Secrets, Surveillance, And Survival At Gold Base - Secrets of Scientology LIVE Q&A

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Secrets don’t just hide in the shadows at Scientology’s international headquarters—they’re baked into the rules. We open the door on life at Gold Base: the mail opened before you read it, the addresses laundered through Hollywood to disguise location, and an internet “filter” that blocks anything critical while flagging your clicks for review. From the first days on the EPF, autonomy is stripped away in favor of orders, and a snitch culture ensures everyone polices everyone else. The result is a sealed system where control feels normal and dissent looks dangerous.

We dig into the question people ask most: why do members stay when they’re unhappy? The answer stacks up fast: family inside, marriages on the base, jobs tied to Scientology employers, and years of indoctrination telling you anyone who doubts must be cut off. Add sunk costs and a fear of disconnection, and leaving can feel like losing your entire life overnight. We share the moment the façade cracked—visiting “booming” ideal orgs that were nearly empty—and how that gap between sales pitch and reality became impossible to ignore.

This conversation goes beyond exposure; it’s a guide to rebuilding. We talk through practical first steps for a safe exit—private communication lines, non‑Scientology employment, independent housing—and why no one should be bullied into staying or leaving. Reclaiming identity takes time, curiosity, and community: reading widely on trauma and recovery, questioning “ethics” narratives, and replacing fear with facts. We also separate myth from reality at the top, contrasting the image of principled leadership with stories of luxury, selective policy enforcement, and rewards for outside contractors while staff go without.

There’s real hope here. Membership is shrinking, public awareness is stronger than ever, and decompression times are shorter thanks to accessible information. People still inside are finding quiet channels to learn, plan, and step out on their terms. If you’ve wondered how control really works—or how to help someone find a way out—this episode lays out the mechanisms and the map.

If this resonated, subscribe, share with someone who needs it, and leave a review. Your support helps more people find clear information and safe options.

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_01 (00:25):
Hey guys, welcome back to the channel.
Welcome to another episode ofBlown for Good, Scientology
Exposed.
As usual, I am joined today bymy lovely wife, Claire.

SPEAKER_00 (00:35):
Hey, hey, hey, everybody.
Happy Sunday.
Thanks for joining us today.
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (00:46):
And so we're going to uh we've taken questions from
YouTube, X, Facebook, whereveremails, wherever we get
comments, questions, those arethe questions we're going to be
answering.
And if you want, if we if we jamthrough those uh in it with
enough time, then if you haveother questions that we didn't

(01:09):
answer, go ahead and put thosein the comments and we'll try to
get to some of those as well.

SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
Yep.
And even if we don't, we'll savethose for the next time we do
one of these QA's.
It's good to just circle backaround on questions people have.
So that's why we're here today.

SPEAKER_01 (01:23):
Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 (01:24):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:25):
Okay.
Well, there's no time like thepresent.
I guess we just get to it, eh?

SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
Sounds good.

SPEAKER_01 (01:30):
Here we go.

SPEAKER_00 (01:32):
All right.
What is something about life atGoldbase that people outside
would genuinely struggle tobelieve?

SPEAKER_01 (01:41):
Um I think just the amount of restrictions you have,
like you're not allowed to goanywhere without permission.
You're not allowed to call yourfamily without permission.

SPEAKER_00 (01:53):
Um You're not allowed to receive a letter
without it being read first.

SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Yeah, your mail gets opened uh on the way in, and
your mail gets opened on the wayout.
Or you leave it open, you don'tseal it.
If you write a letter to yourfamily or anybody, actually, in
that matter, um you leave itopen so security can read it.
And when they're done readingit, then they will close,
they'll seal it and then mailit, or not, depending on what

(02:20):
you wrote in the letter.

SPEAKER_00 (02:21):
Right.
And that was even true when Iwas in Clearwater, Florida, and
you were in California, even ourcorrespondence had to be read.

SPEAKER_01 (02:31):
Which is kind of crazy if you like you would send
me like these little uh postcardletters and stuff like that.
And to think that they'rereading every single one of
those is kind of crazy.

SPEAKER_00 (02:43):
Yeah.
And uh that we were not evenallowed to I wasn't even allowed
to talk to you on the phoneduring that time.
Anyway, but yeah, I think alsoat that property specifically,
the level of isolation and so ifyou think about in in real world
standards now for me lookingback, most people in the real

(03:06):
world know how to drive and theyhave a car and they have a
general sense of geographicalorientation.

SPEAKER_02 (03:14):
Yes.

SPEAKER_00 (03:15):
Which surprisingly, like if I were it even when we
went back there one time um witha film crew, I I had no idea
where how to get to birthing,you know, even though we made
that bus ride multiple times,you're so exhausted and so we
just sleep on the bus.

(03:35):
Right, exactly.
It's not like you're payingattention to turns and and
everything else.
So it just the I think the levelof isolation, um, as we've
commented before, it's moreextreme than Supermax.

SPEAKER_01 (03:47):
Yeah.
And this is particular to theinternational headquarters,
19625 Highway 79, Gilman HotSprings, California.
Um at that location, even ifsomebody wrote you a letter,
they weren't writing you aletter at that location.
They would send it to the whatthe basically the int base would

(04:07):
get the mail from Los Angeles.
So if somebody was writing toGolden Air Productions, they'd
write to 6331 HollywoodBoulevard, and that would go to
gold, Golden Era Productions.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_00 (04:18):
That's if they were writing to you at Golden Air
Productions.
If they're writing to me when Iwas in Religious Technology
Center, it went to 1710 IvarAvenue.

SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
Yeah, which is just the other street that the HGV is
on.

SPEAKER_00 (04:30):
It's the same physical building.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_01 (04:32):
Just a different door.
And then that and so all of thepeople that were at the
international base, they all hadan LA address.

SPEAKER_00 (04:42):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (04:43):
And so if someone was writing to you, they'd write
to that address.
And when you wrote them back,you would write it from that
address.

SPEAKER_02 (04:50):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (04:51):
And it would be postmarked in Los Angeles.
The mail would get sent down toLos Angeles and then mailed in
Los Angeles from the post officethere.
So the postmark was fromHollywood, not from Gillan Hot
Springs, California.

SPEAKER_00 (05:05):
Yeah, exactly.
So how old were you when youfirst were posted at the Imp
base?
Okay.
And did your mom have to signover guardianship of you?

SPEAKER_01 (05:18):
No.

SPEAKER_00 (05:18):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (05:19):
I was 16 when I joined, well, I was fifteen when
I joined the C org.
I turned 16 at AbelInternational, and then I turned
18 when I or 17, like while Iwas on clearance lines when I
was getting my securityinterrogations to be able to go
to the internationalheadquarters.
That's actually when I had mybirthday.

(05:40):
And then like a week after that,I went to uh Gilman Hot Springs.
So I got there in late May of1990.

SPEAKER_00 (05:48):
Okay.
But your mom, of course, was notallowed to know physically where
you worked.

SPEAKER_01 (05:53):
No.
My no no nobody in my familywas.
Because my sister wasn't at theAMP base either.
It was just me.
My sister came uh a bit later,and then my mom ended up joining
the Sea Org after that.

SPEAKER_00 (06:06):
Yeah, way after that.

SPEAKER_01 (06:07):
And so and she never knew she never knew where where
we were.
Yeah.
Which is kind of silly becauseyou could just look up, you
could just Google Golden EraProductions.
Yeah.
And it'll just tell you rightwhere it is.
There's even now if you searchAnt Base, you don't even have
you can say Ant Base, Gold,Golden Era Productions, The
Hole.
You can look up all of thosethings and it'll tell you

(06:28):
exactly where it is.

SPEAKER_00 (06:29):
Yeah, the beauty of the internet.
But yeah, so I was 16 in 1991.
And for me, my mom and mystepdad did have they were
required to sign overguardianship of me to Leonora
Adam, who I had never met.

SPEAKER_01 (06:45):
I think it was Adams.

SPEAKER_00 (06:46):
No, it was Adam.

SPEAKER_01 (06:48):
You sure?
Leonora Adam?
Adams.
Somebody out there who knows.
Back me up.
Leonora Adams.

SPEAKER_00 (06:56):
Adam.
I'm sticking to my sticking tomy memory of it.
Anyway.
She was your guardian.

SPEAKER_01 (07:01):
You had no idea who she was.

SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
Never met her.
No.
And yeah, you know, I wasintroduced to her and the I mean
I thought Gelda was your She wasmore of my guardian in reality,
but she wasn't my legalguardian.

SPEAKER_01 (07:16):
Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_00 (07:16):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (07:17):
She was just watching out for you.

unknown (07:19):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (07:19):
A little bit.

SPEAKER_00 (07:20):
Or, you know, smacking me around.
Whatever.
Okay.
Oh, look at that.
Catherine says, Claire is right.
Music to my ears.

SPEAKER_01 (07:32):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (07:32):
Thank you, Catherine.

SPEAKER_01 (07:33):
This is the first time for everything, babe.
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (07:36):
Yeah, not for that though.

SPEAKER_01 (07:39):
When did you realize that obedience was being valued
over truth?

