July 25, 2022 • 43 mins
In this episode of the New York Fishing Podcast, I speak with Mr. Chris Papro on a number of topics in the marine life around Long Island. Chis aka @fishphotoguy spends plenty of time in around our waters and he captures some great content. He also does a lot of hands-on work with sharks and other pelagics and he's a wealth of information on the subject.
Give it a listen as we talk about the recent in-shore shark "nibbles" that have beachgoers out of the water.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
George Scocca (00:01):
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York fishing podcast.
My name is George Scocca.
I will be your host here againfor another wonderful episode,
brought to you by N myr.com.
New York anglers reporting onthe New York fishing.
(00:23):
So today I speak with ChrisPatro.
This episode is kind ofdedicated to the news of the
week, but there are other issuesthat we discuss.
And Chris is really up onthings, very educated on things
as the best social media.
A content that I know I enjoyhis the most, and he is very
(00:49):
educated on what's going on.
And I kind of wanted to get awayfrom this hype, this whole thing
with this sharking going on.
So we talked to him about thatand a few other things.
So without further ado, I amgoing to go to the interview,
which we had this morning.
(01:11):
I would like to welcome ChrisPaparo to the show.
Chris is pretty much an expertabout everything that I don't
know, not only swims, but fliesand nests around long island.
He has by far, in my opinion,the best social media, photos
(01:32):
and videos.
You can find anywhere, someamazing stuff, Chris, and you
always seem, I, I I've said thisbefore.
How does this guy did all thisstuff, you know, it's like you
see things I've been on thewater for, I don't know, 40
years.
And you see stuff every day thatlike I've never seen before.
So yeah, no, it's, I, I, as youknow, I spend a lot of time in
(01:56):
and around and on the water.
There's not a day that goes bywhere I'm not at least at the
beach for a few minutes, youknow, and I always have a camera
or a drone or something with meto try to capture something
something to share with thepublic.
Well, it's pretty amazing.
And, and I really urge everyoneto follow the Phish photo guy.
And he'll, he'll give you allthe info at the end of the show.
(02:20):
So Chris, I wanted to discuss acouple things.
Few of my pet peeves areobviously yours.
And, and actually just about allanglers and concerned, anglers,
those of us that.
Chris Paparo (02:31):
You know, on the water a lot.
And that's this time of year,all the garbage, all the Mylar
balloons and all like thedisregard that people have.
I mean, they let balloons go andthey think, I think they think
they're going to heaven, butyeah.
You know can you talk, I, I knowyou, you, you know, you're
(02:53):
making an effort to bring this.
Yeah.
I mean, you know, for those thatfollow me on Phish guy photos
you know, that I rarely postnegative stuff, you know, for
no, I know for the most part,for the most part, I like to
post focus on the positive cuzyou know what, there is a lot of
stuff, wrong out you with ourenvironment and, and the world
around us.
But you know, there are otherpeople that talk about that.
And I think what happens ispeople get.
(03:14):
Bombarded with the tomb andgloom and they just don't care
anymore.
So that's why I try to likeshowcase all the really cool
stuff and positive things thatare happening here.
But like you mentioned, thereare just a few things that irk
me and one of them by far hasgotta be balloons, you know?
And I mean, you know, you spendtime on the water, you can't go
off shore or actually not evenoff shore, just you can't go in
the bay, the ocean.
(03:35):
And honestly, I spend a lot oftime in the woods.
You'd be amaz the amount ofballoons I find in the woods.
They're not, it's not just aMarine problem.
What happens is, you know, I'llfind trash out on the, you know,
around about.
And, you know, I often like to,I like to think that maybe it's
there cuz it's by accident felloff of something blew away, but
all the balloons that are outthere are there because somebody
(03:57):
let it go and you know, so theydid that on purpose.
So for me, it just seems like areally easy fix.
To just not buy them in thefirst place.
You know, don't release, don'trelease some or, you know,
better yet just don't buy'em.
I tell a lot of people I'm like,you know, I've been to parties
with balloons.
I've been to parties withoutballoons.
There's no difference.
But what I would do is take yourballoon money and buy better
food or better yet buy betterbeer, you know, spend the money
(04:20):
on other stuff.
Cause like you said, it goes upit, you know, I, I picked up one
the other day and it was, youknow, oh, pop pop.
We really miss you.
We love you so much.
XO, XO.
And I, I feel really bad thatthey lost pop pop.
I really do.
But all that balloon is gonna dois potentially send a sea turtle
to heaven, to be with pop pop,you know, like don't, don't do
(04:42):
that just, and, you know, yeah.
Just so that just to me is evenworse, you know, it, it's not
going to heaven.
It's just going up and comingdown and potentially entangling
some sort of wild.
Well, I mean, we saw photos.
I suspect you saw him.
Chris be had posted last year,literally.
Yeah.
With, with a turtle, with aballoon around his neck and you
(05:02):
know, out west, this is, theydeal with the same thing there.
And the guys in Californiathey're tournaments, they
actually have a separate awardfor the person who brings in the
most, my law balloons duringtheir tournaments.
So what we did that.
So we did that this summer.
So I'm, as you know, I'm part ofthe south fork, natural history,
museum's shark research team.
(05:24):
Mm-hmm and the last two summers.
Now we've done a balloontournament and it's a$25 entry
fee.
And this year we went for twomonths.
And what happens is we allowpeople to find balloons, land,
air, sea by boat, by shore.
New York, New Jersey,Connecticut, and whoever
collects the most balloons winsa trip for two to go take sharks
with us that summer.
(05:45):
Wow.
And for us, it's a great way to,you know, raise some money for
our research.
You know, we're not for profit,right.
But it's a great way to getpeople aware of this problem,
you know, and I, the numbershaven't come in yet, but the
last I heard tallys they pickedup well over 2000 balloons.
Yeah.
And that's, you know, that'sjust one.
(06:05):
Mo, you know, one group that'sorganized doing it and yeah.
I mean, like you say, you can'tgo out, especially this time of
year, you got your weddings, yougot your, you know, graduations
mm-hmm birthdays, 4th of July.
Yeah.
I mean, it's, it is kind ofridiculous.
And, and the thing is I trulybelieve a few.
Here's a, there's a few things.
(06:26):
First of all, there is a billactually by a Congresswoman in
Westchester.
To eliminate the sale of morethan 25 bylaw balloons.
Now we've been in touch withthat office.
She seems willing.
I mean, I think that a simple,you can't release the balloons.
(06:46):
It's illegal period.
The same way you can't throw apiece of paper out on the side
of the.
George Scocca (06:51):
Why should you be able to release those balloons?
Well, up in, up until only acouple years ago, the law for
Suffolk county, the way it waswritten in the books, it was
unlawful to release 25 or more.
So you could release 24 everyday.
And that was perfectly legal,right.
Which is just absurd.
That that was even per, as alaw.
like, it just doesn't make anysense.
(07:12):
So here, I know in Suffolkcounty, or at least on the east
end, a lot of the local townshave banned the sale of
balloons, you know, And a lot ofpeople, like when I post these
balloons, they're like, see, butwe should, we Bann it.
Why are they still here?
They drift far.
So, you know, we can ban'em inthe state of New York, but I
guarantee more though, thoseballoons are coming from the
west.
You know, you gotta remember,they go off, they drift.
(07:33):
So a balloon released off ofeast Hampton.
Is gonna float out over theocean and be somebody else, some
problem out out further, it'snot gonna go to Jersey or
Pennsylvania.
It's gonna, you know, so itreally needs to be a large scale
passing of this to bandreleasing of these balloons, you
know, to, yeah.
I mean, that's gotta be the wayto go cuz once you try to stop
the sale of something, forgetit.
(07:55):
The, the, you know, I dealt onthe legislative end.
Very heavily.
And once you try to stop someoneand they're like, oh, you're
gonna put me outta visit.
And the other thing is, youknow, maybe we can find funding
or someone can find funding tosimply educate the people.
Yeah.
That don't, that's what I try todo.
I really don't think peoplerealize, like they don't think,
(08:18):
you know, they let it go.
And, and I think if someonesays, you know, look, this is
what's happening.
Please don't release them.
Here's how you should dispose ofthem and just give a card or a
sheet or whatever.
Yeah.
You know, well, you're a hunyou're a hundred percent, right.
Cuz when I first started postingabout the balloon things a few
years back, you know, I hadquite a few people say.
(08:40):
I had no idea, you know, and,and then they're like, I will
never release a balloon again.
And I'm like, all right, Ireached someone and I know that
person is then gonna tell theirfriends.
And so like, it's an educationalthing.
And well, you know, I, I'm not afan of laws and, and rules and
all this other stuff, you know,I'd much rather just.
Get people better educated, likereally get them educated about
(09:03):
cases what's going on.
Yeah.
In many cases that absolutelydoes work.
All right.
So let's move on.
The balloons are a problem.
I, you know, there's gotta be agroup out there where we can all
get together one day and maybethere's a weekend next year.
We'll see where there's a bunchof tournaments going on.
And we can, you know, basicallymaybe pull'em all together and
(09:27):
work together.
Yeah.
Because I know every singletournament direct anyone that
fishes, it knows this is aproblem and knows it needs to be
dealt with.
So you dealt with it, you know,this is.
See, like years ago we hadgroups we could go to and say,
Hey, look, guys, help us withthis right now.
We don't have that.
But but we'll be able to get theword out.
(09:48):
So.
All right.
So the next thing again, I don'twant to go negative, but I
caught a video of a dive whereit literally looked like a junk
you at the bottom.
Of the bridge.
And I was, I was wondering ifyou could talk a little bit
about that and what you guys areseeing, because I, I was
(10:09):
shocked.
Yeah.
So, you know, I mean, again,it's not just above the surface
that there's garbage, there'sgarbage down below.
And this, this earlier thissummer, I was talking with Randy
Randazzo from Hampton divecenter in Riverhead.
And he was like, Hey, let's tryto organize.
A beach cleanup at P qu bridge.
You know, it's a place that wedive a lot.
(10:30):
I mean, me personally thatbridge has a lot of just
memories and it means a lot tome.
So I jumped on.
I was like, yeah, let's do it.
And you know, it's tough to getpermits and stuff in the
summertime cuz of parking andwhatnot.
But you know, we had about 20divers show up and we went down
and the bridge is a tough dive,you know, the current and the
visibility.
Wasn't great.
But.
As you saw, we pulled up quite abit of garbage, a lot of it,
(10:50):
fish and gear fishing line.
