Full Show Podcast: 11 May 2026

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Pressing the newsmakers to get the real story. It's Heather
Duplicy Ellen drive with One New Zealand to coverage like
no one else news talks.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
It'd be.

Speaker 3 (00:14):
Afternoon.

Speaker 4 (00:14):
Welcome to the show.

Speaker 3 (00:15):
Coming up today, one of the Maldi party MPs has
officially split and started her own party. Question is how
many of the others, if not all of the others,
will they all end up going Doctor Lara Greeves after
five on that, Michael Baker on how long that Kiwi
on the cruise ship with huntervirus will have to quarantine
and we'll have a chat to end ZiT twenty about
how many players they will lose because of the year's delay.

Speaker 5 (00:35):
Heather Duplicy Ellen, Okay, we're.

Speaker 3 (00:37):
Never going to know for sure what tipped the government
into finally cutting the fees free policy, but I would
like to take some credit for this show's part in it,
because we have harped on about the need to get
rid of that policy so long it actually started to
even get boring for me. But as with everything, persevere
and you will succeed. And finally the policy is gone.
We had it confirmed by Winston Peters on Friday. Now

(00:59):
I've already had any from people who are upset about this.
I've heard students complaining about this. I've heard some parents
complaining about this, and I understand because it is never
fun to have free government money taken away from you.
And it is because of this kind of angst that
free government money is so rarely taken away once it
started to be handed out. But this policy was a
dog from the start. It costs perhaps three hundred and

(01:21):
fifty million dollars a year. Three hundred and fifty million
dollars a year is a lot of money, and for
that money, it didn't do what it was supposed to do,
which was to lift enrollments from poorer kids, which means
if it didn't do what it was supposed to do,
if the kids were going to go to UNI anyway,
and were still going to UNI, then all we were
doing was wasting three hundred and fifty million dollars. And
to the people worrying about students living in poverty or

(01:43):
unable to afford to study, please remember we taxpayers already
subsidize about seventy percent of what it costs Kiwi kids
to go to university. We already provide interest free student loans.
It is already globally relatively cheap to go to university here.
You could argue that our system in this country for

(02:03):
university study is already so good that even when we
made it more generous, it didn't lift enrollments. It's already
generous enough. Now I'm not going to I am Rother,
So I am going to withhold judgment on Nichola and
Winston and what the plan is from here on in,
because they are typically for this government saving money only
to spend it again. They're going to take some of
the money and they're going to spend it on trades trading.

(02:25):
Now that might be a good idea, but then again
it might also be the same kind of slop as
fees free, just in a more worthy place. We'll see,
But for the cutting of Jasinda's wasteful and pointless free
year of study rip, And may we be more careful
with our spending in the future.

Speaker 5 (02:39):
Ever do for c Ellens.

Speaker 3 (02:42):
Nine ninety two is the text number? Maybe standard text
free into fez uprime. Maybe maybe if we get round
to it. We'll talk to Tresh and Josie on the
huddle later, but we have got a chocol block show,
so let's crack into it. Ministry of Education has told
schools not to let students take left over school lunches home.
According to a bulletin that's been put up on the
ministries website, any spare lunches should be returned to the
supply because they're worried that any lunches that go home

(03:05):
may be a food safety risk. Pat Newman is the
principal at Hord Hodder School and is with us. Now, Hi, Pat, Yeah,
come out, welcome back to the show mate. Now do
you send spare lunches home?

Speaker 5 (03:16):
Yep?

Speaker 6 (03:17):
Why, well, I think it's a hell of a lot
better than actually throwing them out just for the sake
of it, because we've had no incidence of anyone getting
ill from it. There's no proof there is. The only
lunches that anyone's got ill from or taken wrongly who
are ones that were supplied by the ministry at the
first place. We actually take better care. And in our case,

(03:41):
we're a little bit different because we're a contractor in
the way I employ staff to cook our lunches and
the ministry only pays is for ninety percent of them.
So for every hundred lunches we do that. We only
get paid for ninety of them, so the ten that
I send home each day I think is coming out
of our money anyway.

Speaker 3 (04:00):
Yeah, do you believe the food safety reasoning because that
seemed like bollocks to me.

Speaker 6 (04:06):
It's bollocks. It's that's a polite way of putting it.
But we can't say those. Oh we could now because
the checks it's gone, so we can say, yeah, bollocks,
bollocks are more bollocks. Look, I I got really incense
because I flicked you up something earlier. But mister Seymour
made the comment that I'm a kin to a shoplifter

(04:27):
because I said, yeah, because I was sending home the
lunches the left over.

Speaker 3 (04:32):
And I can sort of see where they're coming from,
because what they're trying to avoid is schools getting into
a pattern of over ordering the lunches and then having
so many suplus they just send them home, and and
and perhaps by forcing the schools to send the suplus
back to the supplier kind of knocks that on the head.
Can you see that logic?

Speaker 6 (04:53):
I can see where their thinking comes from. Whether you
say it's logical, I don't agree with. But I can
see where they're thinking. Company, do you think there will
be The whole thing is by the time we sent
by the time we send the food back, if we
were going to do that, it would be extra coff
seening it back. On top of that, in our case,
we've already had to provide the food, you know, why

(05:14):
waste it?

Speaker 3 (05:15):
Yeah, not fair enough. But you know how the other
schools they have the little carrier that people come in
with the carrier bags and then offload the lunches for
today and then take the other lunches away. In that circumstance,
you can kind of see the logic there, right.

Speaker 6 (05:26):
Well, the only logic I think is that they probably
don't want the parents to see the food that they're providing,
the quality of it. Yeah, that's probably what I'm that
would be logical.

Speaker 3 (05:36):
Well, I mean, do we care what the parents think
because the parents aren't feeding their own kids, so they
can bugger off, can't they.

Speaker 6 (05:42):
Well, at the same time, the ministry tells us we
have to take notice of everything the parents tell us,
so they can't have one thing and the other. Look,
at the end of the day, I actually question whether
they've got the legal right to tell us what to
do about that anyway?

Speaker 3 (05:56):
Are you going to continue to do what you want?
Of course you are, Pat over.

Speaker 6 (06:03):
Well, listen, I would rather send home something that was
left over, that was nothing wrong with it, and have
a kid have it for tea or family, then throw
it in the rubbish or send it back to the
ministry for them to throw on their own.

Speaker 3 (06:16):
I can understand your logic.

Speaker 7 (06:17):
Pat.

Speaker 3 (06:17):
It's always good to talk to you, mate, Thanks very much.
It's Pat Newman, the principle of hord to Hood School. Well,
we're going to have to talk about what's happened internationally
in politics over the weekend, because it's course it's been
very exciting in the UK with reform, and it's been
very exciting with one Nation winning the pharaoh Bye election.
The Liberals though, have already shut down any chance of
joining forces with one nation in government. They don't like

(06:39):
the idea of that at all. As you can imagine.
Oliver Peterson is going to be that's our Aussie correspondent.
Just after half US four news. It's fourteen past four
right now.

Speaker 1 (06:49):
It's the Heather to Bussy Al and Drive Full Show
podcast on iHeartRadio powered by News Talks be Hea.

Speaker 3 (06:57):
Then my brother in law's a deputy principle and apart
from eating two or three of the lunches for his
lunch daily, be a big boy. Then he also takes
some home for a lazy dinner some nights. Thank you,
Ryan sixteen past four good.

Speaker 1 (07:10):
Sport with generate celebrating great performances in sport and key we.

Speaker 3 (07:15):
Saver against Jason Pine Sports talk hoosters of that's hello Piney,
Hello Heather Right, what do you make of the in
Z twenty league being delayed by a year?

Speaker 8 (07:23):
Yeah, I think it's the right decision. I know you've
got Don mccannanon in an hour or so, and I'm
sure he'll tell you that it is really because of
the squeezing of what the proposed window is in January,
because of the existing international calendar. New Zealand play Australia
in four test matches, the last of which finishes in
early January. Sri Lankay here for an all format tour

(07:43):
which begins early February. They want a thirty three day window.
They just won't get it with existing commitments around the
international calendar. So rather than try and squeeze it in,
have a bunch of double headers and make it, you know,
try to fit. What they're going to do is give
themselves some area, which also gives them the chance, of course,
to finalize investors and a bit more time up their

(08:04):
sleeves to get everything right and launch it in the
summer of twenty seven to twenty.

Speaker 3 (08:08):
N Do you believe that story because none of this
has changed right the whole way through this discussion. Those
things have been fixed in the calendar. Is that really
the reason? Or is the truth that it was way
too ambitious doing everything that needed to be done, getting
the councils to tender for the teams, finding investors for
the teams, you know, auctioning the players, like building uniforms.

(08:28):
Everything just seemed really ambitious.

Speaker 8 (08:30):
Well, I mean, yeah, great questions for Don McKinnon to
answer when you chat to them. I the Sri Lankan
part of it wasn't absolutely locked in. The Australian series
has been there for some time. I'm not sure that
the Sri Lankan series was unmovable. But what I mean,
there's no doubt that it gives them a lot more
time to get things locked in. They were racing the
clock because it took so long for NZ twenty to

(08:50):
be given the tick by New Zealand Cricket, they were
up against it. At least this gives them some you know,
some time to not make hasty decisions and to make
sure they do get it right when it does launch.

Speaker 3 (09:01):
Okay, what do you then think of how many players
we're going to lose? Because when I was when it
was explained to me why they had to hurry and
get this thing up for January twenty twenty seven, it's
because this year players are going to be signing contracts overseas.
But those contracts are two year contracts. So if we
lose them for jan twenty seven, are we also losing
them for January twenty eight, which is now the start

(09:21):
of the competition.

Speaker 8 (09:22):
Not always two year contracts. They can be two year contracts,
not always, that's not common. And I think if the
New Zealand players, you know, put their money where their
mouths are, they'll say, okay, well I do still want
to be an NZ at twenty, I'll sign a one
year contract. One year contracts are not rare, Heather and
T twenty so, and they're also if somebody is under
a two year contract and couldn't have been signed for
this year, then they do become available for the next one.

(09:45):
So I guess it's swingson roundabouts as far as that's concerned.

Speaker 3 (09:47):
Yeah, Dohn McKinnon's with us just after five or about
quarter past five.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
Now.

Speaker 3 (09:51):
The Wellington Phoenix women's side has done really well, isn't it?

Speaker 8 (09:53):
How good into a Grand Final for the first time,
First time and New Zealand teams ever made the Grand
Final on the A League. Yeah, cool atmosphere out of
to a park is thatday. I was lucky enough to
be their massive crowd, huge emotion and the fact that
they've nearly ever made the playoffs before, let alone the
Grand Final. It was already called occasion. They played Melbourne
City on Saturday night in Melbourne one off game. Look,
I wouldn't put it past them to go over there

(10:15):
and win the match. You know it's a one off
game and who knows what might happen. But yeah, really
call achievement.

Speaker 3 (10:21):
Can we put this down to the coach?

Speaker 8 (10:23):
Absolutely? Yeah, absolutely, she's Yeah, she's brilliant. She improves every
player she coaches and we all know the circumstances behind
how Beef Priestsman came to be the Wellington Phoenix coach
the band for the drone sky spying scandal at the
last Olympic Games, the twelve month ban. The irony is
here that if she hadn't been banned, the Wellington Phoenix
would have gone nowhere near her. You know, she's in

(10:45):
many ways far too good at coach for this league.
But the circumstances fell into place and here we are.

Speaker 3 (10:50):
Yeah, brilliant, Hey Piney, thank you. I really appreciate its
Jason Pine SportsTalk Coast. He'll be back at seven year.
If you don't remember this, BEF priestsman, she's the one
who's the coach of the women's football side. She was
the coach of the Canadian team. Remember this when they
got a drone up in the air and they were
spying on the New Zealand side at the Paris Olympics,
and nobody could understand understand why they were spying on

(11:10):
the New Zealand side because our side sucks and their
side doesn't. And it was such a high price to
pay for such a completely unnecessary bout of spying on
a crappy team. She lost a job, she was stood
down for it. I think that her wife is in
New Zealander. I think that's how she ended up here,
like there was a tie back to New Zealand anyway,
as they say, come right, because we are the ones

(11:33):
who got spied on, and then we end up with
her as one of our coaches. So it's all worked
out brilliantly for us Full twenty one here.

Speaker 1 (11:39):
What matters the facts over the noise, it's Heather Duplessy
Allen drive with one New Zealand coverage like no one
else news talks.

