October 21, 2025 • 55 mins
Without a doubt, Shelley Craft remains one of the most loved personalities on our TV screens - just as she has been for three decades. From Saturday Disney, to The Great Outdoors, Funniest Home Videos and the powerhouse that is The Block.
How did she turn a work experience stint into a career?
How did she deal with being in the public eye, and the many ups and downs of the industry?
What are the practices and principles that keep her able to show up so authentically that we think we all know her?
What we hear from Shelley aren't the usual success secrets: Instead, it's all about how she relates to herself, the work, and those around her. And it applies just as much to our every day lives as it does to being on telly.
To hear more from Shelley, check out her podcast The Aging Project and The Official Block Podcast
For tickets to Story Club, copies of So What, Now What? and to get in touch with Osher, head here
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
There's nothing else to say but be comfortable in your
own skin. And if you're not comfortable in your own skin,
this isn't the place for you to be. Find something
else to do, because how can you do all the
crazy things that you asked to do, particularly on a
kid show or a travel show, if you can't get
(00:23):
past the fact that a million people are watching you
at home while you eat that cricket, or while you
bungee jump or while you're getting a wedge eat Like,
how can you actually be in the moment if you're
not in the moment with yourself. So that's the only
advice I would still give anyone who had any desired
(00:43):
drive to be in the public eye. It's just be
happy and comfortable with who you are.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
First, Welcome to the show. This is Better than Yesterday.
Useful tools and useful conversations to help make your day
to day better than yesterday. Every week, twice a week
since twenty thirteen, Mine Am Josha Ginsberg, and Shelley Craft
is on the show. Today Today we're gonna talk about motherhood,
(01:08):
aging fabulously, being comfortable in your own skin, and what
it takes to stay on our screens, stay loved enough
to be invited into people's homes via television for over
thirty years, from Saturday Disney to Funniest Home Videos, to
The Block and beyond. I do have to pay the bills,
so here's some ads. We're back with Shelly Craft at
(01:29):
a moment. Thank you so much for listening to the show.
I've got a question, what does it take to remain
one of the most loved names and faces on Australian
television for decades. You're gonna get some answers in the
next hour or so. Shelley Craft is our guest today.
(01:49):
She opens right up about how she broke through on
Saturday Disney, from Funniest Home Videos to the Block, how
she managed to stay relevant and stay vital and stay
the best choice for every one of those jobs along
the way. Shelley also she's a lot of other things.
She's a mum, she's a podcaster. She has a podcast
called The Aging Project, which she says is all about
learning the holistic secrets of aging. Fabulously, she's a real
(02:13):
estate agent, which is really interesting. We're going to get
to all of that stuff today, including the importance of service,
the power in not having to be in control of everything,
of being comfortable in your own skin, being easy on yourself,
maintaining curiosity as a primary purpose in your day. Enjoy
(02:34):
this conversation with Shelley Craft. Shelley, I'm very happy you're
here today.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Because I've done this podcast since twenty thirteen, I think
at nearly a thousand interviews that I've done, But in
all those guests, I have never felt the confidence, nay,
the desire. In fact, I have eschewed it and shoot
it away when people have wanted to play the Brisbane
game with.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
Me, oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And I've never played. I've never played the Brisbane game
on this show. But today I think, for the first
time ever, in twelve and a bit years of doing
this show, I think I would like to play the
Brisbane game.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Okay, well, I did move away from Brisbane in ninety three.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
I moved away in seventeen. I moved away from Brisbane
in ninety eight.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
Okay, all right, so this is old school Brisbane.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
It's okay, let's go there. We're on James Street in
the Valley. We're one of those lovely open day wine
bar things.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
That didn't exist in ninety three.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
That did not exist. There was a fucking shit hole
and you wouldn't walk around there at night.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I did live down the end of James Street in
Wellsby Street as a matter of fact, in about ninety four.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Here we go. So you moved away in ninety three,
so that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
I came back, came back. I've dip mytee left in
the Brisbane River and yeah, okay, okay, we're at the
Mirtha Bolls.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
We're at Mirtha Bowls and we meet each other. Let's
say it's ninety four, I'm I'm I'd be twenty, you'd
be eighteen.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
You're already on Brisbane radio by that time. So I
would be like.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Oh my, oh my god, it's a tragic.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Do I go?
Speaker 2 (04:23):
And so hard?
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Or hard?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Do I know? I was spidy? I was. I was
a black thunder driver, you know I was doing overnight
were to mid dawns. You went awake and so we
would probably start with the Brisbane game. For people who
don't know it is like, oh what's goooge.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Go Kenmore South Primary School? Ok s s s. We
all know that where the best. And then I went
to Brisbane Girls Grammar Ubla hubla same out of tong bisbabish.
Who's the long Mary pad matter rakakou? Come on grammar
blue blue.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Blue, Okay, so I'm going to go in reverse order.
I went to school up the road from you, I know, yes,
on the pool named after the street Gregory Terrace.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
And it wasn't actually was it. That is not the
name of the school.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
No, it was Sir Joseph's, correct, but everyone called it Terrace.
And until this moment, I have never met anyone else
that also went to Kenmore South State School?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Did you go to keil South?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I went to see Kenmore South State School?
Speaker 1 (05:24):
You did not.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
When I moved to Brisbane in nineteen seventy nine, I
started in grade one.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Oh my goodness, there were wow. Okay, there is so
much that makes sense about you now.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
I lived, I walked around the corner. I walked to school.
I was five and I walked to school by myself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Because you could, because it was Brisbane and.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
We lived up the street and around the corner of
My brother was friends with his daughter. These people that
were on TV at the time, there were a couple
Mike and Amanda Gibson or Gibbo. You I made his
Saturday morning TV cartoons and I remember seeing him at
school pickup and just going like I'd fucking witnessed the deity,
like I just.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Did when I saw Andre g at the Mirth of Bowls, Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
And I recall on like a school Fate Day or something,
because he worked at Channel nine at the time, which
was like I said, they did Sunday morning Saturday Morning cartoons, right.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
It was actually seven and it was seven Super Saturday.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Which there was. You're absolutely right, right.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
And Gibbo and Ian called.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Who I worked with later at Brisbane Radio. But I
remember on the school Fate Day they organized the Channel
seven chop on the one from the Red Gum Song
to land on the Oval.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Amazing.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
My mind melted. There was just something so magical about
television when I was a little kid, like the cameras
and everything just fucking blew my mind. I was so
enchanted by it.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
So you're actually aware of it at that time at
that age.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Because I asked Mon what those towers were because in Brisbane,
if you've ever watched the towers in the background, that's
the tower there everywhere, so it's really kind of obvious, like, oh,
that's where that comes from.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And ken Moore being a suburb that sits at the
base of mount even more ever present in your day,
isn't it. That's great. That is great. Okay, the ken
More South thing is ridiculous. And we could talk about
our favorite teaching mister Lakeman a little bit later on.
But my parents used to drive us up to Channel
seven and we would go and sit in the audience
(07:24):
of seven Super Saturday. And I'm sure this is where
it all like, as you say, the magic came from.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Tell me about that, because it is unlike in everywhere
else in Australia.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Smell it.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
I could smell the studio now, Oh, I know it's
talking about in Brisbane. It's all on the top of
this mountain hill. Yes, and you have to go on
this adventure to get there, and they're the only buildings
up there. It's all inside a National park and there's
something mythical.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
It is like go to Oz. It is like arriving
at the Great Wizard's Door, which were the Channels Evans Studio.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
BACKLP boxes of the talent as you walk.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
In, absolutely and there they were. You know, you had
the wonderful Fiona McDonald and Jackie, the sisters, and Gillian
and Gail and Anne, Marie Bigger and obviously, as you mentioned,
you know, Gibbo Boris's Breakfast Club. Okay, if we're talking
brizzy childhood, but this is this is when Telly was
(08:30):
was more regional, and maybe it was just because it
was Brisbane and a really parochial, you know, wonderful TV environment,
and they produced so many amazing kids shows over the years,
and of course that that's where I sort of kicked off.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
It was quite the hub of like Adelaide was as well.
It was quite the hub of children's TV programming.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Absolutely absolutely, and there was a posseve old men producing
kids shows. But we loved them.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
And they were funny, and it was all live, all
lie amazing.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
And we got to sit there in the audience in
the pews and they just threw bags of chips at you.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
The classic audience want technique.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Oh my goodness, that's what you're going to do. I'm
sure we still did that when I hosted Funniest and
we had a live audience. I'm sure we just threw
chips out of them. That was the way to do it.
But my god, that was absolutely as you say, magical,
a magical childhood experience, and the lights and the cameras
and the ad breaks and the shenanigans that went on
(09:31):
during the ad breaks, and now that I did have
a period when I worked on a studio based program
and you got I was that person. I would sit
there going, oh my god, I remember this as a kid, like,
how do I now give back to the audience life changing,
I guess, or life life formative for my life.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
We also have another thing in common in that we
both did work experience up at the mountain I did.
I did my work experience at the recording studio that
was at the back of Channel Line, and you did
yours at Channel seven about four hundred meters apart. What
was it like for you to be doing a work
experience at that TV network with a more kind of
grown up mind.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Well, it was funny. I do remember that I turned
up for the first day of work experience because this
was outside of school. I had finished year twelve. I've
been working at Movie World for about six months and
a girlfriend of mine, who was Catwoman Terre's Livingston, who
went on to host Agro's Cartoon Connection. We worked at
Movie world together. She's an incredible human. But she got
(10:32):
the role on Agros and everyone at a movie I
was like, oh my gosh, she's leaving. She's you know,
she's going to host a TV show. And she said,
why don't you just come up and hang out. And
then my sister, who was in advertising, she had sort
of an inn. I basically said, I will lick envelopes,
photocopy or sweet floors. I will do anything. I've actually,
(10:53):
even though I'd spent years going up and sitting in
a studio, I hadn't really connected the dots about what
a job in television might look like. And so when
I went up for my first day, I had on suit,
I had heels, I was all frocked up, I had
hair in curlers, and I was ready for my moment
on air, even though I had said I will do anything.
(11:15):
And I remember Mario Silvestri, who was a producer up
there at one of the shows. He just looked and laughed.
He goes, right, get in the chopper, we're off. We're
shooting the Motor Show today. I was like, oh, fantastic. Okay,
So they bundled me into the chopper, which again should
have been an amazing, ridiculous experience for the kid. On
first day work experience, I was just going on, I'm
a little oven dressed. Now this is really awkward. We
(11:37):
flew out over some fires that were happening on the
Sunshine Coast and circled back around, and by this time
I was like, oh, a little queasy, not feeling flashed.
This is my first chopper experience. And long story shot,
we used to do a lot of road trips as kids,
and Mama just say, go to sleep, go to sleep,
and we'll get there sooner. So I literally fell asleep
in the chopper and they woke me up when we
(11:58):
landed right back at Mount Cotton to at the racetrack
there to do some shooting for the motor Show. And
so a they've said, this is meant to be the
most extraordinary experience of your life, and you just went
to sleep. So I don't know what else we're going
to do for you in your work experience to make
this any more impressive than taking you in the chop.
I went, no, no, no, it's just my way of coping.
(12:20):
I just fall asleep. So out we get and here
we are on a racetrack, steaming hot Brisbane summer in
a full suit, going this is ridiculous. Okay, my next
day is going to be better and I'm going to
be more prepared. And that was it. Television really has
been like that for me since day one. It's like,
just turn up, be ready for anything, hang on for
(12:41):
the ride, and enjoy yourself. And I've sort of just
looked at everything that way.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
You said something quite that I really align with and
I really recognize, but I'd love you to talk about
it a bit more. What's the value in I want
to do this thing so much, I will do below
entry level of it, owe money because I just want
I have to be around it. What's the value in?
