September 24, 2025 • 44 mins
When Calculus Meets Heart: Stand and Deliver Gets the Math TreatmentWelcome to this episode of The Most Excellent 80s Movies Podcast! Hosts Krissy Lenz and Nathan Blackwell tackle the 1988 inspirational drama Stand and Deliver, starring Edward James Olmos as real-life teacher Jaime Escalante. This episode dives into whether this classroom classic still holds up or if it's just another case of sitting through endless math problems.The Good, The Bad, and The CalculusThe hosts appreciate Edward James Olmos' committed, Academy Award-nominated performance—he even underwent hair thinning for the role and followed the real teacher around for research. Lou Diamond Phillips also shines as Angel, the charismatic bad boy with hidden depths. However, Krissy and Nathan find themselves wanting more emotional depth and character development. They argue that while the movie succeeds as inspiration, it fails to show the real struggles and motivations that would drive these students to commit so deeply to advanced mathematics.The discussion takes an interesting turn when they question the practicality of teaching calculus versus life skills like tax accounting. They also critique the film's structure, noting that despite being billed as a comedy, it's more of a straightforward drama that keeps viewers at arm's length from the action. The hosts give Stand and Deliver a solid 6 out of 10, appreciating its heart while acknowledging its limitations.Additional Thoughts:
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- The movie should have been called "Sit and Calculate" given how much sitting and math occurs
- More scenes showing students' home lives and personal struggles would have strengthened the narrative
- The ending needed more follow-up on what happened to these students after passing their AP exams
- Edward James Olmos deserved the Oscar over Michael Douglas that year
- The film lacks the dramatic tension found in other inspirational teacher movies
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Thanks for tuning in to another episode of the Most
Excellent Eighties Movies Podcast. Want to skip those ads and
get early access, become a member at true story dot fm,
slash join and discover all the other great parks that
come with it.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hello and welcome to the Most Excellent Eighties Movies Podcast.
It's the podcast where we rise and turn in our
reviews of the eighties movies we think we love or
might have missed with. These are modernized to see how
they hold up. And today we're talking about Stand and Deliver,
a movie selection from nineteen eighty eight, about which letterbox says,
(00:54):
at a tough school, someone had to take a stand
dot dot dot and someone did. Together, one teacher and
one class proved to America they could. Hi May Escalante
is a mathematics teacher in a school in a school
in a Hispanic neighborhood. Convinced that his students have potential,
(01:16):
he adopts unconventional teething teaching methods to try and turn
gang members and no hopers into some of the country's
top algebra and calculus students. All right, here comes the trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Baby Say You're wake as You're waking up, Wake Up,
this morning.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
How are you bringing toothpicks to pinch open your eye?
Can we talk about I have.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
To discuss sex.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
I have to get sex for homework.
Speaker 4 (01:49):
I wouldn't do that if I lose a finger, I
won't be able to come to down.
Speaker 5 (01:55):
At a tough school, someone had to take a stand,
and someone did. Now the critics stand up and cheer
for stand and deliver terrific, tremendous, gripping and compelling, more
exciting than La bamba. Almost gives a wonderful performance, declares
Jack Crole Newsweek. Enormously inspiring and very rewarding. Almost gives
(02:19):
the first great performance of the year. Jeffrey Lyons Sneak Previews,
and Pat Collins WWRTV says, stand up and cheer for
a movie with art. It's the Rocky of the classroom.
Edward James, Almost, Lou Diamond Phillips stand and deliver.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Why they have to take a shot at lobamba? Geez o,
my gosh, poor Lou Diamond Phillips. I'm Chrissy Lynz, one
of the directors at the Neighborhood Comedy Theater in downtown Mesa, Arizona,
and with me as always.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Is Nathan Blackwell, independent filmmaker. Hi.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Hi, So before we jump in and really pick apart
Stand and Deliver, we got to say a little message
to you are loyal listeners, so you may have noticed
the ads have gotten a bit wonky lately. We just
switched all of True Story IFM just switched to a
(03:33):
new system and we're working out the kinks. So don't panic.
The ads will be back to normal soon. For now,
just to bear with us as we work on more
strategic placement of the ads. And I apologize for the
(03:54):
bonkers ad placement on Little Monsters. It'll be cleaned up
soon and you'll be able to go back and listen
to that one with a little more comfort as soon
as we get fixed and updated. So that's our little
housekeeping at the beginning, Stand and Deliver, Nathan, is this
a movie you've seen it before?
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Yes? So this was one of those movies that I think,
you know, I was in grade school or elementary school
or whatever. The difference is that that came out, and
so it was definitely one of those like inspirational stories
that you know, there was kind of a small collection
(04:39):
of movies that teachers would play in class when they
didn't want to teach, or it was a half day
you know, or like whatever for like summer session or whatever,
and so this was one of those.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Yeah, sure was. That's the only reason I've seen it
is because an English teacher showed it to me in
high school. Yes, yes, the only time I've seen it.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Yes, I've seen it once or twice, I believe, and
then and now it's been quite some time.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, I never returned to it. I remember, I remember
liking it, I remember being moved by it and like
inspired by it. Yes, but for no reason, no reason
to ever go back to it. So I think it
has as long as English teachers keep showing it to
(05:32):
their classrooms. Were good. But if the tradition continues, yeah,
then I don't think that many people are going to
be revisiting this movie.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
Well it's interesting. It's like, you know, like anything, there's
there's movies of the time where they have a lot
of impact and a lot of splash, and some movies
just there the connection or whatever, you know, it it
doesn't last. There's there's plenty of movies that we grew
(06:03):
up in in high school that were a big deal
and now it's it's a struggle for it to find
on like on on streaming or digital. And of course
why would I have any examples in mind, But but
(06:25):
for sure there were tons of movies that saide high school,
and we talked about it and and now we're just
kind of out of the sphere of influence and they
just don't have any lasting power. Not saying that this
is necessarily like that, but I could totally see how
this is no longer in the rotation when when there's
(06:47):
plenty of like big you know, like sports teacher inspirational movies.
It's it's it's the niche of.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Or niche if you will, I will, I will.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
The down on there. Like I don't know if Dead
Poet Society is still in the conversation anymore, you know,
I would say.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
It is more so than Stand and Deliver. I think
that Dead Poet Society, because of Robin Williams, has a
little bit more cachet and nostalgia. Not which is not
(07:31):
to say that Edward James almost is not resplendent and
wonderful in this movie. He is. He was nominated for
an Academy Award and a Golden Globe, and deservedly so.
He went real method on this movie and followed the
real teacher around and like lived at his house.
Speaker 4 (07:57):
Geez, did he know?
Speaker 2 (08:00):
I hope?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
So I feel like another one like mister Hulland's Opus
that was one that I don't think is on radars anymore, or.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
The obvious one to me is Dangerous Minds from nineteen
ninety five. Yes, and I don't think that movie is
really in the zeitgeist anymore either, aside from Coolio's contribution.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
Of yeah in the mid to late nineties.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah, I think we more remember weird Al's Amish Paradise
than we remember Coolio's Gangster's Paradise.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's interesting. And so what are the
those inspirational movies now?
Speaker 3 (08:51):
You know?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
The I honestly couldn't tell you. I don't know is
it supposed to be center? Because I don't think we're
making that many new movies about and of course I
could be having a huge blind spot that I don't
know about, but where are the movies about teachers in
(09:13):
the LATINX neighborhoods now making big progress and doing big things?
And you know what really bothers me about this is
that calculus is useless.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
Unless you unless you are specifically going into a hard
math and science profession. You know, but if you want to.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Get these kids like a better job and a real
profession like AP, calculus is perhaps not the way, Like
can we teach them tax accounting? Can we teach them
you know, can they pass the AP?
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Uh?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
You know, life skills class? You know in dangerous Minds?
