June 26, 2023 • 51 mins
Ever wondered why Cobia fishery has been booming in our local waters? Join us as we chat with Jimmy Furch Jr., a young angler with invaluable insights working at Bay Park Marina, to uncover the secrets behind the explosive growth of this incredible Cobia fishery. From tactics and techniques to environmental changes, we leave no stone unturned in our pursuit of understanding this fascinating phenomenon.
We also tackle the inshore tuna bite, exploring what might be driving yellowfin and bluefin species further inshore. With insights from marine ecologist Dr. Dan Creer, we discuss the massive, unseen underwater transitions and the impact on various fisheries, such as the lobster in Long Island Sound. With a focus on sustainability, we explore how changing ocean conditions due to climate change could affect the future of fishing and marine life.
Don't miss this exciting episode packed with expert advice, environmental perspectives, and the importance of sustainable fishing practices. Get ready to be enthralled by the world of Cobia, inshore tuna, and the ever-changing ocean environment. So subscribe now and join us on this journey to uncover the mysteries of the deep and become a more knowledgeable, responsible angler.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
George Scocca (00:00):
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York Fishing Podcast.
My name is George Scaca and Iam your host.
So today we have a discussionon Cobia why they're here, how
they got here and how to catchhim.
(00:20):
Now that they're around, ispeak with Jimmy Furch Jr.
He works or I don't know if hestill does, but I think he does
over at Bay Park, marietum.
Whether he does or not.
big shout out to those guys.
They have always been bigsupporters of mine and my
(00:42):
brother, who is no longer withus.
So those folks over there, theywere weighing in Cobia.
I saw them.
They were over like 70 pounds.
I didn't even know they gotthat big.
Sorry, i'm not educated on them.
I'm always working on what wehave here, but that is one heck
(01:04):
of a fish.
And I saw a photo after photoof fish that were weighed in at
Bay Park And I'm sure it washappening all up and down the
coast.
So I figured, hey, let's takesome time.
We'll speak with someone who'sbeen weighing these fish and he
can tell us how they're beingcaught.
And then we have an interviewwith the number one scientist I
(01:34):
would say that's involved inthis transition of fisheries
that we're seeing.
So listen in on the wholeepisode, don't forget to
subscribe.
And once again, here we go withthe junior sharpie, future
sharpie Jimmy Birch Jr.
(01:56):
I'd like to welcome our guestsomebody.
I've always used the termfuture sharpie.
He's kind of a sharpie already,but he's a definite future
sharpie And he's a juniorfisherman.
He's lucky that he's got agreat dad who takes a fishing,
(02:18):
who's taught him fishing and wholoves fishing, and his dad is a
great guy.
He's also a public servant Andwe appreciate he's a first
responder in the city and weappreciate everything he does,
and most of you folks would dohim his whalehead right
Whalehead, not whaleface right,it's whalehead Jimmy.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (02:38):
Whalehead, yeah , okay.
George Scocca (02:40):
I hope you didn't pick that name out for him, did
you?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (02:45):
No, it was his friends.
George Scocca (02:47):
Okay, okay, so you work over Bay Park, marina,
those guys over there havealways been a huge supporter of
mine.
You know I started before youwere born And I think they were
there then.
Yeah, they probably were Foryears.
(03:08):
Yeah, they will always supporthis thing.
My brother Phil, well before hepassed on And I always
appreciate everything they bringto the game.
And now that you're workingthere, it's great And I wanted
to talk to you.
I saw you with a couple of Kobeand I know you're working at a
place that's way ahead of a lotof Kobe, so I was wondering what
(03:33):
are you guys looking for now?
I mean, you know anglers in thesound.
obviously We haven't seen any,but nothing's impossible.
We do have tons of dolphin inthe sound this year, which is
weird, but I guess they come upthat they followed a bait and
they come later.
And how do you target them?
Take it one step at a time.
(03:54):
When do you think you'll behanging your first fish?
Let me put it that way.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (03:59):
Right, so usually when all the warm water
fish come around, when the wateris the warmest, to say like
mid-July.
I mean, it's different everyyear.
It seems to be getting earlierand earlier every year.
Okay, but yeah, i would assumemid-July, when the bunker around
(04:20):
, the fish are always on thebunker pods, usually Everything
has been on the bunker All thebig giant bluefin we've been
seeing in shore, all thestripers now the live line bites
, amazing, right.
But yeah, all the Kobe havebeen on the bunker pods for the
(04:41):
most part.
George Scocca (04:42):
So now, when you say in a bunker pod so you know
when we used to fish right Bestof all, when I used to fish for
when we do fish, right, best ofall you know you get right on
the pods you're kind of you'redigging, you're casting in there
.
In some cases you're trying tofeed a live one.
So how are you targeting theKobia and what types of rigs and
(05:08):
tackle and stuff like that, howdo you use it?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (05:12):
All right.
So the main thing I use is justa bunker snagger with some
heavy, heavy monolidre, becauseI there's a lot of sharks around
, which is usually like the mainissue when targeting them, like
it'd be a lot easier to catchthem if it weren't so many
(05:34):
sharks which doesn't which isfunny to say, being in New York
but it's really a problem whenyou're fishing for them.
Now You spend quite a quite afew dollars on bunker snaggers,
right, when you go out for Kobia.
But the thing is, if you don'twant to lose as many bunker
snaggers, you could use wire,and people say that you can
(05:58):
catch Kobia on wire And I'veheard of it being done before.
But I definitely would thinkwhere I would say mono works
better.
Right, i like to use and what Icaught my fish on was, i believe
, 80 pound mono.
It was.
My dad had some old leadermaterial in the garage and I
(06:21):
found it and brought it with mejust in case and down to the
last couple of bunker snaggersand tied that on like about
three or four foot of it and toa barrel swivel.
I was using my 5000 vanford.
It's a Shimano spinning reeland a 30 pound breed on there.
George Scocca (06:49):
So these fish?
are you looking for fish in thepond?
Do you actually sight fish it?
or you just drift in thesebunker in the pod, or are you
looking outside the pods forthese fish?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (07:01):
You always want .
So you always want to look forthe fish and a lot of people do
see them on top of the water.
The difficult thing is theylook just like sharks.
So you got to, you got to kindof pick them up, but usually
they're on top and in the side,on the sides of the bunker pods,
and the sharks will cut through.
You'll see the bunker make likethey'll move around.
(07:25):
You know, you see the videos ofthe sharks going through and
the bunker will move around forthem.
So they're just moving throughthe bunker pod right The Cove.
The Cove is, stay on theoutside.
George Scocca (07:37):
Okay, so now let's be clear now, how deep are
you fishing?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (07:42):
It's really wherever the bunker pods are.
I've heard of people catchingthem as far as three miles
offshore and you know 80 feet ofwater, or in you know 2015 feet
of water right, right.
George Scocca (07:58):
So it's where they're on top of the bait,
where it's just yes, justwherever the bait is, but it's
basically an inch or fishery,yeah where we are.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:07):
It seems like it.
George Scocca (08:08):
So.
so tell me about a couple ofthose fish that were hung over
there.
last year I saw some picturesof some Kobe.
I didn't even know that theygrew that big, yeah.
So what sizes are those things?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:26):
We started getting them in in.
the first couple of fish we hadweighed in were like record
breaking We were.
we thought they were insaneThey're.
I think the first couple werelike 50 and 60 pounds Right.
George Scocca (08:41):
I saw those two Yeah.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:43):
Right Yeah, and people started one person
weighed them in, one wentweighed in the fish And then
another person weighed one inAnd then it became a regular
thing.
They're like people were justweighing in Kobe all the time.
Everyone wanted to go afterthem and the fish were getting
bigger and bigger.
We saw them up to like I wantto say 75 pushing 80 pounds.
George Scocca (09:09):
That is totally amazing.
That is some fishery that a lotof people here in the South
Shore you know they hear aboutit But they don't want to put in
the time or the effort that ittakes to catch a fish like that.
You know they all feel you haveto be lucky.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (09:28):
But yeah, everyone thinks it's just random
luck that there happens to be aKobe here.
George Scocca (09:34):
Right, but you got to put a lot of little
pieces together and to knowwhere to look for them.
How long did they stick around?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (09:43):
Do you know?
I mean, we've only really hadthem the last two, maybe three
years, yeah, and it seems thatthey're just here was as long as
all the warm water fish arelike.
I think we they stopped gettingweighed in Bay Park around.
I mean September, early midSeptember.
George Scocca (10:04):
Wow, they hang around.
Yeah, they hung around for awhile.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (10:09):
I would say August is was the heat of it,
like it was.
Every day.
We'd get fish weighed in and itwas all.
Kobe, that's all I ever wantedto do.
There was a bunker snaggershortage for all the bait and
tackle shops in the area And Iremember Mark Mark at Bay Park.
He preordered like 300 of them.
(10:32):
So he was, he was, so he wasstocked up for the end of the
season.
George Scocca (10:38):
Well, that's great.
See, that's what happens.
You know you're, you're young,right?
So you see all these strikebass and you know a lot of
people take for granted allthese fish that we have, but
when I was your age they're likeno strike bass.
So so things change And rightafter this talk you and I have,
(11:01):
i had spoken with someone that'sactually in charge of Kobe at
the Atlantic States MarineFisheries Commission And he
gives a good description aboutwhy those fish are here.
And you know what we're seeingAnd obviously it's what we all
know warmer, warming watersalthough you think you know
there are deniers of it, but itis warming waters and bait.
(11:27):
You know everything wants baitAnd we have all bait.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (11:32):
We have all bait, we have all the springing
and everything, everything yousee, oh, the fishing has really
been amazing from it recently.
