Most cosmetic and plastic surgery clinics can tell you they’re “specialist”. The harder question is: how do you prove it in a way patients can feel from the first enquiry to the final follow-up? We talk with Alon Ben Harry, Director of CREO Clinic in London, about what it takes to build a high-trust private healthcare business in one of the most competitive markets in the UK.
We get into the decisions that shape real differentiation: premium positioning that is backed by consultant-led care, high clinical standards, and a patient experience designed to reduce anxiety. Alon explains why CREO bundles value into the core fee rather than upselling essentials, including unlimited consultations, generous follow-up, and practical post-op support like lymphatic drainage and scar treatments. We also explore how clinics can earn trust consistently through reviews, organic visibility, and a team culture that gives clinicians the space to do their best work.
From there, we zoom out to what’s changing across aesthetic medicine and private plastic surgery: shifting demand away from exaggerated BBL looks, rising skin tightening needs linked to weight-loss drugs, and the “comparison shift” driven by social media. On the business side, Alon is candid about marketing spend, lead conversion rates, why hiring for accountability can make or break expansion, and the growing uncertainty as AI and search reshape how patients discover clinics.
If you run a clinic, lead a patient-facing medical business, or you’re simply curious about how high-quality private care is built, subscribe, share, and leave a review. What’s the single biggest lever for trust in your world: outcomes, communication, or consistency?
Guest Biography
Alon Ben Arie is Director and Co-Founder of CREO Clinic, a London-based specialist plastic surgery practice focused on consultant-led care, patient experience, and clinical excellence.
Before entering private healthcare, Alon trained and worked as a solicitor before moving into the medical devices sector, where he managed international markets across the Asia-Pacific region. After relocating to the UK, he worked on introducing innovative medical technologies into the NHS before co-founding CREO Clinic alongside Consultant Plastic Surgeon Mr Omar Tillo.
Today, Alon leads the commercial and operational side of the business, overseeing growth strategy, marketing, patient acquisition, and service delivery. His approach centres on specialisation, premium patient care, and building sustainable healthcare businesses through trust and long-term value creation.
Links
- Website (Main): https://creoclinic.com
- Website (Gender-Affirming Surgery) https://gender.creoclinic.com
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alon-ben-arie-73b3b168/
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About the podcast
Voices in Health and Wellness features conversations at the intersection of medicine, lifestyle, and human potential, with clinicians, scientists, and thinkers shaping the future of care.
About Dr Andrew Greenland
UK-based medical doctor and founder of Greenland Medical, specialising in Integrative and Functional Medicine. Trained in both conventional and root-cause approaches, Andrew helps people optimise health, performance, and longevity, with a focus on cognitive resilience and healthy ageing.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr Andrew Greenland (00:00):
Welcome back to Voices in Health and
Wellness.
This is the podcast where wespeak with leaders across
private healthcare, wellness,and patient-facing medical
businesses about what it reallytakes to build, grow and operate
successful practices.
Today I'm joined by Alon BenArie, Director of the CREO
Clinic, a specialist plasticsurgery and aesthetics practice
in London.
CREO Clinic has built a strongreputation with a highly
(00:20):
competitive sector by focusingon patient experience,
consultant-led care, andmaintaining high clinical
standards while navigating therealities of running a modern
private healthcare business.
So with that, Alon, I'd like towelcome you to the show.
Thank you very much for joiningus.
Alon Ben Arie (00:34):
Thank you very much for inviting me, Andrew.
Dr Andrew Greenland (00:37):
So maybe we could start with your story.
So for listeners that may notknow you, could you tell us a
little bit about your backgroundand what led you into
healthcare and eventually to theCreole Clinic?
Alon Ben Arie (00:47):
Oh wow, okay.
So um actually started um well,I I'm I'm a solicitor in trade,
and I I at some stage decidedthat that's probably not my the
right career path.
And I started working in themedical device sector, um,
especially kind of managing umsegments.
(01:10):
So I was in charge of APAC fora while, for over six years in a
company called Vayora, which isa medical device manufacturer,
mostly for the aesthetic um umkind of side of the business.
We had some other sides of thebusiness as well, but that was
kind of the main focus.
Um, and I've done that forabout six years, managing um
(01:31):
kind of the APAC region, um,understanding a lot about this
market.
I guess this is my kind of uhyou know segue to this industry
as well today.
Um so yeah, this is how Istarted.
I then moved to the UK, I kindof left Bayora at some stage.
I opened my own uh consultancybusiness and a skincare business
(01:54):
as well.
Um, and I when I moved to theUK, I started kind of to uh
introduce new technologies tothe NHS.
So that could have been uh someplastic surgery equipment, but
also some ophthalmologicalophthalmology um equipment,
mostly lasers, um, and some AIequipment as well.
So not equipment, but uh youknow software.
(02:14):
Um I've done that for for kindof the beginning from 2018 to
about when kind of COVID hit.
Uh and then um when COVID hit,there was less of an appetite in
the NHS for new technologies atthe time.
So um yeah, I kind of thoughtabout new things to do.
(02:34):
And um that's generally where Imet uh my business partner
today, Mr.
Omar Tillo, uh, who is aplastic surgeon himself.
And he was on this same on theon this on the stage where he
kind of left the NHS on aboutthat time.
Um and we understood quiteearly on that we'll need um a
(02:55):
business arm to this.
Um so he's in charge of theclinical stuff, and uh he's a
medical director, and I'm incharge of the commercial um
stuff in the clinic.
So we we established CREO in2022, um, with the aim of um um
(03:16):
finding, well, specializing uhfinding surgeons that will
specialize in very, veryspecific things, not doing a bit
of everything.
Um and this is kind of theessence of the clinic generally,
uh, to be very specialized, orat least this is what we thought
that we we will be at the time.
Uh there's a long story forthat that we might get onto uh
(03:36):
during this conversation.
So yeah, and then we arerunning um Cryo um ever since,
so ever since early 2022, reallylate 21 until today.
Um so yeah, this is a bit of abit about me.
Dr Andrew Greenland (03:53):
Thank you, and a really helpful background
and context.
So, was there a particularmoment when you realized that
you enjoyed building businessesas much as being involved in
healthcare?
Because you've done a number ofdifferent things, and now
you've kind of gravitatedtowards healthcare.
What was the kind of thing foryou in healthcare?
Alon Ben Arie (04:08):
So actually, um this was quite a natural move
for me.
So we uh Valora was a familybusiness at the time, uh, before
we kind of uh spin it off andsolve it uh to uh actually an
English pharmaceutical, notChinese, a Sinclair pharma.
Um and um so it was kind of anight natural thing for me to
(04:30):
do.
My father was in the businessfor many years, so I kind of
always um I was always familiarwith with it and I always liked
it.
So I thought that this issomething I should pursue with.
Um but then moving to the B2Cwas a complete change for me.
Uh I guess that the uh theskincare business kind of was
(04:51):
the first thing that kind of umit was a professional uh
skincare business at the time uhthat was sold mainly for
doctors and to doctors and umand to beticians.
Um and I think that was a goodsegue for me uh to understand
the B2C market, if that makessense, or the patient market.
Um and I kind of understoodmore about this, more about
(05:13):
marketing, more around kind ofrunning ads as well.
So I mean everything togetherkind of uh everything came
together, and I think that bythat time I was ready to uh you
know take on the uh privatesector of healthcare in the UK,
and this is what we're doingever since.
Dr Andrew Greenland (05:33):
Thank you.
So perhaps you would you mindtelling us a little bit about
the Creo Clinic today?
What does it look like, and whodo you primarily serve?
Alon Ben Arie (05:42):
Right.
So um the Creo Clinic today isquite a small setup, actually.
We are we're a team of eight,so we are two surgeons, myself
who kind of run the businessside of everything, two nurses
and three admins.
Uh that's the whole team.
Um of course we have some kindof freelancers, etc., that kind
of help us um with certaintasks, usually marketing stuff.
