November 14, 2025 • 52 mins
MAGA may have ended this week as Trump betrays America First by flooding H1B visas, burying Epstein files, and importing 600K Chinese students. Clint Russell exposes how pro-Israel donors control the White House while J6 justice vanishes and AI wipes out jobs. In a friendly debate with Bob Murphy, Clint defends platforming Nick Fuentes to unite non-interventionists against empire. Trump’s own words—“No, you don’t have talented people here”—prove the bait-and-switch is complete. Check out my show over on Fountain: https://www.fountain.fm/show/nUTYcMtl4yMuoKHljZWu Become a supporting member of Liberty Lockdown here!: https://libertylockdown.locals.com/ This is where I do monthly AMA's for supporting members only Super valuable stuff! Twitter: https://twitter.com/LibertyLockPod Pickup LL shirts over at https://www.toplobsta.com/products/ll-lakers?_pos=5&_sid=e7319ba4a&_ss=r&variant=40668064186434 NEW DESIGNS JUST DROPPED All links: https://www.libertylockdownpodcast.com/ Linktree: https://linktr.ee/libertylockdown As always, if you leave a five star review on Apple Podcasts with your social media handle I'll read it on next weeks show (audio version only)! Love you long time Liberty Lockdown presents a variety of opinions, sometimes opposing and controversial. They are not representative of the host of the podcast. Guests are encouraged to express their opinions in a safe and equitable environment.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Republicans have to talk about it a lot.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
And does that mean the H one B visa thing
will not be a big priority for your administration, Because
if you want to raise wages for American workers, you
can't flood the country with tens of thousands or hundreds.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Of And we also do have to bring in talent when.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We got your talent and fail, you don't.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
We don't have talent. No, you don't know, you don't.
Six words that may have just ended the magatrain. Donald Trump,
a guy who campaigned repeatedly on the opposite, is now
saying Nope, we cannot do it without immigration. Don't take
my word for it. Here's Donald Trump on the campaign
(00:39):
trail many many moons ago, when he still actually believed
in putting America first.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Well, first of all, I think, and I know the
H one be very well, and it's something that I
frankly use and I shouldn't be allowed to use. We
shouldn't have it. Very very bad for workers. And second
of all, I think it's very important to say, well,
I'm a businessman and I have to do what I
have to do, and it's sitting there waiting for you.
But it's very bad it's very bad for business in
(01:03):
terms of it's very bad for our workers, and it's
unfair for our workers, and we should end it.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
So campaign Donald Trump h one b's are a scam
and they're basically being taken advantage of by corporations to
try and undercut the wages of the domestic population. And
then President Donald Trump in twenty twenty five saying, we
don't have talented people here that can do these jobs.
You cannot possibly take an American kid and train him
on how to make batteries the way the South Koreans do.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
You know, No, you don't.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
We don't have talent people now you don't have you
don't have certain talents, and you have to people have
to learn. You can't take people off an unemployment like
an unemployment line and say I'm going to put you
into a factory who we're going to make missiles or
I'm going.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
To put do we ever do it before?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Well, Lemon and I I'll give you an example. In
Georgia they raided because they wanted illegal immigrants. They had
people from from South Korea that made batteries all their lives.
You know, making batteries are very complicated It's not an
easy thing and very dangerous, a lot of explosions, a
lot of problems. They had like five or six hundred
(02:06):
people early stages to make batteries and to teach people
how to do it. Well, they wanted them to get
out of the country. You're going to need that lure.
I mean, I know you and I disagree on this.
You can't just say, take people off an unemployment line
who haven't worked in five years and they're going to
start making their missiles.
Speaker 5 (02:24):
It doesn't work that well.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
All right, Well, aside from the fact that that's just
patently false, and aside from the fact that like the
university system in America, despite all of its flaws, actually
does produce kids that are capable of doing a lot
of things. Even if you just assume for a second
that the university system does not do those things, it
does not prepare anybody to do anything of value, which
(02:48):
oftentimes that is true. Well, then how about you actually
take a holistic approach to this. How about you actually
do something to help these kids. How about you acknowledge
the fact that the printing and borrowing and spending that
you did in your first term ultimately destroyed the dollar
and made it extraordinarily challenging for these kids to get ahead.
How about you acknowledged the fact that the lockdown era
and the forced social distancing and the masking for kids
(03:11):
while they were in high school, in the most important
formative years of their life or younger for that matter,
they were essentially tormented by some of your policies. How
about you acknowledged that. How about you acknowledge the fact
that the DEI environment completely destroyed the education system and
made it so that professors were ultimately just demeaning all
of the men in their class or all of the boys,
(03:32):
i should say, and just breaking their spirits. And now
you expect them to just bounce back after that in
the me too environment and cancel culture and then being
put through lockdowns and then put through the most progressive
garbage education system you can imagine, And then you go,
they can't build batteries. Okay, whose fault is that? Though? Look,
(03:56):
I'm not saying that the state is required to make
us capable of doing anything. Quite the contrary. I'm arguing,
quite specifically the inverse of that, that the state has
hindered the development of these children. And now instead of
acknowledging the damage done by not just Donald Trump but
every politician in our lifetimes. Instead, he goes the opposite direction,
(04:20):
and he says, well, they're useless. They can't actually accomplish
any of these things, So we're going to replace them
with immigrants, vih one b's or otherwise. In what world
is that America first? And what world is that making
America great again? It comes across much more obviously to
be an appealed to your donors, to the special interests
(04:42):
that clearly run your White House and run you. And
I think that's what your base is reflecting on and
realizing and coming to terms with, is that you're a fraud,
that what brought you to power is not what keeps
you in power, That the people that keep you in
power don't want to focus on actually remedying any of
the issues that have plagued young people in this country,
(05:04):
but instead to replace them entirely, which is in effect,
very little difference from what the Joe Biden or Kamala
Harris presidency would have delivered for them. So when you
see your poll numbers taking, just remember it's not us
that abandon you, it's you that abandon us.
Speaker 6 (05:22):
The Trump administration seems to have been hiding these emails.
They're not good, Okay, they are completely indefensible. But I
already told you I was done with MAGA at the
moment he looked us in the face and he said,
what files right, what are we still talking about Jeffrey Epstein.
Pam Bondi said it was a Democrat hoax. No, I
think the entire nation has been hoaxed by Republicans and Democrats,
(05:47):
and there are pervert elites that sit at the top.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And you can point to many different dates throughout the
past couple months that would probably be good indications that
the Trump train was totally off the rails. For me,
the most obvious date are the inflat auction. Point that
really jumps to mine was July eighth, when this happened and.
Speaker 7 (06:04):
Released yesterday, and Jeffrey Epstein left some lingering mysteries of
One of the biggest ones is whether he ever worked
for an American or foreign intelligence agency. The former Leader
secretary who was Miami US attorney Alex Costa, allegedly said
that he did work for an intelligence agency. So could
(06:24):
you resolve whether or not he did, and also could
you see why there was a minute missing from the
jailhouse team on the names.
Speaker 8 (06:30):
Yeah, I.
Speaker 5 (06:34):
Are you still talking about Jeffrey Epstein? This guy's been
talked about for years. You're asking we have Texas, we
have this, we have all of the things right, and
are people still talking about this guy? This creep? That
is unbelievable? Do you want to waste the time? And
do you feel like answering?
Speaker 8 (06:54):
I don't mind answering.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I mean, I can't believe you're asking a question on
at Epstein at a time like this where we're having
some of the greatest success.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Are we still talking about Epstein still? I mean, you
can answer the question if you want, but like, are
we really can't? Haven't we moved on that creep? No,
actually we haven't moved on. And particularly given that your
entire cabinet is filled with people that they promised disclosures
and justice in that arena, we're not going to move on,
including yourself. So I don't even know why that's so
(07:24):
beyond the pale.
Speaker 8 (07:25):
The evidence we have in our files clearly indicates that
it was in fact the suicide.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
We released the video showing definitively the video was not
conclusive at Jeffrey Epstein's story is a big deal. Please
do not let that story go.
Speaker 9 (07:40):
Keep your eye on this.
Speaker 10 (07:41):
Jeffrey Epstein isn't with us anymore, and nobody seems to
want to talk about it.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
But that was kind of the moment where I started
to realize that there's something deeply, deeply wrong here. Now,
I'm not going to pretend as if I was the
first person to realize that. A lot of people, including
Nick flant Is, identified this before Trump was elected president
for a second time, and I stand corrected. They were right.
They got it right. Donald Trump was in fact compromised,
(08:07):
and I think he was compromised by his donors. Elon
Musk also got it right. It looks like to me
when he started to point out that the Epstein files
are being buried because of Donald Trump's relationship to him. Now,
I've never claimed and I don't know for a fact
as to whether or not Trump did anything illegal in
the Epstein network operation thing. But what I do know
(08:28):
is that thanks to drop site News over the past
few weeks, they've been doing incredible work thanks to this
email leak of I think it was a whu Barock's
emails that got put online. No other corporate journalist is
doing this deep diving, of course, because they are all
essentially forbidden from doing so, I guess. But drop site
News has been all over this, and God bless them
(08:49):
for it. What they've proven, beyond a shadow of a
doubt in my mind, is that Jeffrey Epstein was in
fact an Israeli asset. And this is evidenced by the
fact that he had intelligent agents that were staying at
his property in Manhattan repeatedly. These are Israeli intelligence agents.
I also had the former Prime Minister of Israel who
was in constant communication with Jeffrey Epstein and stayed with
(09:11):
him three dozen times over a few year period, which
is more often than I see my own family. I
find that utterly bizarre. So yeah, to believe that he
wasn't at least an asset of israel I think is
totally ridiculous. So then you have to connect some dots,
and this is where it gets uncomfortable for those that
are tenfoil averse. But the obvious dots to connect is
(09:36):
that Donald Trump is funded to the tune of hundreds
of millions of dollars by pro Israel donors. Also those
same donors are responsible for the primary campaign against Thomas Massey.
Why would they be so opposed to Thomas Massey. Well,
Thomas Massey is the one who's responsible today for having
passed the bill that is essentially going to force a
(09:59):
vote as to whether or not to release the Epstein files.
So why is it that these pro Israel donors are
so deeply concerned about the disclosures of the Epstein files.
Could it be that, in fact, Jeffrey Epstein was an
Israeli asset, that he was in fact building compromont files
against the rich and powerful, both in politics and corporate America.
(10:19):
I would argue that the preponderance of evidence says yes,
that's exactly what his role was. Not to say that
he didn't have other roles. He was also a major
financial wheeler and dealer in the gray and black market.
I think he did that on behalf of multiple state
intelligence agencies, including Israel as well as our own, probably
the UK am I six and also arguably the French.
(10:41):
So he's a jack of all trades. So he was
serving a lot of purposes. But why is Donald Trump,
who is being smeared as having participated in this underage
sex trafficking operation. Why would he not want full disclosure if,
particularly if he's innocent. Well, the obvious answer would be
(11:03):
that his donors want those disclosures not to be made,
and as a consequence, Donald Trump is unwilling to do
what's right, to do what he promised to do, which
is to be transparent. So I think that's the obvious
dot connection there is that, in fact, this intelligence operation
is being buried by the sitting president of the United
(11:23):
States because of his donors. It could be argued that
there's additional pressure being levied against him, be that violent,
financial or otherwise. I can't say definitively why. All I
know is that Donald Trump is lying. Donald Trump is
covering up Cash Betel and Dan Bongino are doing the same,
despite promises to the contrary when they were trying to
get in positions of power. Now that they sit in
(11:44):
those positions of power, they say, there's no there there?
Why is there no there there? Dan Cash? And if
there is no there there, why is it not your
job to present me the there? Could you give me
the there? I guess not. So my answer for all
of this at this junction, because I think It's the
most logical conclusion to come to is that the entire
Trump administration is essentially under the thumb of a foreign
(12:08):
government or foreign intelligence agency. And tragically that has resulted
in a tremendous amount of injustice to the American people.
And then you wonder why Tucker Carlson has flipped against Israel.