Speaker 3 (11:48):
That'd be Lord, We're ready for Michael Baker, aren't we? Heather?
Please please please don't let Michael Baker back out. He
should as in like, back out into the community. I
think you would like her to be backed out of
the interview. Should be kept locked away and remain irrelevant
from Jackie Heather, mister Baker, are you short of content today? No, listen,
Michael Baker is very good at what he does, right,

(12:09):
because he is an epidemiologist. He's into all the virusy
stuff on that front. It's not his fault. He's good
at what he does. He's a purist like you would
expect him to be. It's not his fault that when
Jacinda Whiz was taking his advice, she forgot to think
about the economy, which was the other part of her job.
It's not his What happened is not his fault that
he was definitely advocating for his thing quite hard. Anyway,

(12:31):
he still remains an expert on the old you know,
communicable diseases, contagious diseases. So we're going to get him
on because the development on the Hunter virus cruise ship
is that the Kiwi and the Australians are going to
be the last ones off and they're going to apparently
go and quarantine in Australia. And it is it sounds
like it's a significant period of time, like it's eight
to nine this virus after exposure, there's about an eight

(12:54):
to nine week period during which people can start to
themselves display the symptoms. So the question is, of course
they need to then quarantine for eight to nine weeks,
which seems rather excessive. Anyway, he's with us after five
o'clock on that. On another thing which we're going to
deal with later in the program. Maria men Or Kapa Kingi,
the Maori Party MP, has now announced she's quitting the
Maori Party to start her own party. I mean, if

(13:15):
you feel confused about like your eyes are doing little circles,
I do not blame you. Because this is the MP
who was kicked out of the party then went to
court to be reinstated into the party. Then we find
out last week she's actually not in the party. She's
sharing an office with another expelled MP, and now she's
leaving the party, which is where she was beforehand. Anyway,
what it means for the collapse of the party is

(13:36):
the more interesting thing, because on Friday it was reported
that all of these MPs were going to split off,
like all four mp all four MPs who are not
the leaders of the Maori Party and set up their
own party. She though, has set up a party called
the Tetai Tukero Party for her own electorates. So they're
not all going to join that party, are they, Because
they've got their own electorates with their own electric names.
So it looks maybe like what is going to happen

(13:57):
is they're all going to set up their individual parties
for their own electorates and then work in a kind
of like an umbrella alliance over them or something like that. Anyway,
Lara Grieves is with us after five o'clock and we'll
find out whether this is going to be you know,
if this is going to work or not, because the
Labor Party has made it clear they trying to annihilate
all of these people. They just want to get them
out of Parliament altogether. So that's quite a fight that's

(14:18):
worth watching. Just really quickly on the Bafter's success for
Adolescens at the Bafters in the UK overnight it won
four awards. It got Best Limited Drama, Best Leading Actor
for Stephen Graham, Best Supporting Actor for The Kid Owen Cooper,
and then Christine Tremaco. Why do I feel like Christina's
Stephen Graham's wife? Am I imagining that? Anyway? She won

(14:40):
the title of Best Supporting Actress Steve Coogan. I can't
believe Steve Coogan is still doing for I felt like
Steve Coogan's first foray into comedy. I don't think he
was funny the first time he did Alan Partridge, but
now he's won another award for Best Actor in a
Comedy for Alan Partridge. If you can actually believe it,
east Enders is one the best soap for the second

(15:01):
year running, beating Coronation Street, which I think we will
all agree is an absolute. It's an upset, isn't It's
a disgrace? Heather. It is obviously sensible to send the
food to Holmes. To do otherwise as both stupid and
as treating adults as sort of mentally deficient. Maybe the
food safety people should be treated like the BSA eliminated, Heather.

(15:21):
It is definitely for food safety. My god, it would
be reported immediately as the government's fault if someone became
food sick from food that had been reheated. Fair point
that you make on that. It probably would be the
governments for Everything's the governments for, isn't it. News is next,
and then we're off to Australia.

Speaker 5 (15:44):
The day's newsmakers talk to Heather first.

Speaker 1 (15:47):
Heather Duplicy Ellen drive with One New Zealand and the
power of satellite mobile news doorgs v.

Speaker 7 (16:04):
Right.

Speaker 3 (16:04):
Oliver Peterson was standing by with news out of Australia
and just a few minutes time, they've got Barrys Sofa
on politics in ten minutes time. It looks like the
cops have cracked down pretty hard on one of those
unruly cycle events yesterday. Apparently in Auckland. There are about
one hundred and twenty people who jumped on bikes. And
when I say bikes, like it's not cool, I'm not
talking about dirt bikes, not talking about something cool here.
It was just regular old pedal power bikes. But I

(16:27):
mean maybe they were electric or something, but they were
bike bikes. Your dad wears lycra and jumps on a
bike bike, do you know what I mean? Not cool? Anyway,
these people all jumped on these bikes and started hassling
people doing a round trip from Henderson to Newlyn between
eleven am and two pm, and the police followed. Four
people were arrested, one vehicle was impounded. Fifty three infringement

(16:47):
notices were issued because people were failing to comply with
road safety messaging and legislation. Twenty four away from five.

Speaker 1 (16:54):
It's the world wires on newstalks. They'd be drive.

Speaker 3 (16:58):
Donald trump'say's arms response to has latest peace offer is unacceptable.
The Iranians responded to the offer by demanding all the
usual things, including war reparations, and expert says neither side
seems to be taking the peace negotiations seriously.

Speaker 9 (17:11):
The United States is held to its demands, which is
complete submission by Iran, and Iran is held to its demands,
which is we will not And so far the Iranians
are heralding firm and there's no reason to doubt that
they will continue to do so.

Speaker 3 (17:27):
Yeah, I'll run you through the detail of that shortly.
One Nation's David Farley says he's humbled and exhilarated to
have won the Pharah by election. He's going to be
the first ever One Nation MP to win a seat
in Australia's Lower House.

Speaker 2 (17:37):
We're good at articulating our narrative of policy and our
action plans to get those policies working. And at the
end of it all, it gave the constituents of a
confidence that we were the better party to represent them
in fact in that camera.

Speaker 3 (17:54):
And finally, a German tourist has been awarded two thousand
New Zealand dollars after he sued a tour company for
sending him to a hotel in Greece that didn't have
enough sun loungers. So the chap was disappointed when he
took his family down to the pool in the morning
and he found all the other guests have left their
towels on all the lounges to reserve them. Even though
calling DIBs like this is technically against the hotel's rules,

(18:16):
the court has ruled that while the hotel doesn't have
to provide a sun lounger for every single guest, there
should still be a reasonable number available at all times.

Speaker 1 (18:24):
International correspondence with Ends and Eye Insurance Peace of Mind
for New Zealand Business.

Speaker 3 (18:30):
Olli Peterson ABC Perth Drive Radio presenters with us Hello Olli,
Hello the Heather. Okay, so how significant do you think
it is that one nation is one Farah.

Speaker 10 (18:40):
I think it's quite significant because it does.

Speaker 11 (18:42):
Just back up these opinion polls that we've seen around
Australia and it really does keep the Coalition in particular
on its nose. That Prime Minister was probably the one
doing a bit of a victory lap all weekend and
again this morning going on the ABC, saying that he
thinks that the Liberal Party, the National Party, had made
a big mistake by leg you're devising one nation and
adopting many of their policies, but a lighter version of them.

(19:04):
So he's seeing this as a bit of a win
for the government. I'm not so sure about that header
and I think maybe the heads of the Liberal Party,
the National Party and Paul Enhanson itself may come together
at some stage and form a bigger coalition that takes
on the government, because ultimately that's who they're up against,

(19:25):
and it might make sense. There's a lot to play
out with this One Nation obviously would resist that for
some time either because it is now eyeing off seats.
For example, in Western Sydney there's a Queensland MP by
the name of Colin Boyce, who, to be honest, I've
never heard of until today who was actually thinking about
defecting from the National Party to One Nation. Now he
takes in some of those mining areas like Gladstone and Rockhampton,

(19:48):
but he said that he was considering everything yesterday today
indicating that I'm a National Party member.

Speaker 10 (19:55):
I'm going to stick strong with the National Party. He's
not going anywhere yet.

Speaker 11 (19:58):
But it just gives you uni to Barnaby Joyce obviously
made the defection.

Speaker 10 (20:02):
Now they've picked up Pharah.

Speaker 11 (20:03):
It just gives you an indication how the landscape here
in Australia is shifting significantly.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
It really is. I see the Liberals have shut down
any talk of a coalition. But I mean is that
just like what they have to do. They can't necessarily
hold to that all the way through.

Speaker 5 (20:21):
Of course.

Speaker 11 (20:22):
And really the one who is in the pole position
here is Pauline Hanson, because she can sneap an opportunity
to pick up not just obviously the cet now of Farah,
but they might pick up a whole bunch of other
seats and the next federal election. But if the One
Nation Party was to want to form government, they're going
to have to do that with the Nats and the Libs.
So I mean, you see some of the pitches of
the people who are at the function on Saturday night.

(20:44):
He the Maga hats which are saying that make Albow
go away. So they're united One Nation, the National Party
and the Liberal Party of the fact that they all
want to take on the government, and probably by the
unification of wanting to remove Anthony Albert Ezy in the
Labor Party from government, maybe they do eventually find a
way to be on the same page.

Speaker 10 (21:03):
It's a fascinating time in Australian politics.

Speaker 3 (21:06):
Hey, are you expecting a road user charge and the
budget tomorrow?

Speaker 11 (21:10):
Well, nothing has been ruled out yet by the Treasurer
Jim Charmers, and he has flown this kind on a
number of occasions and try to indicate which ways he's
going to blow.

Speaker 10 (21:19):
But the McKell Institute, which is quite.

Speaker 11 (21:21):
Closely aligned with the Labor Party, has brought out some
modeling today which I just find the timing of it
very interesting, Hew, because it's modeling.

Speaker 10 (21:30):
It's suggesting that.

Speaker 11 (21:33):
We bring in a road user charge, but if you
earn more, you pay more. So they're arguing, for example,
if you're a lower income earner, you pay just under
four cents a kilometer, but if you earn a higher salary,
if you're a high income earner, which in Australia is
over one hundred and fifty thousand dollars a year, you'd
be paying thirteen cents per kilometer, so.

Speaker 10 (21:51):
Four hundred and forty bucks versus fifteen hundred dollars per year.
And they said that.

Speaker 11 (21:54):
Would be obviously linked to your income through the tax system.

Speaker 10 (21:58):
I believe that we will here in announcement.

Speaker 11 (22:00):
Tomorrow from Jim Chalmers that we will be bringing in
a road user charge, but I on think you'll commit
to it from one July he'll say it'll be coming
in twenty twenty eight or something like that. There's just
enough of a suggestion that this is about to be
introduced by the federal government.

Speaker 10 (22:13):
That's a little tip of bit of a prediction, but
nothing confirmed.

Speaker 3 (22:15):
You interesting, Okay, Listen, explain to me what's going on
with the rugby league players who are retired getting these
medical screenings.

Speaker 11 (22:22):
When they have to pay for them at the moment
so cte obviously with the head knocks, and we know
what that's done to a number of people's lives as
a result. If you don't get a PET scan, it
costs you about nine hundred dollars.

Speaker 10 (22:32):
The MRI is about five hundred dollars.

Speaker 11 (22:34):
Mark Carroll and James Graham, two of the toughest prop
forwards to play rugby league over the last thirty years,
have convinced the National Rugby League that they will now
pay for any NRL or any NRLW player who is
suspected of these head knocks wants to go and have
one of these PET scans or these MRI scans. So look,
that's I guess part of the health and the welfare,

(22:55):
isn't it. The Occupational health and safety of the players
in their retirement. They've convinced the r they'll go through
with paying for those scans. So hopefully we're not going
to hear about too many more through concussion and head
knocks as a result of playing the great game of
rugby league.

Speaker 3 (23:10):
Yeah, hey, Ollie, thank you very much. Talk to you
again soon. Good luck tomorrow. That's Oliver Peterson ABC Perth
Radio Drive presenter And yeah, they're really talking up this
budget tomorrow is like generational change. So let's see what
happens there seventeen away from.

Speaker 1 (23:24):
Five ever, duper cl Hey, what about this?

Speaker 3 (23:28):
As you know, Winston leaked the fees free part he
leaked he let slip. I don't really know anyway, he
lets slip the fees free policy is going to be
scrapped when he was on the show with us on Friday,
because I was just going on about it again, like
I was just harping on about it as I do,
and it just got on top of Winston. He's like, oh,
just get get her off the get her away from me.
So he let the cat out of the back. Anyway,

(23:48):
what this has now started is another round of conversations
about whether the Prime Minister is angry with Winston for
ruining another moment for them, which is that they're going
to get rid of the thing. This is he was
asked about it at post cabinet prem minis.

