Full Show Podcast: 07 December 2025

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Resident Builder podcast with Peter wolf
Camp from US talks ed by.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Doing up the house, storning the garden, asked Pete for ahead.

Speaker 1 (00:16):
The Resident Builder with Peter wolf Camp Call eight hundred
US talks edb.

Speaker 3 (00:23):
A house is a hole even when it's dark, even
when the grass is overgrown in the.

Speaker 4 (00:31):
Yard, even when the dog is too old to bar,
And when you're sitting at the table trying not to
start house scissor home.

Speaker 5 (00:45):
Even when weave a bend, even when you're there alone, old.

Speaker 4 (01:02):
House a home, even when those goes, even when.

Speaker 3 (01:07):
You got around from the ones you love your most,
scream broken.

Speaker 4 (01:13):
Paints, appeel in front of the.

Speaker 3 (01:17):
Locals, lisbro when they're going and leaving the neighbors, even
when wend, even when you're in there looney.

Speaker 6 (01:53):
Wanting look on to the Risenal Builder. On Sunday, you're
with Peak wolf Camp Risen and Builder and today Sunday
Morning used talk see big. We are talking all things
building and construction, as we always do on US Morning.
So some rough weather I understand, particularly in the Auckland.
I think a little bit of rough weather down south

(02:14):
this week as well. Time for us to think about
how our buildings perform, what we need to do in
terms of repairs and maintenance. And just when we thought
we were getting into that summer months where we could
start thinking about sort of long periods of dry weather,
maybe to start doing some exterior paintings, start thinking about
knocking that deck up before the Christmas season approaches, or

(02:36):
doing some landscaping. It would seem that mother Nature had
some other ideas. But the weather is getting better, is
my understanding, and now there is an opportunity for us
to talk about all things building and construction. So it's
eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the number to call.
If you'd like to talk about building, we can talk
about that, like I say, eight hundred eighty ten eighty.

(02:57):
The text machine is up and running. That's nine two
nine two or zbzb from your mobile phone. And if
you'd like to send me an email, well you're more
than well to do that as well. It's Pete at
newstalksitb dot co dot NZ. Now I'll be completely upfront
and honest with you. I'm not in the studio. In fact,

(03:18):
I'm not even in New Zealand. I happen to be
of all places in Paris right now. So this is
a family holiday that's been planned for some time. We
took off last weekend. That's why Rud thank you very much.
Rud for hosting the show last Sunday filled in for me.
We were transitting through the United States. We flew into London.

(03:43):
We've been staying with some friends and we hopped on
the Eurostar the other day and trained ourselves across to Paris.
So we've had a night in Paris. I've had a
wander around. We went to I quite like flea markets.
To be fair, I won't keep talking about the trip,
but I just let you know what we've been up to.
So we went to one of the flea markets just

(04:04):
on the outskirts of Paris city for a bit of
a mooch around this morning, something that we enjoyed very
much when we were here Shivers. Twenty five years ago,
I had an opportunity to come to France and spend
about three months working on an old French farmhouse for
some people that I knew, and part of our habit

(04:24):
at that time was on a Saturday or a Sunday
morning to go to these muss the flea markets basically
of the brock arts and mooch around and pick up
some little collectibles and that sort of thing. So I
did actually come away from the markets today with a
putty knife. Yes, of all of the things that you
could go to France and purchase, I came away with

(04:45):
a putty knife. But it will be one of those things.
It just had the right amount of flex and a
beautiful handle with a little brass band whether the wood
meets the flexible part. And so I know that when
I'm ashop I will I'll really be enjoying the fact
that I've used something that I picked up in a
flea market a trip to Paris. So I might mention

(05:09):
a few things that we're up to while we're over
this way, and I tell you what. Later on today,
we're going to be talking with Daniels Staunders, Daniel's builder
in christ Church. He's also instrumental in the super home movement,
which over the last couple of days in christ Church
has been running a series of tours so that people

(05:30):
can see examples of what better building looks like. Dan's
going to give us a quick breakdown of what's been
happening in christ Church. Also very exciting to see that.
There is something I've talked about a number of times
on the program when we've looked for solutions for if
you want to build better than the building code, where

(05:51):
do you go?

Speaker 7 (05:51):
Right?

Speaker 6 (05:52):
What's the resource that you can find? And one of
those resources is this essentially crowd sourced bit of gold
in terms of information called the Super Home Movement's Building Guide,
right selection of ideas around better building performance, focused very
much on new builts. Now, some of those same people

(06:13):
have been involved in preparing a guide for renovations and
that's about to be released. So we're going to talk
with Dan Saunders, who's a building christ Church about that
a little bit later on this morning. Also got another
interview that, in fact, if I'm really I recorded before
I left last week with Michael Thornton, who was a

(06:33):
barrister and solicitor. We've had him on the show before
talking about his specialty is construction law, particularly I guess
litigation around defects. Now Michael and I sat down had
a chat about what does this proposed mandatory house warranty
scheme look like for New Zealanders, what's that going to

(06:55):
mean and especially what's it going to mean for builders
because it was announced a little while ago. It would
seem at this stage that we know that there is
basically one insurer that's operating in the market, to the
best of my knowledge right now, who will offer a
housing warranty scheme as will be required by the new legislation.
The only other groups that offer it are the two

(07:17):
sort of carpentry trade associations, user On Certified Builders and
the Master Builders Association. So it would appear at this
stage that if you're a builder and you're licensed, and
you want to be able to offer one of these warranties,
you're either going to have to go to Stanford's and
they may or may not want to ensure you, or

(07:37):
you're going to essentially be forced to join either Master
Builders or Certified Builders. So anyway, I've had a discussion
with Mike about that. We will have that conversation for
you after eight o'clock this morning. The lines are open
and due to the wonders of technology colling to you, Ricky, well,

(07:59):
actually it turns out that I can't, so Isaiah, my producer,
if you could just put Ricky on air, we'll crack
into it. There you go, Ricky, good morning to you
here you are mate, all right, you're not dead in yourself?

Speaker 8 (08:12):
Here you good things? He listen, not put an inquiry.
And in regards of putting windows on, Now, if you're
putting windows on, aren't you mean to follow the code?
If you're doing the work yourself for a few of
the company and to do it, isn't it the correct
way to do it? You followed your code to compliance?
Is that correct?

Speaker 6 (08:30):
Each of the window manufacturers will probably issue you with
a description of how to install the windows correctly. So,
for example, some types of aluminium joinery require a winds
bar on the outside, so a reinforcing bar. There's a
requirement around the fixings. There's details about how you flash
it and so on. So is that what you're asking about.

Speaker 8 (08:54):
I'm getting windows put in or I've head windows put
in and I quier it. In regards of putting the
salt tape on, the salt tape right from the bottom
across the bottoms two footy mil onto, the understanding if
you're taken windows out, even if they are when you're upgrading,
that should be put on as daisy to code as
a correct.

Speaker 6 (09:14):
Yeah, look, to be fair, it's I've always thought it's
a little bit of a gray area. So let's say
you're existing. I mean, the whole point of the sill
tape is to ensure that if any moisture gets around
the edge of the window, that rather than being directed
into the framing, it's able to go. It's it's pushed

(09:35):
away from the building envelope, away from the framing by
the sill tape. But you know, for a long long time,
all we ever did was cut if you were framing
from you you do your framing, you wrap your building paper,
you'd folded into the opening, and then you'd install the windows.
Right the sill tape didn't exist. So if you've taken
a window out of that situation and it never had

(09:58):
silk tape and those sorts of things in the past,
sort of like, yes, it's a good idea to install,
but it's not going that it'll still perform the same
way as it used to. But I guess what you're
after is you want it to be better than what
it was.

Speaker 8 (10:15):
Exactly what I'm saying is I've taken the windows out.
They're aluminium are in the last thirty five forty years. Yeah, sure,
I've gone to the company to put them in and
I was screwing them regards because I don't see there's
no salt tape in there. And they said, now we're
sort of requirement. But if you owned the building, or
if I'm as a homeowner, have always joined that job

(10:36):
myself personally, and I got a building inspect out, he'd
probably shy the book and me say it's not You've
got to do it as to code. That's what my
querier is. And I'm sort of thinking, well, hey, what's
coming on here? Because I'm not qualified. I'm just I'm
nobody supposedly and I've been around builders all my life,
my or et cetera. And yeah, so I'm sort of
aqueriing saying well, what's going on here? Come and help

(10:57):
come as professional as they can get awaut of it.
Because I'm just a nobody. I get the books train
at me and I'm upgrading, so to me, if you're
upgrading and of elementium and you're putting newis them as
so there's the tape in there, it's to co yeah sure.

Speaker 6 (11:11):
Also, yeah, there's also a practical thing, Ricky, where again,
if you were doing the sill tape and the taping
around the openings, you would do it when you've put
your building wrap on, you've got your frames up, you
put your building tape that you're building wrap on. Then
you do the tape, then you install your cavity battens
or your cladding. Now, in your instance, I'm presuming that

(11:33):
you've got your timber framing, you've got some building wrap,
you've got the cladding already fixed in place, So there's
not an option for you to fasten the tape in
the way that it would be if you were complying
with the building code, because you're not taking the cladding off.
I presume.

Speaker 8 (11:52):
Yeah. And also it's also it's a newer home too.
It's an older home rather should I say, you're talking
about you know, nineteen twenty sort of stuff. So you
want to down the steeing.

Speaker 6 (12:03):
Yeah, no I do. So is it what type of cladding?

Speaker 8 (12:06):
Do you have a rock cast.

Speaker 6 (12:10):
As in plaster?

Speaker 8 (12:12):
Yeah, it's applied old plaster home? Yeah yeah, timber framework right.

Speaker 6 (12:20):
Actually, I'm curious, now, how are you going to flash that?
Because I would imagine that those if you if you've
taken out have you taken out old timber or old
aluminium jewinery.

Speaker 8 (12:30):
The old aminum jewnery here, and how was.

Speaker 6 (12:34):
That butted into the rough cast plaster? Did the flange
sit over the outside?

Speaker 8 (12:42):
I was sitting in the inside basically the framework. It's
just taken out light for light to be honest here, Yeah,
I'm just wanted that plate tape is required along the
bottom are here?

Speaker 7 (12:56):
See.