(06:08):
Um and the aim also for theclinic, perhaps in the next two
years, is to onboard three moresurgeons.
So the aim is definitely forgrowth.
Um we serve mostly um kind ofuntil today we'll patients that
seek plastic surgery from theneck down.
(06:29):
So Dr.
Tillow and Dr.
Dendel Vecchio both specializeonly in that.
We're currently onboarding somesurgeons, uh, another surgeon
that would be an octoplasticsurgeon, um, that would uh you
know do eye-related surgery.
Uh, but the idea is to keepthings very, very focused um and
never to kind of do a bit ofeverything, never be jack of all
(06:52):
trades.
Um, this is what we'recurrently doing.
The end of 2025, we alsodecided to open another segment
of the business, which is thegender, creo gender, um, where
we will serve the transgendercommunity in the UK.
That's the um the main idea.
Uh here the idea was is tobasically be a hub for the
(07:20):
transgender uh community when itcomes to surgery.
So we found that the UK marketis currently quite um segmented,
and we decided that thereshould be one home uh or one
surgical hub where we don't needto refer to each other all the
time or we can just see them allin one centralized place.
So that's also something we'recurrently developing.
(07:41):
Uh we just started with that,but this is something we have
high hopes for.
Dr Andrew Greenland (07:46):
Amazing.
So the plastic surgery andaesthetic market has become
increasingly crowded over thelast decade.
And what do you think hashelped CREO establish itself
within the market?
Alon Ben Arie (07:58):
So, yeah, so that's uh I think a really good
question.
Um, and I think this issomething that we had a lot of
well we had a lot of trials onthat, and and I think what we
initially started while gettinginto this um was changed
throughout the journey.
Um so initially we were quitefocused on on being specialized.
(08:24):
So we thought that this wouldbe our main selling point.
We'll have only surgeons thatspecialize in very specific
things, and um, well, peoplewill understand that we're
specialized and they will liketo come for specialists, and uh,
you know, uh it will probablyplay itself like that.
Um but with time we understoodthat um, well, everybody say
(08:44):
that they're specialists, and umyou'd you'd probably need
something more than that uh tobe able to show for it, not just
to say that we're specialistsand you know, that's it, and
hope that um the UK um patientbase will just kind of um be
convinced by that.
Um and um so I think with timewe we kind of perfected the the
(09:10):
marketing and and we kind of uhperfected the the messaging
until I found that today almostafter five years, we're still
we're starting to get themessage across.
Uh and I think um one of thethings that um you know one of
the things that worked for us isthe differentiation.
(09:31):
Uh we we always try to makevery clear to the patients or to
the clients at that stage umwhat makes us different.
Um and so the first thing wouldbe positioning.
I think that it's it's it'sit's important to understand
from the beginning uh if youwould be um positioning yourself
(09:56):
high, I mean, especially withprices, but that comes with some
more some other thing that'skind of attached to it, or that
you will position yourself low,which is okay.
Um, you probably can get moremarket share if that makes
sense.
Um but we both Omar and Idecided that we want to kind of
go for the higher market.
(10:17):
Um, and that's also because ithas two reasons why we decided
to go to we have this decision.
A is that we thought that umyou know we'll be less volatile
to changes in market.
Uh you know, if if you if yougo for the higher spenders, if
you will, then they will be lessvolatile, and that would also
(10:40):
mean that we will be lessvolatile.
So that was the firstconsideration.
But also I think that we wantedto provide the best care.
And although it's possible toprovide very good care and cheap
care as well, or not cheap, butless expensive, we wanted to
kind of make sure that we costwould not be a deterrent for us.
(11:01):
So that sometimes means um morethat more money should be
involved.
And so we wanted to essentiallyum you know provide the best
care, even if it means that itwill cost a bit more money.
And this is what we what wewent for.
Um but I think that the problemwas how even then we will kind
(11:25):
of project it to the clients.
How would they how would theyknow about this?
Um, and I think that this tookus a while to figure out.
Um, yeah, if you if you thinkit's the right way to go, I'm
more than happy to share moreinformation about this.
Dr Andrew Greenland (11:42):
Sure.
So I was just thinking aboutprospective clients when they
first engage with the clinic.
What experience are you tryingto create for them?
And particularly as you've justmentioned, that you're working
more with the high end of themarket.
How do you what kind ofexperience do you create and how
do you do it?
Alon Ben Arie (11:58):
So I think first of all, you're right, there's an
experience when they come in,everything needs to kind of play
the part, so the clinic needsto look quite nice, but also um
kind of the service itself orthe promise of what you will
provide to them, I think, needsto um needs to be right.
Uh so for example, we do notlimit in the amount of
(12:20):
consultations of of you know oneof our patients that want to
see us.
So the consultation fee willalways include unlimited amounts
of consultations, unlimitedamount of follow-up.
So we kind of we give, Ibelieve, the impression that um
we're actually taking care ofsomeone.
It's not just um they're comingto get a service from us, we
(12:42):
are kind of we're trying to giveas much value as possible from
the beginning.
And I think this kind of goesthroughout the um throughout,
it's kind of show throughout thejourney with us.
Um so also the idea of surgerywith us is like that.
So we I think this is somethingthat at some stage I kind of
got from a random video, I kindof uh scene of Steam Jobs uh
(13:06):
with Apple uh at some stage.
That um he was talking aboutApple, of course, and you know,
maybe it's a bit of a cliche,but I kind of said that he
should include as much value aspossible into your services.
Um was thinking how we couldreally do that also in our in
our kind of small niche ofclassic surgery.
(13:26):
And um, you know, we justthought about how we can bundle
everything in together as muchas possible and never kind of
and never put this to the clientas another uh version that he
can upgrade to or anything likethat.
Everything is bundled from dayone, get everything included in
the price.
(13:46):
Um, so that's for example, inour clinic wouldn't you know it
would mean lymphatic massagedrainage, um, lymphatic drainage
massage after surgery, scartreatments with lasers,
supplements before or after.
Um, you know, uh again,unlimited, even sometimes
(14:07):
excessive amount of follow-upjust to make sure that
everything is okay andperfected.
So we really try to,everything, of course, with with
taste and reason uh that wethink that would be valuable to
the client, and then we wouldadd it.
So that's that's kind of ourphilosophy, I suppose.
Um, and I think it took sometime until it shows because it's
(14:28):
not something that patients seeimmediately, but I think that
with time that you kind ofcontinuously do that and you
stay on it, um then eventuallypatients kind of get that and
they they decide that they seethe value and they kind of pass
on, and of course, this kind ofcomes out with reviews and then
uh with with referrals, etc.
(14:50):
So yeah, I think eventually youyou you you reap the reward.
It takes some time, but umeventually it does.
Dr Andrew Greenland (14:59):
Thank you.
So you talked a lot about theyou know putting as much value
into um a patient experience aspossible.
I guess trust is absolutelyhuge as well, particularly for
patients considering um surgery.
So, how does your team buildthat sort of trust consistently
across the whole patientjourney?
Alon Ben Arie (15:17):
Um yeah, right.
So I think trust generally is avery personal thing.
You you can't really well youcan convey the trust with
reviews, of course.
So that's something that wealways try to get.
That's very important for anyclinic, I think, to get.
Uh, and if if somebody doesn'thave a review platform, they
should definitely get one andand then and um yeah, and then
(15:39):
work on that.
Also, when it comes to kind ofmarketing in terms of social uh
or social marketing, but alsoorganic organic traffic.
So I think that's that'ssomething which is very
valuable.
So we we um we focus on that.
So that's one part of trust, ofcourse, a marketing part of it.
But in the clinical side, um, Ithink that comes very much with
(16:02):
the um surgeons and the nursesthat we work with um that have
very good rapport with thepatient.
The fact that we don't limitthe amount of consultations also
gives some um it givessomething, obviously it gives
some reassurance to the patient,but it also gives some kind of
reassurance to the surgeon thatyou know that he from the clinic
(16:26):
side at least that he doesn'tneed to um kind of limit
everything to a very specifictime, and if somebody needs has
more questions, they can come inagain.