Because I hear there's quite a lot on this show,
(13:08):
what's the value behind that? And do you recognize how
that helped you and what other people saw in that?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I probably do now, and I guess if I was
to someone. I can't even really sum myself up. I
am a Gemini, I'm a third child, and I grew
up in Brisy. I think those three things have made
me a very curious doer. I'm happy to do what
people would like me to do it I do it
(13:36):
the best that I can. I don't want to be
in charge of anything. I just like doing things. I
like trying new things. I'm curious about everything, and I'm
happy just to scrape the surface of everything and then
move on to the next I don't feel this huge
desire to have to accomplish or control or gain total
(13:57):
power over anything, really. So television was a wonderful environment
to start in for that because there's so many elements
of what this thing is, and you work out very
quickly that the person on air, the person in front
of the camera, is a very tiny link in a
very long chain of things that have to happen, and
(14:18):
that could have taken me in many different directions. I
have worked as a PA for a little while. I
hung around for a week basically, and they gave me
a job as a PA, which is like a secretary
for a show at the end of the week and
i'ment okay, great, So now I'm working on this movie
review program. What have I got to do? Oh, we're
going to watch some movies. You've got to write a review. Great,
(14:40):
so I can do that. What else would you like
me to do? Oh? Well, then we go into studio
and we record it. So here's the AUTOQ. Can you
work the auto Q? And yeah, sure, I can learn
how to do that. So again, I think it is
more my nature to just be curious and try stuff
and not really have a goal in mind. I didn't
have a goal being on air. I was just in
(15:04):
a great environment with creative people. And I've always described
Telly as the perfect place for people who don't belong
anywhere else. It doesn't matter whether you're an accountant or
a lawyer, or you work in the canteen. Just being
in the building, particularly when they were studios and there
was lots of different shows being produced at once, Telly
(15:26):
was just a great place for people who didn't really
fit anywhere else because you could find your spot. I
guess I found my spot.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
There's something to be said for being around and being
seen to be hungry and being seen to be willing
and curious to learn.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yes, And I would say that to anyone anytime. And like,
you know, if I look at it now, some of
our block contestants have auditioned for the show seven times.
You know, I will meet anyone in Australia would say, oh,
I was going to audition for that. You know, we
thought about sending in a tape and I say, well,
the people that are on this season, some of them
have auditioned for this show seven times and that's seven years.
(16:05):
Their lives are very very different now than they were
when they first tried out for the show. But you've
got to show you're keen. And I'm sure our casting
directors look at that and go, well, it was just
a one off, and you know a couple's tried it
once and we never see them again. You know, it's
a bloody heart show for one, So I think they
want to see that people are really keen to give
(16:26):
this everything they've got.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, where did the break come? Because you we mentioned
Saturday Morning TV. You ended up on Saturday Morning TV
and a time before YouTube and minecraft and other things.
That was it? How did that happen?
Speaker 1 (16:42):
The greatest babysitters of all time? Weren't we? We started
on air at seven I think, and went live till
nine thirty, when parents could then roll out of bed.
And because it was Disney, they knew it was perfectly
safe and perfectly clean, and they weren't going to come
across anything.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Radical sad showing crickets drinking beer and girls with Peginnis
falling out of the sky in between, which was fine.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, that was probably again that was Brisbane programming. I
don't know whether the other states, the other states got that,
but as I said, I was working as a PA
for a show Saturday. Disney was the office down the
corridor and Janine Mapp was retire or leaving. She was
off to do something else, so they had a spot.
And basically Disney was a blonde, a brunette, and a boy.
(17:27):
That's how it worked. The blonde was leaving. So I
was already fifty percent up on half the girls that
wanted to audition, and I did. I just said, do
you mind if I audition? I said, sure, stick yourhead
in the ring. So you had to go out and
shoot a story. I just went to South Bank and
shot a little story about the Winter Olympics at the
(17:49):
ice skating rink that happened to be there at the time,
and went through the rigorous process. Obviously, Disney themselves, the
head offices, whether it be Asia or in the States,
had to approve the next host, and yeah, that was me.
I got the job. So I think five six years
I was on the show and as you say, just
being around and being in their face and being blonde.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I have spent a portion of my career, two portions
of my career I have spen blonde, and I can
I can attest that there is a factor. There is
a factor there, a blonde factor that played a role.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
Well, sometimes they want to blonde and sometimes they want
to bring it. What are you going to do? And
I think again that that's my nature to go, oh well,
if I didn't get the role, you know, my next
job was The Great Outdoors, which was a travel program,
and they had the Girl next Door and then they
had a couple of you know, supermodels, and they had
you know, some parents, and they had some older guys,
(18:48):
and you know, it was finding the mix. And I
auditioned for that maybe two or three times before I
got the job because I wasn't the right fit for
the cast. So again, not for an on air roll off,
and it's not really about who you are, it's where
you fit in the mix of what's already existing.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
I'm curious as to because there was a point where
that stuff at the Seven Networks started to not peter off,
but just kind of the intensity of it started to
decrease a bit, and I'm wondering at what point did
you start to notice that was happening, and when you
started to think about, oh, I might need to change here,
because that can happen. I ask because not everyone works
(19:28):
in television, but people can certainly notice when I am
not necessarily taken for granted, but you don't cause the
fast and you're reliable, people kind of forget.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
I've always always said it. I am a staff member. Yeah,
I'm not a star. I turn up, I do my job.
I do it the best I can on the day,
and sometimes that's one hundred percent, sometimes it's eighty, but
it's everything I've got at the time. Yeah, I'm on staff.
I'm a cannie. I'm a trade person, you know, that's
what I do, not a.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Celebrity among workers. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
And again, as you know, oh, there are so many
incredible humans behind the camera that don't get credit for
making us look good. You know, I am one hundred
percent for the fact that it's a team effort in
every show and in every environment, and we just get
the accolades, all the criticism for it, to be honest,
(20:27):
where a lot of it's not even our problem, right.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
But that's the gig. That's the gas. That's the gig
is to deflect the praise and take the heat. That's yeah,
that's the gig.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
But Disney was a great, great start, and it was
probably four months in to my on air time, and
then they moved the show to Sydney and that was
sort of the disbanding of regional television. I suppose they
moved some shows to Perth, they moved, as you say, Adelaide,
they were trying this kind of separation of everything. But
that did land me in Sydney, where a lot more
(20:57):
of the decisions were made and obviously a lot more
of the I guess the decision makers were stationed. So again,
put yourself out there, put yourself in front of I
don't even know if they were the right people, but
I put myself in front of everybody. Hi, I'm here.
Just move from brizzye.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
I come with a good attitude.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
That's the thing that if I look back at the
breaks in my career, I just happened to be the
person that was able to solve their problem in the
easiest way because I showed up and I had what
they needed. It wasn't luck had an enormous amount to
do with it. But if I looked at it rather
than if I've found and later on, as you know,
(21:38):
when I pitched stuff, now it's like, rather than I
need you to please say yes to me, it's like
I'm here to solve a problem for you.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
Yeah. You must have worked on that too, though, because
you just said a lot of it is luck, and
it is. And I would be the first to say,
oh my god, I've had so many lucky breaks. Oh
my god, I've had so many lucky opportunities, and that
gets very self deprecating as you move. But I'm not
a journalist. I have no other skills but being comfortable
(22:05):
with being me, and there's not many of us. I'm
not an Olympian. I don't have a gold medal. And
now television is made up of a lot of people
with other incredible skills and knowledge that they can bring.
I just bring again. I guess I have put it
down to this curiosity.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
When you talk to young people who are keen, they
won't be in television. But when you talk to young
people who are keen to I don't know, start a
YouTube channel or whatever, how do you Because often these people.
The thing about working in the environments that we came
up in, they were very collective, they were probably minimum.
If you're on a travel show, maybe you're always going
to be with five other people. But so many people
(22:43):
now they're coming up in a solo environment where the
only feedback they get is a number that either goes
up or down, and they don't know why. So when
people come to you and they ask, you, know, what
advice do you have for me? Like, how do you know?
I don't know advice a young woman or a young
man who's coming to you asking about trying to start out, Now, Oh, it's.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Probably the same advice I've always given. And I did
try and teach a presenter's course for a while through
one of the casting companies in Sydney, and I said,
I don't know how I can make I don't know
how I can spread this out over three nights a
week for six weeks. There's nothing else to say but
be comfortable in your own skin. And if you're not
comfortable in your own skin, this isn't the place for
(23:25):
you to be. Find something else to do. Because and
even this was long before, as you say, that immediate
feedback of numbers or comments or you know, whatever it
might be where people can actually get hold of you.
I was like, how can you do all the crazy
things that you asked to do, particularly on a kid
show or a travel show, if you can't get past
(23:48):
the fact that a million people are watching you at
home while you eat that cricket or while you you know,
bungee jump or while you're getting a wedge eat, Like,
how how can you actually be in the moment if
you're not in the moment with yourself. So that's the
only advice I would still give anyone who had any
desired drive to be in the public eye. It's just
(24:10):
be happy and comfortable with who you are first, or
be an actor and then you can be someone else.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yeah, what about with your own with your own family?
As you got you got kids who are starting to
get to the you know, time to you know, off
your pop go get a part time gig somewhere. What
do you tell them about entering the workforce and what
it's like to work with with other people in a team.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
It comes down to your work ethic, does it? And
I don't know whether you're born with it. I mean
I say to my girls, you turn up and you
give one hundred percent. I don't care whether it's on
the sporting field, I don't care whether it's in the classroom.
Treat school like a job, and I think it's really
hard for kids. Now. I know that whole school environment
is a tricky one. I said, go there, do your job,
(24:55):
and come home. That's it. The teacher is your boss.
You do what you're told and you come home and
hopefully that will pay off for you.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
But I think even there's something in knowing that you've
done whatever you could that davinive. As you said before
it was only eighty percent. There is some amount of
satisfaction that comes just from Look, I gave it everything.
Whether the outcome is what we're all striving for or not,
I can't control that. What I can control is my
(25:24):
effort control, and I feel good about the effort that
I've put in today.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Look, you've probably worked out now. I'm pretty I'm pretty
easy on myself. I know I'm not going to deliver
my best sometimes, and I don't hold that against myself.
I've worked out. I think that's being human, that you're
not always going to be at your best. Sometimes my
(25:51):
best is pretty shitty, but it was still what I
thought was best at the time, whether it's a decision
or an effort. And I'm pretty good at not letting
myself off the hook, but just saying, wow, okay, you
can well, you can do better. Okay, wasn't your best?
(26:12):
Let it go? Move on like it. You could say,
oh Jesus, I should have should have done this differently.
Nothing you can do about it now, is there, So
get over it and move on.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
What's wonderful about the way that you and I came
up As I came up through radio, you came up
through television. But when it's live, you can't do anything
about it. When it's gone, it's gone in a TV whatever.
They say, you're only as good as your last gig,
Well you're only as good as your last break, all right,
so your last talk break. So it's okay, you can't
(26:48):
do anything about it. You blew that caller, or you
fucked up that whatever that reveal of the competition or whatever.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
At the end of this Addvrea and we've all done
it live on air, and I have I've made some
booboosh and it used to be live and disappeared and
never seen again. And even now when it is live,
somehow it's recorded and it turns up again and again
and again. I cannot find a frame of the first
ten years of my television life. Really, they don't exist.
(27:17):
There is then nothing. Maybe you know, Charles Sim's got
the buried somewhere deep. But yeah, everything from that point
now turns up. You know, you work walk into it.
I was at a fish and chip shop the other
day and there was reruns of the block on from
a few years ago. You're like, oh, I thought that
moment was gone, but no, here it is. So yeah,
maybe I should think about it a little bit more,
(27:38):
but again, nothing I can do about it. And I
don't know. You tell me because I know I know
that you are a very deep thinker, is.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Am?
Speaker 1 (27:48):
I am I too lenient on myself? Should I think
about things a little bit more?
