July 13, 2026 • 55 mins
Karima Hazim is the co-founder of Sunday Kitchen, Sydney's beloved Lebanese cooking school, which she runs with her mother. Together they turned a love of family food and storytelling into a sell-out weekly institution and a cookbook.
In this episode of The Edit, Karima joins Home Beautiful Editor-in-Chief Elle Lovelock for a tour of her century-old home in Drummoyne, full of framed photos of Beirut and Tripoli, a big Tasmanian oak dining table and a kitchen bench that is never, ever bare. She talks about growing up Lebanese in Sydney, the fashion degree that shaped the way she tells stories, and why having her daughter Layla was the moment that led her back to her mother's kitchen.
Plus, Karima shares her philosophy on produce as decor, why she hates kitchens with hidden appliances and the secrets behind cooking a great Lebanese spread.
This episode covers:
- Growing up Lebanese in Sydney
- Lebanese hospitality
- A tour of her century-old home in Drummoyne
- Cookbooks as storybooks
- A fashion and design degree and the storytelling skills it transferred
- How becoming a mum to Layla led her back to her mother's kitchen
- The founding of Sunday Kitchen, how it grew, and what makes it different from a regular cooking class
- Her cookbook Sofra: Lebanese Recipes to Share
- Lebanese food tips and why you should find your local Middle Eastern grocer
- Inherited butcher and baker loyalties
- Weekly go-to recipes: lemon and garlic chicken tray bake, and a fattoush salad prepped fresh every weekend
- Design crimes, kitchen edition: hidden utensils and bare benches
- The mystery drawer: a special item brought back from Lebanon
- What makes a home beautiful
Photo Credits: @sundaykitchenau
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Credits:
Host: Elle Lovelock
Guest: Karima Hazim
Edited by: Leah Porges
Head of Vodcasting: Rachel Fountain
With thanks to our wonderful Home Beautiful team.
The Edit is a production of Home Beautiful and Are Media.
https://www.homebeautiful.com.au/home-beautiful-the-edit-podcast/
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
So what do you look for in Lebanese bread.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
We've just got a brand that we've always bought, and
you inherit that brand in your family, Like my mum
went to the Kinderberry Bakery. So the Lebanese gross cell
will get bread from six to eight different bakeries. They're
all making the same thing. Oh my god, you need
to have every version of variety because you're going to
(00:23):
have a customer that does not want and discriminates against
that bread and wants the other bread.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I'm El Lovelock, editor in chief of Home Beautiful. Welcome
to the edit where we bring you into the beautiful
homes with the people who create them. There's a certain
kind of home that feels immediately alive the moment you
walk through the door, where the kitchen bench is never
quite clear, where there's always something baking, something beautiful sitting
(00:51):
in a bowl just because it was too good to
walk past at the market. That's the kind of home
that Carema has em keeps and it tells you everything
that you need to know about who she is. Kareema
is the co founder of Sunday Kitchen, Sydney's beloved Lebanese
cooking school run with her mother and co author of Souffra,
a cookbook that is as much about culture, memory, and
(01:14):
belonging as it is about food. Today, she joins us
to talk about what a home should feel like, why
her kitchen is deliberately never too tidy, and what it
really means to cook not just four people, but with them.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Kareem and welcome to the edit.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Thank you, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
It's an absolute pleasure's cleasure too. We've already started chatting.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
We have We couldn't help ourselves.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
I know. And it's always it's always such a shame
that we don't have the cameras on earlier.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Oh my god, friend, probably.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Wire because the conversation just sometimes it just flows. I
feel like we've known each other for ages, but we
just met. The thing that I just love that you
were saying before was about your kids and screen time.
So we're talking about the chaos of having young children.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, you've got two daughters.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Yes, Leila and Eden. So Leila has just turned nine yep,
and Eden will be turning seven. So we're kind of
out of the really high needs doing everything for them,
and now it's more monitoring what they're doing and stepping
in when you need to.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yes, And I asked if they get along and if
they're chatty with each other, and and you said yes, because.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Well they kind of have to because they've only got
each other. We've got a no screen and like no
tech policy during the week.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I love it, do you?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
They don't love it? I tell you, they don't love it.
You know what they've they've come to love it, and
they've come to completely accept it now, like and what
it has done is re reignited their relationship. I mean,
and we started it when Leila was in kindergarten. She's
in year three now, so they've completely forgotten what it's
like to be watching TV anytime during the week. But
(03:09):
they really only have each other. They wake up very
early in the morning and school doesn't start till just
after nine, so they've got sometimes two and a half hours,
and like, what are you going to do? So we've
got puzzles out, and we've got some play doo out,
and we're drawing and we're doing those sorts of things.
So they do get along because they kind of have
to get along, and then they look forward to movie
(03:30):
night on Friday. So we start after school. We have
our showers, we have dinner, and we sit down and
watch a movie. And we used to do that when
I was growing up. You know, yeah, that was you know,
we didn't have Netflix or anything, so you had to
wait to see what was on TV on TV and
no matter what it was, we got together and sat
down and watched a movie. So they get to have
(03:51):
that now.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
That's so sweet. What was your family home like growing up?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
So we're Lebanese and I've got two sisters, so we're
three girls. Mom and dad both worked. We were sort
of always very busy with after school activities and we
always had people over on the weekend. My mum would
put on these beautiful lunches for us growing up, and
you know, always found a way to get family and
friends together around food. So definitely food was the center
(04:20):
of our home.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
So what what else do your girls do? Then?
Speaker 1 (04:24):
If they're playing with each other, they're playing their games.
We were talking before about the mess that comes with
that because a screen is very tight tidy, yes, but activities,
you know.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
They make mess. What's your home like now?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So you have to kind of surrender to the mess,
which was a challenge for me at the beginning. Because
you know, it's a very big part of our culture
as well, Like you have to have an immaculate home
all the time in terms of like keeping it really
clean and neat and tidy in case someone just drops in,
(05:00):
Like yeah, it's a very typical Lebanese thing, like the
house is always going to be, Like even if mum
comes over, the first thing she wants to do is, well,
there's dishes in the sinking, let me help you with that,
or she'll go into my laundry and say, I'll put
a load on fame like mum. So I always try
to make sure that everything is done so that I
don't have I don't sort of have the spotlight on that.
(05:20):
So when you've got kids and you don't want them
on screens, you don't want them watching a TV. They've
got to play and they've got to make mess. So
I have completely surrendered to the mess now, dear, I
actually enjoy looking at it. Like we've got this really
old chocolate brown cabinet in my kitchen and it's got
(05:42):
all of their arts and craft supplies because they do
so much arts and craft, and it's such a big mess,
but it's a beautiful mess. It is a point that
you look at when you walk into my kitchen, and
it just means that they are part of the furniture
in the house, engrossed in it, using up every space
of it. You know, they hang up their artworks everywhere
(06:03):
because I love, you know, random pictures and photos. If
I'm traveling or if I see something that I love
and inspires me, I will buy it, get it framed,
could be a piece of like tapestry or whatever it is.
I've got so many different types of things up on
the walls, so they want to add to that as well.
You know, they've got things stuck everywhere.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
I'd love to know more about the So the cultural
importance of having a tidy home or a welcoming home
is that based in hospitality.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Where does that come from?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Like, naturally, as Lebanese people, we are extremely hospitable. That's
sort of like our driving characteristic. And you know, we
take so much pride in our home and whenever we're
inviting family, friends, whoever is coming, it's our home immediately
becomes their home. So we want them to feel extremely comfortable.
(06:57):
And this is why there is a lot of this
sort of I wouldn't say pressure but it's like this
underlying thing, like the house has valued. Yeah, really, so
that was something that And I mean, I'm someone who
loves to cook. I'm cooking. I cook for work and
I cook for fun and play, So I'm cooking all
the time. My kitchen is the most used space in
(07:19):
my home. The byproduct of that is it's impossible to
keep that area of the house immaculate all the time. Like, yeah,
you know, my dishrack is always full because I'm always
doing dishes because I'm always cooking, and that sort of thing.
I've had to completely let go of a lot of
sort of things that I grew up with, a lot
of the expectation around you know, even when you're hosting,
(07:43):
the host will get up and start cleaning up while
the guests are there, never let the guests help. But
it had to be done straight away because God forbid
we leave the dishes in this thing buga that I
don't do that anymore because I want to spend time
I'm with my guests and I don't want them to
pa getting all worked up because the worst thing is
(08:04):
you've just had a beautiful lunch and you don't want
to be sitting there and watching the person who cooked
for you clean in front of you as well.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
I think it's uncomfortable for everyone exactly.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
So, I mean when our guests are Lebanese, they kind
of understand it, so there's never going to be and
I mean they will always fight and come in and
want to help, and they end up just drying. We
don't give them any of the difficult tasks. But now
I just give everything a little bit of a rn,
scrape most of it into the.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Bin and just leave it.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Sometimes I leave it over mind.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Oh I do too, amazing.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
I only discovered this two years ago and I was like,
and I've been hosting since I got married ten years ago,
and I was like, why was I doing this? Actually
enjoyable to pack down your kitchen the next morning, I know,
with a podcast on or exactly music on.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Do you justify it to yourself because I like to say, oh,
I need to let it soak. It'll clean better if
I let it soak overnight.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I just don't care. I'm like, I am, I am
not doing that now. I'm going to do it tomorrow.
It took a while, you know what. It was like
the light just switched on and I was like, what
we can not one's watching me exactly. We have this
fear someone's watching and judging us. Anyway, just as long
as no one's rocking up like my mother in law's
not rocking up first thing the next morning.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
So if I were to come over to your house
on the weekend, take us all on a tour. So
I'd love for you to describe what does it look
like you open the door, what's the first thing we see?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Oh? I love my house. We have been living in
Droumoine for five years now. We are in a really
really old house. So I think my house was built
over one hundred years ago and it's still in its
same sort of still got the same facade, like a
pitched roof queen and really really old scage. Yes, it
(10:03):
is gorgeous and I'm an old soul, so I definitely
didn't want to do any alterations to the house, not
that we can afford to right now, but anyway, we'll
all get to it. I mean, even if we could
and when we are able to. I have always said
to my husband that I just want to do touch
ups and never want to do any door remake. It's
(10:25):
beautiful anyway, so really quaint and quite old, and when
you come in you are immediately greeted with lots of pictures.
So I've got old photos of Lebanon, so Beirut or
Tripoli where my family are from. And we've got a
beautiful sort of mirror when you walk in, and then
(10:46):
immediately the first thing you can see is the water
because we live on the Bay Run, so the bay
is there or the boats are there. So it's a
very very nice aspect, very nice. It's a immediately when
you see the water, you feel a sense of relaxation,
like you just come in, you just chilled straight away.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
So do you ever run the Bay Run?
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Yeah? I do the I did it this morning in
the rain too. Yeah. So yeah, you walk in and
I've got a big, beautiful entertaining kitchen. So that was
definitely the part of the house that I fell in
love with when we were you know, when we saw
the house and my husband sort of looked at me
and he said, this like, this is your kitchen.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
You know what makes it your kitchen? What does it
look like?
Speaker 2 (11:30):
It's very open, there's a very big island kitchen, island
bench in the in the middle of it. Very very open.
There's a big sort of window that kind of looks
out to the water and it's got stained glass, So
this bright green and pink stained glass window, which is gorgeous,
like very very me. In a dream world, I would
(11:52):
take away all of the cabinets and have them exposed.