And so I think all of thesethings together, all these
factors together, uh buildtrust.
It's not one thing, it's like amultiple thing, uh, multiple
things that you need to makesure that you tap on uh to
eventually give the you know thepatient is um this feeling.
Dr Andrew Greenland (16:53):
Thank you.
So we already talked aboutyou're operating in a very
fast-changing sector.
What sort of major shifts areyou seeing in private healthcare
more widely at the moment?
And are you asking are youseeing any changes in patient
expectations?
Alon Ben Arie (17:09):
Um yes, it's a good question, actually.
Because there are there are afew things that are happening
right now, I think.
Um one of the procedures thatwe've been doing quite a lot of
is a procedure called, I don'tknow if everybody else knows it,
but it's called BBL.
Uh so it's um essentially fattransfer to the botox and hips,
(17:33):
which is quite uh um, well, Isuppose it was quite a uh uh a
trendy procedure uh at the time.
And now I think with time wesee a general shift, not not
necessarily from it, but fromthe um but from the look that
people were were were trying toto achieve, this kind of you
(17:56):
know uh you know big button, Isuppose.
Um so that's kind of toned downsignificantly, which which we
are very much you know in favorof generally, because this is
not the the look or theexaggerated look was never the
kind of the kind of look that wewould provide.
We actually would turn manypatients away to say that we we
(18:20):
cannot provide this kind oflook.
So we're actually quite happywith this change.
So this is one major changethat that happened, I think, in
the industry of plastic surgeryor body contouring surgery.
Uh the BBL market kind of toneddown a bit.
Um but on the other side, onthe on the other side of this, I
think we have seen um a higheramount of patients coming in for
(18:45):
skin reduction or skintightening procedures due to
kind of um you know late uhweight losing drugs, uh,
especially.
Um so we can see many morepatients that um they know that
they need to stop than beforeprocedure to kind of stable
their weight, and you can seemore and more patients coming in
(19:07):
with um skin acidity issues.
Dr Andrew Greenland (19:12):
And how much more informed are patients
today compared with when youfirst started in the sector, you
know, four or five years ago?
Alon Ben Arie (19:20):
I wouldn't say that there is a big change uh in
terms of informed.
You have you have the informedpatients and you have the
uninformed patients in the city.
And I think that the umequally, you know, the the um
the ratio changed uh in the lastfive years that we've we've
been doing it in the CRIOclinic.
I mean, internet is there.
Um some patients kind of readmore into very vast treatment
(19:45):
pages with all this informationand become more prepared.
Some of them seen moresurgeons, some of them you know
didn't almost or didn't readmuch about it, and you're
probably the first surgeon thatthat you've seen.
So there is kind of a spectrumto that, and I don't think that
I've seen much variance in thelast five years.
Dr Andrew Greenland (20:04):
And you touched earlier on about social
media, and obviously socialmedia is incredibly topical at
the moment, but how has thattransformed aesthetic and
cosmetic surgery?
And has it had much of animpact on patient behavior from
what you see?
Alon Ben Arie (20:19):
Yes, actually, that's um again, that's a good
question.
Our doctor, um Dr.
Daniel Vecchio, who joins usfrom the United States, um,
talks a lot about a lot aboutthis, uh, especially when it
comes to uh BBL.
So he's one of the biggestsurgeons for BBL in the state,
and now he kind of um performedsurgery with us as well.
(20:41):
And he's talking aboutsomething that is called the
comparison shift.
In the past, where when youknow somebody had one or wanted
surgery, they would look attheir before surgery or you
know, on their before picturesand compare them to the after
pictures.
But that's what changed todaythat because of social media,
(21:03):
that people are not really uhcomparing their results to their
previous look.
What they're doing is comparingit to the world, um, or you
know, if you will, the bestlooking, you know, pictures out
there.
Um so what it drives isessentially less satisfied
(21:24):
clients or patients um in thatregard, I think.
Um it really I think that thedifference is not the same for
all surgeries.
So I think this specificsurgery suffered from this
comparison shift, but you haveprocedures like um, I don't
know, Tommy Tak, um where youknow it's mostly um postnatal um
(21:49):
uh women that that um that arejust very happy uh to kind of
restore uh their own um bodyback, if you will.
So
Dr Andrew Greenland (22:00):
depends on the procedure and the type of
client the age as well reallymatters here but social media is
definitely uh especially forthe younger um sectors of
patients uh it's it's definitelyuh an issue sometimes so
obviously you work on thebusiness side of the clinic and
(22:20):
what do you what are the biggestmisunderstandings about running
a healthcare business ratherthan simply working in one from
what you see I think that thereare two big um or before I got
into it I thought I thought twothings would be probably easier
uh one of them is choosingpersonnel I found that um maybe
(22:46):
I'll I'll complement that with astory so about three years ago
we decided that we will uhengage with uh the non-surgical
um um side or side of thebusiness a lot would be uh
injectables uh lasers and youknow non-surgical aesthetic
procedures if you will um and wethought okay we we'll buy a few
(23:09):
machines and and um you knowwe'll buy some consumables and
um we'll hire a good doctor thatwe think that is knowledgeable
enough and she will join theteam and we'll we'll just um you
know start start start this umbut I think very soon we found
out that you you you need tofind people that will not only
(23:33):
take accountabilityaccountability uh for their own
work but that will that thatwill care enough about your
business to actually um you knowdevelop something for you it's
not just that you know um youknow it's not about just
bringing anybody um to come andwork with you and so the more we
(23:53):
kind of try to find someone wewe we understood that it's not
an easy job and then we probablywant to focus only on things
that we know that we're doingand only when we find the right
partner kind of branch out tosomething new.
Alon Ben Arie (24:08):
So this is what we did we actually scaled down
from non-surgical almostcompletely um and we kind of
decided to refocus our effortsonly to the surgical uh segment
of the business and I think thatalso has some financial it has
some focus element to it so allof a sudden you don't need to
focus on several things and whenyou have more focus on
(24:31):
something at least potentiallyuh you you expect to see better
returns but also financially umyou know all of a sudden our
kind of marketing budget and ouryou know consumable budget or
general budget um is not kind ofdistributed into several
segments but only one segment Ithink we understood that from
(24:52):
now on we focus on somethinguntil we perfect it only when we
feel at least that we perfectedit to a certain degree that we
are happy with only then we willkind of branch out and do more.
So that's one thing that I'velearned that is kind of um you
know something that I I I didn'thave I thought it would
(25:13):
probably be a bit easier umbecause I never you know I never
um I never worked with people Imean it was with service
providers before it was alwaysselling a product or selling um
you know machines or or softwareit was never about people in
service so this is definitely uma plus and a minus to to the
(25:36):
business and the second thing ismarketing um which I also found
to be very challenging uhcompared to maybe even um
products or or B2B businesses umespecially in plastic surgery
where a lot of the business isum not repeatable or not you
(25:57):
know it's a one-off usually 90%of the patient will only have
one procedure with us so onlyabout 10% that will have another
one so you constantly need toreinvent yourself or to find
anything that you're doing andand the effort it takes is is
huge.
So yeah I can say today thatabout 20% of our um revenue goes
(26:22):
to marketing today which ismore than I initially thought it
would take thank you thank youfor sharing um so what are the
biggest um operationalchallenges or bottlenecks that
you're currently navigatingwithin the business if you're
happy to share just give us somesense of how from a sort of
director's point of view whatcurrently is keeping you up at
(26:42):
night um so I think I kind oftouched upon it now so it's the
supply and demand so it's theboth sides of the story.
