you

(34:01):
know uh acquiring budget forcampaigns, you know, choosing
tactics, you know, which whichone, how can I measure that?
How can I ensure I am getting uhthe I-word?
You know what the I-word is,right?

SPEAKER_01 (34:15):
Incrementality.

SPEAKER_00 (34:16):
Incrementality, yes.

SPEAKER_01 (34:18):
Everyone's saying forever.

SPEAKER_00 (34:19):
Everybody loves a little good increment
incrementality.
Um, but and it's it's clear thatthat that definitely needs to
happen.
But I still think that there, aswe just was just discussing
about in-store retail media,we're not gonna be able to
measure everything one-to-one.
Right.
And so, you know, like what aresome of your thoughts on where

(34:40):
where measurement couldpotentially go in in the future?

SPEAKER_02 (34:43):
Yeah, I I think that measurements, uh, it's still, I
would say, I think it's fair tosay disjointed in some ways.
We know that there's stillopportunity in that space, but
there's always gonna be somecomplexity there and that you're
dealing with you, you're tryingto unify measurement across
different retailers, differentretailer environments, uh,
different categories, differentbrands, uh, different

(35:06):
priorities.
And so you've got, you know, Xnumber of factors, and you're
trying to simplify it into acouple of KPIs.
And it's it's never gonna be sosimple as that.
Um, I think there areopportunities for advancement in
measurement.
I think methodology is keybecause I don't think we have
total alignment on attributionwindows, on first touch, last

(35:30):
touch, multi-touch, attribution.
Yeah.
We have retailers and retailmedia networks all over the
place when it comes to thosethings.
We're starting to see somealignment.
You know, you mentionedincrementality a minute ago.
Even where incrementalitymeasurement is often an
end-of-campaign measurement thatdoesn't give us, it's not
something you can do real time.
You have to still optimize onROAS.
And even so, you're not gettingit in the cadence and

(35:53):
consistency that you'd like tosee across retail media
networks.
So I think there's a lot of workto be done just to hit sort of
hit stride, essentially.
We have to, we have to define asan as an industry what are those
key metrics for success and howare how are we going to measure
them?
Not just what they are, but howwe measure them.
Um, and until we can do that,we're never really gonna hit our

(36:15):
stride.
I think we're gonna leave, youknow, if I if I'm speaking
directly to these retail medianetworks, until we uh unify on
those measurement methodologies,we're gonna leave dollars on the
table for from brands becausethey are trying to tell a story
internally of growth andrevenue.
And if they can't provide thatholistic story using your data,
they're gonna have to lean intotheir own.

(36:37):
Um, and so I I think that youknow it's it's storytelling as
much as anything that that isgonna um lend itself to that
unification of measurement.

SPEAKER_00 (36:46):
Yeah, it's interesting because I I feel
like in retail media, the defacto measurement is ROAS.
But I have been in a millionconversations that everyone
says, I hate ROAS.

SPEAKER_01 (36:59):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (37:00):
Because ROAS doesn't tell me that it doesn't line up
with my sales sheet.

SPEAKER_01 (37:04):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (37:04):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (37:05):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (37:05):
And so how do you square those circles?
Right.
Like, how do you make those twothings come together?
Because I again I've been inconversations where I don't some
people are okay with model data.
Some conversations people arenot okay with model data.
Right.
Like there's so many differentfacets to this this thing.
And it's hard to get your armsaround and tell a consistent

(37:25):
message.
So you dumb it down, call itdumb it down, to ROAS.
Yeah.
And then be everybody then theindustry pop comes back and
says, I hate ROAS.
It has to be I ROAS now, right?
Right.
So, you know, what are yourthoughts?

