Dear Wiggles: The Bedtime Negotiation

Bedtime is meant to be the calm part of the day. So why does it suddenly involve one more book, one more cuddle, one more drink, the other teddy, the blanket fixed, and a very specific sock situation?

In this Dear Wiggles, Simon, Lachy, John and Caterina answer a listener’s question about bedtime stalling: when to say yes, when to hold the line, and how to stop the whole routine turning into a nightly negotiation.

HOSTS
Simon Pryce
Lachy Gillespie

GUESTS
John Pearce
Caterina Mete

PRODUCERS
Produced by The Wiggles and Mylk Media
Madeline Joannou
Nick Webb

To submit a question for the ‘Dear Wiggles’ segment, email us at [e-mail] or head to thewiggles.com/podcast to send in a voice note.

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About The Wiggles' Podcast - Wiggle Talk

Think you’ve got parenting figured out? So do Simon and Lachy - until the toddler throws a curveball. On Wiggle Talk - a podcast for parents, Red Wiggle Simon Pryce and Purple Wiggle Lachy Gillespie tackle the tricky, funny, and unexpected moments of raising little humans.

Simon, dad to son Asher, and Lachy, father to twin daughters Lulu and Lottie and stepdad to Jasper, share the highs and lows of parenting in the early years. Alongside their own stories, they welcome guests - from parenting experts to well-known personalities - who bring fresh perspectives and practical wisdom to the table.

Each week also features Dear Wiggles- where listeners send in their questions, the things that keep them up at night, or the dilemmas they’d love another parent’s take on. Simon and Lachy talk it through with honesty, and when needed, they call in expert friends to help provide thoughtful advice and reassurance.

With decades of experience in children’s education and entertainment, The Wiggles bring their trademark warmth and playfulness to conversations on everything from sleep and routines to tantrums, play, and the big feelings that come with family life.

Two dads, no filter, figuring it out as they go.

About The Wiggles

For over three decades, The Wiggles have been a beloved cornerstone of children's entertainment, captivating and educating millions of preschoolers—and their parents—around the world. Known for their high-energy performances, catchy songs, and colourful characters, The Wiggles have built a global legacy rooted in the power of music and movement to inspire early childhood learning.

With a mission to make education fun, The Wiggles create content specifically designed for pre-K, preschool, kindergarten, and nursery school age groups. Their unique blend of music, dance, and educational content not only entertains but also helps children understand the world around them. Generations of fans who grew up watching The Wiggles are now sharing that same joy with their own children.

The Wiggles’ impact is truly global: they’ve achieved billions of music streams and YouTube views, and have sold more than 30 million albums and DVDs, along with eight million books worldwide. The Wiggles continue to dominate the preschool entertainment scene, connecting with new generations through various platforms. Their live shows consistently sell out across three continents, and their videos are enjoyed on countless broadcast and digital platforms in over 190 countries.

The Wiggles continue to dominate the preschool entertainment scene, connecting with new generations through various platforms. You can watch them on ABC Kids, Netflix, Prime Video, and Stan, and st

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Wiggles acknowledge the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia
and their connections to land, see and community. We pay
our respects to elders, past, present and emerging.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to wiggle Talk, a podcast parents. I'm Simon, I'm
the Red Wiggle, and I'm here.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
I'm Lucky and I'm the Purple Wiggle, and I too
am here.

Speaker 4 (00:30):
We together.

Speaker 5 (00:31):
We are here together, but not just together, not just us.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
No, no, Today we're joined by John the Purple Wiggle.

Speaker 4 (00:38):
I should let you introduce yourself.

Speaker 6 (00:40):
Please, Hey, I'm John the Purple Wiggle and Katerina the
Red Wiggle and Red.

Speaker 3 (00:49):
To give us the straight thing courage.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
To song everybody, if we haven't heard it.

Speaker 5 (01:00):
That's my best attempt at kind of you contempt hole singing.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Vanessa a very good out of tune.

Speaker 3 (01:09):
We are here for a Dear Wigle segment tonight. Now
we've got a really good question from Jen. Yes, so
we thought let's bring in more parents. That's right, arm
ourselves ready to tackle this question from Jen.

Speaker 5 (01:21):
Wigle Talk Talk Talk, wiggle Talk.

Speaker 2 (01:23):
It's Dear Wiggles, authorized by Simon Lucky Keterine.

Speaker 4 (01:28):
Would you like to read the question absolutely from Jen.

Speaker 7 (01:30):
Okay, Jen. It says, bedtime in our house has turned
into a very detailed negotiation. Our son has started asking
for one more book, one more cuddle, one more drink,
the other teddy, the blanket fixed, the socks taken off,
the socks put back on, and somehow every request feels
like just reasonable enough that I just keep saying yes.