So it's the supply um in termsof you know more surgeon or more
time from surgeon that we needto you know if you look at this
(27:04):
on a business perspective to toincrease um kind of revenue in
the end of the day um and youknow the demand is is getting
more leads through the door andI think that um and and kind of
perfect the cycle of ofcontacting the lead and there's
a full philosophy to that Isuppose that we can get into if
(27:24):
you'd like but you know um tounderstand how to value a lead
and how many leads you wouldneed or to understand the
conversion rate between a leadto a consultation and then to
understand the conversion ratebetween a consultation to a
surgery and kind of be inunderstanding the full pathway
of that and and then kind ofunderstanding how much you're
(27:46):
putting into this because in asense it's it's um it's a
machine um well that you youcould you you could look at it
very kind of uh from five milesaway I suppose it's not really a
machine but it's uh if you lookat it uh it's a machine that's
supposed to you're supposed toinvest into it something and
there should be some kind ofoutput that hopefully would be
(28:08):
more than what you put into it.
So um I think to constantlythink about what's not working
maybe with some parts of thismachine or how to improve these
parts of the machine or uh it'ssomething that takes a lot of my
time and effort especially nowwith all these changes you know
with AI and and search that arehappening and many new things
(28:30):
that are happening now in theworld and you need to think
about how how you kind of adaptyourself.
Dr Andrew Greenland (28:37):
So many of our listeners are clinic owners
or healthcare operators and whenyou think about scaling a
specialist clinic such as andcreo clinic what lessons have
stood out to you that might beof value to others in the
industry um I think that it'snot much different from any
(28:59):
other business in this sensethat I think that if you want to
scale then you should allow orconsider the amount of of of
well cost that it will take fromyou.
Alon Ben Arie (29:16):
Both kind of you know personal cost time etc but
also you know uh means uh so theamount of money that you you
you expect to put into this uhfor it to scale or for how long
you are prepared to invest intothe business until you will reap
the reward and it's always atricky business because you
(29:37):
never really know if you know ifif it's how much you need to
spend or when or what the returnyou would see and if the plan
that you're you're havingactually um you know is
worthwhile.
Most of the clinics includingus um we kind of export this
side of the business to a to ayou know a provider usually or
(29:59):
you know a marketing agency onetwo three a PR agency etc so
kind of controlling all that ina way that will make sense for
you at the end of the day soit's something that you need to
constantly think about and and Ithink that's the biggest um
challenge in a way but that'salso kind of you know I I guess
(30:22):
the question is well what youshould focus on or so that's I I
I would say that this is if youwant to scale your business
then you should definitely thinkabout these things.
Thank you and what operationallessons do you wish somebody had
um taught you earlier on inyour journey operational um I
(30:47):
think that we kind of we keptour our operation quite lean in
a sense so a lot of um I don't Idon't think that so that that
made things quite easy for me atleast operational we don't have
a lot of employees and you knowand we don't have kind of a big
um huge investment in in afacility or surgical facility
(31:12):
which a lot of clinics do fromthe get-go so I think that I
don't have a lot of things Ithink most of my lessons on the
operational side are to belearned and less to be uh to be
teaching um but um I think thatthe right thing that we've done
on on that regard on theoperational side of the business
(31:32):
is that we didn't that wedidn't go for a for a surgery
that we didn't create our owntheater from day one.
That I think that would havekind of reduced our chances and
growing on the rate that we did.
Our money would be tied to umyou know a facility and
(31:54):
personnel but not necessarily umgenerate growth.
I think that especially in thebeginning you should think about
kind of allocating the majorityof your funds into things that
will actually generate growthfor you or kind of improve your
business or your kind ofpathways but try to refrain from
(32:14):
kind of increasing your uminfrastructure in a way that
would not necessarily bebeneficial to your aims.
I'm guessing your role is verydifferent today compared with
when you first started how hasyour leadership style evolved as
you've been in the business umdefinitely I think in the
(32:40):
beginning it was very much kindof a a two a two man band if you
will um the business was smallwe didn't have any employees so
it was easier um with time youknow we we we we grew the we you
know we had more and moreemployees and and and
freelancers that we work withand the team grew and hey you
(33:03):
know maybe it's uh because ofyou know this is the way I do
things and it's easier for mebut I give a lot of space to
people um you know to to dotheir work.
I try to I I might be sometimesyou know um you know getting in
touch with them on WhatsApp tounderstand exactly what's the
current situation when I need itbut I try to give as much
(33:25):
autonomy as possible.
So that's my style of usershipum I expect people to perform um
and you know if if I seesomething doesn't perform then
then I step in but I try to givea lot of freedom um I think
especially in healthcare uh andespecially since I'm not coming
(33:45):
from healthcare I mean I'm not auh clinician myself then I
don't have a lot of inputclinically so that would be more
of for for Dr.
Martillo uh to do um so on myend usually it would just be um
if things go really wrong then Istep in I think that what I do
(34:08):
where maybe I'm a bit morestraight or what what I try to
focus on more is with some ofour providers because we rely
mostly on our providers tocreate you know growth for us
and I'm a bit more in tune towhat they're doing on the
(34:28):
day-to-day level uh so I'm verystrict about KPIs um and kind of
reaching them um and I'm notshy on replacing a provider if I
see that you know it's nothappening.
And I think that's a veryimportant lesson.
I think that actually manypeople don't they feel
uncomfortable with this or theyyou know they think that it's
(34:49):
this is a partnership that isbuilt to last and I I really
hope that would be the case butin reality thinking that in you
know in the last five years thatwe are practicing um we've
probably changed about 15companies um you know and for
for a marketing now I thinkwe've kind of nailed it for
because we were staying for forthe one with the one that we are
(35:12):
for a while now but um we'vemade a few a lot of changes um
and we had a lot of providers aswell so it sounds maybe like we
changed the same person to thesame task many times but no we
have somebody that does socialmedia somebody that uh you know
isn't responsible for SEOsomebody that's responsible for
ad it's not the same person Ithink that's another lesson
(35:33):
maybe to to to have is that youshould find somebody that has
specialty in one thing and kindof stick to them because usually
people that offer multiplerange of services are experts in
none.
Dr Andrew Greenland (35:45):
So what we kind of pride ourselves of being
is expert in very specificniches we also try to kind of um
expect from our providersthat's good advice um if I was
to give you a magic wand and youcould fix one business one one
thing in the business tomorrowwhat would that be if anything
well um I think just tounderstand what's going on now
(36:13):
with um with all the changeshappening with you know search
and ai and that's a hugechallenge I think um I'm not
sure how many of the clinics arekind of engaging with this on a
day-to-day level but in the endof the day that's kind of the
at least I found that it's it'skind of the it could make or
(36:33):
break a business um if thatworks or not and not
understanding what's happeningnow with AI is very troubles me
uh even I would say because allof a sudden we have some kind of
expectancy of we knew what weshould expect from these
channels and all of a suddenthey do not do this anymore or
(36:54):
they do it differently and youkind of need to readjust to kind
of have some bit more clarityabout what's happening that
would be that would be great.
Alon Ben Arie (37:03):
I think we're very much in a in a time in life
where everything's justshuffled every day and and um
it's very difficult tounderstand um where things would
be in a year time even so a bitof foresight would be good.
And on on the subject offoresight looking ahead to the
(37:25):
next 12 months what wouldsuccess look like for you in the
CLIO clinic um so we have wehave quite clear um KPIs uh for
each year so we try to do thatand we can analyze them so for
us is to reach a certain amountof um you know certain amount of
(37:45):
revenue um to increase our sizewith some new employees I think
two more employees by the endof the year um and kind of
onboarding more surgeons.
I think that's kind of the ourmy KPIs at least um and of
course um there there are someKPIs for um for organic uh kind
(38:12):
of organic uh increase uh inneeds um that is also kind of
one of our KPIs but for that II'm completely um in the dark
right now understanding how howwould that happen um yeah thank
you and finally um what wouldyou say is the best piece of
business advice you've ever beengiven um I think that's
(38:46):
probably what I um mentionedearlier uh I was it it was told
me somebody said that many yearsago but essentially as to how
how to handle employees or howto treat people that work well
and how people how to treatpeople that do not work well.
(39:07):
I might say this a bit toobluntly but uh I'll I'll try to
explain um so people that workwell I think should be maybe
it's a cliché maybe it'ssomething that people do anyway
but but it shouldn't comeunnoticed.
