Episode Transcript
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Ori Wellington (00:00):
Welcome to the
Deep Dive.
Today we're jumping into astory that really made some
noise recently Workiva.
Oh yeah, big stock surge right32% after their Q2 2025 earnings
Huge number Exactly.
And you know, at first glanceyou think, okay, great quarter
success story, right.
But when you dig into thecourses, especially this piece
(00:21):
from Wheelhouse Advisors,workiva's IRM surge a strategic
evolution it paints a much morecomplex picture.
It's actually a reallyinteresting story about a
company in the middle of apretty critical strategic shift.
Sam Jones (00:35):
That's exactly right
and that's kind of our mission
today, isn't it?
To get past that headlinenumber.
We really want to unpack whatthis surge actually means in the
bigger context of integratedrisk management, irm.
It's a field that's changingfast, so we'll look at those
market shifts, what Workiva isdoing specifically, their Q2
results, obviously and,importantly, what it all means
for risk tech going forward.
Ori Wellington (00:56):
Okay, let's
unpack this then.
So what's this strong quarterreally telling us about
Workiva's bigger game plan?
And, maybe more importantly forlisteners, what does it signal
about how companies you knowenterprises are thinking about
risk these days?
Sam Jones (01:11):
Well, maybe start
with the numbers.
Ori Wellington (01:13):
Yeah, because
they are strong, yeah let's do
that Q2, $215 million totalrevenue.
That's up 21% year over year,pretty solid.
Sam Jones (01:21):
Very solid and the
driver behind that, the
subscription revenue thatclimbed even faster 23% up to
$198 million.
Ori Wellington (01:30):
Those are
impressive figures.
Sam Jones (01:31):
They really are, and
it's not just the growth.
Look at the retention 97% grossretention.
Ori Wellington (01:36):
Wow.
Sam Jones (01:36):
And get this 114% net
retention.
That means existing customersare spending more.
Ori Wellington (01:42):
That's a great
sign.
Sam Jones (01:43):
Absolutely, and they
even raised their full year
guidance to around $872 million.
Ori Wellington (01:50):
So you, know the
momentum seems real, which
explains the investor reaction.
That huge 32% jump afterearnings Makes sense Totally.
Sam Jones (01:56):
But and this is where
Wheelhouse Advisors add some
important context- Right,there's always a but.
Exactly.
While this Q2 rally isfantastic news for them now,
their stock had actually beendown quite a bit before this,
about 24% over the previous twoyears.
Ori Wellington (02:10):
Okay, so not
exactly a smooth ride up until
this point.
Some volatility investor doubtsmaybe.
Sam Jones (02:16):
Definitely signals
that.
It suggests this isn't like thefinish line of a transformation
, it's more like the promisingstart of one.
Ori Wellington (02:23):
A necessary one.
It sounds like A very necessarystrategic realignment.
Sam Jones (02:26):
yes, they had some
let's call them structural
vulnerabilities before, mostlylinked to depending too heavily
on specific regulations.
Ori Wellington (02:35):
Ah, like the
EU's CSRD.
Yeah, the CorporateSustainability Reporting
Directive.
I remember hearing about delaysthere impacting companies.
Sam Jones (02:43):
Exactly that kind of
thing Delays impact reporting
timelines, which hits revenuerecognition, which spooks
investors.
So this recent surge suggestsinvestors are starting to
believe Workiva is finallyaddressing those kinds of
dependencies, getting moreresilient.
Ori Wellington (02:57):
OK, that makes a
lot of sense, and this pivot
Workiva is making it seems toalign perfectly with a bigger
trend in the whole riskmanagement space, doesn't it?
Sam Jones (03:05):
Absolutely.
The Wheelhouse Advisors Report,their IRM navigator for 2025,
nails this.
They talk about enterprise riskmanagement, moving
fundamentally from compliance tointelligence.
Ori Wellington (03:17):
From compliance
to intelligence.
Ok, what does that mean?
Practically Less box ticking.
Sam Jones (03:22):
Pretty much Less
focus on just meeting regulatory
requirements you know, checkingthe boxes and much more focused
on getting real time, actualinsights.