Speaker 2 (27:54):
No? No, not at all? I know. And this is
what I'm getting at, is I think it's an enormous
ass it to understand the effort you put in, take
a reasonable and expected amount of time to debrief and
figure out, well, what actually happened there? It's not exactly
what I wanted? What could I do next time? And
(28:15):
then focus on that action point rather than and do
that thing with flinching. Oh that's why I did that
thing four years ago. And you like you remember that
dumb thing you did once and it naunts you. It
takes up space in your brain. You could always be
here in the moment or you know, working on the
next thing. And that's an enormous asset. And the thing
(28:35):
about you know, I say quite a bit as kids
don't do what you tell them, they do what you
show them. And by doing that, you're showing your kids
this is a reasonable amount of time to you know,
hold yourself to account and a reasonable lot of times
are then and go all right, now, I'm just going
to keep trying to do the best thing because I
can't change that thing. I'm going to work on this thing.
And that's an enormous thing to teach your kids.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
I sometimes wish my kids knew me as a kid.
Do you ever think that, like now I'm a parent,
And even the other day, I've told this story my daughter.
I was having fun in the morning, horror in the
middle of everyone getting ready, you know, to go somewhere immediately.
And my little one, who's now thirteen, she basically might
(29:18):
me you drunk? I said, why, because you're having fun.
You're like laughing and having fun in the morning, And
I went, I used to laugh, And have you never
seen me laugh and have fun? Like I'm the most
fun person you're ever going to meet? Why is this
such a shock to you? And not that I'm grumpy
(29:38):
in the mornings, but yeah, I went, Well, if you
knew me as a kid, would we have been friends?
Would you have liked me? Would I have liked you?
I don't know. Would we have been mates? It's a
big question.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
I wouldn't want my kids when I was a kid,
and I wouldn't want me to meet them. You know,
I was very different and a very weird person. I'm
very grateful I know me now.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
But I don't want them to go. I don't want
you know, that whole idea of oh, you're parenting and
you'll make you you know, don't make the same mistakes
I made. Oh my gosh, go and make some mistakes.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Yeah, that's also okase, but it's also and you know,
you can't learn the lessons that I learned from those
respects mistakes if you don't make them in some form.
So how can I protect you from the real terrible
version of that, but keep you safe as you explore
this and understand for yourself why that thing is not
a good idea. That's also sometimes part of it. Yeah,
(30:36):
when you you got to Sydney, there was a moment
where you took over a huge television franchise with funniest
home videos, which was a beast of a television show.
It is before YouTube the only place to watch cute
cat videos or people falling off roofs on surfboards. There's
(30:58):
a reason those views those video get a squolion views
now is because it's funny.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
It's funny.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
It's funny. Yeah, and tell me what that was like
to get the call up for such a massive, massive show,
but also the pressure of I knew it like it.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Was our favorite show at home when we were kids,
like my brothers and sisters. We loved it. Graham Kennedy,
you know whacked the old video and the JBCVCR. You
know it was catch grow not forever. The show had
obviously evolved and changed a lot since since Graham hosted,
and then there had been sort of a rollout of
(31:37):
pretty young girls hosting the show. So I think it
was very different. But as you say, the clips were
what made the show. And I've always said any show
that I've worked on, it's never been about me. It's
been about the content. So Disney was about the cartoons,
Great Outdoors was about the travel, funniest home videos was
definitely about the videos and the blocks about the contestants.
Never been about me, which is great. That's kind of
(31:58):
my disclaimer. Yes, I was a juggernaut. It was a
staple in Australian television history and I'm thrilled to have
been a part of it. And I loved every single
second of it, even though some of the scripts I
did not understand and some of the jokes went over
my head. But oh my god, I think it was
the perfect show for me as a human. I thrived.
(32:23):
I loved it. But to be at the helm of
the show when it didn't return, that's a bit sad,
isn't it. YouTube did kill the video star and.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Oh yeah, tell me about what that's like when because
I've been on shows that are canceled and everyone's going
to be facing a gig that not every business works.
You know, not everything is a success. You can't have
one hundred percent strike rate. You know, even the best
batsman gets out. Even Queensland lose the state of origin
(32:54):
from time to time. It's going to happen. So what
did you learn about your relationship to success and your
relationship to the opposite of success when that show didn't
come back.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
I can't remember the exact moment it wasn't coming back.
I was already filming Domestic Blitz as well, which was
sort of the prelude to the Block. So Scott cam
was the host and we used to go into people's
houses and renovate them over three or four days. Then
they'd come back.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Did they know you were coming? Or did you just
go hey? And just like Balk thrives through the door.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
A lot of the time they didn't know we were coming,
or somebody in their family or neighborhood knew we were coming.
Some times when you rolled up at the front door
with the megaphone and a bus full of tradees, was
a little awkward. Well, be honest. And then when again,
I'm very house proud, I completely understand that if someone
said move aside, I'm renovating your house, I would die
(33:55):
and not be thrilled about it. So I could see
the look on a lot of the home owner's face.
They don't want to see it. What do we do?
Do we turn around and go back?
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Note that's an associate producers job. I'm going to be
sitting in there. I'll be in the crew car if
you need me.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
The planning had been going on for months and we
had had you know, architects and designers in their homes
obviously with the blessing of their family members for the
person that this was going to be a you know,
an amazing surprise for so again sort of out of
my hands. So yes, I was already busy working on
that when Funniest didn't come back, and I think I
(34:36):
was just devastated that the show itself was gone, not
that I had not a role in it, just that
the show itself didn't exist. Why what do you mean
it's gone? Where are we going to have our fun
on Saturday nights? And again, you know your audience are
like ah, whether they were kids or adults. You know,
kids loved watching it, adults loved watching it before they
went out. And every time there was a dog video
(34:58):
or someone that fell off a chair backwards, you know
they have a few shots. Whatever your pre Saturday night
games were seemed to be related to funniest time videos.
It was an institution in that time slot. So I'm
just sad that my kids don't get to enjoy it.
You know, they watched clips without the stupid voiceover and
they think it's funny, and I say, let's watch some reruns.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I kept case said, very well out of that.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Incredible. And then there were some of those little running jokes,
like there was one where to go gadzooks and Gadzuks
was kind of an inside joke for the fact that
we knew this video was a setup, and often it
was the same dude. He must have made hundreds and
hundreds of clips over the time of you know, the
car rolling down the driveway with the door open, with
(35:46):
the wheelbarrow positions, like he went to a lot of
trouble to make these videos. But Gadzuks was his little,
you know, hidden clue word that hey, mate, we know,
we know you made this one. We know you've seen
him another.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Pre TikTok content creation. I like it absolutely. I guess
I was trying to get to you know, what, what
is it that you when you reflect on now, that
feeling when something doesn't go right and it's out of
your hands, but you are involved in it. What do
you do? How do you, you know, get up and
(36:21):
do the next thing.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
You always wish you'd saved a little bit better, don't you.
But then the other part of me goes, oh, well,
you're resourceful, you'll find something. So I guess I always
just thought, oh, well, that's my time, and I still
say it now when my time comes and you know
there's there's no job waiting for me anymore. Well, thanks
very much, good night Australia. I've had fun and I
(36:46):
guess end of funniest home videos. I'd already moved on
to another show, so I was sort of filming too,
so I was still in the game of television. I
guess that's yeah, I guess that's what you're getting at.
I was still working in an industry that I loved,
so it didn't I didn't feel like I was losing
a part of me.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
But it changed. Did it change the way you thought
about your planning for the future though?
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Have I started saving anymore? Nollie, No, I've I've got
another job now outside of TV, so I guess I
do always have a little succession plan on the go
for the fact that I have been freelance now for
thirty years on a yearly contract for thirty years, so
(37:30):
really every Christmas I'm like, oh, well this might be it.
You know, the first of December's rolling around, this might
be it.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
So yeah, this is the thing, like people have this
idea that you sign on the show like the Block
or whatever, and you sign these amazing five years, seven
figured deals that hasn't existed since pre two thousand and
I think maybe four people got them. The idea that
if you get on TV for one season of something,
(37:57):
you're set for life doesn't exist, and it hasn't for
there's maybe two people I can think of in the
country that have those kind of deals. Oh everybody else's
year on you, everybody else's year to year, and you
just cross. Oh it's the worst.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, well it it's sort of. I guess it's open ended,
and that idea I didn't. I didn't want a network
contract for the fact that then you have to do
lots of other little things like can you turn up
to this, can it be at this? We've got this
event happening. This is a show you have to do
because you're on a contract, so it's actually quite wonderful
(38:35):
to go, well, this is my job.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
It's great. It's celebrity belly flops and you're going to
be brilliant. We'll put you in a bikini.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
But it was actually I think it was called Hole
in the Wall, and they made us wear silver Licras
suits exactly.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
And that's how you end up with those people. That's
how you end up with network talent on those shows.
Taking a quick break from Shelley Craft, do you have
to play some ads before I do? Though? If this
podcast is something that you're enjoying, please do share it
with someone. Please do like it and follow it, subscribe
to it, and rate it and do all kinds of
other things. If you want to support me, I'd love
(39:09):
you to do this. Buy a copy of my books.
All right? So what now? What is out right?
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Now?
Speaker 2 (39:14):
You can get links in the show notes. I might
be our last show for the year of story Club
on the ninth of November at the Factory Theater in
marckful Beck. Melrose who writes for Gruin, Harley Breen, Mark Humphreys,
Nina Oyama you know her from Deadlock, and one more
special guest yet to be announced. This one is selling
real well, so get on top of that. The tickets
(39:36):
are in the show notes. We'll be back with Shelley
Kraft at a moment, you know, to a full transparency,
I went from Gold Logan nomination to unemployment. I haven't
worked full time in television in two years. I did
four episodes of Dancing with the Stars. That's it. That's
(39:57):
what I've done. And I am fifty one, and I
am very much noticing that because I'm fifty one, there
appetite to have someone who's my age involved in a
project is diminishing. And I understand it's an ageist industry,
and I understand that it's a lookist industry.
Speaker 1 (40:20):
Do you think who's younger than us in television? I
don't know. I'm fifty next year, next June. Is there
people younger than me on TV? I still think I'm
one of the youngest people in television. There's not what
we had, Osha. There's not a bunch of shows where
you can cut your teeth in television. Maybe I'm just
completely oblivious, Osha. But when I turn up to a
(40:44):
Channel nine event, there's lots of beautiful well I call
them mature women. Maybe they don't consider themselves mature that
have all got kids, families. I think a lot has
changed in the time that I stay on air. I know,
you know, there was Nicky Buckley, Sail of the Century.
(41:05):
She was the first pregnant woman on television as far
as I can remember, And ever since then, everyone has
had babies on air on television, they just don't shoot
you side on. I remember hosting Funniest. I had two
babies while I was on Funniest. The one was hanging
from the jolly jumper in the studio door, and I
was pregnant with the other one, and I'd just say
(41:26):
to the camera and I'm not that. Just come around
a little bit more to the front. I'll just stay
front on till. I think there's a lot of beautiful
older women on television.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
You've never felt the pressure of being in a visual
industry and getting older?
Speaker 1 (41:46):
No, No, I have not. Maybe I just have this
insane ego.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
No, not at all, insane ego. You would not be
on TV because the time of dealing with this egos.
That's the other thing people think is like you can
be a dickhead and get away. No, No, that there's
one person I can think of in broadcasting that is
hard to deal with, that still has a job, and
I'm not going to say their name, but everybody else.
(42:13):
Is not enough time or money for dickheads.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
No, there is not. And as you say, it's not
what it was even before in the eighties. You know,
we've got this kind of idea of television and celebrities
and stars. I don't think it's it's certainly not that
way in my life anyway. I couldn't be more normal,
I don't think. And as you say, we're there to
(42:38):
help tell a story, it's not a story about me. Yeah,
not my story. And you will never see me on
a reality show. I will I will never be dancing,
I will never be in a jungle. I will never
be swimming with sharks. It's not what I'm here for.