George Scocca (11:42):
So this couple years?
Yeah, that's, that's great,that's great.
So.
So let me ask you this So whenare you looking for any certain
tide?
Do you like a ore, time of dayor light or dusk?
Do you know?
have you seen any patterns,like, if you're in the shop and
you're weighing them on, rainydays?
(12:02):
Yeah, is there any way you canconnect something?
Because I know that's what I'dbe doing.
I'd be saying wait a minute,this guy's waiting this today.
Let me check the weather, youknow.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (12:12):
Yeah, no, definitely I wouldn't.
I wouldn't say anything aboutthe tide too much.
I mean, if the fishing slow onone tide, the tide change
usually turns it on.
That's true.
Right, A lot of fishing, butsunny days Sunny days, it's
easier to see the cobia there ontop more the bunker on top.
(12:35):
The sunny days were always thebetter days.
If it was a nice day out on thedock there'd be a lot of boats.
It was always busy.
There was always always fishbeing weighed in with all the
commotion.
It was definitely definitelysunny days.
That's when I caught my land.
That's usually when you hearlike there was usually good days
(12:56):
where fish would get.
A bunch of fish would getweighed in in the day where it
was sunny out and next day maybeit wasn't and there weren't any
fish weighed in.
George Scocca (13:06):
Yeah, well, hopefully we'll get to a point
where we can target them withall the fish and all kinds of
stuff, like they do right downsouth, although it is a big bait
fish We down south also, i doknow some people, some charter
fishermen too, actually, thathave used bucktails and shads
(13:30):
and things like that to catchthem.
Oh, and it works.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (13:34):
Yeah, yeah, they've caught them on using
that One guy I know.
he's caught more cobia thananyone I've I've known before.
His name's Ian.
He would use blue claws, blueclaw crabs, and he caught cobia
after cobia after cobia.
It's like clockwork.
(13:54):
He could have been a commercialfisherman.
George Scocca (13:58):
You know how?
did I tell you I've never eatenone.
I hear they taste pretty good.
Oh man, I love, I love them.
Did your dad let you at leasttaste some of them with your own
fish?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (14:09):
Oh, the cobia, Yeah, yeah, he, he wouldn't even
cut it, he wouldn't even cut it.
George Scocca (14:16):
He's, he's really funny.
Yeah, so you guys do a lot offishing.
Tell me a little bit about howoften you fish.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (14:25):
I mean before I started working, when I all my
all I did all summer I was outfish.
I wasn't hanging out with myfriends, i was pretty much just
fishing.
Yeah, tough life, i love it.
Uh, would we would just fishand try every different thing we
could possibly do in thetwenty-three foot boat.
Right, i would beg him to gofarther and farther every time
(14:49):
trying to do something else.
George Scocca (14:51):
Yeah, i'm sure you would.
I've seen you guys out at, uh,i think, mcallister or AB.
I saw you out there somewhere.
You know when I'm fishing outthere.
I'm not that familiar with thearea, so, uh, i kind of I kind
of never know where the LEP istaking me till we finally get
there.
But, uh, the fluke fishing outthere is great, but I want to
(15:11):
keep this to cobia, so so you'reexpecting them to come in any
day.
Well, i mean, it's been alittle cool, but you know, who
knows what what the oceantemperature is doing right now.
Uh, so they should be coming innext month sometime right, or
the end of this month.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (15:31):
Yeah, i would, i would assume.
So.
I mean, everything seems to becoming in earlier and earlier
each year.
I wouldn't be surprised if itcame in then to this month or
the beginning of next month.
George Scocca (15:42):
Well, i tell you, what we'll be doing is
definitely keeping an eye on BayPark's fishing reports over
there, definitely, and we'll bein touch with you, and I'd like
to keep in touch with you duringthe course of the year, and we
do.
We do this, uh, a little bitmore in in that you can
introduce people to differenttypes of fishing and it's good
(16:04):
that right, um, peopleunderstand that they're all
younger folks out there thatwant to get into this game, of
course, and that's the thingthat they are Yeah, that's uh,
that's really good to know.
So, okay, look, i appreciateyour time on cobia.
Um, i do hope to get mine thisyear.
(16:25):
So you know, let me know if I'mgoing out.
you see me going, throw me ahot tip, send me a text,
something.
I know you're not gonna,because you followed, kill you,
but I'm gonna get one of thosestuff because this year I am
getting in cobia.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (16:43):
I got a lot of fun when you do it, oh my god.
George Scocca (16:47):
Yeah, i want to do.
They're a good fighting fish.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (16:51):
Oh yeah, he didn't know he was hooked when I
had them until he was rightnext to the boat and just zoom
woke up.
I love when it happens.
George Scocca (17:01):
I love when it happens when it's not a fish
that I really don't want to drop.
But when it's a fish I don'twant to drop and it doesn't, oh
my goodness, that's all of asudden.
It hurts to be mad at you,exactly So I had that happen to
me This year on a freshwaterfish, so I don't want to talk
(17:21):
about it.
This is basically salt waterstuff right now.
So all right, jimmy, we aregoing to speak, definitely
during the course of the year.
I'd love to get some updatesfrom you on what's happening
over there at a Bay Park, if Ican help marking a gang at all
through this.
We do have a number of listenersand it's growing each episode,
(17:43):
so pass along my thanks toeveryone.
Say hello to your dad.
Keep up the good work, keepposting your photos.
Look, spend some time onmyanglercom.
We miss you.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (17:56):
Yeah, I've been looking at the site recently.
George Scocca (18:00):
Yeah, well, let me tell you it's going to start
growing.
We have a whole new beautifulsite being built, but that's a
surprise that that'll be comingout soon.
But spend some time there, sendyour friends there And, again,
say hello to your dad for me AndI thank you so much for coming
on, of course, and I will besending you, or hopefully I'll
(18:26):
be weighing in a Cobia at BayPark All right, send me a text.
Yeah, i sure will.
All right, jim, good speakingwith you and good fishing.
We'll do this again very soon.
Sure, i got to get out there,you got it.
Thank you, buddy, you got it.
Bye-bye, you have it, folks.
(18:47):
Jimmy Furch Jr, a angler, and agood angler in his own right.
I've seen him out there, deepwater fluke, and I've seen many
photos of some great fish thathe's caught.
The kid has learned a lot.
It's pretty obvious this Cobiafishery is a site fishery.
(19:07):
Every everything I read up anddown the coast, they're
targeting with live bait andit's a site fishery.
It's not like you're going togo to the rip and you're going
to find bass there.
You're not going to find Cobiain the same spot.
They're moving around with thebait, but there are a lot of
(19:28):
fish being caught Now.
With that said, things arechanging.
We could be in denial and saythey are not.
I don't know what's causing it.
I don't pretend to have anyidea what's causing it, but
things are changing.
They just are.
We see it in the watertemperatures.
It can't be denied.
(19:49):
So what's happening is we havea transition of fisheries.
I've discussed this and I willcontinue to do so, as we have
more and more of southernfisheries that are headed up
into the New York bite area.
This is happening consistentlyover the past couple of years.
(20:12):
So I went straight to the top tofind out what the scientific
community and managementcommunity thinks is happening
regarding this transition, andalso there's an in-depth
discussion on the Cobia itself.
And get ready.
(20:35):
They should be showing up soon.
From what I hear, there aresome bunkers down in Jersey on
their way up.
For some reason We're a littlethin on bunker right now, but
hopefully that'll change As soonas they come and you get the
bass on them.
You know that the Cobia aregoing to be there this year in
better numbers.
(20:56):
So listen, in a way, jimmyfished it.
There are other tactics,obviously.
You know I've seen some folksthat kind of fish them like
they're fishing a bass.
They'll hook it up as a lightbunker rig and swim it back out,
and they do work.
(21:17):
They also mentioned aboutfishing on the outskirts of the
bunker schools.
So look, it's just one of thosefisheries that you're going to
have to be in the right place atthe right time.
But if you are, make sureyou're ready.
It's like you got to be readyfor it Because you know if
you're not ready it's going tohappen.
So you be ready.
(21:38):
And if you see them, cash in onthem.
I hear they're a good fightingfish and excellent eating fish
And obviously, just as usrecreational anglers always do,
you know, just take what you'regoing to eat And you can release
the rest.
(21:59):
And now for my interview.
I'm in line with Dr Dan Creer.
He's a marine ecologiststudying the effects of the
changing environment on marinespecies and fisheries.
And first, dan, i'd like towelcome you to the show.
You know you are involved insomething that really has my
(22:22):
interest and things that arehappening right now.
You know I'm a believer thatthere's a lot going on under the
water right now And we're inthis transition that you know.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm seeinga lot of things And I kind of
wanted to get your take on it.
And specifically, maybe wecould start out with this new
(22:44):
fishery that we have.
I call the Kobea fishery.
I mean, we have had actuallyregulations in place for this
fishery for the longest time,but I used to wonder why.
Now I know I mean we had a lotof big Kobea come aboard.
So again, welcome to the show,dan.
Oh, thank you for having me.
(23:05):
This was great.
So what are your thoughts onthe fact that we now have a
targeted fishery directed atKobea?
Like?
it's like the first time ever.
I've been doing this for 35years now, so I know for a fact
that you can count on one handthe time there was a 50-pound
(23:28):
Kobea weight.
Dr Dan Creer (23:31):
Right, right, yeah , it's definitely going to
continue as well.
Because of the continuouslywarming waters And it may not
happen every single year, but ona year's only have warmer
temperatures or warmer watersthat these species are going to,
especially including Kobea, aregoing to continue to shift
(23:52):
further north, especially duringthe summertime, and the shallow
areas right around Long Islandare nice and right around their
sweet spot and the temperaturesthat they like.