SPEAKER_00 (07:43):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (07:44):
I think you learned that when you right when you get
do the Sea Org uh EPF, you learnyou basically when you're being
recruited for the Corganization, they tell you all
these tall tales about whatyou're going to be able to do,
and that's going to be awesome,and you're going to do this, and
you can do that.
And then once you get into the Corg and you do what's called the
EPF, the Estates Project Force,you do it's there's a course,

(08:09):
there's many courses you have todo as part of that.
Um study Scientology C orgcourses.
But one of them is calledWelcome to the Sea Org.
And in that you basically learnwhatever the Sea Org wants, the
Sea Org gets.
It's not about you anymore.
You're now part of this groupthat you you you have no

(08:30):
autonomy anymore.
You're gonna you're gonnaoperate on orders and you're
gonna be told what you're gonnado, and you're gonna do it.
Whether and it there's even athing, no matter what job or
what location you're assignedto, it's your responsibility to
do that job.
So if they say, hey, guess what?
You're going to Denmark, you'regoing to Denmark.
If they say, hey, you're goingto Canada to work at the CLO,

(08:53):
the Continental Liaison org inCanada, you're going to Canada.
It doesn't matter.
You have no choice.

SPEAKER_00 (08:59):
Or even, oh, guess what?
You're going to be assigned asan electrician.
You're like, I know nothingabout electricity.
Don't care.
Make it go right.
Do your job.
Get hatted.

SPEAKER_01 (09:10):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (09:10):
Figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 (09:11):
Make it go.
Right?

SPEAKER_00 (09:15):
Yeah.
But my answer to that is Ilearned that when I was four
years old when my mom joined theC organization.

SPEAKER_02 (09:24):
Sure.

SPEAKER_00 (09:25):
Um, because you know, you know when when you
like in my case, growing up inthe cadet organization, I knew
that no matter what, the rulesof uh the group were the laws of
the land, so to speak.
And um, yeah, they were seniorto anything else, even senior to

(09:45):
my mom's care and protection.

SPEAKER_02 (09:47):
Totally.

SPEAKER_00 (09:48):
Yeah.
All right.
I'm reading this one.
Let's see.
What's one rule insideScientology that still surprises
you when you think about it now?
Um my answer to that is thesnitch culture.
It's still like oof.
It's so insidious and so umcontrolling, leveraging, um like

(10:15):
knowing that you know you couldwrite a report on me.

SPEAKER_01 (10:19):
Never happened.

SPEAKER_00 (10:20):
Or I could write a report on you.

SPEAKER_01 (10:22):
Happened all the time.

SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
No, it did not.
Oh my god, here we go again,folks.

SPEAKER_01 (10:27):
I never ever wrote a report on Claire.
Oh, you shouldn't have to dothat.
Not once.
Not once, not ever.
Never happened.
Okay.
Because I knew that was down anddirty.
You can't do that.

SPEAKER_02 (10:39):
Well, you know.

SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
Anyway, listen to this.
It doesn't matter who you dosomething around, there's a 95%
chance they're gonna rat youout.
They're gonna write a report onyou.

SPEAKER_02 (10:52):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (10:53):
And it doesn't matter if it's your spouse, your
best friend for 10 years, thepeople that you work with day
and night, that you're superclose with, your tight little
group that you work in, itdoesn't matter if there's m if
there's another person that'saround when you do it, the rule
is if you don't write a reporton that person and you knew

(11:17):
about it, and they get caught,then you get the same penalties
they get when it's found out.
So it's basically like CYA tothe maximum.
There's no everybody's is tryingto cover their own ass so they
don't get in trouble.
And very, very rarely willsomething happen where somebody

(11:40):
else doesn't know about it andwrite a report.

SPEAKER_00 (11:44):
Yep.
Um and my personal pet pee wasthe trend that whenever someone
escaped, yeah, all of a suddenit's like you're obligated now
to I mean, and and to be fair,sometimes there were things that
you'd seen or you know, whateverthat were nonsense.

(12:06):
But most often those wereordered directly by David
Miscavige or stemmed from him.
But then so like uh, you know,the person would take off and
all of a sudden it's like thisflood of knowledge reports comes
in because people are trying tocover their ass, like, oh shoot.

SPEAKER_01 (12:22):
But also, anytime somebody escapes, and if
something's going wrong orsomething is like messed up in
that area, then everybody blamesit on the guy who just left
because he can't defend himself.

SPEAKER_00 (12:34):
Yeah.
And then what happens is theythey solicit- even though you're
required to copy the person onthe report, he he's not even
there anymore.
So all of a sudden now, youknow, all bets are off.
You can say whatever it isyou've been uh if you were like
when Marty Rathbun blew, I wrotewrote a report on him for all
the times I witnessed himphysically abuse staff.

(12:55):
Um, but of course, I didn'tcover in there the times that I
saw David Miscavige physicallyabuse.

SPEAKER_01 (13:01):
They're not asking how many people David Miscavige
built up.
They're soliciting reports onhow many people Marty beat up.

SPEAKER_00 (13:07):
Yeah.
In fact, if if if anybody everwrote wrote a report on David
Miscavige, they would be uh shutdown pronto.

SPEAKER_01 (13:16):
Aaron Powell Yeah, you you'd find out real quick
what what what happens when youdo that.

SPEAKER_00 (13:20):
Yeah.
What's good for the goose is notgood for the gander.

SPEAKER_01 (13:24):
How does Scientology keep people loyal even when
they're unhappy?
I think the re the how they dothat is well, in the case of the
Sea Org members, you're gonnaget kicked out of the Sea Org if
you don't play by the rules.
And if you get kicked out of theSea Org, it's very likely that
you're not gonna be able to talkto your family or you don't

(13:46):
you're not gonna have a job, youdon't know where to go, you
don't know where to do.
But if you don't have the uhyou're not able to talk to your
family, then you're sort ofgonna be out there on your own.
Yeah.
And you're not gonna have anyresources.
So even if you're unhappy, um,you still have to play by the
rules.
There's there there's at the Intbase I want to say in its
heyday, there was nearly athousand people that worked

(14:09):
there.
800, 900, almost a thousandpeople between all the different
organizations, not just go.

SPEAKER_00 (14:15):
And this was leading up to 1996 is when they really s
shut down and stopped bringing awhole lot of new people to the
property.
So up until 1996, yeah, it wasclose to, you're right, close to
a thousand at its peak.

SPEAKER_01 (14:30):
Aaron Ross Powell I would say there was about at
least a hundred people therethat you that everybody knew
they didn't want to be there.
They were just like, this placesucks, Dave sucks.
They were openly um voicingthese things.
And then I want to say inprobably the late 90s, they did

(14:51):
a purge and they got rid of allof those people.
Like the people that like thespike bushes and the um and any
older people that were there,any elderly people that were
there.

SPEAKER_00 (15:03):
Yeah, that was that was in the early 2000s for the
older people.
But yeah, they yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 (15:09):
They called it the Deadwood Program.
And the people that were Theoffloads.

SPEAKER_02 (15:14):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (15:14):
So all the people that were Deadwood, they were
like, we just got to get rid ofthese people.
They went to the PAC RPF or theywent to the Flag RPF, the
Rehabilitation Project Force,um, which is basically like a
labor camp.
And they just got rid of thosepeople.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
And and even the people thatwere unhappy, you don't walk

(15:34):
around showing that you'reunhappy.
You've got to put on a goodface.
If you're one of the not notthose people.
There was probably a few hundredother people that were on the
struggle bus and just beinglike, I don't know, I cannot do
this.
This is crazy.
It's too much.
And they would just, you know,put on a good face.
But a lot of times it was thesame people that were getting in

(15:58):
trouble regularly.

SPEAKER_00 (15:59):
I would say that statistically, probably ninety
percent of the staff at the basehad family in.
And then the other 10 percent,even if they didn't have family
in, they were married tosomebody at that property.

SPEAKER_01 (16:14):
And they had family in.

SPEAKER_00 (16:16):
Right.
So you have to understand to me,it's layers of control and
leverage.
So it's not only family andpeople who are important to you
that you don't want to lose, butalso such an extreme lack of
resources.
Where would you go with nomoney, you know, oftentimes no

(16:37):
car, most times no car.
Maybe what, two, three, fourpercent of the staff at the base
had a car, maybe less.

SPEAKER_01 (16:45):
There's probably like 20, 30 people out of all
those people that had a vehicle.
But the other thing is there wasalso I would say a large
majority of the CWORC membersthat were at the international
headquarters weresecond-generation
Scientologists.
So they were the children ofScientologists.
And in some cases, their spousesor their mother or father or

(17:07):
brother or sister were also atthe international headquarters.
Like in my case, my sister wasthere.
My mom was in the Sea Org atFLAG, and my half-brother was
also a Scientologist, and hisdad was a Scientologist.
So everybody pretty much that Iknew on my mom's immediate side

(17:28):
of the family, they were allinvolved in Scientology.
So if I left, I was never gonnatalk to those people ever again.