Dr Andrew Greenland (39:27):
I mean I think if people work well for
the company they should behighly compensated and we try at
least to kind of compensate onthe high level of the market
always for people that areperforming well and the idea is
to keep them there for as longas we possibly can um you know
and then for example we weprovide things that I think
other clinics do not like freehealth care like free private
(39:48):
health care and we we try tokind of make sure that the
patient the the the employeesthat that you know give us the
best of the years uh will betaken care of but the other side
of the coin is also true it'sit's we need to understand that
um that's something I doprobably not as good um but um
(40:08):
to cut or as possible as much aspossible cut from your business
um people that do notcontribute or you don't feel
that they're doing their theirtheir part um well enough
obviously try to do whatever youcan to make it work uh but not
(40:30):
dwell on this and don't kind ofdrag it on for years and I see
many people that do um thatthey're not happy but you know
they continue the relationshipanyway and I think in the end of
the day you're not doing aservice for your for your own
business and I think this iswhat you should um focus on as
as a business owner this hasbeen such a fantastic
(40:54):
conversation thank you so muchfor sharing your experience your
insights and some of therealities behind building and
operating a specialist privatehealthcare business and very
grateful for your time it's beena really good conversation
thank you very much thank youvery much yeah appreciate it
Welcome back to Voices in Health and
Wellness.
This is the podcast where wespeak with leaders across
private healthcare, wellness,and patient-facing medical
businesses about what it reallytakes to build, grow and operate
successful practices.
Today I'm joined by Alon BenArie, Director of the CREO
Clinic, a specialist plasticsurgery and aesthetics practice
in London.
CREO Clinic has built a strongreputation with a highly
(00:20):
competitive sector by focusingon patient experience,
consultant-led care, andmaintaining high clinical
standards while navigating therealities of running a modern
private healthcare business.
So with that, Alon, I'd like towelcome you to the show.
Thank you very much for joiningus.
Alon Ben Arie (00:34):
Thank you very much for inviting me, Andrew.
Dr Andrew Greenland (00:37):
So maybe we could start with your story.
So for listeners that may notknow you, could you tell us a
little bit about your backgroundand what led you into
healthcare and eventually to theCreole Clinic?
Alon Ben Arie (00:47):
Oh wow, okay.
So um actually started um well,I I'm I'm a solicitor in trade,
and I I at some stage decidedthat that's probably not my the
right career path.
And I started working in themedical device sector, um,
especially kind of managing umsegments.
(01:10):
So I was in charge of APAC fora while, for over six years in a
company called Vayora, which isa medical device manufacturer,
mostly for the aesthetic um umkind of side of the business.
We had some other sides of thebusiness as well, but that was
kind of the main focus.
Um, and I've done that forabout six years, managing um
(01:31):
kind of the APAC region, um,understanding a lot about this
market.
I guess this is my kind of uhyou know segue to this industry
as well today.
Um so yeah, this is how Istarted.
I then moved to the UK, I kindof left Bayora at some stage.
I opened my own uh consultancybusiness and a skincare business
(01:54):
as well.
Um, and I when I moved to theUK, I started kind of to uh
introduce new technologies tothe NHS.
So that could have been uh someplastic surgery equipment, but
also some ophthalmologicalophthalmology um equipment,
mostly lasers, um, and some AIequipment as well.
So not equipment, but uh youknow software.
(02:14):
Um I've done that for for kindof the beginning from 2018 to
about when kind of COVID hit.
Uh and then um when COVID hit,there was less of an appetite in
the NHS for new technologies atthe time.
So um yeah, I kind of thoughtabout new things to do.
(02:34):
And um that's generally where Imet uh my business partner
today, Mr.
Omar Tillo, uh, who is aplastic surgeon himself.
And he was on this same on theon this on the stage where he
kind of left the NHS on aboutthat time.
Um and we understood quiteearly on that we'll need um a
(02:55):
business arm to this.
Um so he's in charge of theclinical stuff, and uh he's a
medical director, and I'm incharge of the commercial um
stuff in the clinic.
So we we established CREO in2022, um, with the aim of um um
(03:16):
finding, well, specializing uhfinding surgeons that will
specialize in very, veryspecific things, not doing a bit
of everything.
Um and this is kind of theessence of the clinic generally,
uh, to be very specialized, orat least this is what we thought
that we we will be at the time.
Uh there's a long story forthat that we might get onto uh
(03:36):
during this conversation.
So yeah, and then we arerunning um Cryo um ever since,
so ever since early 2022, reallylate 21 until today.
Um so yeah, this is a bit of abit about me.
Dr Andrew Greenland (03:53):
Thank you, and a really helpful background
and context.
So, was there a particularmoment when you realized that
you enjoyed building businessesas much as being involved in
healthcare?
Because you've done a number ofdifferent things, and now
you've kind of gravitatedtowards healthcare.
What was the kind of thing foryou in healthcare?
Alon Ben Arie (04:08):
So actually, um this was quite a natural move
for me.
So we uh Valora was a familybusiness at the time, uh, before
we kind of uh spin it off andsolve it uh to uh actually an
English pharmaceutical, notChinese, a Sinclair pharma.
Um and um so it was kind of anight natural thing for me to
(04:30):
do.
My father was in the businessfor many years, so I kind of
always um I was always familiarwith with it and I always liked
it.
So I thought that this issomething I should pursue with.
Um but then moving to the B2Cwas a complete change for me.
Uh I guess that the uh theskincare business kind of was
(04:51):
the first thing that kind of umit was a professional uh
skincare business at the time uhthat was sold mainly for
doctors and to doctors and umand to beticians.
Um and I think that was a goodsegue for me uh to understand
the B2C market, if that makessense, or the patient market.
Um and I kind of understoodmore about this, more about
(05:13):
marketing, more around kind ofrunning ads as well.
So I mean everything togetherkind of uh everything came
together, and I think that bythat time I was ready to uh you
know take on the uh privatesector of healthcare in the UK,
and this is what we're doingever since.
Dr Andrew Greenland (05:33):
Thank you.
So perhaps you would you mindtelling us a little bit about
the Creo Clinic today?
What does it look like, and whodo you primarily serve?
Alon Ben Arie (05:42):
Right.
So um the Creo Clinic today isquite a small setup, actually.
We are we're a team of eight,so we are two surgeons, myself
who kind of run the businessside of everything, two nurses
and three admins.
Uh that's the whole team.
Um of course we have some kindof freelancers, etc., that kind
of help us um with certaintasks, usually marketing stuff.
(06:08):
Um and the aim also for theclinic, perhaps in the next two
years, is to onboard three moresurgeons.
So the aim is definitely forgrowth.
Um we serve mostly um kind ofuntil today we'll patients that
seek plastic surgery from theneck down.
(06:29):
So Dr.
Tillow and Dr.
Dendel Vecchio both specializeonly in that.
We're currently onboarding somesurgeons, uh, another surgeon
that would be an octoplasticsurgeon, um, that would uh you
know do eye-related surgery.
Uh, but the idea is to keepthings very, very focused um and
never to kind of do a bit ofeverything, never be jack of all
(06:52):
trades.
Um, this is what we'recurrently doing.
The end of 2025, we alsodecided to open another segment
of the business, which is thegender, creo gender, um, where
we will serve the transgendercommunity in the UK.
That's the um the main idea.
Uh here the idea was is tobasically be a hub for the
(07:20):
transgender uh community when itcomes to surgery.
So we found that the UK marketis currently quite um segmented,
and we decided that thereshould be one home uh or one
surgical hub where we don't needto refer to each other all the
time or we can just see them allin one centralized place.
So that's also something we'recurrently developing.
(07:41):
Uh we just started with that,but this is something we have
high hopes for.
Dr Andrew Greenland (07:46):
Amazing.
So the plastic surgery andaesthetic market has become
increasingly crowded over thelast decade.