I love exposed shelves and sort of because I collect
everything from platters to cropery, and.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
They can be like works of art.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
They are works of art, like I love looking at them.
So yeah, in my dream kitchen, it would be just
stripping back those cabinets and having them on display. I
also love collecting water and pestles do I love water?
They are and I always find really beautiful ones. And
even though I've got I don't know ten, I reckon
(12:25):
twelve of them. I don't necessarily use them all, but
they're just so beautiful to look at. Some of made
of stone, some made of marble, some made of wood.
So I'd love to have them on display. But it
is a definitely an entertaining kitchen and everything is out
for you to look at, and I love that like big.
You know, if I've gone to the markets and found
(12:47):
the most beautiful pomegranates, or tomatoes, or buy a box
of them so I can put them in a big
bowl and have that sitting in the center.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Because love that.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I love that produce as their core. That's very much
my style.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
So take us through from the kitchen we do. What
do you see next?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Directly opposite the kitchen is the dining table. I've got
a really long Tasmanian oak dining table, so very rustic.
It hasn't been sort of shaved down and it's still
got its organic side grain on it. It's a very
commanding table, which I love. And that is the center.
(13:24):
That's where everything happens. That's where everybody comes to the
best moments living in that house have happened around that table.
And it overlooks the water, so that's exactly where you
sit down and you can sort of you just relax.
We open up the bifold doors and we've got a
very small sort of entertaining balcony. It's very cute. That's
(13:47):
got the aspect. And then we've got a really enormous pool,
so the backyard is completely taken up by swimming pool.
So it's because it's such an old bill build back
in the day when you could basically put a swimming
pool the size of your backyard.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
That's what we've got.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Who needs green exactly? So that yeah, that's that's a beautiful,
beautiful part of the house. But behind the dining table
is my lounge room. And I love that room because
it's got an enormous bookshelf. It is so beautiful. It's
sort of floor to ceiling. The TV is it's not
(14:26):
even built to have a TV. We found a way
to wedge your TV in the middle of it, but
originally it wasn't built to fit a TV. And it's
got all of my cookbooks and I have hundreds of cookbook.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
How then have you been collecting cookbooks?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
I think I've been collecting them from for about gosh,
since I was eighteen, so twenty years ago almost. Yeah,
I've got some really beautiful oldies. I've got some of
my mum's Australian Women's Weekly cookbooks in there as well,
so I've got kind of a vintage section and then
(14:59):
all of you know, it's my work. I love cookbooks.
They're like storybooks to me.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
I am loving getting to know Kareema. We'll be back
with more in just a bit. Tell us more about
your career in food. So I think for people who
who don't know you, it will be just so fascinating
to share the story. And then for people who are
(15:28):
just total fans for them to hear maybe some snippets
they haven't heard before.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Okay, I had a very untraditional and unconventional sort of
entry into food. I sort of just wedged my way
into the food world. I have a fashion design background.
That's what I studied. When I left school, I went
to UTS and did a fashion degree. It was a
(15:56):
very long, grueling degree. It was difficult in so many
ways and fascinating in so many ways, I guess, and
I've spoken about this before. The fascinating thing about it
is what the degree taught me more than anything was storytelling.
The medium was fashion, and I have been able to
(16:17):
apply so much of that learning and knowledge and just
change the medium up to food.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Isn't that incredible?
Speaker 1 (16:25):
I love that for people who are listening, who are
thinking about I don't love what I'm doing at the moment.
Skills are absolutely transferable, totally in ways you don't expect
like there is and.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I mean, the landscape now has evolved so much in
the sense that you can literally do whatever you want
with your skills, just as long as you persistently stay
at it. So I think after so I worked in fashion,
I definitely didn't love it because it was a hobby
(17:02):
of mine and it was something I was so interested
in and loved. But loving something and having a hobby
is one thing, and then working in it and accepting
all of the layers that come with that job is
a completely different thing. So when I got married and
had my daughter, Laila, I was sitting at home thinking
what am I going to do? Like, what is to
(17:25):
me going to be worth leaving this little child behind
and going back into it was definitely not going to
be fashion. My mom is a remarkable cook. I don't
say that because she's my mom. I say it because
she really is such a beautiful cook. She enjoys it,
(17:45):
She respects ingredients the way I've really never seen anyone
do before. And she made me like I didn't even
realize the role food played in our life, how much
inspiration I drew from cooking with her and just food
being the center of our worlds. So as soon as
(18:06):
I got married, I would have lunches and just host
my friends. You know, I'm nearly weird. A lot of
my friends got married at the same time, and so
they'd come over for lunch and I would have a
table spread full of food, and my girlfriends, jaws on
the ground, were like, how did you do this? Yeah,
(18:27):
because coming from a Lebanese family, although food is the
center of our world, it's not like our moms put
the time and effort or even wanted to teach us
how to cook, because they did not come all the
way across the world and leave wars and their families
and whatever they left to teach their kids how to cook.
(18:47):
They wanted us to go to university to get an education,
to make something of ourselves, Like cooking is just something
that you do at home. So no, no, no, don't you know,
I don't need your help go and study. I don't
need your help, go to UNI or whatever. It was.
So a lot of my girlfriends didn't actually learn how
to cook from their moms, and inherit this confidence that
(19:10):
I all of a sudden had. I said to her,
why don't we You know, my friends have sort of
challenged me. I told them that I could teach them
how to cook very easily. This is a really easy
menu so it was. I remember it was a lamb
like a lambs shoulder on rice and all the sides
that Mum would always put around it. And I found
(19:30):
a kitchen in Roselle. The first class had fifteen people
in it that most of them were my friends, and
my mom was completely against it because she was like,
I'm not a chef. How can I teach people cook?
I said, Mom, you have been cooking your entire life.
You are an amazing cook. If you could teach me
(19:52):
how to cook, you can teach them how to cook.
So that's where it started. We brought them into the
kitchen and then that grew. I told their friends, and
all of a sudden we had another class and we
were teaching a class almost every fortnight out of that
little kitchen. And then a publisher in the UK, Hardi
Grant in the UK approached us and said would you
(20:15):
like to write a cookbook? And Mom and I put
a cookbook together. So I think the cookbook really cemented
to me that I have something to say in terms
of sharing our Lebanese culture, sharing our Lebanese Australian heritage,
sharing our food. I mean, you look at Australia, it's
extremely multicultural. The people who were coming to our classes,
(20:37):
the guests who were coming were all walks of life,
all nationalities. Everybody had this same love and understanding and
just desire to want to cook or learning new recipe
or learn about ingredients. So yeah, after the cookbook, I
really then sort of took to social media because I
(20:57):
realized that I was only able to read each a
certain amount of people in the class. I mean there
was only ever fifteen guests because we kept it very
very intimate, and it wasn't a class where you came
in and chopped an onion and sort of followed a recipe.
It was a class where we did so much storytelling.
We spoke so much about ingredients and let them taste
all of the exotic, you know, Middle Eastern spices and ingredients,
(21:21):
and then gave them and then we all cooked together.
We cooked how we would cook at home, and then
everybody sort of joined in and shared their own stories
and their own anecdotes. Because we're all children of migrants,
we all came with different cooking, Like food is such
a center in so many people's lives.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Did you only do it on Sundays?
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, we only taught them on Sundays, which is why we.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
Called it, so I've been wondering about that.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
They were definitely the first class was inspired by the
lunch as mum would put on. You know, she always
had like this hero protein. So whether it was lamb
or whether it was fish, or whether it was like
you know, spatchcocked chickens that she would stuff. There was
always a rice dish to a company. And then there
(22:06):
were so many sides. That was a big, beautiful salad.
There were a selection of dips, like there was always
bits and pieces because this is how we eat eleven
these people. We never sort of just make one thing
God forbid and put it on the table. It's all
about torture everybody. You imagine, we need to torture everyone.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
At what point did you and your mom go this
is a business. This is not just something we're doing occasionally.
This is a real business. I mean, have you had
that moment.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
We haven't completely had it, only because it's like running
a cooking class is challenging and it's a labor of love.
Like it's no matter how it's not scalable in the
sense because you get burnt out. It takes the whole
day to prep and set up. You can only ever
teach fifteen that's maximum twenty people. It's not going to
(22:57):
have the same impact or effect if you had fifty
to one hundred people. I mean, that's where you'd start
making money. So I guess for us, it was never
about it actually being a business. It was about it
being a really beautiful, welcoming space. I really wanted to
(23:17):
share with people who we are as migrants because I
feel like the conversation never extended beyond oh, you've just
left your home country and you've moved to another country.
So giving people giving our guests perspective on you know,
my grandparents, for example, my mum's parents, they were famous
(23:40):
sweet makers in Triboli. They had the most They had
a sweet empire. So to be able to leave that behind,
my grandfather had one hundred staff working with him. He
was a very prominent figure in his community. My grandmother
became the same. You know, they had fifteen children, so
I come from an extremely big family. For them to
(24:02):
leave all of that behind and comge to a country
on the other side of the world with no plan,
you know, it's like they sat down one day and said,
you know what, I'm going to go to Australia and
we're going to set up shop there and we're going
to They had to pack frantically and leave within two
weeks and come here, so that I need. I wanted
(24:24):
to share that because I knew everyone else in the
room would have someone or some kind of story that
related to that, or would just leave with a stronger
understanding or appreciation for all of the different types of
people that we are so blessed to live with, work with,
(24:44):
be neighbors with, surround ourselves with.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
There is a whole life that has come.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Before the The move that's right, that's right and food
is the most gentle and welcoming way to do that
because I see so many of the guests, like you've
got to imagine, they're all strangers come into this class.
They've got all their layers up, you know, and they're
just sitting there. A lot of them have their own
(25:11):
opinions already. You know, they've lived their own lives, They've
got their own stereotypes and prejudices, and think that they
have this understanding of certain people, certain foods, certain topics
or whatever. All of that comes down because how do
you do that telling talking, you know, sharing where my
family comes from, sharing origins of certain dishes, explaining things
(25:36):
that you're never going to get that information when you
go and have a meal at a Lebanese restaurant. You're
just going to go. Even the food at Lebanese restaurants
is not how we eat. This is how, isn't it.
We definitely eat those dishes. We don't only eat like exactly,
you know. And we made sure that when we did
(25:56):
these classes, we focused on dishes that people have never
heard of. Yeah, I would never think to cook or
to eat and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Do people give you feedback of the dishes that they've
loved the most or been surprised by?
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Definitely what sorts of things.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
Well, first of all, I can't believe how many of
them actually go home and cook the dishes and they
send me photos and you know, they'll say, this has
now become a weekly staple for us, or this has
become like my entertaining go to. Oh, we've got a
vegetarian class, so we really a vegetarian dishes because our
diet is predominantly vegetarian. And I mean people would never
(26:33):
know that because when you go to a Lebanese restaurant.
You're just hammered with meat skewers and guff to skewers
and lambshow and beef show chickenho, it's just meat coming out.
We do not eat like that at all predominantly. I
mean our cookbook Softra I would say eighty five percent
of it is vegetarian. Great, that is how we eat.