Speaker 6 (12:56):
I wonder whether in terms of weather tightness, you would
actually be better off having a sill tray or a
sill flashing made up. So you know, if you're standing
on the outside of the building, you would see a
downturn over the front of the plaster and then it
returns back and maybe it has a small upstand, and

(13:16):
then your windows installed on top of that. So any
moisture that that comes down the window hits the sill
and is directed outside in front, you know, over the
top of the cladding. Any moisture that might drain out
through the wheepholes hits that same sill tray and is
directed to the outside. So I probably wouldn't you know,
you could do some tape underneath that, but I think

(13:38):
that sort of job you really need to have a
messile sill flashing put into that place.

Speaker 8 (13:45):
Just to plea Okay, now that's all good. I just
wanted I just wanted the other professional, but I get
away out of it as being a homeowner or a
nobody or they can say yes, you know, we can
do it there. But could I reply? Could I request
that they as signed off to code so have passed

(14:06):
so they take responsible if something goes wrong?

Speaker 6 (14:10):
Yeah, I mean, because you're not getting like you're able
to do this work undershed you one of the Building Act, right,
so you don't actually need a building consent for this,
but you could no, because unless you're changing the size
of the window, like making it larger, simply taking a
window out and replacing it with a similar type of
window doesn't require a building consent, saying that even work

(14:34):
that's done using Schedule one of the Act still needs
to be done in accordance with the Building Code, and
the Building Code does talk about these flashings. So I
would run some tape around the perimeter, probably just sticking
onto the edge of the plaster, but I would definitely
do a metal sil tray, install the windows beat of

(14:54):
sealant around the perimeter, and that that should be reasonably
we're the type then.

Speaker 8 (14:59):
Yeah, because I mean when you go on, when you
look at s Bill the Specter rather on the the
website so said, any the Upbraide Newson should be done
to go or that's yes, that's to go.

Speaker 6 (15:13):
Yeah, No, I think I definitely do definitely do a
sill flashing. That will make a big difference to that.
Take you down there, all the very best of your recket,
take care your news talks that we're taking your calls.
If you've got a question of a building nature, you
should call right now. We've got a couple of interviews
a little bit later on. Really talk about your projects.

(15:37):
Talk about in this instance, some of those things that
might it's anyone who's taken old joinery out and replaced it.
We all know that. The way in which we install
jowinery today, in terms of the preparation that goes into
the opening prior to the joinery being installed is you know,
you've got building, You've got your framing going up, You've

(15:57):
got your building wrap on. You return that to the
inside of the opening, you staple it off, you take
the tape and you seal the corners and the sill
and up the side and all the rest of it.
But it returns back on to the framing before either
the cladding is installed or cavity battens and then platting.
The challenge there is that, you know, the clouding's already

(16:18):
on in this case, in Ricky's case, it's actually stucco.
So where does the tape go. Yes, putting some tape
over the that junction will probably help. But you know,
tape's not really designed to stick to concrete. But it's
better than not doing anything at all. So that sort
of practical advice. If you've got a question, let's see
where we can get to. Eight hundred eighty ten eighty

(16:39):
is the number to call. Let's take a break. We'll
take your calls right now. There's a line sphere. Give
us a call eight hundred eighty ten eighty.

Speaker 1 (16:47):
Whether you're painting with stealing, fixing with fans, or wondering
how to fix that hole in the wall, give Peter
Wolfcapit call on eight hundred eighty. The resident builder on
Youth Talks B.

Speaker 6 (16:59):
News Talk said, b early in the morning for you guys,
a little bit later in the day for me. And
again I'm not going to go on about the fact
that I'm overseas at the moment. But anyway, so twelve
hours difference. This might be the first time that I
kind of have dinner while doing a breakfast show. Anyway,
it is six twenty six here at news Talks hereb Now,

(17:22):
this is an interesting text that's just come through. Hey,
we've got some spear lines, so give us a call
if you've got a building question. Morning Peak. We've just
had completed a new build, had the handover on Friday
where we noticed a number of bootmarks set in our
polished concrete living room floor. Apparently nothing we can do

(17:43):
about it, could you please advise. I'm slightly amused and
a little bewildered, and I guess I'm probably as shocked
as you might be that. You know, if in your
specifications for your bill you opted for a polished concrete floor.

(18:05):
You know, everyone who's ever done one knows that there's
a certain amount of care and attention that you need
to pay to that. So what I'm a little bit
curious about in this particular instance is when you say bootmarks,
is that marks that you can see in the concrete
or is it marks that you can see in the
polish that they apply to it. So typically with these jobs,

(18:30):
there's a special way of finishing the floor, so you
don't want to float it too much so that you're
not bringing too much of the fines to it. And
then typically either before most of the interior finishes are done,
a team of specialists will come through and they will grind,
they will hone the surface of the concrete to bring
up all of that aggregate so you can see that.

(18:51):
And then maybe they apply a coat of sealer at
that time, which is sort of sacrificial. It's just there
to prevent anything from staining the concrete. Then you'll carry
on with the build, do all the insulation, do the lining,
do the stopping, do the have all of the sub
trades finish all of their work, get everything done, clean

(19:12):
the house out, and at that time the team will
come back, do another cut of the polished concrete, or
polish the concrete, apply a code of seiler there out.
It's like having the carpet done. It's the last thing.
If you're doing a new bill, and I guess what
you wouldn't expect to see is dirty great bootmarks all
over your carpet or over your wooden floor, and certainly

(19:32):
you wouldn't expect to see it in your polish concrete
living room floor. Apparently nothing we can do about it. Well,
I'm not sure that that's true. I would have thought that,
you know, unless you specified in your description of the
building work that you wanted to see bootmarks in the
polish concrete floor, that they're not supposed to be there.

(19:55):
You didn't ask for them, someone put them there, somebody
didn't take them out. I would probably I would definitely
be going back to the builder, to the main contractor,
to the project manager, to the owner of the business
and going look, if someone has applied a coat and
then someone's walked in it inadvertently, it needs to be

(20:15):
ground off and recoated. And I can only imagine that
that would be the sort of thing that every day
when you get up, it's the first thing you would see,
even if it's not terribly noticeable to anybody else, it
would absolutely be the first thing that you would see. Now,

(20:36):
someone else's text, well, a suggestion, you'll need to ground
out the marks, grind out the marks until they're no
longer visible. And then the person who texts me in
the first place has said it's in the concrete. It's
in the actual concrete itself. My goodness, Well again, I

(21:01):
see where your contract is coming from. There's not a
lot that you can do about it now, but shouldn't
have been there in the past. So if when the
job was done, if somebody walked on the concrete floor
before it was set, and now they've ground it and
that mark is there kind of forever, really they should
have put their hand up at the time to go, look,
I'm really sorry, but that polished concrete floor, it's now

(21:24):
got to mark in it. And depending on how deep
it is, you know, you don't want to be grinding
four or five millimeters of your concrete floor down cheepers. I.
It's one of those things, you know, if you're going
to make a mistake, put your hand up and tell
the owner, Tell the client, I'm really sorry, but the

(21:47):
concrete floor someone has put a mark on it. Because
any sort of patch that you might try and do,
like if you were to grind that area back and
fill the depression caused by the boot walking across the floor,
that's going to be noticeable.

Speaker 7 (22:05):
You know.

Speaker 6 (22:05):
It's like doing plastic cast of a dinosaur footprint in
an old river bed or something like that. I'd be
really interested to hear. I'd take a phone call from
someone who perhaps works in the whole exposed concrete, polished
concrete area. I just really think that maybe you're going

(22:26):
to end up either living with it, which I don't
think you should have to. If someone had to put
their hand up early enough to say there's a problem. Yeah,
this is what happens when cowboys are involved. There is
a texter. Thank you for that, but not terribly useful,
I have to say, But gosh, that would be It's

(22:47):
one of those things, you know, if right at the
beginning of the job, and it would have been you know,
the concrete floor goes down, somebody's walked in it, and
then nobody's told the client. Nobody's had the guts basically
to put their hand up and go, we've got a problem.
We could deal with it now. We could grind it. Now,
we could try and patch it. We could cut that
bit of the floor out and re pour it. We

(23:09):
can do all of those things. Anyway, we're gonna have
a chat with Wayne straight after the break because he
might have some ideas on that. It is six six
thirty two at News Talk SEB. We'll talk to Wayne
in a moment if you'd like to join us. The
lines are open. The number to call is eight hundred
eighty ten eighty.

Speaker 2 (23:26):
Squeaky door or squeaky floor.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
Get the right advice from Peter Wolfcamp, the resident builder
on news Talk SEB.

Speaker 6 (23:35):
Righty oh, eight hundred eighty ten eighty is the number
to call. Pete wolf Camp, resident builder with you this
morning talking all things building in construction, and every now
and then I was thinking about this what I was
just talking about with the text message there, so that
if you've just joined us, what's happened is someone has
texta and said, look were we on Friday? We took

(23:58):
handover of our brand new bill and on that day
we've discovered that there is a footprint in the exposed
concrete floor, and they're telling us that there is nothing
that we can do about it. And I'm thinking, well,
you know, it literally would have been there from the
day that the concrete was poured, because me assure you,

(24:21):
once concrete hardens, you're not putting a footprint in it.
So somewhere someone has stepped onto the concrete floor in
the living room, a floor that's going to be polished
and left exposed and honed and beautifully looked after, and
coats of seal it, and now that footprint is there.
And at this point, however, many days weeks, months after

(24:43):
the footprint was first introduced to the concrete, the builder
is saying to the new homeowner, nothing that we can
do about it? Well, there was, but you didn't put
your hand up, didn't sort of admit the problem. You
must have known about it. You can't not see these things, surely,
So what do you do about it? Now? Well, Wayne,

(25:03):
what do you think.

Speaker 9 (25:06):
Hyped? No, actually a bit of miscommunication.

Speaker 8 (25:10):
Now.

Speaker 9 (25:10):
I just woke up and listening to you and I
heard this particular court text. It prompted me because I've
got an issue with concrete. A concrete slab in our
house which is has got the findings that it's been
floated so fine that the sand is coming away from

(25:34):
the from the actual concrete itself now and it's been
doing this for I don't know a little bit for
about five years. It's it's nine years old. And I
recently went back to the the people that had the
we built the house or they built it a home

(25:55):
and land package, and said to them, is there anything
we can do under are we Is it warranted under
the ten year help warrantine whatever, and they subcontracted that
out to a builder, and the builders a master builder.
As I understand it, I've researched that it's they then

(26:16):
would have somebody subcontracted that back out to a concrete supply.
And I've been under several concrete supplies about this particular issue,
because it's now got to the point we've got decks
nice or decks everywhere, and we're dragging standing off the
top of this concrete lab all the time, and the
thing and then what can a would I be covered

(26:36):
under a builder's warranty tenured be? What can I then
do about it?