But then just a lot of justtrash, you know, bags and old
t-shirts and stuff.
So, I mean it was great and itwas a great way to get some of
that out.
There's still way more downthere.
But it was again, a way to bringawareness to it.
And we're gonna try to organizeanother one this fall.
So you could follow me or Randyat Hampton dive to kind of get
notified next time that we do.
(11:12):
Yeah, I'd actually like to goout there and see maybe I do,
maybe I don't cuz.
You know, like I'd like to havemore faith in people to realize
that they just can't throwgarbage in freaking water, but
you know, people still do it.
And yeah, but again, it's, it'san educational, it's an educate.
It's a way to educate people,you know, just so show showing
(11:33):
what we've brought up and, youknow, again, there was a lot
more down there.
You know, I brought my camera totry to document some of it.
I honestly should have left thecamera home.
Cause it was really tough tryingto cut stuff and bring stuff up,
which is one hand.
So.
Yeah.
So next time I'll probably leavethe camera home, but we'll but
yeah, we're gonna do it againand again, it's it's just every
little bit helps.
And again, it brings awarenessand yeah, exactly.
(11:56):
Let me tell you those, thosetype of thing, a video and a
photo brought to, I know youdon't like laws, but
unfortunately that's the way hisplace were, but you know, like
those photos are very.
Yeah.
You know, they're very helpfuland they, people look at that
and they go, you mean, this isgoing on under the water.
Well, yep.
(12:16):
That's exactly what's happening.
All right.
So another subject let's move onand, you know, please keep us in
touch on or me or whateverthrough your social channel on,
on that next dive.
I'd like, I'd really like toknow more about that.
And I think, you know, there'sfunding available for that type
of stuff, but that's a wholenother.
(12:36):
Whole nother thing.
All right.
So I I've been saying now for acouple of years, and I'm not the
only one, many scientistsresearchers.
I, I mean, I'm, I'm on the webof all time looking at this
stuff and it's the generalconsensus that we have warm
water fish.
Walmart fish are moving northand.
(12:58):
Fish that are traditionally incertain areas seem to be moving
north and offshore.
Now, when I follow your.
Your feed.
You know, I noticed earlier thisyear you mentioned how you're
seeing more and more tropicalfish earlier in the season.
So, you know, we are seeing alot of stuff.
(13:18):
That's, you know, look, it lookslike sea bad.
I mean, this year we have a lotof fluke.
I'm not gonna say the, the flukecan's been pretty good, but you
could tell kind of C bass andmove it in and, and starting to
move in on that territory.
Chris Paparo (13:32):
And I kind of feel like.
Little bit at a time, you know,they're gonna start taking over.
And I was wondering what yourtheory is on this whole thing.
I mean, we, we lost all, all thelobsters.
I believe it's due basically towater temperatures, but it could
be wrong.
We'd lost all the pecan basegallops.
There's just so much we lost inthe sound.
(13:54):
And I was wondering.
What your thoughts are.
Yeah.
If you have it and yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, so lobsters andscallops, there's a lot of
factors in play there, you know,lobsters in the sound, you know,
a lot of that was pollution.
A big part of that waspollution.
You know, temperature sure isdefinitely not helping there
(14:15):
either.
As far as the base scallopsresearchers at Stony Brook have
been looking into several.
Temperature disease harmfulalgal blooms, you know, again,
they're, they're facing a lot ofdifferent changes in the
environment all at once, whichis kind of not good for the
scallops.
So, so we're still trying tofigure that out.
As far as like the tropicalfish, you know, tropical fish
(14:38):
have been coming to long islandever since the Atlantic ocean
was formed.
Right.
And you know, they drift on theGulf stream.
And often when I, when I mentiontropical fish on long island
right away, everyone says, seeclimate change.
I told you, you know, and youknow, the ocean's changing.
The ocean's definitely gettingwarmer and the climate's getting
warmer.
You know, you can argue abouthow, and I'm not gonna get into
that.
I'm just saying, you know, youlook at numbers, it's happening.
(14:59):
It's you can argue all day longon how or why it's happening.
It's happening, but you know, sosome of these tropicals, I blame
it on that, but I'm like, again,they come in on the Gulf stream
and with that it's so variableyear to year, cuz it's all based
on winds, you know, right lastyear was actually a decent year
for tropical fish.
We had a lot of Southeast winds.
(15:20):
If you remember, there was likesix weeks in a row where it
just.
Constant constant winds outtathe south Southeast.
And we had all those Souths thatwashed in those clear little
tuna kits that covered thebeaches.
Right.
We had the Portuguese man ofwar.
Last year I found quite a fewbutterfly fish and angel fish.
I found some lion fish.
Prior to that the last fiveyears was horrible.
(15:42):
I didn't even go collecting cuzit was just so bad.
But why was that?
Well, most of the winds were outthe west Southwest, which just
pushes coastal water.
So a lot of those tropicalthings and it's not just small
stuff, you know, hammerheadsharks, tiger sharks.
They come in off the Gulfstreams.
So again, they can be variablewith the years as it goes.
But lately there's been a lotof, you know, things like Toby
(16:03):
being.
Sheep's head being caught blackdrums, you know, some of these
species, like the sheep's headand the black drum, you know,
they're oyster reef, fish.
We eradicated oysters on longisland years ago, you know?
Yeah.
My feeling as oysters are comingback is we're, you know, a lot
of organizations, includingStoneberg are putting'em out
there.
You're gonna start seeing a lotof these oyster reef, community
fish returning as well.
But then you're also what we'realso seeing is a, a shift north
(16:26):
of some population.
So as things warm up.
Things like Kobe, you know,would be common to maybe south
Jersey, you know, then theywould, their, their historical
range would be up to Cape Codhistorically that they've always
been there.
But, you know, as things warm,we're seeing them a little bit
more frequently, few more innumbers, you know, as, as
things, you know, as, as watertemperatures warm and, and you
(16:48):
mentioned sea bass, they'rehaving a problem in the Gulf of
Maine right now with sea bass,because that's a fish that
historically was not in the Gulfof Maine.
Right.
But is now in the Gulf of Maine,the problem there is, is they
eat lobsters.
I was gonna say, that's theirnumber one thing.
They eat the little bugs.
They swallow'em whole.
So now the lobster industry upin Maine is all freaking out
what to do because now we gotthese sea bass, you know, and
(17:11):
it's funny, everyone, when Imentioned stuff like that.
And.
You know, like tarp in, on longisland people like, oh my God,
that would be awesome.
I don't, you know, like I don'thave to go far to catch these
fish, but yeah.
Just think about what's goingon, where these fish normally
would be.
So it's not, you know, you startseeing tarp in on long island
regularly.
That's probably not good fordown south where they're
(17:32):
normally coming from.
So, you know, this is all stuffthat one you know, that needs a
lot more research into what'sexactly going on.
But you know, that's part ofwhat we're seeing is, is, you
know, these is this kind ofpopulation shift as, as things
warm up.
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
See, I mean, you mentioned Kobe,right?
So there's a prime example.
(17:53):
So let's say three, four yearsago, you know, I'm always
following the fishing.
So I'm following, what's beingcaught and what's happening.
I'm always looking at differentthings.
And I was like, you know, it'sstarting to catch some co.
George Scocca (18:06):
Some guys are actually, you know, targeting
them.
And then this year, I mean, Idon't know if you've seen the
fish, I mean, weighed in baypark is weighing in like, 30 40
50 pound fish every day.
Every day.
Yep.
And from what I used, well, youknow, keep in mind though there,
you know, COPI are on have, are,and have been on the books for
(18:26):
New York state as far as a sizelimit for a long time.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
So it's it, you know, when, whenyou look at something like that,
that can't just be a, you know,like, oh, well just in case, you
know, they're, you know, they,they have them on the, the books
for a reason.
Well, it's funny because Ialways used to say, why do we
have that?
You know, like, and red fish,red fish are on the books too.
(18:47):
Exactly.
I'm like, why do we have those?
Well, it won't be long beforethe red fish comes up here.
Right?
Well, well, and they have, andthey have caught some red fish.
There was that guy.
I wasn't the name, Liz, Eliza, Ithink.
Oh yeah.
Yeah, he'd caught several redfish.
I don't, he never gave thelocation, but I know he fished
to the west, so, wow.
So he was picking some big bullsup here in long island.
(19:07):
So again, you know, I thinkthere's a lot of different
things going on with some ofthese fish that are here, you
know, is it a cycle?
Is it some of them just beingpushed for, for the north coast
of climate or populationsgrowing.
To maybe do to conservation.
A lot of these fish populationsare rebounding and growing and
spreading, you know, so there's,there's so many variables that
(19:29):
could be at play with some ofthese different species.
You know, I think everyone is, Ithink is gonna have to take a
little bit different of a youknow, look at on why.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, there is a targeted,you, you probably know this, but
right now there is, it's short.
It's less than a month, butthere's a targeted Tarpon
Fisher.
In Chesapeake bay, they'rethey're corn places in that bay.
(19:52):
I know fisherman mm-hmm two, twoto four weeks a year.
They literally catch tarp and inChesapeake bay, so, well, I
mean, I know a couplecommercial, I know a couple
commercial guys that get atleast one or two every year.
Inlanders.
You know, so, so they're therethey're there and I've had some
other locals that know theirstuff that said they have seen
(20:15):
tarp in, you know, coming up andtaking that breath and all that.
And they just, you know, I'venever heard of anyone catch one
on rod and real in long island,but, but you know, they, you
know, even for the, for theyears that I've been involved
with this, you know, 20, 20 plusyears, I've been seeing at least
one Tarpon every year from alocal fisherman commercial guy
usually usually caught in apound net or something like
(20:35):
that.
So, you know, again, it's, maybethey're not, you know, and
that's the thing.
There's things that we justdon't get to see because you
don't catch'em.
But these commercial guys, theysee all sorts of weird stuff,
cool stuff in their nets.
And then today with socialmedia, you know, back 20 years
ago, if somebody caught one, youdidn't see, maybe you saw a
picture that they had in theirwallet or something, but you
didn't.
(20:56):
Texted to a friend andeverything.
So, you know, some of that isalso I think, kind of taking
place too.
Yes, absolutely.
Totally agree.
All right.
So the last one, I'm sure.
It's your favorite one?
I'm I'm sure your phone isringing off the hook on this is
we enter, I think it's likeshark week or something coming
up on TV.
(21:16):
And so we've got thesesupposedly.
Ensure tiger sharks immature.
I mean, I think they can't.
How big could they be there?
Wasn't.