Speaker 12 (23:59):
This is what he said, We're going to do a
pre budget announcement. He got Heathers on the radio, and
that's all good.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
Got here, that got headed. I'm a verb now, I'm
a doing word. I'm actually quite into that, although I
can see how that's going to probably be commandeered within
my domestic situation and turned on me, and I just
have to have I just have to have a lot
of self love at that moment and be like, yep,
being here, that is a good thing.

Speaker 13 (24:25):
Being here.

Speaker 3 (24:25):
That is good for everyone, especially myself. Okay, here's the
details of what Iran has said. Iran has gone back
to Trump and said it wanted the lifting of US sanctions,
ending of the US naval blockade of the Strait of Humus,
an immediate end to the war with guarantees that the
US won't strike again on the nukes. They want a
shorter period than the US wants as a moratorium on

(24:48):
uranium and Richmond, I think the US wanted twenty years
and they want a shorter period and there aren't obviously.
They also want to keep some of their stockpile of
a highly enriched uranium. The US wants to ship it
all over to the States. They also want to keep
their facil that is intact. The US wants to disable
all of them. So I mean, basically, Iran wants to
be able to continue building a nuclear warhead in the
US doesn't want. And this is the thing that's come

(25:09):
down to, and so I think they're out of luck
on that. But we'll see what happens.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
Quarter to politics with centric credit, check your customers and
get payments certainty.

Speaker 3 (25:17):
Political commentator Lara Grieves on Mariamental Kappa KINGI leaving the
Maori Party after five thirteen away from five. Barri Soper,
senior political correspondence with US Hey Barring, Good afternoon, Heather. Okay,
So the poll of polls tells us what I think
we already knew was going to happen in the center.
The coalition government's returned, right.

Speaker 13 (25:32):
Yeah, This poll of polls is a really interesting reflection
because what it looks at is it looks at data
from all the polls that we talk about time and
time again, and the lead up to an election and
other private or less public profile polls and it chucks
them all into a com computer model and then the

(25:55):
data comes up. Well, the data now says, if it
looks over the past few that the probability of the
coalition winning a second term after the election based at
eighty eight point three percent. And that's up a lot.
If you look at the support for the three coalition

(26:16):
parties is fifty point two percent compared to forty four
point nine percent for the opposition. Last March, the model
showed the average gap between coalition and opposition parties was
just three point three percent. So, like we've been saying
now for months, the idea that this coalition is on

(26:36):
the way out I think is relatively remote possibility, even
though the polls are relatively close.

Speaker 3 (26:43):
What did you make of the Greens policy announcement today
on electricity prices.

Speaker 13 (26:47):
Well, see, it's very unfortunate that they won't get to
implement that if this poll is right, because they won't
be part of the Labor coalition. So what they're saying
essentially is that, look, the government owns the percent of
RIDI in Genesis and mercury and they've written this is
the Green co leadership have written to the relevant ministers

(27:09):
Nikola Willison, the Energy Minister, Same and Brown saying that
basically what they should do is instruct the energy sector
to reduce prices for households. They say nearly two hundred
thousand households can't afford to heat their homes or they
couldn't last year, and they said that's up from almost

(27:32):
seventy thousand more now can't heat their homes and last year.
So they're saying that, but of course these companies and
they're talking about solar energy as well. They say there
should be low interest loans to homes to convert solar energy.
I think that aspect of it's quite good. But you
can't instruct companies. It's like the government saying I don't

(27:55):
like banks, although they don't own fifty one percent of
the banks, But instructing company on how to operate to
me is just not part of.

Speaker 3 (28:03):
What about this democratic This is my favorite part of
the policy. The Greens are also asking the government to
ensure no households are disconnected solely due to the inability
to pay the bills. Asked at what point she would
consider a household warranted disconnection for non payment, as in
like how many bills do you have to miss before
you actually are disconnected? Chloe Swarbrick was unwilling to engage.

(28:25):
I would rather not engage in hypotheticals, he said, When
all policy is hypotheticals, isn't it totally totally all right?
Ropps free, Yes, And of course it was the story
you're pressured, poor old Winston, Peter. Do you realize how
excited I am about this? Well, a gigantic waste of money?

Speaker 13 (28:45):
Well indeed, and Winston let the cat out of the bag.
Now you know, budget leaks usually are treated very seriously
because you got to mention an MMP government. You can't
have other parties sitting around the cabinet table you're discussing
what you're going to do in the budget, and then
one breaks ranks and comes out and has headed on

(29:06):
radio on.

Speaker 5 (29:07):
News Talk z B.

Speaker 13 (29:09):
It was on your show, of course, on Friday, that
Peters was quite open about free student fees for the
third year of study, which is what this coalition introduced
after Labor introduced the first year. They changed it. They
Winston said, to be scrapped in the budget. The Prime minister, though,
it was pretty relaxed about what all that had a

(29:30):
post cabinet news conference, even though you're standing alongside Nichola Willis.

Speaker 12 (29:34):
We were always going to do a pre budget announcement
around that. It's a failed policy. It's a huge waste
of taxpayers money hasn't delivered at all, and it can
be better deployed doing other things like trades training.

Speaker 5 (29:44):
As we've talked about.

Speaker 12 (29:44):
The bigger issue for me was that fees three was
a big easy on first commitment and actually, you know,
give them real credit because they actually have seen you know,
that's a policy. It's not working, So you really relaxed.

Speaker 3 (29:55):
He literally said, I'll give you a budget leak and you're.

Speaker 5 (29:58):
Not going to he got you.

Speaker 12 (30:00):
I think you got here that, Jenna.

Speaker 7 (30:01):
I think that's what happened.

Speaker 3 (30:03):
You're not going to catsgate a minister for leaking a
part of the budget. Like what, very relaxed.

Speaker 12 (30:08):
We're going to do a pre budget announcement. He got
Heathers on the radio and that's all good. He got
Heathers on the radio and that's all good.

Speaker 5 (30:18):
Oh dear, dear.

Speaker 13 (30:19):
Now I've been heather for many years, of course, but
when we talk about students and they're not going to
now though, well we'll have to I guess study in
political science what being heathered is, and that'll become part
of the new lexicond of getting a political science degree.

Speaker 3 (30:36):
One can only hope, One can only hope we make
it into enterprint in some way in the history box.
If that's the only way, it will be the only way. Barry,
thank you, Barry Sober seeing your political correspondent seven away
from five.

Speaker 1 (30:47):
Here yourself think it's the make Hosking breakfast.

Speaker 14 (30:50):
What's your assessment of the political risk of telling people
vote for me because I'm going to make it harder
for you to retire and get money.

Speaker 12 (30:57):
I think you're going to be quite careful with that
because people need to and going forward, you know, you
could see future governments changing thresholds.

Speaker 14 (31:03):
So in other words, it's still an entitlement.

Speaker 12 (31:05):
You either get it or yeah, I think so, because
other ways you get rearranging of affairs.

Speaker 14 (31:09):
Can you say it's safely the selection given that New
Zealand first don't want to bar but therefore it's not
a bottom line. I take it's not a bottom line
for you.

Speaker 12 (31:15):
I mean, we have to get into a negotiation on it.
We couldn't get it across the line in the last
coalition because we've gone to the campaign on.

Speaker 14 (31:21):
The safely knowing it's never gotten well the light of
don't well.

Speaker 12 (31:23):
But I think it's actually kind of important.

Speaker 14 (31:25):
Back tomorrow at six am the Mic Hosking Breakfast with
a Vida News talk z' be Heather.

Speaker 3 (31:32):
I'm voting for the word being heathered for the annual
Word of the Year. James, you should and if I
tell you what, if it gets in there, hit me
up and then I'll buy your bottle of whiskey. Actually, incidentally,
last night I had to settle a beat Jess. I
really I'm bad at beating a io barrier he reckons
a couple.

Speaker 15 (31:48):
I was about to jump in there and be like,
sure you will, You'll definitely get you into the game.

Speaker 3 (31:52):
So last night, so what happened is somebody said to
me because it was split ends last night, and I
have to tell you about split ins, and I will
do that in the next hour anyway on my bucket list. Anyway,
we went out for dinner beforehand, and then as I
was paying for dinner, my friend, who I don't think
is really my friend, because she does stuff like this.
She goes owe me, you owe me a meal. I
said why why? She said, because we took a bet
about Mikey Sherman and I said Mikey Sherman was going

(32:14):
to get fired, and you said Mikey Sherman was not
going to get fired. So then I had to pay
for her dinner, just as I was paying for my
own dinner, I had to pay for her dinner as well.
But the moral of the story is I do set
all my bets, James. So if you get heathered into
the annual Word of the year whatever that stupid competition
thing is, I'll buy your bottle of whiskey, as long
as you're not an alcoholic, in which case I'll just
buy some chocolate. Barry. When is the next reprint of

(32:35):
your reprint of your book available? Apparently next week? Apparently
it's coming out next week. Stop talking about it. You're
giving him a big head. Kiirstarma is in huge trouble.
You know that you knew this was going to happen,
because we've been talking about it all of last week
and kind of really in the months before it. But
after that wipeout by reforming the local council elections in

(32:56):
the UK. He's got a really tough twenty four hours
ahead of her, probably slightly longer, but twenty four hours
is really halving. One of his rivals, West Streeting has
apparently gone to him and told him to his face
that he is preparing his case to be the next
Prime Minister of the UK. F Kiir Starmer is forced
to resign as a result of his results. We'll have
a chat to Gavin Gray, are UK correspondent about that.

(33:17):
He's with us just before seven o'clock. But next up,
let's talk to Lara Grieves about what's going on with
the Maori Party and how many of them are going
to defect. News doorgs. They'd been no Thasday never met us,
let us go yesterday.

Speaker 5 (33:29):
No one said meds Way or our boss.

Speaker 1 (33:32):
I heard this say the only drive show you can
try the truck to ask the questions, get the answers,
find a fave saying and give the analysis. Here the
duplicy Ellen Drive with one New Zealand and the power
of satellite mobile news dogs, they'd.

Speaker 3 (33:50):
Be good afternoon. The predicted possible collapse of the Maori
Party may have started with Maria Mental Kappa king He
announcing that she is starting her own party will be
called the tet I talk it O Party, which reflects
the test I talk it O elector that she's running in.
She told the Hoe that she and the other female
lemps of the Maori Party have discussed the internal issues
they face.

Speaker 16 (34:10):
As Marty woman in the party Mati and the conditions
in which we had to work with and were tough
for all of us, and so we would we would
share those things, we would talk about those things.

Speaker 3 (34:24):
Doctor Lara Greaves as a Maori politics a commentator and
associate professor in politics, that the University of Victoriana is
with us. Now, Hi, Lara Kilda, do you think this
is the start of a possible collapse.

Speaker 17 (34:37):
Yeah, potentially. I mean it's one of those things of
Marty politics. It's really hard to see what will happen
in these electorates. Ultimately, you know, they're hyperlocal, so local
issues are really important, but also sometimes strategy is important. Again,
really hard to tell what exactly what happened in the electorates,
but what we do have in electorates like t tay
Tokoto is now a four way race potentially between Party Mary,

(34:59):
the New part the Greens and Labor. So there's just
so much road to run still, but ultimately vote splitting
will be at play, and just yeah, a lot of
potential other dramas.

Speaker 3 (35:10):
So Taku to Perris is already out, Muddy a mental couple,
Kingi is already out. It sounds like Hannah might be
a Rafiti. Clark may also leave that only leaves or
any Kuiperer. Why is she stick here?

Speaker 17 (35:22):
Yeah, So what we're really looking to now is whether
Taku's a fairis does a really similar thing to Muddy
and men a cup of Kini and starts up as
kind of tea Taitonga party. A big question there, will
they align in some way? But with any Kuipeer and
Afaty might be Clark, will they leave to Party Mardi
because that would be a huge blow to them, right
because Hanad Afati's got like such name recognition and even like,

(35:45):
you know, she's known around the world for the viral hacker,
so like it would be a big, big issue for
them and a big problem their newest MP or any Kuipeer.
You know, she did had quite a convincing when in
that by election, I mean that would be another blow
to them, and then they ultimately would only have the
leaders left. So I mean it's it's not really looking
good for de Party Marty at this point.

Speaker 3 (36:05):
Of the four MPs who are not the leaders being
Debbie and obviously at aarity of the four MPs, how
many of them would win their seats back if they
if they if they defected from the Maori Party.