So whoever comes to the vegetarian class leaves going I
(26:56):
cannot believe what you guys do with vegetables.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
I will not just designed.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
I wanted to eat meat. This is plenty, This is
so hearty, It's tasty. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
So what is something that you would love to share
with people who are listening about Lebonese food? Is it
something a recipe they should try? Is it a tip,
a bit of advice?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
I love to share this with the guests that come
to our classes or anyone that comes to a cooking
demo that I do. Lebonese Food is not about recipes.
Recipes are a guide and they sort of give you
an understanding of what the ingredients are. You should be
(27:44):
approaching it with a lot of intuition in terms of
like how do I actually cook? What do I love
you know, do I like things to be seed that
little bit extra? Do I love salt? Do I love lemon?
Do I love garlic? Do I love? And I feel
like when you approach it like that, you transform the
dishes into your own, and they become so easy because
(28:09):
they are. I mean a lot of people assume lebonese
food is so difficult.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
To make and so much flavor in it.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
There's so many ingredients and it tastes so good, so
that there must be like a secret there, and it
really isn't. I mean, it's about looking at the recipe.
And I stress this in the class, and I say
to them, take even the cookbook, take it as a guide. Like,
first of all, you've got to make the time for this. Yeah,
(28:36):
you know, this is a style of food that you
want to potter around the kitchen on the weekend. A
lot of the elements can be prepared in advance, which
people don't necessarily know. I mean, we've come from really
big families. There's no way whoever was cooking did it
all that morning.
Speaker 3 (28:53):
I couldn't imagine.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
There's something you can do on the Thursday afternoon that
sort of just sits in the friut till Sunday comes.
It's something that you can do on the Friday. There's
something so little bits and pieces, And I think one
of the most important things is going to a Middle
Eastern grosser, like take sometimes they can be far from
wherever you're living and taking the time to go to
(29:15):
the original source because the authenticity there, the ingredients, the freshness,
the quality, the abundance, you know, I feel like it
just adds that another layer, Like nobody wants to make
tabulli with little packets of parsley. Like you're gonna go
and buy a market bunch of parsley from the Lebanese grosser.
(29:39):
It's only five dollars. Could I'm telling you, it's a
bunch this big. It's about twelve packs of those in there,
and it's so fresh and everything sort of just jumping
at you. Yeah, there's no way, there's no way you
could compare, you know, going there getting that full expire.
(30:00):
Going to a isle of tahini, not a section, it's
an ale because we've got tahini from Yeah, there's like
a tahini. Even Lebanese bread, there's an isle of Lebanese bread.
Because there's like politics about where you buy your bread
from and something really thick on. Some people like this
size and something.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
So what do you look for in Lebanese bread.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
We've just got a brand that we've always bought, and
you inherit that brand in your family, Like my mom
went to the Canterbury bakery. So the Lebanese grosser will
get bread from six to eight different bakeries. They're all
making the same thing. You need to have every version
of variety because you're going to have a customer that
(30:41):
does not want and discriminates against that bread and wants
the other bread. So we inherit bread. We also inherit butchers.
So we've got a allegiance to our butcher. Like I've
been going to my butcher. So my mom went there,
and my grandmother went there. And my grandmother's passed by
the way. You know, she came to Australia in the seventies,
so this was the butcher she went to. My mom
(31:03):
goes there, and I go there. That's what you do,
you go to your mum's.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Could you imagine the shame if you didn't?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Of course, Also, are we're going to hold accountable if
we're not happy with something. We need to have a sauce.
There's only been once my mum has sent me back
to the woodshad and said give this back to him
and tell him I do not want it. It is
not up to scratch.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
It's quite an open dialogue.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And they've seen me in all of my life and
all of my horms.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
You know.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
And I've grown up seeing their sons, their young sons
in soccer gear that are coming after school and training.
And I was with my mum, we're picking up me
and now they're running the shop now and I'm going
to I'm an adult that I've got my kids in
tow with me. So yeah, that's a really that's a
really beautiful thing about community. And I feel like Lebanese
(31:53):
people have done an amazing job of that here in
Sydney and in Melbourne. And that's another part that we're
able to share with our guests. I do a lot
of sharing of that in any social media that I
do and any cooking I always sort of encourage people
to go out and get an experience because we're so
(32:15):
lucky to have access to it. Absolutely once a week
I will go to the so I'll go to green Acre,
and that's sort of the hub for me. My butcher's there,
the gross is there, the bakery is there, and I
sort of do Everybody knows me now, they know what
I do, and so it's almost like I'm going to
(32:36):
see my family. To some extent, they asked me, oh,
what are you doing today and what are you working on?
And it's just become such a big part of my food.
Like I just can't justify getting I don't enjoy getting
my ingredients from anywhere else, and it's part of my
(32:56):
weekly habit now. It's part of my weekly my movements
during the week. And I love taking my kids there
because they get this really big dose of culture and
you know, everybody speaking in Arabic and everybody's carrying on
and there's a chaos and it's I love it.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
It sounds so exciting.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
It is very exciting. It is.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Speaking of weekly rituals and routines, what recipes are on
weekly rotation at your place? Okay, what are your go tos?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
What are my go tos? I actually did this recipe
with The Women's Weekly a few weeks ago. We were
shooting some recipes, so definitely like a lemon and garlic
chicken tray, bake, So that's a very quintessential Lebonese. Yeah,
weekly weeknight dish. My girls love it. It just leaves
the most beautiful aroma in the house.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
They run in from after school and it's the first
thing they can smell, and Laya goes, I know you're
making the chicken trade tonight, and I said, yeah, that's
what we're having tonight. So definitely that on the weekend.
Most weekends, I try and make a really big fatush salad.
The fatush that I make has so many seasonal ingredients,
(34:10):
Like I just get really excited when I go to
the Lebanese grosser and I see big chunky bunches of
a regular rocket and fresh oregano. So I go a
bit mad and buy everything. And then I'll make a
really big salad, leave out the tomatoes, toss it, and
I'll make a dressing and I'll put that in the
(34:32):
fridge and then we will have salad as part of
whatever we're having for dinner. So we'll have a fatush
basically every night, and then I'll add different things to it,
like sometimes I'll add chicken to it, or sometimes we'll
have it next to a steak. If the girl's for
like steak. So that's definitely something that we have.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Why do you leave out the tomatoes.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Because it will spoil the see how they spoil over
a few days. So I'll definitely chop up tomatoes on
the night, I'll just add them. Okay, salad is so colorful.
It's all tossed, it's undressed, it's in an airtight container
because the ingredients are so fresh. So things like fresh pomegranate, cucumber,
(35:10):
capsic and cabbage, all of the herbs, radish, yeah, nice,
and finally chopped up, tossed in a container. And then
I've got a big jar of like pomegranate molasses and
lemon juice and olive oil dressing with the sumac ready
to go. So i just have to take it out,
put it in a bowl and mix it and then
(35:30):
toss it. If I'm going to take everything out to
chop every night, it would exhaust me. So that's like
one of my hacks that I do most weekends, so
that we've got this very vibrant and fresh salad chopped
fist exactly. Well, it doesn't take that long because you're like, well,
you know, instead of cutting too cucumbers, for dinner. I
just cut six or eight of them, and then you
(35:53):
build this big salad.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Are you a knife and chopping board, gal or do
you use one of those little like hats either boxes.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Honestly, I inherited using a paring knife and just cutting
on top of the chopping you r g. Honestly, sometimes
it's so much easier. We're just chop and pop pop
them in. Yes, but that's something my kids help me do.
So they'll do the things like the capsic and the radish,
(36:21):
the cucumber, they're all things that they can chop. Yeah,
so they'll go and start. I'll wash it all for them.
And sometimes they're all awkward shapes and sizes, but it
doesn't matter. It means they're going to eat the salad.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Coming up, it's Design Crimes the Kitchen Edition. I want
to ask a question that's a bit of a tweak
on a question I like to ask our guests, and
that is about design crimes. Okay, I would like for
us to discuss design crimes the Kitchen Edition. Okay, so
(36:56):
we're in the kitchen, yep. What are some of the
biggest or one of the biggest problems you see in
Australian kitchens that you just think, please stop doing that,
or please fix that or change it.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
I would have to say. And I know some people
are going to be completely against me here. I cannot
handle going into a kitchen that has everything hidden and
is completely bare because I don't feel invited in there.
I don't feel like any cooking is happening in here.
(37:32):
So for me, and I mean a lot of my
friends are very guilty of this. I can't see a
single appliance. I can't see are utensils jar? I can't
see anything. Yeah, I can't say it's spotless, it's bear
it's weird, it's weird. I'm like, does anyone eat here?
What are we doing here? So that is like, I mean,
(37:55):
my kitchen in comparison, is just a mess. I have
a beautiful brown VARs that has whatever olive branches or
something that I have found, Like I've gone to my
father in law's house and cut off a stem with
a baby pomming grund. It hanging, and that has to
take center stage. Like I said, I've got fruit on display,
(38:15):
I've got vegetables on display. Whatever's sort of happening. You know,
all of those beautiful serving spoons. I've got them in
their own.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Vas you know, on like flowers.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Show me, Show me how you cooking here and what
you cook him, like what you're doing, Give me some
life in here. I feel like people think that a
kitchen is not a living space. You spend most of
your time nourishing yourself from this space, like it needs
to be full of inspiration. I've got a beautiful poultry
book on the shelf with my cookbook and another Lebanese
(38:49):
cookbook that I love, you know, and then I rotate
the books that go there because obviously I've got a
really big bookshelf, and it's just it's alive. Everybody says
that when they come to my house, they say, your
kitchen is alive. I just want to eat when I'm
in here because I love it. That's what a kitchen is.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
What is something that is always fresh in your home.
It doesn't have to be in the kitchen, it can be,
but something that's always fresh.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
I would have to say produce. Yeah, I think if
if someone saw my produce bill every year, like that's
my vice. That's something that I just like, I will
go to the shops for one thing and I will
come back with because food. I need to have it
with me if I see it. Like the other day
(39:40):
it was Persimon's. I could not walk past them. I
had to buy them. I had to get them. I
put them in my fruit ball and I was like,
you know what, I haven't really baked with persmons before.
I'm gonna like, well, I've got twelve of them. I
have to put them to.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Figure something out.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I have to figure that is honestly, that's definitely something.
You know. I've always got an abundance of lemons. I've
always got whatever is in season and it can sit
in a fruit bowl. I will buy it and then
I use it. I mean, I will find a way.
My friend of mine was picking off those really big,
(40:17):
sort of beautiful mandarins that come in the right in
the middle of winter from his farthest tree in five
close to where I am, and his tree is enormous,
and he put on Instagram if anybody wants some, I'm
going to have so many. He brought me a twenty
five liter bucket from Bunnings full of these mandarins. So
they are now taking center stage on this big wooden bowl,
(40:40):
which I said to my husband, see That's why I
made you pull over in barrel and stop me to
buy this bowl I saw outside. This is what we
needed it for. What was I going to put all
these mandarins in?
Speaker 3 (40:53):
Do you burn candles?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
I do, I do, but I put them in places
like the bathrooms. Oh yeah, in the hallway when you
first walk into the house.
Speaker 1 (41:02):
And do you have a favorite scent? Do you like
or do you mix it up whatever's coming through.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
I can't remember the name of the candle brand. I
wish I could, because it was gifted to me and
the smell was heirloom tomato. You know that smell where
her green flower?
Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yes, the stork you know how it's got that real
love that scent.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Oh god, you've got to smell that as a candle.