Speaker 4 (26:40):
And so on?

Speaker 9 (26:40):
And I've had a particular company to have given us
several options or they haven't actually sent the quote to
me yet. I've grinding off, acid washing it and so on.
So my question to you is do I have a
case or given the information I've given you, do I

(27:01):
have a case? Then it's under warranty and it shouldn't
be doing this.

Speaker 6 (27:07):
Just to be really clear, this is out exterior concrete paths.

Speaker 9 (27:12):
Yeah, and it's a slab patio outside our deck. It's
eight meters meters yep.

Speaker 6 (27:22):
And it was it was laid and it was floating.
It wasn't given a broom finish, which is typically how
you might finish exterior concrete so that it doesn't become slippery, and.

Speaker 4 (27:35):
It was.

Speaker 6 (27:37):
It was. It was floated up finished with a steel
over trialed so that you've actually got all of its
sand at the top now rather than or it's starting
to break down effectively.

Speaker 9 (27:51):
Yeah, it was finished lovely like, it was nice look
and it was even and you know, very nice. Yeah,
but it's just it's all the standards coming on. There
was one area there we put up a little and
where water is flown a bit from that it is

(28:11):
is worse and you can see the more aggregate underneath
a bit, but it's all over the whole slab and
it's it's just I don't know. A concrete supplier gave
me all sorts of technical information and regarding how can this,
what can cause that, and the text and time, but

(28:31):
it's too old and you can't go back to when
it was laid. What was the weather on day, like
on the where the water box was the play and
so on. You know, we don't know that. All I
know is what i've got now, And it's a question
purely okay, remedies for.

Speaker 6 (28:52):
I just wonder whether you know to try and go
through the remedy process right to find the contract a
tribute blamee asked them to fix it. I suspect it's
a little bit too late and just too difficult to
do because everyone will point the finger at somebody out.
So yeah, you just get to the point where you
just go, okay, So what's my solution. It's eight by four?

(29:14):
Do I get someone in to grind the surface, apply
a really good quality sealer to it that will bind
all of that material together, give you what should be
still quite an attractive finish. In fact, the ground look
I think, actually looks really good. And then at least
you've got a fix. You know, no one's going to

(29:39):
pay for that. That's on you, I suspect, but at
least it will give you a fix.

Speaker 9 (29:45):
Yeah, no, no, there is a facts for it, for sure.
And I understand that it was just a question of okay,
there's still any liability under the TENU warranty, and I
suspect myself that there probably wasn't. But I gone through
the exercise and then I woke up and heard you
talk about I'll create like this.

Speaker 6 (30:02):
Yeah, and also I think sometimes things like you know,
like the tenure warranties really are for kind of critical
building elements and not everything will be warranted for ten years.
And also, you know, you've got to remember that even
though this current legislation that's being proposed around a compulsory

(30:26):
home warranty scheme for all new builds and for all
renovations over one hundred thousand dollars, is there to capture
things like you know, cladding leaking or failing, or a shower,
let's say, a tile shower that's waterproof, right, that that
fails those sorts of things, But it doesn't also exclude

(30:47):
responsibility for the fact that, for example, a structure of
the building still needs to stay up for fifty years.
You don't have to warranty it for fifty years, but
it still has for fifty years. Some other things will
actually they only have a defect period of a year
or you know, two years or three years, and there
might be a failure after that time. Well there's no

(31:08):
warranty claims after that time. And again, most of our focus,
rightly so, should be on what's really critical to the building,
to its structural performance. To its performance in terms of
weather tightness and durability and other things like a claim
on a driveway or a patio. I'm not sure. I
just think you could spend an awful lot of time

(31:29):
and energy trying to find out a solution, a legal one,
get nowhere, and in the meantime, what you could have
done is, you know, cleaned it up. Muzz is just
text three says are you won't be able to grind
all of that exterior will be too slippery. I hear
what you're saying that you can apply non slip sealers
as well, So you'd have to look at that because
obviously if you going to grind it, it is going

(31:51):
to be smooth. So then you'd want to apply a
sealer that has a little bit of a slip resistance
coefficient to it. Going. Yeah, you're right, the overtrawling it
is not good.

Speaker 9 (32:05):
Yeah, I had I had someone come around and have
a look, and yeah, there's several ways they can do it,
but that Yeah, probably the most afflicable way is to
blinded off and then apply stealing with grit and to
avoid living.

Speaker 6 (32:22):
Yeah. The other thing, actually, I tell you what, just
one thing before we go the other thing that I did.
I did it earlier this year at home. I had
a concrete table that I made about all about eighteen
years ago, right. I had some pump mix, so some
thirty MPa ten mil pump mix, and I boxed up

(32:42):
basically an outdoor table, poured it, dragged it around to
my house. That sat outside at my place for the
last eighteen years or thereabouts, and it was starting to
get a bit pitted, and you know, if I was
having dinner at the table, there'd be a little bit
of sand in there and that sort of thing. So
we used It's a new product from Razine Construction micro Cement, right,

(33:03):
So Microstone micro cement it is, and it's a really
really durable coating with a clear sealer over the top.
So have a look at that. Actually, go to the
Razine Construction site and look at some of the micro
cement products. Amazing, absolutely mass and then that might give
you another option because you can add a bit of

(33:23):
color to it and then a sealer to it and
leave a little bit of texture in there that will
give you that slip resistance. So that's another option for
you as well.

Speaker 9 (33:32):
Wait, oh okay, mate, thank you very much.

Speaker 6 (33:35):
Make lovely to chat with you, have a great day.
All the very best here to take care your News
Talks FB was six forty five, pretty much six forty six.
Actually here in News TALKSB, we're talking concrete, we're talking windows.
We can talk anything related to building. Oh eight hundred
eighty ten eighty the number to call.

Speaker 1 (33:53):
Helping you get those DIY projects done right. The resident
Filder with Peter WOLFCAF call oh eight hundred eighty eight.

Speaker 6 (34:00):
US TALKSB, you and News Talks SB. We're talking all
things building construction and as guse, what happens when those stakes.
There's a very technical phrase that we use on building sites,
but I just can't bring myself to say it on here.
But every now and then something just gets stuffed up
and it's not that easy to fix. Stephen, what do

(34:21):
you think?

Speaker 10 (34:22):
And one a year I had some expose they would
get done. The house built in Australia and we built
the top garage and they screened off and polished and
they come up beautiful. So we had a basement as well,
and it had a seventy five by seventy five draining
on the.

Speaker 7 (34:39):
Outside of it.

Speaker 10 (34:40):
So they put the original floor down and then pulled
the next seventy five to one as a finishing concrete,
and we were going to polish out the head oxide
put in it and anyway, it was all laid down,
and the guy screwed it really well and looked really nice,
and then got a week later the polish would come
along and started polishing it and everywhere, because it was

(35:00):
fall and a screened meters. The guy had screened and
then he'd stop and he'd stand up, and then he'd
screwed a bit more and stop and he'd stand up,
and every time he stood up, he's putting meat on
the screed, which was pushing all the egg get down.
And then the sand had come to the top of it.
So then the polisher come along and polished it and
did a beautiful job, but it looked like a zebra

(35:21):
that every about every six meters, every well not even
six meters, for every five four or five meters, here's
these big stripes that were like four meters long by
probably six hundred, and so they grounded again. They took
another five meals off and then there was nothing they
could do about it, not a thing. So we builder

(35:44):
had a major ship for it with the with the polisher,
wasn't It wasn't.

Speaker 7 (35:49):
The polisher's fault.

Speaker 11 (35:50):
It was the guy that laid the concrete.

Speaker 7 (35:52):
Yes, he went he went broke.

Speaker 10 (35:55):
And disappeared, and so the builder. We ended up tiling
the four hundred square meters because it was so atrocious.

Speaker 11 (36:03):
What point is is that if you're going to do.

Speaker 10 (36:07):
Exposed avert or polished concrete, and it really does start
at the lane before you polishing it, and it was
just it was absolutely unbelievable, So that footprint there will
be nothing you can do about it.

Speaker 6 (36:23):
That's the feeling that I get to, and it's it's
awful when you get to that stage where you just
have to say to someone there's just really you know,
apart from cutting the entire floor out and doing it
all again, there's probably not a lot you can do.

Speaker 10 (36:35):
This is goat briskas and by a goat a biscas
and by a matt and put over it.

Speaker 6 (36:42):
Actually, I tell you what the person who texts us
through said, Look, it would have been fine to put
a rug there, but it's right by the front entrance way. Parently,
it's actually right in front of the wine fridge. So
that's not.

Speaker 11 (36:55):
My point is that you know it really, it really
does start as you lay.

Speaker 10 (36:59):
The concrete, and I'll never come again in my born
never in my born life would anything to do it
exposed to ever again like that.

Speaker 11 (37:07):
For that simple reason. You get the wrong guy. And
you know it was.

Speaker 7 (37:11):
A big port. It was falling.

Speaker 10 (37:12):
This grimed me this, but he just every time he
stood up, he'd it just pushed all the aggregate.

Speaker 11 (37:20):
To the bottom and brought the sand.

Speaker 10 (37:22):
And what what made it worse is it was brown
off side, so we'd put a half mixer brown in it.

Speaker 11 (37:28):
Mm hmm. So he ended up tiring.

Speaker 6 (37:32):
All right, mate, I appreciate the story. That's awesome. You
have a great day in America. Take care, thanks buddy,
take care by. I think your news talks. He'd be
David quick one before the break. How are you, sir?

Speaker 12 (37:44):
Oh good, good, thank you? And God got an apartment
with it's on the ground flour near on a beach area,
and we've got two layers of piles that have been
put on there in the past. Now we're going to
pull those up because we wanted to renovate it. And
when we put the new tie down, do we need

(38:05):
to re level and reseal the original concrete base before
we relay the new tile on top.

Speaker 6 (38:14):
Also it's a concrete slab, it's head tiles on it.
You've removed the tiles and you're going to retie.

Speaker 12 (38:25):
That's the plan here.

Speaker 6 (38:27):
Yeah, okay, what's been on that concrete surface for all
of this time?