SPEAKER_00 (17:34):
So I said, And also you had to do it.
You you and I both had noconnection or way to reach our
extended family who were not inScientology.

SPEAKER_01 (17:44):
Aaron Powell Yeah, that's true.
Even though I actually did haveum a lot of family members,
cousins and aunts and uncles onmy dad's side, I didn't know
their phone numbers or addressesor any I had no I didn't
wouldn't even know how to findthem.

SPEAKER_00 (17:58):
Yeah, and let alone um it's weird to me also in
retrospect how much I wasconvinced that none of those
people would help me if I askedfor help.
It's not that I thought thatthey were mean or didn't care or
anything else.
It was just that, hey, youhaven't spoken to somebody in 20
years, and now all of a suddenyou're like, help me escape.

(18:21):
It's just it's just not areality.

SPEAKER_01 (18:24):
Okay, next one.

SPEAKER_00 (18:25):
All right.
Hold on.

SPEAKER_01 (18:26):
Do you think Tom Cruise would overleave
Scientology?
No.

SPEAKER_00 (18:29):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (18:30):
Um he is so tied to the hip with David Miscavige,
Tom Cruise.
Um their bromance goes runsdeep.

SPEAKER_00 (18:38):
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Yeah.
And he's been in now, what,since the early to mid-80s,
roughly?

SPEAKER_01 (18:43):
Aaron Ross Powell Well, really in the early 1990s
is when he started doing coursesand counseling, and that's when
he audited me on with theScientology e-meter and
counseling, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 (18:53):
Aaron Ross Powell But that was when he was married
to Nicole, and already hisprevious wife was a
Scientologist.
So he'd been in already for awhile at that point.

SPEAKER_01 (19:00):
Aaron Powell Yeah, but he read Dianetics.

SPEAKER_00 (19:02):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (19:03):
He wasn't he wasn't doing anything.
He read a book when he was MimiRogers.

SPEAKER_00 (19:09):
Uh But also, but also to me, like there are
certain events in somebody'slife that tell you a lot about
whether they're ever gonna wakeup and get out of Scientology or
if they're lifers.
And the fact that he cut off hisdaughter and hasn't talked to
her in however long, to me, saysmore about him that that he will

(19:34):
never wake up and get out.
I mean, never say never, right?

SPEAKER_01 (19:37):
You know, there's there's people who are gonna
have to David Miscavige is gonnahave to really stick it in his
back in order for him to go.
I mean, I just don't know how itit I would say there's a 1%
chance.
But if there's any chance atall, it's very slim.
But the other thing is that hehas it's that cost uh Sunk cost

(20:03):
fallacy.
He sunk so much into Scientologyat this point.

SPEAKER_00 (20:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (20:09):
For him to go, nope.

SPEAKER_00 (20:11):
And he also got so many of his family involved.

SPEAKER_01 (20:15):
Yeah, his sisters.

SPEAKER_00 (20:16):
Um I think even his mom was involved at some point.

SPEAKER_01 (20:19):
Yeah, but I think she passed.

SPEAKER_00 (20:21):
Okay.

SPEAKER_01 (20:21):
But um yes.
If she hasn't sorry about that,I didn't I I thought she had.
But um but yeah, his sisters arein.
Um he's got Scientology, uh,he's got buildings all around,
he's like bought properties allaround their stuff.
He's he's sold he's sold all hisother houses everywhere else so

(20:41):
he could be concentrated in oneplace.
I mean, it's just it's a lot.
It's a lot to say for him, oh, Iwas wrong.
This was stupid.
Um and also he's still trying towork out a way to kill the
aliens.
He's like everybody inScientology Here we go, folks.

(21:02):
Everybody in Scientology isrooting for him because he's
he's basically uh cosplaying howthey could all the different
ways they could get rid of thealiens.
You watch.
He's I bet you he does morealien movies.
You watch.
Another Tom Cruise movie comesout and it's about aliens.
Just saying.

(21:22):
Yeah, next.

SPEAKER_00 (21:24):
All right, hold on here.
Um what was the biggest internalconflict you had before leaving?
I'm sure your answer isdifferent than well, it might be
similar.
You answer first.

SPEAKER_01 (21:36):
Um what was the biggest internal conflict you
had before leaving?
Um The biggest conflict that Ihad was uh Scientology says that
it is the way to solve allmankind's problems.
Ever for every problem mankindhas, they have a solution.
And if basically if everythingis done with Scientology,

(22:00):
Technology, then you would beliving in a utopia.
And the place where we worked,there were only Scientologists
there.
There wasn't any other people.
It was the whole place was beingrun on Scientology policies and
programs and it was the furthestthing from a utopia in the
world.
A utopia, it was not.

(22:21):
And it was so miserable workingthere.
And it was so miserable.
It was just a miserableexperience every single day.
And every year it would be like,well, uh look at the bread side,
it can't get any worse thanthis.
And then next year it's worse.
And so it could always get worseand worse and worse and worse.

(22:42):
And I thought, this is whatthey're trying to do everywhere?
I don't think so.
I can't.
That's when it for me, when Iwas the if you've read my book,
you you know all this.
But in 2004, I had theopportunity to work on the
audiovisual systems in a wholebunch of Scientology
organizations outside of theinternational base.

(23:05):
Go there, check on theirsystems, make sure everything's
working properly.
And every single place I went towas empty, like a bone yard.
And so for me, then I realizedoh, not only are they lying to
the public, they're lying to us.
They're telling us these placesare booming and this
everything's awesome.

(23:26):
And then you go there, you'relike, there's nobody here.
This organization is a brand newideal organization, and there's
zero people here, it's like zeroScientologists in there doing
courses and stuff like that.
And if there were people there,it was one or two people.
So then you realize they'relying to us, they're lying to

(23:47):
the Scientologists, and and it'smiserable.
And and also the people in theorganizations were miserable
too.
So I'm going, every one part ofthis is miserable.
There's no happy people in this,even the public.
You think, oh, these people aredonating all this money.
When there's an event, they havethis every there's like seven or

(24:08):
eight events every yearthroughout the year in
Scientology, and the public,Scientologists that are not on
the C org or they're not onstaff, they're just paying
members of Scientology.
They dread these events.
Oh, completely.
They're gonna get they knowthey're gonna be they're gonna
be harassed until they donatefor a course or some lectures or

(24:33):
give a donation to the IAS, orthere's no way you get out of
there without spending money.
No.
So nobody wants to go to thesethings.
So everybody in the everybody inthe Scientology pyramid, they're
all miserable.

SPEAKER_02 (24:47):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (24:48):
And the only people that I think that aren't like
just this is horrible, are therich people that are getting
people into Scientology andmaking money off of the people
that they get into Scientology.

SPEAKER_00 (25:02):
Yeah.
So by the way, Catherinecommented, and if they didn't
show up to the events, theywould be seen in ethics later.

SPEAKER_01 (25:09):
You would get in trouble if you didn't go listen
to David Miscavige drone on forthree hours.
I about shit that's alreadyhappened.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (25:17):
So we being that we worked at the headquarters, it
was we wouldn't go to a lot ofthe events in Los Angeles.
I think initially when I gotthere, the only event we would
go to was the New Year's event.

SPEAKER_02 (25:30):
That's right.

SPEAKER_00 (25:30):
However, in 1993, October 1993, at the
International Association ofScientologists event where David
Miscavige announced taxexemption.

SPEAKER_01 (25:41):
At the LA Sports Arena.
Rest in peace sports arena.

SPEAKER_00 (25:45):
Yeah.
We went to that one.
And I remember um that the SeaOrg members were basically like
surrounded every entrance orevery exit, I should say, to the
LA Sports Arena.
And we were all required to sellthe tapes and lectures.

SPEAKER_01 (26:01):
We were selling cassettes.
We were selling cassettes in1993.
And I remember the cassette wewere selling was nothing's gonna
stop us.
Nothing's gonna stop us now.
It was a little audio thing.
You remember that?

SPEAKER_00 (26:20):
Yes.
I do.

SPEAKER_01 (26:22):
Was that 1993 or was that the 2000 one?

SPEAKER_00 (26:25):
I think that was the 2000 one.
I can't remember.
I think.
I don't know.
We'll have to anyone whoremembers.

SPEAKER_01 (26:31):
Did you is that it?
Did we answer this question?
Um Yes, say yes.

SPEAKER_00 (26:35):
No, no, I didn't even answer yet.
You were telling your answer.
Give me a second there, honeybuns.
What was the biggest internalconflict?
So for me, again, factoring inthe difference that I was born
into it and my mom had joinedthe C organization when I was
four, I knew uh it it was a lotfor me to consider losing my

(26:57):
entire family.
And and also, unlike Mark, I hadfear of their labels and what
they would do and all thosethings.
Mark, you were always the rebel.
Um like you you were it was foryou, not that it was nothing,
but rel compared to me, it waslike water off a duck's back.