Speaker 3 (41:31):
Is it green?
Speaker 2 (41:32):
Yeah, like a dark green? Yes?
Speaker 3 (41:34):
Is it flamingo estate?
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Maybe?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Maybe maybe that's it. Yeah, sister gives it to.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Me and it's nearing the end, and I always when
I put that on, it's got such a gorgeous smells good.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Something about it compliments the product.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
Now, you talked about your kitchen having things out on display.
Speaker 3 (41:53):
Are you a tidy person?
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Are you or are you a like shove everything in
the cupboard kind of gal.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
I would honestly describe myself as like an organized chaos,
Like some people would feel extremely overwhelmed with all of
the stuff that I have out and about. You know,
I don't have a bare wall. There is something on
every single wall, you know, whatever I have fallen in
love with and bought and framed. So yeah, it's it's
(42:19):
definitely not everybody's taste, but it's definitely not messy. It
all makes sense and it's a complete reflection of me,
you know, because everything that I do is inspired by
so many different things. I don't have just one sort
of straight and narrow road. It's very eclectic. My husband
(42:43):
has had to like completely surrender to it. It's like, oh,
so we have that now, Okay.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
I like to tell my husband, I'm not a hoarder,
I'm a collector.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
I'm a collector. Yeah, there's a difference, absolutely, there's a difference.
And you know, back to the plates and platters. So
my two vices are the fresh produce, yeah, and then
collecting the most beautiful platters and serving crockery and stuff cutlery.
And at the beginning, he was like, why do we
(43:14):
need this? And now he understands. He actually bought me
a mortar and pestel because he saw it at a
vintage shop. I don't know where he was. He was
away with his with his friends, and he came back
he goes, I got you something, and he took out
a watar and pestel from the bit of his car,
and I said, oh my god, that is the most.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
He goes.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
I know you love them, and I get it now.
I get this one is not like any of the
ones that you have. I said, see.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Better than diamonds. So with with being so hospitable and
having people over, are you a shoes on or off household?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Now we're shoes on? Yeah, yeah, I don't care. I'll
clean the floor, the face can be cleaned. I would
come from so many you know, so that's a big
taboo in Lebanese culture, like eleven homes your shoes off definitely, wow. Yeah.
I mean my mum was a little bit more relaxed
to it.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Also because I don't feel comfortable taking my shoes off
sometimes sometimes I just want to have my shoes on,
you know, and I feel like I feel violated when
I have to take them off at the door.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
Maybe I haven't done a petty Yeah, maybe I.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Want to keep my shoes on. Yes, anyway, so I
let people put their shoes on. I will clean the
negga like it doesn't. A home is completely supposed to
be lived in. Yeah, and I Yeah, my husband has
really helped, if I think about the last ten years,
he's helped reinstill that in me, because he's like, when
(44:40):
you buy something, or when we have something, whether it's
a house or it's a chopping board, whatever it is, Yeah,
we have it so we can use it, and it
is best when it's used, not, you know, just to
stare at it kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (44:51):
Definitely, Yes, speaking of things, let's do our mystery draw seconds.
So we've asked you to bring something in from from
your home or your life, and I haven't seen it.
I can't wait to find out what it is.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
I've spoken about it the whole episode.
Speaker 3 (45:11):
It is for everybody.
Speaker 2 (45:12):
Listening, A waterer and vessel a baby.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
It is so cute't it gorgeous? Let's give our listeners
an audio description of Okay, are we looking at So?
Speaker 2 (45:26):
I found this when I was on holidays in Lebanon.
This would have been about I don't know, twelve or
thirteen years ago, I wasn't even working in food. So
this is the thing like I have.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
This is a true love thing.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
This is a true love thing. And cooking has really
been such a center in my world growing up, even
when I wasn't even working in it or with it. Yeah,
so when I saw it, I just fell in love
with it. I brought it back with me. So it's
a sort of white and navy blue stone water and yeah,
(46:03):
now I'll tell you I found it at a sort
of beautiful kind of boutique like store. I only use
it when I'm making desserts so that I can ground
grind so if I'm doing like a cinnamon sugar and
I want to grind the elements down into a finer
(46:26):
sort of consistency, or if I'm crushing So sometimes we
use these mastic. They're almost like really tiny stones. It's
an ingredient mastic and you have to grind it down
really finely with sugar so that it can actually penetrate
(46:47):
the food and have flavor, and you can't sort of
when you're using a normal water and pestel. Like I
throw everything in their garlic chili onion whatever. So that's
for my savory cooking, and so I've reserved of this
for whenever I'm doing something sweet. That's the water and
prestle that I use.
Speaker 3 (47:05):
I love it. It looks like just the right size.
Speaker 2 (47:07):
It's the perfect size because you're only ever using like
one or two tablespoons and whatever you're grinding in it.
Speaker 3 (47:13):
It's a beautiful design.
Speaker 2 (47:14):
I wonder you know I paid it. No, It's like
when I bought it, I thought, oh, this is like
nice and small and it can fit in my luggage
and it's not too heavy. But I didn't bother to ask,
like where was it made, who made it? Where is
it from? I just sort of loved it and bought it.
I was I was still living at home then anyway,
and then it's just it's stayed with me, and now
(47:36):
I have twelve of them.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
But then.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
They are all different. I just found a guy on
Etsy in Italy who makes the most beautiful olive green marble.
This is like the Italian ones that they make pesto in. Oh,
and I've got it on.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
It's going to be yes, I look out. What does
being a homemaker mean to you? Or the concept of
a homemaker because I think it's so different to what
it meant decades ago, generations ago. What does it mean
to you?
Speaker 2 (48:12):
For me, it is all about making everyone that lives
in the home and everyone that comes to the home
you feel incredibly welcome and comfortable. You know. I grew
up in one of those families, like I love my family,
but we had a formal salon or living room upstairs
(48:34):
that was like no one sat there, so the you know,
the remote had a perfect covering on it and everything.
You know, we had doilies on the side and my
man had all of her beautiful stuff on the on
the coffee table, and that was a normal thing. Like
if you didn't have one of those rooms, then.
Speaker 3 (48:54):
I mean you didn't have Can you receive people?
Speaker 2 (48:55):
How can you receive people? Because that's where they come
and sit and that kind of thing. Where where is
for me? I want to think that we as a
family feel so comfortable living with all of our beautiful things.
Like when I first moved to my house in Dremoyne,
I fell in love with those linen lounges. Yes, sam
(49:20):
house with all of the pillows. So as soon as
we moved into Jamoye and my daughters were still I
would say three and five. I bought them in white
cream ivory because I loved that color and it suited
the house so much. And then everybody that came over
was like, and you know my husband, I told you
(49:42):
he is all about living in the thing. Yeah, Like,
don't worry. Whatever we do to it, it's supposed we're
supposed to do to it, like enjoy it. We can
clean it. We can. Everybody came and said, how could
you get this. You've got children, this is your only
living room. They're going to get trashed. My mom was like,
he is, Mom, but like this is suicide. They're so expensive,
(50:03):
and you went and bought them for your home, and
you've got young children, you love entertaining, you've always got
people over. And I was like, exactly, Yes, this is
what you're supposed to do. Like home, it's a reflection
of what I love and what I want people to,
you know, come and see when they come in, and
then I want them to sit and enjoy them. I
don't want them to you know. And it's a really
fat sofa. It's long. It's called the Deep Joe or
(50:26):
whatever it is. Yeah, and you your whole body you
can't sort of sit on it and have your knees.
You can't have your back touching the back and your
knees in the ground.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
You and you have to relax into it.
Speaker 2 (50:40):
Do you know how gout that feels, especially if you're
like visiting someone and you're just chilling out. You might
be having a drink. You can see this beautiful view
like it was the lounge. So I feel like slip.
Speaker 3 (50:52):
Covered as well.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
So it's not like you know, a slipcovered design.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
You can take exactly and you can take them off.
Speaker 1 (50:58):
A vanish and back to God. I get a lot
of aish, you know, and.
Speaker 2 (51:03):
Then you just you buy another set. You can buy
the covers, and then you have two seasons. So we
put the white ones on in summer because it's really summery,
and then I've got this beautiful stone dark stone color
in winter. Yeah, and then I've got all my different
throws and like an outpacker pillowcase, and it's so warm,
and we've got a beautiful fireplace that is on every day.
(51:26):
My husband loves a fire. God it drives me mad sometimes.
Speaker 3 (51:29):
Oh I love a fire.
Speaker 2 (51:30):
He loves a fire on, especially if we have people
over and it is like it's cozy, so beautiful about
it in winter. So I feel like, to answer your question,
being a homemaker is all about comfort, and I don't
feel like, especially if you have younger children, you necessarily
(51:54):
need to discount the things that you want to have
in your life you're worried about them getting destroyed. I
mean like, unless you've got tornadoes, you.
Speaker 3 (52:07):
Know the furniture is going to survive.
Speaker 2 (52:09):
It's going to survive, and it's going to take on
its own new life, which it does, and then you know,
you get to have the best of both worlds and
not sort of have to sit and wait or make
anybody uncomfortable if you do have nice things and constantly
being worried about how they are going to survive, because
then their survival relies on your living.
Speaker 3 (52:31):
Absolute.
Speaker 2 (52:33):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
So what to you makes a home beautiful?
Speaker 2 (52:38):
A home is like I immediately associate it with food.
So what makes my home beautiful or what I feel
like completely distracts from all of the esthetics is the
meal that we had, how we had it, where we
had it, And it doesn't even have to be completely
(53:00):
extraordinary in any way. It could just be a beautiful
cheese platter on an afternoon, beautiful music on. But I
feel like food really does add this layer of warmth hospitality,
and you don't need to put bells and whistles on
when you're hosting like there are. So hosting is such
(53:23):
a massive spectrum and there's a big stigma around it
where you need to have you need to put so
much effort in and needs to stress you out. If
you're not stressed, then you're not doing a good job.
It's the complete opposite of that. Sometimes it's making a
cake because you wanted to and then calling your friends
or your neighbors or whoever. It is. Like for me,
(53:43):
it was like one of the school mums and I
said to her, you know what, just bring your ug boots.
I've just made this cake. Granted I had to. I
was writing a recipe and testing a recipe. Let's just
sit down and have a tea and eat the cake
and that kind of thing. So these are all the
hosts moments. You know, they don't have to be they
don't have to tie you out and kill you. They
(54:05):
can just be whatever you want them to be. And
I feel like that is what makes a home so
warm and beautiful Kareema.
Speaker 3 (54:14):
I loved chatting with you.
Speaker 2 (54:16):
I love chatting with you too.
Speaker 3 (54:18):
Thank you so much for joining me here at the edit.
Speaker 1 (54:21):
And I'm really looking forward to our baywalk. How amazing
was that chat with Kareema. Her passion for her culture
and people and food is just infectious, and I got
to say, I can't wait to get cooking some Lebanese
food on my own. I especially loved how she brings
(54:44):
produce into the home, not just to cook with, but
to decorate with it and really teach her daughters about
food before you go. I'd love to ask a favor.
If you've enjoyed this podcast, follow it in your favorite
podcast app, and definitely subscribe to our channel on YouTube.