So I'm not surprised at all.
I'm not surprised that you'reseeing it more often, and some
of the work that I've done Ishowed that during warmer years,
(24:14):
kobea are further north.
During cooler years they're notas far north And as you get
further into the future and westill have our continued trend
of warming we are going tocontinue to see Kobea more and
more often be found furthernorth up in New York and New
Jersey.
George Scocca (24:33):
Yeah, so now what about the fact?
See, i've been thinking that,ok, it's warming, the fish are
coming up, and when they gethere in New York, we have these
great protections in place forour manhading and bunker
fisheries, like none of thereduction fleets are allowed in
(24:53):
our waters at all.
So we've been getting tons andtons of bait, to the point that
humpbacks are 30 yards off thebeach And so there's a ton of
bait in there, and I'm wonderinghow much that plays into it.
Dr Dan Creer (25:09):
Yeah, they are definitely, because so Kobea are
generalist feeders, which meansthat they eat a lot of
different types of species.
And so what makes that nice forthem is that they can move into
new places and still find food,luckily for them also.
Manhading are also found in offof Virginia and North Carolina
(25:31):
and whatnot, where they areknown to reside as well, and
that's the primary species thatKobea feed on.
So that could definitely directmaybe locally where they are
Within or, i guess, off ofConnecticut or New York or New
Jersey.
But what may push them furthernorth?
that further distance canlikely be the warming waters,
(25:57):
and in addition, those warmerwaters could be pushing
manhading further north.
So for a given few weeks or fora given month, as they're
following the localized warmingthat's happening throughout the
summer.
So it definitely varies.
They're very driven by foodright, and they're going to
follow fish both fish So it's alittle hard to feed that apart,
(26:23):
whether it's temperature or preyor both, and my guess is that
it's probably a combination ofboth And temperature is
affecting both.
The prey, like manhading andKobea.
George Scocca (26:35):
OK, is there a directed commercial fishery with
Kobea?
Because I don't recall eversinging it in a seafood store.
But I'm just curious if youknow if there's a directed
commercial fishery.
Dr Dan Creer (26:52):
Yes, it is, but it's very, very small.
I can't remember the quota offthe top of my head, but it's
very, very, very, or the percentof the quota.
It's less than 5%.
The quota is allocated forcommercial, so the vast, vast
majority is allocated just forrecreational, and so sometimes
(27:16):
you'll see them as like aspecialty item at a restaurant,
but yeah, for the most partyou're not going to see them in
the supermarket.
George Scocca (27:25):
Yeah, because from everything I hear, i
haven't had any yet, but I hearit's a pretty good eating fish.
And that always scares me.
Oh, you haven't?
No, i haven't, i want to catchthe one that I eat.
So that's a problem.
I haven't been in the rightplace at the right time yet, but
I will.
And but that always frightensme, you know, because every fish
(27:50):
that tastes really good, youknow it's got a bounty on its
head.
So that's why I asked thatquestion, you know.
You know we eat, we love fish,you know.
So Americans love to eat fish,and a fish like that, i mean,
you know, right now, a liveblack fish, believe it or not.
(28:11):
In New York it's illegal, butthey're doing, but it happens,
and they're selling live blackfish for $25 a pound.
So you get it.
Whoever thought that wouldhappen?
right, no one.
So you know.
so I'm just bringing it up andtrying to nip it in the bud, you
know So.
So now, what about thesespawning habits?
(28:33):
Where?
where those fish spawned, youknow?
Dr Dan Creer (28:36):
Yeah, so the major spawning area, especially for
the cobia that used the morenorthern parts of the Atlantic,
is Chesney Bay.
That's their biggest spawningground.
They, both males and females,come in there during during late
spring, early summer, spawn andthey can spawn continuously
(28:59):
throughout the summertime Andthen after the summer they'll
leave And for some reasonsometimes in the middle of the
summer some individuals willshoot further north, just like
that.
They might come and go up toLong Island off from New Jersey,
off from Delaware and Maryland,but during the spawning times
it is well known that it occursin Chesney Bay.
(29:21):
There have been some hypothesesout there that they that they
might spawn offshore, offshoreof Virginia and offshore of
Maryland and Delaware, but thatis not as well understood.
And then there's also spawningoff of South Carolina as well,
(29:47):
in some of the estuaries there.
But primarily the individualsthat you guys are interacting
with up in New York are latelyfrom the, the group that spawned
Chesney Bay.
George Scocca (30:01):
Okay, so that tells me that if they're
spawning in Chesney Bay, i meanwe have the same conditions in
the Hudson River.
I mean we have the secondlargest striped bass fishery you
know reproduces, second amountbehind Chesapeake for striped
bass, and almost seems likethey're spawning around the same
(30:21):
exact time as a striped bass.
So I'm thinking that maybewe'll see I don't know, you
never know could see residentpopulation.
Dr Dan Creer (30:33):
Yeah, and so I know striped bass spawn on a
little bit more fresher waters,so Kobia will still spawn in,
and pretty saline waters,probably between like 15, which
on the map is very low and 15parts per thousand, all the way
(30:55):
up to ocean ocean, which isaround 35 parts per thousand
personally.
So so, yeah, obviously there's.
There's a lot of otherconditions that dictate what
makes a good habitat for fish tospawn in And for Kobia.
We are still trying to figurethat out.
That's something that may belinked to if we may or may not
(31:18):
see Kobia spawning happening inareas further north, such as
Delaware Bay or Long IslandSound and whatnot, or New York
Bight, that those are areas thatpotentially, given the
temperatures, could be suitablefor spawning.
But there are other attributesor features that are important
as well for spawning or forsuccessful spawning.
(31:39):
So whether it ends up happeningor not, we'll have to wait and
see.
But as they start to use moreand more area up there or more
and more habitat up there for alonger period of time, i
wouldn't be surprised.
George Scocca (31:52):
Okay.
So let's for a moment switchspecies here and jump over to
tuna.
So in the last few years we'vehad a really good inshore bite
on both yellow fin and blue fin.
When I say inshore, you know 20miles, and I was wondering, you
(32:16):
know?
I mean, you think those fishare moving in, because I don't
think the Gulf Stream came inthat far I was, i was watching
it, but you think maybe it's dueto the warm waters that those
fish are coming in, or, you know, i've seen this in the past.
So I really don't think thatthere's a connection.
But I'm curious what you guysare saying.
Dr Dan Creer (32:38):
Yeah, i think the best guess that that that we
think it's causing this isprobably like that they're
following those large men inschools and that are that are
that are occurring furtherinshore.
That's probably driving the twodistributions more more right?
(32:59):
Yeah, so I agree with you there.
George Scocca (33:04):
Okay, so do you feel the I mean we.
you know we're seeing somereally good seasons.
Do you know how Noah feelsabout the stock and the biomass
and all the fishery For whichspecies?
Yellow, blue and blue?
Dr Dan Creer (33:20):
Yeah, so the the West Atlantic Lupin tuna fishery
is is very well sustainable oris very well sustainable.
There's been a lot of work doneby by no fisheries to improve
the populations for, especiallyfor, especially western blue and
(33:45):
tuna, and the elephant tuna aswell has has improved as well.
But Yeah, so so far they theyare.
they are both both verysustainable fisheries.
So we encourage you to to eatlocal, you know, and support US
caught fisheries for sure.
George Scocca (34:06):
Absolutely So the give me a general outlook for
what you see happening.
You know I'm of the belief aswe discussed the warfare for a
minute that we're in the middleof a huge transition, that
things are happening underneaththe water that you know we can't
(34:29):
see what's happening.
So you know, like you know,like you said before, you know
the Kobe may be spawningoffshore.
You know I'm an advisor on theweekfish board And I was shocked
to find out a couple months agothat there are weekfish being
caught like way offshore inwinter.
So like I never even knew theywere out there, you know so.
(34:53):
So here we are.
We're experiencing like crazystuff, like we used to have when
a flounder you could thinkabout, in them you could macro,
would run through the sound andfor a couple weeks, and we had
Tommy Cod, we had all thesedifferent fisheries.
Yet there's a lot that we havethat we didn't have.
So, for example, sea bass havebeen phenomenal.
(35:16):
The fluke fishery is is hangingin there.
It's still hanging tough.
I mean that wasn't reallyaround that much.
You know, back in the late, i'mgonna say early 80s, i'm sure
my age you so you know.
So we see this huge change Andthen we have all the lobster and
long Island sound die And theyliterally died.
(35:38):
There's not a lobster in thesound.
I mean it's exaggerate.
I mean you may see a lobsterhere or there, but it's it's.
They're all gone.
And, by the way, we have anestimated million ghost pots
laying in the middle of thesound right now.
So, so, and you know, it'sfunny, not that it's funny, but
(35:59):
it's ironic that a lot of thesefolks that efficient, that send
down video cameras you almostalways see a ghost pot when
they're in the sound.
I mean, every shot I see oneback there.
So they're all over the place.
But what do you think ishappening?
(36:20):
And or what is happening That'sthat's causing this change.
Dr Dan Creer (36:28):
Yes, i think again , a lot of it is is ocean
conditions changing Basically?
we have have just continuedwarming oceans right from from
climate change, and so the inthe Gulf Stream is shifting
northward, and the LabradorCurrent, which comes down south
and inshore from basicallyCanada That's what keeps the
(36:53):
coastline up in New England andwhatnot And north of Hatteras
cool, the Labrador Current Thatis, that is weakening And and so
a combination of those, thosethings are contributing to
species just shifting furthernorth to their sweet spots.