So I want, I want to correct youon that one.
Yeah.
So the media and some of thelocal politicians have been
claiming that tiger sharks aredoing these bites.
It's not tiger sharks.
(21:37):
They're sand tiger sharks.
I, what?
I said sand, but if I didn't, Itake the, no, you did.
Okay.
No, you, I, I heard you saytiger, but I've also, again,
it's been in the news that it'stiger sharks.
It's tiger shark.
And it's definitely no, it'snot.
It's a, because a bite from atiger shark is definitely gonna
leave a bigger mark than a sandtiger shark.
So yeah.
So can you explain to us why?
(21:59):
I mean, you know, you hear allthese bites and this and that,
and then you're reading a paper.
Oh man, the guy got twostitches.
I'm like, He got, I get a biggerbite from a blue fish, you know,
sometimes so.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I'm wondering, I mean, mythought is that that's
supposedly a popping ground, nottoo far from there.
(22:19):
Yes.
And you've got these little fishcoming in.
On bait.
Or just because there's more nowthan there were before, or maybe
there could be a milliondifferent things, right.
It's a, you know, it's a, it's alot, it's a lot of different
things.
Just like everything that we'vebeen talking about.
There's no really one, you know,thing, you know, the species
such as the SANDAG or thesandbar, the dusky, they were
(22:41):
heavily fished in the seventiesand eighties, you know,
especially for the fin market.
Right.
You know, they're all thosethree are prohibited species,
which, which means you're noteven allowed to target them for
catch and release.
So a lot of these shore basesurf fishermen that are
targeting sand Tiger's duskysand sandbars, it's completely
against the law.
(23:01):
You know, and if you happen tobe blue fishing and catch one of
these.
You're not allowed to drag itoutta the water.
You're not allowed to takepictures with, you know, you
gotta release it as quickly aspossible.
So I mean, just that there.
So they are still prohibited andbecause of protections, many of
these populations are startingto rebound, right?
So it's a sign of like asuccessful conservation efforts.
(23:22):
Absolutely.
And as you mentioned, you know,the sand tigers, you know my
colleagues at the New Yorkaquarium, they've been studying
a nursery, a sand nursery ingreat south bay, and they've had
years of data of sharksreturning and, you know, so
it's, so again, we got allthese, like these little
nurseries, my work at the museumsouth for natural history
museum, you know, we, we put apaper out that proved that long
(23:45):
island bite.
Is it pumping is, is a nursery,not a pumping up, sorry, nursery
ground for young of the yearwhite sharks.
Right.
You know, and it's, and, and alot of the work we do we're
starting to, you know, look atthe fact that you know, many of
these species, this might be anursery ground.
You know, we we're catchingdusky sharks that still have
umbilical scars.
Wow.
You know, so it's like, theseare pups, these are all young
(24:07):
ones.
So again, so a lot of thesesharks are young.
That's why you're seeing, likeyou said, two stitches, three
stitches.
They're smaller sharks.
They're feeding on bait fish,you know, and the one.
With these sharks is they don'thave hands.
So when they wanna investigatesomething, they bite, you know,
that's a good point.
And that's so like, you know,for example, you know, the
lifeguard at Smith point, thatwas bit, you know, he was doing
(24:30):
his training exercise.
He was playing a victimthrashing kicking around well
sharks.
Can sense that they have theAmul eye of Lauren Zini that
they can pick up on thoseelectric pulses.
So right.
They go in thinking, oh, maybethere's a big fish dying and I'm
gonna take a chunk out of itand, you know, get an easy,
quick meal and they go over andthey get up close and they go,
what is this thing?
And they take a bite and they'relike, ah, that's not a fish.
(24:51):
It's got bones.
I can't break through.
So even a, if these sharks,yeah.
Right.
But even if these sharks wantedto eat you, they physically
can't, they don't have the jawstructure or the teeth to break
bone and all that kind.
Thank you because I've beensaying that no exist that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's, I mean, that's someof what's going on there, you
know, they're coming into feedon bunker, you know, you know,
(25:14):
as you've been involved with alot of that conservation work,
mm-hmm, you know, we're seeingmore bunker than we've ever seen
before.
Which as not only fueled sharks,but that's why we're seeing all
the whales and dolphins.
And I like to use thatcomparison because it's the.
That's funny because whales werehunted to extinction.
Yes.
Near ex near extinction.
Yes.
So we're, you know, sharks werehammered with, by fishing
(25:36):
pressure, both of the return,but nobody gets upset when
there's a whale.
they get upset when there's ashark, but we're seeing.
More whales, which also ismeaning we're seeing more boat
strikes, you know?
Right.
And it's not because we'redriving more aggressive, more
whales.
There's gonna be moreencounters, more sharks.
There's a better chance of moreencounters.
(25:56):
So a lot of it ends up being thenumbers game.
When you, when you start lookingat that kind of stuff, you know,
and then let's face it.
The waters are much cleaner.
You be fishing these waterslonger than I have.
You could probably attest tothat better than I can.
Oh, absolutely.
Even the sound.
I mean, I'm amazed at how clearthe sound is.
And any, you know, way you go tothe water really is I think has
(26:18):
improved dramatically.
I mean, we haven't seen that youknow, bring any.
Great increase of, you know,life into these bays being that
we dump well, you know, as wellas I do more sewage than you can
imagine, but sure.
But look, everything we're stilllooking good that, and we're
still seeing problems.
It's not, yeah.
I don't wanna say that ourenvironment is pristine.
(26:40):
You know, we still see.
Brown tides, rust tides.
You know, we're seeing redtides.
So, you know, some of our baysare still very problem.
It's not, we're not done.
We're not outta the woods, butwhat I like to just point out is
look, it's possible to makechanges.
You know, we can do things,right?
So again, it all comes down toeducation.
If we could just better educatepeople on little things, you
(27:03):
know, you don't always have to,you know, Lifestyle changes,
just minor little things hereand there.
Just to, if everyone did that,they make such differences.
And again, it's just, it's justbeing better educated on what's
around us.
I totally, I couldn't agree withyou more.
And I, you know, what it amazesme is how the news is jumping
(27:25):
all over this.
I see you all over the place whoquote a news date today.
And I hear you've beeninterviewed by a bunch of
people.
Being that, you know, what'sgoing on.
But I have to say if I see onemore picture that dead white
shark I mean, oh my God.
I mean, it was on every state.
(27:45):
I'm like last year, four ofthose things washed up to our
cost of the year.
Yeah.
And nobody even cared about it.
You know, it was a timing thing.
I was, so it was, you know, itwas a quiet weekend.
The media kind of got quiet andthen my social media lit up with
that shark.
And then within minutes, myphone was off the hook and it's
how crazy is it rare?
Is it odd?
(28:05):
Is it this?
And like, no, they're here.
I just, and I would have toreiterate, you know, we've,
we've proven this is a nurseryground, you know, there, this,
these sharks most likely were bycatch, you know at least some of
the ones that we've found whenwe do the knee crops, either,
either have hooks in.
Or signs of commercialinteraction, you know, like tra
or Gill, net or something alongthose lines, but again, right.
(28:28):
There's, there's, you know,they're here, you know, and
that's, that's, what's gonnahappen, but yeah, it's just,
it's, it's a hysteria thing.
And I think it's because, youknow, it's movies, it's
Hollywood, it's, it's been putin our heads that we have to be
afraid, you know, but last year,You know, getting back to like
the shark attack thing, youknow, there were 73 unprovoked
attacks worldwide, you know,2000 people on average a year
(28:50):
die in New York state in caraccidents.
Oh yeah.
But nobody gets like, we're notfreaking out about that, you
know 4,000 people in the us dieevery year drowning.
Yeah.
But again, people still goswimming.
So that's where I, I get, youknow, you see the news and
people like I'll never go inswimming.
But you'll get in your car.
There's a better chance you'regoing to die in your car.
(29:10):
You know?
So that kind of stuff alwayskind of gets me.
I just wish people had a fear oftheir cars.
Like they do of sharks.
We'd all be safer.
Right.
You know, and that's, those arelike the things, but again, it
ends up becoming Hollywood.
We're not desensitized to it.
Like where it's just a common,everyday thing, you know?
You know, then there's, there's,there's a, I guess, so there's
also that, just that primal fearof sharks, you know, I mean it's
(29:33):
yeah.
Oh yeah.
Something fr, you know, so I, Ido understand some of that, but
like I said, I also, at the samepoint don't understand why
people don't get upset aboutthose other things that I
mentioned, because there's abetter chance there than, than
the shark thing.
Well, you know what, I think itdoesn't make as good a news half
the time.
Sure.
The other, the other thing.
Like you say, people are paraafraid.
(29:54):
They get in the water.
They don't know what's there.
But I mean, look at in New York,I don't know if anyone's ever
actually been killed by a sharkbite.
No.
In New York, no, nobody's diedin New York.
So, you know, I mean, so there'sa couple little bites on a beach
now they're making this huge,they got drones.
They got this they're higher.
(30:15):
Like it's jaws, like they'regonna go around.
Right.
And with that though, I UN youknow, and with that though, I
understand all that becausenobody wants to be the mayor
from jaws.
Right.
Right now.
Yeah.
The features are safe.
Go ahead.
So, you know, so they're puttingup the drones, they're
increasing patrols.
Do I think it's gonna help?
Sure.
It'll get people, maybe just,again, more aware of what's
(30:37):
going on around them, but youknow, and more relaxed maybe
that they, yeah.
Maybe more relax and.
Yeah, but the beaches because ofthat are gonna be closed more
often.
I mean, absolutely.
As we started this conversation,you said how I'm always finding
this find out, cause I'm lookingright.
We've never been looking forsharks on the beach or at least
lifeguards and patrollers.
And so once they start looking,they're gonna be like me,
(30:58):
they're gonna find them whenthey go out in the morning,
they're gonna be there, youknow, so, right.
Yeah.
So again, but that's gonna bejust something we just have to
understand and kind of go with,you know, and right, right.
Realize that sharks.
Our crucial part of theenvironment.
You know, we need them as muchas we need the Striped best that
we enjoy and, you know, and thesummer flounder, you know, it's
all, it's all connected.
(31:18):
I don't care what you agree.
It's all connected.
Yeah.
I, and you know, I'm a littlebit nervous when D C issued a
statement in Newsday that it'sthe amount of bait fish due to
their change.
In in 19, remember they madethat change and stopped the, in
(31:41):
saw the inside pair walls.
So.
So they're saying, you know bydoing that, we have more fish.