It's not about me.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
It was fascinating to be on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
I couldn't do it. I find this hard enough talking
to you. I'm finding this hard enough. Yeah, I couldn't
do it. I couldn't be myself.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
No, I'm interested you as you're approaching fifty, it's quite
the milestone. How do you feel about getting older.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
I'm excited about getting older. It's actually again, I think
I've got a young outlook on life, I think, and
maybe a young attitude. So I'm youthful in my expression
and my interest getting older. And certainly I've noticed at
(43:37):
first when I had kids, and it suddenly gave me
permission to be an adult. And I think I've always
leaned on the Disney thing as being one of the
Disney kids. That's kept me very young, because by the
time I left that show, I was twenty five or
six acting like a sixteen year old. So I'm literally
ten years younger than I really am. I think in
my mind that's me young, and it's also probably given
(44:02):
me an excuse in my own mind to stay young
and be youthful. So when I had kids, I went, wow,
I'm a grown up now, and people might treat me
like a grown up. And I know that turning thirty
was certainly for a lot of women, it's like I'm
now an adult. I certainly didn't get treated any differently
at thirty than I did at twenty seven, and I
certainly didn't get treated any differently at forty than I
(44:23):
did at thirty. So coming on fifty, I'm hoping that
I finally have some adultness.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
What does that look like? What's the adult this? I
mean because I know people in their eighties who are
still Grommets right, and I would love to be. And
that's I think from my experience, that is what I
find is if you can maintain a childish curiosity about
the world you live in, life appears very differently for
(44:51):
you than if you're like another opening so many for
another Olympics.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
You know, and someone for someone who has experienced a
heck of a lot. Because I did travel the world
for seven years on somebody else's budget. I saw a
lot of incredible things and some scary ones too. Yeah,
that that should make me a little bit ah hum
when you do. I've done that, done that, done that,
(45:16):
being there seeing that. And that's why I love traveling
with my kids, because I do get to see the
world through fresh eyes, and you do get to experience
them doing something for the first time. And I love that.
I love that about being a mum that I get
to see my kids do things for the first time,
and I try to give them as many experiences as possible.
I think I've got this lovely kind of I don't
(45:38):
know what's happening now, but this I'm old enough to
not care. Yeah, but I'm also young enough to still
be curious, so I don't care what other people think. Really,
every so often I go ooh, okay, that hit a
little bit hard, but I'm nothing I can do about
(46:01):
it now? Right again? Back to that, Oh, well, like
nothing I can do about it. So there is that
not giving any fs as you get older, which is
a thing. It's an absolute thing, and for some people
that might kick in at twenty, but for me it's
probably kicking in it now forty nine. I'll care about
what I can, I'll control what I can. But other
(46:21):
than that, you're all on your own.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Really, you mentioned that when your kids come along it
was a transformation upon you. What are the what are
the best for people that are thinking about kids who
haven't had kids yet. Let's be fair here. What are
the most incredible things and the most difficult things that
you've found about parenting.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
The most incredible things are that I just fascinated by
the fact that the baby's eyes that I looked in
the day they were born are exactly the same eyes
that I look in my girls now and I can
see that baby. I see the twinkle, and I see
the cheekiness, and they look completely different obviously to everybody else,
(47:07):
but to me, I can see that bright eyed, fresh
faced new world I've just been born look in their
eyes and that that's incredible because it's they're fifteen and
thirteen now, but they're exactly the same as who they were.
And I know I can feel them in my tummy,
(47:29):
which is crazy, the way that Miller, my eldest, moves now.
I can still feel that there is some connection to
my gut with my children.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
That's just us down quite crazy standing. And what about
the challenge that you didn't.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Expect seeing them get hurt or that realization of that's
that's the real world. Whether it's that moment in a
friendship or a relationship or something you just go oh
and again you feel that with them for the first time,
(48:13):
and you wish you could protect them from that, but
you can't. I guess when they get disappointed about humanity,
I think that's that hurts the most. And I've hurt them.
I've said things that I just go, wow, where did
that come from? That was not nice?
Speaker 2 (48:33):
You're human, I'm human.
Speaker 1 (48:34):
And they look at you, they look at you disappointed,
they look at it. Did my mum just say that
to me to my face? It's so, that's horrible. I've
had a couple of those in my life. I've just gone, yeah,
that was shit, that was shitty thing to say.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
But then you have to look at it like the
opportunity to go. Now I get to teach you about contrition,
and you get to teach about responsibility of owning the
consequences of your choices. And you can say, mate, this morning,
when I said that to you, it wasn't okay that
I did that. Okay, you know sometimes I get upset
to sometimes I lose my temper and I'm really sorry.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Yeah, and we're still growing, Like I'm still I'm still
trying to be a better person.
Speaker 2 (49:19):
I'm so grateful I've got a chance to speak with
you and thank you for being my first person I
played the Brisbane game with on this show. Oh it's
a beautiful thing. Thank you for being you, and thank
you for making time to come on our show today.
You are one of these people that we feel we
know because you do your job so well, and in
this conversation, I think you've really helped us understand why
(49:41):
it is that you have remained the nast screens for
so long.
Speaker 1 (49:43):
This was literally just a pleasure for me to talk
to you. I hate I hate being interviewed. Oh my god,
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (49:51):
Okay, it's like, do you hope because I just.
Speaker 1 (49:56):
Because I don't think I ever actually answered the question.
And I'm not trying to be some kind of weird
politician that goes around and around in circles. But I
do get a little bit side tracked, and I love
a chat. And when I keep thinking back to the
better than yesterday, better than yesterday? How can I how
can I prove that I do live to be better
than I was yesterday?
Speaker 2 (50:15):
I can see it in your eyes, Shelly. I can
see that you have a positivity and optimism there, and
that is a thing that has also got to be
I think we've got to have it.
Speaker 1 (50:25):
You wake up every morning and go today today's day.
Speaker 2 (50:28):
Well, I'm going to give it a shot today.
Speaker 1 (50:30):
It was my dad, I'll be honest. It was my
dad when he used to pick us up every day
from school and say, who had an adventure today? And
you always felt like you had to come up with
something you couldn't just go nah, not me, Nah, I
just want to go home. So who had an adventure
at the dinner table? It's like, oh God, we're going
around in a circle. We have to comele something good.
So I think I just have always had to look
(50:51):
for the adventure and the excitement and something crazy and
cool in every day.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
That. Ha's a brilliant technique. I do that with Wolf
earth Wolf every night. I ask him what went well today?
We ask each other. What you're doing is you're priming
your brain to look for possibility and look for adventure.
You start noticing when things are adventures exciting. You start
to pursue things that are adventurous and exciting, and your
life becomes adventurers and exciting. Is technique.
Speaker 1 (51:19):
I love that? And does everyone have that? This is?
Does everyone have that in them?
Speaker 2 (51:25):
We have it, but we need to cultivate it.
Speaker 1 (51:27):
You have to train yourself.
Speaker 2 (51:28):
We need to train ourselves adventure.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
And excitement because I'm sure a lot of people don't
want adventure and they do not want excitement or gratitude.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
Gratitude is simply training yourself to look for when things
are pretty incredible.
Speaker 1 (51:43):
I am very grateful. I am very grateful, and as
you say, even if you go back to the funniest
home videos, saying and on what other shows have I've
been on that didn't survive, There's been a few. I
think I was grateful that was a great experience. I
was grateful for that time. I was grateful to have
met these humans. I mean, I'm working with Camerman now
that I worked with five odd years ago. I'm grateful
for those friendships and those people. It's never about the
(52:06):
show or the medium, or you know, the minimal part
of your day is we're actually rolling. The rest is
just hanging out with good people and enjoying the experience.
Speaker 2 (52:15):
But that stuff does affect. That stuff affects how the
product is made, all right. If you've got a crew
that is hating each other, that will come across on camera. Yes,
you know, when you're a kid and you go to
your friend's house and their parents have been fighting. You sit,
they're like, I don't know what, and you can't quite
relax because there's a weirdness in the air, all right,
(52:37):
that the crew is at each other's throats. Whatever you
film will be affected by that, and so that off
camera stuff is as important and yes, it's like any team. Really,
the product is that you're making is a product of
the people that are making it. And you need to
look after the culture of a place and what you're describing.
(52:59):
You're just making all stuff with cool people. That's what
you want to do, really cool stuff with cool people.
Speaker 1 (53:03):
And we're all, as you say, safe, and we all
want the best.
Speaker 2 (53:07):
We don't have to work, and Telly, we can try
to cultivate that wherever you work.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
Absolutely. Can you imagine oh, doing a job that you
didn't enjoy. And I guess that's always been my thing too.
When I've had enough, I don't like it anymore, I'll
say thank you goodbye. I worked at Macers Kennel, Mackers,
Interpilli Macers.
Speaker 2 (53:29):
I worked there as well. There you go. I worked that.
I had that yeah four months.
Speaker 1 (53:33):
Yeah, and I am now. The girls hate it when
I go to McDonald's or something because I refold the
bag in front of the poor girl, or I ask,
you know, have a nice I say have a nice
day that I said to me at the end, whatever
it is. They don't like taking me to McDonald's and
I want to eat Burger King hungry Jacks because I
am you know that was might bring you back.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Yeah, but you were always on window. You're always on
window because you're smiling into life.
Speaker 1 (53:58):
I did my presenting skills, did come can more?
Speaker 2 (54:01):
Drive through the back, just slinging, slinging dishes, doing late
night clean up and I hate it. It was the worst.
Speaker 1 (54:07):
But it was always quality, service, cleanliness and value QSCV.
That was the Machas rule.
Speaker 2 (54:13):
If you've got time to lean, Shelley, if you've got
time to.
Speaker 1 (54:16):
Lean, time to clean, and you learn how to mop
in a figure of eight like it was an amazing job.
But that QSCV was something that I and now people
get sick of me saying it. So I bring this
hopefully every day. I bring quality. I give service. I'm clean,
and you're getting value for money, quality service, cleanliness and value.
(54:37):
If that wasn't in your workplace, or you couldn't deliver
that in your workplace, please find something else to do
with your life, because you are worth more than being
miserable every day. Be happy, Choose happy.
Speaker 2 (54:51):
You're the best, Shelley. Have a lovely, lovely, lovely day.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
And that's the wrap up. It's been lovely, cheddy to.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Be a better out. It couldn't be a better out
than that. And my friends. That was shlley Craft. Shaley Craft.
She's on the official Block podcast as well as her podcast,
The Aging Project, which you can find where you found
this podcast. Thank you so much for listening. Thank you
to Adam for producing it, Adam Buncher. Like I said earlier,
(55:20):
if you want to help us out, buy a copy
of the book So what Now? What by it for you?
Buy it for a friend and come and see story Club.
It's probably our last show for the November the ninth
at the Factory Theater in Marrickville. Tickets are in the
show notes. Mark Humphrey, Is, Harley Brown, Nina Beck, Melrose
and more to be announced. Thank you so much for listening.
If you like the show, please share it with somebody
and leave a rating, leave a review, subscribe it, follow it,
(55:42):
do all that kind of stuff. I'll see you Monday.
There's nothing else to say but be comfortable in your
own skin. And if you're not comfortable in your own skin,
this isn't the place for you to be. Find something
else to do, because how can you do all the
crazy things that you asked to do, particularly on a
kid show or a travel show, if you can't get
(00:23):
past the fact that a million people are watching you
at home while you eat that cricket, or while you
bungee jump or while you're getting a wedge eat Like,
how can you actually be in the moment if you're
not in the moment with yourself. So that's the only
advice I would still give anyone who had any desired
(00:43):
drive to be in the public eye. It's just be
happy and comfortable with who you are.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
First, Welcome to the show. This is Better than Yesterday.