It will really help more people find us so we
(55:05):
can keep growing our community. We'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (55:17):
This is an Our Media podcast
So what do you look for in Lebanese bread.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
We've just got a brand that we've always bought, and
you inherit that brand in your family, Like my mum
went to the Kinderberry Bakery. So the Lebanese gross cell
will get bread from six to eight different bakeries. They're
all making the same thing. Oh my god, you need
to have every version of variety because you're going to
(00:23):
have a customer that does not want and discriminates against
that bread and wants the other bread.
Speaker 1 (00:31):
I'm El Lovelock, editor in chief of Home Beautiful. Welcome
to the edit where we bring you into the beautiful
homes with the people who create them. There's a certain
kind of home that feels immediately alive the moment you
walk through the door, where the kitchen bench is never
quite clear, where there's always something baking, something beautiful sitting
(00:51):
in a bowl just because it was too good to
walk past at the market. That's the kind of home
that Carema has em keeps and it tells you everything
that you need to know about who she is. Kareema
is the co founder of Sunday Kitchen, Sydney's beloved Lebanese
cooking school run with her mother and co author of Souffra,
a cookbook that is as much about culture, memory, and
(01:14):
belonging as it is about food. Today, she joins us
to talk about what a home should feel like, why
her kitchen is deliberately never too tidy, and what it
really means to cook not just four people, but with them.
Speaker 3 (01:30):
Kareem and welcome to the edit.
Speaker 2 (01:32):
Thank you, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:34):
It's an absolute pleasure's cleasure too. We've already started chatting.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
We have We couldn't help ourselves.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
I know. And it's always it's always such a shame
that we don't have the cameras on earlier.
Speaker 2 (01:45):
Oh my god, friend, probably.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
Wire because the conversation just sometimes it just flows. I
feel like we've known each other for ages, but we
just met. The thing that I just love that you
were saying before was about your kids and screen time.
So we're talking about the chaos of having young children.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
Yeah, you've got two daughters.
Speaker 2 (02:08):
Yes, Leila and Eden. So Leila has just turned nine yep,
and Eden will be turning seven. So we're kind of
out of the really high needs doing everything for them,
and now it's more monitoring what they're doing and stepping
in when you need to.
Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yes, And I asked if they get along and if
they're chatty with each other, and and you said yes, because.
Speaker 2 (02:34):
Well they kind of have to because they've only got
each other. We've got a no screen and like no
tech policy during the week.
Speaker 3 (02:44):
I love it, do you?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
They don't love it? I tell you, they don't love it.
You know what they've they've come to love it, and
they've come to completely accept it now, like and what
it has done is re reignited their relationship. I mean,
and we started it when Leila was in kindergarten. She's
in year three now, so they've completely forgotten what it's
like to be watching TV anytime during the week. But
(03:09):
they really only have each other. They wake up very
early in the morning and school doesn't start till just
after nine, so they've got sometimes two and a half hours,
and like, what are you going to do? So we've
got puzzles out, and we've got some play doo out,
and we're drawing and we're doing those sorts of things.
So they do get along because they kind of have
to get along, and then they look forward to movie
(03:30):
night on Friday. So we start after school. We have
our showers, we have dinner, and we sit down and
watch a movie. And we used to do that when
I was growing up. You know, yeah, that was you know,
we didn't have Netflix or anything, so you had to
wait to see what was on TV on TV and
no matter what it was, we got together and sat
down and watched a movie. So they get to have
(03:51):
that now.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
That's so sweet. What was your family home like growing up?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
So we're Lebanese and I've got two sisters, so we're
three girls. Mom and dad both worked. We were sort
of always very busy with after school activities and we
always had people over on the weekend. My mum would
put on these beautiful lunches for us growing up, and
you know, always found a way to get family and
friends together around food. So definitely food was the center
(04:20):
of our home.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
So what what else do your girls do? Then?
Speaker 1 (04:24):
If they're playing with each other, they're playing their games.
We were talking before about the mess that comes with
that because a screen is very tight tidy, yes, but activities,
you know.
Speaker 3 (04:36):
They make mess. What's your home like now?
Speaker 2 (04:39):
So you have to kind of surrender to the mess,
which was a challenge for me at the beginning. Because
you know, it's a very big part of our culture
as well, Like you have to have an immaculate home
all the time in terms of like keeping it really
clean and neat and tidy in case someone just drops in,
(05:00):
Like yeah, it's a very typical Lebanese thing, like the
house is always going to be, Like even if mum
comes over, the first thing she wants to do is, well,
there's dishes in the sinking, let me help you with that,
or she'll go into my laundry and say, I'll put
a load on fame like mum. So I always try
to make sure that everything is done so that I
don't have I don't sort of have the spotlight on that.
(05:20):
So when you've got kids and you don't want them
on screens, you don't want them watching a TV. They've
got to play and they've got to make mess. So
I have completely surrendered to the mess now, dear, I
actually enjoy looking at it. Like we've got this really
old chocolate brown cabinet in my kitchen and it's got
(05:42):
all of their arts and craft supplies because they do
so much arts and craft, and it's such a big mess,
but it's a beautiful mess. It is a point that
you look at when you walk into my kitchen, and
it just means that they are part of the furniture
in the house, engrossed in it, using up every space
of it. You know, they hang up their artworks everywhere
(06:03):
because I love, you know, random pictures and photos. If
I'm traveling or if I see something that I love
and inspires me, I will buy it, get it framed,
could be a piece of like tapestry or whatever it is.
I've got so many different types of things up on
the walls, so they want to add to that as well.
You know, they've got things stuck everywhere.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
I'd love to know more about the So the cultural
importance of having a tidy home or a welcoming home
is that based in hospitality.
Speaker 3 (06:34):
Where does that come from?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Like, naturally, as Lebanese people, we are extremely hospitable. That's
sort of like our driving characteristic. And you know, we
take so much pride in our home and whenever we're
inviting family, friends, whoever is coming, it's our home immediately
becomes their home. So we want them to feel extremely comfortable.
(06:57):
And this is why there is a lot of this
sort of I wouldn't say pressure but it's like this
underlying thing, like the house has valued. Yeah, really, so
that was something that And I mean, I'm someone who
loves to cook. I'm cooking. I cook for work and
I cook for fun and play, So I'm cooking all
the time. My kitchen is the most used space in
(07:19):
my home. The byproduct of that is it's impossible to
keep that area of the house immaculate all the time. Like, yeah,
you know, my dishrack is always full because I'm always
doing dishes because I'm always cooking, and that sort of thing.
I've had to completely let go of a lot of
sort of things that I grew up with, a lot
of the expectation around you know, even when you're hosting,
(07:43):
the host will get up and start cleaning up while
the guests are there, never let the guests help. But
it had to be done straight away because God forbid
we leave the dishes in this thing buga that I
don't do that anymore because I want to spend time
I'm with my guests and I don't want them to
pa getting all worked up because the worst thing is
(08:04):
you've just had a beautiful lunch and you don't want
to be sitting there and watching the person who cooked
for you clean in front of you as well.
Speaker 3 (08:10):
I agree.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
I think it's uncomfortable for everyone exactly.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
So, I mean when our guests are Lebanese, they kind
of understand it, so there's never going to be and
I mean they will always fight and come in and
want to help, and they end up just drying. We
don't give them any of the difficult tasks. But now
I just give everything a little bit of a rn,
scrape most of it into the.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
Bin and just leave it.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
Sometimes I leave it over mind.
Speaker 3 (08:35):
Oh I do too, amazing.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
I only discovered this two years ago and I was like,
and I've been hosting since I got married ten years ago,
and I was like, why was I doing this? Actually
enjoyable to pack down your kitchen the next morning, I know,
with a podcast on or exactly music on.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
Do you justify it to yourself because I like to say, oh,
I need to let it soak. It'll clean better if
I let it soak overnight.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
I just don't care. I'm like, I am, I am
not doing that now. I'm going to do it tomorrow.
It took a while, you know what. It was like
the light just switched on and I was like, what
we can not one's watching me exactly. We have this
fear someone's watching and judging us. Anyway, just as long
as no one's rocking up like my mother in law's
not rocking up first thing the next morning.
Speaker 1 (09:29):
So if I were to come over to your house
on the weekend, take us all on a tour. So
I'd love for you to describe what does it look
like you open the door, what's the first thing we see?
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Oh? I love my house. We have been living in
Droumoine for five years now. We are in a really
really old house. So I think my house was built
over one hundred years ago and it's still in its
same sort of still got the same facade, like a
pitched roof queen and really really old scage. Yes, it
(10:03):
is gorgeous and I'm an old soul, so I definitely
didn't want to do any alterations to the house, not
that we can afford to right now, but anyway, we'll
all get to it. I mean, even if we could
and when we are able to. I have always said
to my husband that I just want to do touch
ups and never want to do any door remake. It's
(10:25):
beautiful anyway, so really quaint and quite old, and when
you come in you are immediately greeted with lots of pictures.
So I've got old photos of Lebanon, so Beirut or
Tripoli where my family are from. And we've got a
beautiful sort of mirror when you walk in, and then
(10:46):
immediately the first thing you can see is the water
because we live on the Bay Run, so the bay
is there or the boats are there. So it's a
very very nice aspect, very nice. It's a immediately when
you see the water, you feel a sense of relaxation,
like you just come in, you just chilled straight away.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
So do you ever run the Bay Run?
Speaker 2 (11:08):
Yeah? I do the I did it this morning in
the rain too. Yeah. So yeah, you walk in and
I've got a big, beautiful entertaining kitchen. So that was
definitely the part of the house that I fell in
love with when we were you know, when we saw
the house and my husband sort of looked at me
and he said, this like, this is your kitchen.
Speaker 3 (11:26):
You know what makes it your kitchen? What does it
look like?
Speaker 2 (11:30):
It's very open, there's a very big island kitchen, island
bench in the in the middle of it. Very very open.
There's a big sort of window that kind of looks
out to the water and it's got stained glass, So
this bright green and pink stained glass window, which is gorgeous,
like very very me. In a dream world, I would
(11:52):
take away all of the cabinets and have them exposed.
I love exposed shelves and sort of because I collect
everything from platters to cropery, and.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
They can be like works of art.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
They are works of art, like I love looking at them.
So yeah, in my dream kitchen, it would be just
stripping back those cabinets and having them on display. I
also love collecting water and pestles do I love water?
They are and I always find really beautiful ones. And
even though I've got I don't know ten, I reckon
(12:25):
twelve of them. I don't necessarily use them all, but
they're just so beautiful to look at. Some of made
of stone, some made of marble, some made of wood.
So I'd love to have them on display. But it
is a definitely an entertaining kitchen and everything is out
for you to look at, and I love that like big.
You know, if I've gone to the markets and found
(12:47):
the most beautiful pomegranates, or tomatoes, or buy a box
of them so I can put them in a big
bowl and have that sitting in the center.
Speaker 3 (12:54):
Because love that.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I love that produce as their core. That's very much
my style.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
So take us through from the kitchen we do. What
do you see next?
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Directly opposite the kitchen is the dining table. I've got
a really long Tasmanian oak dining table, so very rustic.
It hasn't been sort of shaved down and it's still
got its organic side grain on it. It's a very
commanding table, which I love. And that is the center.
(13:24):
That's where everything happens. That's where everybody comes to the
best moments living in that house have happened around that table.
And it overlooks the water, so that's exactly where you
sit down and you can sort of you just relax.