Speaker 12 (38:34):
Uh, two layers of porcelain tiles, but we don't but
they're all outdated now and so we have to remove
remove the idea of the builder wants to do is
it's over in Australia, this apartment, and what we want
to do is he wants to remove the two layers
of tiles. But I just want to make sure that

(38:55):
we do need to seal it and so no water
wish it comes up being nail beach on ground floor
in the future. And what's of waterproofing or selant do
we need to use before we put the new tile
back one.

Speaker 6 (39:15):
I think it would be really sensible to do exactly that.
So when the tiles are removed, you'll have the old adhesive,
so someone will need to come and do some surface prep,
which is just an angle grinder with a diamond blade
in it, an extraction you just go over, remove all
of that old adhesive, then thoroughly clean that. There's a

(39:37):
special type of primer, and then effectively like a waterproof
layer that you can apply. It's got to bind with
the primer onto the concrete. And then it's really important
actually that the tiler who is doing the work probably
does the waterproofing, because what you want is the sealer,

(39:57):
the waterproofing, and the adhesive that you're going to use
for the tiles all to be compatible to ensure that
then sticks to the next one basically, And I saw
a guy do it just recently, where again it was
a concrete floor very similar to what you've just described.
Ground it back, applied the primer, applied the waterproofing compound

(40:20):
to it, then use the appropriate adhesive to then Betters
tiles down. So yes, that's the process, but really important
that all of those items relate to each other.

Speaker 12 (40:34):
Yeah, gotcha, that's all right. So I'm on the watch, Yeah,
way the right way.

Speaker 6 (40:38):
No, you're definitely on the right Yeah, okay, absolutely, good
luck with the project. All the best, take care, David,
Thank you very much. We'll come back. We'll take more
of your calls after the break. We're coming up to
News top of the hour at seven o'clock in New Zealand,
so if you'd like to call, we'll have a bit
of a chat in the next hour as well. We

(40:59):
are going to catch up with Dan Saunders, who's a builder,
great builder in christ Church, part of the super home movement.
If you're in christ Church, there's been some tours if
you've been to those in the last couple of days
to see some examples of super homes and why they
are as good as everyone's talking about. We'll be catching
up with Dan about that. And also there is now

(41:20):
a new guide for people who are interested in doing
renovations but to a super home standard. So we'll talk
about that in the next hour. But call us now before.

Speaker 1 (41:29):
The measure twice God once, but maybe call Pete first
for your WORFGAF.

Speaker 2 (41:35):
The Resident Builder News Talk sa'd.

Speaker 6 (41:37):
Be Today we're taking a closer look at a product
that's quietly transforming framing right across New Zealand. It's Jayframe.
It's an engineered timber product. It's strong, it's straight, it's durable,
it's sustainably made with timber right here from New Zealand Forest.
So joining me this morning is Miles Wichita, who's director
at Pouterkawa Frame and Trust, based just outside of Thames,

(42:00):
who's been working with jaframe for a while and has
some really good insights into how it's performing in the
real world. So very good morning to you, Miles. Now,
i've heard a few builders who are giving jframe ago
for the first time. I've been using it for like
ten years. What's the general vibe any surprises that you've
come upon.

Speaker 13 (42:19):
We've been We've been using it for about the same
topics ten years. Very consistent growth over those over those years. Yes, most,
if not all.

Speaker 7 (42:31):
Of the boards that we that we.

Speaker 13 (42:34):
Engage with, once I've used jaframe don't typically go back
to traditional timber.

Speaker 7 (42:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (42:41):
Hey, now, obviously you're involved in manufacturing, that's what Frame
and Trust is all about, and so you're doing far
more volume than most of us would. So what difference
does the jframe make in terms of strength and the
consistency of the frames that you're producing.

Speaker 13 (42:59):
It's a combination of things. It's a nice product to use,
it's easy to hand, or it's lightweight but very strong.
But the wrong benefits, we believe is it's a true
it's a very straight, it's a true product. Gauging is
incredibly consistent. So the builder that that, like I said,

(43:21):
that use it, don't typically go back to your traditional pine.

Speaker 7 (43:27):
Sure.

Speaker 13 (43:28):
As for manufacturing, it's it's it's better for productivity for us,
goes through our factory and through our production lines very smoothly,
really efficiently limits any sort of.

Speaker 7 (43:43):
Rework in the factory.

Speaker 13 (43:45):
And that's really just because of of that consistency with
the gauge in and just doesn't doesn't walk, doesn't walk.

Speaker 6 (43:53):
So in terms of things like install speed, design, flexibility,
are there projects where jframes really stood out.

Speaker 13 (44:03):
Not materially, but like I said, I think everybody enjoys
working with it. As to speed on site, I think
it is. The feedback we get from builders is it
is slightly quicker. And again that's just because it's it's
it's it's true, it's straight, it's it's in that gauge

(44:26):
is rarely consistent.

Speaker 6 (44:28):
And in terms of like introducing jay frame, which is
an now VL into the plant and introducing it to
to the to your team, any teething issues.

Speaker 9 (44:36):
There no, no, none at all.

Speaker 13 (44:39):
We just treated it like you like any other any
other product. Yeah, but yeah, I think the benefit for
us was just having that confidence that every piece that
you handle is consistent. You know, with traditional timber, you
you sort of each piece that you load onto the

(44:59):
onto the automated saws, you are you are checking for,
you know, a slight bow and place on on on
the production line according to that bow. Where jaframe is
just straight. You don't have to you don't have to
think about it. You just pick it up and where
you can put.

Speaker 6 (45:17):
It and drop it straight onto the cut saw. Yeah. Absolutely.

Speaker 7 (45:22):
Hey.

Speaker 6 (45:23):
Now Jframe also of course has code Mark certification and
for people not familiar with it, you know, sometimes getting
consents through and making changes can be a bit tricky
with counsels. But if it's got code Mark, then that
smooth out that whole process around consents and compliance, isn't it.

Speaker 14 (45:42):
Oh yeah, I think so.

Speaker 13 (45:43):
I think any product that carries the code Marke sertification
gives everybody involved some confidence that it's been rigorously checked
and needs robust builder standards. So so ESP it's just
that's right, Yeah.

Speaker 6 (45:58):
Yeah, brilliant.

Speaker 15 (45:59):
Hey.

Speaker 6 (45:59):
Now, in terms of the LVLS, the engineered timber like Jframe,
in the years ahead, can you see more and more
people sort of starting to use it for framing.

Speaker 13 (46:08):
Personally, I think Engineer Timber will continue to grow signimically
in New Zealand, driven by sustainability benefits, structural efficiencies. It
has a much lower carbon footprint compared to steal. It
offers excellent sort of strength, durability and seismic performance.

Speaker 7 (46:25):
So you look.

Speaker 13 (46:26):
I think Jframe or will reap the benefits of this
trend going forward.

Speaker 6 (46:32):
Yeah, all that innovation is going to pay off. Hey,
I really enjoy chatting with you today. If people want
to know more, it's Bhotakowa Frame and Trust just outside
of Thames doing bills. We were chatting about this earlier
from Auckland right throughout the North Island. Check them out online.
So it's p f t L dot co dot en Z.

(46:52):
If you want to learn more about Jframe then go
to JNL dot co dot NZ. Miles, thanks very much
of your time today.

Speaker 7 (47:00):
Thanks gat to take care all this good news.

Speaker 2 (47:03):
Dog ZBI.

Speaker 6 (47:06):
News talks b PEG Wolf Camp with you. We're talking
all things building construction. Quick text before we talk to Jason. Hey, Pete,
my daughter wants to close up an open fireplace in
her nineteen sixties bungalow. Will she require a building consent
to remove the hearth and brick mantle, then block up
the fireplace and internally line the opening. They'll not touch

(47:29):
the exterior brick chimney. Many thanks, Mike, Mike. No, there's
no requirement to get a building consent. There is if
you were to remove the chimney, and the reason being
for many older homes that the chimney was one of
the first things that was built, and then parts of
the house are actually attached to it. Certainly, you know,
part of the selling joists and so it might actually

(47:51):
be supported by the chimney. Plus, typically the chimney extends
through the roof, so you've got to make sure that
that's where the tight But if what you're doing is
simply removing the hearth and removing the mantle from around
it and blocking that up, just internal minor alterations, no
requirement to get a building consent there. So that's a

(48:13):
job that you can do before Christmas. I'm sure right.
We're taking your calls. Oh, eight hundred and eighty ten
eighty is the number the call Jason, Very good morning to.

Speaker 11 (48:20):
You, Oh, good morning to you, Pete.

Speaker 12 (48:25):
I've just waken up myself.

Speaker 9 (48:27):
Can you hear me?

Speaker 6 (48:27):
Okay, absolutely, go for it.

Speaker 11 (48:32):
I just there's two issues.

Speaker 9 (48:34):
One was, I've just moved into this new complex.

Speaker 11 (48:37):
It's really cool, it's really good for me.

Speaker 16 (48:41):
But when I look at walk out on the for
you out to the road or whatever in amongst the complex,
my feet are like getting pins and needles in it.
Like I have to go get some gandal too or
songs to walk out on there, or wear my shoes
all the time. Well, what's happened to the concrete there

(49:03):
or the slab that they've they do?

Speaker 6 (49:06):
So this is an exterior concrete like a patio or
a pathway leading up to the house. I presume it's
not inside the house. Yeah. As a really straightforward way
of finishing exterior concrete is after it's being trailed and
then floated and then trailed off, they'll wait for it

(49:26):
to set for a little while and then they'll run
across it with a broom to give it a broom finish.
It's the most common way of doing exterior concrete, and
the benefit of the broom finishes it raps it up slightly,
which means that you're not going to slip and fall
over every time you go out outside. Right, So I
think the fact that you have to go and get
your jandles to walk outside, if you've got particularly sensitive feet,

(49:51):
well it's stopping you from going base over APEX basically.

Speaker 9 (49:56):
Yeah, it's like.

Speaker 7 (49:59):
Stains.

Speaker 14 (50:00):
It's like walking on stains. Your feet really feel it?

Speaker 6 (50:04):
Yeah, I mean look if is this your own.

Speaker 9 (50:07):
Place, Oh no, no, this is this is a complex or.