And what do you think hashelped CREO establish itself
within the market?
Alon Ben Arie (07:58):
So, yeah, so that's uh I think a really good
question.
Um, and I think this issomething that we had a lot of
well we had a lot of trials onthat, and and I think what we
initially started while gettinginto this um was changed
throughout the journey.
Um so initially we were quitefocused on on being specialized.
(08:24):
So we thought that this wouldbe our main selling point.
We'll have only surgeons thatspecialize in very specific
things, and um, well, peoplewill understand that we're
specialized and they will liketo come for specialists, and uh,
you know, uh it will probablyplay itself like that.
Um but with time we understoodthat um, well, everybody say
(08:44):
that they're specialists, and umyou'd you'd probably need
something more than that uh tobe able to show for it, not just
to say that we're specialistsand you know, that's it, and
hope that um the UK um patientbase will just kind of um be
convinced by that.
Um and um so I think with timewe we kind of perfected the the
(09:10):
marketing and and we kind of uhperfected the the messaging
until I found that today almostafter five years, we're still
we're starting to get themessage across.
Uh and I think um one of thethings that um you know one of
the things that worked for us isthe differentiation.
(09:31):
Uh we we always try to makevery clear to the patients or to
the clients at that stage umwhat makes us different.
Um and so the first thing wouldbe positioning.
I think that it's it's it'sit's important to understand
from the beginning uh if youwould be um positioning yourself
(09:56):
high, I mean, especially withprices, but that comes with some
more some other thing that'skind of attached to it, or that
you will position yourself low,which is okay.
Um, you probably can get moremarket share if that makes
sense.
Um but we both Omar and Idecided that we want to kind of
go for the higher market.
(10:17):
Um, and that's also because ithas two reasons why we decided
to go to we have this decision.
A is that we thought that umyou know we'll be less volatile
to changes in market.
Uh you know, if if you if yougo for the higher spenders, if
you will, then they will be lessvolatile, and that would also
(10:40):
mean that we will be lessvolatile.
So that was the firstconsideration.
But also I think that we wantedto provide the best care.
And although it's possible toprovide very good care and cheap
care as well, or not cheap, butless expensive, we wanted to
kind of make sure that we costwould not be a deterrent for us.
(11:01):
So that sometimes means um morethat more money should be
involved.
And so we wanted to essentiallyum you know provide the best
care, even if it means that itwill cost a bit more money.
And this is what we what wewent for.
Um but I think that the problemwas how even then we will kind
(11:25):
of project it to the clients.
How would they how would theyknow about this?
Um, and I think that this tookus a while to figure out.
Um, yeah, if you if you thinkit's the right way to go, I'm
more than happy to share moreinformation about this.
Dr Andrew Greenland (11:42):
Sure.
So I was just thinking aboutprospective clients when they
first engage with the clinic.
What experience are you tryingto create for them?
And particularly as you've justmentioned, that you're working
more with the high end of themarket.
How do you what kind ofexperience do you create and how
do you do it?
Alon Ben Arie (11:58):
So I think first of all, you're right, there's an
experience when they come in,everything needs to kind of play
the part, so the clinic needsto look quite nice, but also um
kind of the service itself orthe promise of what you will
provide to them, I think, needsto um needs to be right.
Uh so for example, we do notlimit in the amount of
(12:20):
consultations of of you know oneof our patients that want to
see us.
So the consultation fee willalways include unlimited amounts
of consultations, unlimitedamount of follow-up.
So we kind of we give, Ibelieve, the impression that um
we're actually taking care ofsomeone.
It's not just um they're comingto get a service from us, we
(12:42):
are kind of we're trying to giveas much value as possible from
the beginning.
And I think this kind of goesthroughout the um throughout,
it's kind of show throughout thejourney with us.
Um so also the idea of surgerywith us is like that.
So we I think this is somethingthat at some stage I kind of
got from a random video, I kindof uh scene of Steam Jobs uh
(13:06):
with Apple uh at some stage.
That um he was talking aboutApple, of course, and you know,
maybe it's a bit of a cliche,but I kind of said that he
should include as much value aspossible into your services.
Um was thinking how we couldreally do that also in our in
our kind of small niche ofclassic surgery.
(13:26):
And um, you know, we justthought about how we can bundle
everything in together as muchas possible and never kind of
and never put this to the clientas another uh version that he
can upgrade to or anything likethat.
Everything is bundled from dayone, get everything included in
the price.
(13:46):
Um, so that's for example, inour clinic wouldn't you know it
would mean lymphatic massagedrainage, um, lymphatic drainage
massage after surgery, scartreatments with lasers,
supplements before or after.
Um, you know, uh again,unlimited, even sometimes
(14:07):
excessive amount of follow-upjust to make sure that
everything is okay andperfected.
So we really try to,everything, of course, with with
taste and reason uh that wethink that would be valuable to
the client, and then we wouldadd it.
So that's that's kind of ourphilosophy, I suppose.
Um, and I think it took sometime until it shows because it's
(14:28):
not something that patients seeimmediately, but I think that
with time that you kind ofcontinuously do that and you
stay on it, um then eventuallypatients kind of get that and
they they decide that they seethe value and they kind of pass
on, and of course, this kind ofcomes out with reviews and then
uh with with referrals, etc.
(14:50):
So yeah, I think eventually youyou you you reap the reward.
It takes some time, but umeventually it does.
Dr Andrew Greenland (14:59):
Thank you.
So you talked a lot about theyou know putting as much value
into um a patient experience aspossible.
I guess trust is absolutelyhuge as well, particularly for
patients considering um surgery.
So, how does your team buildthat sort of trust consistently
across the whole patientjourney?
Alon Ben Arie (15:17):
Um yeah, right.
So I think trust generally is avery personal thing.
You you can't really well youcan convey the trust with
reviews, of course.
So that's something that wealways try to get.
That's very important for anyclinic, I think, to get.
Uh, and if if somebody doesn'thave a review platform, they
should definitely get one andand then and um yeah, and then
(15:39):
work on that.
Also, when it comes to kind ofmarketing in terms of social uh
or social marketing, but alsoorganic organic traffic.
So I think that's that'ssomething which is very
valuable.
So we we um we focus on that.
So that's one part of trust, ofcourse, a marketing part of it.
But in the clinical side, um, Ithink that comes very much with
(16:02):
the um surgeons and the nursesthat we work with um that have
very good rapport with thepatient.
The fact that we don't limitthe amount of consultations also
gives some um it givessomething, obviously it gives
some reassurance to the patient,but it also gives some kind of
reassurance to the surgeon thatyou know that he from the clinic
(16:26):
side at least that he doesn'tneed to um kind of limit
everything to a very specifictime, and if somebody needs has
more questions, they can come inagain.
And so I think all of thesethings together, all these
factors together, uh buildtrust.
It's not one thing, it's like amultiple thing, uh, multiple
things that you need to makesure that you tap on uh to
eventually give the you know thepatient is um this feeling.
Dr Andrew Greenland (16:53):
Thank you.
So we already talked aboutyou're operating in a very
fast-changing sector.
What sort of major shifts areyou seeing in private healthcare
more widely at the moment?
And are you asking are youseeing any changes in patient
expectations?
Alon Ben Arie (17:09):
Um yes, it's a good question, actually.
Because there are there are afew things that are happening
right now, I think.
Um one of the procedures thatwe've been doing quite a lot of
is a procedure called, I don'tknow if everybody else knows it,
but it's called BBL.
Uh so it's um essentially fattransfer to the botox and hips,
(17:33):
which is quite uh um, well, Isuppose it was quite a uh uh a
trendy procedure uh at the time.
And now I think with time wesee a general shift, not not
necessarily from it, but fromthe um but from the look that
people were were were trying toto achieve, this kind of you
(17:56):
know uh you know big button, Isuppose.
Um so that's kind of toned downsignificantly, which which we
are very much you know in favorof generally, because this is
not the the look or theexaggerated look was never the
kind of the kind of look that wewould provide.