(37:15):
Right, so in for for givenspecies there's a range of
temperatures that they prefer tobe in, right, and if that, if
that range is, or if thoseconditions are down off of
Virginia one year and then, andthen all of a sudden, in
whatever 20 years from now,those conditions are now off of
(37:38):
New York, that those species aregoing to follow those
conditions, given that, as longas you know, there's food there,
right, and so.
So temperature is a majordriver physiologically for a
larger, for a lot of marinespecies.
There are other conditions aswell that are important, like
salinity and the amount ofoxygen in the water.
(38:00):
But temperature is a reallyknown strong driver dictating
where species go.
George Scocca (38:07):
And we could expect to see this continue.
I mean, actually it's beenhappening, you know, over time,
But but now we're all realizingwhat has been happening and why
it's been happening.
I mean, you know, winterflounder.
everybody wants to know why wecan't.
There are no winter flounderinshore yet the offshore
fisheries loaded.
(38:27):
So I'm thinking they wanted to,just got to want them, you know
, and they moved out.
not that we killed them all, Soso I'm going to ask you I don't
know if this is in your, in yourwheelhouse, so to speak but do
you have any opinion on what'shappening with the whales that
are washing up on on the JerseyShore?
(38:47):
I know it's a touchy subjectbecause of the green energy and
all that stuff, but I'mwondering if, if you're aware of
what's going on and have a havean opinion.
Dr Dan Creer (38:59):
Yeah, i only slightly aware of it.
Unfortunately the marine mammalside is a little bit outside my
my expertise So it's hard forme to comment too much on on
that.
But I am aware I've seen, i'veread some stories in the scene
pictures Absolutely, but I'm notfully aware of what's driving
(39:20):
that.
George Scocca (39:20):
Okay, so the other one that you cover, or you
cover in shark too, right?
Yeah, obviously, you know welove to make a shark in New York
And I know it's totally offbase, but you know how, how
healthy is that fishery, thatthat's an amazing, freaking fish
, you know.
(39:41):
So I'm curious as to what, whatyou guys, how you feel the
overall biomass is doing.
Dr Dan Creer (39:52):
Well, so it's that it is.
Oh, it is tough because it'sthe internationally managed
species, right?
It's managed by eye cat, right,and so so they're there there
have been declines, But we'relooking at it from the the
(40:12):
entire Atlantic or NorthAtlantic population.
And so and some kind of off ofsome countries some countries we
may see we've seen somedeclines, but off of others that
may not be the case.
And so I know with, with eyecat eventually, all the
countries that came to anagreement that that we need to
be more cautious with makeup,with, with the worry that we
(40:35):
want to make sure that the stockis able to be filled.
So I, so I'm not part of the ofthat, of that conversation.
I'm not, i don't work with theinternational side with eye cat
But, but with my understanding,is that they I think there's
(40:56):
this extreme caution, given howmuch they interact with
fisheries and also the lifehistories of maple sharks,
because they take a long time toreach maturity.
They don't have very, very manyyoung pups at once.
And and and they take a longtime to grow, and so they are
(41:16):
vulnerable to two fisheries, allkinds of fisheries.
So so there are reasons why thegovernment and the
international community is beingcautious there.
George Scocca (41:29):
Okay, yeah, we all want to protect the mighty
Mako.
I had a big one once when I wasa kid.
If I had to do all of, idefinitely release that fish.
I was like 600 pounds.
But in any case, it is what itis And we have to move on to
whatever species that we canfind, whatever comes up our way.
So, and you know, look, i'mjust trying to bring out the
(41:54):
fact that, yes, things arechanging, but it's not bad, you
know, it's just changing.
My guess is we're going to seeblack drum in our area soon.
We're already kind of seeingsome small ones around And I
think we're going to have a lotmore black drum soon, but we'll
see.
Dr Dan Creer (42:12):
So yeah, i think, i think it's.
I think it's safe to say thatyou can eat, like you should
expect to see, especially duringwarm years, some unique species
being found further north.
We've experienced that inChesapeake Bay as well, with
with species coming like topfull species that end up like
(42:32):
randomly appearing in ourspecies.
They may be caught inGulfstream, you know, and and
and fall the warm water you knowinto the, into the bay.
But but yeah, so I think it'sgoing to continue And yeah, i'm
not surprised It's probablygoing to continue at at a faster
rate as well, but or more at ahigher recurring rate.
George Scocca (42:53):
I get it.
Well, look, i truly appreciatethis interview and your time.
I'm going to keep your numberand email because something
tells me we're going to betalking again pretty soon, so is
there anything else that youcan?
you'd like to inform ourlisteners about anything?
Dr Dan Creer (43:15):
Oh man, i what I think.
I think you got to get preparedto.
You know, buy your bucktailsand in your cacti rods and
towers, you know, and, and, andhopefully you're able to catch
some cobi, because they are anawesome fish to catch and an
awesome fish to eat, andcurrently they are.
(43:36):
They are sustainable and so ifyou get out there and then catch
them, i hope you'll be able toand enjoy it.
George Scocca (43:44):
So do you actually fish for them, you
yourself?
Dr Dan Creer (43:51):
So when I was a PhD student at the Virginia
Institute of Marine Science, orWIMS for short, that's right off
of trustee bay And so I workedwith fishermen a lot to tag them
, and also I've brought themback to BIMS and I did some live
experiments on them.
So fishermen helped a lot.
The recreational communityhelped a lot on collecting my
(44:15):
animals, but I also caught somemyself.
We had our own vessel and thenwe had a tower on it, and so
once I learned how to fish forthem properly, we got not as
good as fishermen, but we gotall right.
We did our fishing withcatching Cobia on our own and
(44:39):
tagging them and releasing them.
George Scocca (44:40):
That's great.
That is great because the guysthat had them they were just
outside of the bunker schoolskind of running with them, but
they had to catch one thatwasn't actively feeding.
But those ones, those were theones that they were getting them
on.
They would throw a bunk aroundin front of it and, provided it
(45:04):
wasn't in the middle of theschool, that's how they were
catching them.
So I guess it won't be too longbefore we have a mandatory
circle hook on them.
I don't know, i hope not.
Dr Dan Creer (45:16):
Yeah, yeah, yes, and I know from my research some
of the models that I createdhave predicted that over in the
next 20 to 40 years that thebest habitat for Cobia in the
summertime so thermally the besthabitat is off of New Jersey.
(45:39):
It'll be more, it'll be thebest suitable habitat will be
off of New.
The most, i guess I should saythe highest percentage of
suitable habitat will occur offof New Jersey compared to
anywhere else of the Atlantic inthe summertime, and so it's
only going to continue to, orthe speed of the land continues
(46:00):
to slowly push up.
They may not be readily in NewYork all the time, but I think
those instances are going tocontinue to increase, and, yes,
20 to 40 years in the future,and I wouldn't be surprised if
you see them every summer on areliable basis.
George Scocca (46:20):
All right, Great Again.
Look, then, I really appreciateyou doing the interview and
we're going to do another one inthe future And keep up the good
work there.
We appreciate it.
Like I said, there's a lot ofpeople listening to this thing
right now that they I don't knowwhat it is, they don't want to
(46:42):
accept it.
Things are changing even thoughthey are right before their
eyes, So things like this helpeducate folks And I hope I mean
look, there's nothing we coulddo about it.
Really, It is good, It is whatit's going to be And you know,
as a world or as a nation, weall got to try and slow it down,
(47:02):
But I don't see that happeninganytime soon.
Dr Dan Creer (47:06):
So Yeah, and at this point, the ocean.
you know the ocean takes a longtime to change, right?
And so we can make changes, youknow, and improvements to lower
our greenhouse gas emissionsand our reliance on fossil fuels
, But that doesn't mean thatwell, regardless it's so going.
(47:26):
There's a lot of inertia rightthat that a warming that's going
to continue to happen before westart to see any, i guess,
lessening of the warming effect,And that's just in the air.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (47:42):
If you don't, if you look into the water.
Dr Dan Creer (47:44):
It's even slower right.
So these species are going tobe transitioning further north
for for them for decades anddecades and decades to come,
regardless of how much we do atthat time to control greenhouse
gas emissions.
So that means that fishermenneed to adapt, that means that
(48:06):
managers need to adapt, thatmeans scientists need to adapt,
and so that's going to happenregardless.
And you're going to see newspecies and you're going to
might lose some species, andthat's just the way it is.
And, like I said, everyone'sgoing to have to learn to adapt,
just like these fish are.
George Scocca (48:23):
Right.
Well, you know what It's theway I see it's an excuse to buy
different tackle.
Okay, so now I have to tacklejust for cobia.
That's how we are.
You got some for flukes type aswhatever it is.
So, yeah, i'm loving itactually.
Dr Dan Creer (48:38):
So you can take advantage of the new situation
that you know or the new speciesthat are there.
That can be exciting.
George Scocca (48:47):
Well, that's exactly what we're all doing.
So again, dan, i appreciate it.
We will talk again soon Andthanks again for doing this
interview Awesome, thank you forhaving me.
Dr Dan Creer (49:00):
I really appreciate it.
George Scocca (49:01):
Okay, thank you Have it.
folks.
I hope you enjoyed that as muchas I did.
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(49:47):
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(51:20):
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Thanks again, everyone.
Get out there tight lines.
I don't have to tell you thefishing is really good.
Hello and welcome everyone to another episode of
the New York Fishing Podcast.
My name is George Scaca and Iam your host.
So today we have a discussionon Cobia why they're here, how
they got here and how to catchhim.
(00:20):
Now that they're around, ispeak with Jimmy Furch Jr.
He works or I don't know if hestill does, but I think he does
over at Bay Park, marietum.
Whether he does or not.
big shout out to those guys.