Speaker 11 (12:20):
You want people to follow you. You want to sell
your ideas to them. You want to convince them of
what you're saying is true. Show some love for them,
demonstrate that you love that you care about them. Why
are we doing this because we think it's better for you?
Shapiro and all of these guys, they don't make an
effort to do that because they.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Don't feel that way at all. Shut up, Cattle, you're
a Nazi.
Speaker 11 (12:44):
Give us the money for our preferred little country, or
else we're going to denounce you.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Man.
Speaker 11 (12:53):
Those attitudes are incompatible with leadership. I really care so
much about this thing, and you better care about it too, Russ.
I'm going to attack you in deep platform you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
It doesn't work.
Speaker 11 (13:08):
It's illegitimate, actually, and if you keep it up, you're
flirting with, you know, real backlash, like a real one,
not Nick fuints like a real one, so cool it.
Listen to other people, don't treat them like cattle, treat
them like human beings.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Or you wonder why Nick Flintes has grown in prominence, Well,
it's because we have eyes and we have ears, and
we pay attention, and we know that something is awry,
something is wrong here.
Speaker 12 (13:36):
What we want is for someone to unashamedly and single
mindedly advocate for Americans and Americans only. We want someone
to say, you know, the only thing I care about
is helping Americans. Only people I care about in the
world are Americans. And we don't want to just hear that,
but we want to see the action taken as well.
You know, I've seen some people on social media say, hey,
it's America first, but not America only.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
I disagree. I think it is America only. Something is
totally counter to what our expectations were and to what
your promises were, and you were failing egregiously. Just yesterday.
He also promised that he would be bringing in Chinese
students to fill our university systems on an annual basis.
That is no small figure.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Folks are not thrilled about this idea of hundreds of
thousands of foreign students in the United States. We have
about three hundred and fifty thousand Chinese. One point during
COVID you were going to you know, we'll push to
get them out, but that was pulled back. You've said
as many as six hundred thousand Chinese students could come
to the United States. Why, sir, is that a pro
(14:36):
maga position when so many American kids want to go
to school and there are places not for them, and
these universities are getting rich off Chinese money.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Sure, never said about China, but we do have a
lot of people coming in from China. We always have
China and other countries. We also have a massive system
of colleges and universities. And if we were to cut
that in half, which perhaps make some people happy, you
would have half the colleges in the United States school
out of business. Well, I think that's a big deal.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
Why would he do that, Well, because he says otherwise
the collegiate system in America would collapse, to which I say, good.
Since when are we in the business of defending academia.
Academia which has destroyed the minds of young people across
this country for decades? Now, why would we possibly be
doing so, why would we possibly be doing anything to
(15:27):
keep them afloat much less? If China is our enemy,
our top enemy according to Trump and many other people
that talk about China as if that's a fact, why
would we be bringing in over half a million of
their kids every year to study at our universities? And moreover,
how is it making America great again to essentially replace
the American domestic population that wants to go to those
(15:50):
universities but no longer can because those seats are being
filled by foreigners. Here's another uncomfortable dot to connect. But
many people are now theorizing that perhaps the six hundred
thousand Chinese students being allowed into our country, perhaps that
was the carrit that was dangled or the trade that
was made in order to get China to allow for
(16:10):
the byte dance or TikTok sale to the Israeli side.
But regardless, does that possibly mean that we are putting
America first? I don't see how you can make that argument.
Certainly not. You're not putting American students first, that's for sure. Okay, Well,
then how about the J six justice, seeing as you
had a couple hundred plain closed police officers that were
(16:32):
in the crowd on J six. How about the fact
that we now have pretty damn good evidence through that
data analysis from the Blaze that it looks as if
the FBI pulled Kyle Saraffin and his surveillance team off
of the J five pipe bomber the guy who or
gal actually who was what it appears to be framing
(16:53):
the Jay sixers as terrorists, assuming that they did not
get catalyzed into rioting and storming the capitol, which they did,
so I guess you didn't have to blow up that bomb.
So aside from the pardons for the Jay sixers, we're
not really getting justice when it comes to the entrapment
scheme that they fell victim to. Shouldn't people be put
in prison for doing that? I would say definitely. How
(17:14):
about there being peace in Ukraine? Nope, not that either.
Another campaign promised that has fallen flat got no obscene disclosures.
You got six one hundred thousand Chinese students maximum h
one b's And I guess we can now take out
a fifty year mortgage to buy a starter home for
three quarters of a million dollars, assuming I don't get
deported for anti Semitism. So yeah, if you rattle off
(17:37):
this entire list and then you come to the conclusion
that we're abandoning Donald Trump, I don't think you remember
at all what he campaigned on. He campaigned in opposition
to everything I just detailed. So when I say that
MAGA is not divided, MAGA is dead, I don't think
I'm overstating it. In fact, one might argue I'm late
(17:58):
to the game, that it fell apart many months ago.
And that's sad, because I thought that the coalition that
Donald Trump put together was one of the most remarkable
things I have ever seen in my life of covering politics.
To have the entire MAGA alliance, which was obviously the
America First camp, the non interventionist but also more nativistic
nationalistic side of the conservative wing. You get the make
(18:21):
America Healthy Again, the RFK juniors, the people that realize
that our food supply is largely toxic and our diets
are atrocious, and pharma is a huge problem and in
fact not a solution in many regards. That was an
incredible part of the alliance. Then you bring in the
Libertarians and a non inventionist and the actual truly America first,
people like myself, and we're like, Okay, this is an
(18:42):
interesting alliance. This is actually building to something. You got
Vivik Ramaswami, who's a young upstart who's got some impressive
rhetoric and seems that he may be on our side
of the fence too, and then you bring in a
whole bunch of other people, Elon Musk and Tulci Gabbard,
and it starts to look like, Wow, this is a
dream team. This is Brett weinst the world were actually
putting together avengers of sorts to try and save the country.
(19:06):
And it felt good and there was hope for a time. Genuinely,
I felt like there was a chance. I wasn't overly optimistic,
but it did seem given the atrocious political establishment that
existed prior, this seemed like a huge improvement and an
opportunity worth taking. Essentially, Donald Trump gets inaugurated and suddenly
(19:26):
the bait and switch becomes more and more obvious. And
it's been ten months now and essentially he's delivered on
nothing aside from securing the border. So I'll give him
credit for that. I was expecting a bit more, just
a tad bit more. And apparently that makes me a
pannikin and that makes me a hater and whatever. I'm
(19:48):
not really interested in the smears. I don't really care.
We don't have time. We don't have time to allow
for our political establishment, the political elites, to lie to
us any longer. We cannot be bait and switched any more.
We cannot allow for the domestic population to continue to
be replaced, which is clearly the plan underneath the Trump administration,
just as it was under former administrations. It's egregious, it's deceptive,
(20:13):
it's disgusting, and if you want to try and take
the wind out of the sales of one Nick Fuentes,
you're going to have to stop. You're going to have
to stop doing these things. And you're not. You're going
full speed ahead. In fact, you're saying repeatedly that you
do not need the support of anybody who wants justice
when it comes to the Epstein files. Well, then when
(20:34):
I don't offer you my support anymore, don't get mad.
You told me not to, I said, Okay. Simultaneously, we
have the FBI lying repeatedly when it comes to the
Charlie Kirk case and getting tons of things wrong, including
in the very first day or two where they said
that they had the guy under in custody and then
immediately backpedaled and said, no, we don't. And now they
(20:56):
say that they do, and they also say that he
worked alone, and they say that if you're digging at all,
that you're ultimately an anarchist in a danger to the country.
While simultaneously, Cash Ptel, the head of the FBI's girlfriend,
is suing my buddy Elijah Shaeffer and others for apparently
claiming that she's some sort of honeypot, which I have
(21:18):
never made that claim and I have no reason to
believe it. I have no idea. I hope that you
and Cash have a great life together. I just really
wish that Cash Bettel would do his fucking job. That
would be great. So under the Biden administration you got
Alex Jones being hit with billion dollar fines, and then
under the Trump administration you got Elijah Shaeffer and Sam
Parker getting hit with five million dollar lawsuits. All right,
(21:40):
I guess things are kind of not changing very much.
But it's not all negative news. There's some really good things.
For instance, Donald Trump sent a letter yesterday to the
President of Israel, mister Herzog to ask or implore him
to pardon bb Net and Yahoo. So at least we
got that on our side. That was a bucket list item,
(22:01):
that was a box to be checked. When Donald Trump
was campaigning, right that he would try and get baby
that now who pardoned? Because that makes America great again.
But probably more than anything, the reason that Donald Trump
was so beloved is that it became more and more
apparent to all of us that the political elite literally
hated us. They thought that we were just garbage. From
(22:24):
Hillary Clinton calling us a basket of deplorables and just
the description of us being flyover country and whatever. It
was just obvious that the liberal elites in particular really
had a deep hatred for the American people. So you
got Donald Trump, now, who's obviously the remedy to that.
And then when asked, don't we have plenty of talented
(22:47):
people to get these jobs done, and Donald Trump responds
very bluntly, no, you don't, No, you don't. Add to
this the fact that the unemployment rate for recent college
graduates is now higher today than it was in two
thousand and eight and nine, at the height of the
great recession. These kids are being replaced not just by immigrants,
(23:08):
which obviously the immigrant flood has declined this year, thank goodness,
but also by artificial intelligence. This is a tsunami headed
our way. This is going to be a catastrophe of
the highest order, and nobody is preparing for it. Nobody
is being honest about it. Nobody is giving these kids
(23:29):
guidance on how they might ride the wave of the tsunami,
if anything, so that they don't drown underneath it. It's
a huge, huge problem, and the only people speaking to
their concerns are Thomas Massey, MTG. Tucker Carlson. These are
the people that actually seem to understand the problems that
the young people are facing, and as long as you
(23:50):
ignore them, you're going to radicalize them further. We do
have plenty of talented people in this country. All of
the damage done to these kids can and must be undone.
We must remedy what ails them. These are our countrymen,
these are our children. These are the people that we
should put as a priority. If America first means anything,
(24:11):
it must mean that, and if you cannot deliver on that,
then you should resign or you should be impeached, and
I might add that in the mid terms coming up
just a year from now, you're going to get shll Act.
You're going to lose the House, and as soon as
that next Congress is admitted, you're going to be impeached
most likely. And when you are, I want to be
(24:33):
very clear, I and millions of other Americans who defended
you during the nonsensical Russian collusion hoax and that entire
impeachment charade will not be coming to your defense. You
have opted to go with your donors over your voters,
and we're going to find out if the donors can
(24:53):
keep you safe when the establishment comes for you once again,
which they inevitably will. The American people that are paying
attention at least are not going to have your back
because you didn't have hours. And that's really as simple
as it gets. So seeing as you've decided to bait
and switch us and condescend to us and ultimately try
and replace us, don't be surprised when you get replaced yourself.
(25:15):
It's going to happen. Your presidential term will come to
an end inevitably, and you're not going to be able
to get anything accomplished because the Democrats are going to
control the House, probably the Senate, and your legacy will
have gone up in smoke. And it's all your fault
because all you had to do was deliver on what
you promised. You didn't have to pull off miracles. You
(25:36):
just had to be courageous. You didn't have to really
do anything hyper dangerous other than do what you said,
and you would have had the American people backing you
to the end of the earth. You already have such
a tremendous fan base, some truly right or die beautiful
people that want nothing more than this country to be
(25:57):
made great again, and that is why they got behind you,
and then you decided to step on them. And that's
sad and more than that, it's infuriating, and it just
demonstrates that you don't have the courage. And I don't
know that it's necessarily your honest feelings. It's a distinct
possibility that you have been compromised, that you're being threatened
(26:18):
financially or physically, I don't know which, or maybe there's
other avenues of attack that I'm not considering. Maybe there's
threats against your family. There's lots of angles that could
justify why you're being such an unbelievable bitch and liar
right now. But it doesn't change the fact that you're
being a bitch and a liar right now, and therefore,
as a truth teller, I have no choice but to
(26:40):
call you out for it. Donald Trump, you are failing.
You are failing as a president in your second term.