Speaker 6 (50:13):
I suspect that they've they've finished the concrete in such
a way to ensure that it's slip resistant. Now, maybe
they've gone a little bit over the top in terms
of going for you know, something that's a little bit
more abrasive perhaps than you might have expected. But in
the end, I think chances are that's how it's designed

(50:35):
to be to ensure that people don't fall over. And
if it means that you have to wear jendles when
you're outside, well that's going to be the way that
it is. Good luck with that, Jason, all the very
best to you and Lynn A very good morning to you.

Speaker 17 (50:49):
Good morning hey and them hoping you can help me out,
good morning.

Speaker 6 (50:54):
Indeed, it is.

Speaker 17 (50:57):
I just really I last winter came groggily, had breakfast
and there was water coming out of the light in
the kitchen, and that turned out to be a pin
hole US pleasure in the copper piping in the kitchen.
So all fixed that, no drama's done. Then this a

(51:18):
couple of weeks ago, I had another one in the hall.
It's started dripping down and that was once again, luckily
it seems to happen when I noticed it within an hour,
so it was fixed. And there's a little bit of
damage to the timber that's got to dry out and
be sorted. Not a great deal, but it's a nineteen
nineties house. Can I expect this to keep happening? Is

(51:40):
Do you have any advice about what you would do
if it was your house.

Speaker 6 (51:46):
I do recall a story, and it's going back a
few years, which makes sense if you're talking about a
nineteen nineties house where there was a batch of copper
that came into the country that had been basically poorly manufactured, right,
and so the thickness of the wall was uneven, and

(52:08):
that particular batch, and I don't know whether that's one
hundred lengths of pipe or a thousand lengths of copper
pipe was installed into houses and then people found that
after a period of time, there was a failure because
the wall was not the correct thickness and you had
these little pin hole leaks appear in copper because typically

(52:30):
when we talk about copper piping, it's really really rare
unless you've driven a nail through it to actually have
a problem with it, right, it's generally regarded as being
very robust. But there was an incident where essentially some
substandard product was introduced into the market. It's been installed

(52:51):
into houses, and I guess, you know, practically speaking, let's
say the plumber coming to plumb your house when it
was brand new, would go to the merchant would pick up,
you know, five ten lengths of copper piping copper tubing
that they need. So chances are all of the piping
from your house is from potentially that defective bunch, in

(53:13):
which case it's not every single length, and it's not
every single part of every single length, but you couldn't
discount the possibility that there might be some other leaks
in your house over time. So it makes it sound
like there was another defective type of piping that we had,
which is called all sorts of problems for people. So

(53:37):
the question I guess is do you go to the
expense of removing it. I don't know whether you'd be
able to make a claim anymore unless you went to
your insurer and said, to your ensurer, you know this
is likely to happen again. How about we do one repair,
rip it all out, replace it all and then we

(53:59):
never have to worry about it. But only if your
insurer was going to meet the cost of that.

Speaker 17 (54:06):
Yeah, irang them when it first happened, because it were
in this water country. And I got the thing about
if it's a slow leak, laddie glady, we won't cover you.
And whether bad see that it's been me replace it
or it would be my problem anyway, I'm not sure.

Speaker 6 (54:28):
Yeah, And this is that whole thing between gradual damage
and an accident sort of thing, so you know, in
the end if you get a see I don't think
that they should categorize a leak and a pipe. A
hole in a pipe is gradual damage, right, that's an
event the pipe was working, then the pipe's not working,
therefore it's an accident. So gradual damage, I think is

(54:51):
things like people going, look, I didn't repair the spouting.
It's been running down the wall for five years and
now my wall is rotten. Well that's gradual damage, right,
So I guess you could go to your insurer and say, hey,
if we want to make sure or that this doesn't
happen again, let's make a claim to replace for that damage,

(55:11):
to replace all of the pipework. The other option would
be I guess you just go do a negotiated settlement.
And again, there was a product a couple of years
ago called Duck's Quest and it was a PBC pipe
and the elbows tended to fail on it. And I
know people who had their whole house piped out and

(55:33):
this one would go. A couple of years later, another
one would go, and someone I know eventually went to
their insuran and said, look, the only way to solve
this is to repipe the entire house. They got a
payout from the insurer and they use that to do
that work. So potentially you could try and do that
with your insurer.

Speaker 14 (55:54):
Thank you.

Speaker 17 (55:55):
Yeah, Okay, yeah, I just winded because you're I've been
here how many a while?

Speaker 6 (56:01):
Yeah, it's been there a while. And the other thing is,
if it's nine right, so we're talking thirty thirty five years,
you've had two minor leaks and thirty five years, do
you kind of take the risk and go, you know what,
I think that in the next ten years that I'm
in the house or whatever it's going to be, maybe

(56:21):
I have one more leak. Do you accept that risk?
Doesn't doesn't feel comfortable, But it's a possibility, isn't it.

Speaker 17 (56:31):
It's possibility?

Speaker 6 (56:32):
Yeah, yeah, thank good luck for.

Speaker 9 (56:34):
That at least.

Speaker 6 (56:35):
And I'm sure if you did a Google search you
would see some news stories about that copper piping.

Speaker 17 (56:41):
Okay, I loll and thank you, thank you for your advisers.

Speaker 6 (56:45):
All my pleasure, lovely to chat with you this morning, Lynd.
You take care all the best, Ridio. We'll talk to
Kevin after the break. If you'd like to join us,
the lines are open. The number to call is oh,
eight hundred and eighty eighty ten eighty, it's me and
it is seven twenty one.

Speaker 2 (57:03):
Doing up the house and sorting the garden. Asked Pete
for a hand.

Speaker 1 (57:06):
A resident builder with Peter Wolfcab calls.

Speaker 6 (57:12):
Your news Talks be We're going to catch up with
Dan Saunders later on from christ Church around the super
home movement. And actually I'll tell you why it's really important,
and I guess somewhere like christ Church. I live in Auckland,
christ Church further south where it genuinely gets cold. Parts
of the North Island obviously get cold as well, or
colder than Auckland. I'm on the road at the moment

(57:36):
and I've been staying with some friends who live just
north of London, about thirty minutes on the high speed train,
so north of London, and they've done some renovations to
their house and they really set out to try and
make an energy efficient house, so lots of insulation, good
quality joinery, They've got a heat recovery system inside the house.

(58:02):
And being inside that house looking out at frost on
the ground outside, knowing it's two or three degrees and
I'm walking around the house in bare feet in a
T shirt in the beginning of winter over here, says
why if we build well, we'll get better houses, and
I think we'll have healthy people as a result of it.
So that's been a good insight for me in a

(58:25):
place where you know, building performance is tested by the environment.
If you do it well, it's going to look after you.
A couple of quick texts before we talk to Kevin,
good morning, regarding a new roof being installed. Am I
supposed to provide tea, morning tea and lunch? Also, I've
heard that when the job is completed, am I to
buy the roof of something? Am I supposed to what?

(58:46):
Am I supposed to buy them? And then they talk
a little bit about the price for the job, about
twenty grand, which is not too bad. I would have
thought that's from Margaret. Margaret, you don't have to get
morning tea and lunch. But at the same time, if
you do, and you know, the roofers might be there
three four days, right, if you were to do a
little morning tea and something a bite to it at lunchtime,

(59:10):
I'm sure that they will do a much better job
for you than if you didn't. And at the end
of the job. Yeah, well, a roof shout is a
traditional thing. It's a little bit trickier these days in
terms of I suppose being responsible for people and ensuring
that they don't drink and drive and those sorts of things.
And I've noticed that roof shouts are not as common

(59:31):
as they used to be, but it is quite a
nice idea. So Margaret, look, I'm sure if you were
to give them a cup of tea and maybe something
a couple of scones at lunchtime, something like that. I
think it's a great idea. Someone's also pointed out this
is a very good and straightforward text. Insurance companies do
not get involved in preventative safety that could cause damage.

(59:52):
That's never been accepted in New Zealand time and time again.
As a builder, we've tried to prevent things. Get the
insurance company to comforate, No way. So I think the
point there is that you know, I was talking, we
were talking with Lynn about the copper piping that's gone,
these pinhole pricks developing in it. So you could go
to the insurer and go, look, can we do a

(01:00:13):
payout on this that I'll go ahead and do the repairs,
and then you fund the replacement by using that money
as kind of the beginning of your budget for that.
That's kind of what I was talking about. But you're right,
I don't think insurers are going to be wanting to
provide preventative methods or measures for that. Another quick one too,

(01:00:36):
just before we talk to Kevin Pete. A twelve year
old weatherboard house and all of the double glazing windows
are failing. They're showing moisture between the glass. I'm told
we've got a ten year warranty. Are there any options
other than to replace? That's from Josh. I mean, look,
one or two failures maybe might be expected, but I

(01:00:59):
suspect that there is a bigger problem with the glazing.
If you're getting all of the glazing in a twelve
year old house that's failing. Technically, yes, it's a ten
year warranty. You would like to think though, that if
you were able to track who the manufacturer was and
ask them to come out, that they would help you out.

(01:01:19):
Because I mean, we've all seen glazing that's double glazing
that's considerably older than that that doesn't fail very rarely.
I've seen much newer double glazing fail. But I think
if I was you, i'd try and track down who
the original provider of the double glazing units is and

(01:01:40):
see whether they would come to the party. You may
not want to hold your breath for that, but I
would give it a go. Right, we're back to your calls.
Oh eight hundred and eighty ten eighty is that number
to call? Kevin?

Speaker 15 (01:01:52):
A very good morning, good morning to you, Pete, Hey,
I've got a couple of well I think are real
good building tips where you're going and your listeners.

Speaker 18 (01:02:03):
So the first one is I'd done a reno a
few years ago and I put in ranchlider and new
windows and that. So then on a dead alongside the
stud was put in some six y two to the
next one, so that when the plaster board went on
and I was putting the curtain rail up, I screwed
it straight into wood.

Speaker 6 (01:02:24):
Brilliant. Yes.

Speaker 18 (01:02:25):
And the other one is this anybody with French doors,
This is what I've done a few years ago. Now,
this was a wooden deck, but it wouldn't matter what
deck is, but the wooden one made it but easier.
So I got a bit of one fifty one fifty
one fifty long catalyzed blot and I cut the center

(01:02:48):
out of it to the depth of the from the
deck up to the underside of the French door underneath it,
and probably overlapped it by probably about sixty mil so
that the door was down into the cut by about
sixty milk. Then I earn that over took the edge

(01:03:08):
off the block both ends. Then draw the whole white
through and then used a bit of quite well, I
use a bit of number eight. Why but people that
haven't got number weight, why they could use some rolling
ride and take the flux of it, put a pigtail
in it, and then that goes between the gaps and

(01:03:30):
your wooden deck. And then if you had a concrete one, well,
what I'd suggest is you put a plate on the
side of the block, slide it onto your French door,
and then mark the holes out so that when you
come to open your door however far you want it,

(01:03:51):
it's easy. Ton't drop me wire down into the holes
you put a concrete.

