December 1, 2025 • 40 mins
Feeding kids shouldn’t feel like a daily battle - but between beige-food phases, lunchbox pressure and breakfast standoffs, it often does. So today, we called in help.
Joel Feren - accredited dietitian, dad of two, and the internet’s beloved “Nutrition Guy” - joins Lachy and Simon to take the stress out of feeding families. Joel’s known for cutting through confusing food advice and giving parents permission to focus on what actually matters: balance, flavour, routine and connection - not perfection, just what works.
HOSTS
Simon Pryce
Lachlan Gillespie
GUEST
Joel Feren - @the_nutritionguy
You can find out more about Joel and his recipes here.
PRODUCERS
Produced by The Wiggles and Mylk Media
Madeline Joannou
Nick Webb
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About The Wiggles' Podcast - Wiggle Talk
Think you’ve got parenting figured out? So do Simon and Lachy - until the toddler throws a curveball. On Wiggle Talk - a podcast for parents, Red Wiggle Simon Pryce and Purple Wiggle Lachy Gillespie tackle the tricky, funny, and unexpected moments of raising little humans.
Simon, dad to son Asher, and Lachy, father to twin daughters Lulu and Lottie and stepdad to Jasper, share the highs and lows of parenting in the early years. Alongside their own stories, they welcome guests - from parenting experts to well-known personalities - who bring fresh perspectives and practical wisdom to the table.
Each week also features Dear Wiggles - where listeners send in their questions, the things that keep them up at night, or the dilemmas they’d love another parent’s take on. Simon and Lachy talk it through with honesty, and when needed, they call in expert friends to help provide thoughtful advice and reassurance.
With decades of experience in children’s education and entertainment, The Wiggles bring their trademark warmth and playfulness to conversations on everything from sleep and routines to tantrums, play, and the big feelings that come with family life.
Two dads, no filter, figuring it out as they go.
About The Wiggles
For over three decades, The Wiggles have been a beloved cornerstone of children's entertainment, captivating and educating millions of preschoolers—and their parents—around the world. Known for their high-energy performances, catchy songs, and colourful characters, The Wiggles have built a global legacy rooted in the power of music and movement to inspire early childhood learning.
With a mission to make education fun, The Wiggles create content specifically designed for pre-K, preschool, kindergarten, and nursery school age groups. Their unique blend of music, dance, and educational content not only entertains but also helps children understand the world around them. Generations of fans who grew up watching The Wiggles are now sharing that same joy with their own children.
The Wiggles’ impact is truly global: they’ve achieved billions of music streams and YouTube views, and have sold more than 30 million albums and DVDs, along with eight million books worldwide. The Wiggles continue to dominate the preschool entertainment scene, connecting with new generations through various platforms. Their live shows consistently sell out across three continents, and their videos are enjoyed on countless broadcast and digital platforms in over 190 countries.
The Wiggles continue to dominate the preschool entertainment scene, connecting with new generations through various platfor
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
The Wiggles acknowledge the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia
and their connections to land, sea and community. We pay
our respects to elders, past, present and emerging.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to Wiggle Talk. It's a podcast for parents. My
name is Lockey and I am the Purple Wiggle, one
of the purple Wiggles in the Wiggles.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
I'm very confused, but my name is Simon. I'm one
of the red Wiggles in the Wiggles where there's two
red Wiggles myself and Caterina. But today we're joined by
someone who's on a mission. Well he's on a mission
to make food feel a little less stressful. Accredited dietitian
and dad Joel Ferren. He's better known as the Nutrition Guy.
(00:48):
Now we're going to speak to Joel. But before we do, Lockie,
you said you had something to tie all.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
In or in our big show world Simon. At the moment, yeah,
we are, and on the weekend big breaks they are.
We're doing a ten and a three o'clock show mostly.
But you know what, I find there's more dancing in
this show than ever before for myself because I'm off
the piano.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Which I been slave to the keyboard for years.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
I look, and I'm hoping the crowds are enjoying seeing
Locky move again. Dust off the old shoes. But this
is kind of related to food. But I tell you what,
eating just before the second show made it very hard
to dance.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Did you save yours? You saved yourself till before this one?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I think I too much.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah, see, I'm an overeater in between shows. I've been
very easy by myself for many years. But I know.
But see, I've found that this longer break. So we
normally do ten, one and four yes, But because of
the size of the crowds, we're doing a ten and
a three yes. And so I'm eating lunch at midday
(01:53):
and that gives me plenty of time to digest for
the three o'clock. Normally, at the one o'clock I'm struggle
town because of the old Buckliver's coming back up. I
never I've never eaten buckler, and that's we haven't eat
a lot of chicken.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
We Well, maybe it's because I've got used to it.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Maybe you've had a few years because you have the piano. Yes,
so you stand there. I do be up and down
the spot for years.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Okay, well I felt it. That's what I felt, So
I'm going to have to resays, and now I understand.
Danna always said she couldn't eat before showtime, and that
was a lot more moving than what I do some
turns in the show. You yes, what's that dizzy? That
song you've seen so beautifully. I do quite a few turns,
(02:46):
but I just noticed it. So I'm going to take note.
For the rest of the tour, maybe you'll see me
jump a little bit higher.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Well, I look forward to that, and watch out for
the buckliver.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I hope we get buck on some somewmer on the
tour or some a good brigs on just.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yeah, okay, Well. Joel Ferren has built a huge following
online as the Nutrition Guy. He's an accredited practicing dietitian
who translates all the confusing food advice into something parents
can actually use.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
He is also a dat of two, so he knows
what real meal time looks like. You might have seen
Joel on TV or social media talking about everything from
hidden sugars to why we should stop sneaking veggies into
meals and start celebrating them instead.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
He's all about taking the pressure off parents, helping families
eat well without overthinking it. Now, today we're tackling one
of parenting's greatest mysteries, how to get children to actually
eat what's in front of them, from the beige food
phase to breakfast, sugar bombs and school lunchboxes. Joel's here
to help us feed our families better.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
So let's get into it. Joel, welcome to wiggle Talk.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Can we just start with breakfast? What's a good start
for breakfast for children but for all of us?
Speaker 4 (04:00):
Yeah, I think this conversation can definitely extend to grown
ups too. Now, when I think about breakfast, I want
to be getting a few different things on my plate
or potentially in my bowl. So I'm all about maximizing
food groups and utrends as well. So looking at some
type of whole grain sauce, things like whole grains, fruits
and or veggies, we want to get some healthy fats
(04:23):
and a dairy sauce or a potentially suitable alternative. So
some specific examples could be a hearty bowl of breakfast
cereal things like wheat picks or oats or wheaties or
brand if your kids will eat that sort of stuff
and then you know, sort of gone in the days
of just having a bowl of breakfast cereal with a
(04:44):
splash of milk on top. We want to be looking
to add adding different things in. So it might be
a handful of fruit, hearty fats in the form of
seeds or nuts, could be some yogurt as well. Haven't
quite worked out a way to get veggies in my
breakfast cereal bowl, but hats off to anybody who does.
So it's looking to create something that's it's really well
balanced and really well rounded that's going to sustain a
(05:08):
child or an adult through those morning hours, potentially powering
them through to morning tea or even to lunchtime.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
So it's more of those types of we'll call them
cereals like wheat bis dew. Class them as whole grains,
Is that what you class them as?
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Yeah, as opposed to your refined grains, So your fine grains,
they're whole grains to start, but they're stripped of those
outer layers, so you're losing a lot of those key
nutrients as well as fiber. So things like wheatboks like
I mentioned, it could be oats, it could be Wheati's brand.
I mean, there's so many on the market. These are
really valuable sources of nutrition.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
Basically, things get pump full of sugar. Is that what
happens with cereals ultimately?
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean it's not always the case, but yes,
sometimes they're pump full of sugar. So looking at a
low sugar option, and that's where like the ones I've
already mentioned, they're naturally low sugar, so they're perfect options.
Doesn't always have to be a bowl of breakfast cereal.
It could be a smoothie. I've got a three year
old son and that's what he loves and he demands
it as soon as he wakes up. And once again
(06:11):
I sort of follow that same idea of what can
I chuck into his breakfast smoothie to make it more nutritious.
So I'll give you my key secret or you know
what he likes. But it's a wheat bix. It's some
yogurt top with milk. I had Pepeda's in there, nut butter, banana,
blueberries because that's his favorite. And for me, it's a
(06:32):
nutrition bomb and it's clearly a flavor bomb too, and
he just smashes it, and you know, nothing makes me
prouder as a dad, and obviously he's a dietitian. Then
getting my kids off to a really hearty and nourishing
start to the day.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
And you're right to put a bit of honey and
things like that in't it? Is that okay? Like to
sweeten it?
Speaker 4 (06:50):
Yeah? Look, I don't mind a splash of honey. I mean,
just be mindful. Kids under one shouldn't be having honey
because it's a risk of botulism. But the pros well
and truly outweigh the cons in this regard. So I
think sometimes we get the blinkers on when we talk
about nutrition and we focus on the one specific nutrient,
but you lose sight of the forest for the trees.
(07:11):
And if you've got a really hearty breakfast bowl, like
it's going to be pretty insignificant if you add a
drizzle of honey, and if that means that the child
is actually going to consume that bowl of cereal, then
you're obviously well in front.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Yeah, where does toast or bread sit in the mix
for breakfast?
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Same idea, It's all about what else can you add
to it to make it more nutritious. So what I
would say, if it's a bread or a piece of toast,
make it a whole grain variety. I mean, whole meal
is a good start. Whole grains better, something visible grains
and seeds in there, and then adding some type of
protein sauce. So it could be some eggs on toast,
(07:51):
maybe some nut butter, cut up some fruit and team
it up with you know, maybe a side serf of
yogurt or a glass of milk, and there you go
sort of tapped into maybe three or four food groups
at breakfast. So rather than just your toast with a
smear of butter and it's not going to quite cut it,
but potentially adding things in I'm all about nutrition. By addition,
(08:13):
you might have sort of guessed that already in the
early stages, so you know, always thinking about what else
can you add, what else can you build to make
it more nutritious.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Growing up, I remember the food pyramid. Is that still
a thing? Was that grains on the bottom is I
Actually I can't remember it, but I remember that was
kind of the big talking point of getting all you
nutrition for the days it still worked that way or
rules changed.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
Similar I mean similar sort of principles. It's morphed more
from a pyramid into what we call a plate model
and the austrain Dictor guidelines. They were last reviewed, I
think it was twenty thirteen, and they're up for review
again next year, so you might see some slight differences
from previous models, but essentially it's the same type of
meat and we're always focused on the core food, so
(09:03):
the five different food groups. So, like you mentioned Simon,
whole grains are a key feature of that. But then
we've got things like fruits, we've got veggies, we've got
dairy and suitable alternatives. And then you've got your lean proteins,
and it's not always your animal proteins, but your vegetarian
sauces as well. And then it's limiting or potentially restricting
some of those what I would call extra foods. You're
(09:25):
heavily processed foods, your lollies, chocolates, those types of things.
They're not a no no altogether, but what I would
call sometimes more like a treat or a fun food.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Yeah, I saw your ready made burritos for breakfast that
just go in the freezer and egg and beans and
cheese and put them in the press look delicious.
Speaker 4 (09:47):
I feel quite touchy. Been on my Instagram this is great, lucky. Yeah,
they're awesome. I also work as a recipe developer. I'm
not just a dietitian, so for me, it puts these
things into practice. So those breakfast breas are really great,
and it's preparing ahead of time. I don't know about
you guys, but my mornings are pretty hectic and breakfast
(10:07):
is just one of those things to tick off. And
if I've got something that's ready to go that my
kids are going to eat, because it's always it's only
nutrition if it gets eaten. And if I've got something
that's ready to go in the freezer that I can
put in a sandwich press and I'll get eaten, I
think it ticks all the right boxes. But once again,
you know those breakfast burritos, there was a whole grain wrap,
there was some legumes, there was a dairy sauce in
(10:28):
the form of cheese. You can even add in some
fresh spinach before you toast it, and you're ticking pretty
much all the boxes.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
The other day, my kids, through watching a show, wanted
to make a smoothie out of nowhere, and it reminded
me how good smoothies can be. But that is there
is something in that isn't there is you can kind
of get a few more ingredients that they probably wouldn't
eat on their own in something like a smoothie or
I had even like a frittada or a pancake, where
you can kind of add a little bit more they're
(10:56):
probably not going to eat just in a clump off
the table.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
That's a good thing, absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
I mean, I don't like this idea of hiding things.
I think, you know, it's always good to showcase foods
in all their glory and getting engaging all the senses.
But from time to time, and particularly something like a smoothie,
it's a great opportunity to get more of those things in.
So hats off to if your kids will eat spinach
and kale in a smoothie. But I think you can
pretty much stick all the other boxes.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
If I spinach and kale, say you're having difficulty giving
your child the healthy breakfast, the smoothie, or the eggs,
the toast of the eggs and all the is it
okay to have one of the other cereals If that's
all you're going to be able to get them to eat,
or they're better off filling up on water. Like, if
you're struggling trying to give them to eat the healthy version,
(11:47):
what's something your parents can do.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
The first thing I'd say to that is fed is best.
And sometimes it's about setting the bar low. So for
whatever reason, if it's rice, bubbles or corn flakes, use
that as a starting point, use that as a benchmark,
and see what else you can add to it. I mean,
nothing is inherently bad. You know, they might be higher
in sugar, and they might be lower in fiber, and
they might be slightly higher in salt, but there's still
(12:11):
some good things in some of those refined breakfast cereals,
so they're not I don't want to say that they're terrible.
Nothing's ever terrible. But potentially it's finding other things to
add to it, or maybe it's combining something else with it.
Maybe it's having I'm using corn flakes as an example,
but I'm sure you can lump in a whole raft
of other options. But maybe it's combining something like cornflakes
(12:33):
with a wheatbix or a handful of oats, topping it
with some nuts or seeds, or blending in some nut butter,
a whole milk or a soy milk, and obviously getting
things like fruit in there as well. It's actually quite
a decent start to the day. I mean, everyone expects
me as a dietician to have the most perfect diet
(12:53):
and then by extension, my kids. But while my son
loves that really hearty smoothie that I've shared with you all,
my daughter, on the other hand, breakfast has been a
struggle over the years and we've just now landed on
up and goes for her. And you know, it might
not win the Olympic gold medal, but you know, from
(13:15):
my perspective, it's still not a bad option. She's still
getting some calcium, she's still getting some grains in there,
she's still getting some vitamins and minerals and some protein,
and for her, it ticks the right boxes. And we're
not getting that conflict in the morning, which is absolutely
something you want to avoid. And for us, that's where
we've landed and it keeps the peace, and it means
(13:38):
that she goes off to school now that she's in
prep with something pretty nutritious in her belly.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well that's good. And then I guess at some stage
during the day she's going to get the nutrient she
needs from. She might be having the breakfast battle, but
for whatever reason, lunch is okay. And so then you've
got your lunch where she's going to get all the
nutritional benefits from.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Absolutely to think I pack a pretty hearty lunch for her,
and we can definitely move on to talking about strategies
for how to pack a healthy lunchbox. But meals don't
have to be perfect. It's all about getting that balance,
and for whatever that looks like for somebody, balance is
always going to look slightly different. But we talk a
lot about dietary patterns, and it's not about single nutrients
(14:22):
or single foods. It's about what your diet looks overall. So, yes,
my daughter has up and go in the morning, and
you know, it might get a B or a B
plus maybe, but I'd like to think that elsewhere in
my daughter's diet she gets A pluses and she might
get the occasional C or D. But overall, it's the
context that matters.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I've always been happy with just a pass.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
You know, it depends what you're aiming for, And as
I said, everyone's got different goals. And everyone's got different needs.
I think we've sort of got to drop this idea
that our diets and our kids diets need to be perfect,
because I don't know what perfect quite looks like. I
think there's always got to be some regal room.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
Yeah, is it important for children to see their parents
eating the same foods? That sort of modeling behavior. If
you're asking your child eat broccoli, then you should be
eating broccoli yourself.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Absolutely, It's always about modeling behaviors, and our kids pick
up on that. Their kids are like sponges. So it's
not only the foods we eat, but also the language
we use around food. And I can share specifically bringing
you back to me is that for many years I
was vegetarian and my kids and my wife as well,
and my kids just didn't see either of us eating meat.
(15:40):
And I've reintroduced meat in the past few months for
different reasons, and I think that's actually having a flow
on effect for my kids as well. So if you
want your kids to eat their veggies, put veggies on
your plate. Talk about the benefits of veggies, not from
necessarily a specific health perspective, but that veggies might help
us think better and concentrate more and learn better at
(16:03):
school and help us perform on the sporting field. I
think that that modeling behavior is really really crucial, So yeah,
definitely practice what you preach.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Yeah, which then leans into families eating together, doesn't it that.
I know with Asher, he's always been a pretty good eater,
but he's always been the best eater when we're all
together eating as a family and there's little share things
on the table and he's using the tongs and he's
kind of involved and engaged, and he eats much better
when we're all they're doing it together.
Speaker 4 (16:32):
Love it. And that might not be the case all
the time because of wet commitments and travel and whatever else.
But I think, you know, really protecting that when it's
available to you.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Certainly from my experience, I think it's good too to
remember that it's some things just take a bit of time.
Like I really wanted all my kids to eat eggs,
and it just wasn't happening for a while, but then
out of nowhere, and I think it actually teamed up
with Donner and I just having eggs on a weekend
and then all of a sudden they wanted to try
(17:04):
scrambled eggs and now they eat it really well. It
didn't happen straight away, but it does happen if you
kind of stick with it rather than just going on.
You know, that's just not going to happen. Let's not
worry about eggs. But they're so good and you want
them to. Can we go to the lunchbox now? Because
I know we've both got lunchbox age children.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Yes, starting next year, ready to pack it. We went
to a school's orientation that we need three lunchboxes. We
need a crunch and sip, a lunch lunch box and
an afternoon teas. There's a lot of meal prep. That's
a lot of frozen burritos.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Hey, I know I'm based in Melbourne, but invite me
up to Sydney. I'll be happy to make you some goutch,
cook you some burritos.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
If you're going to look at a lunchbox or lunch
on a plate, what wouldn't I ideal lunch look like
for a child?
Speaker 4 (17:53):
Similar philosophy from breakfast. That's what I take to lunch.
I think like a dietitian, So my mind, I'm thinking
about all those core food groups and that's what I
want to cover in lunch. Keeping in mind it's not
always about nutrition, sometimes about nourishing the soul as well.
I'll put my nutrition hat on. So for me, there's
a whole grain in there, so that could be something
like a sandwich or a whole grain wrap and filling
(18:15):
it up with something like maybe a protein. So there
could be some chicken in there, it could be some tuna,
even some cheese, egg to your point, lucky, and then
it's fleshing it out with maybe some veggies in there.
My daughter's obviously prep so for her she likes things
like cherry tomatoes, cucumbers. She likes pickle cucumbers, so often
they're a feature in her lunch box. And then there's
(18:37):
some fruit, and that could be in the form of
dried fruit as well, so we get these hundred percent
fruit straps that are really good. She likes prunes, strawberries.
And then there's some sort of dairy sauce. So often
it's a yogurt, slice of cheese. If it wasn't in
a sandwich, there might be you know, some packaged food
in there as well. Sometimes I packed some whole grain
(18:59):
crackers or some sea you eat. But what I would
encourage listeners to do is just think about all the
different food groups and making sure that something from those
food groups at least features in the lunch box. More
often than not.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Do we over snack our children, Like in between meals,
what's appropriate and appropriate snack for children to have so
they're still going to eat their lunch. I know, when
Asha finishes preschool, he's starving, so I'll give him something
to eat, which then can tend to affect what is
going to eat for dinner. And then I'm trying to
force him to eat dinner because I think he needs
(19:32):
to eat it. But maybe he's not hungr anymore. I mean,
who knows. But are there too many snacks that we
can have?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Yeah, it's a really tricky one to navigate. I'm all
about protecting meal times, so kids typically will need three
square meals a day plus two to three snacks. Okay,
So if you can stick to some sort of routine,
I think that will work best. The problem is when
you graze over the day, it can really dull those
hunger cues. And we want our kids to know what
(19:59):
hungry like, what hungry feels like. So from my perspective,
a snack is just something to tide them over between meals,
so that might be a piece of fruits, some yogurt,
some cheese, and biscuits.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Things like air.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
Dried popcorn are really good snacks, so they're sort of
my my go to options. But definitely want to try
and protect meal times as much as we can.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
Yeah, we don't tend to allow ourselves to get hungry anymore,
do we we get a constant state of eating? Well,
I am anyway, You're right.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
I mean sort of hit the nail on the head.
I mean we try. I try so at least have
you know, some sort of time between snacks and meals,
whether that's an hour, an hour and a half. I
think schools are pretty good with that, and it's sort
of protecting those meal times, particularly lunch, and having adequate
times for snacks in the morning and then in the
afternoon as well. But I know I can get a
(20:55):
bit tricky with say three point thirty pickup, and if
dinner's five o'clock and then the kids are snacking sort
of four even closer to four point thirty, that can
sort of interrupt what happens at dinner.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
We're still at that stage, and it is frustrating. But
you know, the short order cooks that multiple dinners each
night and then finally you get to mum or dad
dinner at whatever time it is. But have you got
some helpful tips for that.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
It's a really slippery slope. I think you don't want
to set any sort of type of precedent to cook
multiple meals. And it goes back to that modeling behavior
that we talked about before. I think the key is
is giving the kids some sort of autonomy and making
sure that there's something we call it safe foods, that
there's something that they're guaranteed to love historically they've loved.
(21:42):
And then trying with the art of persistence is you know,
encouraging some different options. So trying to cook one meal
or at least you know, if it's two meals, it's
that there are similar features. And this sort of resonates
with me and is timely because last night we all
had tofu. We all had tofu with rice. But my
(22:04):
wife mine and my wife's meal looked slightly different to
what my kids meal looked like, but it was still
the same features. So you know, it might have looked
like two different meals, but in a sense, it was
dished up slightly differently, but give your kids autonomy, making
sure there's something safe on the plate and that they're
guaranteed to eat, and trying to be a little bit
(22:24):
persistent with the different options. So I mean last night,
classic example, it was tofu with brown rice. There was
some carrots and cucumber, and we did it as a
salad and for my kids, it was a bit deconstructed.
That's how my kids tend to eat. I'm not sure
about your kids and listeners kids as well, but you know,
they like the tofu separate to the rice, and they
(22:45):
like the veggie separate, and they had some cor morse
on their plate, and you know, it was a bit
of a mixed bag, but it ticked all the right
boxes from my perspective, protein, whole grain, veggie, and it
was cooked in extra virgin olivol, so that's why the
healthy fat came in. And from that perspective, you know,
it might have not necessarily looked instagram worthy. I didn't
share it on my Instagram, but it ticked all the
(23:07):
right nutrient boxes.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Is it normal for children to go through the beije
food stage where everything is beige and it's hard to
get a piece of vegetable on the plate. It is
a stage. We have to accept it, but then work
through that stage.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Absolutely, and I've lived through it. I'm living through it
right now with my three year old. I think the
biggest message that I can share is just be persistent
and don't push back. The dinner table is not a
place for a battleground. It's really about kids exercising that
autonomy as well, and their taste buds are constantly turning over,
(23:49):
so things that they may have eaten in the past
they may just go completely off, so their preferences are
constantly in flux. The one thing I'd suggest is just
keep persisting, and that goes to your point again, Locky
about eggs, is that you know, maybe with a little
bit of gentle encouragement, but maybe it's through role modeling,
(24:10):
or maybe it's just through that regular exposure, it led
to your kids actually eating eggs. So classic example last
night is after dinner, my daughter grabbed the punnet of
cherry tomatoes from the fridge and was just snacking them
one by one, and my son, he doesn't like cherry tomatoes,
but he was watching his older sister eat them, and
(24:30):
he picked one out of the punnet and took a
bite and he did not like it with the funniest face.
But from my perspective, that was progress. And you know,
he may never touch a cherry tomato ever again, but
I'm hopeful over time. He's only three, so I'll give
him the benefit of the doubt that he might go
(24:51):
back to it at some point. But there was no encouragements,
there was no suggestion that he should have the cherry tomato,
but he was just like, whatever was going on through
his head led him to take it, and I think
that was a great thing. So be persistent. It's very
easy to lose heart. But the research shows is that
(25:11):
kids will need to be exposed to a new food
ten even twenty times before they actually try it and
accept it. So it can be very disheartening, it can
be very expensive, but you've got to just stay the course.
You've got to be persistent.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Like you said at the beginning, it will continue to change,
so that will be a phase and before you know it,
your son will be eating cherry tomatoes on his own
out of the planet, hopefully, hopefully.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
And the other thing I want to add to that
is that I think sometimes as parents, we can be
a little bit flavor averse for our kids, and I'm
all about maximizing flavor and whatever that looks like. I mean,
another example last night. I'm using last night as an
example very timely. They we're having this chat now, But
I put brown rice on my kid's plates, and my
(26:00):
son was like, nah, not really interested. But I gave
him a little ramikin of soy sauce to dip his
tofu in salt reduced and he decided to splash a
little bit of that soy on the rice, and for
him that was more palatable and actually really enjoyed it.
Another example of you know, let's add flavor to kids foods.
My kids demand to have extra virgin olive oil drizzled
(26:23):
on their food, and they like pepper and they like
lemon juice. So if you're just dishing up plain old
boiled broccoli, like no one's gonna really want that, maybe
the dietitian will eat it. But let's add flavor to foods.
And that might be through spice, it might be through herbs,
the lemon juice, extra virgin olivoil, even things like pepper
and sauces as well. Let's not see that as a
(26:46):
means to detract from the nutritional quality of a food.
Once again, it's only nutrition if it gets eaten. And
from my perspective, if something like the brown rice gets
eaten even though there's a little bit of soy sauce
on top, then I think that's pretty insignificant. And I
think he actually wins.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
I think that's a really good point. I think we
do naturally shy away from flavor when it comes to
our children. For some reason, we've got to keep a
plain and simple where flavor can actually help with the
taste and actually will help them eat it.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
Definitely. I don't think there's an expectation on any of
us to eat plain foods.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
So yes, no, that's right. First, I grew up with
boiled vegetables, so.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
I think we all did.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Yeah, that's right. It wasn't a lot of flavor. But
I'm quite happy with plain and so maybe I kind
of push that onto Asher a little bit too much
given how I grew up. But you mentioned before about
your vegetarian and now you eat meat. The importance of meat,
but in particular red meat in a children's diet, I'm
(27:48):
assuming it's a source of iron. But there are other
ways that children can get iron. But how important is
it for children to be eating meat?
Speaker 4 (27:55):
Yeah, Look, I'm a big wrap for kids eating meat.
I don't think we need to throw all our eggs
into one basket. I don't think meat needs to feature daily.
But you're right, red meat is a wonderful source of iron.
It's also a great source of things like protein and
zinc and vitamin B twelve. These nutrients are not exclusively
found in meat, So what I would suggest is trying
(28:19):
to get that balance, so making sure there's always some
sort of protein source with each of the meal. So
for using dinner as an example, I think that's where
red meat would typically feature. Maybe have red meat two
or three times a week and mix it up, make
sure there's things like chicken, some fish. But also introduce
your kids to vegetarian sources of protein as well, because
(28:41):
these foods are often good sources of iron. They're not
the best, but they're decent enough. So things like tofu tenpey, legumes, beans, chickpeas,
these are all really valuable sources of nutrition. Also good
source of fiber. Then we know the role of fiber
keeping out our guts nice and healthy, but also fostering
that wonderful ecosystem aboutteria that live in our large bower
(29:03):
that often have implications for our general health and wellbeing,
including mood and mental health. So it's not always about
getting meat and a couple of edge on your plate.
It's really about dietary diversity and making sure that there's
plenty of variety on your plate. And that extends to
kids as well. So iron is critically important, and low
(29:26):
iron can lead to things like slower growth, irritability, being
pale in color as well. So we definitely want to
be promoting those iron rich foods, but it doesn't always
have to be in the form of red meat.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
I think we easily fall into a trap of just
staying in a little world of what we make, and
so as parents, probably broaden our horizons a little bit
and think about other alternatives. I think it's a really
good idea.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
I think it's very easy to fall into these food ruts.
I think we all do it. Try new foods, experimenting
with different flavors, that regular exposure, like I talked about,
Hopefully that will lead to so some really great outcomes
where our kids have a really diverse and very diet
and they actually enjoyed the foods that they're consuming. I
think that's a great thing for us all to aspire to.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
Absolutely Now, sugar. Sugar is in a lot of foods,
I guess, primary packaged foods. How much sugar is too
much for children? How do we limit the amount of
sugar that children have?
Speaker 4 (30:24):
Yeah, I mean, to your first point, sugar added sugar.
So in the form of many of these, we'll call
it packaged foods. Just for ease here, children don't need
added sugar in their diet. But that's not to say
it can't feature at all. I think once you make
something forbidden, it sort of becomes the desired option. And
we know that historically through Bible stories like Adam and Eve,
(30:47):
they only wanted the apples that they were told not
to have. It's once again that careful balance. We don't
want to restrict it all together, but it doesn't necessarily
need to be a featured daily We want to be
promoting things like fruit and dairy and things like yogurts, milk.
They all contain natural sources of sugar, and I don't
want people to shy away from these things for fear
(31:09):
that the sugar is going to be detrimental to their
child's health. But we definitely want to be limiting, potentially
restricting some of those forms of added sugar, So the lollies,
the chocolates, the sweet biscuits, cakes, even things like fruit juices, cordials,
certainly soft drinks, and even to some extent, things like
(31:30):
flavored milk. They don't need to feature daily, but they
can feature from time to time.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
Going back on the sometimes food you spoke of earlier,
so is water the best thing for children to drink?
Speaker 4 (31:41):
Absolutely? What is the preferred beverage of choice? But I'd
add milk into that category as well. If it's a
light milk or a full cream milk, excellent. If it's
a plant milk, soy milks might pick of the bunch. Nutritionally,
it mirrors that of cow's milk. If you're going to
go for a different option, things like almond, coconut, The
(32:03):
list goes on. Just make sure it's fortified with calcium.
But keep in mind you're not getting that protein quality
that you're or even the amount that you would get
from a glass of soy milk or a glass of
cow's milk.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
And is a glass of milk a day kind of
the idea.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
The issue with milk, too much milk is that it
will displace other things from the diet. So if your
child's heavily reliant on milk, then potentially what are they
missing out on? So calcium is particularly important. This is
when we're building bone mineral density early in life and
through our adolescence as well and early adult years. So
(32:41):
we definitely want to be promoting dairy foods or as
I keep saying, suitable alternatives to dairy if you're avoiding
dairy for whatever reason. But potentially a glass of milk
plus a tub of yogurt or a pouch of yogurt
and a slice or two of cheese that will take
all the calcium boxes for the day.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
Mango seasons back in Brisbane, that's very I've never seen
more mango on the kids faces.
Speaker 3 (33:05):
Really the other day. Yeah, do they put it in
their mouth? Not a lot.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
But raw veggies are the are they in the lunch
boxes or like obviously that's the best rather than cooked
and you can add cooked veggies.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I think there's this idea once again that it always
has to be raw veggies. Anything that's going to be
eaten if it's canned. Let's not shy away from the
benefits of things like canned veggies as well frozen. We've
sort of got this elitist mindset as well that all
our veggies need to be fresh, But there's lots of
research to show that even frozen veggies are more nutritious
(33:43):
than fresh. And that's because fresh veggies, fresh and inverted
commas often spend long time in storage and going from
one place to another, compared to frozen vegge which are
literally snap frozen, popped in a freezer. They retain a
lot of their nutritional goodness. But vegetables in any form,
let's just get them in buy and large kids as
(34:06):
well as adults don't hit their veggie targets. So let's
think outside the box a little bit when it comes
to veggies. This idea of eating the rainbow, it's not
always about getting your greens in, but trying to get
your other colorful fruits and vegetables in there too, because
we know that's another way of maximizing your nutrend intake.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
That's a great image for children too, that concept of
eating the rainbow. I love that. That's excellent.
Speaker 4 (34:30):
Yeah, and I mentioned the Austraine dietary guidelines. I mean
they're falling flat. A very few of us get five
serves of veggies a dates. It's almost aspirational. It's not
really achievable for a lot of people. And some of
the talk in my circles is to change the language
around it to be more reflective of eating the rainbow.
(34:50):
And I really like this idea. It's eating all the
different colored fruits and vegetables and maybe not necessarily putting
a specific target on it, like five serves a day,
but maybe just encouraging people to have different colored veggies
in our diet, and hopefully that will lead to people
eating more of it, because at the moment we're all
falling well short. We want kids to engage their senses
(35:13):
when it comes to vegetables. We want them to know
what it feels like, texture, that crunch, and maybe it's
more incumbent on us to dish it up in different
novel ways and make food fun and engaging and colorful
and having that variety. And you know, you might be
familiar with this song called fruit salad, Yummy, Yummy. I
think that yeah, you might have performed it once or twice.
(35:36):
I think and I think that that really resonates and
that rings true. Let's make food fun and being persistent
regularly providing those foods, making that exposure a really key
feature in all our households. And hopefully the winds will happen,
and they might happen down the track. And like I
(35:56):
said last night, the wind was my son trying the
cherry to And who knows. It might be a week,
it might be a year, it might be five years
before he decides that he wants to eat cherry tomatoes,
if at all. But I will look back and go,
that's what started at.
Speaker 3 (36:11):
And I guess that is it's about making it fun
and some gentle encouragement. If there's some pushback, you leave
it alone and you're trying it another time instead of
you know, like you're saying, you want that you want
dinner to be a fun, fun place to be, or
a meal time a fun place to be that the
whole family can experience and enjoy.
Speaker 4 (36:28):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's often lost because meal times
is one of those things we're all experiencing. We've all
got kids similar age, but you know, it's just one
of those boxes to tick, and meal times particularly dinner
should be more about connection as well and fun. I
like this idea of bringing fun back into the kitchen,
bringing fun back to the dinner table. That's not lost
(36:50):
on me as a dietitian. I think sometimes we all,
you know, maybe my peers, and maybe the way the
conversation goes that it's all about just getting the nutrients in.
But for me, it's about talking about the day. It's
telling stories, sharing stories, hearing stories, and that's all part
of it. And I don't want that dinner table to
be a scene of conflict. There's enough conflict going on
(37:13):
in the world. I certainly don't need to open up
another front in my kitchen. And let's see food for
all its fabulous forms. Yes, it provides nutrition, but it's
also a source of love and connection and heritage and memory.
And that's certainly not lost on me as a nutrition professional.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Yeah, and that comes to getting the children, if they want,
they're interested to help cook the dinner as well or
prepare the food, be part of that whole process as well.
Speaker 4 (37:39):
I'm really big on that. I think it's about equipping
kids with the skills, a life skill that unfortunately has
almost become a lost art.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
Form.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
And when you talk about encouraging kids to try new foods,
that's a great way of getting kids to try new foods,
taste tests along the way, get them to cut something,
give them that owner ship as well in the kitchen,
and you know, I would say they're more inclined to
try something new if they've actually been involved in the process.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Joel, this has been a really great chat and some
really practical elements for our audience, and great to get
your thoughts and ideas on eating healthily. And I think
we often get very confused these days about what you
can and can't eat or you shouldn't shouldn't eat. But
I think you've given some really good or insights into
(38:31):
what we can do as a family for our meal time.
So thank you, Joel, thanks for coming on. We will talk.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
Excellent, has been my pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Well.
Speaker 3 (38:44):
Joel made food time feel very simple, he did and
great and flavorsome.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Flavorsome fine. I like that bit at the end we're
talking about fun. But that reminded me of done and
I went out one night. We had a beautiful nanny
and she cut You had to get a quite a
sharp knife. I think but little carrot circles, cut little
bits out of them to make them a little flower.
And all the girls talked about for a week after
was queer carrot flowers. Carrot flowers, but they loved them,
(39:11):
just a little raw carrots. But it's just there are
so many different little things we can do and we
I've forgotten about that. I'll bring that out.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
Again on Sunday. Yeah, I know. But that's the thing,
isn't it. We always feel like we're so pressed for time,
and we just go back to what we always do,
and that's great, and things work, and if your child's
eating then that's the most important thing. But then at
some point we need to explore a little bit and
refresh and make some carrot flowers, you know, the sharp life. Yes,
(39:39):
but not the child.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
No, no surprise them. But thank you to Joel. That
was great And you can follow Joel on Instagram at
the Underscore Nutrition Guy. So I would have said the yes, Okay,
then I can do that again. You could follow Joel
at Instagram at the Underscore Nutrition Guy. Ad check out
his website for easy, practical recipes and follow his tips
(40:03):
for families. We'll have the link in the show.
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Notes Look, if you love the show, please rate and
review us so that others can find it too. Thanks
for listening to wheel Talk. You know what, Logie, Yes,
it's a podcast for parents. It is to you.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Bye bye
The Wiggles acknowledge the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia
and their connections to land, sea and community. We pay
our respects to elders, past, present and emerging.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to Wiggle Talk. It's a podcast for parents. My
name is Lockey and I am the Purple Wiggle, one
of the purple Wiggles in the Wiggles.
Speaker 3 (00:28):
I'm very confused, but my name is Simon. I'm one
of the red Wiggles in the Wiggles where there's two
red Wiggles myself and Caterina. But today we're joined by
someone who's on a mission. Well he's on a mission
to make food feel a little less stressful. Accredited dietitian
and dad Joel Ferren. He's better known as the Nutrition Guy.
(00:48):
Now we're going to speak to Joel. But before we do, Lockie,
you said you had something to tie all.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
In or in our big show world Simon. At the moment, yeah,
we are, and on the weekend big breaks they are.
We're doing a ten and a three o'clock show mostly.
But you know what, I find there's more dancing in
this show than ever before for myself because I'm off
the piano.
Speaker 3 (01:10):
Which I been slave to the keyboard for years.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
I look, and I'm hoping the crowds are enjoying seeing
Locky move again. Dust off the old shoes. But this
is kind of related to food. But I tell you what,
eating just before the second show made it very hard
to dance.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Did you save yours? You saved yourself till before this one?
Speaker 2 (01:30):
I think I too much.
Speaker 3 (01:32):
Yeah, see, I'm an overeater in between shows. I've been
very easy by myself for many years. But I know.
But see, I've found that this longer break. So we
normally do ten, one and four yes, But because of
the size of the crowds, we're doing a ten and
a three yes. And so I'm eating lunch at midday
(01:53):
and that gives me plenty of time to digest for
the three o'clock. Normally, at the one o'clock I'm struggle
town because of the old Buckliver's coming back up. I
never I've never eaten buckler, and that's we haven't eat
a lot of chicken.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
We Well, maybe it's because I've got used to it.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Maybe you've had a few years because you have the piano. Yes,
so you stand there. I do be up and down
the spot for years.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
Okay, well I felt it. That's what I felt, So
I'm going to have to resays, and now I understand.
Danna always said she couldn't eat before showtime, and that
was a lot more moving than what I do some
turns in the show. You yes, what's that dizzy? That
song you've seen so beautifully. I do quite a few turns,
(02:46):
but I just noticed it. So I'm going to take note.
For the rest of the tour, maybe you'll see me
jump a little bit higher.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
Well, I look forward to that, and watch out for
the buckliver.
Speaker 2 (02:57):
I hope we get buck on some somewmer on the
tour or some a good brigs on just.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
Yeah, okay, Well. Joel Ferren has built a huge following
online as the Nutrition Guy. He's an accredited practicing dietitian
who translates all the confusing food advice into something parents
can actually use.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
He is also a dat of two, so he knows
what real meal time looks like. You might have seen
Joel on TV or social media talking about everything from
hidden sugars to why we should stop sneaking veggies into
meals and start celebrating them instead.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
He's all about taking the pressure off parents, helping families
eat well without overthinking it. Now, today we're tackling one
of parenting's greatest mysteries, how to get children to actually
eat what's in front of them, from the beige food
phase to breakfast, sugar bombs and school lunchboxes. Joel's here
to help us feed our families better.
Speaker 2 (03:50):
So let's get into it. Joel, welcome to wiggle Talk.
Speaker 4 (03:53):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Can we just start with breakfast? What's a good start
for breakfast for children but for all of us?
Speaker 4 (04:00):
Yeah, I think this conversation can definitely extend to grown
ups too. Now, when I think about breakfast, I want
to be getting a few different things on my plate
or potentially in my bowl. So I'm all about maximizing
food groups and utrends as well. So looking at some
type of whole grain sauce, things like whole grains, fruits
and or veggies, we want to get some healthy fats
(04:23):
and a dairy sauce or a potentially suitable alternative. So
some specific examples could be a hearty bowl of breakfast
cereal things like wheat picks or oats or wheaties or
brand if your kids will eat that sort of stuff
and then you know, sort of gone in the days
of just having a bowl of breakfast cereal with a
(04:44):
splash of milk on top. We want to be looking
to add adding different things in. So it might be
a handful of fruit, hearty fats in the form of
seeds or nuts, could be some yogurt as well. Haven't
quite worked out a way to get veggies in my
breakfast cereal bowl, but hats off to anybody who does.
So it's looking to create something that's it's really well
balanced and really well rounded that's going to sustain a
(05:08):
child or an adult through those morning hours, potentially powering
them through to morning tea or even to lunchtime.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
So it's more of those types of we'll call them
cereals like wheat bis dew. Class them as whole grains,
Is that what you class them as?
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Yeah, as opposed to your refined grains, So your fine grains,
they're whole grains to start, but they're stripped of those
outer layers, so you're losing a lot of those key
nutrients as well as fiber. So things like wheatboks like
I mentioned, it could be oats, it could be Wheati's brand.
I mean, there's so many on the market. These are
really valuable sources of nutrition.
Speaker 3 (05:44):
Basically, things get pump full of sugar. Is that what
happens with cereals ultimately?
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Yeah? Yeah, I mean it's not always the case, but yes,
sometimes they're pump full of sugar. So looking at a
low sugar option, and that's where like the ones I've
already mentioned, they're naturally low sugar, so they're perfect options.
Doesn't always have to be a bowl of breakfast cereal.
It could be a smoothie. I've got a three year
old son and that's what he loves and he demands
it as soon as he wakes up. And once again
(06:11):
I sort of follow that same idea of what can
I chuck into his breakfast smoothie to make it more nutritious.
So I'll give you my key secret or you know
what he likes. But it's a wheat bix. It's some
yogurt top with milk. I had Pepeda's in there, nut butter, banana,
blueberries because that's his favorite. And for me, it's a
(06:32):
nutrition bomb and it's clearly a flavor bomb too, and
he just smashes it, and you know, nothing makes me
prouder as a dad, and obviously he's a dietitian. Then
getting my kids off to a really hearty and nourishing
start to the day.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
And you're right to put a bit of honey and
things like that in't it? Is that okay? Like to
sweeten it?
Speaker 4 (06:50):
Yeah? Look, I don't mind a splash of honey. I mean,
just be mindful. Kids under one shouldn't be having honey
because it's a risk of botulism. But the pros well
and truly outweigh the cons in this regard. So I
think sometimes we get the blinkers on when we talk
about nutrition and we focus on the one specific nutrient,
but you lose sight of the forest for the trees.
(07:11):
And if you've got a really hearty breakfast bowl, like
it's going to be pretty insignificant if you add a
drizzle of honey, and if that means that the child
is actually going to consume that bowl of cereal, then
you're obviously well in front.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
Yeah, where does toast or bread sit in the mix
for breakfast?
Speaker 4 (07:30):
Same idea, It's all about what else can you add
to it to make it more nutritious. So what I
would say, if it's a bread or a piece of toast,
make it a whole grain variety. I mean, whole meal
is a good start. Whole grains better, something visible grains
and seeds in there, and then adding some type of
protein sauce. So it could be some eggs on toast,
(07:51):
maybe some nut butter, cut up some fruit and team
it up with you know, maybe a side serf of
yogurt or a glass of milk, and there you go
sort of tapped into maybe three or four food groups
at breakfast. So rather than just your toast with a
smear of butter and it's not going to quite cut it,
but potentially adding things in I'm all about nutrition. By addition,
(08:13):
you might have sort of guessed that already in the
early stages, so you know, always thinking about what else
can you add, what else can you build to make
it more nutritious.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Growing up, I remember the food pyramid. Is that still
a thing? Was that grains on the bottom is I
Actually I can't remember it, but I remember that was
kind of the big talking point of getting all you
nutrition for the days it still worked that way or
rules changed.
Speaker 4 (08:40):
Similar I mean similar sort of principles. It's morphed more
from a pyramid into what we call a plate model
and the austrain Dictor guidelines. They were last reviewed, I
think it was twenty thirteen, and they're up for review
again next year, so you might see some slight differences
from previous models, but essentially it's the same type of
meat and we're always focused on the core food, so
(09:03):
the five different food groups. So, like you mentioned Simon,
whole grains are a key feature of that. But then
we've got things like fruits, we've got veggies, we've got
dairy and suitable alternatives. And then you've got your lean proteins,
and it's not always your animal proteins, but your vegetarian
sauces as well. And then it's limiting or potentially restricting
some of those what I would call extra foods. You're
(09:25):
heavily processed foods, your lollies, chocolates, those types of things.
They're not a no no altogether, but what I would
call sometimes more like a treat or a fun food.
Speaker 2 (09:37):
Yeah, I saw your ready made burritos for breakfast that
just go in the freezer and egg and beans and
cheese and put them in the press look delicious.
Speaker 4 (09:47):
I feel quite touchy. Been on my Instagram this is great, lucky. Yeah,
they're awesome. I also work as a recipe developer. I'm
not just a dietitian, so for me, it puts these
things into practice. So those breakfast breas are really great,
and it's preparing ahead of time. I don't know about
you guys, but my mornings are pretty hectic and breakfast
(10:07):
is just one of those things to tick off. And
if I've got something that's ready to go that my
kids are going to eat, because it's always it's only
nutrition if it gets eaten. And if I've got something
that's ready to go in the freezer that I can
put in a sandwich press and I'll get eaten, I
think it ticks all the right boxes. But once again,
you know those breakfast burritos, there was a whole grain wrap,
there was some legumes, there was a dairy sauce in
(10:28):
the form of cheese. You can even add in some
fresh spinach before you toast it, and you're ticking pretty
much all the boxes.
Speaker 2 (10:36):
The other day, my kids, through watching a show, wanted
to make a smoothie out of nowhere, and it reminded
me how good smoothies can be. But that is there
is something in that isn't there is you can kind
of get a few more ingredients that they probably wouldn't
eat on their own in something like a smoothie or
I had even like a frittada or a pancake, where
you can kind of add a little bit more they're
(10:56):
probably not going to eat just in a clump off
the table.
Speaker 3 (10:59):
That's a good thing, absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
I mean, I don't like this idea of hiding things.
I think, you know, it's always good to showcase foods
in all their glory and getting engaging all the senses.
But from time to time, and particularly something like a smoothie,
it's a great opportunity to get more of those things in.
So hats off to if your kids will eat spinach
and kale in a smoothie. But I think you can
pretty much stick all the other boxes.
Speaker 3 (11:25):
If I spinach and kale, say you're having difficulty giving
your child the healthy breakfast, the smoothie, or the eggs,
the toast of the eggs and all the is it
okay to have one of the other cereals If that's
all you're going to be able to get them to eat,
or they're better off filling up on water. Like, if
you're struggling trying to give them to eat the healthy version,
(11:47):
what's something your parents can do.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
The first thing I'd say to that is fed is best.
And sometimes it's about setting the bar low. So for
whatever reason, if it's rice, bubbles or corn flakes, use
that as a starting point, use that as a benchmark,
and see what else you can add to it. I mean,
nothing is inherently bad. You know, they might be higher
in sugar, and they might be lower in fiber, and
they might be slightly higher in salt, but there's still
(12:11):
some good things in some of those refined breakfast cereals,
so they're not I don't want to say that they're terrible.
Nothing's ever terrible. But potentially it's finding other things to
add to it, or maybe it's combining something else with it.
Maybe it's having I'm using corn flakes as an example,
but I'm sure you can lump in a whole raft
of other options. But maybe it's combining something like cornflakes
(12:33):
with a wheatbix or a handful of oats, topping it
with some nuts or seeds, or blending in some nut butter,
a whole milk or a soy milk, and obviously getting
things like fruit in there as well. It's actually quite
a decent start to the day. I mean, everyone expects
me as a dietician to have the most perfect diet
(12:53):
and then by extension, my kids. But while my son
loves that really hearty smoothie that I've shared with you all,
my daughter, on the other hand, breakfast has been a
struggle over the years and we've just now landed on
up and goes for her. And you know, it might
not win the Olympic gold medal, but you know, from
(13:15):
my perspective, it's still not a bad option. She's still
getting some calcium, she's still getting some grains in there,
she's still getting some vitamins and minerals and some protein,
and for her, it ticks the right boxes. And we're
not getting that conflict in the morning, which is absolutely
something you want to avoid. And for us, that's where
we've landed and it keeps the peace, and it means
(13:38):
that she goes off to school now that she's in
prep with something pretty nutritious in her belly.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
Well that's good. And then I guess at some stage
during the day she's going to get the nutrient she
needs from. She might be having the breakfast battle, but
for whatever reason, lunch is okay. And so then you've
got your lunch where she's going to get all the
nutritional benefits from.
Speaker 4 (13:58):
Absolutely to think I pack a pretty hearty lunch for her,
and we can definitely move on to talking about strategies
for how to pack a healthy lunchbox. But meals don't
have to be perfect. It's all about getting that balance,
and for whatever that looks like for somebody, balance is
always going to look slightly different. But we talk a
lot about dietary patterns, and it's not about single nutrients
(14:22):
or single foods. It's about what your diet looks overall. So, yes,
my daughter has up and go in the morning, and
you know, it might get a B or a B
plus maybe, but I'd like to think that elsewhere in
my daughter's diet she gets A pluses and she might
get the occasional C or D. But overall, it's the
context that matters.
Speaker 3 (14:42):
I've always been happy with just a pass.
Speaker 4 (14:44):
You know, it depends what you're aiming for, And as
I said, everyone's got different goals. And everyone's got different needs.
I think we've sort of got to drop this idea
that our diets and our kids diets need to be perfect,
because I don't know what perfect quite looks like. I
think there's always got to be some regal room.
Speaker 3 (15:06):
Yeah, is it important for children to see their parents
eating the same foods? That sort of modeling behavior. If
you're asking your child eat broccoli, then you should be
eating broccoli yourself.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Absolutely, It's always about modeling behaviors, and our kids pick
up on that. Their kids are like sponges. So it's
not only the foods we eat, but also the language
we use around food. And I can share specifically bringing
you back to me is that for many years I
was vegetarian and my kids and my wife as well,
and my kids just didn't see either of us eating meat.
(15:40):
And I've reintroduced meat in the past few months for
different reasons, and I think that's actually having a flow
on effect for my kids as well. So if you
want your kids to eat their veggies, put veggies on
your plate. Talk about the benefits of veggies, not from
necessarily a specific health perspective, but that veggies might help
us think better and concentrate more and learn better at
(16:03):
school and help us perform on the sporting field. I
think that that modeling behavior is really really crucial, So yeah,
definitely practice what you preach.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
Yeah, which then leans into families eating together, doesn't it that.
I know with Asher, he's always been a pretty good eater,
but he's always been the best eater when we're all
together eating as a family and there's little share things
on the table and he's using the tongs and he's
kind of involved and engaged, and he eats much better
when we're all they're doing it together.
Speaker 4 (16:32):
Love it. And that might not be the case all
the time because of wet commitments and travel and whatever else.
But I think, you know, really protecting that when it's
available to you.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
Certainly from my experience, I think it's good too to
remember that it's some things just take a bit of time.
Like I really wanted all my kids to eat eggs,
and it just wasn't happening for a while, but then
out of nowhere, and I think it actually teamed up
with Donner and I just having eggs on a weekend
and then all of a sudden they wanted to try
(17:04):
scrambled eggs and now they eat it really well. It
didn't happen straight away, but it does happen if you
kind of stick with it rather than just going on.
You know, that's just not going to happen. Let's not
worry about eggs. But they're so good and you want
them to. Can we go to the lunchbox now? Because
I know we've both got lunchbox age children.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
Yes, starting next year, ready to pack it. We went
to a school's orientation that we need three lunchboxes. We
need a crunch and sip, a lunch lunch box and
an afternoon teas. There's a lot of meal prep. That's
a lot of frozen burritos.
Speaker 4 (17:42):
Hey, I know I'm based in Melbourne, but invite me
up to Sydney. I'll be happy to make you some goutch,
cook you some burritos.
Speaker 3 (17:48):
If you're going to look at a lunchbox or lunch
on a plate, what wouldn't I ideal lunch look like
for a child?
Speaker 4 (17:53):
Similar philosophy from breakfast. That's what I take to lunch.
I think like a dietitian, So my mind, I'm thinking
about all those core food groups and that's what I
want to cover in lunch. Keeping in mind it's not
always about nutrition, sometimes about nourishing the soul as well.
I'll put my nutrition hat on. So for me, there's
a whole grain in there, so that could be something
like a sandwich or a whole grain wrap and filling
(18:15):
it up with something like maybe a protein. So there
could be some chicken in there, it could be some tuna,
even some cheese, egg to your point, lucky, and then
it's fleshing it out with maybe some veggies in there.
My daughter's obviously prep so for her she likes things
like cherry tomatoes, cucumbers. She likes pickle cucumbers, so often
they're a feature in her lunch box. And then there's
(18:37):
some fruit, and that could be in the form of
dried fruit as well, so we get these hundred percent
fruit straps that are really good. She likes prunes, strawberries.
And then there's some sort of dairy sauce. So often
it's a yogurt, slice of cheese. If it wasn't in
a sandwich, there might be you know, some packaged food
in there as well. Sometimes I packed some whole grain
(18:59):
crackers or some sea you eat. But what I would
encourage listeners to do is just think about all the
different food groups and making sure that something from those
food groups at least features in the lunch box. More
often than not.
Speaker 3 (19:11):
Do we over snack our children, Like in between meals,
what's appropriate and appropriate snack for children to have so
they're still going to eat their lunch. I know, when
Asha finishes preschool, he's starving, so I'll give him something
to eat, which then can tend to affect what is
going to eat for dinner. And then I'm trying to
force him to eat dinner because I think he needs
(19:32):
to eat it. But maybe he's not hungr anymore. I mean,
who knows. But are there too many snacks that we
can have?
Speaker 4 (19:37):
Yeah, it's a really tricky one to navigate. I'm all
about protecting meal times, so kids typically will need three
square meals a day plus two to three snacks. Okay,
So if you can stick to some sort of routine,
I think that will work best. The problem is when
you graze over the day, it can really dull those
hunger cues. And we want our kids to know what
(19:59):
hungry like, what hungry feels like. So from my perspective,
a snack is just something to tide them over between meals,
so that might be a piece of fruits, some yogurt,
some cheese, and biscuits.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Things like air.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
Dried popcorn are really good snacks, so they're sort of
my my go to options. But definitely want to try
and protect meal times as much as we can.
Speaker 3 (20:24):
Yeah, we don't tend to allow ourselves to get hungry anymore,
do we we get a constant state of eating? Well,
I am anyway, You're right.
Speaker 4 (20:33):
I mean sort of hit the nail on the head.
I mean we try. I try so at least have
you know, some sort of time between snacks and meals,
whether that's an hour, an hour and a half. I
think schools are pretty good with that, and it's sort
of protecting those meal times, particularly lunch, and having adequate
times for snacks in the morning and then in the
afternoon as well. But I know I can get a
(20:55):
bit tricky with say three point thirty pickup, and if
dinner's five o'clock and then the kids are snacking sort
of four even closer to four point thirty, that can
sort of interrupt what happens at dinner.
Speaker 2 (21:07):
We're still at that stage, and it is frustrating. But
you know, the short order cooks that multiple dinners each
night and then finally you get to mum or dad
dinner at whatever time it is. But have you got
some helpful tips for that.
Speaker 4 (21:19):
It's a really slippery slope. I think you don't want
to set any sort of type of precedent to cook
multiple meals. And it goes back to that modeling behavior
that we talked about before. I think the key is
is giving the kids some sort of autonomy and making
sure that there's something we call it safe foods, that
there's something that they're guaranteed to love historically they've loved.
(21:42):
And then trying with the art of persistence is you know,
encouraging some different options. So trying to cook one meal
or at least you know, if it's two meals, it's
that there are similar features. And this sort of resonates
with me and is timely because last night we all
had tofu. We all had tofu with rice. But my
(22:04):
wife mine and my wife's meal looked slightly different to
what my kids meal looked like, but it was still
the same features. So you know, it might have looked
like two different meals, but in a sense, it was
dished up slightly differently, but give your kids autonomy, making
sure there's something safe on the plate and that they're
guaranteed to eat, and trying to be a little bit
(22:24):
persistent with the different options. So I mean last night,
classic example, it was tofu with brown rice. There was
some carrots and cucumber, and we did it as a
salad and for my kids, it was a bit deconstructed.
That's how my kids tend to eat. I'm not sure
about your kids and listeners kids as well, but you know,
they like the tofu separate to the rice, and they
(22:45):
like the veggie separate, and they had some cor morse
on their plate, and you know, it was a bit
of a mixed bag, but it ticked all the right
boxes from my perspective, protein, whole grain, veggie, and it
was cooked in extra virgin olivol, so that's why the
healthy fat came in. And from that perspective, you know,
it might have not necessarily looked instagram worthy. I didn't
share it on my Instagram, but it ticked all the
(23:07):
right nutrient boxes.
Speaker 3 (23:17):
Is it normal for children to go through the beije
food stage where everything is beige and it's hard to
get a piece of vegetable on the plate. It is
a stage. We have to accept it, but then work
through that stage.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
Absolutely, and I've lived through it. I'm living through it
right now with my three year old. I think the
biggest message that I can share is just be persistent
and don't push back. The dinner table is not a
place for a battleground. It's really about kids exercising that
autonomy as well, and their taste buds are constantly turning over,
(23:49):
so things that they may have eaten in the past
they may just go completely off, so their preferences are
constantly in flux. The one thing I'd suggest is just
keep persisting, and that goes to your point again, Locky
about eggs, is that you know, maybe with a little
bit of gentle encouragement, but maybe it's through role modeling,
(24:10):
or maybe it's just through that regular exposure, it led
to your kids actually eating eggs. So classic example last
night is after dinner, my daughter grabbed the punnet of
cherry tomatoes from the fridge and was just snacking them
one by one, and my son, he doesn't like cherry tomatoes,
but he was watching his older sister eat them, and
(24:30):
he picked one out of the punnet and took a
bite and he did not like it with the funniest face.
But from my perspective, that was progress. And you know,
he may never touch a cherry tomato ever again, but
I'm hopeful over time. He's only three, so I'll give
him the benefit of the doubt that he might go
(24:51):
back to it at some point. But there was no encouragements,
there was no suggestion that he should have the cherry tomato,
but he was just like, whatever was going on through
his head led him to take it, and I think
that was a great thing. So be persistent. It's very
easy to lose heart. But the research shows is that
(25:11):
kids will need to be exposed to a new food
ten even twenty times before they actually try it and
accept it. So it can be very disheartening, it can
be very expensive, but you've got to just stay the course.
You've got to be persistent.
Speaker 3 (25:28):
Like you said at the beginning, it will continue to change,
so that will be a phase and before you know it,
your son will be eating cherry tomatoes on his own
out of the planet, hopefully, hopefully.
Speaker 4 (25:39):
And the other thing I want to add to that
is that I think sometimes as parents, we can be
a little bit flavor averse for our kids, and I'm
all about maximizing flavor and whatever that looks like. I mean,
another example last night. I'm using last night as an
example very timely. They we're having this chat now, But
I put brown rice on my kid's plates, and my
(26:00):
son was like, nah, not really interested. But I gave
him a little ramikin of soy sauce to dip his
tofu in salt reduced and he decided to splash a
little bit of that soy on the rice, and for
him that was more palatable and actually really enjoyed it.
Another example of you know, let's add flavor to kids foods.
My kids demand to have extra virgin olive oil drizzled
(26:23):
on their food, and they like pepper and they like
lemon juice. So if you're just dishing up plain old
boiled broccoli, like no one's gonna really want that, maybe
the dietitian will eat it. But let's add flavor to foods.
And that might be through spice, it might be through herbs,
the lemon juice, extra virgin olivoil, even things like pepper
and sauces as well. Let's not see that as a
(26:46):
means to detract from the nutritional quality of a food.
Once again, it's only nutrition if it gets eaten. And
from my perspective, if something like the brown rice gets
eaten even though there's a little bit of soy sauce
on top, then I think that's pretty insignificant. And I
think he actually wins.
Speaker 3 (27:04):
I think that's a really good point. I think we
do naturally shy away from flavor when it comes to
our children. For some reason, we've got to keep a
plain and simple where flavor can actually help with the
taste and actually will help them eat it.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
Definitely. I don't think there's an expectation on any of
us to eat plain foods.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
So yes, no, that's right. First, I grew up with
boiled vegetables, so.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
I think we all did.
Speaker 3 (27:28):
Yeah, that's right. It wasn't a lot of flavor. But
I'm quite happy with plain and so maybe I kind
of push that onto Asher a little bit too much
given how I grew up. But you mentioned before about
your vegetarian and now you eat meat. The importance of meat,
but in particular red meat in a children's diet, I'm
(27:48):
assuming it's a source of iron. But there are other
ways that children can get iron. But how important is
it for children to be eating meat?
Speaker 4 (27:55):
Yeah, Look, I'm a big wrap for kids eating meat.
I don't think we need to throw all our eggs
into one basket. I don't think meat needs to feature daily.
But you're right, red meat is a wonderful source of iron.
It's also a great source of things like protein and
zinc and vitamin B twelve. These nutrients are not exclusively
found in meat, So what I would suggest is trying
(28:19):
to get that balance, so making sure there's always some
sort of protein source with each of the meal. So
for using dinner as an example, I think that's where
red meat would typically feature. Maybe have red meat two
or three times a week and mix it up, make
sure there's things like chicken, some fish. But also introduce
your kids to vegetarian sources of protein as well, because
(28:41):
these foods are often good sources of iron. They're not
the best, but they're decent enough. So things like tofu tenpey, legumes, beans, chickpeas,
these are all really valuable sources of nutrition. Also good
source of fiber. Then we know the role of fiber
keeping out our guts nice and healthy, but also fostering
that wonderful ecosystem aboutteria that live in our large bower
(29:03):
that often have implications for our general health and wellbeing,
including mood and mental health. So it's not always about
getting meat and a couple of edge on your plate.
It's really about dietary diversity and making sure that there's
plenty of variety on your plate. And that extends to
kids as well. So iron is critically important, and low
(29:26):
iron can lead to things like slower growth, irritability, being
pale in color as well. So we definitely want to
be promoting those iron rich foods, but it doesn't always
have to be in the form of red meat.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
I think we easily fall into a trap of just
staying in a little world of what we make, and
so as parents, probably broaden our horizons a little bit
and think about other alternatives. I think it's a really
good idea.
Speaker 4 (29:49):
I think it's very easy to fall into these food ruts.
I think we all do it. Try new foods, experimenting
with different flavors, that regular exposure, like I talked about,
Hopefully that will lead to so some really great outcomes
where our kids have a really diverse and very diet
and they actually enjoyed the foods that they're consuming. I
think that's a great thing for us all to aspire to.
Speaker 3 (30:12):
Absolutely Now, sugar. Sugar is in a lot of foods,
I guess, primary packaged foods. How much sugar is too
much for children? How do we limit the amount of
sugar that children have?
Speaker 4 (30:24):
Yeah, I mean, to your first point, sugar added sugar.
So in the form of many of these, we'll call
it packaged foods. Just for ease here, children don't need
added sugar in their diet. But that's not to say
it can't feature at all. I think once you make
something forbidden, it sort of becomes the desired option. And
we know that historically through Bible stories like Adam and Eve,
(30:47):
they only wanted the apples that they were told not
to have. It's once again that careful balance. We don't
want to restrict it all together, but it doesn't necessarily
need to be a featured daily We want to be
promoting things like fruit and dairy and things like yogurts, milk.
They all contain natural sources of sugar, and I don't
want people to shy away from these things for fear
(31:09):
that the sugar is going to be detrimental to their
child's health. But we definitely want to be limiting, potentially
restricting some of those forms of added sugar, So the lollies,
the chocolates, the sweet biscuits, cakes, even things like fruit juices, cordials,
certainly soft drinks, and even to some extent, things like
(31:30):
flavored milk. They don't need to feature daily, but they
can feature from time to time.
Speaker 3 (31:35):
Going back on the sometimes food you spoke of earlier,
so is water the best thing for children to drink?
Speaker 4 (31:41):
Absolutely? What is the preferred beverage of choice? But I'd
add milk into that category as well. If it's a
light milk or a full cream milk, excellent. If it's
a plant milk, soy milks might pick of the bunch. Nutritionally,
it mirrors that of cow's milk. If you're going to
go for a different option, things like almond, coconut, The
(32:03):
list goes on. Just make sure it's fortified with calcium.
But keep in mind you're not getting that protein quality
that you're or even the amount that you would get
from a glass of soy milk or a glass of
cow's milk.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
And is a glass of milk a day kind of
the idea.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
The issue with milk, too much milk is that it
will displace other things from the diet. So if your
child's heavily reliant on milk, then potentially what are they
missing out on? So calcium is particularly important. This is
when we're building bone mineral density early in life and
through our adolescence as well and early adult years. So
(32:41):
we definitely want to be promoting dairy foods or as
I keep saying, suitable alternatives to dairy if you're avoiding
dairy for whatever reason. But potentially a glass of milk
plus a tub of yogurt or a pouch of yogurt
and a slice or two of cheese that will take
all the calcium boxes for the day.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
Mango seasons back in Brisbane, that's very I've never seen
more mango on the kids faces.
Speaker 3 (33:05):
Really the other day. Yeah, do they put it in
their mouth? Not a lot.
Speaker 2 (33:11):
But raw veggies are the are they in the lunch
boxes or like obviously that's the best rather than cooked
and you can add cooked veggies.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I think there's this idea once again that it always
has to be raw veggies. Anything that's going to be
eaten if it's canned. Let's not shy away from the
benefits of things like canned veggies as well frozen. We've
sort of got this elitist mindset as well that all
our veggies need to be fresh, But there's lots of
research to show that even frozen veggies are more nutritious
(33:43):
than fresh. And that's because fresh veggies, fresh and inverted
commas often spend long time in storage and going from
one place to another, compared to frozen vegge which are
literally snap frozen, popped in a freezer. They retain a
lot of their nutritional goodness. But vegetables in any form,
let's just get them in buy and large kids as
(34:06):
well as adults don't hit their veggie targets. So let's
think outside the box a little bit when it comes
to veggies. This idea of eating the rainbow, it's not
always about getting your greens in, but trying to get
your other colorful fruits and vegetables in there too, because
we know that's another way of maximizing your nutrend intake.
Speaker 3 (34:25):
That's a great image for children too, that concept of
eating the rainbow. I love that. That's excellent.
Speaker 4 (34:30):
Yeah, and I mentioned the Austraine dietary guidelines. I mean
they're falling flat. A very few of us get five
serves of veggies a dates. It's almost aspirational. It's not
really achievable for a lot of people. And some of
the talk in my circles is to change the language
around it to be more reflective of eating the rainbow.
(34:50):
And I really like this idea. It's eating all the
different colored fruits and vegetables and maybe not necessarily putting
a specific target on it, like five serves a day,
but maybe just encouraging people to have different colored veggies
in our diet, and hopefully that will lead to people
eating more of it, because at the moment we're all
falling well short. We want kids to engage their senses
(35:13):
when it comes to vegetables. We want them to know
what it feels like, texture, that crunch, and maybe it's
more incumbent on us to dish it up in different
novel ways and make food fun and engaging and colorful
and having that variety. And you know, you might be
familiar with this song called fruit salad, Yummy, Yummy. I
think that yeah, you might have performed it once or twice.
(35:36):
I think and I think that that really resonates and
that rings true. Let's make food fun and being persistent
regularly providing those foods, making that exposure a really key
feature in all our households. And hopefully the winds will happen,
and they might happen down the track. And like I
(35:56):
said last night, the wind was my son trying the
cherry to And who knows. It might be a week,
it might be a year, it might be five years
before he decides that he wants to eat cherry tomatoes,
if at all. But I will look back and go,
that's what started at.
Speaker 3 (36:11):
And I guess that is it's about making it fun
and some gentle encouragement. If there's some pushback, you leave
it alone and you're trying it another time instead of
you know, like you're saying, you want that you want
dinner to be a fun, fun place to be, or
a meal time a fun place to be that the
whole family can experience and enjoy.
Speaker 4 (36:28):
Yeah, yeah, I think that's often lost because meal times
is one of those things we're all experiencing. We've all
got kids similar age, but you know, it's just one
of those boxes to tick, and meal times particularly dinner
should be more about connection as well and fun. I
like this idea of bringing fun back into the kitchen,
bringing fun back to the dinner table. That's not lost
(36:50):
on me as a dietitian. I think sometimes we all,
you know, maybe my peers, and maybe the way the
conversation goes that it's all about just getting the nutrients in.
But for me, it's about talking about the day. It's
telling stories, sharing stories, hearing stories, and that's all part
of it. And I don't want that dinner table to
be a scene of conflict. There's enough conflict going on
(37:13):
in the world. I certainly don't need to open up
another front in my kitchen. And let's see food for
all its fabulous forms. Yes, it provides nutrition, but it's
also a source of love and connection and heritage and memory.
And that's certainly not lost on me as a nutrition professional.
Speaker 3 (37:32):
Yeah, and that comes to getting the children, if they want,
they're interested to help cook the dinner as well or
prepare the food, be part of that whole process as well.
Speaker 4 (37:39):
I'm really big on that. I think it's about equipping
kids with the skills, a life skill that unfortunately has
almost become a lost art.
Speaker 3 (37:47):
Form.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
And when you talk about encouraging kids to try new foods,
that's a great way of getting kids to try new foods,
taste tests along the way, get them to cut something,
give them that owner ship as well in the kitchen,
and you know, I would say they're more inclined to
try something new if they've actually been involved in the process.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
Joel, this has been a really great chat and some
really practical elements for our audience, and great to get
your thoughts and ideas on eating healthily. And I think
we often get very confused these days about what you
can and can't eat or you shouldn't shouldn't eat. But
I think you've given some really good or insights into
(38:31):
what we can do as a family for our meal time.
So thank you, Joel, thanks for coming on. We will talk.
Speaker 4 (38:35):
Excellent, has been my pleasure. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 1 (38:44):
Well.
Speaker 3 (38:44):
Joel made food time feel very simple, he did and
great and flavorsome.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
Flavorsome fine. I like that bit at the end we're
talking about fun. But that reminded me of done and
I went out one night. We had a beautiful nanny
and she cut You had to get a quite a
sharp knife. I think but little carrot circles, cut little
bits out of them to make them a little flower.
And all the girls talked about for a week after
was queer carrot flowers. Carrot flowers, but they loved them,
(39:11):
just a little raw carrots. But it's just there are
so many different little things we can do and we
I've forgotten about that. I'll bring that out.
Speaker 3 (39:18):
Again on Sunday. Yeah, I know. But that's the thing,
isn't it. We always feel like we're so pressed for time,
and we just go back to what we always do,
and that's great, and things work, and if your child's
eating then that's the most important thing. But then at
some point we need to explore a little bit and
refresh and make some carrot flowers, you know, the sharp life. Yes,
(39:39):
but not the child.
Speaker 2 (39:40):
No, no surprise them. But thank you to Joel. That
was great And you can follow Joel on Instagram at
the Underscore Nutrition Guy. So I would have said the yes, Okay,
then I can do that again. You could follow Joel
at Instagram at the Underscore Nutrition Guy. Ad check out
his website for easy, practical recipes and follow his tips
(40:03):
for families. We'll have the link in the show.
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Notes Look, if you love the show, please rate and
review us so that others can find it too. Thanks
for listening to wheel Talk. You know what, Logie, Yes,
it's a podcast for parents. It is to you.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Bye bye
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