Useful tools and useful conversations to help make your day
to day better than yesterday. Every week, twice a week
since twenty thirteen, Mine Am Josha Ginsberg, and Shelley Craft
is on the show. Today Today we're gonna talk about motherhood,
(01:08):
aging fabulously, being comfortable in your own skin, and what
it takes to stay on our screens, stay loved enough
to be invited into people's homes via television for over
thirty years, from Saturday Disney to Funniest Home Videos, to
The Block and beyond. I do have to pay the bills,
so here's some ads. We're back with Shelly Craft at
(01:29):
a moment. Thank you so much for listening to the show.
I've got a question, what does it take to remain
one of the most loved names and faces on Australian
television for decades. You're gonna get some answers in the
next hour or so. Shelley Craft is our guest today.
(01:49):
She opens right up about how she broke through on
Saturday Disney, from Funniest Home Videos to the Block, how
she managed to stay relevant and stay vital and stay
the best choice for every one of those jobs along
the way. Shelley also she's a lot of other things.
She's a mum, she's a podcaster. She has a podcast
called The Aging Project, which she says is all about
learning the holistic secrets of aging. Fabulously, she's a real
(02:13):
estate agent, which is really interesting. We're going to get
to all of that stuff today, including the importance of service,
the power in not having to be in control of everything,
of being comfortable in your own skin, being easy on yourself,
maintaining curiosity as a primary purpose in your day. Enjoy
(02:34):
this conversation with Shelley Craft. Shelley, I'm very happy you're
here today.
Speaker 1 (02:43):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
Because I've done this podcast since twenty thirteen, I think
at nearly a thousand interviews that I've done, But in
all those guests, I have never felt the confidence, nay,
the desire. In fact, I have eschewed it and shoot
it away when people have wanted to play the Brisbane
game with.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
Me, oh my goodness.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And I've never played. I've never played the Brisbane game
on this show. But today I think, for the first
time ever, in twelve and a bit years of doing
this show, I think I would like to play the
Brisbane game.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Okay, well, I did move away from Brisbane in ninety three.
Speaker 2 (03:22):
I moved away in seventeen. I moved away from Brisbane
in ninety eight.
Speaker 1 (03:27):
Okay, all right, so this is old school Brisbane.
Speaker 2 (03:30):
It's okay, let's go there. We're on James Street in
the Valley. We're one of those lovely open day wine
bar things.
Speaker 1 (03:40):
That didn't exist in ninety three.
Speaker 2 (03:41):
That did not exist. There was a fucking shit hole
and you wouldn't walk around there at night.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
I did live down the end of James Street in
Wellsby Street as a matter of fact, in about ninety four.
Speaker 2 (03:51):
Here we go. So you moved away in ninety three,
so that's amazing.
Speaker 1 (03:54):
I came back, came back. I've dip mytee left in
the Brisbane River and yeah, okay, okay, we're at the
Mirtha Bolls.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
We're at Mirtha Bowls and we meet each other. Let's
say it's ninety four, I'm I'm I'd be twenty, you'd
be eighteen.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
You're already on Brisbane radio by that time. So I
would be like.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Oh my, oh my god, it's a tragic.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
Do I go?
Speaker 2 (04:23):
And so hard?
Speaker 1 (04:23):
Or hard?
Speaker 2 (04:24):
Do I know? I was spidy? I was. I was
a black thunder driver, you know I was doing overnight
were to mid dawns. You went awake and so we
would probably start with the Brisbane game. For people who
don't know it is like, oh what's goooge.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Go Kenmore South Primary School? Ok s s s. We
all know that where the best. And then I went
to Brisbane Girls Grammar Ubla hubla same out of tong bisbabish.
Who's the long Mary pad matter rakakou? Come on grammar
blue blue.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
Blue, Okay, so I'm going to go in reverse order.
I went to school up the road from you, I know, yes,
on the pool named after the street Gregory Terrace.
Speaker 1 (05:04):
And it wasn't actually was it. That is not the
name of the school.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
No, it was Sir Joseph's, correct, but everyone called it Terrace.
And until this moment, I have never met anyone else
that also went to Kenmore South State School?
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Did you go to keil South?
Speaker 2 (05:22):
I went to see Kenmore South State School?
Speaker 1 (05:24):
You did not.
Speaker 2 (05:25):
When I moved to Brisbane in nineteen seventy nine, I
started in grade one.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
Oh my goodness, there were wow. Okay, there is so
much that makes sense about you now.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
I lived, I walked around the corner. I walked to school.
I was five and I walked to school by myself.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Because you could, because it was Brisbane and.
Speaker 2 (05:46):
We lived up the street and around the corner of
My brother was friends with his daughter. These people that
were on TV at the time, there were a couple
Mike and Amanda Gibson or Gibbo. You I made his
Saturday morning TV cartoons and I remember seeing him at
school pickup and just going like I'd fucking witnessed the deity,
like I just.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Did when I saw Andre g at the Mirth of Bowls, Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
And I recall on like a school Fate Day or something,
because he worked at Channel nine at the time, which
was like I said, they did Sunday morning Saturday Morning cartoons, right.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
It was actually seven and it was seven Super Saturday.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Which there was. You're absolutely right, right.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
And Gibbo and Ian called.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Who I worked with later at Brisbane Radio. But I
remember on the school Fate Day they organized the Channel
seven chop on the one from the Red Gum Song
to land on the Oval.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
Amazing.
Speaker 2 (06:38):
My mind melted. There was just something so magical about
television when I was a little kid, like the cameras
and everything just fucking blew my mind. I was so
enchanted by it.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
So you're actually aware of it at that time at
that age.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
Because I asked Mon what those towers were because in Brisbane,
if you've ever watched the towers in the background, that's
the tower there everywhere, so it's really kind of obvious, like, oh,
that's where that comes from.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
And ken Moore being a suburb that sits at the
base of mount even more ever present in your day,
isn't it. That's great. That is great. Okay, the ken
More South thing is ridiculous. And we could talk about
our favorite teaching mister Lakeman a little bit later on.
But my parents used to drive us up to Channel
seven and we would go and sit in the audience
(07:24):
of seven Super Saturday. And I'm sure this is where
it all like, as you say, the magic came from.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
Tell me about that, because it is unlike in everywhere
else in Australia.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Smell it.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
I could smell the studio now, Oh, I know it's
talking about in Brisbane. It's all on the top of
this mountain hill. Yes, and you have to go on
this adventure to get there, and they're the only buildings
up there. It's all inside a National park and there's
something mythical.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
It is like go to Oz. It is like arriving
at the Great Wizard's Door, which were the Channels Evans Studio.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
BACKLP boxes of the talent as you walk.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
In, absolutely and there they were. You know, you had
the wonderful Fiona McDonald and Jackie, the sisters, and Gillian
and Gail and Anne, Marie Bigger and obviously, as you mentioned,
you know, Gibbo Boris's Breakfast Club. Okay, if we're talking
brizzy childhood, but this is this is when Telly was
(08:30):
was more regional, and maybe it was just because it
was Brisbane and a really parochial, you know, wonderful TV environment,
and they produced so many amazing kids shows over the years,
and of course that that's where I sort of kicked off.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
It was quite the hub of like Adelaide was as well.
It was quite the hub of children's TV programming.
Speaker 1 (08:47):
Absolutely absolutely, and there was a posseve old men producing
kids shows. But we loved them.
Speaker 2 (08:57):
And they were funny, and it was all live, all
lie amazing.
Speaker 1 (09:01):
And we got to sit there in the audience in
the pews and they just threw bags of chips at you.
Speaker 2 (09:07):
The classic audience want technique.
Speaker 1 (09:09):
Oh my goodness, that's what you're going to do. I'm
sure we still did that when I hosted Funniest and
we had a live audience. I'm sure we just threw
chips out of them. That was the way to do it.
But my god, that was absolutely as you say, magical,
a magical childhood experience, and the lights and the cameras
and the ad breaks and the shenanigans that went on
(09:31):
during the ad breaks, and now that I did have
a period when I worked on a studio based program
and you got I was that person. I would sit
there going, oh my god, I remember this as a kid, like,
how do I now give back to the audience life changing,
I guess, or life life formative for my life.
Speaker 2 (09:49):
We also have another thing in common in that we
both did work experience up at the mountain I did.
I did my work experience at the recording studio that
was at the back of Channel Line, and you did
yours at Channel seven about four hundred meters apart. What
was it like for you to be doing a work
experience at that TV network with a more kind of
grown up mind.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Well, it was funny. I do remember that I turned
up for the first day of work experience because this
was outside of school. I had finished year twelve. I've
been working at Movie World for about six months and
a girlfriend of mine, who was Catwoman Terre's Livingston, who
went on to host Agro's Cartoon Connection. We worked at
Movie world together. She's an incredible human. But she got
(10:32):
the role on Agros and everyone at a movie I
was like, oh my gosh, she's leaving. She's you know,
she's going to host a TV show. And she said,
why don't you just come up and hang out. And
then my sister, who was in advertising, she had sort
of an inn. I basically said, I will lick envelopes,
photocopy or sweet floors. I will do anything. I've actually,
(10:53):
even though I'd spent years going up and sitting in
a studio, I hadn't really connected the dots about what
a job in television might look like. And so when
I went up for my first day, I had on suit,
I had heels, I was all frocked up, I had
hair in curlers, and I was ready for my moment
on air, even though I had said I will do anything.
(11:15):
And I remember Mario Silvestri, who was a producer up
there at one of the shows. He just looked and laughed.
He goes, right, get in the chopper, we're off. We're
shooting the Motor Show today. I was like, oh, fantastic. Okay,
So they bundled me into the chopper, which again should
have been an amazing, ridiculous experience for the kid. On
first day work experience, I was just going on, I'm
a little oven dressed. Now this is really awkward. We
(11:37):
flew out over some fires that were happening on the
Sunshine Coast and circled back around, and by this time
I was like, oh, a little queasy, not feeling flashed.
This is my first chopper experience. And long story shot,
we used to do a lot of road trips as kids,
and Mama just say, go to sleep, go to sleep,
and we'll get there sooner. So I literally fell asleep
in the chopper and they woke me up when we
(11:58):
landed right back at Mount Cotton to at the racetrack
there to do some shooting for the motor Show. And
so a they've said, this is meant to be the
most extraordinary experience of your life, and you just went
to sleep. So I don't know what else we're going
to do for you in your work experience to make
this any more impressive than taking you in the chop.
I went, no, no, no, it's just my way of coping.
(12:20):
I just fall asleep. So out we get and here
we are on a racetrack, steaming hot Brisbane summer in
a full suit, going this is ridiculous. Okay, my next
day is going to be better and I'm going to
be more prepared. And that was it. Television really has
been like that for me since day one. It's like,
just turn up, be ready for anything, hang on for
(12:41):
the ride, and enjoy yourself. And I've sort of just
looked at everything that way.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
You said something quite that I really align with and
I really recognize, but I'd love you to talk about
it a bit more. What's the value in I want
to do this thing so much, I will do below
entry level of it, owe money because I just want
I have to be around it. What's the value in?
Because I hear there's quite a lot on this show,
(13:08):
what's the value behind that? And do you recognize how
that helped you and what other people saw in that?
