With the year nearing its end, Mark Mitchell and Ginny Andersen joined Mike Hosking for the final Politics Wednesday of 2025.
They discussed Scrutiny Week, Labour’s decision to chase the Māori seats and what’s ahead as we enter an election year.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Our last show together. Is it right for the yes?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Are you're not here back next week? You two? What's happening?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
No, we're back, we're back. We didn't negotiate a good
enough contract with you, so we sort of stuck with it.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
With those amazing ratings.
Speaker 4 (00:16):
Do you put the ratings down to your rape, your
wit or is it the magic DJ voice that makes
those ratings so speA.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
I think you've hit the nail on the head there, Ginny.
And that's why you're my favorite in the segment, because
you want it's a combination. It's the combination. It's all
the magic coming together. Now, look, I need some insight
from both of you. I've been watching Trump's cabinet meeting,
which has been going since before six o'clock this morning
in New Zealand time, and all it happens is that
(00:43):
you go round the table and we go, Ginny, a
report from you, please mark a report from it? Is that, Ginny?
Is that how a durn slash Hipkins ran cabinet?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
No? No, not at all. No, you should have all
had a talk. You discuss an issue.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Who starts it?
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Does?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
It's on the agenda?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Is you do have an agenda?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
And that's also made public, so you can you know,
you can a cabinet minutes and kebnet agendas, but the
detailed conversation usually is confidential.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Okay. Is that how we run labeled?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Probably labor and the labor cabinet Wold probably would probably
sit holding the hand seeing comeboya and it's probably.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
The major.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And just throw how they can spray more money around
the place they're actually delivery, do you think? But no,
that's not how the cabinets run. Cemw. The Prime Minister
runs the kibinet and we have kept that. You have
cabinet papers that come up that are then discussed and debated.
And let's how the cabinets run.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
On average, Jenny in your time, how long does a
cabinet meeting go? Roughly?
Speaker 5 (01:51):
Can It can be like an hour and a half
to two hours, depending But if you've got a really
big agenda, often towards the end of the year, there's
lots of things you want to get through, so you
can have a longer agenda than usual.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
So it does depend on what's happening at that time,
and of course you can have urgent issues, so if
there's been a natural disaster or there's urgent action. You
get things bumped up that have to be interessed immediately.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yours an hour and a half buckh between half an
ear and two ears opinion? What's on the agenda?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Okay? Does anybody in the room go, oh, just one
more thing?
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Seem more all the time?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Oh, there's the odd time.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I love it now. Scrutiny week? What was so yesterday? Jinny?
Would you defend what happened with Nikola Willis and your
three because that just turned into sort of a not
to put two fine a point on a bitch slap,
didn't it?
Speaker 5 (02:48):
Well?
Speaker 4 (02:49):
It was scrappy, but I mean there's clear stats showing
that there's been lease investment and infrastructure, and she's saying
the opposite. So you could see how people get frustrated
when they're saying they come opposite to what the data shows.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Okay, but did you learn anything?
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Do we learn anything? Well, we had for police, which
was in depth. You get quite a lot of time
when you're going through line by line where money was
spent or not spent and what happened that caused that
to happen.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
So you don't get to see that kind of stuff
on the news.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
You get the grabs, but the detailed line by line
scrutiny of the past year's budget and where it went,
that's useful.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
And they don't prepare the problem is with this opposition
and labor, they don't prepare for the Selik committees, it's
their chance to come prepared and scrutinize the governments point
part of our democracy. They don't come prepared. So what
they do is they just yell and shout and scream
and put things out there and hope that one of
the media pick it up. What's your look.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Here's one of my questions yesterday here the Order to
General and Treasury have both found corporate functions within police
and an up to standard. Did the reduction of nineteen
point six millionaire for four years in corporate functions of
primary responsementshould contribute towards the failure of this target?
Speaker 1 (04:05):
And Mark's like, I don't know, I've.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Got no answer. Mynswer there is simply this is that
when I became minister, the police were broke because you
hadn't funded the properly. We had to put one hundred
and twenty million dollars in to support those core functions
because you hadn't funded them. They were a week away
to Jilly, you want the answer, giving you the answer.