Speaker 6 (01:03:58):
I think I get what you mean. I good ideas,
why not? Thank you very much for that, Kevin, much
appreciate it quickly before we go to the break Pete.
Insurers will rigidly stick to the overriding condition that for
any claim to be admitted, there has to be unforeseen,
accidental and sudden circumstances. So again, you know, you might

(01:04:20):
be able to go for a settlement that allows you
to use that money to do the repairs and maybe
do some preventative maintenance. But you're right, the insurer themselves
is unlikely to pay out for that, so appreciate that unforeseen,
accidental and sudden circumstances. That's how it goes. And someone's
text through too, because we were talking with Miles about jframe.

(01:04:42):
So what is jframe. Well, it is an LVL timber,
so it's from the good people that you can jn L.
It's a laminated Veneer lumber. I've been using it as
I probably would have first used it more than ten
years ago. So for timber framing because it's laminated, my

(01:05:02):
experience has been that it just like when you cut well,
when you you've got to pack there and you're cutting
frames literally every single stick you can use. Because it's
true and it's straight. It's dimensionally stable, a little bit
heavier than sort of conventional timber, but it is in
terms of its rigidity, it's it's just fabulous. So jframe

(01:05:25):
just look it up. Just go JNL dot co dot
nz you'll find out all the information for jaframe there. Right,
we can take short break Diana up straight after the break.

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
Whether you're painting with stealing, fixing with fans, or wondering
how to fix that hole in the wall. Do you
have a Peter wolfcap call on eight eighty the resident
builder on youth dogs, b you a.

Speaker 6 (01:05:47):
News talks the b Someone has helpfully text through to say, hey, look,
there's a bit of an echo in the room. You're
right there is because I'm probably in a one hundred,
one hundred and twenty year old building in France. It's
lots of bricks and bits and pieces. So maybe next
week when I'm in a different country it might sound
a bit different. We'll see how we go. Diana agree
to you.

Speaker 19 (01:06:07):
Good morning, Peter. With a little bit of a problem.
Our house is well a fifty years old brick and
the grouting has so just appearing on the brick. Can
we fix it ourselves by getting some grouting and do it,
or do we have to get somebody professional into doo it.

Speaker 6 (01:06:31):
It's one of those jobs where really it's just an
attention to detail in patience, right, and you've probably got
both of those. So yeah, I think that there's no
reason that you can't either. You can do You can
actually buy bags of trade mortar, right, So it's exactly
what briclays would use today. So it's all got the

(01:06:52):
sand and the cement in it, and possibly a little
bit of adhesive as well. Mix that up scrape out
any loose material. You've got to get the right trail,
so a very narrow pointing trail or a grouting trail,
and then work your around just simply replacing that ground
where it's missing.

Speaker 19 (01:07:11):
Oh, it's heapsmissing. Wasn't until my son bought the attention
to me. He said, then we have to do something
about the smifflee and fie out if it was possible.

Speaker 6 (01:07:24):
What do you think has caused the ground to deteriorate.

Speaker 11 (01:07:29):
Over the years.

Speaker 19 (01:07:30):
I mean, I know the house is at least fifty
I think it was built on the fifties.

Speaker 7 (01:07:36):
Yes, And is it just.

Speaker 6 (01:07:42):
Something like that.

Speaker 9 (01:07:43):
No, we're down the beach area. We're in the beach area.

Speaker 19 (01:07:48):
But I know I caused it on one side of
the house because I bought a water bluster and thought
I was just water bluster. Have okay, mistake number one.
I only did one side, one side of the house,
but the rest of it is just quite the terror
at the top of the e z.

Speaker 11 (01:08:11):
Of the house.

Speaker 8 (01:08:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 6 (01:08:13):
Look, I think that if you were to get some
trade mortar. There are some other products which are like
for semititious crack repair or grout repair, but they come
in sort of a small pot. They've got a bit
of adhesive in them. They're a little bit finer. But
if you've got quite a lot to do, you'll be
buying a lot of pots of the whole trade. Mortar

(01:08:39):
have a practice in a not so obvious area, scrape
out anything that's loose, bring the pointing up to the surface,
strike it off, wash the bricks down and then just
carry on. So attention to detail and perseverance is the key.

Speaker 19 (01:08:55):
So wash it down after each brick area or.

Speaker 6 (01:09:01):
Yeah, I think often when you see no actually I
would just brush off. So I think if you mortar
needs to be relatively dry when you're applying it. Otherwise
it's really hard to get onto the trail and into
the ground lines. And then if you do happen to
get a little bit onto the brickwork. Often you'll see
bricklayers just with an old broom or something like that,

(01:09:24):
just the head of an old brew just dust it
off straight away.

Speaker 19 (01:09:28):
Well that's going to give them.

Speaker 6 (01:09:31):
But yeah, it might be more than a weekend, but
at least there's a couple of those before Christmas. All
the best do you die, Good luck with all of that,
Take care and Sandy, are very good morning to you.

Speaker 9 (01:09:45):
Why I'm ody there.

Speaker 6 (01:09:46):
Good a Sandy, I am go for it.

Speaker 14 (01:09:49):
So I just collapped from under the cats. I bring
up a couple of things. Yeah, I'm the electrician today.
The mustering windows, I've got that problem too. It's the
double glazing.

Speaker 9 (01:10:03):
My mate.

Speaker 14 (01:10:04):
Luckily we both had them done no years ago, and
they're to sturn a full replacement. There's a bit one
of them. And they told me around ten years ago
they had a certain supply that the fitting because I've
got the aluminium framing done, and that all of them
are failing from that supplier. So it's like they've got

(01:10:25):
a big bill to take care of around the wrong
a prairie area.

Speaker 7 (01:10:29):
Yeah, and are they.

Speaker 6 (01:10:32):
Without mentioning necessarily a supplier like one of I know
because I do do some work with double glazing supplies
with metro glass that sometimes what happens is the unit
itself is okay, but the way in which it's installed
is not as per the recommendations, and the installation can
contribute to the failure of the DJ unit. So if

(01:10:56):
there's no spaces under it, that sort of thing, it
would be interesting to know what the cause of your failure.

Speaker 14 (01:11:02):
Is yes, yes, well I did all the installation, so
you know, we left it to them like a one
stock shop. Get it sorted. But anyway, I'm glad they're
come into the party because I don't you know those
round sucker marks where they hold them? Yeah, next thing
that concrete. That guy having the problem with concrete and

(01:11:23):
the marks in it. I wonder if he's looked into
someone like Elite Creed or someone like that who does
the epoxy resin codings on top and they can color it.
I've seen them make them look like even wooden boards
and or stone or you know, they've they got some
real talent, those guys. I almost sort about changing careers
looking at doing it looks so good.

Speaker 6 (01:11:45):
Then what's the crowd that you're talking about.

Speaker 14 (01:11:48):
One's called Elite Creek. They googled that. They'll show them pictures.
I think they're an American company, but they have representation
in New Zealand and hold courses and stuff like that
for anyone who wants to become a contractor. But there's
a few people that do it. There's another guy that's
just done it for my mate up from a prero
as well. I don't know the name of this company,

(01:12:09):
but yeah, I just want to look into POxy resin
tonings on concrete and he could choose a color or
he could try and make it look like something else
or yeah place and.

Speaker 6 (01:12:20):
The other one I mentioned too. I did an old
concrete table and I recently had it recoated using razine
construction of rock coke microstone finishes. This is a new
product from them, and again you gat a bit of
color to it, trail it on, get whatever finish you want,
maybe a little bit of texture, maybe really smooth, and
then a clear seiler over the top. And it's it's

(01:12:41):
been transformational, so there are some options there. Sandy really
appreciate you giving us a call and you with New
Stork set B. We'll take a break. We're going to
catch up with Dan Saunders. This is part of super Home,
So I don't know why this. I must ask him.
Why are super Home so well represented and trush it?
Probably because if it's a little bit colder, you want

(01:13:03):
your house to work a little bit harder for you.
I think that one of the things that stops maybe
those of us who live in the more temperate parts
of the North Island from getting super excited about super
homes is because our houses don't have to work that
hard in terms of keeping us warm in winter when
it gets genuinely chili. But like I say, I've been
staying with some friends just a little bit north of

(01:13:24):
London and I got up the other morning, opened the curtains,
looked out. There's frost on the ground, on the plant boxes,
on the trees and all the rest of it. Inside
the house, yes there's heating on, but a barely modest
amount of heating. But well insulated, good quality double glazing,
good quality joinery makes a massive difference. Is that part

(01:13:48):
of the super home story. We'll find out. We'll have
a chat with Dan Saunders after the break.

Speaker 1 (01:13:53):
A squeaky door or squeaky floor get the right advice
from Peter Wolfcab, the resident builder on news Talks hed b.

Speaker 6 (01:14:02):
Your news talk said, be one of the groups that
I've mentioned a number of times over the last couple
of years, essentially ever since they came out with their
Better Building Guide has been the super home movement, and
a key contributor of that is Dan Saunders from christ Church.
A very good morning to you.

Speaker 7 (01:14:20):
Dan.

Speaker 11 (01:14:20):
It's good morning Peter.

Speaker 6 (01:14:21):
How are you today, Greetings, I'm very well.

Speaker 7 (01:14:24):
Hey.

Speaker 6 (01:14:24):
Now, I understand over the last couple of days there
has been an opportunity for the general public to come
along and have a look at some of these super
homes that are being developed in the christ Church area.
Looks like plenty of people have come along to the
super home tour.

Speaker 7 (01:14:40):
Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 20 (01:14:40):
So we had two houses open or two projects that
were open to the public yesterday. One was the A
four unit development which is aimed at zero carbon, low
carbon homes in Summerfield. So that's called Nafetti Parada, which
means to bask and bask in the sun, will warm
yourself in the sun. So that was a midbuild open

(01:15:01):
home and it showed basically as it says, the midbuild
construction had all the wall faming open and stuff like that,
so people can see how the how the belt and
what techniques were doing and things like that. The other
one was in Addington by Ness Residential, which was they
target sort of high density, medium to high density developments,

(01:15:22):
but rather than cheaper version, they put in the base
guide of the super home certification guide, so they take
at the base level, which means it's still a very warm, warm,
and healthy environment for the people to live in.