SPEAKER_02 (37:36):
I think, well, and I think ROAS in and of itself, you
know, it's an imperfectmeasurement.
I think we all know that.
And it's it's been a it's beenthe most unified measurement
we've been able to achieve.
And I think that's why it'salways sort of like the bread
and butter of every plan has tobe ROAS.
But even if you get into the thethe weeds of that, you know, how
you define an item set withinROAS, are you using a Halo set

(37:57):
or a feature set?
And is your feature set includedin your Halo set?
Another big question I oftenwrite into.
There's there's complexitieseven there.
And I would just say this ROASis an indicator for success.
It's not a driver, right?
So if if your sales datainternally as a brand doesn't
align with what you're seeing inyour numbers from like a ROAS
perspective, understand whatthat misalignment is so you can

(38:20):
make your data stronger.
It's not that Roas needs to beyour end-all, be-all.
It should be an indicator ofsuccess.
And so I think that um it'salways gonna be a measurement on
the table.
I don't think it's the exclusivemeasurement and I think it's
imperfect.
But I think as um reporting andand data analysis and
methodology get stronger, Ithink we're gonna see some of

(38:42):
these metrics emerge as like ourpoints of truth, and those are
gonna be able to be utilized ina way they just aren't today.

SPEAKER_00 (38:48):
Yeah.
I think you know, some of thiscomes down to like whoever is
looking at the numbers, right?
And what level of sophisticationthey have in the understanding
of everything in in this spaceand really why you use ROAS.
I like the idea of you knowusing it as an indicator, but
not the end all be all.
But yeah, I mean, you and I havebeen in briefings where the

(39:09):
goal, the objective is three X,you know, three X ROAS every
time.
It's every time.

SPEAKER_01 (39:15):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (39:15):
You know, and and you know, you're doing
everything obviously to try toachieve that, but you know, it's
not always it's not always ifyou're just a number on a on a
paper.

SPEAKER_02 (39:25):
One the one thing that no brand ever wants to
hear, but I think is the realityin many cases, it's you're gonna
sacrifice on ROAS in order toachieve broader awareness.
If you want to grow, if you ifyou have a new and emerging item
or you need to uh steal share,that's expensive.
And you're gonna sacrificeyou're often gonna sacrifice on

(39:46):
ROAS when you're trying to buildbrand equity in a commerce
environment.
And I just I think it's a toughpill to swallow.
And it's part of why ROAS can'tbe our end all be all, right?
Is sometimes we need to makesure a Walmart shop or a Target
Shopper is even aware that thisitem is available at shelf, much
less to buy it.
And so I think we that you'rejust gonna make sacrifices at

(40:08):
times on realise.
And that's that's a very toughstory to try to tell.

SPEAKER_00 (40:12):
I mean, to be fair, clients want it all.

SPEAKER_02 (40:14):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (40:14):
I want a high role.

SPEAKER_02 (40:16):
I want it all too.

SPEAKER_00 (40:17):
And so, like, yes, I want everybody to know about my
product.
I want everybody to buy myproduct.
Right.
And then I want, you know, wantit all.
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (40:25):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (40:26):
But like it's those that are sophisticated enough to
understand like the trade-offsin within that.
And so I think it's, you know,um on the strategist to try to
do their best to inform clientsand try to, you know, help them
understand the the biggerpicture so that they can in turn
tell others, you know, the aboutthe bigger picture as well.

SPEAKER_02 (40:47):
Yeah.
And and there's complexities.
I I know I keep mentioningstorytelling, and it's kind of
in my word of the year in manyways, because I think part of
the challenge of ROAS and oftrying to tell a story is it's
not always the shop or marketinglead who it doesn't grasp or
understand that complexity.
It's often they're goingin-house internally and they're
trying to explain to their salesteam or their brand counterparts

(41:10):
why they've sacrificed on ROASbecause they really just need to
drive awareness that this iseven available at shelf, or they
need to still share.
And that's a complex story forthem to try to tell internally
as well.
And so where they may have thisbroad breadth of knowledge on
how these different componentsof a plan work, they still have
to tell the story internally.
And I think it's ourresponsibility to help them tell

(41:30):
that story.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (41:31):
Yeah.
Awesome.
Well, big year for retail mediafor sure.
I think 2026 is going to beanother big year for retail
media.
Um, obviously, these are youknow just a handful of the big
stories from from this year.
Uh, appreciate you know yourperspective on all of these.
And um, yeah, we're gonna we'regonna move on now to our retail

(41:54):
media word of the year.
All right.
All right, Lindsay.
Well, we're gonna get to thepoint where we have to decide
what is our retail media word ofthe year.
So these are words that wereused quite often, not as much as
synergy.

SPEAKER_02 (42:10):
Not as much as synergy, my favorite word.