SPEAKER_01 (27:21):
Yeah, I did not let it affect me personally because
I understood that the system wasa giant lump of shit.
So I was basically like, don'tget all worked up.
This ain't personal.
Yeah.
Everybody's just a a giant turdhere, and they're basically in
order for you to move up in theSea Org, somebody else has to go

(27:43):
down.
You gotta kick that you gottakick people down a pattern.
Dog eat dog.
Yeah, it's all dog-eat dog.
And and after a while, you'rejust like, whatever.
And then it also, if you aregenuinely, genuinely trying to
get something done, and peoplesee that you're genuinely trying
to get something done, most ofthe time they would leave me
alone.
They would see, oh this guy'sgetting stuff done.

(28:05):
He's a little unorthodox, butlet's let's leave leave him be.

SPEAKER_02 (28:09):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (28:10):
And then every once in a while, I would just get in
trouble randomly for somethingcompletely stupid.
And I would just be like,whatever, I get stuff done.
If you don't want me to getstuff done, then put me on a
post where I don't get stuffdone.
I don't care.
I'm I'm good either way.
I was that's how my view was islike, whatever.

(28:30):
It's you're you're already somiserable.
What else can they do?
Yeah.
It's it's that kind of thing.
If you to me, it feltunproductive to get emotional
about it because it doesn't itdoesn't solve or it doesn't
change anything at all.

SPEAKER_00 (28:49):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (28:49):
They just now they just add that to the list of
things that they need to sortout with you is that you get
emotional as well.

SPEAKER_00 (28:56):
Right.
I know a little off topic, butwhen we left, I literally felt
broken emotionally.
Like I felt that the mostobvious thing about me was that
that I was a suppressive person.
I I'm just saying, like in theaftermath of escaping, shush,
stop it.
And but I I did.

(29:17):
I felt broken emotionally,broken physically, and
everything else.
It took me a lot to recover fromthat.

SPEAKER_01 (29:22):
Possad out says no AR.

SPEAKER_00 (29:26):
Emotion and reaction.
Scientology.

SPEAKER_01 (29:28):
Yeah in Scientology, they have a word for crying,
getting mad, uh yelling.

SPEAKER_00 (29:36):
Um HR is one, human emotion reaction, case on post,
uh, which you're not allowed tohave.
There you go, case on post.
Yeah, exactly.
I know.
Anyway, seriously.

SPEAKER_01 (29:48):
So when you're in, you know they frown on that.

SPEAKER_00 (29:53):
Frying other fish off purpose.

SPEAKER_01 (29:55):
But they know that if you get like that, that
means, ooh, maybe something elseis going on.

SPEAKER_02 (30:00):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (30:01):
So I was just playing the game.
So when something happened, I'djust be like, okay.

SPEAKER_02 (30:06):
Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 (30:08):
And then they don't they don't you're not getting
upset about it.
So it's just like, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 (30:13):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (30:14):
Okay, let's go.
Next one.

SPEAKER_00 (30:16):
Sounds good.

SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
What do people misunderstand most about why
members stay?
Um you want to answer that one?

SPEAKER_00 (30:22):
Yeah.
Um, I think that uh I think it'sexpressed best by Prison of
Belief as Lawrence Wright usedin his title, Go and Clear
Scientology and the Prison ofBelief, or I can't remember the
full subtitle, but it is aprison of belief.
So very often the indoctrinationand programming make eventually

(30:46):
gets you to do the work ofkeeping yourself in, in addition
to the external reinforcementsby Scientology of ethics, um,
justice, uh, peer pressure, allthose things.
And it's a very small world.
So most often a Scientologisthas, like we've said, has family

(31:06):
members, their kids, theyprobably work for a
Scientologist, their friends areScientologists, like it's a very
intricate web that tends to keeppeople in.

SPEAKER_01 (31:16):
Yeah, one of the very first courses that you do
when you get into Scientology iscalled the PTSP course.
That's potential trouble sourceslash suppressive person course.
And you are taught very early onthat anyone who's negative
towards you or uh isantagonistic about your

(31:38):
involvement with Scientology,you got to cut all those people
off.
Not just one of them, you got tocut them all off out of your
life.
And so it insulates you rightoff the bat.
And then now everyonesurrounding you is either a
Scientologist or supportive ofyou being in Scientology.
So and that is usually otherScientologists or SEARC members.

(32:02):
So it it they it's very thewhole system is very, very
calculated to make sure thatafter the longer you're in, the
less chances they have of yougetting out.

SPEAKER_00 (32:15):
Right.
And that's why Which isreinforced by isolation from any
context, not in Scientology.

SPEAKER_01 (32:21):
Totally.

SPEAKER_00 (32:22):
Yeah.
It's it if you really thinkabout it, it is um evil to a
level beyond many other cultsand organizations, in that like
it systematically digs theperson into a hole that
eventually they will be close toincapable of breaking out of.

SPEAKER_01 (32:41):
I gotta I gotta post this.
Catherine, thanks to Catherine,she's uh one of our mods.
Um she was in the Sea Org for uhmany years, a lot of years.

SPEAKER_00 (32:51):
Yep, I think 27.

SPEAKER_01 (32:53):
Yeah.
She's almost was in almostlonger than both of us put
together.

SPEAKER_00 (32:57):
Yep.
Well, not longer than we were inScientology.

SPEAKER_01 (33:00):
But in the Sea Org.

SPEAKER_00 (33:01):
But in the Sea Org, yes.

SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
She said she did that course three times.
It seems like you might have amisunderstood on that one,
Catherine, because you ain'tthere anymore.
You done did good.

SPEAKER_00 (33:11):
Um course he's being sarcastic.
Everybody.
That's well done, andcongratulations, Catherine.
You know we love you.

SPEAKER_01 (33:19):
And that is the and that's the craziest thing is if
you if you're a Scientologist,most and or a Sea Org member in
most places, they all believethat if you do it exactly how
Hubbard says, then it'll allwork out right.
Then the flip side of that is atthe base.

(33:40):
They don't do anything the wayL.
Ron Hubbard says to do it.
They do it more the way DavidMiscavige wants it done rather
than the way L.
Ron Hubbard said to do it.

SPEAKER_02 (33:50):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (33:50):
And so it it uh it's a weird thing at the imp base
because you know that Hubbardsaid, do not do this, and Dave
is doing this.
Yep.
But he's the boss, you can't sayanything.
No, so it's just a weird thing.
Then you go to one of theseplaces, or this is the perfect
example.
When Leah Remini left and shekept saying, But the policy says

(34:16):
she kept, I was talking to heron the phone a bunch when she
was still in, but she wasthinking about getting out.
And she would say, But the polyand I was like, she kept saying
that, and she kept saying that.
I said, Leah, Leah, Leah, holdon a second.
No one gives a shit about thepolicies.
What are you talking about?
And she's like, What do youmean?
I go, There's no no one'squoting policy at the imp base

(34:40):
to you when you do something.
That's this nut the you're beingsilly.
You're like being a goodobedient Scientologist.

SPEAKER_00 (34:48):
There's that that's I I would modify that though.
The only time policy is quotedat the imp base is in the form
of punishment and degradationand humiliation.
Like, like, you know, oh, you'regonna join the Walking Dead, and
you know, we're gonna give you ablack eye in the in the alley
and put your ethics in all thatnonsense.

SPEAKER_01 (35:08):
Aaron Powell Walking Dead was a hit TV show.

SPEAKER_00 (35:12):
Right.
Okay, next one.
Uh okay, hold on here.

SPEAKER_01 (35:17):
If someone currently inside reached out privately,
what practical first steps wouldyou suggest?

SPEAKER_00 (35:23):
Yeah.
Well, the first thing that umeven on the foundation's crisis
line is we just always focus onis the person safe?
Are they able to communicatefreely?
Free com uh an opencommunication line is the most
important thing.
Um nobody should be bullied intostaying and nobody should be
bullied into leaving.

(35:43):
It's a very personal decisionand it has a lot of
ramifications for a lot ofpeople.
So, you know, just one but oncethe person's made that decision,
guiding them to get safely outwithout being intercepted is my
answer to that.

SPEAKER_01 (35:59):
Yeah.
And also if you're thinking ofgetting out, that there are
steps you can do to like slowly,you know, kind of make your way
out of that without withoutsending off you know flares that
you're doing that.
Yep.
And we've talked about that.
I think one of the best ones wedid, we did an interview with
Phil Jones.
Maybe you could make a note toput that in a link in the

(36:21):
description.
But we we we talked about, youknow, getting a different job if
you work at a Scientologycompany.
Aaron Ross Powell Getting if youlive with Scientologists, get
your own place.
You know, like you want to beable to not have to rely on the
Scientology network when onceyou've left.
And if you can if you canextract yourself enough where

(36:44):
you're not reliant on them, theydon't they're not the ones
paying you every week, orthey're not the ones where
supporting your housing or allthese different things, then
leaving is not that big of adeal.

unknown (36:57):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (36:58):
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Sea Org members and I think C
org members and staff membersmight have it a little worse
because their whole world isScientology.
They don't even in a lot ofcases, C org members don't have
any close friends or family thatthey talk to on a regular basis
that are not in Scientology.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_00 (37:15):
Right.
Which is why also when we have,I mean, we've had now thousands
of people reach out to us overthe years saying, oh, I have a
family member who's on staff orin the C organization, what can
I do?
And we're like, just open upthat communication line and be
there for them and know makethem make sure they know that
you're a safe person.