And my answer to that is letnature take care of itself.
Sure.
I mean, do we need somethingcalled a reduction boat to come
in and take bunker out of thewater?
I mean, it's ludicrous, soright.
We gotta, and at that samepoint, they're gonna end up
(32:03):
catching sharks, bass,everything that's also there.
And, you know, you know whathappens with the stuff that
doesn't.
Is not, they're not their targetspecies, you know, that just
gets discarded.
Right.
You know?
So what impact would that have?
So, I mean, yeah.
It's, you know, it's funny.
I have seen people like it's allthe Bunker's fault, you know,
it's like, all right, well,let's get rid of bunker.
Well then the whales go away.
(32:24):
Right?
The tuna, the blue tuna thathave been all over the place, go
away, gone.
The dolphin go away.
I mean, it, it's not just thesharks.
Exactly.
It, it fuels everything, youknow, everything eats bunker.
It's the most important fish inour ocean.
Abso and birds too.
Yeah.
That's what I mean, everythingbirds, crabs, fish.
I mean, when they wash up on theshore, you get land down like
(32:45):
raccoons and things, you know,it's, it's everything, there's
it, you know, it's thera, it'severything eats them.
So yeah, it's, it's animportant.
It's an important fish.
And I, you know, again, and I'mnot the type who says, all
right, we shouldn't harvest anybunker.
You know, I'm not, I'm not likethat at all.
I just responsible harvest, Ithink is what we just need to
keep in mind.
Again, if the bunk, if thebunker population's at the point
(33:08):
where it can sustain a littlebit more harvest, I'm not
against that, but I'm just, Ijust wanna make sure that it's
being done responsibly andlooking at the big ecosystem,
not just somebody's, you know,pocket on what they're making.
Yes.
You know, I agree and disagreein the sense that they think
that that's gonna.
Right.
It's not.
Yeah, I truly don't believe.
(33:30):
Let's say, they're gonna say,okay, let's take out, you know,
let's hit the bunker that are in30 feet of water, less or
whatever, and that's not gonnahelp anything.
No.
So it's not gonna stop anything,you know, as well as I do, those
shocks have been there forever.
They have been there forever.
They're just doing better nowbecause of our conservation.
(33:51):
Sure.
So, I mean, that's how I feelanyway.
Yeah, no, and I, I, I, I agreewith you.
I, like I said, what I look,what I look at is, you know, we
often as anglers, you know, wesay, well, there's so many CBAs,
why won't they give us moreCBAs?
We should be able to get moreCBA, you know?
Well, that should apply toeverything.
Then that that's where I guesswhat I'm getting at, you know?
So if there are more bunkerwell, and they should be allowed
to harness a little bit more ABabsolutely.
(34:12):
I guess that's, that's just whatI'm saying.
Cuz sometimes we get it like.
Only what's best for us, youknow?
And I, yeah, no, I look at thebig picture and like, I'm, I am,
I am for sustainable fisheries.
Like if it's, if it'ssustainable and they can
increase the take on it, thenI'm all for it, you know?
But again, it's gotta be.
Sustainable, you know, andthat's guess that's, that's what
(34:33):
kind of what I was getting at.
Yeah.
I'm not, no, I agree.
I totally not a fan.
I'm a fan of calls and all, cuzit, you know, calls have been
proven not to work, you know,just, that's just, you know,
other things move in when youpull out other stuff.
So it, it's not a exactly.
Yeah.
You know, the only way callswork is wiping out, just like we
did with the sharks and thewhales and the seals, you know,
(34:54):
when they're hunted to nearextinction, then you don't have
a problem with those animals.
But you know, I mean, but youneed.
You need them you're part of thewhole overall ecosystem.
Yep.
So, all right, well, Chris, I'lllet you go.
You gotta get your hat done cuzyou, you, you might be on TV
tonight.
but did I give you like a makeupperson or.
(35:16):
No most of this has been zoom,so it, yeah, most of it's been
zoom it's, you know, cause I'mall the way on south Hampton.
So very rarely do they want tocome all the way out here, you
know?
Cause this is the end of theworld.
Well, I, well, everything's zoomtoday.
It's, it's a good way for themto save money.
Anyhow, you know?
Yeah.
So, and you know what you'redoing on zoom?
I'm sure you'll have a nicebackground and oh yeah, you'll
(35:37):
be all set up.
So we need to do this again.
I, you know, later on, I reallyenjoy speaking with you.
You and I.
Really on the same level.
And I I'm telling you, I knowfor a fact we can make real
change, especially now with theleadership we have in place and
either way, you know, I mean, Iknow I don't wanna get
(35:59):
political, but you know, Zeldahas always been a good friend of
ours and HOK seemed hours andHule seems to be as concerned as
anybody else about a fisheries.
So hopefully moving forward, Youknow, will be able to put things
in place and I'm sure they'regonna wanna clean up.
So, you know, no, I definitely,I agree.
(36:20):
I, I have a positive outlook.
I think, you know, we've, we'veproven that we've done some cool
stuff.
Like, like I said, the humpbackwhale, for example, you know,
they're in the Atlantic, they'renot listed as end danger or
threatened anymore.
And that's, that's huge, youknow?
Oh, I mean, they still, in otherparts of the world are not in
good shape at all, but just, itcan be done.
We just have to kind of worktogether and, and just again, be
(36:41):
better educated.
That's about it.
I totally agree.
Well, look, we're gonna have todo this again soon.
Yes.
You know, watch yourself withthe shark frenzy.
I will, because you know,they're gonna want you to say
things that, you know, they'regonna say.
Yep.
Oh, these white sharks they'reeverywhere.
Right?
What happens?
What happened to that one whiteshark that we've seen all
(37:02):
shriveled up on the beach?
Yeah.
Like on every station, everyfive minutes, but Yeah.
So, anyway again, Chris, I, Ican't thank enough.
I really enjoy everything fromyour wood ducks to I mean,
literally everything, you know,my wife, I'm like, look at this
(37:23):
guy.
Yeah, my social media channelchanges with the season.
So it's a little fishier now in,in the winter time, it's a
little bit more terrestrial, butyeah, you can, you can, everyone
can follow me on Phish guyphotos on Instagram, Facebook,
Twitter, YouTube, Vimeo.
I'm even on TikTok.
But you can get me at all thosedifferent places.
Again.
Phish guy photos, all one wordthere.
And no, George it's been great.
(37:44):
Yes, Chris, we'll have to do itagain and enjoy your shark week.
Thanks.
You too.
Thank you.
Bye bye.
Once again, I'd like to thankChris for his insights and for
his time, he is a busy guy rightnow.
He's kind of like Quint.
Everybody's calling him aboutshark fishing.
(38:05):
But truthfully, when you speakto him, he's like the furthest
thing from Quint.
But in any case, we are nowdealing with like a strange
phenomena.
The sharks are so far have beensmall.
I'm not one of these people thatthink like you gotta look out.
I don't think, that these dronesand all this other stuff,
(38:27):
they're gonna find the sharks.
They've always been there.
They've been there for years.
I've seen pictures of thousandssharks right off shore of fire
island.
They've been there forever.
So what's happening, I believeis these Fisher starting to
return.
Remember they're they're on theendangered species list.
They're almost totally bite.
(38:48):
So now they're starting toreturn and we do have the bait
ensure.
So they don't for the bait.
And you know, this is somethingwe have to deal for a couple of
weeks.
It's no big deal is this is notjaws.
So as much as I did wanna playthat theme song, like to open
this whole thing, but I didn'tdo that.
(39:10):
I thought it was gonna be alittle cheesy, but it's not
yours.
Are these fish?
Right now are small.
All the bites have been minor.
I don't wanna downplay too much,but they have been so look,
don't bite on no pun intended onthe first thing.
You're going to hear about howto fix it.
(39:30):
And I'm telling you, I said thislast week, when it first
started, that they're gonna saywe have too many bunk.
Ensure, and that they're gonnawant to take some out.
It would be the worst thing forus with those bunker leave the
Eagle population, which isstarting to grow the osprays
that are, that are flourishing,the bass that are following
(39:54):
those, those bunker up and downthe coast, as well as the blue
fish and everything else.
So don't bite on that.
No pun intended.
Let's not give up this, thisbait fishery that we have that
most, any state would love tohave.
(40:15):
Let's not give it up.
You know, Chesapeake bay fish inthere are starving.
Here are fish are thriving.
We've seen pictures of theStriped bass.
We're catching here, and I'venever seen so many big, healthy
looking fish.
So don't bite on the bunker.
Yes.
What Chris said was true.
(40:36):
And if you could harvest alittle bit more fine, but it's
gotta be local commercialfishermen.
I don't want omega coming backin with their giant processing
ships, pulling the bunker,because if they do kiss the
whales goodbye to dolphin,goodbye forget the bluefin
fishery.
It'll be just like, it was 20years ago cuz you know this
(40:59):
bill, I know they said it was2019.
This didn't happen three years.
There was a much stronger billthat was passed early, you know,
years ago.
And since then we are seeingfine results.
So don't bite on that.
You know, this is just a strangephenomena.
It's not gonna continue.
And if it does find anotherbeach to go to, I don't think we
(41:23):
should kill all our bunker justto allow.
X amount of people who goswimming for eight weeks a year.
I'm sorry, I just don't buy itin any case.
I'm I'll be back again.
Next week.
I have Billy, the Greek is gonnabe on talking surf fishing for
Striped bass at this time ofyear.
(41:45):
And I'm reaching out to a fewpeople to talk about the big
Kobe that are being caught andhow they're catching them.
I hear they just run'em with.
With bunker bunker schools thatlook like they're being beat up.
So I guess they're kind offishing strip it.
I mean, I don't know.
'em just guessing I don't knowenough about that fishery, but I
(42:05):
will, for the next episode, Ihope to have it out right around
this time next week.
And again, I'd like to thankChris.
I'd like to thank all mylisteners.
I'd like to thank Glen over atNew York, angler.com.
Otherwise known.
As the general, that's where youcan find me as well, as
(42:27):
thousands of really smartSharpie anglers.
And we're not stuck up andthere's no person in fighting
and there's no politics allowed,even though there's times, even
I have to bite my lip, but yeah,come visit us new york
angler.com.
(42:48):
Sign.
We got a lot in store coming upfor this season.
And once again, thanks forlistening.
Make sure that you click thesubscribe buttons so you will
get notifications every time.
There's a new one and be sure totake advantage of the phenomenal
fishing that we have.