Speaker 17 (36:17):
Well, it's really hard to know that. So basically we
know the Mardi population is really young. Turnout is quite variable,
especially among young Marty, and we kind of can see
that in a lot of those electorates. We have quite
strong Labor Party candidates coming through, people with a bit
of governance experience and fucker popper and experience and the electorates.
So there's a lot of issues to consider there as

(36:38):
to whether voters will kind of go with the Marti
Party incumbents or will try someone new, or whether they'll
kind of be sick of what's happened with Fency Party
Marti when they haven't been focusing on the issues. This
is one of those things where all of these races
are anybody's game, really anybody's race. It's going to be
hard to predict even on the night, will be shocked again,
will be shocked again?

Speaker 3 (36:57):
Most likely? Give me your take on what Labour is
going to do here, because Labor it's made it very
clear that they're going to try and annihilate the Maori Party, right,
but in order to do that you almost have to
out Malory Party the Maori Party, So you have to
go quite far, like I would say, quite radical to
that side. Does that affect the Labor parties in the
determination to take this party out on one side of them?
Does it affect their ability to appeal to center voters?

Speaker 17 (37:19):
I mean, that's a really good question and it's one
of the things that I'll be watching too as well.
You know, for quite a few elections now, the Labor
Party has run a Maori manifesto or a Marori center campaign,
you know, Willie Jackson's run it, and so that's what
they'll be trying to balance, to make sure that they
don't have anything that looks kind of too radical for
that center voter that they're trying to attract. It's like
a really hard balance of them. But I would say

(37:41):
that the candidates, they have people with that kind of
governance experience, people who are kind of well known at
having those sort of more corporate roles or development roles.
So perhaps the kind of candidates that will be quite good.
Be sure they're measured and they're speaking, that they stick
to their talking points, but then kind of signal nudge
nudge when gwenk housewirs. So they've kind of got a

(38:01):
good candidate selection there of the kind of people who
probably can say that more middle of the road message.

Speaker 3 (38:06):
Yeah, Lara, it's good to talk to you mate. Thank you.
Doctor Lara Greaves Marty politics commentator, Associate professor in politics
at Victoria University. It's coming up twelve past five.

Speaker 5 (38:14):
Together Dupless, the l here.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
We passenger on board the Hunter virus hit cruise ship
will be taken to Australia to quarantine with the Australian passengers.
Three people already have died. There were several infections. Michael
Baker is an Otago University epidemiologist. High Michael oh curea Heather, Now,
is this person going to have to quarantine over there
for the full period that they are at risk, which
is like eight or nine weeks.

Speaker 4 (38:37):
It won't be quite that long, but yes, this virus
has a very long incubation period. It's routinely or the
median is about three weeks, but it can be up
to six or eight weeks. Most of the people now
who are on the ship will probably last have been
exposed to really active infect maybe a week or two ago,

(39:02):
so that will reduce the quarantine or the ear the
quarantine period they need.

Speaker 3 (39:07):
Okay, so you can take a bit more risk on board.
I suppose if this person does actually develop the sickness,
what is the risk of somebody else catching it? Like,
is it via the air or how do they get it?

Speaker 4 (39:21):
Well, it's generally very close prolonged contact. It's not a
as infectious as something like the virus that causes COVID
nineteen or influenza. The Hunter virus in general don't transmit
between people. There are more than twenty species of them.
This Andy's virus, which is one of them, is unusual

(39:44):
and having caused some previous outbreaks of person to person transmission.
But it's very unusual and when they're investigated, these are
often people who are living in the same house or
the same bedroom, or spending a lot of time to
get It's not from casual contact, but the cruise ship
setting as we know, involves a lot of people in

(40:08):
a very confined environment for weeks, and so that's a
prime environment for transmitting these kind of viruses, okay.

Speaker 3 (40:15):
And so because it's less infectious, this is why everybody
can say with some confidence it's not the next COVID pandemic, right.

Speaker 4 (40:22):
That's right. It also has some unusual features, all different
features in that you only seem to be infectious once
you have symptoms, so there isn't that pre symptomatic transmission,
which was quite a big driver for COVID nineteen for instance.

Speaker 3 (40:38):
Michael together do for Clen Michael, thank you very much.
Was Michael Baker, epidemiologist. Okay, have a listen to this.
This is Hopkins refusing to comment on the scrapping of
the fees free.

Speaker 7 (40:49):
This is him.

Speaker 3 (40:50):
This was just in the five o'clock bulletin. I want
to see the detail of what the government are doing
with that money first.

Speaker 4 (40:55):
We're not making any commitments around spending until after the budget,
quite responsibly.

Speaker 3 (40:59):
So now I look fair play to him. He is
waiting until after the budget. But this is surely surely
on this one he can make some comment. This is
a policy he brought in. He brought this policy in,
he looked at it and he said, you know what,
I believe so wholeheartedly, just sindo his next years for me.
Next year's on us. I believe so wholeheartedly that we

(41:21):
need to pay for the first year year of university
for these kids to get them in that. I am
prepared to spend three hundred and fifty million dollars a
year doing it. That's how much he believed in it
when they brought it in, right, and then it gets
scrapped and he's like, well, can't comment on it. Does
that not tell you how ideologically vacuous he is? And
I say, I really like Chris Hipkins. But there was

(41:41):
there was no ideology behind this. They just wondered if
they could win some votes, didn't they with three hundred
and fifty million taxpayer dollars? That's expensive, isn't it to
help them win an election? Quarter past? Okay? If you're
looking for a perfectly sized city or town car to
run around the place with without the enormous cost of
fuel at the moment, have a look at the all

(42:02):
Electric byd Atto two. Now, this is a perfect compact
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into those tiny little inner city streets and really heard
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for you to be able to head away for the
weekend with three hundred and forty five k's on the
electric battery. Now I'm driving at the moment. The premium model,

(42:23):
it comes packed with all of the features that you
would expect from BYD. You've got the huge rotating screen,
three hundred and sixty degree camera, full glass roof with sunshade.
But you've also got the well specked dynamic model that
features ample tech and safety features, and that's just priced
from thirty nine nine hundred and ninety dollars plus on
road costs additional BYD interest mentions for LASTMA and by
the way, bid just topped EV sales in New Zealand

(42:45):
for the month of April, and they were also number
one for plug in hybrid. So clearly people are loving
what they're selling. So check them out at BYD Auto
dot co dot.

Speaker 5 (42:54):
NZ together duper clan.

Speaker 3 (42:56):
Yeah, the why did Michael Baker greet you with killed it?
Because he's embossedon so he did us as solid. He's
in Boston, he's at Harvard. He got up for us,
he did the thing and he's he's homestick obviously is
nostalgic for home. Only six months posting, apparently nineteen past five.
Now the n ZED twenty Cricket League has been delayed
by a year. So it was due to launch January
twenty twenty seven has now been pushed to January twenty eight.

(43:18):
Don McKinnon is chair of the n Z twenty Establishment
Committee and with us.

Speaker 18 (43:22):
Hi Don, Yeah, afternoon, Heather.

Speaker 3 (43:24):
Now Don a little bit worried about this because I
was told when this was being set up that we
had to get this thing over the line for jan
twenty seven because otherwise we were going to lose players
who are going to sign two year contracts. Is that
a thing?

Speaker 18 (43:36):
Ah, well, there's that risk, unquestionably. I mean we've been
talking to the players Association. They're relatively confident most players
will do their best, absolute upmost actually to make sure
they're available for this complhinent. It starts in the summer
after next Barts. Look, ultimately it's a shared decision between

(43:56):
ourselves and New Zealand Cricket that we've got to get
this right. Unfortunately, the window that we've got for January
twenty seven is just too tight, particularly with the other
commitments that we've sort of locked in for test cricket.
So look makes good sense, but yeah, it is a rest.
I'm not going to deny that.

Speaker 3 (44:13):
How many of them are going to sign do you
think two year contracts versus the one year contract that
may be able to.

Speaker 18 (44:19):
Well, we hope a lot less now because obviously they
now know that we're locked in for jan twenty e eight.
So look, and there may be the odd player that
just gets too good and offer they can't deny, and
you know that is a risk. At the same time,
there will be some players will be coming off contract
that now have the opportunity to say, okay, well jan

(44:39):
twenty eight works for me. So there'll be some swings
in aroundabouts.

Speaker 3 (44:42):
Yet do you reckon? I mean, because the thing about
it is it's not just about keeping and retaining our
own talent, but it's about trying to get the likes
of Ben Stokes over what are the chances that we
can draw that kind of a name from overseas well.

Speaker 18 (44:53):
I think the good thing about this process is that
this gives us the best chance to get you know,
the best invest in the process. That was one of
the things we were looking at that we just found
everything was rushed in terms of going to the market
using the company that we want to work with to
put these teams on the market. This time gives us

(45:14):
the opportuity this extra time because the ability to go
to the market and really careful, clever, professional process that
attracts the best investors both internationally and out of New Zealand.
That gives us the best change, their best chance to
get players like Ben Stokes and the like from around
the world.

Speaker 3 (45:31):
Good stuff, Don, Thank you for having a chat to us.
Good luck that it's Don McKinnon, en Z twenty Establishment
Committee Chair. Now, well, now that we've dealt with the
fees free, I'm we have to find something else to
get obsessed about. So I'm marginally interested in the Originaire
and I've been harping on about them. It is becoming
a pattern, though I am harper. I'm a harper, Aren't
I harp on about things? Don't I? Anyway, it's been

(45:52):
harping on about this. How did Originaire get money to
be able to go for another month when it's just
obviously not like this this whole Westport leg is just
not a thing we should be putting money in. I
may have an answer for you, will get to it
before six o'clock, hopefully. Nikola Willis, by the way, is
with us after six five twenty two.

Speaker 1 (46:08):
The name you trust to get the answers you need,
it's Heather of duplicy Ellen drive with one New Zealand
coverage like no one else news talks.

Speaker 3 (46:18):
They'd be whether holbrid was spliteens Patrick sending me that
that's that's a rhetorical question because Patrick was there, I
suspect and knows how good Spliteans was. We'll deal with
that before six A. It's five twenty five. Tell you
what if you were interested in international politics. It was
a blockbuster of the weekend, wasn't it? In the UK
and Australia. In Australia, Pauline Hansen's One Nation won the
Pharaoh by election, beating the Liberals who've held the seat

(46:40):
for twenty five years straight and apart from basically a
bird of a flirtation with the National Party, the Liberals
have held it for like seventy something years. In the UK,
Reform went from holding two council seats to holding about
fifteen hundred if it was translated into local inter central
government actually into the House of Commons, be the equivalent
of them coming with than forty seats in the UK

(47:01):
Parliament of a majority. And given the size of the
UK pilot Parliament relative to ours, it's like basically the
same as coming within about seven seats in New Zealand
of getting a majority. It was enormous. Now, obviously what
this is is a rise in popular populism in the
English speaking world. And all of us who are watching this,
and Winston Peters is probably the most interested, I think,
because he's trying to emulate exactly this. Sorry, he's got

(47:24):
people from Reform helping him with his campaign. All of
us watching it are probably tempted to predict that the
same thing might happen here. But I don't think it's
going to to be honest, I just don't think we
have the same kind of immigration tensions as Australia and
the UK. And let's be clear what we're talking about
here when we talk about euphemistically immigration tensions, that is
a synonym for Muslim immigration tensions. We don't have it here.

(47:46):
They have it in Australia, they have it in the UK.
We also don't have the same kind of die in
the wool right wing media outlets like the Murdock Press
and the tabloids in the UK that really push those
parties ideas hard. And Sure, there is a rise in
populism here in New Zealand, but the problem for you
Zeeland First, who want to capitalize on it, is it's
not just them pushing running for that vote. They're having
to split it with ACT. After all, it was ACT

(48:07):
last week who came out with a citizenship test, which
is populism, isn't it? Through and through? So I think
Winston Raymond Peters would be heartened by what he saw
in Australia and the UK over the weekend. But I
think you should also temper his expectations because for all
of the similarities we do have with those places, we
are a very different place.

Speaker 5 (48:25):
As well, ever do perceived.