I had such high hopes because you were impeached over garbage,
because the media tried to destroy you, because the FBI
tried to destroy you, because the entire political establishment tried
to destroy you. I had to believe that there was
a chance, just a small fraction of a chance, that
(27:01):
you were the real deal, that you were actually interested
in putting Americans first and essentially ending the empire. You're
not that guy. You don't have the courage to do so.
And JD. Vance, your vice president, doesn't have the courage
to say that you're failing, so he's also not the solution.
We're going to have to find somebody else to me.
(27:23):
The obvious options are Thomas Massey and MTG. And I
know that sounds crazy, but that's the presidential ticket that
I'll be pushing for, and I hope that you'll support
me in that, because I think that's our only hope
at this junction, aside from looking after our families trying
to remedy what the state can't, and really looking out
for our communities, our kids, trying to get them in
(27:45):
front of this AI wave. Believe me when I tell
you it's already upon us, and it's going to grow exponentially.
So this is urgent times, and political solutions are looking
increasingly fleeting, unfortunately. So it's up to us now, It's
up to this rag tag group of misfits on the
internet that are simultaneously trying to save the country as
(28:06):
well as solve the Charlie Kirk murder. We got a
lot on our plate, but we also have no choice
but to prevail. So prevail we shall. You cannot break
our spirits. Even when you aly to us, Donnie, We're
still gonna keep forging ahead. We have no other choice.
All right, Let's get into this brief debate I had
with my good friend, the economist Bob Murphy. He was
(28:30):
being very polite and chastising me slightly for aligning my
messaging with one Nick Fuentes. I stand by how I
have been messaging that and making the distinctions between the
two of us known while also echoing the sentiments that
I think he has completely one hundred percent correct, and
I will continue to do so. But because Bob put
together an our compilation essentially explaining his hypothesis as to
(28:54):
why I should not be doing so essentially that it
makes it very hard for people to distinguish between the
identitarian in America First movement versus the non interventionist, libertarian
individualist America First Movement. I am not so much interested in,
you know, making that the focus of how I talk
about these things. I think that we don't have the
numbers for purity spiraling games. We have very little time,
(29:18):
and we need people to actually come together to work
on these things. So I will continue to do so
even when we have areas of disagreement. I'm going if
you if you want to put America first, you're an ally.
That's how I view it. It's very simple. You might
want to push for socialism, we'll debate that after we
end the empire and focus on Americans. Okay, how about that?
(29:39):
So enjoy this very friendly debate that I had with
Bob Murphy. If you want to support to work at
liberty lockpot on X. Subscribe there. I'll follow you back
or at libertylockdown dot locals dot com, or go over
to my pillow dot com and use promo code lockdown
to get yourself some cozy and be swell like Mike
Lindell my pillow dot com promo code lockdown. Please do
with the like button comment, share it around and I
will catch you soon the next one. I am joined
(30:01):
today by the only libertarian with more hair than me.
Just kidding. You took a dig at my baldness, so
I got a fire back at your illustrious locks. We
got Bob Murphy on today. He put out a very
thoughtful video last night that I took the time to watch,
and I thought it was a fair criticism. I obviously
have some disagreements, given that I am the one that's
(30:21):
basically the messaging subject of the topic at hand, but
I wanted to give you a couple of minutes just
to explain your position, and I'll give you my two cents.
Speaker 9 (30:30):
Okay, sure, and I appreciate you having me on here.
Speaker 10 (30:32):
And to clarify folks, I said that Clint is a
tough guy because he has you know, he went completely
bald so that was the point that I wasn't taking
a dig. He can handle this criticism for sure. And also,
I should say is a disclaimer. I only picked your tweets, Clint,
or your messaging just so people would have something specific
in mine, right, So I wasn't just speaking in.
Speaker 9 (30:52):
Generalizing, Bob, what are you talking about? Give us something.
Speaker 10 (30:54):
So so my concern with our sides, and I say
that without irony, like I really do consider like you
and Dave Smith and you know, Glenn Greenwell on this issue,
we're all, you know, on the same side of this stuff.
My concern is the way that we respond to Ben
Shapiro and like Mark Levin, like they're smear tactics that
(31:18):
I'm concerned that we're giving them almost too much credit
or we're giving them an unnecessary way that they can
appeal to the people they're trying to reach. And so specifically,
I think that I was trying to think of the
best way I can get this across to your audience
very succinctly. So think back to when like Darryl Cooper
was on Tucker's show, right, and he had that now
(31:38):
infamous thing where he said, gee, I think the case
that yeah, that Winsters with the Chief Villion and so
of course everyone's running around, oh my gosh, he's a
Holocaust and Iron he loves Hitler and Da da da
and so, and I went out, I did an entire
episode of my show going through and showing no, you're
misunderstand that's not what he was saying. And then back,
you know, before my time. But when Pat you can
(32:00):
and came out with his book on the Unnecessary War
again anti semi you love nazis da da da in
the anti war crowd, No, that's.
Speaker 9 (32:07):
Not what he was saying that.
Speaker 10 (32:09):
So my concern is when Tucker has you know, Nick
Fuentes on and then Ben Shapiro and those guys run
around and.
Speaker 9 (32:15):
Say, oh, he's talking to an anti Semi.
Speaker 10 (32:17):
That kid's a neo Nazi, he's a fascist, but he
doesn't believe in the Holocaust. That if we say the
exact same thing for him and said, what are you
talking about? Come on, guys, the real issue is our
support for Israel.
Speaker 9 (32:29):
That might you know, normal.
Speaker 10 (32:30):
People who look at those clips might say, no, that
sounds like he really is.
Speaker 9 (32:34):
Okay, again, he could be putting on an act. It's trolling.
I get it.
Speaker 10 (32:36):
But I'm just saying tactically, I think it would be
better if instead just so people say okay, we'll Bob
give us something better, instead of saying it that way,
to just say, look, there are lots of people who
clearly were not anti Semitic and not even saying anything
in the same zip code as that, and you guys
use the same smear tactics, and so this is your
go to card. And you know what, if you don't
(32:58):
want you know, anti semi in this space, then maybe
you should stop scaring way respectable people. So it's your
own behavior that causes this vacuum. So only someone like
a Nick fuent Is who has nothing to lose can
come in and talk about these issues. So don't be
surprised you kind of created this. Yeah, so it's sort
of a subtle difference, but I think, you know, an
important one.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
And moreover, if it wasn't for their bad behavior and
smearing and labeling a bunch of non anti Semites anti Semites,
Nick Fuintes probably doesn't exist, you know, like that's his
origin stories. That's what Ben Shapiro did because he was questioning,
you know, our relationship with Israel andies like anybody that
questions the Jewish person as to having dual loyalty as
a you know, classic anti Semite, and Nick Fuentt is
(33:36):
is like what you know, and he's seventeen years old
at the time. You know, I, as I said, I
watched your entire breakdown, and I am sincere when I
say I thought it was very thoughtful. I actually have
a clip that I want to play for you, because
this gives kind of the counter argument to the ideas.
Speaker 9 (33:52):
Not me denying the Holocaust, is it.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
No, that would be hilarious, but no, it's not that. Yeah.
So a couple days ago, or maybe it was a
week ago, I don't know how long, there was this
moment with Dave Portnoy, who is Barstool Sports guy, and
this is what happened. Hey, everybody, all right, So there's
(34:21):
this kid who says f the j's and throws coins
at Dave Portnoy. Obviously an egregious thing to do, not
particularly violent, but still, you know, very very shitty and
not a good sign for our culture. I will agree
with that, But I want you to hear what Nick
Flint has had to say about this.
Speaker 13 (34:41):
Okay, this kind of thing is really a problem. And
before anybody says I got the call or you know,
somebody put me up to this, we do have to
be very careful here, because this is nothing other than
what you could accurately describe as j verbal abuse. Going
(35:03):
up to somebody and saying fuck that person in public
and saying fuck you, That actually doesn't change anything. It's rude,
it is disorderly. This is not how we're supposed to behave.
I don't think that we can hold a society together
if this is what it's going to turn into. And
(35:25):
I don't think that's any type of civilized way to
live that people should be getting a screened at or
heckled or punched or beat up. I do actually believe
in civility, and I think that's what America is about.
I think that's Christian and so I would caution everybody because,
don't get me wrong, I don't like Dave Portnoy. I
(35:46):
think he's a poser. I think he's an asshole. I
think he's a trader. But if I saw him in
the street, I wouldn't run up on him and yell
fuck you. Honestly, I wouldn't confront him at all. And
if I did I would be polite. I don't think
that's the right thing to do. I don't think that's
the right way to conduct ourselves, and I can't approve
of it.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
I know you're big into non violence, as am I,
and I think that the obvious claim that he's making
there is one that is relatively Christian ethos, that you
don't want to be aggressing on your fellow man, and
you don't want to be verbally assaulting or physically assaulting them.
And I just wanted to contend with the argument that
many people have made because of the clip that you
(36:26):
did play on your show, which is when he was
I think he was eighteen years old at the time
where he's doing the whole oven cookie thing. He's just
not that guy, you know, Like there is additional nuance
to him. That doesn't mean that he's not a white nationalist.
I think it's fair to describe him that way, but
I do think that in terms of calling him a
Nazi someone who's actually interested in vicious political violence and
(36:50):
Paul Groms or whatever, I just don't think that's accurate.
And I think that the nuance on this actually does
matter because he not Because I'm trying to get people
to support him, but because he has a tremendous amount
of support, like that's just the truth. He's got millions
of people, young men in particular, that really you know,
look up to him at this point, and that ideology
is not going away. So my contention is that having
(37:13):
discussions with those same audience members or with Nick himself
is to our benefit. And I think that the energy
that his movement brings, you know, this kind of infusing
a fight back into young men in this country is
a good thing. It's a healthy thing, and it's something
that we need, and it's something that libertarians actually lack
(37:34):
to a large extent. So I see it as in
many ways a positive sign, and I know a lot
of libertarians, you know, view it as purely a negative.
So I don't know. I guess I just have a
very nuanced take on this entire Kroyper movement, and I'm
just curious what your thoughts are After I ranted.
Speaker 9 (37:54):
Sure, okay, well thanks for that.
Speaker 10 (37:56):
I guess I would ask your viewers because I've encountered
some fans of Nick, and they come with as much
understanding and grace as you're giving Nick and his statements
over the years. Please also don't assume I'm saying something
I'm not. And so to be clear, I had no
problem with Dave or Glenn Greenwald or Tucker having Nick
on their show. And I don't even have a problem
that they didn't say, hey, you're a naughty boy, like
(38:17):
I sais. That would be pointless. What would be the
point of doing that. So now that again I had
a very mild I guess I put it this way.
It's not a coincidence that the New York Times picked
the most badass photo of Nick Fuente as they could find, like.
Speaker 9 (38:30):
James Dean, and saying the new leader of the right, like.
Speaker 10 (38:34):
The left, totally wants it to be a conventional wisdom.
Now that Nick went has just took over, he's the idea.
I'm saying it's worth thinking through. Now that doesn't mean
just because they say something, therefore we shouldn't say it.
But I'm saying, think through why they want to say that,
and that's in their interest in terms of the next
election or to frame it. So that's why I just
think we should be a little bit cautious and not
just give it to him on a silver platter and say, oh, yeah,
(38:55):
we're basically Nick fun days.
Speaker 14 (38:56):
Now.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
Well, see, this is the other point of contention between
you and I is that you know, you took the
screenshot of James Lindsay posting my video that opens with
a segment from Nick Fuentes, and because it was a
screenshot that you showed, it shows you know I James
Lindsay says, I tried to warn you about these people,
and he's talking about me, and he's talking about the
anti war right. But if you're actually on Twitter and
(39:18):
you see that post, the video is playing underneath it
and what's being said, as you said, there's really nothing
to disagree with. It's like a pure America First message.
So my point is this, regardless of what we do,
James Lindsay has been calling us the woke right and
basically accusing us of this for years, despite the fact
that it was never true and I was not in
(39:39):
any way defending Nick Fuentes years ago. So my point is, like,
this is what they do. Ron Paul the sweetest man
on the planet. He wants to grab the neck of
a jew according to Ben Shapiro, and then you got
you know, Pap Buchanan and so many others that have
been smeared with this when it's just obviously not true.