Speaker 1 (13:16):
I probably do now, and I guess if I was
to someone. I can't even really sum myself up. I
am a Gemini, I'm a third child, and I grew
up in Brisy. I think those three things have made
me a very curious doer. I'm happy to do what
people would like me to do it I do it
(13:36):
the best that I can. I don't want to be
in charge of anything. I just like doing things. I
like trying new things. I'm curious about everything, and I'm
happy just to scrape the surface of everything and then
move on to the next I don't feel this huge
desire to have to accomplish or control or gain total
(13:57):
power over anything, really. So television was a wonderful environment
to start in for that because there's so many elements
of what this thing is, and you work out very
quickly that the person on air, the person in front
of the camera, is a very tiny link in a
very long chain of things that have to happen, and
(14:18):
that could have taken me in many different directions. I
have worked as a PA for a little while. I
hung around for a week basically, and they gave me
a job as a PA, which is like a secretary
for a show at the end of the week and
i'ment okay, great, So now I'm working on this movie
review program. What have I got to do? Oh, we're
going to watch some movies. You've got to write a review. Great,
(14:40):
so I can do that. What else would you like
me to do? Oh? Well, then we go into studio
and we record it. So here's the AUTOQ. Can you
work the auto Q? And yeah, sure, I can learn
how to do that. So again, I think it is
more my nature to just be curious and try stuff
and not really have a goal in mind. I didn't
have a goal being on air. I was just in
(15:04):
a great environment with creative people. And I've always described
Telly as the perfect place for people who don't belong
anywhere else. It doesn't matter whether you're an accountant or
a lawyer, or you work in the canteen. Just being
in the building, particularly when they were studios and there
was lots of different shows being produced at once, Telly
(15:26):
was just a great place for people who didn't really
fit anywhere else because you could find your spot. I
guess I found my spot.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
There's something to be said for being around and being
seen to be hungry and being seen to be willing
and curious to learn.
Speaker 1 (15:42):
Yes, And I would say that to anyone anytime. And like,
you know, if I look at it now, some of
our block contestants have auditioned for the show seven times.
You know, I will meet anyone in Australia would say, oh,
I was going to audition for that. You know, we
thought about sending in a tape and I say, well,
the people that are on this season, some of them
have auditioned for this show seven times and that's seven years.
(16:05):
Their lives are very very different now than they were
when they first tried out for the show. But you've
got to show you're keen. And I'm sure our casting
directors look at that and go, well, it was just
a one off, and you know a couple's tried it
once and we never see them again. You know, it's
a bloody heart show for one, So I think they
want to see that people are really keen to give
(16:26):
this everything they've got.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, where did the break come? Because you we mentioned
Saturday Morning TV. You ended up on Saturday Morning TV
and a time before YouTube and minecraft and other things.
That was it? How did that happen?
Speaker 1 (16:42):
The greatest babysitters of all time? Weren't we? We started
on air at seven I think, and went live till
nine thirty, when parents could then roll out of bed.
And because it was Disney, they knew it was perfectly
safe and perfectly clean, and they weren't going to come
across anything.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Radical sad showing crickets drinking beer and girls with Peginnis
falling out of the sky in between, which was fine.
Speaker 1 (17:06):
Yeah, that was probably again that was Brisbane programming. I
don't know whether the other states, the other states got that,
but as I said, I was working as a PA
for a show Saturday. Disney was the office down the
corridor and Janine Mapp was retire or leaving. She was
off to do something else, so they had a spot.
And basically Disney was a blonde, a brunette, and a boy.
(17:27):
That's how it worked. The blonde was leaving. So I
was already fifty percent up on half the girls that
wanted to audition, and I did. I just said, do
you mind if I audition? I said, sure, stick yourhead
in the ring. So you had to go out and
shoot a story. I just went to South Bank and
shot a little story about the Winter Olympics at the
(17:49):
ice skating rink that happened to be there at the time,
and went through the rigorous process. Obviously, Disney themselves, the
head offices, whether it be Asia or in the States,
had to approve the next host, and yeah, that was me.
I got the job. So I think five six years
I was on the show and as you say, just
being around and being in their face and being blonde.
Speaker 2 (18:11):
I have spent a portion of my career, two portions
of my career I have spen blonde, and I can
I can attest that there is a factor. There is
a factor there, a blonde factor that played a role.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
Well, sometimes they want to blonde and sometimes they want
to bring it. What are you going to do? And
I think again that that's my nature to go, oh well,
if I didn't get the role, you know, my next
job was The Great Outdoors, which was a travel program,
and they had the Girl next Door and then they
had a couple of you know, supermodels, and they had
you know, some parents, and they had some older guys,
(18:48):
and you know, it was finding the mix. And I
auditioned for that maybe two or three times before I
got the job because I wasn't the right fit for
the cast. So again, not for an on air roll off,
and it's not really about who you are, it's where
you fit in the mix of what's already existing.
Speaker 2 (19:06):
I'm curious as to because there was a point where
that stuff at the Seven Networks started to not peter off,
but just kind of the intensity of it started to
decrease a bit, and I'm wondering at what point did
you start to notice that was happening, and when you
started to think about, oh, I might need to change here,
because that can happen. I ask because not everyone works
(19:28):
in television, but people can certainly notice when I am
not necessarily taken for granted, but you don't cause the
fast and you're reliable, people kind of forget.
Speaker 1 (19:41):
I've always always said it. I am a staff member. Yeah,
I'm not a star. I turn up, I do my job.
I do it the best I can on the day,
and sometimes that's one hundred percent, sometimes it's eighty, but
it's everything I've got at the time. Yeah, I'm on staff.
I'm a cannie. I'm a trade person, you know, that's
what I do, not a.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Celebrity among workers. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
And again, as you know, oh, there are so many
incredible humans behind the camera that don't get credit for
making us look good. You know, I am one hundred
percent for the fact that it's a team effort in
every show and in every environment, and we just get
the accolades, all the criticism for it, to be honest,
(20:27):
where a lot of it's not even our problem, right.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
But that's the gig. That's the gas. That's the gig
is to deflect the praise and take the heat. That's yeah,
that's the gig.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
But Disney was a great, great start, and it was
probably four months in to my on air time, and
then they moved the show to Sydney and that was
sort of the disbanding of regional television. I suppose they
moved some shows to Perth, they moved, as you say, Adelaide,
they were trying this kind of separation of everything. But
that did land me in Sydney, where a lot more
(20:57):
of the decisions were made and obviously a lot more
of the I guess the decision makers were stationed. So again,
put yourself out there, put yourself in front of I
don't even know if they were the right people, but
I put myself in front of everybody. Hi, I'm here.
Just move from brizzye.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Oh.
Speaker 1 (21:15):
I come with a good attitude.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
That's the thing that if I look back at the
breaks in my career, I just happened to be the
person that was able to solve their problem in the
easiest way because I showed up and I had what
they needed. It wasn't luck had an enormous amount to
do with it. But if I looked at it rather
than if I've found and later on, as you know,
(21:38):
when I pitched stuff, now it's like, rather than I
need you to please say yes to me, it's like
I'm here to solve a problem for you.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
Yeah. You must have worked on that too, though, because
you just said a lot of it is luck, and
it is. And I would be the first to say,
oh my god, I've had so many lucky breaks. Oh
my god, I've had so many lucky opportunities, and that
gets very self deprecating as you move. But I'm not
a journalist. I have no other skills but being comfortable
(22:05):
with being me, and there's not many of us. I'm
not an Olympian. I don't have a gold medal. And
now television is made up of a lot of people
with other incredible skills and knowledge that they can bring.
I just bring again. I guess I have put it
down to this curiosity.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
When you talk to young people who are keen, they
won't be in television. But when you talk to young
people who are keen to I don't know, start a
YouTube channel or whatever, how do you Because often these people.
The thing about working in the environments that we came
up in, they were very collective, they were probably minimum.
If you're on a travel show, maybe you're always going
to be with five other people. But so many people
(22:43):
now they're coming up in a solo environment where the
only feedback they get is a number that either goes
up or down, and they don't know why. So when
people come to you and they ask, you, know, what
advice do you have for me? Like, how do you know?
I don't know advice a young woman or a young
man who's coming to you asking about trying to start out, Now, Oh, it's.
Speaker 1 (23:03):
Probably the same advice I've always given. And I did
try and teach a presenter's course for a while through
one of the casting companies in Sydney, and I said,
I don't know how I can make I don't know
how I can spread this out over three nights a
week for six weeks. There's nothing else to say but
be comfortable in your own skin. And if you're not
comfortable in your own skin, this isn't the place for
(23:25):
you to be. Find something else to do. Because and
even this was long before, as you say, that immediate
feedback of numbers or comments or you know, whatever it
might be where people can actually get hold of you.
I was like, how can you do all the crazy
things that you asked to do, particularly on a kid
show or a travel show, if you can't get past
(23:48):
the fact that a million people are watching you at
home while you eat that cricket or while you you know,
bungee jump or while you're getting a wedge eat, Like,
how how can you actually be in the moment if
you're not in the moment with yourself. So that's the
only advice I would still give anyone who had any
desired drive to be in the public eye. It's just
(24:10):
be happy and comfortable with who you are first, or
be an actor and then you can be someone else.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
Yeah, what about with your own with your own family?
As you got you got kids who are starting to
get to the you know, time to you know, off
your pop go get a part time gig somewhere. What
do you tell them about entering the workforce and what
it's like to work with with other people in a team.
Speaker 1 (24:33):
It comes down to your work ethic, does it? And
I don't know whether you're born with it. I mean
I say to my girls, you turn up and you
give one hundred percent. I don't care whether it's on
the sporting field, I don't care whether it's in the classroom.
Treat school like a job, and I think it's really
hard for kids. Now. I know that whole school environment
is a tricky one. I said, go there, do your job,
(24:55):
and come home. That's it. The teacher is your boss.
You do what you're told and you come home and
hopefully that will pay off for you.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
But I think even there's something in knowing that you've
done whatever you could that davinive. As you said before
it was only eighty percent. There is some amount of
satisfaction that comes just from Look, I gave it everything.
Whether the outcome is what we're all striving for or not,
I can't control that. What I can control is my
(25:24):
effort control, and I feel good about the effort that
I've put in today.
Speaker 1 (25:29):
Look, you've probably worked out now. I'm pretty I'm pretty
easy on myself. I know I'm not going to deliver
my best sometimes, and I don't hold that against myself.
I've worked out. I think that's being human, that you're
not always going to be at your best. Sometimes my
(25:51):
best is pretty shitty, but it was still what I
thought was best at the time, whether it's a decision
or an effort. And I'm pretty good at not letting
myself off the hook, but just saying, wow, okay, you
can well, you can do better. Okay, wasn't your best?
(26:12):
Let it go? Move on like it. You could say,
oh Jesus, I should have should have done this differently.
Nothing you can do about it now, is there, So
get over it and move on.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
What's wonderful about the way that you and I came
up As I came up through radio, you came up
through television. But when it's live, you can't do anything
about it. When it's gone, it's gone in a TV whatever.
They say, you're only as good as your last gig,
Well you're only as good as your last break, all right,
so your last talk break. So it's okay, you can't
(26:48):
do anything about it. You blew that caller, or you
fucked up that whatever that reveal of the competition or whatever.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
At the end of this Addvrea and we've all done
it live on air, and I have I've made some
booboosh and it used to be live and disappeared and
never seen again. And even now when it is live,
somehow it's recorded and it turns up again and again
and again. I cannot find a frame of the first
ten years of my television life. Really, they don't exist.
(27:17):
There is then nothing. Maybe you know, Charles Sim's got
the buried somewhere deep. But yeah, everything from that point
now turns up. You know, you work walk into it.
I was at a fish and chip shop the other
day and there was reruns of the block on from
a few years ago. You're like, oh, I thought that
moment was gone, but no, here it is. So yeah,
maybe I should think about it a little bit more,
(27:38):
but again, nothing I can do about it. And I
don't know. You tell me because I know I know
that you are a very deep thinker, is.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Am?
Speaker 1 (27:48):
I am I too lenient on myself? Should I think
about things a little bit more?