We open up the bifold doors and we've got a
very small sort of entertaining balcony. It's very cute. That's
(13:47):
got the aspect. And then we've got a really enormous pool,
so the backyard is completely taken up by swimming pool.
So it's because it's such an old bill build back
in the day when you could basically put a swimming
pool the size of your backyard.
Speaker 3 (14:04):
That's what we've got.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
Who needs green exactly? So that yeah, that's that's a beautiful,
beautiful part of the house. But behind the dining table
is my lounge room. And I love that room because
it's got an enormous bookshelf. It is so beautiful. It's
sort of floor to ceiling. The TV is it's not
(14:26):
even built to have a TV. We found a way
to wedge your TV in the middle of it, but
originally it wasn't built to fit a TV. And it's
got all of my cookbooks and I have hundreds of cookbook.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
How then have you been collecting cookbooks?
Speaker 2 (14:39):
I think I've been collecting them from for about gosh,
since I was eighteen, so twenty years ago almost. Yeah,
I've got some really beautiful oldies. I've got some of
my mum's Australian Women's Weekly cookbooks in there as well,
so I've got kind of a vintage section and then
(14:59):
all of you know, it's my work. I love cookbooks.
They're like storybooks to me.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
I am loving getting to know Kareema. We'll be back
with more in just a bit. Tell us more about
your career in food. So I think for people who
who don't know you, it will be just so fascinating
to share the story. And then for people who are
(15:28):
just total fans for them to hear maybe some snippets
they haven't heard before.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Okay, I had a very untraditional and unconventional sort of
entry into food. I sort of just wedged my way
into the food world. I have a fashion design background.
That's what I studied. When I left school, I went
to UTS and did a fashion degree. It was a
(15:56):
very long, grueling degree. It was difficult in so many
ways and fascinating in so many ways, I guess, and
I've spoken about this before. The fascinating thing about it
is what the degree taught me more than anything was storytelling.
The medium was fashion, and I have been able to
(16:17):
apply so much of that learning and knowledge and just
change the medium up to food.
Speaker 3 (16:23):
Isn't that incredible?
Speaker 1 (16:25):
I love that for people who are listening, who are
thinking about I don't love what I'm doing at the moment.
Skills are absolutely transferable, totally in ways you don't expect
like there is and.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
I mean, the landscape now has evolved so much in
the sense that you can literally do whatever you want
with your skills, just as long as you persistently stay
at it. So I think after so I worked in fashion,
I definitely didn't love it because it was a hobby
(17:02):
of mine and it was something I was so interested
in and loved. But loving something and having a hobby
is one thing, and then working in it and accepting
all of the layers that come with that job is
a completely different thing. So when I got married and
had my daughter, Laila, I was sitting at home thinking
what am I going to do? Like, what is to
(17:25):
me going to be worth leaving this little child behind
and going back into it was definitely not going to
be fashion. My mom is a remarkable cook. I don't
say that because she's my mom. I say it because
she really is such a beautiful cook. She enjoys it,
(17:45):
She respects ingredients the way I've really never seen anyone
do before. And she made me like I didn't even
realize the role food played in our life, how much
inspiration I drew from cooking with her and just food
being the center of our worlds. So as soon as
(18:06):
I got married, I would have lunches and just host
my friends. You know, I'm nearly weird. A lot of
my friends got married at the same time, and so
they'd come over for lunch and I would have a
table spread full of food, and my girlfriends, jaws on
the ground, were like, how did you do this? Yeah,
(18:27):
because coming from a Lebanese family, although food is the
center of our world, it's not like our moms put
the time and effort or even wanted to teach us
how to cook, because they did not come all the
way across the world and leave wars and their families
and whatever they left to teach their kids how to cook.
(18:47):
They wanted us to go to university to get an education,
to make something of ourselves, Like cooking is just something
that you do at home. So no, no, no, don't you know,
I don't need your help go and study. I don't
need your help, go to UNI or whatever. It was.
So a lot of my girlfriends didn't actually learn how
to cook from their moms, and inherit this confidence that
(19:10):
I all of a sudden had. I said to her,
why don't we You know, my friends have sort of
challenged me. I told them that I could teach them
how to cook very easily. This is a really easy
menu so it was. I remember it was a lamb
like a lambs shoulder on rice and all the sides
that Mum would always put around it. And I found
(19:30):
a kitchen in Roselle. The first class had fifteen people
in it that most of them were my friends, and
my mom was completely against it because she was like,
I'm not a chef. How can I teach people cook?
I said, Mom, you have been cooking your entire life.
You are an amazing cook. If you could teach me
(19:52):
how to cook, you can teach them how to cook.
So that's where it started. We brought them into the
kitchen and then that grew. I told their friends, and
all of a sudden we had another class and we
were teaching a class almost every fortnight out of that
little kitchen. And then a publisher in the UK, Hardi
Grant in the UK approached us and said would you
(20:15):
like to write a cookbook? And Mom and I put
a cookbook together. So I think the cookbook really cemented
to me that I have something to say in terms
of sharing our Lebanese culture, sharing our Lebanese Australian heritage,
sharing our food. I mean, you look at Australia, it's
extremely multicultural. The people who were coming to our classes,
(20:37):
the guests who were coming were all walks of life,
all nationalities. Everybody had this same love and understanding and
just desire to want to cook or learning new recipe
or learn about ingredients. So yeah, after the cookbook, I
really then sort of took to social media because I
(20:57):
realized that I was only able to read each a
certain amount of people in the class. I mean there
was only ever fifteen guests because we kept it very
very intimate, and it wasn't a class where you came
in and chopped an onion and sort of followed a recipe.
It was a class where we did so much storytelling.
We spoke so much about ingredients and let them taste
all of the exotic, you know, Middle Eastern spices and ingredients,
(21:21):
and then gave them and then we all cooked together.
We cooked how we would cook at home, and then
everybody sort of joined in and shared their own stories
and their own anecdotes. Because we're all children of migrants,
we all came with different cooking, Like food is such
a center in so many people's lives.
Speaker 3 (21:39):
Did you only do it on Sundays?
Speaker 2 (21:41):
Yeah, we only taught them on Sundays, which is why we.
Speaker 1 (21:43):
Called it, so I've been wondering about that.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
They were definitely the first class was inspired by the
lunch as mum would put on. You know, she always
had like this hero protein. So whether it was lamb
or whether it was fish, or whether it was like
you know, spatchcocked chickens that she would stuff. There was
always a rice dish to a company. And then there
(22:06):
were so many sides. That was a big, beautiful salad.
There were a selection of dips, like there was always
bits and pieces because this is how we eat eleven
these people. We never sort of just make one thing
God forbid and put it on the table. It's all
about torture everybody. You imagine, we need to torture everyone.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
At what point did you and your mom go this
is a business. This is not just something we're doing occasionally.
This is a real business. I mean, have you had
that moment.
Speaker 2 (22:35):
We haven't completely had it, only because it's like running
a cooking class is challenging and it's a labor of love.
Like it's no matter how it's not scalable in the
sense because you get burnt out. It takes the whole
day to prep and set up. You can only ever
teach fifteen that's maximum twenty people. It's not going to
(22:57):
have the same impact or effect if you had fifty
to one hundred people. I mean, that's where you'd start
making money. So I guess for us, it was never
about it actually being a business. It was about it
being a really beautiful, welcoming space. I really wanted to
(23:17):
share with people who we are as migrants because I
feel like the conversation never extended beyond oh, you've just
left your home country and you've moved to another country.
So giving people giving our guests perspective on you know,
my grandparents, for example, my mum's parents, they were famous
(23:40):
sweet makers in Triboli. They had the most They had
a sweet empire. So to be able to leave that behind,
my grandfather had one hundred staff working with him. He
was a very prominent figure in his community. My grandmother
became the same. You know, they had fifteen children, so
I come from an extremely big family. For them to
(24:02):
leave all of that behind and comge to a country
on the other side of the world with no plan,
you know, it's like they sat down one day and said,
you know what, I'm going to go to Australia and
we're going to set up shop there and we're going
to They had to pack frantically and leave within two
weeks and come here, so that I need. I wanted
(24:24):
to share that because I knew everyone else in the
room would have someone or some kind of story that
related to that, or would just leave with a stronger
understanding or appreciation for all of the different types of
people that we are so blessed to live with, work with,
(24:44):
be neighbors with, surround ourselves with.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
There is a whole life that has come.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Before the The move that's right, that's right and food
is the most gentle and welcoming way to do that
because I see so many of the guests, like you've
got to imagine, they're all strangers come into this class.
They've got all their layers up, you know, and they're
just sitting there. A lot of them have their own
(25:11):
opinions already. You know, they've lived their own lives, They've
got their own stereotypes and prejudices, and think that they
have this understanding of certain people, certain foods, certain topics
or whatever. All of that comes down because how do
you do that telling talking, you know, sharing where my
family comes from, sharing origins of certain dishes, explaining things
(25:36):
that you're never going to get that information when you
go and have a meal at a Lebanese restaurant. You're
just going to go. Even the food at Lebanese restaurants
is not how we eat. This is how, isn't it.
We definitely eat those dishes. We don't only eat like exactly,
you know. And we made sure that when we did
(25:56):
these classes, we focused on dishes that people have never
heard of. Yeah, I would never think to cook or
to eat and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (26:03):
Do people give you feedback of the dishes that they've
loved the most or been surprised by?
Speaker 3 (26:09):
Definitely what sorts of things.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
Well, first of all, I can't believe how many of
them actually go home and cook the dishes and they
send me photos and you know, they'll say, this has
now become a weekly staple for us, or this has
become like my entertaining go to. Oh, we've got a
vegetarian class, so we really a vegetarian dishes because our
diet is predominantly vegetarian. And I mean people would never
(26:33):
know that because when you go to a Lebanese restaurant.
You're just hammered with meat skewers and guff to skewers
and lambshow and beef show chickenho, it's just meat coming out.
We do not eat like that at all predominantly. I
mean our cookbook Softra I would say eighty five percent
of it is vegetarian. Great, that is how we eat.
So whoever comes to the vegetarian class leaves going I
(26:56):
cannot believe what you guys do with vegetables.
Speaker 3 (27:00):
I will not just designed.
Speaker 2 (27:01):
I wanted to eat meat. This is plenty, This is
so hearty, It's tasty. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:07):
So what is something that you would love to share
with people who are listening about Lebonese food? Is it
something a recipe they should try? Is it a tip,
a bit of advice?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
I love to share this with the guests that come
to our classes or anyone that comes to a cooking
demo that I do. Lebonese Food is not about recipes.
Recipes are a guide and they sort of give you
an understanding of what the ingredients are. You should be
(27:44):
approaching it with a lot of intuition in terms of
like how do I actually cook? What do I love
you know, do I like things to be seed that
little bit extra? Do I love salt? Do I love lemon?
Do I love garlic? Do I love? And I feel
like when you approach it like that, you transform the
dishes into your own, and they become so easy because
(28:09):
they are. I mean a lot of people assume lebonese
food is so difficult.
Speaker 3 (28:13):
To make and so much flavor in it.
Speaker 2 (28:15):
There's so many ingredients and it tastes so good, so
that there must be like a secret there, and it
really isn't. I mean, it's about looking at the recipe.