She's teaching them poetry, like is equally useful. Yeah I
say that as a huge fan of poetry.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Uh, yeah, I am. I did. I remember. I have
a distinct memory of being in algebra and talking to
the teacher about what I would have to do to
move on to calculus, and he was like, what the
fuck are you thinking? Like you're you're my worst student
in algebra, you know, you want to go to calcus.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
There's no like unless you're an engineer or a science person. Uh,
there's no like real word application for this calculus that
they're learning. And it's like, it's wonderful that they're learning.
And I get that he's like proving that they can
learn and that they can achieve.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
And then they yes, they can achieve the top of
the academic.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Pyramid. Yes, the latter uh huh uh.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
And that's great, but they're obviously not doing that in
all their classes. So I mean, I don't think colleges,
and maybe colleges are going to look at their one
AP credit and go like, Okay, this kid's got chopped,
But I just don't see it as providing the springboard
they need to have a new life.
Speaker 4 (11:36):
Yeah, it is calculus. So I'm the wrong person to ask.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Well, you're a filmmaker and I'm a comedian, so yes,
so what the fuck do we know?
Speaker 4 (11:48):
We're degenerates? Yeah, yeah, we're degenerates when it comes to that.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
I've my degree is in visual communications, for God's sake,
So yeah, I'm a calculus did I take Yeah?
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Never, I've never used algebra. I've never used a lot
of the math and science that I took, the Earth
sciences I took in community college. Yeah, but that's because
of my degenerate path. You know, this movie Stand and
(12:27):
Deliver really should have been called Sit and Calculate, Yes,
because I can't think of another movie where everyone is
just sitting all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Sitting all the time, and like we do see a
little bit of their home lives. There's a really one
of My favorite parts is where one of the girls, Anna,
who's actually one of the only girls who are one
of the only student characters who was really based one
to one on a real life person. Edward James almost
(13:00):
and his wife go eat in her father's restaurant and
let her go to school.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
Yeah, that's one of the best scenes.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
That's what scenes.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
What we needed were more of those scenes, Like I
felt like, so again, I'm not I was inspired by
this movie. Edward James almost knocks it out of the park,
But there are some.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
I have to say. He underwent hair thinning for this role,
which I can't imagine a male Hollywood lead actor doing
in this day and age. And he gained everyone's gaining
and losing weight.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
Well he still looks better than me.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
But yeah, oh Edward James almost Yeah, yes, and he
and he's knotting out of the park. Also, lou Diamond
Phillips is magnetic. Yes, but never did I feel he's
sort of the bad boy angel. He like he's a
bad boy. He shows up drunk when they get their
(13:58):
test results and and uh, we're But never was I
afraid that the gang life was going to take him.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
No, my biggest criticism of this film is that we
are almost outside of the action. Like I wanted to
feel their resistance of taking all this math like at
some like I wanted to to see more of each
(14:26):
of them have a reason to join Dumbledore's army, you know,
because because they they it's not just that he is inspirational.
They end up joining this you know, math group. You know,
it is a die hard commitment. They're doing it, you know,
(14:51):
like every day, and they're doing it in the summer.
They all at some point, yeah, it's like they're you know,
it's almost like they're they're I'm missing their motivation. I'm
missing the turning point to where they're each kind of
deciding to step into this team and to make a
(15:16):
difference in their life, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Right. In fact, there's one scene where what are the kids?
I forget his name, but he's like, you know, Chemo,
they call him Chemo short for Chemo Sabe and he's like, Kimo,
I have to work Saturday and Sunday. I can't you know,
do calculus Saturday and Sunday. I have to work. I
can make double the money, you know, I need the money.
And so mister Escalante takes him out for a drive
(15:42):
in his car and is like stripping the gears of
his car, and he's like, which way right or left? Right?
Or left? Go right? Go right? So they go right
and he hits a dead end and he goes you
see the lesson, You only see the turn, not the
road ahead, And it's like, well, did you know that
was a dead end? What were you? What was the
plan here? Like and and okay, I think it would
(16:05):
have been more inspirational if he was trying to like
work with them and allow them to like make some
money for their families, which they probably like sorely need.
Also learning calculus.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
Don't worry in a year and a half to all
pay off when you passed the calculus.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Test, and yeah, and in what way you know? Like
spoiler alert. They all passed the test, and the you know,
what do they achieve beyond that? Like you know, and
and then the the very end, so what So they
(16:43):
all passed the test, but their grades get challenged, challenged
by Andy Garcia and his partner who are like, we
think that you all cheated because you all got the
same wrong answers. So they make them take the test
again and they all pass again. Yeah, and then the
(17:07):
little like our little freeze frame at the end, which
is like, Okay, in nineteen seventy four, this many kids passed.
In nineteen seventy five, double that many passed in nineteen
seventy six, triple that number past. You know, in seventy eight,
almost one hundred kids passed the bad test, And I
was like, okay, great, but like what happened to them after?
(17:28):
Like did they get jobs as teachers? Where are they now?
Like how many of them got out of East LA
and like made better lives for themselves and their families.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Yeah, I you know, I wanted a graphic that said,
like I think it ended like an eighty six or something.
I wanted a graphic that said, like, in twenty twenty,
the calculus class had grown so powerful that it had
enveloped all of earth building. What we needed was an
(18:07):
American graffiti style ending to where it says, like how
specifically that are the people that we've been following have
gone on to other things. Now. It's tough because they're,
as far as I know, they're fictionalized amalgamations.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Right, alba Anna is the only one who is based
on a real student, A one to one basis. The
rest were, as you said, amalgamation so so so make
it up, use some artistic license, you know, or.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Or showing the real kids and then about what they're
you know, it's like, you know, showing the real photos
of Haimiescalante and the kids and showing where they all
went off. This person, you know, became a doctor, this
person is an analyst at NASA, you know, or or
(19:05):
just or what you know, just give us a little
extra meet at the end. You know, it is inspirational.
It is great to see them surpass it. I just
was missing. I just felt like I was missing a
little more of the the inside experience, the the the
emotion of of the challenge, you know, of the of
(19:29):
the characters, their motivations. It just felt like we were
outside of the action watching the movie.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Objectively, I completely agree with you. And in fact, there's
a moment when in the take in the retake test
where Anna, who is the girl from the restaurant who's
the only one who's a real student not an amalgamation,
has to leave early. Uh, and she's like, I have
to go to a meeting about my scholarship. Oh great,
(19:58):
she's getting a scholarship to where for what? Poor?
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Why?
Speaker 2 (20:03):
You know? Tell me more please, and they're just like,
are you sure you have to go? And she's like yep, bie,
but she's still passed the test, So like I wanted
to know more about that, and maybe I just wasn't
paying attention and they told us what she became, but
I didn't. I didn't write that down.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
My favorite part of the whole thing is when lou
Diamond Phillips angel Is his character's name, is out with
his friend and they're like just driving around drinking and
they stop in a like vacant lot and he's like,
we're looking at the stars, but those aren't really the
(20:47):
stars anymore. That's the light from the stars millions of
years ago. The stars are all dead now. And it's
like this really beautiful moment and it's like, okay, so
you're doing well in science too, Like are you doing
well in all your classes? Like who taught you that?
(21:08):
Because it wasn't Chemo.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Right, Yeah, he he was a great character, but it
didn't it like there was like that really confrontational gang
friend of his and I never saw like him. I
hope it wasn't. Just didn't miss this. I never saw
him like blow off or resist and leave. He was
(21:32):
just gone one day.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Yeah, he was just gone one day.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Yeah, it would have been really nice if he was.