(01:51):
The problem is bedtime now stretches forever, and I can
feel myself getting more and more annoyed, which is exactly
the opposite of the calm bedtime vibe I'm going for.
Where do you draw the line, Jen?

Speaker 5 (02:06):
Very good?

Speaker 2 (02:06):
Yes, yes, Jen, Jen, we're all going through. We are
going That's I think that's a good place to start.
That's very It's fascinating that every child does this.

Speaker 7 (02:16):
Yeah normal, But I guess as adults you sort of
do it in a way too. Don't one hour episode
that will get you at least Yeah, No, I hear
your Simon.

Speaker 5 (02:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:30):
Catherine and I talk about Real Housewives quite a bit.
We've talked about this Rhode Island. They're fascinating people.

Speaker 7 (02:36):
They're amazing.

Speaker 6 (02:38):
What are you watching, John, I'm not really watching too much.
We go to bed when henry just because we've got
to get in front.

Speaker 5 (02:45):
We can't see you do that.

Speaker 2 (02:48):
You know that concept of sleep when your child sleeps,
and I could never do that.

Speaker 4 (02:52):
That's what they meant, because it's cleaning to be done.

Speaker 5 (02:54):
Yes, agree, so your house must be a mess.

Speaker 4 (02:58):
We get a better.

Speaker 6 (03:01):
Day.

Speaker 5 (03:02):
Yeah, that's good.

Speaker 7 (03:04):
I know my girls are at that stage, especially Gg.
She always asks food, food, and I'm like, no food,
you've had food, And then I think about it, I'm like, actually,
she really didn't eat that much.

Speaker 4 (03:13):
Maybe she is hungry.

Speaker 5 (03:14):
You're worried that you're going to get the three o'clock
wake up because they.

Speaker 7 (03:16):
Are hungry and you hear their tummy grumbling. And so
the other night because they were in their sleeping sacks,
everything and we just shuffled into the kitchen, sat on
the floor and we just ate to the point where okay,
Gigi had enough. Then Dolly didn't want to let go
of the food because she wanted to go to bed
with it. No, no, no, we don't take food bed
and had a melt down. Anyone crumbs in that bed,

(03:40):
So we had to deal with the mountdown and then
finally she went to bed, but yeah, it doesn't get
easier with age.

Speaker 5 (03:47):
No, well it does to a point, only lots.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
And I when this started happening, and it was the food,
it was the water, it was it was everything's jed
and explained. We then just started setting the boundaries up
so I know what Jen's saying. She's saying, I keep
giving into it all. Now there's a knock on effect
that the child goes. Well, I could just keep pushing

(04:10):
the boundaries because that's really ultimately they're doing. It's just
a massive part of the development which they're meant to do.
And so we just started putting the boundaries around it.
And the food thing we would ask before as she
goes to bed, we still do it.

Speaker 5 (04:22):
Now are you hungry? Do you need food?

Speaker 2 (04:24):
And he said no, and we'll say, okay, well this
is the last opportunity to get food. The water bottle
is now always beside his bed, so it's just there,
I need some water, okay. The amount of books we
just set that early on, and it always it's either
two biggish books or three small ones and he gets
to choose them, and so that stays the same. Now,

(04:47):
we always kept pushing it, but he knew that those
boundaries are never going to move, and so we just
set them, and so now he will try and then
he has that little okay because we've never shifted on it.
And I think that's kind of that that has worked
for us. But it's time and it's a decision you've
got to make that this is what we're going to

(05:07):
go through. And it might cause meltdowns early on, but
ultimately in the end those rules kind.

Speaker 5 (05:12):
Of get established.

Speaker 4 (05:14):
That's a good way to do that.

Speaker 5 (05:15):
That was Loso's idea.

Speaker 3 (05:16):
Of course, it is hard, isn't it, because they don't want
to go to bed, they just want to stay up.
But I find too that again it just changes. They
just get more words and more more ways of telling
you things. But I think we've noticed that if you
just start early, it's hard when they start going to school,
because the afternoons get so busy by the time you

(05:37):
get home. Unless you start literally cooking dinner straight away,
the whole night just gets drawn out and they get
worser than night gets later because they get over time
over time. Starting the whole dinner into bedtime routine earlier
I think helps gen But you probably probably do that
already again, it's just a phase that they.

Speaker 4 (05:57):
Kind of continue to go through. But that's a really
good point something.

Speaker 5 (06:00):
Yeah, how's Henry.

Speaker 6 (06:01):
We're not at this stage exactly like he's a little
bit younger, but we're still like, you know, that's our
routine is we're still rocking him to sleep, and that's
kind of like what we've done. But lately we've taken
him off so we're trying to wean him off breastfeeding.
He's really connected to Jess and choose to feed him
to sleep and we'll try to break that. So lately
I've been rocking him, so we separated Jess from feeding

(06:22):
him to sleep, feed him in the lounge room in
a bright lit room so it's separate to bed. I've
been doing the night sleep. So we go around the house,
we say good night to everything. We go say good
night to Bali, our cat, good night to the bath,
good night.

