Dr Claire Charters: Waitangi Tribunal tells govt to stop planned changes to education law

The Waitangi Tribunal is calling on the Government to immediately stop its planned changes to the education law. 

The Government has confirmed today that it is planning to remove the Treaty Principles within the Education and Training Act. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Afternoon, the White Toungy Tribunal is calling on the government
to immediately stop its plan changes to the Education Law.
The government has confirmed today that it is planning to
remove the treaty principle within the Education and Training Act now.
Doctor Clare Charters is an Associate professor and Indigenous constitutional
law expert at the University of Auckland and with US
High Claire.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Hi tenaqua is the tribunal.

Speaker 1 (00:22):
Right that this plan change is as bad as the
treaty principal's will.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Look, it's a different way I think of achieving something
similar of was sharing down the I guess the legal
value of Tennity or White Tangul or the Treaty of
White Tangy. It does it in slightly different ways, but
in the sense of, you know, we can nan the
treaty in its law, in our constitution it does the

(00:48):
same thing.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
But how does this weaken the treaty? If you take
this treaty principle out of the Education and Training Act,
how does it weaken the treaty?

Speaker 2 (00:55):
M So it weakens the requirement for the executive the
government to comply with your white honey.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Okay, except it is not requiring the executive in this
piece of law, it is requiring school boards.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
Oh you're talking about school board this particular piece of legislation. Yes,
so so in the case of school boards, so yeah, obviously,
if they are under a obligation to you know, take
into account or have regard to toadity your white honey,
and you are no longer requiring that. Obviously, that is
a that is a diminishment of the requirement to think about.

Speaker 1 (01:35):
But only if there is a practical outcome of having regard,
Because I mean, if you put put yourself in the
position of being on a school board and you're now.

Speaker 2 (01:42):
Thinking about it the school board finally enough.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
Yes, So how does it practically having a quick think
about the treaty? How does that practically change the way
that you run your school?

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Mm hmmm. So you know, school boards and again I'm
not an expert on legislation around school boards, but you know,
school boards to all make all sorts of important decisions, right,
So they make decisions with respect to who you employ.
They make decisions with respect to should you have tea
hunger as part of your daily you know life in

(02:15):
a school. You make decisions about how much I guess
to your white, you should influence your decision making as
a board. So you know, there's lots of ways in
which tis your white and you can color you know
what you do.

Speaker 1 (02:30):
Okay, I'll come back at you with two things on
that number one. The first thing is school boards should
be predominantly preoccupied with trying to get their kids educated,
nothing else. Or this most important thing is are the
kids turning up and passing the n CEA or all
the grades or whatever. Second thing is the treaty doesn't
bind a school board. It binds the crown. So what like,

(02:50):
is there any logic to them binding every other dude
out there when actually it should be the crown who's
in the partnership if we call it our partnership.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
Yeah, I mean, good, good questions. Thanks that so in
the in the first instance, so if you know, I mean,
there's obviously clearly different views about you know, what school
what the priorities of school boards should be. But absolutely,
of course, getting getting kids educated and inside the school,
et cetera incredibly important because you can't do much teaching

(03:18):
unless they are there. But you know, like when you
when you understand that Mardi TOEA students do better when
they are taught and to do a marty in many instances,
then that is something that if you're looking for outcomes
you should take into account and obviously or have regard
to or give respect to, and obviously to tend to

(03:39):
a white tongue, you would color that right like if
you're looking for better outcomes for artier on land in fact,
and this is the case that that we do better
when you know there's education to do a Mardi, then
totally relevant. Right. So the second thing you you raised this, well,
school boards are not the crown should should bind the crown.
You know, there's lots of sort of constitutional matters that

(04:03):
we could go into, but the point is basically that
school boards are exercising powers that of government. Right, that
they are doing really important questions of government and especially
in the realm of education. Right that's that's arguably a
public good and something that is so essential for a
nation as a whole. And that's and they're effectively delegating

(04:26):
those obligations by you know, sett out in the situslation
to have school boards. And you know, we've had this
this and I think when it was Tomorrow's schools a
lot while ago now, but that's that's been the case
for some time. So they are in that sense exercising
government as the Crown does, but in a very specific
scenario of course, so they're exercising those powers, so you know,

(04:48):
they are in that sense kind of clacking in that way.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
It's been lovely to talk to you. Thank you very
much for coming on the show. I do appreciate it.
As doctor Claar Chater's Indigenous and constitutional law expert at
the University of Auckland.

Speaker 2 (04:59):
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