They have always been bigsupporters of mine and my
(00:42):
brother, who is no longer withus.
So those folks over there, theywere weighing in Cobia.
I saw them.
They were over like 70 pounds.
I didn't even know they gotthat big.
Sorry, i'm not educated on them.
I'm always working on what wehave here, but that is one heck
(01:04):
of a fish.
And I saw a photo after photoof fish that were weighed in at
Bay Park And I'm sure it washappening all up and down the
coast.
So I figured, hey, let's takesome time.
We'll speak with someone who'sbeen weighing these fish and he
can tell us how they're beingcaught.
And then we have an interviewwith the number one scientist I
(01:34):
would say that's involved inthis transition of fisheries
that we're seeing.
So listen in on the wholeepisode, don't forget to
subscribe.
And once again, here we go withthe junior sharpie, future
sharpie Jimmy Birch Jr.
(01:56):
I'd like to welcome our guestsomebody.
I've always used the termfuture sharpie.
He's kind of a sharpie already,but he's a definite future
sharpie And he's a juniorfisherman.
He's lucky that he's got agreat dad who takes a fishing,
(02:18):
who's taught him fishing and wholoves fishing, and his dad is a
great guy.
He's also a public servant Andwe appreciate he's a first
responder in the city and weappreciate everything he does,
and most of you folks would dohim his whalehead right
Whalehead, not whaleface right,it's whalehead Jimmy.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (02:38):
Whalehead, yeah , okay.
George Scocca (02:40):
I hope you didn't pick that name out for him, did
you?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (02:45):
No, it was his friends.
George Scocca (02:47):
Okay, okay, so you work over Bay Park, marina,
those guys over there havealways been a huge supporter of
mine.
You know I started before youwere born And I think they were
there then.
Yeah, they probably were Foryears.
(03:08):
Yeah, they will always supporthis thing.
My brother Phil, well before hepassed on And I always
appreciate everything they bringto the game.
And now that you're workingthere, it's great And I wanted
to talk to you.
I saw you with a couple of Kobeand I know you're working at a
place that's way ahead of a lotof Kobe, so I was wondering what
(03:33):
are you guys looking for now?
I mean, you know anglers in thesound.
obviously We haven't seen any,but nothing's impossible.
We do have tons of dolphin inthe sound this year, which is
weird, but I guess they come upthat they followed a bait and
they come later.
And how do you target them?
Take it one step at a time.
(03:54):
When do you think you'll behanging your first fish?
Let me put it that way.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (03:59):
Right, so usually when all the warm water
fish come around, when the wateris the warmest, to say like
mid-July.
I mean, it's different everyyear.
It seems to be getting earlierand earlier every year.
Okay, but yeah, i would assumemid-July, when the bunker around
(04:20):
, the fish are always on thebunker pods, usually Everything
has been on the bunker All thebig giant bluefin we've been
seeing in shore, all thestripers now the live line bites
, amazing, right.
But yeah, all the Kobe havebeen on the bunker pods for the
(04:41):
most part.
George Scocca (04:42):
So now, when you say in a bunker pod so you know
when we used to fish right Bestof all, when I used to fish for
when we do fish, right, best ofall you know you get right on
the pods you're kind of you'redigging, you're casting in there
.
In some cases you're trying tofeed a live one.
So how are you targeting theKobia and what types of rigs and
(05:08):
tackle and stuff like that, howdo you use it?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (05:12):
All right.
So the main thing I use is justa bunker snagger with some
heavy, heavy monolidre, becauseI there's a lot of sharks around
, which is usually like the mainissue when targeting them, like
it'd be a lot easier to catchthem if it weren't so many
(05:34):
sharks which doesn't which isfunny to say, being in New York
but it's really a problem whenyou're fishing for them.
Now You spend quite a quite afew dollars on bunker snaggers,
right, when you go out for Kobia.
But the thing is, if you don'twant to lose as many bunker
snaggers, you could use wire,and people say that you can
(05:58):
catch Kobia on wire And I'veheard of it being done before.
But I definitely would thinkwhere I would say mono works
better.
Right, i like to use and what Icaught my fish on was, i believe
, 80 pound mono.
It was.
My dad had some old leadermaterial in the garage and I
(06:21):
found it and brought it with mejust in case and down to the
last couple of bunker snaggersand tied that on like about
three or four foot of it and toa barrel swivel.
I was using my 5000 vanford.
It's a Shimano spinning reeland a 30 pound breed on there.
George Scocca (06:49):
So these fish?
are you looking for fish in thepond?
Do you actually sight fish it?
or you just drift in thesebunker in the pod, or are you
looking outside the pods forthese fish?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (07:01):
You always want .
So you always want to look forthe fish and a lot of people do
see them on top of the water.
The difficult thing is theylook just like sharks.
So you got to, you got to kindof pick them up, but usually
they're on top and in the side,on the sides of the bunker pods,
and the sharks will cut through.
You'll see the bunker make likethey'll move around.
(07:25):
You know, you see the videos ofthe sharks going through and
the bunker will move around forthem.
So they're just moving throughthe bunker pod right The Cove.
The Cove is, stay on theoutside.
George Scocca (07:37):
Okay, so now let's be clear now, how deep are
you fishing?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (07:42):
It's really wherever the bunker pods are.
I've heard of people catchingthem as far as three miles
offshore and you know 80 feet ofwater, or in you know 2015 feet
of water right, right.
George Scocca (07:58):
So it's where they're on top of the bait,
where it's just yes, justwherever the bait is, but it's
basically an inch or fishery,yeah where we are.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:07):
It seems like it.
George Scocca (08:08):
So.
so tell me about a couple ofthose fish that were hung over
there.
last year I saw some picturesof some Kobe.
I didn't even know that theygrew that big, yeah.
So what sizes are those things?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:26):
We started getting them in in.
the first couple of fish we hadweighed in were like record
breaking We were.
we thought they were insaneThey're.
I think the first couple werelike 50 and 60 pounds Right.
George Scocca (08:41):
I saw those two Yeah.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (08:43):
Right Yeah, and people started one person
weighed them in, one wentweighed in the fish And then
another person weighed one inAnd then it became a regular
thing.
They're like people were justweighing in Kobe all the time.
Everyone wanted to go afterthem and the fish were getting
bigger and bigger.
We saw them up to like I wantto say 75 pushing 80 pounds.
George Scocca (09:09):
That is totally amazing.
That is some fishery that a lotof people here in the South
Shore you know they hear aboutit But they don't want to put in
the time or the effort that ittakes to catch a fish like that.
You know they all feel you haveto be lucky.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (09:28):
But yeah, everyone thinks it's just random
luck that there happens to be aKobe here.
George Scocca (09:34):
Right, but you got to put a lot of little
pieces together and to knowwhere to look for them.
How long did they stick around?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (09:43):
Do you know?
I mean, we've only really hadthem the last two, maybe three
years, yeah, and it seems thatthey're just here was as long as
all the warm water fish arelike.
I think we they stopped gettingweighed in Bay Park around.
I mean September, early midSeptember.
George Scocca (10:04):
Wow, they hang around.
Yeah, they hung around for awhile.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (10:09):
I would say August is was the heat of it,
like it was.
Every day.
We'd get fish weighed in and itwas all.
Kobe, that's all I ever wantedto do.
There was a bunker snaggershortage for all the bait and
tackle shops in the area And Iremember Mark Mark at Bay Park.
He preordered like 300 of them.
(10:32):
So he was, he was, so he wasstocked up for the end of the
season.
George Scocca (10:38):
Well, that's great.
See, that's what happens.
You know you're, you're young,right?
So you see all these strikebass and you know a lot of
people take for granted allthese fish that we have, but
when I was your age they're likeno strike bass.
So so things change And rightafter this talk you and I have,
(11:01):
i had spoken with someone that'sactually in charge of Kobe at
the Atlantic States MarineFisheries Commission And he
gives a good description aboutwhy those fish are here.
And you know what we're seeingAnd obviously it's what we all
know warmer, warming watersalthough you think you know
there are deniers of it, but itis warming waters and bait.
(11:27):
You know everything wants baitAnd we have all bait.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (11:32):
We have all bait, we have all the springing
and everything, everything yousee, oh, the fishing has really
been amazing from it recently.
George Scocca (11:42):
So this couple years?
Yeah, that's, that's great,that's great.
So.
So let me ask you this So whenare you looking for any certain
tide?
Do you like a ore, time of dayor light or dusk?
Do you know?
have you seen any patterns,like, if you're in the shop and
you're weighing them on, rainydays?
(12:02):
Yeah, is there any way you canconnect something?
Because I know that's what I'dbe doing.
I'd be saying wait a minute,this guy's waiting this today.
Let me check the weather, youknow.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (12:12):
Yeah, no, definitely I wouldn't.
I wouldn't say anything aboutthe tide too much.
I mean, if the fishing slow onone tide, the tide change
usually turns it on.
That's true.
Right, A lot of fishing, butsunny days Sunny days, it's
easier to see the cobia there ontop more the bunker on top.
(12:35):
The sunny days were always thebetter days.
If it was a nice day out on thedock there'd be a lot of boats.
It was always busy.
There was always always fishbeing weighed in with all the
commotion.
It was definitely definitelysunny days.
That's when I caught my land.
That's usually when you hearlike there was usually good days
(12:56):
where fish would get.
A bunch of fish would getweighed in in the day where it
was sunny out and next day maybeit wasn't and there weren't any
fish weighed in.
George Scocca (13:06):
Yeah, well, hopefully we'll get to a point
where we can target them withall the fish and all kinds of
stuff, like they do right downsouth, although it is a big bait
fish We down south also, i doknow some people, some charter
fishermen too, actually, thathave used bucktails and shads
(13:30):
and things like that to catchthem.