You know, he obviously came with the toughest resistance up front,
and he rejects the whole thing and he gets thrown
out or he walks out or whatever. But there's that
it's like not everyone will join there is this is
a tough environment.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
So the friend doesn't join, but lou Diamond Phillips and
in fact he like, he's like, I'll give you three
sets of book. He asks for another set of books
so he can keep one at home and have one
at school so he doesn't have to like be seen
with his books because it'll hurry street cred.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
There's still just not enough meat, you know, there's not
enough meat.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
And he's like, I'll give you three books. You can
have a book for your locker, a book for the classroom,
and a book for home. And it's like, okay, great,
that's a great solution. But I never see him like
get shamed by his gang and anything. It makes Yeah, uh,
there's a Keanu Reeves baseball movie. Do you know what
movie I'm.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
Talking about no continue.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
It's called Hardball, okay, and it's about it's like basically
the same story as The Mighty Ducks. He's like a
high powered attorney who somehow gets like busted for gambling
and he has to go teach an inner city baseball
(23:01):
team mm hmmm as punishment, and of course, like he
learns to love them and he teaches them valuable lessons
as they go along the way. But at some point
a kid dies ooh in this lighthearted baseball movie. And
at no point was I worried and stand and deliver
(23:24):
that any kid was going to die, even though like
they build this movie as a comedy, which I didn't
find it that funny. At no point was I worried
that Angel was like risking his life to take this
math class.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
Yeah this, yeah, this is the drama. And and I'm
when this movie started, I was like, gosh, I missed
when they made dramas.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Oh yeah, you missed dramas. Yeah, yeah, no dramas for
you these days.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
They don't seem to make theatrical dramas these days.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Do they. So what the hell are they making? I'm
gonna go see weapons tomorrow. What the hell is that?
Speaker 4 (24:02):
Movie. It's not a drama. Okay, it's like it's like
two or three things, but drama is not one of them.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Drama is not one of them yet. But they build
this movie as a comedy, and I was just like,
I'm not laughing.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Mm hmmm.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
In fact, I was as I was. I was moved,
I was inspired. I did come to care for the characters.
But I also thought this movie was really goddamn for it.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
It was a little long, and we keep saying that
we wish there was more mm.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Hmm, but not more length, more.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
Depth, Yeah, more obstacles. Really, you know, if you're gonna
fictionalize them, if you're gonna make an amalgamation, that gives
you more license to maybe push it a little harder.
You know, you don't have to have like anyone die.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
But I wanted to see her Keanu Reeves Baseball movie.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Just wanted to see a little more resistance. There's just
see any normal person would do.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Where there's a scene where one of the girls can't
study at night because her mom comes home from work
and she's so tired. And then this student has been
taking care of her little brothers and sisters all day
and she's trying to do her homework at night, and
the mom's like, will you turn off the light, and
she's like, yeah, mom, I'll turn off the light, and
so she can't do her studying. But we never see
(25:32):
her struggle with calculus, like she's always just like and
now I'm good with Now I'm good at calculus. Yeah,
I'm perfect at it. Like not a single kid failed.
They all passed, and then they all pass again. I
don't know, I don't know. It's like, it's hard to
(25:54):
talk about a movie where not much happens except math.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Is there another math heavy movie? What's another math heavy movie?
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Goodwill Hunting?
Speaker 4 (26:08):
Yeah, kind of it, but that math is treated like magic.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
That's true, and they certainly don't make it seem like
I guess maybe hidden figures.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Mmm, yeah, that's but that's a good one that does
have the struggle that really just you know, makes a
meal out of it because it is based off of
a real story as well. But yeah, they make it
really tough on the characters and it means more.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
Yeah, I agree, that's really all I can come up with. Yeah,
what's that one where they go and they count cards?
Season it? And they go and they count cards and
they are trying to like win money from the casino.
(27:09):
That's that's about math.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
Okay, good, that's it.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
That's all I got. Because Dangerous Minds is about poetry.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Yeah, okay, that's weird. Admittedly I haven't seen that one.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
You haven't seen Dangerous Minds. It was so popular that
you rejected it, that.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
I rejected it. I went through a phase but also.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Rejecting everything that was popular in the nineties. Well, I
want to know more about this, Nathan.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
It took me. I was resistant to Titanic, but I
did see it in theaters, but I was initially resistant.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Okay. I feel that way about Avatar, like I have
no I have no business.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
I think when there's movies in the zeitgeist, but there
aren't necessarily in your wheelhouse, your genre wheelhouse. You know
that that gives you a reason not to watch it
because it's in the zeitgeist, you know, like the zeitgeist
makes it for whatever reason, you decide to rebel against it.
(28:17):
That's my thinking.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Well, I remember Dangerous Minds being really good.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
Okay, good, So I think that you would like it? Mmmm?
Is that your deep cut recommendation?
Speaker 2 (28:34):
It's not, it's not my deep cut recommendation. I feel
like it's too obvious, but I do feel like you
would like it. It should be the obvious cut recommendation
for everyone who's who's seeing this film. And honestly, I like,
I don't know what else to say about this film,
like aside from like recapping it start to finish, which
I even can't do that because it's like and then
they sit in New Math, and then they sit in
(28:55):
New Math, and then they sit in New Math.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
There's one part that I wrote down where he at
the very beginning, he's handing out the test scores for
like their very first quiz, and he gives Anna her
test score and she did very well, and he goes
he leans down like to her ear and goes, is
it true that intelligent people make better lovers? And I'm like,
don't you say that to her? That's disgusting, sir.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
I felt there was like at least three moments where
that was like, you know where he kind of walked
over that bridge, like it's even used in the trailer.
You know, it's like, if you guys are talking about sex,
I have to give you sex for homework.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Yeah, that's not appropriate.
Speaker 4 (29:39):
Swer uh huh.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
No, thank you, mister Ascalante. Yeah, I mean I don't.
I didn't even have that many notes that I was like, oh,
we got to talk about this. They like they pimp
his ride.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It did look nice, it did look nice.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
He's like driving this like beat up little VW bug
and on the first day it gets its windows broken,
and like, we don't even really get to see we
got to see a little bit of his struggle with
his family, Like at some point his wife is like,
I don't want you working on Christmas and he's just
like too bad, and she's like, well okay.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
And then he has a heart attack, but he doesn't stop.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
Yeah, he has a heart attack and he learns no lessons.
You know what.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
That's the movie. What the movie should have been called
is test.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Passers, Test passers, test passers. So no matter what Andy
Garcia says, they're going to pass the test. We never
even really get to see Andy Garcia eat his words. No, no,
a tense confrontation where he confronts them and he's like, FYI,
(30:57):
you're being racist and Andy is like you're telling me
I'm being racist. Uh, excuse me, sir, I'm not being racist,
And he's like, well, you still kind of are, and
and they're they're having this argument about whether or not
this investigation of his students is being racist, which it is,
(31:19):
but even that is not really brought into aside from
that little scene and then it's gone mm hmm, and
then we just move on next. It's a real slice
of life picture.
Speaker 4 (31:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Yeah, And I have a hard time knowing if I
liked it.
Speaker 4 (31:47):
I liked it, but with with reservations, with with with
with you know, I was really taken with it when
I saw it long ago as a young boy, but now, yeah,
it's now having seen you know, it's like you have
(32:10):
a couple of first time inspirational student teacher movies, and
those first ones make a big impact on you because
they're the they're like you're you're the they're the initial
ones that that that kind of introduce you to the
to the whole idea like we I you know, I
love a good teacher, misfit student, let's all get together,
(32:33):
let's do a School of Rock or be great at
basketball or whatever.
Speaker 5 (32:38):
You know.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I love School of Rock. I think School of Rock
is a really multi layered movie that gets taken for granted.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
Agreed, agreed, but yeah, just missing now that we've seen
so many of these movies, this it's not the story,
but this particular movie is just missing a meat that
was missing subjectivity.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Do you do you think it's because of it was
made in nineteen eighty eight like that it would just
would have been made more exciting and more dramatized if
it was made in No.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
I feel like I feel like a like a good
but weird analogy to this is the Karate Kid, you know,
of having. So you've got one person with a problem,
You've got one person with an unorthodox teaching method, and
there's a lot of conflict between choosing to learn this
(33:38):
thing and not and the path they take and the
ups and downs that entail and how it transforms their life.