(37:36):
That alone, just having somebodyto fall back on when all hell
goes, you know, all hell breaksloose, that is huge.

SPEAKER_01 (37:43):
Totally.

SPEAKER_00 (37:44):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (37:45):
What part of rebuilding your marriage or
identity was harder than youexpected?
I'll let you answer this one.

SPEAKER_00 (37:54):
I would say just so it was really like starting over
in many respects, um, not onlyin terms of identity, um,
because in my case, being that Iwas born into Scientology, I
didn't have any pre-cultreferences or experiences.

(38:15):
So um there was so much uh fearand concern of like, you know,
um, that would all the thingsthat I was had been told my
whole life would happen if Iever broke free from
Scientology, would those thingshappen?
Like I remember having aconversation with you being

(38:35):
really just terrified.
Like, uh, you know, I've beentold for the in our entire
marriage that anyone who leavestheir marriage falls apart and
they cheat and you know goes tohell in a handbasket.
And that was a huge burden forme.
And and you, you I remember verydistinctly, you were like, why

(38:58):
are you worried about this?
Like, that's not fair.
We've been married 14 years.
What have I ever done to makeyou think that way?
And it was an earth-shatteringmoment of like, okay, that's
fair.
You don't deserve that.
Uh so I would say thatrebuilding, you know, um really
our relationship and trust andum, you know, just outside of

(39:23):
that frame of reference um was,you know, it was it was a path.

SPEAKER_01 (39:29):
Yeah, I think for me, the biggest thing that I had
to figure out was that thatworld is behind me now.
It's done.
I can't I'm not gonna go back toit.
I'm not gonna I don't I'm notworried about if they do
something.
You just basically have to belike, okay, that's done.

(39:52):
And then figure out, you know,it took us a few years to kind
of figure out what our ourthings were and kind of, you
know, okay, you're good at this,I'm good at this, let's do that.
And but it but it took like a ayear or two for that to kind of
shake out.

SPEAKER_00 (40:08):
But then maybe even a bit more than that.
Sure.

SPEAKER_01 (40:10):
But either way, within a within five years, we
sort of knew, okay, we're gonnado this, we're gonna, this is
how we're gonna do it.

SPEAKER_02 (40:18):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (40:18):
And the only thing that I would say that ended up
being a little different wasScientology started kind of
attacking us before we'd doneanything.
Right.
I want to make always make thatclear to everybody that's
watching.
If you're a Scientologist andyou're watching this, we were
playing it cool.
For sure.
We were we were happy to be goneand we were just gonna live our
lives, and Scientology couldn'tlet that happen, and they

(40:42):
started messing with us.
And I think I sort of decided afew years ago, because some
people are like, why are youeven doing these videos?
Why are it's only there's only7,000 people that are watching
this, or you know, whatever itis.
Um I think I would be willing todo it right now, in this my
current state of mind.

(41:02):
I think I'm gonna be willing todo this as long as they are
continually attacking us.
Yep.

SPEAKER_00 (41:09):
And destroying families and hurting people and
all the things.

SPEAKER_01 (41:13):
I think if we stop, they win.

SPEAKER_00 (41:16):
Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 (41:17):
So for me, and I'll and to be fair, we're doing this
two hours a week.
Okay.
This the the the bloopity bloopsand the the YouTubes and the X's
and all that.
But obviously the aftermath, wedo that as well.
But that's that's more of we'rethis is really trying to expose
Scientology and the things thatgo on it from people that were

(41:40):
there for a long time at the topof the headquarters.
So of course there's people, andwe've had tons of people on, and
we've interviewed people thatwere at orgs or that they were
in LA or they were in Florida,so we can hear their stories
too.
In in the large, they're allvery, very similar.
Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_00 (41:58):
Yeah.
But we also hope that it'stherapeutic, too, for people who
have been in.
It is the best thing to do totalk about it or learn about it
in whatever form you'recomfortable with.

SPEAKER_02 (42:10):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (42:10):
To ask questions and choose for yourself, you know.
That's that's what I I feelstrongly.

SPEAKER_01 (42:16):
Aaron Ross Powell And I think that is a good part
of rebuilding is to come toterms with that it was nonsense
and that it was wrong, and insome cases illegal, and all
these other things, and then yousay, okay, so it's not me, it's
them.
Right.
And then you go, okay, fine.

(42:37):
Now, now if you can't get yourshit together after that and you
need some work, there's tons ofresources and people that can
help you.
But you gotta you gotta realizethat those guys were not doing
what was in your best interests.
Right.
They're trying to, they'retrying to make Scientology
successful.
They're not trying to makeindividual Scientologists

(43:00):
successful.
If a Scientologist goes bankruptand and they get rack up all
these tens of thousands,hundreds of thousands of dollars
in credit card debt, and thenthey can't pay it off,
Scientology doesn't come in andhelp them.

SPEAKER_00 (43:13):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (43:14):
They're like, see, I wouldn't want to be.

SPEAKER_00 (43:16):
Go talk to the ethics officer in good
conditions.

SPEAKER_01 (43:18):
Yes, sucks to suck.

SPEAKER_00 (43:19):
Because if you're if you're failing and you can't
give us more money, then tech isnot going in.
Therefore, ethics is out.
But yeah, and also I would sayanother thought you reminded me
of in regards to this is thatagain, in the context that I was
born into Scientology and in thecadet organization and the C
organization from the age offour, um, I really I found that

(43:42):
the more books I read, the morethings I listened to, the more
research I did, and um juststudying up on various different
things, not just aboutScientology.
Um, trauma and recovery is oneof the books I read that relates
to PTSD.
By Judith.
I can't remember her last name,but it's like the, you know, one

(44:04):
of the founding texts ofresearch of about um PTSD.
But unraveling like my thoughtprocess and peeling back those
layers of programming andindoctrination, um, like I would
just start to go like, well,wait a minute, why am I thinking
this way?
Is this because this is real andthis is or is this because

(44:27):
that's what Scientology trainedme to think?
And just unraveling all of that.
It's it's a process, but it wasvery, very helpful and
therapeutic to approach it thatway.

SPEAKER_01 (44:38):
Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 (44:39):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (44:40):
Okay, next one.

SPEAKER_00 (44:42):
Okay.
What do you think is the biggestmisconception the public has
about David Miscavige?
My answer to that is that DavidMiscavige is a Scientologist.

SPEAKER_01 (44:53):
That's a great one.
The misconception that he's aScientologist, that he's a
Theorg member, that he caresabout Scientologists.
He David Miscavige is in it forDavid Miscavige.
Right.
And the uh the if you've workedwith the guy for any amount of
years, um we're slaving away 120hours a week, and he's

(45:17):
snowmobiling with Tom Cruise.

SPEAKER_00 (45:20):
Yeah, or scuba diving.

SPEAKER_01 (45:21):
Or scuba diving, or taking pictures underwater.
You're just like Neil had towatch a slideshow, an underwater
slideshow of pictures he'd takenin the ABC's uh Aruba Bonair and
Curacao.
Yeah, and then we had to givefeedback on a music soundtrack,
this fucking slideshow.

(45:41):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (45:42):
You want to know my honest feedback?
I haven't taken a three-weekleave of absence ever.

SPEAKER_01 (45:48):
Yeah, you spent more time underwater than I've spent
time off this year, Bub.

SPEAKER_02 (45:52):
Geez.

SPEAKER_01 (45:54):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (45:55):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (45:55):
Literally, he spent more time scuba diving than a
Sea Org member has off in ayear.

SPEAKER_00 (46:02):
Yep.
Yep.
Seeing their family, any ofthat.

SPEAKER_01 (46:06):
He was going, he was watching football every week,
too.

SPEAKER_00 (46:09):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (46:09):
When we went to do the event, we were at an event.
I will never forget this.

SPEAKER_00 (46:13):
And and the the problem is it's not that it's
bad to watch football, but whenstaff are being abused and
mistreated and underpaid andunderfed and humiliated and like
put through hell, living hell onearth, the contrast is a huge
problem.

SPEAKER_01 (46:31):
Yeah, we were doing an event in Los Angeles at the
Shrine Auditorium.
And when we would do theseScientology events, they would
there was a broadcast truckthere, like uh they have at the
Super Bowl or they have at anNFL game.
And the guys that worked in thetruck did NFL football games
when they weren't doingScientology gigs.

(46:52):
And we were in the truck onetime, and Dave would um he would
always give them very expensivegifts.

SPEAKER_02 (46:59):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (47:00):
Right after the event, um, somebody would pass
out all these gifts from him,and they were, you know, ten
thousand dollar watches orwhatever you name it, expensive
shit for these guys that arealready getting paid like
thirty, forty thousand dollarsto to do the event.

SPEAKER_00 (47:15):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (47:15):
E individually.

SPEAKER_00 (47:16):
Yeah.
And these gifts were not paidfor by David Miscavige
personally, of course.