So I'll just straight with you, I'm not interested in
(40:01):
playing their game. I'm not interested in trying to walk
on eggshells to make sure that they don't misattribute my
beliefs to Nick fluentt Is in his audience, I'm like,
I'm going to just speak my mind, say what I
actually believe, and kind of ride this wave and see
where it ends up. But I'm not going to change
(40:21):
my behavior to try and prevent bad actors from acting badly,
because they're going to do that regardless. They have already decided.
I mean, the Misis Caucus and myself were already written
up by the SPLC years ago, and it's like we're
just genuine libertarians, like non interventionist, anti war people, and
we're always labeled as being you know, hateful bigots and races.
Speaker 15 (40:43):
I actually give credit to the great Bob Murphy who
talked about this on his podcast this week. What's happened
here is especially on the right, but everywhere all across
the political spectrum. Anyone who has the slightest problem with
Zionism or with Zionist power and influence in the United
States is a media condemned as a Nazi and an
anti semi. And I am saying this upfront quite honestly.
(41:07):
I have never watched Nick's show, Nick Fointest's show from
beginning to end. I've seen a few clips. I think
it's pretty clear that he's essentially the result of what
you could have bet on anyway, that if you keep
saying that everyone who disagrees with Zionism is a Nazi
who hates Jews, you're gonna have a young man say, fine,
that doesn't hurt me, and then go ahead and own
(41:27):
that and then beat it to beat that horse to death,
which is what he's done, right, is stake that out.
And I saw him saying the other day a clip
of him, I think in context of him saying, you.
Speaker 9 (41:39):
Say, hitler, hitler, hitler, hitler, hitler, every.
Speaker 15 (41:41):
Time anyone says anything about any of these issues, and
then he says, but that word no longer has any
power here. That was a long time ago. It has
nothing to do with what's going on with us, and
not like that. So what's happened is Zionism, which has
a total kind of stranglehold and lock on the center
of American politics has marginalized anti Zionism to the fringes
(42:07):
where now legitimate anti Semites can claim to own it.
Speaker 8 (42:10):
I just think it's really funny. You're trying to have
it both ways. Like on the one hand, you're saying
anti Zionism is the most the most censored view in
America and then acknowledge that entire Democratic Party is anti Zionist.
You're saying that the person who criticizes Israel is labeled
an anti Zionists. And then you come out here and
(42:30):
defend an actual anti Semite, Nick Flints. And this is
the problem, Pierce, is that this is exactly how it goes.
Speaker 14 (42:37):
They want to what did you're out here saying that
because you're out here saying that because you know that
every person who is.
Speaker 8 (42:53):
Of Zionism, but you see, you're a strong man.
Speaker 9 (42:56):
That's what he is.
Speaker 8 (42:57):
He said that any person who is at all critical
of Zionism becomes labeled an anti Semite, and therefore Nick
Flentis has a seat at the table who is an
act I.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
Didn't say that you have to keep making things.
Speaker 9 (43:10):
I didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
I say people, and I just it doesn't work on me. Anymore.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 9 (43:17):
It does? Can I say one more thing on that?
Speaker 3 (43:19):
Of course?
Speaker 9 (43:19):
Yeah, So I totally get everything you're saying. I just
want to be clear.
Speaker 10 (43:23):
I'm not saying, hey, guys, you know, I think James
Lindsay had a point there, and you try to convince
that I'm talking about like puting you this way.
Speaker 9 (43:31):
I have people I.
Speaker 10 (43:33):
Follow and they follow me on Twitter who like James
Lindsay and they get mad at Dave or whatever, and
like they're cool on other stuff and they like me,
and so I was initially surprised, like, how come everone
just doesn't think like me and his friends with all
my But I'm saying, so stuff like this, if all
you really know about it is wait, what's going on?
Speaker 9 (43:49):
And so here's the clincher.
Speaker 10 (43:51):
If it's it's not anything coming out of your mouth
and and you know anything that Michael Heiss ever said,
or that I ever said, or certainly run you know
over the years and people calling us Holocaust and ires
and neo Nazi that it's ludicrous. But I'm saying now
on this one though, if Ben Shapiro plays a bunch
of clips and the response from our team is, oh,
come on, give me a break, guys, he's just screwing
(44:13):
around when those clips are way more intense than anything
are coming out of your or my mouth. So that's
my modest point is I think just we're giving that
to them when we don't need to.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
So yeah, that's it. Yeah. Well, you know, as I
said ten minutes ago or whatever, I think it's fair
to describe Nick flint as as a white nationalists and
I'm not that, so I understand there is a distinction
that needs to be made. But I also think it's
unfair to call him a Nazi because I don't think
that that's accurate. So you know, I'm not trying to
make him one of us or pretend I am one
(44:43):
of him. I'm just trying to be honest about what
I see. And I think that Shapiro is obvious despite
the fact that those clips are him honestly talking. Nick
Fuint is from seventeen or eighteen years old through twenty seven,
so basically a decade now, has done three hours live
almost every night for a decade. That's an insane amount
of talking and recording and like way more than I'll
(45:07):
probably ever do in my life. That's so much and
he is the young man who's appealing to young men.
If you take the greatest hits of my stuff, especially
when I was doing the comedy show, you could paint
me in the worst light. Also, the reason I played
that clip from Frontes is that I think there is
a concerted effort to paint him as the worst version
(45:27):
of himself in his words, yeah, but not taking into
consideration the more nuanced, more Christian worldview that I think
he actually does believe in the spouse Oftentimes when he's
being more serious, like in the aftermath of Charlie Kirk's murder,
he has a very touching and very Christian ethos that
he projected, and you know, myself and Dave applauded him
(45:48):
for that because I thought it was really needed at
that time. And then I think this is a good
example too, Like I don't like Dave Portnoy, but I
don't want people throwing coins at him and saying terrible
things like that, like that's not a country I want
to live in, either. So I just think it's oftentimes,
you know, whatever the worst version of him is supposed
to be, it's not that. But he's also not this
(46:11):
like purely great leader figure that many of his audience
believes him to be. He's somewhere in between.
Speaker 10 (46:19):
Yeah, and also too, I will say, I don't know
if you caught it, but on the most recent as
we're recording this episode of Provoked, you know, Scott Horton
and Darryl Cooper going back if we're talking about this stuff,
and I'm largely with on Scott's team there, like he
was kind of saying the same things I'm saying now
with more vulgarity.
Speaker 3 (46:34):
But that's what he does.
Speaker 10 (46:36):
Yes, But Daryl made a good point too that I
totally agree with, to say, look, Nick's out there, He's
got his followers, and if he says, hey, guys, you
got to stand down on it, like they might listen
to him because he's got credibility and there is whereas
if you know, Scott Horton or me, you know, say
that to like, they're not gonna you guys, you know exactly,
and you're just trying to, you know, remain respectable.
Speaker 9 (46:57):
Where's Nick calls it like it is? So I totally
get that.
Speaker 10 (47:00):
So again it's you know, if people want to talk
to him, I think that's great to have dialogue just
in general, journalist talking to anybody.
Speaker 3 (47:07):
Yeah, and moreover, you know, he's growing up, Like I
can see it in him from watching the old greatest
hits of him saying the wildest shit and then listening
to him over the past couple of years or seeing clips.
I don't really watch the show in full. I don't
have time for that, but it's just obvious to me
that he's maturing and he's realizing that he has a
real position of power that just kind of came out
(47:27):
of nowhere. He went from being the most hated blacklisted
man in the world to now having one of the
biggest audiences in the country, And it's like that comes
with a lot of pressure, and I think that you
start to think more deeply about what you have to
say and try and iron out more of your ideology.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (47:44):
So I think it's very healthy and very important that
people like Tucker Carlson, like Dave Smith have conversations with
this guy. Like that's obviously a good thing, and it's
just so frustrating that the mentality from the actual wook,
right the James Lindsay's, the Ben Shapiro's, is We're not
just going to cancel you if you have a conversation
with him. We're gonna cancel people who won't condemn you
(48:05):
for platforming Nick fuent Is. You know, it's the most
unhealthy way to go about this. And I know you
don't agree with what they're doing. I'm not trying to
say that. I'm just saying it's so dangerous. It creates
the monster they're trying to slay. Like, I don't know
why they can't see that, it's so obvious even with
all of the suppression, he's become one of the biggest figures.
So what the fuck are you guys doing? Like, what
do you do you think? Oh, no, we just need
(48:27):
to go harder. We just need a double down more.
We just need a black list him more. We just
need to, you know, not just steal his bank accounts,
but put him in prison this time, as if that
won't turn him into a martyr and ultimately uplift his
entire movement into a truly radical, dangerous thing. And it's
just like, I feel like I'm talking to a brick
wall that people just can't see what I'm saying.
Speaker 10 (48:44):
There To answer though, that, like not you know, is
not make it a rhetorical question on your part. That, like,
I think James Lindsay would love it if Nickquinte said
something crazy and it's not a show, so it's not that.
Don't you guys see your creating this and they say,
I mean, if they were being honest, yes, we need
him to exist to justify what we've been saying.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
Yep, no, I agree, But I guess I just that's
kind of my distinction between whether or not you're a
good actor or a bad actor is that if James
is a genuine actor, like he's genuinely concerned about the
rise of the alt right right, my opinion would be, well,
then obviously you're going to want to sit down and
have as many conversations with Nick fuent as you possibly can,
because you you're a college professor type that you know
(49:24):
has studied these things, and you understand the rise of
authoritarian figures and the pitfalls of that, and wouldn't you
want to imbue that knowledge in him to try and
prevent him from leading his audience down that path and
instead his answer to the rise of an authoritarian right
is to respond with the authoritarianism and like basically or
soft power, I guess, but to suppress this conversation with
(49:47):
this kid as much as humanly possible, and to do
all of the things that you lamented when it came
to the woke left, you're now doing to the right.
And it's I just think it's such a dead end.
And I think it's so dangerous, And it's funny because
they think that Flinta is indicative or reflective of all
this danger that I can't see, but they can't see
the danger of what they're doing themselves.
Speaker 10 (50:09):
Yeah again, And I think you're right, Like it's you know,
the analogy I use in my episode was with drug
dealing that oh, if you don't like drive by shootings
and overdoses and stuff, then don't make something illegal, because
then that means it's only criminals and shoddy business practices
that are in that space. So like we was here,
yeah that it's respectable people don't touch this stuff. And
I when he was telling that story to Tucker and
(50:30):
Flint is about how you know, back in the day
when he was talking about Jesus, seems like, you know,
we're gonna be a my whites are going to be
a minority in this because I mean I can remember
ten years ago, like, yeah, you could you said anything
like that like this, some people would have taken a
step back away from you, like, oh, I want to
get cooties, so I can understand. Whereas now that's the
very mainstream thing to say because stuff has changed, So
(50:50):
I understand you know what you're getting at in terms
of like if things had happened differently, we wouldn't know
his name right now, or he would have been sort
of more convention commentator, but this sort of pushed him
in that direction, or he was going to go this way.
The reason people flocked to him is because no one
else was talking about this stuff because everyone else is afraid.
Speaker 3 (51:08):
Right well, and he's very gifted, so it's like it's
a dangerous combination. You took a really naturally talented orator
with right wing tendencies and then you abused him very
aggressively when he was very young, and it's like, well
you want to just kick him out of Painter school next,
you know, like what are you guys trying to do here?
And I just think this is the fight that we're
in though, It's like this is going to be the
(51:30):
real divide on the right is like are we an
identitarian not an interventionist right wing. Are we a non
identitarian more of an America constitutionalist libertarian, non an inventionist,
individualist right wing more of our camp, And it's like,
I still believe that both of those sides are preferable
to endless empire and woke progressivism and socialism and ultimately,
(51:55):
you know, destruction of the Constitution. And it's like, so
I'm just going to continue to be in the fray
on that conversation and try and win that argument that
I think our worldview is preferential to that that Nick
Fuentes prescribes and let the chips fall where they may.