Like this is a sports movie. This is Rocky and
the Karate Kid, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yeah, but the sport is calculus, Yes, And it's hard
to see calculus as an enemy mm hmm, even in
dangerous minds. She's like Dylan Thomas and Bob Dylan are
the same, and it's like, Okay, well Bob Dylan is
still out of date. Yeah in nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
Yeah, I mean it's a It is a great story.
It is a great story of hope and transformation. I
just wish the movie was a little more dramatic.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
So on a scale of one, pimped out vw.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
Or so they got like a one to five at
the end of their what was their test called.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
By the way, the ap calculus exam?
Speaker 4 (34:44):
Right, So they they got to score one one to
five and three passes.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Right, yep, that's right. So are we gonna Are we
gonna break with tradition and score this on one to five?
Speaker 4 (34:56):
No, I say we do. So the passing grade is
three out of five. So how many three out of
fives are you going to give the movie?
Speaker 2 (35:03):
Okay? How many three out of fives? Out of ten?
Out of ten? Three out of five? Now we're doing calculus, yes,
and I don't know if I approve of us doing
this calculus? Okay, So so I find this really hard,
and I still don't know what I'm going to rate it.
What are you going to rate it?
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I would say it pains me, but I'm going to
give it a six. I want to give it a seven.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
I want to give it a seven too. I want
to give it an eight, But I can't.
Speaker 4 (35:36):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
I think it's a six. I think this movie is
a six.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
Yeah, maybe even like a six point four. But yeah,
I think I'm we have spoken, the council has sproken.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Okay, so what is your deep cut recommendation? And it
can't be dangerous minds?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
Look, I look. I sometimes these deep cut recommendations are
very difficult. Okay, there's they're all obvious town not deep cut. Yeah,
I don't know. I love Edward James almost, and he's
fantastic in Battle Star. If you also love Edward James
(36:26):
almost and you haven't seen him in Battlestar Galactica, just
watch it. It's great. I know the show is old
now it holds up. Or one assumes I've never seen it.
It's if you want more Edward James almost, he's great
in it. The show goes hard, it's not it's not
a fluff show.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
I would also recommend like he does a lot of conventions.
Speaker 4 (36:50):
But I hear, yeah, yeah, I am, I have. I've
I've met Edward James almost in real life. He was
a guest speaker at my high school.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
No way did you deliver?
Speaker 4 (37:03):
He standed and delivered. This was nine in nineteen ninety
four or something like that. But yeah, I think he's great.
I hope other people think he's great.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
And uh great, I think he's wonderful. I think he's
wonderful in this. Yes, I'm gonna I'm going to look
up who did win the Best Actor Oscar in nineteen
eighty eight. Michael Douglas for Wall Street.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Mmmm, I don't know that's a that. I'd give it
to Edward James almost like he would be my Edward.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
James almost too, because Wall Street was a weird.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
Yeah, it was an iconic performance. I think in terms
of I would have given it to Edward James almost.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Yeah, for sure, I think so too. So you love
him undergo any hair fitting?
Speaker 4 (38:00):
Yes, I think that was pretty insane.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
But yes, yeah, okay, So I have two deep cut recommendations.
Speaker 4 (38:09):
So no rating. Oh no, you did a rating?
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I did. I agreed with you. I'd give it six.
Speaker 4 (38:14):
Okay, continue, Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
My first one is about a group of teachers who
have to do the best they can with not the
best resources, who really care about their students and provide
inspiration on a weekly basis. I recommend Abbott Elementary very good.
(38:36):
Have you seen it.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
I've seen some of it. I can't say that I've
fully committed to it, but I've definitely seen some.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Yeah, it's very funny, it's very good. I highly recommend it.
Leslie Odom Junior shows up at some point and it's
just Bradley Cooper shows up at some point, like it's.
Speaker 4 (38:56):
Just, oh, there's an always Sunny in Philadelphia crossover with
the show.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
I have not I'm not caught up to that point,
but I know that they did it, so I'm looking
forward to it.
Speaker 4 (39:10):
It's literally a crossover where they're all in the same episode.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
That's so weird.
Speaker 4 (39:18):
It's so insane, that's so weird.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
So here's my other deep cut recommendation. And I have
to say, we went on a little journey. So I
made my husband, Dorian watched this movie with me. I
tried to make my son, Rocket, who is fifteen, watched
this movie with me, and he was like, no, thanks, Mom,
this movie's about math. I get enough math in my
real life. I'm dipping out. But Dorian watched this movie
(39:41):
with me and he was just like, you know what
I want to watch now, Young Guns? And I was like, oh, no,
Guns is terrible. He was like, no, it's not Young Guns.
It's great and I was like, I assure you, it's terrible,
and he was like, well, I want to watch it anyway,
and I was like, okay, I'll watch it with you.
But it wasn't available on Prime. So what Washington dead
(40:03):
was Young Guns two?
Speaker 4 (40:06):
Uh huh.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
So I want to low key recommend Huns Too because
lou Diamond Phillips is magnetic. He's just you can't when
he's on screen, you can't take your eyes off him.
He is even though he plays a relatively small part,
(40:29):
he's like at the heart of Young Guns Too. And
there's a really fun moment where he clashes with Christian
Slater and they have a big fight, and that, to me,
was the best part of the movie. M my low
key recommendation is Young Guns Too.
Speaker 4 (40:52):
I think my low key recommendation is the Key and
Peel sketch if Hogwarts were an inner city school. Oh
it's so good, Vincent Clortho Public School of Wizardry.
Speaker 2 (41:05):
Yes, I love that sketch. Now that's a good recommendation. Yeah.
So spoiler, we have an event coming up where we're
doing a crossover with the podcast called The Long Rewind
where we're gonna watch some Ninja movies and I'll be
I don't know if we'll get to do our deep
cut recommendation. So mine's going to be a Saturday a
live sketch.
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Oh okay, yeah, yeah, very good. Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
So in this very short episode, Nathan, why don't you
tell the people where they can support your filmmaking endeavors.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
Yeah, so, as always, Squishy Studios dot com is the
place to go. That's if you want to check out
any of my Voyage Trekkers stuff, which is for my
older web series where if you haven't checked out my
feature film The Last Movie Ever Made, you can find
links like a trailer there. It's just the easiest place
for that stuff. And then there's links if you want
(42:01):
to click and rent the movie or something like that
on Amazon and Apple.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
Excellent, all very fun. Love Voyage Treckers. Can't recommend it enough.
If you want to see me in real life, go
to the Neighborhood Comedy Theater in downtown Mesa, Arizona, every
Friday and Saturday night. You can say hi to me
if you tell me you're a most excellent Eighties movies
podcast listener, I will buy you a drink at the
Sacred Pint, which is our little pub that's in front
(42:31):
of the Neighborhood Comedy Theater. There. If you want to
listen to me more and you like the show Supernatural,
tune in to Gank That Drink, a supernatural drinking game
podcast where me and my co host Nate mccorter watch
and drink along to our favorite episodes of our favorite
show Supernatural. Also a true story FM product. And if
(42:52):
you're listening here at the end and you're like, not
only where these ads a bit bonkers and I want
them gone, but also I want to know more about
Nate and Chrissy, Nathan and Chrissy. Sorry, Nate is my
other host.
Speaker 4 (43:12):
You're Nathan, but he's got a type.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
I do do have a type. Sign up to be
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(43:39):
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Speaker 4 (43:54):
And partier dudes
Thanks for tuning in to another episode of the Most
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Speaker 2 (00:29):
Hello and welcome to the Most Excellent Eighties Movies Podcast.
It's the podcast where we rise and turn in our
reviews of the eighties movies we think we love or
might have missed with. These are modernized to see how
they hold up. And today we're talking about Stand and Deliver,
a movie selection from nineteen eighty eight, about which letterbox says,
(00:54):
at a tough school, someone had to take a stand
dot dot dot and someone did. Together, one teacher and
one class proved to America they could. Hi May Escalante
is a mathematics teacher in a school in a school
in a Hispanic neighborhood. Convinced that his students have potential,
(01:16):
he adopts unconventional teething teaching methods to try and turn
gang members and no hopers into some of the country's
top algebra and calculus students. All right, here comes the trailer.