SPEAKER_01 (47:21):
Of course not.
Scientology paid for those.

SPEAKER_00 (47:24):
Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 (47:25):
Um they would get to talking, and he was a big uh
he's from Philadelphia.

SPEAKER_02 (47:31):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (47:32):
So he's a big Philadelphia sports fan.
And they get talking aboutdifferent sports, and he was
like, Oh, and what about thatplay last week when the guy and
you're like and I'm thinking tomyself, the play last week?
Bitch, you're watching footballtoo?
I'm like he this guy, he doeswhatever he wants.
Right.
He's not doing anything comparedto what a Sea Word member or

(47:54):
even a Scientologist does.

SPEAKER_00 (47:56):
Right.

SPEAKER_01 (47:57):
He is the king of the castle.

unknown (47:59):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (47:59):
Okay, back to it.

SPEAKER_00 (48:01):
All right.

SPEAKER_01 (48:02):
Oh, double clair.

SPEAKER_00 (48:03):
Oh, look at that.
Um what gives you hope right nowwhen you look at how things are
changing?
Um a few things.
Number one, definitelyScientology is shrinking um in
membership and in good people umwho have gotten out.
Yep.
Um, public awareness, especiallysince HBO's Go and Clear

(48:26):
documentary, and then of courseLee Remini's Scientology in the
Aftermath three seasons.
Um, the public awareness of theabusive nature and truth about
Scientology has dramaticallychanged from when we first got
out.

SPEAKER_01 (48:40):
Yeah, I think more people are willing to speak out,
knowing that they're all barkand not a lot of bite.
They maybe sometimes they'llthey get a good nibble in, but
for the most part, their bark isway worse than their bite.
Yeah.
And people who leave, somepeople leave and they don't say
anything and nothing happens tothem.
Yeah.
And some people leave and theydo say things they do tell other

(49:03):
people.
And maybe Scientology sends thema nasty gram or does something
that you know tells somebodydon't talk to that person
anymore.
They're they're an SP or youknow, something like that.
Which is that that's gonna comeno matter what.
If you do speak out, you'regonna get a nasty gram.
For sure.
Which is why quit talking aboutScientology.

SPEAKER_00 (49:21):
Right, which is why the help the Aftermath
Foundation provides is nevercontingent upon someone speaking
out.
It's you know, that is a verypersonal choice, and the
foundation's focus is on helpingpeople gain regain stability,
security, and to choose theirown path and go their own way.
Um, but also I would say theother thing that gives me hope

(49:45):
is seeing the um uh what's theword the decompression time has
dramatically shrunk.

SPEAKER_02 (49:54):
That's true.

SPEAKER_00 (49:55):
Like the time it takes somebody to wake up now
with the internet, with all theresources available.
Um so when that when when wefirst joined, you know, when the
foundation was first formed backin December 2017, um, all of the
original board members, wethought, oh yeah, this is a
great idea and would bewonderful.
But the thought of actuallybeing able to reach people

(50:17):
currently in was, you know, kindof a far-off hope.
And now it's it's a regularoccurrence, which is really,
really uh, you know, to me, noto to know that we're reaching
the people inside so that theyknow they have options and
resources to get out and they'renot trapped by that lack of

(50:37):
resources or that imagined lackof resources, that gives me
hope.

SPEAKER_01 (50:41):
Totally.
I think that that's a very goodpoint.
The amount of people, even theamount of people that watch this
channel that are Scientologists,is a lot more than I thought it
would be.
And they are regularly gettingcontent and truth about
Scientology from many differentsources that they go, hmm.

(51:04):
Like the things that theywondered about, they're finding
out those things, a lot of thosethings are true.
Like, oh, this is a scam.
This is all about the money.
Uh there's not, it's it's it'sreally that's it.
It's a scam and it's aboutmoney.
That's really and manipulatingpeople.

SPEAKER_00 (51:22):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (51:23):
Okay, awesome.
There we go.
That was it.
We want to do some other ones.

SPEAKER_00 (51:26):
All right.
Um, yeah.
So we should do a shout out.

SPEAKER_01 (51:29):
There is an upcoming Comedy for our cause event that
we're doing in Denver.

SPEAKER_00 (51:33):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (51:33):
Um there's still tickets, there's still tickets
available.
So we want to sell this out ifpossible.
And we've got about a littleless than a month, three weeks.

SPEAKER_00 (51:43):
Yes.
So it's March 11th at ComedyWorks South in um it's
technically Denver Tech Centerarea, south of Denver.

SPEAKER_02 (51:53):
It's Denver-ish.

SPEAKER_00 (51:54):
Yeah.
We will we have an amazingonline silent auction.
Uh, thank you to everybody whohas donated.
If you'd still like to donateitems, you're we would really,
really appreciate that.
But we have it's already shapingup to be a really great event
that we're really lookingforward to.

SPEAKER_01 (52:11):
And if you can't make it, you can donate and have
the tickets for somebody else.
Like there's a lot of peoplethat are coming to help put on
the event and um and specialguests that might be coming.
Yep.
So if you don't eat if you can'tmake it and you want to donate,
just go to the you can go toComedy Works and you can just
buy the tickets and then tellus, hey, I'm donating these

(52:33):
tickets.
Or you can just go to theAftermath Foundation and say,
hey, I want to donate, you know,five tickets or ten tickets or
two tickets or whatever it is.
And then that way we can we kindof don't have to eat up uh
tickets with people that arethere to, you know, support and
stuff like that that are thatare guests or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 (52:51):
Any and all support is greatly appreciated.
Um and so yeah, we hope as manypeople will join us as can, and
we're looking forward to it.
And yes, um, so we can do a fewquestions before we wrap up for
today.

SPEAKER_01 (53:04):
Sure.
Here's one.
We got uh I I'm not we're notpreviewing these, so hopefully
uh okay.

SPEAKER_00 (53:09):
Angela, question that I've wanted to pose for a
while.
Did you have NetNanny installedon your sorry, hold on here.

SPEAKER_01 (53:17):
I got it.
Yeah.
We had a filter at the yeah,yes, thank you for the question,
Angela.
Um we had a program at the ImpBase, which was essentially it
was called the filter.
And it and every single personat the Imp base who had to go on
the internet, except for DavidMiscavige, had to go through a

(53:38):
filter.
And if you typed in anythingrelated to Scientology, you
would get an access denied page.
And if you typed in anythingthat was antagonistic towards
Scientology, you would get anaccess denied page.
And then the person that oversawthe internet access, I want to
say when I had it, I was one ofthe very, very first people to

(54:00):
have internet access at theinternational base.

SPEAKER_00 (54:02):
And we should provide this context too.
You had to have approval fromlike five people to even have
internet access at all.
Yes.
Like you had to prove that youhad to have access to the
internet to do the duties ofyour job, which was what, maybe
five percent of the staff at theproperty could prove that?

SPEAKER_01 (54:23):
Even less.
Yeah.
Your shit your shit couldn'tstink if you were trying to get
on the internet.
Well, she didn't have internetaccess, but I did.
But one of the things that ifyou so if you went to a site
that was restricted or you did asearch and you saw something and
you clicked on it and got one ofthese access denied, the
administrators that ran thefilter would get an alert.

(54:46):
And one of those people was anRTC and one of those people was
in security golden airproductions.

SPEAKER_00 (54:51):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (54:52):
So if you did even click on something.

SPEAKER_00 (54:56):
And if you didn't have a good answer as to why you
clicked on that, your internetaccess was revoked instead of.

SPEAKER_01 (55:02):
And then you would never get it back.

SPEAKER_00 (55:03):
Yep.
So even if it even if your jobrequired it, didn't matter.

SPEAKER_01 (55:09):
I will say that the way they managed the filter was
they managed it with sites andkeywords.
So if there was a like OperationClambake, which was a message
board that a lot of peopleshared uh exposing Scientology
stuff on.
So that whole domain was justblocked.
Aaron Ross Powell Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (55:28):
Had you ever heard of Operation Clambake when you
were at the base?
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (55:31):
Never.

SPEAKER_00 (55:32):
Only when you got out.

SPEAKER_01 (55:33):
But but another way they would do it is by keywords.

SPEAKER_00 (55:36):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (55:37):
So they would just have a list of keywords.
Well, I will tell you that atthe international headquarters,
I would say at least fifty tosixty percent of the staff there
are foreign nationals.

SPEAKER_00 (55:51):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (55:51):
That speak and some of them speak multiple
languages.

SPEAKER_02 (55:54):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (55:55):
And those people that had internet access very
quickly realized that if theyjust searched in their own
languages, that they thoseweren't those weren't keywords
that were on the filter.
Nope.
So I don't even know how theycould possibly do it now.
Because you basically have tohave the keywords and then
translations of those into everypossible variation to be able to

(56:18):
so anyway, they probably justdon't have internet access.

SPEAKER_00 (56:21):
Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 (56:23):
Okay.
Hopefully that answers yourquestion, Annie.

SPEAKER_00 (56:25):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (56:25):
We definitely had net Nanny.
Oh, and there was a t timeperiod in the in the 1990s where
all Scientologists wereencouraged to set up an I an I
am a Scientologist website.