Speaker 3 (48:27):
Thank god, Luxeon's ruled out the idea of a grand coalition.
Have you caught up with this idea? Audrey's loving it.
Audrey's been pushing the idea. Audrey Young from the Herald,
by the way, it's been pushing the idea of a
grand coalition where basically National and Labor gets so tired
of the Loonies that they're having to deal with. It's
worse for Labor. Obviously they've got the Greens and the
Marlby Party, but you know, National is getting tired of

(48:49):
the stuff going on with ACT in New Zealand first,
so they decide to hold hands across the aisle and
they form a grand Coalition and they cut out all
those kind of like more extreme ideas. And Audrey went to,
I don't know if you saw in the PA. It's
worth digging up actually just for like an interesting exercise
in politics. She went to the to the to the
extent of, you know, drawing up what a cabinet would
look like, and who would hold Finance and who'd be

(49:10):
the Prime Minister and how they would swap the roles
and what they would be, and Nikola would be taken
out of finance and she'd be given another anyway, Luxeon
has said that would be insanity, Thank the Lord, because
if there's one thing I've come to realize is I
hate bipartisanship. I hate the idea that two really big
guys would get together and say this is how we're
going to run the show and nobody gets to say anymore.
I like the fact that we can have a contest

(49:31):
of ideas. That would be getting rid of ideas, wouldn't it.
Anyway huddles with us shortly on.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
That accountability analysis answers here what matters? It's Heather Duple
see Ellen Drive with one New Zealand and coverage life.

Speaker 5 (49:47):
No one else us talks. That'd be you need a.

Speaker 4 (49:49):
Came over, a can.

Speaker 5 (49:55):
I'll remember.

Speaker 13 (50:00):
Smart right, Nicko?

Speaker 3 (50:01):
Well this will wear us after six o'clock. Heather, I
disagree with you that the Elder Young article would be
worth digging out. I thought it was a complete waste
of time. Well, it's only a waste of time as
much as fantasy football teams are a waste of time.
Do you know? Like that is her fantasy football that
would have kept her? She would have been fair fizzling
about that for a full month actually thinking about how
that would all work. The huddle is going to be

(50:22):
with us, I almost said the sports huddle, because for them,
politics is like sports. They're going to be with us shortly.
Right now, it's twenty four away from six now, apparently
twenty seven percent basically a quarter. Basically, one in four
of our public servants are considering going overseas. This is
a new survey from the PSA, who worn that we're
at risk of losing an entire generation of skilled workers
and the productivity that comes with us. Flufit Simons is

(50:44):
the National Secretary for the PSA and is.

Speaker 19 (50:46):
With us high flir good evening.

Speaker 3 (50:48):
When we talk about these public servants, we're not actually
talking about bureaucrats. We're talking about health workers and nurses
and so on.

Speaker 6 (50:55):
Right.

Speaker 19 (50:57):
All the survey covers mental health workers, careers, offices, home
support workers, people who work in local government, whole range
of policy specialists, all sorts of public service and community
workers all over New Zealand. So it's quite telling findings
that we are seeing one in four considering going overseas.
But also particularly damning is that forty nine percent of

(51:19):
those under twenty five are considering leaving New Zealand. So
that's a real worry for the future of our public
and community services.

Speaker 3 (51:26):
Have you guys split it out at all between the
people we would consider bureaucrats and the people we would
consider actual workers.

Speaker 19 (51:34):
We don't make those kind of distinctions. What we know
is that Each of these public service workers makes an
important contribution to New Zealand. They want a future here.
But what we're seeing from this government is an onslaught
against working people. We saw it in the cuts to
public services. We've seen it in the canceling of pay
equity claims. Now they're coming after holidays and leave and

(51:54):
they're changes with the Employment Leaves Bill. It's not surprising
that people are looking to go overseas and how this
government treats working people.

Speaker 3 (52:02):
You may not make that distinction, but others will, right
because of course it will probably freak me out more
to think that we're losing nurses who could save our
lives as opposed to just a bunch of people who
sit around in their bums writing reports.

Speaker 19 (52:15):
Well, I think you are worried. You are right to
be worried about nurses a mental health experience.

Speaker 3 (52:20):
If you split it out, well, I just know how
many nurses and corrections workuse like actual workers are going
to be leaving.

Speaker 19 (52:28):
We'll let me tell you the figures on mental health
nurses and corrections officers and what they will earn in
Australia and experience. Mental health nurse in Australia will get
thirty thousand dollars more a year. An experienced correction of
corrections officer in Australia will get twenty thousand dollars.

Speaker 3 (52:44):
If you look at home that we need to lift wages.

Speaker 19 (52:47):
Absolutely, we need to lift wages. We need to make
as to work.

Speaker 3 (52:51):
I love that idea. What are you cutting to pay
for that because we're broke?

Speaker 19 (52:56):
Well, we wouldn't have made the billions of dollars in
tax relation for landlords. That was a complete waste of
money and cost of investment. Absolutely, we would not We
would not let that happen. This government has made tax
cuts that have benefited tobacco companies and landlords at the
extense of mental health workers and correctionscors.

Speaker 3 (53:16):
But you've taken me down this path. Now when you
say we are you talking about Fleur at the PSA
or Flur who wants to be in the Labor Party.

Speaker 19 (53:21):
No, the PSA has been advocating for tax justice for
as long as we've existed. Actually, and we would make
different choices to those that this government has made. We
would invest in the people that deliver public and community
services instead of dismissing them.

Speaker 7 (53:34):
But they have.

Speaker 3 (53:35):
Okay, flu thank you. I always appreciate talking to you.
Flurford Simon's PSA National Secretary twenty one away from six.

Speaker 1 (53:41):
The Huddle with New Zealand Southby's International Realty, a name
you can trust locally and globally.

Speaker 3 (53:47):
On that hold on, excuse me.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
High with New Zealand Southeby's International Realty, the only truly
global brand.

Speaker 3 (53:57):
Again on the Huddle, we have Trusshurs and Shars and
Willis Pere and Joe Spaguanni Child Found Chief Executive. Hello
you do Hello?

Speaker 20 (54:03):
Hello?

Speaker 21 (54:03):
I hope you're wearing a mask. Heather sneezing everywhere?

Speaker 3 (54:06):
Well, no, it was that was one of those ones, Josie,
where you go to breathe and you just like swallow
your own spit down your airhold. I know, I wouldn't
want you to think I have hunt of virus though,
It's more like I'm trying to suffocate myself with saliva. Anyway, Trisha,
tell me what you make of the Maori party. What
do you think is going on here? Is this the
start of the end? Is this the collapse?

Speaker 22 (54:28):
I think this is proving that old adage and it goes.
It's proof that it goes across any party that voters
absolutely punish disunity. The Maori Party has looked like as
shambles now for four months, and then I think there's
something more important that's underpinning it and what they will

(54:49):
be punished for. It is the way that the likes
of Mario Minno Kappa Kingi have been attacked from within
her party. From what I hear from people, that is
just not the way. It's not the way that Mary
voters want to see their MPs are treated or disrespected.

(55:11):
And then I think the other interesting point about this
is it shows the difference between trying to control a
party and trying to control a movement. And don't forget
when we had the what we're probably the biggest protests
of our time, which were the Toytu Tatility protest led

(55:33):
by the young Hannah Mapi Clark and Maria Muno's son.
One of the call to actions from that whole protest
was sign up to the Maori role, increase our power,
increase our power for the Mardi Party. The question now
is where are those for those people who have signed

(55:55):
up expecting to vote to party Maori. Where is that
support going to go? Because I don't think in the
in the absence of those key MPs, I don't think
that support will be there.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
Yeah, well, it's hard to see it going to labor.
What do you think, Josie, Well, I.

Speaker 21 (56:10):
Think Rawii Waitite and Debbie Nawita Paka. I think they'll
both win their seat no matter what. Probably, So if
one of them wins their seat, I don't think they
won't get anywhere near five percent again, So I don't
think they're gone. Heather, I don't think this is the
end of Party Mary, but I think what's happening is
not actually a bad thing. I think it's quite healthy
for Marty politics. And we've seen this all the way

(56:33):
through the year that it's fracturing and splintering along different
kind of ideological lines. And you know, we wouldn't have
it to Party Pakia, would we. So this is this
is a good thing. And so I think it's splintering
along those in Mary them who think that okay, we
can have a bicultural reform, we can adapt Pakier institutions,

(56:53):
you're you know, New Zealand institutions to help Mary, or
we create Mary institutions and devolved who Mary institutions. Then
you've got young Mary, the Kohunger generation who are more
radical than older Mary, who and about a third of
older Mary are actually identifying as center rights, so they

(57:14):
would see themselves as sort of pretty disengagement politics at all.
So you've got that splinter. And then now we've got
with which is really interesting with Miriam Minno is that
she's putting forward actually a very local party so as
you said to Titokuro, so the Northern Mari electorate. So
then you know, you kind of go, well, maybe that's
not a bad thing, and maybe we could do that

(57:35):
in all our parties rather than having party lists, maybe
we need more independent MPs who stand for their electorate
and get into parliament. So you're seeing this split too,
So I think it's really interesting.

Speaker 22 (57:48):
If Mario Mino pulls this off, and remember in New
Zealand it's highly unusual to come in as an independent MP,
she has very strong support in t Taitoko could in
my view, she could take it out. I think what
the current leaders of to Party Maori have struggled to
do is what Dame tari Anaturia and.

Speaker 3 (58:10):
Peter Sharples did.

Speaker 22 (58:12):
They understood that being in parliament is about using that
machinery to create a legacy and really drive for change.
They were conviction politicians and what you saw with the
likes of Farno Order they were a huge policy win
for to Party Maori and they were probably focused in

(58:33):
the place that a lot of their voters felt was
most valuable. These leaders have continued to be activists and
they are not, in my view, interested in using the
machinery of government for gain.

Speaker 21 (58:46):
And the other thing we've got Trisha's is you know
you cannot dismiss the Marii factor in New Zealand first,
although interestingly, you know, a lot of the sort of
party our elite and Wellington would like to see the
likes of Winston Peters and Shane Jones and even David
c or As in authentic Marty voices. Well, I think
what you're also seeing there is another alternative for Marty voters,

(59:06):
which is regional development jobs. And they're all nationalists, you know,
it's all kind of nation stuff as well. So you
know there's an anti immigration strand through that too, but
not nearly as badly as it was in New Zealand
first in the nineties. So Mary has got a lot
of choices now and I think that's a really positive thing.

Speaker 3 (59:25):
All right, we'll take a break, might come back actually
and talk about that stuff with the populism in New Zealand. First,
it's call to two.

Speaker 5 (59:30):
The Huddle with New Zealand.

Speaker 1 (59:32):
Southerby's International Realty, a name you can trust locally and globally.

Speaker 3 (59:36):
We write you back with the Huddle, Joseph A. Gani
and Tricius and Josie. Do you think that Winston Peter's well,
to what extent do you think Winston Peters will benefit
from the right wing populism that's sweeping Australia and the
UK at the moment.

Speaker 21 (59:47):
I don't think the situations are the same. I know
that there's a you know, we just talked about it,
an anti immigration strand in New Zealand first at the moment,
But it's nothing like New Zealand first rhetoric in in
the nineties, where it was a lot more about anti immigration.
And I don't I mean, most people look at it
and they look at Shane Jones and they think, I
don't really think you believe in this anti immigration stuff.

(01:00:09):
So yes, they do have that popular strand of economically
quite left wing economically talking about you know, government intervening
to the market to create manufacturing, regional developments and so on,
and then quite conservatives socially. But I would say that's
actually quite a mainstream center right view. Really, I don't

(01:00:31):
think we've got the same populism. And if you look
at the UK and Australia just this weekend, you know,
those elections aren't earthquakes, they're more like aftershocks. So they're
telling you that those populations, particularly in the UK where
immigration and refugee crisis has been a big issue, and
you can date that back to twenty ten and Syria

(01:00:54):
where you suddenly had this influx of refugees into Europe.
So that's a very particular situation. And I do think,
you know, when when you've got the mainstream parties dresting,
that's the only risk I would see here. We've got
national and labor both kind of you know, a bit
bla when mainstream parties dressed popular still the void. But

(01:01:15):
I don't think we're seeing that yet here. But it's
a wake up call of those mainstream parties.

Speaker 23 (01:01:20):
To do more.

Speaker 3 (01:01:21):
Should we just call it out for what it is, Trish,
which is what is going on with one nation is
anti Muslim. What's going on with reform is in part
anti Muslim, and we don't have those tensions here in
this country to the extent that they do, so it
just will not work here.