Speaker 3 (01:29):
Baby Say You're wake as You're waking up, Wake Up,
this morning.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
How are you bringing toothpicks to pinch open your eye?
Can we talk about I have.
Speaker 4 (01:45):
To discuss sex.
Speaker 3 (01:46):
I have to get sex for homework.
Speaker 4 (01:49):
I wouldn't do that if I lose a finger, I
won't be able to come to down.
Speaker 5 (01:55):
At a tough school, someone had to take a stand,
and someone did. Now the critics stand up and cheer
for stand and deliver terrific, tremendous, gripping and compelling, more
exciting than La bamba. Almost gives a wonderful performance, declares
Jack Crole Newsweek. Enormously inspiring and very rewarding. Almost gives
(02:19):
the first great performance of the year. Jeffrey Lyons Sneak Previews,
and Pat Collins WWRTV says, stand up and cheer for
a movie with art. It's the Rocky of the classroom.
Edward James, Almost, Lou Diamond Phillips stand and deliver.
Speaker 2 (02:50):
Why they have to take a shot at lobamba? Geez o,
my gosh, poor Lou Diamond Phillips. I'm Chrissy Lynz, one
of the directors at the Neighborhood Comedy Theater in downtown Mesa, Arizona,
and with me as always.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Is Nathan Blackwell, independent filmmaker. Hi.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
Hi, So before we jump in and really pick apart
Stand and Deliver, we got to say a little message
to you are loyal listeners, so you may have noticed
the ads have gotten a bit wonky lately. We just
switched all of True Story IFM just switched to a
(03:33):
new system and we're working out the kinks. So don't panic.
The ads will be back to normal soon. For now,
just to bear with us as we work on more
strategic placement of the ads. And I apologize for the
(03:54):
bonkers ad placement on Little Monsters. It'll be cleaned up
soon and you'll be able to go back and listen
to that one with a little more comfort as soon
as we get fixed and updated. So that's our little
housekeeping at the beginning, Stand and Deliver, Nathan, is this
a movie you've seen it before?
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Yes? So this was one of those movies that I think,
you know, I was in grade school or elementary school
or whatever. The difference is that that came out, and
so it was definitely one of those like inspirational stories
that you know, there was kind of a small collection
(04:39):
of movies that teachers would play in class when they
didn't want to teach, or it was a half day
you know, or like whatever for like summer session or whatever,
and so this was one of those.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
Yeah, sure was. That's the only reason I've seen it
is because an English teacher showed it to me in
high school. Yes, yes, the only time I've seen it.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Yes, I've seen it once or twice, I believe, and
then and now it's been quite some time.
Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yeah, I never returned to it. I remember, I remember
liking it, I remember being moved by it and like
inspired by it. Yes, but for no reason, no reason
to ever go back to it. So I think it
has as long as English teachers keep showing it to
(05:32):
their classrooms. Were good. But if the tradition continues, yeah,
then I don't think that many people are going to
be revisiting this movie.
Speaker 4 (05:43):
Well it's interesting. It's like, you know, like anything, there's
there's movies of the time where they have a lot
of impact and a lot of splash, and some movies
just there the connection or whatever, you know, it it
doesn't last. There's there's plenty of movies that we grew
(06:03):
up in in high school that were a big deal
and now it's it's a struggle for it to find
on like on on streaming or digital. And of course
why would I have any examples in mind, But but
(06:25):
for sure there were tons of movies that saide high school,
and we talked about it and and now we're just
kind of out of the sphere of influence and they
just don't have any lasting power. Not saying that this
is necessarily like that, but I could totally see how
this is no longer in the rotation when when there's
(06:47):
plenty of like big you know, like sports teacher inspirational movies.
It's it's it's the niche of.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
Or niche if you will, I will, I will.
Speaker 4 (07:02):
The down on there. Like I don't know if Dead
Poet Society is still in the conversation anymore, you know,
I would say.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
It is more so than Stand and Deliver. I think
that Dead Poet Society, because of Robin Williams, has a
little bit more cachet and nostalgia. Not which is not
(07:31):
to say that Edward James almost is not resplendent and
wonderful in this movie. He is. He was nominated for
an Academy Award and a Golden Globe, and deservedly so.
He went real method on this movie and followed the
real teacher around and like lived at his house.
Speaker 4 (07:57):
Geez, did he know?
Speaker 2 (08:00):
I hope?
Speaker 4 (08:01):
So I feel like another one like mister Hulland's Opus
that was one that I don't think is on radars anymore, or.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
The obvious one to me is Dangerous Minds from nineteen
ninety five. Yes, and I don't think that movie is
really in the zeitgeist anymore either, aside from Coolio's contribution.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
Of yeah in the mid to late nineties.
Speaker 2 (08:31):
Yeah, I think we more remember weird Al's Amish Paradise
than we remember Coolio's Gangster's Paradise.
Speaker 4 (08:39):
Yeah. Yeah, it's it's interesting. And so what are the
those inspirational movies now?
Speaker 3 (08:51):
You know?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
The I honestly couldn't tell you. I don't know is
it supposed to be center? Because I don't think we're
making that many new movies about and of course I
could be having a huge blind spot that I don't
know about, but where are the movies about teachers in
(09:13):
the LATINX neighborhoods now making big progress and doing big things?
And you know what really bothers me about this is
that calculus is useless.
Speaker 4 (09:34):
Unless you unless you are specifically going into a hard
math and science profession. You know, but if you want to.
Speaker 2 (09:44):
Get these kids like a better job and a real
profession like AP, calculus is perhaps not the way, Like
can we teach them tax accounting? Can we teach them
you know, can they pass the AP?
Speaker 4 (10:00):
Uh?
Speaker 2 (10:02):
You know, life skills class? You know in dangerous Minds?
She's teaching them poetry, like is equally useful. Yeah I
say that as a huge fan of poetry.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
Uh, yeah, I am. I did. I remember. I have
a distinct memory of being in algebra and talking to
the teacher about what I would have to do to
move on to calculus, and he was like, what the
fuck are you thinking? Like you're you're my worst student
in algebra, you know, you want to go to calcus.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
There's no like unless you're an engineer or a science person. Uh,
there's no like real word application for this calculus that
they're learning. And it's like, it's wonderful that they're learning.
And I get that he's like proving that they can
learn and that they can achieve.
Speaker 4 (10:59):
And then they yes, they can achieve the top of
the academic.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
You know.
Speaker 4 (11:07):
Pyramid. Yes, the latter uh huh uh.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
And that's great, but they're obviously not doing that in
all their classes. So I mean, I don't think colleges,
and maybe colleges are going to look at their one
AP credit and go like, Okay, this kid's got chopped,
But I just don't see it as providing the springboard
they need to have a new life.
Speaker 4 (11:36):
Yeah, it is calculus. So I'm the wrong person to ask.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
Well, you're a filmmaker and I'm a comedian, so yes,
so what the fuck do we know?
Speaker 4 (11:48):
We're degenerates? Yeah, yeah, we're degenerates when it comes to that.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
I've my degree is in visual communications, for God's sake,
So yeah, I'm a calculus did I take Yeah?
Speaker 4 (12:01):
Never, I've never used algebra. I've never used a lot
of the math and science that I took, the Earth
sciences I took in community college. Yeah, but that's because
of my degenerate path. You know, this movie Stand and
(12:27):
Deliver really should have been called Sit and Calculate, Yes,
because I can't think of another movie where everyone is
just sitting all the time.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Sitting all the time, and like we do see a
little bit of their home lives. There's a really one
of My favorite parts is where one of the girls, Anna,
who's actually one of the only girls who are one
of the only student characters who was really based one
to one on a real life person. Edward James almost
(13:00):
and his wife go eat in her father's restaurant and
let her go to school.