SPEAKER_00 (42:12):
Your favorite word, but but words that were used in
this space that were verybuzzworthy and notable.
Yeah.
Okay, in in in the world thatyou and I live in.

SPEAKER_02 (42:22):
This is a lot of pressure.
I'm nervous.
Okay, this is good.

SPEAKER_00 (42:25):
We have five candidates for the retail media
word of the year.
So we'll walk through each ofthe five and then you'll have to
help decide what is that retailmedia word of the year.

SPEAKER_02 (42:36):
All right, I'll do my best.

SPEAKER_00 (42:37):
The audience is counting on him.
All right.

SPEAKER_02 (42:40):
Won't let him down.
Not this time.

SPEAKER_00 (42:42):
All right.
So the first word is actually aword that we hit on in our
previous segment.
Incrementality.

SPEAKER_01 (42:49):
One of my favorites.

SPEAKER_00 (42:51):
Yeah.
So that became the word thateverybody decided to care about
when it comes to measurement forretail media in 2025.
Um, you know, how you how do youwhat do you think how are you
feeling about that word,incrementality?

SPEAKER_02 (43:04):
You know, it's a it's a good one.
I it's one I've heard in many,many rooms this year, but I'm
not sure it's my word of theyear.
I think it's an importantcomponent of the puzzle.

SPEAKER_00 (43:13):
All right.

SPEAKER_02 (43:14):
It's a part of measurement, but I don't know if
it's the word of the year.

SPEAKER_00 (43:16):
All right, all right.
All right, word number two.
Okay.
It's and this is cheatingbecause there's actually three,
three actors, three actors.

SPEAKER_02 (43:23):
Lies.
I was lied to really listen,like the audience.

SPEAKER_00 (43:26):
Sorry about that.
So SEO, AEO, and GEO.
So these three little friendshere have been traveling around
together for the last four, fouror five months, right?
And so, you know, traditionalSEO is expanded into AEO, and
now we've got our GEO.
So um, so like these have had animpact on how we look at retail,

(43:50):
how we look at shopping, how welook at discovery, as we've
already talked about.
So, how are you thinking aboutthis, this, these words I
cheated with?

SPEAKER_02 (43:59):
I yes.
I, you know, I think it's it'sthe future.
I think maybe the word of the2026, honestly, because I don't
think we've figured out how theEOs, I'm gonna call them them,
Brandon, and the EOs have uhworked together yet.
I think we're trying to turnthem all into SEO, but I'm not
sure we've quite figured out ormastered how to differentiate
just yet.
So I think that's that may bethe 2026 word, not to spoil the

(44:22):
the December 2026.

SPEAKER_00 (44:24):
But I'll have to have you back for the wrap up
second.
That's perfect 2028.

SPEAKER_02 (44:27):
I'll I'll I'll pop in just for that segment.
Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 (44:31):
I'm already I have you booked.

SPEAKER_02 (44:33):
Perfect.

SPEAKER_00 (44:33):
All right.
So all right, so that was wordnumber two.
Okay.
Words number two.
Word number three.
Oh boy, agentic.
Oh everything now is agentic.

SPEAKER_01 (44:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (44:45):
Nobody works anymore.
Everything uh it's all agents,right?
We don't work anymore.
Uh agents are doing all the allthe shopping.
I mean, yeah, I think we'rewe're uh we've got a good right
now, right?
So we how do you feel about thatword, agentic?

SPEAKER_02 (44:58):
You know, it's it's a strong contender.
That might take the bag becauseagentic is uh the the word on
everyone's lips right now and ineveryone's minds.
How do we how do we capitalizeon this?
So I'm gonna put that near thetop of the list.
Let's see what else you've got.

SPEAKER_00 (45:13):
All right.
Next word number four, this isone you like.

SPEAKER_02 (45:17):
Ooh, okay, I'm ready.

SPEAKER_00 (45:18):
AI slot.

SPEAKER_02 (45:21):
It's a favorite, it's a real favorite.

SPEAKER_00 (45:24):
So, you know, that word slop, you know, is this
generation of low qualitycontent, we'll say assets in a
lot of different ways.
Yeah.
It's just flooding into media ina lot of different ways.
Everybody sees it on social.

SPEAKER_01 (45:40):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (45:41):
Um, you know, there's work slop, right?
Claire and I talked about workslop a little bit a few episodes
ago.
Um, you know, so AI Slop is, youknow, it it's it's it's
definitely one that's had animpact.

