November 3, 2024 • 66 mins
This episode I take you to Kolkata the capital city of West Bengal, a state in the east of India. Although Kolkata is known as the 'city of joy', it is also known as having one of the largest red-light districts in Asia and is one of India's largest human trafficking hubs.
Today I will be speaking to Smarita Sengupta, the founder of the NGO Destiny Reflection which began in 2007. Destiny aims to disrupt the cycles of sexual exploitation and human trafficking in Kolkata. Destiny and Smarita have won numerous awards nationally and internationally for their dedicated work.
Smarita has a beautiful authenticity about her, and I hope you enjoy learning more about her and the journey of Destiny.
Follow Destiny Reflection:
Website: https://www.destinyreflection.org/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/destinyreflection
Instagram: destiny.reflection & madebydestinyreflection
Some resources I mention:
Shop ethical: https://ethical.org.au/
Documentary: 'Stolen Innocence' https://youtu.be/eTtBnPxNpYs?si=Cz2gdJPpQk2t0h-6
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hello world family and welcome to Ripples of Humanity.
(00:06):
I'm Rachel Thompson and through this podcast I'm sharing interesting stories along my travels
of people, projects and initiatives I discover that are contributing to positive ripples
throughout humanity.
In this episode I am taking you to Kolkata, the capital city of the state of West Bengal
in the east of India.
So although Kolkata is known as the city of joy, it is also known as having one of the
(00:31):
largest red light districts in Asia and one of India's largest trafficking hubs.
Today I'll be speaking to Smriti Sengupta, the founder of the NGO Destiny Reflection,
which began in 2007.
The aim of Destiny is to disrupt the cycles of sexual exploitation and human trafficking
(00:51):
in Kolkata.
Destiny and Smriti have won numerous awards nationally and internationally for its work
and I'm really excited to share the conversation with Smriti today.
Just firstly, I first met Smriti in 2016, so eight years ago now.
It was my second trip to India and this time in India I planned to stay for six months.
(01:14):
I just finished my month long yoga teacher training that was in Rishikesh and I knew
that I wanted to stay in one place after that and volunteer somewhere for the remaining
five months.
But at that time I had no idea where or what I wanted to do.
I had previously heard of Kolkata because I shared a mutual friend with someone who
was living in Kolkata and started an NGO there, but I knew nothing about this city of over
(01:40):
15 million people and I just had a feeling that Kolkata was where I needed to be and
I had a feeling I needed to be working with children.
So after some online research I was led to this NGO called New Light Foundation and I
reached out to them and then before I knew it I was on a plane to Kolkata.
(02:01):
So just briefly, New Light Foundation have many, many programs that support children
and youth of sex workers and at risk children and youth in Kolkata.
It was then through New Light that I met Smriti and some of the women from Destiny at an event.
Smriti I remember had this really bright, enthusiastic and warm energy about her and
(02:26):
she invited me to come along and see what Destiny was all about.
So I made some time to visit Destiny and to get a real feel for what the organization
was about and I was so glad I did.
I remember when I arrived there I just felt so welcomed and warm.
I also fell in love with the social enterprise branch of Destiny where women survivors of
(02:49):
trafficking are trained and then employed to make really beautiful products that are
sold nationally and internationally and profits and then redirected back into Destiny.
For those who are close to me or have come to my yoga classes you probably know about
or own one of the handmade yoga mat bags made from recycled sari material.
(03:12):
It was a really funny story when I first went to Destiny and saw the yoga mat bags I just
found them so beautiful and I wanted to bring some back to Australia to see if I could sell
them so I bought about 20 bags and then when I was going back to Australia I tried to put
(03:33):
them all in my luggage.
It was such a scene at the airport because turns out my luggage was too heavy and they
were going to charge me like $300 excess for the luggage and I didn't want to pay that
so I didn't want to get rid of the yoga mat bags so I was at the airport unloading stuff
(03:56):
and I just remember having so many yoga mat bags like sprawled across the floor of the
airport and all my belongings everywhere just trying to work out what to throw out, what
I wanted to, what I needed to take back to Australia, what I might be able to leave in
a small bag in India for a friend to come and collect.
So it all worked out in the end I left a small bag with some of my belongings that a friend
(04:19):
came to the rescue and I would hope that I'd come back to India one day to collect it.
It turns out over two years later I returned to Kolkata and reunited with my bag so that
was great but I had room then for the, I had weight left for the yoga mat bags and for
(04:39):
the necessities that I needed to bring back to Australia so that was definitely an experience.
And then over the years when I got back to Australia over the years I think I sold and
gifted over a hundred of the yoga mat bags to people and it just brings me so much joy
when I see someone in my hometown, Geelong, using one of the bags and every time I would
(05:08):
sell one of the bags it just brought me right back to destiny and the cause and what they're
doing and yeah it's a really special organisation and I hope you enjoy the conversation I have
with Smarita to learn a bit more.
(05:28):
And once again India got me and during the conversation with Smarita there was some unavoidable
construction noises going on in the background so I did the best I could to minimise the
sound without damaging the audio quality too much but it's all a big learning process for
me trying to edit out background noise and if anyone has any good recommendations for
(05:56):
reducing background noise without damaging the audio quality too much then please let
me know I am open to any teachings.
Thank you and apologies again for that disruption in the evening conversation with Smarita.
Thank you so much for joining me Smarita.
(06:16):
When I first had the vision for doing this podcast you were one of the people that came
into my mind as someone who I actually really wanted to speak to.
Since I've met you you've been someone who's really inspired me and remembered the energy
you bring to your work and the cause that you're working for and it's made a powerful
(06:37):
impact on my life when I first met you.
Yeah I still remember the day we met, the time we met.
I'd love to start by taking a step back in time to when you first envisioned destiny
reflection coming and what was your what inspired you what was your motivation?
(07:00):
Yeah very interesting question and I would say like it is about what bothers you.
I think there used to be several things which has been bothering me when I have grown up
growing up years going to college or maybe the first break somewhere as an intern, volunteer
(07:23):
etc.
So I think the first botheration was the discrimination like why few people are like that and why
there's so much of clusters and kind of divides and also like some toxic people toxic environment.
(07:46):
Those were all my what I gathered you know from at different stages of life anyway and
I think that turned into choosing I consider those experiences maybe when I had the opportunity
to decide what I want to do what I want to take up seriously.
(08:08):
So this is how I would say destiny came to me and then I choose kind of both ways.
I like how you say destiny came to you and when you say that what do you mean?
Yeah by destiny is the name of the organization as you know so I would rather say the work
(08:29):
chose me and I also choose the work that happened together.
So for a long time I was very unclear like I opted for a couple of jobs completed my
education and then I felt I don't know I didn't feel like why I am doing this and I am not
getting the kind of interest I should be.
(08:51):
I used to do every work I used to do very carefully, properly, perfectly that was my
trend but you know the other part was missing like the content.
Yeah and I thought I have a lot of energy to do something else something more and what
is that?
Were you working in the like for an NGO or in the social sector?
(09:12):
Yeah I got into because I started working in a very young age like I did small job when
I was in college also so I was very much into that work so I was getting experience rather.
So yeah so when I landed a non-profit yeah I landed a non-profit and I had hardly any
clue like what non-profits are like except that they are giving agencies to give kind
(09:37):
of apart from that.
And then I faced some toxic part of it also that why questions lot of questions why this
why this why not this etc etc and then I met a couple of women young children in the red
light area and then I went for a re-exhaust so they screen small children with the police
(10:02):
of course from the brothel etc red light area or private houses where they had been trafficked
or in route to trafficking etc.
Were they in Khaukhara?
Yeah those were in Kolkata and in Sabaabs also around Kolkata.
So every bit you know like made me think question and then I went to the root cause I got to
(10:25):
know why is this happening like why they why not me or why not someone else.
Then I realized that it is society is responsible and there is something which we can do and
this cause is and the reason of the cause is hidden in our society in different different
(10:46):
ways.
So this is how I got to start and then it took shape and now we are here we are 15,
16 years old and the journey is also big big learning.
I can imagine you face some challenges along the way.
(11:11):
Yeah of course.
What's been in creating an NGO and starting it from you started it from scratch it was
your baby that you started.
What was the biggest challenge to get it to get it started?
I think the missing but I never thought I will I wanted to contribute to this but that
(11:34):
doesn't mean that I'll have to start something and own something or lead something so it
pushed me because I saw some gaps I noticed and I always felt like this could have been
done that way this way so that was one of the reason and the second hesitation was you
know like question myself am I able to do it.
(11:57):
You know my God I'm going to start our organization that was that is something so then I found
a couple of people around me who actually say that why don't you do it you can do it
actually so that's a big piece that one line that you can do it.
(12:19):
Who were those people do you remember?
Yeah I still remember I met a Canadian professor who is my age kind of we can close and then
I used to tell her about the frustrations and she was she came as a volunteer here to
work with different charities etc and she also like we were kind of at the same page
(12:44):
like and then suddenly she said I think you will do a better job.
You are all about it.
Is it me?
Yes.
Why not you?
Yes I am very much in touch with those people.
I mean I'm very lucky that way that she's not the only one of the she may be the first
one if I could remember but and then I continuously kept meeting people who are who thinks the
(13:10):
same way.
Yeah.
Do you feel like you were guided to meet those people?
Yeah I believe in that I believe in hard work I believe in planning strategy also but at
the same time there are divine interventions also which are all together.
So what was that of the first things you did when you were starting Destiny to get it going
(13:34):
off the ground from the very beginning?
Yeah I mean the setting up the organization.
Yeah.
So I got involved even before there was a transition kind of setting up the organization
or I am already into the work and I remember I happened to bring a survivor girl to my
(13:56):
house and I didn't plan it that way it just happened she needed a place and then I bought
her home so several I made several small you know experiences which became very meaningful
at the later stage of time.
So when I started the organization I think I had to do a lot of what you call it registration
(14:18):
work etc etc etc which took a lot of time but I think we kept on working even if even
before we were actually registered on paper etc.
Yeah.
I kept on working because I was involved and I have been you know been into it.
And what did that work look like at that time?