Speaker 4 (13:06):
Yeah, that's one of the best scenes.
Speaker 2 (13:08):
That's what scenes.
Speaker 4 (13:09):
What we needed were more of those scenes, Like I
felt like, so again, I'm not I was inspired by
this movie. Edward James almost knocks it out of the park,
But there are some.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
I have to say. He underwent hair thinning for this role,
which I can't imagine a male Hollywood lead actor doing
in this day and age. And he gained everyone's gaining
and losing weight.
Speaker 4 (13:35):
Well he still looks better than me.
Speaker 2 (13:37):
But yeah, oh Edward James almost Yeah, yes, and he
and he's knotting out of the park. Also, lou Diamond
Phillips is magnetic. Yes, but never did I feel he's
sort of the bad boy angel. He like he's a
bad boy. He shows up drunk when they get their
(13:58):
test results and and uh, we're But never was I
afraid that the gang life was going to take him.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
No, my biggest criticism of this film is that we
are almost outside of the action. Like I wanted to
feel their resistance of taking all this math like at
some like I wanted to to see more of each
(14:26):
of them have a reason to join Dumbledore's army, you know,
because because they they it's not just that he is inspirational.
They end up joining this you know, math group. You know,
it is a die hard commitment. They're doing it, you know,
(14:51):
like every day, and they're doing it in the summer.
They all at some point, yeah, it's like they're you know,
it's almost like they're they're I'm missing their motivation. I'm
missing the turning point to where they're each kind of
deciding to step into this team and to make a
(15:16):
difference in their life, you know.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Right. In fact, there's one scene where what are the kids?
I forget his name, but he's like, you know, Chemo,
they call him Chemo short for Chemo Sabe and he's like, Kimo,
I have to work Saturday and Sunday. I can't you know,
do calculus Saturday and Sunday. I have to work. I
can make double the money, you know, I need the money.
And so mister Escalante takes him out for a drive
(15:42):
in his car and is like stripping the gears of
his car, and he's like, which way right or left? Right?
Or left? Go right? Go right? So they go right
and he hits a dead end and he goes you
see the lesson, You only see the turn, not the
road ahead, And it's like, well, did you know that
was a dead end? What were you? What was the
plan here? Like and and okay, I think it would
(16:05):
have been more inspirational if he was trying to like
work with them and allow them to like make some
money for their families, which they probably like sorely need.
Also learning calculus.
Speaker 4 (16:17):
Don't worry in a year and a half to all
pay off when you passed the calculus.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Test, and yeah, and in what way you know? Like
spoiler alert. They all passed the test, and the you know,
what do they achieve beyond that? Like you know, and
and then the the very end, so what So they
(16:43):
all passed the test, but their grades get challenged, challenged
by Andy Garcia and his partner who are like, we
think that you all cheated because you all got the
same wrong answers. So they make them take the test
again and they all pass again. Yeah, and then the
(17:07):
little like our little freeze frame at the end, which
is like, Okay, in nineteen seventy four, this many kids passed.
In nineteen seventy five, double that many passed in nineteen
seventy six, triple that number past. You know, in seventy eight,
almost one hundred kids passed the bad test, And I
was like, okay, great, but like what happened to them after?
(17:28):
Like did they get jobs as teachers? Where are they now?
Like how many of them got out of East LA
and like made better lives for themselves and their families.
Speaker 4 (17:40):
Yeah, I you know, I wanted a graphic that said,
like I think it ended like an eighty six or something.
I wanted a graphic that said, like, in twenty twenty,
the calculus class had grown so powerful that it had
enveloped all of earth building. What we needed was an
(18:07):
American graffiti style ending to where it says, like how
specifically that are the people that we've been following have
gone on to other things. Now. It's tough because they're,
as far as I know, they're fictionalized amalgamations.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Right, alba Anna is the only one who is based
on a real student, A one to one basis. The
rest were, as you said, amalgamation so so so make
it up, use some artistic license, you know, or.
Speaker 4 (18:43):
Or showing the real kids and then about what they're
you know, it's like, you know, showing the real photos
of Haimiescalante and the kids and showing where they all
went off. This person, you know, became a doctor, this
person is an analyst at NASA, you know, or or
(19:05):
just or what you know, just give us a little
extra meet at the end. You know, it is inspirational.
It is great to see them surpass it. I just
was missing. I just felt like I was missing a
little more of the the inside experience, the the the
emotion of of the challenge, you know, of the of
(19:29):
the characters, their motivations. It just felt like we were
outside of the action watching the movie.
Speaker 2 (19:37):
Objectively, I completely agree with you. And in fact, there's
a moment when in the take in the retake test
where Anna, who is the girl from the restaurant who's
the only one who's a real student not an amalgamation,
has to leave early. Uh, and she's like, I have
to go to a meeting about my scholarship. Oh great,
(19:58):
she's getting a scholarship to where for what? Poor?
Speaker 4 (20:02):
Why?
Speaker 2 (20:03):
You know? Tell me more please, and they're just like,
are you sure you have to go? And she's like yep, bie,
but she's still passed the test, So like I wanted
to know more about that, and maybe I just wasn't
paying attention and they told us what she became, but
I didn't. I didn't write that down.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
My favorite part of the whole thing is when lou
Diamond Phillips angel Is his character's name, is out with
his friend and they're like just driving around drinking and
they stop in a like vacant lot and he's like,
we're looking at the stars, but those aren't really the
(20:47):
stars anymore. That's the light from the stars millions of
years ago. The stars are all dead now. And it's
like this really beautiful moment and it's like, okay, so
you're doing well in science too, Like are you doing
well in all your classes? Like who taught you that?
(21:08):
Because it wasn't Chemo.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
Right, Yeah, he he was a great character, but it
didn't it like there was like that really confrontational gang
friend of his and I never saw like him. I
hope it wasn't. Just didn't miss this. I never saw
him like blow off or resist and leave. He was
(21:32):
just gone one day.
Speaker 2 (21:34):
Yeah, he was just gone one day.
Speaker 4 (21:36):
Yeah, it would have been really nice if he was.
You know, he obviously came with the toughest resistance up front,
and he rejects the whole thing and he gets thrown
out or he walks out or whatever. But there's that
it's like not everyone will join there is this is
a tough environment.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
So the friend doesn't join, but lou Diamond Phillips and
in fact he like, he's like, I'll give you three
sets of book. He asks for another set of books
so he can keep one at home and have one
at school so he doesn't have to like be seen
with his books because it'll hurry street cred.
Speaker 4 (22:14):
There's still just not enough meat, you know, there's not
enough meat.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
And he's like, I'll give you three books. You can
have a book for your locker, a book for the classroom,
and a book for home. And it's like, okay, great,
that's a great solution. But I never see him like
get shamed by his gang and anything. It makes Yeah, uh,
there's a Keanu Reeves baseball movie. Do you know what
movie I'm.
Speaker 4 (22:37):
Talking about no continue.
Speaker 2 (22:40):
It's called Hardball, okay, and it's about it's like basically
the same story as The Mighty Ducks. He's like a
high powered attorney who somehow gets like busted for gambling
and he has to go teach an inner city baseball
(23:01):
team mm hmmm as punishment, and of course, like he
learns to love them and he teaches them valuable lessons
as they go along the way. But at some point
a kid dies ooh in this lighthearted baseball movie. And
at no point was I worried and stand and deliver
(23:24):
that any kid was going to die, even though like
they build this movie as a comedy, which I didn't
find it that funny. At no point was I worried
that Angel was like risking his life to take this
math class.
Speaker 4 (23:38):
Yeah this, yeah, this is the drama. And and I'm
when this movie started, I was like, gosh, I missed
when they made dramas.