(43:09):
And I know the weather's tough,you know, like today the fish
would probably be cooked by thetime you got it in, but that's
how it goes.
The fishing's been great time toget out and enjoy.
And once again, thanks forlistening and good luck and good
(43:30):
fishing.
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York fishing podcast.
My name is George Scocca.
I will be your host here againfor another wonderful episode,
brought to you by N myr.com.
New York anglers reporting onthe New York fishing.
(00:23):
So today I speak with ChrisPatro.
This episode is kind ofdedicated to the news of the
week, but there are other issuesthat we discuss.
And Chris is really up onthings, very educated on things
as the best social media.
A content that I know I enjoyhis the most, and he is very
(00:49):
educated on what's going on.
And I kind of wanted to get awayfrom this hype, this whole thing
with this sharking going on.
So we talked to him about thatand a few other things.
So without further ado, I amgoing to go to the interview,
which we had this morning.
(01:11):
I would like to welcome ChrisPaparo to the show.
Chris is pretty much an expertabout everything that I don't
know, not only swims, but fliesand nests around long island.
He has by far, in my opinion,the best social media, photos
(01:32):
and videos.
You can find anywhere, someamazing stuff, Chris, and you
always seem, I, I I've said thisbefore.
How does this guy did all thisstuff, you know, it's like you
see things I've been on thewater for, I don't know, 40
years.
And you see stuff every day thatlike I've never seen before.
So yeah, no, it's, I, I, as youknow, I spend a lot of time in
(01:56):
and around and on the water.
There's not a day that goes bywhere I'm not at least at the
beach for a few minutes, youknow, and I always have a camera
or a drone or something with meto try to capture something
something to share with thepublic.
Well, it's pretty amazing.
And, and I really urge everyoneto follow the Phish photo guy.
And he'll, he'll give you allthe info at the end of the show.
(02:20):
So Chris, I wanted to discuss acouple things.
Few of my pet peeves areobviously yours.
And, and actually just about allanglers and concerned, anglers,
those of us that.
Chris Paparo (02:31):
You know, on the water a lot.
And that's this time of year,all the garbage, all the Mylar
balloons and all like thedisregard that people have.
I mean, they let balloons go andthey think, I think they think
they're going to heaven, butyeah.
You know can you talk, I, I knowyou, you, you know, you're
(02:53):
making an effort to bring this.
Yeah.
I mean, you know, for those thatfollow me on Phish guy photos
you know, that I rarely postnegative stuff, you know, for
no, I know for the most part,for the most part, I like to
post focus on the positive cuzyou know what, there is a lot of
stuff, wrong out you with ourenvironment and, and the world
around us.
But you know, there are otherpeople that talk about that.
And I think what happens ispeople get.
(03:14):
Bombarded with the tomb andgloom and they just don't care
anymore.
So that's why I try to likeshowcase all the really cool
stuff and positive things thatare happening here.
But like you mentioned, thereare just a few things that irk
me and one of them by far hasgotta be balloons, you know?
And I mean, you know, you spendtime on the water, you can't go
off shore or actually not evenoff shore, just you can't go in
the bay, the ocean.
(03:35):
And honestly, I spend a lot oftime in the woods.
You'd be amaz the amount ofballoons I find in the woods.
They're not, it's not just aMarine problem.
What happens is, you know, I'llfind trash out on the, you know,
around about.
And, you know, I often like to,I like to think that maybe it's
there cuz it's by accident felloff of something blew away, but
all the balloons that are outthere are there because somebody
(03:57):
let it go and you know, so theydid that on purpose.
So for me, it just seems like areally easy fix.
To just not buy them in thefirst place.
You know, don't release, don'trelease some or, you know,
better yet just don't buy'em.
I tell a lot of people I'm like,you know, I've been to parties
with balloons.
I've been to parties withoutballoons.
There's no difference.
But what I would do is take yourballoon money and buy better
food or better yet buy betterbeer, you know, spend the money
(04:20):
on other stuff.
Cause like you said, it goes upit, you know, I, I picked up one
the other day and it was, youknow, oh, pop pop.
We really miss you.
We love you so much.
XO, XO.
And I, I feel really bad thatthey lost pop pop.
I really do.
But all that balloon is gonna dois potentially send a sea turtle
to heaven, to be with pop pop,you know, like don't, don't do
(04:42):
that just, and, you know, yeah.
Just so that just to me is evenworse, you know, it, it's not
going to heaven.
It's just going up and comingdown and potentially entangling
some sort of wild.
Well, I mean, we saw photos.
I suspect you saw him.
Chris be had posted last year,literally.
Yeah.
With, with a turtle, with aballoon around his neck and you
(05:02):
know, out west, this is, theydeal with the same thing there.
And the guys in Californiathey're tournaments, they
actually have a separate awardfor the person who brings in the
most, my law balloons duringtheir tournaments.
So what we did that.
So we did that this summer.
So I'm, as you know, I'm part ofthe south fork, natural history,
museum's shark research team.
(05:24):
Mm-hmm and the last two summers.
Now we've done a balloontournament and it's a$25 entry
fee.
And this year we went for twomonths.
And what happens is we allowpeople to find balloons, land,
air, sea by boat, by shore.
New York, New Jersey,Connecticut, and whoever
collects the most balloons winsa trip for two to go take sharks
with us that summer.
(05:45):
Wow.
And for us, it's a great way to,you know, raise some money for
our research.
You know, we're not for profit,right.
But it's a great way to getpeople aware of this problem,
you know, and I, the numbershaven't come in yet, but the
last I heard tallys they pickedup well over 2000 balloons.
Yeah.
And that's, you know, that'sjust one.
(06:05):
Mo, you know, one group that'sorganized doing it and yeah.
I mean, like you say, you can'tgo out, especially this time of
year, you got your weddings, yougot your, you know, graduations
mm-hmm birthdays, 4th of July.
Yeah.
I mean, it's, it is kind ofridiculous.
And, and the thing is I trulybelieve a few.
Here's a, there's a few things.
(06:26):
First of all, there is a billactually by a Congresswoman in
Westchester.
To eliminate the sale of morethan 25 bylaw balloons.
Now we've been in touch withthat office.
She seems willing.
I mean, I think that a simple,you can't release the balloons.
(06:46):
It's illegal period.
The same way you can't throw apiece of paper out on the side
of the.
George Scocca (06:51):
Why should you be able to release those balloons?
Well, up in, up until only acouple years ago, the law for
Suffolk county, the way it waswritten in the books, it was
unlawful to release 25 or more.
So you could release 24 everyday.
And that was perfectly legal,right.
Which is just absurd.
That that was even per, as alaw.
like, it just doesn't make anysense.
(07:12):
So here, I know in Suffolkcounty, or at least on the east
end, a lot of the local townshave banned the sale of
balloons, you know, And a lot ofpeople, like when I post these
balloons, they're like, see, butwe should, we Bann it.
Why are they still here?
They drift far.
So, you know, we can ban'em inthe state of New York, but I
guarantee more though, thoseballoons are coming from the
west.
You know, you gotta remember,they go off, they drift.
(07:33):
So a balloon released off ofeast Hampton.
Is gonna float out over theocean and be somebody else, some
problem out out further, it'snot gonna go to Jersey or
Pennsylvania.
It's gonna, you know, so itreally needs to be a large scale
passing of this to bandreleasing of these balloons, you
know, to, yeah.
I mean, that's gotta be the wayto go cuz once you try to stop
the sale of something, forgetit.
(07:55):
The, the, you know, I dealt onthe legislative end.
Very heavily.
And once you try to stop someoneand they're like, oh, you're
gonna put me outta visit.
And the other thing is, youknow, maybe we can find funding
or someone can find funding tosimply educate the people.
Yeah.
That don't, that's what I try todo.
I really don't think peoplerealize, like they don't think,
(08:18):
you know, they let it go.
And, and I think if someonesays, you know, look, this is
what's happening.
Please don't release them.
Here's how you should dispose ofthem and just give a card or a
sheet or whatever.
Yeah.
You know, well, you're a hunyou're a hundred percent, right.
Cuz when I first started postingabout the balloon things a few
years back, you know, I hadquite a few people say.
(08:40):
I had no idea, you know, and,and then they're like, I will
never release a balloon again.
And I'm like, all right, Ireached someone and I know that
person is then gonna tell theirfriends.
And so like, it's an educationalthing.
And well, you know, I, I'm not afan of laws and, and rules and
all this other stuff, you know,I'd much rather just.
Get people better educated, likereally get them educated about
(09:03):
cases what's going on.
Yeah.
In many cases that absolutelydoes work.
All right.
So let's move on.
The balloons are a problem.
I, you know, there's gotta be agroup out there where we can all
get together one day and maybethere's a weekend next year.
We'll see where there's a bunchof tournaments going on.
And we can, you know, basicallymaybe pull'em all together and
(09:27):
work together.
Yeah.
Because I know every singletournament direct anyone that
fishes, it knows this is aproblem and knows it needs to be
dealt with.
So you dealt with it, you know,this is.
See, like years ago we hadgroups we could go to and say,
Hey, look, guys, help us withthis right now.
We don't have that.
But but we'll be able to get theword out.
(09:48):
So.
All right.
So the next thing again, I don'twant to go negative, but I
caught a video of a dive whereit literally looked like a junk
you at the bottom.
Of the bridge.
And I was, I was wondering ifyou could talk a little bit
about that and what you guys areseeing, because I, I was
(10:09):
shocked.
Yeah.
So, you know, I mean, again,it's not just above the surface
that there's garbage, there'sgarbage down below.
And this, this earlier thissummer, I was talking with Randy
Randazzo from Hampton divecenter in Riverhead.
And he was like, Hey, let's tryto organize.
A beach cleanup at P qu bridge.
You know, it's a place that wedive a lot.
(10:30):
I mean, me personally thatbridge has a lot of just
memories and it means a lot tome.
So I jumped on.
I was like, yeah, let's do it.
And you know, it's tough to getpermits and stuff in the
summertime cuz of parking andwhatnot.
But you know, we had about 20divers show up and we went down
and the bridge is a tough dive,you know, the current and the
visibility.
Wasn't great.
But.
As you saw, we pulled up quite abit of garbage, a lot of it,
(10:50):
fish and gear fishing line.
But then just a lot of justtrash, you know, bags and old
t-shirts and stuff.
So, I mean it was great and itwas a great way to get some of
that out.
There's still way more downthere.
But it was again, a way to bringawareness to it.
And we're gonna try to organizeanother one this fall.