When I became minister, the police were about to become
(04:27):
go broke. They were a week away from breaching their appropriation.
We had to immediately put one hundred and twenty million
dollars in to provide those core services because you had
not funded them, they had stopped recruiting to save money.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Good question, good answer, your approach, your apprecia.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Well that's a love yeah, a.
Speaker 4 (04:47):
Lovely answer, but it fails to address why you took
money out of your ears and why was the road
policing budget.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I just told you six million over it. You did
the same.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I just told you. I just told you that we
put more money immediately into police to stay below because
you had because you had not funded them, they had
stopped recruiting. Proud, very proud. Well we've put more. We
had put more funding and resource in the front light.
That is true, and by the way, they're delivering outstanding results.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Now we have got questions as drink scrutiny weekend holidays
back from your point of view, is this the third
year of scrutiny in whatever year it is Is it
worth it? Is there something to be gained out of
the exercise.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Yeah, I think it's important as part of our democracy
and it is away for the opposition to hold the
government to account and that is important. But it's just
that they it's a total complete waste of time because
the opposition aren't organized, they don't really know how to
scrutinize it, that they don't come prepared. And that's exactly
where you saw the debarcle yesterday at the Finance Committee
were all they could do was was was yelling and
(05:54):
you know, and have the finest minister, it's crazy you
would you're probably you.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Would argue, though, Jinny that see I've saw just the
clips of Chambers on the news, for example, and which
was regurgitation of what he's already said about a thousand
times before you would argue there was more that wasn't
covered therefore that was of genuine value.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
Well that there was three hours in total, and Mark
Mattel came for the last forty five minutes of that.
But we had a structured agenda where we go right
through all different areas that the committee agrees on and
we look at things like where is money being spent,
where is it not being spent.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
We get to understand things like.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
The falsification of the breath alcohol breath testing, trying to
understand what parts of the country that was in, asking
what would be the incentive of doing that, why were
they doing that? Is it likely to happen again? So
while it's the bits you see reported are the politicized
and fiery bits, there's a whole lot going in there
where MPs get to ask genuine questions, and usually from officials,
(06:55):
not from ministers, to be honest, you get some detailed,
good answers that help us.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
So, Mike, can I just clarify I just want to
clarify one thing. I was not invited by the committee
to go to scrutiny yesterday. The commissioner was, and that's
normally what happens. I approached the committee and said I
would like to come in a peer. I think with
everything that's gone on with the IPCA report, with everything
that's happening, it's important that.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
I appear in front of the committee.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
I was not asked, I was not compelled to go.
So I just want to correct Ginny's little thing there
about me being here for forty five minutes. That's the
time the committee gave me when I went back and
said I would like to come and peer in front of.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
The coma fair enough Maorray seats, Jinny, what's the argument
in your party for chasing them apart from the fact
you want to win it and it's called to win.
But if you're looking to up in the government next year,
wouldn't you be better off cutting a deal with the
Murray party getting an overhang because splitting an overhang makes
it harder for the government to be the government.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
We want to win every one of those seats and
we'll be working hard to render wind that we do
because we believe that we want to form a government
and we want those seats represented by Labor Mardi imps
our Malori. Labor Caucus knows that best outcomes for Maldi
and when Mardi and Parker and all other people work together,
(08:10):
and that gives the best outcomes for New Zealand and
the best outcomes for Maldi, and that's what we believe in.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I think the best the best outcomes from Mary at
the moment is under the current present government. We are
with our latest crime stats as assaults serious assaults on
Mary have dropped significantly. Education, everything's hidden in the right
direction in terms of achievement for for married students. That's
what matters. That's what matters, Ginny, not you, guys.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Prosecution up under you.
Speaker 4 (08:44):
The number of Malori being prosecuted has increased under you,
disproportionately in some areas, but for low level offending.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
And so you know, we've.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
Been very we've been very clear.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
If you finished, I'd like to Finnish one and then.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
There will be a sanction for that.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Are you guys looking forward to election? You?