Speaker 4 (06:32):
Toys, and he's just going around.

Speaker 5 (06:33):
He's looking a bit.

Speaker 6 (06:34):
O me, me, Mi, me, good night, good night everyone,
good night mom. He knows he's going to sleep because
he's not really fighting me. And then we go into
the room with the rain sounds playing, it gets dark
and he just rests his head on my shoulder and
I'll just rock him for a bit, and just before
he goes to sleep, I'll put him in the cotton.
And I think that's been working lately so far. And
to get to the stage where we just put him

(06:55):
in there cold turkey and just shut the door. But
we're not there yet, but looking forward to this stage.

Speaker 3 (07:01):
It reminds me too, that's a really good point of
someone said that just to make the bedroom such a
nice spot, a nice relaxing spot too, which then helps
if you've got the sounds ready. And again it's the
same routine every night, but if that's a really comfortable spot,
I think playing in there during the day helps too.
This is probably more when they're scared, scared of bed
and scared of the dark, and well things like that.

(07:21):
All that helps to set up all those familiar things
that are all the same every time. Are no bloody
even in non winter times. But likes her socks on
so that it doesn't pull up her that never comes
up until you've already tucked them in. And I kin't
have socks on. Your hants don't want to come up

(07:43):
in the night, not that you know to come up
as you'd be asleep. We have to put socks on right,
the socks put back on right.

Speaker 4 (07:49):
The last moment.

Speaker 7 (07:50):
My girls have just started liking you know the light
that has stars on the roof.

Speaker 4 (07:55):
Do we do that before bed?

Speaker 2 (07:57):
They love it.

Speaker 7 (07:58):
They're like, shut the door, mummy, and they know so
they need Although it's funny because now they think it
happens all the time, so it's daylight and they.

Speaker 5 (08:05):
Shut the door.

Speaker 7 (08:06):
I'm like, no, no, it's not dark and it's so
that's a nice way relaxing before bed, lying down because
I remember I loved I remember sticking.

Speaker 3 (08:15):
The National geography right, So that's a nice sort of
bedtime routine that helps relax them a bit.

Speaker 5 (08:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:24):
I mean, I think kind of what we're all talking
about is keeping a consistent routine, and your child's always
going to kind of try to push it around. But
if you create that routine and that consistency that actually
gives them comfort, will hopefully see them through the ages.
But it's funny how it does change. I still have
to be in the room with Asher when he first

(08:45):
starts going to sleep. It was interesting John ashually if
I was holding Asher and rocking him as soon as
I put him down at the same age as Henry,
he would wake up.

Speaker 5 (08:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah, we couldn't do that. We had to have him
in the bed, the cod or whatever and then just
be there with him, and that gave him comfort.

Speaker 5 (09:00):
But if that changed, he was.

Speaker 6 (09:02):
There were phases that that was the case for us.
We just tried everything, and he just changed one day.
We just kind of kept doing it and just one
day he just went in there and didn't want to
get back up. But it still happens. It still happens
when he's kind of feeling a bit unwell or something
and he wants to sleep on us all night. So
I think it just changes, and we just adapt as
much as we can, just embrace it and hard enough

(09:24):
a bit.

Speaker 2 (09:25):
If you're if you're are you a fall of sleeper,
Like if you're putting Henry down, you're in the room
there with him.

Speaker 6 (09:32):
I feel like he can see my eyes, So I'm
just kind of I'm rocking.

Speaker 3 (09:34):
MYEP is a massive fall asleep.

Speaker 4 (09:40):
She can be there for hours. Sometimes, why do you
come awake me up?

Speaker 3 (09:43):
I would just look so comfy, But then the whole night, well,
because the.

Speaker 5 (09:51):
Sleep yourself, you're awake.

Speaker 4 (09:56):
We hope we've We've helped, haven't.

Speaker 5 (09:58):
We don't want to. We have helped Jenny.

Speaker 4 (10:00):
Yeah, thank you Jen for your question.

Speaker 3 (10:02):
If you have other questions you would like to send
into the Deer Wiggles segment, you can absolutely do that.

Speaker 4 (10:07):
On our website through technology. Yes, but that's all for
the episode today. Thank you, Katerina and John. No worries,
goodbye everybody. Yes, been wiggled talk.

Speaker 5 (10:17):
Well yeah, I just drifted off. I was like, I was.

Speaker 4 (10:21):
Made me sleep.

Speaker 2 (10:22):
Don't worry side, but I've got you your calm voices
just made me drift off.

Speaker 5 (10:26):
But yeah, that is awful wiggle talk.

Speaker 2 (10:28):
Yes, that was Deer Wiggles and you know lucky John, Katerina,
it's a podcast for parents.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
Goodbye, good night,