Speaker 22 (01:01:35):
I agree with that. I mean, that's certainly what Faraj
and Senator Hanson have been, you know, fomenting, haven't they.
They have really gone after those populations as a way
to lift their message. I would say the way i'd
phrase this, I would say that it is anti incumbent

(01:01:58):
populism with a hard right edge. So voters in those
countries haven't suddenly woken up and suddenly been ideological and gone, oh,
we're all right wingers now. What they are grumping about,
and Josie just alluded to it, they are grumpy with
the mainstream parties who just don't seem to be able
to get on and fix what's making voters grumpy. And importantly,

(01:02:23):
voters keep waking up every morning and going, my life
is not materially better and you've promised me it will be,
So they are punishing them.

Speaker 3 (01:02:31):
Grumpiness exists here, doesn't it.

Speaker 22 (01:02:34):
So that's very much that very much does.

Speaker 21 (01:02:38):
Yeah, the risk here is not so much the sort
of anti Muslim anti immigration thing. The risk is exactly
what you said, Trash, is that if you look back
at the Brexit vote in the UK, it wasn't just
about immigration. It was also about a cry for a
better economic model, a sort of anti globalization and a
sort of nation state flag waving. Really, where you go,

(01:03:01):
my community is broken. I don't you know. We don't
have the same things that pull us together, like going
to church or the sports club. I don't have a
sense of place. All of that that lack of delivery
is going to really could exacerbate a sort of populous
reaction in New Zealand, and.

Speaker 22 (01:03:19):
I think that's where, yeah, that's where Winston Raymond Peters
is focusing his energies. As you've said on the show
here that we've had these headline policies around big industries
that are simply nuts and won't work and in fact
will cause higher prices. But alfran O'Sullivan actually did a

(01:03:40):
really great column. I think it was not this weekend,
the one before last. She actually pointed out though the
problem for national is that those get cut through, and
she really spoke to this that it's it's about reflecting
the anger and the frustration and the and the you know,
the the empty wallet at the end of the week
that New Zealand and families are facing and that's where

(01:04:02):
Winston is winning up against National and Labor.

Speaker 3 (01:04:05):
I agree with you. Hey, thanks ladies, both of you
really appreciate it. Tris, Jason and Jose Biguanny our huddle
this evening, seven away from six, it's the.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
Heather Duper c Allen Drive Full Show podcast on my
Art Radio powered by News Talk ZBI.

Speaker 3 (01:04:20):
Shane Solely is going to be sortly because obviously one
of the questions we'd like to have answered is what
do the markets do when they heard that Donald Trump
wasn't happy with Iran's counterproposal. Shane will talk us through it,
and Nichola Willis is going to be other shortly and
I will get you the answer on the Origin air
thing now. Split Ends last night Tris, as Trish was
in here before, she was just absolutely fair fizzling about it.
She went down to see Splitdeens in christ Church. Split

(01:04:43):
Ends was on my bucket list of things to do,
so I was my son came down with a fever
on Saturday night and on Saturday night, really on Friday,
but really it was quite bad on Saturday, and I
was like, please, dear God, don't be sick on Sunday,
little mate, because I have waited since I was about
seventeen year old to see this band get together, and
I thank god he got better anyway, So I went

(01:05:04):
along to the concert. There's such a weird band when
you think, like all the years that we've had since
they broke up, it's kind of made me forget how
weird they actually work. As they came out last night
on stage in this weird little like orange tent that
they had sewed for themselves to get like why go,
why all the pilava? But they climb in their little
tent and then they walk out on the stage and

(01:05:24):
they rip the tent off and there they are in
their weird little suits. And then Nold Nol with his
crazy hair, had his spoons out again. Who was doing
the weird spoons thing, Neil. At one point tim Fin
started doing his weird do you remember he used to
do that thing with his arms. We had danced with
them in like a windmill. He did that as well.
She just have a weird and you forget how how
circus like some of their music is like my mistake,

(01:05:45):
you know. Anyway, what I had never appreciated until last
night though watching them play, was how fundamental Eddie Rainer
is to that band, because we all get a bit
blindsided by the Finns as they go on to success
later on, but they are actually not the part of
the band that they're not the most important part of

(01:06:05):
the band. Eddie rain is the most important part of
the band, because if you actually watch the band play
the music, then you see how all of his little
keyboard and piano bits are all the good bits in
the songs, and how he's clearly written all the awesome songs,
and how if you're gonna get a drink, definitely do
it during one of Neil Finn's songs like I Got You,
which sucks, what have you got?

Speaker 8 (01:06:23):
Ants?

Speaker 3 (01:06:25):
Like listen to that piano anyway. To the crowd, though,
what the hell happened? Nobody got up and danced until
six months in a leaky vote and Ice read at
the very end, everybody was sat there, politely clapping like
it was Japan. I had to like, I had to

(01:06:45):
seek dance because I didn't want to block the view
of the people behind me, and it was not what
I wanted. I wanted us all up and honing it anyway.
Nichola willis next.

Speaker 1 (01:07:09):
Keeping track of where the money is flowing. The Business
Hour with Heather duper celt and MAS Insurance and Investments.
Your future is in good hands u Storp ZB.

Speaker 3 (01:07:21):
Evening Coming up in the next hour, Shane Soley will
talk us through how the markets reacted to Trump declining
Iran's deal, and energy sector economists will explain whether the
Greens plan to cap the power prices will solve the
electricity problem we actually have. And then Gavin Gray is
with US out of the UK on the surge of
reform at seven past six, and Nichola Willis Finance Ministers
with US high Nikola, Hi, Heather, so, is this year

(01:07:42):
the last year of fees free?

Speaker 5 (01:07:44):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (01:07:46):
Why'd you change your mind on it?

Speaker 24 (01:07:48):
Well, Heather, as my grandmother always said, if at first
you don't succeed, try try and try again. Success is
the reward for the persistent. And while at first went
to Peter's in New Zealand first could not be persuaded
to drop their coalition commitment, Ultimately wisdom prevailed and those
are dollars that are best invested and the things that

(01:08:11):
New Zealanders really need and want, not a failed policy
that didn't achieve any of the goals it set out
to achieve.

Speaker 3 (01:08:18):
Okay, so are you saying that you have for the
last two and a half years been trying to convince
them and you've finally been able.

Speaker 24 (01:08:22):
To Well, you'll remember you interviewed me and said, well,
why don't you go and talk to Winston about that?
And I did, and at first I wasn't successful, but
we continued that conversation on and Winston like me, like
you can see that New Zealand has been in deficit
since twenty nineteen. We're carrying a heck a lot of debt.

(01:08:44):
We've got some real priorities for our budget in terms
of the health system, the education we want to give
our young kids, the defense system that we want to
build out, the infrastructure we want to build, and all
of those things have a better call on money than
a scheme that hasn't left tertiary education, hasn't served the
most underprivilege, and has altogether failed.

Speaker 3 (01:09:04):
Okay, how much money are we so was it? Did
you actually work out how much it costs three fifty
million year?

Speaker 24 (01:09:10):
So we originally made a saving in our first budget
by shifting it from the first year to the final year,
and the savings from getting rid of it altogether will
add up to around a billion dollars over the next
four years, so.

Speaker 3 (01:09:22):
About two fifty million year. And then is that what
you're pocketing or are you from that then taking money
and paying for the trades training.

Speaker 24 (01:09:29):
And the way we budget is that we have core
priorities for New Zealanders, which include the fact we've got
an aging population with growing health needs, we've got kids
who need to be educated. So all of our savings
and reprioritization help support those things. And yes, there will
be a specific budget announcement about us prioritizing trades training,

(01:09:52):
which actually is a really really fruitful path that we
want to see more young people going down that leads
to fantastic jobs.

Speaker 3 (01:10:01):
When you've been run into the same thing, skill shortages,
same trouble, we're how's it going to do the trades
training anyway? And throwing money at it is not going
to lift enrollments.

Speaker 24 (01:10:09):
Heather, I'm not going to be falling into the same
trap that Winston did by pre announcing a budget announcement.
But I'm looking forward to making an announcement about what
we're going to do.

Speaker 3 (01:10:18):
Right trade now. One of the things out of the
OECD report that came out last last week was the
suggestion that what we should do is run a government
run form of generation electricity generation right and then flood
the market to bring the prices down.

Speaker 24 (01:10:31):
Would we consider that, Well, we already, of course have
a heavy, significant taxpayer investment in the electricity market with
our shares of the mixed ownership model generation company. So
we already have that investment, and your recall, I've already
pre announced that we're apping our equity stake and Genesis
Energy to ensure that they can provide the firming coal

(01:10:53):
and gas capacity needed when the hydro lakes are running
low and the sum's not shining and the wind's not blowing.
So the government is playing a role in the market already.

Speaker 3 (01:11:03):
Okay, So a separate because this is an idea that
is starting to float around, a separate idea that's perhaps
run by transpower, that can flood the market to bring
down wholesale prices when they're too high. You're not going
to do that.

Speaker 24 (01:11:14):
Well, what there is a lot of discussion about and
in fact, there is an ongoing work program is ensuring
that there's what's called a firming market, So that is
making sure that if you come and you build a
wind farm, you can be guaranteed to buy affordable contract
for firming electricity, so you can say to your customer,
it doesn't matter if the sun's not shining, I'll still

(01:11:34):
be able to provide you electricity come whatever weather may come.
And making sure that that market operates that those firming
contracts can be purchased by the existing gent tailors is
something that we are continuing the work.

Speaker 3 (01:11:47):
The other idea is that you force the gentailors to
drop the dividends they pay you.

Speaker 24 (01:11:51):
Would you consider that, well, that's cutting off your nose
despite your face, because then the question becomes, how are
you going to make sure you've got the funding for
health and education that every one of those dollars goes towards.
Right now, now, that shouldn't be that the gentailers are
making excessive profits, and there is clear regulation in place

(01:12:12):
to do that, and we do want to see the
market being properly competitive. But if you break down the
increases in electricity prices in recent times, the major driver
has been the cost of the extra transmission lines and
towers being put in.

Speaker 3 (01:12:27):
When you talk about superannuation changes, are you talking about
lifting the pension age or doing means testing.

Speaker 7 (01:12:33):
Well?

Speaker 24 (01:12:33):
We have to make it more affordable because it is
a growing share of everyone's tax dollar. We've gone from
a situation where there were seven workers for every superinuitant
to four workers.

Speaker 3 (01:12:46):
What are you talking about lifting or means testing well?

Speaker 24 (01:12:49):
We will present a policy at the election that is
all about making sure superannuation is sustainable, that it is affordable,
and that people can be sure about what they're entitlments
are to the future.

Speaker 3 (01:13:02):
It won't happen because the problem here is that New
Zealand first isn't going to say yes and help you.
And then if you reach across the aisle to labor,
they're not going to say yes either.

Speaker 24 (01:13:09):
Unless the beginning of this let's go back to the
beginning of this interview, I persuaded Winston Peters on fees free.
You won't now.

Speaker 3 (01:13:19):
Even his serious knowledge, but this is his core vote.
It's the oldies. He's not going to touch the pension.

Speaker 24 (01:13:25):
Actually, give Winston Peters some credit. He came into New
Zealand politics wanting to make this country better for all
in a situation in which our superannuation bill becomes so
unaffordable that taxes on every working person need to be
increased dramatically to pay for it, where dollars are robbed

(01:13:46):
from our cree the logic came he's.

Speaker 3 (01:13:48):
Been consistent on the pension all of this.

Speaker 24 (01:13:50):
Well I've been I have been successful in convincing him
of my logic in the past. And as my grandmother said,
is the quoted to you at the beginning, But first
you don't succeed, try try and try well.

Speaker 3 (01:14:02):
Hoping for Winston Peters to get us out of structural deficit,
I think on that is probably be hoping a bit
too much. Listen, are you making any decisions or any
announcements about banks and the budget?

Speaker 24 (01:14:11):
Well, I don't make my budget announcements on the Heatherdoo
plus Allen Show. But I have to say, you did
a magnificent job of Heather in Winston last week, so
I can see why you're giving it a try again tonight.
No banking Levy, I'm not going to tell you about
what's in the budget or what's not in the budget,
because when I start the rule and rule out game.

Speaker 3 (01:14:30):
It never means okay, Niicola, thank you you got away
with that on because you made me feel so wonderful
about myself. Nichola Willis Finance Minister. Uh yeah, there's more
drama in the Marty Party should run. Yeah, I'll rain
you through it. Well, we've got a quick minute second.
MP has told Stuff that they're thinking about leaving. It's
or any kaipitter they are. Stuff asked her if she

(01:14:51):
would stay with the Marti Party or if she would
follow Maria Mental Cup of king E's lead, and she said,
and I quote, I am still considering options. So as
a result of that, our newsroom got in touch with
Ordiny kaypit As people and they told us that that
story is crap and they want a correction. But I
will quote her again for you, I am still considering options.
Draw your own conclusions. Quarter past six.