So you could follow me or Randyat Hampton dive to kind of get
notified next time that we do.
(11:12):
Yeah, I'd actually like to goout there and see maybe I do,
maybe I don't cuz.
You know, like I'd like to havemore faith in people to realize
that they just can't throwgarbage in freaking water, but
you know, people still do it.
And yeah, but again, it's, it'san educational, it's an educate.
It's a way to educate people,you know, just so show showing
(11:33):
what we've brought up and, youknow, again, there was a lot
more down there.
You know, I brought my camera totry to document some of it.
I honestly should have left thecamera home.
Cause it was really tough tryingto cut stuff and bring stuff up,
which is one hand.
So.
Yeah.
So next time I'll probably leavethe camera home, but we'll but
yeah, we're gonna do it againand again, it's it's just every
little bit helps.
And again, it brings awarenessand yeah, exactly.
(11:56):
Let me tell you those, thosetype of thing, a video and a
photo brought to, I know youdon't like laws, but
unfortunately that's the way hisplace were, but you know, like
those photos are very.
Yeah.
You know, they're very helpfuland they, people look at that
and they go, you mean, this isgoing on under the water.
Well, yep.
(12:16):
That's exactly what's happening.
All right.
So another subject let's move onand, you know, please keep us in
touch on or me or whateverthrough your social channel on,
on that next dive.
I'd like, I'd really like toknow more about that.
And I think, you know, there'sfunding available for that type
of stuff, but that's a wholenother.
(12:36):
Whole nother thing.
All right.
So I I've been saying now for acouple of years, and I'm not the
only one, many scientistsresearchers.
I, I mean, I'm, I'm on the webof all time looking at this
stuff and it's the generalconsensus that we have warm
water fish.
Walmart fish are moving northand.
(12:58):
Fish that are traditionally incertain areas seem to be moving
north and offshore.
Now, when I follow your.
Your feed.
You know, I noticed earlier thisyear you mentioned how you're
seeing more and more tropicalfish earlier in the season.
So, you know, we are seeing alot of stuff.
(13:18):
That's, you know, look, it lookslike sea bad.
I mean, this year we have a lotof fluke.
I'm not gonna say the, the flukecan's been pretty good, but you
could tell kind of C bass andmove it in and, and starting to
move in on that territory.
Chris Paparo (13:32):
And I kind of feel like.
Little bit at a time, you know,they're gonna start taking over.
And I was wondering what yourtheory is on this whole thing.
I mean, we, we lost all, all thelobsters.
I believe it's due basically towater temperatures, but it could
be wrong.
We'd lost all the pecan basegallops.
There's just so much we lost inthe sound.
(13:54):
And I was wondering.
What your thoughts are.
Yeah.
If you have it and yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, so lobsters andscallops, there's a lot of
factors in play there, you know,lobsters in the sound, you know,
a lot of that was pollution.
A big part of that waspollution.
You know, temperature sure isdefinitely not helping there
(14:15):
either.
As far as the base scallopsresearchers at Stony Brook have
been looking into several.
Temperature disease harmfulalgal blooms, you know, again,
they're, they're facing a lot ofdifferent changes in the
environment all at once, whichis kind of not good for the
scallops.
So, so we're still trying tofigure that out.
As far as like the tropicalfish, you know, tropical fish
(14:38):
have been coming to long islandever since the Atlantic ocean
was formed.
Right.
And you know, they drift on theGulf stream.
And often when I, when I mentiontropical fish on long island
right away, everyone says, seeclimate change.
I told you, you know, and youknow, the ocean's changing.
The ocean's definitely gettingwarmer and the climate's getting
warmer.
You know, you can argue abouthow, and I'm not gonna get into
that.
I'm just saying, you know, youlook at numbers, it's happening.
(14:59):
It's you can argue all day longon how or why it's happening.
It's happening, but you know, sosome of these tropicals, I blame
it on that, but I'm like, again,they come in on the Gulf stream
and with that it's so variableyear to year, cuz it's all based
on winds, you know, right lastyear was actually a decent year
for tropical fish.
We had a lot of Southeast winds.
(15:20):
If you remember, there was likesix weeks in a row where it
just.
Constant constant winds outtathe south Southeast.
And we had all those Souths thatwashed in those clear little
tuna kits that covered thebeaches.
Right.
We had the Portuguese man ofwar.
Last year I found quite a fewbutterfly fish and angel fish.
I found some lion fish.
Prior to that the last fiveyears was horrible.
(15:42):
I didn't even go collecting cuzit was just so bad.
But why was that?
Well, most of the winds were outthe west Southwest, which just
pushes coastal water.
So a lot of those tropicalthings and it's not just small
stuff, you know, hammerheadsharks, tiger sharks.
They come in off the Gulfstreams.
So again, they can be variablewith the years as it goes.
But lately there's been a lotof, you know, things like Toby
(16:03):
being.
Sheep's head being caught blackdrums, you know, some of these
species, like the sheep's headand the black drum, you know,
they're oyster reef, fish.
We eradicated oysters on longisland years ago, you know?
Yeah.
My feeling as oysters are comingback is we're, you know, a lot
of organizations, includingStoneberg are putting'em out
there.
You're gonna start seeing a lotof these oyster reef, community
fish returning as well.
But then you're also what we'realso seeing is a, a shift north
(16:26):
of some population.
So as things warm up.
Things like Kobe, you know,would be common to maybe south
Jersey, you know, then theywould, their, their historical
range would be up to Cape Codhistorically that they've always
been there.
But, you know, as things warm,we're seeing them a little bit
more frequently, few more innumbers, you know, as, as
things, you know, as, as watertemperatures warm and, and you
(16:48):
mentioned sea bass, they'rehaving a problem in the Gulf of
Maine right now with sea bass,because that's a fish that
historically was not in the Gulfof Maine.
Right.
But is now in the Gulf of Maine,the problem there is, is they
eat lobsters.
I was gonna say, that's theirnumber one thing.
They eat the little bugs.
They swallow'em whole.
So now the lobster industry upin Maine is all freaking out
what to do because now we gotthese sea bass, you know, and
(17:11):
it's funny, everyone, when Imentioned stuff like that.
And.
You know, like tarp in, on longisland people like, oh my God,
that would be awesome.
I don't, you know, like I don'thave to go far to catch these
fish, but yeah.
Just think about what's goingon, where these fish normally
would be.
So it's not, you know, you startseeing tarp in on long island
regularly.
That's probably not good fordown south where they're
(17:32):
normally coming from.
So, you know, this is all stuffthat one you know, that needs a
lot more research into what'sexactly going on.
But you know, that's part ofwhat we're seeing is, is, you
know, these is this kind ofpopulation shift as, as things
warm up.
Right.
Right.
Yeah.
See, I mean, you mentioned Kobe,right?
So there's a prime example.
(17:53):
So let's say three, four yearsago, you know, I'm always
following the fishing.
So I'm following, what's beingcaught and what's happening.
I'm always looking at differentthings.
And I was like, you know, it'sstarting to catch some co.
George Scocca (18:06):
Some guys are actually, you know, targeting
them.
And then this year, I mean, Idon't know if you've seen the
fish, I mean, weighed in baypark is weighing in like, 30 40
50 pound fish every day.
Every day.
Yep.
And from what I used, well, youknow, keep in mind though there,
you know, COPI are on have, are,and have been on the books for
(18:26):
New York state as far as a sizelimit for a long time.
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
So it's it, you know, when, whenyou look at something like that,
that can't just be a, you know,like, oh, well just in case, you
know, they're, you know, they,they have them on the, the books
for a reason.
Well, it's funny because Ialways used to say, why do we
have that?
You know, like, and red fish,red fish are on the books too.
(18:47):
Exactly.
I'm like, why do we have those?
Well, it won't be long beforethe red fish comes up here.
Right?
Well, well, and they have, andthey have caught some red fish.
There was that guy.
I wasn't the name, Liz, Eliza, Ithink.
Oh yeah.
Yeah, he'd caught several redfish.
I don't, he never gave thelocation, but I know he fished
to the west, so, wow.
So he was picking some big bullsup here in long island.
(19:07):
So again, you know, I thinkthere's a lot of different
things going on with some ofthese fish that are here, you
know, is it a cycle?
Is it some of them just beingpushed for, for the north coast
of climate or populationsgrowing.
To maybe do to conservation.
A lot of these fish populationsare rebounding and growing and
spreading, you know, so there's,there's so many variables that
(19:29):
could be at play with some ofthese different species.
You know, I think everyone is, Ithink is gonna have to take a
little bit different of a youknow, look at on why.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, there is a targeted,you, you probably know this, but
right now there is, it's short.
It's less than a month, butthere's a targeted Tarpon
Fisher.
In Chesapeake bay, they'rethey're corn places in that bay.
(19:52):
I know fisherman mm-hmm two, twoto four weeks a year.
They literally catch tarp and inChesapeake bay, so, well, I
mean, I know a couplecommercial, I know a couple
commercial guys that get atleast one or two every year.
Inlanders.
You know, so, so they're therethey're there and I've had some
other locals that know theirstuff that said they have seen
(20:15):
tarp in, you know, coming up andtaking that breath and all that.
And they just, you know, I'venever heard of anyone catch one
on rod and real in long island,but, but you know, they, you
know, even for the, for theyears that I've been involved
with this, you know, 20, 20 plusyears, I've been seeing at least
one Tarpon every year from alocal fisherman commercial guy
usually usually caught in apound net or something like
(20:35):
that.
So, you know, again, it's, maybethey're not, you know, and
that's the thing.
There's things that we justdon't get to see because you
don't catch'em.
But these commercial guys, theysee all sorts of weird stuff,
cool stuff in their nets.
And then today with socialmedia, you know, back 20 years
ago, if somebody caught one, youdidn't see, maybe you saw a
picture that they had in theirwallet or something, but you
didn't.
(20:56):
Texted to a friend andeverything.
So, you know, some of that isalso I think, kind of taking
place too.
Yes, absolutely.
Totally agree.
All right.
So the last one, I'm sure.
It's your favorite one?
I'm I'm sure your phone isringing off the hook on this is
we enter, I think it's likeshark week or something coming
up on TV.
(21:16):
And so we've got thesesupposedly.
Ensure tiger sharks immature.
I mean, I think they can't.
How big could they be there?
Wasn't.
So I want, I want to correct youon that one.
Yeah.
So the media and some of thelocal politicians have been
claiming that tiger sharks aredoing these bites.
It's not tiger sharks.
(21:37):
They're sand tiger sharks.