Speaker 6 (01:15:38):
That's fantastic. The mid build I think that that's such
a good opportunity in terms of people being able to
see because you know, it's all well and good to
go to a really high performance house when it's finished,
but you don't know the bits that went into it.
So to see the insulation, to see how you seal
around the joinery, to have a look at some of
the ducting and mechanical ventilation that might be in it,

(01:16:01):
that's fantastic.

Speaker 20 (01:16:03):
Yeah, it was, because that's the people we the people
that come in for their interests are the ones that
are actually well educated in it now. Like ten years
ago when the super movement first started, obviously people weren't
really up for it or up to it, so they
didn't really know what was going on. So when they
walk into a house, like you say, all they see
is plaster board carpet and they don't understand the why.
So the good thing about it we do, even when

(01:16:25):
we do the completed open homes, it's getting the feel
of it, the vibe. So when you walk into the house,
you walk into a house that's got, you know, the
fresh air coming in from outside one hundred you know,
twenty four hours of the day. You've got the acoustically
the triple glaze windows that we use. Aside from the
fact that they're very firmly efficient, you know, two and
a half times standard family broken aluminium, they're very acoustic

(01:16:47):
acoustically sound as well, so perform exceptionally well in that sense.
So it's just a quiet, peaceful place to be.

Speaker 6 (01:16:53):
Yes, it does, and you can feel it. You can
sense it when you're in these spaces, and I've mentioned
a couple of signs. I've had the opportunity of the
last few days to stay with some friends just outside
of London super Home. But they have put a massive
amount of effort and thought into creating a house that's

(01:17:13):
going to be warm, particularly when outside for many months
of the year it'll be you know, one or two
degrees or less in the morning. So being able to
walk around their place knowing that it's frosty outside you
can see it on the ground, and yet the house
is warm, dry, comfortable is amazing. The other thing Dan
is the super Home Guide when it came out. How

(01:17:35):
many years ago did the first super Home Guide come out?

Speaker 20 (01:17:38):
That was I think three or four years ago, and
obviously it's been a work in progress. So what we've
done is we've released the super what we call the
super Reno Guide as well. So it's a it's a
live document. It's always going to be changing, it's're always
going to be adding new techniques, new products to it.
So what it is it's based for the consumer at

(01:17:59):
a consumer level. So it's got things like the different
eras of housing that we have, you know, bungalows, contemporary,
all that sort of stuff, and it goes through most
of the problems that they have when renovating these houses
is the fact they all have the same similary substructure.
They just have different cluttings or differently different designs. So
most of the time they have the same problem. So

(01:18:19):
we just go through different ways of fixing those problems
using the right products and things like that. So it's
and it's also got embedded through it links to the
more technical data if people are interested in that as well.

Speaker 6 (01:18:34):
Look, when is it going to be released? I haven't
had a chance to look at it yet. When's it out?

Speaker 20 (01:18:39):
Well, I actually it was released yesterday. That was part
of the tours we had yesterday was to obviously to
have the midbuild open Home for these these developments, but
also to release the super Home Design Guide. So it's
live on the super Home website right now and you
can go in there and just follow the links on
the on the front page and you'll be able to
follow follow through, which I.

Speaker 6 (01:19:00):
Think is just such a tremendously valuable resource for people.
So if you're in that situation, let's say you've got
a well, you know, maybe you've got next Staatey right
from the nineteen forties, nineteen fifties, and you go, Okay,
I'd like to make this a little bit more energy efficient.
I want it to be more comfortable. Where do I start?
So it's going to guide you through insalation, air tightness,

(01:19:22):
maybe some ventilation systems, that sort of thing, particularly tailored
to that style of house.

Speaker 20 (01:19:30):
Yeah, And the good thing about it is too, is
that it's got links to obviously people and experts in
particularly areas like ventilation windows, all that sort of stuff.
So it's great. The thing about it when you're renovating
a house that you've probably covered as many times in
your show is you know, you don't have to do
everything all at once. It can be a systematic room
by room project, where as you can afford it, you

(01:19:50):
do one room at a time. We just finished eight
months ago a job where we've done basically half a house.
We've stripped it right back. I think of it like
a nineteen sixties red brick house with renew stards, pitched roof.
We stripped it right back from the inside back to
beer framing. There was three bedrooms of bathroom I think,
and we stripped it back, installed a vapor sorry a

(01:20:12):
weather tight barrier just to protect ventilation from the inside
because we didn't change the cladding, changed the windows to
PVC windows and insulated it. Then used plywood for two
reasons to generally know to have structure as well as
an air tight layer on the walls and then an
air tight layer on the ceilings. Of ventilation system. So
we did a prelim blower door test on that particular

(01:20:34):
side of the house and it was seventeen air changes
per hour if you're familiar with If people are familiar
with that, that's quite high. There's standard air changes for
new construction in New Zealand, even new builders sits around
between four and seven ear changes per hour. So every
time you lose the volume.

Speaker 11 (01:20:51):
Of house and.

Speaker 20 (01:20:54):
Through air leaks is that's the energy that you're creating
to heat your house is going out with it. So
that's why it costs so much to heat.

Speaker 6 (01:21:02):
Yeah, that's I mean, that's I just think that having
a And the other thing that I think is really
cool about the guide is that it's made by people
who are getting their hands dirty doing this stuff. Right. Yeah, absolutely,
So check it out online. Just have a search for
super Reno or the super Home Guide. You'll find all

(01:21:23):
that information there. Dan, really appreciate your time this morning.
It's it's fabulous. Would have loved to have been there,
but I'm in christ Church next year, so we'll have
a look. My pleasure all the rest of you. Dan
take care. So check it out, folks, And if you're

(01:21:46):
in christ Church, you know the tours do come around
fairly regularly, so keep an eye on that. But if
you're about to do some renovations and you want to
know about better performance, maybe having a house that's just
going to be more comfortable, then check out the super
Reno and the super home movement. You'll find some great

(01:22:06):
nation there. Now coming up after the news, one of
the big stories this year in terms of building legislation,
is an announcement by the government that they will require
in the future a ten year home warranty scheme. What
does it look like. Well, inevitably, when things don't go well,
it's the lawyers that get involved. So let's talk to
barrister and solistor Michael Thornton after the News at eight

(01:22:30):
o'clock his thoughts on the new warranty scheme.

Speaker 1 (01:22:37):
Helping you get those DIY projects done right the resident
builder with Peter Wolfcat calls.

Speaker 6 (01:22:46):
In the last couple of days, the government have announced
further changes to the Building Act. This one involves mandatory
home warranties. I've listened to the minister talk about it.
I've seen some comment from the sector. Everybody's got an opinion. Inevitably,
if there's a dispute, you're going to end up talking
to your lawyer. So let's do exactly that. Mike Thornton,

(01:23:08):
friend of the show, has been with us on this
program a couple of times. Very good morning, Thank you
very much for your.

Speaker 7 (01:23:13):
Time, No problem, Peter, glad to be here.

Speaker 6 (01:23:17):
So Mike, it's basically where this I think started, is
that the government announced a little while ago that they
were going to change from joined in several liability in
terms of building disputes through to proportional liability. So where
council was often last man standing and would pay out
the entire claim, that's not going to be the case.

(01:23:39):
So there's going to be a gap. How do we
plug that gap? Well, let's introduce mandatory home warranties. Is
that too simplistic?

Speaker 7 (01:23:47):
No, that's exactly right, Peter. What happens now and will
be changed in twenty twenty seven, I think, is that
where you have a number of parties that are liable
for the same damage ie council, a builder, and architect,
and they're liable for the full of out of the
same damage. Where one party can't contribute its share of

(01:24:12):
that damage to a settlement or to a judgment. If
the matter goes to court, the other party is also
liable for that damage and can be required to pay.
And the anecdotal viewer is that is most likely to
be counseled because they have no councils, have no solvency issues.
So that's changing to a system called proportionate liability, where

(01:24:34):
it says in a scenario where a court determines who
is liable. It will determine the amounts of each liability,
and each party only has a liability to pay their
share of that amount. So in the classic scenario of
a builder being liable for all of the damage to
a house and the council being liable for it, that

(01:24:57):
the share is being determined eighty percent builder, twenty percent council.
So will you have other parties in the mix that
can vary in that, But that that would mean where
your builder is insolvent, you as the homeowner and only
recover the twenty percent from the council, and you would
have to be the shortfall of eighty percent because your

(01:25:19):
builder is insolvent.

Speaker 6 (01:25:21):
Right, And I guess in a perfect world you'd say,
if there's a defect with a building, you'd bring your
builder and the builder would come round and sort it out,
or the plumber would turn up with a sparky, or
whichever trade was involved. Now, obviously we don't live in
a perfect world. So the proposal seems to say that
every new build and every renovation over one hundred thousand

(01:25:42):
dollars is going to be you must have a mandatory
home warranty attached to it at this stage. From my
point of view, what I know is that new Zeale
Certified Builders Master Builders Association, they offer to their members
a warranty scheme, and there is one other insurer in

(01:26:03):
the market that also offers home warranty schemes. But it
doesn't feel like that's enough.

Speaker 7 (01:26:11):
Well there are. It's a suite of measures that the
Minister has said, we'll deal with the whole issue of
the construction industry being too contents, being too slow, and
will generate more activity in the market. So let's just
isolate what the three of them are, because I'll come

(01:26:32):
to the warranty one because I think that's the most
important one. The first one is all designed professionals will
need professional demnity insurance. Not much of a change because
of them. Anyway, ramping up the fines for offenses against
against negligent builders into the LBP from ten to twenty

(01:26:54):
thousand a great thing. It will probably drive out the
more negligent builders. And the third thing is, well, look,
if you've got the shortfall that I just described as
the homeowner, how is the what are the consumer protection
measures in place for the homeowner? Now? What's been released
by and described by the Minister with the assistance of

(01:27:18):
Malcolm Fleming from CBA is there's going to be a
mandatory home warranty requirement and that's for any construction over
or alterations over one hundred thousand dollars or more. Now
you've correctly identified. At the moment there's only three providers. Now.
Two of them are what I'm going to call building

(01:27:38):
associations that offer guarantees to homeowners who enter into a
contract to have their home built by a member of
their association. Ye. Now, there are various issues around how
that all works, and essentially you can't get that guarantee
unless you've signed a contract with a member of that association.