(14:39):
Yeah it is a lot of like I would say counselling I think talking to people I mean they would
reach out for some problem solving solutions or the next steps finding so that was very
much involved and then we got connected with couple of shelter homes.
(15:03):
And if you could explain shelter homes?
Different shelter homes where you know young girls they mostly were rescued from trafficking
net or orphan or have some family problem or domestic violence so they are generally
housed by the government or non-government homes.
So generally it could be 0 to 18 years of any age girls.
(15:26):
So by the time I have already been started going to those shelter homes and developed
relationship with many of the children and young adults.
So even though there were no funds I kept going, fund was not a problem like I could
go and meet them that was one part of it and then already by the time I knew bunch of them
(15:51):
they needed work and then we started the production unit and only thing they know is hand work
or something handicraft creative work etc.
So we started that and that was in the planning process in the thought process because we
realized that income generation is a very important crucial thing.
(16:14):
Your own income gives you dignity, gives you a voice, helps you decide for yourself decision
making so combat violence or resist exploitation.
So for me I always thought that livelihood generation would be the first thing which
(16:36):
can follow with several others and then we started the production unit immediately and
by the time we also apparently had the relationships as I mentioned with the shelter homes, the
young, the children and then we started the unit with five girls and it was a small set
(17:02):
up and I found someone who were willing to support it also by that time, to support it
financially a little bit so that when we are independent we won't need that support.
What's your experience been like with funding Destiny?
This is interesting so I knew from the very beginning before I started that funding won't
(17:31):
be easy, why would people give me money?
I haven't proved anything.
So I was prepared that why would people give me money?
That was I always had that big question so and then again some incident happened and
funding came to us like from the people who I met who were surrounding me and so I think
(18:03):
the problem was not only one level, I think funding challenge was later because I didn't
know that I needed a lot of money to start to do that so we somehow we gathered that
money to pay for a rent and have startup production unit and we got the first order also, first
(18:26):
one or two jobs so I would say it wasn't the only problem.
I think I realized the problems where the first problem was I think to develop myself
because I realized very soon that I have taken a big responsibility and it is not only like
you know that okay I dream about that and so I thought I need to you know skill myself
(18:53):
and increase our network and so that was my first realization.
Also understand the issue deeply.
I'd love to talk about the issue, so the issue that Destiny Reflections is trying to
address and where that fits into the broader systemic issue of trafficking.
(19:16):
Yeah it is a deep level question you have asked so that also took me some time to understand
as I mentioned we just only know the top sign I could see the people suffering or I could
see this is like modern slavery is a largest illegal profit making business in the world
(19:40):
so those information came to me you know as I was working and then my curiosity got deeper
and learned more about this so it is definitely systemic it is in the system and modern slavery
is quite broad it also covers you know cheap labels cheap clothes and which is everywhere
(20:06):
all over the world so which means clearly that some people are making money and some
people are getting expirited out of that so that became very clear to us and also that
the organization like us we are fighting for it we need ecosystem to get supported otherwise
(20:30):
I don't think I can you know fight for a crime which is so big large all over the world so
then the realization came that I can do it myself alone or in a small team it has to
be in a bigger I have to expand the circle so we went out of India also it happened so
some fellowships etc. I was able to cross the border and so this is it how we also expanded
(21:00):
our network because the crime we are challenging is big so we also need bigger strength and
circle and have you found networks have been welcoming to that collaboration definitely
yes and no both because everywhere you know if one network is already very established
(21:22):
and suddenly I want to get in again you haven't proved yourself why would they partner with
you or why would they fund you or why would they you know collaborate with you that has
always remained a big challenge and also it has not been an easy task for me but at the
same time I think I broke that challenge through individual people who I was able to involve
(21:48):
them into my mission and my network also expanded through the leadership courses I got selected
Ford fellowship and global women leadership network those gave me exposures to meet people
and there I found some like-minded people and also people with same vision yeah so that
(22:08):
helped me break those barriers but till date I think networking I mean partnership building
is not really easy it isn't easy especially with different stakeholders if I'm in non-profit
to non-profit is different if I want to talk to other stakeholders it is challenging yeah
(22:30):
what's been your biggest personal challenge you've had to overcome in this journey I think
personal challenge I went through a lot of health challenges and not only me my family
also that is biggest I was almost I got into stroke situation several times that is one
(22:55):
of the challenge and I said continuously building myself I don't have a degree of a international
big university or something I am educated I do have degrees but I realized like people
are better than me they're presenting better so continuously you know developing yourself
yeah it's I won't say it's a challenge but it was hard work to do that and especially
(23:18):
like I never left my country left India so for my work when I left India for the first
time I landed to US or UK then again I'm adopting I'm learning and so that is professional
challenge and personal level what did you study I studied in Kolkata in business commerce
(23:39):
and I also learned some coding etc which I never utilized that way yeah yeah I don't
like that and personal challenge I think that is I continuously develop myself so that I
fit into it I never tried to fit into myself totally honestly I wanted to stay how I am
yeah that's something that I feel from you is this real authenticity about you and I
(24:05):
wonder how have you in having to be in the spotlight a little bit more than maybe what
you'd like how have you maintained your authenticity in that process yeah I think yeah I think
I was really at one point of time I thought I will have to be like them like flawlessly
(24:26):
presenting flawlessly about in a stage or somewhere and or also when we were you know
reached out from various media and news channel then I don't know if like how proper I should
look speak talk yeah I think I was in a question in between that like how much should I prepare
(24:50):
myself that I and then I realized I don't want to lose myself completely by you know
being like someone else and I think here I would definitely mention that I am really
lucky to be surrounded by some family members and the people who have been supporting me
and it is they are from different part of the world US UK and some Australians so I
(25:14):
think they continuously they I got some mentorship from them as well they said you are good
how you are so don't try to be like completely like that so some flaws are actually good
so then I think I stopped worrying and I was feeling very tired also I realized this is
(25:38):
I don't think I want to go beyond this polishing myself like shoes you know polish polish so
I said no I don't want to wear your shoe like this shining bright so that is it but definitely
I work on myself but it would be more on knowledge gathering and also I want to stay close to
(26:02):
the issue I continuously I say to the victims or the people who I am working with my colleagues
team members my board members wherever they are in whichever country so I am curious and
I try to be you know useful for them.
That's good.
And to where destiny is now what could you give a snapshot of how it's grown and.
(26:27):
I think it's exciting so I think 2007 or 2008 we got started and then I had all the realization
I said which way I go I improve myself polish myself develop knowledge network building
I realized that I have taken a big huge decision and then I think the first break was me getting
(26:50):
through the leadership fellowship from US.
So 2010 from 2008 or 7 to 2010 I think that was my first jump first move I got selected
from whatever number of applicants and the first time I landed to US and I got into the
leadership fellowship program where I really value each and every member their life time
(27:14):
relationships I have built.
And was this a leadership fellowship?
Yeah it's global women leadership network.
So that was my first first breakthrough and that also happened to a volunteer girl who
came to India to volunteer for us and then she helped me reach out to these people so
(27:34):
that was first breakthrough and then I think I came back really refreshed and better and
then 2013 I got awarded from the same group global women leadership network as a leader
of impact.
So that is another you know motivation encouragement so and if that happened through voting from
(28:02):
different part of the world and I got maximum vote so that happened and then 2013 again
I got fourth fellowship opportunity again there was a huge application process etc and
my application was selected again I was you know told about this fellowship by someone
from my network and then 2015 suddenly that was little kind of unexpected surprise suddenly
(28:29):
we realized we got nominated for Indian of the Year in the public service.
Wow.
And that happened in 2015 the CNN the name is CNN News 18 Indian of the Year and there
we I didn't get the award but our organization was listed and the nomination which was like
(28:51):
kind of okay so what we are doing is okay.
Sounds like you're getting all these reassurances along the way.
Yeah.
So those networks that you built they were they were not to say paying off but they were
yeah providing benefit because you're authentically building the network.
Exactly and I think that is what I choose to be not quick money or quick funding.
Yeah.
(29:12):
I really wanted to have a solid ground of the work we are doing and a good relationship
as I mentioned with everyone surrounding me and keeping our values intact so it was not
a quick kind of mission I went through so that was and in spite of all the challenges
I said in the challenges at home health issues and continuously you know fighting for like
(29:36):
my skills my knowledge and also running an organization funding challenges selling product.
So that happened in 2013 and then 2015 and then 2017 I got another award from the local
women economic forum and then 2020 I got another award which is from Delhi and which was given
(30:03):
by some of the ministers and that came through a college which Shivaji college in Delhi women
development center from that center.
So these awards I am talking about again these were you know consistently telling you that
yeah it is okay you are on the right track and whatever we are doing is actually benefiting
(30:26):
at least some portion of our hard work is benefiting.
Yeah.
And I think I would still say and the people I had met through all the process through
the fellowships or through some partnership buildings etc. those were like miracle in
my life so it's not only me that it is wrong I may be I am facing the organization in the
(30:51):
face of that I am taking you know everything in my plate and then managing but I am very
lucky to have all the people who have been supporting me all through.
Yeah and then we talk about the impact because along the way you are getting these awards
but then behind those awards is obviously the impact of the work that you are doing
could you talk a bit about the impact?
(31:13):
Yeah that also you know I was illusion like when I hear the numbers when we look at our
numbers it's really small and not a big numbers not in millions or etc. etc.
Then again I think we come up as a group and we discuss these challenges that and then
we realized that we are going longitudinal which means we are staying with the survivor
(31:44):
or the beneficiary for a long time because we know the group we have chosen they are
you know they are really broken and they are damaged mentally physically and they hardly
have any skill to rebuild their life and career which means the vulnerability returns to them
(32:08):
more often than any of us.
So which means that we have to stay with them for a longer time.
So that way we are going we are looking into the depth of the program rather than numbers
increasing the numbers.
Yeah.
So now I think I am content I am happy previously it used to bother me a lot maybe one day we
(32:30):
can we will be able to keep both the quality and quantity but right now we are not able
to till now.
I think they are focusing on quality.
Yeah I think that's important because you don't want to have you don't want to over
commit and have too much and then not be able to support and then have that actually cause
(32:50):
more harm.