Speaker 2 (23:46):
Oh yeah, you missed dramas. Yeah, yeah, no dramas for
you these days.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
They don't seem to make theatrical dramas these days.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
Do they. So what the hell are they making? I'm
gonna go see weapons tomorrow. What the hell is that?
Speaker 4 (24:02):
Movie. It's not a drama. Okay, it's like it's like
two or three things, but drama is not one of them.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
Drama is not one of them yet. But they build
this movie as a comedy, and I was just like,
I'm not laughing.
Speaker 4 (24:16):
Mm hmmm.
Speaker 2 (24:17):
In fact, I was as I was. I was moved,
I was inspired. I did come to care for the characters.
But I also thought this movie was really goddamn for it.
Speaker 4 (24:34):
It was a little long, and we keep saying that
we wish there was more mm.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Hmm, but not more length, more.
Speaker 4 (24:44):
Depth, Yeah, more obstacles. Really, you know, if you're gonna
fictionalize them, if you're gonna make an amalgamation, that gives
you more license to maybe push it a little harder.
You know, you don't have to have like anyone die.
Speaker 2 (25:02):
But I wanted to see her Keanu Reeves Baseball movie.
Speaker 4 (25:06):
Just wanted to see a little more resistance. There's just
see any normal person would do.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Where there's a scene where one of the girls can't
study at night because her mom comes home from work
and she's so tired. And then this student has been
taking care of her little brothers and sisters all day
and she's trying to do her homework at night, and
the mom's like, will you turn off the light, and
she's like, yeah, mom, I'll turn off the light, and
so she can't do her studying. But we never see
(25:32):
her struggle with calculus, like she's always just like and
now I'm good with Now I'm good at calculus. Yeah,
I'm perfect at it. Like not a single kid failed.
They all passed, and then they all pass again. I
don't know, I don't know. It's like, it's hard to
(25:54):
talk about a movie where not much happens except math.
Speaker 4 (26:00):
Is there another math heavy movie? What's another math heavy movie?
Speaker 2 (26:06):
Goodwill Hunting?
Speaker 4 (26:08):
Yeah, kind of it, but that math is treated like magic.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
That's true, and they certainly don't make it seem like
I guess maybe hidden figures.
Speaker 4 (26:26):
Mmm, yeah, that's but that's a good one that does
have the struggle that really just you know, makes a
meal out of it because it is based off of
a real story as well. But yeah, they make it
really tough on the characters and it means more.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
Yeah, I agree, that's really all I can come up with. Yeah,
what's that one where they go and they count cards?
Season it? And they go and they count cards and
they are trying to like win money from the casino.
(27:09):
That's that's about math.
Speaker 4 (27:11):
Okay, good, that's it.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
That's all I got. Because Dangerous Minds is about poetry.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
Yeah, okay, that's weird. Admittedly I haven't seen that one.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
You haven't seen Dangerous Minds. It was so popular that
you rejected it, that.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
I rejected it. I went through a phase but also.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Rejecting everything that was popular in the nineties. Well, I
want to know more about this, Nathan.
Speaker 4 (27:42):
It took me. I was resistant to Titanic, but I
did see it in theaters, but I was initially resistant.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
Okay. I feel that way about Avatar, like I have
no I have no business.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
I think when there's movies in the zeitgeist, but there
aren't necessarily in your wheelhouse, your genre wheelhouse. You know
that that gives you a reason not to watch it
because it's in the zeitgeist, you know, like the zeitgeist
makes it for whatever reason, you decide to rebel against it.
(28:17):
That's my thinking.
Speaker 2 (28:19):
Well, I remember Dangerous Minds being really good.
Speaker 4 (28:23):
Okay, good, So I think that you would like it? Mmmm?
Is that your deep cut recommendation?
Speaker 2 (28:34):
It's not, it's not my deep cut recommendation. I feel
like it's too obvious, but I do feel like you
would like it. It should be the obvious cut recommendation
for everyone who's who's seeing this film. And honestly, I like,
I don't know what else to say about this film,
like aside from like recapping it start to finish, which
I even can't do that because it's like and then
they sit in New Math, and then they sit in
(28:55):
New Math, and then they sit in New Math.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (28:58):
There's one part that I wrote down where he at
the very beginning, he's handing out the test scores for
like their very first quiz, and he gives Anna her
test score and she did very well, and he goes
he leans down like to her ear and goes, is
it true that intelligent people make better lovers? And I'm like,
don't you say that to her? That's disgusting, sir.
Speaker 4 (29:21):
I felt there was like at least three moments where
that was like, you know where he kind of walked
over that bridge, like it's even used in the trailer.
You know, it's like, if you guys are talking about sex,
I have to give you sex for homework.
Speaker 2 (29:38):
Yeah, that's not appropriate.
Speaker 4 (29:39):
Swer uh huh.
Speaker 2 (29:42):
No, thank you, mister Ascalante. Yeah, I mean I don't.
I didn't even have that many notes that I was like, oh,
we got to talk about this. They like they pimp
his ride.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
It did look nice, it did look nice.
Speaker 2 (30:01):
He's like driving this like beat up little VW bug
and on the first day it gets its windows broken,
and like, we don't even really get to see we
got to see a little bit of his struggle with
his family, Like at some point his wife is like,
I don't want you working on Christmas and he's just
like too bad, and she's like, well okay.
Speaker 4 (30:21):
And then he has a heart attack, but he doesn't stop.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
Yeah, he has a heart attack and he learns no lessons.
You know what.
Speaker 4 (30:29):
That's the movie. What the movie should have been called
is test.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Passers, Test passers, test passers. So no matter what Andy
Garcia says, they're going to pass the test. We never
even really get to see Andy Garcia eat his words. No, no,
a tense confrontation where he confronts them and he's like, FYI,
(30:57):
you're being racist and Andy is like you're telling me
I'm being racist. Uh, excuse me, sir, I'm not being racist,
And he's like, well, you still kind of are, and
and they're they're having this argument about whether or not
this investigation of his students is being racist, which it is,
(31:19):
but even that is not really brought into aside from
that little scene and then it's gone mm hmm, and
then we just move on next. It's a real slice
of life picture.
Speaker 4 (31:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:36):
Yeah, And I have a hard time knowing if I
liked it.
Speaker 4 (31:47):
I liked it, but with with reservations, with with with
with you know, I was really taken with it when
I saw it long ago as a young boy, but now, yeah,
it's now having seen you know, it's like you have
(32:10):
a couple of first time inspirational student teacher movies, and
those first ones make a big impact on you because
they're the they're like you're you're the they're the initial
ones that that that kind of introduce you to the
to the whole idea like we I you know, I
love a good teacher, misfit student, let's all get together,
(32:33):
let's do a School of Rock or be great at
basketball or whatever.
Speaker 5 (32:38):
You know.
Speaker 2 (32:40):
I love School of Rock. I think School of Rock
is a really multi layered movie that gets taken for granted.
Speaker 4 (32:48):
Agreed, agreed, but yeah, just missing now that we've seen
so many of these movies, this it's not the story,
but this particular movie is just missing a meat that
was missing subjectivity.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Do you do you think it's because of it was
made in nineteen eighty eight like that it would just
would have been made more exciting and more dramatized if
it was made in No.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
I feel like I feel like a like a good
but weird analogy to this is the Karate Kid, you know,
of having. So you've got one person with a problem,
You've got one person with an unorthodox teaching method, and
there's a lot of conflict between choosing to learn this
(33:38):
thing and not and the path they take and the
ups and downs that entail and how it transforms their life.
Like this is a sports movie. This is Rocky and
the Karate Kid, you know.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yeah, but the sport is calculus, Yes, And it's hard
to see calculus as an enemy mm hmm, even in
dangerous minds. She's like Dylan Thomas and Bob Dylan are
the same, and it's like, Okay, well Bob Dylan is
still out of date. Yeah in nineteen ninety five.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
Yeah, I mean it's a It is a great story.