And I stress this in the class, and I say
to them, take even the cookbook, take it as a guide. Like,
first of all, you've got to make the time for this. Yeah,
(28:36):
you know, this is a style of food that you
want to potter around the kitchen on the weekend. A
lot of the elements can be prepared in advance, which
people don't necessarily know. I mean, we've come from really
big families. There's no way whoever was cooking did it
all that morning.
Speaker 3 (28:53):
I couldn't imagine.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
There's something you can do on the Thursday afternoon that
sort of just sits in the friut till Sunday comes.
It's something that you can do on the Friday. There's
something so little bits and pieces, And I think one
of the most important things is going to a Middle
Eastern grosser, like take sometimes they can be far from
wherever you're living and taking the time to go to
(29:15):
the original source because the authenticity there, the ingredients, the freshness,
the quality, the abundance, you know, I feel like it
just adds that another layer, Like nobody wants to make
tabulli with little packets of parsley. Like you're gonna go
and buy a market bunch of parsley from the Lebanese grosser.
(29:39):
It's only five dollars. Could I'm telling you, it's a
bunch this big. It's about twelve packs of those in there,
and it's so fresh and everything sort of just jumping
at you. Yeah, there's no way, there's no way you
could compare, you know, going there getting that full expire.
(30:00):
Going to a isle of tahini, not a section, it's
an ale because we've got tahini from Yeah, there's like
a tahini. Even Lebanese bread, there's an isle of Lebanese bread.
Because there's like politics about where you buy your bread
from and something really thick on. Some people like this
size and something.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
So what do you look for in Lebanese bread.
Speaker 2 (30:19):
We've just got a brand that we've always bought, and
you inherit that brand in your family, Like my mom
went to the Canterbury bakery. So the Lebanese grosser will
get bread from six to eight different bakeries. They're all
making the same thing. You need to have every version
of variety because you're going to have a customer that
(30:41):
does not want and discriminates against that bread and wants
the other bread. So we inherit bread. We also inherit butchers.
So we've got a allegiance to our butcher. Like I've
been going to my butcher. So my mom went there,
and my grandmother went there. And my grandmother's passed by
the way. You know, she came to Australia in the seventies,
so this was the butcher she went to. My mom
(31:03):
goes there, and I go there. That's what you do,
you go to your mum's.
Speaker 3 (31:06):
Could you imagine the shame if you didn't?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Of course, Also, are we're going to hold accountable if
we're not happy with something. We need to have a sauce.
There's only been once my mum has sent me back
to the woodshad and said give this back to him
and tell him I do not want it. It is
not up to scratch.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
It's quite an open dialogue.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
And they've seen me in all of my life and
all of my horms.
Speaker 1 (31:31):
You know.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
And I've grown up seeing their sons, their young sons
in soccer gear that are coming after school and training.
And I was with my mum, we're picking up me
and now they're running the shop now and I'm going
to I'm an adult that I've got my kids in
tow with me. So yeah, that's a really that's a
really beautiful thing about community. And I feel like Lebanese
(31:53):
people have done an amazing job of that here in
Sydney and in Melbourne. And that's another part that we're
able to share with our guests. I do a lot
of sharing of that in any social media that I
do and any cooking I always sort of encourage people
to go out and get an experience because we're so
(32:15):
lucky to have access to it. Absolutely once a week
I will go to the so I'll go to green Acre,
and that's sort of the hub for me. My butcher's there,
the gross is there, the bakery is there, and I
sort of do Everybody knows me now, they know what
I do, and so it's almost like I'm going to
(32:36):
see my family. To some extent, they asked me, oh,
what are you doing today and what are you working on?
And it's just become such a big part of my food.
Like I just can't justify getting I don't enjoy getting
my ingredients from anywhere else, and it's part of my
(32:56):
weekly habit now. It's part of my weekly my movements
during the week. And I love taking my kids there
because they get this really big dose of culture and
you know, everybody speaking in Arabic and everybody's carrying on
and there's a chaos and it's I love it.
Speaker 3 (33:13):
It sounds so exciting.
Speaker 2 (33:14):
It is very exciting. It is.
Speaker 1 (33:16):
Speaking of weekly rituals and routines, what recipes are on
weekly rotation at your place? Okay, what are your go tos?
Speaker 2 (33:25):
What are my go tos? I actually did this recipe
with The Women's Weekly a few weeks ago. We were
shooting some recipes, so definitely like a lemon and garlic
chicken tray, bake, So that's a very quintessential Lebonese. Yeah,
weekly weeknight dish. My girls love it. It just leaves
the most beautiful aroma in the house.
Speaker 3 (33:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:48):
They run in from after school and it's the first
thing they can smell, and Laya goes, I know you're
making the chicken trade tonight, and I said, yeah, that's
what we're having tonight. So definitely that on the weekend.
Most weekends, I try and make a really big fatush salad.
The fatush that I make has so many seasonal ingredients,
(34:10):
Like I just get really excited when I go to
the Lebanese grosser and I see big chunky bunches of
a regular rocket and fresh oregano. So I go a
bit mad and buy everything. And then I'll make a
really big salad, leave out the tomatoes, toss it, and
I'll make a dressing and I'll put that in the
(34:32):
fridge and then we will have salad as part of
whatever we're having for dinner. So we'll have a fatush
basically every night, and then I'll add different things to it,
like sometimes I'll add chicken to it, or sometimes we'll
have it next to a steak. If the girl's for
like steak. So that's definitely something that we have.
Speaker 3 (34:48):
Why do you leave out the tomatoes.
Speaker 2 (34:50):
Because it will spoil the see how they spoil over
a few days. So I'll definitely chop up tomatoes on
the night, I'll just add them. Okay, salad is so colorful.
It's all tossed, it's undressed, it's in an airtight container
because the ingredients are so fresh. So things like fresh pomegranate, cucumber,
(35:10):
capsic and cabbage, all of the herbs, radish, yeah, nice,
and finally chopped up, tossed in a container. And then
I've got a big jar of like pomegranate molasses and
lemon juice and olive oil dressing with the sumac ready
to go. So i just have to take it out,
put it in a bowl and mix it and then
(35:30):
toss it. If I'm going to take everything out to
chop every night, it would exhaust me. So that's like
one of my hacks that I do most weekends, so
that we've got this very vibrant and fresh salad chopped
fist exactly. Well, it doesn't take that long because you're like, well,
you know, instead of cutting too cucumbers, for dinner. I
just cut six or eight of them, and then you
(35:53):
build this big salad.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Are you a knife and chopping board, gal or do
you use one of those little like hats either boxes.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Honestly, I inherited using a paring knife and just cutting
on top of the chopping you r g. Honestly, sometimes
it's so much easier. We're just chop and pop pop
them in. Yes, but that's something my kids help me do.
So they'll do the things like the capsic and the radish,
(36:21):
the cucumber, they're all things that they can chop. Yeah,
so they'll go and start. I'll wash it all for them.
And sometimes they're all awkward shapes and sizes, but it
doesn't matter. It means they're going to eat the salad.
Speaker 1 (36:33):
Coming up, it's Design Crimes the Kitchen Edition. I want
to ask a question that's a bit of a tweak
on a question I like to ask our guests, and
that is about design crimes. Okay, I would like for
us to discuss design crimes the Kitchen Edition. Okay, so
(36:56):
we're in the kitchen, yep. What are some of the
biggest or one of the biggest problems you see in
Australian kitchens that you just think, please stop doing that,
or please fix that or change it.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
I would have to say. And I know some people
are going to be completely against me here. I cannot
handle going into a kitchen that has everything hidden and
is completely bare because I don't feel invited in there.
I don't feel like any cooking is happening in here.
(37:32):
So for me, and I mean a lot of my
friends are very guilty of this. I can't see a
single appliance. I can't see are utensils jar? I can't
see anything. Yeah, I can't say it's spotless, it's bear
it's weird, it's weird. I'm like, does anyone eat here?
What are we doing here? So that is like, I mean,
(37:55):
my kitchen in comparison, is just a mess. I have
a beautiful brown VARs that has whatever olive branches or
something that I have found, Like I've gone to my
father in law's house and cut off a stem with
a baby pomming grund. It hanging, and that has to
take center stage. Like I said, I've got fruit on display,
(38:15):
I've got vegetables on display. Whatever's sort of happening. You know,
all of those beautiful serving spoons. I've got them in
their own.
Speaker 3 (38:24):
Vas you know, on like flowers.
Speaker 2 (38:26):
Show me, Show me how you cooking here and what
you cook him, like what you're doing, Give me some
life in here. I feel like people think that a
kitchen is not a living space. You spend most of
your time nourishing yourself from this space, like it needs
to be full of inspiration. I've got a beautiful poultry
book on the shelf with my cookbook and another Lebanese
(38:49):
cookbook that I love, you know, and then I rotate
the books that go there because obviously I've got a
really big bookshelf, and it's just it's alive. Everybody says
that when they come to my house, they say, your
kitchen is alive. I just want to eat when I'm
in here because I love it. That's what a kitchen is.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
What is something that is always fresh in your home.
It doesn't have to be in the kitchen, it can be,
but something that's always fresh.
Speaker 2 (39:18):
I would have to say produce. Yeah, I think if
if someone saw my produce bill every year, like that's
my vice. That's something that I just like, I will
go to the shops for one thing and I will
come back with because food. I need to have it
with me if I see it. Like the other day
(39:40):
it was Persimon's. I could not walk past them. I
had to buy them. I had to get them. I
put them in my fruit ball and I was like,
you know what, I haven't really baked with persmons before.
I'm gonna like, well, I've got twelve of them. I
have to put them to.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Figure something out.
Speaker 2 (39:55):
I have to figure that is honestly, that's definitely something.
You know. I've always got an abundance of lemons. I've
always got whatever is in season and it can sit
in a fruit bowl. I will buy it and then
I use it. I mean, I will find a way.
My friend of mine was picking off those really big,
(40:17):
sort of beautiful mandarins that come in the right in
the middle of winter from his farthest tree in five
close to where I am, and his tree is enormous,
and he put on Instagram if anybody wants some, I'm
going to have so many. He brought me a twenty
five liter bucket from Bunnings full of these mandarins. So
they are now taking center stage on this big wooden bowl,
(40:40):
which I said to my husband, see That's why I
made you pull over in barrel and stop me to
buy this bowl I saw outside. This is what we
needed it for. What was I going to put all
these mandarins in?
Speaker 3 (40:53):
Do you burn candles?
Speaker 2 (40:54):
I do, I do, but I put them in places
like the bathrooms. Oh yeah, in the hallway when you
first walk into the house.
Speaker 1 (41:02):
And do you have a favorite scent? Do you like
or do you mix it up whatever's coming through.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
I can't remember the name of the candle brand. I
wish I could, because it was gifted to me and
the smell was heirloom tomato. You know that smell where
her green flower?
Speaker 1 (41:24):
Yes, the stork you know how it's got that real
love that scent.
Speaker 2 (41:29):
Oh god, you've got to smell that as a candle.
Speaker 3 (41:31):
Is it green?
Speaker 2 (41:32):
Yeah, like a dark green? Yes?
Speaker 3 (41:34):
Is it flamingo estate?
Speaker 2 (41:35):
Maybe?
Speaker 3 (41:35):
Maybe maybe that's it. Yeah, sister gives it to.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
Me and it's nearing the end, and I always when
I put that on, it's got such a gorgeous smells good.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
Something about it compliments the product.
Speaker 1 (41:48):
Now, you talked about your kitchen having things out on display.