We actually would turn manypatients away to say that we we
(18:20):
cannot provide this kind oflook.
So we're actually quite happywith this change.
So this is one major changethat that happened, I think, in
the industry of plastic surgeryor body contouring surgery.
Uh the BBL market kind of toneddown a bit.
Um but on the other side, onthe on the other side of this, I
think we have seen um a higheramount of patients coming in for
(18:45):
skin reduction or skintightening procedures due to
kind of um you know late uhweight losing drugs, uh,
especially.
Um so we can see many morepatients that um they know that
they need to stop than beforeprocedure to kind of stable
their weight, and you can seemore and more patients coming in
(19:07):
with um skin acidity issues.
Dr Andrew Greenland (19:12):
And how much more informed are patients
today compared with when youfirst started in the sector, you
know, four or five years ago?
Alon Ben Arie (19:20):
I wouldn't say that there is a big change uh in
terms of informed.
You have you have the informedpatients and you have the
uninformed patients in the city.
And I think that the umequally, you know, the the um
the ratio changed uh in the lastfive years that we've we've
been doing it in the CRIOclinic.
I mean, internet is there.
Um some patients kind of readmore into very vast treatment
(19:45):
pages with all this informationand become more prepared.
Some of them seen moresurgeons, some of them you know
didn't almost or didn't readmuch about it, and you're
probably the first surgeon thatthat you've seen.
So there is kind of a spectrumto that, and I don't think that
I've seen much variance in thelast five years.
Dr Andrew Greenland (20:04):
And you touched earlier on about social
media, and obviously socialmedia is incredibly topical at
the moment, but how has thattransformed aesthetic and
cosmetic surgery?
And has it had much of animpact on patient behavior from
what you see?
Alon Ben Arie (20:19):
Yes, actually, that's um again, that's a good
question.
Our doctor, um Dr.
Daniel Vecchio, who joins usfrom the United States, um,
talks a lot about a lot aboutthis, uh, especially when it
comes to uh BBL.
So he's one of the biggestsurgeons for BBL in the state,
and now he kind of um performedsurgery with us as well.
(20:41):
And he's talking aboutsomething that is called the
comparison shift.
In the past, where when youknow somebody had one or wanted
surgery, they would look attheir before surgery or you
know, on their before picturesand compare them to the after
pictures.
But that's what changed todaythat because of social media,
(21:03):
that people are not really uhcomparing their results to their
previous look.
What they're doing is comparingit to the world, um, or you
know, if you will, the bestlooking, you know, pictures out
there.
Um so what it drives isessentially less satisfied
(21:24):
clients or patients um in thatregard, I think.
Um it really I think that thedifference is not the same for
all surgeries.
So I think this specificsurgery suffered from this
comparison shift, but you haveprocedures like um, I don't
know, Tommy Tak, um where youknow it's mostly um postnatal um
(21:49):
uh women that that um that arejust very happy uh to kind of
restore uh their own um bodyback, if you will.
So
Dr Andrew Greenland (22:00):
depends on the procedure and the type of
client the age as well reallymatters here but social media is
definitely uh especially forthe younger um sectors of
patients uh it's it's definitelyuh an issue sometimes so
obviously you work on thebusiness side of the clinic and
(22:20):
what do you what are the biggestmisunderstandings about running
a healthcare business ratherthan simply working in one from
what you see I think that thereare two big um or before I got
into it I thought I thought twothings would be probably easier
uh one of them is choosingpersonnel I found that um maybe
(22:46):
I'll I'll complement that with astory so about three years ago
we decided that we will uhengage with uh the non-surgical
um um side or side of thebusiness a lot would be uh
injectables uh lasers and youknow non-surgical aesthetic
procedures if you will um and wethought okay we we'll buy a few
(23:09):
machines and and um you knowwe'll buy some consumables and
um we'll hire a good doctor thatwe think that is knowledgeable
enough and she will join theteam and we'll we'll just um you
know start start start this umbut I think very soon we found
out that you you you need tofind people that will not only
(23:33):
take accountabilityaccountability uh for their own
work but that will that thatwill care enough about your
business to actually um you knowdevelop something for you it's
not just that you know um youknow it's not about just
bringing anybody um to come andwork with you and so the more we
(23:53):
kind of try to find someone wewe we understood that it's not
an easy job and then we probablywant to focus only on things
that we know that we're doingand only when we find the right
partner kind of branch out tosomething new.
Alon Ben Arie (24:08):
So this is what we did we actually scaled down
from non-surgical almostcompletely um and we kind of
decided to refocus our effortsonly to the surgical uh segment
of the business and I think thatalso has some financial it has
some focus element to it so allof a sudden you don't need to
focus on several things and whenyou have more focus on
(24:31):
something at least potentiallyuh you you expect to see better
returns but also financially umyou know all of a sudden our
kind of marketing budget and ouryou know consumable budget or
general budget um is not kind ofdistributed into several
segments but only one segment Ithink we understood that from
(24:52):
now on we focus on somethinguntil we perfect it only when we
feel at least that we perfectedit to a certain degree that we
are happy with only then we willkind of branch out and do more.
So that's one thing that I'velearned that is kind of um you
know something that I I I didn'thave I thought it would
(25:13):
probably be a bit easier umbecause I never you know I never
um I never worked with people Imean it was with service
providers before it was alwaysselling a product or selling um
you know machines or or softwareit was never about people in
service so this is definitely uma plus and a minus to to the
(25:36):
business and the second thing ismarketing um which I also found
to be very challenging uhcompared to maybe even um
products or or B2B businesses umespecially in plastic surgery
where a lot of the business isum not repeatable or not you
(25:57):
know it's a one-off usually 90%of the patient will only have
one procedure with us so onlyabout 10% that will have another
one so you constantly need toreinvent yourself or to find
anything that you're doing andand the effort it takes is is
huge.
So yeah I can say today thatabout 20% of our um revenue goes
(26:22):
to marketing today which ismore than I initially thought it
would take thank you thank youfor sharing um so what are the
biggest um operationalchallenges or bottlenecks that
you're currently navigatingwithin the business if you're
happy to share just give us somesense of how from a sort of
director's point of view whatcurrently is keeping you up at
(26:42):
night um so I think I kind oftouched upon it now so it's the
supply and demand so it's theboth sides of the story.
So it's the supply um in termsof you know more surgeon or more
time from surgeon that we needto you know if you look at this
(27:04):
on a business perspective to toincrease um kind of revenue in
the end of the day um and youknow the demand is is getting
more leads through the door andI think that um and and kind of
perfect the cycle of ofcontacting the lead and there's
a full philosophy to that Isuppose that we can get into if
(27:24):
you'd like but you know um tounderstand how to value a lead
and how many leads you wouldneed or to understand the
conversion rate between a leadto a consultation and then to
understand the conversion ratebetween a consultation to a
surgery and kind of be inunderstanding the full pathway
of that and and then kind ofunderstanding how much you're
(27:46):
putting into this because in asense it's it's um it's a
machine um well that you youcould you you could look at it
very kind of uh from five milesaway I suppose it's not really a
machine but it's uh if you lookat it uh it's a machine that's
supposed to you're supposed toinvest into it something and
there should be some kind ofoutput that hopefully would be
(28:08):
more than what you put into it.
So um I think to constantlythink about what's not working
maybe with some parts of thismachine or how to improve these
parts of the machine or uh it'ssomething that takes a lot of my
time and effort especially nowwith all these changes you know
with AI and and search that arehappening and many new things
(28:30):
that are happening now in theworld and you need to think
about how how you kind of adaptyourself.
Dr Andrew Greenland (28:37):
So many of our listeners are clinic owners
or healthcare operators and whenyou think about scaling a
specialist clinic such as andcreo clinic what lessons have
stood out to you that might beof value to others in the
industry um I think that it'snot much different from any
(28:59):
other business in this sensethat I think that if you want to
scale then you should allow orconsider the amount of of of
well cost that it will take fromyou.