It is a great story of hope and transformation. I
just wish the movie was a little more dramatic.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
So on a scale of one, pimped out vw.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
Or so they got like a one to five at
the end of their what was their test called.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
By the way, the ap calculus exam?
Speaker 4 (34:44):
Right, So they they got to score one one to
five and three passes.
Speaker 2 (34:48):
Right, yep, that's right. So are we gonna Are we
gonna break with tradition and score this on one to five?
Speaker 4 (34:56):
No, I say we do. So the passing grade is
three out of five. So how many three out of
fives are you going to give the movie?
Speaker 2 (35:03):
Okay? How many three out of fives? Out of ten?
Out of ten? Three out of five? Now we're doing calculus, yes,
and I don't know if I approve of us doing
this calculus? Okay, So so I find this really hard,
and I still don't know what I'm going to rate it.
What are you going to rate it?
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I would say it pains me, but I'm going to
give it a six. I want to give it a seven.
Speaker 2 (35:32):
I want to give it a seven too. I want
to give it an eight, But I can't.
Speaker 4 (35:36):
Mm hmm.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
I think it's a six. I think this movie is
a six.
Speaker 4 (35:43):
Yeah, maybe even like a six point four. But yeah,
I think I'm we have spoken, the council has sproken.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Okay, so what is your deep cut recommendation? And it
can't be dangerous minds?
Speaker 4 (36:05):
Look, I look. I sometimes these deep cut recommendations are
very difficult. Okay, there's they're all obvious town not deep cut. Yeah,
I don't know. I love Edward James almost, and he's
fantastic in Battle Star. If you also love Edward James
(36:26):
almost and you haven't seen him in Battlestar Galactica, just
watch it. It's great. I know the show is old
now it holds up. Or one assumes I've never seen it.
It's if you want more Edward James almost, he's great
in it. The show goes hard, it's not it's not
a fluff show.
Speaker 2 (36:47):
I would also recommend like he does a lot of conventions.
Speaker 4 (36:50):
But I hear, yeah, yeah, I am, I have. I've
I've met Edward James almost in real life. He was
a guest speaker at my high school.
Speaker 2 (37:01):
No way did you deliver?
Speaker 4 (37:03):
He standed and delivered. This was nine in nineteen ninety
four or something like that. But yeah, I think he's great.
I hope other people think he's great.
Speaker 2 (37:20):
And uh great, I think he's wonderful. I think he's
wonderful in this. Yes, I'm gonna I'm going to look
up who did win the Best Actor Oscar in nineteen
eighty eight. Michael Douglas for Wall Street.
Speaker 4 (37:35):
Mmmm, I don't know that's a that. I'd give it
to Edward James almost like he would be my Edward.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
James almost too, because Wall Street was a weird.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
Yeah, it was an iconic performance. I think in terms
of I would have given it to Edward James almost.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
Yeah, for sure, I think so too. So you love
him undergo any hair fitting?
Speaker 4 (38:00):
Yes, I think that was pretty insane.
Speaker 2 (38:03):
But yes, yeah, okay, So I have two deep cut recommendations.
Speaker 4 (38:09):
So no rating. Oh no, you did a rating?
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I did. I agreed with you. I'd give it six.
Speaker 4 (38:14):
Okay, continue, Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:16):
My first one is about a group of teachers who
have to do the best they can with not the
best resources, who really care about their students and provide
inspiration on a weekly basis. I recommend Abbott Elementary very good.
(38:36):
Have you seen it.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
I've seen some of it. I can't say that I've
fully committed to it, but I've definitely seen some.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Yeah, it's very funny, it's very good. I highly recommend it.
Leslie Odom Junior shows up at some point and it's
just Bradley Cooper shows up at some point, like it's.
Speaker 4 (38:56):
Just, oh, there's an always Sunny in Philadelphia crossover with
the show.
Speaker 2 (39:04):
I have not I'm not caught up to that point,
but I know that they did it, so I'm looking
forward to it.
Speaker 4 (39:10):
It's literally a crossover where they're all in the same episode.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
That's so weird.
Speaker 4 (39:18):
It's so insane, that's so weird.
Speaker 2 (39:20):
So here's my other deep cut recommendation. And I have
to say, we went on a little journey. So I
made my husband, Dorian watched this movie with me. I
tried to make my son, Rocket, who is fifteen, watched
this movie with me, and he was like, no, thanks, Mom,
this movie's about math. I get enough math in my
real life. I'm dipping out. But Dorian watched this movie
(39:41):
with me and he was just like, you know what
I want to watch now, Young Guns? And I was like, oh, no,
Guns is terrible. He was like, no, it's not Young Guns.
It's great and I was like, I assure you, it's terrible,
and he was like, well, I want to watch it anyway,
and I was like, okay, I'll watch it with you.
But it wasn't available on Prime. So what Washington dead
(40:03):
was Young Guns two?
Speaker 4 (40:06):
Uh huh.
Speaker 2 (40:08):
So I want to low key recommend Huns Too because
lou Diamond Phillips is magnetic. He's just you can't when
he's on screen, you can't take your eyes off him.
He is even though he plays a relatively small part,
(40:29):
he's like at the heart of Young Guns Too. And
there's a really fun moment where he clashes with Christian
Slater and they have a big fight, and that, to me,
was the best part of the movie. M my low
key recommendation is Young Guns Too.
Speaker 4 (40:52):
I think my low key recommendation is the Key and
Peel sketch if Hogwarts were an inner city school. Oh
it's so good, Vincent Clortho Public School of Wizardry.
Speaker 2 (41:05):
Yes, I love that sketch. Now that's a good recommendation. Yeah.
So spoiler, we have an event coming up where we're
doing a crossover with the podcast called The Long Rewind
where we're gonna watch some Ninja movies and I'll be
I don't know if we'll get to do our deep
cut recommendation. So mine's going to be a Saturday a
live sketch.
Speaker 4 (41:26):
Oh okay, yeah, yeah, very good. Okay, very good.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
So in this very short episode, Nathan, why don't you
tell the people where they can support your filmmaking endeavors.
Speaker 4 (41:38):
Yeah, so, as always, Squishy Studios dot com is the
place to go. That's if you want to check out
any of my Voyage Trekkers stuff, which is for my
older web series where if you haven't checked out my
feature film The Last Movie Ever Made, you can find
links like a trailer there. It's just the easiest place
for that stuff. And then there's links if you want
(42:01):
to click and rent the movie or something like that
on Amazon and Apple.
Speaker 2 (42:07):
Excellent, all very fun. Love Voyage Treckers. Can't recommend it enough.
If you want to see me in real life, go
to the Neighborhood Comedy Theater in downtown Mesa, Arizona, every
Friday and Saturday night. You can say hi to me
if you tell me you're a most excellent Eighties movies
podcast listener, I will buy you a drink at the
Sacred Pint, which is our little pub that's in front
(42:31):
of the Neighborhood Comedy Theater. There. If you want to
listen to me more and you like the show Supernatural,
tune in to Gank That Drink, a supernatural drinking game
podcast where me and my co host Nate mccorter watch
and drink along to our favorite episodes of our favorite
show Supernatural. Also a true story FM product. And if
(42:52):
you're listening here at the end and you're like, not
only where these ads a bit bonkers and I want
them gone, but also I want to know more about
Nate and Chrissy, Nathan and Chrissy. Sorry, Nate is my
other host.
Speaker 4 (43:12):
You're Nathan, but he's got a type.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
I do do have a type. Sign up to be
a member at true story dot fm. Just click on
our little podcast, click on the linky. You get episodes
a week early in ad free, and you get some
extra special bonus content. Today, me and Nathan are going
to talk about favorite teachers. Ooh yeah, favorite teachers that
(43:39):
we've had. Uh. So, if you want to get that content,
the tune in there. And as always, when you're out
there in the world. Please keep the most excellent eighties
movies podcast model in mind. Be excellent to each other
Speaker 4 (43:54):
And partier dudes
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