SPEAKER_02 (45:53):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (45:54):
Um, what do you how are you feeling about AI Slop?

SPEAKER_02 (45:56):
I think culturally, AI slot might be the it's the
negative word of theater.
It's harming, it's harming ourability to create great content
from an AI perspective.
But I do love that word.
That might be that might be acontender as well.
Okay, we'll keep it on the list.
I'll decide at the end.

SPEAKER_00 (46:12):
All right, all right.
And so the last nominee for theaward is omnichannel.
And omnichannel is aninteresting one because it's
kind of a legacy word.
And sometimes when you use it,it sounds dated, but then at the
same time, it does includeeverything that happens within
retail media.

SPEAKER_01 (46:32):
Right.

SPEAKER_00 (46:32):
So I mean, it has a legacy, it's still relevant.
People don't want to use it, butthey still use it anyway.
Yeah.
So it has a very interestingposition in in in in this last
year.
What are your thoughts onomnichannel?

SPEAKER_02 (46:46):
I have to tell you, I have history with this word.
I remember way back in the day,I put omni channel strategist on
my resume.
I thought I was really on tosomething with that.

SPEAKER_00 (46:55):
That means multi-channel.

SPEAKER_02 (46:56):
That's I mean, I was pretty proud of myself.
No, I think it doesn't go awaybecause we haven't found a
better word for it.
And there's something to that.
There is something to it.

SPEAKER_00 (47:04):
Yeah.
So I much as we want to kick itto the curve, right?
As much as we want to come back.

SPEAKER_02 (47:09):
It keeps coming back around.
It's too important to us.
So another strong contender.

SPEAKER_00 (47:13):
Like basin in a Friday to 13.

SPEAKER_02 (47:15):
We can't we can't get rid of it.
Yeah, it just keeps haunting usin the best possible way.

SPEAKER_00 (47:20):
All right.
So to recap the words,incrementality.
Number two is A uh SEO, AEO, andGEO, the little EO twins.

SPEAKER_02 (47:30):
Yeah, true.
You cheated on that one, butthat's okay.

SPEAKER_00 (47:32):
Agentic.

SPEAKER_02 (47:33):
Agentic, okay.

SPEAKER_00 (47:35):
AI slop.

SPEAKER_02 (47:37):
I love that word.
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (47:38):
And then the last one was omnichannel.
That just that that word, thatlegacy word that just sticks
around.
So is it time to decide?
No press no no pressure, butyes.

SPEAKER_02 (47:48):
Do you have any drum roll?
Can I get a little will the micpick it up?

SPEAKER_00 (47:52):
Uh yes, probably we'll pick it up and feel free
to drum roll.
Uh, but yeah, what do you whatdo you think?

SPEAKER_02 (47:58):
I mean, I I think it's I think it's a non-starter.
I think um there's one word thatstands well and uh far above the
others in terms of the year, theword of the year.

SPEAKER_00 (48:09):
Okay.

SPEAKER_02 (48:10):
It's the winner all around in all categories, BB,
and that is agentic.

SPEAKER_00 (48:14):
Agentic.

SPEAKER_02 (48:15):
Well, well done.

SPEAKER_00 (48:16):
Yeah, agentic.
Yeah, I can that is definitelythe word that everywhere it it
you know it started the year.
So I think the interesting thingabout agentic.
So, you know, I was at CES lastyear um at the beginning of
2025, and agentic and it youknow was everything I heard.
And you know, so many talks thatI went to, they were talking

(48:37):
about agents and agentic, andyou know, and to be honest, I
you know, I worked for an AIcompany that we are very
agentic, like the the workflowsand how we build creative uh is
in an agentic way.
And so, and just being appliedusing the word and using the
technology, the agent, yeah,agents to do things on on your

(49:00):
behalf is continuing to getbetter and better and better.
And I think you know, there'sgonna be a lot of advancements
continuing into 2026.
So I I I I agree with you onyour word of the year.

SPEAKER_02 (49:11):
Wow, look at us.

SPEAKER_00 (49:12):
Well done.

SPEAKER_02 (49:13):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (49:14):
Well done.