Yeah because one beneficiary or we also call them our partners not actually beneficiaries
when we call them partner then it becomes equal and empowering.
So that way if the girl is coming if we are supporting a girl and she has a child and
then she has a family also she has health issues she has different different challenges
(33:14):
so we take care of everything.
Yeah but we look at it holistically.
Yeah.
So we have to take care of her job and it is complicated why I say especially with the
victims of trafficking because you can only you can we can give her a skill training and
then we can give her a job also but maybe she doesn't have a place to stay or she is
(33:39):
a single mother which means she may not be able to continue with the job or the skill
training because she has other problems in her life.
Yeah.
So we have to see that she is able to continue with the opportunities she is getting so we
take care of the child also and sometimes we need other NGOs help for that because
we can do everything.
(34:00):
So we see that the girl is the child is taken care of her health mental health physical
health etc her parents condition and so holistically we help her in the journey of recovery.
Yeah so could you take us on a bit of a journey to when someone when you identify someone
(34:23):
who needs the support who's been trafficked and you refer to them as a partner.
So what's the journey of that person coming into destiny.
Yeah so I say that the plan cannot be seen for everyone.
It has to be tailored.
It has to be tailored because everyone the problem is unique for each and every one.
(34:47):
So I can tell you two case studies in brief.
So one was this girl was trafficked at the age of 12 and then she was rescued at the
age of 15 or something and she landed a shelter home.
This is generally what happens.
She gave she became a model at the age of 16 and then we have been so we we provide
(35:15):
care in the shelter room where we find this kind of girls and then when she turned 17
she came to destiny for training.
She completed her training by the age of 18 and she started her life again but her trafficker
(35:37):
she also wanted to punish her trafficker which is a big decision.
Sometimes they are so broken with a baby and ill health and the trauma they're not able
to decide to fight for the trafficker.
In her case her trafficker was trafficker I think disappeared for seven years and the
(35:57):
case was pending and then it took several more years to fight the case and prove the
trafficker guilty.
So she had gone through all the process being the destiny because why because it helped
her because her child was being taken care of in her children's home where she had the
(36:18):
opportunity to go and meet her and then her family also was not scared because the trafficker
was from the neighborhood.
So she was they were and the family was unable to bring the get the girl home and the trafficker
was moving around you know disappeared but that doesn't mean he won't home he or she
won't go.
(36:39):
So there were level of complicacies in one case and we have to take care of each and
every part very carefully and then we can arrive to restoration or success or in power.
So she fought for her trafficker and she was able to fight it because she had a job she
had a she had her child was safe her family was safe so all multiple things helped her.
(37:07):
And now where is she now?
She is still with us and recently she received an award also.
We nominated her name and not only that she has taken a leadership role.
She faces people crowd and she talks gives her insights to younger girls.
(37:32):
That's really special.
When some of these women feel or able to speak about their empowerment that they feel from
the journey what sort of things do they say about what empowerment means to them?
Yeah it takes pretty long honesty to speak up their mind.
I think there are several ways they express.
(37:55):
I think they say that mentorship has been very important for them.
So only rescuing and living in the shelter home and facing the life after 18 after once
you turn 18 is not only thing they need.
Because once they're 18 their shelter home says goodbye and then they're out in the world.
(38:20):
Or maybe in some time extension of one year they get.
So they say it is like terrifying that when we live and we have to leave shelter home
and whatever skills we have gathered and it is extremely competitive life outside and
we are not educated we don't have solid family support and sometimes we have they have children
(38:42):
and health issues and they most of the time they don't have accommodation also.
They're trafficked from the rural side so either they have to go back to the village
and find their empowerment there which is possible.
Many time we do that as well.
So they need honesty they need long term mentorship hand-punting that is what they want.
And they also say that they really hate the crime and wish they could punish their trafficker.
(39:11):
But many a time they have to they can't think of punishing because there's so much problem
in their life.
Yeah when you say punish you mean legal take legal action.
So it means again some guts courage that no I'm going to pursue and.
(39:33):
And the system if they're taking legal action in India how would you describe that system?
So we have we have experience that again that is another big part and law enforcement people
can give more light on this but I have seen that the victims they have to get support
(39:56):
from the government or NGOs to find a good lawyer who would fight for the case.
Whereas the traffickers that syndicate they're much much stronger.
There are some money flow from the top level somewhere we don't know they're able to hire
quick lawyers and they're quite aggressive and so which is this is really sad and it's
(40:23):
safety issue then as well.
Safety issues is there.
Even though the government the law enforcement has been has reformed now they have private
room for questions sessions etc interrogation etc.
So things are improving but it is still a big challenge.
They still need more support and the only NGOs they are more they're stronger I would
(40:47):
say the other side.
If we talk about the issue itself of trafficking especially here in the presence in Kolkata
how how big is it?
Yeah it is definitely big and it is more vulnerable I would say because Kolkata borders with Nepal
(41:11):
and Bangladesh.
So cross border trafficking is huge and which makes it a source transit and destination
point of trafficking.
So our region is very very vulnerable and also that we are only 100 kilometer maybe
or less than that from Sundarbans.
(41:34):
So and which is a you know it's a natural mangrove forest and which is extremely get
disaster prone natural disaster prone where people get displaced or they opt for unsafe
migration which makes trafficking easier or they're pushed into trafficking.
(41:57):
Yeah and in what when you say that what does that look like being pushed into trafficking?
Yeah because they're taking decisions like they're opting for job without even very
fine where they're going.
Or sometimes the men of the house they leave and they are becoming migrant or somewhere
(42:19):
else sometimes they don't even often report back to the city and the women the children
and the wife or the family they become vulnerable.
So they have to send the young the children to work or they have to drop out their school.
(42:41):
So that can look like they're being taken advantage of with the work they're doing but
it can also be that it's sexual.
Yeah it could be anything it could be labor trafficking, it could be organ trafficking,
it could be child trafficking they can get into any form of trafficking.
Would you say this is one of the most vulnerable areas in India for trafficking?
(43:01):
Of course, of course, especially climate and trafficking is very much interrelated.
Because it is about people's vulnerability, families vulnerability and economic crisis
which leads to take decisions quick decisions without verifying a job or marriage situation.
(43:26):
So with the issue of trafficking is other numbers growing and increasing do you think
it's becoming worse?
Honestly I can say because we don't have any data that way.
That would be hard to get.
Yeah it would be hard to get maybe the government departments can't because many of the cases
are not even registered sometimes it happens silently.
(43:49):
So we really don't know about the data at this moment.
But we definitely know that crime is thriving.
It hasn't I think.
But we have taken some measures and protections.
You're doing your part in your corner of Kolkata for this huge issue.
How do you stay grounded and stay hopeful in what is a massive societal issue?
(44:15):
How do you keep going with what you're doing?
I think it bothers me a lot honestly because every time I think I feel that I'm not doing
enough.
I'm not doing enough.
And then again it is constantly counseling myself talking to myself talking to our team.
But then I think okay only a drop maybe a drop in the ocean but still we should go on.
(44:41):
So basically it is demotivating in that sense.
But again it is motivating when you tell yourself that even if it is one girl is saved or one
boy is saved or one girl is getting better education I think we are doing our job.
Because you're breaking the cycle.
I'm breaking this I'm disrupting it.
Yeah.
(45:02):
Yes.
And also it is not only this is about working with the survivors directly.
We also do some other kind of work for awareness building.
So we are continuously we have academic partnership with around five to ten universities around
internationally all over the world.
(45:25):
And many students are taking interest in the you know business and social good the intersections.
So I think if the next generation if we can pass on our knowledge and experience to the
next generation or the students that is also a big thing we can give to the society.
(45:48):
So that also motivates me.
I see lots of students universities they're taking deep interest to learn this and to
identify what they can do where they are contributing to the crime.
So that gives me a lot of satisfaction that I'm working on advocacy awareness at least
trying to.
(46:10):
Prevention intervention angle.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So you kind of you're on the ground doing that work as well as the seeing the bigger
picture.
Yeah.
Seeing a bigger picture and at least passing my knowledge information to as many people
as we can.
So if you could talk to someone internationally if you were talking to a group of international
people and who might feel a bit removed from the actual trafficking and seeing what's what
(46:36):
the impact is on the ground.
What would you be saying to them about what can help them to understand the issue or check
or do something in their power to contribute to the issue.
So as I said that that it is it is a crime where multiple stakeholders are involved knowing
(46:57):
or unknowingly and I think trafficking is very common in UN, UK, Australia everywhere
and we have to expose this crime.
So they can definitely gain knowledge wherever they are.
They have to just keep their eyes open looking to the data or search or find out any NGOs
wherever they're sitting in any corner of the world.
(47:20):
They can get information.
So information learning is big, big thing I would say.
Try to learn, try to find and gather like you are here.
You have definitely at one point of time looked beyond your circle.
And what about consumption of goods and what do you to for people internationally like
(47:47):
for in Australia for example what advice can you give to people about the goods that they
consume.
So this is very, very crucial, very, very important.
I think we talk a lot about the crime, the survivors and how we are restoring their life.
But I think we should look into why the why the questions.
(48:09):
So this is a big part of modern slavery or human trafficking.
So we should be definitely very conscious about what we are buying and if it is ethical,
if they are paid well or if they are made by children.
(48:34):
And so I think customer has to question.
How do they know with such a fast paced consumption in society?
What is it anything, any advice that you have?
I think first of all awareness.
Learn about what is happening and what is the issue.
(48:55):
That's number one.
And I don't think it is going to be very challenging or difficult with social media handles and
with this technology communication system is so sophisticated now.
Because we can share anything in the social media.
So I think we should definitely tell all the brands that declare where you are sourcing
(49:18):
it.
Tell us your ethical policy.
Tell us about your supply chain.
Why can't we do that?
Why can't we say it should be it could be the social media also.
And then we challenge.
I imagine there would be a place for technology to play a pivotal role in that.
Are there any good I know I've seen some some apps that can help to identify if you're buying
(49:45):
something what the company that you're buying it from what their history is like and how
ethical they are.
Is there any that you're aware of?
I heard that Marks and Spencer they have when you go to their website they have a map about
their production units which means they're telling about their sourcing and if you want
(50:11):
you can visit maybe.