Speaker 1 (01:15:13):
It's the Head Duper Celan Drive Full Show podcast on
my Heart Radio powered by news dog Zebbi.

Speaker 3 (01:15:21):
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Speaker 5 (01:16:07):
Heather do for see give you the.

Speaker 3 (01:16:09):
Numbers in is itex fifty up zero point two seven
percent today, a six fifty down zero point six eight
percent so far today a barrel of Brent crude oil
is now costing one hundred and five US dollars. That's
up four percent just today. One New Zealand dollar is
worth fifty nine US cents eighty two. Izzie cents fifty
one eurosents forty four UK pence in ninety three en.
It's nineteen past six and Shane Sally Harbor Acid Management

(01:16:30):
is with us Alo. Shane. Hey here, well, I can
see how the price of oil reacted to the no
deal announcement.

Speaker 7 (01:16:37):
Yeah, look, we're getting used to this sort of no
warn opiece Middle East conflict. But yeah, we did see
the oil prices traded down late last week. Has had
bond yields on the basis that we were coming into
potential for a piece office. So this latest rejection by
mister Trump, certainly the market's taking a little bit negatively.
In Asia, pack markets down except for China, which is
actually up on anticipation of this becauseitive summit that's coming

(01:17:01):
up between China and US. Locally, as you said, our
sheer market actually had a bit of a balance, but
it actually traded lower all day probably the call out
there was in for to all up to an all
time high of fifteen dollars seventy three, quite stunning that
stock with stitt or ten bucks probably six months ago.
Futures US futures what the markets are indicating, and they'll

(01:17:21):
be down slightly tonight. But I will let's just wait
and see on that one.

Speaker 3 (01:17:25):
Now, I see Pacific Edges announced to capital raise today.
What are they going to use the money for.

Speaker 7 (01:17:29):
Yeah, apecific Edge, it's cancer detection monitoring, particular prostate cancers.
They've raised twenty four million dollars seventeen since per year.
That's about two percent below where it closed on Friday.
The money is being used to get the business ready
to get US Medicare coverage. Again, US Medicaire is obvious
a government insurance package, and so they've been working to

(01:17:51):
get reimbursement for its tests for the doctor and use
their test and government pays for the test. So that's
been a big deal. They're getting closer to getting that
approved and if they do then that they're expecting something
before September. So yeah, they've raised some capital to get
their business ready to go in terms of sales team
and production and so forth.

Speaker 3 (01:18:10):
How did the market react, by the way, to rocket
Lab last week?

Speaker 7 (01:18:14):
Yeah, so we were priced blasted off. It was up
thirty four percent on Friday to one hundred and five
dollars US or slightly more of that. And I think
there's a few things behind that. The beat revenue expectations.
There are revenues up sixty percent plus year a year.
But what they talked about is they've got a two
point two billion dollar pipeline of potential launches to go.
They've guided to revenue for the second quarter between two

(01:18:37):
hundred and twenty five million US to two forty in US.
That's well, I bove the expectations of two in a
mill and they sign a massive contract. They obviously can't
tell us who it is, but it's the biggest ever
in so Peter Beck, he's pretty abiliant on the analyst call.
Demand signal was clear, and he's talking about their relentless
launch process they're going through to meet that requirement. So yeah,

(01:18:59):
pretty positive from the Rocket lad team.

Speaker 3 (01:19:01):
Yeah good Shane, thank you very much, appreciate it. Shane Soley,
Harbor Asset Management, six twenty one.

Speaker 1 (01:19:07):
Approaching the numbers and getting the results. It's Heather duper
c Allen on the Business Hour with Maths, Insurance and Investments,
Your futures in good hands, used talks that'd be may have.

Speaker 3 (01:19:19):
It's something of an answer for you on the Origin
Air thing, because I don't know if you've been following it.
It seems something of a conundrum. So the Origin Air
story this is the Westport Link, is that in New
Zealand flew the Westport to Wellington route right and it
didn't work. So they sold it, and I think it
was Sound Air bought it and they tried it and
it didn't work. And so in the end Origin Air
bought it and they flew it and it didn't work.

(01:19:40):
So they were announcing they were going to shut it.
But then whoopsie a couple of weeks ago, last week
whenever it was, they suddenly managed to find money from
West Development West Coast and quote the government to keep
it going for another month. So we've been asking, you know,
whoever we could from the government, how much money have
we given them? How much? Why? Why if this thing
hasn't worked for three airlines not going to work? Well. Finally,

(01:20:01):
so we finally got in touch with Nichola Willis's office
and they said, honestly, guys, they got in touch with
James Meagher's office for us, and it turns out it
might just have been misreported. It's not funding from Development
West Coast and the Government. It's funding from Development West
Coast and local government by the looks of things. However,
having said that, it does sound like James Megha is

(01:20:23):
considering he's open to the idea of pumping some more
government cash in there, and I look forward to having
that debate with him, because that would be a stupid idea,
wouldn't it when the country's broke. Hither The problem with
the market, the electricity market is that it pays the
price of the last mega watt that is generated. That
a hangover from the Bradford days when the market was
set up. They need to fix that, mark. I agree.
The more I look into it, the more I'm starting

(01:20:45):
to understand that's the problem. So when Nicholas talking about
giving Genesis whoever some money to have more coal and
gas firming, it doesn't solve the problem. It does not
solve the problem because if we're burning more gas, we're
all paying all coal, we're all coal's most expensive, we're
all paying coal prime. What you need is some other
way of like flooding really cheap electricity in so everything,
so you don't need to burn the coal and the gas. Anyway,

(01:21:07):
We'll see what happens. By the way, I have got
like probably about four or five different stories about different green.
MP's from around the world being weird, and we're gonna
do that. We're just gonna have a little green extravaganza
in about ten minutes time. Stand by six twenty six.

Speaker 5 (01:21:24):
There's no business like show business. What the time?

Speaker 3 (01:21:30):
I haven't thought about her for a while. Of here
Susan Boyle. She's the opera singer who went viral on
Britain's Got Talent back in the day. And she went
viral because people which just amazed that someone so plain
could sing so beautifully. So you're now wondering, well, why
we're talking about her again. Well, Simon cow he's now
apologized for the way that he acted during her audition.
If you watch it back, the judges are quite literally

(01:21:51):
laughing in Susan's face as they ask her how old
she is and scoff at her saying she wants to
be a professional singer. Simon is now embarrassed about it,
he sinks, He says, he thinks actually the judges got
off lightly in the edit.

Speaker 25 (01:22:04):
I think we were even worse than that, and they went,
you look awful. I said, we are awful, and of
course I had the ability to cut all that stuff out,
but it was.

Speaker 5 (01:22:16):
A bit of a wake up call.

Speaker 25 (01:22:17):
Wow, you can't judge a book by its cover.

Speaker 5 (01:22:19):
We do look disgusting.

Speaker 3 (01:22:21):
Yeah, And if it seems like a bit of good
fun and it's all fine, well, Susan doesn't think so.
She recently told the Irish Daily Mirror the audition made
her feel like a freak show, but overall, she says,
the positives that have come from the experience outweigh the negatives.
Good attitude, Eh, right, Green's extravaganza next, whether.

Speaker 1 (01:22:46):
It's macro micro or just plain economics, it's all on
the business hour with header duper CLA and mas insurance
and investments, your futures in good hands, used talks envy.

Speaker 3 (01:23:01):
Start like that Gray is going to be a US
and ten minutes because of course it's all going down
for Keir Starman. And if that man still has his
job by the end of the year, I mean it
all starts now, but if he still has his job
at the end of the year, it'll be quite the surprise.
Jesse Mulligan, who writes for Viva for The Herald, has
asked staff hospitality staff what is the greatest irritation to them, Like,

(01:23:25):
what is the single thing that customers do. That is
the most irritating and you'll never guess it. There is
not a chance that you will guess it unless you've
read his article in the Herald. Stand by, I'm going
to talk to you about it. It's kind of it's
kind of weird. Actually, twenty four away from seven now,
the Green Party, as we've discussed on the show, the
Green Party has written to government ministers urging them to
intervene in the electricity market before winter. They want ministers

(01:23:47):
to cap the increase to household power bills, demand that
Gen Taylors scale up their hardship programs and also give
out low and then themselves as the government, give out
low interest loans so houses can to install solar. Jeff
Bertram is an end the economist who's been working on
getting power prices down since the nineteen eighties, and he's
with us. Hi Jeff, Hi, Mate, if you've been working
at it since the nineteen eighties, do you reckon? This

(01:24:09):
is your year?

Speaker 6 (01:24:09):
It's going to work, all right.

Speaker 23 (01:24:12):
So it's about time, and with an election coming up,
it's chance for all the political parties to think up
something sensible and effective to bring prices down. And make
it affordable for households. It really is time that we
dealt to the exercise of monopoly power by the Gen
Taylor's Transpower, the lines companies, the whole bunch of them.

(01:24:33):
And the difficulty is that, firstly, when we changed all
the electricity into a moll market system, we did not
put in place the regulatory restraints that you would expect
to prevent monopoly from breaking out, and Parliament has subsequently
left the government actually was not that many things that

(01:24:54):
it's allowed to do to drive prices down unless the
government gets a spine and takes actions such as putting
a windfall tax on the gent tailors when they profit
here from dry years, taking the carbon tax off hydroelectricity.
I mean there's about a billion dollars a year that
consumers are paying in carbon tax on their electricity, which

(01:25:17):
is nut going to the gentiles, not to the government.
That could all be rebate, you know, we can all
be clawed back and rebated through the customers. There's tons
of stuff that can be done, but it's actually it's
quite hard to spot where those openings are. And the
Greens are trying very hard, and good on them for

(01:25:37):
trying to think up constructive things that government can do
right away in order to get a handle on the problem.

Speaker 3 (01:25:44):
Okay, let's look at the greens. Is there anything in
what they've announced all day that actually strikes you as
being worthwhile to explore?

Speaker 23 (01:25:51):
Yes, a lot of things are. The first thing that
they've suggested is that the government was fifty one percent
shareholder and the end the gentailors that they be leaning
on the boards of those companies to get prices down
to the cap the rate at which they increase prices,
but ideally bring them down to limit the amount of
dividends that they pay out.

Speaker 3 (01:26:11):
But we're not going to do it. I mean, Nikola
Willis was on the show half an hour ago telling
us they're not going to do it because they need
the money themselves, because the country's broke.

Speaker 2 (01:26:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 23 (01:26:19):
Well, let's face it. I mean a lot of the
profiteering that's going on from the electricity, which is driving
poorer households to the war is actually, you know, part
of the government's tax take, which is keeping Nicola Willis's
budget and balance. Let's non mense words about this. In
so far as you've got a predatory electricity industry squeezing

(01:26:40):
people's budgets the House that the government is part of
the predation.

Speaker 3 (01:26:45):
Following to take it to its logical conclusion, then does
this government actually want to drop prices?

Speaker 23 (01:26:51):
No, the whole point about the high prices and high
profits is that is about a billion dollars a year
going into the government's coffers and without which Nichola Willis
would be struggling with her coming upcoming budget. So she's
not going to be on side with doing the things
that the Greens would like her to do as a
shareholding minister. I mean they would like her to pull

(01:27:12):
pull the reins a bit and check the extent which
the government's owner that the government owned or the mixed
ownership models which the government has a big share are
able to exercise their market powder squeeze consumers. Consumers obviously
would like Nikola Willis to get in there and sort
out the pricing issues, and I agree with them. I

(01:27:37):
think that it's been a great petty that mix under
the mixed ownership model, the government's become sort of as
Dixid to the diberdyns and profit tax is coming into
electricity and we need to break that addiction.

Speaker 3 (01:27:51):
So tell me, tell me off the two things. I'm
going to give you a couple of ideas and you
tell me which one you like the most. Right, the
OECD has suggested that what we need to do. This
isn't the report that came out last week, that we
need to have extra generation like firming generation that goes
in there and I'm presuming floods the market. The second
idea is Winston Peter's idea, which they're going to campaign
on this year, which is breaking up of the gent tailors.

(01:28:11):
Which of the two do you prefer?

Speaker 23 (01:28:14):
Well? I like the breaking up of the gentailors burning
as part of a wider package. And I think the OECD,
coming from outside it doesn't fully understand how the UCUM
electricity system operates and what we're the competitive pressure is
coming from. Now. The competition for the electricity market is
not among the gent tailors or within the people playing
in the wholesale market. The big competition is outside the market.

