Fleur Fitzsimons: PSA National Secretary on the number of public servants looking to move overseas for work

There's a view Government attacks on public service workers are driving them out of the country. 

New Public Service Commission data finds a quarter are considering quitting the country for better pay overseas. 

Health and public service department workers are most likely to pack their bags.

PSA National Secretary, Fleur Fitzsimons, says workers want to build a future here, but they're seeing an 'onslaught' of measures that negatively impact them.

"We saw it in the cuts to public services, we've seen it in the cancelling of pay equity claims, now they're coming after holidays and leave in their changes with the Employment Leave Bill. It's not surprising that people are looking to go overseas." 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now apparently twenty seven percent, basically a quarter, basically one
in four of our public servants are considering going overseas.
This is a new survey from the PSA, who worn
that we're at risk of losing an entire generation of
skilled workers and the productivity that comes with us. Fluviet
Simons is the National Secretary for the PSA and.

Speaker 2 (00:17):
Is with us high flirt good evening.

Speaker 1 (00:20):
When we talk about these public servants, we're not actually
talking about bureaucrats, are We're talking about health workers and
nurses and so on.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
Right. All the survey covers mental health workers, corrections officers,
home support workers, people who work in local government, whole
range of policy specialists, all sorts of public service and
community workers all over New Zealand. So it's quite telling
findings that we are seeing one and four considering going overseas.

(00:47):
But also particularly damning is that forty nine percent of
those under twenty five are considering leaving New Zealand. So
that's a real worry for the future of our public
and community services.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Have you guys split it out at all between the
people we would consider bureaucrats and the people we would
consider actual workers.

Speaker 2 (01:05):
We don't make those kind of distinctions. What we know
is that each of these public service workers makes an
important contribution to New Zealand. They want a future here.
But what we are seeing from this government is an
onslaught against working people. We saw it in the cuts
to public services. We've seen it in the canceling of
pay equity claims. Now they're coming after holidays and leave

(01:25):
and they're changes with the Employment Leaves Bill. It's not
surprising that people are looking to go overseas given how
this government treats working people.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
You may not make that distinction, but others will, right
because of course it probably freak me out more to
think that we're losing nurses who could save our lives
as opposed to just a bunch of people who sit
around in their bums writing reports.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
Well, I think you are worried. You are right to
be worried about nurses a mental health's experience.

Speaker 1 (01:52):
Have you split it out, well, I know how many
nurses and corrections wor because like actual workers are going
to be leaving.

Speaker 2 (02:00):
Tell you the figures on mental health nurses and corrections
officers and what they will earn in Australia and experience
mental health nurse in Australia will get thirty thousand dollars
more a year. An experienced correction of corrections officer in
Australia we'll get twenty thousand dollars.

Speaker 1 (02:16):
If you look at home that we need to lift wages.

Speaker 2 (02:19):
Absolutely, we need to lift wages. We need to make
has to work.

Speaker 1 (02:23):
I love that idea. What are you cutting to pay
for that because we're broke?

Speaker 2 (02:27):
Well, we wouldn't have made the billions of dollars in
tax relief for landlords. That was a complete waste of
money and the cost of investment. Absolutely, we would not
We would not let that happen. This government has made
tax cuts that have benefited tobacco companies and landlords at
the extense of mental health workers and corrections officers.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
But you've taken me down this path. Now when you
say we are you talking about flour at the PSA
or flo who wants to be in the Labor Party.

Speaker 2 (02:53):
No, the PSA has been advocating for tax justice for
as long as we've existed. Actually, and we would make
different choices to those that this government has made. We
would invest in the people that deliver public and community
services instead of dismissing them that they have okay flu.

Speaker 1 (03:07):
Thank you, I always appreciate talking to you. Fluford Simon's
PSA National Secretary. For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive,
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