Yeah.
Or if they are going through all the compliances etc. due diligence process.
That is one part.
And secondly I think whenever we are entering a store there should be some index or something
shown in every store.
I think we should demand that.
Yeah it's about what we demand in society.
(50:33):
Because when you are coming to a store you are shopping it should reflect that some key
information on every store which is missing I guess.
Yeah.
Because all the time you cannot look into website and then find and maybe some people
will do that but not all.
Yeah.
(50:53):
There should be some few key areas mandatory which should be on the store.
Any big store.
Is there one area that you would like to see changed or more action to be taken in particular?
Yeah actions definitely I know government has a big role to play but I think consumers
(51:14):
at the end voice.
Because consumer voice can influence what government does.
Yeah consumer voice is the last thing because we are the buyer we will decide our money
where it will go.
So I think consumer voice they should strengthen and people know how to where to protest and
where to what it is like or like or dislike.
(51:36):
Yeah.
Consumer voice is very important and I know it is a system is there policies are there
at every level.
We have to come together and partnerships collaborations improve that is needed.
Yeah.
Back to the destiny how many employees do you have?
(51:56):
We have around 15.
What kind of culture have you like have you created here?
Yeah this is very interesting.
I think from the very beginning like my priority was a joyful working environment, a smart
(52:17):
office culture where you come work you can leave you be your and it will be leadership
oriented goal oriented and very much connected to our vision mission very much connected
we can never forget why we are here.
Our end goal is maybe disrupting the cycle of exploitation.
So whenever we are stuck anywhere stuck just look and go back.
(52:40):
It is like you are no star.
Then I think the problem is solved.
So we believe in a smart office culture leadership approach and also it can be a bottom up approach
because we believe in grassroots leadership honestly.
So it instead of top down it could be bottom up or it could be both ways working.
(53:02):
Yeah.
Combination.
Whatever you need.
Yeah.
So grassroots leadership, survivor's leadership is the center.
They need to be their voice and they need to take control of their problem.
So in the office also we maintain it that way.
It's a really happy and joyful workplace and we make sure it happens.
(53:27):
We do a lot of we don't do it like on a paper like team building and then team time.
It's not like that.
I think we make opportunities to laugh, share and spend time together and same with the
community also.
That's nice.
And does it happen organically because of that culture?
(53:48):
It is happening organically till now because once you implant the culture.
Yeah.
I can really feel that here.
I do.
We should keep it that way.
But yeah, but I don't know what happens with the next generation leader because I believe
(54:11):
in passing on leadership because I don't want to be forever here and doing the same thing.
Maybe I will take up another vision.
This will still be very close to my heart what I do, but I think there is plenty of
things to do.
So maybe I will divert 50 percent of my time to something little different, but it has
(54:31):
to be something for the society and also self sustainable.
Yeah.
So both ways.
So what I see, I think the next level leadership is also the same way.
Everyone nowadays they are prioritizing a joyful work environment which is productive,
(54:52):
which is sustainable.
And you welcome, seems like you welcome volunteers to come to Destiny.
Very much, very much.
Yeah.
Because I always think, you know, when I began Destiny, so I used to secretly say one day
we will have an email ID and a lot of people will write to us from all over the world.
And so that was a kind of dream kind of.
(55:15):
And then now when I see so many emails, so many people want to come to us, come to us
and see how do I manage, do we manage time?
Then I think of that day.
Wow.
That's so nice.
That no one day I'm working this and this is happening.
Now you probably have to turn away.
Do you ever have to turn away volunteers?
You don't have to honestly.
No, that's good.
Unless they are able to work on our same date or something, then you miss people.
(55:40):
But otherwise they are pretty open and we don't have to struggle too much to accommodate
people.
Yeah.
So if anyone wanted to volunteer at Destiny from around the world and come to Kolkata
or offer some expertise even remotely, you welcome that.
Yeah, we welcome that.
But definitely, you know, we look into the time, the skill, if it is what they're expecting,
(56:04):
that is very important.
So we make sure that that matches.
So we go through a very, I mean, discussion process.
So we can eliminate people or people can eliminate Destiny and go to somewhere else.
So we go through that process.
Because it has to be mutually beneficial for both parts.
Yeah, it has to be mutually beneficial to both parts.
So I think it's a quite healthy way of recruiting volunteers.
(56:28):
So we get to know what is expected.
Some people say, no, I'm very professional.
I want this date to that date and I want to be really busy.
Then we tell them that it is not that place, I think.
Because we are not like feeding 100 people or nursing 100 old people.
It is not that kind of maybe you could go to different place.
(56:50):
Yeah, it is a lot about because our success is when you understand about modern slavery,
human trafficking, exploitations, couple of SDG goals.
Maybe if you take only 5% of the knowledge, we think that's a success.
So first is understanding of the issue and then understanding the organization and then
whatever way you contribute.
(57:11):
Yeah.
What kind of projects do you have happening at the moment that you could share?
Is there anything interesting?
So we are having, so we have a project in one of the red light area, scum and red light
area, the children and women.
We have a social enterprise where some of the women are manufacturing some fashion
(57:37):
boots, etc.
And then we are, we also work, still continue going to the shelter homes.
We provide some mindfulness, some English learning skills or providing them some necessary
articles what they need.
And we have recently got another project in collaboration with US Embassy Kolkata.
(58:01):
So we are the grantee and we will be working on our gender based violence project with
indigenous women.
So we will be selecting around 16 indigenous women from Nagaland and Assam.
And then we will find four mentors from the United States and we will have some session,
(58:22):
mentorship session.
Yeah.
How to combat GBV in your own area, etc.
So it's a cross border kind of collaboration project where we learn from each other.
And how far into that project?
Yeah.
So we began in 1st of August and we have selected almost 16 mentors we have selected.
(58:48):
We have mentors also ready.
We will be starting our mentorship session from mid November.
Amazing.
Great.
So we are very excited about that.
And gender based violence is very much into related to human trafficking.
Of course.
It's very aligned.
(59:09):
That is something we are very excited about.
And with the social enterprise aspect of Destiny where you make the products, how much of that
fuels the rest of the work that Destiny is able to do and funds the rest of the work
that Destiny is able to do?
Yeah, that is also a very good question.
(59:31):
So basically what we have seen that people, many people they have said that they love
the idea of this hybrid model.
Having the social business as well as the nonprofit.
They like it.
So that is I think a big component in our strength of our model.
(59:59):
And the social enterprise is actually is also even though it is a model social enterprise,
it's not that we have 100 women working and manufacturing.
So model is a small 10 women unit.
And it is a model in a way like it talks about business value chain and ethical business
(01:00:22):
and also being careful about people and planet.
They were working, they were in a good environment with also products and eco-friendly.
So I think it covers a couple of SDG goals.
So definitely it is very, very motivating for what we do on the other side.
(01:00:45):
And it is also as I mentioned that it is also like we need the intersection is very, very
important right now.
So we like the idea that the business and the social cause is together.
Yet they are separate with their own entity.
(01:01:07):
Yeah it's a powerful model.
It's a big, I think it is an excitement, it is a satisfaction, it is motivating also how
we are able to.
What advice would you give to youngest Marita who was innocently starting out Destiny Reflection?
(01:01:27):
What advice would you give her now if you could?
I think you should risk instead of going for a paid job and not taking an adventurous journey,
you should actually believe in yourself, just listen to your inner self and find out.
That is one point.
(01:01:48):
And second point, if something goes wrong, like don't feel deserted or think that is
the only chance I had gone, there will be chances which comes back.
So both way.
So just take risks, start if you want to be an entrepreneur, what will be your, you risk
yourself, do that.
(01:02:09):
At the same time, don't get too deserted and then you take it, it becomes a mental health
issues for many people, when you are not able to reach that far or reach that numbers or
you missed out that funding or you don't have any business or you are not able to make partnerships,
I think don't get overworked up on all this.
(01:02:36):
Stay there, you can do something in a small scale also, you can do something in a big
scale also, so keep a balance.
Good advice.
Is there anything else you wanted to share before we wrap up?
I think it's been a lovely journey and even though you know, it is a learning, it is a
(01:02:59):
learning and at the end I think, you know, it is about containment, you have to find
your success within yourself and you have to measure your own success and instead of
building, because when I began, when I started, I think I didn't know like I would look at
(01:03:24):
some model visitor organization and think maybe this is what success looks like, but
I think from my experience, I think I decide my success.
Create your own markup.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I decide my success.
Experiencing what you do within, moving out of your comfort zone, going out, this is very,
(01:03:47):
very important.
I think we should know our world and reach out to the people who are in the corners.
So I think it is a very interesting journey and I encourage people to come and take small
risks or and explore the world and understand the problems.
(01:04:13):
Yeah, yeah, and then you might find your area that sparks something inside you to take action.
Thank you Smreeta.
Thank you.
It's been so wonderful.
Thank you, Rachel.
It was lovely talking to you.
I don't know if it makes sense or not, but then it spoke from my heart.
It speaks.
I can hear it loud and clear.
(01:04:35):
Thank you.
So I hope you enjoy hearing from Smreeta and learning a bit more about Destiny and what
they're trying to achieve and perhaps opening your eyes up a little bit more to the huge
systemic issue of trafficking across the world.
It was really so, so lovely to see the Destiny team again.
(01:04:57):
It had been five years since I'd been back to India and when I walked back into the Destiny
office, it really was the same energy, if not more vibrant than before.
I will link to Destiny's social media in the episode notes and also their website where
you can have a look at the beautiful different products that they make.
(01:05:18):
And if you have any questions or would like to know more about Destiny, I'm sure they
would be thrilled to hear from you.
And I'll also link to a documentary that's on YouTube.
You can watch for free.
It's called Stolen Innocence and this features both Destiny and New Life Foundation actually.
It's about trafficking in Kolkata.
(01:05:41):
And then in terms of something you can do, I will also link to a website called Shop
Ethical.
This is an ethical consumer guide.
It's directed towards Australian consumers and it gives the lowdown on environmental
and social records of companies that are behind like common name brands that are common in
(01:06:03):
Australia.
You can also buy an app online which is about $6 where you can actually scan the barcodes
of products and it pulls up an ethical rating of the brand.