Ori Wellington (03:31):
So companies
want to spot risks proactively,
maybe even like predict thembefore they blow up.
Sam Jones (03:37):
Precisely Spot and
neutralize threats before they
become catastrophes.
It's a huge shift and itchanges what companies look for
in their vendors.
Ori Wellington (03:44):
So who wins in
that kind of market?
Sam Jones (03:46):
The winners are the
vendors delivering those
cross-domain insights.
Automation, too, platforms thatcan connect the dots across
different risk areas, not justtools stuck on one narrow
regulation.
Ori Wellington (03:57):
Okay, so where
Kiva is trying to become one of
those platforms, repositioningfrom primarily a financial
reporting tool, which is wherethey started.
Sam Jones (04:04):
Right, that was their
core.
Ori Wellington (04:05):
To something
much broader, covering ESG audit
, financial disclosure and thiswhole integrated risk management
IRM umbrella.
That sounds like a massiveundertaking.
Sam Jones (04:17):
It is.
It's a big pivot.
Ori Wellington (04:18):
How's it going?
Is it actually working?
Sam Jones (04:20):
Well, the numbers
suggest it is resonating.
They mentioned 71% of theirsubscription revenue now comes
from customers using multiplesolutions on their platform.
Ori Wellington (04:29):
Oh, wow, okay,
so customers are buying into the
broader platform idea, not justusing one piece.
Sam Jones (04:34):
Exactly, it shows
successful cross-selling, yes,
but also dupper adoption.
They're building out featuresfor assured integrated reporting
workflows that connect teams,continuous monitoring, real-time
analytics trying to deliver onthat integrated promise.
Ori Wellington (04:50):
Which naturally
brings us to the competition,
because they're not doing thisin a vacuum.
Sam Jones (04:55):
Not at all.
The competitive landscape iswell.
It's really interesting here.
Ori Wellington (04:58):
So who are the
benchmarks?
Who should we compare Workivato?
Sam Jones (05:01):
Well, the Wheelhouse
Report points to companies like
Archer and OneTrust.
They're examples of firms thatmade this kind of integrated IRM
play earlier and successfully.
Ori Wellington (05:09):
Right, expanding
from, maybe, it risk or privacy
into broader areas like ESG orcyber risk.
Sam Jones (05:15):
Exactly.
They kind of set a benchmarkfor what that integration path
looks like.
Ori Wellington (05:19):
OK, and then
there are others taking a
different approach.
Sam Jones (05:21):
Yeah, look at someone
like Audit Board.
They've focused more on deepspecialization really strong and
internal audit and GRCgovernance, risk and compliance.
Ori Wellington (05:33):
So best of breed
in a specific area rather than
the broad platform play.
Sam Jones (05:38):
Right, and that
approach has its strengths, for
sure, deep expertise but it alsocarries that potential
vulnerability we talked aboutearlier, being maybe too
dependent on specific regulatorydrivers or niches, a bit like
Workiva's past challenges,potentially.
Ori Wellington (05:52):
Ah, okay, so
you've got these two different
strategies playing out Deepspecialization versus broad
integration.
Sam Jones (05:57):
Exactly, and that
really highlights the strategic
tightrope Workiva is walking.
They're clearly betting onintegration now.
Ori Wellington (06:04):
That's where it
gets really interesting.
As you said, High stakes.
Sam Jones (06:07):
Definitely and to
understand where Workiva fits in
that integrated futureWheelhouse uses this model.
Their five functional layers ofautonomous IRM.
Ori Wellington (06:16):
Okay, five
layers Sounds structured.
What are they?
Sam Jones (06:19):
Think of them not as
separate boxes, but as
interconnected decision layers.
They all work together to helpa company achieve its goals
across performance, resilience,assurance and compliance.
They call it PRAC for short.
Ori Wellington (06:34):
PRAC Got it
Performance, resilience,
assurance, compliance.
Sam Jones (06:39):
Right.
It's a framework for thinkingabout what a truly integrated,
maybe even autonomous, riskmanagement system needs to do.
Ori Wellington (06:47):
So, within those
five layers, where does Workiva
currently shine?
Where are their strengths?
Sam Jones (06:53):
Based on that model,
their traditional strengths are
clearly in layer five, which isverification and audit.
Ori Wellington (06:58):
Okay, Makes
sense given their background and
also layer one strategicoversight.
Sam Jones (07:02):
So the high level
view and the detail checking.
Ori Wellington (07:04):
Gotcha top and
bottom layers, sort of so if
those are the strengths, where'sthe room for growth?
Where are the big opportunitiesfor them to really become that
end-to-end IRM player?
Sam Jones (07:13):
The big gaps, or
rather opportunities, are in the
middle layers.
Layer three is threatintelligence proactively
identifying risks.
Layer two is businessorchestration, coordinating
actions across the company.
And layer four is automatedresponse actually acting on
threats automatically wherepossible.
Ori Wellington (07:32):
And those middle
layers.
Sam Jones (07:33):
Yeah.
Ori Wellington (07:34):
Those are areas
where competitors might be
stronger right now.
Sam Jones (07:37):
That's what the
analysis suggests.
Competitors like Archer andOneTrust often have strong
capabilities in those particularareas.
So that's where Rakeva reallyneeds to build out, either
organically or maybe throughacquisition, to fulfill that
true integrated vision.
Ori Wellington (07:51):
Okay, this ties
back to the investor view, then
right, investors are gettingsavvier about this.
Sam Jones (07:56):
Seems like it, the
sentiment is shifting away from
just rewarding compliance plays.
Ori Wellington (08:00):
They want more
strategic value Platforms that
aren't going to get sideswipedby one regulatory change.
Sam Jones (08:04):
Exactly.
They prefer these integrated,diversified platforms more
resilient, more adaptable, lessdependent on, say, one specific
mandate, like CSRD was for atime.
Right, so the recommendationsflowing from this analysis would
be Well, for Workiva it'spretty clear Push hard into
those middle IRM layers threat,intel, orchestration, response
(08:26):
and, crucially, communicate thestrategic value, not just the
compliance box ticking.
Ori Wellington (08:31):
Makes sense and
for other vendors.
Sam Jones (08:33):
The message is
similar Embrace integration.
Either build it yourself orpartner up.
Silos are becoming lessattractive.
Ori Wellington (08:40):
And for the
actual risk and compliance
leaders, listening in the peoplein the trenches.
Sam Jones (08:45):
For them, it's about
thinking strategically about
their tech roadmap, aligning itwith this integrated IRM future
and, when evaluating vendors,maybe use a framework like those
autonomous IRM layers to seewho covers what and how well.
It's about future-proofingtheir own risk programs who
covers what?
Ori Wellington (09:00):
and how well
it's about future-proofing their
own risk programs.
Okay, so wrapping this up,where Kiva's strong Q2 and that
stock surge, it's like an earlythumbs up for a major strategic
pivot they're undertaking.
Sam Jones (09:08):
Yeah, an initial
validation but, definitely just
the beginning.
Ori Wellington (09:11):
Right, this
isn't just about one company's
quarterly earnings.
It's reflecting a reallyfundamental shift in how
businesses have to think aboutrisk today, moving beyond just
compliance and how businesseshave to think about risk today,
moving beyond just complianceTowards intelligent, integrated
solutions.
Sam Jones (09:24):
It's about managing
risk proactively in a world
that's just getting more complex.
Ori Wellington (09:29):
So a final
thought then what's the bigger
takeaway here?
Sam Jones (09:31):
Well, if we connect
this to the really big picture,
it kind of begs a crucialquestion, doesn't it?
In this environment of, youknow, of constant change,
overwhelming information, howvital is it for any company,
really no matter the industry,to ditch those fragmented
approaches to truly embracecross-domain integration?
(09:52):
Not just in their tech stack,but Right, not just technology,
but in their strategy, theirdecision-making, their culture.
How critical is that shiftbecoming for survival, let alone
success?
Maybe something for you, thelistener, to think about in your
own context, your own industry.
Ori Wellington (10:07):
That's a
powerful question to leave
people with Great food forthought.
Thanks for joining us on thisdeep dive into Workiva, its
strategic journey and the reallydynamic world of integrated
risk management.