SPEAKER_02 (56:39):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (56:39):
And they would get a CD.
Scientology gave everybody allthe members CDs, and you would
install that CD on your computerto make your I'm a Scientologist
site.
And one of the programs that itwould install was a filter on
your computer.
A lot of Scientologists don'tknow that.

(57:01):
If anybody's got a copy of thatCD, let me know.
Reach out because I would loveto open it and show you what it
was.
That would be crazy if we coulddo that.
Yeah.
But if you just look upScientologist NetNanny C D or
something like that, you'llyou'll there's people that wrote
about it, and it's definitelywhy was widely documented at the

(57:22):
time.

SPEAKER_00 (57:22):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (57:22):
Oh, we got a super chat here.

SPEAKER_00 (57:24):
Oh, nice.
Lisa, take it or leave it.
NYC here.
I've been following the story ofScientology since the mid-80s.
What kind of catch-up do youhave to do health-wise when you
leave aka dental health afterliving in the state of
emergency?
Yes.
Uh a lot.
I mean, uh, we've we've toldmany stories about this, but

(57:46):
yeah, I had I had never hadproper dental work done.
I had to go through all kinds ofdental work and we had to do
physical checkups and all thatkind of stuff.
I thought I had cancer when Ifirst got out because I had
adrenal gland exhaustion.
Um and that's that's notuncommon.

SPEAKER_01 (58:03):
Yeah, I had to have every single filling or anything
that the dentist at theinternational headquarters had
done.
I had to have them all taken outand replaced.
And they they asked me at thedentist if I had gone to a third
world country to get my dentalwork done.
And I was like, what?

(58:25):
They were like, this is theworst.

SPEAKER_00 (58:27):
And it and I was You know what's bad when you see the
dentist looking at the X-ray andkind of going, hmm, I haven't
seen this before.
Uh where did you get this done?
Yeah, that happened a lot.

SPEAKER_01 (58:38):
It was bad news.

SPEAKER_00 (58:38):
It was bad news, yeah.
Bad news bears.

SPEAKER_01 (58:41):
Claire was tapping me while she was reading that.
I was like, quit tapping me.
And then I realized the camerawas on me, not her.
She was doing all the reading.

SPEAKER_00 (58:49):
Yes, coffee milk, dude.
Donation for AftermathFoundation fundraiser.
Best you guys, always a greattime here on BFG.
Yes, so just for the records,yeah.
Foundate um foundation donationsare need to be made on the
foundation channel.
We will do that transfer.
Thank you.
But just for future reference,if you'd like to support support
the Aftermath Foundation, do iton the Foundation website.

(59:12):
Uh or the foundation channel.
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (59:15):
Can you give donations on there yet?

SPEAKER_00 (59:17):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (59:18):
You can?
Okay, good.
Perfect.

SPEAKER_00 (59:19):
But thank you.
We will take care of it on theback end.
No worries.

SPEAKER_01 (59:22):
Yes.
Okay.
Do we have anything left?
There's I mean, I saw them.
Oh, I gotta go back to thestarred ones.

SPEAKER_00 (59:28):
Yes.
I'm sure we have a few morehere.

Question (59:30):
Do you ever plan on having Amir on?
Yes, definitely.
I will talk to Amir.

SPEAKER_02 (59:35):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (59:35):
Um, I have had to take a hiatus from doing
interviews because I alreadyhave a full-time job and a
family and everything else.
And to carve out the time neededto finish my book, I had to kind
of put certain things on hold.
But yes, I would love to talk toAmir for sure.
So coming later this year, assoon as I have any news to

(59:57):
announce.

SPEAKER_01 (59:57):
This one says Mark being a bit afraid he might get
pneumonia.
I wasn't afraid, but I wantedto, if it happened, I would be
like, okay, but if it didn'thappen, that was it.
And that was that really was uhI I joke, but it really was the
moment when I watched the SouthPark thing, and then I read all

(01:00:21):
of the OT levels, every singleone, all the way up to OT eight.
And when I read all of those andw found out about Zenu, I read
up everything.
So the South Park is sort of anabridged version of OT3.

SPEAKER_02 (01:00:35):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:00:36):
When you read the whole thing, it's it's even
crazier than South Park.
But then you and it says rightin there that you will get
pneumonia.
It says in the materials youwill get pneumonia.

SPEAKER_00 (01:00:47):
But you know what's funny that you just made me
think of?
So, for context, Mark tells mehe's gonna read all of the OT
levels, and he and he says, if Idie from pneumonia, uh, then
they were right.
Okay, so that happened.
And I was like, But did I takeit seriously?
Did I really think he was gonnadie from pneumonia?
Honestly, no, I didn't.
When you when you were told meyou're gonna release your book,

(01:01:09):
I'm like, we need wills, we needto make sure our children are
protected.
I'm just saying, like thecontrast to me says a lot about
the reality of are you gonna diefrom pneumonia?
Or uh compared to is what damageis Scientology gonna try to
perpetrate on you if you dare tospeak out?

(01:01:29):
So anyway, just an interestingthought that you reminded me of
there.

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:32):
This is a good one.
I like this one.

SPEAKER_00 (01:01:34):
Okay.
Bill Kormetsky, how is itpossible to somehow not show
quote unquote case overloggerheads which are constant?
Fear and loathing neverrecognized.

SPEAKER_01 (01:01:46):
You you can't.
I mean, some people there wouldliterally just be yes, sir,
okay, sir, and then they justtake it.
Um or if you're trying to dosomething and the other person
is trying to stop you or is isis trying to sabotage you or
whatever, you can write areport, but nothing's really

(01:02:06):
gonna happen to them.
They're just gonna do whateverthey're gonna do.

SPEAKER_02 (01:02:10):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:10):
So I I think a lot of people are a little bit
apathetic about that.
Like they just take it like,okay, well, there's nothing I
can do.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:18):
I'm that's the true cause of the pie face phenomena
where you just get so beat downthat you just feel like there's
no the life there's no life leftin you on sadly and
unfortunately.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:32):
There's no reason to fight.
It's only gonna go more bad foryou.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:35):
Right.
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:37):
Yeah, it's a bummer.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:38):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:39):
Okay.
Oh, here we go.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:42):
Lisa, take it or leave it.
I remember watching Stacy andJesse trailing.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:48):
Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_00 (01:02:48):
They both Stacy 20 years ago.

SPEAKER_01 (01:02:51):
Uh Jesse Prince and Stacy Young.
What it was Stacy Vaughn, Stacy.
Stacy Vaughn, Stacy Young.
They did a bunch of YouTubevideos.
That's right.
And they and they would tell alot of these things.
And you know that Jesse Princeis one of the people that I
realized because he used to bein RTC, and then he was in gold,

(01:03:11):
and then he was gone.

SPEAKER_02 (01:03:13):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:13):
And he started speaking out, and he said
somewhere there's no way theycan stop you from talking about
things that are illegal.
There's no way that you can getin trouble for telling something
that's illegal that they'redoing.
And when he said that, I waslike, oh, and he was doing it.

(01:03:34):
It was all over the internet.
It was videos and there's posts,and that's all.

SPEAKER_00 (01:03:37):
Yeah, and he also wrote a book, The Expert
Witness.
So if you haven't read that,give that a listen for sure.

SPEAKER_01 (01:03:42):
Aaron Ross Powell, so that was one of the key
things for me that was like, oh,they're gonna mess with us, and
there's no consequence if wetalk about what happened.
Because up until that point, Iwas worried that if we talked
about something at the base,then maybe something would
happen to us.
And they had drafted up alawsuit.

(01:04:02):
And I we have copies of that.
I think we even covered it onthe spy files on this channel.
But they had drawn up an entirelawsuit against me about telling
all these secrets at the endbase, just based on the
Operation Clan Book uh postingsthat I had done.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:17):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:17):
And they never filed it, they never did it.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:20):
But if they had at that time, it I mean, of course
it would have been way worse forthem than it was for us.
But in that moment, it wouldhave been devastating for us.
Like we had a newborn baby.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:35):
Yeah.
I mean financially it would havebeen h it would have been rough.
But then also, Scientology, um,they don't initiate a lot of
lawsuits.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:45):
No.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:46):
They're the recipients of them.

SPEAKER_00 (01:04:48):
I think the last one they initiated was on Debbie
Cook.
We all know how that went.

SPEAKER_01 (01:04:52):
Yeah.
So but if you do file a lawsuitagainst them, they will use the
discovery phase to try to get asmuch dirt and info on you as
possible so that when thelawsuit is all done and dusted,
they have enough ammunitionunless it goes your way and they
have to be hands-off.

SPEAKER_00 (01:05:13):
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: Yeah.
And of course, now, whichhopefully will get shut down
eventually, but now they'veadded the kangaroo court of
arbitration.
Yeah, we did not have no lawyerspresent, no just absolute I
mean, I can't even believe thatthey're getting away with that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:31):
So Yeah, I'm trying to see if there's any other
super chats in here that Imissed because I it used to
automatically put those inthere.
Anyway.
Yeah.
Um I wanted to do some shoutouts because we normally did the
shout outs at the beginning.
And now we do kind of do them atthe end.
So I'll do some shout outs.