At the very least, check out the website because it's really interesting to play around with
and I'm sure if you're in a different country, you can have a search for something that might
be similar relating to your country.
(01:06:24):
But it can just be a really eye-opening exercise to see how some of the companies you might
shop regularly with are behaving and it might just influence which brands you might choose
over others for the future.
So thank you for taking the time to listen.
Please feel free to rate the podcast and share with any friends who this may interest.
(01:06:48):
Sending you love, my fellow humans, wherever you are.
Hello world family and welcome to Ripples of Humanity.
(00:06):
I'm Rachel Thompson and through this podcast I'm sharing interesting stories along my travels
of people, projects and initiatives I discover that are contributing to positive ripples
throughout humanity.
In this episode I am taking you to Kolkata, the capital city of the state of West Bengal
in the east of India.
So although Kolkata is known as the city of joy, it is also known as having one of the
(00:31):
largest red light districts in Asia and one of India's largest trafficking hubs.
Today I'll be speaking to Smriti Sengupta, the founder of the NGO Destiny Reflection,
which began in 2007.
The aim of Destiny is to disrupt the cycles of sexual exploitation and human trafficking
(00:51):
in Kolkata.
Destiny and Smriti have won numerous awards nationally and internationally for its work
and I'm really excited to share the conversation with Smriti today.
Just firstly, I first met Smriti in 2016, so eight years ago now.
It was my second trip to India and this time in India I planned to stay for six months.
(01:14):
I just finished my month long yoga teacher training that was in Rishikesh and I knew
that I wanted to stay in one place after that and volunteer somewhere for the remaining
five months.
But at that time I had no idea where or what I wanted to do.
I had previously heard of Kolkata because I shared a mutual friend with someone who
was living in Kolkata and started an NGO there, but I knew nothing about this city of over
(01:40):
15 million people and I just had a feeling that Kolkata was where I needed to be and
I had a feeling I needed to be working with children.
So after some online research I was led to this NGO called New Light Foundation and I
reached out to them and then before I knew it I was on a plane to Kolkata.
(02:01):
So just briefly, New Light Foundation have many, many programs that support children
and youth of sex workers and at risk children and youth in Kolkata.
It was then through New Light that I met Smriti and some of the women from Destiny at an event.
Smriti I remember had this really bright, enthusiastic and warm energy about her and
(02:26):
she invited me to come along and see what Destiny was all about.
So I made some time to visit Destiny and to get a real feel for what the organization
was about and I was so glad I did.
I remember when I arrived there I just felt so welcomed and warm.
I also fell in love with the social enterprise branch of Destiny where women survivors of
(02:49):
trafficking are trained and then employed to make really beautiful products that are
sold nationally and internationally and profits and then redirected back into Destiny.
For those who are close to me or have come to my yoga classes you probably know about
or own one of the handmade yoga mat bags made from recycled sari material.
(03:12):
It was a really funny story when I first went to Destiny and saw the yoga mat bags I just
found them so beautiful and I wanted to bring some back to Australia to see if I could sell
them so I bought about 20 bags and then when I was going back to Australia I tried to put
(03:33):
them all in my luggage.
It was such a scene at the airport because turns out my luggage was too heavy and they
were going to charge me like $300 excess for the luggage and I didn't want to pay that
so I didn't want to get rid of the yoga mat bags so I was at the airport unloading stuff
(03:56):
and I just remember having so many yoga mat bags like sprawled across the floor of the
airport and all my belongings everywhere just trying to work out what to throw out, what
I wanted to, what I needed to take back to Australia, what I might be able to leave in
a small bag in India for a friend to come and collect.
So it all worked out in the end I left a small bag with some of my belongings that a friend
(04:19):
came to the rescue and I would hope that I'd come back to India one day to collect it.
It turns out over two years later I returned to Kolkata and reunited with my bag so that
was great but I had room then for the, I had weight left for the yoga mat bags and for
(04:39):
the necessities that I needed to bring back to Australia so that was definitely an experience.
And then over the years when I got back to Australia over the years I think I sold and
gifted over a hundred of the yoga mat bags to people and it just brings me so much joy
when I see someone in my hometown, Geelong, using one of the bags and every time I would
(05:08):
sell one of the bags it just brought me right back to destiny and the cause and what they're
doing and yeah it's a really special organisation and I hope you enjoy the conversation I have
with Smarita to learn a bit more.
(05:28):
And once again India got me and during the conversation with Smarita there was some unavoidable
construction noises going on in the background so I did the best I could to minimise the
sound without damaging the audio quality too much but it's all a big learning process for
me trying to edit out background noise and if anyone has any good recommendations for
(05:56):
reducing background noise without damaging the audio quality too much then please let
me know I am open to any teachings.
Thank you and apologies again for that disruption in the evening conversation with Smarita.
Thank you so much for joining me Smarita.
(06:16):
When I first had the vision for doing this podcast you were one of the people that came
into my mind as someone who I actually really wanted to speak to.
Since I've met you you've been someone who's really inspired me and remembered the energy
you bring to your work and the cause that you're working for and it's made a powerful
(06:37):
impact on my life when I first met you.
Yeah I still remember the day we met, the time we met.
I'd love to start by taking a step back in time to when you first envisioned destiny
reflection coming and what was your what inspired you what was your motivation?
(07:00):
Yeah very interesting question and I would say like it is about what bothers you.
I think there used to be several things which has been bothering me when I have grown up
growing up years going to college or maybe the first break somewhere as an intern, volunteer
(07:23):
etc.
So I think the first botheration was the discrimination like why few people are like that and why
there's so much of clusters and kind of divides and also like some toxic people toxic environment.
(07:46):
Those were all my what I gathered you know from at different stages of life anyway and
I think that turned into choosing I consider those experiences maybe when I had the opportunity
to decide what I want to do what I want to take up seriously.
(08:08):
So this is how I would say destiny came to me and then I choose kind of both ways.
I like how you say destiny came to you and when you say that what do you mean?
Yeah by destiny is the name of the organization as you know so I would rather say the work
(08:29):
chose me and I also choose the work that happened together.
So for a long time I was very unclear like I opted for a couple of jobs completed my
education and then I felt I don't know I didn't feel like why I am doing this and I am not
getting the kind of interest I should be.
(08:51):
I used to do every work I used to do very carefully, properly, perfectly that was my
trend but you know the other part was missing like the content.
Yeah and I thought I have a lot of energy to do something else something more and what
is that?
Were you working in the like for an NGO or in the social sector?
(09:12):
Yeah I got into because I started working in a very young age like I did small job when
I was in college also so I was very much into that work so I was getting experience rather.
So yeah so when I landed a non-profit yeah I landed a non-profit and I had hardly any
clue like what non-profits are like except that they are giving agencies to give kind
(09:37):
of apart from that.
And then I faced some toxic part of it also that why questions lot of questions why this
why this why not this etc etc and then I met a couple of women young children in the red
light area and then I went for a re-exhaust so they screen small children with the police
(10:02):
of course from the brothel etc red light area or private houses where they had been trafficked
or in route to trafficking etc.
Were they in Khaukhara?
Yeah those were in Kolkata and in Sabaabs also around Kolkata.
So every bit you know like made me think question and then I went to the root cause I got to
(10:25):
know why is this happening like why they why not me or why not someone else.
Then I realized that it is society is responsible and there is something which we can do and
this cause is and the reason of the cause is hidden in our society in different different
(10:46):
ways.
So this is how I got to start and then it took shape and now we are here we are 15,
16 years old and the journey is also big big learning.
I can imagine you face some challenges along the way.
(11:11):
Yeah of course.
What's been in creating an NGO and starting it from you started it from scratch it was
your baby that you started.
What was the biggest challenge to get it to get it started?
I think the missing but I never thought I will I wanted to contribute to this but that
(11:34):
doesn't mean that I'll have to start something and own something or lead something so it
pushed me because I saw some gaps I noticed and I always felt like this could have been
done that way this way so that was one of the reason and the second hesitation was you
know like question myself am I able to do it.
(11:57):
You know my God I'm going to start our organization that was that is something so then I found
a couple of people around me who actually say that why don't you do it you can do it
actually so that's a big piece that one line that you can do it.
(12:19):
Who were those people do you remember?
Yeah I still remember I met a Canadian professor who is my age kind of we can close and then
I used to tell her about the frustrations and she was she came as a volunteer here to
work with different charities etc and she also like we were kind of at the same page
(12:44):
like and then suddenly she said I think you will do a better job.
You are all about it.
Is it me?
Yes.
Why not you?
Yes I am very much in touch with those people.
I mean I'm very lucky that way that she's not the only one of the she may be the first
one if I could remember but and then I continuously kept meeting people who are who thinks the
(13:10):
same way.
Yeah.
Do you feel like you were guided to meet those people?
Yeah I believe in that I believe in hard work I believe in planning strategy also but at
the same time there are divine interventions also which are all together.
So what was that of the first things you did when you were starting Destiny to get it going
(13:34):
off the ground from the very beginning?
Yeah I mean the setting up the organization.
Yeah.
So I got involved even before there was a transition kind of setting up the organization
or I am already into the work and I remember I happened to bring a survivor girl to my
(13:56):
house and I didn't plan it that way it just happened she needed a place and then I bought
her home so several I made several small you know experiences which became very meaningful
at the later stage of time.
So when I started the organization I think I had to do a lot of what you call it registration
(14:18):
work etc etc etc which took a lot of time but I think we kept on working even if even
before we were actually registered on paper etc.
Yeah.
I kept on working because I was involved and I have been you know been into it.
And what did that work look like at that time?
(14:39):
Yeah it is a lot of like I would say counselling I think talking to people I mean they would
reach out for some problem solving solutions or the next steps finding so that was very
much involved and then we got connected with couple of shelter homes.
(15:03):
And if you could explain shelter homes?
Different shelter homes where you know young girls they mostly were rescued from trafficking
net or orphan or have some family problem or domestic violence so they are generally
housed by the government or non-government homes.
So generally it could be 0 to 18 years of any age girls.
(15:26):
So by the time I have already been started going to those shelter homes and developed
relationship with many of the children and young adults.
So even though there were no funds I kept going, fund was not a problem like I could
go and meet them that was one part of it and then already by the time I knew bunch of them
(15:51):
they needed work and then we started the production unit and only thing they know is hand work
or something handicraft creative work etc.
So we started that and that was in the planning process in the thought process because we
realized that income generation is a very important crucial thing.
(16:14):
Your own income gives you dignity, gives you a voice, helps you decide for yourself decision
making so combat violence or resist exploitation.
So for me I always thought that livelihood generation would be the first thing which
(16:36):
can follow with several others and then we started the production unit immediately and
by the time we also apparently had the relationships as I mentioned with the shelter homes, the
young, the children and then we started the unit with five girls and it was a small set
(17:02):
up and I found someone who were willing to support it also by that time, to support it
financially a little bit so that when we are independent we won't need that support.
What's your experience been like with funding Destiny?
This is interesting so I knew from the very beginning before I started that funding won't
(17:31):
be easy, why would people give me money?
I haven't proved anything.
So I was prepared that why would people give me money?
That was I always had that big question so and then again some incident happened and
funding came to us like from the people who I met who were surrounding me and so I think
(18:03):
the problem was not only one level, I think funding challenge was later because I didn't
know that I needed a lot of money to start to do that so we somehow we gathered that
money to pay for a rent and have startup production unit and we got the first order also, first
(18:26):
one or two jobs so I would say it wasn't the only problem.
I think I realized the problems where the first problem was I think to develop myself
because I realized very soon that I have taken a big responsibility and it is not only like
you know that okay I dream about that and so I thought I need to you know skill myself
(18:53):
and increase our network and so that was my first realization.
Also understand the issue deeply.
I'd love to talk about the issue, so the issue that Destiny Reflections is trying to
address and where that fits into the broader systemic issue of trafficking.
(19:16):
Yeah it is a deep level question you have asked so that also took me some time to understand
as I mentioned we just only know the top sign I could see the people suffering or I could
see this is like modern slavery is a largest illegal profit making business in the world
(19:40):
so those information came to me you know as I was working and then my curiosity got deeper
and learned more about this so it is definitely systemic it is in the system and modern slavery
is quite broad it also covers you know cheap labels cheap clothes and which is everywhere
(20:06):
all over the world so which means clearly that some people are making money and some
people are getting expirited out of that so that became very clear to us and also that
the organization like us we are fighting for it we need ecosystem to get supported otherwise
(20:30):
I don't think I can you know fight for a crime which is so big large all over the world so
then the realization came that I can do it myself alone or in a small team it has to
be in a bigger I have to expand the circle so we went out of India also it happened so
some fellowships etc. I was able to cross the border and so this is it how we also expanded
(21:00):
our network because the crime we are challenging is big so we also need bigger strength and
circle and have you found networks have been welcoming to that collaboration definitely
yes and no both because everywhere you know if one network is already very established
(21:22):
and suddenly I want to get in again you haven't proved yourself why would they partner with
you or why would they fund you or why would they you know collaborate with you that has
always remained a big challenge and also it has not been an easy task for me but at the
same time I think I broke that challenge through individual people who I was able to involve
(21:48):
them into my mission and my network also expanded through the leadership courses I got selected
Ford fellowship and global women leadership network those gave me exposures to meet people
and there I found some like-minded people and also people with same vision yeah so that
(22:08):
helped me break those barriers but till date I think networking I mean partnership building
is not really easy it isn't easy especially with different stakeholders if I'm in non-profit
to non-profit is different if I want to talk to other stakeholders it is challenging yeah
(22:30):
what's been your biggest personal challenge you've had to overcome in this journey I think
personal challenge I went through a lot of health challenges and not only me my family
also that is biggest I was almost I got into stroke situation several times that is one
(22:55):
of the challenge and I said continuously building myself I don't have a degree of a international
big university or something I am educated I do have degrees but I realized like people
are better than me they're presenting better so continuously you know developing yourself
yeah it's I won't say it's a challenge but it was hard work to do that and especially
(23:18):
like I never left my country left India so for my work when I left India for the first
time I landed to US or UK then again I'm adopting I'm learning and so that is professional
challenge and personal level what did you study I studied in Kolkata in business commerce
(23:39):
and I also learned some coding etc which I never utilized that way yeah yeah I don't
like that and personal challenge I think that is I continuously develop myself so that I
fit into it I never tried to fit into myself totally honestly I wanted to stay how I am
yeah that's something that I feel from you is this real authenticity about you and I
(24:05):
wonder how have you in having to be in the spotlight a little bit more than maybe what
you'd like how have you maintained your authenticity in that process yeah I think yeah I think
I was really at one point of time I thought I will have to be like them like flawlessly
(24:26):
presenting flawlessly about in a stage or somewhere and or also when we were you know
reached out from various media and news channel then I don't know if like how proper I should
look speak talk yeah I think I was in a question in between that like how much should I prepare
(24:50):
myself that I and then I realized I don't want to lose myself completely by you know
being like someone else and I think here I would definitely mention that I am really
lucky to be surrounded by some family members and the people who have been supporting me
and it is they are from different part of the world US UK and some Australians so I
(25:14):
think they continuously they I got some mentorship from them as well they said you are good
how you are so don't try to be like completely like that so some flaws are actually good
so then I think I stopped worrying and I was feeling very tired also I realized this is
(25:38):
I don't think I want to go beyond this polishing myself like shoes you know polish polish so
I said no I don't want to wear your shoe like this shining bright so that is it but definitely
I work on myself but it would be more on knowledge gathering and also I want to stay close to
(26:02):
the issue I continuously I say to the victims or the people who I am working with my colleagues
team members my board members wherever they are in whichever country so I am curious and
I try to be you know useful for them.
That's good.
And to where destiny is now what could you give a snapshot of how it's grown and.
(26:27):
I think it's exciting so I think 2007 or 2008 we got started and then I had all the realization
I said which way I go I improve myself polish myself develop knowledge network building
I realized that I have taken a big huge decision and then I think the first break was me getting
(26:50):
through the leadership fellowship from US.
So 2010 from 2008 or 7 to 2010 I think that was my first jump first move I got selected
from whatever number of applicants and the first time I landed to US and I got into the
leadership fellowship program where I really value each and every member their life time
(27:14):
relationships I have built.
And was this a leadership fellowship?
Yeah it's global women leadership network.
So that was my first first breakthrough and that also happened to a volunteer girl who
came to India to volunteer for us and then she helped me reach out to these people so
(27:34):
that was first breakthrough and then I think I came back really refreshed and better and
then 2013 I got awarded from the same group global women leadership network as a leader
of impact.
So that is another you know motivation encouragement so and if that happened through voting from
(28:02):
different part of the world and I got maximum vote so that happened and then 2013 again
I got fourth fellowship opportunity again there was a huge application process etc and
my application was selected again I was you know told about this fellowship by someone
from my network and then 2015 suddenly that was little kind of unexpected surprise suddenly
(28:29):
we realized we got nominated for Indian of the Year in the public service.
Wow.
And that happened in 2015 the CNN the name is CNN News 18 Indian of the Year and there
we I didn't get the award but our organization was listed and the nomination which was like
(28:51):
kind of okay so what we are doing is okay.
Sounds like you're getting all these reassurances along the way.
Yeah.
So those networks that you built they were they were not to say paying off but they were
yeah providing benefit because you're authentically building the network.
Exactly and I think that is what I choose to be not quick money or quick funding.
Yeah.
(29:12):
I really wanted to have a solid ground of the work we are doing and a good relationship
as I mentioned with everyone surrounding me and keeping our values intact so it was not
a quick kind of mission I went through so that was and in spite of all the challenges
I said in the challenges at home health issues and continuously you know fighting for like
(29:36):
my skills my knowledge and also running an organization funding challenges selling product.
So that happened in 2013 and then 2015 and then 2017 I got another award from the local
women economic forum and then 2020 I got another award which is from Delhi and which was given
(30:03):
by some of the ministers and that came through a college which Shivaji college in Delhi women
development center from that center.
So these awards I am talking about again these were you know consistently telling you that
yeah it is okay you are on the right track and whatever we are doing is actually benefiting
(30:26):
at least some portion of our hard work is benefiting.
Yeah.
And I think I would still say and the people I had met through all the process through
the fellowships or through some partnership buildings etc. those were like miracle in
my life so it's not only me that it is wrong I may be I am facing the organization in the
(30:51):
face of that I am taking you know everything in my plate and then managing but I am very
lucky to have all the people who have been supporting me all through.
Yeah and then we talk about the impact because along the way you are getting these awards
but then behind those awards is obviously the impact of the work that you are doing
could you talk a bit about the impact?
(31:13):
Yeah that also you know I was illusion like when I hear the numbers when we look at our
numbers it's really small and not a big numbers not in millions or etc. etc.
Then again I think we come up as a group and we discuss these challenges that and then
we realized that we are going longitudinal which means we are staying with the survivor
(31:44):
or the beneficiary for a long time because we know the group we have chosen they are
you know they are really broken and they are damaged mentally physically and they hardly
have any skill to rebuild their life and career which means the vulnerability returns to them
(32:08):
more often than any of us.
So which means that we have to stay with them for a longer time.
So that way we are going we are looking into the depth of the program rather than numbers
increasing the numbers.
Yeah.
So now I think I am content I am happy previously it used to bother me a lot maybe one day we
(32:30):
can we will be able to keep both the quality and quantity but right now we are not able
to till now.
I think they are focusing on quality.
Yeah I think that's important because you don't want to have you don't want to over
commit and have too much and then not be able to support and then have that actually cause
(32:50):
more harm.
Yeah because one beneficiary or we also call them our partners not actually beneficiaries
when we call them partner then it becomes equal and empowering.
So that way if the girl is coming if we are supporting a girl and she has a child and
then she has a family also she has health issues she has different different challenges
(33:14):
so we take care of everything.
Yeah but we look at it holistically.
Yeah.
So we have to take care of her job and it is complicated why I say especially with the
victims of trafficking because you can only you can we can give her a skill training and
then we can give her a job also but maybe she doesn't have a place to stay or she is
(33:39):
a single mother which means she may not be able to continue with the job or the skill
training because she has other problems in her life.
Yeah.
So we have to see that she is able to continue with the opportunities she is getting so we
take care of the child also and sometimes we need other NGOs help for that because
we can do everything.
(34:00):
So we see that the girl is the child is taken care of her health mental health physical
health etc her parents condition and so holistically we help her in the journey of recovery.
Yeah so could you take us on a bit of a journey to when someone when you identify someone
(34:23):
who needs the support who's been trafficked and you refer to them as a partner.
So what's the journey of that person coming into destiny.
Yeah so I say that the plan cannot be seen for everyone.
It has to be tailored.
It has to be tailored because everyone the problem is unique for each and every one.
(34:47):
So I can tell you two case studies in brief.
So one was this girl was trafficked at the age of 12 and then she was rescued at the
age of 15 or something and she landed a shelter home.
This is generally what happens.
She gave she became a model at the age of 16 and then we have been so we we provide
(35:15):
care in the shelter room where we find this kind of girls and then when she turned 17
she came to destiny for training.
She completed her training by the age of 18 and she started her life again but her trafficker
(35:37):
she also wanted to punish her trafficker which is a big decision.
Sometimes they are so broken with a baby and ill health and the trauma they're not able
to decide to fight for the trafficker.
In her case her trafficker was trafficker I think disappeared for seven years and the
(35:57):
case was pending and then it took several more years to fight the case and prove the
trafficker guilty.
So she had gone through all the process being the destiny because why because it helped
her because her child was being taken care of in her children's home where she had the
(36:18):
opportunity to go and meet her and then her family also was not scared because the trafficker
was from the neighborhood.
So she was they were and the family was unable to bring the get the girl home and the trafficker
was moving around you know disappeared but that doesn't mean he won't home he or she
won't go.
(36:39):
So there were level of complicacies in one case and we have to take care of each and
every part very carefully and then we can arrive to restoration or success or in power.
So she fought for her trafficker and she was able to fight it because she had a job she
had a she had her child was safe her family was safe so all multiple things helped her.
(37:07):
And now where is she now?
She is still with us and recently she received an award also.
We nominated her name and not only that she has taken a leadership role.
She faces people crowd and she talks gives her insights to younger girls.
(37:32):
That's really special.
When some of these women feel or able to speak about their empowerment that they feel from
the journey what sort of things do they say about what empowerment means to them?
Yeah it takes pretty long honesty to speak up their mind.
I think there are several ways they express.
(37:55):
I think they say that mentorship has been very important for them.
So only rescuing and living in the shelter home and facing the life after 18 after once
you turn 18 is not only thing they need.
Because once they're 18 their shelter home says goodbye and then they're out in the world.
(38:20):
Or maybe in some time extension of one year they get.
So they say it is like terrifying that when we live and we have to leave shelter home
and whatever skills we have gathered and it is extremely competitive life outside and
we are not educated we don't have solid family support and sometimes we have they have children
(38:42):
and health issues and they most of the time they don't have accommodation also.
They're trafficked from the rural side so either they have to go back to the village
and find their empowerment there which is possible.
Many time we do that as well.
So they need honesty they need long term mentorship hand-punting that is what they want.
And they also say that they really hate the crime and wish they could punish their trafficker.
(39:11):
But many a time they have to they can't think of punishing because there's so much problem
in their life.
Yeah when you say punish you mean legal take legal action.
So it means again some guts courage that no I'm going to pursue and.
(39:33):
And the system if they're taking legal action in India how would you describe that system?
So we have we have experience that again that is another big part and law enforcement people
can give more light on this but I have seen that the victims they have to get support
(39:56):
from the government or NGOs to find a good lawyer who would fight for the case.
Whereas the traffickers that syndicate they're much much stronger.
There are some money flow from the top level somewhere we don't know they're able to hire
quick lawyers and they're quite aggressive and so which is this is really sad and it's
(40:23):
safety issue then as well.
Safety issues is there.
Even though the government the law enforcement has been has reformed now they have private
room for questions sessions etc interrogation etc.
So things are improving but it is still a big challenge.
They still need more support and the only NGOs they are more they're stronger I would
(40:47):
say the other side.
If we talk about the issue itself of trafficking especially here in the presence in Kolkata
how how big is it?
Yeah it is definitely big and it is more vulnerable I would say because Kolkata borders with Nepal
(41:11):
and Bangladesh.
So cross border trafficking is huge and which makes it a source transit and destination
point of trafficking.
So our region is very very vulnerable and also that we are only 100 kilometer maybe
or less than that from Sundarbans.
(41:34):
So and which is a you know it's a natural mangrove forest and which is extremely get
disaster prone natural disaster prone where people get displaced or they opt for unsafe
migration which makes trafficking easier or they're pushed into trafficking.
(41:57):
Yeah and in what when you say that what does that look like being pushed into trafficking?
Yeah because they're taking decisions like they're opting for job without even very
fine where they're going.
Or sometimes the men of the house they leave and they are becoming migrant or somewhere
(42:19):
else sometimes they don't even often report back to the city and the women the children
and the wife or the family they become vulnerable.
So they have to send the young the children to work or they have to drop out their school.
(42:41):
So that can look like they're being taken advantage of with the work they're doing but
it can also be that it's sexual.
Yeah it could be anything it could be labor trafficking, it could be organ trafficking,
it could be child trafficking they can get into any form of trafficking.
Would you say this is one of the most vulnerable areas in India for trafficking?
(43:01):
Of course, of course, especially climate and trafficking is very much interrelated.
Because it is about people's vulnerability, families vulnerability and economic crisis
which leads to take decisions quick decisions without verifying a job or marriage situation.
(43:26):
So with the issue of trafficking is other numbers growing and increasing do you think
it's becoming worse?
Honestly I can say because we don't have any data that way.
That would be hard to get.
Yeah it would be hard to get maybe the government departments can't because many of the cases
are not even registered sometimes it happens silently.
(43:49):
So we really don't know about the data at this moment.
But we definitely know that crime is thriving.
It hasn't I think.
But we have taken some measures and protections.
You're doing your part in your corner of Kolkata for this huge issue.
How do you stay grounded and stay hopeful in what is a massive societal issue?
(44:15):
How do you keep going with what you're doing?
I think it bothers me a lot honestly because every time I think I feel that I'm not doing
enough.
I'm not doing enough.
And then again it is constantly counseling myself talking to myself talking to our team.
But then I think okay only a drop maybe a drop in the ocean but still we should go on.
(44:41):
So basically it is demotivating in that sense.
But again it is motivating when you tell yourself that even if it is one girl is saved or one
boy is saved or one girl is getting better education I think we are doing our job.
Because you're breaking the cycle.
I'm breaking this I'm disrupting it.
Yeah.
(45:02):
Yes.
And also it is not only this is about working with the survivors directly.
We also do some other kind of work for awareness building.
So we are continuously we have academic partnership with around five to ten universities around
internationally all over the world.
(45:25):
And many students are taking interest in the you know business and social good the intersections.
So I think if the next generation if we can pass on our knowledge and experience to the
next generation or the students that is also a big thing we can give to the society.
(45:48):
So that also motivates me.
I see lots of students universities they're taking deep interest to learn this and to
identify what they can do where they are contributing to the crime.
So that gives me a lot of satisfaction that I'm working on advocacy awareness at least
trying to.
(46:10):
Prevention intervention angle.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So you kind of you're on the ground doing that work as well as the seeing the bigger
picture.
Yeah.
Seeing a bigger picture and at least passing my knowledge information to as many people
as we can.
So if you could talk to someone internationally if you were talking to a group of international
people and who might feel a bit removed from the actual trafficking and seeing what's what
(46:36):
the impact is on the ground.
What would you be saying to them about what can help them to understand the issue or check
or do something in their power to contribute to the issue.
So as I said that that it is it is a crime where multiple stakeholders are involved knowing
(46:57):
or unknowingly and I think trafficking is very common in UN, UK, Australia everywhere
and we have to expose this crime.
So they can definitely gain knowledge wherever they are.
They have to just keep their eyes open looking to the data or search or find out any NGOs
wherever they're sitting in any corner of the world.
(47:20):
They can get information.
So information learning is big, big thing I would say.
Try to learn, try to find and gather like you are here.
You have definitely at one point of time looked beyond your circle.
And what about consumption of goods and what do you to for people internationally like
(47:47):
for in Australia for example what advice can you give to people about the goods that they
consume.
So this is very, very crucial, very, very important.
I think we talk a lot about the crime, the survivors and how we are restoring their life.
But I think we should look into why the why the questions.
(48:09):
So this is a big part of modern slavery or human trafficking.
So we should be definitely very conscious about what we are buying and if it is ethical,
if they are paid well or if they are made by children.
(48:34):
And so I think customer has to question.
How do they know with such a fast paced consumption in society?
What is it anything, any advice that you have?
I think first of all awareness.
Learn about what is happening and what is the issue.
(48:55):
That's number one.
And I don't think it is going to be very challenging or difficult with social media handles and
with this technology communication system is so sophisticated now.
Because we can share anything in the social media.
So I think we should definitely tell all the brands that declare where you are sourcing
(49:18):
it.
Tell us your ethical policy.
Tell us about your supply chain.
Why can't we do that?
Why can't we say it should be it could be the social media also.
And then we challenge.
I imagine there would be a place for technology to play a pivotal role in that.
Are there any good I know I've seen some some apps that can help to identify if you're buying
(49:45):
something what the company that you're buying it from what their history is like and how
ethical they are.
Is there any that you're aware of?
I heard that Marks and Spencer they have when you go to their website they have a map about
their production units which means they're telling about their sourcing and if you want
(50:11):
you can visit maybe.
Yeah.
Or if they are going through all the compliances etc. due diligence process.
That is one part.
And secondly I think whenever we are entering a store there should be some index or something
shown in every store.
I think we should demand that.
Yeah it's about what we demand in society.
(50:33):
Because when you are coming to a store you are shopping it should reflect that some key
information on every store which is missing I guess.
Yeah.
Because all the time you cannot look into website and then find and maybe some people
will do that but not all.
Yeah.
(50:53):
There should be some few key areas mandatory which should be on the store.