So I've got to run because hop on your buddy show,
(52:16):
Tom Woods. Okay, yeah, but I really appreciate your thoughtful
analysis and pushback and I will absolutely keep it in
mind and maybe we can do this again in the future.
Speaker 9 (52:27):
Okay, thanks so much for having Mekln.
Speaker 3 (52:28):
Yep, thank you, Bob talk so
Republicans have to talk about it a lot.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
And does that mean the H one B visa thing
will not be a big priority for your administration, Because
if you want to raise wages for American workers, you
can't flood the country with tens of thousands or hundreds.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Of And we also do have to bring in talent when.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
We got your talent and fail, you don't.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
We don't have talent. No, you don't know, you don't.
Six words that may have just ended the magatrain. Donald Trump,
a guy who campaigned repeatedly on the opposite, is now
saying Nope, we cannot do it without immigration. Don't take
my word for it. Here's Donald Trump on the campaign
(00:39):
trail many many moons ago, when he still actually believed
in putting America first.
Speaker 4 (00:42):
Well, first of all, I think, and I know the
H one be very well, and it's something that I
frankly use and I shouldn't be allowed to use. We
shouldn't have it. Very very bad for workers. And second
of all, I think it's very important to say, well,
I'm a businessman and I have to do what I
have to do, and it's sitting there waiting for you.
But it's very bad it's very bad for business in
(01:03):
terms of it's very bad for our workers, and it's
unfair for our workers, and we should end it.
Speaker 3 (01:08):
So campaign Donald Trump h one b's are a scam
and they're basically being taken advantage of by corporations to
try and undercut the wages of the domestic population. And
then President Donald Trump in twenty twenty five saying, we
don't have talented people here that can do these jobs.
You cannot possibly take an American kid and train him
on how to make batteries the way the South Koreans do.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
You know, No, you don't.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
We don't have talent people now you don't have you
don't have certain talents, and you have to people have
to learn. You can't take people off an unemployment like
an unemployment line and say I'm going to put you
into a factory who we're going to make missiles or
I'm going.
Speaker 3 (01:44):
To put do we ever do it before?
Speaker 1 (01:46):
Well, Lemon and I I'll give you an example. In
Georgia they raided because they wanted illegal immigrants. They had
people from from South Korea that made batteries all their lives.
You know, making batteries are very complicated It's not an
easy thing and very dangerous, a lot of explosions, a
lot of problems. They had like five or six hundred
(02:06):
people early stages to make batteries and to teach people
how to do it. Well, they wanted them to get
out of the country. You're going to need that lure.
I mean, I know you and I disagree on this.
You can't just say, take people off an unemployment line
who haven't worked in five years and they're going to
start making their missiles.
Speaker 5 (02:24):
It doesn't work that well.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
All right, Well, aside from the fact that that's just
patently false, and aside from the fact that like the
university system in America, despite all of its flaws, actually
does produce kids that are capable of doing a lot
of things. Even if you just assume for a second
that the university system does not do those things, it
does not prepare anybody to do anything of value, which
(02:48):
oftentimes that is true. Well, then how about you actually
take a holistic approach to this. How about you actually
do something to help these kids. How about you acknowledge
the fact that the printing and borrowing and spending that
you did in your first term ultimately destroyed the dollar
and made it extraordinarily challenging for these kids to get ahead.
How about you acknowledged the fact that the lockdown era
and the forced social distancing and the masking for kids
(03:11):
while they were in high school, in the most important
formative years of their life or younger for that matter,
they were essentially tormented by some of your policies. How
about you acknowledged that. How about you acknowledge the fact
that the DEI environment completely destroyed the education system and
made it so that professors were ultimately just demeaning all
of the men in their class or all of the boys,
(03:32):
i should say, and just breaking their spirits. And now
you expect them to just bounce back after that in
the me too environment and cancel culture and then being
put through lockdowns and then put through the most progressive
garbage education system you can imagine, And then you go,
they can't build batteries. Okay, whose fault is that? Though? Look,
(03:56):
I'm not saying that the state is required to make
us capable of doing anything. Quite the contrary. I'm arguing,
quite specifically the inverse of that, that the state has
hindered the development of these children. And now instead of
acknowledging the damage done by not just Donald Trump but
every politician in our lifetimes. Instead, he goes the opposite direction,
(04:20):
and he says, well, they're useless. They can't actually accomplish
any of these things, So we're going to replace them
with immigrants, vih one b's or otherwise. In what world
is that America first? And what world is that making
America great again? It comes across much more obviously to
be an appealed to your donors, to the special interests
(04:42):
that clearly run your White House and run you. And
I think that's what your base is reflecting on and
realizing and coming to terms with, is that you're a fraud,
that what brought you to power is not what keeps
you in power, That the people that keep you in
power don't want to focus on actually remedying any of
the issues that have plagued young people in this country,
(05:04):
but instead to replace them entirely, which is in effect,
very little difference from what the Joe Biden or Kamala
Harris presidency would have delivered for them. So when you
see your poll numbers taking, just remember it's not us
that abandon you, it's you that abandon us.
Speaker 6 (05:22):
The Trump administration seems to have been hiding these emails.
They're not good, Okay, they are completely indefensible. But I
already told you I was done with MAGA at the
moment he looked us in the face and he said,
what files right, what are we still talking about Jeffrey Epstein.
Pam Bondi said it was a Democrat hoax. No, I
think the entire nation has been hoaxed by Republicans and Democrats,
(05:47):
and there are pervert elites that sit at the top.
Speaker 3 (05:49):
And you can point to many different dates throughout the
past couple months that would probably be good indications that
the Trump train was totally off the rails. For me,
the most obvious date are the inflat auction. Point that
really jumps to mine was July eighth, when this happened and.
Speaker 7 (06:04):
Released yesterday, and Jeffrey Epstein left some lingering mysteries of
One of the biggest ones is whether he ever worked
for an American or foreign intelligence agency. The former Leader
secretary who was Miami US attorney Alex Costa, allegedly said
that he did work for an intelligence agency. So could
(06:24):
you resolve whether or not he did, and also could
you see why there was a minute missing from the
jailhouse team on the names.
Speaker 8 (06:30):
Yeah, I.
Speaker 5 (06:34):
Are you still talking about Jeffrey Epstein? This guy's been
talked about for years. You're asking we have Texas, we
have this, we have all of the things right, and
are people still talking about this guy? This creep? That
is unbelievable? Do you want to waste the time? And
do you feel like answering?
Speaker 8 (06:54):
I don't mind answering.
Speaker 5 (06:55):
I mean, I can't believe you're asking a question on
at Epstein at a time like this where we're having
some of the greatest success.
Speaker 3 (07:02):
Are we still talking about Epstein still? I mean, you
can answer the question if you want, but like, are
we really can't? Haven't we moved on that creep? No,
actually we haven't moved on. And particularly given that your
entire cabinet is filled with people that they promised disclosures
and justice in that arena, we're not going to move on,
including yourself. So I don't even know why that's so
(07:24):
beyond the pale.
Speaker 8 (07:25):
The evidence we have in our files clearly indicates that
it was in fact the suicide.
Speaker 3 (07:30):
We released the video showing definitively the video was not
conclusive at Jeffrey Epstein's story is a big deal. Please
do not let that story go.
Speaker 9 (07:40):
Keep your eye on this.
Speaker 10 (07:41):
Jeffrey Epstein isn't with us anymore, and nobody seems to
want to talk about it.
Speaker 3 (07:44):
But that was kind of the moment where I started
to realize that there's something deeply, deeply wrong here. Now,
I'm not going to pretend as if I was the
first person to realize that. A lot of people, including
Nick flant Is, identified this before Trump was elected president
for a second time, and I stand corrected. They were right.
They got it right. Donald Trump was in fact compromised,
(08:07):
and I think he was compromised by his donors. Elon
Musk also got it right. It looks like to me
when he started to point out that the Epstein files
are being buried because of Donald Trump's relationship to him. Now,
I've never claimed and I don't know for a fact
as to whether or not Trump did anything illegal in
the Epstein network operation thing. But what I do know
(08:28):
is that thanks to drop site News over the past
few weeks, they've been doing incredible work thanks to this
email leak of I think it was a whu Barock's
emails that got put online. No other corporate journalist is
doing this deep diving, of course, because they are all
essentially forbidden from doing so, I guess. But drop site
News has been all over this, and God bless them
(08:49):
for it. What they've proven, beyond a shadow of a
doubt in my mind, is that Jeffrey Epstein was in
fact an Israeli asset. And this is evidenced by the
fact that he had intelligent agents that were staying at
his property in Manhattan repeatedly. These are Israeli intelligence agents.
I also had the former Prime Minister of Israel who
was in constant communication with Jeffrey Epstein and stayed with
(09:11):
him three dozen times over a few year period, which
is more often than I see my own family. I
find that utterly bizarre. So yeah, to believe that he
wasn't at least an asset of israel I think is
totally ridiculous. So then you have to connect some dots,
and this is where it gets uncomfortable for those that
are tenfoil averse. But the obvious dots to connect is
(09:36):
that Donald Trump is funded to the tune of hundreds
of millions of dollars by pro Israel donors. Also those
same donors are responsible for the primary campaign against Thomas Massey.
Why would they be so opposed to Thomas Massey. Well,
Thomas Massey is the one who's responsible today for having
passed the bill that is essentially going to force a
(09:59):
vote as to whether or not to release the Epstein files.
So why is it that these pro Israel donors are
so deeply concerned about the disclosures of the Epstein files.
Could it be that, in fact, Jeffrey Epstein was an
Israeli asset, that he was in fact building compromont files
against the rich and powerful, both in politics and corporate America.
(10:19):
I would argue that the preponderance of evidence says yes,
that's exactly what his role was. Not to say that
he didn't have other roles. He was also a major
financial wheeler and dealer in the gray and black market.
I think he did that on behalf of multiple state
intelligence agencies, including Israel as well as our own, probably
the UK am I six and also arguably the French.
(10:41):
So he's a jack of all trades. So he was
serving a lot of purposes. But why is Donald Trump,
who is being smeared as having participated in this underage
sex trafficking operation. Why would he not want full disclosure if,
particularly if he's innocent. Well, the obvious answer would be
(11:03):
that his donors want those disclosures not to be made,
and as a consequence, Donald Trump is unwilling to do
what's right, to do what he promised to do, which
is to be transparent. So I think that's the obvious
dot connection there is that, in fact, this intelligence operation
is being buried by the sitting president of the United
(11:23):
States because of his donors. It could be argued that
there's additional pressure being levied against him, be that violent,
financial or otherwise. I can't say definitively why. All I
know is that Donald Trump is lying. Donald Trump is
covering up Cash Betel and Dan Bongino are doing the same,
despite promises to the contrary when they were trying to
get in positions of power. Now that they sit in
(11:44):
those positions of power, they say, there's no there there?
Why is there no there there? Dan Cash? And if
there is no there there, why is it not your
job to present me the there? Could you give me
the there? I guess not. So my answer for all
of this at this junction, because I think It's the
most logical conclusion to come to is that the entire
Trump administration is essentially under the thumb of a foreign
(12:08):
government or foreign intelligence agency. And tragically that has resulted
in a tremendous amount of injustice to the American people.
And then you wonder why Tucker Carlson has flipped against Israel.
Speaker 11 (12:20):
You want people to follow you. You want to sell
your ideas to them. You want to convince them of
what you're saying is true. Show some love for them,
demonstrate that you love that you care about them. Why
are we doing this because we think it's better for you?
Shapiro and all of these guys, they don't make an
effort to do that because they.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
Don't feel that way at all. Shut up, Cattle, you're
a Nazi.
Speaker 11 (12:44):
Give us the money for our preferred little country, or
else we're going to denounce you.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
Man.
Speaker 11 (12:53):
Those attitudes are incompatible with leadership. I really care so
much about this thing, and you better care about it too, Russ.
I'm going to attack you in deep platform you.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
It doesn't work.
Speaker 11 (13:08):
It's illegitimate, actually, and if you keep it up, you're
flirting with, you know, real backlash, like a real one,
not Nick fuints like a real one, so cool it.