SPEAKER_02 (01:05:48):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:05:48):
And then um, if you guys uh just want to say hi or
you know, whatever, I will putthe comments in on the end
video.
I put the I Show the comments onthe right.

SPEAKER_00 (01:06:01):
And any questions we didn't get to that get relates
to QA, we'll keep those for nexttime.
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:06:07):
We we got a lot of requests to do QA's, and we've
been getting a lot of questionson other uh platforms.
Yep.
And so and there was some guy, Ican't figure out how to answer
it.
He posted on YouTube that if Ihad seen the Tron movie and then
it has a whole bunch of DepecheMode references in it.
Yes.
Yes, I have seen the movie, andyes, I do know it has a lot of
Depeche Mode references in it.

(01:06:28):
And uh and I liked I liked themovie.
So I know some people didn'tlike it.
Some people thought it was dumb.
I liked it, and that it theytalk about depeche mode.
Basically, Depeche Mode's thehero of the movie.
Let's just say that.

SPEAKER_00 (01:06:39):
Um fun fact, Mark and I are not really Minecraft
people.
However, we went Minecraft.
No, no, it relates.
Just give me a second to toconnect the dots here.
Here we go.
Um, our kids play Minecraft.
So we took our youngest son togo see the Minecraft movie.
Not only was that hilariousbecause it was kind of a cult

(01:07:00):
experience, but also a depechemode in there.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:04):
That's right.
The kids are like, my dad'ssuper cool, man.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:08):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:08):
Okay.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:09):
There you go.
I got to my punchline.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:11):
Here we go.
I was like, Minecraft.
Okay, let's jam these through.
You ready?

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:14):
Yep, I'm ready.
Hi from Albuquerque, Mary Kay,and Angel Cat.
Hi from Sunland, California.
Harvey Denton's Toad.
Hi, everyone.
Beaches Activate.
Yes.
Uh good evening, everyone fromNova Scotia.
Nice.
Trevor.
Good evening from theNetherlands.
Old Techie.
Hi from Nebraska.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:36):
Okay.
Now Techie.
Was your name always Old Techieor was it just Techie?

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:41):
Yeah, we're having a familial debate here.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:45):
And Claire says it was always Old Techie.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:47):
Yeah.
So.

SPEAKER_01 (01:07:48):
I want to know.
I want to know the answers.

SPEAKER_00 (01:07:51):
Tracy Hobart, howdy from Wyoming.
Hello from Tuolemy.
Becky, big brother fan, goodevening from UK.

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:02):
Oh, Harvey Denton's got a good one coming up.

SPEAKER_00 (01:08:04):
Greetings from Cameron, North Carolina.
Harvey Denton's Toad.
Wonder if Warren McShane stilllooks at adult sites, of course.

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:14):
We know he does.

SPEAKER_00 (01:08:15):
Yeah, we know he does.

SPEAKER_01 (01:08:16):
You know he does.

SPEAKER_00 (01:08:17):
Yeah.
For anyone missing contextthere.
It's in the book.
Um, Warren McShane is inReligious Technology Center.
He's the top legal guy.
He was at our um at mydeposition during our lawsuit.
And one of the most epic momentsever was when Mr.
Mark Marmorough, who then laterbecame a Supreme Court judge,
says, Well, Miss Headley, isn'tit true that you audited Mr.

(01:08:41):
McShane here?
Audited meaning Scientology'scounseling.
And I said, No.
Actually, it was definitelytechnically I'm not auditing
you.
And David Miscavige asked me todo an ethics interview on Mr.
McShane because he was lookingat X-rated material on the
internet.
And Mark Marlowe was like,strike that from the record.

SPEAKER_01 (01:09:02):
It was the best.
So remember when I said therewas people monitoring the
interwebs at the base, and onewas in RTC and one was in
Security Gold.
Well, Warren McShane was the guyin RTC and the guy in security,
his name was Kenny Campelman,and he was uh he was a security
guard in Golden Era Productions.

SPEAKER_02 (01:09:23):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:09:24):
When he when when um Kenny or when Warren would go on
these other sites, uh itwouldn't give them an access
denied because they're theadministrators.

SPEAKER_02 (01:09:34):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:09:35):
But the administrators can see what the
other administrators' historiesare.
So Kenny Campelman could seethat Warren McShane was going on
to X-rated websites, and WarrenMcShane could see that Kenny
Campelman was going on toX-rated websites.
So the two guys that were theadministers of the entire system

(01:09:57):
were breaking the rules everychance they could get, which in
my mind is hilarious becausethey're coming enlightened
people up for for accidentallyclicking on a Scientology
article and Rolling Stone orsomething like that.
Meanwhile, they're good justgoing to porn sets whenever they
want.

SPEAKER_00 (01:10:13):
Yep.

unknown (01:10:14):
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:15):
Holy moly maniacs.

SPEAKER_00 (01:10:17):
Maniacs is right.
Okay, sorry, hold on.
Give me let me get that.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:20):
Hello from Copenhagen.
I have a tardy note.
Oh, okay.
Well, there you go.
Hey, hey, from Virginia.
Carrie Rodriguez, thank you.
Hello from Auckland, NewZealand.
Nice.
Oh, apostate Alex is in here.
Apostate Alex, hi to you inLondon.

SPEAKER_02 (01:10:35):
Nice.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:36):
Um, Central Florida, Snooky.
Uh, and then we've got uh AlohaGoddess, Aloha from Kauai,
Hawaii.

SPEAKER_00 (01:10:44):
Kawaii Hawaii.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:45):
You know, I know somebody, I know somebody who's
there right now.
I just emailed them, a designerthat we work with on museums.

SPEAKER_02 (01:10:52):
Nice.

SPEAKER_01 (01:10:53):
Um, okay.
And oh, apostate Alex, org andturbulation officer, IAS
International Association ofSuppressive Persons, London
Foundation Reporting for DutyService.

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:06):
Hey Alex, thanks for joining us.
Thanks for all the work you'vebeen doing.
Alex you're awesome.
Alex is so laying 5.4xing hisstats.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:14):
He is causing so much nonsense with what he's up
to over there.

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:18):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:19):
It's awesome.
Yeah.
Do we show this one?

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:21):
Tracy Howdy from Wyoming.
Yep.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:23):
Awesome.
Okay.
Oh.

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:25):
I Catherine Olsen, I had a lot of misunderstood
words.
That's why I left.
It made no sense anymore.

SPEAKER_01 (01:11:32):
You know, that's another thing Catherine does say
that that probably in in in jetin jest, but in Scientology,
they believe if you pass amisunderstood word, that that
leads to overts, and overtsleads to blow-offs, and that's
when people escape is the rootof that.

SPEAKER_00 (01:11:51):
Yeah, one of the manifestations.
Yeah, no, one of themanifestations of a
misunderstood word is below.
I aka escape.
Yeah.
Aka unauthorized departure.
So yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:05):
Yeah.
Crazy people, crazy.
Well, I I appreciate you guys.
Um oh, there's a live see.
Oh wow, there's oh I there's abunch of things that weren't
starred, but um, if there's anyhighs, buys, or thanks or
whatever, I will put those up uhon the end and we will try to
get to um as many questions aswe we can as we get them in,

(01:12:26):
maybe every few weeks.

SPEAKER_00 (01:12:28):
Yes.
Oh, and let me say we will beback next week with special
guests to do a follow-up to yourdiscussion with Matt Pesh
regarding the rehabilitationproject for us.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:39):
So RPF story.
So if you guys have got anyreally crazy RPF stories, you
can send those in too, and thenwe can share notes with uh our
special guests on um on thosethings.
And that'll be next Sunday.

SPEAKER_00 (01:12:54):
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:55):
Definitely Sunday.

SPEAKER_00 (01:12:56):
Definitely Sunday.

SPEAKER_01 (01:12:58):
Okay.
Put it on your calendar.
You heard it here, folks.

SPEAKER_00 (01:13:01):
Nothing happens in this family unless I put it on
the calendar.
So I got you.
Yes.

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:07):
Okay.
Yahweh.

SPEAKER_00 (01:13:08):
Thank you to everyone joining us today.

SPEAKER_01 (01:13:11):
See you next week.
Until next time.
Thanks for watching.
If you'd like to help supportthe channel, feel free to check
out the merch store link in thedescription.
We have Hail Xenu, Xenu is myhomeboy and BFG branded mouse
pads, shirts, mugs, all sorts ofother stuff in there that helps
us to bring you new content on aregular basis.

(01:13:32):
You can also pick up a copy ofmy book, Blown for Good Behind
the Iron Curtain of Scientologyin hardback, Kindle, and Audible
versions as well.
There's also a link to ourpodcast, and you can get that on
Apple, Spotify, or wherever youlisten to podcasts.
And if you'd like to watchanother video, you can click on

(01:13:53):
this link right here, or you canclick on this one here, or you
can click on the subscribebutton right here.
Thanks a lot, until next time.