Any big store.
Is there one area that you would like to see changed or more action to be taken in particular?
Yeah actions definitely I know government has a big role to play but I think consumers
(51:14):
at the end voice.
Because consumer voice can influence what government does.
Yeah consumer voice is the last thing because we are the buyer we will decide our money
where it will go.
So I think consumer voice they should strengthen and people know how to where to protest and
where to what it is like or like or dislike.
(51:36):
Yeah.
Consumer voice is very important and I know it is a system is there policies are there
at every level.
We have to come together and partnerships collaborations improve that is needed.
Yeah.
Back to the destiny how many employees do you have?
(51:56):
We have around 15.
What kind of culture have you like have you created here?
Yeah this is very interesting.
I think from the very beginning like my priority was a joyful working environment, a smart
(52:17):
office culture where you come work you can leave you be your and it will be leadership
oriented goal oriented and very much connected to our vision mission very much connected
we can never forget why we are here.
Our end goal is maybe disrupting the cycle of exploitation.
So whenever we are stuck anywhere stuck just look and go back.
(52:40):
It is like you are no star.
Then I think the problem is solved.
So we believe in a smart office culture leadership approach and also it can be a bottom up approach
because we believe in grassroots leadership honestly.
So it instead of top down it could be bottom up or it could be both ways working.
(53:02):
Yeah.
Combination.
Whatever you need.
Yeah.
So grassroots leadership, survivor's leadership is the center.
They need to be their voice and they need to take control of their problem.
So in the office also we maintain it that way.
It's a really happy and joyful workplace and we make sure it happens.
(53:27):
We do a lot of we don't do it like on a paper like team building and then team time.
It's not like that.
I think we make opportunities to laugh, share and spend time together and same with the
community also.
That's nice.
And does it happen organically because of that culture?
(53:48):
It is happening organically till now because once you implant the culture.
Yeah.
I can really feel that here.
I do.
We should keep it that way.
But yeah, but I don't know what happens with the next generation leader because I believe
(54:11):
in passing on leadership because I don't want to be forever here and doing the same thing.
Maybe I will take up another vision.
This will still be very close to my heart what I do, but I think there is plenty of
things to do.
So maybe I will divert 50 percent of my time to something little different, but it has
(54:31):
to be something for the society and also self sustainable.
Yeah.
So both ways.
So what I see, I think the next level leadership is also the same way.
Everyone nowadays they are prioritizing a joyful work environment which is productive,
(54:52):
which is sustainable.
And you welcome, seems like you welcome volunteers to come to Destiny.
Very much, very much.
Yeah.
Because I always think, you know, when I began Destiny, so I used to secretly say one day
we will have an email ID and a lot of people will write to us from all over the world.
And so that was a kind of dream kind of.
(55:15):
And then now when I see so many emails, so many people want to come to us, come to us
and see how do I manage, do we manage time?
Then I think of that day.
Wow.
That's so nice.
That no one day I'm working this and this is happening.
Now you probably have to turn away.
Do you ever have to turn away volunteers?
You don't have to honestly.
No, that's good.
Unless they are able to work on our same date or something, then you miss people.
(55:40):
But otherwise they are pretty open and we don't have to struggle too much to accommodate
people.
Yeah.
So if anyone wanted to volunteer at Destiny from around the world and come to Kolkata
or offer some expertise even remotely, you welcome that.
Yeah, we welcome that.
But definitely, you know, we look into the time, the skill, if it is what they're expecting,
(56:04):
that is very important.
So we make sure that that matches.
So we go through a very, I mean, discussion process.
So we can eliminate people or people can eliminate Destiny and go to somewhere else.
So we go through that process.
Because it has to be mutually beneficial for both parts.
Yeah, it has to be mutually beneficial to both parts.
So I think it's a quite healthy way of recruiting volunteers.
(56:28):
So we get to know what is expected.
Some people say, no, I'm very professional.
I want this date to that date and I want to be really busy.
Then we tell them that it is not that place, I think.
Because we are not like feeding 100 people or nursing 100 old people.
It is not that kind of maybe you could go to different place.
(56:50):
Yeah, it is a lot about because our success is when you understand about modern slavery,
human trafficking, exploitations, couple of SDG goals.
Maybe if you take only 5% of the knowledge, we think that's a success.
So first is understanding of the issue and then understanding the organization and then
whatever way you contribute.
(57:11):
Yeah.
What kind of projects do you have happening at the moment that you could share?
Is there anything interesting?
So we are having, so we have a project in one of the red light area, scum and red light
area, the children and women.
We have a social enterprise where some of the women are manufacturing some fashion
(57:37):
boots, etc.
And then we are, we also work, still continue going to the shelter homes.
We provide some mindfulness, some English learning skills or providing them some necessary
articles what they need.
And we have recently got another project in collaboration with US Embassy Kolkata.
(58:01):
So we are the grantee and we will be working on our gender based violence project with
indigenous women.
So we will be selecting around 16 indigenous women from Nagaland and Assam.
And then we will find four mentors from the United States and we will have some session,
(58:22):
mentorship session.
Yeah.
How to combat GBV in your own area, etc.
So it's a cross border kind of collaboration project where we learn from each other.
And how far into that project?
Yeah.
So we began in 1st of August and we have selected almost 16 mentors we have selected.
(58:48):
We have mentors also ready.
We will be starting our mentorship session from mid November.
Amazing.
Great.
So we are very excited about that.
And gender based violence is very much into related to human trafficking.
Of course.
It's very aligned.
(59:09):
That is something we are very excited about.
And with the social enterprise aspect of Destiny where you make the products, how much of that
fuels the rest of the work that Destiny is able to do and funds the rest of the work
that Destiny is able to do?
Yeah, that is also a very good question.
(59:31):
So basically what we have seen that people, many people they have said that they love
the idea of this hybrid model.
Having the social business as well as the nonprofit.
They like it.
So that is I think a big component in our strength of our model.
(59:59):
And the social enterprise is actually is also even though it is a model social enterprise,
it's not that we have 100 women working and manufacturing.
So model is a small 10 women unit.
And it is a model in a way like it talks about business value chain and ethical business
(01:00:22):
and also being careful about people and planet.
They were working, they were in a good environment with also products and eco-friendly.
So I think it covers a couple of SDG goals.
So definitely it is very, very motivating for what we do on the other side.
(01:00:45):
And it is also as I mentioned that it is also like we need the intersection is very, very
important right now.
So we like the idea that the business and the social cause is together.
Yet they are separate with their own entity.
(01:01:07):
Yeah it's a powerful model.
It's a big, I think it is an excitement, it is a satisfaction, it is motivating also how
we are able to.
What advice would you give to youngest Marita who was innocently starting out Destiny Reflection?
(01:01:27):
What advice would you give her now if you could?
I think you should risk instead of going for a paid job and not taking an adventurous journey,
you should actually believe in yourself, just listen to your inner self and find out.
That is one point.
(01:01:48):
And second point, if something goes wrong, like don't feel deserted or think that is
the only chance I had gone, there will be chances which comes back.
So both way.
So just take risks, start if you want to be an entrepreneur, what will be your, you risk
yourself, do that.
(01:02:09):
At the same time, don't get too deserted and then you take it, it becomes a mental health
issues for many people, when you are not able to reach that far or reach that numbers or
you missed out that funding or you don't have any business or you are not able to make partnerships,
I think don't get overworked up on all this.
(01:02:36):
Stay there, you can do something in a small scale also, you can do something in a big
scale also, so keep a balance.
Good advice.
Is there anything else you wanted to share before we wrap up?
I think it's been a lovely journey and even though you know, it is a learning, it is a
(01:02:59):
learning and at the end I think, you know, it is about containment, you have to find
your success within yourself and you have to measure your own success and instead of
building, because when I began, when I started, I think I didn't know like I would look at
(01:03:24):
some model visitor organization and think maybe this is what success looks like, but
I think from my experience, I think I decide my success.
Create your own markup.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I decide my success.
Experiencing what you do within, moving out of your comfort zone, going out, this is very,
(01:03:47):
very important.
I think we should know our world and reach out to the people who are in the corners.
So I think it is a very interesting journey and I encourage people to come and take small
risks or and explore the world and understand the problems.
(01:04:13):
Yeah, yeah, and then you might find your area that sparks something inside you to take action.
Thank you Smreeta.
Thank you.
It's been so wonderful.
Thank you, Rachel.
It was lovely talking to you.
I don't know if it makes sense or not, but then it spoke from my heart.
It speaks.
I can hear it loud and clear.
(01:04:35):
Thank you.
So I hope you enjoy hearing from Smreeta and learning a bit more about Destiny and what
they're trying to achieve and perhaps opening your eyes up a little bit more to the huge
systemic issue of trafficking across the world.
It was really so, so lovely to see the Destiny team again.
(01:04:57):
It had been five years since I'd been back to India and when I walked back into the Destiny
office, it really was the same energy, if not more vibrant than before.
I will link to Destiny's social media in the episode notes and also their website where
you can have a look at the beautiful different products that they make.
(01:05:18):
And if you have any questions or would like to know more about Destiny, I'm sure they
would be thrilled to hear from you.
And I'll also link to a documentary that's on YouTube.
You can watch for free.
It's called Stolen Innocence and this features both Destiny and New Life Foundation actually.
It's about trafficking in Kolkata.
(01:05:41):
And then in terms of something you can do, I will also link to a website called Shop
Ethical.
This is an ethical consumer guide.
It's directed towards Australian consumers and it gives the lowdown on environmental
and social records of companies that are behind like common name brands that are common in
(01:06:03):
Australia.
You can also buy an app online which is about $6 where you can actually scan the barcodes
of products and it pulls up an ethical rating of the brand.
At the very least, check out the website because it's really interesting to play around with
and I'm sure if you're in a different country, you can have a search for something that might
be similar relating to your country.
(01:06:24):
But it can just be a really eye-opening exercise to see how some of the companies you might
shop regularly with are behaving and it might just influence which brands you might choose
over others for the future.
So thank you for taking the time to listen.
Please feel free to rate the podcast and share with any friends who this may interest.
(01:06:48):
Sending you love, my fellow humans, wherever you are.
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