(01:27:59):
So one issue is, well, if it's going to be
a mandatory home warranty, does that mean that all builders
are going to have to be members of these associations
or will there be another provider? Now the other provider
out there at the moment is Stamford. They provide a
building warranty product. They don't it's not tied to a

(01:28:20):
building contract. They would probably want to see the contract,
but it's not tied to a contracts in the same
way as the Master Build and CP Association guarantees are,
but I think there was last time I came on
the show, there was a recent there was a comment
by the head of Stamford saying, we're not really interested

(01:28:42):
in underwriting negligent builders because we've got the builders that
we want to cover, and we know they're going to
do a good job, and we know our assessment of
the risk. We're not really interested in stepping up to
ensure these guys. So he's a really big question around
This is essentially going to need to be an insurance
backed product because what has been announced is that providers

(01:29:07):
of the home warranties will need to demonstrate that they
can effectively be insurers in my assessment of it, because
the technical description is that they can meet actuarial and
operational requirements and stand by claims for a ten year
period verified through an independent audit, and that essentially means
credential requirements similar to that of an insurer. Have you

(01:29:30):
got the money to pay out a claim in year ten?
Right now at the moment, we just simply don't know
whether those associations have the capacity to underwrite that level
of insurance because they aren't required because they're not insurers.
They aren't required to publish any information about their financial position,

(01:29:55):
claims paying ability. You know, there's ratings for all insurers
in terms of, you know, how well they are rated
in terms of how they pay. None of that applies
to these guys because they're not actually insurers. Is that
is that going to mean that they're going to become insurers?
And if so, do they offer that insurance that warranty

(01:30:17):
to the market is it or is it or is
it linked to only two members of their association and
homeowners who sign a contract with members of their association.
That's the first point. There's also issues around level of
cover and how and how and how the policies work because,

(01:30:40):
for example, as it's been alluded to and the information
provided by the by the Minister, there's three types of cover.
There's your loss deposit. That's if you pay some money
to a builder any buggers off with excuse my French,
that's that's that's pretty straightforward. There's non completion, so that's
defects during construction, and there's everything that happens after the bill.

(01:31:01):
So that's your ten year, that's your ten years. Well,
the noncompletion issue is sometimes the hardest because where you
get into a scenario where your builder has created defects
during construction. The current situation, certainly with the master Bill guarantee,
is you have to exhaust all your legal rights to

(01:31:23):
get the builder to come and to fix the defex Now,
that can be a problem, and it can be an
expensive problem. Effectively, you might need to engage a lawyer.
And I've been involved in very difficult and protected disputes
that have brought work to an end while we attempted
to negotiate with a builder are returned to site to
complete deficts. Now where there are arguments about where the

(01:31:45):
defects are, access store the builder's own money, that can
take a long time, and effectively the guarantee doesn't pay
out unless your builder can't do the work or ie
is insolvent, and then the guarantee will pay. So what
happens in the scenario where there are there are other

(01:32:06):
parties that might also be liable for the work, such
as the designers who now have professed indemnity insurance. How
in the scenario that we are working presently, if all
of those parties, if a homemowner brings a claim against
all of those parties, typically at some point in time,
everyone sits down and negotiates a settlement based on their

(01:32:28):
assessment of liability. Well, in this warranty scenario, will it
mean that the homeowner will get a full in what
we call an indemnity, a payment for the defects from
the warranty provider, or will other parties have to contribute?
And if so, how will that actually happen? Because most
insurers don't like seeing other parties not pay their fair share.

(01:32:53):
In fact, that presumably is the entire reason behind proportionate liability.
It is you should be paying the amount that you
are liable for. It shouldn't be falling on other other
parties who who aren't who are jointly liable for it,
but their share is their share of the actual liability
is much less. Soon we've got those issues, But I

(01:33:16):
guess the biggest issue is this is an insurance product
and at the moment we're being told by the association
players that they can scale up, but there's no idea
at this stage of what that's going to look like.
So it's very very uncertain. It might it might work,

(01:33:40):
and if it drives building standards and gets rid of
what the Minister calls cowboys. We're all for it. I'll
be out of a job, but that'll be a great
thing because you won't all the defects will be getting fixed.
I don't think I will, because in the scenario that
I've just described, there's likely to still be people needing

(01:34:01):
advice around these issues. But that would be a good thing, right,
we would drive standards, and that's the whole point of this.
But at the moment, until we get more guidance around
how that warranty scheme is going to work, it's really
difficult to make an assessment of whether it might work.
And I guess the other thing. The other thing to

(01:34:23):
mention is that there's there might well, and I know
this government will probably not want to be involved in
any way and underwriting it itself. That has happened in
overseas jurisdictions when private private insurers have failed. So it's
all it's all very very uncertain, and some of what's
being offered as a solution has a number of issues

(01:34:47):
that need to be questioned and I guess ironed out
before it's the full scheme is announced.

Speaker 6 (01:34:53):
We can see sort of the general direction, but you're right,
the details, it's not terribly transparent. I mean, I do
wonder whether we might end with us is that. I
agree with you. I think what we need is better standards, right,
and I guess there's a couple of different ways of
achieving that. And you can imagine a scenario, let's say
in five years time, where all of the new builds

(01:35:16):
require an insurance all work over one hundred thousand dollars,
and that's not a particularly big renovation these days also
will require this mandatory home warranty. There will be a
certain group of builders who just won't be able to
get that right their reputation as such, or their track
record with counsel, or they've had a claim and an

(01:35:37):
insurer won't reinsure them for further work and they'll be
driven out. And you could argue, well, that's not a
bad thing, and I wonder whether this is part of
what this legislation is designed to do.

Speaker 7 (01:35:50):
I completely agree, and I think there will be an
excellent thing. And if that's if that's what this this
scheme of changes produces, that would be an excellent outcome,
and I fully support the intention behind it. Yes, we're
always I think in this country was sometimes led by

(01:36:11):
what's happening overseas, most notably over the ditch, and there
have been a number of ways that they've gone about it,
and they've had For example, I think some states have
compulsory build a liability insurance and other schemes have the
home warranty schemes and governments back some of it back.
It all can work, I guess, but until we see detail,

(01:36:32):
we don't know. And will it drive standards? We hope so,
because then homeowners we get houses built that that didn't
have problems, which was as an excellent thing.

Speaker 6 (01:36:43):
That would be an excellent thing. I think what we'll
do is once a little bit more detail comes out,
we'll get you back on the show. I really appreciate
your time as always. Michael Thornton, barrister and solicitor. You
can find them on the web as well. Much appreciated Michael,
take care.

Speaker 7 (01:36:58):
No problem, Pete, thanks a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:36:59):
All the best news talks there'd be measured wise God
was God. Maybe call Pete first, feed your warf gap.
The resident builder news talks that'd be.

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Speaker 2 (01:38:22):
News Talk said B.

Speaker 6 (01:38:25):
Yeah, News Talks hed B. Just before the break, we
had a chat with Mike Thornton, who is a barrister
and solicitor does a lot of work in the whole
building spirits, building defects, side of things. So a bunch
of techts that have come in. I think it's something
that will probably talk about maybe next week on the show,

(01:38:45):
certainly in weeks to come. Here's a sample of what
people are saying as a response to the conversation I
had with Mike. Will this stop a builder declaring bankruptcy
and just starting up another country, another company the following week.
It's a very good question, Pete. I wish the new
legislation about negligent builders architects was around when I had

(01:39:06):
three leaky properties, all purchased off the plans. Never do that.
Thank you Kathy for that one, Pete. Is this a
cop out for the government who make the rules? Everything
gets built by chairs from Bob morning Peak Master bill
to guarantee is not insurance, as your man has said,
it will still require legal action. Getting an insurance policy
to cover what will be required is nine impossible and

(01:39:30):
very expensive. So again, the only person who pays will
be the homeowner. At any one stage, I could pay
a premium on insurance policy and maybe two hundred houses
in a rolling ten years. This is not going to
be an easy fix. No, it's not. The whole change
is a joke. The council has to be the last
stop and do a bigger and better job inspecting, or

(01:39:54):
the market will have no builders to work as the
risk will be too high to bother says Sean. I'm
not criticizing, but do you do realize you've just driven
building costs up twenty to thirty percent. Well, I don't
think that I've particularly done that, but you know, one
of the common criticisms is, let's introduce the warranty scheme,
let's introduce the insurance and let's not expect that that's

(01:40:18):
going to add to the cost of building, because it
will inevitably someone's going to be paying for it, and
chances are it's going to be the homeowner. Anyway, it
is a topic that we will discuss probably again in
the near future, because this is legislation that's on its way.
It is a seismic shift in the way in which we,

(01:40:40):
I suppose, seek redress for defects in our buildings. If
you recall, she would have been about two almost three
years ago. Actually, we had a guest on the show,
class Leon, who is a lawyer also a barrister and
solicitor working in Sweden. I've known him for twenty years.

(01:41:02):
This is a field that he works in quite a
lot because the European model, or the Swedish model, is
that every single contractor is insured and so these implied
warranties are part of every build. Council have a very
much a backs seat role in terms of looking after

(01:41:23):
buildings and ensuring that if there are any defects, it
gets fixed. So here where council's inevitably last man standing
for one of a better phrase. That's not the case
in Sweden. As it happens at dinner with him just
the other night, talking about updates, talking about things that
we had discussed a couple of years ago about how

(01:41:44):
they do things in Sweden seems to be how we
are going to be starting to do things in New
Zealand in the future. But in walking with him today
we were having a bit of a chat about that.
I said, well, how many insurers? He said, well, every
single insurer will offer a warranty scheme for a new build,
and I'm thinking, well, in New Zealand right now is

(01:42:06):
one that I'm aware of and it's probably not going
to be your insurance. So we've got some interesting stuff
to talk about on this going forward. But right now,
let's change gear. Let's get into the garden. Her red
climb past is with us. Let's talk all things gardening
and the wonderful world of bugs.

Speaker 1 (01:42:22):
After the break doing up the house, storning the garden,
asked Pete. For ahead the Resident Builder with Peter Wolfcamp,
call oh eight eighty ten eighty News Talks EDB. For
more from the Resident Builder with Peter Wolfcamp. Listen live
to News Talks EDB on Sunday mornings from six, or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio