September 30, 2022 • 36 mins
Jason and Mike react to the injury received by Tua Tagovailoa during Thursday Night Football leaving the game on a stretcher. Chris Nowinski - PHD in Neuroscience joins the guys to explain the risk of playing Tua tonight and the utter disappointment in the teams ability to protect him!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:23):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Hello, Welcome inside our
three of The Jason Smith Show with Mike Harmon Live
from the tire Rack dot Com studios, where to a
tongue of VLOA and his story has been front and
center since the Dolphins quarterback left the game after getting
slammed to the turf in the first half of the
(00:45):
Dolphins lost to the Cincinnati Bengals. Too, who suffered a
head injury on Sunday, was Woozy after he got slammed
to the ground against the Bills, was allowed back in
the game. Was not in concussion protocol this week. Many
were surprised that he was out to play tonight. After
TWOA was slammed to the turf, he rolled over. He
had his hands in front of his face in a
(01:06):
posturing situation, which is a sign of neurological damage. According
to many doctors who have weighed in on this over
the course of the past couple of hours. The good
news is two is going to be able to fly
home with the Dolphins tonight. But how did he get
on the field. Someone who's been very active on Twitter
tonight and social media, and his thoughts have been shared
(01:27):
throughout the world is Kris Nowinsky, PhD. Dr Krista Winsky,
former w w E superstar who is now the founding
CEO of Concussion LF and a neuroscientist. Chris, Welcome to
the show. How are you? Um, I'm frustrated, but thanksving me.
How are you good? You know I want to start
go back to before the game with you if I can, doctor,
(01:49):
because you're the one who said before the game, if
TA takes the field tonight, it's such a massive step
back for concussion care in the NFL. And I know
you had said, look, I take no pride or joy
in being right about this, but you had talked about
how scary this was coming in. What were your thoughts
going into this for twa My thoughts were, I I
(02:15):
just couldn't. It was like watching a slow motion car crash,
like I wanted to stop it. So it started on Sunday.
Like Sunday, the team completely botched his concussion diagnosis. He
got hit in the head. He showed five separate signs
of concussion. Uh you know, stumbling, grabbing his helmet, shaking
(02:35):
his head into shaking the cobwebs, falling, falling down, and
then having to be held up by his teammates, and
the idea that he that they tried to tell us
it was a back injury. Uh I, I tweeved on Sunday,
b S is not a back injury. I can't believe
you put them back in. You would have thought between
Sunday and Thursday somebody would have smartened up and said, look,
(02:55):
we botched the call, or at least we should air
on the side of caution to was future in the
franchise is this week four? Who gives it cares? But
the fact they rolled them out there, um just shows
a lack of caring for him as a human being.
And it was entirely predictable that he had a very
good chance of getting another concussion. And what apparently no
(03:16):
one was thinking about is two concussions in five days
can kill you. I know these families. Uh, And even
if it doesn't kill you, it can be a life
changing event. And I know this because I had two
concussions a month in wrestling for WWO B and that
ended my career. It gave me a fifteen year headache
or sleep disorder, a long list of problems that I'm
(03:36):
still getting over. And so I like the fact that
you would just risk a talent like to Ah for
a meaningless game is it's both sad and stupid. And
the fact that we let this happen, like you know,
the NFL needs to learn from this, I can't believe.
I mean, frankly, the NFL should have stepped in and
just said he can't play and just you know. And
I can't believe they didn't do that either. I mean,
(03:58):
I think it's within their rights. So howards off to
watch and wait and see what happened. Yeah, I think
that was the curiosity. Dr When when we get a
statement from the league from the players Association that you
have a an ongoing investigation, yet in those four days
he was able to get back on the field. Yeah,
you gotta finish up that investigation before the Thursday night game,
(04:18):
I think might be the lesson for them. I mean,
it's absurd. It's absurd, you know. Doctor. The thing that
gets me is that normally when there's a head injury,
when it occurs like this is everything that gets out
information wise, is is pretty open. The coach talks about it.
This is where he's at, This is where he's at
in the protocol, this is where he is. But I
(04:39):
don't know if it's just because he wasn't in protocol,
but I felt like the Dolphins, the the entire situation
surrounding how he got back out of this with Shady
it was, it was not it was not a lot
of reports on it. Why are we not getting the information?
All that does is is so distrust that the right
thing is not being done. No, I I I agree,
I mean like this was. I mean, in my opinion,
(05:02):
this was this was a clear cover up that that
that was completely obvious to everyone and everyone everyone was
looking the other way. I mean, I think, you know,
I don't know how many media members asked the Dolphins
like are you sure he didn't have a concussion? Like
did you see those five things? Uh, there's no explanation
was asked and you know. I mean, you know, I
just when I saw the Frankly, I wasn't even thinking
(05:25):
about tweeting about it, but I saw the NFL promoting
two version brows. This is to be so big, Like
I thought, Okay, this is like you forget that, Like
I mean, I think the NFL should have been cringing
that too was out there, so for them to be
promoting it makes them complicit in this whole disaster. And
and you know, I don't mean what someone's uh. I
(05:47):
don't want to saying too inflammatory, but I would say
this if TA does not realize that the Dolphins clearly
did not care about his future. Um, he needs to
a cup. And if I were him, knowing what I
know and having gone to what I've gone through, I
would not suit up for the Dolphins again. He should
(06:08):
not have open He's not a doctor, he doesn't he's
not supposed to know this stuff. But the Dolphins had
so many oportunities to protect him. They put his career
in his life on the line tonight, and I would
not play for them again. Uh, you know, I just
he's and this is how we have to think about this.
How many people need to die either on the field
or twenty years later or fifty years later from uh,
(06:31):
these brain injuries. It's it's I'm just tired of it.
Chris Noisky PhD on Twitter at Chris Nowinsky, one founding
CEO Concussion, Uh the Concussion like the Legacy Foundation Neuroscientists,
author and speaker, grew up or at least was born
near where I was, probably about a mile away there
(06:52):
in Oak Park, Illinois. You know, I was just that
side of Harlem, still in the city there, Chris, mm hmm,
so right right there, right in the neighborhood though. But
you know, well, you know, just given the geographic that,
you know, we're not so far apart. But the the idea,
I guess going into the protocols altogether supposed supposedly cleared
(07:16):
by two doctors, you've got the independent neurologists, you know,
from a obviously it's a larger thing to undertake C B,
A S and everything else. But what what would be
the next step in the protocols of of another safeguard
or is is it just a matter of following what's
already there. I think it's a matter of following following
(07:38):
with there. Frankly, I mean, like there's just there's just
no excuse. I think I think there might the problem.
I mean, all concussion care is a bit subjective. So
the NFL added a bunch of no go you know,
things like you're not gun conscious and never going back
in and what they call gross motor instability is on
that list. But I believe there's a carve that if
(08:00):
a doctor can find another reason why they fell down,
like their shoelaces untide, they can overrule it. And in
this case, apparently somebody believed to it when he said
it was my back, even though there's no medical basis
for his behavior and a in a back tweak that
he can miraculously play through minutes later, Like it's just
it's so it's silly, like the fact that they tried
(08:22):
to lie to us and now that they got caught.
But the only person he's getting punished here is to uh, Like,
this is just not right. It's just not You do
not treat people like this medically, especially you know, I mean,
even if you only thought it as a piece of
meat and an asset, you still wouldn't play him because
you need him, uh to take you the super Bowl.
(08:44):
But now with a guy with I would say, too,
concussions in five days, you aren't playing him the rest
of the season if in a in a humane world.
I was just in Australia starting the concussion like the
foundation in Australia where they are ten years behind us,
and I met athletes who had three concussions in one
season in recent history, and I remarked to them, Oh,
(09:06):
we don't have that in America anymore. We've learned our lessons.
We know three concussions in the seasons it could be
career ending. We know two concussions this season will be
career ending. So now what's gonna happen next is the
Dolphins are going to stick to their guns and they're
gonna say that first one still wasn't the concussion. This
is only one concussion. We'll treat his one concussion and
he'll be back in a month, and then we all
(09:27):
can watch with bated breath if he, you know, has
a third concussion, and then we may never see him
again on a football field. So UM, I don't know.
It's just it's so sad to watch this and predicted
this behavior because I don't think people are acting with
the right intentions. Doctor, are you surprised they're letting him
fly home tonight. Is that because that that was just
(09:49):
it's kind of is you okay with him flying home?
He we went to the highly got krey got discharged.
So so technically with a with a run of the
milk concussion, you know you you are allowed to fly
home in this situation when you when you show when
(10:10):
you have two and five days and you have brain
stem involvement because of the fencing posture, the posturing um.
I I would like to see him stay overnight from
I mean, you're stressing his brain taking him home and
putting him on a flight. Let's be honest, his brain
needs to rest for twenty four to four to eight hours.
(10:33):
So I honestly like because the safer medical move is
to have him stay overnight. I think this is the
beginning of a pattern of trying to play this down
and to say, well he was healthy enough to fly
home again. No one is airing on the side of
caution and I just don't understand why. So now this
is I guess this would be a third mistake in
(10:54):
a row um because you know, he just needs that
he rest and and and and sleep, and you know
flying is stressful getting home at whatever God knows in
the morning is not good for his recovery. Um, this
is just we're just watching mistake after mistake after mistake.
(11:14):
Dr lastly, let let me let me go this way
with you now, because this is kind of something that
it's a weird It gets into the it gets into
the the thinking of going through the week. Now, he
was never put into concussion protocol. So if they look
at him on Sunday and they allow him back into
the game to play, which many people were surprised about,
(11:38):
are they on the hook or do they suddenly get
more scrutiny if they put him in concussion protocol a
day or two after, because then it looks like, well, wait,
if he's concussion protocol, now, how do you let him
back in the game, because I don't know if that
was where one mistake got to this one and there
was no emergency breaks that were thrown, Well, we can't
put him in concussion protocol because then we look really
(11:58):
bad for not taking him out of the game in
the first place. Yeah, that's a great question. Um, So
it does happen every season that players are pulled out,
put back in and later found having concussion. It's well
known that symptoms can be delayed by a day or two,
so it would not have been embarrassing for them to
(12:19):
put them in protocol a day or two later. That
happens all the time, when they just say, oh, he
reported the symptom, therefore we're putting in protocol. We've learned that.
I mean, I feel like that's where we're two three
years ago, and I feel like people are trying now,
trying to get away with things again because we hadn't
had a two type incidents. Maybe Tom Savage in UM
when he had the fencing posture, it was left back
(12:40):
in because no one was watching the video. Now you're
required to watch the video. And that's what makes us
even worse, because somebody watched that video and tried to
claim he didn't have a concussion, and that person should
not be allowed to watch video and make this judgment
anymore because they missed five signs. So UM, I don't know,
it's just it's just disappointing, and you know, and and
it's l fans need to fight back because we're all
(13:03):
we're doing right now. My life is watching our heroes
die horrible depths decades later from CTE or the chronic
effects of concussions, and I'm sick and tired of it.
It's now happening to my friends. You're gonna hear about
a very good friend of mine very soon. We went
through this and by tolerance is at zero right now.
Dr Kristowinsky, PhD. He is on Twitter at Kris Nowinsky one.
(13:25):
That is at Kris Nowinsky one, founding CEO Concussion LF
neuroscientist Chris. Thank you, Dr for stopping by with us
here tonight and appreciate all your thoughts and your insight.
Thanks so much. All right, thank you, take care. All right,
there goes Dr Kris Nowinsky, and boy, you know and
ending right there, you can tell where he is with this.
You know, one of his one of his friends coming
(13:47):
out soon. You're gonna hear about this and and so
many different concussions signs that were missed by the dolphins.
And you know, look, we're gonna break this down, you know,
coming up next a bit. But just you can hear
him talk and you can see the way that this
story is going to be pushed ahead and you can
see the dolphins sort of all right, we're already starting
(14:07):
to play defense on this and and let's let's already
let's hey, we we went this far. Now we have
to kind of go all the way on this. And
and it wasn't a concussion on Sunday, and this is
a concussion now and and now we're gonna go forward
this way. This story is just getting started. Be sure
to catch live editions of The Jason Smith Show with
(14:28):
Mike Harmon weekdays at ten pm Eastern, seven pm Pacific,
Fox Sports Radio. The Jason Smith Show with my best
friend Mike Harmon. Hey, we could talk about how complicated
other banks make it radium credit card rewards, or we
could talk about how with Discovery you can redeem rewards
for cash and any amount at anytime. I mean, talk
about amazing learn more discovered dot com slash redeem rewards
(14:50):
terms they do apply. Uh. We had a great conversation
a few minutes ago, phenomenal conversation. We waited for him
to check in with for an hour or so. Dr
Kris Nowinsky, PhD, former w w E Star neuroscientist, founding
CEO of Concussion LF, had some really strong thoughts about
the Miami Dolphins and how to a tongue of blow
(15:13):
was allowed back on the field after his injury. Sunday
against the Bills, he suffered another head and neck injury
tonight was taken to the hospital. The posturing that he
did with his hands was very, uh severe, and we're
wondering hoping there's no neurological damage. It's it's been an
absolute blank show for the Dolphins, uh, surrounding this and
(15:36):
the two big things I want to get into before
we play, Mike McDaniel for you is that the first
thing is you can already tell the Dolphins are saying,
how do we play defense on this? And we we
we can't come out and say, boy, we really we
really blew this or we upawn further of you know
that they can only stick with the note there was
(15:57):
no concussion, and we got a concussion to night. He
had a back injury, which is back injury. The guy
hit his head and he got up and he was
he was wobbling from side to side. I mean, come on, man.
Uh So you can tell already that they're gonna stick
with that defense, which, honestly, if they do is just disgraceful.
It's we're worried about lawsuits, are worried about this. No,
you made a decision to put a guy back on
(16:18):
the field when it was not safe for him. That's
what you should be worried about. But instead you could
already tell Mike McDaniel at the postgame press conference. You're
gonna hear from him. No, did not have a concussion.
All I knew tonight. We had to get him out
of the game. Yes, So what about the whole last
four or five days. That's what's gonna piss me off
the most about this, I can already tell is the
way the Dolphins are going to act, because they're gonna
(16:39):
be in cover up mode because if they if they're
found to have been culpable in this, and hopefully the
NFL's investigation is above board and and we're able to
get details on it, and they just don't cover it
up and say, yeah, we're looking into it and here's
our findings. Oh great, so they can control what they're
where they're gonna tell us. Uh. That's the part that's
gonna upset me the most is that the Dolphins are
gonna play this kind of ridiculous defense. They're gonna deny
(17:01):
things and and and just flat out refuse to talk
about them, and that's gonna be the biggest shame in
here because the people that are gonna lose on this
are the players. And two was gonna lose and players
are gonna lose because in a situation where a guy
should have been kept off the field, the guy was
not kept off the field, and he was put back
on the field. And I know that's what the Dolphins
are gonna do. Yeah, I mean, the biggest thing. And
(17:21):
we talked with Jay Glazer about it earlier and obviously
Dr Dewinsky that was absolutely an incredible conversation. Uh And
and I felt a little emboldened because some of my
my discussion points from a little bit earlier. He confirmed
at least, uh affirmed a little bit in the way
my my brain was processing, uh, the events of the
(17:42):
last several days. Jason especially related to if they put
him in concussion protocol the next day, saying he now
had symptoms because we've had that discussion many times in
the past, right didn't present on Sunday in the moment,
and you like, you know what, at first, it was
the back we could we could say it, but you know,
he came in and etcetera, etcetera, and now you're in protocol,
(18:05):
and it doesn't eliminate whatever your immediate decision making was.
But now you know he's going to go through the
proper channels to go through. By not putting him in
protocol at all, Uh, you didn't do any further evaluations.
So curiosity of how much transparency we get of the
timeline from Sunday afternoon through now because independent events. But
(18:33):
then you know, you just look at the way it's
stacked and the optics and just the process as it's
been relayed to us at this point, it doesn't pass
the smell test in any way, shape or form, you know.
And the part of me that is most incredulous, all right,
(18:53):
the way it went tonight, Yes to it hits his head,
you get him out of the game, you bring him
to the hospital. Uh, you know, forget about the you know,
he wasn't in protocol the last couple of days for
whatever reason. It checked out after the game, and this
is what they said. They said it was a back injury.
When come on, really, I mean, you're you tell me
it's a back injury. The thing that gets me the most,
(19:14):
and it's what we all saw with our own eyes.
This is This is the worst part of it. You
saw it to get his head slam to the ground, right,
You saw it. You saw him get his head slam
to the ground. You saw him stand up, you saw
him try to run forward, and you saw him fall down.
I'm sorry. That's the end of your day. That's the
end of your day, and that's the end of your week. Okay,
(19:35):
I'm sorry that you want to win this game. I
want to win the game. But that when when you
get up and you and you start to run a
couple of feat and then you fall down. No, you
can't get up and play football. Come on, man, That
was the worst part. How does he get back in
the game? Everything else comes off of that? How does
he go back in the game when he shows that
I hit my head and I get up and I
(19:58):
fall down? Right? This is you know, this is what
I look at as because I like to think that
not every franchise would make this decision, right, I'd like
to think that way. But here's the Dolphins that have
a rookie head coach that has never been in a
situation like this before. Are we going through the proper channels?
Are we not? We have an owner who is suspended.
(20:20):
We talked about Steven Ross being suspended until October seventeen.
So is there anybody there? Was there anybody there that
could have made that decision, that could stand up and
say yeah and be the strong one to make that sense,
say no, sorry, he can't come back, you know, whether
it's Mike McDaniel or the GM there there I I
don't know if there was that lack of people who
(20:40):
could make a sound decision just because of it, because
mcdani look, it's his third game in the National Football League,
it's his third game, and he's two and oh and
he could be three and oh, and they're hanging in
against the Bills and they really want to win. So yeah,
you get taken out of that a little bit. You
get taken out of a all right, maybe you know,
maybe you know he could he's all right, Oh, you
tell him, he's okay, we need him. Let's get him
back in the game so we can play. But that's
(21:01):
the part that really that doesn't make any sense to
me at all, is that you saw him get up
and you saw him fall down, and you still put
him back in the game on Sunday. Everything else from
there we can debate and we can break down, but
that was the what the hell kind of decision was that?
What the everything else was, Well, did he have a concussion?
While we can go through and show you that he didn't, well,
(21:23):
we can debate back and forth the injury that he had,
the back of all that other stuff we can debate,
but that is something that is irrefutable. And he fell down.
He's like, Nope, you can go back in the game
and go play. Seriously, you're kidding me. And that's the thing, right,
And some will argue, well, he got cleared by the
independent neurologies, Like, Okay, nobody's ever rubber stamp something. And
(21:46):
obviously this is a very serious thing. And I'm not
trying to be glib, but we we've seen many players
get back on the field after hits, after injuries, et cetera.
I mean that's part of what sets football up as
the greatest reality show of all Right, the term glady,
it gets used all the time. Right, We've seen legs
bend anyway till Sunday and guys are back out there
(22:10):
for the next sequence of of of plays and you're
looking at it and you're around like, is he plastic? Man,
how does that happen? So I don't discount the for
lack of a better term, herculean efforts that we see
from guys from time to time. That one just seemed
so agreed. You said again, it's me and the education
(22:31):
that I have, which is not as anybody trained in
the medical arts. Just what we've watched and what has
the site test and in the investigation. You can only
hope that the people that made these decisions that everything
checks out and that they there's accountability if there were
(22:52):
holes in the evaluation, which I believe as a football
loving uh and football watching world, we all we all
don't think it really hit right the visual and then
him being back on the field, but we've seen stuff before.
I'm curious to see from the nfl p A how
(23:13):
much of a push there is, because we're seeing a
lot of their members pushing back on how much effort
the nfl p A leadership did on guys getting in
trouble off the field and for the outlier guys versus
making sure that those players that that are within the
white lines are being attended to properly. And I think
(23:35):
that's a big fight that this instance with two a
tongue of voloa. You may have stirred a hornets nest
there within the p A. I really that That's what
I keep coming back to. And and still he was
then allowed to get back on the field tonight after
what happened on Sunday. Uh that Jason Smith's with Mike
Carmen live from the tirerac dot com studios. Let's here
(23:56):
for a little bit of Mike McDaniel right now, Dolphins,
said coach who addressed the TA situation after the game.
He was asked about tah and being in concussion protocol
after the hit that put him into the hospital tonight.
He was evaluated for um for concussion and he's in
(24:17):
the concussion protocol. Uh, he he was, he was at
the hospital. I believe he's about to get discharged. Um.
It was yeah, that that was an emotional moment. Um.
That is not part of the deal that anyone signs
(24:37):
up for, even though you you know it's a possibility
in football to have something that you have to get
taken off on a stretcher. Is you know, all of
his teammates, myself, we were all, um very very concerned.
So the best news that we could get is that
(24:57):
everything is checked out. UM, that he didn't have any
anything more serious than um, a concussion will be Uh,
he'll be flying back with us here on the plane.
Can you express news any concussion injury? Yeah, otherwise we
(25:20):
would have reported him having a head injury. I mean
that's that's why the NFL has these protocols. UM. And
there's not like every single NFL game that is played, UM,
there's an independent specialist that specializes in the specialty of
brain matter. So UM yeah, UM, for me, as long
(25:42):
as I'm coaching here, UM, if there's in you know,
I'm not gonna fudge that whole, that whole situation. If
there's UM any any sort of inclination that someone has
a concussion, they go into the cussion protocol and it's
very strict without without Yeah, if people don't vary or stray,
(26:06):
we don't mess with that. Never have and as long
as I'm the head coach, that will never be UM
an issue that you guys have to worry about. Okay,
First of all, how scared out of his mind? Does
Mike McDaniel sound talking about specialists specifications in his mind? Yeah?
It was straight out of UM. A few good men
(26:29):
in your expert metal goal opinion that was tying to
the specialists that are specializing the whole nine yards. He
sounded I I I I I I I with with
this is just a situation, and you can already tell
that this is Miami playing defense, right I Not that
(26:51):
I expected them to say anything else, not that I
expected Mike McDaniel to say, oh, well, yeah, listen, we
we you know, we did X, Y and Z and
we it had done A, B and C. But now
they really have no choice because if they don't present
this exactly as they have the last few days, they're
and even more trouble than they are right now with
what whatever NFL investigation is gonna come in. How tour
(27:15):
was allowed to play in this game, you know, because
you can sit here until you're blue in the face,
and they have an independent evaluator that can tell you, you
you know, he's allowed to go back. Okay, still, let's
just let's just say that. Let's just say, hey, we
have an independent evaluator that evaluates you for concussion. He
was able to tell right there that toa did na
have a concussion? Right, Let's let's just take Mike McDaniel
(27:37):
at his word. For a second. Take his word that
he was evaluated and didn't having cushion. You still put
him back in the game after you watch what happened,
after you saw him get hit, get up and fall down,
you still were okay putting them back in again. It's
gotta shake it loose. He gets back in the game.
Oh my god, that's what I'm thinking if i'm too
at this point. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And you still put
(27:58):
me back in the game. Wow, yeah, of course I
wanted to go play. You still leave me back in
the game. You still did that. You watched what happened,
You saw it. This wasn't a hidden thing. This wasn't
where two of got his bell rung and he came
off the field, and and you were unsure because he
didn't exhibit any kind of behavior that you could tell
outwardly was a concussion. The guy got hit, he got up,
(28:19):
he took a couple of steps, and he fell down. Yeah,
that's where you keep the guy out. Why you keep
the guy out just as a safety precaution, which is
what you should do when he is your franchise quarterback.
You should also do it if he's the fifty third
guy on your roster. That's what you do. But the
Dolphins didn't do it. No matter what you want to say, Oh,
we followed this, this and this, you still you allowed
(28:42):
him back on the field. You said he had a
back injury, which come on, don't try to make me
believe that. And then you put him back on the
field on Thursday night. You did all of these things.
You did nothing to help him, nothing to help him,
just to get him on the field. So that's where
I would go with Mike Mdel. You want to tell
me about people independently clearing him. You saw what happened,
(29:03):
and you were still okay with him playing the entire
game on Sunday and then bringing it back for this
game on Thursday, and you saw what happened to him.
At least say you felt bad, Oh my goodness after
playing him. You know, it was a tough week. We
were you know, but he was cleared. We were happy.
Oh my goodness. I felt so awful. There was none
of that, none of that. There's just now you know,
we're glad he's good, and you know, yeah, I think
you know I would. I would never put that at risk.
(29:25):
All you did was put him at risk. All you
did was put him at risk? Well, he answered the
base questions. Right. It's the old what do you call
guy who finishes last in the class of whatever the
discipline is still gets his degree, still gets to go practice. Uh.
In this case, that's kind of what I get from
the independent evaluation. Yep, good enough, go ahead, especially if
(29:48):
he's saying I feel all right and I can go play.
I just feel dirty listening to the Dolphin listen to
talk about this. I feel so dirty. Be sure to
catch live editions of The Jason Smith Show with Mike
arm in weekdays at ten pm Eastern, seven pm Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Hey what's up everybody. It's me three time pro bowler Lavarrington,
(30:10):
and I couldn't be more excited to announce a new
podcast called Up on Game. What is Up on Game?
You asked, along with my fellow pro bowler t J.
Hudshman's otta and Super Bowl champion. That's right, Plexico birds.
You can only name a show with that type of
talent on it. Up on Game. We're going to be
sharing our real life experiences loaded with teachable moments. Listen
(30:34):
to Up on Game with Me. LaVar Arrington, t J
hudgmans Otta, and Plexico Birds on the I Heart Radio app,
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Sports Radio. The Jason Smith Show with my best friend
Mike Harmon, the good news is to a tongue of
my Lola, it's gonna be okay. Flying back to Miami
(30:57):
with the Dolphins tonight after head and neck injuries against
the Bengals, just four days after an apparent head injury
that the Dolphins like to say was a back injury.
Uh knocked him out of the game against the Bills,
and somehow he was able to stay in the game.
Uh car come back into the game, not enter concussion
protocol until we saw what happened tonight, in which case
(31:19):
this is now two head injuries for twa in the
last five days. And you know, Mike, the the part
of me that that makes this thing, that brings this
home on a on a on a on a basis
for everybody else, is that you know, I talk all
the time, you know, coaching soccer and softball for from
my daughter's teams. And I've done that now for a
long time. Every season, every single season, I have to
(31:44):
pass concussion protocol. I have to be able to have
to take a class online and I have to pass
a test. I have to pass health and safety to
be a coach, and the concussion protocol is a big deal,
and they go They spend a lot of time being
able to tell you, Okay, this is how to look
for a concussion. These are the signs. This is when
(32:05):
a player should come out of the game. And I
I still remember because it's the same, It's the same one. Uh.
They show one of the some of the same examples
every year. And the one that I keep getting is
they show this. They show this girl who comes out
of a game and she says, yeah, I'm okay, and
the coach says, okay, go back in, and she goes
in and she kind of takes a couple of looping
(32:27):
steps and then stumbles. And it's when you see that
you take someone out of the game and they don't
go back in even if they say they're okay. They
need to be taken to a hospital and be evaluated
by a doctor in in in great light and certain circumstances.
And I think about that, and that's every year I
have to doesn't matter how many years I coach, doesn't
matter how many times I have to pass concussion protocol
(32:50):
every single time I do this. And that's the that's
the shining example of what they say, this is what
you have to watch out for, and and and someone
coming to this and then they kind of weave a
little bit and fall down. And that's exactly what happened
to on Sunday with the Bills where he hit his head.
He got up, he took a few steps, and then
he fell down, and the Dolphins are trying to say, yeah,
(33:11):
it was a back injury. I mean, that's the exact
that's the if they showed that instead of the girl
coming to the sideline, you would say, yes, that's where
you take this guy out of the game and you
don't put them back in and you have to go
through all kinds of concussion protocol. Even though it right
right now it looks like he could be okay, no,
they still didn't do it. And and that's what that's
what gets me so fired up about this is that
(33:33):
this is something that here's me. I'm a you know,
I'm a fifty year old guy who's coaching youth sports,
and you know, I had a lot of a lot
of things going on during the course of the game,
but that's a big thing. Someone gets hit in head
with the ball. Okay, let's stop softball. Let me check
you out and me make sure. How do you feel?
Are you okay? Sit down, get some water, rest, tell
me how you're feeling. Let me look at your eyes.
All these things that I also have to do in
(33:56):
coaching the game, and there's no way I would look
at one of these girls would say, yeah, okay, that
happened to you. And you come to me and you
zig zag side to side and you fall down. No,
this is hey. You know what. You gotta go to
the hospital right now. You gotta go here. Your mom
and dad are here, go out. Everything is every I'm
sure everything is fine. You know. You take some ice,
go to the hospital right now and get checked out.
(34:16):
That's what happens. And instead I see this with TWA
and I keep going back to everything that happened tonight
in the last few days, was him going back into
that game on Sunday, and I still can't get over that. Yeah,
it's a curious you know flow. I mean, because you
go back to um Sunday and people tweeting out and
(34:37):
just seeing into your timelines from the Miami Dolphins Twitter
account of to a being out with a you know,
questionable to return with a head injury. So to then
try to just say, oh, no, no, no, no no, it's
just a back injury. I don't know that's that's a
big deal. Um. But to your point, yeah, at every level,
it's the the paramount of the discussions and things you
(35:00):
got to get re certified for and trained as an official,
as a coach, as the team parent, all of those
things that that's part of the training. And as much
as you're watching the game after you know, I don't know.
I've got a daughter that that plays aggressively on defense.
She'll go to ahead of ball and even after one
(35:20):
that comes off, even with no contact with another player,
every once in a while you'll have the official walk
over and be like that didn't sound right you okay
that hit kind of or with one of her teammates,
same kind of thing, And so you go through the
evaluation at each level. Obviously it's going to be differences,
and as we've talked about all night, there's always that
superhero effect when it comes to professional athletes. But I
(35:43):
mean that that's the scary part, as you know it.
Volunteering to coach and being on the sidelines is trying
to make that evaluation. And the whole idea is that
you air on the side of caution. You'd rather be
wrong that way, wouldn't you? A hundred times out of
a hundred. Yeah. And And the thing is, and I
don't want to take the girls out of it. I
(36:03):
don't want to. They practiced all week, they're coming to
I don't want to take them out, but but I
kind of have to. I can. I know it sucks.
It's the first minute of the game and you have
the rest of the game to go, and I think
you're okay. I don't want to do that, but that
that's the responsibility you have because if you're wrong, the
consequences can be twitter at how about Afresca might get
(36:25):
swollen done? The Jason Smith's with Mike Carmen Live from
the Tirac dot Com Studios. Coming out next, we have
more on this developing story of tah What I need
to see next is next on Fox
Thanks for listening to The Jason Smith Show with Mike
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night ten pm to two a m. Eastern seven to
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(00:23):
You're listening to Fox Sports Radio. Hello, Welcome inside our
three of The Jason Smith Show with Mike Harmon Live
from the tire Rack dot Com studios, where to a
tongue of VLOA and his story has been front and
center since the Dolphins quarterback left the game after getting
slammed to the turf in the first half of the
(00:45):
Dolphins lost to the Cincinnati Bengals. Too, who suffered a
head injury on Sunday, was Woozy after he got slammed
to the ground against the Bills, was allowed back in
the game. Was not in concussion protocol this week. Many
were surprised that he was out to play tonight. After
TWOA was slammed to the turf, he rolled over. He
had his hands in front of his face in a
(01:06):
posturing situation, which is a sign of neurological damage. According
to many doctors who have weighed in on this over
the course of the past couple of hours. The good
news is two is going to be able to fly
home with the Dolphins tonight. But how did he get
on the field. Someone who's been very active on Twitter
tonight and social media, and his thoughts have been shared
(01:27):
throughout the world is Kris Nowinsky, PhD. Dr Krista Winsky,
former w w E superstar who is now the founding
CEO of Concussion LF and a neuroscientist. Chris, Welcome to
the show. How are you? Um, I'm frustrated, but thanksving me.
How are you good? You know I want to start
go back to before the game with you if I can, doctor,
(01:49):
because you're the one who said before the game, if
TA takes the field tonight, it's such a massive step
back for concussion care in the NFL. And I know
you had said, look, I take no pride or joy
in being right about this, but you had talked about
how scary this was coming in. What were your thoughts
going into this for twa My thoughts were, I I
(02:15):
just couldn't. It was like watching a slow motion car crash,
like I wanted to stop it. So it started on Sunday.
Like Sunday, the team completely botched his concussion diagnosis. He
got hit in the head. He showed five separate signs
of concussion. Uh you know, stumbling, grabbing his helmet, shaking
(02:35):
his head into shaking the cobwebs, falling, falling down, and
then having to be held up by his teammates, and
the idea that he that they tried to tell us
it was a back injury. Uh I, I tweeved on Sunday,
b S is not a back injury. I can't believe
you put them back in. You would have thought between
Sunday and Thursday somebody would have smartened up and said, look,
(02:55):
we botched the call, or at least we should air
on the side of caution to was future in the
franchise is this week four? Who gives it cares? But
the fact they rolled them out there, um just shows
a lack of caring for him as a human being.
And it was entirely predictable that he had a very
good chance of getting another concussion. And what apparently no
(03:16):
one was thinking about is two concussions in five days
can kill you. I know these families. Uh, And even
if it doesn't kill you, it can be a life
changing event. And I know this because I had two
concussions a month in wrestling for WWO B and that
ended my career. It gave me a fifteen year headache
or sleep disorder, a long list of problems that I'm
(03:36):
still getting over. And so I like the fact that
you would just risk a talent like to Ah for
a meaningless game is it's both sad and stupid. And
the fact that we let this happen, like you know,
the NFL needs to learn from this, I can't believe.
I mean, frankly, the NFL should have stepped in and
just said he can't play and just you know. And
I can't believe they didn't do that either. I mean,
(03:58):
I think it's within their rights. So howards off to
watch and wait and see what happened. Yeah, I think
that was the curiosity. Dr When when we get a
statement from the league from the players Association that you
have a an ongoing investigation, yet in those four days
he was able to get back on the field. Yeah,
you gotta finish up that investigation before the Thursday night game,
(04:18):
I think might be the lesson for them. I mean,
it's absurd. It's absurd, you know. Doctor. The thing that
gets me is that normally when there's a head injury,
when it occurs like this is everything that gets out
information wise, is is pretty open. The coach talks about it.
This is where he's at, This is where he's at
in the protocol, this is where he is. But I
(04:39):
don't know if it's just because he wasn't in protocol,
but I felt like the Dolphins, the the entire situation
surrounding how he got back out of this with Shady
it was, it was not it was not a lot
of reports on it. Why are we not getting the information?
All that does is is so distrust that the right
thing is not being done. No, I I I agree,
I mean like this was. I mean, in my opinion,
(05:02):
this was this was a clear cover up that that
that was completely obvious to everyone and everyone everyone was
looking the other way. I mean, I think, you know,
I don't know how many media members asked the Dolphins
like are you sure he didn't have a concussion? Like
did you see those five things? Uh, there's no explanation
was asked and you know. I mean, you know, I
just when I saw the Frankly, I wasn't even thinking
(05:25):
about tweeting about it, but I saw the NFL promoting
two version brows. This is to be so big, Like
I thought, Okay, this is like you forget that, Like
I mean, I think the NFL should have been cringing
that too was out there, so for them to be
promoting it makes them complicit in this whole disaster. And
and you know, I don't mean what someone's uh. I
(05:47):
don't want to saying too inflammatory, but I would say
this if TA does not realize that the Dolphins clearly
did not care about his future. Um, he needs to
a cup. And if I were him, knowing what I
know and having gone to what I've gone through, I
would not suit up for the Dolphins again. He should
(06:08):
not have open He's not a doctor, he doesn't he's
not supposed to know this stuff. But the Dolphins had
so many oportunities to protect him. They put his career
in his life on the line tonight, and I would
not play for them again. Uh, you know, I just
he's and this is how we have to think about this.
How many people need to die either on the field
or twenty years later or fifty years later from uh,
(06:31):
these brain injuries. It's it's I'm just tired of it.
Chris Noisky PhD on Twitter at Chris Nowinsky, one founding
CEO Concussion, Uh the Concussion like the Legacy Foundation Neuroscientists,
author and speaker, grew up or at least was born
near where I was, probably about a mile away there
(06:52):
in Oak Park, Illinois. You know, I was just that
side of Harlem, still in the city there, Chris, mm hmm,
so right right there, right in the neighborhood though. But
you know, well, you know, just given the geographic that,
you know, we're not so far apart. But the the idea,
I guess going into the protocols altogether supposed supposedly cleared
(07:16):
by two doctors, you've got the independent neurologists, you know,
from a obviously it's a larger thing to undertake C B,
A S and everything else. But what what would be
the next step in the protocols of of another safeguard
or is is it just a matter of following what's
already there. I think it's a matter of following following
(07:38):
with there. Frankly, I mean, like there's just there's just
no excuse. I think I think there might the problem.
I mean, all concussion care is a bit subjective. So
the NFL added a bunch of no go you know,
things like you're not gun conscious and never going back
in and what they call gross motor instability is on
that list. But I believe there's a carve that if
(08:00):
a doctor can find another reason why they fell down,
like their shoelaces untide, they can overrule it. And in
this case, apparently somebody believed to it when he said
it was my back, even though there's no medical basis
for his behavior and a in a back tweak that
he can miraculously play through minutes later, Like it's just
it's so it's silly, like the fact that they tried
(08:22):
to lie to us and now that they got caught.
But the only person he's getting punished here is to uh, Like,
this is just not right. It's just not You do
not treat people like this medically, especially you know, I mean,
even if you only thought it as a piece of
meat and an asset, you still wouldn't play him because
you need him, uh to take you the super Bowl.
(08:44):
But now with a guy with I would say, too,
concussions in five days, you aren't playing him the rest
of the season if in a in a humane world.
I was just in Australia starting the concussion like the
foundation in Australia where they are ten years behind us,
and I met athletes who had three concussions in one
season in recent history, and I remarked to them, Oh,
(09:06):
we don't have that in America anymore. We've learned our lessons.
We know three concussions in the seasons it could be
career ending. We know two concussions this season will be
career ending. So now what's gonna happen next is the
Dolphins are going to stick to their guns and they're
gonna say that first one still wasn't the concussion. This
is only one concussion. We'll treat his one concussion and
he'll be back in a month, and then we all
(09:27):
can watch with bated breath if he, you know, has
a third concussion, and then we may never see him
again on a football field. So UM, I don't know.
It's just it's so sad to watch this and predicted
this behavior because I don't think people are acting with
the right intentions. Doctor, are you surprised they're letting him
fly home tonight. Is that because that that was just
(09:49):
it's kind of is you okay with him flying home?
He we went to the highly got krey got discharged.
So so technically with a with a run of the
milk concussion, you know you you are allowed to fly
home in this situation when you when you show when
(10:10):
you have two and five days and you have brain
stem involvement because of the fencing posture, the posturing um.
I I would like to see him stay overnight from
I mean, you're stressing his brain taking him home and
putting him on a flight. Let's be honest, his brain
needs to rest for twenty four to four to eight hours.
(10:33):
So I honestly like because the safer medical move is
to have him stay overnight. I think this is the
beginning of a pattern of trying to play this down
and to say, well he was healthy enough to fly
home again. No one is airing on the side of
caution and I just don't understand why. So now this
is I guess this would be a third mistake in
(10:54):
a row um because you know, he just needs that
he rest and and and and sleep, and you know
flying is stressful getting home at whatever God knows in
the morning is not good for his recovery. Um, this
is just we're just watching mistake after mistake after mistake.
(11:14):
Dr lastly, let let me let me go this way
with you now, because this is kind of something that
it's a weird It gets into the it gets into
the the thinking of going through the week. Now, he
was never put into concussion protocol. So if they look
at him on Sunday and they allow him back into
the game to play, which many people were surprised about,
(11:38):
are they on the hook or do they suddenly get
more scrutiny if they put him in concussion protocol a
day or two after, because then it looks like, well, wait,
if he's concussion protocol, now, how do you let him
back in the game, because I don't know if that
was where one mistake got to this one and there
was no emergency breaks that were thrown, Well, we can't
put him in concussion protocol because then we look really
(11:58):
bad for not taking him out of the game in
the first place. Yeah, that's a great question. Um, So
it does happen every season that players are pulled out,
put back in and later found having concussion. It's well
known that symptoms can be delayed by a day or two,
so it would not have been embarrassing for them to
(12:19):
put them in protocol a day or two later. That
happens all the time, when they just say, oh, he
reported the symptom, therefore we're putting in protocol. We've learned that.
I mean, I feel like that's where we're two three
years ago, and I feel like people are trying now,
trying to get away with things again because we hadn't
had a two type incidents. Maybe Tom Savage in UM
when he had the fencing posture, it was left back
(12:40):
in because no one was watching the video. Now you're
required to watch the video. And that's what makes us
even worse, because somebody watched that video and tried to
claim he didn't have a concussion, and that person should
not be allowed to watch video and make this judgment
anymore because they missed five signs. So UM, I don't know,
it's just it's just disappointing, and you know, and and
it's l fans need to fight back because we're all
(13:03):
we're doing right now. My life is watching our heroes
die horrible depths decades later from CTE or the chronic
effects of concussions, and I'm sick and tired of it.
It's now happening to my friends. You're gonna hear about
a very good friend of mine very soon. We went
through this and by tolerance is at zero right now.
Dr Kristowinsky, PhD. He is on Twitter at Kris Nowinsky one.
(13:25):
That is at Kris Nowinsky one, founding CEO Concussion LF
neuroscientist Chris. Thank you, Dr for stopping by with us
here tonight and appreciate all your thoughts and your insight.
Thanks so much. All right, thank you, take care. All right,
there goes Dr Kris Nowinsky, and boy, you know and
ending right there, you can tell where he is with this.
You know, one of his one of his friends coming
(13:47):
out soon. You're gonna hear about this and and so
many different concussions signs that were missed by the dolphins.
And you know, look, we're gonna break this down, you know,
coming up next a bit. But just you can hear
him talk and you can see the way that this
story is going to be pushed ahead and you can
see the dolphins sort of all right, we're already starting
(14:07):
to play defense on this and and let's let's already
let's hey, we we went this far. Now we have
to kind of go all the way on this. And
and it wasn't a concussion on Sunday, and this is
a concussion now and and now we're gonna go forward
this way. This story is just getting started. Be sure
to catch live editions of The Jason Smith Show with
(14:28):
Mike Harmon weekdays at ten pm Eastern, seven pm Pacific,
Fox Sports Radio. The Jason Smith Show with my best
friend Mike Harmon. Hey, we could talk about how complicated
other banks make it radium credit card rewards, or we
could talk about how with Discovery you can redeem rewards
for cash and any amount at anytime. I mean, talk
about amazing learn more discovered dot com slash redeem rewards
(14:50):
terms they do apply. Uh. We had a great conversation
a few minutes ago, phenomenal conversation. We waited for him
to check in with for an hour or so. Dr
Kris Nowinsky, PhD, former w w E Star neuroscientist, founding
CEO of Concussion LF, had some really strong thoughts about
the Miami Dolphins and how to a tongue of blow
(15:13):
was allowed back on the field after his injury. Sunday
against the Bills, he suffered another head and neck injury
tonight was taken to the hospital. The posturing that he
did with his hands was very, uh severe, and we're
wondering hoping there's no neurological damage. It's it's been an
absolute blank show for the Dolphins, uh, surrounding this and
(15:36):
the two big things I want to get into before
we play, Mike McDaniel for you is that the first
thing is you can already tell the Dolphins are saying,
how do we play defense on this? And we we
we can't come out and say, boy, we really we
really blew this or we upawn further of you know
that they can only stick with the note there was
(15:57):
no concussion, and we got a concussion to night. He
had a back injury, which is back injury. The guy
hit his head and he got up and he was
he was wobbling from side to side. I mean, come on, man.
Uh So you can tell already that they're gonna stick
with that defense, which, honestly, if they do is just disgraceful.
It's we're worried about lawsuits, are worried about this. No,
you made a decision to put a guy back on
(16:18):
the field when it was not safe for him. That's
what you should be worried about. But instead you could
already tell Mike McDaniel at the postgame press conference. You're
gonna hear from him. No, did not have a concussion.
All I knew tonight. We had to get him out
of the game. Yes, So what about the whole last
four or five days. That's what's gonna piss me off
the most about this, I can already tell is the
way the Dolphins are going to act, because they're gonna
(16:39):
be in cover up mode because if they if they're
found to have been culpable in this, and hopefully the
NFL's investigation is above board and and we're able to
get details on it, and they just don't cover it
up and say, yeah, we're looking into it and here's
our findings. Oh great, so they can control what they're
where they're gonna tell us. Uh. That's the part that's
gonna upset me the most is that the Dolphins are
gonna play this kind of ridiculous defense. They're gonna deny
(17:01):
things and and and just flat out refuse to talk
about them, and that's gonna be the biggest shame in
here because the people that are gonna lose on this
are the players. And two was gonna lose and players
are gonna lose because in a situation where a guy
should have been kept off the field, the guy was
not kept off the field, and he was put back
on the field. And I know that's what the Dolphins
are gonna do. Yeah, I mean, the biggest thing. And
(17:21):
we talked with Jay Glazer about it earlier and obviously
Dr Dewinsky that was absolutely an incredible conversation. Uh And
and I felt a little emboldened because some of my
my discussion points from a little bit earlier. He confirmed
at least, uh affirmed a little bit in the way
my my brain was processing, uh, the events of the
(17:42):
last several days. Jason especially related to if they put
him in concussion protocol the next day, saying he now
had symptoms because we've had that discussion many times in
the past, right didn't present on Sunday in the moment,
and you like, you know what, at first, it was
the back we could we could say it, but you know,
he came in and etcetera, etcetera, and now you're in protocol,
(18:05):
and it doesn't eliminate whatever your immediate decision making was.
But now you know he's going to go through the
proper channels to go through. By not putting him in
protocol at all, Uh, you didn't do any further evaluations.
So curiosity of how much transparency we get of the
timeline from Sunday afternoon through now because independent events. But
(18:33):
then you know, you just look at the way it's
stacked and the optics and just the process as it's
been relayed to us at this point, it doesn't pass
the smell test in any way, shape or form, you know.
And the part of me that is most incredulous, all right,
(18:53):
the way it went tonight, Yes to it hits his head,
you get him out of the game, you bring him
to the hospital. Uh, you know, forget about the you know,
he wasn't in protocol the last couple of days for
whatever reason. It checked out after the game, and this
is what they said. They said it was a back injury.
When come on, really, I mean, you're you tell me
it's a back injury. The thing that gets me the most,
(19:14):
and it's what we all saw with our own eyes.
This is This is the worst part of it. You
saw it to get his head slam to the ground, right,
You saw it. You saw him get his head slam
to the ground. You saw him stand up, you saw
him try to run forward, and you saw him fall down.
I'm sorry. That's the end of your day. That's the
end of your day, and that's the end of your week. Okay,
(19:35):
I'm sorry that you want to win this game. I
want to win the game. But that when when you
get up and you and you start to run a
couple of feat and then you fall down. No, you
can't get up and play football. Come on, man, That
was the worst part. How does he get back in
the game? Everything else comes off of that? How does
he go back in the game when he shows that
I hit my head and I get up and I
(19:58):
fall down? Right? This is you know, this is what
I look at as because I like to think that
not every franchise would make this decision, right, I'd like
to think that way. But here's the Dolphins that have
a rookie head coach that has never been in a
situation like this before. Are we going through the proper channels?
Are we not? We have an owner who is suspended.
(20:20):
We talked about Steven Ross being suspended until October seventeen.
So is there anybody there? Was there anybody there that
could have made that decision, that could stand up and
say yeah and be the strong one to make that sense,
say no, sorry, he can't come back, you know, whether
it's Mike McDaniel or the GM there there I I
don't know if there was that lack of people who
(20:40):
could make a sound decision just because of it, because
mcdani look, it's his third game in the National Football League,
it's his third game, and he's two and oh and
he could be three and oh, and they're hanging in
against the Bills and they really want to win. So yeah,
you get taken out of that a little bit. You
get taken out of a all right, maybe you know,
maybe you know he could he's all right, Oh, you
tell him, he's okay, we need him. Let's get him
back in the game so we can play. But that's
(21:01):
the part that really that doesn't make any sense to
me at all, is that you saw him get up
and you saw him fall down, and you still put
him back in the game on Sunday. Everything else from
there we can debate and we can break down, but
that was the what the hell kind of decision was that?
What the everything else was, Well, did he have a concussion?
While we can go through and show you that he didn't, well,
(21:23):
we can debate back and forth the injury that he had,
the back of all that other stuff we can debate,
but that is something that is irrefutable. And he fell down.
He's like, Nope, you can go back in the game
and go play. Seriously, you're kidding me. And that's the thing, right,
And some will argue, well, he got cleared by the
independent neurologies, Like, Okay, nobody's ever rubber stamp something. And
(21:46):
obviously this is a very serious thing. And I'm not
trying to be glib, but we we've seen many players
get back on the field after hits, after injuries, et cetera.
I mean that's part of what sets football up as
the greatest reality show of all Right, the term glady,
it gets used all the time. Right, We've seen legs
bend anyway till Sunday and guys are back out there
(22:10):
for the next sequence of of of plays and you're
looking at it and you're around like, is he plastic? Man,
how does that happen? So I don't discount the for
lack of a better term, herculean efforts that we see
from guys from time to time. That one just seemed
so agreed. You said again, it's me and the education
(22:31):
that I have, which is not as anybody trained in
the medical arts. Just what we've watched and what has
the site test and in the investigation. You can only
hope that the people that made these decisions that everything
checks out and that they there's accountability if there were
(22:52):
holes in the evaluation, which I believe as a football
loving uh and football watching world, we all we all
don't think it really hit right the visual and then
him being back on the field, but we've seen stuff before.
I'm curious to see from the nfl p A how
(23:13):
much of a push there is, because we're seeing a
lot of their members pushing back on how much effort
the nfl p A leadership did on guys getting in
trouble off the field and for the outlier guys versus
making sure that those players that that are within the
white lines are being attended to properly. And I think
(23:35):
that's a big fight that this instance with two a
tongue of voloa. You may have stirred a hornets nest
there within the p A. I really that That's what
I keep coming back to. And and still he was
then allowed to get back on the field tonight after
what happened on Sunday. Uh that Jason Smith's with Mike
Carmen live from the tirerac dot com studios. Let's here
(23:56):
for a little bit of Mike McDaniel right now, Dolphins,
said coach who addressed the TA situation after the game.
He was asked about tah and being in concussion protocol
after the hit that put him into the hospital tonight.
He was evaluated for um for concussion and he's in
(24:17):
the concussion protocol. Uh, he he was, he was at
the hospital. I believe he's about to get discharged. Um.
It was yeah, that that was an emotional moment. Um.
That is not part of the deal that anyone signs
(24:37):
up for, even though you you know it's a possibility
in football to have something that you have to get
taken off on a stretcher. Is you know, all of
his teammates, myself, we were all, um very very concerned.
So the best news that we could get is that
(24:57):
everything is checked out. UM, that he didn't have any
anything more serious than um, a concussion will be Uh,
he'll be flying back with us here on the plane.
Can you express news any concussion injury? Yeah, otherwise we
(25:20):
would have reported him having a head injury. I mean
that's that's why the NFL has these protocols. UM. And
there's not like every single NFL game that is played, UM,
there's an independent specialist that specializes in the specialty of
brain matter. So UM yeah, UM, for me, as long
(25:42):
as I'm coaching here, UM, if there's in you know,
I'm not gonna fudge that whole, that whole situation. If
there's UM any any sort of inclination that someone has
a concussion, they go into the cussion protocol and it's
very strict without without Yeah, if people don't vary or stray,
(26:06):
we don't mess with that. Never have and as long
as I'm the head coach, that will never be UM
an issue that you guys have to worry about. Okay,
First of all, how scared out of his mind? Does
Mike McDaniel sound talking about specialists specifications in his mind? Yeah?
It was straight out of UM. A few good men
(26:29):
in your expert metal goal opinion that was tying to
the specialists that are specializing the whole nine yards. He
sounded I I I I I I I with with
this is just a situation, and you can already tell
that this is Miami playing defense, right I Not that
(26:51):
I expected them to say anything else, not that I
expected Mike McDaniel to say, oh, well, yeah, listen, we
we you know, we did X, Y and Z and
we it had done A, B and C. But now
they really have no choice because if they don't present
this exactly as they have the last few days, they're
and even more trouble than they are right now with
what whatever NFL investigation is gonna come in. How tour
(27:15):
was allowed to play in this game, you know, because
you can sit here until you're blue in the face,
and they have an independent evaluator that can tell you, you
you know, he's allowed to go back. Okay, still, let's
just let's just say that. Let's just say, hey, we
have an independent evaluator that evaluates you for concussion. He
was able to tell right there that toa did na
have a concussion? Right, Let's let's just take Mike McDaniel
(27:37):
at his word. For a second. Take his word that
he was evaluated and didn't having cushion. You still put
him back in the game after you watch what happened,
after you saw him get hit, get up and fall down,
you still were okay putting them back in again. It's
gotta shake it loose. He gets back in the game.
Oh my god, that's what I'm thinking if i'm too
at this point. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And you still put
(27:58):
me back in the game. Wow, yeah, of course I
wanted to go play. You still leave me back in
the game. You still did that. You watched what happened,
You saw it. This wasn't a hidden thing. This wasn't
where two of got his bell rung and he came
off the field, and and you were unsure because he
didn't exhibit any kind of behavior that you could tell
outwardly was a concussion. The guy got hit, he got up,
(28:19):
he took a couple of steps, and he fell down. Yeah,
that's where you keep the guy out. Why you keep
the guy out just as a safety precaution, which is
what you should do when he is your franchise quarterback.
You should also do it if he's the fifty third
guy on your roster. That's what you do. But the
Dolphins didn't do it. No matter what you want to say, Oh,
we followed this, this and this, you still you allowed
(28:42):
him back on the field. You said he had a
back injury, which come on, don't try to make me
believe that. And then you put him back on the
field on Thursday night. You did all of these things.
You did nothing to help him, nothing to help him,
just to get him on the field. So that's where
I would go with Mike Mdel. You want to tell
me about people independently clearing him. You saw what happened,
(29:03):
and you were still okay with him playing the entire
game on Sunday and then bringing it back for this
game on Thursday, and you saw what happened to him.
At least say you felt bad, Oh my goodness after
playing him. You know, it was a tough week. We
were you know, but he was cleared. We were happy.
Oh my goodness. I felt so awful. There was none
of that, none of that. There's just now you know,
we're glad he's good, and you know, yeah, I think
you know I would. I would never put that at risk.
(29:25):
All you did was put him at risk. All you
did was put him at risk? Well, he answered the
base questions. Right. It's the old what do you call
guy who finishes last in the class of whatever the
discipline is still gets his degree, still gets to go practice. Uh.
In this case, that's kind of what I get from
the independent evaluation. Yep, good enough, go ahead, especially if
(29:48):
he's saying I feel all right and I can go play.
I just feel dirty listening to the Dolphin listen to
talk about this. I feel so dirty. Be sure to
catch live editions of The Jason Smith Show with Mike
arm in weekdays at ten pm Eastern, seven pm Pacific
on Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app.
Hey what's up everybody. It's me three time pro bowler Lavarrington,
(30:10):
and I couldn't be more excited to announce a new
podcast called Up on Game. What is Up on Game?
You asked, along with my fellow pro bowler t J.
Hudshman's otta and Super Bowl champion. That's right, Plexico birds.
You can only name a show with that type of
talent on it. Up on Game. We're going to be
sharing our real life experiences loaded with teachable moments. Listen
(30:34):
to Up on Game with Me. LaVar Arrington, t J
hudgmans Otta, and Plexico Birds on the I Heart Radio app,
Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcast from Fox
Sports Radio. The Jason Smith Show with my best friend
Mike Harmon, the good news is to a tongue of
my Lola, it's gonna be okay. Flying back to Miami
(30:57):
with the Dolphins tonight after head and neck injuries against
the Bengals, just four days after an apparent head injury
that the Dolphins like to say was a back injury.
Uh knocked him out of the game against the Bills,
and somehow he was able to stay in the game.
Uh car come back into the game, not enter concussion
protocol until we saw what happened tonight, in which case
(31:19):
this is now two head injuries for twa in the
last five days. And you know, Mike, the the part
of me that that makes this thing, that brings this
home on a on a on a on a basis
for everybody else, is that you know, I talk all
the time, you know, coaching soccer and softball for from
my daughter's teams. And I've done that now for a
long time. Every season, every single season, I have to
(31:44):
pass concussion protocol. I have to be able to have
to take a class online and I have to pass
a test. I have to pass health and safety to
be a coach, and the concussion protocol is a big deal,
and they go They spend a lot of time being
able to tell you, Okay, this is how to look
for a concussion. These are the signs. This is when
(32:05):
a player should come out of the game. And I
I still remember because it's the same, It's the same one. Uh.
They show one of the some of the same examples
every year. And the one that I keep getting is
they show this. They show this girl who comes out
of a game and she says, yeah, I'm okay, and
the coach says, okay, go back in, and she goes
in and she kind of takes a couple of looping
(32:27):
steps and then stumbles. And it's when you see that
you take someone out of the game and they don't
go back in even if they say they're okay. They
need to be taken to a hospital and be evaluated
by a doctor in in in great light and certain circumstances.
And I think about that, and that's every year I
have to doesn't matter how many years I coach, doesn't
matter how many times I have to pass concussion protocol
(32:50):
every single time I do this. And that's the that's
the shining example of what they say, this is what
you have to watch out for, and and and someone
coming to this and then they kind of weave a
little bit and fall down. And that's exactly what happened
to on Sunday with the Bills where he hit his head.
He got up, he took a few steps, and then
he fell down, and the Dolphins are trying to say, yeah,
(33:11):
it was a back injury. I mean, that's the exact
that's the if they showed that instead of the girl
coming to the sideline, you would say, yes, that's where
you take this guy out of the game and you
don't put them back in and you have to go
through all kinds of concussion protocol. Even though it right
right now it looks like he could be okay, no,
they still didn't do it. And and that's what that's
what gets me so fired up about this is that
(33:33):
this is something that here's me. I'm a you know,
I'm a fifty year old guy who's coaching youth sports,
and you know, I had a lot of a lot
of things going on during the course of the game,
but that's a big thing. Someone gets hit in head
with the ball. Okay, let's stop softball. Let me check
you out and me make sure. How do you feel?
Are you okay? Sit down, get some water, rest, tell
me how you're feeling. Let me look at your eyes.
All these things that I also have to do in
(33:56):
coaching the game, and there's no way I would look
at one of these girls would say, yeah, okay, that
happened to you. And you come to me and you
zig zag side to side and you fall down. No,
this is hey. You know what. You gotta go to
the hospital right now. You gotta go here. Your mom
and dad are here, go out. Everything is every I'm
sure everything is fine. You know. You take some ice,
go to the hospital right now and get checked out.
(34:16):
That's what happens. And instead I see this with TWA
and I keep going back to everything that happened tonight
in the last few days, was him going back into
that game on Sunday, and I still can't get over that. Yeah,
it's a curious you know flow. I mean, because you
go back to um Sunday and people tweeting out and
(34:37):
just seeing into your timelines from the Miami Dolphins Twitter
account of to a being out with a you know,
questionable to return with a head injury. So to then
try to just say, oh, no, no, no, no no, it's
just a back injury. I don't know that's that's a
big deal. Um. But to your point, yeah, at every level,
it's the the paramount of the discussions and things you
(35:00):
got to get re certified for and trained as an official,
as a coach, as the team parent, all of those
things that that's part of the training. And as much
as you're watching the game after you know, I don't know.
I've got a daughter that that plays aggressively on defense.
She'll go to ahead of ball and even after one
(35:20):
that comes off, even with no contact with another player,
every once in a while you'll have the official walk
over and be like that didn't sound right you okay
that hit kind of or with one of her teammates,
same kind of thing, And so you go through the
evaluation at each level. Obviously it's going to be differences,
and as we've talked about all night, there's always that
superhero effect when it comes to professional athletes. But I
(35:43):
mean that that's the scary part, as you know it.
Volunteering to coach and being on the sidelines is trying
to make that evaluation. And the whole idea is that
you air on the side of caution. You'd rather be
wrong that way, wouldn't you? A hundred times out of
a hundred. Yeah. And And the thing is, and I
don't want to take the girls out of it. I
(36:03):
don't want to. They practiced all week, they're coming to
I don't want to take them out, but but I
kind of have to. I can. I know it sucks.
It's the first minute of the game and you have
the rest of the game to go, and I think
you're okay. I don't want to do that, but that
that's the responsibility you have because if you're wrong, the
consequences can be twitter at how about Afresca might get
(36:25):
swollen done? The Jason Smith's with Mike Carmen Live from
the Tirac dot Com Studios. Coming out next, we have
more on this developing story of tah What I need
to see next is next on Fox
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