(01:28:37):
It's rooftop solar. It's farmers putting solar arrays out in
their fields and putting up little wind farms. It's the
prospects for big offshore wind farms may be owned by
completing independent parties and coming into the market from the outside,
and that's the real competition that could break the power
of the current lot of gent Taylors and transpower. Difficult.

(01:28:59):
The difficult is that we've got a market to share
up that sort of blocks at out.

Speaker 3 (01:29:03):
Yeah, but you know what you can do it though,
through the power of the government, can't you. Government can
act as that person if it wanted to, or that
independent party, but it probably doesn't want to. As you say, Jeff,
good to talk to you, Jeff Bertram, energy economist, nineteen
away from seven, Heather, do for see Allen's hoping it
is the year. I am sick of this nonsense, Heather
as a chef. Stupid dietaries are the most no alan
that is not the most annoying thing. Wait, I will

(01:29:24):
tell you shortly. Okay, So the first thing that's this
is Green's extravaganza, Green stupidity.

Speaker 5 (01:29:30):
Here we go.

Speaker 3 (01:29:31):
The first thing that stupid is the thing that I
mentioned earlier, which is when Chloe said before that the
government should allow people not to pay their bills and
not get disconnected, and then when she was asked, well,
how many bills are too many bills? At which point
somebody should be disconnected. She said, Oh, I don't want
to deal with hypotheticals that's dumb, because I will absolutely
gain that. I'll just stop paying my bills. I'm like, no,
I'm not going to get disconnected. It's fine. Greens in

(01:29:52):
the UK are as looney as the Greens in New Zealand.
So one who has just I've got four examples. Chloe
is the first. Here's your second. There is a Green
MP who's just been elected to the Scottish Parliament. This
Green MP has been busted for a social media post
from twenty twenty two in which she wished death on
the late Queen, who was still alive. She posted, I
cannot wait till big Lizard Lizzie kicks the bucket, not

(01:30:14):
because she's dead, but because of the absolute meltdowner will
cause the British consciousness. She elected on Friday into Scotland's
Parliament has now deleted the message for obvious reasons. Third
example the leader of the Greens in the UK, Zach Polanski.
Now this one is quite Zach is quite fun. Zach
has a lot of controversies and a lot of things
that he does that is really dumb. Here's his latest one,

(01:30:35):
because he's got an epic CV. I don't know if
you're aware of it. Weird weird CV. He has now
been busted for telling a porky He claimed that he
worked at the Ministry of Justice while he was running
for office. He didn't. He was actually an actor who
was hired for role playing scenarios as part of the
interview process for would be judges. So basically, when they
think are you going to be you're gonna be a
decent judge, let's get you in. You'd see if you're
going to be a judge. Then they get the actors in.

(01:30:56):
One has to play the policeman and one has to
play the whatever, the bad guy. I want us to
play the prosecutor. That's what Zach was doing. He was
acting in a courtroom. But then he said he was
working at the Ministry of Justice, which he wasn't. And
I rounded off with example number four. Our very own
Torri Fanno Tory has today been complaining to the White
Tonguey Tribunal about the way that our very own Mike

(01:31:19):
Hosking and Sean Plunkett treated her because Mike called her
a poster child for ineptitude, and Sean Plunkett called her fat,
and she says that these are examples of the sustained racist,
misogynistic and sexualized abuse during her time in office that
ultimately drove her from politics and out of New Zealand. Now,
the fact that Tory is winging again and pretending that

(01:31:39):
her race and her gender were the problem when she
was mayor, that's not new. She's been doing that for ages.
But taking this to the White Tonguy Tribunal does feel
a bit new and a little bit weird, because you
are welcome to correct me if I'm wrong, but I
thought the White Tonguey Tribunal was set up to investigate
breaches of the Treaty of White Tongey and Mike and
Sean calling her fat and accusing her of a neptitude

(01:32:02):
do not feel like a breach of the Treaty of
White Tonguey. I mean maybe in her life it's right
up there. Maybe she's like, oh, they stole some land,
that the colonial government stole some land and shorn like
it called me fat, same same breach of the Treaty
of White Tangy. But for the rest of us not,
In which case, what is that? Why? Why? Why is
the White Tugy Tribunal listening to this? So many questions,

(01:32:25):
so many examples of Green's being weird.

Speaker 1 (01:32:27):
Quarter two, everything from SMEs to the big corporates, the
Business Hour with Heather Dupericy, Allen and Ma's insurance and investments,
Your futures in good hands, news talks.

Speaker 5 (01:32:39):
That'd be right.

Speaker 3 (01:32:40):
Let's get immediately to what's been going on in the UK.
It's thirteen away from seven and Gavin Gray are UK
correspondents with us. Hello, Gavin, Hi? They have all right?
So does Keir Starmer thinks that he can, like seriously,
does he think he can fix it with the reset speech?

Speaker 21 (01:32:53):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (01:32:54):
I think he thinks he can.

Speaker 20 (01:32:55):
With you to hear what he's got to say in
a few hours time from now, but the storm clouds
and most definitely over his head. More than thirty of
his own MPs have said they would support a replacement
for him. Now, I mean that's a significant number. And
we also have a sort of fairly unknown Bagpencher from

(01:33:16):
London saying if nobody else stands, I'm going to stand.
What of course she's hoping, Catherine West is that she
doesn't want to be the party leader, but she wants
to initiate a contest and once one person is in,
they tend to pile in afterwards. Now she has modified
that threat slightly, saying if she's not impressed by Secure
Starmer's speech today, the reset speech. So ultimately this is

(01:33:38):
probably going to be the toughest speech he's given, the
most important speech as Premier to remain as Premier at
the UK. We're hearing that at the heart of it
will be an ambush to put Britain at the heart
of Europe by seeking closer ties with the EU, a
move that he said will define his government and strengthen
the UK's economy, trade and defense. Now that'll really frustrate

(01:34:00):
lots of Brexit voting people, Brexit voting labor supporters as well,
But what about their MPs. They'll be desperate to keep
their job. So we'll wait to see how that goes down.
I have to say, I think most people think they're
more worried about what's happening in the UK than trying
and to form links with another group of nations. But
we will see how it.

Speaker 3 (01:34:20):
Goes downven I mean, this does feel just so misguided
from him. First of all it is. It does feel
like he's addressing the wrong problem. But then also, isn't
it past the point of no return for him? I mean,
if you listen to what is being reported, people are
saying they don't want to vote for labor because they
hate Keir Starmer so much. A speech is not going
to change that sentiment, is it.

Speaker 5 (01:34:40):
No?

Speaker 20 (01:34:41):
I wouldn't have thought so. But you know, at the
same time, people do vote, as it were, with their wallets,
with their pockets, and we know what money they're getting into.
But none of this can happen quickly, and that's what
his problem is. He also still talks and acts like
a lawyer, and many people just simply don't find them appealing.

Speaker 3 (01:35:00):
Yeah, now on reform, I mean, reformers obviously had a
fantastic we can but they are at risk now, aren't they.
Because what they are is they are a kind of
pro There's been a protest vote. It's very different when
you are now running councils and you have to be
responsible for the decisions you make. Is every chance that
they do not maintain this level of popularity? What do
you think?

Speaker 20 (01:35:21):
Yes, that is a very very real possibility, as it
always is. With these mid term tests. And incidentally, one
of their candidates, who were successful in one local election,
has now been immediately suspended within thirty six hours of
winning because of something said on social media a couple

(01:35:42):
of years back, and his bosses or those in the
party immediately admitted that was a failure of checking and
background checks on him. So there will be problems for
reform in the future. But here's another thought and another
way of looking at it. So many people will have
been embarrassed to admit that they were going to vote reform.

Speaker 5 (01:36:01):
Now that reform's.

Speaker 20 (01:36:02):
Done very well, those people might turn around and go, oh, well,
actually if so many people and they are going to
join them sort of thing, because they really do stand
a chance. So I think that cuts both ways.

Speaker 3 (01:36:11):
That's a very interesting point that you make there, Gavin,
Thank you mate, look after yourself. Gavin Gray, UK Correspondent.
Remember how last week we were talking about how crazy
it is that people just are so emboldened to just
publicly hate on Jewish people. I've got another example for you.
This is out of Australia right Remember Australia right now
has this inquiry that's going on into anti Semitism they've

(01:36:33):
just had Jewish people on Bondi Beach shot and killed.
So you would think that of all places in the world,
Australia would pull its head and no. A woman has
just been outed in the papers for an anti Jewish
tirade and a netball game for kids. So her kids
team were playing Maccabee the Jewish netball club. The Jewish
netball club, by the way, is not completely made up

(01:36:55):
of Jewish kids. It's all kinds of kids. It's just
that it's the Jewish run one. Anyway. She apparently tells
them on the sidelines if the Jews and then said
that Jewish people should have been eradicated. A man walked
past her heard her, asked her what she'd said. She
repeated the phrase, but then people from her club other
parents came over and defended her. One man was recorded

(01:37:16):
saying that there's a reason why this happens to you people.
Every weekend. You're always playing the victim, where all families,
Australian families just watching our kids plan, having a good
time and enjoy the weekend. It's disgusting that woman has
been charged as she should be eight away from seven.

Speaker 1 (01:37:33):
It's the heather top see allan Drive full show podcast
on iHeartRadio powered by newstalk ZEBBI.

Speaker 3 (01:37:42):
All right, here we go. What is the most irritating
thing that we do in restaurants as customers? That rarely
gets the goat of the hospitality staff. If you thought,
I would have thought, not showing up would be right
up there as the top thing. It's not the top thing.
Being rude and making them treating them like your servants

(01:38:05):
also not the top thing. Making up allergies also not
the top thing, although I don't know how they know
that you're making up the allergies because some people's allergies
are pretty wild. It's helping stack the plates. Apparently that
is the most irritating thing. This is what Jesse Mulligan's written.
This one surprised me, but it was the most popular response.
I have a technique, says a hospitality worker, and an
order of stacking, and it becomes impossible to carry out

(01:38:28):
once you have made a crooked stack of plates. Same
goes for trying to hand me things. As I clear,
I have my own system. I do that so if
but especially have you noticed this sometimes when you go
to a restaurant, they have these incredibly tiny tiny tiny
little tables, like tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny little tables. But
then they also do the thing where it's sharing plates guys.

(01:38:49):
So then you need your plate for your food, their
plate and their plate and their plate because it's four
of you. But then somehow in the available space you
have to fit all the main plates that the food
is coming from. And when the stuff come over, I go,
excuse me, excuse me? Can I give this to you?
And I just start handing them things? Love the thought,
said a worker. But not when it comes to a
Jinger tower. I can't lift. So no, I mean that

(01:39:13):
was surprising to me, was it not you?

Speaker 15 (01:39:15):
And there you go, stop taking your plates, everybody. I
can't helping, Stop helping. Can't stop by Red Hotchilly Peppers
to play us out tonight. The Red Hot Chelly Peppers
have become the latest musical acts to sell their back catalog.
They have sold their entire catalog, all thirteen albums, to
Warner Music Group. They've gotten five hundred and five million
New Zealand dollars for that deal. They're doing it all

(01:39:37):
in the wrong order, didn't they haven't We all learned
from Queen what you do is you get them to
make a nice biopic about you and then license the
catalog to that biopick for loads of money, and then
once that movie is stopped making money, then you sell it.
You know, they shoul They should have done the Red
Hot Chilli Peppers version of Bohemian raapste Oh my.

Speaker 3 (01:39:53):
Goodness, I haven't that you've really thought the throats There
you go. Yep, you are wasted. Jeff Bertram is our
energy famous, you're our music royalties.

Speaker 15 (01:40:01):
A condoms flee you just called me first, think about
how much money be sitting on this is stupid.

Speaker 3 (01:40:06):
Well, just help the next one out, Bieber or whoever,
thank you an see tomorrow. D go right, choel, let's
sit on the pavement and stop right home on know
what the way man kick start to go to TENN.

Speaker 11 (01:40:17):
To rake up sweet talk, but don't intimidate harp.

Speaker 3 (01:40:21):
Can't stop the gods from engineering.

Speaker 15 (01:40:23):
You'll no need for any interfering.

Speaker 5 (01:40:26):
You'll imiting the dictionary. This life is more than ordinary.

Speaker 3 (01:40:31):
Canna get to maybe even three of these coming from
a space to teach you what the bee it is.

Speaker 5 (01:40:36):
Can't stop the spear between They need you.

Speaker 1 (01:40:39):
This life is more than just to read through for
more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive. Listen live to news
talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow the
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