Oh, and it works.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (13:34):
Yeah, yeah, they've caught them on using
that One guy I know.
he's caught more cobia thananyone I've I've known before.
His name's Ian.
He would use blue claws, blueclaw crabs, and he caught cobia
after cobia after cobia.
It's like clockwork.
(13:54):
He could have been a commercialfisherman.
George Scocca (13:58):
You know how?
did I tell you I've never eatenone.
I hear they taste pretty good.
Oh man, I love, I love them.
Did your dad let you at leasttaste some of them with your own
fish?
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (14:09):
Oh, the cobia, Yeah, yeah, he, he wouldn't even
cut it, he wouldn't even cut it.
George Scocca (14:16):
He's, he's really funny.
Yeah, so you guys do a lot offishing.
Tell me a little bit about howoften you fish.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (14:25):
I mean before I started working, when I all my
all I did all summer I was outfish.
I wasn't hanging out with myfriends, i was pretty much just
fishing.
Yeah, tough life, i love it.
Uh, would we would just fishand try every different thing we
could possibly do in thetwenty-three foot boat.
Right, i would beg him to gofarther and farther every time
(14:49):
trying to do something else.
George Scocca (14:51):
Yeah, i'm sure you would.
I've seen you guys out at, uh,i think, mcallister or AB.
I saw you out there somewhere.
You know when I'm fishing outthere.
I'm not that familiar with thearea, so, uh, i kind of I kind
of never know where the LEP istaking me till we finally get
there.
But, uh, the fluke fishing outthere is great, but I want to
(15:11):
keep this to cobia, so so you'reexpecting them to come in any
day.
Well, i mean, it's been alittle cool, but you know, who
knows what what the oceantemperature is doing right now.
Uh, so they should be coming innext month sometime right, or
the end of this month.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (15:31):
Yeah, i would, i would assume.
So.
I mean, everything seems to becoming in earlier and earlier
each year.
I wouldn't be surprised if itcame in then to this month or
the beginning of next month.
George Scocca (15:42):
Well, i tell you, what we'll be doing is
definitely keeping an eye on BayPark's fishing reports over
there, definitely, and we'll bein touch with you, and I'd like
to keep in touch with you duringthe course of the year, and we
do.
We do this, uh, a little bitmore in in that you can
introduce people to differenttypes of fishing and it's good
(16:04):
that right, um, peopleunderstand that they're all
younger folks out there thatwant to get into this game, of
course, and that's the thingthat they are Yeah, that's uh,
that's really good to know.
So, okay, look, i appreciateyour time on cobia.
Um, i do hope to get mine thisyear.
(16:25):
So you know, let me know if I'mgoing out.
you see me going, throw me ahot tip, send me a text,
something.
I know you're not gonna,because you followed, kill you,
but I'm gonna get one of thosestuff because this year I am
getting in cobia.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (16:43):
I got a lot of fun when you do it, oh my god.
George Scocca (16:47):
Yeah, i want to do.
They're a good fighting fish.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (16:51):
Oh yeah, he didn't know he was hooked when I
had them until he was rightnext to the boat and just zoom
woke up.
I love when it happens.
George Scocca (17:01):
I love when it happens when it's not a fish
that I really don't want to drop.
But when it's a fish I don'twant to drop and it doesn't, oh
my goodness, that's all of asudden.
It hurts to be mad at you,exactly So I had that happen to
me This year on a freshwaterfish, so I don't want to talk
(17:21):
about it.
This is basically salt waterstuff right now.
So all right, jimmy, we aregoing to speak, definitely
during the course of the year.
I'd love to get some updatesfrom you on what's happening
over there at a Bay Park, if Ican help marking a gang at all
through this.
We do have a number of listenersand it's growing each episode,
(17:43):
so pass along my thanks toeveryone.
Say hello to your dad.
Keep up the good work, keepposting your photos.
Look, spend some time onmyanglercom.
We miss you.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (17:56):
Yeah, I've been looking at the site recently.
George Scocca (18:00):
Yeah, well, let me tell you it's going to start
growing.
We have a whole new beautifulsite being built, but that's a
surprise that that'll be comingout soon.
But spend some time there, sendyour friends there And, again,
say hello to your dad for me AndI thank you so much for coming
on, of course, and I will besending you, or hopefully I'll
(18:26):
be weighing in a Cobia at BayPark All right, send me a text.
Yeah, i sure will.
All right, jim, good speakingwith you and good fishing.
We'll do this again very soon.
Sure, i got to get out there,you got it.
Thank you, buddy, you got it.
Bye-bye, you have it, folks.
(18:47):
Jimmy Furch Jr, a angler, and agood angler in his own right.
I've seen him out there, deepwater fluke, and I've seen many
photos of some great fish thathe's caught.
The kid has learned a lot.
It's pretty obvious this Cobiafishery is a site fishery.
(19:07):
Every everything I read up anddown the coast, they're
targeting with live bait andit's a site fishery.
It's not like you're going togo to the rip and you're going
to find bass there.
You're not going to find Cobiain the same spot.
They're moving around with thebait, but there are a lot of
(19:28):
fish being caught Now.
With that said, things arechanging.
We could be in denial and saythey are not.
I don't know what's causing it.
I don't pretend to have anyidea what's causing it, but
things are changing.
They just are.
We see it in the watertemperatures.
It can't be denied.
(19:49):
So what's happening is we havea transition of fisheries.
I've discussed this and I willcontinue to do so, as we have
more and more of southernfisheries that are headed up
into the New York bite area.
This is happening consistentlyover the past couple of years.
(20:12):
So I went straight to the top tofind out what the scientific
community and managementcommunity thinks is happening
regarding this transition, andalso there's an in-depth
discussion on the Cobia itself.
And get ready.
(20:35):
They should be showing up soon.
From what I hear, there aresome bunkers down in Jersey on
their way up.
For some reason We're a littlethin on bunker right now, but
hopefully that'll change As soonas they come and you get the
bass on them.
You know that the Cobia aregoing to be there this year in
better numbers.
(20:56):
So listen, in a way, jimmyfished it.
There are other tactics,obviously.
You know I've seen some folksthat kind of fish them like
they're fishing a bass.
They'll hook it up as a lightbunker rig and swim it back out,
and they do work.
(21:17):
They also mentioned aboutfishing on the outskirts of the
bunker schools.
So look, it's just one of thosefisheries that you're going to
have to be in the right place atthe right time.
But if you are, make sureyou're ready.
It's like you got to be readyfor it Because you know if
you're not ready it's going tohappen.
So you be ready.
(21:38):
And if you see them, cash in onthem.
I hear they're a good fightingfish and excellent eating fish
And obviously, just as usrecreational anglers always do,
you know, just take what you'regoing to eat And you can release
the rest.
(21:59):
And now for my interview.
I'm in line with Dr Dan Creer.
He's a marine ecologiststudying the effects of the
changing environment on marinespecies and fisheries.
And first, dan, i'd like towelcome you to the show.
You know you are involved insomething that really has my
(22:22):
interest and things that arehappening right now.
You know I'm a believer thatthere's a lot going on under the
water right now And we're inthis transition that you know.
Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm seeinga lot of things And I kind of
wanted to get your take on it.
And specifically, maybe wecould start out with this new
(22:44):
fishery that we have.
I call the Kobea fishery.
I mean, we have had actuallyregulations in place for this
fishery for the longest time,but I used to wonder why.
Now I know I mean we had a lotof big Kobea come aboard.
So again, welcome to the show,dan.
Oh, thank you for having me.
(23:05):
This was great.
So what are your thoughts onthe fact that we now have a
targeted fishery directed atKobea?
Like?
it's like the first time ever.
I've been doing this for 35years now, so I know for a fact
that you can count on one handthe time there was a 50-pound
(23:28):
Kobea weight.
Dr Dan Creer (23:31):
Right, right, yeah , it's definitely going to
continue as well.
Because of the continuouslywarming waters And it may not
happen every single year, but ona year's only have warmer
temperatures or warmer watersthat these species are going to,
especially including Kobea, aregoing to continue to shift
(23:52):
further north, especially duringthe summertime, and the shallow
areas right around Long Islandare nice and right around their
sweet spot and the temperaturesthat they like.
So I'm not surprised at all.
I'm not surprised that you'reseeing it more often, and some
of the work that I've done Ishowed that during warmer years,
(24:14):
kobea are further north.
During cooler years they're notas far north And as you get
further into the future and westill have our continued trend
of warming we are going tocontinue to see Kobea more and
more often be found furthernorth up in New York and New
Jersey.
George Scocca (24:33):
Yeah, so now what about the fact?
See, i've been thinking that,ok, it's warming, the fish are
coming up, and when they gethere in New York, we have these
great protections in place forour manhading and bunker
fisheries, like none of thereduction fleets are allowed in
(24:53):
our waters at all.
So we've been getting tons andtons of bait, to the point that
humpbacks are 30 yards off thebeach And so there's a ton of
bait in there, and I'm wonderinghow much that plays into it.
Dr Dan Creer (25:09):
Yeah, they are definitely, because so Kobea are
generalist feeders, which meansthat they eat a lot of
different types of species.
And so what makes that nice forthem is that they can move into
new places and still find food,luckily for them also.
Manhading are also found in offof Virginia and North Carolina
(25:31):
and whatnot, where they areknown to reside as well, and
that's the primary species thatKobea feed on.
So that could definitely directmaybe locally where they are
Within or, i guess, off ofConnecticut or New York or New
Jersey.
But what may push them furthernorth?
that further distance canlikely be the warming waters,
(25:57):
and in addition, those warmerwaters could be pushing
manhading further north.