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Yes? Yea New Zealand is out there looking for.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
I was just going to say, what you realize is
why I take a long holiday because.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I know that next year I'm going to need it
to recharge.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
My Merry Christmas to you and Kate Mate, I hope
it's genuinely. I hope you have a great break over
the summer.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Where are you going, Ginny.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I'm going to Castle Point, which is lovely. It's the
upper Coast.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I know I know where it is, but blowy, yeah,
but blowing it is.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
It's quite nice though.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
It's got a lagoon area, good s wineries nearby.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I quite like the wild weather. So it's nice. Are
you going often?
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Well? Apparently calling to Ginny, I've got a private island
in Bali. I wish that was true, but we're going
up there for ten days. My daughter and her family
live in Dubai, so we are meeting them halfway and
I'm going to get to see my two year old granddaughter.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Oh that's exciting. Now you can't time. Where would you stay?
Can by the way, I'm looking to go to do
but where would you stay? Whe's a nice place to
stay with the pool.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
Uh?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Well, I mean there's there's so much choice. Any of
the Emirates Group hotels are fantastic, you know, so Dubai
Creek if you go the get to all the odd
suits and things like that experience, you go to what
he might you'll enjoy.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
A wig if you go down.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Put that up on socials too, mate.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Jenny, calm down. Nice to see you, very very merry
Christmas to both of you, and happy holidays and all
of that will take Thanks for having us on great pleasure,
Jenny Anderson.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Mark for more from the Mike Asking Breakfast listen live
to news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
Our last show together. Is it right for the yes?
Speaker 2 (00:04):
Are you're not here back next week? You two? What's happening?
Speaker 3 (00:07):
No, we're back, we're back. We didn't negotiate a good
enough contract with you, so we sort of stuck with it.
Speaker 1 (00:14):
With those amazing ratings.
Speaker 4 (00:16):
Do you put the ratings down to your rape, your
wit or is it the magic DJ voice that makes
those ratings so speA.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
I think you've hit the nail on the head there, Ginny.
And that's why you're my favorite in the segment, because
you want it's a combination. It's the combination. It's all
the magic coming together. Now, look, I need some insight
from both of you. I've been watching Trump's cabinet meeting,
which has been going since before six o'clock this morning
in New Zealand time, and all it happens is that
(00:43):
you go round the table and we go, Ginny, a
report from you, please mark a report from it? Is that, Ginny?
Is that how a durn slash Hipkins ran cabinet?
Speaker 1 (00:54):
No? No, not at all. No, you should have all
had a talk. You discuss an issue.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Who starts it?
Speaker 5 (00:59):
Does?
Speaker 2 (00:59):
It's on the agenda?
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Is you do have an agenda?
Speaker 4 (01:06):
And that's also made public, so you can you know,
you can a cabinet minutes and kebnet agendas, but the
detailed conversation usually is confidential.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Okay. Is that how we run labeled?
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Probably labor and the labor cabinet Wold probably would probably
sit holding the hand seeing comeboya and it's probably.
Speaker 2 (01:25):
The major.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
And just throw how they can spray more money around
the place they're actually delivery, do you think? But no,
that's not how the cabinets run. Cemw. The Prime Minister
runs the kibinet and we have kept that. You have
cabinet papers that come up that are then discussed and debated.
And let's how the cabinets run.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
On average, Jenny in your time, how long does a
cabinet meeting go? Roughly?
Speaker 5 (01:51):
Can It can be like an hour and a half
to two hours, depending But if you've got a really
big agenda, often towards the end of the year, there's
lots of things you want to get through, so you
can have a longer agenda than usual.
Speaker 4 (02:04):
So it does depend on what's happening at that time,
and of course you can have urgent issues, so if
there's been a natural disaster or there's urgent action. You
get things bumped up that have to be interessed immediately.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yours an hour and a half buckh between half an
ear and two ears opinion? What's on the agenda?