Listen to other people, don't treat them like cattle, treat
them like human beings.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Or you wonder why Nick Flintes has grown in prominence, Well,
it's because we have eyes and we have ears, and
we pay attention, and we know that something is awry,
something is wrong here.
Speaker 12 (13:36):
What we want is for someone to unashamedly and single
mindedly advocate for Americans and Americans only. We want someone
to say, you know, the only thing I care about
is helping Americans. Only people I care about in the
world are Americans. And we don't want to just hear that,
but we want to see the action taken as well.
You know, I've seen some people on social media say, hey,
it's America first, but not America only.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
I disagree. I think it is America only. Something is
totally counter to what our expectations were and to what
your promises were, and you were failing egregiously. Just yesterday.
He also promised that he would be bringing in Chinese
students to fill our university systems on an annual basis.
That is no small figure.
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Folks are not thrilled about this idea of hundreds of
thousands of foreign students in the United States. We have
about three hundred and fifty thousand Chinese. One point during
COVID you were going to you know, we'll push to
get them out, but that was pulled back. You've said
as many as six hundred thousand Chinese students could come
to the United States. Why, sir, is that a pro
(14:36):
maga position when so many American kids want to go
to school and there are places not for them, and
these universities are getting rich off Chinese money.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Sure, never said about China, but we do have a
lot of people coming in from China. We always have
China and other countries. We also have a massive system
of colleges and universities. And if we were to cut
that in half, which perhaps make some people happy, you
would have half the colleges in the United States school
out of business. Well, I think that's a big deal.
Speaker 3 (15:07):
Why would he do that, Well, because he says otherwise
the collegiate system in America would collapse, to which I say, good.
Since when are we in the business of defending academia.
Academia which has destroyed the minds of young people across
this country for decades? Now, why would we possibly be
doing so, why would we possibly be doing anything to
(15:27):
keep them afloat much less? If China is our enemy,
our top enemy according to Trump and many other people
that talk about China as if that's a fact, why
would we be bringing in over half a million of
their kids every year to study at our universities? And moreover,
how is it making America great again to essentially replace
the American domestic population that wants to go to those
(15:50):
universities but no longer can because those seats are being
filled by foreigners. Here's another uncomfortable dot to connect. But
many people are now theorizing that perhaps the six hundred
thousand Chinese students being allowed into our country, perhaps that
was the carrit that was dangled or the trade that
was made in order to get China to allow for
(16:10):
the byte dance or TikTok sale to the Israeli side.
But regardless, does that possibly mean that we are putting
America first? I don't see how you can make that argument.
Certainly not. You're not putting American students first, that's for sure. Okay, Well,
then how about the J six justice, seeing as you
had a couple hundred plain closed police officers that were
(16:32):
in the crowd on J six. How about the fact
that we now have pretty damn good evidence through that
data analysis from the Blaze that it looks as if
the FBI pulled Kyle Saraffin and his surveillance team off
of the J five pipe bomber the guy who or
gal actually who was what it appears to be framing
(16:53):
the Jay sixers as terrorists, assuming that they did not
get catalyzed into rioting and storming the capitol, which they did,
so I guess you didn't have to blow up that bomb.
So aside from the pardons for the Jay sixers, we're
not really getting justice when it comes to the entrapment
scheme that they fell victim to. Shouldn't people be put
in prison for doing that? I would say definitely. How
(17:14):
about there being peace in Ukraine? Nope, not that either.
Another campaign promised that has fallen flat got no obscene disclosures.
You got six one hundred thousand Chinese students maximum h
one b's And I guess we can now take out
a fifty year mortgage to buy a starter home for
three quarters of a million dollars, assuming I don't get
deported for anti Semitism. So yeah, if you rattle off
(17:37):
this entire list and then you come to the conclusion
that we're abandoning Donald Trump, I don't think you remember
at all what he campaigned on. He campaigned in opposition
to everything I just detailed. So when I say that
MAGA is not divided, MAGA is dead, I don't think
I'm overstating it. In fact, one might argue I'm late
(17:58):
to the game, that it fell apart many months ago.
And that's sad, because I thought that the coalition that
Donald Trump put together was one of the most remarkable
things I have ever seen in my life of covering politics.
To have the entire MAGA alliance, which was obviously the
America First camp, the non interventionist but also more nativistic
nationalistic side of the conservative wing. You get the make
(18:21):
America Healthy Again, the RFK juniors, the people that realize
that our food supply is largely toxic and our diets
are atrocious, and pharma is a huge problem and in
fact not a solution in many regards. That was an
incredible part of the alliance. Then you bring in the
Libertarians and a non inventionist and the actual truly America first,
people like myself, and we're like, Okay, this is an
(18:42):
interesting alliance. This is actually building to something. You got
Vivik Ramaswami, who's a young upstart who's got some impressive
rhetoric and seems that he may be on our side
of the fence too, and then you bring in a
whole bunch of other people, Elon Musk and Tulci Gabbard,
and it starts to look like, Wow, this is a
dream team. This is Brett weinst the world were actually
putting together avengers of sorts to try and save the country.
(19:06):
And it felt good and there was hope for a time. Genuinely,
I felt like there was a chance. I wasn't overly optimistic,
but it did seem given the atrocious political establishment that
existed prior, this seemed like a huge improvement and an
opportunity worth taking. Essentially, Donald Trump gets inaugurated and suddenly
(19:26):
the bait and switch becomes more and more obvious. And
it's been ten months now and essentially he's delivered on
nothing aside from securing the border. So I'll give him
credit for that. I was expecting a bit more, just
a tad bit more. And apparently that makes me a
pannikin and that makes me a hater and whatever. I'm
(19:48):
not really interested in the smears. I don't really care.
We don't have time. We don't have time to allow
for our political establishment, the political elites, to lie to
us any longer. We cannot be bait and switched any more.
We cannot allow for the domestic population to continue to
be replaced, which is clearly the plan underneath the Trump administration,
just as it was under former administrations. It's egregious, it's deceptive,
(20:13):
it's disgusting, and if you want to try and take
the wind out of the sales of one Nick Fuentes,
you're going to have to stop. You're going to have
to stop doing these things. And you're not. You're going
full speed ahead. In fact, you're saying repeatedly that you
do not need the support of anybody who wants justice
when it comes to the Epstein files. Well, then when
(20:34):
I don't offer you my support anymore, don't get mad.
You told me not to, I said, Okay. Simultaneously, we
have the FBI lying repeatedly when it comes to the
Charlie Kirk case and getting tons of things wrong, including
in the very first day or two where they said
that they had the guy under in custody and then
immediately backpedaled and said, no, we don't. And now they
(20:56):
say that they do, and they also say that he
worked alone, and they say that if you're digging at all,
that you're ultimately an anarchist in a danger to the country.
While simultaneously, Cash Ptel, the head of the FBI's girlfriend,
is suing my buddy Elijah Shaeffer and others for apparently
claiming that she's some sort of honeypot, which I have
(21:18):
never made that claim and I have no reason to
believe it. I have no idea. I hope that you
and Cash have a great life together. I just really
wish that Cash Bettel would do his fucking job. That
would be great. So under the Biden administration you got
Alex Jones being hit with billion dollar fines, and then
under the Trump administration you got Elijah Shaeffer and Sam
Parker getting hit with five million dollar lawsuits. All right,
(21:40):
I guess things are kind of not changing very much.
But it's not all negative news. There's some really good things.
For instance, Donald Trump sent a letter yesterday to the
President of Israel, mister Herzog to ask or implore him
to pardon bb Net and Yahoo. So at least we
got that on our side. That was a bucket list item,
(22:01):
that was a box to be checked. When Donald Trump
was campaigning, right that he would try and get baby
that now who pardoned? Because that makes America great again.
But probably more than anything, the reason that Donald Trump
was so beloved is that it became more and more
apparent to all of us that the political elite literally
hated us. They thought that we were just garbage. From
(22:24):
Hillary Clinton calling us a basket of deplorables and just
the description of us being flyover country and whatever. It
was just obvious that the liberal elites in particular really
had a deep hatred for the American people. So you
got Donald Trump, now, who's obviously the remedy to that.
And then when asked, don't we have plenty of talented
(22:47):
people to get these jobs done, and Donald Trump responds
very bluntly, no, you don't, No, you don't. Add to
this the fact that the unemployment rate for recent college
graduates is now higher today than it was in two
thousand and eight and nine, at the height of the
great recession. These kids are being replaced not just by immigrants,
(23:08):
which obviously the immigrant flood has declined this year, thank goodness,
but also by artificial intelligence. This is a tsunami headed
our way. This is going to be a catastrophe of
the highest order, and nobody is preparing for it. Nobody
is being honest about it. Nobody is giving these kids
(23:29):
guidance on how they might ride the wave of the tsunami,
if anything, so that they don't drown underneath it. It's
a huge, huge problem, and the only people speaking to
their concerns are Thomas Massey, MTG. Tucker Carlson. These are
the people that actually seem to understand the problems that
the young people are facing, and as long as you
(23:50):
ignore them, you're going to radicalize them further. We do
have plenty of talented people in this country. All of
the damage done to these kids can and must be undone.
We must remedy what ails them. These are our countrymen,
these are our children. These are the people that we
should put as a priority. If America first means anything,
(24:11):
it must mean that, and if you cannot deliver on that,
then you should resign or you should be impeached, and
I might add that in the mid terms coming up
just a year from now, you're going to get shll Act.
You're going to lose the House, and as soon as
that next Congress is admitted, you're going to be impeached
most likely. And when you are, I want to be
(24:33):
very clear, I and millions of other Americans who defended
you during the nonsensical Russian collusion hoax and that entire
impeachment charade will not be coming to your defense. You
have opted to go with your donors over your voters,
and we're going to find out if the donors can
(24:53):
keep you safe when the establishment comes for you once again,
which they inevitably will. The American people that are paying
attention at least are not going to have your back
because you didn't have hours. And that's really as simple
as it gets. So seeing as you've decided to bait
and switch us and condescend to us and ultimately try
and replace us, don't be surprised when you get replaced yourself.
(25:15):
It's going to happen. Your presidential term will come to
an end inevitably, and you're not going to be able
to get anything accomplished because the Democrats are going to
control the House, probably the Senate, and your legacy will
have gone up in smoke. And it's all your fault
because all you had to do was deliver on what
you promised. You didn't have to pull off miracles. You
(25:36):
just had to be courageous. You didn't have to really
do anything hyper dangerous other than do what you said,
and you would have had the American people backing you
to the end of the earth. You already have such
a tremendous fan base, some truly right or die beautiful
people that want nothing more than this country to be
(25:57):
made great again, and that is why they got behind you,
and then you decided to step on them. And that's
sad and more than that, it's infuriating, and it just
demonstrates that you don't have the courage. And I don't
know that it's necessarily your honest feelings. It's a distinct
possibility that you have been compromised, that you're being threatened
(26:18):
financially or physically, I don't know which, or maybe there's
other avenues of attack that I'm not considering. Maybe there's
threats against your family. There's lots of angles that could
justify why you're being such an unbelievable bitch and liar
right now. But it doesn't change the fact that you're
being a bitch and a liar right now, and therefore,
as a truth teller, I have no choice but to
(26:40):
call you out for it. Donald Trump, you are failing.
You are failing as a president in your second term.
I had such high hopes because you were impeached over garbage,
because the media tried to destroy you, because the FBI
tried to destroy you, because the entire political establishment tried
to destroy you. I had to believe that there was
a chance, just a small fraction of a chance, that
(27:01):
you were the real deal, that you were actually interested
in putting Americans first and essentially ending the empire. You're
not that guy. You don't have the courage to do so.
And JD. Vance, your vice president, doesn't have the courage
to say that you're failing, so he's also not the solution.
We're going to have to find somebody else to me.
(27:23):
The obvious options are Thomas Massey and MTG. And I
know that sounds crazy, but that's the presidential ticket that
I'll be pushing for, and I hope that you'll support
me in that, because I think that's our only hope
at this junction, aside from looking after our families trying
to remedy what the state can't, and really looking out
for our communities, our kids, trying to get them in
(27:45):
front of this AI wave. Believe me when I tell
you it's already upon us, and it's going to grow exponentially.