Speaker 2 (27:54):
No? No, not at all? I know. And this is
what I'm getting at, is I think it's an enormous
ass it to understand the effort you put in, take
a reasonable and expected amount of time to debrief and
figure out, well, what actually happened there? It's not exactly
what I wanted? What could I do next time? And
(28:15):
then focus on that action point rather than and do
that thing with flinching. Oh that's why I did that
thing four years ago. And you like you remember that
dumb thing you did once and it naunts you. It
takes up space in your brain. You could always be
here in the moment or you know, working on the
next thing. And that's an enormous asset. And the thing
(28:35):
about you know, I say quite a bit as kids
don't do what you tell them, they do what you
show them. And by doing that, you're showing your kids
this is a reasonable amount of time to you know,
hold yourself to account and a reasonable lot of times
are then and go all right, now, I'm just going
to keep trying to do the best thing because I
can't change that thing. I'm going to work on this thing.
And that's an enormous thing to teach your kids.
Speaker 1 (28:58):
I sometimes wish my kids knew me as a kid.
Do you ever think that, like now I'm a parent,
And even the other day, I've told this story my daughter.
I was having fun in the morning, horror in the
middle of everyone getting ready, you know, to go somewhere immediately.
And my little one, who's now thirteen, she basically might
(29:18):
me you drunk? I said, why, because you're having fun.
You're like laughing and having fun in the morning, And
I went, I used to laugh, And have you never
seen me laugh and have fun? Like I'm the most
fun person you're ever going to meet? Why is this
such a shock to you? And not that I'm grumpy
(29:38):
in the mornings, but yeah, I went, Well, if you
knew me as a kid, would we have been friends?
Would you have liked me? Would I have liked you?
I don't know. Would we have been mates? It's a
big question.
Speaker 2 (29:52):
I wouldn't want my kids when I was a kid,
and I wouldn't want me to meet them. You know,
I was very different and a very weird person. I'm
very grateful I know me now.
Speaker 1 (30:00):
But I don't want them to go. I don't want
you know, that whole idea of oh, you're parenting and
you'll make you you know, don't make the same mistakes
I made. Oh my gosh, go and make some mistakes.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
Yeah, that's also okase, but it's also and you know,
you can't learn the lessons that I learned from those
respects mistakes if you don't make them in some form.
So how can I protect you from the real terrible
version of that, but keep you safe as you explore
this and understand for yourself why that thing is not
a good idea. That's also sometimes part of it. Yeah,
(30:36):
when you you got to Sydney, there was a moment
where you took over a huge television franchise with funniest
home videos, which was a beast of a television show.
It is before YouTube the only place to watch cute
cat videos or people falling off roofs on surfboards. There's
(30:58):
a reason those views those video get a squolion views
now is because it's funny.
Speaker 1 (31:03):
It's funny.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
It's funny. Yeah, and tell me what that was like
to get the call up for such a massive, massive show,
but also the pressure of I knew it like it.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
Was our favorite show at home when we were kids,
like my brothers and sisters. We loved it. Graham Kennedy,
you know whacked the old video and the JBCVCR. You
know it was catch grow not forever. The show had
obviously evolved and changed a lot since since Graham hosted,
and then there had been sort of a rollout of
(31:37):
pretty young girls hosting the show. So I think it
was very different. But as you say, the clips were
what made the show. And I've always said any show
that I've worked on, it's never been about me. It's
been about the content. So Disney was about the cartoons,
Great Outdoors was about the travel, funniest home videos was
definitely about the videos and the blocks about the contestants.
Never been about me, which is great. That's kind of
(31:58):
my disclaimer. Yes, I was a juggernaut. It was a
staple in Australian television history and I'm thrilled to have
been a part of it. And I loved every single
second of it, even though some of the scripts I
did not understand and some of the jokes went over
my head. But oh my god, I think it was
the perfect show for me as a human. I thrived.
(32:23):
I loved it. But to be at the helm of
the show when it didn't return, that's a bit sad,
isn't it. YouTube did kill the video star and.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
Oh yeah, tell me about what that's like when because
I've been on shows that are canceled and everyone's going
to be facing a gig that not every business works.
You know, not everything is a success. You can't have
one hundred percent strike rate. You know, even the best
batsman gets out. Even Queensland lose the state of origin
(32:54):
from time to time. It's going to happen. So what
did you learn about your relationship to success and your
relationship to the opposite of success when that show didn't
come back.
Speaker 1 (33:08):
I can't remember the exact moment it wasn't coming back.
I was already filming Domestic Blitz as well, which was
sort of the prelude to the Block. So Scott cam
was the host and we used to go into people's
houses and renovate them over three or four days. Then
they'd come back.
Speaker 2 (33:26):
Did they know you were coming? Or did you just
go hey? And just like Balk thrives through the door.
Speaker 1 (33:31):
A lot of the time they didn't know we were coming,
or somebody in their family or neighborhood knew we were coming.
Some times when you rolled up at the front door
with the megaphone and a bus full of tradees, was
a little awkward. Well, be honest. And then when again,
I'm very house proud, I completely understand that if someone
said move aside, I'm renovating your house, I would die
(33:55):
and not be thrilled about it. So I could see
the look on a lot of the home owner's face.
They don't want to see it. What do we do?
Do we turn around and go back?
Speaker 2 (34:05):
Note that's an associate producers job. I'm going to be
sitting in there. I'll be in the crew car if
you need me.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
The planning had been going on for months and we
had had you know, architects and designers in their homes
obviously with the blessing of their family members for the
person that this was going to be a you know,
an amazing surprise for so again sort of out of
my hands. So yes, I was already busy working on
that when Funniest didn't come back, and I think I
(34:36):
was just devastated that the show itself was gone, not
that I had not a role in it, just that
the show itself didn't exist. Why what do you mean
it's gone? Where are we going to have our fun
on Saturday nights? And again, you know your audience are
like ah, whether they were kids or adults. You know,
kids loved watching it, adults loved watching it before they
went out. And every time there was a dog video
(34:58):
or someone that fell off a chair backwards, you know
they have a few shots. Whatever your pre Saturday night
games were seemed to be related to funniest time videos.
It was an institution in that time slot. So I'm
just sad that my kids don't get to enjoy it.
You know, they watched clips without the stupid voiceover and
they think it's funny, and I say, let's watch some reruns.
Speaker 2 (35:21):
I kept case said, very well out of that.
Speaker 1 (35:26):
Incredible. And then there were some of those little running jokes,
like there was one where to go gadzooks and Gadzuks
was kind of an inside joke for the fact that
we knew this video was a setup, and often it
was the same dude. He must have made hundreds and
hundreds of clips over the time of you know, the
car rolling down the driveway with the door open, with
(35:46):
the wheelbarrow positions, like he went to a lot of
trouble to make these videos. But Gadzuks was his little,
you know, hidden clue word that hey, mate, we know,
we know you made this one. We know you've seen
him another.
Speaker 2 (36:00):
Pre TikTok content creation. I like it absolutely. I guess
I was trying to get to you know, what, what
is it that you when you reflect on now, that
feeling when something doesn't go right and it's out of
your hands, but you are involved in it. What do
you do? How do you, you know, get up and
(36:21):
do the next thing.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
You always wish you'd saved a little bit better, don't you.
But then the other part of me goes, oh, well,
you're resourceful, you'll find something. So I guess I always
just thought, oh, well, that's my time, and I still
say it now when my time comes and you know
there's there's no job waiting for me anymore. Well, thanks
very much, good night Australia. I've had fun and I
(36:46):
guess end of funniest home videos. I'd already moved on
to another show, so I was sort of filming too,
so I was still in the game of television. I
guess that's yeah, I guess that's what you're getting at.
I was still working in an industry that I loved,
so it didn't I didn't feel like I was losing
a part of me.
Speaker 2 (37:03):
But it changed. Did it change the way you thought
about your planning for the future though?
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Have I started saving anymore? Nollie, No, I've I've got
another job now outside of TV, so I guess I
do always have a little succession plan on the go
for the fact that I have been freelance now for
thirty years on a yearly contract for thirty years, so
(37:30):
really every Christmas I'm like, oh, well this might be it.
You know, the first of December's rolling around, this might
be it.
Speaker 2 (37:35):
So yeah, this is the thing, like people have this
idea that you sign on the show like the Block
or whatever, and you sign these amazing five years, seven
figured deals that hasn't existed since pre two thousand and
I think maybe four people got them. The idea that
if you get on TV for one season of something,
(37:57):
you're set for life doesn't exist, and it hasn't for
there's maybe two people I can think of in the
country that have those kind of deals. Oh everybody else's
year on you, everybody else's year to year, and you
just cross. Oh it's the worst.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
Yeah, well it it's sort of. I guess it's open ended,
and that idea I didn't. I didn't want a network
contract for the fact that then you have to do
lots of other little things like can you turn up
to this, can it be at this? We've got this
event happening. This is a show you have to do
because you're on a contract, so it's actually quite wonderful
(38:35):
to go, well, this is my job.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
It's great. It's celebrity belly flops and you're going to
be brilliant. We'll put you in a bikini.
Speaker 1 (38:41):
But it was actually I think it was called Hole
in the Wall, and they made us wear silver Licras
suits exactly.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
And that's how you end up with those people. That's
how you end up with network talent on those shows.
Taking a quick break from Shelley Craft, do you have
to play some ads before I do? Though? If this
podcast is something that you're enjoying, please do share it
with someone. Please do like it and follow it, subscribe
to it, and rate it and do all kinds of
other things. If you want to support me, I'd love
(39:09):
you to do this. Buy a copy of my books.
All right? So what now? What is out right?
Speaker 1 (39:14):
Now?
Speaker 2 (39:14):
You can get links in the show notes. I might
be our last show for the year of story Club
on the ninth of November at the Factory Theater in
marckful Beck. Melrose who writes for Gruin, Harley Breen, Mark Humphreys,
Nina Oyama you know her from Deadlock, and one more
special guest yet to be announced. This one is selling
real well, so get on top of that. The tickets
(39:36):
are in the show notes. We'll be back with Shelley
Kraft at a moment, you know, to a full transparency,
I went from Gold Logan nomination to unemployment. I haven't
worked full time in television in two years. I did
four episodes of Dancing with the Stars. That's it. That's
(39:57):
what I've done. And I am fifty one, and I
am very much noticing that because I'm fifty one, there
appetite to have someone who's my age involved in a
project is diminishing. And I understand it's an ageist industry,
and I understand that it's a lookist industry.
Speaker 1 (40:20):
Do you think who's younger than us in television? I
don't know. I'm fifty next year, next June. Is there
people younger than me on TV? I still think I'm
one of the youngest people in television. There's not what
we had, Osha. There's not a bunch of shows where
you can cut your teeth in television. Maybe I'm just
completely oblivious, Osha. But when I turn up to a
(40:44):
Channel nine event, there's lots of beautiful well I call
them mature women. Maybe they don't consider themselves mature that
have all got kids, families. I think a lot has
changed in the time that I stay on air. I know,
you know, there was Nicky Buckley, Sail of the Century.
(41:05):
She was the first pregnant woman on television as far
as I can remember, And ever since then, everyone has
had babies on air on television, they just don't shoot
you side on. I remember hosting Funniest. I had two
babies while I was on Funniest. The one was hanging
from the jolly jumper in the studio door, and I
was pregnant with the other one, and I'd just say
(41:26):
to the camera and I'm not that. Just come around
a little bit more to the front. I'll just stay
front on till. I think there's a lot of beautiful
older women on television.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
You've never felt the pressure of being in a visual
industry and getting older?
Speaker 1 (41:46):
No, No, I have not. Maybe I just have this
insane ego.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
No, not at all, insane ego. You would not be
on TV because the time of dealing with this egos.
That's the other thing people think is like you can
be a dickhead and get away. No, No, that there's
one person I can think of in broadcasting that is
hard to deal with, that still has a job, and
I'm not going to say their name, but everybody else.
(42:13):
Is not enough time or money for dickheads.