Alon Ben Arie (29:16):
Both kind of you know personal cost time etc but
also you know uh means uh so theamount of money that you you
you expect to put into this uhfor it to scale or for how long
you are prepared to invest intothe business until you will reap
the reward and it's always atricky business because you
(29:37):
never really know if you know ifif it's how much you need to
spend or when or what the returnyou would see and if the plan
that you're you're havingactually um you know is
worthwhile.
Most of the clinics includingus um we kind of export this
side of the business to a to ayou know a provider usually or
(29:59):
you know a marketing agency onetwo three a PR agency etc so
kind of controlling all that ina way that will make sense for
you at the end of the day soit's something that you need to
constantly think about and and Ithink that's the biggest um
challenge in a way but that'salso kind of you know I I guess
(30:22):
the question is well what youshould focus on or so that's I I
I would say that this is if youwant to scale your business
then you should definitely thinkabout these things.
Thank you and what operationallessons do you wish somebody had
um taught you earlier on inyour journey operational um I
(30:47):
think that we kind of we keptour our operation quite lean in
a sense so a lot of um I don't Idon't think that so that that
made things quite easy for me atleast operational we don't have
a lot of employees and you knowand we don't have kind of a big
um huge investment in in afacility or surgical facility
(31:12):
which a lot of clinics do fromthe get-go so I think that I
don't have a lot of things Ithink most of my lessons on the
operational side are to belearned and less to be uh to be
teaching um but um I think thatthe right thing that we've done
on on that regard on theoperational side of the business
(31:32):
is that we didn't that wedidn't go for a for a surgery
that we didn't create our owntheater from day one.
That I think that would havekind of reduced our chances and
growing on the rate that we did.
Our money would be tied to umyou know a facility and
(31:54):
personnel but not necessarily umgenerate growth.
I think that especially in thebeginning you should think about
kind of allocating the majorityof your funds into things that
will actually generate growthfor you or kind of improve your
business or your kind ofpathways but try to refrain from
(32:14):
kind of increasing your uminfrastructure in a way that
would not necessarily bebeneficial to your aims.
I'm guessing your role is verydifferent today compared with
when you first started how hasyour leadership style evolved as
you've been in the business umdefinitely I think in the
(32:40):
beginning it was very much kindof a a two a two man band if you
will um the business was smallwe didn't have any employees so
it was easier um with time youknow we we we we grew the we you
know we had more and moreemployees and and and
freelancers that we work withand the team grew and hey you
(33:03):
know maybe it's uh because ofyou know this is the way I do
things and it's easier for mebut I give a lot of space to
people um you know to to dotheir work.
I try to I I might be sometimesyou know um you know getting in
touch with them on WhatsApp tounderstand exactly what's the
current situation when I need itbut I try to give as much
(33:25):
autonomy as possible.
So that's my style of usershipum I expect people to perform um
and you know if if I seesomething doesn't perform then
then I step in but I try to givea lot of freedom um I think
especially in healthcare uh andespecially since I'm not coming
(33:45):
from healthcare I mean I'm not auh clinician myself then I
don't have a lot of inputclinically so that would be more
of for for Dr.
Martillo uh to do um so on myend usually it would just be um
if things go really wrong then Istep in I think that what I do
(34:08):
where maybe I'm a bit morestraight or what what I try to
focus on more is with some ofour providers because we rely
mostly on our providers tocreate you know growth for us
and I'm a bit more in tune towhat they're doing on the
(34:28):
day-to-day level uh so I'm verystrict about KPIs um and kind of
reaching them um and I'm notshy on replacing a provider if I
see that you know it's nothappening.
And I think that's a veryimportant lesson.
I think that actually manypeople don't they feel
uncomfortable with this or theyyou know they think that it's
(34:49):
this is a partnership that isbuilt to last and I I really
hope that would be the case butin reality thinking that in you
know in the last five years thatwe are practicing um we've
probably changed about 15companies um you know and for
for a marketing now I thinkwe've kind of nailed it for
because we were staying for forthe one with the one that we are
(35:12):
for a while now but um we'vemade a few a lot of changes um
and we had a lot of providers aswell so it sounds maybe like we
changed the same person to thesame task many times but no we
have somebody that does socialmedia somebody that uh you know
isn't responsible for SEOsomebody that's responsible for
ad it's not the same person Ithink that's another lesson
(35:33):
maybe to to to have is that youshould find somebody that has
specialty in one thing and kindof stick to them because usually
people that offer multiplerange of services are experts in
none.
Dr Andrew Greenland (35:45):
So what we kind of pride ourselves of being
is expert in very specificniches we also try to kind of um
expect from our providersthat's good advice um if I was
to give you a magic wand and youcould fix one business one one
thing in the business tomorrowwhat would that be if anything
well um I think just tounderstand what's going on now
(36:13):
with um with all the changeshappening with you know search
and ai and that's a hugechallenge I think um I'm not
sure how many of the clinics arekind of engaging with this on a
day-to-day level but in the endof the day that's kind of the
at least I found that it's it'skind of the it could make or
(36:33):
break a business um if thatworks or not and not
understanding what's happeningnow with AI is very troubles me
uh even I would say because allof a sudden we have some kind of
expectancy of we knew what weshould expect from these
channels and all of a suddenthey do not do this anymore or
(36:54):
they do it differently and youkind of need to readjust to kind
of have some bit more clarityabout what's happening that
would be that would be great.
Alon Ben Arie (37:03):
I think we're very much in a in a time in life
where everything's justshuffled every day and and um
it's very difficult tounderstand um where things would
be in a year time even so a bitof foresight would be good.
And on on the subject offoresight looking ahead to the
(37:25):
next 12 months what wouldsuccess look like for you in the
CLIO clinic um so we have wehave quite clear um KPIs uh for
each year so we try to do thatand we can analyze them so for
us is to reach a certain amountof um you know certain amount of
(37:45):
revenue um to increase our sizewith some new employees I think
two more employees by the endof the year um and kind of
onboarding more surgeons.
I think that's kind of the ourmy KPIs at least um and of
course um there there are someKPIs for um for organic uh kind
(38:12):
of organic uh increase uh inneeds um that is also kind of
one of our KPIs but for that II'm completely um in the dark
right now understanding how howwould that happen um yeah thank
you and finally um what wouldyou say is the best piece of
business advice you've ever beengiven um I think that's
(38:46):
probably what I um mentionedearlier uh I was it it was told
me somebody said that many yearsago but essentially as to how
how to handle employees or howto treat people that work well
and how people how to treatpeople that do not work well.
(39:07):
I might say this a bit toobluntly but uh I'll I'll try to
explain um so people that workwell I think should be maybe
it's a cliché maybe it'ssomething that people do anyway
but but it shouldn't comeunnoticed.
Dr Andrew Greenland (39:27):
I mean I think if people work well for
the company they should behighly compensated and we try at
least to kind of compensate onthe high level of the market
always for people that areperforming well and the idea is
to keep them there for as longas we possibly can um you know
and then for example we weprovide things that I think
other clinics do not like freehealth care like free private
(39:48):
health care and we we try tokind of make sure that the
patient the the the employeesthat that you know give us the
best of the years uh will betaken care of but the other side
of the coin is also true it'sit's we need to understand that
um that's something I doprobably not as good um but um
(40:08):
to cut or as possible as much aspossible cut from your business
um people that do notcontribute or you don't feel
that they're doing their theirtheir part um well enough
obviously try to do whatever youcan to make it work uh but not
(40:30):
dwell on this and don't kind ofdrag it on for years and I see
many people that do um thatthey're not happy but you know
they continue the relationshipanyway and I think in the end of
the day you're not doing aservice for your for your own
business and I think this iswhat you should um focus on as
as a business owner this hasbeen such a fantastic
(40:54):
conversation thank you so muchfor sharing your experience your
insights and some of therealities behind building and
operating a specialist privatehealthcare business and very
grateful for your time it's beena really good conversation
thank you very much thank youvery much yeah appreciate it
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