So this is urgent times, and political solutions are looking
increasingly fleeting, unfortunately. So it's up to us now, It's
up to this rag tag group of misfits on the
internet that are simultaneously trying to save the country as
(28:06):
well as solve the Charlie Kirk murder. We got a
lot on our plate, but we also have no choice
but to prevail. So prevail we shall. You cannot break
our spirits. Even when you aly to us, Donnie, We're
still gonna keep forging ahead. We have no other choice.
All right, Let's get into this brief debate I had
with my good friend, the economist Bob Murphy. He was
(28:30):
being very polite and chastising me slightly for aligning my
messaging with one Nick Fuentes. I stand by how I
have been messaging that and making the distinctions between the
two of us known while also echoing the sentiments that
I think he has completely one hundred percent correct, and
I will continue to do so. But because Bob put
together an our compilation essentially explaining his hypothesis as to
(28:54):
why I should not be doing so essentially that it
makes it very hard for people to distinguish between the
identitarian in America First movement versus the non interventionist, libertarian
individualist America First Movement. I am not so much interested in,
you know, making that the focus of how I talk
about these things. I think that we don't have the
numbers for purity spiraling games. We have very little time,
(29:18):
and we need people to actually come together to work
on these things. So I will continue to do so
even when we have areas of disagreement. I'm going if
you if you want to put America first, you're an ally.
That's how I view it. It's very simple. You might
want to push for socialism, we'll debate that after we
end the empire and focus on Americans. Okay, how about that?
(29:39):
So enjoy this very friendly debate that I had with
Bob Murphy. If you want to support to work at
liberty lockpot on X. Subscribe there. I'll follow you back
or at libertylockdown dot locals dot com, or go over
to my pillow dot com and use promo code lockdown
to get yourself some cozy and be swell like Mike
Lindell my pillow dot com promo code lockdown. Please do
with the like button comment, share it around and I
will catch you soon the next one. I am joined
(30:01):
today by the only libertarian with more hair than me.
Just kidding. You took a dig at my baldness, so
I got a fire back at your illustrious locks. We
got Bob Murphy on today. He put out a very
thoughtful video last night that I took the time to watch,
and I thought it was a fair criticism. I obviously
have some disagreements, given that I am the one that's
(30:21):
basically the messaging subject of the topic at hand, but
I wanted to give you a couple of minutes just
to explain your position, and I'll give you my two cents.
Speaker 9 (30:30):
Okay, sure, and I appreciate you having me on here.
Speaker 10 (30:32):
And to clarify folks, I said that Clint is a
tough guy because he has you know, he went completely
bald so that was the point that I wasn't taking
a dig. He can handle this criticism for sure. And also,
I should say is a disclaimer. I only picked your tweets, Clint,
or your messaging just so people would have something specific
in mine, right, So I wasn't just speaking in.
Speaker 9 (30:52):
Generalizing, Bob, what are you talking about? Give us something.
Speaker 10 (30:54):
So so my concern with our sides, and I say
that without irony, like I really do consider like you
and Dave Smith and you know, Glenn Greenwell on this issue,
we're all, you know, on the same side of this stuff.
My concern is the way that we respond to Ben
Shapiro and like Mark Levin, like they're smear tactics that
(31:18):
I'm concerned that we're giving them almost too much credit
or we're giving them an unnecessary way that they can
appeal to the people they're trying to reach. And so specifically,
I think that I was trying to think of the
best way I can get this across to your audience
very succinctly. So think back to when like Darryl Cooper
was on Tucker's show, right, and he had that now
(31:38):
infamous thing where he said, gee, I think the case
that yeah, that Winsters with the Chief Villion and so
of course everyone's running around, oh my gosh, he's a
Holocaust and Iron he loves Hitler and Da da da
and so, and I went out, I did an entire
episode of my show going through and showing no, you're
misunderstand that's not what he was saying. And then back,
you know, before my time. But when Pat you can
(32:00):
and came out with his book on the Unnecessary War
again anti semi you love nazis da da da in
the anti war crowd, No, that's.
Speaker 9 (32:07):
Not what he was saying that.
Speaker 10 (32:09):
So my concern is when Tucker has you know, Nick
Fuentes on and then Ben Shapiro and those guys run
around and.
Speaker 9 (32:15):
Say, oh, he's talking to an anti Semi.
Speaker 10 (32:17):
That kid's a neo Nazi, he's a fascist, but he
doesn't believe in the Holocaust. That if we say the
exact same thing for him and said, what are you
talking about? Come on, guys, the real issue is our
support for Israel.
Speaker 9 (32:29):
That might you know, normal.
Speaker 10 (32:30):
People who look at those clips might say, no, that
sounds like he really is.
Speaker 9 (32:34):
Okay, again, he could be putting on an act. It's trolling.
I get it.
Speaker 10 (32:36):
But I'm just saying tactically, I think it would be
better if instead just so people say okay, we'll Bob
give us something better, instead of saying it that way,
to just say, look, there are lots of people who
clearly were not anti Semitic and not even saying anything
in the same zip code as that, and you guys
use the same smear tactics, and so this is your
go to card. And you know what, if you don't
(32:58):
want you know, anti semi in this space, then maybe
you should stop scaring way respectable people. So it's your
own behavior that causes this vacuum. So only someone like
a Nick fuent Is who has nothing to lose can
come in and talk about these issues. So don't be
surprised you kind of created this. Yeah, so it's sort
of a subtle difference, but I think, you know, an
important one.
Speaker 3 (33:16):
And moreover, if it wasn't for their bad behavior and
smearing and labeling a bunch of non anti Semites anti Semites,
Nick Fuintes probably doesn't exist, you know, like that's his
origin stories. That's what Ben Shapiro did because he was questioning,
you know, our relationship with Israel andies like anybody that
questions the Jewish person as to having dual loyalty as
a you know, classic anti Semite, and Nick Fuentt is
(33:36):
is like what you know, and he's seventeen years old
at the time. You know, I, as I said, I
watched your entire breakdown, and I am sincere when I
say I thought it was very thoughtful. I actually have
a clip that I want to play for you, because
this gives kind of the counter argument to the ideas.
Speaker 9 (33:52):
Not me denying the Holocaust, is it.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
No, that would be hilarious, but no, it's not that. Yeah.
So a couple days ago, or maybe it was a
week ago, I don't know how long, there was this
moment with Dave Portnoy, who is Barstool Sports guy, and
this is what happened. Hey, everybody, all right, So there's
(34:21):
this kid who says f the j's and throws coins
at Dave Portnoy. Obviously an egregious thing to do, not
particularly violent, but still, you know, very very shitty and
not a good sign for our culture. I will agree
with that, But I want you to hear what Nick
Flint has had to say about this.
Speaker 13 (34:41):
Okay, this kind of thing is really a problem. And
before anybody says I got the call or you know,
somebody put me up to this, we do have to
be very careful here, because this is nothing other than
what you could accurately describe as j verbal abuse. Going
(35:03):
up to somebody and saying fuck that person in public
and saying fuck you, That actually doesn't change anything. It's rude,
it is disorderly. This is not how we're supposed to behave.
I don't think that we can hold a society together
if this is what it's going to turn into. And
(35:25):
I don't think that's any type of civilized way to
live that people should be getting a screened at or
heckled or punched or beat up. I do actually believe
in civility, and I think that's what America is about.
I think that's Christian and so I would caution everybody because,
don't get me wrong, I don't like Dave Portnoy. I
(35:46):
think he's a poser. I think he's an asshole. I
think he's a trader. But if I saw him in
the street, I wouldn't run up on him and yell
fuck you. Honestly, I wouldn't confront him at all. And
if I did I would be polite. I don't think
that's the right thing to do. I don't think that's
the right way to conduct ourselves, and I can't approve
of it.
Speaker 3 (36:05):
I know you're big into non violence, as am I,
and I think that the obvious claim that he's making
there is one that is relatively Christian ethos, that you
don't want to be aggressing on your fellow man, and
you don't want to be verbally assaulting or physically assaulting them.
And I just wanted to contend with the argument that
many people have made because of the clip that you
(36:26):
did play on your show, which is when he was
I think he was eighteen years old at the time
where he's doing the whole oven cookie thing. He's just
not that guy, you know, Like there is additional nuance
to him. That doesn't mean that he's not a white nationalist.
I think it's fair to describe him that way, but
I do think that in terms of calling him a
Nazi someone who's actually interested in vicious political violence and
(36:50):
Paul Groms or whatever, I just don't think that's accurate.
And I think that the nuance on this actually does
matter because he not Because I'm trying to get people
to support him, but because he has a tremendous amount
of support, like that's just the truth. He's got millions
of people, young men in particular, that really you know,
look up to him at this point, and that ideology
is not going away. So my contention is that having
(37:13):
discussions with those same audience members or with Nick himself
is to our benefit. And I think that the energy
that his movement brings, you know, this kind of infusing
a fight back into young men in this country is
a good thing. It's a healthy thing, and it's something
that we need, and it's something that libertarians actually lack
(37:34):
to a large extent. So I see it as in
many ways a positive sign, and I know a lot
of libertarians, you know, view it as purely a negative.
So I don't know. I guess I just have a
very nuanced take on this entire Kroyper movement, and I'm
just curious what your thoughts are After I ranted.
Speaker 9 (37:54):
Sure, okay, well thanks for that.
Speaker 10 (37:56):
I guess I would ask your viewers because I've encountered
some fans of Nick, and they come with as much
understanding and grace as you're giving Nick and his statements
over the years. Please also don't assume I'm saying something
I'm not. And so to be clear, I had no
problem with Dave or Glenn Greenwald or Tucker having Nick
on their show. And I don't even have a problem
that they didn't say, hey, you're a naughty boy, like
(38:17):
I sais. That would be pointless. What would be the
point of doing that. So now that again I had
a very mild I guess I put it this way.
It's not a coincidence that the New York Times picked
the most badass photo of Nick Fuente as they could find, like.
Speaker 9 (38:30):
James Dean, and saying the new leader of the right, like.
Speaker 10 (38:34):
The left, totally wants it to be a conventional wisdom.
Now that Nick went has just took over, he's the idea.
I'm saying it's worth thinking through. Now that doesn't mean
just because they say something, therefore we shouldn't say it.
But I'm saying, think through why they want to say that,
and that's in their interest in terms of the next
election or to frame it. So that's why I just
think we should be a little bit cautious and not
just give it to him on a silver platter and say, oh, yeah,
(38:55):
we're basically Nick fun days.
Speaker 14 (38:56):
Now.
Speaker 3 (38:56):
Well, see, this is the other point of contention between
you and I is that you know, you took the
screenshot of James Lindsay posting my video that opens with
a segment from Nick Fuentes, and because it was a
screenshot that you showed, it shows you know I James
Lindsay says, I tried to warn you about these people,
and he's talking about me, and he's talking about the
anti war right. But if you're actually on Twitter and
(39:18):
you see that post, the video is playing underneath it
and what's being said, as you said, there's really nothing
to disagree with. It's like a pure America First message.
So my point is this, regardless of what we do,
James Lindsay has been calling us the woke right and
basically accusing us of this for years, despite the fact
that it was never true and I was not in
(39:39):
any way defending Nick Fuentes years ago. So my point is, like,
this is what they do. Ron Paul the sweetest man
on the planet. He wants to grab the neck of
a jew according to Ben Shapiro, and then you got
you know, Pap Buchanan and so many others that have
been smeared with this when it's just obviously not true.
So I'll just straight with you, I'm not interested in
(40:01):
playing their game. I'm not interested in trying to walk
on eggshells to make sure that they don't misattribute my
beliefs to Nick fluentt Is in his audience, I'm like,
I'm going to just speak my mind, say what I
actually believe, and kind of ride this wave and see
where it ends up. But I'm not going to change
(40:21):
my behavior to try and prevent bad actors from acting badly,
because they're going to do that regardless. They have already decided.
I mean, the Misis Caucus and myself were already written
up by the SPLC years ago, and it's like we're
just genuine libertarians, like non interventionist, anti war people, and
we're always labeled as being you know, hateful bigots and races.