SPEAKER_02 (49:14):
It's the word of the hour, the minute, the hour, the
second, the month, yeah.
That is uh what everybody'sthinking about.

SPEAKER_00 (49:21):
All right.
Well, you definitely have tocome back for next year's show.

SPEAKER_02 (49:24):
I would love to.

SPEAKER_00 (49:25):
We'll see what happens.
All right, we'll see whathappens.
Okay.
All right, here we go.
This is the the wrap up of thisshow where we get into a little
fun.
Not that we haven't had funthroughout, but it's all fun.
But so we're gonna we're gonnado something a little different.
We're gonna do our bold vibes.

SPEAKER_01 (49:43):
Wow.

SPEAKER_00 (49:44):
And so this is where I throw out some bold statements
about retail media, marketing,maybe a little pop culture for
some things that might happen in2026, and I'm gonna get your gut
reaction.
So no long answers, no.

SPEAKER_02 (50:01):
That's hard for me, BB.
Yeah, the short answers.

SPEAKER_00 (50:05):
But I do want your your feelings.

SPEAKER_02 (50:08):
Yeah.
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (50:08):
All right.
Are you are you ready?
So I have seven of these.

SPEAKER_02 (50:11):
As ready as I'll ever be.

SPEAKER_00 (50:12):
Seven of these.

SPEAKER_02 (50:13):
Okay, you ready?

SPEAKER_00 (50:14):
All right.
Number one creative, nottargeting, will finally become
the number one performance leverfor retail media teams to focus
on in 2026.

SPEAKER_02 (50:26):
Oh, I hate to say this for all my creative
friends, but no.

SPEAKER_00 (50:29):
No.

SPEAKER_02 (50:30):
I don't think so yet.
I think it's it's it's coming.
Their day is coming.
Their day in the sun is coming,but not yet.

SPEAKER_00 (50:36):
All right.
Here's a hot take.
Amazon will attempt to acquireInstacart.

SPEAKER_02 (50:41):
Oh stocks.
Um I, you know, why buy what youcan build, BV?
I don't know.
I I think they've tried, but Idon't think they're gonna buy
it.

SPEAKER_00 (50:51):
I think they're gonna build it.
All right.
Oh, okay.
Cracker Barrel.
That's always always a good oneyou start with Cracker Barrel.
Cracker Barrel will attemptanother logo change in 2026.

SPEAKER_02 (51:02):
It's gonna be a hard pass.
Hard pass.
Never do it.
I don't think they're gonnastart to sneak it in.
I don't think they're gonna dothat for the next 50 to 100
years.
BB, that's that's stuck whereit's where it sits for now.

SPEAKER_00 (51:14):
Okay.
Next one retail mediameasurement will actually become
standardized 2026.

SPEAKER_02 (51:20):
You know, I think I think it's gonna take a lot of
steps in the right direction.
I don't think it's gonna fullystandardize, but it's gonna be a
lot closer.

SPEAKER_00 (51:27):
Okay.
Next, agentic shopping willgrow, but nowhere near as much
as everyone is predicting.

SPEAKER_02 (51:35):
Oh, I think it's gonna grow in different ways
than people are predicting.
I think we still have thatbarrier to actual purchase that
agentic has to overcome.
And I think that could slowthings down on the purchase
front, but I think it's gonnaevolve in other ways that we
can't yet predict.

SPEAKER_00 (51:50):
Okay.
All right.
The next one AI will generate atleast 50% of all ads.

SPEAKER_02 (51:59):
Uh yes.
I think and maybe not next year,but I think I think we will get
there eventually.

SPEAKER_00 (52:05):
I think it's what percentage you would you put on
tonight.

SPEAKER_02 (52:08):
Oh, I'm gonna go with a very specific number of
34%.

SPEAKER_00 (52:13):
Oh, I I like 34% as okay.
All right, last one.
This is probably the mostimportant one of all seven.

SPEAKER_02 (52:20):
Ready.

SPEAKER_00 (52:21):
Taylor Swift.
Oh my Taylor Swift will televiseher wedding and it will be
bigger than the Super Bowl.
So whether it's on a streamingservice or whatever, but she
will find a way to have herwedding out there for people to
watch, and it will have moreviewers than the Super Bowl.