Speaker 1 (42:17):
No, there is not. And as you say, it's not
what it was even before in the eighties. You know,
we've got this kind of idea of television and celebrities
and stars. I don't think it's it's certainly not that
way in my life anyway. I couldn't be more normal,
I don't think. And as you say, we're there to
(42:38):
help tell a story, it's not a story about me. Yeah,
not my story. And you will never see me on
a reality show. I will I will never be dancing,
I will never be in a jungle. I will never
be swimming with sharks. It's not what I'm here for.
It's not about me.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
It was fascinating to be on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
I couldn't do it. I find this hard enough talking
to you. I'm finding this hard enough. Yeah, I couldn't
do it. I couldn't be myself.
Speaker 2 (43:06):
No, I'm interested you as you're approaching fifty, it's quite
the milestone. How do you feel about getting older.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
I'm excited about getting older. It's actually again, I think
I've got a young outlook on life, I think, and
maybe a young attitude. So I'm youthful in my expression
and my interest getting older. And certainly I've noticed at
(43:37):
first when I had kids, and it suddenly gave me
permission to be an adult. And I think I've always
leaned on the Disney thing as being one of the
Disney kids. That's kept me very young, because by the
time I left that show, I was twenty five or
six acting like a sixteen year old. So I'm literally
ten years younger than I really am. I think in
my mind that's me young, and it's also probably given
(44:02):
me an excuse in my own mind to stay young
and be youthful. So when I had kids, I went, wow,
I'm a grown up now, and people might treat me
like a grown up. And I know that turning thirty
was certainly for a lot of women, it's like I'm
now an adult. I certainly didn't get treated any differently
at thirty than I did at twenty seven, and I
certainly didn't get treated any differently at forty than I
(44:23):
did at thirty. So coming on fifty, I'm hoping that
I finally have some adultness.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
What does that look like? What's the adult this? I
mean because I know people in their eighties who are
still Grommets right, and I would love to be. And
that's I think from my experience, that is what I
find is if you can maintain a childish curiosity about
the world you live in, life appears very differently for
(44:51):
you than if you're like another opening so many for
another Olympics.
Speaker 1 (44:56):
You know, and someone for someone who has experienced a
heck of a lot. Because I did travel the world
for seven years on somebody else's budget. I saw a
lot of incredible things and some scary ones too. Yeah,
that that should make me a little bit ah hum
when you do. I've done that, done that, done that,
(45:16):
being there seeing that. And that's why I love traveling
with my kids, because I do get to see the
world through fresh eyes, and you do get to experience
them doing something for the first time. And I love that.
I love that about being a mum that I get
to see my kids do things for the first time,
and I try to give them as many experiences as possible.
I think I've got this lovely kind of I don't
(45:38):
know what's happening now, but this I'm old enough to
not care. Yeah, but I'm also young enough to still
be curious, so I don't care what other people think. Really,
every so often I go ooh, okay, that hit a
little bit hard, but I'm nothing I can do about
(46:01):
it now? Right again? Back to that, Oh, well, like
nothing I can do about it. So there is that
not giving any fs as you get older, which is
a thing. It's an absolute thing, and for some people
that might kick in at twenty, but for me it's
probably kicking in it now forty nine. I'll care about
what I can, I'll control what I can. But other
(46:21):
than that, you're all on your own.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Really, you mentioned that when your kids come along it
was a transformation upon you. What are the what are
the best for people that are thinking about kids who
haven't had kids yet. Let's be fair here. What are
the most incredible things and the most difficult things that
you've found about parenting.
Speaker 1 (46:44):
The most incredible things are that I just fascinated by
the fact that the baby's eyes that I looked in
the day they were born are exactly the same eyes
that I look in my girls now and I can
see that baby. I see the twinkle, and I see
the cheekiness, and they look completely different obviously to everybody else,
(47:07):
but to me, I can see that bright eyed, fresh
faced new world I've just been born look in their
eyes and that that's incredible because it's they're fifteen and
thirteen now, but they're exactly the same as who they were.
And I know I can feel them in my tummy,
(47:29):
which is crazy, the way that Miller, my eldest, moves now.
I can still feel that there is some connection to
my gut with my children.
Speaker 2 (47:45):
That's just us down quite crazy standing. And what about
the challenge that you didn't.
Speaker 1 (47:51):
Expect seeing them get hurt or that realization of that's
that's the real world. Whether it's that moment in a
friendship or a relationship or something you just go oh
and again you feel that with them for the first time,
(48:13):
and you wish you could protect them from that, but
you can't. I guess when they get disappointed about humanity,
I think that's that hurts the most. And I've hurt them.
I've said things that I just go, wow, where did
that come from? That was not nice?
Speaker 2 (48:33):
You're human, I'm human.
Speaker 1 (48:34):
And they look at you, they look at you disappointed,
they look at it. Did my mum just say that
to me to my face? It's so, that's horrible. I've
had a couple of those in my life. I've just gone, yeah,
that was shit, that was shitty thing to say.
Speaker 2 (48:53):
But then you have to look at it like the
opportunity to go. Now I get to teach you about contrition,
and you get to teach about responsibility of owning the
consequences of your choices. And you can say, mate, this morning,
when I said that to you, it wasn't okay that
I did that. Okay, you know sometimes I get upset
to sometimes I lose my temper and I'm really sorry.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
Yeah, and we're still growing, Like I'm still I'm still
trying to be a better person.
Speaker 2 (49:19):
I'm so grateful I've got a chance to speak with
you and thank you for being my first person I
played the Brisbane game with on this show. Oh it's
a beautiful thing. Thank you for being you, and thank
you for making time to come on our show today.
You are one of these people that we feel we
know because you do your job so well, and in
this conversation, I think you've really helped us understand why
(49:41):
it is that you have remained the nast screens for
so long.
Speaker 1 (49:43):
This was literally just a pleasure for me to talk
to you. I hate I hate being interviewed. Oh my god,
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (49:51):
Okay, it's like, do you hope because I just.
Speaker 1 (49:56):
Because I don't think I ever actually answered the question.
And I'm not trying to be some kind of weird
politician that goes around and around in circles. But I
do get a little bit side tracked, and I love
a chat. And when I keep thinking back to the
better than yesterday, better than yesterday? How can I how
can I prove that I do live to be better
than I was yesterday?
Speaker 2 (50:15):
I can see it in your eyes, Shelly. I can
see that you have a positivity and optimism there, and
that is a thing that has also got to be
I think we've got to have it.
Speaker 1 (50:25):
You wake up every morning and go today today's day.
Speaker 2 (50:28):
Well, I'm going to give it a shot today.
Speaker 1 (50:30):
It was my dad, I'll be honest. It was my
dad when he used to pick us up every day
from school and say, who had an adventure today? And
you always felt like you had to come up with
something you couldn't just go nah, not me, Nah, I
just want to go home. So who had an adventure
at the dinner table? It's like, oh God, we're going
around in a circle. We have to comele something good.
So I think I just have always had to look
(50:51):
for the adventure and the excitement and something crazy and
cool in every day.
Speaker 2 (50:57):
That. Ha's a brilliant technique. I do that with Wolf
earth Wolf every night. I ask him what went well today?
We ask each other. What you're doing is you're priming
your brain to look for possibility and look for adventure.
You start noticing when things are adventures exciting. You start
to pursue things that are adventurous and exciting, and your
life becomes adventurers and exciting. Is technique.
Speaker 1 (51:19):
I love that? And does everyone have that? This is?
Does everyone have that in them?
Speaker 2 (51:25):
We have it, but we need to cultivate it.
Speaker 1 (51:27):
You have to train yourself.
Speaker 2 (51:28):
We need to train ourselves adventure.
Speaker 1 (51:30):
And excitement because I'm sure a lot of people don't
want adventure and they do not want excitement or gratitude.
Speaker 2 (51:36):
Gratitude is simply training yourself to look for when things
are pretty incredible.
Speaker 1 (51:43):
I am very grateful. I am very grateful, and as
you say, even if you go back to the funniest
home videos, saying and on what other shows have I've
been on that didn't survive, There's been a few. I
think I was grateful that was a great experience. I
was grateful for that time. I was grateful to have
met these humans. I mean, I'm working with Camerman now
that I worked with five odd years ago. I'm grateful
for those friendships and those people. It's never about the
(52:06):
show or the medium, or you know, the minimal part
of your day is we're actually rolling. The rest is
just hanging out with good people and enjoying the experience.
Speaker 2 (52:15):
But that stuff does affect. That stuff affects how the
product is made, all right. If you've got a crew
that is hating each other, that will come across on camera. Yes,
you know, when you're a kid and you go to
your friend's house and their parents have been fighting. You sit,
they're like, I don't know what, and you can't quite
relax because there's a weirdness in the air, all right,
(52:37):
that the crew is at each other's throats. Whatever you
film will be affected by that, and so that off
camera stuff is as important and yes, it's like any team. Really,
the product is that you're making is a product of
the people that are making it. And you need to
look after the culture of a place and what you're describing.
(52:59):
You're just making all stuff with cool people. That's what
you want to do, really cool stuff with cool people.
Speaker 1 (53:03):
And we're all, as you say, safe, and we all
want the best.
Speaker 2 (53:07):
We don't have to work, and Telly, we can try
to cultivate that wherever you work.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
Absolutely. Can you imagine oh, doing a job that you
didn't enjoy. And I guess that's always been my thing too.
When I've had enough, I don't like it anymore, I'll
say thank you goodbye. I worked at Macers Kennel, Mackers,
Interpilli Macers.
Speaker 2 (53:29):
I worked there as well. There you go. I worked that.
I had that yeah four months.
Speaker 1 (53:33):
Yeah, and I am now. The girls hate it when
I go to McDonald's or something because I refold the
bag in front of the poor girl, or I ask,
you know, have a nice I say have a nice
day that I said to me at the end, whatever
it is. They don't like taking me to McDonald's and
I want to eat Burger King hungry Jacks because I
am you know that was might bring you back.
Speaker 2 (53:54):
Yeah, but you were always on window. You're always on
window because you're smiling into life.
Speaker 1 (53:58):
I did my presenting skills, did come can more?
Speaker 2 (54:01):
Drive through the back, just slinging, slinging dishes, doing late
night clean up and I hate it. It was the worst.
Speaker 1 (54:07):
But it was always quality, service, cleanliness and value QSCV.
That was the Machas rule.
Speaker 2 (54:13):
If you've got time to lean, Shelley, if you've got
time to.
Speaker 1 (54:16):
Lean, time to clean, and you learn how to mop
in a figure of eight like it was an amazing job.
But that QSCV was something that I and now people
get sick of me saying it. So I bring this
hopefully every day. I bring quality. I give service. I'm clean,
and you're getting value for money, quality service, cleanliness and value.
(54:37):
If that wasn't in your workplace, or you couldn't deliver
that in your workplace, please find something else to do
with your life, because you are worth more than being
miserable every day. Be happy, Choose happy.
Speaker 2 (54:51):
You're the best, Shelley. Have a lovely, lovely, lovely day.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
And that's the wrap up. It's been lovely, cheddy to.
Speaker 2 (54:58):
Be a better out. It couldn't be a better out
than that. And my friends. That was shlley Craft. Shaley Craft.
She's on the official Block podcast as well as her podcast,
The Aging Project, which you can find where you found
this podcast. Thank you so much for listening. Thank you
to Adam for producing it, Adam Buncher. Like I said earlier,
(55:20):
if you want to help us out, buy a copy
of the book So what Now? What by it for you?
Buy it for a friend and come and see story Club.
It's probably our last show for the November the ninth
at the Factory Theater in Marrickville. Tickets are in the
show notes. Mark Humphrey, Is, Harley Brown, Nina Beck, Melrose
and more to be announced. Thank you so much for listening.
If you like the show, please share it with somebody
and leave a rating, leave a review, subscribe it, follow it,
(55:42):
do all that kind of stuff. I'll see you Monday.
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