Speaker 15 (40:43):
I actually give credit to the great Bob Murphy who
talked about this on his podcast this week. What's happened
here is especially on the right, but everywhere all across
the political spectrum. Anyone who has the slightest problem with
Zionism or with Zionist power and influence in the United
States is a media condemned as a Nazi and an
anti semi. And I am saying this upfront quite honestly.
(41:07):
I have never watched Nick's show, Nick Fointest's show from
beginning to end. I've seen a few clips. I think
it's pretty clear that he's essentially the result of what
you could have bet on anyway, that if you keep
saying that everyone who disagrees with Zionism is a Nazi
who hates Jews, you're gonna have a young man say, fine,
that doesn't hurt me, and then go ahead and own
(41:27):
that and then beat it to beat that horse to death,
which is what he's done, right, is stake that out.
And I saw him saying the other day a clip
of him, I think in context of him saying, you.
Speaker 9 (41:39):
Say, hitler, hitler, hitler, hitler, hitler, every.
Speaker 15 (41:41):
Time anyone says anything about any of these issues, and
then he says, but that word no longer has any
power here. That was a long time ago. It has
nothing to do with what's going on with us, and
not like that. So what's happened is Zionism, which has
a total kind of stranglehold and lock on the center
of American politics has marginalized anti Zionism to the fringes
(42:07):
where now legitimate anti Semites can claim to own it.
Speaker 8 (42:10):
I just think it's really funny. You're trying to have
it both ways. Like on the one hand, you're saying
anti Zionism is the most the most censored view in
America and then acknowledge that entire Democratic Party is anti Zionist.
You're saying that the person who criticizes Israel is labeled
an anti Zionists. And then you come out here and
(42:30):
defend an actual anti Semite, Nick Flints. And this is
the problem, Pierce, is that this is exactly how it goes.
Speaker 14 (42:37):
They want to what did you're out here saying that
because you're out here saying that because you know that
every person who is.
Speaker 8 (42:53):
Of Zionism, but you see, you're a strong man.
Speaker 9 (42:56):
That's what he is.
Speaker 8 (42:57):
He said that any person who is at all critical
of Zionism becomes labeled an anti Semite, and therefore Nick
Flentis has a seat at the table who is an
act I.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
Didn't say that you have to keep making things.
Speaker 9 (43:10):
I didn't say that.
Speaker 3 (43:12):
I say people, and I just it doesn't work on me. Anymore.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 9 (43:17):
It does? Can I say one more thing on that?
Speaker 3 (43:19):
Of course?
Speaker 9 (43:19):
Yeah, So I totally get everything you're saying. I just
want to be clear.
Speaker 10 (43:23):
I'm not saying, hey, guys, you know, I think James
Lindsay had a point there, and you try to convince
that I'm talking about like puting you this way.
Speaker 9 (43:31):
I have people I.
Speaker 10 (43:33):
Follow and they follow me on Twitter who like James
Lindsay and they get mad at Dave or whatever, and
like they're cool on other stuff and they like me,
and so I was initially surprised, like, how come everone
just doesn't think like me and his friends with all
my But I'm saying, so stuff like this, if all
you really know about it is wait, what's going on?
Speaker 9 (43:49):
And so here's the clincher.
Speaker 10 (43:51):
If it's it's not anything coming out of your mouth
and and you know anything that Michael Heiss ever said,
or that I ever said, or certainly run you know
over the years and people calling us Holocaust and ires
and neo Nazi that it's ludicrous. But I'm saying now
on this one though, if Ben Shapiro plays a bunch
of clips and the response from our team is, oh,
come on, give me a break, guys, he's just screwing
(44:13):
around when those clips are way more intense than anything
are coming out of your or my mouth. So that's
my modest point is I think just we're giving that
to them when we don't need to.
Speaker 3 (44:23):
So yeah, that's it. Yeah. Well, you know, as I
said ten minutes ago or whatever, I think it's fair
to describe Nick flint as as a white nationalists and
I'm not that, so I understand there is a distinction
that needs to be made. But I also think it's
unfair to call him a Nazi because I don't think
that that's accurate. So you know, I'm not trying to
make him one of us or pretend I am one
(44:43):
of him. I'm just trying to be honest about what
I see. And I think that Shapiro is obvious despite
the fact that those clips are him honestly talking. Nick
Fuint is from seventeen or eighteen years old through twenty seven,
so basically a decade now, has done three hours live
almost every night for a decade. That's an insane amount
of talking and recording and like way more than I'll
(45:07):
probably ever do in my life. That's so much and
he is the young man who's appealing to young men.
If you take the greatest hits of my stuff, especially
when I was doing the comedy show, you could paint
me in the worst light. Also, the reason I played
that clip from Frontes is that I think there is
a concerted effort to paint him as the worst version
(45:27):
of himself in his words, yeah, but not taking into
consideration the more nuanced, more Christian worldview that I think
he actually does believe in the spouse Oftentimes when he's
being more serious, like in the aftermath of Charlie Kirk's murder,
he has a very touching and very Christian ethos that
he projected, and you know, myself and Dave applauded him
(45:48):
for that because I thought it was really needed at
that time. And then I think this is a good
example too, Like I don't like Dave Portnoy, but I
don't want people throwing coins at him and saying terrible
things like that, like that's not a country I want
to live in, either. So I just think it's oftentimes,
you know, whatever the worst version of him is supposed
to be, it's not that. But he's also not this
(46:11):
like purely great leader figure that many of his audience
believes him to be. He's somewhere in between.
Speaker 10 (46:19):
Yeah, and also too, I will say, I don't know
if you caught it, but on the most recent as
we're recording this episode of Provoked, you know, Scott Horton
and Darryl Cooper going back if we're talking about this stuff,
and I'm largely with on Scott's team there, like he
was kind of saying the same things I'm saying now
with more vulgarity.
Speaker 3 (46:34):
But that's what he does.
Speaker 10 (46:36):
Yes, But Daryl made a good point too that I
totally agree with, to say, look, Nick's out there, He's
got his followers, and if he says, hey, guys, you
got to stand down on it, like they might listen
to him because he's got credibility and there is whereas
if you know, Scott Horton or me, you know, say
that to like, they're not gonna you guys, you know exactly,
and you're just trying to, you know, remain respectable.
Speaker 9 (46:57):
Where's Nick calls it like it is? So I totally
get that.
Speaker 10 (47:00):
So again it's you know, if people want to talk
to him, I think that's great to have dialogue just
in general, journalist talking to anybody.
Speaker 3 (47:07):
Yeah, and moreover, you know, he's growing up, Like I
can see it in him from watching the old greatest
hits of him saying the wildest shit and then listening
to him over the past couple of years or seeing clips.
I don't really watch the show in full. I don't
have time for that, but it's just obvious to me
that he's maturing and he's realizing that he has a
real position of power that just kind of came out
(47:27):
of nowhere. He went from being the most hated blacklisted
man in the world to now having one of the
biggest audiences in the country, And it's like that comes
with a lot of pressure, and I think that you
start to think more deeply about what you have to
say and try and iron out more of your ideology.
Speaker 1 (47:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (47:44):
So I think it's very healthy and very important that
people like Tucker Carlson, like Dave Smith have conversations with
this guy. Like that's obviously a good thing, and it's
just so frustrating that the mentality from the actual wook,
right the James Lindsay's, the Ben Shapiro's, is We're not
just going to cancel you if you have a conversation
with him. We're gonna cancel people who won't condemn you
(48:05):
for platforming Nick fuent Is. You know, it's the most
unhealthy way to go about this. And I know you
don't agree with what they're doing. I'm not trying to
say that. I'm just saying it's so dangerous. It creates
the monster they're trying to slay. Like, I don't know
why they can't see that, it's so obvious even with
all of the suppression, he's become one of the biggest figures.
So what the fuck are you guys doing? Like, what
do you do you think? Oh, no, we just need
(48:27):
to go harder. We just need a double down more.
We just need a black list him more. We just
need to, you know, not just steal his bank accounts,
but put him in prison this time, as if that
won't turn him into a martyr and ultimately uplift his
entire movement into a truly radical, dangerous thing. And it's
just like, I feel like I'm talking to a brick
wall that people just can't see what I'm saying.
Speaker 10 (48:44):
There To answer though, that, like not you know, is
not make it a rhetorical question on your part. That, like,
I think James Lindsay would love it if Nickquinte said
something crazy and it's not a show, so it's not that.
Don't you guys see your creating this and they say,
I mean, if they were being honest, yes, we need
him to exist to justify what we've been saying.
Speaker 3 (49:01):
Yep, no, I agree, But I guess I just that's
kind of my distinction between whether or not you're a
good actor or a bad actor is that if James
is a genuine actor, like he's genuinely concerned about the
rise of the alt right right, my opinion would be, well,
then obviously you're going to want to sit down and
have as many conversations with Nick fuent as you possibly can,
because you you're a college professor type that you know
(49:24):
has studied these things, and you understand the rise of
authoritarian figures and the pitfalls of that, and wouldn't you
want to imbue that knowledge in him to try and
prevent him from leading his audience down that path and
instead his answer to the rise of an authoritarian right
is to respond with the authoritarianism and like basically or
soft power, I guess, but to suppress this conversation with
(49:47):
this kid as much as humanly possible, and to do
all of the things that you lamented when it came
to the woke left, you're now doing to the right.
And it's I just think it's such a dead end.
And I think it's so dangerous, And it's funny because
they think that Flinta is indicative or reflective of all
this danger that I can't see, but they can't see
the danger of what they're doing themselves.
Speaker 10 (50:09):
Yeah again, And I think you're right, Like it's you know,
the analogy I use in my episode was with drug
dealing that oh, if you don't like drive by shootings
and overdoses and stuff, then don't make something illegal, because
then that means it's only criminals and shoddy business practices
that are in that space. So like we was here,
yeah that it's respectable people don't touch this stuff. And
I when he was telling that story to Tucker and
(50:30):
Flint is about how you know, back in the day
when he was talking about Jesus, seems like, you know,
we're gonna be a my whites are going to be
a minority in this because I mean I can remember
ten years ago, like, yeah, you could you said anything
like that like this, some people would have taken a
step back away from you, like, oh, I want to
get cooties, so I can understand. Whereas now that's the
very mainstream thing to say because stuff has changed, So
(50:50):
I understand you know what you're getting at in terms
of like if things had happened differently, we wouldn't know
his name right now, or he would have been sort
of more convention commentator, but this sort of pushed him
in that direction, or he was going to go this way.
The reason people flocked to him is because no one
else was talking about this stuff because everyone else is afraid.
Speaker 3 (51:08):
Right well, and he's very gifted, so it's like it's
a dangerous combination. You took a really naturally talented orator
with right wing tendencies and then you abused him very
aggressively when he was very young, and it's like, well
you want to just kick him out of Painter school next,
you know, like what are you guys trying to do here?
And I just think this is the fight that we're
in though, It's like this is going to be the
(51:30):
real divide on the right is like are we an
identitarian not an interventionist right wing. Are we a non
identitarian more of an America constitutionalist libertarian, non an inventionist,
individualist right wing more of our camp, And it's like,
I still believe that both of those sides are preferable
to endless empire and woke progressivism and socialism and ultimately,
(51:55):
you know, destruction of the Constitution. And it's like, so
I'm just going to continue to be in the fray
on that conversation and try and win that argument that
I think our worldview is preferential to that that Nick
Fuentes prescribes and let the chips fall where they may.
So I've got to run because hop on your buddy show,
(52:16):
Tom Woods. Okay, yeah, but I really appreciate your thoughtful
analysis and pushback and I will absolutely keep it in
mind and maybe we can do this again in the future.
Speaker 9 (52:27):
Okay, thanks so much for having Mekln.
Speaker 3 (52:28):
Yep, thank you, Bob talk so
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Las Culturistas with Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang
Ding dong! Join your culture consultants, Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang, on an unforgettable journey into the beating heart of CULTURE. Alongside sizzling special guests, they GET INTO the hottest pop-culture moments of the day and the formative cultural experiences that turned them into Culturistas. Produced by the Big Money Players Network and iHeartRadio.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.