I, what?
I said sand, but if I didn't, Itake the, no, you did.
Okay.
No, you, I, I heard you saytiger, but I've also, again,
it's been in the news that it'stiger sharks.
It's tiger shark.
And it's definitely no, it'snot.
It's a, because a bite from atiger shark is definitely gonna
leave a bigger mark than a sandtiger shark.
So yeah.
So can you explain to us why?
(21:59):
I mean, you know, you hear allthese bites and this and that,
and then you're reading a paper.
Oh man, the guy got twostitches.
I'm like, He got, I get a biggerbite from a blue fish, you know,
sometimes so.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I'm wondering, I mean, mythought is that that's
supposedly a popping ground, nottoo far from there.
(22:19):
Yes.
And you've got these little fishcoming in.
On bait.
Or just because there's more nowthan there were before, or maybe
there could be a milliondifferent things, right.
It's a, you know, it's a, it's alot, it's a lot of different
things.
Just like everything that we'vebeen talking about.
There's no really one, you know,thing, you know, the species
such as the SANDAG or thesandbar, the dusky, they were
(22:41):
heavily fished in the seventiesand eighties, you know,
especially for the fin market.
Right.
You know, they're all thosethree are prohibited species,
which, which means you're noteven allowed to target them for
catch and release.
So a lot of these shore basesurf fishermen that are
targeting sand Tiger's duskysand sandbars, it's completely
against the law.
(23:01):
You know, and if you happen tobe blue fishing and catch one of
these.
You're not allowed to drag itoutta the water.
You're not allowed to takepictures with, you know, you
gotta release it as quickly aspossible.
So I mean, just that there.
So they are still prohibited andbecause of protections, many of
these populations are startingto rebound, right?
So it's a sign of like asuccessful conservation efforts.
(23:22):
Absolutely.
And as you mentioned, you know,the sand tigers, you know my
colleagues at the New Yorkaquarium, they've been studying
a nursery, a sand nursery ingreat south bay, and they've had
years of data of sharksreturning and, you know, so
it's, so again, we got allthese, like these little
nurseries, my work at the museumsouth for natural history
museum, you know, we, we put apaper out that proved that long
(23:45):
island bite.
Is it pumping is, is a nursery,not a pumping up, sorry, nursery
ground for young of the yearwhite sharks.
Right.
You know, and it's, and, and alot of the work we do we're
starting to, you know, look atthe fact that you know, many of
these species, this might be anursery ground.
You know, we we're catchingdusky sharks that still have
umbilical scars.
Wow.
You know, so it's like, theseare pups, these are all young
(24:07):
ones.
So again, so a lot of thesesharks are young.
That's why you're seeing, likeyou said, two stitches, three
stitches.
They're smaller sharks.
They're feeding on bait fish,you know, and the one.
With these sharks is they don'thave hands.
So when they wanna investigatesomething, they bite, you know,
that's a good point.
And that's so like, you know,for example, you know, the
lifeguard at Smith point, thatwas bit, you know, he was doing
(24:30):
his training exercise.
He was playing a victimthrashing kicking around well
sharks.
Can sense that they have theAmul eye of Lauren Zini that
they can pick up on thoseelectric pulses.
So right.
They go in thinking, oh, maybethere's a big fish dying and I'm
gonna take a chunk out of itand, you know, get an easy,
quick meal and they go over andthey get up close and they go,
what is this thing?
And they take a bite and they'relike, ah, that's not a fish.
(24:51):
It's got bones.
I can't break through.
So even a, if these sharks,yeah.
Right.
But even if these sharks wantedto eat you, they physically
can't, they don't have the jawstructure or the teeth to break
bone and all that kind.
Thank you because I've beensaying that no exist that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So that's, I mean, that's someof what's going on there, you
know, they're coming into feedon bunker, you know, you know,
(25:14):
as you've been involved with alot of that conservation work,
mm-hmm, you know, we're seeingmore bunker than we've ever seen
before.
Which as not only fueled sharks,but that's why we're seeing all
the whales and dolphins.
And I like to use thatcomparison because it's the.
That's funny because whales werehunted to extinction.
Yes.
Near ex near extinction.
Yes.
So we're, you know, sharks werehammered with, by fishing
(25:36):
pressure, both of the return,but nobody gets upset when
there's a whale.
they get upset when there's ashark, but we're seeing.
More whales, which also ismeaning we're seeing more boat
strikes, you know?
Right.
And it's not because we'redriving more aggressive, more
whales.
There's gonna be moreencounters, more sharks.
There's a better chance of moreencounters.
(25:56):
So a lot of it ends up being thenumbers game.
When you, when you start lookingat that kind of stuff, you know,
and then let's face it.
The waters are much cleaner.
You be fishing these waterslonger than I have.
You could probably attest tothat better than I can.
Oh, absolutely.
Even the sound.
I mean, I'm amazed at how clearthe sound is.
And any, you know, way you go tothe water really is I think has
(26:18):
improved dramatically.
I mean, we haven't seen that youknow, bring any.
Great increase of, you know,life into these bays being that
we dump well, you know, as wellas I do more sewage than you can
imagine, but sure.
But look, everything we're stilllooking good that, and we're
still seeing problems.
It's not, yeah.
I don't wanna say that ourenvironment is pristine.
(26:40):
You know, we still see.
Brown tides, rust tides.
You know, we're seeing redtides.
So, you know, some of our baysare still very problem.
It's not, we're not done.
We're not outta the woods, butwhat I like to just point out is
look, it's possible to makechanges.
You know, we can do things,right?
So again, it all comes down toeducation.
If we could just better educatepeople on little things, you
(27:03):
know, you don't always have to,you know, Lifestyle changes,
just minor little things hereand there.
Just to, if everyone did that,they make such differences.
And again, it's just, it's justbeing better educated on what's
around us.
I totally, I couldn't agree withyou more.
And I, you know, what it amazesme is how the news is jumping
(27:25):
all over this.
I see you all over the place whoquote a news date today.
And I hear you've beeninterviewed by a bunch of
people.
Being that, you know, what'sgoing on.
But I have to say if I see onemore picture that dead white
shark I mean, oh my God.
I mean, it was on every state.
(27:45):
I'm like last year, four ofthose things washed up to our
cost of the year.
Yeah.
And nobody even cared about it.
You know, it was a timing thing.
I was, so it was, you know, itwas a quiet weekend.
The media kind of got quiet andthen my social media lit up with
that shark.
And then within minutes, myphone was off the hook and it's
how crazy is it rare?
Is it odd?
(28:05):
Is it this?
And like, no, they're here.
I just, and I would have toreiterate, you know, we've,
we've proven this is a nurseryground, you know, there, this,
these sharks most likely were bycatch, you know at least some of
the ones that we've found whenwe do the knee crops, either,
either have hooks in.
Or signs of commercialinteraction, you know, like tra
or Gill, net or something alongthose lines, but again, right.
(28:28):
There's, there's, you know,they're here, you know, and
that's, that's, what's gonnahappen, but yeah, it's just,
it's, it's a hysteria thing.
And I think it's because, youknow, it's movies, it's
Hollywood, it's, it's been putin our heads that we have to be
afraid, you know, but last year,You know, getting back to like
the shark attack thing, youknow, there were 73 unprovoked
attacks worldwide, you know,2000 people on average a year
(28:50):
die in New York state in caraccidents.
Oh yeah.
But nobody gets like, we're notfreaking out about that, you
know 4,000 people in the us dieevery year drowning.
Yeah.
But again, people still goswimming.
So that's where I, I get, youknow, you see the news and
people like I'll never go inswimming.
But you'll get in your car.
There's a better chance you'regoing to die in your car.
(29:10):
You know?
So that kind of stuff alwayskind of gets me.
I just wish people had a fear oftheir cars.
Like they do of sharks.
We'd all be safer.
Right.
You know, and that's, those arelike the things, but again, it
ends up becoming Hollywood.
We're not desensitized to it.
Like where it's just a common,everyday thing, you know?
You know, then there's, there's,there's a, I guess, so there's
also that, just that primal fearof sharks, you know, I mean it's
(29:33):
yeah.
Oh yeah.
Something fr, you know, so I, Ido understand some of that, but
like I said, I also, at the samepoint don't understand why
people don't get upset aboutthose other things that I
mentioned, because there's abetter chance there than, than
the shark thing.
Well, you know what, I think itdoesn't make as good a news half
the time.
Sure.
The other, the other thing.
Like you say, people are paraafraid.
(29:54):
They get in the water.
They don't know what's there.
But I mean, look at in New York,I don't know if anyone's ever
actually been killed by a sharkbite.
No.
In New York, no, nobody's diedin New York.
So, you know, I mean, so there'sa couple little bites on a beach
now they're making this huge,they got drones.
They got this they're higher.
(30:15):
Like it's jaws, like they'regonna go around.
Right.
And with that though, I UN youknow, and with that though, I
understand all that becausenobody wants to be the mayor
from jaws.
Right.
Right now.
Yeah.
The features are safe.
Go ahead.
So, you know, so they're puttingup the drones, they're
increasing patrols.
Do I think it's gonna help?
Sure.
It'll get people, maybe just,again, more aware of what's
(30:37):
going on around them, but youknow, and more relaxed maybe
that they, yeah.
Maybe more relax and.
Yeah, but the beaches because ofthat are gonna be closed more
often.
I mean, absolutely.
As we started this conversation,you said how I'm always finding
this find out, cause I'm lookingright.
We've never been looking forsharks on the beach or at least
lifeguards and patrollers.
And so once they start looking,they're gonna be like me,
(30:58):
they're gonna find them whenthey go out in the morning,
they're gonna be there, youknow, so, right.
Yeah.
So again, but that's gonna bejust something we just have to
understand and kind of go with,you know, and right, right.
Realize that sharks.
Our crucial part of theenvironment.
You know, we need them as muchas we need the Striped best that
we enjoy and, you know, and thesummer flounder, you know, it's
all, it's all connected.
(31:18):
I don't care what you agree.
It's all connected.
Yeah.
I, and you know, I'm a littlebit nervous when D C issued a
statement in Newsday that it'sthe amount of bait fish due to
their change.
In in 19, remember they madethat change and stopped the, in
(31:41):
saw the inside pair walls.
So.
So they're saying, you know bydoing that, we have more fish.
And my answer to that is letnature take care of itself.
Sure.
I mean, do we need somethingcalled a reduction boat to come
in and take bunker out of thewater?
I mean, it's ludicrous, soright.