So for a given few weeks or fora given month, as they're
following the localized warmingthat's happening throughout the
summer.
So it definitely varies.
They're very driven by foodright, and they're going to
follow fish both fish So it's alittle hard to feed that apart,
(26:23):
whether it's temperature or preyor both, and my guess is that
it's probably a combination ofboth And temperature is
affecting both.
The prey, like manhading andKobea.
George Scocca (26:35):
OK, is there a directed commercial fishery with
Kobea?
Because I don't recall eversinging it in a seafood store.
But I'm just curious if youknow if there's a directed
commercial fishery.
Dr Dan Creer (26:52):
Yes, it is, but it's very, very small.
I can't remember the quota offthe top of my head, but it's
very, very, very, or the percentof the quota.
It's less than 5%.
The quota is allocated forcommercial, so the vast, vast
majority is allocated just forrecreational, and so sometimes
(27:16):
you'll see them as like aspecialty item at a restaurant,
but yeah, for the most partyou're not going to see them in
the supermarket.
George Scocca (27:25):
Yeah, because from everything I hear, i
haven't had any yet, but I hearit's a pretty good eating fish.
And that always scares me.
Oh, you haven't?
No, i haven't, i want to catchthe one that I eat.
So that's a problem.
I haven't been in the rightplace at the right time yet, but
I will.
And but that always frightensme, you know, because every fish
(27:50):
that tastes really good, youknow it's got a bounty on its
head.
So that's why I asked thatquestion, you know.
You know we eat, we love fish,you know.
So Americans love to eat fish,and a fish like that, i mean,
you know, right now, a liveblack fish, believe it or not.
(28:11):
In New York it's illegal, butthey're doing, but it happens,
and they're selling live blackfish for $25 a pound.
So you get it.
Whoever thought that wouldhappen?
right, no one.
So you know.
so I'm just bringing it up andtrying to nip it in the bud, you
know So.
So now, what about thesespawning habits?
(28:33):
Where?
where those fish spawned, youknow?
Dr Dan Creer (28:36):
Yeah, so the major spawning area, especially for
the cobia that used the morenorthern parts of the Atlantic,
is Chesney Bay.
That's their biggest spawningground.
They, both males and females,come in there during during late
spring, early summer, spawn andthey can spawn continuously
(28:59):
throughout the summertime Andthen after the summer they'll
leave And for some reasonsometimes in the middle of the
summer some individuals willshoot further north, just like
that.
They might come and go up toLong Island off from New Jersey,
off from Delaware and Maryland,but during the spawning times
it is well known that it occursin Chesney Bay.
(29:21):
There have been some hypothesesout there that they that they
might spawn offshore, offshoreof Virginia and offshore of
Maryland and Delaware, but thatis not as well understood.
And then there's also spawningoff of South Carolina as well,
(29:47):
in some of the estuaries there.
But primarily the individualsthat you guys are interacting
with up in New York are latelyfrom the, the group that spawned
Chesney Bay.
George Scocca (30:01):
Okay, so that tells me that if they're
spawning in Chesney Bay, i meanwe have the same conditions in
the Hudson River.
I mean we have the secondlargest striped bass fishery you
know reproduces, second amountbehind Chesapeake for striped
bass, and almost seems likethey're spawning around the same
(30:21):
exact time as a striped bass.
So I'm thinking that maybewe'll see I don't know, you
never know could see residentpopulation.
Dr Dan Creer (30:33):
Yeah, and so I know striped bass spawn on a
little bit more fresher waters,so Kobia will still spawn in,
and pretty saline waters,probably between like 15, which
on the map is very low and 15parts per thousand, all the way
(30:55):
up to ocean ocean, which isaround 35 parts per thousand
personally.
So so, yeah, obviously there's.
There's a lot of otherconditions that dictate what
makes a good habitat for fish tospawn in And for Kobia.
We are still trying to figurethat out.
That's something that may belinked to if we may or may not
(31:18):
see Kobia spawning happening inareas further north, such as
Delaware Bay or Long IslandSound and whatnot, or New York
Bight, that those are areas thatpotentially, given the
temperatures, could be suitablefor spawning.
But there are other attributesor features that are important
as well for spawning or forsuccessful spawning.
(31:39):
So whether it ends up happeningor not, we'll have to wait and
see.
But as they start to use moreand more area up there or more
and more habitat up there for alonger period of time, i
wouldn't be surprised.
George Scocca (31:52):
Okay.
So let's for a moment switchspecies here and jump over to
tuna.
So in the last few years we'vehad a really good inshore bite
on both yellow fin and blue fin.
When I say inshore, you know 20miles, and I was wondering, you
(32:16):
know?
I mean, you think those fishare moving in, because I don't
think the Gulf Stream came inthat far I was, i was watching
it, but you think maybe it's dueto the warm waters that those
fish are coming in, or, you know, i've seen this in the past.
So I really don't think thatthere's a connection.
But I'm curious what you guysare saying.
Dr Dan Creer (32:38):
Yeah, i think the best guess that that that we
think it's causing this isprobably like that they're
following those large men inschools and that are that are
that are occurring furtherinshore.
That's probably driving the twodistributions more more right?
(32:59):
Yeah, so I agree with you there.
George Scocca (33:04):
Okay, so do you feel the I mean we.
you know we're seeing somereally good seasons.
Do you know how Noah feelsabout the stock and the biomass
and all the fishery For whichspecies?
Yellow, blue and blue?
Dr Dan Creer (33:20):
Yeah, so the the West Atlantic Lupin tuna fishery
is is very well sustainable oris very well sustainable.
There's been a lot of work doneby by no fisheries to improve
the populations for, especiallyfor, especially western blue and
(33:45):
tuna, and the elephant tuna aswell has has improved as well.
But Yeah, so so far they theyare.
they are both both verysustainable fisheries.
So we encourage you to to eatlocal, you know, and support US
caught fisheries for sure.
George Scocca (34:06):
Absolutely So the give me a general outlook for
what you see happening.
You know I'm of the belief aswe discussed the warfare for a
minute that we're in the middleof a huge transition, that
things are happening underneaththe water that you know we can't
(34:29):
see what's happening.
So you know, like you know,like you said before, you know
the Kobe may be spawningoffshore.
You know I'm an advisor on theweekfish board And I was shocked
to find out a couple months agothat there are weekfish being
caught like way offshore inwinter.
So like I never even knew theywere out there, you know so.
(34:53):
So here we are.
We're experiencing like crazystuff, like we used to have when
a flounder you could thinkabout, in them you could macro,
would run through the sound andfor a couple weeks, and we had
Tommy Cod, we had all thesedifferent fisheries.
Yet there's a lot that we havethat we didn't have.
So, for example, sea bass havebeen phenomenal.
(35:16):
The fluke fishery is is hangingin there.
It's still hanging tough.
I mean that wasn't reallyaround that much.
You know, back in the late, i'mgonna say early 80s, i'm sure
my age you so you know.
So we see this huge change Andthen we have all the lobster and
long Island sound die And theyliterally died.
(35:38):
There's not a lobster in thesound.
I mean it's exaggerate.
I mean you may see a lobsterhere or there, but it's it's.
They're all gone.
And, by the way, we have anestimated million ghost pots
laying in the middle of thesound right now.
So, so, and you know, it'sfunny, not that it's funny, but
(35:59):
it's ironic that a lot of thesefolks that efficient, that send
down video cameras you almostalways see a ghost pot when
they're in the sound.
I mean, every shot I see oneback there.
So they're all over the place.
But what do you think ishappening?
(36:20):
And or what is happening That'sthat's causing this change.
Dr Dan Creer (36:28):
Yes, i think again , a lot of it is is ocean
conditions changing Basically?
we have have just continuedwarming oceans right from from
climate change, and so the inthe Gulf Stream is shifting
northward, and the LabradorCurrent, which comes down south
and inshore from basicallyCanada That's what keeps the
(36:53):
coastline up in New England andwhatnot And north of Hatteras
cool, the Labrador Current Thatis, that is weakening And and so
a combination of those, thosethings are contributing to
species just shifting furthernorth to their sweet spots.
(37:15):
Right, so in for for givenspecies there's a range of
temperatures that they prefer tobe in, right, and if that, if
that range is, or if thoseconditions are down off of
Virginia one year and then, andthen all of a sudden, in
whatever 20 years from now,those conditions are now off of
(37:38):
New York, that those species aregoing to follow those
conditions, given that, as longas you know, there's food there,
right, and so.
So temperature is a majordriver physiologically for a
larger, for a lot of marinespecies.
There are other conditions aswell that are important, like
salinity and the amount ofoxygen in the water.
(38:00):
But temperature is a reallyknown strong driver dictating
where species go.
George Scocca (38:07):
And we could expect to see this continue.
I mean, actually it's beenhappening, you know, over time,
But but now we're all realizingwhat has been happening and why
it's been happening.
I mean, you know, winterflounder.
everybody wants to know why wecan't.
There are no winter flounderinshore yet the offshore
fisheries loaded.
(38:27):
So I'm thinking they wanted to,just got to want them, you know
, and they moved out.
not that we killed them all, Soso I'm going to ask you I don't
know if this is in your, in yourwheelhouse, so to speak but do
you have any opinion on what'shappening with the whales that
are washing up on on the JerseyShore?
(38:47):
I know it's a touchy subjectbecause of the green energy and
all that stuff, but I'mwondering if, if you're aware of
what's going on and have a havean opinion.
Dr Dan Creer (38:59):
Yeah, i only slightly aware of it.
Unfortunately the marine mammalside is a little bit outside my
my expertise So it's hard forme to comment too much on on
that.