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Okay? Does anybody in the room go, oh, just one
more thing?
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Seem more all the time?
Speaker 3 (02:33):
Oh, there's the odd time.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
I love it now. Scrutiny week? What was so yesterday? Jinny?
Would you defend what happened with Nikola Willis and your
three because that just turned into sort of a not
to put two fine a point on a bitch slap,
didn't it?
Speaker 5 (02:48):
Well?
Speaker 4 (02:49):
It was scrappy, but I mean there's clear stats showing
that there's been lease investment and infrastructure, and she's saying
the opposite. So you could see how people get frustrated
when they're saying they come opposite to what the data shows.
Speaker 2 (03:02):
Okay, but did you learn anything?
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Do we learn anything? Well, we had for police, which
was in depth. You get quite a lot of time
when you're going through line by line where money was
spent or not spent and what happened that caused that
to happen.
Speaker 1 (03:20):
So you don't get to see that kind of stuff
on the news.
Speaker 4 (03:23):
You get the grabs, but the detailed line by line
scrutiny of the past year's budget and where it went,
that's useful.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
And they don't prepare the problem is with this opposition
and labor, they don't prepare for the Selik committees, it's
their chance to come prepared and scrutinize the governments point
part of our democracy. They don't come prepared. So what
they do is they just yell and shout and scream
and put things out there and hope that one of
the media pick it up. What's your look.
Speaker 4 (03:50):
Here's one of my questions yesterday here the Order to
General and Treasury have both found corporate functions within police
and an up to standard. Did the reduction of nineteen
point six millionaire for four years in corporate functions of
primary responsementshould contribute towards the failure of this target?
Speaker 1 (04:05):
And Mark's like, I don't know, I've.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
Got no answer. Mynswer there is simply this is that
when I became minister, the police were broke because you
hadn't funded the properly. We had to put one hundred
and twenty million dollars in to support those core functions
because you hadn't funded them. They were a week away
to Jilly, you want the answer, giving you the answer.
When I became minister, the police were about to become
(04:27):
go broke. They were a week away from breaching their appropriation.
We had to immediately put one hundred and twenty million
dollars in to provide those core services because you had
not funded them, they had stopped recruiting to save money.
Speaker 2 (04:40):
Good question, good answer, your approach, your apprecia.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Well that's a love yeah, a.
Speaker 4 (04:47):
Lovely answer, but it fails to address why you took
money out of your ears and why was the road
policing budget.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I just told you six million over it. You did
the same.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
I just told you. I just told you that we
put more money immediately into police to stay below because
you had because you had not funded them, they had
stopped recruiting. Proud, very proud. Well we've put more. We
had put more funding and resource in the front light.
That is true, and by the way, they're delivering outstanding results.
Speaker 2 (05:16):
Now we have got questions as drink scrutiny weekend holidays
back from your point of view, is this the third
year of scrutiny in whatever year it is Is it
worth it? Is there something to be gained out of
the exercise.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Yeah, I think it's important as part of our democracy
and it is away for the opposition to hold the
government to account and that is important. But it's just
that they it's a total complete waste of time because
the opposition aren't organized, they don't really know how to
scrutinize it, that they don't come prepared. And that's exactly
where you saw the debarcle yesterday at the Finance Committee
were all they could do was was was yelling and
(05:54):
you know, and have the finest minister, it's crazy you
would you're probably you.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
Would argue, though, Jinny that see I've saw just the
clips of Chambers on the news, for example, and which
was regurgitation of what he's already said about a thousand
times before you would argue there was more that wasn't
covered therefore that was of genuine value.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
Well that there was three hours in total, and Mark
Mattel came for the last forty five minutes of that.