We gotta, and at that samepoint, they're gonna end up
(32:03):
catching sharks, bass,everything that's also there.
And, you know, you know whathappens with the stuff that
doesn't.
Is not, they're not their targetspecies, you know, that just
gets discarded.
Right.
You know?
So what impact would that have?
So, I mean, yeah.
It's, you know, it's funny.
I have seen people like it's allthe Bunker's fault, you know,
it's like, all right, well,let's get rid of bunker.
Well then the whales go away.
(32:24):
Right?
The tuna, the blue tuna thathave been all over the place, go
away, gone.
The dolphin go away.
I mean, it, it's not just thesharks.
Exactly.
It, it fuels everything, youknow, everything eats bunker.
It's the most important fish inour ocean.
Abso and birds too.
Yeah.
That's what I mean, everythingbirds, crabs, fish.
I mean, when they wash up on theshore, you get land down like
(32:45):
raccoons and things, you know,it's, it's everything, there's
it, you know, it's thera, it'severything eats them.
So yeah, it's, it's animportant.
It's an important fish.
And I, you know, again, and I'mnot the type who says, all
right, we shouldn't harvest anybunker.
You know, I'm not, I'm not likethat at all.
I just responsible harvest, Ithink is what we just need to
keep in mind.
Again, if the bunk, if thebunker population's at the point
(33:08):
where it can sustain a littlebit more harvest, I'm not
against that, but I'm just, Ijust wanna make sure that it's
being done responsibly andlooking at the big ecosystem,
not just somebody's, you know,pocket on what they're making.
Yes.
You know, I agree and disagreein the sense that they think
that that's gonna.
Right.
It's not.
Yeah, I truly don't believe.
(33:30):
Let's say, they're gonna say,okay, let's take out, you know,
let's hit the bunker that are in30 feet of water, less or
whatever, and that's not gonnahelp anything.
No.
So it's not gonna stop anything,you know, as well as I do, those
shocks have been there forever.
They have been there forever.
They're just doing better nowbecause of our conservation.
(33:51):
Sure.
So, I mean, that's how I feelanyway.
Yeah, no, and I, I, I, I agreewith you.
I, like I said, what I look,what I look at is, you know, we
often as anglers, you know, wesay, well, there's so many CBAs,
why won't they give us moreCBAs?
We should be able to get moreCBA, you know?
Well, that should apply toeverything.
Then that that's where I guesswhat I'm getting at, you know?
So if there are more bunkerwell, and they should be allowed
to harness a little bit more ABabsolutely.
(34:12):
I guess that's, that's just whatI'm saying.
Cuz sometimes we get it like.
Only what's best for us, youknow?
And I, yeah, no, I look at thebig picture and like, I'm, I am,
I am for sustainable fisheries.
Like if it's, if it'ssustainable and they can
increase the take on it, thenI'm all for it, you know?
But again, it's gotta be.
Sustainable, you know, andthat's guess that's, that's what
(34:33):
kind of what I was getting at.
Yeah.
I'm not, no, I agree.
I totally not a fan.
I'm a fan of calls and all, cuzit, you know, calls have been
proven not to work, you know,just, that's just, you know,
other things move in when youpull out other stuff.
So it, it's not a exactly.
Yeah.
You know, the only way callswork is wiping out, just like we
did with the sharks and thewhales and the seals, you know,
(34:54):
when they're hunted to nearextinction, then you don't have
a problem with those animals.
But you know, I mean, but youneed.
You need them you're part of thewhole overall ecosystem.
Yep.
So, all right, well, Chris, I'lllet you go.
You gotta get your hat done cuzyou, you, you might be on TV
tonight.
but did I give you like a makeupperson or.
(35:16):
No most of this has been zoom,so it, yeah, most of it's been
zoom it's, you know, cause I'mall the way on south Hampton.
So very rarely do they want tocome all the way out here, you
know?
Cause this is the end of theworld.
Well, I, well, everything's zoomtoday.
It's, it's a good way for themto save money.
Anyhow, you know?
Yeah.
So, and you know what you'redoing on zoom?
I'm sure you'll have a nicebackground and oh yeah, you'll
(35:37):
be all set up.
So we need to do this again.
I, you know, later on, I reallyenjoy speaking with you.
You and I.
Really on the same level.
And I I'm telling you, I knowfor a fact we can make real
change, especially now with theleadership we have in place and
either way, you know, I mean, Iknow I don't wanna get
(35:59):
political, but you know, Zeldahas always been a good friend of
ours and HOK seemed hours andHule seems to be as concerned as
anybody else about a fisheries.
So hopefully moving forward, Youknow, will be able to put things
in place and I'm sure they'regonna wanna clean up.
So, you know, no, I definitely,I agree.
(36:20):
I, I have a positive outlook.
I think, you know, we've, we'veproven that we've done some cool
stuff.
Like, like I said, the humpbackwhale, for example, you know,
they're in the Atlantic, they'renot listed as end danger or
threatened anymore.
And that's, that's huge, youknow?
Oh, I mean, they still, in otherparts of the world are not in
good shape at all, but just, itcan be done.
We just have to kind of worktogether and, and just again, be
(36:41):
better educated.
That's about it.
I totally agree.
Well, look, we're gonna have todo this again soon.
Yes.
You know, watch yourself withthe shark frenzy.
I will, because you know,they're gonna want you to say
things that, you know, they'regonna say.
Yep.
Oh, these white sharks they'reeverywhere.
Right?
What happens?
What happened to that one whiteshark that we've seen all
(37:02):
shriveled up on the beach?
Yeah.
Like on every station, everyfive minutes, but Yeah.
So, anyway again, Chris, I, Ican't thank enough.
I really enjoy everything fromyour wood ducks to I mean,
literally everything, you know,my wife, I'm like, look at this
(37:23):
guy.
Yeah, my social media channelchanges with the season.
So it's a little fishier now in,in the winter time, it's a
little bit more terrestrial, butyeah, you can, you can, everyone
can follow me on Phish guyphotos on Instagram, Facebook,
Twitter, YouTube, Vimeo.
I'm even on TikTok.
But you can get me at all thosedifferent places.
Again.
Phish guy photos, all one wordthere.
And no, George it's been great.
(37:44):
Yes, Chris, we'll have to do itagain and enjoy your shark week.
Thanks.
You too.
Thank you.
Bye bye.
Once again, I'd like to thankChris for his insights and for
his time, he is a busy guy rightnow.
He's kind of like Quint.
Everybody's calling him aboutshark fishing.
(38:05):
But truthfully, when you speakto him, he's like the furthest
thing from Quint.
But in any case, we are nowdealing with like a strange
phenomena.
The sharks are so far have beensmall.
I'm not one of these people thatthink like you gotta look out.
I don't think, that these dronesand all this other stuff,
(38:27):
they're gonna find the sharks.
They've always been there.
They've been there for years.
I've seen pictures of thousandssharks right off shore of fire
island.
They've been there forever.
So what's happening, I believeis these Fisher starting to
return.
Remember they're they're on theendangered species list.
They're almost totally bite.
(38:48):
So now they're starting toreturn and we do have the bait
ensure.
So they don't for the bait.
And you know, this is somethingwe have to deal for a couple of
weeks.
It's no big deal is this is notjaws.
So as much as I did wanna playthat theme song, like to open
this whole thing, but I didn'tdo that.
(39:10):
I thought it was gonna be alittle cheesy, but it's not
yours.
Are these fish?
Right now are small.
All the bites have been minor.
I don't wanna downplay too much,but they have been so look,
don't bite on no pun intended onthe first thing.
You're going to hear about howto fix it.
(39:30):
And I'm telling you, I said thislast week, when it first
started, that they're gonna saywe have too many bunk.
Ensure, and that they're gonnawant to take some out.
It would be the worst thing forus with those bunker leave the
Eagle population, which isstarting to grow the osprays
that are, that are flourishing,the bass that are following
(39:54):
those, those bunker up and downthe coast, as well as the blue
fish and everything else.
So don't bite on that.
No pun intended.
Let's not give up this, thisbait fishery that we have that
most, any state would love tohave.
(40:15):
Let's not give it up.
You know, Chesapeake bay fish inthere are starving.
Here are fish are thriving.
We've seen pictures of theStriped bass.
We're catching here, and I'venever seen so many big, healthy
looking fish.
So don't bite on the bunker.
Yes.
What Chris said was true.
(40:36):
And if you could harvest alittle bit more fine, but it's
gotta be local commercialfishermen.
I don't want omega coming backin with their giant processing
ships, pulling the bunker,because if they do kiss the
whales goodbye to dolphin,goodbye forget the bluefin
fishery.
It'll be just like, it was 20years ago cuz you know this
(40:59):
bill, I know they said it was2019.
This didn't happen three years.
There was a much stronger billthat was passed early, you know,
years ago.
And since then we are seeingfine results.
So don't bite on that.
You know, this is just a strangephenomena.
It's not gonna continue.
And if it does find anotherbeach to go to, I don't think we
(41:23):
should kill all our bunker justto allow.
X amount of people who goswimming for eight weeks a year.
I'm sorry, I just don't buy itin any case.
I'm I'll be back again.
Next week.
I have Billy, the Greek is gonnabe on talking surf fishing for
Striped bass at this time ofyear.
(41:45):
And I'm reaching out to a fewpeople to talk about the big
Kobe that are being caught andhow they're catching them.
I hear they just run'em with.
With bunker bunker schools thatlook like they're being beat up.
So I guess they're kind offishing strip it.
I mean, I don't know.
'em just guessing I don't knowenough about that fishery, but I
(42:05):
will, for the next episode, Ihope to have it out right around
this time next week.
And again, I'd like to thankChris.
I'd like to thank all mylisteners.
I'd like to thank Glen over atNew York, angler.com.
Otherwise known.
As the general, that's where youcan find me as well, as
(42:27):
thousands of really smartSharpie anglers.
And we're not stuck up andthere's no person in fighting
and there's no politics allowed,even though there's times, even
I have to bite my lip, but yeah,come visit us new york
angler.com.
(42:48):
Sign.
We got a lot in store coming upfor this season.
And once again, thanks forlistening.
Make sure that you click thesubscribe buttons so you will
get notifications every time.
There's a new one and be sure totake advantage of the phenomenal
fishing that we have.
(43:09):
And I know the weather's tough,you know, like today the fish
would probably be cooked by thetime you got it in, but that's
how it goes.
The fishing's been great time toget out and enjoy.
And once again, thanks forlistening and good luck and good
(43:30):
fishing.
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