But I am aware I've seen, i'veread some stories in the scene
pictures Absolutely, but I'm notfully aware of what's driving
(39:20):
that.
George Scocca (39:20):
Okay, so the other one that you cover, or you
cover in shark too, right?
Yeah, obviously, you know welove to make a shark in New York
And I know it's totally offbase, but you know how, how
healthy is that fishery, thatthat's an amazing, freaking fish
, you know.
(39:41):
So I'm curious as to what, whatyou guys, how you feel the
overall biomass is doing.
Dr Dan Creer (39:52):
Well, so it's that it is.
Oh, it is tough because it'sthe internationally managed
species, right?
It's managed by eye cat, right,and so so they're there there
have been declines, But we'relooking at it from the the
(40:12):
entire Atlantic or NorthAtlantic population.
And so and some kind of off ofsome countries some countries we
may see we've seen somedeclines, but off of others that
may not be the case.
And so I know with, with eyecat eventually, all the
countries that came to anagreement that that we need to
be more cautious with makeup,with, with the worry that we
(40:35):
want to make sure that the stockis able to be filled.
So I, so I'm not part of the ofthat, of that conversation.
I'm not, i don't work with theinternational side with eye cat
But, but with my understanding,is that they I think there's
(40:56):
this extreme caution, given howmuch they interact with
fisheries and also the lifehistories of maple sharks,
because they take a long time toreach maturity.
They don't have very, very manyyoung pups at once.
And and and they take a longtime to grow, and so they are
(41:16):
vulnerable to two fisheries, allkinds of fisheries.
So so there are reasons why thegovernment and the
international community is beingcautious there.
George Scocca (41:29):
Okay, yeah, we all want to protect the mighty
Mako.
I had a big one once when I wasa kid.
If I had to do all of, idefinitely release that fish.
I was like 600 pounds.
But in any case, it is what itis And we have to move on to
whatever species that we canfind, whatever comes up our way.
So, and you know, look, i'mjust trying to bring out the
(41:54):
fact that, yes, things arechanging, but it's not bad, you
know, it's just changing.
My guess is we're going to seeblack drum in our area soon.
We're already kind of seeingsome small ones around And I
think we're going to have a lotmore black drum soon, but we'll
see.
Dr Dan Creer (42:12):
So yeah, i think, i think it's.
I think it's safe to say thatyou can eat, like you should
expect to see, especially duringwarm years, some unique species
being found further north.
We've experienced that inChesapeake Bay as well, with
with species coming like topfull species that end up like
(42:32):
randomly appearing in ourspecies.
They may be caught inGulfstream, you know, and and
and fall the warm water you knowinto the, into the bay.
But but yeah, so I think it'sgoing to continue And yeah, i'm
not surprised It's probablygoing to continue at at a faster
rate as well, but or more at ahigher recurring rate.
George Scocca (42:53):
I get it.
Well, look, i truly appreciatethis interview and your time.
I'm going to keep your numberand email because something
tells me we're going to betalking again pretty soon, so is
there anything else that youcan?
you'd like to inform ourlisteners about anything?
Dr Dan Creer (43:15):
Oh man, i what I think.
I think you got to get preparedto.
You know, buy your bucktailsand in your cacti rods and
towers, you know, and, and, andhopefully you're able to catch
some cobi, because they are anawesome fish to catch and an
awesome fish to eat, andcurrently they are.
(43:36):
They are sustainable and so ifyou get out there and then catch
them, i hope you'll be able toand enjoy it.
George Scocca (43:44):
So do you actually fish for them, you
yourself?
Dr Dan Creer (43:51):
So when I was a PhD student at the Virginia
Institute of Marine Science, orWIMS for short, that's right off
of trustee bay And so I workedwith fishermen a lot to tag them
, and also I've brought themback to BIMS and I did some live
experiments on them.
So fishermen helped a lot.
The recreational communityhelped a lot on collecting my
(44:15):
animals, but I also caught somemyself.
We had our own vessel and thenwe had a tower on it, and so
once I learned how to fish forthem properly, we got not as
good as fishermen, but we gotall right.
We did our fishing withcatching Cobia on our own and
(44:39):
tagging them and releasing them.
George Scocca (44:40):
That's great.
That is great because the guysthat had them they were just
outside of the bunker schoolskind of running with them, but
they had to catch one thatwasn't actively feeding.
But those ones, those were theones that they were getting them
on.
They would throw a bunk aroundin front of it and, provided it
(45:04):
wasn't in the middle of theschool, that's how they were
catching them.
So I guess it won't be too longbefore we have a mandatory
circle hook on them.
I don't know, i hope not.
Dr Dan Creer (45:16):
Yeah, yeah, yes, and I know from my research some
of the models that I createdhave predicted that over in the
next 20 to 40 years that thebest habitat for Cobia in the
summertime so thermally the besthabitat is off of New Jersey.
(45:39):
It'll be more, it'll be thebest suitable habitat will be
off of New.
The most, i guess I should saythe highest percentage of
suitable habitat will occur offof New Jersey compared to
anywhere else of the Atlantic inthe summertime, and so it's
only going to continue to, orthe speed of the land continues
(46:00):
to slowly push up.
They may not be readily in NewYork all the time, but I think
those instances are going tocontinue to increase, and, yes,
20 to 40 years in the future,and I wouldn't be surprised if
you see them every summer on areliable basis.
George Scocca (46:20):
All right, Great Again.
Look, then, I really appreciateyou doing the interview and
we're going to do another one inthe future And keep up the good
work there.
We appreciate it.
Like I said, there's a lot ofpeople listening to this thing
right now that they I don't knowwhat it is, they don't want to
(46:42):
accept it.
Things are changing even thoughthey are right before their
eyes, So things like this helpeducate folks And I hope I mean
look, there's nothing we coulddo about it.
Really, It is good, It is whatit's going to be And you know,
as a world or as a nation, weall got to try and slow it down,
(47:02):
But I don't see that happeninganytime soon.
Dr Dan Creer (47:06):
So Yeah, and at this point, the ocean.
you know the ocean takes a longtime to change, right?
And so we can make changes, youknow, and improvements to lower
our greenhouse gas emissionsand our reliance on fossil fuels
, But that doesn't mean thatwell, regardless it's so going.
(47:26):
There's a lot of inertia rightthat that a warming that's going
to continue to happen before westart to see any, i guess,
lessening of the warming effect,And that's just in the air.
Jimmy Ferch Jr. (47:42):
If you don't, if you look into the water.
Dr Dan Creer (47:44):
It's even slower right.
So these species are going tobe transitioning further north
for for them for decades anddecades and decades to come,
regardless of how much we do atthat time to control greenhouse
gas emissions.
So that means that fishermenneed to adapt, that means that
(48:06):
managers need to adapt, thatmeans scientists need to adapt,
and so that's going to happenregardless.
And you're going to see newspecies and you're going to
might lose some species, andthat's just the way it is.
And, like I said, everyone'sgoing to have to learn to adapt,
just like these fish are.
George Scocca (48:23):
Right.
Well, you know what It's theway I see it's an excuse to buy
different tackle.
Okay, so now I have to tacklejust for cobia.
That's how we are.
You got some for flukes type aswhatever it is.
So, yeah, i'm loving itactually.
Dr Dan Creer (48:38):
So you can take advantage of the new situation
that you know or the new speciesthat are there.
That can be exciting.
George Scocca (48:47):
Well, that's exactly what we're all doing.
So again, dan, i appreciate it.
We will talk again soon Andthanks again for doing this
interview Awesome, thank you forhaving me.
Dr Dan Creer (49:00):
I really appreciate it.
George Scocca (49:01):
Okay, thank you Have it.
folks.
I hope you enjoyed that as muchas I did.
Please subscribe to thispodcast.
We're getting more and morelisteners every single week.
It's very simple You get.
All you have to do is say, hey,siri, play the New York fishing
podcast.
Or hey, google, play the NewYork fishing podcast, or
(49:25):
whatever it is Alexa or Googledevice at home or any telephone
you have, so be sure to tune in.
I'm going to try to bring youinformation that you're not
going to find anywhere else AndI know some of it sounds boring
And it's actually gets that waysometimes with me but I'm going
(49:47):
to bring you the facts.
I'm not making up stuff.
Every single thing I say is afact, or at least I fact checked
it.
Hopefully what I checked wasreal, but I try to deliver, and
I try hard to deliver the truthand the facts, and so please
(50:08):
subscribe to this.
More listeners turns into morestrength, and that's what we
need right now.
We need unity.
I believe we all unified, butwe're kind of unified apart,
which is something you knowsocial media brought to the
scene.
Anyhow, subscribe to thispodcast.
(50:30):
Remember I'm doing this for 35years, i know what I'm talking
about And you want to be in onwhat I know As the next episode,
which I may just do right afterthis one, we'll tell you all
about what's going to be in yourNew York State fishing license,
which you will have in 2004, 24.
(50:55):
Don't bother to fight it, it'sdone.
We just got to see what we getout of this thing, and they all
baiting us with a lot of stuff.
So watch out for that podcast.
Make sure you subscribe.
It means a lot.
The more subscribers, the morepeople understand that I'm
probably speaking for a lot ofpeople, a lot of people on both
(51:20):
sides the industry and therecreational angler And, most
importantly, the conservation ofthe fishery.
So please subscribe.
Thanks for tuning in And I'llbe right back at you with all
the license information that Ihave, which is fact.
It's not made up, it's not doneyet, but I got all the dates
(51:44):
and all the figures, so we'regoing to do that right after
this.
Thanks again, everyone.
Get out there tight lines.
I don't have to tell you thefishing is really good.
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