But we had a structured agenda where we go right
through all different areas that the committee agrees on and
we look at things like where is money being spent,
where is it not being spent.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
We get to understand things like.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
The falsification of the breath alcohol breath testing, trying to
understand what parts of the country that was in, asking
what would be the incentive of doing that, why were
they doing that? Is it likely to happen again? So
while it's the bits you see reported are the politicized
and fiery bits, there's a whole lot going in there
where MPs get to ask genuine questions, and usually from officials,
(06:55):
not from ministers, to be honest, you get some detailed,
good answers that help us.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
So, Mike, can I just clarify I just want to
clarify one thing. I was not invited by the committee
to go to scrutiny yesterday. The commissioner was, and that's
normally what happens. I approached the committee and said I
would like to come in a peer. I think with
everything that's gone on with the IPCA report, with everything
that's happening, it's important that.
Speaker 2 (07:18):
I appear in front of the committee.
Speaker 3 (07:19):
I was not asked, I was not compelled to go.
So I just want to correct Ginny's little thing there
about me being here for forty five minutes. That's the
time the committee gave me when I went back and
said I would like to come and peer in front of.
Speaker 2 (07:30):
The coma fair enough Maorray seats, Jinny, what's the argument
in your party for chasing them apart from the fact
you want to win it and it's called to win.
But if you're looking to up in the government next year,
wouldn't you be better off cutting a deal with the
Murray party getting an overhang because splitting an overhang makes
it harder for the government to be the government.
Speaker 4 (07:49):
We want to win every one of those seats and
we'll be working hard to render wind that we do
because we believe that we want to form a government
and we want those seats represented by Labor Mardi imps
our Malori. Labor Caucus knows that best outcomes for Maldi
and when Mardi and Parker and all other people work together,
(08:10):
and that gives the best outcomes for New Zealand and
the best outcomes for Maldi, and that's what we believe in.
Speaker 3 (08:17):
I think the best the best outcomes from Mary at
the moment is under the current present government. We are
with our latest crime stats as assaults serious assaults on
Mary have dropped significantly. Education, everything's hidden in the right
direction in terms of achievement for for married students. That's
what matters. That's what matters, Ginny, not you, guys.
Speaker 1 (08:41):
Prosecution up under you.
Speaker 4 (08:44):
The number of Malori being prosecuted has increased under you,
disproportionately in some areas, but for low level offending.
Speaker 1 (08:51):
And so you know, we've.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
Been very we've been very clear.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
If you finished, I'd like to Finnish one and then.
Speaker 3 (08:58):
There will be a sanction for that.
Speaker 2 (09:00):
Are you guys looking forward to election? You?
Speaker 1 (09:04):
Yes? Yea New Zealand is out there looking for.
Speaker 2 (09:10):
I was just going to say, what you realize is
why I take a long holiday because.
Speaker 1 (09:13):
I know that next year I'm going to need it
to recharge.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
My Merry Christmas to you and Kate Mate, I hope
it's genuinely. I hope you have a great break over
the summer.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Where are you going, Ginny.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
I'm going to Castle Point, which is lovely. It's the
upper Coast.
Speaker 2 (09:29):
I know I know where it is, but blowy, yeah,
but blowing it is.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
It's quite nice though.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
It's got a lagoon area, good s wineries nearby.
Speaker 1 (09:38):
I quite like the wild weather. So it's nice. Are
you going often?
Speaker 3 (09:42):
Well? Apparently calling to Ginny, I've got a private island
in Bali. I wish that was true, but we're going
up there for ten days. My daughter and her family
live in Dubai, so we are meeting them halfway and
I'm going to get to see my two year old granddaughter.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Oh that's exciting. Now you can't time. Where would you stay?
Can by the way, I'm looking to go to do
but where would you stay? Whe's a nice place to
stay with the pool.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
Uh?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Well, I mean there's there's so much choice. Any of
the Emirates Group hotels are fantastic, you know, so Dubai
Creek if you go the get to all the odd
suits and things like that experience, you go to what
he might you'll enjoy.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
A wig if you go down.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Put that up on socials too, mate.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Jenny, calm down. Nice to see you, very very merry
Christmas to both of you, and happy holidays and all
of that will take Thanks for having us on great pleasure,
Jenny Anderson.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
Mark for more from the Mike Asking Breakfast listen live
to news talks. It'd be from six am weekdays or
follow the podcast on iHeartRadio,
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