Speaker 3 (41:53):
Are you a tidy person?
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Are you or are you a like shove everything in
the cupboard kind of gal.
Speaker 2 (41:59):
I would honestly describe myself as like an organized chaos,
Like some people would feel extremely overwhelmed with all of
the stuff that I have out and about. You know,
I don't have a bare wall. There is something on
every single wall, you know, whatever I have fallen in
love with and bought and framed. So yeah, it's it's
(42:19):
definitely not everybody's taste, but it's definitely not messy. It
all makes sense and it's a complete reflection of me,
you know, because everything that I do is inspired by
so many different things. I don't have just one sort
of straight and narrow road. It's very eclectic. My husband
(42:43):
has had to like completely surrender to it. It's like, oh,
so we have that now, Okay.
Speaker 1 (42:50):
I like to tell my husband, I'm not a hoarder,
I'm a collector.
Speaker 2 (42:53):
I'm a collector. Yeah, there's a difference, absolutely, there's a difference.
And you know, back to the plates and platters. So
my two vices are the fresh produce, yeah, and then
collecting the most beautiful platters and serving crockery and stuff cutlery.
And at the beginning, he was like, why do we
(43:14):
need this? And now he understands. He actually bought me
a mortar and pestel because he saw it at a
vintage shop. I don't know where he was. He was
away with his with his friends, and he came back
he goes, I got you something, and he took out
a watar and pestel from the bit of his car,
and I said, oh my god, that is the most.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
He goes.
Speaker 2 (43:32):
I know you love them, and I get it now.
I get this one is not like any of the
ones that you have. I said, see.
Speaker 1 (43:37):
Better than diamonds. So with with being so hospitable and
having people over, are you a shoes on or off household?
Speaker 2 (43:50):
Now we're shoes on? Yeah, yeah, I don't care. I'll
clean the floor, the face can be cleaned. I would
come from so many you know, so that's a big
taboo in Lebanese culture, like eleven homes your shoes off definitely, wow. Yeah.
I mean my mum was a little bit more relaxed
to it.
Speaker 3 (44:07):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (44:07):
Also because I don't feel comfortable taking my shoes off
sometimes sometimes I just want to have my shoes on,
you know, and I feel like I feel violated when
I have to take them off at the door.
Speaker 1 (44:16):
Maybe I haven't done a petty Yeah, maybe I.
Speaker 2 (44:17):
Want to keep my shoes on. Yes, anyway, so I
let people put their shoes on. I will clean the
negga like it doesn't. A home is completely supposed to
be lived in. Yeah, and I Yeah, my husband has
really helped, if I think about the last ten years,
he's helped reinstill that in me, because he's like, when
(44:40):
you buy something, or when we have something, whether it's
a house or it's a chopping board, whatever it is, Yeah,
we have it so we can use it, and it
is best when it's used, not, you know, just to
stare at it kind of thing.
Speaker 1 (44:51):
Definitely, Yes, speaking of things, let's do our mystery draw seconds.
So we've asked you to bring something in from from
your home or your life, and I haven't seen it.
I can't wait to find out what it is.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
I've spoken about it the whole episode.
Speaker 3 (45:11):
It is for everybody.
Speaker 2 (45:12):
Listening, A waterer and vessel a baby.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
It is so cute't it gorgeous? Let's give our listeners
an audio description of Okay, are we looking at So?
Speaker 2 (45:26):
I found this when I was on holidays in Lebanon.
This would have been about I don't know, twelve or
thirteen years ago, I wasn't even working in food. So
this is the thing like I have.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
This is a true love thing.
Speaker 2 (45:41):
This is a true love thing. And cooking has really
been such a center in my world growing up, even
when I wasn't even working in it or with it. Yeah,
so when I saw it, I just fell in love
with it. I brought it back with me. So it's
a sort of white and navy blue stone water and yeah,
(46:03):
now I'll tell you I found it at a sort
of beautiful kind of boutique like store. I only use
it when I'm making desserts so that I can ground
grind so if I'm doing like a cinnamon sugar and
I want to grind the elements down into a finer
(46:26):
sort of consistency, or if I'm crushing So sometimes we
use these mastic. They're almost like really tiny stones. It's
an ingredient mastic and you have to grind it down
really finely with sugar so that it can actually penetrate
(46:47):
the food and have flavor, and you can't sort of
when you're using a normal water and pestel. Like I
throw everything in their garlic chili onion whatever. So that's
for my savory cooking, and so I've reserved of this
for whenever I'm doing something sweet. That's the water and
prestle that I use.
Speaker 3 (47:05):
I love it. It looks like just the right size.
Speaker 2 (47:07):
It's the perfect size because you're only ever using like
one or two tablespoons and whatever you're grinding in it.
Speaker 3 (47:13):
It's a beautiful design.
Speaker 2 (47:14):
I wonder you know I paid it. No, It's like
when I bought it, I thought, oh, this is like
nice and small and it can fit in my luggage
and it's not too heavy. But I didn't bother to ask,
like where was it made, who made it? Where is
it from? I just sort of loved it and bought it.
I was I was still living at home then anyway,
and then it's just it's stayed with me, and now
(47:36):
I have twelve of them.
Speaker 3 (47:37):
But then.
Speaker 2 (47:39):
They are all different. I just found a guy on
Etsy in Italy who makes the most beautiful olive green marble.
This is like the Italian ones that they make pesto in. Oh,
and I've got it on.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
It's going to be yes, I look out. What does
being a homemaker mean to you? Or the concept of
a homemaker because I think it's so different to what
it meant decades ago, generations ago. What does it mean
to you?
Speaker 2 (48:12):
For me, it is all about making everyone that lives
in the home and everyone that comes to the home
you feel incredibly welcome and comfortable. You know. I grew
up in one of those families, like I love my family,
but we had a formal salon or living room upstairs
(48:34):
that was like no one sat there, so the you know,
the remote had a perfect covering on it and everything.
You know, we had doilies on the side and my
man had all of her beautiful stuff on the on
the coffee table, and that was a normal thing. Like
if you didn't have one of those rooms, then.
Speaker 3 (48:54):
I mean you didn't have Can you receive people?
Speaker 2 (48:55):
How can you receive people? Because that's where they come
and sit and that kind of thing. Where where is
for me? I want to think that we as a
family feel so comfortable living with all of our beautiful things.
Like when I first moved to my house in Dremoyne,
I fell in love with those linen lounges. Yes, sam
(49:20):
house with all of the pillows. So as soon as
we moved into Jamoye and my daughters were still I
would say three and five. I bought them in white
cream ivory because I loved that color and it suited
the house so much. And then everybody that came over
was like, and you know my husband, I told you
(49:42):
he is all about living in the thing. Yeah, Like,
don't worry. Whatever we do to it, it's supposed we're
supposed to do to it, like enjoy it. We can
clean it. We can. Everybody came and said, how could
you get this. You've got children, this is your only
living room. They're going to get trashed. My mom was like,
he is, Mom, but like this is suicide. They're so expensive,
(50:03):
and you went and bought them for your home, and
you've got young children, you love entertaining, you've always got
people over. And I was like, exactly, Yes, this is
what you're supposed to do. Like home, it's a reflection
of what I love and what I want people to,
you know, come and see when they come in, and
then I want them to sit and enjoy them. I
don't want them to you know. And it's a really
fat sofa. It's long. It's called the Deep Joe or
(50:26):
whatever it is. Yeah, and you your whole body you
can't sort of sit on it and have your knees.
You can't have your back touching the back and your
knees in the ground.
Speaker 1 (50:37):
You and you have to relax into it.
Speaker 2 (50:40):
Do you know how gout that feels, especially if you're
like visiting someone and you're just chilling out. You might
be having a drink. You can see this beautiful view
like it was the lounge. So I feel like slip.
Speaker 3 (50:52):
Covered as well.
Speaker 1 (50:53):
So it's not like you know, a slipcovered design.
Speaker 2 (50:56):
You can take exactly and you can take them off.
Speaker 1 (50:58):
A vanish and back to God. I get a lot
of aish, you know, and.
Speaker 2 (51:03):
Then you just you buy another set. You can buy
the covers, and then you have two seasons. So we
put the white ones on in summer because it's really summery,
and then I've got this beautiful stone dark stone color
in winter. Yeah, and then I've got all my different
throws and like an outpacker pillowcase, and it's so warm,
and we've got a beautiful fireplace that is on every day.
(51:26):
My husband loves a fire. God it drives me mad sometimes.
Speaker 3 (51:29):
Oh I love a fire.
Speaker 2 (51:30):
He loves a fire on, especially if we have people
over and it is like it's cozy, so beautiful about
it in winter. So I feel like, to answer your question,
being a homemaker is all about comfort, and I don't
feel like, especially if you have younger children, you necessarily
(51:54):
need to discount the things that you want to have
in your life you're worried about them getting destroyed. I
mean like, unless you've got tornadoes, you.
Speaker 3 (52:07):
Know the furniture is going to survive.
Speaker 2 (52:09):
It's going to survive, and it's going to take on
its own new life, which it does, and then you know,
you get to have the best of both worlds and
not sort of have to sit and wait or make
anybody uncomfortable if you do have nice things and constantly
being worried about how they are going to survive, because
then their survival relies on your living.
Speaker 3 (52:31):
Absolute.
Speaker 2 (52:33):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1 (52:34):
So what to you makes a home beautiful?
Speaker 2 (52:38):
A home is like I immediately associate it with food.
So what makes my home beautiful or what I feel
like completely distracts from all of the esthetics is the
meal that we had, how we had it, where we
had it, And it doesn't even have to be completely
(53:00):
extraordinary in any way. It could just be a beautiful
cheese platter on an afternoon, beautiful music on. But I
feel like food really does add this layer of warmth hospitality,
and you don't need to put bells and whistles on
when you're hosting like there are. So hosting is such
(53:23):
a massive spectrum and there's a big stigma around it
where you need to have you need to put so
much effort in and needs to stress you out. If
you're not stressed, then you're not doing a good job.
It's the complete opposite of that. Sometimes it's making a
cake because you wanted to and then calling your friends
or your neighbors or whoever. It is. Like for me,
(53:43):
it was like one of the school mums and I
said to her, you know what, just bring your ug boots.
I've just made this cake. Granted I had to. I
was writing a recipe and testing a recipe. Let's just
sit down and have a tea and eat the cake
and that kind of thing. So these are all the
hosts moments. You know, they don't have to be they
don't have to tie you out and kill you. They
(54:05):
can just be whatever you want them to be. And
I feel like that is what makes a home so
warm and beautiful Kareema.
Speaker 3 (54:14):
I loved chatting with you.
Speaker 2 (54:16):
I love chatting with you too.
Speaker 3 (54:18):
Thank you so much for joining me here at the edit.
Speaker 1 (54:21):
And I'm really looking forward to our baywalk. How amazing
was that chat with Kareema. Her passion for her culture
and people and food is just infectious, and I got
to say, I can't wait to get cooking some Lebanese
food on my own. I especially loved how she brings
(54:44):
produce into the home, not just to cook with, but
to decorate with it and really teach her daughters about
food before you go. I'd love to ask a favor.
If you've enjoyed this podcast, follow it in your favorite
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It will really help more people find us so we
(55:05):
can keep growing our community. We'll see you next time.
Speaker 2 (55:17):
This is an Our Media podcast
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