SPEAKER_02 (52:39):
You know, if she televised her wedding, I think
she absolutely would have moreviewers to Super Bowl.
But you know, I'm not as I'm notas big of a Swifty.
I I appreciate her music, butI'm I haven't followed her the
way some have.
My Swifty friends, I think,would tell me that there's no
way, there's no way she'dtelevise it.
All right as much as we'd allenjoy it.

SPEAKER_00 (52:56):
Okay, all right, awesome.
Well, nice, nice job, Lindsay.
You got got through the boldvibes.

SPEAKER_02 (53:02):
That was the hardest part right there.

SPEAKER_00 (53:04):
Well, of course it was.
I mean, that's I always say thehardest part for thee.

SPEAKER_02 (53:07):
That's it.

SPEAKER_00 (53:08):
Well, it's time to wrap this episode up.
All right, well, that's a wrapon this episode of Retail Media
Vibes.
I want to say thank you to ourguest, Lindsay, who helped me
recap 2025.

SPEAKER_02 (53:20):
This is a good year.
This is a great year, honestly.

SPEAKER_00 (53:23):
It was just it was pretty good.
Yeah, a lot, definitely a lot totalk about.
That was definitely a blast, alot of fun.
I'm happy to have you on theshow uh today.
Is there anything that you oranyone that you want to shout
out or anything you want to plugbefore we wrap this one up?

SPEAKER_02 (53:38):
You know, there is one major shout out that I would
like to make, and that is toretail media vibes.
What?
Because, and I said this to youearlier before the podcast, V V,
but I'm gonna say it again.
I think you're filling a veryunique space in Northwest
Arkansas.
They need content like this.
Um, there is so much movement inthe Northwest Arkansas area

(53:58):
around this exact topic.
And there's a space that needsto be filled where educational
content is coming out aboutwhere people are discussing the
movements being made.
And I think retail media vibesis achieving just that.
So retail media vibes is theshout out of 2025.

SPEAKER_00 (54:12):
Yeah.
I yeah, I I appreciate Iappreciate that.
You know, we do we do um reallytry to put on a good show here
and have great guests likeyourself on on and you know talk
about the topics that arerelevant to you know what
everyone else is is talkingabout.
There's so much going on in thisspace.
But I also want to say a specialthank you to you for joining

(54:32):
this, joining me today becauseit was a last minute request.
So we had a cancellation,unplanned cancellation, and you
were happened to be available.
And you live in Cincinnati, youdon't live here anymore.

SPEAKER_02 (54:43):
I drew 12 hours to get here just for this, no.
But I would have.

SPEAKER_00 (54:47):
Oh, and I and I I I I appreciate that.
And I think it's so nice to havepeople who you can count on,
people who show up for eachother.
I think that's you know, thatwas one thing I learned, I
think, this year.
Um, is like who shows up for foryou?
Right.
When when you you know need ahand or just some encouragement,

(55:09):
you know, or if you're doingsomething like a podcast or
you're doing an event, like whoshows up for you?
Who's there?
You know, who brings theirpresence?
And you know, it's super, supergreat that you were able to, you
know, be here for that.
But I think for me, that's oneof the things that I learned in
this this year is you knowshowing up for showing up for

(55:31):
people.
And yeah, it's it's a it's it'sa simple sometimes it's just a
simple thing that anybody can dofor each other.
So, you know, find someone thatyou can show, show up for.
If somebody invites you tosomething, it doesn't have to
be, you know, this podcast ortalk that I'm doing or anything
like that.
But if there's somebody outthere that's doing something,
you know, support them and tryto help them as much as as much
as you can and just be there forthem.

(55:52):
I think they can go a long wayand you know, build the
community that we all want tobuild around, you know, whether
it's you know in marketing andretail media or even even beyond
that as well.

SPEAKER_02 (56:02):
So there are people who are real connectors in this
industry and they're the peoplethat have the all the energy and
all the movement is around thework that they do.
And I think you're one of thoseconnectors, Vivi.
So keep doing the work you'redoing.

SPEAKER_00 (56:12):
It's a gift, just fine give.
So uh all right.
So if you have a question orfeedback, you can hit me up at
retailmedia vibes at gmail.com.
And so I would just want to say,you know, thank you for tuning
in.
Thank you for listening.
And as always, I promise to dobetter next time.
Be the out of the day.